politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » Johnson’s first battle as PM with the BXP looks set to be at B
Comments
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'Trolls' and 'feeding' come to mind!Philip_Thompson said:
Incest is illegal full stop. With or without marriage. You are comparing an illegal relationship for a legal one for some bizarre reason to justify trying to enforce your "morals" as law.Viceroy_of_Orange said:
Isn't the common retort amongst those who support gay marriage that marriage isn't just about procreation? So why are you using it now?Philip_Thompson said:
No. Incest is illegal due to birth defects etc which causes harm, not due to morals.Viceroy_of_Orange said:
The law already discriminates between relationship types, that is why marriage between relatives/marriage between more than two people is illegal.Philip_Thompson said:He does. He wants marriage to be illegal for legal relationships he views as immoral.
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I disagree. Taking away fundamental liberties from others isn't acceptable even if it is the will of the majority IMO.isam said:
People can campaign to get the law changed for whatever they want in my opinion. I don’t see what you mean by ‘entitled’. No one is entitled to change any lawPhilip_Thompson said:Tyranny of the majority is not ok. Taking away the liberties of others is not acceptable.
If a majority wanted to ban interracial marriage should that be OK?
If a majority wanted to take away women's rights to vote should that be OK?
If a majority wanted to take away the right to vote from Norhtern Ireland should that be OK?
The answer to all to me is absolutely not under any circumstances.0 -
That's correct, the actual long-term goal is to put the border between the British Isles and the EU. The original thought was that there would be a domino effect and the Irish would leave the EU as well, but failing that you can try to get the same thing by stealth as the UK gradually diverges. This plan isn't going as well as originally hoped, because the EU don't have cornflakes for brains.RochdalePioneers said:This back stop. I don't understand all the fuss about it. Apparently there is a technological solution to the Irish border that means we won't need one. Gove et al keep talking about it. So with technology there will be no border and thus no back stop.
So why are the people who insist technology is the fix insist the back stop must go? Is it because they know they are lying about the technology solution?
However, if you were to assume good faith, you could say that the Brexit enthusiasts are concerned that the EU side are using the Irish situation as a pretext to prevent the UK from setting its own rules, and that they won't agree to the technological solution even though it's really great and totally works.0 -
What a weird question, considering that same-sex marriage is not recognised in Northern Ireland.isam said:
He hasn’t got that right, who says he has?Philip_Thompson said:
Viceroy has the right to hold whatever views he wants.isam said:
I think the truth is that people who claim to want a diverse society actually want a conformist society but don’t like to think of themselves as authoritarian. True diversity means accepting that views like those of @Viceroy_of_Orange are part and parcel of society and don’t need to be put under the microscope or corrected. If we all have to think the same, then we aren’t diversenichomar said:
Yes unless that diversity seeks to prevent others having their diversity.isam said:
When people say they want diversity in politics/life in general, what do they mean?nichomar said:
I wonder if he is from one of the remaining Orange Lodge families, they still exist in Liverpool but I would have thought that was dying out. He clearly follows most of the DUP line in politics. He probably marches with the pipes and drums to celebrate the battle of the Boyne each year.Gallowgate said:
He shouldn't have the right to take liberties away from others.
It's not a question of discussing whether people have the right to take away liberties from others. The liberties don't exist. They are already being taken away.0 -
I agree that campaigning for change in a law is a perfectly legitimate activity. But Philip is surely right that some individual liberties should have protection against arbitrary decisions by 51% of the electorate. For example, I don't think that it should be *possible* to pass a law to imprison anyone called "isam" - clearly it's undesirable, but it should in fact be regarded as an inadmissible infringement of rights. In other words, democracy needs to be qualified by a charter of rights which should be difficult to overturn.isam said:
People can campaign to get the law changed for whatever they want in my opinion. I don’t see what you mean by ‘entitled’. No one is entitled to change any lawPhilip_Thompson said:
Diversity of opinion yes.
Diversity of rights no. If I as a Dawkins style atheist say I think organised religion is immoral and that marriage between two religious people should be illegal then am I entitled to get the law changed to reflect that?
Tyranny of the majority is not ok. Taking away the liberties of others is not acceptable.0 -
No it is not. It is taking away the right of NI voters to vote on making their own choices.FF43 said:
The backstop is the prioritisation of the right of the larger GB to diverge from the EU over the right of the smaller NI not to be destabilised.Philip_Thompson said:
Yes for the EXACT same reason.
The risk of violence is bad.
The taking away of fundamental liberties (the right to elect your government) is worse.
I am a classical liberal. The backstop is illiberal.
It is ultimately a choice.
If at periodical elections the voters of NI elect an executive that chooses to keep their laws aligned with EU laws that would be their choice. That would be democratic.0 -
Do you view that as acceptable? I don't.Chris said:
What a weird question, considering that same-sex marriage is not recognised in Northern Ireland.isam said:
He hasn’t got that right, who says he has?Philip_Thompson said:
Viceroy has the right to hold whatever views he wants.isam said:
I think the truth is that people who claim to want a diverse society actually want a conformist society but don’t like to think of themselves as authoritarian. True diversity means accepting that views like those of @Viceroy_of_Orange are part and parcel of society and don’t need to be put under the microscope or corrected. If we all have to think the same, then we aren’t diversenichomar said:
Yes unless that diversity seeks to prevent others having their diversity.isam said:
When people say they want diversity in politics/life in general, what do they mean?nichomar said:
I wonder if he is from one of the remaining Orange Lodge families, they still exist in Liverpool but I would have thought that was dying out. He clearly follows most of the DUP line in politics. He probably marches with the pipes and drums to celebrate the battle of the Boyne each year.Gallowgate said:
He shouldn't have the right to take liberties away from others.
It's not a question of discussing whether people have the right to take away liberties from others. The liberties don't exist. They are already being taken away.0 -
I saw the right to travel and work in Europe without restriction as a fundamental liberty. The will of the micro-majority is removing that. Your outrage is selective.Philip_Thompson said:
I disagree. Taking away fundamental liberties from others isn't acceptable even if it is the will of the majority IMO.isam said:
People can campaign to get the law changed for whatever they want in my opinion. I don’t see what you mean by ‘entitled’. No one is entitled to change any lawPhilip_Thompson said:Tyranny of the majority is not ok. Taking away the liberties of others is not acceptable.
If a majority wanted to ban interracial marriage should that be OK?
If a majority wanted to take away women's rights to vote should that be OK?
If a majority wanted to take away the right to vote from Norhtern Ireland should that be OK?
The answer to all to me is absolutely not under any circumstances.1 -
Is Boris really going to go for an early election. I doubt it. Why get his dream and then throw it away after a few weeks?
No. He will let his friends in the ERG down and organize an extension.
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No, I don't.Philip_Thompson said:
Do you view that as acceptable? I don't.Chris said:
What a weird question, considering that same-sex marriage is not recognised in Northern Ireland.isam said:
He hasn’t got that right, who says he has?Philip_Thompson said:
Viceroy has the right to hold whatever views he wants.isam said:
I think the truth is that people who claim to want a diverse society actually want a conformist society but don’t like to think of themselves as authoritarian. True diversity means accepting that views like those of @Viceroy_of_Orange are part and parcel of society and don’t need to be put under the microscope or corrected. If we all have to think the same, then we aren’t diversenichomar said:
Yes unless that diversity seeks to prevent others having their diversity.isam said:
When people say they want diversity in politics/life in general, what do they mean?nichomar said:
I wonder if he is from one of the remaining Orange Lodge families, they still exist in Liverpool but I would have thought that was dying out. He clearly follows most of the DUP line in politics. He probably marches with the pipes and drums to celebrate the battle of the Boyne each year.Gallowgate said:
He shouldn't have the right to take liberties away from others.
It's not a question of discussing whether people have the right to take away liberties from others. The liberties don't exist. They are already being taken away.
The point I'm making is that we're not talking about the right of some oddball to argue for a hypothetical withdrawal of rights.
We're talking about a situation in which, by law, rights are already being withheld.
That's quite a difference.0 -
https://twitter.com/AndrewSparrow/status/1141668865761525760rottenborough said:Is Boris really going to go for an early election. I doubt it. Why get his dream and then throw it away after a few weeks?
No. He will let his friends in the ERG down and organize an extension.1 -
Jeremy Corbyn has the no-confidence motion ready in his desk drawer.rottenborough said:Is Boris really going to go for an early election. I doubt it. Why get his dream and then throw it away after a few weeks?
No. He will let his friends in the ERG down and organize an extension.0 -
If the Tories elect a liar as leader, it will be anyone's guess what - if anything - he has been telling the truth about.rottenborough said:Is Boris really going to go for an early election. I doubt it. Why get his dream and then throw it away after a few weeks?
No. He will let his friends in the ERG down and organize an extension.0 -
I had a library card at age four (you weren't supposed to have one until seven). The Little Grey Men was the first book I took out of the library.JackW said:
Denys Watkins-PitchfordPhilip_Thompson said:
Who is BB?TOPPING said:That ES editorial reads as though GO is playing BB for the lazy, duplicitous, solipsistic git he is - I will be the (eg Northern) power(house) behind the throne is how it seems to have been written.
Did they grow up to become the Little Men in Grey?
(I also loved his Bill Badger books.)1 -
Boris has to win first - plenty of time for a slip up.rottenborough said:Is Boris really going to go for an early election.
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I wonder if the LibDems have revisited their earlier position not to support it?DecrepitJohnL said:
Jeremy Corbyn has the no-confidence motion ready in his desk drawer.rottenborough said:Is Boris really going to go for an early election. I doubt it. Why get his dream and then throw it away after a few weeks?
No. He will let his friends in the ERG down and organize an extension.0 -
Not so because there needs to be a treaty between the UK and the EU for that alignment to work. The proposed treaty gives the UK the choice whether to prioritise GB divergence from the EU or divergence from Northern Ireland. The latter will antagonise the Unionist community. The EU is not offering Northern Ireland divergence from Ireland because that will destabilise whole Ireland. We do have a choice of going ahead on that basis, but with a No Deal.Philip_Thompson said:
No it is not. It is taking away the right of NI voters to vote on making their own choices.FF43 said:
The backstop is the prioritisation of the right of the larger GB to diverge from the EU over the right of the smaller NI not to be destabilised.Philip_Thompson said:
Yes for the EXACT same reason.
The risk of violence is bad.
The taking away of fundamental liberties (the right to elect your government) is worse.
I am a classical liberal. The backstop is illiberal.
It is ultimately a choice.
If at periodical elections the voters of NI elect an executive that chooses to keep their laws aligned with EU laws that would be their choice. That would be democratic.0 -
I doubt it, too, and am surprised at all the PB’ers who seem to think he will. Not only has he said, several times, that he won’t (which isn’t worth that much tbf), he’s playing everything safety first with no sign of being a bold decisive politician, his MPs don’t want it, and he isn’t going to risk losing his life’s dream so quickly.rottenborough said:Is Boris really going to go for an early election. I doubt it. Why get his dream and then throw it away after a few weeks?
No. He will let his friends in the ERG down and organize an extension.
The circumstance of GE is if Boris doesn’t become PM because his government is taken down by defections and/or a VONC immediately after the election.0 -
Can you travel and work in American without restriction? Or Australia? Or Canada? Or India?matt said:
I saw the right to travel and work in Europe without restriction as a fundamental liberty. The will of the micro-majority is removing that. Your outrage is selective.Philip_Thompson said:
I disagree. Taking away fundamental liberties from others isn't acceptable even if it is the will of the majority IMO.isam said:
People can campaign to get the law changed for whatever they want in my opinion. I don’t see what you mean by ‘entitled’. No one is entitled to change any lawPhilip_Thompson said:Tyranny of the majority is not ok. Taking away the liberties of others is not acceptable.
If a majority wanted to ban interracial marriage should that be OK?
If a majority wanted to take away women's rights to vote should that be OK?
If a majority wanted to take away the right to vote from Norhtern Ireland should that be OK?
The answer to all to me is absolutely not under any circumstances.
The right to travel and work is nice to have (and I liked it too) but it is not and never has been a fundamental human right. Not like the right to vote or get married.1 -
So should same-sex incest be legalised?Philip_Thompson said:
No. Incest is illegal due to birth defects etc which causes harm, not due to morals.Viceroy_of_Orange said:
The law already discriminates between relationship types, that is why marriage between relatives/marriage between more than two people is illegal.Philip_Thompson said:He does. He wants marriage to be illegal for legal relationships he views as immoral.
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Presumably you also think adultery is immoral, what with it being against one of the Ten Commandments.Viceroy_of_Orange said:
Of course the law is shaped on our morals as a society. Unless you're advocating a Ron Paul type society, which wouldn't be a completely bad thing, then it is a battle to define what those morals are.Philip_Thompson said:The law has nothing to do with morals. Morals are a matter for individuals not the law.
And TSE, in the closet? Quite the opposite.
Would you make that illegal / criminal as well?0 -
Remember that in a Tory vs LD contest, the Tories would need to win 2 Leavers from TBP to make up for every Remainer they lose to LDHYUFD said:Pre Boris I would expect the LDs to win the seat as like Peterborough the Brexit Party will split the Tory vote in this Leave voting seat.
However if Boris does indeed win the Tory leadership and become PM just before the by election then I think the Tories could hold it by winning back Brexit Party voters and if they have a local farmer as the candidate0 -
Reading AEP (I know, I know) this morning in the telegraph to an extent I can see why. Yes things are deteriorating but announcing your plans before anyone does isn't the best plan - especially when the BoE has a lot more to worry about than anyone else...AlastairMeeks said:0 -
He could table it on Monday. That would be interesting.DecrepitJohnL said:
Jeremy Corbyn has the no-confidence motion ready in his desk drawer.rottenborough said:Is Boris really going to go for an early election. I doubt it. Why get his dream and then throw it away after a few weeks?
No. He will let his friends in the ERG down and organize an extension.0 -
Stuttgart would seem a good place to start...TheScreamingEagles said:
Well as a good Muslim boy Oktoberfest was wasted on me.Alanbrooke said:
Oktoberfest is for touristsTheScreamingEagles said:
More than at Oktoberfest?Alanbrooke said:
Schutzenfest - theyll all be getting hammered for the next 5 daysPulpstar said:
https://twitter.com/Pulpstar/status/1141641463601815552?s=19Alanbrooke said:
Mittenwald ?Pulpstar said:Imagine the most Bavarian scene possible, Alpen foothills; locals out in traditional garb, houses with flowered wooden balconies. Sound of a brass band ..
That's where I am right now.
The real hammerings happen in the towns and villages over the summer and the big Rhineland Cities in the run up to Lent.
I'm off to Stuttgart next month, any places I should visit?
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Yes. I agree. I still think there's a chance he wont make it.IanB2 said:
I doubt it, too, and am surprised at all the PB’ers who seem to think he will. Not only has he said, several times, that he won’t (which isn’t worth that much tbf), he’s playing everything safety first with no sign of being a bold decisive politician, his MPs don’t want it, and he isn’t going to risk losing his life’s dream so quickly.rottenborough said:Is Boris really going to go for an early election. I doubt it. Why get his dream and then throw it away after a few weeks?
No. He will let his friends in the ERG down and organize an extension.
The circumstance of GE is if Boris doesn’t become PM because his government is taken down by defections and/or a VONC immediately after the election.0 -
If there is one ballot with a cock and balls drawn across it, I think we can guess who did it...TheScreamingEagles said:Not good enough Ken, I was planning to vote for whomever your backed.
https://twitter.com/Alan_McGuinness/status/11416577700742881310 -
Incest has been banned for centuries. It was why banns of marriage were read in church to ensure the resident experts ensured it didn't accidently occur...Philip_Thompson said:
No. Incest is illegal due to birth defects etc which causes harm, not due to morals.Viceroy_of_Orange said:
The law already discriminates between relationship types, that is why marriage between relatives/marriage between more than two people is illegal.Philip_Thompson said:He does. He wants marriage to be illegal for legal relationships he views as immoral.
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Nah. Tories wouldn't play that game.Mysticrose said:
He could table it on Monday. That would be interesting.DecrepitJohnL said:
Jeremy Corbyn has the no-confidence motion ready in his desk drawer.rottenborough said:Is Boris really going to go for an early election. I doubt it. Why get his dream and then throw it away after a few weeks?
No. He will let his friends in the ERG down and organize an extension.0 -
If Tory MPs were going to defect before he had a chance to become PM, why wouldn't they make that threat now?rottenborough said:
Yes. I agree. I still think there's a chance he wont make it.IanB2 said:
I doubt it, too, and am surprised at all the PB’ers who seem to think he will. Not only has he said, several times, that he won’t (which isn’t worth that much tbf), he’s playing everything safety first with no sign of being a bold decisive politician, his MPs don’t want it, and he isn’t going to risk losing his life’s dream so quickly.rottenborough said:Is Boris really going to go for an early election. I doubt it. Why get his dream and then throw it away after a few weeks?
No. He will let his friends in the ERG down and organize an extension.
The circumstance of GE is if Boris doesn’t become PM because his government is taken down by defections and/or a VONC immediately after the election.0 -
Best place in Stuttgart is the train to Munich.viewcode said:
Stuttgart would seem a good place to start...TheScreamingEagles said:
Well as a good Muslim boy Oktoberfest was wasted on me.Alanbrooke said:
Oktoberfest is for touristsTheScreamingEagles said:
More than at Oktoberfest?Alanbrooke said:
Schutzenfest - theyll all be getting hammered for the next 5 daysPulpstar said:
https://twitter.com/Pulpstar/status/1141641463601815552?s=19Alanbrooke said:
Mittenwald ?Pulpstar said:Imagine the most Bavarian scene possible, Alpen foothills; locals out in traditional garb, houses with flowered wooden balconies. Sound of a brass band ..
That's where I am right now.
The real hammerings happen in the towns and villages over the summer and the big Rhineland Cities in the run up to Lent.
I'm off to Stuttgart next month, any places I should visit?
But the Mercedes museum is good fun if you like cars.
Also
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ludwigsburg_Palace
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Andrew Neil on BBC2 "Politics Today" skewers the Boris renegotiation plan completely. Car crash tv.
Neil should chair the final two debate .... please .... 0 -
In loathing and contempt for him?Scott_P said:0 -
Love or loathe him Andrew Neil is brilliant. He has just utterly destroyed a BJ supporter on PL.0
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Absolutely correct. The Irish are making a fuss about the border, because it's a big problem for them, and not just because they are unreasonable. It's an even bigger problem for the Northern Irish, but no-one in.GB cares two hoots about them.edmundintokyo said:
The actual long-term goal is to put the border between the British Isles and the EU. The original thought was that there would be a domino effect and the Irish would leave the EU as well, but failing that you can try to get the same thing by stealth as the UK gradually diverges. This plan isn't going as well as originally hoped, because the EU don't have cornflakes for brains.
[....]
.
GB can avoid dealing with its Brexit contradiction of maintaining the status quo in NI and being able to diverge from the EU if Ireland follows the UK in that divergence
This is the real issue. Ireland doesn't see why it should fall in line with the UK. It didn't ask for Brexit and it thinks the EU gives it leverage over a UK weakened by Brexit. At the same time it worries that other EU member states might do a deal with the UK that sees Ireland isolated. That's why it is taking a very hard line on the border. Tactically it might be better to let events play out and then when the UK is in its new subordinate position relative to the EU, turn the screws
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Like not snorting cocaine whilst ruining the lives of teachers who snort cocaine? That kind of right thing?AndyJS said:The fact that Tory MPs are having to hand their phones in before voting in order to prove they haven't taken photos of the ballot papers is a bit depressing from the point of view of honesty. Whatever happened to trusting people to do the right thing?
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I think so. They will wish they had backed Raab.rottenborough said:Is Boris really going to go for an early election. I doubt it. Why get his dream and then throw it away after a few weeks?
No. He will let his friends in the ERG down and organize an extension.
Perhaps Labour can force an election at the point at which it becomes clear that Johnson is ratting on Hard Brexit. But since that would be suicide for the Tories it will be difficult.
My prediction is no election, no referendum, the Withdrawal Agreement passed in 2020.0 -
I think it's legitimate for countries to impose controls on migration.matt said:
I saw the right to travel and work in Europe without restriction as a fundamental liberty. The will of the micro-majority is removing that. Your outrage is selective.Philip_Thompson said:
I disagree. Taking away fundamental liberties from others isn't acceptable even if it is the will of the majority IMO.isam said:
People can campaign to get the law changed for whatever they want in my opinion. I don’t see what you mean by ‘entitled’. No one is entitled to change any lawPhilip_Thompson said:Tyranny of the majority is not ok. Taking away the liberties of others is not acceptable.
If a majority wanted to ban interracial marriage should that be OK?
If a majority wanted to take away women's rights to vote should that be OK?
If a majority wanted to take away the right to vote from Norhtern Ireland should that be OK?
The answer to all to me is absolutely not under any circumstances.0 -
There is a big tower you can go up. Good view from the top (unsurprisingly).viewcode said:
Stuttgart would seem a good place to start...TheScreamingEagles said:
Well as a good Muslim boy Oktoberfest was wasted on me.Alanbrooke said:
Oktoberfest is for touristsTheScreamingEagles said:
More than at Oktoberfest?Alanbrooke said:
Schutzenfest - theyll all be getting hammered for the next 5 daysPulpstar said:
https://twitter.com/Pulpstar/status/1141641463601815552?s=19Alanbrooke said:
Mittenwald ?Pulpstar said:Imagine the most Bavarian scene possible, Alpen foothills; locals out in traditional garb, houses with flowered wooden balconies. Sound of a brass band ..
That's where I am right now.
The real hammerings happen in the towns and villages over the summer and the big Rhineland Cities in the run up to Lent.
I'm off to Stuttgart next month, any places I should visit?
Otherwise it was all beer and schnitzel when I was there.0 -
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What a great idea. I think I might do that with mine when I get it.SandyRentool said:
If there is one ballot with a cock and balls drawn across it, I think we can guess who did it...TheScreamingEagles said:Not good enough Ken, I was planning to vote for whomever your backed.
https://twitter.com/Alan_McGuinness/status/11416577700742881310 -
It's good to see the Guardian recycling. This tweet strapline has had regular use over the years:
https://twitter.com/guardiannews/status/11416735404811796480 -
Take it a step further - recall all MPs simultaneously and you have a do-it-yourself general election.MarqueeMark said:All MPs elected in 2017 pledging to implement Brexit but then refusing to do so should be subject to recall. After all, what is that if not a fraud on the voters?
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What's the author referring to?Stereotomy said:Meanwhile, in America:
https://twitter.com/JewishWorker/status/11414357533958266880 -
Is there a large country in the world with worse cuisine than Germany? Canada, maybe?SandyRentool said:
There is a big tower you can go up. Good view from the top (unsurprisingly).viewcode said:
Stuttgart would seem a good place to start...TheScreamingEagles said:
Well as a good Muslim boy Oktoberfest was wasted on me.Alanbrooke said:
Oktoberfest is for touristsTheScreamingEagles said:
More than at Oktoberfest?Alanbrooke said:
Schutzenfest - theyll all be getting hammered for the next 5 daysPulpstar said:
https://twitter.com/Pulpstar/status/1141641463601815552?s=19Alanbrooke said:
Mittenwald ?Pulpstar said:Imagine the most Bavarian scene possible, Alpen foothills; locals out in traditional garb, houses with flowered wooden balconies. Sound of a brass band ..
That's where I am right now.
The real hammerings happen in the towns and villages over the summer and the big Rhineland Cities in the run up to Lent.
I'm off to Stuttgart next month, any places I should visit?
Otherwise it was all beer and schnitzel when I was there.0 -
This is an interesting (ie I agree with it) article in the Guardian enumerating the reasons why Trump will win re-election unless the Democrats suddenly get their arses in gear.
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2019/jun/20/four-reasons-why-trump-is-cruising-towards-re-election
Could 2020 end up being a repeat of 2016? Remain to lose - again - in a rerun of the Brexit referendum, and Trump to win re-election.
Would any bookie offer odds on the double?0 -
On a four day visit there's not a huge amount of time to get out into the countryside, but I did any number of trips once I'd bought a little Opel. Tubingen is a nice university town south of Stuttgart, with Hohenzollern castle further to the south and the Black Forest is to the east. Stuttgart is quite leafy for a city and there are vineyards in the surrounding hills.Alanbrooke said:
No not at alllogical_song said:
I loved Stuttgart when I worked there for over a year in the eighties.Alanbrooke said:
Think of Dungannon with lots of car factoriesTOPPING said:
Good to know that the best bit of Stuttgart seems to be leaving it!TheScreamingEagles said:
Four days and cheers.Alanbrooke said:
depends what you like and how long you are stayingTheScreamingEagles said:
Well as a good Muslim boy Oktoberfest was wasted on me.Alanbrooke said:
Oktoberfest is for touristsTheScreamingEagles said:
More than at Oktoberfest?Alanbrooke said:
Schutzenfest - theyll all be getting hammered for the next 5 daysPulpstar said:
https://twitter.com/Pulpstar/status/1141641463601815552?s=19Alanbrooke said:
Mittenwald ?Pulpstar said:Imagine the most Bavarian scene possible, Alpen foothills; locals out in traditional garb, houses with flowered wooden balconies. Sound of a brass band ..
That's where I am right now.
The real hammerings happen in the towns and villages over the summer and the big Rhineland Cities in the run up to Lent.
I'm off to Stuttgart next month, any places I should visit?
the centre still has some old bits we didnt blow the crap out of and there are lots of museums
but if you have time there are better things outside the city within about an hours drive - Black Forest, Spa towns, Rothenburg
The Staatsgalerie is worth visiting for the architecture as well as the art. It's a Spa town, I liked Das Leuze best for a swim. There's the Mercedes factory at UnterTurkheim and Porsche at Zuffenhausen if you like cars. There's a long park parallel to the main shopping street and beyond which includes the Opera House.
Sorry if the info is out of date!
personally I prefer the country to the City.
There are lots of things to do in Stuttgart, but being a yokel I appreciated the surrounding countryside more
each to his own of course.0 -
Sky News trying to get a conspiracy theory going about whips rigging votes....then shot down by 3 different Tory MPs telling them they have got how the proxy vote process works wrong...embarrassing.0
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Not much point in making a prediction this time, because the positions will depend on tactical voting and there's no sensible way of trying to forecast how that will turn out.0
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And to while away the minutes before the latest loser in musical chairs is announced, here's a tweet to add to the general miasma of disquiet:
https://twitter.com/Dr_Ulrichsen/status/11415666959890063360 -
That would make you @Nigel_ForeskinNigel_Foremain said:
What a great idea. I think I might do that with mine when I get it.SandyRentool said:
If there is one ballot with a cock and balls drawn across it, I think we can guess who did it...TheScreamingEagles said:Not good enough Ken, I was planning to vote for whomever your backed.
https://twitter.com/Alan_McGuinness/status/1141657770074288131
Boom-tish 0 -
Brexiters like taking away people's rights. It gives them a cheap thrill. I suspect you also believe other rights are "nice to haves" that you would happily sacrifice, along with the Union, and people's businesses, jobs and even lives so you can have your beloved Brexit. Go on, don't be like Boris, tell the truth and admit it, everything is up for grabs to get Brexit!Philip_Thompson said:
Can you travel and work in American without restriction? Or Australia? Or Canada? Or India?matt said:
I saw the right to travel and work in Europe without restriction as a fundamental liberty. The will of the micro-majority is removing that. Your outrage is selective.Philip_Thompson said:
I disagree. Taking away fundamental liberties from others isn't acceptable even if it is the will of the majority IMO.isam said:
People can campaign to get the law changed for whatever they want in my opinion. I don’t see what you mean by ‘entitled’. No one is entitled to change any lawPhilip_Thompson said:Tyranny of the majority is not ok. Taking away the liberties of others is not acceptable.
If a majority wanted to ban interracial marriage should that be OK?
If a majority wanted to take away women's rights to vote should that be OK?
If a majority wanted to take away the right to vote from Norhtern Ireland should that be OK?
The answer to all to me is absolutely not under any circumstances.
The right to travel and work is nice to have (and I liked it too) but it is not and never has been a fundamental human right. Not like the right to vote or get married.0 -
Which is why unless the abhorrent backstop gets dropped the ONLY democratic decision is with regret no deal.FF43 said:
Not so because there needs to be a treaty between the UK and the EU for that alignment to work. The proposed treaty gives the UK the choice whether to prioritise GB divergence from the EU or divergence from Northern Ireland. The latter will antagonise the Unionist community. The EU is not offering Northern Ireland divergence from Ireland because that will destabilise whole Ireland. We do have a choice of going ahead on that basis, but with a No Deal.Philip_Thompson said:
No it is not. It is taking away the right of NI voters to vote on making their own choices.FF43 said:
The backstop is the prioritisation of the right of the larger GB to diverge from the EU over the right of the smaller NI not to be destabilised.Philip_Thompson said:
Yes for the EXACT same reason.
The risk of violence is bad.
The taking away of fundamental liberties (the right to elect your government) is worse.
I am a classical liberal. The backstop is illiberal.
It is ultimately a choice.
If at periodical elections the voters of NI elect an executive that chooses to keep their laws aligned with EU laws that would be their choice. That would be democratic.
The voters of NI either must have the right to vote on EU laws or the right to diverge. Having to follow laws but having no right to diverge is colonialism and is undemocratic.0 -
German food is fine, IMHO, if not as good as Italian, French, or Spanish.MarqueeMark said:
Is there a large country in the world with worse cuisine than Germany? Canada, maybe?SandyRentool said:
There is a big tower you can go up. Good view from the top (unsurprisingly).viewcode said:
Stuttgart would seem a good place to start...TheScreamingEagles said:
Well as a good Muslim boy Oktoberfest was wasted on me.Alanbrooke said:
Oktoberfest is for touristsTheScreamingEagles said:
More than at Oktoberfest?Alanbrooke said:
Schutzenfest - theyll all be getting hammered for the next 5 daysPulpstar said:
https://twitter.com/Pulpstar/status/1141641463601815552?s=19Alanbrooke said:
Mittenwald ?Pulpstar said:Imagine the most Bavarian scene possible, Alpen foothills; locals out in traditional garb, houses with flowered wooden balconies. Sound of a brass band ..
That's where I am right now.
The real hammerings happen in the towns and villages over the summer and the big Rhineland Cities in the run up to Lent.
I'm off to Stuttgart next month, any places I should visit?
Otherwise it was all beer and schnitzel when I was there.0 -
Yes Ludwigsburg is an impressive palace to the north. It also has a Boris connection (see his 'Who Do you Think You Are' programme).TGOHF said:
Best place in Stuttgart is the train to Munich.viewcode said:
Stuttgart would seem a good place to start...TheScreamingEagles said:
Well as a good Muslim boy Oktoberfest was wasted on me.Alanbrooke said:
Oktoberfest is for touristsTheScreamingEagles said:
More than at Oktoberfest?Alanbrooke said:
Schutzenfest - theyll all be getting hammered for the next 5 daysPulpstar said:
https://twitter.com/Pulpstar/status/1141641463601815552?s=19Alanbrooke said:
Mittenwald ?Pulpstar said:Imagine the most Bavarian scene possible, Alpen foothills; locals out in traditional garb, houses with flowered wooden balconies. Sound of a brass band ..
That's where I am right now.
The real hammerings happen in the towns and villages over the summer and the big Rhineland Cities in the run up to Lent.
I'm off to Stuttgart next month, any places I should visit?
But the Mercedes museum is good fun if you like cars.
Also
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ludwigsburg_Palace0 -
Brian Butterfield. The type of thrusting entrepreneur who makes up the modern Tory party membership.Philip_Thompson said:
Who is BB?TOPPING said:That ES editorial reads as though GO is playing BB for the lazy, duplicitous, solipsistic git he is - I will be the (eg Northern) power(house) behind the throne is how it seems to have been written.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cCLn94xi1LQ0 -
where can I watch it?TOPPING said:Love or loathe him Andrew Neil is brilliant. He has just utterly destroyed a BJ supporter on PL.
0 -
The UK.MarqueeMark said:
Is there a large country in the world with worse cuisine than Germany? Canada, maybe?SandyRentool said:
There is a big tower you can go up. Good view from the top (unsurprisingly).viewcode said:
Stuttgart would seem a good place to start...TheScreamingEagles said:
Well as a good Muslim boy Oktoberfest was wasted on me.Alanbrooke said:
Oktoberfest is for touristsTheScreamingEagles said:
More than at Oktoberfest?Alanbrooke said:
Schutzenfest - theyll all be getting hammered for the next 5 daysPulpstar said:
https://twitter.com/Pulpstar/status/1141641463601815552?s=19Alanbrooke said:
Mittenwald ?Pulpstar said:Imagine the most Bavarian scene possible, Alpen foothills; locals out in traditional garb, houses with flowered wooden balconies. Sound of a brass band ..
That's where I am right now.
The real hammerings happen in the towns and villages over the summer and the big Rhineland Cities in the run up to Lent.
I'm off to Stuttgart next month, any places I should visit?
Otherwise it was all beer and schnitzel when I was there.0 -
Hugh Christie School asks for 'best looking' pupil votes
https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-england-kent-48702392
The snowflakes are going to get a shock when they get on Tinder looking for a partner...0 -
Everything is up for grabs to honour democracy yes.Nigel_Foremain said:
Brexiters like taking away people's rights. It gives them a cheap thrill. I suspect you also believe other rights are "nice to haves" that you would happily sacrifice, along with the Union, and people's businesses, jobs and even lives so you can have your beloved Brexit. Go on, don't be like Boris, tell the truth and admit it, everything is up for grabs to get Brexit!Philip_Thompson said:
Can you travel and work in American without restriction? Or Australia? Or Canada? Or India?matt said:
I saw the right to travel and work in Europe without restriction as a fundamental liberty. The will of the micro-majority is removing that. Your outrage is selective.Philip_Thompson said:
I disagree. Taking away fundamental liberties from others isn't acceptable even if it is the will of the majority IMO.isam said:
People can campaign to get the law changed for whatever they want in my opinion. I don’t see what you mean by ‘entitled’. No one is entitled to change any lawPhilip_Thompson said:Tyranny of the majority is not ok. Taking away the liberties of others is not acceptable.
If a majority wanted to ban interracial marriage should that be OK?
If a majority wanted to take away women's rights to vote should that be OK?
If a majority wanted to take away the right to vote from Norhtern Ireland should that be OK?
The answer to all to me is absolutely not under any circumstances.
The right to travel and work is nice to have (and I liked it too) but it is not and never has been a fundamental human right. Not like the right to vote or get married.
Democracy is more important than the risk of violence or economic hardship.0 -
As long as you have a good lie down afterwards.Sean_F said:
German food is fine, IMHO, if not as good as Italian, French, or Spanish.MarqueeMark said:
Is there a large country in the world with worse cuisine than Germany? Canada, maybe?SandyRentool said:
There is a big tower you can go up. Good view from the top (unsurprisingly).viewcode said:
Stuttgart would seem a good place to start...TheScreamingEagles said:
Well as a good Muslim boy Oktoberfest was wasted on me.Alanbrooke said:
Oktoberfest is for touristsTheScreamingEagles said:
More than at Oktoberfest?Alanbrooke said:
Schutzenfest - theyll all be getting hammered for the next 5 daysPulpstar said:
https://twitter.com/Pulpstar/status/1141641463601815552?s=19Alanbrooke said:
Mittenwald ?Pulpstar said:Imagine the most Bavarian scene possible, Alpen foothills; locals out in traditional garb, houses with flowered wooden balconies. Sound of a brass band ..
That's where I am right now.
The real hammerings happen in the towns and villages over the summer and the big Rhineland Cities in the run up to Lent.
I'm off to Stuttgart next month, any places I should visit?
Otherwise it was all beer and schnitzel when I was there.0 -
You have just made that choice without reference to the people of Northern Ireland in whose name you were claiming a democratic right to decide.Philip_Thompson said:
Which is why unless the abhorrent backstop gets dropped the ONLY democratic decision is with regret no deal.FF43 said:
Not so because there needs to be a treaty between the UK and the EU for that alignment to work. The proposed treaty gives the UK the choice whether to prioritise GB divergence from the EU or divergence from Northern Ireland. The latter will antagonise the Unionist community. The EU is not offering Northern Ireland divergence from Ireland because that will destabilise whole Ireland. We do have a choice of going ahead on that basis, but with a No Deal.Philip_Thompson said:
No it is not. It is taking away the right of NI voters to vote on making their own choices.FF43 said:
The backstop is the prioritisation of the right of the larger GB to diverge from the EU over the right of the smaller NI not to be destabilised.Philip_Thompson said:
Yes for the EXACT same reason.
The risk of violence is bad.
The taking away of fundamental liberties (the right to elect your government) is worse.
I am a classical liberal. The backstop is illiberal.
It is ultimately a choice.
If at periodical elections the voters of NI elect an executive that chooses to keep their laws aligned with EU laws that would be their choice. That would be democratic.
The voters of NI either must have the right to vote on EU laws or the right to diverge. Having to follow laws but having no right to diverge is colonialism and is undemocratic.0 -
My guess is that they are drawing an equivalence between the Israeli treatment of Palestinians and the Nazi treatment of Jews.Sean_F said:
What's the author referring to?Stereotomy said:Meanwhile, in America:
https://twitter.com/JewishWorker/status/11414357533958266880 -
At a former workplace we had a running joke - by mixing up 'working at the forefront of science' and 'pushing back the frontiers of science' we said that we were "pushing back the foreskin of science".viewcode said:
That would make you @Nigel_ForeskinNigel_Foremain said:
What a great idea. I think I might do that with mine when I get it.SandyRentool said:
If there is one ballot with a cock and balls drawn across it, I think we can guess who did it...TheScreamingEagles said:Not good enough Ken, I was planning to vote for whomever your backed.
https://twitter.com/Alan_McGuinness/status/1141657770074288131
Boom-tish0 -
Also suicide. Which actually was illegal until the Suicide Act 1961. Prior to that unsuccessful suicides were convicted and imprisoned. We think that modern mores are typical of history, whereas they are quite exceptionalCyclefree said:
Presumably you also think adultery is immoral, what with it being against one of the Ten Commandments.Viceroy_of_Orange said:
Of course the law is shaped on our morals as a society. Unless you're advocating a Ron Paul type society, which wouldn't be a completely bad thing, then it is a battle to define what those morals are.Philip_Thompson said:The law has nothing to do with morals. Morals are a matter for individuals not the law.
And TSE, in the closet? Quite the opposite.
Would you make that illegal / criminal as well?0 -
Neil is the best political interviewer the BBC have, despite being right learning, he appears to like nothing more than skewering bullshitters of all colours. Sad the BBC marginalise him in preference to second rate talent.eek said:
That skewering is why Andrew Neil will not be chairing any debate...JackW said:Andrew Neil on BBC2 "Politics Today" skewers the Boris renegotiation plan completely. Car crash tv.
Neil should chair the final two debate .... please ....0 -
Absolutely!FF43 said:
You have just made that choice without reference to the people of Northern Ireland in whose name you were claiming a democratic right to decide.Philip_Thompson said:
Which is why unless the abhorrent backstop gets dropped the ONLY democratic decision is with regret no deal.FF43 said:
Not so because there needs to be a treaty between the UK and the EU for that alignment to work. The proposed treaty gives the UK the choice whether to prioritise GB divergence from the EU or divergence from Northern Ireland. The latter will antagonise the Unionist community. The EU is not offering Northern Ireland divergence from Ireland because that will destabilise whole Ireland. We do have a choice of going ahead on that basis, but with a No Deal.Philip_Thompson said:
No it is not. It is taking away the right of NI voters to vote on making their own choices.FF43 said:
The backstop is the prioritisation of the right of the larger GB to diverge from the EU over the right of the smaller NI not to be destabilised.Philip_Thompson said:
Yes for the EXACT same reason.
The risk of violence is bad.
The taking away of fundamental liberties (the right to elect your government) is worse.
I am a classical liberal. The backstop is illiberal.
It is ultimately a choice.
If at periodical elections the voters of NI elect an executive that chooses to keep their laws aligned with EU laws that would be their choice. That would be democratic.
The voters of NI either must have the right to vote on EU laws or the right to diverge. Having to follow laws but having no right to diverge is colonialism and is undemocratic.
A sectarian majority of NI voters has no right to disenfranchise their compatriots.
If all NI voters get regular elections to shape their laws and they continuously elect people who choose to keep the laws aligned then that is their choice.0 -
Nowt wrong with British food. Birthplace of the balti!TheScreamingEagles said:
The UK.MarqueeMark said:
Is there a large country in the world with worse cuisine than Germany? Canada, maybe?SandyRentool said:
There is a big tower you can go up. Good view from the top (unsurprisingly).viewcode said:
Stuttgart would seem a good place to start...TheScreamingEagles said:
Well as a good Muslim boy Oktoberfest was wasted on me.Alanbrooke said:
Oktoberfest is for touristsTheScreamingEagles said:
More than at Oktoberfest?Alanbrooke said:
Schutzenfest - theyll all be getting hammered for the next 5 daysPulpstar said:
https://twitter.com/Pulpstar/status/1141641463601815552?s=19Alanbrooke said:
Mittenwald ?Pulpstar said:Imagine the most Bavarian scene possible, Alpen foothills; locals out in traditional garb, houses with flowered wooden balconies. Sound of a brass band ..
That's where I am right now.
The real hammerings happen in the towns and villages over the summer and the big Rhineland Cities in the run up to Lent.
I'm off to Stuttgart next month, any places I should visit?
Otherwise it was all beer and schnitzel when I was there.0 -
The TV Tower https://www.fernsehturm-stuttgart.de/ revolving restaurant at the top was a good place to take young ladies.SandyRentool said:
There is a big tower you can go up. Good view from the top (unsurprisingly).viewcode said:
Stuttgart would seem a good place to start...TheScreamingEagles said:
Well as a good Muslim boy Oktoberfest was wasted on me.Alanbrooke said:
Oktoberfest is for touristsTheScreamingEagles said:
More than at Oktoberfest?Alanbrooke said:
Schutzenfest - theyll all be getting hammered for the next 5 daysPulpstar said:
https://twitter.com/Pulpstar/status/1141641463601815552?s=19Alanbrooke said:
Mittenwald ?Pulpstar said:Imagine the most Bavarian scene possible, Alpen foothills; locals out in traditional garb, houses with flowered wooden balconies. Sound of a brass band ..
That's where I am right now.
The real hammerings happen in the towns and villages over the summer and the big Rhineland Cities in the run up to Lent.
I'm off to Stuttgart next month, any places I should visit?
Otherwise it was all beer and schnitzel when I was there.0 -
Chinese, Indian, Thai, Vietnamese, pretty much anywhere outside Eastern Europe really.Sean_F said:
German food is fine, IMHO, if not as good as Italian, French, or Spanish.MarqueeMark said:
Is there a large country in the world with worse cuisine than Germany? Canada, maybe?SandyRentool said:
There is a big tower you can go up. Good view from the top (unsurprisingly).viewcode said:
Stuttgart would seem a good place to start...TheScreamingEagles said:
Well as a good Muslim boy Oktoberfest was wasted on me.Alanbrooke said:
Oktoberfest is for touristsTheScreamingEagles said:
More than at Oktoberfest?Alanbrooke said:
Schutzenfest - theyll all be getting hammered for the next 5 daysPulpstar said:
https://twitter.com/Pulpstar/status/1141641463601815552?s=19Alanbrooke said:
Mittenwald ?Pulpstar said:Imagine the most Bavarian scene possible, Alpen foothills; locals out in traditional garb, houses with flowered wooden balconies. Sound of a brass band ..
That's where I am right now.
The real hammerings happen in the towns and villages over the summer and the big Rhineland Cities in the run up to Lent.
I'm off to Stuttgart next month, any places I should visit?
Otherwise it was all beer and schnitzel when I was there.0 -
I made similar points repeatedly before the ref...FF43 said:
Absolutely correct. The Irish are making a fuss about the border, because it's a big problem for them, and not just because they are unreasonable. It's an even bigger problem for the Northern Irish, but no-one in.GB cares two hoots about them.edmundintokyo said:
The actual long-term goal is to put the border between the British Isles and the EU. The original thought was that there would be a domino effect and the Irish would leave the EU as well, but failing that you can try to get the same thing by stealth as the UK gradually diverges. This plan isn't going as well as originally hoped, because the EU don't have cornflakes for brains.
[....]
.
GB can avoid dealing with its Brexit contradiction of maintaining the status quo in NI and being able to diverge from the EU if Ireland follows the UK in that divergence
This is the real issue. Ireland doesn't see why it should fall in line with the UK. It didn't ask for Brexit and it thinks the EU gives it leverage over a UK weakened by Brexit. At the same time it worries that other EU member states might do a deal with the UK that sees Ireland isolated. That's why it is taking a very hard line on the border. Tactically it might be better to let events play out and then when the UK is in its new subordinate position relative to the EU, turn the screws
0 -
Well if we had an elected govt that held a referendum on it that was supported by the HofC, and 51% said I should be imprisoned I guess I’d have to say it was legit. It just wouldn’t happen though.NickPalmer said:
I agree that campaigning for change in a law is a perfectly legitimate activity. But Philip is surely right that some individual liberties should have protection against arbitrary decisions by 51% of the electorate. For example, I don't think that it should be *possible* to pass a law to imprison anyone called "isam" - clearly it's undesirable, but it should in fact be regarded as an inadmissible infringement of rights. In other words, democracy needs to be qualified by a charter of rights which should be difficult to overturn.isam said:
People can campaign to get the law changed for whatever they want in my opinion. I don’t see what you mean by ‘entitled’. No one is entitled to change any lawPhilip_Thompson said:
Diversity of opinion yes.
Diversity of rights no. If I as a Dawkins style atheist say I think organised religion is immoral and that marriage between two religious people should be illegal then am I entitled to get the law changed to reflect that?
Tyranny of the majority is not ok. Taking away the liberties of others is not acceptable.0 -
Result?0
-
Any of them apart from Boris could go out in a few minutes.0
-
Which they would do under Boris, TBP and the Tories won well over 50% in Powys combined at the European electionsStereotomy said:
Remember that in a Tory vs LD contest, the Tories would need to win 2 Leavers from TBP to make up for every Remainer they lose to LDHYUFD said:Pre Boris I would expect the LDs to win the seat as like Peterborough the Brexit Party will split the Tory vote in this Leave voting seat.
However if Boris does indeed win the Tory leadership and become PM just before the by election then I think the Tories could hold it by winning back Brexit Party voters and if they have a local farmer as the candidate0 -
Expected in five mins0
-
Fat head now complaining on Sky that the Tory announcing in a HoC meeting room looks too "traditional"...what a tw@t...0
-
Even worse, it used to carry the death penalty. There is an appalling story in I think Alvarez' The Savage God about a bloke who cut his throat, and was very difficult to hang because the wound kept opening up.viewcode said:
Also suicide. Which actually was illegal until the Suicide Act 1961. Prior to that unsuccessful suicides were convicted and imprisoned. We think that modern mores are typical of history, whereas they are quite exceptionalCyclefree said:
Presumably you also think adultery is immoral, what with it being against one of the Ten Commandments.Viceroy_of_Orange said:
Of course the law is shaped on our morals as a society. Unless you're advocating a Ron Paul type society, which wouldn't be a completely bad thing, then it is a battle to define what those morals are.Philip_Thompson said:The law has nothing to do with morals. Morals are a matter for individuals not the law.
And TSE, in the closet? Quite the opposite.
Would you make that illegal / criminal as well?0 -
Nothing yet. Maybe a recount.Casino_Royale said:Result?
0 -
UK probably. German food is good of its kind if you go to the right, traditional, places. If you are into fine dining you will likely find more choices and lower prices than elsewhere. A lot of the chefs in Germany are women, unusually.MarqueeMark said:
Is there a large country in the world with worse cuisine than Germany? Canada, maybe?SandyRentool said:
There is a big tower you can go up. Good view from the top (unsurprisingly).viewcode said:
Stuttgart would seem a good place to start...TheScreamingEagles said:
Well as a good Muslim boy Oktoberfest was wasted on me.Alanbrooke said:
Oktoberfest is for touristsTheScreamingEagles said:
More than at Oktoberfest?Alanbrooke said:
Schutzenfest - theyll all be getting hammered for the next 5 daysPulpstar said:
https://twitter.com/Pulpstar/status/1141641463601815552?s=19Alanbrooke said:
Mittenwald ?Pulpstar said:Imagine the most Bavarian scene possible, Alpen foothills; locals out in traditional garb, houses with flowered wooden balconies. Sound of a brass band ..
That's where I am right now.
The real hammerings happen in the towns and villages over the summer and the big Rhineland Cities in the run up to Lent.
I'm off to Stuttgart next month, any places I should visit?
Otherwise it was all beer and schnitzel when I was there.0 -
BXP will campaign along the lines of “keep Boris honest” and that’ll deny the Tories a lot of votes.HYUFD said:
Which they would do under Boris, TBP and the Tories won well over 50% in Powys combined at the European electionsStereotomy said:
Remember that in a Tory vs LD contest, the Tories would need to win 2 Leavers from TBP to make up for every Remainer they lose to LDHYUFD said:Pre Boris I would expect the LDs to win the seat as like Peterborough the Brexit Party will split the Tory vote in this Leave voting seat.
However if Boris does indeed win the Tory leadership and become PM just before the by election then I think the Tories could hold it by winning back Brexit Party voters and if they have a local farmer as the candidate0 -
So if there's a tie, we have a re-run. But if a tie happens a second time all those in bottom place would be eliminated. (Assumes 3 candidates don't tie).0
-
...and, as we seem to be on the subject of Biblical basis for law, iirc slavery is not strictly forbidden by the Bible, and this was used by pro-slavery campaigners prior to the American Civil War.Cyclefree said:
Presumably you also think adultery is immoral, what with it being against one of the Ten Commandments.Viceroy_of_Orange said:
Of course the law is shaped on our morals as a society. Unless you're advocating a Ron Paul type society, which wouldn't be a completely bad thing, then it is a battle to define what those morals are.Philip_Thompson said:The law has nothing to do with morals. Morals are a matter for individuals not the law.
And TSE, in the closet? Quite the opposite.
Would you make that illegal / criminal as well?0 -
I tend to be very partial to Weiner Schnitzel, sauerkraut, smoked pigs trotters, smoked chicken, German sausages etc.IanB2 said:
As long as you have a good lie down afterwards.Sean_F said:
German food is fine, IMHO, if not as good as Italian, French, or Spanish.MarqueeMark said:
Is there a large country in the world with worse cuisine than Germany? Canada, maybe?SandyRentool said:
There is a big tower you can go up. Good view from the top (unsurprisingly).viewcode said:
Stuttgart would seem a good place to start...TheScreamingEagles said:
Well as a good Muslim boy Oktoberfest was wasted on me.Alanbrooke said:
Oktoberfest is for touristsTheScreamingEagles said:
More than at Oktoberfest?Alanbrooke said:
Schutzenfest - theyll all be getting hammered for the next 5 daysPulpstar said:
https://twitter.com/Pulpstar/status/1141641463601815552?s=19Alanbrooke said:
Mittenwald ?Pulpstar said:Imagine the most Bavarian scene possible, Alpen foothills; locals out in traditional garb, houses with flowered wooden balconies. Sound of a brass band ..
That's where I am right now.
The real hammerings happen in the towns and villages over the summer and the big Rhineland Cities in the run up to Lent.
I'm off to Stuttgart next month, any places I should visit?
Otherwise it was all beer and schnitzel when I was there.
German wine, of course, should be poured down the sink.0 -
Spoilt 20
-
Two spoilt ballot papers0 -
2 spoilt ballots0
-
Ken Clarke one of them?TheScreamingEagles said:
Two spoilt ballot papers0 -
Result:
Johnson 157
Gove 61
Hunt 59
Javid 34
Spoilt: 20 -
Javid eliminated.
Gove second.0 -
Death by dumplingsSean_F said:
I tend to be very partial to Weiner Schnitzel, sauerkraut, smoked pigs trotters, smoked chicken, German sausages etc.IanB2 said:
As long as you have a good lie down afterwards.Sean_F said:
German food is fine, IMHO, if not as good as Italian, French, or Spanish.MarqueeMark said:
Is there a large country in the world with worse cuisine than Germany? Canada, maybe?SandyRentool said:
There is a big tower you can go up. Good view from the top (unsurprisingly).viewcode said:
Stuttgart would seem a good place to start...TheScreamingEagles said:
Well as a good Muslim boy Oktoberfest was wasted on me.Alanbrooke said:
Oktoberfest is for touristsTheScreamingEagles said:
More than at Oktoberfest?Alanbrooke said:
Schutzenfest - theyll all be getting hammered for the next 5 daysPulpstar said:
https://twitter.com/Pulpstar/status/1141641463601815552?s=19Alanbrooke said:
Mittenwald ?Pulpstar said:Imagine the most Bavarian scene possible, Alpen foothills; locals out in traditional garb, houses with flowered wooden balconies. Sound of a brass band ..
That's where I am right now.
The real hammerings happen in the towns and villages over the summer and the big Rhineland Cities in the run up to Lent.
I'm off to Stuttgart next month, any places I should visit?
Otherwise it was all beer and schnitzel when I was there.
Talking of which:
Two spoiled papers!0 -
SandyRentool said:
At a former workplace we had a running joke - by mixing up 'working at the forefront of science' and 'pushing back the frontiers of science' we said that we were "pushing back the foreskin of science".viewcode said:
That would make you @Nigel_ForeskinNigel_Foremain said:
What a great idea. I think I might do that with mine when I get it.SandyRentool said:
If there is one ballot with a cock and balls drawn across it, I think we can guess who did it...TheScreamingEagles said:Not good enough Ken, I was planning to vote for whomever your backed.
https://twitter.com/Alan_McGuinness/status/1141657770074288131
Boom-tish 0 -
Javid out, Gove ahead of Hunt.0
-
Gove 61
Hunt 59
Javid 34
Johnson 157
Javid eliminated
Gove overtakes Hunt for 2nd0 -
BJ 157
Gove 61
Hunt 59
Javid 340
