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Comments
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Yes, the remainers in 10 and 11 have been grossly negligent, haven't they.Scott_P said:0 -
The allegation is that the NGO;s are in contact with the smugglers via mobile phone. The people smugglers phone the NGO with the position of the migrants. The NGO ships are tracked by AIS and the Italian authorities noted they always seem to sail in a direct line to the pick up point, no searching required. If this is going on then they are just another link in the people smuggling network.Philip_Thompson said:
What crime have the charity workers committed?MaxPB said:
Indeed. The action necessary is simple (but tough to follow through on). Arrest the charity workers, seize the boats, load up the migrants and dump them back on the coast of Libya and pay the Libyans off. Have a massive PR campaign across Africa that this is the end result and all that will happen is they will be $5000 worse off and stuck somewhere in Libya if they try and illegally enter Europe.Pulpstar said:
I note that one barely ever sees an arab or berber amongst the migrants departing from Libya.MaxPB said:
Well Salvini seems like he's just done it. I think there is going to be an almighty reckoning over this in the next few weeks. Spain won't be able to handle their new open ports position for long and they will have to take the same action, Greece will most likely follow suit which effectively closes the external European border against the wishes of the richer northern EU nations from where most of the "charity" boats originate.blueblue said:
Why is it so hard for the law to treat these NGOs and "charities" as what they are - people traffickers?Morris_Dancer said:Mr. Max, quite. Picking up boats just off the Libyan shore and ferrying undocumented migrants with no pretence of following the legal process for migration and then calling it a 'crisis' is ridiculous. It isn't a crisis. It's a choice.
Make an agreement with Lybia that the migrants must be dropped off back there and then compel the charities to do that, but until then the charities are following our laws not breaking them.0 -
Rainbow Warrior the ships - that will stop it.Philip_Thompson said:
What crime have the charity workers committed?MaxPB said:
Indeed. The action necessary is simple (but tough to follow through on). Arrest the charity workers, seize the boats, load up the migrants and dump them back on the coast of Libya and pay the Libyans off. Have a massive PR campaign across Africa that this is the end result and all that will happen is they will be $5000 worse off and stuck somewhere in Libya if they try and illegally enter Europe.Pulpstar said:
I note that one barely ever sees an arab or berber amongst the migrants departing from Libya.MaxPB said:
Well Salvini seems like he's just done it. I think there is going to be an almighty reckoning over this in the next few weeks. Spain won't be able to handle their new open ports position for long and they will have to take the same action, Greece will most likely follow suit which effectively closes the external European border against the wishes of the richer northern EU nations from where most of the "charity" boats originate.blueblue said:
Why is it so hard for the law to treat these NGOs and "charities" as what they are - people traffickers?Morris_Dancer said:Mr. Max, quite. Picking up boats just off the Libyan shore and ferrying undocumented migrants with no pretence of following the legal process for migration and then calling it a 'crisis' is ridiculous. It isn't a crisis. It's a choice.
Make an agreement with Lybia that the migrants must be dropped off back there and then compel the charities to do that, but until then the charities are following our laws not breaking them.
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Its the only way the EU knows - protectionist means protectionist.David_Evershed said:
Singapore is known as a successful trading economy.Scott_P said:
Great new for the workers of Sunderland and Flint.David_Evershed said:Under a no deal scenario we don't have to impose tariffs on imports from the EU or anywhere else. The Singapore solution?
Singapore is known for their cars and planes.
Oh, wait...
Relying on tariffs to be competitive is not a sustainable solution in the long term.
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Bezos, Branson and Musk are more like Iceland, Kidderminster Harriers and Brazil.Pulpstar said:The space race equivalent of Iceland, Brazil and Panama in football.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-5875115/Jeff-Bezos-Blue-Origin-reveals-start-selling-tickets-tourists-year.html0 -
And even if we had, it still wouldn't beScott_P said:0 -
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I blame the Leavers who said that was Project Fear and that Brexit would be easy.MaxPB said:
Yes, the remainers in 10 and 11 have been grossly negligent, haven't they.Scott_P said:
If Number 10/11 have been negligent then why haven’t the likes of Johnson, Gove, Fox, Grayling, and Davis quit?
https://twitter.com/tseofpb/status/1002541345964216321?s=210 -
The IRA were in contact with the Police during their bombing campaigns with codes to give warnings prior to them acting. Does that mean that the Police were just another link in the IRA's network?ralphmalph said:
The allegation is that the NGO;s are in contact with the smugglers via mobile phone. The people smugglers phone the NGO with the position of the migrants. The NGO ships are tracked by AIS and the Italian authorities noted they always seem to sail in a direct line to the pick up point, no searching required. If this is going on then they are just another link in the people smuggling network.Philip_Thompson said:
What crime have the charity workers committed?MaxPB said:
Indeed. The action necessary is simple (but tough to follow through on). Arrest the charity workers, seize the boats, load up the migrants and dump them back on the coast of Libya and pay the Libyans off. Have a massive PR campaign across Africa that this is the end result and all that will happen is they will be $5000 worse off and stuck somewhere in Libya if they try and illegally enter Europe.Pulpstar said:
I note that one barely ever sees an arab or berber amongst the migrants departing from Libya.MaxPB said:
Well Salvini seems like he's just done it. I think there is going to be an almighty reckoning over this in the next few weeks. Spain won't be able to handle their new open ports position for long and they will have to take the same action, Greece will most likely follow suit which effectively closes the external European border against the wishes of the richer northern EU nations from where most of the "charity" boats originate.blueblue said:
Why is it so hard for the law to treat these NGOs and "charities" as what they are - people traffickers?Morris_Dancer said:Mr. Max, quite. Picking up boats just off the Libyan shore and ferrying undocumented migrants with no pretence of following the legal process for migration and then calling it a 'crisis' is ridiculous. It isn't a crisis. It's a choice.
Make an agreement with Lybia that the migrants must be dropped off back there and then compel the charities to do that, but until then the charities are following our laws not breaking them.0 -
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Davis should have quit the moment Theresa said no to planning for the trade/customs cliff edge. He's a fool and he will go down in history as the fall guy if everything goes wrong.TheScreamingEagles said:
I blame the Leavers who said that was Project Fear and that Brexit would be easy.MaxPB said:
Yes, the remainers in 10 and 11 have been grossly negligent, haven't they.Scott_P said:
If Number 10/11 have been negligent then why haven’t the likes of Johnson, Gove, Fox, Grayling, and Davis quit?
https://twitter.com/tseofpb/status/1002541345964216321?s=210 -
There's no timePhilip_Thompson said:
It would collapse our economy
Get real0 -
Brexiteers think that is "a price worth paying", assuming someone else does the paying of coursenot_on_fire said:It would collapse our economy
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Interesting how Brexit doesn’t figure at all in Trump’s consciousness anymore.
https://twitter.com/ddale8/status/10114091279548784640 -
Funny - I was thinking of exactly the same comparison. Decided not to go there to avoid getting people heated. Now I can watch and see whether I was right not to make the comparison.Philip_Thompson said:
The IRA were in contact with the Police during their bombing campaigns with codes to give warnings prior to them acting. Does that mean that the Police were just another link in the IRA's network?ralphmalph said:
The allegation is that the NGO;s are in contact with the smugglers via mobile phone. The people smugglers phone the NGO with the position of the migrants. The NGO ships are tracked by AIS and the Italian authorities noted they always seem to sail in a direct line to the pick up point, no searching required. If this is going on then they are just another link in the people smuggling network.Philip_Thompson said:
What crime have the charity workers committed?MaxPB said:
Indeed. The action necessary is simple (but tough to follow through on). Arrest the charity workers, seize the boats, load up the migrants and dump them back on the coast of Libya and pay the Libyans off. Have a massive PR campaign across Africa that this is the end result and all that will happen is they will be $5000 worse off and stuck somewhere in Libya if they try and illegally enter Europe.Pulpstar said:
I note that one barely ever sees an arab or berber amongst the migrants departing from Libya.MaxPB said:
Well Salvini seems like he's just done it. I think there is going to be an almighty reckoning over this in the next few weeks. Spain won't be able to handle their new open ports position for long and they will have to take the same action, Greece will most likely follow suit which effectively closes the external European border against the wishes of the richer northern EU nations from where most of the "charity" boats originate.blueblue said:
Why is it so hard for the law to treat these NGOs and "charities" as what they are - people traffickers?Morris_Dancer said:Mr. Max, quite. Picking up boats just off the Libyan shore and ferrying undocumented migrants with no pretence of following the legal process for migration and then calling it a 'crisis' is ridiculous. It isn't a crisis. It's a choice.
Make an agreement with Lybia that the migrants must be dropped off back there and then compel the charities to do that, but until then the charities are following our laws not breaking them.0 -
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It’s an option which leads in short order to chaos on the ground, humiliation for the British state, and the break up of the UK.Philip_Thompson said:0 -
Apologies if already posted but I liked this joke:
Boris Johnson should have any problem lying in front of a bulldozer as he has plenty of experience lying in front of a bus.0 -
Are there any downsides?williamglenn said:It’s an option which leads in short order to chaos on the ground, humiliation for the British state, and the break up of the UK.
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Boris and Hunt have got Theresa in a terrible fix. The poor woman now has to go grovelling to the captains of industry to clear up their mess. It's demeaning.Scott_P said:0 -
The NGO's if taking a call should then notify the authorities that illegal activity is going to take place and by whom, of what is planned, so they can try and stop it or the Libyan cost guard "the proper trained authorities with links to the other emergency services if required), can turn up and deal with it.Philip_Thompson said:
The IRA were in contact with the Police during their bombing campaigns with codes to give warnings prior to them acting. Does that mean that the Police were just another link in the IRA's network?ralphmalph said:
The allegation is that the NGO;s are in contact with the smugglers via mobile phone. The people smugglers phone the NGO with the position of the migrants. The NGO ships are tracked by AIS and the Italian authorities noted they always seem to sail in a direct line to the pick up point, no searching required. If this is going on then they are just another link in the people smuggling network.Philip_Thompson said:
What crime have the charity workers committed?MaxPB said:
Indeed. The action necessary is simple (but tough to follow through on). Arrest the charity workers, seize the boats, load up the migrants and dump them back on the coast of Libya and pay the Libyans off. Have a massive PR campaign across Africa that this is the end result and all that will happen is they will be $5000 worse off and stuck somewhere in Libya if they try and illegally enter Europe.Pulpstar said:
I note that one barely ever sees an arab or berber amongst the migrants departing from Libya.MaxPB said:
Well Salvini seems like he's just done it. I think there is going to be an almighty reckoning over this in the next few weeks. Spain won't be able to handle their new open ports position for long and they will have to take the same action, Greece will most likely follow suit which effectively closes the external European border against the wishes of the richer northern EU nations from where most of the "charity" boats originate.blueblue said:
Why is it so hard for the law to treat these NGOs and "charities" as what they are - people traffickers?Morris_Dancer said:Mr. Max, quite. Picking up boats just off the Libyan shore and ferrying undocumented migrants with no pretence of following the legal process for migration and then calling it a 'crisis' is ridiculous. It isn't a crisis. It's a choice.
Make an agreement with Lybia that the migrants must be dropped off back there and then compel the charities to do that, but until then the charities are following our laws not breaking them.0 -
Oh don't worry about Max he is probably down the pub and crowd-posting.rkrkrk said:
Funny - I was thinking of exactly the same comparison. Decided not to go there to avoid getting people heated. Now I can watch and see whether I was right not to make the comparison.Philip_Thompson said:
The IRA were in contact with the Police during their bombing campaigns with codes to give warnings prior to them acting. Does that mean that the Police were just another link in the IRA's network?ralphmalph said:
The allegation is that the NGO;s are in contact with the smugglers via mobile phone. The people smugglers phone the NGO with the position of the migrants. The NGO ships are tracked by AIS and the Italian authorities noted they always seem to sail in a direct line to the pick up point, no searching required. If this is going on then they are just another link in the people smuggling network.Philip_Thompson said:
What crime have the charity workers committed?MaxPB said:
Indeed. The action necessary is simple (but tough to follow through on). Arrest the charity workers, seize the boats, load up the migrants and dump them back on the coast of Libya and pay the Libyans off. Have a massive PR campaign across Africa that this is the end result and all that will happen is they will be $5000 worse off and stuck somewhere in Libya if they try and illegally enter Europe.Pulpstar said:
I note that one barely ever sees an arab or berber amongst the migrants departing from Libya.MaxPB said:
Well Salvini seems like he's just done it. I think there is going to be an almighty reckoning over this in the next few weeks. Spain won't be able to handle their new open ports position for long and they will have to take the same action, Greece will most likely follow suit which effectively closes the external European border against the wishes of the richer northern EU nations from where most of the "charity" boats originate.blueblue said:
Why is it so hard for the law to treat these NGOs and "charities" as what they are - people traffickers?Morris_Dancer said:Mr. Max, quite. Picking up boats just off the Libyan shore and ferrying undocumented migrants with no pretence of following the legal process for migration and then calling it a 'crisis' is ridiculous. It isn't a crisis. It's a choice.
Make an agreement with Lybia that the migrants must be dropped off back there and then compel the charities to do that, but until then the charities are following our laws not breaking them.0 -
Business != big business.Scott_P said:
Big business who can afford teams of lawyers etc can easily navigate regulations and pointless bureaucracy.
Small business gets tangled up in the red tape though.
Shame you don't seem to care about small business.0 -
That's one option but its not their only one. Given that our authorities aren't dealing with the situation themselves, the charities doing so is not a problem. If our authorities start dropping people back off in Libya or instructing the charities to do so then that would be different but that's not the case at the moment.ralphmalph said:The NGO's if taking a call should then notify the authorities that illegal activity is going to take place and by whom, of what is planned, so they can try and stop it or the Libyan cost guard "the proper trained authorities with links to the other emergency services if required), can turn up and deal with it.
Blame the authorities not the charities. Only the authorities can change any of this.0 -
You say the same about Brexit in general.williamglenn said:
It’s an option which leads in short order to chaos on the ground, humiliation for the British state, and the break up of the UK.Philip_Thompson said:0 -
Big businesses are also much more likely to export, or have supply chains that cross borders. Small businesses are less likely to have to worry about that directly.Philip_Thompson said:
Business != big business.Scott_P said:
Big business who can afford teams of lawyers etc can easily navigate regulations and pointless bureaucracy.
Small business gets tangled up in the red tape though.
Shame you don't seem to care about small business.
But if there is no deal then small businesses will find that there is less business overall and that should worry them.0 -
An interesting view from Catherine Bearder, the only LibDem MEP, in the Independent...
https://www.independent.co.uk/voices/brexit-latest-news-eu-talks-brussels-uk-theresa-may-a8416076.html0 -
Industrial collapse kills small businesses too. I care more about them than the brexiteersPhilip_Thompson said:Shame you don't seem to care about small business.
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Do you mean small businesses or small businesses that don't export?. I'm retired now, but as a small business (just me) I providing services. It was seamless within the EU and not elsewhere. I had a complete nightmare dealing with the USA. Prior to this I worked for a large company and this was prior to the current EU trading arrangements and every time I temporarily exported stuff (eg demo equipment) we ran into problems and it usually went pearshaped.Philip_Thompson said:
Business != big business.Scott_P said:
Big business who can afford teams of lawyers etc can easily navigate regulations and pointless bureaucracy.
Small business gets tangled up in the red tape though.
Shame you don't seem to care about small business.0 -
I don't think small businesses are any different to big businesses on this issue. Nobody wants unnecessary regulations, but most are both necessary and desirable. And having them harmonised across the globe is a definite plus - so I don't think there is any bonus from avoiding EU regulations. Pointless bureaucracy is by definition without value, but it is not clear to me why we would have less of it from Westminster than Brussels. If anything I'd say that the EU stuff tends to be less objectionable to my business.Philip_Thompson said:
Business != big business.Scott_P said:
Big business who can afford teams of lawyers etc can easily navigate regulations and pointless bureaucracy.
Small business gets tangled up in the red tape though.
Shame you don't seem to care about small business.0 -
You're fucking wrong.Philip_Thompson said:
Business != big business.Scott_P said:
Big business who can afford teams of lawyers etc can easily navigate regulations and pointless bureaucracy.
Small business gets tangled up in the red tape though.
Shame you don't seem to care about small business.
http://theconversation.com/brexits-impact-on-small-businesses-the-experts-may-be-spot-on-after-all-90561
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Alternatively, the charity boats can drop off in Germany or the Netherlands where they are based.Philip_Thompson said:
That's one option but its not their only one. Given that our authorities aren't dealing with the situation themselves, the charities doing so is not a problem. If our authorities start dropping people back off in Libya or instructing the charities to do so then that would be different but that's not the case at the moment.ralphmalph said:The NGO's if taking a call should then notify the authorities that illegal activity is going to take place and by whom, of what is planned, so they can try and stop it or the Libyan cost guard "the proper trained authorities with links to the other emergency services if required), can turn up and deal with it.
Blame the authorities not the charities. Only the authorities can change any of this.
I agree with the Italians, there needs to be an Australian style solution to boat arrivals.0 -
Wow, not someone I expected to agree with! Are you sure you're a Lib Dem?!Foxy said:
Alternatively, the charity boats can drop off in Germany or the Netherlands where they are based.Philip_Thompson said:
That's one option but its not their only one. Given that our authorities aren't dealing with the situation themselves, the charities doing so is not a problem. If our authorities start dropping people back off in Libya or instructing the charities to do so then that would be different but that's not the case at the moment.ralphmalph said:The NGO's if taking a call should then notify the authorities that illegal activity is going to take place and by whom, of what is planned, so they can try and stop it or the Libyan cost guard "the proper trained authorities with links to the other emergency services if required), can turn up and deal with it.
Blame the authorities not the charities. Only the authorities can change any of this.
I agree with the Italians, there needs to be an Australian style solution to boat arrivals.0 -
Yep, we are an SME and EU regulations have not held us back.Recidivist said:
I don't think small businesses are any different to big businesses on this issue. Nobody wants unnecessary regulations, but most are both necessary and desirable. And having them harmonised across the globe is a definite plus - so I don't think there is any bonus from avoiding EU regulations. Pointless bureaucracy is by definition without value, but it is not clear to me why we would have less of it from Westminster than Brussels. If anything I'd say that the EU stuff tends to be less objectionable to my business.Philip_Thompson said:
Business != big business.Scott_P said:
Big business who can afford teams of lawyers etc can easily navigate regulations and pointless bureaucracy.
Small business gets tangled up in the red tape though.
Shame you don't seem to care about small business.
0 -
+1Recidivist said:
I don't think small businesses are any different to big businesses on this issue. Nobody wants unnecessary regulations, but most are both necessary and desirable. And having them harmonised across the globe is a definite plus - so I don't think there is any bonus from avoiding EU regulations. Pointless bureaucracy is by definition without value, but it is not clear to me why we would have less of it from Westminster than Brussels. If anything I'd say that the EU stuff tends to be less objectionable to my business.Philip_Thompson said:
Business != big business.Scott_P said:
Big business who can afford teams of lawyers etc can easily navigate regulations and pointless bureaucracy.
Small business gets tangled up in the red tape though.
Shame you don't seem to care about small business.
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I have posted this for some years!MaxPB said:
Wow, not someone I expected to agree with! Are you sure you're a Lib Dem?!Foxy said:
Alternatively, the charity boats can drop off in Germany or the Netherlands where they are based.Philip_Thompson said:
That's one option but its not their only one. Given that our authorities aren't dealing with the situation themselves, the charities doing so is not a problem. If our authorities start dropping people back off in Libya or instructing the charities to do so then that would be different but that's not the case at the moment.ralphmalph said:The NGO's if taking a call should then notify the authorities that illegal activity is going to take place and by whom, of what is planned, so they can try and stop it or the Libyan cost guard "the proper trained authorities with links to the other emergency services if required), can turn up and deal with it.
Blame the authorities not the charities. Only the authorities can change any of this.
I agree with the Italians, there needs to be an Australian style solution to boat arrivals.
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It’s not only ‘interesting’ it’s sensible and logical.OchEye said:An interesting view from Catherine Bearder, the only LibDem MEP, in the Independent...
https://www.independent.co.uk/voices/brexit-latest-news-eu-talks-brussels-uk-theresa-may-a8416076.html
After all WE STARTED THIS!0 -
No I'm not. Your own link simply shows who is concerned about Brexit not what the impact will be. Your own link also says that 2/3rds of those responding for exporting SMEs and 5/6ths of those responding on behalf of non-exporting SMEs are not concerned about Brexit.Bromptonaut said:
You're fucking wrong.Philip_Thompson said:
Business != big business.Scott_P said:
Big business who can afford teams of lawyers etc can easily navigate regulations and pointless bureaucracy.
Small business gets tangled up in the red tape though.
Shame you don't seem to care about small business.
http://theconversation.com/brexits-impact-on-small-businesses-the-experts-may-be-spot-on-after-all-90561
Considering that Remainers make up 50% of the population it appears that SMEs are less concerned about Brexit than the population as a whole.0 -
TBH, ‘regulations’ are why small businesses join trade associations and shre in the cost of the lawyers and whatever.kjh said:
Do you mean small businesses or small businesses that don't export?. I'm retired now, but as a small business (just me) I providing services. It was seamless within the EU and not elsewhere. I had a complete nightmare dealing with the USA. Prior to this I worked for a large company and this was prior to the current EU trading arrangements and every time I temporarily exported stuff (eg demo equipment) we ran into problems and it usually went pearshaped.Philip_Thompson said:
Business != big business.Scott_P said:
Big business who can afford teams of lawyers etc can easily navigate regulations and pointless bureaucracy.
Small business gets tangled up in the red tape though.
Shame you don't seem to care about small business.0 -
I do not know anything about the law in Libya to say that it is a legal requirement to inform the police if you know a crime will be committed in the future.Philip_Thompson said:
That's one option but its not their only one. Given that our authorities aren't dealing with the situation themselves, the charities doing so is not a problem. If our authorities start dropping people back off in Libya or instructing the charities to do so then that would be different but that's not the case at the moment.ralphmalph said:The NGO's if taking a call should then notify the authorities that illegal activity is going to take place and by whom, of what is planned, so they can try and stop it or the Libyan cost guard "the proper trained authorities with links to the other emergency services if required), can turn up and deal with it.
Blame the authorities not the charities. Only the authorities can change any of this.
With respect to the Coastguard they are doing there job in partnership with the Italian authorities.
https://www.euractiv.com/section/justice-home-affairs/news/libyan-coastguard-prevents-ngo-boat-from-rescuing-migrants/
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I've just started a small service business selling all over the world. This describes my life very preciselykjh said:
Do you mean small businesses or small businesses that don't export?. I'm retired now, but as a small business (just me) I providing services. It was seamless within the EU and not elsewhere. I had a complete nightmare dealing with the USA. Prior to this I worked for a large company and this was prior to the current EU trading arrangements and every time I temporarily exported stuff (eg demo equipment) we ran into problems and it usually went pearshaped.Philip_Thompson said:
Business != big business.Scott_P said:
Big business who can afford teams of lawyers etc can easily navigate regulations and pointless bureaucracy.
Small business gets tangled up in the red tape though.
Shame you don't seem to care about small business.
After 6 months I have yet to come across any problematic EU red tape.
[Opening a bank account was a colossal pain in the arse, but I don't know if the UK or EU are to blame for that!]
Face it, all the "freedom to trade" talk is, and always was, facile bullshit. Anyone still peddling it is either delusional, lying or a fucking moron.
Sovereignty or immigration, I get. I don't agree with, but I understand it. Claiming the UK will be economically better off outside the EU is now just embarrassing.0 -
Although my previous diatribe on trade might be wrong. Could this save us all?
https://twitter.com/MarkFieldUK/status/10112828550691430420 -
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Props to him/his assistant if that is the correct spelling.Anorak said:Although my previous diatribe on trade might be wrong. Could this save us all?
https://twitter.com/MarkFieldUK/status/10112828550691430420 -
How did we start this? It takes two to tango.OldKingCole said:
It’s not only ‘interesting’ it’s sensible and logical.OchEye said:An interesting view from Catherine Bearder, the only LibDem MEP, in the Independent...
https://www.independent.co.uk/voices/brexit-latest-news-eu-talks-brussels-uk-theresa-may-a8416076.html
After all WE STARTED THIS!
They spent decades changing the organisation we had joined away from what it was when we joined it and then rejected Cameron's attempts to resolve British concerns.0 -
Me too! I'm also a sole trader, and most of my customers are in Germany and Luxembourg. The EU has made it extremely simple for micro-businesses like mine to access a very large customer base. Every now there comes the chance to do work for a US company, but the bureaucratic overhead means that it's simply not worth it for me.Anorak said:
I've just started a small service business selling all over the world. This describes my life very preciselykjh said:
Do you mean small businesses or small businesses that don't export?. I'm retired now, but as a small business (just me) I providing services. It was seamless within the EU and not elsewhere. I had a complete nightmare dealing with the USA. Prior to this I worked for a large company and this was prior to the current EU trading arrangements and every time I temporarily exported stuff (eg demo equipment) we ran into problems and it usually went pearshaped.Philip_Thompson said:
Business != big business.Scott_P said:
Big business who can afford teams of lawyers etc can easily navigate regulations and pointless bureaucracy.
Small business gets tangled up in the red tape though.
Shame you don't seem to care about small business.
After 6 months I have yet to come across any problematic EU red tape.
[Opening a bank account was a colossal pain in the arse, but I don't know if the UK or EU are to blame for that!]
Face it, all the "freedom to trade" talk is, and always was, facile bullshit. Anyone still peddling it is either delusional, lying or a fucking moron.
Sovereignty or immigration, I get. I don't agree with, but I understand it. Claiming the UK will be economically better off outside the EU is now just embarrassing.
Brexit is likely to cause me considerable difficulties; I have already lost one customer that requires its suppliers to be EU members. It's quite likely that my little business will no longer be viable after Brexit, and I'll have to find something else to do!0 -
Philip, You have been responded to more quickly than I can recall any post before by people who actually export and are small businesses all saying you are wrong. Do you have personal experience to contradict us?Philip_Thompson said:
No I'm not. Your own link simply shows who is concerned about Brexit not what the impact will be. Your own link also says that 2/3rds of those responding for exporting SMEs and 5/6ths of those responding on behalf of non-exporting SMEs are not concerned about Brexit.Bromptonaut said:
You're fucking wrong.Philip_Thompson said:
Business != big business.Scott_P said:
Big business who can afford teams of lawyers etc can easily navigate regulations and pointless bureaucracy.
Small business gets tangled up in the red tape though.
Shame you don't seem to care about small business.
http://theconversation.com/brexits-impact-on-small-businesses-the-experts-may-be-spot-on-after-all-90561
Considering that Remainers make up 50% of the population it appears that SMEs are less concerned about Brexit than the population as a whole.
Try selling a service into the USA. I had to complete all sorts of forms to show I wasn't a taxable employee in the US for instance. I was even required to provide evidence embossed with my company stamp. Mind boggling. Nobody has ever asked me to do that before. I think most people would find it difficult to locate it!
I had a nightmare with carnets for demo equipment going in to and out of France twice around 1991. A piece of equipment vital for a bid was held in Cyprus customs for weeks. It could have killed a massive deal for the company I was then working for. It was prior to them joining the EU.0 -
What a fucking moron. HDs have been built in Italy, Japan, the UK and India at various times in their history.williamglenn said:0 -
Pretty clear we're entering a trade war, with tariffs as a weapon.williamglenn said:0 -
I presume this was on Fox and Friends this morning.williamglenn said:0 -
Good thing we have lots of allies and we haven't upset any of them lately.Slackbladder said:Pretty clear we're entering a trade war, with tariffs as a weapon.
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Changes in which we were willing participants. It really wasn’t a case of the 27 or whatever the number was deciding something, then telling the British 'take it or leave it’. Our Government, our MEP’s (until the arrival of UKIP) were full partiicipants in whatever was done.Philip_Thompson said:
How did we start this? It takes two to tango.OldKingCole said:
It’s not only ‘interesting’ it’s sensible and logical.OchEye said:An interesting view from Catherine Bearder, the only LibDem MEP, in the Independent...
https://www.independent.co.uk/voices/brexit-latest-news-eu-talks-brussels-uk-theresa-may-a8416076.html
After all WE STARTED THIS!
They spent decades changing the organisation we had joined away from what it was when we joined it and then rejected Cameron's attempts to resolve British concerns.0 -
And the enemy turns out to be American businesses...Slackbladder said:
Pretty clear we're entering a trade war, with tariffs as a weapon.williamglenn said:0 -
Is he threatening punitive taxes against a company for making him look bad?williamglenn said:
This is the person Boris is "increasingly admiring"?0 -
Interested to see where the Harley thing goes. It's easy to explain in words of one syllable that their domestic success is dependent on international sales and manufacturing.edmundintokyo said:
And the enemy turns out to be American businesses...Slackbladder said:
Pretty clear we're entering a trade war, with tariffs as a weapon.williamglenn said:
What next, Coca-Cola as a traitor for having the temerity to make American fizzy sugar water in furrin parts. Apple? HP?0 -
He’s just copying Boris’s “F*** Business” policy.OblitusSumMe said:
Is he threatening punitive taxes against a company for making him look bad?williamglenn said:
This is the person Boris is "increasingly admiring"?0 -
Sovereignty doesn't pay the mortgageScott_P said:
Brexiteers think that is "a price worth paying", assuming someone else does the paying of coursenot_on_fire said:It would collapse our economy
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Wonder if Jack Daniels will move out of Lynchburg next...0
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We actually believed that the EU owed us a living and we didn't interact fully. Ever hear the fateful words "semi-detached" to describe the UK's attitude to Europe? By not being fully involved, we ended up with out any power to change things, or friends willing to help us... .Philip_Thompson said:
How did we start this? It takes two to tango.OldKingCole said:
It’s not only ‘interesting’ it’s sensible and logical.OchEye said:An interesting view from Catherine Bearder, the only LibDem MEP, in the Independent...
https://www.independent.co.uk/voices/brexit-latest-news-eu-talks-brussels-uk-theresa-may-a8416076.html
After all WE STARTED THIS!
They spent decades changing the organisation we had joined away from what it was when we joined it and then rejected Cameron's attempts to resolve British concerns.0 -
NEW THREAD
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Isn't it curious people start posturing about manufacturing investment and when the actual data is given they lose all interest in the subject.another_richard said:This is the actual ONS data for business investment, at current prices, in the 'engineering and vehicles' manufacturing sector:
1997 £9.247bn
1998 £9.165bn
1999 £8.763bn
2000 £8.730bn
2001 £7.797bn
2002 £6.809bn
2003 £6.139bn
2004 £5.989bn
2005 £6.678bn
2006 £6.728bn
2007 £6.927bn
2008 £7.836bn
2009 £6.902bn
2010 £6.838bn
2011 £7.854bn
2012 £8.729bn
2013 £8.630bn
2014 £10.286bn
2015 £10.540bn
2016 £9.946bn
2017 £11.225bn
From page 4 of the spreadsheet on this link:
https://www.ons.gov.uk/economy/grossdomesticproductgdp/datasets/businessinvestmentbyindustryandasset
For 2018Q1 it is £2.722bn, which is the highest Q1 figure on record.
As Alanbrooke said where were they between 2000-2010 when manufacturing was in depression ?0