politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » Bercow going in the summer opens the way for a Buckingham by-e
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She has made clear she will let the Commons come to a view on what to do next which she and the Government will then implement and presumably put to a voteCharles said:
If she proposes primary legislation yes, but she hasn’t suggested she willHYUFD said:
Be as patronising as ever but if the Head of the Executive ie Theresa May lets Parliament decide whether or not to accept a backstop or No Deal that is what will happenCharles said:
Parliamentary Sovereignty doesn’t mean what you think it meansHYUFD said:
The UK may not last 5 minutes without that.Mortimer said:
May wouldn’t last 5 minutes as leader after proposing that. And back benches can’t take offers to Europe!HYUFD said:
May will ultimately put up a SM + CU backstop but only take it to the EU if Parliament votes it though which it likely willarcher101au said:
Honestly. Private members cannot magically put forward bills that will pass in record time. Private members cannot even put up bills unless they win the ballot. The only Brexit bills that will be considered are those that are proposed by the Government. Try again.HYUFD said:
May will simply alloliament if those talks fail there will be over 4 months until Brexit dayarcher101au said:
This is quite correct. The assumptions about what Parliament will 'do' are a lot more complicated because ultimately you need a functioning Government which has to have a policy.
The 'meaningful vote' can possibly be amended, but it is nothing but an advisory position. As we see on PB all day, people propose things in terms of deal outcomes that can't actually happen (eg HYUFD and his magic transition to SM+CU) so how Parliament does anything but have a general whinge is beyond me.
Parliament can either reject or pass a deal presented to them. If the Government supported it, they could decide either to abandon Brexit or have another referendum, but this can't happen without Govt support because both require primary legislation. But the one thing they can't do is determine which deal outcome they might want.
If none of these happen, no deal will happen. It doesn't need any form of approval.
Your fantasy island politics about MPs taking the lead in negotiating fails to understand our constitution. And the Tory party.
Our constitution is based on Parliamentary sovereignty, Parliament will vote for a SM+CU backstop over No Deal
It is the *Executive* through the Royal Prerogative that exercises the rights of the Crown; ie it is the Crown-in-Parliament (rather than the Crown) which is Sovereign0 -
The last executive who tried to usurp parliament wound up beheaded.Charles said:
No - so that people don’t make important betting decisions based on wrong assumptions (eg that parliamentary sovereignty means the legislature can usurp the rights of the executive)Anazina said:
Er, why? So young fogeys like you can luxuriate over highfalutin monarchistic semantics?Mortimer said:
This should be pinned to every thread.Charles said:
Parliamentary Sovereignty doesn’t mean what you think it meansHYUFD said:
The UK may not last 5 minutes without that.Mortimer said:
May wouldn’t last 5 minutes as leader after proposing that. And back benches can’t take offers to Europe!HYUFD said:
May will ultimately put up a SM + CU backstop but only take it to the EU if Parliament votes it though which it likely willarcher101au said:
Honestly. Private members cannot magically put forward bills that will pass in record time. Private members cannot even put up bills unless they win the ballot. The only Brexit bills that will be considered are those that are proposed by the Government. Try again.HYUFD said:
May will simply alloliament if those talks fail there will be over 4 months until Brexit dayarcher101au said:
This is quite correct. The assumptions about what Parliament will 'do' are a lot more complicated because ultimately you need a functioning Government which has to have a policy.
The 'meaningful vote' can possibly be amended, but it is nothing but an advisory position. As we see on PB all day, people propose things in terms of deal outcomes that can't actually happen (eg HYUFD and his magic transition to SM+CU) so how Parliament does anything but have a general whinge is beyond me.
Parliament can either reject or pass a deal presented to them. If the Government supported it, they could decide either to abandon Brexit or have another referendum, but this can't happen without Govt support because both require primary legislation. But the one thing they can't do is determine which deal outcome they might want.
If none of these happen, no deal will happen. It doesn't need any form of approval.
Your fantasy island politics about MPs taking the lead in negotiating fails to understand our constitution. And the Tory party.
Our constitution is based on Parliamentary sovereignty, Parliament will vote for a SM+CU backstop over No Deal
It is the *Executive* through the Royal Prerogative that exercises the rights of the Crown; ie it is the Crown-in-Parliament (rather than the Crown) which is Sovereign0 -
If it were left to Mortimer and Archer Scotland and NI would probably be gone by Christmas, along with half our manufacturing industry and the banks in the City but they would have the sweet smelling air of No Deal England!Anazina said:HYUFD said:
Asked by Tory MP Heidi Allen what options other than a second referendum would be available if no deal is voted down in the chamber, Mrs May replied: “If it were the case that at the end of the negotiation process actually it was a no deal, then actually that would come back to this House and then we would see what position this House would take in the circumstances.”Charles said:
I’m really impressed you know with such certainty what the PM intends to doHYUFD said:
Hammond is not preparing for Nn the SM + CUarcher101au said:
Not my reading of it. Just reporting a story.Benpointer said:
Not having access to the article, I cannot tell if the Torygraph has a take on Hammond's forecast. But does the fact that they've given it a front page spread indicate a softening of their hard-line Brexit stance?Scott_P said:
But Hammond is a disgrace. Firstly, he is wrong about the legal requirements of the Brexit bill and this has been subject to expert legal advice from people far more credible than the 'Treasury lawyers' that he is for some reason engaging to provide advice that is nothing to do with his department (clearly a DexEU matter). Secondly, he is talking about 'the UK losing in international arbitration' which completely ignores the fact that the UK is not subject to international arbitration on the EU treaties unless we decide to offer it; there is no jurisdiction where the EU can 'enforce' the bill.
Hammond, more than almost anyone except May, is responsible for the mess the Government is in now. He refused to plan for no deal and release the necessary funds, has constantly had the Treasury release bogus forecasts of doom and now he is lying about the bill. Should be fired but of course won't be; the end of his career cannot come soon enough.
I’m not sure she knows herself!
Read more at: https://inews.co.uk/news/politics/theresa-may-hints-that-mps-could-block-a-no-deal-brexit/
That’s a fair and sensible answer by May. As Mike was saying earlier, she might be flawed but at least she is at least considering the country’s welfare, unlike extremists of Mortimer and Archer’s ilk.0 -
How many times to I need to say this. You’re presenting a false dichotomy. Not surrendering is not suggesting no deal. It is pushing for a better solution.HYUFD said:
If it were left to Mortimer and Archer Scotland and NI would probably be gone by Christmas, along with half our manufacturing industry and the banks in the City but they would have the sweet smelling air of No Deal England!Anazina said:HYUFD said:
Asked by Tory MP Heidi Allen what options other than a second referendum would be available if no deal is voted down in the chamber, Mrs May replied: “If it were the case that at the end of the negotiation process actually it was a no deal, then actually that would come back to this House and then we would see what position this House would take in the circumstances.”Charles said:
I’m really impressed you know with such certainty what the PM intends to doHYUFD said:
Hammond is not preparing for Nn the SM + CUarcher101au said:
Not my reading of it. Just reporting aBenpointer said:
Not having access to the article, I cannot tell if the Torygraph has a take on Hammond's forecast. But does the fact that they've given it a front page spread indicate a softening of their hard-line Brexit stance?Scott_P said:
But Hammond is a disgrace. Firstly, he is wrong about the legal requirements of the Brexit bill and this has been subject to expert legal advice from people far more credible than the 'Treasury lawyers' that he is for some reason engaging to provide advice that is nothing to do with his department (clearly a DexEU matter). Secondly, he is talking about 'the UK losing in international arbitration' which completely ignores the fact that the UK is not subject to international arbitration on the EU treaties unless we decide to offer it; there is no jurisdiction where the EU can 'enforce' the bill.
Hammond, more than almost anyone except May, is responsible for the mess the Government is in now. He refused to plan for no deal and release the necessary funds, has constantly had the Treasury release bogus forecasts of doom and now he is lying about the bill. Should be fired but of course won't be; the end of his career cannot come soon enough.
I’m not sure she knows herself!
Read more at: https://inews.co.uk/news/politics/theresa-may-hints-that-mps-could-block-a-no-deal-brexit/
That’s a fair and sensible answer by May. As Mike was saying earlier, she might be flawed but at least she is at least considering the country’s welfare, unlike extremists of Mortimer and Archer’s ilk.
Have you ever negotiated anything?
I’m guessing not.0 -
Frankly I'm not too bothered if the UK exists or not but it won't exist if the backstop happens. If there is a border down the Irish Sea then we won't be a United Kingdom. NI will be formally and legally the other side of the border. Hence why not just the unionists in NI but even Remain-backing Ruth Davidson recognises it as a dreadful idea.HYUFD said:
Thank goodness so otherwise there could be No UK leftGIN1138 said:Remember when your Brave Boudiccia used say "No Deal" was better than a bad deal?
What a load of bullshit that turned out to be...
This is not a good thing for unionism.0 -
You REALLY won't like what follows.....Beverley_C said:
We can always hope so...grabcocque said:So, is tomorrow finally the day when the Brexit dream dies?
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An infograph0 -
Of course it is suggesting No Deal as if we do not have a deal by the end of November there will not be enough time to get everything approved by Brexit day next March unless Parliament backs down and accepts the SM + CU backstopMortimer said:
How many times to I need to say this. You’re presenting a false dichotomy. Not surrendering is not suggesting no deal. It is pushing for a better solution.HYUFD said:
If it were left to Mortimer and Archer Scotland and NI would probably be gone by Christmas, along with half our manufacturing industry and the banks in the City but they would have the sweet smelling air of No Deal England!Anazina said:HYUFD said:
Asked by Tory MP Heidi Allen what options other than a second referendum would be available if no deal is voted down in the chamber, Mrs May replied: “If it were the case that at the end of the negotiation process actually it was a no deal, then actually that would come back to this House and then we would see what position this House would take in the circumstances.”Charles said:
I’m really impressed you know with such certainty what the PM intends to doHYUFD said:
Hammond is not preparing for Nn the SM + CUarcher101au said:
Not my reading of it. Just reporting aBenpointer said:
Not having access to the article, I cannot tell if the Torygraph has a take on Hammond's forecast. But does the fact that they've given it a front page spread indicate a softening of their hard-line Brexit stance?Scott_P said:
But Hammond is a disgrace. Firstly, he is wrong about the legal requirements of the Brexit bill and this has been subject to expert legal advice from people far more credible than the 'Treasury lawyers' that he is for some reason engaging to provide advice that is nothing to do with his department (clearly a DexEU matter). Secondly, he is talking about 'the UK losing in international arbitration' which completely ignores the fact that the UK is not subject to interugh.
I’m not sure she knows herself!
Read more at: https://inews.co.uk/news/politics/theresa-may-hints-that-mps-could-block-a-no-deal-brexit/
That’s a fair and sensible answer by May. As Mike was saying earlier, she might be flawed but at least she is at least considering the country’s welfare, unlike extremists of Mortimer and Archer’s ilk.
Have you ever negotiated anything?
I’m guessing not.0 -
Considering the unionists in Scotland (represented by Davidson) and NI agree with Mortimer and Archer and not Barnier it seems like you don't have the foggiest what you're talking about.HYUFD said:
If it were left to Mortimer and Archer Scotland and NI would probably be gone by Christmas, along with half our manufacturing industry and the banks in the City but they would have the sweet smelling air of No Deal England!Anazina said:HYUFD said:
Asked by Tory MP Heidi Allen what options other than a second referendum would be available if no deal is voted down in the chamber, Mrs May replied: “If it were the case that at the end of the negotiation process actually it was a no deal, then actually that would come back to this House and then we would see what position this House would take in the circumstances.”Charles said:
I’m really impressed you know with such certainty what the PM intends to doHYUFD said:
Hammond is not preparing for Nn the SM + CUarcher101au said:
Not my reading of it. Just reporting a story.Benpointer said:
Not having access to the article, I cannot tell if the Torygraph has a take on Hammond's forecast. But does the fact that they've given it a front page spread indicate a softening of their hard-line Brexit stance?Scott_P said:
But Hammond is a disgrace. Firstly, he is wrong about the legal requirements of the Brexit bill and this has been subject to expert legal advice from people far more credible than the 'Treasury lawyers' that he is for some reason engaging to provide advice that is nothing to do with his department (clearly a DexEU matter). Secondly, he is talking about 'the UK losing in international arbitration' which completely ignores the fact that the UK is not subject to international arbitration on the EU treaties unless we decide to offer it; there is no jurisdiction where the EU can 'enforce' the bill.
Hammond, more than almost anyone except May, is responsible for the mess the Government is in now. He refused to plan for no deal and release the necessary funds, has constantly had the Treasury release bogus forecasts of doom and now he is lying about the bill. Should be fired but of course won't be; the end of his career cannot come soon enough.
I’m not sure she knows herself!
Read more at: https://inews.co.uk/news/politics/theresa-may-hints-that-mps-could-block-a-no-deal-brexit/
That’s a fair and sensible answer by May. As Mike was saying earlier, she might be flawed but at least she is at least considering the country’s welfare, unlike extremists of Mortimer and Archer’s ilk.0 -
Ye gods an extra year of going round and round in circles...williamglenn said:0 -
If NI does not remain in the SM and CU and there is No Deal, NI will leave the UK, quite possibly Scotland too and there will be no Union leftPhilip_Thompson said:
Frankly I'm not too bothered if the UK exists or not but it won't exist if the backstop happens. If there is a border down the Irish Sea then we won't be a United Kingdom. NI will be formally and legally the other side of the border. Hence why not just the unionists in NI but even Remain-backing Ruth Davidson recognises it as a dreadful idea.HYUFD said:
Thank goodness so otherwise there could be No UK leftGIN1138 said:Remember when your Brave Boudiccia used say "No Deal" was better than a bad deal?
What a load of bullshit that turned out to be...
This is not a good thing for unionism.
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For the legislature to usurp the rights of the executive, they would have to replace the executive. There would need to be a grouping of MPs who parliament had confidence in, and who produced their own Prime Minister.Charles said:No - so that people don’t make important betting decisions based on wrong assumptions (eg that parliamentary sovereignty means the legislature can usurp the rights of the executive)
That is an extremely unlikely outcome. The only situation I could see it happening in would be if Mrs May resigned, and there were a raft of desertions from the Conservative Party.
If Mrs May thinks that a deal is essential, and she cannot get one through the House of Commons, then I think she would ask for an extension, and then resign. Although No Deal is the default outcome, it effectively requires whoever is the PM not to ask for an extension.0 -
If Theresa May ultimately walks into Parliament and declares that "No Deal" is possible with the EU because of their intransigence and so she's recommending to move to WTO on 29th March and will fight a general election on that basis if necessary I can't WAIT to see how HYUFD would back peddle to that position after these past few days.
At least BigG has left himself just enough wiggle room lol...
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I say we take off and nuke the entire site from orbit, it's the only way to be sure.SeanT said:
The reason the US, UK, France, NATO, Germany, everyone, kowtows to the truly hideous, grotesque, barbaric Saudi regime (and sell them arms etc) is not because we approve of it - and it's zip to do with the oil - but because we know whatever would replace the Saudi autocracy would almost certainly be WORSE.timmo said:
Could not agree more..this alone could lead to me leaving the Tory party if we do not decisevely act against this barbaric regieme.HYUFD said:Khashoggi butchered alive and surgically dismembered before being injected with an unknown drug and falling silent. If the Saudis are behind this we should cut ties as should the US
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-6281303/Turkish-investigators-say-looking-toxic-materials-Khashoggi-murder-probe.html
It would be Wahhabism, weaponised, ISIS with Saudi oil money. It would be a jihadi superpower with missiles aimed at us. Do we want that? No. So we tolerate the demons, knowing the Devil would take over, should they fall.
If you have a better plan, do tell.0 -
And barely out before an election in June 2022.....GIN1138 said:
Ye gods an extra year of going round and round in circles...williamglenn said:0 -
Only one extra year? you're an optomist...GIN1138 said:
Ye gods an extra year of going round and round in circles...williamglenn said:0 -
LOL.GIN1138 said:If Theresa May ultimately walks into Parliament and declares that "No Deal" is possible with the EU because of their intransigence and so she's recommending to move to WTO on 29th March and will fight a general election on that basis on necessary I can't WAIT to see how HYUFD would back peddle to that position after these past few days.
At least BigG has left himself just enough wiggle room lol...
Eurasia has always been at war with Eastasia0 -
52% of Scots would vote for independence if No Deal BrexitPhilip_Thompson said:
Considering the unionists in Scotland (represented by Davidson) and NI agree with Mortimer and Archer and not Barnier it seems like you don't have the foggiest what you're talking about.HYUFD said:
If it were left to Mortimer anal England!Anazina said:HYUFD said:
Asked by Tes.”Charles said:
I’m really impressed you know with such certainty what the PM intends to doHYUFD said:
Hammond is not preparing for Nn the SM + CUarcher101au said:
Not my reading of it. Just reporting a story.Benpointer said:
Not having access to the article, I cannot tell if the Torygraph has a take on Hammond's forecast. But does the fact that they've given it a front page spread indicate a softening of their hard-line Brexit stance?Scott_P said:
But Hammond is a disgrace. Firstly, he is wrong about the legal requirements of the Brexit bill and this has been subject to expert legal advice from people far more credible than the 'Treasury lawyers' that he is for some reason engaging to provide advice that is nothing to do with his department (clearly a DexEU matter). Secondly, he is talking about 'the UK losing in international arbitration' which completely ignores the fact that the UK is not subject to international arbitration on the EU treaties unless we decide to offer it; there is no jurisdiction where the EU can 'enforce' the bill.
Hammgh.
I’m not sure she knows herself!
Read more at: https://inews.co.uk/news/politics/theresa-may-hints-that-mps-could-block-a-no-deal-brexit/
That’s a flk.
http://scotgoespop.blogspot.com/2018/10/stupefying-survation-survey-suggests.html
57% of Northern Irish voters want 'Special Status' for NI within the single market and customs union, 47.9% would back joining the Republic in the event of a hard Brexit, 45.4% to stay in the UK
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/northern-ireland-support-join-irish-republic-eu-hard-brexit-poll-lucidtalk-a8098531.html0 -
My thought exactly! issue the orders...grabcocque said:
I say we take off and nuke the entire site from orbit, it's the only way to be sure.SeanT said:
The reason the US, UK, France, NATO, Germany, everyone, kowtows to the truly hideous, grotesque, barbaric Saudi regime (and sell them arms etc) is not because we approve of it - and it's zip to do with the oil - but because we know whatever would replace the Saudi autocracy would almost certainly be WORSE.timmo said:
Could not agree more..this alone could lead to me leaving the Tory party if we do not decisevely act against this barbaric regieme.HYUFD said:Khashoggi butchered alive and surgically dismembered before being injected with an unknown drug and falling silent. If the Saudis are behind this we should cut ties as should the US
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-6281303/Turkish-investigators-say-looking-toxic-materials-Khashoggi-murder-probe.html
It would be Wahhabism, weaponised, ISIS with Saudi oil money. It would be a jihadi superpower with missiles aimed at us. Do we want that? No. So we tolerate the demons, knowing the Devil would take over, should they fall.
If you have a better plan, do tell.0 -
Frankly - I don't give a d*mn. I would prefer the UK to stay in, but I and my family are immune to Brexit.MarqueeMark said:
You REALLY won't like what follows.....Beverley_C said:
We can always hope so...grabcocque said:So, is tomorrow finally the day when the Brexit dream dies?
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Bullshit! You don't know that, you're just parroting the most recent opinion poll that blows in the wind just like you always do.HYUFD said:
If NI does not remain in the SM and CU and there is No Deal, NI will leave the UK, quite possibly Scotland too and there will be no Union leftPhilip_Thompson said:
Frankly I'm not too bothered if the UK exists or not but it won't exist if the backstop happens. If there is a border down the Irish Sea then we won't be a United Kingdom. NI will be formally and legally the other side of the border. Hence why not just the unionists in NI but even Remain-backing Ruth Davidson recognises it as a dreadful idea.HYUFD said:
Thank goodness so otherwise there could be No UK leftGIN1138 said:Remember when your Brave Boudiccia used say "No Deal" was better than a bad deal?
What a load of bullshit that turned out to be...
This is not a good thing for unionism.
What we do know is that REAL unionists that have worked hard for unionism and fought in elections for it oppose your beloved nonsense. Who should we listen to as to whether Scotland and NI want this . . . you and whatever random poll you're parroting this week, or lifelong unionists who are very different people except being unionists Arlene Foster and Ruth Davidson?
I'm going to put my faith in Davidson over your poll of the week.0 -
Kind of how I feel when people are saying no deal will be dreadful.Beverley_C said:
Frankly - I don't give a d*mn.MarqueeMark said:
You REALLY won't like what follows.....Beverley_C said:
We can always hope so...grabcocque said:So, is tomorrow finally the day when the Brexit dream dies?
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No need to backpeddle as we have May's quote in her own words she will let Parliament decide rather than waltz off to No Deal and WTO terms and a general election whistling 'rule Britannia' and 'There will always be an England' on the way!GIN1138 said:If Theresa May ultimately walks into Parliament and declares that "No Deal" is possible with the EU because of their intransigence and so she's recommending to move to WTO on 29th March and will fight a general election on that basis if necessary I can't WAIT to see how HYUFD would back peddle to that position after these past few days.
At least BigG has left himself just enough wiggle room lol...
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The Sweden Democrats also joined in July after departing the UKIP/MS5 grouping. They even have a party called the pro Romania party as members - surely all Romanian parties are pro Romania? And For Fatherland and Freedom from Latvia are also members. 'Reload Bulgaria' are also members of the group - they want to restore the Bulgarian monarchy - as are 'Ordinary people' from Slovakia and a party which represents Poles in Lithuania.Sunil_Prasannan said:
Poland's largest party, Law & Justice is also in the ACRE grouping, alongside the Tories.williamglenn said:
Why did the Conservatives leave the EPP?Richard_Nabavi said:
More poppycock. He stalled for a decade.williamglenn said:
It wasn't a mistake that came out of the blue either. He made a strategic decision to appease the extreme Eurosceptics throughout his leadership, and they ended up consuming him.Jonathan said:
His legacy is sheer poison. It is impossible to hold him with more contempt. As Paxman said, the worst PM since Lord North. Yes, I blame him for a referendum designed to bolster his right wing. He put himself and party before country. Unforgivable.Richard_Nabavi said:
If he's a 'total and abject failure' then so are all the sane Labour figures who couldn't even beat Corbyn of all people, and who therefore ensured that the Labour pro-Remain vote went AWOL. I really don't think you can blame Cameron either for that, or for not envisaging it would happen when he committed to the referendum - not that he had any choice on that, let's not forget.Jonathan said:
Cameron is a total and abject failure. His ego led him to be negligent. To blame Labour for his own error is absurd. An error, let us never forget, devised solely to keep his right wing on board in 2015.
https://twitter.com/david_cameron/status/595112367358406656?s=21
Meanwhile, in the actual role of PM he was without doubt the best for half a century, bar the very special case of Maggie.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alliance_of_Conservatives_and_Reformists_in_Europe
With friends like those who needs the DUP! The DUP MEP is non attached so doesn't sit with the Tories.0 -
Davidson has 'triple locked' the DUP's insistence of no regulatory border (Beyond what already exists) in the Irish sea.Philip_Thompson said:
Bullshit! You don't know that, you're just parroting the most recent opinion poll that blows in the wind just like you always do.
What we do know is that REAL unionists that have worked hard for unionism and fought in elections for it oppose your beloved nonsense. Who should we listen to as to whether Scotland and NI want this . . . you and whatever random poll you're parroting this week, or lifelong unionists who are very different people except being unionists Arlene Foster and Ruth Davidson?
I'm going to put my faith in Davidson over your poll of the week.
This is the one red line that I'm very confident May won't budge on.0 -
Oh gee some random polls. Never saw that coming (!)HYUFD said:
52% of Scots would vote for independence if No Deal BrexitPhilip_Thompson said:
Considering the unionists in Scotland (represented by Davidson) and NI agree with Mortimer and Archer and not Barnier it seems like you don't have the foggiest what you're talking about.HYUFD said:
If it were left to Mortimer anal England!Anazina said:HYUFD said:
Asked by Tes.”Charles said:
I’m really impressed you know with such certainty what the PM intends to doHYUFD said:
Hammond is not preparing for Nn the SM + CUarcher101au said:
Not my reading of it. Just reporting a story.Benpointer said:
Not having access to the article, I cannot tell if the Torygraph has a take on Hammond's forecast. But does the fact that they've given it a front page spread indicate a softening of their hard-line Brexit stance?Scott_P said:
But Hammond is a disgrace. Firstly, he is wrong about the legal requirements of the Brexit bill and this has been subject to expert legal advice from people far more credible than the 'Treasury lawyers' that he is for some reason engaging to provide advice that is nothing to do with his department (clearly a DexEU matter). Secondly, he is talking about 'the UK losing in international arbitration' which completely ignores the fact that the UK is not subject to international arbitration on the EU treaties unless we decide to offer it; there is no jurisdiction where the EU can 'enforce' the bill.
Hammgh.
I’m not sure she knows herself!
Read more at: https://inews.co.uk/news/politics/theresa-may-hints-that-mps-could-block-a-no-deal-brexit/
That’s a flk.
http://scotgoespop.blogspot.com/2018/10/stupefying-survation-survey-suggests.html
57% of Northern Irish voters want 'Special Status' for NI within the single market and customs union, 47.9% would back joining the Republic in the event of a hard Brexit, 45.4% to stay in the UK
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/northern-ireland-support-join-irish-republic-eu-hard-brexit-poll-lucidtalk-a8098531.html
Well clearly a poll is never wrong and that's far more meaningful the experience Ruth Davidson has in leading unionism in Scotland (!)0 -
Let me give you a little bit of advice, as someone who was sucked in to voting for Theresa May in 2017 because I believed all her "Brexit Means Brexit" and "no deal is better than a bad deal" bullshit...HYUFD said:
No need to backpeddle as we have May's quote in her own words she will let Parliament decide rather than waltz off to No Deal and WTO terms and a general election whistling 'rule Britannia' and 'There will always be an England' on the way!GIN1138 said:If Theresa May ultimately walks into Parliament and declares that "No Deal" is possible with the EU because of their intransigence and so she's recommending to move to WTO on 29th March and will fight a general election on that basis if necessary I can't WAIT to see how HYUFD would back peddle to that position after these past few days.
At least BigG has left himself just enough wiggle room lol...
What this woman says is literally worthless.... I don't believe a word that comes out of her mouth and if you do... Well more fool you.
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Regardless of what happens re-Brexit , there is no serious possibility of another Independence referendum in Scotland during this Parliament. Theresa May has ruled it out , Davidson supports her - as do I! - and I am pretty sure that Sturgeon knows it too.0
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Oh no, if there is No Deal Sturgeon will call a vote for indyref2 at Holyrood next year no questionjustin124 said:Regardless of what happens re-Brexit , there is no serious possibility of another Independence referendum in Scotland during this Parliament. Theresa May has ruled it out , Davidson supports her - as do I! - and I am pretty sure that Sturgeon knows it too.
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I cant wait, another 12 months of PB squabbling......GIN1138 said:
Ye gods an extra year of going round and round in circles...williamglenn said:
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Yes well unlike you I am not prepared to put my finger in my ears and ignore the evidence while pressing ahead with a crash out No Deal Brexit even most English voters do not supportPhilip_Thompson said:
Oh gee some random polls. Never saw that coming (!)HYUFD said:
52% of Scots would vote for independence if No Deal BrexitPhilip_Thompson said:
Considering the unionists in Scotland (represented by Davidson) and NI agree with Mortimer and Archer and not Barnier it seems like you don't have the foggiest what you're talking about.HYUFD said:
If it were left to Mortimer anal England!Anazina said:HYUFD said:
Asked by Tes.”Charles said:
I’m really impressed you know with such certainty what the PM intends to doHYUFD said:
Hammond is not preparing for Nn the SM + CUarcher101au said:
Not my reading of it. Just reporting a story.Benpointer said:
Not having access to the article, I cannot tell if the Torygraph has a take on Hammond's forecast. But does the fact that they've given it a front page spread indicate a softening of their hard-line Brexit stance?Scott_P said:
But Hammond is a disgrace. Firstly, he is wrong about the legal requirements of the Brexit bill and this has been subject to expert legal advice from people far more credible than the 'Treasury lawyers' that he is for some reason engaging to provide advice that is nothing to do with his department (clearly a DexEU matter). Secondly, he is talking about 'the UK losing in international arbitration' which completely ignores the fact that the UK is not subject to international arbitration on the EU treaties unless we decide to offer it; there is no jurisdiction where the EU can 'enforce' the bill.
Hammgh.
I’m not sure she knows herself!
Read more at: https://inews.co.uk/news/politics/theresa-may-hints-that-mps-could-block-a-no-deal-brexit/
That’s a flk.
http://scotgoespop.blogspot.com/2018/10/stupefying-survation-survey-suggests.html
57% of Northern Irish voters want 'Special Status' for NI within the single market and customs union, 47.9% would back joining the Republic in the event of a hard Brexit, 45.4% to stay in the UK
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/northern-ireland-support-join-irish-republic-eu-hard-brexit-poll-lucidtalk-a8098531.html
Well clearly a poll is never wrong and that's far more meaningful the experience Ruth Davidson has in leading unionism in Scotland (!)0 -
She might ask for one - but will be told to 'Go away'.HYUFD said:
Oh no, if there is No Deal Sturgeon will call a vote for indyref2 at Holyrood next year no questionjustin124 said:Regardless of what happens re-Brexit , there is no serious possibility of another Independence referendum in Scotland during this Parliament. Theresa May has ruled it out , Davidson supports her - as do I! - and I am pretty sure that Sturgeon knows it too.
0 -
May was and still is a Remainer, that is all you really need to know.GIN1138 said:
Let me give you a little bit of advice, as someone who was sucked in to voting for Theresa May in 2017 because I believed all her "Brexit Means Brexit" and "no deal is better than a bad deal" bullshit...HYUFD said:
No need to backpeddle as we have May's quote in her own words she will let Parliament decide rather than waltz off to No Deal and WTO terms and a general election whistling 'rule Britannia' and 'There will always be an England' on the way!GIN1138 said:If Theresa May ultimately walks into Parliament and declares that "No Deal" is possible with the EU because of their intransigence and so she's recommending to move to WTO on 29th March and will fight a general election on that basis if necessary I can't WAIT to see how HYUFD would back peddle to that position after these past few days.
At least BigG has left himself just enough wiggle room lol...
What this woman says is literally worthless.... I don't believe a word that comes out of her mouth and if you do... Well more fool you.
If you want crash out No Deal you will need to replace her as PM with a hard Brexiteer and probably win a majority for No Deal at a general election0 -
This your much-touted escape to Ireland? Good luck with that....you'll be the only people joining not leaving the place.Beverley_C said:
Frankly - I don't give a d*mn. I would prefer the UK to stay in, but I and my family are immune to Brexit.MarqueeMark said:
You REALLY won't like what follows.....Beverley_C said:
We can always hope so...grabcocque said:So, is tomorrow finally the day when the Brexit dream dies?
0 -
Well thanks for confirming her entire 2017 election campaign was a pack of lies.HYUFD said:
May was and still is a Remainer, that is all you really need to know.GIN1138 said:
Let me give you a little bit of advice, as someone who was sucked in to voting for Theresa May in 2017 because I believed all her "Brexit Means Brexit" and "no deal is better than a bad deal" bullshit...HYUFD said:
No need to backpeddle as we have May's quote in her own words she will let Parliament decide rather than waltz off to No Deal and WTO terms and a general election whistling 'rule Britannia' and 'There will always be an England' on the way!GIN1138 said:If Theresa May ultimately walks into Parliament and declares that "No Deal" is possible with the EU because of their intransigence and so she's recommending to move to WTO on 29th March and will fight a general election on that basis if necessary I can't WAIT to see how HYUFD would back peddle to that position after these past few days.
At least BigG has left himself just enough wiggle room lol...
What this woman says is literally worthless.... I don't believe a word that comes out of her mouth and if you do... Well more fool you.
That's why I'm voting for Corbyn next time. Your leader and your party has taken me for a fool!
You'll not get that chance again.0 -
Next election is due on May 5th 2022!MarqueeMark said:
And barely out before an election in June 2022.....GIN1138 said:
Ye gods an extra year of going round and round in circles...williamglenn said:0 -
You are the one ignoring the evidence. If Barnier's backstop is so good for unionism please explain why Ruth Davidson opposes it? Not quote some random nonsense poll, why would she oppose it?HYUFD said:Yes well unlike you I am not prepared to put my finger in my ears and ignore the evidence while pressing ahead with a crash out No Deal Brexit even most English voters do not support
0 -
She could hold one Barcelona style - it would of course have no legal status.justin124 said:
She might ask for one - but will be told to 'Go away'.HYUFD said:
Oh no, if there is No Deal Sturgeon will call a vote for indyref2 at Holyrood next year no questionjustin124 said:Regardless of what happens re-Brexit , there is no serious possibility of another Independence referendum in Scotland during this Parliament. Theresa May has ruled it out , Davidson supports her - as do I! - and I am pretty sure that Sturgeon knows it too.
0 -
I would rather have Corbyn and the UK than no UK at all with No DealGIN1138 said:
Well thanks for confirming her entire 2017 election campaign was a pack of lies.HYUFD said:
May was and still is a Remainer, that is all you really need to know.GIN1138 said:
Let me give you a little bit of advice, as someone who was sucked in to voting for Theresa May in 2017 because I believed all her "Brexit Means Brexit" and "no deal is better than a bad deal" bullshit...HYUFD said:
No need to backpeddle as we have May's quote in her own words she will let Parliament decide rather than waltz off to No Deal and WTO terms and a general election whistling 'rule Britannia' and 'There will always be an England' on the way!GIN1138 said:If Theresa May ultimately walks into Parliament and declares that "No Deal" is possible with the EU because of their intransigence and so she's recommending to move to WTO on 29th March and will fight a general election on that basis if necessary I can't WAIT to see how HYUFD would back peddle to that position after these past few days.
At least BigG has left himself just enough wiggle room lol...
What this woman says is literally worthless.... I don't believe a word that comes out of her mouth and if you do... Well more fool you.
That's why I'm voting for Corbyn next time. Your leader and your party has taken me for a fool!
You'll not get that chance again.0 -
She will hold one anyway and if Yes wins go to UDI if necessaryjustin124 said:
She might ask for one - but will be told to 'Go away'.HYUFD said:
Oh no, if there is No Deal Sturgeon will call a vote for indyref2 at Holyrood next year no questionjustin124 said:Regardless of what happens re-Brexit , there is no serious possibility of another Independence referendum in Scotland during this Parliament. Theresa May has ruled it out , Davidson supports her - as do I! - and I am pretty sure that Sturgeon knows it too.
0 -
Absolutely - and would be widely ignored! I doubt that such a move would help her cause at all. After the trauma of Brexit the last thing most Scots would welcome is a further period of constitutional wrangling over Independence.brendan16 said:
She could hold one Barcelona style - it would of course have no legal status.justin124 said:
She might ask for one - but will be told to 'Go away'.HYUFD said:
Oh no, if there is No Deal Sturgeon will call a vote for indyref2 at Holyrood next year no questionjustin124 said:Regardless of what happens re-Brexit , there is no serious possibility of another Independence referendum in Scotland during this Parliament. Theresa May has ruled it out , Davidson supports her - as do I! - and I am pretty sure that Sturgeon knows it too.
0 -
She wants Scotland to leave on the same terms, which effectively it will be as the UK will still be in the SM and CU the day after Brexit when we enter the transition periodPhilip_Thompson said:
You are the one ignoring the evidence. If Barnier's backstop is so good for unionism please explain why Ruth Davidson opposes it? Not quote some random nonsense poll, why would she oppose it?HYUFD said:Yes well unlike you I am not prepared to put my finger in my ears and ignore the evidence while pressing ahead with a crash out No Deal Brexit even most English voters do not support
0 -
Is May in the FTPA? June would have been the due date under the Septennial Act.justin124 said:
Next election is due on May 5th 2022!MarqueeMark said:
And barely out before an election in June 2022.....GIN1138 said:
Ye gods an extra year of going round and round in circles...williamglenn said:0 -
If the alternative is staying in a No Deal Brexit UK?justin124 said:
Absolutely - and would be widely ignored! I doubt that such a move would help her cause at all. After the trauma of Brexit the last thing most Scots would welcome is a further period of constitutional wrangling over Independence.brendan16 said:
She could hold one Barcelona style - it would of course have no legal status.justin124 said:
She might ask for one - but will be told to 'Go away'.HYUFD said:
Oh no, if there is No Deal Sturgeon will call a vote for indyref2 at Holyrood next year no questionjustin124 said:Regardless of what happens re-Brexit , there is no serious possibility of another Independence referendum in Scotland during this Parliament. Theresa May has ruled it out , Davidson supports her - as do I! - and I am pretty sure that Sturgeon knows it too.
0 -
Sturgeon would not be so stupid as to do anything as inflammatory as that.HYUFD said:
She will hold one anyway and if Yes wins go to UDI if necessaryjustin124 said:
She might ask for one - but will be told to 'Go away'.HYUFD said:
Oh no, if there is No Deal Sturgeon will call a vote for indyref2 at Holyrood next year no questionjustin124 said:Regardless of what happens re-Brexit , there is no serious possibility of another Independence referendum in Scotland during this Parliament. Theresa May has ruled it out , Davidson supports her - as do I! - and I am pretty sure that Sturgeon knows it too.
0 -
The FTPA is still in force.Philip_Thompson said:
Is May in the FTPA? June would have been the due date under the Septennial Act.justin124 said:
Next election is due on May 5th 2022!MarqueeMark said:
And barely out before an election in June 2022.....GIN1138 said:
Ye gods an extra year of going round and round in circles...williamglenn said:
Actually under pre-FTPA rules the election would have been due in early July 2022!0 -
That didn't even work in Spain it's certainly not going to work in the UK.justin124 said:
Sturgeon would not be so stupid as to do anything as inflammatory as that.HYUFD said:
She will hold one anyway and if Yes wins go to UDI if necessaryjustin124 said:
She might ask for one - but will be told to 'Go away'.HYUFD said:
Oh no, if there is No Deal Sturgeon will call a vote for indyref2 at Holyrood next year no questionjustin124 said:Regardless of what happens re-Brexit , there is no serious possibility of another Independence referendum in Scotland during this Parliament. Theresa May has ruled it out , Davidson supports her - as do I! - and I am pretty sure that Sturgeon knows it too.
0 -
She would, her base would demand it.justin124 said:
Sturgeon would not be so stupid as to do anything as inflammatory as that.HYUFD said:
She will hold one anyway and if Yes wins go to UDI if necessaryjustin124 said:
She might ask for one - but will be told to 'Go away'.HYUFD said:
Oh no, if there is No Deal Sturgeon will call a vote for indyref2 at Holyrood next year no questionjustin124 said:Regardless of what happens re-Brexit , there is no serious possibility of another Independence referendum in Scotland during this Parliament. Theresa May has ruled it out , Davidson supports her - as do I! - and I am pretty sure that Sturgeon knows it too.
If we go to No Deal we may have to go down the Spanish route and send the army and riot police up to Scotland if we want to keep the Scots in the UK. We may have to do the same in Northern Ireland to keep the Catholic majority counties in the UK
0 -
I know that. I asked if May (the month) is specified in the FPTA.justin124 said:
The FTPA is still in force.Philip_Thompson said:
Is May in the FTPA? June would have been the due date under the Septennial Act.justin124 said:
Next election is due on May 5th 2022!MarqueeMark said:
And barely out before an election in June 2022.....GIN1138 said:
Ye gods an extra year of going round and round in circles...williamglenn said:
Looking at yes it is. But I was wrong under the Septennial Act theoretically the next election could have been July 2022.0 -
Then why is Davidson opposing the backstop?HYUFD said:
She would, her base would demand it.justin124 said:
Sturgeon would not be so stupid as to do anything as inflammatory as that.HYUFD said:
She will hold one anyway and if Yes wins go to UDI if necessaryjustin124 said:
She might ask for one - but will be told to 'Go away'.HYUFD said:
Oh no, if there is No Deal Sturgeon will call a vote for indyref2 at Holyrood next year no questionjustin124 said:Regardless of what happens re-Brexit , there is no serious possibility of another Independence referendum in Scotland during this Parliament. Theresa May has ruled it out , Davidson supports her - as do I! - and I am pretty sure that Sturgeon knows it too.
If we go to No Deal we may have to go down the Spanish route and send the army and riot police up to Scotland if we want to keep the Scots in the UK. We may have to do the same in Northern Ireland to keep the Catholic counties in the UK0 -
Sturgeon would create serious divisions within Scotland were she to go down that road. She would not do it.HYUFD said:
She would, her base would demand it.justin124 said:
Sturgeon would not be so stupid as to do anything as inflammatory as that.HYUFD said:
She will hold one anyway and if Yes wins go to UDI if necessaryjustin124 said:
She might ask for one - but will be told to 'Go away'.HYUFD said:
Oh no, if there is No Deal Sturgeon will call a vote for indyref2 at Holyrood next year no questionjustin124 said:Regardless of what happens re-Brexit , there is no serious possibility of another Independence referendum in Scotland during this Parliament. Theresa May has ruled it out , Davidson supports her - as do I! - and I am pretty sure that Sturgeon knows it too.
If we go to No Deal we may have to go down the Spanish route and send the army and riot police up to Scotland if we want to keep the Scots in the UK. We may have to do the same in Northern Ireland to keep the Catholic counties in the UK0 -
It seems pretty logical that if you want to know whether something is good for the union, you should see who's backing it and who's opposing it.
Barnier is opposed by Davidson and Foster, but not Sturgeon or Sinn Fein. Funny that.
If HYUFD was at all in the real world with his projections then Sturgeon would be hoping the talks fail and Davidson would be desperate for the backstop. Reality is quite different.0 -
She only opposes the backstop if NI leaves the UK on different terms to Scotland, England and Wales which in effect it would not as GB will stay in the SM and CU after Brexit which will be followed by the transition periodPhilip_Thompson said:
Then why is Davidson opposing the backstop?HYUFD said:
She would, her base would demand it.justin124 said:
Sturgeon would not be so stupid as to do anything as inflammatory as that.HYUFD said:
She will hold one anyway and if Yes wins go to UDI if necessaryjustin124 said:
She might ask for one - but will be told to 'Go away'.HYUFD said:
Oh no, if there is No Deal Sturgeon will call a vote for indyref2 at Holyrood next year no questionjustin124 said:Regardless of what happens re-Brexit , there is no serious possibility of another Independence referendum in Scotland during this Parliament. Theresa May has ruled it out , Davidson supports her - as do I! - and I am pretty sure that Sturgeon knows it too.
If we go to No Deal we may have to go down the Spanish route and send the army and riot police up to Scotland if we want to keep the Scots in the UK. We may have to do the same in Northern Ireland to keep the Catholic counties in the UK0 -
She absolutely will do, Nats will go mad if it is No Deal Brexit and no indyref2.justin124 said:
Sturgeon would create serious divisions within Scotland were she to go down that road. She would not do it.HYUFD said:
She would, her base would demand it.justin124 said:
Sturgeon would not be so stupid as to do anything as inflammatory as that.HYUFD said:
She will hold one anyway and if Yes wins go to UDI if necessaryjustin124 said:
She might ask for one - but will be told to 'Go away'.HYUFD said:
Oh no, if there is No Deal Sturgeon will call a vote for indyref2 at Holyrood next year no questionjustin124 said:Regardless of what happens re-Brexit , there is no serious possibility of another Independence referendum in Scotland during this Parliament. Theresa May has ruled it out , Davidson supports her - as do I! - and I am pretty sure that Sturgeon knows it too.
If we go to No Deal we may have to go down the Spanish route and send the army and riot police up to Scotland if we want to keep the Scots in the UK. We may have to do the same in Northern Ireland to keep the Catholic counties in the UK0 -
Amen.GIN1138 said:
Let me give you a little bit of advice, as someone who was sucked in to voting for Theresa May in 2017 because I believed all her "Brexit Means Brexit" and "no deal is better than a bad deal" bullshit...HYUFD said:
No need to backpeddle as we have May's quote in her own words she will let Parliament decide rather than waltz off to No Deal and WTO terms and a general election whistling 'rule Britannia' and 'There will always be an England' on the way!GIN1138 said:If Theresa May ultimately walks into Parliament and declares that "No Deal" is possible with the EU because of their intransigence and so she's recommending to move to WTO on 29th March and will fight a general election on that basis if necessary I can't WAIT to see how HYUFD would back peddle to that position after these past few days.
At least BigG has left himself just enough wiggle room lol...
What this woman says is literally worthless.... I don't believe a word that comes out of her mouth and if you do... Well more fool you.0 -
Sturgeon is quite clear she is willing to compromise and keep Scotland outside the EU but in the SM and CU despite Scotland voting Remain. Anything else and it is within her rights to pass an indyref2 referendum through Holyrood whether Westminster agrees or not.Philip_Thompson said:It seems pretty logical that if you want to know whether something is good for the union, you should see who's backing it and who's opposing it.
Barnier is opposed by Davidson and Foster, but not Sturgeon or Sinn Fein. Funny that.
If HYUFD was at all in the real world with his projections then Sturgeon would be hoping the talks fail and Davidson would be desperate for the backstop. Reality is quite different.
As I said if we want to be sure of keeping Scotland in the UK if no Deal we will have to send the Army in and the same applies to Northern Ireland. The peace process will of course be dead effectively in all but name if a hard border in Ireland0 -
Some Nats might - but UDI would have little support across Scotland and would be seen as an extreme response. Likely to damage SNP support - perhaps seriously so.HYUFD said:
She absolutely will do, Nats will go mad if it is No Deal Brexit and no indyref2.justin124 said:
Sturgeon would create serious divisions within Scotland were she to go down that road. She would not do it.HYUFD said:
She would, her base would demand it.justin124 said:
Sturgeon would not be so stupid as to do anything as inflammatory as that.HYUFD said:
She will hold one anyway and if Yes wins go to UDI if necessaryjustin124 said:
She might ask for one - but will be told to 'Go away'.HYUFD said:
Oh no, if there is No Deal Sturgeon will call a vote for indyref2 at Holyrood next year no questionjustin124 said:Regardless of what happens re-Brexit , there is no serious possibility of another Independence referendum in Scotland during this Parliament. Theresa May has ruled it out , Davidson supports her - as do I! - and I am pretty sure that Sturgeon knows it too.
If we go to No Deal we may have to go down the Spanish route and send the army and riot police up to Scotland if we want to keep the Scots in the UK. We may have to do the same in Northern Ireland to keep the Catholic counties in the UK0 -
This Brexit is beginning to resemble the day 20 years ago when I said Im bored with chess...go looks interesting .0
-
The polling is clear, if No Deal Brexit a majority of the voters in Scotland and Northern Ireland could vote to leave the UK.justin124 said:
Some Nats might - but UDI would have little support across Scotland and would be seen as an extreme response. Likely to damage SNP support - perhaps seriously so.HYUFD said:
She absolutely will do, Nats will go mad if it is No Deal Brexit and no indyref2.justin124 said:
Sturgeon would create serious divisions within Scotland were she to go down that road. She would not do it.HYUFD said:
She would, her base would demand it.justin124 said:
Sturgeon would not be so stupid as to do anything as inflammatory as that.HYUFD said:
She will hold one anyway and if Yes wins go to UDI if necessaryjustin124 said:
She might ask for one - but will be told to 'Go away'.HYUFD said:
Oh no, if there is No Deal Sturgeon will call a vote for indyref2 at Holyrood next year no questionjustin124 said:Regardless of what happens re-Brexit , there is no serious possibility of another Independence referendum in Scotland during this Parliament. Theresa May has ruled it out , Davidson supports her - as do I! - and I am pretty sure that Sturgeon knows it too.
If we go to No Deal we may have to go down the Spanish route and send the army and riot police up to Scotland if we want to keep the Scots in the UK. We may have to do the same in Northern Ireland to keep the Catholic counties in the UK
Never mind Davidson Unionism the British government would have to go full, hard Rajoy Unionism or Assad and send the army and riot police to Scotland and Northern Ireland and impose British rule using military force if necessary0 -
Because the SCon surge is based on ultra Unionists, Loyalists and ex Kippers. Baking shows and pish about progressive politics for the London luvvies, solidarity with the DUP for the Huns.Philip_Thompson said:
Then why is Davidson opposing the backstop?HYUFD said:
She would, her base would demand it.justin124 said:
Sturgeon would not be so stupid as to do anything as inflammatory as that.HYUFD said:
She will hold one anyway and if Yes wins go to UDI if necessaryjustin124 said:
She might ask for one - but will be told to 'Go away'.HYUFD said:
Oh no, if there is No Deal Sturgeon will call a vote for indyref2 at Holyrood next year no questionjustin124 said:Regardless of what happens re-Brexit , there is no serious possibility of another Independence referendum in Scotland during this Parliament. Theresa May has ruled it out , Davidson supports her - as do I! - and I am pretty sure that Sturgeon knows it too.
If we go to No Deal we may have to go down the Spanish route and send the army and riot police up to Scotland if we want to keep the Scots in the UK. We may have to do the same in Northern Ireland to keep the Catholic counties in the UK0 -
Can we exclude soft Himmler?HYUFD said:
The polling is clear, if No Deal Brexit a majority of the voters in Scotland and Northern Ireland could vote to leave the UK.justin124 said:
Some Nats might - but UDI would have little support across Scotland and would be seen as an extreme response. Likely to damage SNP support - perhaps seriously so.HYUFD said:
She absolutely will do, Nats will go mad if it is No Deal Brexit and no indyref2.justin124 said:
Sturgeon would create serious divisions within Scotland were she to go down that road. She would not do it.HYUFD said:
She would, her base would demand it.justin124 said:
Sturgeon would not be so stupid as to do anything as inflammatory as that.HYUFD said:
She will hold one anyway and if Yes wins go to UDI if necessaryjustin124 said:
She might ask for one - but will be told to 'Go away'.HYUFD said:
Oh no, if there is No Deal Sturgeon will call a vote for indyref2 at Holyrood next year no questionjustin124 said:Regardless of what happens re-Brexit , there is no serious possibility of another Independence referendum in Scotland during this Parliament. Theresa May has ruled it out , Davidson supports her - as do I! - and I am pretty sure that Sturgeon knows it too.
If we go to No Deal we may have to go down the Spanish route and send the army and riot police up to Scotland if we want to keep the Scots in the UK. We may have to do the same in Northern Ireland to keep the Catholic counties in the UK
Never mind Davidson Unionism the British government would have to go full, hard Rajoy Unionism or Assad and send the army and riot police to Scotland and Northern Ireland and impose British rule using military force if necessary
Just asking..0 -
There is an inherent contradiction there. Polling is hardly 'clear' if it merely suggests 'could'. Hypothetical polls are pretty meaningless anyway. However, I do believe that many of those who have switched to the SNP in recent years would cease to support it were it to give the impression of leading the country down the path of civil & political violence - indeed potential civil war. Few there would wish to even risk repeating the experience of Northern Ireland.HYUFD said:
The polling is clear, if No Deal Brexit a majority of the voters in Scotland and Northern Ireland could vote to leave the UK.justin124 said:
Some Nats might - but UDI would have little support across Scotland and would be seen as an extreme response. Likely to damage SNP support - perhaps seriously so.HYUFD said:
She absolutely will do, Nats will go mad if it is No Deal Brexit and no indyref2.justin124 said:
Sturgeon would create serious divisions within Scotland were she to go down that road. She would not do it.HYUFD said:
She would, her base would demand it.justin124 said:
Sturgeon would not be so stupid as to do anything as inflammatory as that.HYUFD said:
She will hold one anyway and if Yes wins go to UDI if necessaryjustin124 said:
She might ask for one - but will be told to 'Go away'.HYUFD said:
Oh no, if there is No Deal Sturgeon will call a vote for indyref2 at Holyrood next year no questionjustin124 said:Regardless of what happens re-Brexit , there is no serious possibility of another Independence referendum in Scotland during this Parliament. Theresa May has ruled it out , Davidson supports her - as do I! - and I am pretty sure that Sturgeon knows it too.
If we go to No Deal we may have to go down the Spanish route and send the army and riot police up to Scotland if we want to keep the Scots in the UK. We may have to do the same in Northern Ireland to keep the Catholic counties in the UK0 -
But what about the soft Himmlers? Are they still with the LibDems?Theuniondivvie said:
Because the SCon surge is based on ultra Unionists, Loyalists and ex Kippers. Baking shows and pish about progressive politics for the London luvvies, solidarity with the DUP for the Huns.Philip_Thompson said:
Then why is Davidson opposing the backstop?HYUFD said:
She would, her base would demand it.justin124 said:
Sturgeon would not be so stupid as to do anything as inflammatory as that.HYUFD said:
She will hold one anyway and if Yes wins go to UDI if necessaryjustin124 said:
She might ask for one - but will be told to 'Go away'.HYUFD said:
Oh no, if there is No Deal Sturgeon will call a vote for indyref2 at Holyrood next year no questionjustin124 said:Regardless of what happens re-Brexit , there is no serious possibility of another Independence referendum in Scotland during this Parliament. Theresa May has ruled it out , Davidson supports her - as do I! - and I am pretty sure that Sturgeon knows it too.
If we go to No Deal we may have to go down the Spanish route and send the army and riot police up to Scotland if we want to keep the Scots in the UK. We may have to do the same in Northern Ireland to keep the Catholic counties in the UK0 -
You have to boil them for at least three minutes, otherwise they go all runny.shiney2 said:
But what about the soft Himmlers? Are they still with the LibDems?Theuniondivvie said:
Because the SCon surge is based on ultra Unionists, Loyalists and ex Kippers. Baking shows and pish about progressive politics for the London luvvies, solidarity with the DUP for the Huns.Philip_Thompson said:
Then why is Davidson opposing the backstop?HYUFD said:
She would, her base would demand it.justin124 said:
Sturgeon would not be so stupid as to do anything as inflammatory as that.HYUFD said:
She will hold one anyway and if Yes wins go to UDI if necessaryjustin124 said:
She might ask for one - but will be told to 'Go away'.HYUFD said:
Oh no, if there is No Deal Sturgeon will call a vote for indyref2 at Holyrood next year no questionjustin124 said:Regardless of what happens re-Brexit , there is no serious possibility of another Independence referendum in Scotland during this Parliament. Theresa May has ruled it out , Davidson supports her - as do I! - and I am pretty sure that Sturgeon knows it too.
If we go to No Deal we may have to go down the Spanish route and send the army and riot police up to Scotland if we want to keep the Scots in the UK. We may have to do the same in Northern Ireland to keep the Catholic counties in the UK
Pause.
The Himmlers, not the Lib Dems.
Obviously.
Um.
Ah, my coat...
0 -
Good to see the traditional friendship between Saudi Arabia and the US continuing.
https://slate.com/news-and-politics/2018/10/khashoggi-trump-pompeo-saudi-arabia-cover-up.html0 -
I usually find Slate too liberal to bear. But it's hard not to disagree with the analysis.rcs1000 said:Good to see the traditional friendship between Saudi Arabia and the US continuing.
https://slate.com/news-and-politics/2018/10/khashoggi-trump-pompeo-saudi-arabia-cover-up.html0 -
Talking of byelections........is it possible McKinlay in South Thanet could be forced out?0
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She hasn’t said that, no matter how many times you repeat it. She said the government will return to the house to identify the way ahead. The government aren’t going to sit on their hands and say “ok chaps, what’s the plan?”HYUFD said:
May has said she will pass the Brexit decision to Parliament if no agreement with the EU in NovemberPhilip_Thompson said:
Irrelevant.HYUFD said:
Only 40 to 45% of voters back No Deal, No Deal ends the 52% Brexit majority in the UK. The only way to save Brexit then would be SM plus CU otherwise it will be EUref2 before March and Remain or a Corbyn minority government after a general election and SM and CU or EUref2 anyway (Soubry, Grieve etc will of course vote with the opposition for a general election if No Deal if the government does not allow EUref2)Philip_Thompson said:
No we won't. We automatically exit on 29 March 2019.HYUFD said:Well we would Remain if No Deal anyway
It will take a deal for us to remain.
There isn't a referendum booked and the sands of time mean we will be gone before the next election. What the polls say is irrelevant unless Parliament acts and Parliament can't really act unilaterally without bringing the government down - it can block what the government wants to do but can't initiate a deal by itself.0 -
I’m not an aristocrat - just from a family that owns a successful medium sized businessFoxy said:
Supreme executive power springs from a mandate from the masses... as Dennis might say!Anazina said:
Er, why? So young fogeys like you can luxuriate over highfalutin monarchistic semantics?Mortimer said:
This should be pinned to every thread.Charles said:
Parliamentary Sovereignty doesn’t mean what you think it meansHYUFD said:
The UK may not last 5 minutes without that.Mortimer said:
May wouldn’t last 5 minutes as leader after proposing that. And back benches can’t take offers to Europe!HYUFD said:
May will ultimately put up a SM + CU backstop but only take it to the EU if Parliament votes it though which it likely willarcher101au said:
Honestly. Private members cannot magically put forward bills that will pass in record time. Private members cannot even put up bills unless they win the ballot. The only Brexit bills that will be considered are those that are proposed by the Government. Try again.HYUFD said:
May will simply alloliament if those talks fail there will be over 4 months until Brexit dayarcher101au said:
The 'meaningful vote' can possibly be amended, but it is nothing but an advisory position. As we see on PB all day, people propose things in terms of deal outcomes that can't actually happen (eg HYUFD and his magic transition to SM+CU) so how Parliament does anything but have a general whinge is beyond me.
Parliament can either reject or pass a deal presented to them. If the Government supported it, they could decide either to abandon Brexit or have another referendum, but this can't happen without Govt support because both require primary legislation. But the one thing they can't do is determine which deal outcome they might want.
If none of these happen, no deal will happen. It doesn't need any form of approval.
Your fantasy island politics about MPs taking the lead in negotiating fails to understand our constitution. And the Tory party.
Our constitution is based on Parliamentary sovereignty, Parliament will vote for a SM+CU backstop over No Deal
It is the *Executive* through the Royal Prerogative that exercises the rights of the Crown; ie it is the Crown-in-Parliament (rather than the Crown) which is Sovereign
https://youtu.be/3vJxrf1r0ak
Charles is an aristocrat. He seems to think that crap actually matters.
And process and governance do matter. Without it you have chaos and injustice0 -
“Presumably” doing a lot of work thereHYUFD said:
She has made clear she will let the Commons come to a view on what to do next which she and the Government will then implement and presumably put to a voteCharles said:
If she proposes primary legislation yes, but she hasn’t suggested she willHYUFD said:
Be as patronising as ever but if the Head of the Executive ie Theresa May lets Parliament decide whether or not to accept a backstop or No Deal that is what will happenCharles said:
Parliamentary Sovereignty doesn’t mean what you think it meansHYUFD said:
The UK may not last 5 minutes without that.Mortimer said:
May wouldn’t last 5 minutes as leader after proposing that. And back benches can’t take offers to Europe!HYUFD said:
May will ultimately put up a SM + CU backstop but only take it to the EU if Parliament votes it though which it likely willarcher101au said:
Honestly. Private members cannot magically put forward bills that will pass in record time. Private members cannot even put up bills unless they win the ballot. The only Brexit bills that will be considered are those that are proposed by the Government. Try again.HYUFD said:
May will simply alloliament if those talks fail there will be over 4 months until Brexit dayarcher101au said:
The 'meaningful vote' can possibly be amended, but it is nothing but an advisory position. As we see on PB all day, people propose things in terms of deal outcomes that can't actually happen (eg HYUFD and his magic transition to SM+CU) so how Parliament does anything but have a general whinge is beyond me.
Parliament can either reject or pass a deal presented to them. If the Government supported it, they could decide either to abandon Brexit or have another referendum, but this can't happen without Govt support because both require primary legislation. But the one thing they can't do is determine which deal outcome they might want.
If none of these happen, no deal will happen. It doesn't need any form of approval.
Your fantasy island politics about MPs taking the lead in negotiating fails to understand our constitution. And the Tory party.
Our constitution is based on Parliamentary sovereignty, Parliament will vote for a SM+CU backstop over No Deal
It is the *Executive* through the Royal Prerogative that exercises the rights of the Crown; ie it is the Crown-in-Parliament (rather than the Crown) which is Sovereign0 -
Which is why the executive power rests with the person who can control a majority of the House of CommonsFoxy said:
The last executive who tried to usurp parliament wound up beheaded.Charles said:
No - so that people don’t make important betting decisions based on wrong assumptions (eg that parliamentary sovereignty means the legislature can usurp the rights of the executive)Anazina said:
Er, why? So young fogeys like you can luxuriate over highfalutin monarchistic semantics?Mortimer said:
This should be pinned to every thread.Charles said:
Parliamentary Sovereignty doesn’t mean what you think it meansHYUFD said:
The UK may not last 5 minutes without that.Mortimer said:
May wouldn’t last 5 minutes as leader after proposing that. And back benches can’t take offers to Europe!HYUFD said:
May will ultimately put up a SM + CU backstop but only take it to the EU if Parliament votes it though which it likely willarcher101au said:
Honestly. Private members cannot magically put forward bills that will pass in record time. Private members cannot even put up bills unless they win the ballot. The only Brexit bills that will be considered are those that are proposed by the Government. Try again.HYUFD said:
May will simply alloliament if those talks fail there will be over 4 months until Brexit dayarcher101au said:
The 'meaningful vote' can possibly be amended, but it is nothing but an advisory position. As we see on PB all day, people propose things in terms of deal outcomes that can't actually happen (eg HYUFD and his magic transition to SM+CU) so how Parliament does anything but have a general whinge is beyond me.
Parliament can either reject or pass a deal presented to them. If the Government supported it, they could decide either to abandon Brexit or have another referendum, but this can't happen without Govt support because both require primary legislation. But the one thing they can't do is determine which deal outcome they might want.
If none of these happen, no deal will happen. It doesn't need any form of approval.
Your fantasy island politics about MPs taking the lead in negotiating fails to understand our constitution. And the Tory party.
Our constitution is based on Parliamentary sovereignty, Parliament will vote for a SM+CU backstop over No Deal
It is the *Executive* through the Royal Prerogative that exercises the rights of the Crown; ie it is the Crown-in-Parliament (rather than the Crown) which is Sovereign0 -
It was a form of words for goodness sake!HYUFD said:
No need to backpeddle as we have May's quote in her own words she will let Parliament decide rather than waltz off to No Deal and WTO terms and a general election whistling 'rule Britannia' and 'There will always be an England' on the way!GIN1138 said:If Theresa May ultimately walks into Parliament and declares that "No Deal" is possible with the EU because of their intransigence and so she's recommending to move to WTO on 29th March and will fight a general election on that basis if necessary I can't WAIT to see how HYUFD would back peddle to that position after these past few days.
At least BigG has left himself just enough wiggle room lol...
Do you really think May is going to turn up in Westminster and say “I haven’t the foggiest what to do next, it’s up to you”?0 -
Scotland is not going to take the UDI routeHYUFD said:
She will hold one anyway and if Yes wins go to UDI if necessaryjustin124 said:
She might ask for one - but will be told to 'Go away'.HYUFD said:
Oh no, if there is No Deal Sturgeon will call a vote for indyref2 at Holyrood next year no questionjustin124 said:Regardless of what happens re-Brexit , there is no serious possibility of another Independence referendum in Scotland during this Parliament. Theresa May has ruled it out , Davidson supports her - as do I! - and I am pretty sure that Sturgeon knows it too.
Don’t be ridiculous0 -
"Little hope or expectation for a Brexit breakthrough as Mrs May heads to Brussels
The PM will address the EU27 just ahead of their pre-summit dinner, but the Irish border question remains the stumbling block."
https://news.sky.com/story/little-hope-or-expectation-for-a-brexit-breakthrough-as-mrs-may-heads-to-brussels-115277190 -
HYUFD was more entertaining when they were Boris #1 Fan. Someone should cut the supply of hysteria pills.justin124 said:
Some Nats might - but UDI would have little support across Scotland and would be seen as an extreme response. Likely to damage SNP support - perhaps seriously so.HYUFD said:
She absolutely will do, Nats will go mad if it is No Deal Brexit and no indyref2.justin124 said:
Sturgeon would create serious divisions within Scotland were she to go down that road. She would not do it.HYUFD said:
She would, her base would demand it.justin124 said:
Sturgeon would not be so stupid as to do anything as inflammatory as that.HYUFD said:
She will hold one anyway and if Yes wins go to UDI if necessaryjustin124 said:
She might ask for one - but will be told to 'Go away'.HYUFD said:
Oh no, if there is No Deal Sturgeon will call a vote for indyref2 at Holyrood next year no questionjustin124 said:Regardless of what happens re-Brexit , there is no serious possibility of another Independence referendum in Scotland during this Parliament. Theresa May has ruled it out , Davidson supports her - as do I! - and I am pretty sure that Sturgeon knows it too.
If we go to No Deal we may have to go down the Spanish route and send the army and riot police up to Scotland if we want to keep the Scots in the UK. We may have to do the same in Northern Ireland to keep the Catholic counties in the UK
While the SNP's 'USP' is "independence", they also get quite a few votes for "competence" (unlikely though that may seem, but again, given the competition from SLAB, not a high hurdle) and talk of UDI would drive a coach and horses through that. Sturgeon is no fool and knows no "UDI Scotland" would get into the EU in her lifetime - there would be a queue of countries lining up to veto the application. What she needs is an unambiguous majority in Holyrood won on the back of a SindyRef2 manifesto, then it would be difficult to see Westminster declining another "once in a generation" (sic) referendum.0 -
I suppose there is. There's also the possibility of one in Peterborough.swing_voter said:Talking of byelections........is it possible McKinlay in South Thanet could be forced out?
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You are drunk, trolling or an idiotHYUFD said:
The polling is clear, if No Deal Brexit a majority of the voters in Scotland and Northern Ireland could vote to leave the UK.justin124 said:
Some Nats might - but UDI would have little support across Scotland and would be seen as an extreme response. Likely to damage SNP support - perhaps seriously so.HYUFD said:
She absolutely will do, Nats will go mad if it is No Deal Brexit and no indyref2.justin124 said:
Sturgeon would create serious divisions within Scotland were she to go down that road. She would not do it.HYUFD said:
She would, her base would demand it.justin124 said:
Sturgeon would not be so stupid as to do anything as inflammatory as that.HYUFD said:
She will hold one anyway and if Yes wins go to UDI if necessaryjustin124 said:
She might ask for one - but will be told to 'Go away'.HYUFD said:
Oh no, if there is No Deal Sturgeon will call a vote for indyref2 at Holyrood next year no questionjustin124 said:Regardless of what happens re-Brexit , there is no serious possibility of another Independence referendum in Scotland during this Parliament. Theresa May has ruled it out , Davidson supports her - as do I! - and I am pretty sure that Sturgeon knows it too.
If we go to No Deal we may have to go down the Spanish route and send the army and riot police up to Scotland if we want to keep the Scots in the UK. We may have to do the same in Northern Ireland to keep the Catholic counties in the UK
Never mind Davidson Unionism the British government would have to go full, hard Rajoy Unionism or Assad and send the army and riot police to Scotland and Northern Ireland and impose British rule using military force if necessary
Or possibly all three.
The U.K. is not going to send the army into Scotland. An independence referendum without Westminister’s Approval has no constitutional standing.
And no, there will not be an Assad style civil war0 -
What the Prime Minister actually said:Charles said:
“Presumably” doing a lot of work there
My hon. Friend’s question involves a number of assumptions. We are working to get a good deal with the European Union. If, at the end of the negotiation process, both sides agreed that no deal was there, that would actually come back to this House, and then we would see what position the House would take in the circumstances of the time.
http://bit.ly/2P6agrW
Mr Glenn reads that as 'EURef2'
Mr Archer reads that as 'No Deal Brexit'
HYUFD reads that as 'CU, SM or its tanks on Princes Street and troops in Derry'*
*If I'm keeping up0 -
Any fule no you have to boil a Lib Dem for at least 15 minutes to stop them being runny...viewcode said:
You have to boil them for at least three minutes, otherwise they go all runny.shiney2 said:
But what about the soft Himmlers? Are they still with the LibDems?Theuniondivvie said:
Because the SCon surge is based on ultra Unionists, Loyalists and ex Kippers. Baking shows and pish about progressive politics for the London luvvies, solidarity with the DUP for the Huns.Philip_Thompson said:
Then why is Davidson opposing the backstop?HYUFD said:
She would, her base would demand it.justin124 said:
Sturgeon would not be so stupid as to do anything as inflammatory as that.HYUFD said:
She will hold one anyway and if Yes wins go to UDI if necessaryjustin124 said:
She might ask for one - but will be told to 'Go away'.HYUFD said:
Oh no, if there is No Deal Sturgeon will call a vote for indyref2 at Holyrood next year no questionjustin124 said:Regardless of what happens re-Brexit , there is no serious possibility of another Independence referendum in Scotland during this Parliament. Theresa May has ruled it out , Davidson supports her - as do I! - and I am pretty sure that Sturgeon knows it too.
If we go to No Deal we may have to go down the Spanish route and send the army and riot police up to Scotland if we want to keep the Scots in the UK. We may have to do the same in Northern Ireland to keep the Catholic counties in the UK
Pause.
The Himmlers, not the Lib Dems.
Obviously.
Um.
Ah, my coat...0 -
Reposting as its an interesting argument from a good source:
https://twitter.com/CER_Grant/status/10522862999132487680 -
0
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Curiously enough, Trump isn't on the list, and from the UK only the Conservatives (at number 2) and the DCMS Cttee make the list:
https://www.rt.com/news/441417-top-10-russophobes-2018/0 -
This thread is now OLD0
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I am reasonably confident that he is not drunk nor trolling.Charles said:
You are drunk, trolling or an idiotHYUFD said:
The polling is clear, if No Deal Brexit a majority of the voters in Scotland and Northern Ireland could vote to leave the UK.justin124 said:
Some Nats might - but UDI would have little support across Scotland and would be seen as an extreme response. Likely to damage SNP support - perhaps seriously so.HYUFD said:
She absolutely will do, Nats will go mad if it is No Deal Brexit and no indyref2.justin124 said:
Sturgeon would create serious divisions within Scotland were she to go down that road. She would not do it.HYUFD said:
She would, her base would demand it.justin124 said:
Sturgeon would not be so stupid as to do anything as inflammatory as that.HYUFD said:
She will hold one anyway and if Yes wins go to UDI if necessaryjustin124 said:
She might ask for one - but will be told to 'Go away'.HYUFD said:
Oh no, if there is No Deal Sturgeon will call a vote for indyref2 at Holyrood next year no questionjustin124 said:Regardless of what happens re-Brexit , there is no serious possibility of another Independence referendum in Scotland during this Parliament. Theresa May has ruled it out , Davidson supports her - as do I! - and I am pretty sure that Sturgeon knows it too.
If we go to No Deal we may have to go down the Spanish route and send the army and riot police up to Scotland if we want to keep the Scots in the UK. We may have to do the same in Northern Ireland to keep the Catholic counties in the UK
Never mind Davidson Unionism the British government would have to go full, hard Rajoy Unionism or Assad and send the army and riot police to Scotland and Northern Ireland and impose British rule using military force if necessary
Or possibly all three.
The U.K. is not going to send the army into Scotland. An independence referendum without Westminister’s Approval has no constitutional standing.
And no, there will not be an Assad style civil war0 -
May won't do a fucking thing. The Joffrey Baratheon of the Empty Quarter is still holding the prospect of a 48 jet order for Typhoons over her.HYUFD said:Khashoggi butchered alive and surgically dismembered before being injected with an unknown drug and falling silent. If the Saudis are behind this we should cut ties as should the US
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-6281303/Turkish-investigators-say-looking-toxic-materials-Khashoggi-murder-probe.html0 -
If you think a majority of Scots and Northern Irish Catholics will meekly accept a No Deal, Crash Out Brexit then think againCharles said:
You are drunk, trolling or an idiotHYUFD said:
The polling is clear, if No Deal Brexit a majority of the voters in Scotland and Northern Ireland could vote to leave the UK.justin124 said:
Some Nats might - but UDI would have little support across Scotland and would be seen as an extreme response. Likely to damage SNP support - perhaps seriously so.HYUFD said:
She absolutely will do, Nats will go mad if it is No Deal Brexit and no indyref2.justin124 said:
Sturgeon would create serious divisions within Scotland were she to go down that road. She would not do it.HYUFD said:
She would, her base would demand it.justin124 said:
Sturgeon would not be so stupid as to do anything as inflammatory as that.HYUFD said:
She will hold one anyway and if Yes wins go to UDI if necessaryjustin124 said:
She might ask for one - but will be told to 'Go away'.HYUFD said:
Oh no, if there is No Deal Sturgeon will call a vote for indyref2 at Holyrood next year no questionjustin124 said:Regardless of what happens re-Brexit , there is no serious possibility of another Independence referendum in Scotland during this Parliament. Theresa May has ruled it out , Davidson supports her - as do I! - and I am pretty sure that Sturgeon knows it too.
If we go to No Deal we may have to go down the Spanish route and send the army and riot police up to Scotland if we want to keep the Scots in the UK. We may have to do the same in Northern Ireland to keep the Catholic counties in the UK
Never mind Davidson Unionism the British government would have to go full, hard Rajoy Unionism or Assad and send the army and riot police to Scotland and Northern Ireland and impose British rule using military force if necessary
Or possibly all three.
The U.K. is not going to send the army into Scotland. An independence referendum without Westminister’s Approval has no constitutional standing.
And no, there will not be an Assad style civil war0 -
Aha! so the soft Himmler is *not* excluded.HYUFD said:
If you think a majority of Scots and Northern Irish Catholics will meekly accept a No Deal, Crash Out Brexit then think againCharles said:
You are drunk, trolling or an idiotHYUFD said:
The polling is clear, if No Deal Brexit a majority of the voters in Scotland and Northern Ireland could vote to leave the UK.justin124 said:
Some Nats might - but UDI would have little support across Scotland and would be seen as an extreme response. Likely to damage SNP support - perhaps seriously so.HYUFD said:
She absolutely will do, Nats will go mad if it is No Deal Brexit and no indyref2.justin124 said:
Sturgeon would create serious divisions within Scotland were she to go down that road. She would not do it.HYUFD said:
She would, her base would demand it.justin124 said:
Sturgeon would not be so stupid as to do anything as inflammatory as that.HYUFD said:
She will hold one anyway and if Yes wins go to UDI if necessaryjustin124 said:
She might ask for one - but will be told to 'Go away'.HYUFD said:
Oh no, if there is No Deal Sturgeon will call a vote for indyref2 at Holyrood next year no questionjustin124 said:Regardless of what happens re-Brexit , there is no serious possibility of another Independence referendum in Scotland during this Parliament. Theresa May has ruled it out , Davidson supports her - as do I! - and I am pretty sure that Sturgeon knows it too.
If we go to No Deal we may have to go down the Spanish route and send the army and riot police up to Scotland if we want to keep the Scots in the UK. We may have to do the same in Northern Ireland to keep the Catholic counties in the UK
Never mind Davidson Unionism the British government would have to go full, hard Rajoy Unionism or Assad and send the army and riot police to Scotland and Northern Ireland and impose British rule using military force if necessary
Or possibly all three.
The U.K. is not going to send the army into Scotland. An independence referendum without Westminister’s Approval has no constitutional standing.
And no, there will not be an Assad style civil war0
