Not difficult to see how the remaining options dissipate so that we end up with no deal or No Brexit left.
May will revoke then resign. If she has to. Because when that's all that's left it's her career over and likely a Tory civil war. Throwing the country onto the bonfire does nothing to alleviate the end...
I can't see May revoking unless it can be completely blamed on others.
Revoke is likely to lead to PM Corbyn and Conservatives will think that more dangerous than No Deal.
Even if No Deal starts disastrously it might be alleviated but a PM Corbyn would be beyond their control.
Of all the outcomes the one that leads most probably to PM Corbyn is no deal. Not least because a big chunk of the Tory sensible wing has already said it would resign the party if no deal exit happens.
Then the Tories and the country are screwed either way because Tory support will simply evaporate if we do not Brexit
Good luck to any of those MPs trying find anyone to pound the streets for them. And we already know social media will crucify them. No Brexit means opposition for the Tories for decades.
If we get No Brexit it will be because of Labour, LD and SNP votes with only a handful of Tories tacked on, remember most Tory MPs have already voted not to rule out No Deal and against extension of Article 50. If we ended up with No Brexit Boris would likely end up Tory leader to avoid Tory Leavers moving en masse to Farage's new Brexit Party and UKIP
For much the same reasons, you may also end up with Johnson as PM in the case of a long extension, which will be viewed in much the same light as revoking. May's 12 months of immunity only lasts until mid-December 2019.
Yes, Johnson will be a Salmond type figure for Leave voters if Brexit never happens, a rallying point against the Unionist, EUphile establishment
Salmond is not someone to aspire to be an example of (sorry Malc)
So May has to present the MV3 motion and plead with Bercow that 'Something has changed! Something has changed!'
The EU 27 should tell May that there are no grounds for an extension since she has no plan that requires extra time to enact. Then it is No Deal or Revoke. Your call Tezzie.
Not difficult to see how the remaining options dissipate so that we end up with no deal or No Brexit left.
May will revoke then resign. If she has to. Because when that's all that's left it's her career over and likely a Tory civil war. Throwing the country onto the bonfire does nothing to alleviate the end...
I can't see May revoking unless it can be completely blamed on others.
Revoke is likely to lead to PM Corbyn and Conservatives will think that more dangerous than No Deal.
Even if No Deal starts disastrously it might be alleviated but a PM Corbyn would be beyond their control.
Of all the outcomes the one that leads most probably to PM Corbyn is no deal. Not least because a big chunk of the Tory sensible wing has already said it would resign the party if no deal exit happens.
Then the Tories and the country are screwed either way because Tory support will simply evaporate if we do not Brexit
Good luck to any of those MPs trying find anyone to pound the streets for them. And we already know social media will crucify them. No Brexit means opposition for the Tories for decades.
My MP said as much at a social on Saturday. She was concerned prospective councillors standing on May 2nd might pay the price for Brexit failure.
Yes. I suspect May 2nd will be a small-screen preview of the next General Election. One of our district seats, currently Lib Dem but held by the Conservatives a few years ago, is up for election and the Tories have selected a very strong candidate. I estimate that she has a whelk's chance in a supernova of winning it. The notion that our strongly pro-Remain town will elect a Tory any time soon is for the birds.
Bercow hast managed to push all the waverers who were coming around to the WA back into the no deal camp.
If there's a second referendum I think Leave win because of today where the establishment has acted against the public vote so blatantly.
My WhatsApp group is absolutely seething at what they see as an establishment coup.
Bercow's ruling was perfectly justified, I've hardly read any comments suggesting otherwise. . As there would have been no more EU talks MV3 would have been identical to MV2. It's teenage histrionics to categorise the Speaker's ruling as ruling as an "establishment coup"
Out there in the real world I doubt 95% of punters wouldn't have you a clue about it if you asked their opinon..
Not difficult to see how the remaining options dissipate so that we end up with no deal or No Brexit left.
May will revoke then resign. If she has to. Because when that's all that's left it's her career over and likely a Tory civil war. Throwing the country onto the bonfire does nothing to alleviate the end...
I can't see May revoking unless it can be completely blamed on others.
Revoke is likely to lead to PM Corbyn and Conservatives will think that more dangerous than No Deal.
Even if No Deal starts disastrously it might be alleviated but a PM Corbyn would be beyond their control.
Of all the outcomes the one that leads most probably to PM Corbyn is no deal. Not least because a big chunk of the Tory sensible wing has already said it would resign the party if no deal exit happens.
Then the Tories and the country are screwed either way because Tory support will simply evaporate if we do not Brexit
Good luck to any of those MPs trying find anyone to pound the streets for them. And we already know social media will crucify them. No Brexit means opposition for the Tories for decades.
If we get No Brexit it will be because of Labour, LD and SNP votes with only a handful of Tories tacked on, remember most Tory MPs have already voted not to rule out No Deal and against extension of Article 50. If we ended up with No Brexit Boris would likely end up Tory leader to avoid Tory Leavers moving en masse to Farage's new Brexit Party and UKIP
For much the same reasons, you may also end up with Johnson as PM in the case of a long extension, which will be viewed in much the same light as revoking. May's 12 months of immunity only lasts until mid-December 2019.
Yes, Johnson will be a Salmond type figure for Leave voters if Brexit never happens, a rallying point against the Unionist, EUphile establishment
Salmond is not someone to aspire to be an example of (sorry Malc)
Maybe not but he did launch the SNP to become the largest party in Scotland
I don't mind MPs repeatedly voting on something, especially as there doesn't seem to be a consensus on anything, but there is an air of deja vu all over again with these "meaningful" votes. If Erskine May has any purpose in preventing repetitions this would surely be it.
I am not sure the public will see it that way. This is one of the issues that most of the public who know what it is, desperately want to be resolved. Standing in the way of that happening using an interpretation of a little known parliamentary procedure looks incredibly self indulgent and out of touch to me.
The ERG, DUP and Labour were standing in the way of a resolution. Not the effing speaker.
Mention of android...can I just say how much better mobile internet experience is now I don't have a massive notch cut out in the screen....Samsung S10 screen is the bollocks.
Presumably the Brexit imp is referencing C.S.Lewis here. Explains a lot.
I haven't read CSLewis but I have read (damn nearly all of) Terry Pratchett, and Hannan always reminded me of Vorbis. No fact, no argument ever sways him: he holds his ideas absolutely and is never swayed by self-doubt.
Mention of android...can I just say how much better mobile internet experience is now I don't have a massive notch cut out in the screen....Samsung S10 screen is the bollocks.
Mention of android...can I just say how much better mobile internet experience is now I don't have a massive notch cut out in the screen....Samsung S10 screen is the bollocks.
Nah.
You need a proper folding phone
God no....just no! Supposedly Samsung already having working demo of 100% screen with the front facing camera under the screen.
Now that Dacre has gone from the Mail, the Express is taking up its demagogic mantle from "the enemies of the people" era. He's a brave, foolhardy, self attention-directing, principled, whatever you want to call him, man - but he's got some guts.
Can we get that in writing? Them not doing anything and shutting the [redacted] up would be a distinct improvement. Maybe if they concentrated on their dayjobs of hedge fund management and advising foreign companies instead of banging on about politics we'd all be a lot happier.
A question to those that predict civil unrest if Brexit is revoked, read this from yesterday's Sunday Times and tell me do you think civil unrest is less likely if a no-deal crash out leads to interruption of drinking water supplies?
Concerns over access to drinking water surfaced in November when it emerged that Michael Gove had only backed Theresa May’s deal after he discovered that Britain would run out within days of a no-deal Brexit.
Chemicals used to purify water are imported to the UK from Europe on a just-in-time basis, meaning any delay at Dover could leave deliveries caught in weeks of border chaos. Liquefied chlorine, sodium silicofluoride, aluminium sulphate, fluorosilicic acid and calcium hydroxide cannot be stockpiled.
Thames Water, the UK’s biggest water company, said it was working with the government to ensure that supplies of drinking water would not be hit.
However, civil servants at the Cabinet Office, which is overseeing Brexit plans, fear that the measures will not be enough and are among those said to be stockpiling bottled water.
I bolded the really salient bit.
Gosh, whatever will we do without those lovely enhancements in our water?
Doubtless the ST and the Cabinet Offices bedwetters will be delighted to learn that there's a reasonably substantial stockpile of calcium hydroxide underneath Scart Hill in County Antrim, and that it's been stockpiled there since at least the time it was discovered in the 1930s, and likely a few hundred million years before that too.
See also aluminium sulphate, alum schists in (or at least under) Lennoxtown, Scotland, C19.
Can we get that in writing? Them not doing anything and shutting the [redacted] up would be a distinct improvement. Maybe if they concentrated on their dayjobs of hedge fund management and advising foreign companies instead of banging on about politics we'd all be a lot happier.
They'd have to be confident of a hard-brexiter replacement to ever carry through anything like that. With Raab or Javid on the horizon, maybe they are ?
Now that Dacre has gone from the Mail, the Express is taking up its demagogic mantle from "the enemies of the people" era. He's a brave, foolhardy, self attention-directing, principled, whatever you want to call him, man - but he's got some guts.
Hypothetically what would happen if May said to the EU "change the backstop so I can get this through Parliament or I will revoke and will veto everything I can until we get a decent withdrawal agreement offered, including every budget proposed"?
This is probably the last chance for May to get hold of the situation. I think her only option left is to ask for a 6 month delay to call a GE and go to the country on the basis of government needs a majority and x mandate to proceed with my deal. If she doesn't 22 will make 97 look close
Has May even "vowed" to delay Brexit for a year? "Accepted grudgingly that we might need to extend but really rather it wouldn't be a long extension if we can possibly help it P.S. vote for my deal" is surely a bit closer to the mark, and I'm no particular fan of hers.
Presumably the Brexit imp is referencing C.S.Lewis here. Explains a lot.
Daniel Hannan is such a snowflake/arsehole.
He gets really upset when you remind him that he's a liar.
Their status isn't changing though is it? Hence the offer of settled status.
Oh really, there's many people like this poor lady.
Many people with #FBPE and #StopBrexit in their name claiming scare stories? I'm sure there are.
I'm equally sure this will still be her home post-Brexit.
I've spent the afternoon helping a friend in a similar situation.
As we saw with windrush, people who have a legal right to be here get chucked out.
But you keep on telling people like that they've got nothing to worry about.
Phillip's MO is simply to deny the veracity of anything and everything that is negative consequence of Brexit.
He told me I was lying about my business having importation problems last week – despite the fact I had an email from a supplier saying exactly that.
Despite you saying you have an email from a supplier saying exactly that
If you do, why not get in touch with the Independent or Guardian who love to run bad news stories yet seem to have been very quiet on this front? Unless you can link to a number of verified stories like you're claiming?
Tory support in the polls has just dipped again. Is an election still going to look appealing when all this has done further damage over the next few weeks ? I would wonder about that.
This is probably the last chance for May to get hold of the situation. I think her only option left is to ask for a 6 month delay to call a GE and go to the country on the basis of government needs a majority and x mandate to proceed with my deal. If she doesn't 22 will make 97 look close
In retrospect its been obvious that a GE would be necessary ever since the ERG had their tantrum last November.
Presumably the Brexit imp is referencing C.S.Lewis here. Explains a lot.
Daniel Hannan is such a snowflake/arsehole.
He gets really upset when you remind him that he's a liar.
Their status isn't changing though is it? Hence the offer of settled status.
Oh really, there's many people like this poor lady.
Many people with #FBPE and #StopBrexit in their name claiming scare stories? I'm sure there are.
I'm equally sure this will still be her home post-Brexit.
I've spent the afternoon helping a friend in a similar situation.
As we saw with windrush, people who have a legal right to be here get chucked out.
But you keep on telling people like that they've got nothing to worry about.
Phillip's MO is simply to deny the veracity of anything and everything that is negative consequence of Brexit.
He told me I was lying about my business having importation problems last week – despite the fact I had an email from a supplier saying exactly that.
Despite you saying you have an email from a supplier saying exactly that
If you do, why not get in touch with the Independent or Guardian who love to run bad news stories yet seem to have been very quiet on this front? Unless you can link to a number of verified stories like you're claiming?
Seems like you are implying people are lying again.
Why the fuck would I waste my time, and possibly offend my supplier, by talking to the press, by the way?
Tory support in the polls has just dipped again. Is an election still going to look appealing when all this has done further damage over the next few weeks ? I would wonder about that.
Is it going to be more appealing later on ?
And is government going to be functioning in the mean time ?
This is probably the last chance for May to get hold of the situation. I think her only option left is to ask for a 6 month delay to call a GE and go to the country on the basis of government needs a majority and x mandate to proceed with my deal. If she doesn't 22 will make 97 look close
In retrospect its been obvious that a GE would be necessary ever since the ERG had their tantrum last November.
Tory support in the polls has just dipped again. Is an election still going to look appealing when all this has done further damage over the next few weeks ? I would wonder about that.
Judging by current polling, the Commons would not become less divided.
A question to those that predict civil unrest if Brexit is revoked, read this from yesterday's Sunday Times and tell me do you think civil unrest is less likely if a no-deal crash out leads to interruption of drinking water supplies?
Concerns over access to drinking water surfaced in November when it emerged that Michael Gove had only backed Theresa May’s deal after he discovered that Britain would run out within days of a no-deal Brexit.
Chemicals used to purify water are imported to the UK from Europe on a just-in-time basis, meaning any delay at Dover could leave deliveries caught in weeks of border chaos. Liquefied chlorine, sodium silicofluoride, aluminium sulphate, fluorosilicic acid and calcium hydroxide cannot be stockpiled.
Thames Water, the UK’s biggest water company, said it was working with the government to ensure that supplies of drinking water would not be hit.
However, civil servants at the Cabinet Office, which is overseeing Brexit plans, fear that the measures will not be enough and are among those said to be stockpiling bottled water.
I bolded the really salient bit.
Gosh, whatever will we do without those lovely enhancements in our water?
Doubtless the ST and the Cabinet Offices bedwetters will be delighted to learn that there's a reasonably substantial stockpile of calcium hydroxide underneath Scart Hill in County Antrim, and that it's been stockpiled there since at least the time it was discovered in the 1930s, and likely a few hundred million years before that too.
See also aluminium sulphate, alum schists in (or at least under) Lennoxtown, Scotland, C19.
Honestly, get a grip.
Excellent news. Can you get a calcium hydroxide mine up and running by a week on Friday?
Presumably the Brexit imp is referencing C.S.Lewis here. Explains a lot.
Daniel Hannan is such a snowflake/arsehole.
He gets really upset when you remind him that he's a liar.
Their status isn't changing though is it? Hence the offer of settled status.
Oh really, there's many people like this poor lady.
Many people with #FBPE and #StopBrexit in their name claiming scare stories? I'm sure there are.
I'm equally sure this will still be her home post-Brexit.
I've spent the afternoon helping a friend in a similar situation.
As we saw with windrush, people who have a legal right to be here get chucked out.
But you keep on telling people like that they've got nothing to worry about.
Phillip's MO is simply to deny the veracity of anything and everything that is negative consequence of Brexit.
He told me I was lying about my business having importation problems last week – despite the fact I had an email from a supplier saying exactly that.
Despite you saying you have an email from a supplier saying exactly that
If you do, why not get in touch with the Independent or Guardian who love to run bad news stories yet seem to have been very quiet on this front? Unless you can link to a number of verified stories like you're claiming?
Seems like you are implying people are lying again.
Why the fuck would I waste my time, and possibly offend my supplier, by talking to the press, by the way?
To please you?
Sorry if I'm not being clear. Yes I'm implying some people are lying.
I have absolutely no doubt whatsoever that companies are putting off investment due to Brexit, or that companies are diversifying their licensing locations or supply chains due to Brexit etc, or blaming* Brexit for the reason they're increasing prices but I do doubt that foreign companies are refusing to take export orders due to it. I am also highly sceptical of people who just so happen to be ardent campaigners against Brexit claiming disasters that others are not reporting.
* Many of them are lying too for the avoidance of doubt.
Surely - since Parliament has voted against the WA and voted against a no deal exit - they must now vote on whether:-
(a) to revoke Article 50; or (b) have a referendum, which are the only options left that relate specifically to Brexit.
Then depending on which gets the most votes in favour May acts on that. The EU 27 would agree to an extension for a referendum I think. They might be relieved if we revoke though I wouldn't blame them if their initial reaction if we revoked was to go "Oh, fuck. No!"
She is however too stubborn, stupid and unimaginative and listens to no-one sensible and the Tory party is such a disgrace that I imagine she will try for some idiotic nonsense (like proroguing or some such arcane idiocy). Which won't work and we end up crashing out with not all of the relevant necessary legislation in place and so a legal mess for years to come. So lawyers - if no-one else - will be pleased.
The Tories are making Corbyn as PM more and more likely (in itself a bad enough prospect for anyone sane) but, even worse, they are making the prospect of him being in power seem like a better alternative than the shower of incompetent shits (with apologies to the decent Tories on this board) the current Tory party has turned into. Some of the stupider Tories seem to think that No Deal will vindicate them whereas it will annihilate them and seriously risks ruining the country.
And once May has acted on what Parliament tells her and been humiliated at the EU summit, she needs to go. Though when I think of who might succeed her I wobble even on that.
Oh - and the ERG should all be deselected. They are all an absolute menace to good governance.
Surely - since Parliament has voted against the WA and voted against a no deal exit - they must now vote on whether:-
(a) to revoke Article 50; or (b) have a referendum, which are the only options left that relate specifically to Brexit.
Then depending on which gets the most votes in favour May acts on that. The EU 27 would agree to an extension for a referendum I think. They might be relieved if we revoke though I wouldn't blame them if their initial reaction if we revoked was to go "Oh, fuck. No!"
She is however too stubborn, stupid and unimaginative and listens to no-one sensible and the Tory party is such a disgrace that I imagine she will try for some idiotic nonsense (like proroguing or some such arcane idiocy). Which won't work and we end up crashing out with not all of the relevant necessary legislation in place and so a legal mess for years to come. So lawyers - if no-one else - will be pleased.
The Tories are making Corbyn as PM more and more likely (in itself a bad enough prospect for anyone sane) but, even worse, they are making the prospect of him being in power seem like a better alternative than the shower of incompetent shits (with apologies to the decent Tories on this board) the current Tory party has turned into. Some of the stupider Tories seem to think that No Deal will vindicate them whereas it will annihilate them and seriously risks ruining the country.
And once May has acted on what Parliament tells her and been humiliated at the EU summit, she needs to go. Though when I think of who might succeed her I wobble even on that.
Didn't Parliament vote against a referendum last week?
This is probably the last chance for May to get hold of the situation. I think her only option left is to ask for a 6 month delay to call a GE and go to the country on the basis of government needs a majority and x mandate to proceed with my deal. If she doesn't 22 will make 97 look close
In retrospect its been obvious that a GE would be necessary ever since the ERG had their tantrum last November.
Tory support in the polls has just dipped again. Is an election still going to look appealing when all this has done further damage over the next few weeks ? I would wonder about that.
Is it going to be more appealing later on ?
And is government going to be functioning in the mean time ?
Well, you have to make the realistic equation of where MP's sense of self-preservation lies in the order of priority, if they can maintain the barest husk of order to hang their seats on in the storm. I hate to be a cynic, but..
Hypothetically what would happen if May said to the EU "change the backstop so I can get this through Parliament or I will revoke and will veto everything I can until we get a decent withdrawal agreement offered, including every budget proposed"?
A question to those that predict civil unrest if Brexit is revoked, read this from yesterday's Sunday Times and tell me do you think civil unrest is less likely if a no-deal crash out leads to interruption of drinking water supplies?
Concerns over access to drinking water surfaced in November when it emerged that Michael Gove had only backed Theresa May’s deal after he discovered that Britain would run out within days of a no-deal Brexit.
Chemicals used to purify water are imported to the UK from Europe on a just-in-time basis, meaning any delay at Dover could leave deliveries caught in weeks of border chaos. Liquefied chlorine, sodium silicofluoride, aluminium sulphate, fluorosilicic acid and calcium hydroxide cannot be stockpiled.
Thames Water, the UK’s biggest water company, said it was working with the government to ensure that supplies of drinking water would not be hit.
However, civil servants at the Cabinet Office, which is overseeing Brexit plans, fear that the measures will not be enough and are among those said to be stockpiling bottled water.
I bolded the really salient bit.
Gosh, whatever will we do without those lovely enhancements in our water?
Doubtless the ST and the Cabinet Offices bedwetters will be delighted to learn that there's a reasonably substantial stockpile of calcium hydroxide underneath Scart Hill in County Antrim, and that it's been stockpiled there since at least the time it was discovered in the 1930s, and likely a few hundred million years before that too.
See also aluminium sulphate, alum schists in (or at least under) Lennoxtown, Scotland, C19.
Honestly, get a grip.
Excellent news. Can you get a calcium hydroxide mine up and running by a week on Friday?
I think you'll need to ask the MP for East Antrim. You'll find him via the DUP office in Westminster.
Hypothetically what would happen if May said to the EU "change the backstop so I can get this through Parliament or I will revoke and will veto everything I can until we get a decent withdrawal agreement offered, including every budget proposed"?
This would be the deal that was rejected twice by overwhelming majorities, would it? Bercow is sabotaging nothing. The deal was sabotaged by Parliament not voting for it.
Sometimes I wonder if May understands how Parliament actually works.
This is probably the last chance for May to get hold of the situation. I think her only option left is to ask for a 6 month delay to call a GE and go to the country on the basis of government needs a majority and x mandate to proceed with my deal. If she doesn't 22 will make 97 look close
In retrospect its been obvious that a GE would be necessary ever since the ERG had their tantrum last November.
What GE outcome would change anything? And is that outcome likely?
This would be the deal that was rejected twice by overwhelming majorities, would it? Bercow is sabotaging nothing. The deal was sabotaged by Parliament not voting for it.
Sometimes I wonder if May understands how Parliament actually works.
Sometimes I wonder if May wishes we were an 'elected dictatorship' and regrets those pesky Parliamentarians getting a say.
Surely - since Parliament has voted against the WA and voted against a no deal exit - they must now vote on whether:-
(a) to revoke Article 50; or (b) have a referendum, which are the only options left that relate specifically to Brexit.
Then depending on which gets the most votes in favour May acts on that. The EU 27 would agree to an extension for a referendum I think. They might be relieved if we revoke though I wouldn't blame them if their initial reaction if we revoked was to go "Oh, fuck. No!"
She is however too stubborn, stupid and unimaginative and listens to no-one sensible and the Tory party is such a disgrace that I imagine she will try for some idiotic nonsense (like proroguing or some such arcane idiocy). Which won't work and we end up crashing out with not all of the relevant necessary legislation in place and so a legal mess for years to come. So lawyers - if no-one else - will be pleased.
The Tories are making Corbyn as PM more and more likely (in itself a bad enough prospect for anyone sane) but, even worse, they are making the prospect of him being in power seem like a better alternative than the shower of incompetent shits (with apologies to the decent Tories on this board) the current Tory party has turned into. Some of the stupider Tories seem to think that No Deal will vindicate them whereas it will annihilate them and seriously risks ruining the country.
And once May has acted on what Parliament tells her and been humiliated at the EU summit, she needs to go. Though when I think of who might succeed her I wobble even on that.
Surely - since Parliament has voted against the WA and voted against a no deal exit - they must now vote on whether:-
(a) to revoke Article 50; or (b) have a referendum, which are the only options left that relate specifically to Brexit.
Then depending on which gets the most votes in favour May acts on that. The EU 27 would agree to an extension for a referendum I think. They might be relieved if we revoke though I wouldn't blame them if their initial reaction if we revoked was to go "Oh, fuck. No!"
She is however too stubborn, stupid and unimaginative and listens to no-one sensible and the Tory party is such a disgrace that I imagine she will try for some idiotic nonsense (like proroguing or some such arcane idiocy). Which won't work and we end up crashing out with not all of the relevant necessary legislation in place and so a legal mess for years to come. So lawyers - if no-one else - will be pleased.
The Tories are making Corbyn as PM more and more likely (in itself a bad enough prospect for anyone sane) but, even worse, they are making the prospect of him being in power seem like a better alternative than the shower of incompetent shits (with apologies to the decent Tories on this board) the current Tory party has turned into. Some of the stupider Tories seem to think that No Deal will vindicate them whereas it will annihilate them and seriously risks ruining the country.
And once May has acted on what Parliament tells her and been humiliated at the EU summit, she needs to go. Though when I think of who might succeed her I wobble even on that.
Didn't Parliament vote against a referendum last week?
Yes and that is where Bercow's ruling causes problems as it has already been voted down
This is probably the last chance for May to get hold of the situation. I think her only option left is to ask for a 6 month delay to call a GE and go to the country on the basis of government needs a majority and x mandate to proceed with my deal. If she doesn't 22 will make 97 look close
In retrospect its been obvious that a GE would be necessary ever since the ERG had their tantrum last November.
What is a general election going to achieve? Very little on current polling but yet another hung parliament, unless May won a landslide of over 100 she still has nowhere near any certainty of getting her Deal through. It is time for Parliament to make its mind up, having ruled out No Deal do they back the Deal, Customs Union and/or Single Market BINO or EUref2 or revoke
A question to those that predict civil unrest if Brexit is revoked, read this from yesterday's Sunday Times and tell me do you think civil unrest is less likely if a no-deal crash out leads to interruption of drinking water supplies?
Concerns over access to drinking water surfaced in November when it emerged that Michael Gove had only backed Theresa May’s deal after he discovered that Britain would run out within days of a no-deal Brexit.
Chemicals used to purify water are imported to the UK from Europe on a just-in-time basis, meaning any delay at Dover could leave deliveries caught in weeks of border chaos. Liquefied chlorine, sodium silicofluoride, aluminium sulphate, fluorosilicic acid and calcium hydroxide cannot be stockpiled.
Thames Water, the UK’s biggest water company, said it was working with the government to ensure that supplies of drinking water would not be hit.
However, civil servants at the Cabinet Office, which is overseeing Brexit plans, fear that the measures will not be enough and are among those said to be stockpiling bottled water.
I bolded the really salient bit.
Gosh, whatever will we do without those lovely enhancements in our water?
Doubtless the ST and the Cabinet Offices bedwetters will be delighted to learn that there's a reasonably substantial stockpile of calcium hydroxide underneath Scart Hill in County Antrim, and that it's been stockpiled there since at least the time it was discovered in the 1930s, and likely a few hundred million years before that too.
See also aluminium sulphate, alum schists in (or at least under) Lennoxtown, Scotland, C19.
Honestly, get a grip.
Excellent news. Can you get a calcium hydroxide mine up and running by a week on Friday?
I think you'll need to ask the MP for East Antrim. You'll find him via the DUP office in Westminster.
We're saved! I'm sure the MP for East Antrim could manage it. For a modest payment to support the local economy.
Surely - since Parliament has voted against the WA and voted against a no deal exit - they must now vote on whether:-
(a) to revoke Article 50; or (b) have a referendum, which are the only options left that relate specifically to Brexit.
Then depending on which gets the most votes in favour May acts on that. The EU 27 would agree to an extension for a referendum I think. They might be relieved if we revoke though I wouldn't blame them if their initial reaction if we revoked was to go "Oh, fuck. No!"
She is however too stubborn, stupid and unimaginative and listens to no-one sensible and the Tory party is such a disgrace that I imagine she will try for some idiotic nonsense (like proroguing or some such arcane idiocy). Which won't work and we end up crashing out with not all of the relevant necessary legislation in place and so a legal mess for years to come. So lawyers - if no-one else - will be pleased.
The Tories are making Corbyn as PM more and more likely (in itself a bad enough prospect for anyone sane) but, even worse, they are making the prospect of him being in power seem like a better alternative than the shower of incompetent shits (with apologies to the decent Tories on this board) the current Tory party has turned into. Some of the stupider Tories seem to think that No Deal will vindicate them whereas it will annihilate them and seriously risks ruining the country.
And once May has acted on what Parliament tells her and been humiliated at the EU summit, she needs to go. Though when I think of who might succeed her I wobble even on that.
Didn't Parliament vote against a referendum last week?
That may be so and I didn't notice. Fine. Then revocation it has to be. There is no alternative.
This is probably the last chance for May to get hold of the situation. I think her only option left is to ask for a 6 month delay to call a GE and go to the country on the basis of government needs a majority and x mandate to proceed with my deal. If she doesn't 22 will make 97 look close
In retrospect its been obvious that a GE would be necessary ever since the ERG had their tantrum last November.
What is a general election going to achieve? Very little on current polling but yet another hung parliament, unless May won a landslide of over 100 she still has nowhere near any certainty of getting her Deal through. It is time for Parliament to make its mind up, having ruled out No Deal do they back the Deal, Customs Union and/or Single Market BINO or EUref2 or revoke
Why have the just ruled out No Deal?
Parliament has already ruled out No Deal, the Deal, Customs Union and/or Single Market BINO and EUref2.
Every single one of them except revoke has already been voted against.
Surely - since Parliament has voted against the WA and voted against a no deal exit - they must now vote on whether:-
(a) to revoke Article 50; or (b) have a referendum, which are the only options left that relate specifically to Brexit.
Then depending on which gets the most votes in favour May acts on that. The EU 27 would agree to an extension for a referendum I think. They might be relieved if we revoke though I wouldn't blame them if their initial reaction if we revoked was to go "Oh, fuck. No!"
She is however too stubborn, stupid and unimaginative and listens to no-one sensible and the Tory party is such a disgrace that I imagine she will try for some idiotic nonsense (like proroguing or some such arcane idiocy). Which won't work and we end up crashing out with not all of the relevant necessary legislation in place and so a legal mess for years to come. So lawyers - if no-one else - will be pleased.
The Tories are making Corbyn as PM more and more likely (in itself a bad enough prospect for anyone sane) but, even worse, they are making the prospect of him being in power seem like a better alternative than the shower of incompetent shits (with apologies to the decent Tories on this board) the current Tory party has turned into. Some of the stupider Tories seem to think that No Deal will vindicate them whereas it will annihilate them and seriously risks ruining the country.
And once May has acted on what Parliament tells her and been humiliated at the EU summit, she needs to go. Though when I think of who might succeed her I wobble even on that.
Parliament has already rejected a 2nd referendum.
Not a referendum on her deal. The amendment that was defeated was for a referendum on an arbitrary deal to be defined.
Surely - since Parliament has voted against the WA and voted against a no deal exit - they must now vote on whether:-
(a) to revoke Article 50; or (b) have a referendum, which are the only options left that relate specifically to Brexit.
Then depending on which gets the most votes in favour May acts on that. The EU 27 would agree to an extension for a referendum I think. They might be relieved if we revoke though I wouldn't blame them if their initial reaction if we revoked was to go "Oh, fuck. No!"
She is however too stubborn, stupid and unimaginative and listens to no-one sensible and the Tory party is such a disgrace that I imagine she will try for some idiotic nonsense (like proroguing or some such arcane idiocy). Which won't work and we end up crashing out with not all of the relevant necessary legislation in place and so a legal mess for years to come. So lawyers - if no-one else - will be pleased.
The Tories are making Corbyn as PM more and more likely (in itself a bad enough prospect for anyone sane) but, even worse, they are making the prospect of him being in power seem like a better alternative than the shower of incompetent shits (with apologies to the decent Tories on this board) the current Tory party has turned into. Some of the stupider Tories seem to think that No Deal will vindicate them whereas it will annihilate them and seriously risks ruining the country.
And once May has acted on what Parliament tells her and been humiliated at the EU summit, she needs to go. Though when I think of who might succeed her I wobble even on that.
Didn't Parliament vote against a referendum last week?
That may be so and I didn't notice. Fine. Then revocation it has to be. There is no alternative.
Indeed. Though I have the sneaky suspicion that Parliament would vote against that too.
This is probably the last chance for May to get hold of the situation. I think her only option left is to ask for a 6 month delay to call a GE and go to the country on the basis of government needs a majority and x mandate to proceed with my deal. If she doesn't 22 will make 97 look close
In retrospect its been obvious that a GE would be necessary ever since the ERG had their tantrum last November.
What GE outcome would change anything? And is that outcome likely?
The Conservatives need to deselect the ERG and Grieve's gang.
Until they do that there is no chance of May's deal passing.
What the outcome of a GE would be I don't know but the current situation clearly is not working.
Surely - since Parliament has voted against the WA and voted against a no deal exit - they must now vote on whether:-
(a) to revoke Article 50; or (b) have a referendum, which are the only options left that relate specifically to Brexit.
Then depending on which gets the most votes in favour May acts on that. The EU 27 would agree to an extension for a referendum I think. They might be relieved if we revoke though I wouldn't blame them if their initial reaction if we revoked was to go "Oh, fuck. No!"
She is however too stubborn, stupid and unimaginative and listens to no-one sensible and the Tory party is such a disgrace that I imagine she will try for some idiotic nonsense (like proroguing or some such arcane idiocy). Which won't work and we end up crashing out with not all of the relevant necessary legislation in place and so a legal mess for years to come. So lawyers - if no-one else - will be pleased.
The Tories are making Corbyn as PM more and more likely (in itself a bad enough prospect for anyone sane) but, even worse, they are making the prospect of him being in power seem like a better alternative than the shower of incompetent shits (with apologies to the decent Tories on this board) the current Tory party has turned into. Some of the stupider Tories seem to think that No Deal will vindicate them whereas it will annihilate them and seriously risks ruining the country.
And once May has acted on what Parliament tells her and been humiliated at the EU summit, she needs to go. Though when I think of who might succeed her I wobble even on that.
Didn't Parliament vote against a referendum last week?
Yes and that is where Bercow's ruling causes problems as it has already been voted down
Bercow has been perfectly clear the rules only apply when he wants them to.
Hypothetically what would happen if May said to the EU "change the backstop so I can get this through Parliament or I will revoke and will veto everything I can until we get a decent withdrawal agreement offered, including every budget proposed"?
They refuse the revocation. For obvious reasons.
We can revoke unilaterally.
I think going to the court and saying "...change the backstop so I can get this through Parliament or I will revoke and will veto everything I can until we get a decent withdrawal agreement offered, including every budget proposed" would test that hypothesis to destruction.
Right now the best thing that could happen is not revocation, another referendum, or a redundant general election, but a rogue asteroid; so that a new Parliament has to be formed from scratch.
Surely - since Parliament has voted against the WA and voted against a no deal exit - they must now vote on whether:-
(a) to revoke Article 50; or (b) have a referendum, which are the only options left that relate specifically to Brexit.
Then depending on which gets the most votes in favour May acts on that. The EU 27 would agree to an extension for a referendum I think. They might be relieved if we revoke though I wouldn't blame them if their initial reaction if we revoked was to go "Oh, fuck. No!"
She is however too stubborn, stupid and unimaginative and listens to no-one sensible and the Tory party is such a disgrace that I imagine she will try for some idiotic nonsense (like proroguing or some such arcane idiocy). Which won't work and we end up crashing out with not all of the relevant necessary legislation in place and so a legal mess for years to come. So lawyers - if no-one else - will be pleased.
The Tories are making Corbyn as PM more and more likely (in itself a bad enough prospect for anyone sane) but, even worse, they are making the prospect of him being in power seem like a better alternative than the shower of incompetent shits (with apologies to the decent Tories on this board) the current Tory party has turned into. Some of the stupider Tories seem to think that No Deal will vindicate them whereas it will annihilate them and seriously risks ruining the country.
And once May has acted on what Parliament tells her and been humiliated at the EU summit, she needs to go. Though when I think of who might succeed her I wobble even on that.
Didn't Parliament vote against a referendum last week?
That may be so and I didn't notice. Fine. Then revocation it has to be. There is no alternative.
Parliament will vote against that, unless they can pass the buck to someone else.
I love the way the news keeps referring to May's "strategy". The one thing May has never had since the moment she became PM has been a strategy.
If the past few years of UK politics had been a work of fiction it would have been criticised for being unrealistic on many points, not least of which being the epic ineptitude of the Prime Minister.
I love the way the news keeps referring to May's "strategy". The one thing May has never had since the moment she became PM has been a strategy.
If the past few years of UK politics had been a work of fiction it would have been criticised for being unrealistic on many points, not least of which being the epic ineptitude of the Prime Minister.
And yet, she is still well above average ability for the Commons.
This is probably the last chance for May to get hold of the situation. I think her only option left is to ask for a 6 month delay to call a GE and go to the country on the basis of government needs a majority and x mandate to proceed with my deal. If she doesn't 22 will make 97 look close
In retrospect its been obvious that a GE would be necessary ever since the ERG had their tantrum last November.
What GE outcome would change anything? And is that outcome likely?
A GE means a new Parliamentary Session - and a new opportunity to vote on May's Deal.
This is probably the last chance for May to get hold of the situation. I think her only option left is to ask for a 6 month delay to call a GE and go to the country on the basis of government needs a majority and x mandate to proceed with my deal. If she doesn't 22 will make 97 look close
In retrospect its been obvious that a GE would be necessary ever since the ERG had their tantrum last November.
What is a general election going to achieve? Very little on current polling but yet another hung parliament, unless May won a landslide of over 100 she still has nowhere near any certainty of getting her Deal through. It is time for Parliament to make its mind up, having ruled out No Deal do they back the Deal, Customs Union and/or Single Market BINO or EUref2 or revoke
Why have the just ruled out No Deal?
Parliament has already ruled out No Deal, the Deal, Customs Union and/or Single Market BINO and EUref2.
Every single one of them except revoke has already been voted against.
They twice voted to rule out No Deal under all circumstances, which leaves them to choose from the Deal, CU and/or SM, EUref2 or revoke
Presumably the Brexit imp is referencing C.S.Lewis here. Explains a lot.
Daniel Hannan is such a snowflake/arsehole.
He gets really upset when you remind him that he's a liar.
Their status isn't changing though is it? Hence the offer of settled status.
Oh really, there's many people like this poor lady.
Many people with #FBPE and #StopBrexit in their name claiming scare stories? I'm sure there are.
I'm equally sure this will still be her home post-Brexit.
I've spent the afternoon helping a friend in a similar situation.
As we saw with windrush, people who have a legal right to be here get chucked out.
But you keep on telling people like that they've got nothing to worry about.
Phillip's MO is simply to deny the veracity of anything and everything that is negative consequence of Brexit.
He told me I was lying about my business having importation problems last week – despite the fact I had an email from a supplier saying exactly that.
Despite you saying you have an email from a supplier saying exactly that
If you do, why not get in touch with the Independent or Guardian who love to run bad news stories yet seem to have been very quiet on this front? Unless you can link to a number of verified stories like you're claiming?
Seems like you are implying people are lying again.
Why the fuck would I waste my time, and possibly offend my supplier, by talking to the press, by the way?
To please you?
Snip
* Many of them are lying too for the avoidance of doubt.
Our supplier is based in the Baltic States. I have no idea whether he has any strong views on Brexit either way, yet you clearly suspect he does. And you are clearly implying either he or I are liars.
I’m glad we got to the bottom of that. I would hope you would trust someone’s word, but it seems not.
Comments
The EU 27 should tell May that there are no grounds for an extension since she has no plan that requires extra time to enact. Then it is No Deal or Revoke. Your call Tezzie.
He gets really upset when you remind him that he's a liar.
Out there in the real world I doubt 95% of punters wouldn't have you a clue about it if you asked their opinon..
I'm equally sure this will still be her home post-Brexit.
https://twitter.com/aedwardslevy/status/1107765124016885766
As we saw with windrush, people who have a legal right to be here get chucked out.
But you keep on telling people like that they've got nothing to worry about.
You need a proper folding phone
Brexiteers determined to shoot themselves. Again.
It's all getting tense
See also aluminium sulphate, alum schists in (or at least under) Lennoxtown, Scotland, C19.
Honestly, get a grip.
He told me I was lying about my business having importation problems last week – despite the fact I had an email from a supplier saying exactly that.
And of course they can't make May quit because they fucked up their last chance.
Gormless idiots.
If you do, why not get in touch with the Independent or Guardian who love to run bad news stories yet seem to have been very quiet on this front? Unless you can link to a number of verified stories like you're claiming?
Why the fuck would I waste my time, and possibly offend my supplier, by talking to the press, by the way?
To please you?
Its the core of where we are now.
And is government going to be functioning in the mean time ?
I have absolutely no doubt whatsoever that companies are putting off investment due to Brexit, or that companies are diversifying their licensing locations or supply chains due to Brexit etc, or blaming* Brexit for the reason they're increasing prices but I do doubt that foreign companies are refusing to take export orders due to it. I am also highly sceptical of people who just so happen to be ardent campaigners against Brexit claiming disasters that others are not reporting.
* Many of them are lying too for the avoidance of doubt.
(a) to revoke Article 50; or
(b) have a referendum, which are the only options left that relate specifically to Brexit.
Then depending on which gets the most votes in favour May acts on that. The EU 27 would agree to an extension for a referendum I think. They might be relieved if we revoke though I wouldn't blame them if their initial reaction if we revoked was to go "Oh, fuck. No!"
She is however too stubborn, stupid and unimaginative and listens to no-one sensible and the Tory party is such a disgrace that I imagine she will try for some idiotic nonsense (like proroguing or some such arcane idiocy). Which won't work and we end up crashing out with not all of the relevant necessary legislation in place and so a legal mess for years to come. So lawyers - if no-one else - will be pleased.
The Tories are making Corbyn as PM more and more likely (in itself a bad enough prospect for anyone sane) but, even worse, they are making the prospect of him being in power seem like a better alternative than the shower of incompetent shits (with apologies to the decent Tories on this board) the current Tory party has turned into. Some of the stupider Tories seem to think that No Deal will vindicate them whereas it will annihilate them and seriously risks ruining the country.
And once May has acted on what Parliament tells her and been humiliated at the EU summit, she needs to go. Though when I think of who might succeed her I wobble even on that.
Oh - and the ERG should all be deselected. They are all an absolute menace to good governance.
Sometimes I wonder if May understands how Parliament actually works.
A variation on Bobby Shafto perhaps?
Parliament has already ruled out No Deal, the Deal, Customs Union and/or Single Market BINO and EUref2.
Every single one of them except revoke has already been voted against.
Until they do that there is no chance of May's deal passing.
What the outcome of a GE would be I don't know but the current situation clearly is not working.
https://youtu.be/VVzc4Orlk3E
I’m glad we got to the bottom of that. I would hope you would trust someone’s word, but it seems not.