politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » What four years of Govey as EdSec did to the teaching vote
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Doubt it. - Getting the HOC to agree EU elections is going to be extremely difficultArtist said:Long extension it is then.
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Rubbish, hopefully she gets stuffed, if Labour and Daily Record were not picking up the tab she would have grovelled and apologised previously. Typical Labour hubris.Pulpstar said:I think and hope Dugdale wins the case. Her homophobia comment wrt Stuart Dickson seems to my mind to be an honestly held opinion. Reserve the libel process for the likes of Lipstadt Vs Irving please.
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One of my closest friends has defected from the Tories to them.isam said:
The gap in the market seems to be for an economically left but socially conservative party. The revamped SDP are that, but they don't seem to get much publicity as they have no parliamentarians.Casino_Royale said:DavidL said:On topic there was some interesting discussion of this at the weekend in relation to the London march which seemed to be largely comprised of middle class professionals who once would have been Tories and now aren't. Some of these statistics may well be down to the same tendency manifesting itself in the teaching profession.
If this happens people will inevitably blame Brexit but I think the causes are much deeper. I hope sending Corbyn a get well soon card is on May's to do list. He is their only hope.
Yes, I’m expecting a drubbing in the not so distant future.DavidL said:On topic there was some interesting discussion of this at the weekend in relation to the London march which seemed to be largely comprised of middle class professionals who once would have been Tories and now aren't. Some of these statistics may well be down to the same tendency manifesting itself in the teaching profession.
What I think is clear is that 9 years of very tight public spending, if not actual austerity in most cases, with cuts in real wages and benefits for those in the public sector have left a long tail legacy of dislike/hatred for the Tories which they are going to find genuinely difficult to overcome. My own guess is that the extent of that damage has been hidden by the complete ineptitude of Corbyn and that Labour under a credible, electable leader may well be set for a Blair style annihilation of the Conservatives who have never managed to get a solid majority despite their success with the economy as a whole.
If this happens people will inevitably blame Brexit but I think the causes are much deeper. I hope sending Corbyn a get well soon card is on May's to do list. He is their only hope.
The Conservatives have never looked totally secure in the last ten years, and i can feel the country moving Left in my gut, which the fundamentals in the underlying data suggest as well.0 -
Mr. Meeks, there's little difficulty distinguishing between a ray of sunshine and a cretinous communist.0
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Now trying to mend the burned bridges from her TV appearance
No deal won't happen unless the House agrees to it (very significant point)0 -
I'm afraid I have!Pulpstar said:Don't rule out The SAJ
My book looks good - since built on long Gove a while ago at double digits - but there are still some bad apples there.
Biggest one is that next PM is JC.
Snap GE, May v Corbyn, Labour run on BINO and REF2 and win it. That costs me big time and I do see it as a possible.0 -
I think she is showing signs of strain and stress and who can blame herIanB2 said:She is speaking way too quickly.
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So, farewell then, MV3.0
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Buy £/$. No deal is almost off the table.
Despite Corbyn now reading out the speech he wrote early this morning.0 -
Corbo not bad here.0
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I'm not watching, just following on the live blog - but is this a valedictory statement? It almost seems like she's summing up the position and saying 'I've done my best...'0
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Those who elected him (many of which were on that march on Saturday) made Brexit happen as a consequence.Richard_Nabavi said:
Following the 2015 election which made the referendum pledge operative, I thought Remain would win easily partly because it had the support of much of the Conservative Party and of all the opposition parties except UKIP. Obviously (before Corbyn, of course) I expected Labour and the trade unions to be a very large part of that, as no doubt David Cameron did. However, the completely unexpected promotion of Corbyn from obscure Marxist relic backbencher to party leader put paid to that expectation. Saturday's march shows how significant that was.williamglenn said:You expected Labour to bail out the Conservatives from putting the country in this position. It's a typical attempt to whitewash the appallingly reckless behaviour of your party.
Rather amusing.0 -
Will be defamation in ScotlandPulpstar said:
The Reverend of Somerset is suing Dugdale for libel iirc ?CarlottaVance said:
Sheriff, but yes...RobD said:
That poor judge.CarlottaVance said:
https://twitter.com/BBCPhilipSim/status/1110182854904950785RobD said:
Some of his best friends are gay?CarlottaVance said:Ever the charmer....
https://twitter.com/BBCPhilipSim/status/1110182267186569218
https://twitter.com/BBCPhilipSim/status/1110184990359371776
https://twitter.com/BBCPhilipSim/status/1110185529058971648
https://twitter.com/BBCPhilipSim/status/11101860656866140170 -
And in any case, if insufficient people are willing to do it to meet the nation's needs, it doesn't really matter whether other people think it's a cushy gig or not. The government (especially one which believes market forces will solve supply problems) has a choice of improving conditions or explaining to voters why schools have no teachers. Meanwhile, instead of going on strike, the teachers are following Normo Tebbs' advice and getting on their bike to another/better/different job.FeersumEnjineeya said:
You've clearly never tried teaching.RobinWiggs said:
Yes - it's appalling to have a graduate starting salary of £22/23k, annual pay progression, and 14 weeks of non-contact time a year. Boo hoo that there is some paper work and assessment of their value add to the children.FeersumEnjineeya said:
Gove's role in making teaching such an unrewarding profession that nobody wants to do it has led to a recruitment crisis so bad that some of my local schools are now closing on Friday afternoons. This is very much less welcome in homes around this part of the country.
It's a wonder anyone wants it as a vocation isn't it.
Gove: his ideas on assessment are sadly outdated and prioritise memorising information over learning research, evaluative and life skills. I'd agree this has separated the wood from the trees in terms of pure 'academic' ability at GCSE, but I'd question whether the future economy needs people who can memorise Shakespeare quotes or in what order the kings and queens came. The future millionaires will be problem-solvers and communicators (I wonder whether his time there contrasts with his later stints at DEFRA and Justice in that he thought he knew what was good from his own time at school, and maybe trusted today's experts a bit more in other jobs). More widely, he and successors have been appalled by the failures of the worst schools with the poorest teaching in the weakest local authorities.. and then applied solutions which have damaged better ones elsewhere (often in Tory areas).
I think Ofsted does a reasonable job in the little time it has - my personal experience as a chair of governors is that it's pretty incisive and, in the most recent framework, produces well written and understandable reports. I think it's a misunderstanding that it's obsessed with attainment. The DfE and league tables may be, but Ofsted will equally major on safeguarding, leadership and a broad(ish) curriculum. My bigger beef is with the disappearance of local authorities' own support and advisory services, who used to keep schools on the straight and narrow in between inspections.. and reduce the chance of nasty suprises when they came.
(Good.. I feel better for that
) 0 -
She as good as just bound the government, in the absence of Commons agreement.notme2 said:
The House cannot bind the PM to stop No Deal.IanB2 said:PM- recognises the house will always oppose no deal.
So a longer extension and EU elections would be the alternative.
Amused that Corbyn is trying to capture the spirit of the weekend's protests despite his having gone out of his way to be as far from them as possible,0 -
Yes she has!Benpointer said:
Tbf May has hardly reached out to them since becoming PM has she?Philip_Thompson said:
I imagine so. The WA is the only legally binding bit, the PD is a fluffy annex that we could cope without.Benpointer said:
Yes, makes sense.Philip_Thompson said:
Labour should [if they were intellectually honest] back the withdrawal agreement.Benpointer said:
Tbh I am not sure what that will achieve.Richard_Nabavi said:Ah about time - from the Guardian live blog:
Theresa May is considering asking MPs to vote on the withdrawal agreement separately from the political declaration, Labour has revealed.
The withdrawal agreement includes a customs union and everything else they're asking for. There's zero reason for them to object to it.
Except of course they're opposing it because they hate the Tories and not because of anything to do with Brexit. Had Corbyn got the same deal they'd be backing it - and the Tories would be opposing it probably.
Would passing the WA but not the PD be sufficient for whichever bit of legislation requires the MV?
So Labour will ensure the WA dies too. Despite backing it in theory.
What have Labour asked for? Primarily a customs union. What has the withdrawal agreement delivered for the duration of the withdrawal agreement? A customs union.
It was Labour Policy to have a customs union and Tory policy not to. The ERG and other Tories object to the WA because it doesnt deliver what they want. Labour object to it despite the fact it delivers what they asked for.0 -
I'd say not - she's not quitting.Richard_Nabavi said:I'm not watching, just following on the live blog - but is this a valedictory statement? It almost seems like she's summing up the position and saying 'I've done my best...'
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I hope so but am very concerned it is still possibleIanB2 said:Buy £/$. No deal is almost off the table.
Despite Corbyn now reading out the speech he wrote early this morning.0 -
Labour backing Letwin.0
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He needs to close with 'Bring Me Sunshine'.TOPPING said:Corbo not bad here.
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LOLCarlottaVance said:
https://twitter.com/BBCPhilipSim/status/1110182854904950785RobD said:
Some of his best friends are gay?CarlottaVance said:Ever the charmer....
https://twitter.com/BBCPhilipSim/status/1110182267186569218
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Why? Legislation is already in place. It simply needs an 'Order in Council' to confirm the date.Big_G_NorthWales said:
Doubt it. - Getting the HOC to agree EU elections is going to be extremely difficultArtist said:Long extension it is then.
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As much as i hate it, Corbyn's kinda right....0
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he wrote? I doubt it...IanB2 said:Buy £/$. No deal is almost off the table.
Despite Corbyn now reading out the speech he wrote early this morning.0 -
Nope. Still trying to budge the immovable object.Richard_Nabavi said:I'm not watching, just following on the live blog - but is this a valedictory statement? It almost seems like she's summing up the position and saying 'I've done my best...'
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Thanks.Benpointer said:
I'd say not - she's not quitting.Richard_Nabavi said:I'm not watching, just following on the live blog - but is this a valedictory statement? It almost seems like she's summing up the position and saying 'I've done my best...'
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A Brexit supporter who egged Jeremy Corbyn while yelling "respect the vote" has been jailed for 28 days.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-476916060 -
It is toxic to most of the conservative party, the DUP and many labour mpsPenddu said:
Why? Legislation is already in place. It simply needs an 'Order in Council' to confirm the date.Big_G_NorthWales said:
Doubt it. - Getting the HOC to agree EU elections is going to be extremely difficultArtist said:Long extension it is then.
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Corbyn on good form (and I'm no fan)Richard_Nabavi said:
Thanks.Benpointer said:
I'd say not - she's not quitting.Richard_Nabavi said:I'm not watching, just following on the live blog - but is this a valedictory statement? It almost seems like she's summing up the position and saying 'I've done my best...'
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Or how damaging civil servants claim it "may" be. A bit like the immediate post referendum recession that was forecast.Benpointer said:
Because more than any of us she had access to what the full impact of No Deal Brexit will be. My guess is she knows how damaging it would be for the country.Philip_Thompson said:If May had any confidence she'd say its MV3 or No Deal as we won't be extending past the elections so make up your mind Parliament.
But she doesn't, so she'll lose again. As she deserves to.0 -
Didn't MPs previously vote against a Customs Union?0
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No Deal will never deliberately happen. It very may well accidentally happen, if the Commons cannot come to any decision.Big_G_NorthWales said:
I hope so but am very concerned it is still possibleIanB2 said:Buy £/$. No deal is almost off the table.
Despite Corbyn now reading out the speech he wrote early this morning.0 -
Every way forward from where we are is toxic to the Tory party. They should have thought a bit more about this before buying the ticket for the horror train.Big_G_NorthWales said:
It is toxic to most of the conservative party, the DUP and many labour mpsPenddu said:
Why? Legislation is already in place. It simply needs an 'Order in Council' to confirm the date.Big_G_NorthWales said:
Doubt it. - Getting the HOC to agree EU elections is going to be extremely difficultArtist said:Long extension it is then.
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I agree. If Labour were prepared to tag some conservative/reactionary (delete to taste) social policy (e.g. tight control of immigration) onto their big state economy message I think they might reap an electoral advantage. For me, it is one of Corbyn & Co's big plus points that they refuse to do this.isam said:The gap in the market seems to be for an economically left but socially conservative party. The revamped SDP are that, but they don't seem to get much publicity as they have no parliamentarians.
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A brief renewal methinks, mediocrity will be back soon.Sean_F said:
In the same way, the Scottish independence referendum revitalised the Scottish Conservatives, after years on the defensive.DavidL said:
What I have found remarkable is that Brexit has created a pro-EU movement in this country for the first time since the very early 70s. Both this march and the last one had large numbers of people seriously committed to the EU concept in ways I simply cannot recall in the last 40 years. As you say, had that happened before 2016 the result might have been very different. Instead we had the likes of Cameron going around saying that he understood why people disliked the EU but really, we were better in than out.Richard_Nabavi said:Regarding Saturday's march, which was very impressive, it must be admitted: I can't help feeling that if the Labour politicians and activists who played such a big role in organising it had put half as much effort into campaigning for Remain in 2016, we wouldn't have been in this mess.
A lot of it reminds me of the Indy ref. Better Together was led by people who were embarrassed to be British and mildly ashamed that we had a Tory government despite how Scotland had voted. Only in the final days with Brown and Ruth did we finally get some emotional drive for the Union. In the EU ref that emotional drive never came.0 -
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£ rising. Buy, buy...0
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The big question now is will the HOC agree to EU elections for a referendum or a GE otherwise it is no deal or TM dealSean_F said:
No Deal will never deliberately happen. It very may well accidentally happen, if the Commons cannot come to any decision.Big_G_NorthWales said:
I hope so but am very concerned it is still possibleIanB2 said:Buy £/$. No deal is almost off the table.
Despite Corbyn now reading out the speech he wrote early this morning.0 -
Mr. Artist, yes, they did. I think they rejected it more than once.0
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May reduced to trying to score a point off Corbyn for his not being on the No Brexit march0
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There's gonna be a looooong extension, possibly into next year.
By the end we will get so bored we might just say Sod it, and forget about Brexit altogether.
I think the Remainers just won.0 -
People greatly discount distant costs, however large they may be. As a political argument, 'this will lead to an immediate recession' is much more effective than 'this may lead to a recession if negotiations come to an unsatisfactory conclusion three years from now'.Philip_Thompson said:
Or how damaging civil servants claim it "may" be. A bit like the immediate post referendum recession that was forecast.Benpointer said:
Because more than any of us she had access to what the full impact of No Deal Brexit will be. My guess is she knows how damaging it would be for the country.Philip_Thompson said:If May had any confidence she'd say its MV3 or No Deal as we won't be extending past the elections so make up your mind Parliament.
But she doesn't, so she'll lose again. As she deserves to.0 -
What can I say to that Richard.Richard_Tyndall said:
I like himmalcolmg said:
A lying cheating sneaky self seeking toerag more like.Casino_Royale said:Gove is very bright but he is only good in small doses. He has to be shuffled every couple of years because it just takes it too far and doesn’t know when to stop.
He also loves the drama and can’t help but plot.
But, he achieved interesting, considered and helpful change at Education, Justice and Environment and also was behind Brexit too.
You can’t deny he’s a haymaker.0 -
Is it ??? If No Deal is now caetgorically ruled out then options are May Deal (No Election) or Extension/Revoke (Election). It doesnt matter if 90% of HoC oppose - it only requires a Government Signature - not a debate and a vote.Big_G_NorthWales said:
It is toxic to most of the conservative party, the DUP and many labour mpsPenddu said:
Why? Legislation is already in place. It simply needs an 'Order in Council' to confirm the date.Big_G_NorthWales said:
Doubt it. - Getting the HOC to agree EU elections is going to be extremely difficultArtist said:Long extension it is then.
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Oh dear, May has resorted to silly jibes at such a serious time.0
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If it was that good would we not have seen it a while ago, another dogs breakfast with even less freedom.kjohnw said:Doesn’t common market 2.0 give us all the economic benefits of EU membership without the political stuff , and freedom of labour rather than freedom of movement . Is it too good to be true? Do we retain independent control over tax policy for example ?
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SNP cleverly bringing things back to May's catastrophic TV appearance0
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Ladbrokes: 2019 referendum 3
No 2019 referendum 1.33
Revoking Article 50 in 2019 is 40 -
Sounds like a scene from the later parts of Downfall. Moving imaginary armies.Norm said:This is a lunatic fantasy
https://twitter.com/andrew_lilico/status/11099614088071372810 -
Really? He clearly wasn't responding to the statement - just going over his repeated attack lines over and over again.Benpointer said:
Corbyn on good form (and I'm no fan)Richard_Nabavi said:
Thanks.Benpointer said:
I'd say not - she's not quitting.Richard_Nabavi said:I'm not watching, just following on the live blog - but is this a valedictory statement? It almost seems like she's summing up the position and saying 'I've done my best...'
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That is correct.Philip_Thompson said:Yes she has!
What have Labour asked for? Primarily a customs union. What has the withdrawal agreement delivered for the duration of the withdrawal agreement? A customs union.
It was Labour Policy to have a customs union and Tory policy not to. The ERG and other Tories object to the WA because it doesnt deliver what they want. Labour object to it despite the fact it delivers what they asked for.
Logically, Corbyn should be arguing for the Deal and May should be opposing it.0 -
I wish we had the SNP in England,0
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What a twat Blackford is - he thinks he's at Bannockburn. Totally misplaced rhetoric.0
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'Win a GE with a Leaver Party'.Norm said:This is a lunatic fantasy
https://twitter.com/andrew_lilico/status/1109961408807137281
Yes, that's what the polling clearly shows. Oh no. Wait.0 -
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Which is, of course, his job.oxfordsimon said:
Really? He clearly wasn't responding to the statement - just going over his repeated attack lines over and over again.Benpointer said:
Corbyn on good form (and I'm no fan)Richard_Nabavi said:
Thanks.Benpointer said:
I'd say not - she's not quitting.Richard_Nabavi said:I'm not watching, just following on the live blog - but is this a valedictory statement? It almost seems like she's summing up the position and saying 'I've done my best...'
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Leavers are hopelessly split down the middle. The purists are killing it for the rest of us.SeanT said:There's gonna be a looooong extension, possibly into next year.
By the end we will get so bored we might just say Sod it, and forget about Brexit altogether.
I think the Remainers just won.0 -
And there would be advantages for both main parties in holding the EP election in that neither TIG nor the Farage Party are ready and would underperform their hype, and maybe not even be able to contest all seats, or any in TIG's case as it has no structure or selection process in place. Is it even a registered political party yet?Penddu said:
Why? Legislation is already in place. It simply needs an 'Order in Council' to confirm the date.Big_G_NorthWales said:
Doubt it. - Getting the HOC to agree EU elections is going to be extremely difficultArtist said:Long extension it is then.
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Whilst that’s true the same might also be true if Cameron had tried to sell his deal too and had EU leaders or advisors saying how they couldn’t believe what the British had won, or similar. Instead he seemed to as good admit it was a bit shit.Richard_Nabavi said:
The majority of Labour voters voted Remain, as you say. However, I think that majority would have been very considerably larger if the Labour leadership had been actively supporting Remain rather than (as is very clearly laid out in Tim Shipman's book) doing everything in their power to sabotage Will Straw's efforts.williamglenn said:The majority of Labour voters voted Remain. It was the Conservative vote that failed to support the position of their own leader, and wasn't going to be swung by Ed Miliband or whichever generic non-Marxist Labour leader you imagine having made a difference.
Then, there was the campaigning faux pas, most of it cosy and/or patronising, of which Obama, “WWIII”, the laughing established parties on the phones with the rosettes and calling those who thought of voting Leave “little Englanders” were just some examples.
And Andrew Cooper should have been fired after the Indyref and never hired again.0 -
Is he on the scandal of cuts to rural bus services again?oxfordsimon said:
Really? He clearly wasn't responding to the statement - just going over his repeated attack lines over and over again.Benpointer said:
Corbyn on good form (and I'm no fan)Richard_Nabavi said:
Thanks.Benpointer said:
I'd say not - she's not quitting.Richard_Nabavi said:I'm not watching, just following on the live blog - but is this a valedictory statement? It almost seems like she's summing up the position and saying 'I've done my best...'
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Definitely less than that if No deal were to happen (which the markets have so far given a lowish probability to, so it hasn't been 'tested'). I agree with Topping that the upside could be 1.45-1.48 - certainly at least 1.40.IanB2 said:0 -
As with May's deal, there was a well-organised group of Tories determined to trash it before he had chance.Casino_Royale said:
Whilst that’s true the same might also be true if Cameron had tried to sell his deal too and had EU leaders or advisors saying how they couldn’t believe what the British had won, or similar. Instead he seemed to as good admit it was a bit shit.Richard_Nabavi said:
The majority of Labour voters voted Remain, as you say. However, I think that majority would have been very considerably larger if the Labour leadership had been actively supporting Remain rather than (as is very clearly laid out in Tim Shipman's book) doing everything in their power to sabotage Will Straw's efforts.williamglenn said:The majority of Labour voters voted Remain. It was the Conservative vote that failed to support the position of their own leader, and wasn't going to be swung by Ed Miliband or whichever generic non-Marxist Labour leader you imagine having made a difference.
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Turns out we are getting that second referendum. It'll be on 23rd May.
Confusingly, the ballot paper will say "European Parliament election" at the top of it. The box for "Remain" will actually have the words "Liberal Democrat" next to it, the box for "Leave" will say "UKIP", and there'll be two "Don't know" boxes, for some reason, described as "Conservative" and "Labour". Still, I'm sure people will understand it.0 -
God no, awful nanny statists.IanB2 said:I wish we had the SNP in England,
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Maybe briefly, but the bottom line is that the £ is undervalued because of the cumulative insanity of our government. Sooner or later this must break on the upside.Richard_Nabavi said:
Definitely less than that if No deal were to happen (which the markets have so far given a lowish probability to, so it hasn't been 'tested'). I agree with Topping that the upside could be 1.45-1.48 - certainly at least 1.40.IanB2 said:0 -
To be fair, Italy has a form of PR, and many of their politicians 'are not to be recommended'.Sean_F said:0 -
No - completely focused on Brexit. Relatively clear and to the point imo.FrancisUrquhart said:
Is he on the scandal of cuts to rural bus services again?oxfordsimon said:
Really? He clearly wasn't responding to the statement - just going over his repeated attack lines over and over again.Benpointer said:
Corbyn on good form (and I'm no fan)Richard_Nabavi said:
Thanks.Benpointer said:
I'd say not - she's not quitting.Richard_Nabavi said:I'm not watching, just following on the live blog - but is this a valedictory statement? It almost seems like she's summing up the position and saying 'I've done my best...'
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And which politicians did you have in mind who would bring about this much needed sanity?IanB2 said:
Maybe briefly, but the bottom line is that the £ is undervalued because of the cumulative insanity of our government. Sooner or later this must break on the upside.Richard_Nabavi said:
Definitely less than that if No deal were to happen (which the markets have so far given a lowish probability to, so it hasn't been 'tested'). I agree with Topping that the upside could be 1.45-1.48 - certainly at least 1.40.IanB2 said:0 -
SouthamObserver said:
Interesting ...
https://twitter.com/YouGov/status/1110197466148818948
If you look at this alongside the petition breakdown by seat you see polarised at each end a large number of Labour seats and a handful of Tory seats strongly remain 50 - 100 seats, and strongly leave 100 seats, and then the majority a middle seats with Tory’s MPs in the middle. It May could somehow cobble together a way to pass the WA then that middle would be much happierSouthamObserver said:Interesting ...
https://twitter.com/YouGov/status/11101974661488189480 -
Hopefully. But in the event of an accidental No Deal anything could happen.IanB2 said:
Maybe briefly, but the bottom line is that the £ is undervalued because of the cumulative insanity of our government. Sooner or later this must break on the upside.Richard_Nabavi said:
Definitely less than that if No deal were to happen (which the markets have so far given a lowish probability to, so it hasn't been 'tested'). I agree with Topping that the upside could be 1.45-1.48 - certainly at least 1.40.IanB2 said:0 -
Sorry - not possibleEl_Capitano said:Turns out we are getting that second referendum. It'll be on 23rd May.
Confusingly, the ballot paper will say "European Parliament election" at the top of it. The box for "Remain" will actually have the words "Liberal Democrat" next to it, the box for "Leave" will say "UKIP", and there'll be two "Don't know" boxes, for some reason, described as "Conservative" and "Labour". Still, I'm sure people will understand it.0 -
I am so fed up with MPs not grasping with the reality of the situation
1 - the EU negotiates with Governments - not Parliaments. Parliament is not there to negotiate - it doesn't have the standing to do so.
2 - the contradiction of the SNP position is utterly ludicrous
3 -Indicative votes can't be binding on any Government - and most, if not all, of the options have already been rejected in this Parliament
4 - When will a single member of the opposition go through the WA and PD and explain in detail why they object to the provisions? I haven't heard that sort of analysis from any of them. It is just opposition for the sake of opposition
5 - the EU won't reopen negotiation - so how is any change supposed to be brought about?
I would be perfectly happy to see the dissolution of this Parliament with a ban on any of the current members from ever standing again.
Parliament has brought itself into disrepute by their collective behaviour - it is no longer fit for purpose as currently constituted. The standing orders need to be ripped up, Parliamentary procedure needs to be replaced. We need a fundamental change in our political system.
Enough is Enough0 -
Italy's problems have nothing to do with its voting system. Opponents of PR always cite Israel or Italy, but this adds no more value than citing a whole host of stable European countries in its favour.OldKingCole said:
To be fair, Italy has a form of PR, and many of their politicians 'are not to be recommended'.Sean_F said:0 -
I am rather surprised by that. Throwing eggs at politicians at election time was for many years a common occurrence.Harold Wilson had quite a few thrown at him during the 1970 election.FrancisUrquhart said:A Brexit supporter who egged Jeremy Corbyn while yelling "respect the vote" has been jailed for 28 days.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-476916060 -
Anti-British traitors do you mean?williamglenn said:
As with May's deal, there was a well-organised group of Tories determined to trash it before he had chance.Casino_Royale said:
Whilst that’s true the same might also be true if Cameron had tried to sell his deal too and had EU leaders or advisors saying how they couldn’t believe what the British had won, or similar. Instead he seemed to as good admit it was a bit shit.Richard_Nabavi said:
The majority of Labour voters voted Remain, as you say. However, I think that majority would have been very considerably larger if the Labour leadership had been actively supporting Remain rather than (as is very clearly laid out in Tim Shipman's book) doing everything in their power to sabotage Will Straw's efforts.williamglenn said:The majority of Labour voters voted Remain. It was the Conservative vote that failed to support the position of their own leader, and wasn't going to be swung by Ed Miliband or whichever generic non-Marxist Labour leader you imagine having made a difference.
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Don't think there ever any doubt who's side Theresa May was really on anyway...Scott_P said:0 -
I believe he didn't throw it, he smashed it onto him, so he was charged with something more serious and IMO quite rightly prosecuted.justin124 said:
I am rather surprised by that. Throwing eggs at politicians at election time was for many years a common occurrence.Harold Wilson had quite a few thrown at him during the 1970 election.FrancisUrquhart said:A Brexit supporter who egged Jeremy Corbyn while yelling "respect the vote" has been jailed for 28 days.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-47691606
I have to say, I am not really sure what use 28 days in prison is. I would have thought community service was invented for these kind of offences (unless the guy has a long track record of violence).0 -
Tbf, those don't know boxes would be bracketed as Leave, but too divided and incompetent to achieve it, and Remain, but too divided and cowardly to admit it.El_Capitano said:Turns out we are getting that second referendum. It'll be on 23rd May.
Confusingly, the ballot paper will say "European Parliament election" at the top of it. The box for "Remain" will actually have the words "Liberal Democrat" next to it, the box for "Leave" will say "UKIP", and there'll be two "Don't know" boxes, for some reason, described as "Conservative" and "Labour". Still, I'm sure people will understand it.0 -
Im not an opponent of PR. In fact the opposite.IanB2 said:
Italy's problems have nothing to do with its voting system. Opponents of PR always cite Israel or Italy, but this adds no more value than citing a whole host of stable European countries in its favour.OldKingCole said:
To be fair, Italy has a form of PR, and many of their politicians 'are not to be recommended'.Sean_F said:0 -
The only upside of accidental no deal is the profit we'll be able to make by trying to buy £s at the bottom. The damage to the country will be progressive and insidious, but our currency will overreact on the downside straight away.Benpointer said:
Hopefully. But in the event of an accidental No Deal anything could happen.IanB2 said:
Maybe briefly, but the bottom line is that the £ is undervalued because of the cumulative insanity of our government. Sooner or later this must break on the upside.Richard_Nabavi said:
Definitely less than that if No deal were to happen (which the markets have so far given a lowish probability to, so it hasn't been 'tested'). I agree with Topping that the upside could be 1.45-1.48 - certainly at least 1.40.IanB2 said:0 -
No Deal Brexit in 2019 Market:
Yes going out
No coming in (from 1.33 to 1.2 in last few mins)0 -
Will that be enough to get the ERG and DUP to toe the line?Scott_P said:0 -
Oddly, as Robert Smithson has pointed out, Italy boomed during the most chaotic period of its Parliamentary history, from 1950 -1990. Since 1992, Italy has had pretty stable governments and its growth rate has slowed to a crawl.OldKingCole said:
To be fair, Italy has a form of PR, and many of their politicians 'are not to be recommended'.Sean_F said:
In general, though, I think the evidence shows PR producing just as many gobshites as First Past the Post.0 -
It will break to the upside, yes - but only if we avoid a catastrophic No Deal. That is likely, but not certain at the moment.IanB2 said:
Maybe briefly, but the bottom line is that the £ is undervalued because of the cumulative insanity of our government. Sooner or later this must break on the upside.Richard_Nabavi said:
Definitely less than that if No deal were to happen (which the markets have so far given a lowish probability to, so it hasn't been 'tested'). I agree with Topping that the upside could be 1.45-1.48 - certainly at least 1.40.IanB2 said:
Mind you, IMO a better way to play that risk might be to buy shares in UK-focused companies which are particularly Brexit-sensitive. Some of those (such as housebuilders) look cheap even if there is a crash-out. That's because prices are depressed both by the specifics of the companies concerned, and by investors underweighting the whole of the UK market.0 -
Incredible bowling from Archer in the T20....4 Overs for just 17 runs and that is with the likes of Gayle batting.
Got to be in the England team.-1
