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It's just the reality that New Zealand is a country with a population smaller than, say, Slovakia, and a hell of a long way away. So increased trade with them, while nice, just won't move economic indicators at all.HYUFD said:
What an arrogant dismissal of our relationship with our New Zealand alliesScott_xP said:
It's not a criticism of the fine people of New Zealand, just economic fact.0 -
Ah, political journalists trying to be experts on aviation again. What could possibly go wrong?Scott_xP said:
$50k might be the cost of a plane’s worth of paint for AA, who buy it by the tonne. It’s sure as hell not the cost of the hangar, scaffolding, mobile platforms, design, printing of masks, paper, tape, stripper for the old paint - oh, and about a dozen certified people working for a week or two on it. £900k is about right.2 -
That's it, thank you! But the BA tail fin was pretty understated anyway.Luckyguy1983 said:
No, she was draping the rebranded BA tailfin art that removed the Union Flag and was just 'world designs' - I think the one she covered was based on Dutch pottery but I could be wrong.Carnyx said:
I was myself thinking more of those pop culture Minis or Mini Mokes of the 1960s (I am a bit too young for that era really).Mexicanpete said:
I have found it wise to steer clear of the occupants of any vehicle bearing a Union Flag or the flag of St George. Perhaps Boris is channelling his inner chav.ydoethur said:
It costs 60 times what any sane person would pay for it and is still shit?Carnyx said:
Bear in mindCarlottaVance said:
The Guardian says:Scott_xP said:
Air Force One for Boris? RAF plane for VIPs gets a union jack makeover
The prime minister’s plane, also used by royalty, is getting a new paint job costing £100,000 plus
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2020/jun/16/air-force-one-for-boris-raf-plane-for-vips-gets-a-union-jack-makeover
Which is bang in the middle for the quoted 777 repaint (not forgetting that there may be more bits n'pieces on the RAF Voyager than a regular airliner.
Where did Faisal Islam get his £900,000 from?
(a) scheme is more complex than most (not all) airliners
(b) it's a PFI job - with the implications
I'd be interested to see how the designers achieve the result on the Johnson-Mobile. It seems to be hard to get a UJ which is recogniseable without it looking like a hippymobile at one extreme or so undertstated at the other that it's not recogniseable as a UJ - like the later British Airways scheme on Concorde for instance. Didn't the latter upset Mrs T so much she draped a hanky over the GRP model showing it at a Farnborough Air Show? Or am I misremembering?1 -
Anyway. Time for footie again0
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Yes, definitely a Fokker-100 - built in the EU, natch!FF43 said:
That's a Fokker 100 plane, I think. Slovakia does have an AIrbus A319, I think, in its presidential flight but the design doesn't work so well. The plane is too fat.Mexicanpete said:
But it looks like a 15 year old Airbus. Style over substance!FF43 said:
Slovakia wins the Presidential Flight Design One-Upmanship award, I think...Mexicanpete said:
He will be the envy of the other 27 EU leaders when he rocks up to trade talks in AirBorisOne/ BorisForceOne.Cyclefree said:Painting a bloody plane! Is that it? Is that what Boris is about?
The art of one-upmanship.
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Tories: Marxism is evil.
Others: But what about all those RCP ones you employ?
Tories: Splendid fellows. Radical free thinkers don't cha know!4 -
Why do they need certifying?Sandpit said:
Ah, political journalists trying to be experts on aviation again. What could possibly go wrong?Scott_xP said:
$50k might be the cost of a plane’s worth of paint for AA, who buy it by the tonne. It’s sure as hell not the cost of the hangar, scaffolding, mobile platforms, design, printing of masks, paper, tape, stripper for the old paint - oh, and about a dozen certified people working for a week or two on it. £900k is about right.
Although I suppose they would be working for Johnson which would send anyone round the twist...0 -
Well lets have fewer criticisms of that US trade deal the government is working on then tooSirNorfolkPassmore said:
It's just the reality that New Zealand is a country with a population smaller than, say, Slovakia, and a hell of a long way away. So increased trade with them, while nice, just won't move economic indicators at all.HYUFD said:
What an arrogant dismissal of our relationship with our New Zealand alliesScott_xP said:
It's not a criticism of the fine people of New Zealand, just economic fact.0 -
Boris is the gift that keeps on giving! Even his surname....SandyRentool said:
They should just draw a giant cock on the side of the plane. Then it will be obvious who has just landed.Mexicanpete said:
He will be the envy of the other 27 EU leaders when he rocks up to trade talks in AirBorisOne/ BorisForceOne.Cyclefree said:Painting a bloody plane! Is that it? Is that what Boris is about?
The art of one-upmanship.
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Worthless, yet brutal. It's barely worth arguing with but when you have the most conservative of teaching groups saying the same things as the more left leaning ones it doesn't stand up for more than a second.eadric said:A brutal but justified takedown of the teaching unions
https://thecritic.co.uk/the-teaching-unions-are-a-national-disgrace/
There is one thing leading this and that is parental will. Parents don't want to send their children into school when the government previously set out to sacrifice half a million people leading to the PM nearly doing it to himself. That's the bottom line.
Blowhards like that really want to have a go at feckless parents but they haven't got the guts,2 -
"Which do you think is more deserving of funding from the UK taxpayer - (i) recruiting yet more "diversity advisors" in local government or (ii) making sure our veterans are properly looked after?"Theuniondivvie said:
BJ's going to plaster the windows with Help For Heroes and I Stand With Soldier F stickers, isn't he?Mexicanpete said:
I have found it wise to steer clear of the occupants of any vehicle bearing a Union Flag or the flag of St George. Perhaps Boris is channelling his inner chav.ydoethur said:
It costs 60 times what any sane person would pay for it and is still shit?Carnyx said:
Bear in mindCarlottaVance said:
The Guardian says:Scott_xP said:
Air Force One for Boris? RAF plane for VIPs gets a union jack makeover
The prime minister’s plane, also used by royalty, is getting a new paint job costing £100,000 plus
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2020/jun/16/air-force-one-for-boris-raf-plane-for-vips-gets-a-union-jack-makeover
Which is bang in the middle for the quoted 777 repaint (not forgetting that there may be more bits n'pieces on the RAF Voyager than a regular airliner.
Where did Faisal Islam get his £900,000 from?
(a) scheme is more complex than most (not all) airliners
(b) it's a PFI job - with the implications
"Yes, Frank, OK - you go first."0 -
0
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Yep. It’ll likely fit in with the “Great” branding that DfIT use internationally.Luckyguy1983 said:The red white and blue plane is a very good idea. The Foreign and Commonwealth Office merger is a very good idea. The motivations for both these actions are quite clear - the Government is going to do its utmost to promote Britain's interests overseas. The people dissing both these ideas are people who were never going to be reconciled to Boris, his Government, or Brexit.
https://www.great.gov.uk/international/0 -
I don't quite understand your point.HYUFD said:
Well lets have fewer criticisms of that US trade deal the government is working on then tooSirNorfolkPassmore said:
It's just the reality that New Zealand is a country with a population smaller than, say, Slovakia, and a hell of a long way away. So increased trade with them, while nice, just won't move economic indicators at all.HYUFD said:
What an arrogant dismissal of our relationship with our New Zealand alliesScott_xP said:
It's not a criticism of the fine people of New Zealand, just economic fact.
Are you saying we should just roll over on any trade deal Trump slops out because his country has 328 million souls (and is economically significant) whereas Jacinda Ardern's has five million and essentially isn't?0 -
I can't speak for them, but I doubt homeopaths are uninterested in cancer treatments, and naturopaths certainly aren't - they are probably interested in a wider range than conventional medics though. So the analogy does work, it just doesn't support your argument.kinabalu said:
The allusion was - somebody heads an inquiry into something they do not think is worth looking into and probably do not even believe in. It almost worked. It's not bad.Luckyguy1983 said:
Homeopathy as a specific medical practise uses infinitesimally small quantities of active ingredients diluted so much that any efficacy is implausible except as a placebo. Indeed, people have conducted 'mass overdoses' of homeopathic remedies to show how useless they are.kinabalu said:
As refreshing as appointing a homeopath to spearhead a review into cancer treatments.BluestBlue said:
Extremely refreshing and important. The identitarian left is about to discover that genuine diversity comes in thought as well as in immutable characteristics...Andy_JS said:"Munira Mirza is the bigoted Left's worst nightmare
The No 10 adviser tasked with a new racial equality commission refuses to bend to identity politics
RAKIB EHSAN"
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2020/06/16/munira-mirza-bigoted-lefts-worst-nightmare/?li_source=LI&li_medium=liftigniter-rhr
However, if your comment was aimed more widely and you're referring to any naturopathic doctor spearheading a review into cancer treatments, yes that would be very refreshing. And probably result in far better cancer outcomes that we have in the UK at the moment.
I thought you would be quite big in homeopathy. Just goes to show. Assumptions about people are fraught with danger. Avoid where possible.0 -
It won't be a fair trade deal, we will have to lower our standards on worker's rights and animal welfare to compete. It will be the only thing we have left, so we will get screwed.HYUFD said:
Well lets have fewer criticisms of that US trade deal the government is working on then tooSirNorfolkPassmore said:
It's just the reality that New Zealand is a country with a population smaller than, say, Slovakia, and a hell of a long way away. So increased trade with them, while nice, just won't move economic indicators at all.HYUFD said:
What an arrogant dismissal of our relationship with our New Zealand alliesScott_xP said:
It's not a criticism of the fine people of New Zealand, just economic fact.0 -
Wokeists - that is a most clumsy word.BluestBlue said:
Wokeists: All forms of diversity in all areas of life are good by definition, and the absence of diversity is bad by definition.Sandpit said:
Munira Mirza, Priti Patel, Rishi Sunak, Kemi Badenoch...Andy_JS said:"Munira Mirza is the bigoted Left's worst nightmare
The No 10 adviser tasked with a new racial equality commission refuses to bend to identity politics
RAKIB EHSAN"
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2020/06/16/munira-mirza-bigoted-lefts-worst-nightmare/?li_source=LI&li_medium=liftigniter-rhr
All the wrong sort of BAME, according to the woke left mob.
Tories: Wonderful. How about these BAME Conservatives with their own considered views on these matters?
Wokeists: Not that kind of diversity! Heretics!
Please use "the Cognescenti" in future.0 -
No, it was one of the "world image" non-UK designs that Fatcha objected to on a model. Concorde always carried the "Chatham" Union Flag design which BA now uses fleet-wide.Carnyx said:
I was myself thinking more of those pop culture Minis or Mini Mokes of the 1960s (I am a bit too young for that era really).Mexicanpete said:
I have found it wise to steer clear of the occupants of any vehicle bearing a Union Flag or the flag of St George. Perhaps Boris is channelling his inner chav.ydoethur said:
It costs 60 times what any sane person would pay for it and is still shit?Carnyx said:
Bear in mindCarlottaVance said:
The Guardian says:Scott_xP said:
Air Force One for Boris? RAF plane for VIPs gets a union jack makeover
The prime minister’s plane, also used by royalty, is getting a new paint job costing £100,000 plus
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2020/jun/16/air-force-one-for-boris-raf-plane-for-vips-gets-a-union-jack-makeover
Which is bang in the middle for the quoted 777 repaint (not forgetting that there may be more bits n'pieces on the RAF Voyager than a regular airliner.
Where did Faisal Islam get his £900,000 from?
(a) scheme is more complex than most (not all) airliners
(b) it's a PFI job - with the implications
I'd be interested to see how the designers achieve the result on the Johnson-Mobile. It seems to be hard to get a UJ which is recogniseable without it looking like a hippymobile at one extreme or so undertstated at the other that it's not recogniseable as a UJ - like the later British Airways scheme on Concorde for instance. Didn't the latter upset Mrs T so much she draped a hanky over the GRP model showing it at a Farnborough Air Show? Or am I misremembering?
(Called "Chatham" because it was inspired by the naval flag factory at the old Chatham naval base.)3 -
Posted earlier, I know, but Austin Powers's Jumbo Jet had the best paint scheme:ydoethur said:
https://youtu.be/ARXqNc5DGXUSandyRentool said:
They should just draw a giant cock on the side of the plane. Then it will be obvious who has just landed.Mexicanpete said:
He will be the envy of the other 27 EU leaders when he rocks up to trade talks in AirBorisOne/ BorisForceOne.Cyclefree said:Painting a bloody plane! Is that it? Is that what Boris is about?
The art of one-upmanship.
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iirc @Foxy suggested using Micropore tape to seal the top of the mask to your face. In this case, there is no obvious reason to wear a mask while driving your own housemates.rpjs said:
I don't think there's any reason to wear the mask actually over your face while you're driving with the windows up, just be ready to put it on properly as soon as you get out.Big_G_NorthWales said:This is a non political question but as my wife and I may venture out soon after 12 weeks locked away I have acquired face masks but on trying them on my glasses steam up
As I have to wear glasses to drive I will not be able to do both
Is this just me or has anyone advice on this strange issue
Also with the disposable kind, the top is usually slightly stiffer so you can mould it to fit close around your nose and cheeks. I've found that very effective in stopping the glasses fogging issue.
ETA link to Government guidance (hope Wales is the same!)
https://www.gov.uk/guidance/coronavirus-covid-19-safer-travel-guidance-for-passengers1 -
And the government's approach is just as rubbish.Sandpit said:
There are millions of people, many of whom are in low-paid or hourly paid work, who can’t go back to work and face losing their jobs if the schools don’t reopen.ukpaul said:Apologies if someone mentioned this but, just skimming the last thread, there's an obvious reason why Starmer won't say yes to schools going back. It's also a stupid question from Johnson, as it seems to be something else that he doesn't know about.
Starmer does want schools to further reopen but he can't push that because he's seen the returning pupil figures and, on average, only 25% of those who could return did so. Parents are clearly not on board (and polls showed that well before anyway). It might just be something to do with the initial attempt to off half a million of us and then Johnson nearly dying himself. If you want the reason why people are so cautious compared to other countries that's why, so there is very little trust left regarding what claims are being made now.
That’s before we think of the kids who need school because they have a chaotic home life, live with someone violent, addicted or abusive, don’t have a computer at home, don’t have parents who care about education etc.
It’s fine for a bunch of middle class parents who love educating their kids and can do home school in the nice garden at this time of year.
Yet Starmer, who’s been sending his own kids to school because he can, chooses not to side with getting the poor and disadvantaged kids back to school - siding instead with the teachers’ unions, for whom no amount of precautions taken would be enough.
Using schools as childcare to allow people to get back to work isn't dignified, but yes, it's part of what schools do, and needs must in a crisis.
So expand the key worker offer from "key workers who have no alternative" to "all workers who have no alternative". Take the load off individual schools by making the national remote offerings as easy to use as possible (Bitesize Daily from the BBC and Oak National Academy from a group of teachers are both pretty good). Then see how much it's possible to get everyone back part-time.
One of mine had their first day back since lockdown today. With the rooms and furniture they have, the school can just about offer 2 days a week to all of years R, 1 and 6 plus children of key workers with no alternative. I really feel for my other one, who isn't in one of those year groups and probably won't get to go back at all because of the dumb priorities the government set. It would have been much better to have got everyone in one day a week.
The guidance from central government has been rubbish, and I suspect that the (academy) school I know most about is representative. They have done the best they can with the rules put in place. The attempts by the government to weaponise this as a culture war are as disgrace.0 -
Surely the tried and tested 'fuckwits' is the noun to use.kinabalu said:
Wokeists - that is a most clumsy word.BluestBlue said:
Wokeists: All forms of diversity in all areas of life are good by definition, and the absence of diversity is bad by definition.Sandpit said:
Munira Mirza, Priti Patel, Rishi Sunak, Kemi Badenoch...Andy_JS said:"Munira Mirza is the bigoted Left's worst nightmare
The No 10 adviser tasked with a new racial equality commission refuses to bend to identity politics
RAKIB EHSAN"
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2020/06/16/munira-mirza-bigoted-lefts-worst-nightmare/?li_source=LI&li_medium=liftigniter-rhr
All the wrong sort of BAME, according to the woke left mob.
Tories: Wonderful. How about these BAME Conservatives with their own considered views on these matters?
Wokeists: Not that kind of diversity! Heretics!
Please use "the Cognescenti" in future.
If you tell me you're 'woke' I won't punch you - I will want to though.0 -
Still think the ex-RCP comrades are secretly working to overthrow capitalism from the inside by making it so unbearable that the masses will have no choice but to start a revolution. Nothing else makes sense.dixiedean said:Tories: Marxism is evil.
Others: But what about all those RCP ones you employ?
Tories: Splendid fellows. Radical free thinkers don't cha know!0 -
Are we absolutely sure Cummings wasn't a member of the RCP?0
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For better or worse it is meaningless as the Johnson majority will easily overturn it in the Commons.HYUFD said:1 -
Harold Wilson, campaigning in 1966: ‘I will never allow a Royal Dockyard to be closed. And why do I say this?’rpjs said:
No, it was one of the "world image" non-UK designs that Fatcha objected to on a model. Concorde always carried the "Chatham" Union Flag design which BA now uses fleet-wide.Carnyx said:
I was myself thinking more of those pop culture Minis or Mini Mokes of the 1960s (I am a bit too young for that era really).Mexicanpete said:
I have found it wise to steer clear of the occupants of any vehicle bearing a Union Flag or the flag of St George. Perhaps Boris is channelling his inner chav.ydoethur said:
It costs 60 times what any sane person would pay for it and is still shit?Carnyx said:
Bear in mindCarlottaVance said:
The Guardian says:Scott_xP said:
Air Force One for Boris? RAF plane for VIPs gets a union jack makeover
The prime minister’s plane, also used by royalty, is getting a new paint job costing £100,000 plus
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2020/jun/16/air-force-one-for-boris-raf-plane-for-vips-gets-a-union-jack-makeover
Which is bang in the middle for the quoted 777 repaint (not forgetting that there may be more bits n'pieces on the RAF Voyager than a regular airliner.
Where did Faisal Islam get his £900,000 from?
(a) scheme is more complex than most (not all) airliners
(b) it's a PFI job - with the implications
I'd be interested to see how the designers achieve the result on the Johnson-Mobile. It seems to be hard to get a UJ which is recogniseable without it looking like a hippymobile at one extreme or so undertstated at the other that it's not recogniseable as a UJ - like the later British Airways scheme on Concorde for instance. Didn't the latter upset Mrs T so much she draped a hanky over the GRP model showing it at a Farnborough Air Show? Or am I misremembering?
(Called "Chatham" because it was inspired by the naval flag factory at the old Chatham naval base.)
Voice from the hall: ‘Because you’re in Chatham...’2 -
I've never ever met anyone telling me that they're woke, in life or on the internet. Plenty of red faced blokes calling other people woke about, mind...Omnium said:
Surely the tried and tested 'fuckwits' is the noun to use.kinabalu said:
Wokeists - that is a most clumsy word.BluestBlue said:
Wokeists: All forms of diversity in all areas of life are good by definition, and the absence of diversity is bad by definition.Sandpit said:
Munira Mirza, Priti Patel, Rishi Sunak, Kemi Badenoch...Andy_JS said:"Munira Mirza is the bigoted Left's worst nightmare
The No 10 adviser tasked with a new racial equality commission refuses to bend to identity politics
RAKIB EHSAN"
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2020/06/16/munira-mirza-bigoted-lefts-worst-nightmare/?li_source=LI&li_medium=liftigniter-rhr
All the wrong sort of BAME, according to the woke left mob.
Tories: Wonderful. How about these BAME Conservatives with their own considered views on these matters?
Wokeists: Not that kind of diversity! Heretics!
Please use "the Cognescenti" in future.
If you tell me you're 'woke' I won't punch you - I will want to though.0 -
Do you think it's in our interests to make people laugh at us?Luckyguy1983 said:The red white and blue plane is a very good idea. The Foreign and Commonwealth Office merger is a very good idea. The motivations for both these actions are quite clear - the Government is going to do its utmost to promote Britain's interests overseas. The people dissing both these ideas are people who were never going to be reconciled to Boris, his Government, or Brexit.
1 -
I sense a blank space where a venn diagram could usefully be.Andy_JS said:"The myth of white privilege
British capitalism was built on the ruthless exploitation of wage slaves, not black slaves.
MOSES DUBE"
https://www.spiked-online.com/2020/06/17/the-myth-of-white-privilege/0 -
Under EU gov procurement laws, anyone in the EU could submit a bid of course.Luckyguy1983 said:
It's the kind of thing that sends Twitter into a frenzy, but the bottom line is that the May Government awarded the contract to the company that put in the best bid. Obviously the management of De La Rue also felt the prospect of the job going overseas was preposterous, and therefore didn't feel they needed to make their bid competitive. Personally, I would like jobs in the UK to be considered as a factor in public procurement (I don't believe it has up until this point, unlike with almost all other world governments), but equally, companies need to know they can't gouge the taxpayer.OnlyLivingBoy said:
You don't think it's ironic that the nasty EU passports were made in the UK while the nice British blue passports are made in the EU? It just sums up the stupidity of the whole exercise and how it was always about prioritising things that don't matter (what colour your passport is) over things that do (jobs).Martin_Kinsella said:
Some people, like you with your gloating and sneering, will no doubt love every single job loss in deprived communities and put it down to brexit.OnlyLivingBoy said:
Siri, give me the definition of irony.Scott_xP said:
The fact is De La Rue are in trouble and have been for a long time and closures are part of,the solution. We are fast becoming a cashless society.
https://www.forbes.com/sites/francescoppola/2020/01/30/why-is-a-company-that-prints-money-running-out-of-cash/
I have nothing but sympathy for the people who lost their jobs, btw. No gloating or sneering from me, I grew up on Tyneside so i can imagine the impact on Gateshead.
No reason why the UK can’t now demand that jobs stay in the UK for this sort of thing, although public sector contracts do usually feature in major trade deals.0 -
I hope the UK sticks to its guns on this one. And we should be applying it to all extradition treaties, particularly those with the US.Richard_Nabavi said:This is interesting (the whole thread is worth a look):
https://twitter.com/tconnellyRTE/status/1273293116301357057
https://twitter.com/tconnellyRTE/status/1273293120453607429
This one looks like a case of the EU doing exactly what it accuses the UK of doing: wanting to reproduce aspects of EU/EEA membership without us being EU/EEA members.
Edit: I see @CarlottaVance has already posted some of the thread.
1 -
Haha - so am I.ydoethur said:
And there are other considerations - New Zealand's environment is incredibly unspoiled, and therefore its food produce is second to none. The more of it that enters the food chain imo, the better for the general health of the UK.0 -
SandyRentool said:
They should just draw a giant cock on the side of the plane. Then it will be obvious who has just landed.Mexicanpete said:
He will be the envy of the other 27 EU leaders when he rocks up to trade talks in AirBorisOne/ BorisForceOne.Cyclefree said:Painting a bloody plane! Is that it? Is that what Boris is about?
The art of one-upmanship.
- you do occasionally shoot the lights out, Sandy, and this is one such. 0 -
What actually were they voting on? The Posonby Rule as codified by the Constitutional Reform and Governance Act 2010 allows either house to veto ratification of a treaty.Richard_Tyndall said:
For better or worse it is meaningless as the Johnson majority will easily overturn it in the Commons.HYUFD said:0 -
You obviously mix with the wrong crowds. It is a common self identifier amongst students. Worn as a badge of honour rather than an insult. Mind you students always have been strange creatures. It seems to be a phase people go through.Theuniondivvie said:
I've never ever met anyone telling me that they're woke, in life or on the internet. Plenty of red faced blokes calling other people woke about, mind...Omnium said:
Surely the tried and tested 'fuckwits' is the noun to use.kinabalu said:
Wokeists - that is a most clumsy word.BluestBlue said:
Wokeists: All forms of diversity in all areas of life are good by definition, and the absence of diversity is bad by definition.Sandpit said:
Munira Mirza, Priti Patel, Rishi Sunak, Kemi Badenoch...Andy_JS said:"Munira Mirza is the bigoted Left's worst nightmare
The No 10 adviser tasked with a new racial equality commission refuses to bend to identity politics
RAKIB EHSAN"
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2020/06/16/munira-mirza-bigoted-lefts-worst-nightmare/?li_source=LI&li_medium=liftigniter-rhr
All the wrong sort of BAME, according to the woke left mob.
Tories: Wonderful. How about these BAME Conservatives with their own considered views on these matters?
Wokeists: Not that kind of diversity! Heretics!
Please use "the Cognescenti" in future.
If you tell me you're 'woke' I won't punch you - I will want to though.0 -
A chance to fix something that was an unjust mess when it was introduced.Richard_Tyndall said:
I hope the UK sticks to its guns on this one. And we should be applying it to all extradition treaties, particularly those with the US.Richard_Nabavi said:This is interesting (the whole thread is worth a look):
https://twitter.com/tconnellyRTE/status/1273293116301357057
https://twitter.com/tconnellyRTE/status/1273293120453607429
This one looks like a case of the EU doing exactly what it accuses the UK of doing: wanting to reproduce aspects of EU/EEA membership without us being EU/EEA members.
Edit: I see @CarlottaVance has already posted some of the thread.
Planespotters.0 -
CPRF surely?Alistair said:Are we absolutely sure Cummings wasn't a member of the RCP?
0 -
Sadly it’s a lot worse than that. BAME conservatives have been getting racist hate mail from the far left for the past couple of weeks.BluestBlue said:
Wokeists: All forms of diversity in all areas of life are good by definition, and the absence of diversity is bad by definition.Sandpit said:
Munira Mirza, Priti Patel, Rishi Sunak, Kemi Badenoch...Andy_JS said:"Munira Mirza is the bigoted Left's worst nightmare
The No 10 adviser tasked with a new racial equality commission refuses to bend to identity politics
RAKIB EHSAN"
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2020/06/16/munira-mirza-bigoted-lefts-worst-nightmare/?li_source=LI&li_medium=liftigniter-rhr
All the wrong sort of BAME, according to the woke left mob.
Tories: Wonderful. How about these BAME Conservatives with their own considered views on these matters?
Wokeists: Not that kind of diversity! Heretics!
https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/we-need-to-talk-about-munira-mirza-and-priti-patel1 -
Sure. A look, a word - we can easily assess we're not frothing loons. At least so it should be. Quite how there are Corbyns and McDonnells escapes me.Theuniondivvie said:
I've never ever met anyone telling me that they're woke, in life or on the internet. Plenty of red faced blokes calling other people woke about, mind...Omnium said:
Surely the tried and tested 'fuckwits' is the noun to use.kinabalu said:
Wokeists - that is a most clumsy word.BluestBlue said:
Wokeists: All forms of diversity in all areas of life are good by definition, and the absence of diversity is bad by definition.Sandpit said:
Munira Mirza, Priti Patel, Rishi Sunak, Kemi Badenoch...Andy_JS said:"Munira Mirza is the bigoted Left's worst nightmare
The No 10 adviser tasked with a new racial equality commission refuses to bend to identity politics
RAKIB EHSAN"
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2020/06/16/munira-mirza-bigoted-lefts-worst-nightmare/?li_source=LI&li_medium=liftigniter-rhr
All the wrong sort of BAME, according to the woke left mob.
Tories: Wonderful. How about these BAME Conservatives with their own considered views on these matters?
Wokeists: Not that kind of diversity! Heretics!
Please use "the Cognescenti" in future.
If you tell me you're 'woke' I won't punch you - I will want to though.
I suspect that you're trying to suggest that I'm some puffing loon. Who knows. I've certainly never accused anyone of being 'woke' though. I don't plan to either - it's horrible English.0 -
Sound words. He's so odious he blots out rational analysis. Sadly, that has been to his advantage so far.Philip_Thompson said:Fingers crossed you're right.
I'm not betting on this, I despise Trump too much to bet rationally on it and don't have faith in Americans not to re-elect him.0 -
Unless you find the very concept of Britain laughable (which I suppose you may, but thankfully most don't), I don't see why either of those developments would make people laugh at us. If the design of Boris Air looks ridiculous, we can talk again.williamglenn said:
Do you think it's in our interests to make people laugh at us?Luckyguy1983 said:The red white and blue plane is a very good idea. The Foreign and Commonwealth Office merger is a very good idea. The motivations for both these actions are quite clear - the Government is going to do its utmost to promote Britain's interests overseas. The people dissing both these ideas are people who were never going to be reconciled to Boris, his Government, or Brexit.
2 -
It was the new funky tail designs that Mrs T didn’t like, that had replaced the union flag ones.Carnyx said:
I was myself thinking more of those pop culture Minis or Mini Mokes of the 1960s (I am a bit too young for that era really).Mexicanpete said:
I have found it wise to steer clear of the occupants of any vehicle bearing a Union Flag or the flag of St George. Perhaps Boris is channelling his inner chav.ydoethur said:
It costs 60 times what any sane person would pay for it and is still shit?Carnyx said:
Bear in mindCarlottaVance said:
The Guardian says:Scott_xP said:
Air Force One for Boris? RAF plane for VIPs gets a union jack makeover
The prime minister’s plane, also used by royalty, is getting a new paint job costing £100,000 plus
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2020/jun/16/air-force-one-for-boris-raf-plane-for-vips-gets-a-union-jack-makeover
Which is bang in the middle for the quoted 777 repaint (not forgetting that there may be more bits n'pieces on the RAF Voyager than a regular airliner.
Where did Faisal Islam get his £900,000 from?
(a) scheme is more complex than most (not all) airliners
(b) it's a PFI job - with the implications
I'd be interested to see how the designers achieve the result on the Johnson-Mobile. It seems to be hard to get a UJ which is recogniseable without it looking like a hippymobile at one extreme or so undertstated at the other that it's not recogniseable as a UJ - like the later British Airways scheme on Concorde for instance. Didn't the latter upset Mrs T so much she draped a hanky over the GRP model showing it at a Farnborough Air Show? Or am I misremembering?
3 -
I had assumed it was a term which began as a self identifier but that it is now primarily used by those who use it as an insult - I have encountered at least one real person who used it in a positive sense, much to my surprise, so I think it cannot have simply been a perjorative invention.Theuniondivvie said:
I've never ever met anyone telling me that they're woke, in life or on the internet. Plenty of red faced blokes calling other people woke about, mind...Omnium said:
Surely the tried and tested 'fuckwits' is the noun to use.kinabalu said:
Wokeists - that is a most clumsy word.BluestBlue said:
Wokeists: All forms of diversity in all areas of life are good by definition, and the absence of diversity is bad by definition.Sandpit said:
Munira Mirza, Priti Patel, Rishi Sunak, Kemi Badenoch...Andy_JS said:"Munira Mirza is the bigoted Left's worst nightmare
The No 10 adviser tasked with a new racial equality commission refuses to bend to identity politics
RAKIB EHSAN"
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2020/06/16/munira-mirza-bigoted-lefts-worst-nightmare/?li_source=LI&li_medium=liftigniter-rhr
All the wrong sort of BAME, according to the woke left mob.
Tories: Wonderful. How about these BAME Conservatives with their own considered views on these matters?
Wokeists: Not that kind of diversity! Heretics!
Please use "the Cognescenti" in future.
If you tell me you're 'woke' I won't punch you - I will want to though.
0 -
Highest point on Earth I've ever reached - the earthquake was a real tragedy. Wonder if it made the tourist trade that much more careful.kinabalu said:2 -
Kiwis are green, with lots of black seeds.kinabalu said:1 -
I somehow doubt it will be something subtle like this.Luckyguy1983 said:
Unless you find the very concept of Britain laughable (which I suppose you may, but thankfully most don't), I don't see why either of those developments would make people laugh at us. If the design of Boris Air looks ridiculous, we can talk again.williamglenn said:
Do you think it's in our interests to make people laugh at us?Luckyguy1983 said:The red white and blue plane is a very good idea. The Foreign and Commonwealth Office merger is a very good idea. The motivations for both these actions are quite clear - the Government is going to do its utmost to promote Britain's interests overseas. The people dissing both these ideas are people who were never going to be reconciled to Boris, his Government, or Brexit.
0 -
According to Edwin Chadwick in 1840, 57% of the working-class children of Manchester died before their fifth birthday, compared with 32% in rural districts. Whereas a farm labourer in Rutland had a life-expectancy of 38, a factory worker in Liverpool had an average age of death of 15.kinabalu said:
I sense a blank space where a venn diagram could usefully be.Andy_JS said:"The myth of white privilege
British capitalism was built on the ruthless exploitation of wage slaves, not black slaves.
MOSES DUBE"
https://www.spiked-online.com/2020/06/17/the-myth-of-white-privilege/
It was slavery in all but name.1 -
Thank you! Nice to see those photos again - after so long.Sandpit said:
It was the new funky tail designs that Mrs T didn’t like, that had replaced the union flag ones.Carnyx said:
I was myself thinking more of those pop culture Minis or Mini Mokes of the 1960s (I am a bit too young for that era really).Mexicanpete said:
I have found it wise to steer clear of the occupants of any vehicle bearing a Union Flag or the flag of St George. Perhaps Boris is channelling his inner chav.ydoethur said:
It costs 60 times what any sane person would pay for it and is still shit?Carnyx said:
Bear in mindCarlottaVance said:
The Guardian says:Scott_xP said:
Air Force One for Boris? RAF plane for VIPs gets a union jack makeover
The prime minister’s plane, also used by royalty, is getting a new paint job costing £100,000 plus
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2020/jun/16/air-force-one-for-boris-raf-plane-for-vips-gets-a-union-jack-makeover
Which is bang in the middle for the quoted 777 repaint (not forgetting that there may be more bits n'pieces on the RAF Voyager than a regular airliner.
Where did Faisal Islam get his £900,000 from?
(a) scheme is more complex than most (not all) airliners
(b) it's a PFI job - with the implications
I'd be interested to see how the designers achieve the result on the Johnson-Mobile. It seems to be hard to get a UJ which is recogniseable without it looking like a hippymobile at one extreme or so undertstated at the other that it's not recogniseable as a UJ - like the later British Airways scheme on Concorde for instance. Didn't the latter upset Mrs T so much she draped a hanky over the GRP model showing it at a Farnborough Air Show? Or am I misremembering?0 -
It could be just a perception, but my feeling is that most EU states pretty much ignore EU competition laws when it comes to public procurement. If there are hundreds of German police cars that are Renaults and Italian police cars that are BMWs, I've missed them. I've never got that with the British Government/civil service, and I've never really known why.Sandpit said:
Under EU gov procurement laws, anyone in the EU could submit a bid of course.Luckyguy1983 said:
It's the kind of thing that sends Twitter into a frenzy, but the bottom line is that the May Government awarded the contract to the company that put in the best bid. Obviously the management of De La Rue also felt the prospect of the job going overseas was preposterous, and therefore didn't feel they needed to make their bid competitive. Personally, I would like jobs in the UK to be considered as a factor in public procurement (I don't believe it has up until this point, unlike with almost all other world governments), but equally, companies need to know they can't gouge the taxpayer.OnlyLivingBoy said:
You don't think it's ironic that the nasty EU passports were made in the UK while the nice British blue passports are made in the EU? It just sums up the stupidity of the whole exercise and how it was always about prioritising things that don't matter (what colour your passport is) over things that do (jobs).Martin_Kinsella said:
Some people, like you with your gloating and sneering, will no doubt love every single job loss in deprived communities and put it down to brexit.OnlyLivingBoy said:
Siri, give me the definition of irony.Scott_xP said:
The fact is De La Rue are in trouble and have been for a long time and closures are part of,the solution. We are fast becoming a cashless society.
https://www.forbes.com/sites/francescoppola/2020/01/30/why-is-a-company-that-prints-money-running-out-of-cash/
I have nothing but sympathy for the people who lost their jobs, btw. No gloating or sneering from me, I grew up on Tyneside so i can imagine the impact on Gateshead.
No reason why the UK can’t now demand that jobs stay in the UK for this sort of thing, although public sector contracts do usually feature in major trade deals.1 -
If Galileo was a "solar system skeptic", yes.BluestBlue said:
More like appointing Galileo to research astronomy rather than leaving it in the hands of the Catholic Inquisition...kinabalu said:
As refreshing as appointing a homeopath to spearhead a review into cancer treatments.BluestBlue said:
Extremely refreshing and important. The identitarian left is about to discover that genuine diversity comes in thought as well as in immutable characteristics...Andy_JS said:"Munira Mirza is the bigoted Left's worst nightmare
The No 10 adviser tasked with a new racial equality commission refuses to bend to identity politics
RAKIB EHSAN"
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2020/06/16/munira-mirza-bigoted-lefts-worst-nightmare/?li_source=LI&li_medium=liftigniter-rhr0 -
Red, white and blue!williamglenn said:
I somehow doubt it will be something subtle like this.Luckyguy1983 said:
Unless you find the very concept of Britain laughable (which I suppose you may, but thankfully most don't), I don't see why either of those developments would make people laugh at us. If the design of Boris Air looks ridiculous, we can talk again.williamglenn said:
Do you think it's in our interests to make people laugh at us?Luckyguy1983 said:The red white and blue plane is a very good idea. The Foreign and Commonwealth Office merger is a very good idea. The motivations for both these actions are quite clear - the Government is going to do its utmost to promote Britain's interests overseas. The people dissing both these ideas are people who were never going to be reconciled to Boris, his Government, or Brexit.
0 -
Which people and about what is they key thing I think. The colour scheme of a plane, or its design, or even how much it costs, are not something that will be of any consequence. People might raise some of the petty crap Trump has done, but none of that is of any consequence next to the much more substantive things he has done. And even those won't matter in terms of government interests with foreign governments and peoples, since they'd be foolish to let such a thing impact their own actions. If Macron spent too much sprucing up his bathroom to look like a cabin on the Titanic that would probably be very silly and make people laugh at him, but it wouldn't matter abroad.williamglenn said:
Do you think it's in our interests to make people laugh at us?Luckyguy1983 said:The red white and blue plane is a very good idea. The Foreign and Commonwealth Office merger is a very good idea. The motivations for both these actions are quite clear - the Government is going to do its utmost to promote Britain's interests overseas. The people dissing both these ideas are people who were never going to be reconciled to Boris, his Government, or Brexit.
We worry far far too much about 'people' laughing at us.4 -
That's good. Like all the other prerogative powers it would be good to see this brought properly under the control of Parliament. Not sure in that case what Adonis is going on about.rpjs said:
What actually were they voting on? The Posonby Rule as codified by the Constitutional Reform and Governance Act 2010 allows either house to veto ratification of a treaty.Richard_Tyndall said:
For better or worse it is meaningless as the Johnson majority will easily overturn it in the Commons.HYUFD said:0 -
But surely not if 'we' is Mr Johnson and his party, and 'people' are UK voters. I suspect there has been a calculation already. But if it turns out like an episode of Pimp My Wings ...kle4 said:
Which people and about what is they key thing I think. The colour scheme of a plane, or its design, or even how much it costs, are not something that will be of any consequence. People might raise some of the petty crap Trump has done, but none of that is of any consequence next to the much more substantive things he has done. And even those won't matter in terms of government interests with foreign governments and peoples, since they'd be foolish to let such a thing impact their own actions. If Macron spent too much sprucing up his bathroom to look like a cabin on the Titanic that would probably be very silly and make people laugh at him, but it wouldn't matter abroad.williamglenn said:
Do you think it's in our interests to make people laugh at us?Luckyguy1983 said:The red white and blue plane is a very good idea. The Foreign and Commonwealth Office merger is a very good idea. The motivations for both these actions are quite clear - the Government is going to do its utmost to promote Britain's interests overseas. The people dissing both these ideas are people who were never going to be reconciled to Boris, his Government, or Brexit.
We worry far far too much about 'people' laughing at us.0 -
Luckyguy1983 said:
It could be just a perception, but my feeling is that most EU states pretty much ignore EU competition laws when it comes to public procurement. If there are hundreds of German police cars that are Renaults and Italian police cars that are BMWs, I've missed them. I've never got that with the British Government/civil service, and I've never really known why.Sandpit said:
Under EU gov procurement laws, anyone in the EU could submit a bid of course.Luckyguy1983 said:
It's the kind of thing that sends Twitter into a frenzy, but the bottom line is that the May Government awarded the contract to the company that put in the best bid. Obviously the management of De La Rue also felt the prospect of the job going overseas was preposterous, and therefore didn't feel they needed to make their bid competitive. Personally, I would like jobs in the UK to be considered as a factor in public procurement (I don't believe it has up until this point, unlike with almost all other world governments), but equally, companies need to know they can't gouge the taxpayer.OnlyLivingBoy said:
You don't think it's ironic that the nasty EU passports were made in the UK while the nice British blue passports are made in the EU? It just sums up the stupidity of the whole exercise and how it was always about prioritising things that don't matter (what colour your passport is) over things that do (jobs).Martin_Kinsella said:
Some people, like you with your gloating and sneering, will no doubt love every single job loss in deprived communities and put it down to brexit.OnlyLivingBoy said:
Siri, give me the definition of irony.Scott_xP said:
The fact is De La Rue are in trouble and have been for a long time and closures are part of,the solution. We are fast becoming a cashless society.
https://www.forbes.com/sites/francescoppola/2020/01/30/why-is-a-company-that-prints-money-running-out-of-cash/
I have nothing but sympathy for the people who lost their jobs, btw. No gloating or sneering from me, I grew up on Tyneside so i can imagine the impact on Gateshead.
No reason why the UK can’t now demand that jobs stay in the UK for this sort of thing, although public sector contracts do usually feature in major trade deals.
0 -
It won't be exactly like that, because we're not France. However, it won't necessarily be worse, as you automatically assume.williamglenn said:
I somehow doubt it will be something subtle like this.Luckyguy1983 said:
Unless you find the very concept of Britain laughable (which I suppose you may, but thankfully most don't), I don't see why either of those developments would make people laugh at us. If the design of Boris Air looks ridiculous, we can talk again.williamglenn said:
Do you think it's in our interests to make people laugh at us?Luckyguy1983 said:The red white and blue plane is a very good idea. The Foreign and Commonwealth Office merger is a very good idea. The motivations for both these actions are quite clear - the Government is going to do its utmost to promote Britain's interests overseas. The people dissing both these ideas are people who were never going to be reconciled to Boris, his Government, or Brexit.
0 -
As the expression used was about '[laughing] at us' from someone who is not a fan of Boris I thought it safe to assume the question was in the context of foreign relations and impact on the interests of this country, and as is usually the case in these situations it assumes foreign governments are far more petty than I think most are.Carnyx said:
But surely not if 'we' is Mr Johnson and his party, and 'people' are UK voters. I suspect there has been a calculation already. But if it turns out like an episode of Pimp My Wings ...kle4 said:
Which people and about what is they key thing I think. The colour scheme of a plane, or its design, or even how much it costs, are not something that will be of any consequence. People might raise some of the petty crap Trump has done, but none of that is of any consequence next to the much more substantive things he has done. And even those won't matter in terms of government interests with foreign governments and peoples, since they'd be foolish to let such a thing impact their own actions. If Macron spent too much sprucing up his bathroom to look like a cabin on the Titanic that would probably be very silly and make people laugh at him, but it wouldn't matter abroad.williamglenn said:
Do you think it's in our interests to make people laugh at us?Luckyguy1983 said:The red white and blue plane is a very good idea. The Foreign and Commonwealth Office merger is a very good idea. The motivations for both these actions are quite clear - the Government is going to do its utmost to promote Britain's interests overseas. The people dissing both these ideas are people who were never going to be reconciled to Boris, his Government, or Brexit.
We worry far far too much about 'people' laughing at us.
Obviously Boris and co becoming a laughing stock among people who presently like him would be of significance, and small issues can cumulatively end up having a big impact on how people and party, even if the issue itself is misleading, but I suspect the impact is limited.1 -
Indeed it was. And is - it continues in many places around the world today.Richard_Tyndall said:
According to Edwin Chadwick in 1840, 57% of the working-class children of Manchester died before their fifth birthday, compared with 32% in rural districts. Whereas a farm labourer in Rutland had a life-expectancy of 38, a factory worker in Liverpool had an average age of death of 15.kinabalu said:
I sense a blank space where a venn diagram could usefully be.Andy_JS said:"The myth of white privilege
British capitalism was built on the ruthless exploitation of wage slaves, not black slaves.
MOSES DUBE"
https://www.spiked-online.com/2020/06/17/the-myth-of-white-privilege/
It was slavery in all but name.
Capitalism needs its victims. It must eat.0 -
You speak great sense of food welfare matters and food in general. It’s just a shame you are such a crank on everything else!Luckyguy1983 said:
Haha - so am I.ydoethur said:
And there are other considerations - New Zealand's environment is incredibly unspoiled, and therefore its food produce is second to none. The more of it that enters the food chain imo, the better for the general health of the UK.1 -
Of course it doesn't. It can work perfectly well without 'victims'. After all its not something extreme like Marxism.kinabalu said:
Indeed it was. And is - it continues in many places around the world today.Richard_Tyndall said:
According to Edwin Chadwick in 1840, 57% of the working-class children of Manchester died before their fifth birthday, compared with 32% in rural districts. Whereas a farm labourer in Rutland had a life-expectancy of 38, a factory worker in Liverpool had an average age of death of 15.kinabalu said:
I sense a blank space where a venn diagram could usefully be.Andy_JS said:"The myth of white privilege
British capitalism was built on the ruthless exploitation of wage slaves, not black slaves.
MOSES DUBE"
https://www.spiked-online.com/2020/06/17/the-myth-of-white-privilege/
It was slavery in all but name.
Capitalism needs its victims. It must eat. 1 -
I thank you for the compliment and duck the swipe.Anabobazina said:
You speak great sense of food welfare matters and food in general. It’s just a shame you are such a crank on everything else!Luckyguy1983 said:
Haha - so am I.ydoethur said:
And there are other considerations - New Zealand's environment is incredibly unspoiled, and therefore its food produce is second to none. The more of it that enters the food chain imo, the better for the general health of the UK.
2 -
Because any job on a plane needs to be done by certified people!ydoethur said:
Why do they need certifying?Sandpit said:
Ah, political journalists trying to be experts on aviation again. What could possibly go wrong?Scott_xP said:
$50k might be the cost of a plane’s worth of paint for AA, who buy it by the tonne. It’s sure as hell not the cost of the hangar, scaffolding, mobile platforms, design, printing of masks, paper, tape, stripper for the old paint - oh, and about a dozen certified people working for a week or two on it. £900k is about right.
Although I suppose they would be working for Johnson which would send anyone round the twist...
In practice, you usually have the team leaders as certified, and they sign for the work of the juniors under them. The seniors then cross check each others’s work for what is known as a duplicate inspection. They don’t recruit sprayers from the local auto repair shop and put them on a plane without a lot of training, and as you’d expect they get well paid for the work they do.
More than one plane has crashed, because important instrument holes got covered up by paint, or someone left some tape on the plane when they finished.
£1m or thereabouts to paint a £200m plane is going to be about right, for a single piece to a unique design.0 -
Agree 100%, and it’s one of the many things that led up to the Brexit vote.Luckyguy1983 said:
It could be just a perception, but my feeling is that most EU states pretty much ignore EU competition laws when it comes to public procurement. If there are hundreds of German police cars that are Renaults and Italian police cars that are BMWs, I've missed them. I've never got that with the British Government/civil service, and I've never really known why.Sandpit said:
Under EU gov procurement laws, anyone in the EU could submit a bid of course.Luckyguy1983 said:
It's the kind of thing that sends Twitter into a frenzy, but the bottom line is that the May Government awarded the contract to the company that put in the best bid. Obviously the management of De La Rue also felt the prospect of the job going overseas was preposterous, and therefore didn't feel they needed to make their bid competitive. Personally, I would like jobs in the UK to be considered as a factor in public procurement (I don't believe it has up until this point, unlike with almost all other world governments), but equally, companies need to know they can't gouge the taxpayer.OnlyLivingBoy said:
You don't think it's ironic that the nasty EU passports were made in the UK while the nice British blue passports are made in the EU? It just sums up the stupidity of the whole exercise and how it was always about prioritising things that don't matter (what colour your passport is) over things that do (jobs).Martin_Kinsella said:
Some people, like you with your gloating and sneering, will no doubt love every single job loss in deprived communities and put it down to brexit.OnlyLivingBoy said:
Siri, give me the definition of irony.Scott_xP said:
The fact is De La Rue are in trouble and have been for a long time and closures are part of,the solution. We are fast becoming a cashless society.
https://www.forbes.com/sites/francescoppola/2020/01/30/why-is-a-company-that-prints-money-running-out-of-cash/
I have nothing but sympathy for the people who lost their jobs, btw. No gloating or sneering from me, I grew up on Tyneside so i can imagine the impact on Gateshead.
No reason why the UK can’t now demand that jobs stay in the UK for this sort of thing, although public sector contracts do usually feature in major trade deals.0 -
I think you'll find that almost all scientists are sceptics by nature - it's what distinguishes science from religion. And my goodness it's time for the religion of woke to experience its Enlightenment...kinabalu said:
If Galileo was a "solar system skeptic", yes.BluestBlue said:
More like appointing Galileo to research astronomy rather than leaving it in the hands of the Catholic Inquisition...kinabalu said:
As refreshing as appointing a homeopath to spearhead a review into cancer treatments.BluestBlue said:
Extremely refreshing and important. The identitarian left is about to discover that genuine diversity comes in thought as well as in immutable characteristics...Andy_JS said:"Munira Mirza is the bigoted Left's worst nightmare
The No 10 adviser tasked with a new racial equality commission refuses to bend to identity politics
RAKIB EHSAN"
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2020/06/16/munira-mirza-bigoted-lefts-worst-nightmare/?li_source=LI&li_medium=liftigniter-rhr
p.s. If you don't like 'Wokeists', then how about 'Egregorotes', as ἐγρηγορότες? Though Omnium's probably hit upon the correct vernacular already.1 -
If the problem is a lack of patriotism among the British elite, how does Brexit help?Sandpit said:
Agree 100%, and it’s one of the many things that led up to the Brexit wore.Luckyguy1983 said:
It could be just a perception, but my feeling is that most EU states pretty much ignore EU competition laws when it comes to public procurement. If there are hundreds of German police cars that are Renaults and Italian police cars that are BMWs, I've missed them. I've never got that with the British Government/civil service, and I've never really known why.Sandpit said:
Under EU gov procurement laws, anyone in the EU could submit a bid of course.Luckyguy1983 said:
It's the kind of thing that sends Twitter into a frenzy, but the bottom line is that the May Government awarded the contract to the company that put in the best bid. Obviously the management of De La Rue also felt the prospect of the job going overseas was preposterous, and therefore didn't feel they needed to make their bid competitive. Personally, I would like jobs in the UK to be considered as a factor in public procurement (I don't believe it has up until this point, unlike with almost all other world governments), but equally, companies need to know they can't gouge the taxpayer.OnlyLivingBoy said:
You don't think it's ironic that the nasty EU passports were made in the UK while the nice British blue passports are made in the EU? It just sums up the stupidity of the whole exercise and how it was always about prioritising things that don't matter (what colour your passport is) over things that do (jobs).Martin_Kinsella said:
Some people, like you with your gloating and sneering, will no doubt love every single job loss in deprived communities and put it down to brexit.OnlyLivingBoy said:
Siri, give me the definition of irony.Scott_xP said:
The fact is De La Rue are in trouble and have been for a long time and closures are part of,the solution. We are fast becoming a cashless society.
https://www.forbes.com/sites/francescoppola/2020/01/30/why-is-a-company-that-prints-money-running-out-of-cash/
I have nothing but sympathy for the people who lost their jobs, btw. No gloating or sneering from me, I grew up on Tyneside so i can imagine the impact on Gateshead.
No reason why the UK can’t now demand that jobs stay in the UK for this sort of thing, although public sector contracts do usually feature in major trade deals.0 -
You did very well. The air is thin up there.sarissa said:
Highest point on Earth I've ever reached - the earthquake was a real tragedy. Wonder if it made the tourist trade that much more careful.kinabalu said:0 -
Goal line technology has screwed up there.
Doesn't VAR kick in there?0 -
Don’t think so. I’ll be livid if that loses me my bet on Sheff Utd for Top 6 @50-1.TheScreamingEagles said:Goal line technology has screwed up there.
Doesn't VAR kick in there?
0 -
But you know what I mean.BluestBlue said:
I think you'll find that almost all scientists are sceptics by nature - it's what distinguishes science from religion. And my goodness it's time for the religion of woke to experience its Enlightenment...kinabalu said:
If Galileo was a "solar system skeptic", yes.BluestBlue said:
More like appointing Galileo to research astronomy rather than leaving it in the hands of the Catholic Inquisition...kinabalu said:
As refreshing as appointing a homeopath to spearhead a review into cancer treatments.BluestBlue said:
Extremely refreshing and important. The identitarian left is about to discover that genuine diversity comes in thought as well as in immutable characteristics...Andy_JS said:"Munira Mirza is the bigoted Left's worst nightmare
The No 10 adviser tasked with a new racial equality commission refuses to bend to identity politics
RAKIB EHSAN"
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2020/06/16/munira-mirza-bigoted-lefts-worst-nightmare/?li_source=LI&li_medium=liftigniter-rhr
p.s. If you don't like 'Wokeists', then how about 'Egregorotes', as ἐγρηγορότες? Though Omnium's probably hit upon the correct vernacular already.
Your problem is that you're on the wrong side of history. Really don't envy you that. It's a place littered with bitterness and disappointment.0 -
Looked for all the world to be over the line.TheScreamingEagles said:Goal line technology has screwed up there.
Doesn't VAR kick in there?
(Great, great stuff that we can argue about this stuff again ♥️⚽️)0 -
I'll be gutted for you as well.tlg86 said:
Don’t think so. I’ll be livid if that loses me my bet on Sheff Utd for Top 6 @50-1.TheScreamingEagles said:Goal line technology has screwed up there.
Doesn't VAR kick in there?
https://twitter.com/TSF/status/12733111965617111050 -
That doesn't really persuade me away from my point about never having met anyone self identifying as such (mainly because it's a fact). However we don't need anecdotal evidence for the reverse, indeed there are several such users on here this very eve.kle4 said:
I had assumed it was a term which began as a self identifier but that it is now primarily used by those who use it as an insult - I have encountered at least one real person who used it in a positive sense, much to my surprise, so I think it cannot have simply been a perjorative invention.Theuniondivvie said:
I've never ever met anyone telling me that they're woke, in life or on the internet. Plenty of red faced blokes calling other people woke about, mind...Omnium said:
Surely the tried and tested 'fuckwits' is the noun to use.kinabalu said:
Wokeists - that is a most clumsy word.BluestBlue said:
Wokeists: All forms of diversity in all areas of life are good by definition, and the absence of diversity is bad by definition.Sandpit said:
Munira Mirza, Priti Patel, Rishi Sunak, Kemi Badenoch...Andy_JS said:"Munira Mirza is the bigoted Left's worst nightmare
The No 10 adviser tasked with a new racial equality commission refuses to bend to identity politics
RAKIB EHSAN"
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2020/06/16/munira-mirza-bigoted-lefts-worst-nightmare/?li_source=LI&li_medium=liftigniter-rhr
All the wrong sort of BAME, according to the woke left mob.
Tories: Wonderful. How about these BAME Conservatives with their own considered views on these matters?
Wokeists: Not that kind of diversity! Heretics!
Please use "the Cognescenti" in future.
If you tell me you're 'woke' I won't punch you - I will want to though.0 -
0
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I can detect the digital tongue in the digital cheek. Which is always nice.Richard_Tyndall said:
Of course it doesn't. It can work perfectly well without 'victims'. After all its not something extreme like Marxism.kinabalu said:
Indeed it was. And is - it continues in many places around the world today.Richard_Tyndall said:
According to Edwin Chadwick in 1840, 57% of the working-class children of Manchester died before their fifth birthday, compared with 32% in rural districts. Whereas a farm labourer in Rutland had a life-expectancy of 38, a factory worker in Liverpool had an average age of death of 15.kinabalu said:
I sense a blank space where a venn diagram could usefully be.Andy_JS said:"The myth of white privilege
British capitalism was built on the ruthless exploitation of wage slaves, not black slaves.
MOSES DUBE"
https://www.spiked-online.com/2020/06/17/the-myth-of-white-privilege/
It was slavery in all but name.
Capitalism needs its victims. It must eat.0 -
It was a joke...Sandpit said:
Because any job on a plane needs to be done by certified people!ydoethur said:
Why do they need certifying?Sandpit said:
Ah, political journalists trying to be experts on aviation again. What could possibly go wrong?Scott_xP said:
$50k might be the cost of a plane’s worth of paint for AA, who buy it by the tonne. It’s sure as hell not the cost of the hangar, scaffolding, mobile platforms, design, printing of masks, paper, tape, stripper for the old paint - oh, and about a dozen certified people working for a week or two on it. £900k is about right.
Although I suppose they would be working for Johnson which would send anyone round the twist...
In practice, you usually have the team leaders as certified, and they sign for the work of the juniors under them. The seniors then cross check each others’s work for what is known as a duplicate inspection. They don’t recruit sprayers from the local auto repair shop and put them on a plane without a lot of training, and as you’d expect they get well paid for the work they do.
More than one plane has crashed, because important instrument holes got covered up by paint, or someone left some tape on the plane when they finished.
£1m or thereabouts to paint a £200m plane is going to be about right, for a single piece to a unique design.1 -
How is that not a goal?TheScreamingEagles said:Ah I missed you football.
https://twitter.com/talkSPORT/status/1273310888477548544
Is the technology as rusty as the ref’s eyesight?
On the positive side, we have sport back!0 -
I'm happier with "member of the cognescenti".Omnium said:
Surely the tried and tested 'fuckwits' is the noun to use.kinabalu said:
Wokeists - that is a most clumsy word.BluestBlue said:
Wokeists: All forms of diversity in all areas of life are good by definition, and the absence of diversity is bad by definition.Sandpit said:
Munira Mirza, Priti Patel, Rishi Sunak, Kemi Badenoch...Andy_JS said:"Munira Mirza is the bigoted Left's worst nightmare
The No 10 adviser tasked with a new racial equality commission refuses to bend to identity politics
RAKIB EHSAN"
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2020/06/16/munira-mirza-bigoted-lefts-worst-nightmare/?li_source=LI&li_medium=liftigniter-rhr
All the wrong sort of BAME, according to the woke left mob.
Tories: Wonderful. How about these BAME Conservatives with their own considered views on these matters?
Wokeists: Not that kind of diversity! Heretics!
Please use "the Cognescenti" in future.
If you tell me you're 'woke' I won't punch you - I will want to though.
A cog?
Call me a bloody cog?0 -
My view, Michael Oliver thought it was goal but the protocol is that he has to wait for the alert on his wrist to confirm the goal.Sandpit said:
How is that not a goal?TheScreamingEagles said:Ah I missed you football.
https://twitter.com/talkSPORT/status/1273310888477548544
Is the technology as rusty as the ref’s eyesight?0 -
Wrong side of today's history is the Labour party - and the description fits.kinabalu said:
But you know what I mean.BluestBlue said:
I think you'll find that almost all scientists are sceptics by nature - it's what distinguishes science from religion. And my goodness it's time for the religion of woke to experience its Enlightenment...kinabalu said:
If Galileo was a "solar system skeptic", yes.BluestBlue said:
More like appointing Galileo to research astronomy rather than leaving it in the hands of the Catholic Inquisition...kinabalu said:
As refreshing as appointing a homeopath to spearhead a review into cancer treatments.BluestBlue said:
Extremely refreshing and important. The identitarian left is about to discover that genuine diversity comes in thought as well as in immutable characteristics...Andy_JS said:"Munira Mirza is the bigoted Left's worst nightmare
The No 10 adviser tasked with a new racial equality commission refuses to bend to identity politics
RAKIB EHSAN"
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2020/06/16/munira-mirza-bigoted-lefts-worst-nightmare/?li_source=LI&li_medium=liftigniter-rhr
p.s. If you don't like 'Wokeists', then how about 'Egregorotes', as ἐγρηγορότες? Though Omnium's probably hit upon the correct vernacular already.
Your problem is that you're on the wrong side of history. Really don't envy you that. It's a place littered with bitterness and disappointment.
Tomorrow's history - who knows.
1 -
So VAR could have overruled the goal line error, so say Sky Sports.1
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On topic, Robert, I hope you're right, but on Sunday I'm explaining why I'm not confident on ruling out Trump.0
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Nah, the goal line technology is still on furlough.CatMan said:2 -
Arguably GLT should be switched off for the second half.
EDIT: The game should be null and void if it’s confirmed that GLT has failed.0 -
Barrow back in Football League after 48 years.1
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Sky are reporting that the referee’s watch did vibrate and flash for a goal ... during the half-time break.tlg86 said:Arguably GLT should be switched off for the second half.
EDIT: The game should be null and void if it’s confirmed that GLT has failed.0 -
Dominic Cummings refereeing the Villa - United game ?0
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Imagine if that relegates West Ham!TheScreamingEagles said:
Sky are reporting that the referee’s watch did vibrate and flash for a goal ... during the half-time break.tlg86 said:Arguably GLT should be switched off for the second half.
EDIT: The game should be null and void if it’s confirmed that GLT has failed.0 -
Sounds like grounds for legal challenge to me!TheScreamingEagles said:
Sky are reporting that the referee’s watch did vibrate and flash for a goal ... during the half-time break.tlg86 said:Arguably GLT should be switched off for the second half.
EDIT: The game should be null and void if it’s confirmed that GLT has failed.0 -
Do you honestly believe that a 'right side of history' even exists? You're kind of illustrating my point by putting your faith - and faith it is - in the distant teleological vindication of a peculiar set of beliefs that happened to gain minor currency in the early 21st century West. There's no such thing as being proved right 'in the end', because history has no end.kinabalu said:
But you know what I mean.BluestBlue said:
I think you'll find that almost all scientists are sceptics by nature - it's what distinguishes science from religion. And my goodness it's time for the religion of woke to experience its Enlightenment...kinabalu said:
If Galileo was a "solar system skeptic", yes.BluestBlue said:
More like appointing Galileo to research astronomy rather than leaving it in the hands of the Catholic Inquisition...kinabalu said:
As refreshing as appointing a homeopath to spearhead a review into cancer treatments.BluestBlue said:
Extremely refreshing and important. The identitarian left is about to discover that genuine diversity comes in thought as well as in immutable characteristics...Andy_JS said:"Munira Mirza is the bigoted Left's worst nightmare
The No 10 adviser tasked with a new racial equality commission refuses to bend to identity politics
RAKIB EHSAN"
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2020/06/16/munira-mirza-bigoted-lefts-worst-nightmare/?li_source=LI&li_medium=liftigniter-rhr
p.s. If you don't like 'Wokeists', then how about 'Egregorotes', as ἐγρηγορότες? Though Omnium's probably hit upon the correct vernacular already.
Your problem is that you're on the wrong side of history. Really don't envy you that. It's a place littered with bitterness and disappointment.
Still, your idea has a mirror image in that of conservative pessimism, which dictates that one day the forces of chaos and entropy will indeed inevitably win and drag us all down into their soggy mire.
But what do we say to the God of Woke? Not today!1 -
Fans of the Blades will take that.tlg86 said:
Imagine if that relegates West Ham!TheScreamingEagles said:
Sky are reporting that the referee’s watch did vibrate and flash for a goal ... during the half-time break.tlg86 said:Arguably GLT should be switched off for the second half.
EDIT: The game should be null and void if it’s confirmed that GLT has failed.1 -
When I look at the ramifications of relegation this season from the PL it is entirely possible some of the relegated clubs could be utterly destroyed.kle4 said:
Sounds like grounds for legal challenge to me!TheScreamingEagles said:
Sky are reporting that the referee’s watch did vibrate and flash for a goal ... during the half-time break.tlg86 said:Arguably GLT should be switched off for the second half.
EDIT: The game should be null and void if it’s confirmed that GLT has failed.0 -
I heard the funny story of a Maoist in Switzerland who followed the "long march through the institutions" plan to advance into senior positions in society, ready for the revolution. I knew him slightly (though I only heard about his nefarious plan later), and the pharmaceutical company (Ciba-Geigy) was vaguely aware that he had radical political ideas but felt they were not a proper matter for the company to investigate, so they were happy to use his undoubted talents. He did indeed achieve a senior position in the company and was poised to assist the masses when they rose up. At that point, his party fell apart and dissolved itself, and Maoism itself started to seem an outdated idea.rpjs said:
Still think the ex-RCP comrades are secretly working to overthrow capitalism from the inside by making it so unbearable that the masses will have no choice but to start a revolution. Nothing else makes sense.dixiedean said:Tories: Marxism is evil.
Others: But what about all those RCP ones you employ?
Tories: Splendid fellows. Radical free thinkers don't cha know!
What to do? He shrugged and settled down to a career as a good senior manager. He, and the company, as as far as I could tell the Swiss masses were all content with the outcome. I'm not sure what the moral is.4 -
Tony Connolly write up on the UK EU bust up over extradition:
https://www.rte.ie/news/brexit/2020/0617/1148078-eu-uk-extradition-post-brexit/
According to the House of Commons Library, extradition requests to the UK under the EAW increased from 1,865 in 2004 to 12,613 in 2015.
Requests made by the UK to other Member States went up from 96 to 228 per year over the same period.1 -
Willie Thorne has died.
Willie Thorne: Snooker favourite dies aged 66
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/snooker/530768610 -
Genius from the leader of the free world:
"If we stop testing right now, we'd have very few cases, if any," Trump said Monday0 -
They were on the wrong side of history on Dec 12th 2019. This is undeniable. But that's history now.Omnium said:
Wrong side of today's history is the Labour party - and the description fits.kinabalu said:
But you know what I mean.BluestBlue said:
I think you'll find that almost all scientists are sceptics by nature - it's what distinguishes science from religion. And my goodness it's time for the religion of woke to experience its Enlightenment...kinabalu said:
If Galileo was a "solar system skeptic", yes.BluestBlue said:
More like appointing Galileo to research astronomy rather than leaving it in the hands of the Catholic Inquisition...kinabalu said:
As refreshing as appointing a homeopath to spearhead a review into cancer treatments.BluestBlue said:
Extremely refreshing and important. The identitarian left is about to discover that genuine diversity comes in thought as well as in immutable characteristics...Andy_JS said:"Munira Mirza is the bigoted Left's worst nightmare
The No 10 adviser tasked with a new racial equality commission refuses to bend to identity politics
RAKIB EHSAN"
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2020/06/16/munira-mirza-bigoted-lefts-worst-nightmare/?li_source=LI&li_medium=liftigniter-rhr
p.s. If you don't like 'Wokeists', then how about 'Egregorotes', as ἐγρηγορότες? Though Omnium's probably hit upon the correct vernacular already.
Your problem is that you're on the wrong side of history. Really don't envy you that. It's a place littered with bitterness and disappointment.
Tomorrow's history - who knows.0
This discussion has been closed.