Indeed. I think her father suffered an unfortunate demise (from his standpoint) at the hands of the Royal Navy at the very end of the war, if memory serves me correctly.
Personally, I think a bottle of red and a one way ticket to Dignitas would be more preferable than having to face Mark Wahlberg's schedule for more than one day....
Yeh, yeh, yeh. Says completely out-of-depth Raab, who is about as far from the actual decision making as next door's cat.
Buried in that lead article is the news that May is saying to ministers that if we don't have a deal by mid-November, we'll need to start building physical infrastructure!
Indeed. I think her father suffered an unfortunate demise (from his standpoint) at the hands of the Royal Navy at the very end of the war, if memory serves me correctly.
Or maybe not. Having looked him up he apparently survived to a ripe old age.
So they have put it back to April as they know they have no chance before Brexit
Well given if we have a Brexit Deal, a Withdrawal Agreement and Transition Deal it will have to be done and dusted by April that is the most farcical threat in history
Personally, I think a bottle of red and a one way ticket to Dignitas would be more preferable than having to face Mark Wahlberg's schedule for more than one day....
I don't believe a word of it. It is just out there to make him look super human or something.
No-one needs to do that to stay in shape. And it doesn't seem to make sense in terms of time allocation: 30 minutes of daily golf. But 90 minutes for his morning shower. That is just bizarre.
I am not sure who he is trying to impress with this.
Personally, I think a bottle of red and a one way ticket to Dignitas would be more preferable than having to face Mark Wahlberg's schedule for more than one day....
Whisky and a revolver methinks. But I’m totally with you on the sentiment.
So they have put it back to April as they know they have no chance before Brexit
Much of this stuff has to be sourced by someone a bit daft. If Brexit has happened in April then May will be untouchable, if it hasn't then she won't be around.
I'm probably well wide of the mark, but this seems like something Anna Soubry would say. I apologise if I'm wrong.
April will be an astonishingly interesting month in politics though. It'll be the great re-positioning. The debate about an agenda of reform of our out-of-the-EU position will commence. The stupid will be lost-at-sea. I have some suspicions as to who might be so affected, but I think it'l be a very short list. The now apparently stupid aren't actually as stupid as they make out.
So they have put it back to April as they know they have no chance before Brexit
Never has so little been delivered by so few......
At least the OED has a new definition for a damp squib. What a pathetic bunch of third-rate charlatans and has-beens they have turned out to be.
Patel: sacked. Redwood: still thinks it is 1990s and he is standing next to Tony Marlowe. Loughton: last seen trotting down Whitehall shouting 'What do we want, Leadsome' Patterson: has it in for badgers, but otherwise has not troubled the history books IDS: sacked as leader, creator of Universal Credit (a policy depth-charge that has yet to fully explode) Bernard Jenkins: wasn't his Dad important once? Gove: ex-member.
I could go on. But I would have to stop well before the 80 they claim and massively below the 159 they need to actually get rid of May.
But the only people from whom such an announcement might carry weight are Farage and Rees-Mogg. Boris is not so much a busted flush as an empty house, on all sides.
You might think so, and I might think so, but polling suggests he's the Brexiteers' great white hope. If he throws in the towel it will have a major impact on opinion.
Why
Because, as HYUFD will tell you, he's still seen as the man with the charisma to make things happen. If he genuinely changes his mind on Brexit, instead of pretending it would all be find if we took a different approach, I think it will be the straw that breaks the camel's back.
It just wouldn’t. Sorry and all that, but it wouldn’t.
Boris has served a purpose, but millions of us thought this one through for keeps. He was a helpful catalyst. Great. But, I really really doubt, even his changing his mind (which I do not see) is going to result in the Damascene conversion of Leavers en masse.
I think it’s time he went back full time to journalism myself. I really don’t fancy a Boris/Jezza choice in 2022. We need a bit of boring. Kinnock jr v Sajid Javid anyone?
The Labour and Tory membership are not going to back either of those, Labour members are only going to back a Corbynite and Tory members will only back an anti Chequers Deal candidate.
So on that basis Tory MPs might keep May for fear of Boris or Mogg and it will be Corbyn v May 2
But the only people from whom such an announcement might carry weight are Farage and Rees-Mogg. Boris is not so much a busted flush as an empty house, on all sides.
You might think so, and I might think so, but polling suggests he's the Brexiteers' great white hope. If he throws in the towel it will have a major impact on opinion.
Why
Because, as HYUFD will tell you, he's still seen as the man with the charisma to make things happen. If he genuinely changes his mind on Brexit, instead of pretending it would all be find if we took a different approach, I think it will be the straw that breaks the camel's back.
"April come she will When streams are ripe and swelled with rain May, she will stay"
Paul Simon
Whan that Aprille with his shoures soote The droghte of Marche hath perced to the roote, And bathed every veyne in swich licour, Of which vertu engendred is the flour;
@Big_G Wales I wish May's Govt would push the badger cull into the long grass; but aside from that (and fracking)....you lass May is the only game in town.....She is still going to be here in 2022, though sadly many tens of thousands of badgers who will be slaughtered before then for no discernible benefit will not......
"April come she will When streams are ripe and swelled with rain May, she will stay"
Paul Simon
Whan that Aprille with his shoures soote The droghte of Marche hath perced to the roote, And bathed every veyne in swich licour, Of which vertu engendred is the flour;
It'll be interesting to see whether their warnings of Armageddon come to anything. Nobody will ever listen to them again if they don't.
Their warnings are predicated on 'no deal' which, hopefully, is unlikely.
No deal + No transition. A no deal and a suitable period of time to transition over a few years will result in very little observable change but the consequences of no deal over medium term is to make us poorer, or less richer. Godzilla and Loki are not going to be unleashing their terrors though. As long as there is a transition period.
"April come she will When streams are ripe and swelled with rain May, she will stay"
Paul Simon
Whan that Aprille with his shoures soote The droghte of Marche hath perced to the roote, And bathed every veyne in swich licour, Of which vertu engendred is the flour;
Geoffrey Chaucer
Very good Oxford....
It's not often that we can get a bit of Middle English into the conversation!
On the Ning Nang Nong Where the Cows go Bong! and the monkeys all say BOO! There's a Nong Nang Ning Where the trees go Ping! And the tea pots jibber jabber joo. On the Nong Ning Nang All the mice go Clang And you just can't catch 'em when they do! So its Ning Nang Nong Cows go Bong! Nong Nang Ning Trees go ping Nong Ning Nang The mice go Clang What a noisy place to belong is the Ning Nang Ning Nang Nong!!
@Big_G Wales I wish May's Govt would push the badger cull into the long grass; but aside from that (and fracking)....you lass May is the only game in town.....She is still going to be here in 2022, though sadly many tens of thousands of badgers who will be slaughtered before then for no discernible benefit will not......
All my family love animals and the badger cull is dreadful. However, after these last few days you despair at the childish and pathetic antics of the 5 -10 extreme Brexiteers but at least there is one grown up around, TM
Personally, I think a bottle of red and a one way ticket to Dignitas would be more preferable than having to face Mark Wahlberg's schedule for more than one day....
I don't believe a word of it. It is just out there to make him look super human or something.
No-one needs to do that to stay in shape. And it doesn't seem to make sense in terms of time allocation: 30 minutes of daily golf. But 90 minutes for his morning shower. That is just bizarre.
I am not sure who he is trying to impress with this.
Mark Wahlberg has a net worth of $225 million, he can organise his daily schedule as he wants
So they have put it back to April as they know they have no chance before Brexit
Never has so little been delivered by so few......
At least the OED has a new definition for a damp squib. What a pathetic bunch of third-rate charlatans and has-beens they have turned out to be.
Patel: sacked. Redwood: still thinks it is 1990s and he is standing next to Tony Marlowe. Loughton: last seen trotting down Whitehall shouting 'What do we want, Leadsome' Patterson: has it in for badgers, but otherwise has not troubled the history books IDS: sacked as leader, creator of Universal Credit (a policy depth-charge that has yet to fully explode) Bernard Jenkins: wasn't his Dad important once? Gove: ex-member.
I could go on. But I would have to stop well before the 80 they claim and massively below the 159 they need to actually get rid of May.
Politics is the art of the possible. If you don’t have the numbers you don’t make a move. You don’t even make a peep, least of all waste gunpowder.
Strange thing. Sense the EU happy it remains her, rather than someone else. Sense the Labour leadership happy if Tories don’t make the change to someone else. Sense Tories look at what options are, and happy to stick, at least avoid a contest.
Except, if Javid was certain to win the contest, rather than a Mogg or a Boris... but they couldn’t be certain, it would be roll of dice.
According to OGH the Brexit fudge she now looks certain to achieve*, with EU and through Parliament in coming months will be her finest hour! A great achievement in the history of priministerial achievements. I have suspicion history books will be less kind, for the reason everyone just wants this thing to end now, but a fudge would just be another beginning.
However, I frowned when listening to Juncker earlier, something didn’t sound right. Almost like, if there’s pain ahead was he already manipulating blame game.
Personally, I think a bottle of red and a one way ticket to Dignitas would be more preferable than having to face Mark Wahlberg's schedule for more than one day....
I don't believe a word of it. It is just out there to make him look super human or something.
No-one needs to do that to stay in shape. And it doesn't seem to make sense in terms of time allocation: 30 minutes of daily golf. But 90 minutes for his morning shower. That is just bizarre.
I am not sure who he is trying to impress with this.
Mark Wahlberg has a net worth of $225 million, he can organise his daily schedule as he wants
I am sure he can. It just seems an attempt to appear impressive - but comes over more obsessive.
A couple of questions some of you Con members may know the answer to:
1. Does Theresa know how many letters there currently are lodged with the 1922 committee? 2. Does Graham Brady make sure MPs who wrote letters, say, 6 months or more earlier, still want a confidence vote?
I don't think anyone has answered this. The answers are:
1. No
2. Almost certainly yes, although there is no rule laid down on this.
I actually subscribe and read TIME - which, to be honest, isn't really a thing to brag about. But most of those names on that list are pretty shopworn. You have to think conventional but conventional with a slight twist. So.... Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez, maybe. She's photogenic and safe and will probably still be in the news come December.
So they have put it back to April as they know they have no chance before Brexit
Never has so little been delivered by so few......
At least the OED has a new definition for a damp squib. What a pathetic bunch of third-rate charlatans and has-beens they have turned out to be.
Patel: sacked. Redwood: still thinks it is 1990s and he is standing next to Tony Marlowe. Loughton: last seen trotting down Whitehall shouting 'What do we want, Leadsome' Patterson: has it in for badgers, but otherwise has not troubled the history books IDS: sacked as leader, creator of Universal Credit (a policy depth-charge that has yet to fully explode) Bernard Jenkins: wasn't his Dad important once? Gove: ex-member.
I could go on. But I would have to stop well before the 80 they claim and massively below the 159 they need to actually get rid of May.
Politics is the art of the possible. If you don’t have the numbers you don’t make a move. You don’t even make a peep, least of all waste gunpowder.
Strange thing. Sense the EU happy it remains her, rather than someone else. Sense the Labour leadership happy if Tories don’t make the change to someone else. Sense Tories look at what options are, and happy to stick, at least avoid a contest.
Except, if Javid was certain to win the contest, rather than a Mogg or a Boris... but they couldn’t be certain, it would be roll of dice.
According to OGH the Brexit fudge she now looks certain to achieve*, with EU and through Parliament in coming months will be her finest hour! A great achievement in the history of priministerial achievements. I have suspicion history books will be less kind, for the reason everyone just wants this thing to end now, but a fudge would just be another beginning.
However, I frowned when listening to Juncker earlier, something didn’t sound right. Almost like, if there’s pain ahead was he already manipulating blame game.
Juncker basically said you can either be in the single market and the Union or outside, there was no halfway house.
Outside the best we can get is a FTA like Canada as Barnier has affirmed but with a border in the Irish Sea which the DUP will not concede so likely May agrees to stay in the single market and customs union in all but name with a work permit and study place on arrival requirement
"April come she will When streams are ripe and swelled with rain May, she will stay"
Paul Simon
Whan that Aprille with his shoures soote The droghte of Marche hath perced to the roote, And bathed every veyne in swich licour, Of which vertu engendred is the flour;
Geoffrey Chaucer
Very good Oxford....
I've never understood the drought of March bit. March is pretty wet in my part of the Midlands.
If the Opposition are not prepared to field a spokesperson, then the Beeb should say so and move on rather than send a car around to Owen's house yet again.
A couple of questions some of you Con members may know the answer to:
1. Does Theresa know how many letters there currently are lodged with the 1922 committee? 2. Does Graham Brady make sure MPs who wrote letters, say, 6 months or more earlier, still want a confidence vote?
I don't think anyone has answered this. The answers are:
1. No
2. Almost certainly yes, although there is no rule laid down on this.
A better question is do the plotting ringleaders know how many letters?
Cos if they hit 48 then there will be a vote on no confidence which they will lose and she is safe for a year.
The Labour and Tory membership are not going to back either of those, Labour members are only going to back a Corbynite and Tory members will only back an anti Chequers Deal candidate.
So on that basis Tory MPs might keep May for fear of Boris or Mogg and it will be Corbyn v May 2
A better question is do the plotting ringleaders know how many letters?
Cos if they hit 48 then there will be a vote on no confidence which they will lose and she is safe for a year.
I don't think they can know for certain. They will know that a given number of MPs amongst those whom they hope are their supporters have told them they've sent the letters, or not sent letters. They won't know whether they are being told porkies, or whether some rival group of plotters have put in letters, or whether some independent-minded MPs have done so on their own initative.
All in all, great scope for plots, counter-plots, and deception.
If EU don’t give us a deal, we don’t bang them any lolly? But if it’s fudge, only small % the final deal, we still giving them all that money arent we, to maintain pretence it’s the proper deal, just to keep May as PM? For that reason we all end up singing verse and chorus.
A couple of questions some of you Con members may know the answer to:
1. Does Theresa know how many letters there currently are lodged with the 1922 committee? 2. Does Graham Brady make sure MPs who wrote letters, say, 6 months or more earlier, still want a confidence vote?
I don't think anyone has answered this. The answers are:
1. No
2. Almost certainly yes, although there is no rule laid down on this.
It’s all utterly irrelevant anyway. May is going nowhere, and rightly so.
She is a deeply flawed PM but rather less deeply flawed than any alternative.
Hence she survives any Vonc visited upon her by anyone stupid enough to trigger one.
A couple of questions some of you Con members may know the answer to:
1. Does Theresa know how many letters there currently are lodged with the 1922 committee? 2. Does Graham Brady make sure MPs who wrote letters, say, 6 months or more earlier, still want a confidence vote?
I don't think anyone has answered this. The answers are:
1. No
2. Almost certainly yes, although there is no rule laid down on this.
A better question is do the plotting ringleaders know how many letters?
Cos if they hit 48 then there will be a vote on no confidence which they will lose and she is safe for a year.
Presumably Graham Brady has some discretion on how to count. I.e. if the 48th letter arrived, he could ring an MP who'd sent a letter ages ago and check whether they really wanted their letter to be active because we're getting awfully close...
A couple of questions some of you Con members may know the answer to:
1. Does Theresa know how many letters there currently are lodged with the 1922 committee? 2. Does Graham Brady make sure MPs who wrote letters, say, 6 months or more earlier, still want a confidence vote?
I don't think anyone has answered this. The answers are:
1. No
2. Almost certainly yes, although there is no rule laid down on this.
A better question is do the plotting ringleaders know how many letters?
Cos if they hit 48 then there will be a vote on no confidence which they will lose and she is safe for a year.
Presumably Graham Brady has some discretion on how to count. I.e. if the 48th letter arrived, he could ring an MP who'd sent a letter ages ago and check whether they really wanted their letter to be active because we're getting awfully close...
The Labour and Tory membership are not going to back either of those, Labour members are only going to back a Corbynite and Tory members will only back an anti Chequers Deal candidate.
So on that basis Tory MPs might keep May for fear of Boris or Mogg and it will be Corbyn v May 2
It’s all utterly irrelevant anyway. May is going nowhere, and rightly so.
She is a deeply flawed PM but rather less deeply flawed than any alternative.
Hence she survives any Vonc visited upon her by anyone stupid enough to trigger one.
Probably, but things could move very fast when she's finally in play. Very hard to predict what would happen. It's not a static situation - if it comes to the point where Brady announces Bingo!, then there will be massive jostling for advantage amongst the various contenders.
The Labour and Tory membership are not going to back either of those, Labour members are only going to back a Corbynite and Tory members will only back an anti Chequers Deal candidate.
So on that basis Tory MPs might keep May for fear of Boris or Mogg and it will be Corbyn v May 2
You may well be right!
The only way I see her falling is if two camps, say ERG/Mogg/Bozza and another camp (say Javid) (mis) calculate that this is their time and both act at once.
So they have put it back to April as they know they have no chance before Brexit
How happy is the blameless vestal's lot! The world forgetting, by the world forgot. Eternal sunshine of the spotless mind! Each pray'r accepted, and each wish resign'd;
So they have put it back to April as they know they have no chance before Brexit
Never has so little been delivered by so few......
At least the OED has a new definition for a damp squib. What a pathetic bunch of third-rate charlatans and has-beens
Politics is the art of the possible. If you don’t have the numbers you don’t make a move. You don’t even make a peep, least of all waste gunpowder.
Strange thing. Sense the EU happy it remains her, rather than someone else. Sense the Labour leadership happy if Tories don’t make the change to someone else. Sense Tories look at what options are, and happy to stick, at least avoid a contest.
Except, if Javid was certain to win the contest, rather than a Mogg or a Boris... but they couldn’t be certain, it would be roll of dice.
According to OGH the Brexit fudge she now looks certain to achieve*, with EU and through Parliament in coming months will be her finest hour! A great achievement in the history of priministerial achievements. I have suspicion history books will be less kind, for the reason everyone just wants this thing to end now, but a fudge would just be another beginning.
However, I frowned when listening to Juncker earlier, something didn’t sound right. Almost like, if there’s pain ahead was he already manipulating blame game.
Juncker basically said you can either be in the single market and the Union or outside, there was no halfway house.
Outside the best we can get is a FTA like Canada as Barnier has affirmed but with a border in the Irish Sea which the DUP will not concede so likely May agrees to stay in the single market and customs union in all but name with a work permit and study place on arrival requirement
I not saying you are wrong. Fair play to you for keeping us educated with some thoughtful opinions on this molten situation.
However. It may have already occurred to the EU they can get a much better deal for themselves the other side of a British General election. Their strategy right now, no serious attempt at final deal until then, any blame for any pain pinned squarely on the Brits. Bear this in mind next time any of them say anything to spot signs of it.
A couple of questions some of you Con members may know the answer to:
1. Does Theresa know how many letters there currently are lodged with the 1922 committee? 2. Does Graham Brady make sure MPs who wrote letters, say, 6 months or more earlier, still want a confidence vote?
I don't think anyone has answered this. The answers are:
1. No
2. Almost certainly yes, although there is no rule laid down on this.
A better question is do the plotting ringleaders know how many letters?
Cos if they hit 48 then there will be a vote on no confidence which they will lose and she is safe for a year.
Presumably Graham Brady has some discretion on how to count. I.e. if the 48th letter arrived, he could ring an MP who'd sent a letter ages ago and check whether they really wanted their letter to be active because we're getting awfully close...
The entire concept of letters seems to me to be vaguely anachronistic. Hasn’t some young gun at ERG HQ devised a simple app to keep track?
So they have put it back to April as they know they have no chance before Brexit
Never has so little been delivered by so few......
At least the OED has a new definition for a damp squib. What a pathetic bunch of third-rate charlatans and has-beens they have turned out to be.
Patel: sacked. Redwood: still thinks it is 1990s and he is standing next to Tony Marlowe. Loughton: last seen trotting down Whitehall shouting 'What do we want, Leadsome' Patterson: has it in for badgers, but otherwise has not troubled the history books IDS: sacked as leader, creator of Universal Credit (a policy depth-charge that has yet to fully explode) Bernard Jenkins: wasn't his Dad important once? Gove: ex-member.
I could go on. But I would have to stop well before the 80 they claim and massively below the 159 they need to actually get rid of May.
“Bernard Jenkins: wasn't his Dad important once?”
Alumnus of Richard Curtis. Sense it wasn’t love, actually, hence Bernard pops up satirically in everything.
A couple of questions some of you Con members may know the answer to:
1. Does Theresa know how many letters there currently are lodged with the 1922 committee? 2. Does Graham Brady make sure MPs who wrote letters, say, 6 months or more earlier, still want a confidence vote?
I don't think anyone has answered this. The answers are:
1. No
2. Almost certainly yes, although there is no rule laid down on this.
A better question is do the plotting ringleaders know how many letters?
Cos if they hit 48 then there will be a vote on no confidence which they will lose and she is safe for a year.
Presumably Graham Brady has some discretion on how to count. I.e. if the 48th letter arrived, he could ring an MP who'd sent a letter ages ago and check whether they really wanted their letter to be active because we're getting awfully close...
The entire concept of letters seems to me to be vaguely anachronistic. Hasn’t some young gun at ERG HQ devised a simple app to keep track?
A couple of questions some of you Con members may know the answer to:
1. Does Theresa know how many letters there currently are lodged with the 1922 committee? 2. Does Graham Brady make sure MPs who wrote letters, say, 6 months or more earlier, still want a confidence vote?
I don't think anyone has answered this. The answers are:
1. No
2. Almost certainly yes, although there is no rule laid down on this.
A better question is do the plotting ringleaders know how many letters?
Cos if they hit 48 then there will be a vote on no confidence which they will lose and she is safe for a year.
Presumably Graham Brady has some discretion on how to count. I.e. if the 48th letter arrived, he could ring an MP who'd sent a letter ages ago and check whether they really wanted their letter to be active because we're getting awfully close...
Where does he keep these letters, must MPs submit them face to face or can they post or email them, is there an electronic record of their existence (say a scanned pdf) and does he provide a receipt to MPs who have submitted one?
S&D looking pretty strong there and very much in the game for Juncker's job.
But presumably a decent chunk of the Lab-S&D number is UK Labour, which creates some interesting incentives for everybody if you try to extend the Brexit deadline...
So they have put it back to April as they know they have no chance before Brexit
Never has so little been delivered by so few......
At least the OED has a new definition for a damp squib. What a pathetic bunch of third-rate charlatans and has-beens
Politics is the art of the possible. If you don’t have the numbers you don’t make a move. You don’t even make a peep, least of all waste gunpowder.
Strange thing. Sense the EU happy it remains her, rather than someone else. Sense the Labour leadership happy if Tories don’t make the change to someone else. Sense Tories look at what options are, and happy to stick, at least avoid a contest.
Except, if Javid was certain to win the contest, rather than a Mogg or a Boris... but they couldn’t be certain, it would be roll of dice.
According to OGH the Brexit fudge she now looks certain to achieve*, with EU and through Parliament in coming months will be her finest hour! A great achievement in the history of priministerial achievements. I have suspicion history books will be less kind, for the reason everyone just wants this thing to end now, but a fudge would just be another beginning.
However, I frowned when listening to Juncker earlier, something didn’t sound right. Almost like, if there’s pain ahead was he already manipulating blame game.
Juncker basically said you can either be in the single market and the Union or outside, there was no halfway house.
Outside the best we can get is a FTA like Canada as Barnier has affirmed but with a border in the Irish Sea which the DUP will not concede so likely May agrees to stay in the single market and customs union in all but name with a work permit and study place on arrival requirement
I not saying you are wrong. Fair play to you for keeping us educated with some thoughtful opinions on this molten situation.
However. It may have already occurred to the EU they can get a much better deal for themselves the other side of a British General election. Their strategy right now, no serious attempt at final deal until then, any blame for any pain pinned squarely on the Brits. Bear this in mind next time any of them say anything to spot signs of it.
Despite the bluster a Corbyn offer to the EU would be almost exactly the same as May is heading for
Maybe but the point is even if he did become PM after a general election you could barely put a cigarette paper between his Brexit position and May's, they are now closer to each other on Brexit than to Umunna or Mogg
...presumably a decent chunk of the Lab-S&D number is UK Labour...
All of it is. The "LAB" in "LAB-S&D" is the UK Labour party, the "S&D" is the European political party/group[1] to which Labour is affiliated. If you look at @EuropeElects, they do this for every poll these days.
[1] I'm fed up of explaining the difference between a political party at the European level (aka a "Europarty") and a political group of the European Parliament, so I elide the two here. Apols but it's late and I'm a bit grumpy.
In fairness to the mainstream media I don't think the death threats against Corbyn mentioned trains, If PBs taught me anything it is that some people really like trains, so probably because of that rather than political bias.
In fairness to the mainstream media I don't think the death threats against Corbyn mentioned trains, If PBs taught me anything it is that some people really like trains, so probably because of that rather than political bias.
One was the act of twats on twitter, the other by MPs and their staff. Can’t you see the difference?
Hmm perhaps we're right to be leaving the EU with that stupid article 13 law they passed today. What a shitshow, only UKIP voting against the nonsense.
I appreciate there are many strong arguments for staying in the EU, but a weak one that many people trot out is the way it restrains the evil political tribe X whenever X wins a general election, because ultimately the EU will prevent them from doing Y. For example there are pro-EU lefties who like the way Tories are restrained by EU laws on workers' right and the environment, but on the flip side there are pro-EU righties who like how Labour would hit difficulties instituting a socialist programme of government. There were (presumably still are, but they're quieter these days) pro-EU righties who wanted us to join the euro because the strict fiscal limits would prevent any future Labour government from turning the spending taps on to full-blast.
I find it a weak argument for several reasons, not least that it doesn't seem very democratic to want the UK electorate's wishes to be hobbled if they are stupid enough to dare voting in the lot you dislike. But the biggest flaw, it seems to me, is that it relies upon the EU being somehow more reliable than the electorate. If the EU takes a turn in a direction you dislike, there is precious little you can do about it. Even if your cause is sufficiently convincing that the majority of the electorate agree with you.
In fairness to the mainstream media I don't think the death threats against Corbyn mentioned trains, If PBs taught me anything it is that some people really like trains, so probably because of that rather than political bias.
One was the act of twats on twitter, the other by MPs and their staff. Can’t you see the difference?
Considering a good portion of the mainstream media outrage regarding Corbyn has been about twats on twitter I don't think that is really a good excuse for them.
In fairness to the mainstream media I don't think the death threats against Corbyn mentioned trains, If PBs taught me anything it is that some people really like trains, so probably because of that rather than political bias.
One was the act of twats on twitter, the other by MPs and their staff. Can’t you see the difference?
Considering a good portion of the mainstream media outrage regarding Corbyn has been about twats on twitter I don't think that is really a good excuse for them.
The quote was specifically about MPs and their staff bullying other MPs though. I think that's a fair deal more problematic from some idiots on twitter.
In fairness to the mainstream media I don't think the death threats against Corbyn mentioned trains, If PBs taught me anything it is that some people really like trains, so probably because of that rather than political bias.
One was the act of twats on twitter, the other by MPs and their staff. Can’t you see the difference?
Considering a good portion of the mainstream media outrage regarding Corbyn has been about twats on twitter I don't think that is really a good excuse for them.
The quote was specifically about MPs and their staff bullying other MPs though. I think that's a fair deal more problematic from some idiots on twitter.
You may think that but the media (who the tweet was about) have been very concerned about idiots on twitter, well some of them anyway. It is the mainstream media that were getting accused rather than you personally.
In fairness to the mainstream media I don't think the death threats against Corbyn mentioned trains, If PBs taught me anything it is that some people really like trains, so probably because of that rather than political bias.
One was the act of twats on twitter, the other by MPs and their staff. Can’t you see the difference?
Considering a good portion of the mainstream media outrage regarding Corbyn has been about twats on twitter I don't think that is really a good excuse for them.
The quote was specifically about MPs and their staff bullying other MPs though. I think that's a fair deal more problematic from some idiots on twitter.
You may think that but the media (who the tweet was about) have been very concerned about idiots on twitter, well some of them anyway. It is the mainstream media that were getting accused rather than you personally.
They have also been concerned about MPs and their staff bullying other MPs. Which you seem totally sanguine about.
In fairness to the mainstream media I don't think the death threats against Corbyn mentioned trains, If PBs taught me anything it is that some people really like trains, so probably because of that rather than political bias.
One was the act of twats on twitter, the other by MPs and their staff. Can’t you see the difference?
Considering a good portion of the mainstream media outrage regarding Corbyn has been about twats on twitter I don't think that is really a good excuse for them.
The quote was specifically about MPs and their staff bullying other MPs though. I think that's a fair deal more problematic from some idiots on twitter.
You may think that but the media (who the tweet was about) have been very concerned about idiots on twitter, well some of them anyway. It is the mainstream media that were getting accused rather than you personally.
They have also been concerned about MPs and their staff bullying other MPs. Which you seem totally sanguine about.
They have also been very concerned about people on twitter, although only when Corbyn can be seen to be blamed, when Corbyn is the target, silence. A train on the other hand....
I thought it was all pretty self explanatory. A tweet pointing out the hypocrisy of the media probably isn't secret code for something else.
...presumably a decent chunk of the Lab-S&D number is UK Labour...
All of it is. The "LAB" in "LAB-S&D" is the UK Labour party, the "S&D" is the European political party/group[1] to which Labour is affiliated. If you look at @EuropeElects, they do this for every poll these days.
[1] I'm fed up of explaining the difference between a political party at the European level (aka a "Europarty") and a political group of the European Parliament, so I elide the two here. Apols but it's late and I'm a bit grumpy.
Sorry, of course, I somehow parsed it as a pan-EU poll but obviously ECR isn't on 42% and where did the EPP go...
In fairness to the mainstream media I don't think the death threats against Corbyn mentioned trains, If PBs taught me anything it is that some people really like trains, so probably because of that rather than political bias.
One was the act of twats on twitter, the other by MPs and their staff. Can’t you see the difference?
Considering a good portion of the mainstream media outrage regarding Corbyn has been about twats on twitter I don't think that is really a good excuse for them.
The quote was specifically about MPs and their staff bullying other MPs though. I think that's a fair deal more problematic from some idiots on twitter.
You may think that but the media (who the tweet was about) have been very concerned about idiots on twitter, well some of them anyway. It is the mainstream media that were getting accused rather than you personally.
They have also been concerned about MPs and their staff bullying other MPs. Which you seem totally sanguine about.
They have also been very concerned about people on twitter, although only when Corbyn can be seen to be blamed, when Corbyn is the target, silence. A train on the other hand....
I thought it was all pretty self explanatory. A tweet pointing out the hypocrisy of the media probably isn't secret code for something else.
...presumably a decent chunk of the Lab-S&D number is UK Labour...
All of it is. The "LAB" in "LAB-S&D" is the UK Labour party, the "S&D" is the European political party/group[1] to which Labour is affiliated. If you look at @EuropeElects, they do this for every poll these days.
[1] I'm fed up of explaining the difference between a political party at the European level (aka a "Europarty") and a political group of the European Parliament, so I elide the two here. Apols but it's late and I'm a bit grumpy.
In fairness to the mainstream media I don't think the death threats against Corbyn mentioned trains, If PBs taught me anything it is that some people really like trains, so probably because of that rather than political bias.
One was the act of twats on twitter, the other by MPs and their staff. Can’t you see the difference?
Considering a good portion of the mainstream media outrage regarding Corbyn has been about twats on twitter I don't think that is really a good excuse for them.
The quote was specifically about MPs and their staff bullying other MPs though. I think that's a fair deal more problematic from some idiots on twitter.
You may think that but the media (who the tweet was about) have been very concerned about idiots on twitter, well some of them anyway. It is the mainstream media that were getting accused rather than you personally.
They have also been concerned about MPs and their staff bullying other MPs. Which you seem totally sanguine about.
They have also been very concerned about people on twitter, although only when Corbyn can be seen to be blamed, when Corbyn is the target, silence. A train on the other hand....
I thought it was all pretty self explanatory. A tweet pointing out the hypocrisy of the media probably isn't secret code for something else.
Just a train? Funny how you dismiss it so easily.
Ahh right we've abandoned the original talking point and now it is about what I have said... given you dismissed the death threats and the petition to get rid of Corbyn in the conversation first I'm not sure you have much of a leg to stand on here.
In fairness to the mainstream media I don't think the death threats against Corbyn mentioned trains, If PBs taught me anything it is that some people really like trains, so probably because of that rather than political bias.
One was the act of twats on twitter, the other by MPs and their staff. Can’t you see the difference?
Considering a good portion of the mainstream media outrage regarding Corbyn has been about twats on twitter I don't think that is really a good excuse for them.
The quote was specifically about MPs and their staff bullying other MPs though. I think that's a fair deal more problematic from some idiots on twitter.
You may think that but the media (who the tweet was about) have been very concerned about idiots on twitter, well some of them anyway. It is the mainstream media that were getting accused rather than you personally.
They have also been concerned about MPs and their staff bullying other MPs. Which you seem totally sanguine about.
They have also been very concerned about people on twitter, although only when Corbyn can be seen to be blamed, when Corbyn is the target, silence. A train on the other hand....
I thought it was all pretty self explanatory. A tweet pointing out the hypocrisy of the media probably isn't secret code for something else.
Just a train? Funny how you dismiss it so easily.
Ahh right we've abandoned the original talking point and now it is about what I have said... given you dismissed the death threats and the petition to get rid of Corbyn in the conversation first I'm not sure you have much of a leg to stand on here.
Why is it only Corbyn (or earlier, Diane Abbott) getting abuse that so concerns you, especially as the latest research shows that Conservative and male MPs get the worst abuse? Much of that abuse is not publicised either.
Any abuse is bad. Trying to make out that Corbyn is somehow 'special' in the abuse he gets is a little odd given leftist idiots just physically campaigned around JRM's house in front of his kids.
But that's the thing about cults: it's good to point out the unacknowledged suffering the 'others' are causing yo your sainted leaders. Even whilst the acolytes carry out worse abuse against the 'other' ...
They have also been concerned about MPs and their staff bullying other MPs. Which you seem totally sanguine about.
They have also been very concerned about people on twitter, although only when Corbyn can be seen to be blamed, when Corbyn is the target, silence. A train on the other hand....
I thought it was all pretty self explanatory. A tweet pointing out the hypocrisy of the media probably isn't secret code for something else.
Just a train? Funny how you dismiss it so easily.
Ahh right we've abandoned the original talking point and now it is about what I have said... given you dismissed the death threats and the petition to get rid of Corbyn in the conversation first I'm not sure you have much of a leg to stand on here.
Why is it only Corbyn (or earlier, Diane Abbott) getting abuse that so concerns you, especially as the latest research shows that Conservative and male MPs get the worst abuse? Much of that abuse is not publicised either.
Any abuse is bad. Trying to make out that Corbyn is somehow 'special' in the abuse he gets is a little odd given leftist idiots just physically campaigned around JRM's house in front of his kids.
But that's the thing about cults: it's good to point out the unacknowledged suffering the 'others' are causing yo your sainted leaders. Even whilst the acolytes carry out worse abuse against the 'other' ...
The basic message I'm getting here is abuse is bad you leftist cultist idiot....
I'm not sure if you are doing some intentional parody or if it comes naturally.
These people don't even like Corbyn, I'm not sure the JRM protesters can be blamed on Corbyn anymore than Jo Cox's killer can be blamed on the Conservatives.
The whole point of the original tweet was all abuse is bad and the media should be more equal in calling it out, the reason it has got people like you upset is because it pointed out the hypocrisy in the media's response and included abuse against Corbyn. This bit is also hypocritical, you rage about how all abuse is bad yet this forum is filled with with people criticising the left for abuse but you don't call those out. One of the few voices pointing out the abuse the other way is the one you get angry about. If you did it both ways you might have a point, as it is your far worse than some of the most partisan tories on here.
Why is it only Corbyn (or earlier, Diane Abbott) getting abuse that so concerns you, especially as the latest research shows that Conservative and male MPs get the worst abuse? Much of that abuse is not publicised either.
Any abuse is bad. Trying to make out that Corbyn is somehow 'special' in the abuse he gets is a little odd given leftist idiots just physically campaigned around JRM's house in front of his kids.
But that's the thing about cults: it's good to point out the unacknowledged suffering the 'others' are causing yo your sainted leaders. Even whilst the acolytes carry out worse abuse against the 'other' ...
The basic message I'm getting here is abuse is bad you leftist cultist idiot....
I'm not sure if you are doing some intentional parody or if it comes naturally.
These people don't even like Corbyn, I'm not sure the JRM protesters can be blamed on Corbyn anymore than Jo Cox's killer can be blamed on the Conservatives.
The whole point of the original tweet was all abuse is bad and the media should be more equal in calling it out, the reason it has got people like you upset is because it pointed out the hypocrisy in the media's response and included abuse against Corbyn. This bit is also hypocritical, you rage about how all abuse is bad yet this forum is filled with with people criticising the left for abuse but you don't call those out. One of the few voices pointing out the abuse the other way is the one you get angry about. If you did it both ways you might have a point, as it is your far worse than some of the most partisan tories on here.
"The basic message I'm getting here is abuse is bad you leftist cultist idiot...."
That is the message you want to read. I might suggest you re-read and engage your brain.
And the original tweet was not about 'all abuse is bad' - it was about how abuse against Corbyn is somehow different. If it had been about 'all abuse is bad', it may have picked up times when death threats against (say) Conservative MPs or moderate Labour MPs had been publicised in comparison. Instead, it was just an attempt to downplay the abuse Ryan gets. "SEE! CORBYN GETS IT WORSE!!!" This is despite the two being very different in nature.
Why should I 'call out' people criticising the left for abuse? Abuse is bad. And yes, that applies in all directions. I*'m calling you out because you are being patently ridiculous.
You are calling me out because you are a hypocrite, start calling out the many people on the right that do it or continue being a hypocrite, I really don't care it does invalidate your point though.
Also the original tweet was about the mainstream media silence of abuse against Corbyn, he was asking for it to be treated the same. Given the rage you go off on when I bring it up I can't imagine how upset you would get if the media did that so I can understand you have strong feelings of disagreement with his tweet. Anyway I must be off so I'll leave you to continue the hypocrisy and abuse whilst condemning abuse, its a good act.
You are calling me out because you are a hypocrite, start calling out the many people on the right that do it or continue being a hypocrite, I really don't care it does invalidate your point though.
Also the original tweet was about the mainstream media silence of abuse against Corbyn, he was asking for it to be treated the same. Given the rage you go off on when I bring it up I can't imagine how upset you would get if the media did that so I can understand you have strong feelings of disagreement with his tweet. Anyway I must be off so I'll leave you to continue the hypocrisy and abuse whilst condemning abuse, its a good act.
No, just no. I am not being hypocritical.
And I'm not in a 'rage'. It's too early in the morning for anger. I am bemused, though, that whenever you get on a sticky wicket you go off on that sort of tangent.
To make it clear: tweeted abuses is wrong. However abuse that actually has physical access to someone's office, and I believe in Crown Estate, is much more serious. It implies: "We can get you."
That is why the latter is seen much more seriously, and is one of the reasons why it will have been featured more on the media.
Comments
https://www.ft.com/content/0fdd6370-b699-11e8-bbc3-ccd7de085ffe
Good night.
Personally, I think a bottle of red and a one way ticket to Dignitas would be more preferable than having to face Mark Wahlberg's schedule for more than one day....
No-one needs to do that to stay in shape. And it doesn't seem to make sense in terms of time allocation: 30 minutes of daily golf. But 90 minutes for his morning shower. That is just bizarre.
I am not sure who he is trying to impress with this.
I'm probably well wide of the mark, but this seems like something Anna Soubry would say. I apologise if I'm wrong.
April will be an astonishingly interesting month in politics though. It'll be the great re-positioning. The debate about an agenda of reform of our out-of-the-EU position will commence. The stupid will be lost-at-sea. I have some suspicions as to who might be so affected, but I think it'l be a very short list. The now apparently stupid aren't actually as stupid as they make out.
Patel: sacked.
Redwood: still thinks it is 1990s and he is standing next to Tony Marlowe.
Loughton: last seen trotting down Whitehall shouting 'What do we want, Leadsome'
Patterson: has it in for badgers, but otherwise has not troubled the history books
IDS: sacked as leader, creator of Universal Credit (a policy depth-charge that has yet to fully explode)
Bernard Jenkins: wasn't his Dad important once?
Gove: ex-member.
I could go on. But I would have to stop well before the 80 they claim and massively below the 159 they need to actually get rid of May.
So on that basis Tory MPs might keep May for fear of Boris or Mogg and it will be Corbyn v May 2
When streams are ripe and swelled with rain
May, she will stay"
Paul Simon
The droghte of Marche hath perced to the roote,
And bathed every veyne in swich licour,
Of which vertu engendred is the flour;
Geoffrey Chaucer
I wish May's Govt would push the badger cull into the long grass; but aside from that (and fracking)....you lass May is the only game in town.....She is still going to be here in 2022, though sadly many tens of thousands of badgers who will be slaughtered before then for no discernible benefit will not......
Lilacs out of dead land mixing
Memory and desire stirring
Dull roots with Spring rain.
TS Eliot Waste Land.
Where the Cows go Bong!
and the monkeys all say BOO!
There's a Nong Nang Ning
Where the trees go Ping!
And the tea pots jibber jabber joo.
On the Nong Ning Nang
All the mice go Clang
And you just can't catch 'em when they do!
So its Ning Nang Nong
Cows go Bong!
Nong Nang Ning
Trees go ping
Nong Ning Nang
The mice go Clang
What a noisy place to belong
is the Ning Nang Ning Nang Nong!!
Spike Milligan
Strange thing. Sense the EU happy it remains her, rather than someone else. Sense the Labour leadership happy if Tories don’t make the change to someone else. Sense Tories look at what options are, and happy to stick, at least avoid a contest.
Except, if Javid was certain to win the contest, rather than a Mogg or a Boris... but they couldn’t be certain, it would be roll of dice.
According to OGH the Brexit fudge she now looks certain to achieve*, with EU and through Parliament in coming months will be her finest hour! A great achievement in the history of priministerial achievements. I have suspicion history books will be less kind, for the reason everyone just wants this thing to end now, but a fudge would just be another beginning.
However, I frowned when listening to Juncker earlier, something didn’t sound right. Almost like, if there’s pain ahead was he already manipulating blame game.
May I wish everyone a peaceful nights rest - one of these days we will wake up and it will be post Brexit
Good night folks
1. No
2. Almost certainly yes, although there is no rule laid down on this.
I would love our media to just focus on reporting actual news and just given opinions a rest.
Oh for the days before 24 hour news cycles. Life was so much simpler.
Outside the best we can get is a FTA like Canada as Barnier has affirmed but with a border in the Irish Sea which the DUP will not concede so likely May agrees to stay in the single market and customs union in all but name with a work permit and study place on arrival requirement
Cos if they hit 48 then there will be a vote on no confidence which they will lose and she is safe for a year.
All in all, great scope for plots, counter-plots, and deception.
(Verse)
May is shit
May is shit
May is shit
(Chorus)
May is shit
May is shit
May is shi-it
Cult of Corbin, waiting at the gates
If EU don’t give us a deal, we don’t bang them any lolly?
But if it’s fudge, only small % the final deal, we still giving them all that money arent we, to maintain pretence it’s the proper deal, just to keep May as PM?
For that reason we all end up singing verse and chorus.
She is a deeply flawed PM but rather less deeply flawed than any alternative.
Hence she survives any Vonc visited upon her by anyone stupid enough to trigger one.
Presumably this is an attack on those people within Labour who have actually like won an election within living memory.
The world forgetting, by the world forgot.
Eternal sunshine of the spotless mind!
Each pray'r accepted, and each wish resign'd;
However. It may have already occurred to the EU they can get a much better deal for themselves the other side of a British General election. Their strategy right now, no serious attempt at final deal until then, any blame for any pain pinned squarely on the Brits. Bear this in mind next time any of them say anything to spot signs of it.
A literal communist, flies to NY, to eat cheese and bagels in probably the most capitalist few square miles on earth.
I presume by aeroflot.
Alumnus of Richard Curtis. Sense it wasn’t love, actually, hence Bernard pops up satirically in everything.
https://twitter.com/paulmasonnews/status/1039994299167985665
But presumably a decent chunk of the Lab-S&D number is UK Labour, which creates some interesting incentives for everybody if you try to extend the Brexit deadline...
Do you support or oppose the Brexit approach of:
Theresa May: 25 support, 51 oppose
Jeremy Corbyn: 13 support, 51 oppose
[1] I'm fed up of explaining the difference between a political party at the European level (aka a "Europarty") and a political group of the European Parliament, so I elide the two here. Apols but it's late and I'm a bit grumpy.
In fairness to the mainstream media I don't think the death threats against Corbyn mentioned trains, If PBs taught me anything it is that some people really like trains, so probably because of that rather than political bias.
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2018/09/12/nelson-mandela-declined-meet-jeremy-corbyns-anti-apartheid-movement/
I find it a weak argument for several reasons, not least that it doesn't seem very democratic to want the UK electorate's wishes to be hobbled if they are stupid enough to dare voting in the lot you dislike. But the biggest flaw, it seems to me, is that it relies upon the EU being somehow more reliable than the electorate. If the EU takes a turn in a direction you dislike, there is precious little you can do about it. Even if your cause is sufficiently convincing that the majority of the electorate agree with you.
I thought it was all pretty self explanatory. A tweet pointing out the hypocrisy of the media probably isn't secret code for something else.
https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2018/10/poland-polarization/568324/
Any abuse is bad. Trying to make out that Corbyn is somehow 'special' in the abuse he gets is a little odd given leftist idiots just physically campaigned around JRM's house in front of his kids.
But that's the thing about cults: it's good to point out the unacknowledged suffering the 'others' are causing yo your sainted leaders. Even whilst the acolytes carry out worse abuse against the 'other' ...
I'm not sure if you are doing some intentional parody or if it comes naturally.
These people don't even like Corbyn, I'm not sure the JRM protesters can be blamed on Corbyn anymore than Jo Cox's killer can be blamed on the Conservatives.
The whole point of the original tweet was all abuse is bad and the media should be more equal in calling it out, the reason it has got people like you upset is because it pointed out the hypocrisy in the media's response and included abuse against Corbyn. This bit is also hypocritical, you rage about how all abuse is bad yet this forum is filled with with people criticising the left for abuse but you don't call those out. One of the few voices pointing out the abuse the other way is the one you get angry about. If you did it both ways you might have a point, as it is your far worse than some of the most partisan tories on here.
That is the message you want to read. I might suggest you re-read and engage your brain.
And the original tweet was not about 'all abuse is bad' - it was about how abuse against Corbyn is somehow different. If it had been about 'all abuse is bad', it may have picked up times when death threats against (say) Conservative MPs or moderate Labour MPs had been publicised in comparison. Instead, it was just an attempt to downplay the abuse Ryan gets. "SEE! CORBYN GETS IT WORSE!!!" This is despite the two being very different in nature.
Why should I 'call out' people criticising the left for abuse? Abuse is bad. And yes, that applies in all directions. I*'m calling you out because you are being patently ridiculous.
Oh, and I am not 'raging'. Far from. Try harder.
Also the original tweet was about the mainstream media silence of abuse against Corbyn, he was asking for it to be treated the same. Given the rage you go off on when I bring it up I can't imagine how upset you would get if the media did that so I can understand you have strong feelings of disagreement with his tweet. Anyway I must be off so I'll leave you to continue the hypocrisy and abuse whilst condemning abuse, its a good act.
And I'm not in a 'rage'. It's too early in the morning for anger. I am bemused, though, that whenever you get on a sticky wicket you go off on that sort of tangent.
To make it clear: tweeted abuses is wrong. However abuse that actually has physical access to someone's office, and I believe in Crown Estate, is much more serious. It implies: "We can get you."
That is why the latter is seen much more seriously, and is one of the reasons why it will have been featured more on the media.
Compare apples with apples.