politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » It is the trend in TMay’s YouGov “best PM” ratings that should
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Gina Miller did OK but I thought she struggled when the woman took her task about not revealing your hand before a negotiation.GeoffM said:
Agree, she's really quite milfy in person.Big_G_NorthWales said:
Last time I saw she had the most votes and most seats and a record vote share.Jonathan said:
Maybe right for the party, but absolutely not for the country. She carries no weight. She is damaged goods. The EU can safely ignore her knowing that sometime, maybe quite soon, she will be gone.Big_G_NorthWales said:As far as TM is concerned do not underestimate her. She has made a horlicks of the election but she is ideal for the party right now to deal with Brexit and the fire tragedy and as a party member I do not see anyone either able or willing to challenge her. And no way will I vote for Boris, he is yesterday's candidate
For that reason alone she should be gone already. Even, dare I say it, if that is sub-optimal for the Tory party.
She may or may not resign sometime but for now most seem to just want her to get on with Brexit.
Also on question time last night I was actually quite impressed with Gina Miller (Wow - did I just write that)
The guy for the Tories was also good as well I thought - Actually he might have been the most coherent of everyone.
SNP guy was pointless (bring back Alex)
Lab guy was clueless...
Oborne was... Drunk?
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That's my hope, yes, agree.williamglenn said:
Thanks to May's decision to invoke Article 50, digging our heels in just brings us closer to the cliff edge.CornishJohn said:
This was a predictable reaction to any generous offer. As we saw from Blair and Cameron's negotiations, the EU banks any offer, claims it is not enough and then demands more. The only right way to deal is what Chirac used to do and dig your heels in.CarlottaVance said:0 -
The US would quit Al Udeid in a heartbeat if the Saudis offered to reactivate PSAB.CarlottaVance said:Roger said:
Very interesting. With any other POTUS the US would see the writing on the wall and realise what dealing with Saudi and the Gulf States looks like. Promoting democracy in the region with those countries as allies looks pretty hollowCarlottaVance said:If I was Qatar I'd be sorely tempted to refer Saudi Arabia to the reply given in Arkell vs Pressdram:
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/middle-east/saudi-arabia-qatar-diplomatic-feud-latest-al-jazeera-demands-list-uae-egypt-bahrain-a7803981.html
I would be very sad to see Al Jazerra close down - it provides excellent reporting and appears pretty unbiased - no wonder the Saudi's hate it. Bit tricky fighting a war with Qatar when the US has a huge base there.....with the UK in a corner of it.....0 -
The fight will be over jurisdiction.Big_G_NorthWales said:
May's offer is almost impossible to reject by the EU - if she wins this the narrative could changeTGOHF said:The EU seems to have been caught completely on the hop by May's offer to EU citizens - they are scrabbling around and failing to get a common line in response - are we sure Barnier is up to the job ?
1-0 to the Uk.
I don't think the UK can accept the ECJ ruling on the rights of citizens residing within its own territory.
It won't be the money, or Northern Ireland, or the negotiating timetable that will be the sticking point, it will be this.0 -
I am amazed at the expert negociators of Brussels with their decades of experience in the specialist subject of complex international trade deals didn't see this coming.dyedwoolie said:
The EU is beaurocracy central. They are lethal in arranged timetabled meetings but terrible off the cuff. The tactic has to be making our plays off the cuff.TGOHF said:The EU seems to have been caught completely on the hop by May's offer to EU citizens - they are scrabbling around and failing to get a common line in response - are we sure Barnier is up to the job ?
1-0 to the Uk.
Given I have been told on here that their crack team is made up of Kasparov brain sized trade deal ninjas who would chase our blustering toffs from the field at every turn it's caused me no end of bafflement.
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In a dominatrix kind of way.GeoffM said:
Agree, she's really quite milfy in person.Big_G_NorthWales said:
Last time I saw she had the most votes and most seats and a record vote share.Jonathan said:
Maybe right for the party, but absolutely not for the country. She carries no weight. She is damaged goods. The EU can safely ignore her knowing that sometime, maybe quite soon, she will be gone.Big_G_NorthWales said:As far as TM is concerned do not underestimate her. She has made a horlicks of the election but she is ideal for the party right now to deal with Brexit and the fire tragedy and as a party member I do not see anyone either able or willing to challenge her. And no way will I vote for Boris, he is yesterday's candidate
For that reason alone she should be gone already. Even, dare I say it, if that is sub-optimal for the Tory party.
She may or may not resign sometime but for now most seem to just want her to get on with Brexit.
Also on question time last night I was actually quite impressed with Gina Miller (Wow - did I just write that)
Each to his own taste.
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I think most people (except Ed Miliband) thought that Hollande's plans were unworkable. Merkel rejected them immediately.another_richard said:
You mean like Francois Hollande did ?SouthamObserver said:
Yep - the one who just won a huge majority in the Presidential and Parliamentary elections.another_richard said:
Is that the Macron who has already had multiple cabinet resignations because of sleeze ?SouthamObserver said:
It's hard to see how it can be sustained - especially if the economy weakens.Bobajob_PB said:Just catching up with YouGov. The more interesting thing than JC being fave PM (not surprising, given how pisspoor May is) is that the nation is swinging against leaving the Single Market in a big way. I expect this trend to continue. Hard Brexit is - I suspect - dying.
It is increasingly clear that May called the election to get a strong enough mandate to allow her to walk away from talks if necessary and to ride out the ensuing economic shit-storm on the back of a Never Surrender, White Cliffs of Dover wave of patriotism. The failure to secure that mandate has buggered up the UK's entire negotiation strategy. And everyone knows it. Instead, May is facing an increasingly self-confident Europe, buoyed by improving economic data and the arrival of Macron. With the totally unreliable, anti-British Trump sitting in the White House, we picked precisely the wrong time to leave the EU.
He was someone else we were told would buoy up an increasingly self-confident Europe. Not to mention end austerity and reform France.
How did that turn out ?
What do they say about Presidents of the fifth Republic ? That each is worse than the previous one.
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Piss off. He's not speaking "the truth". He's a one-man 110dB propaganda trumpet for Remain.TheScreamingEagles said:
Criticising the media/journalists for daring to speak and share the truth.Casino_Royale said:
Islam is a disgrace.Big_G_NorthWales said:
Faisal Islam is Juncker's UK stoogeCarlottaVance said:Druncker:
https
The similarities between Leavers and Corbynistas are so blindingly obvious.
There's no semblance of any balance whatsoever in his Brexit coverage.0 -
dyedwoolie said:
The EU is beaurocracy central. They are lethal in arranged timetabled meetings but terrible off the cuff. The tactic has to be making our plays off the cuff.TGOHF said:The EU seems to have been caught completely on the hop by May's offer to EU citizens - they are scrabbling around and failing to get a common line in response - are we sure Barnier is up to the job ?
1-0 to the Uk.
That's German efficiency for you.
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Well if you are going to burn your bridges you may as well nuke them...CarlottaVance said:
He's certainly writing as though it is.TheScreamingEagles said:
He's moved on and realises his political career is over.Morris_Dancer said:Mr. Eagles, but would Osborne stand if the opportunity (to become an MP) arose?
May will be around for a little while, but if they have any choice MPs won't want her leading them after her less than spectacular effort in 2017.0 -
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Jurisdiction and Northern Ireland coincide as issues since all NI citizens will remain eligible for EU citizenship and the Good Friday Agreement includes provisions for NI's voice to be heard in European institutions.Casino_Royale said:
The fight will be over jurisdiction.Big_G_NorthWales said:
May's offer is almost impossible to reject by the EU - if she wins this the narrative could changeTGOHF said:The EU seems to have been caught completely on the hop by May's offer to EU citizens - they are scrabbling around and failing to get a common line in response - are we sure Barnier is up to the job ?
1-0 to the Uk.
I don't think the UK can accept the ECJ ruling on the rights of citizens residing within its own territory.
It won't be the money, or Northern Ireland, or the negotiating timetable that will be the sticking point, it will be this.0 -
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The EU27 will not reject it. They will welcome it, but say although it is a start it is not enough - that it does not match the protections they are offering to UK citizens. And because May's negotiating hand is so weak there will be compromise and UK citizens will end up with more rights than their government currently wants to give them.Big_G_NorthWales said:
May's offer is almost impossible to reject by the EU - if she wins this the narrative could changeTGOHF said:The EU seems to have been caught completely on the hop by May's offer to EU citizens - they are scrabbling around and failing to get a common line in response - are we sure Barnier is up to the job ?
1-0 to the Uk.
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Northern Ireland is a possible exception, and a very complex one, I grant you.williamglenn said:
Jurisdiction and Northern Ireland coincide as issues since all NI citizens will remain eligible for EU citizenship and the Good Friday Agreement includes provisions for NI's voice to be heard in European institutions.Casino_Royale said:
The fight will be over jurisdiction.Big_G_NorthWales said:
May's offer is almost impossible to reject by the EU - if she wins this the narrative could changeTGOHF said:The EU seems to have been caught completely on the hop by May's offer to EU citizens - they are scrabbling around and failing to get a common line in response - are we sure Barnier is up to the job ?
1-0 to the Uk.
I don't think the UK can accept the ECJ ruling on the rights of citizens residing within its own territory.
It won't be the money, or Northern Ireland, or the negotiating timetable that will be the sticking point, it will be this.
If I were a betting man, I'd say a joint UK SC-EU ECJ panel would be the sensible common ground as the territory remains part of the UK.0 -
That's the public image but socially she's not like that.David_Evershed said:
In a dominatrix kind of way.GeoffM said:
Agree, she's really quite milfy in person.Big_G_NorthWales said:
Last time I saw she had the most votes and most seats and a record vote share.Jonathan said:
Maybe right for the party, but absolutely not for the country. She carries no weight. She is damaged goods. The EU can safely ignore her knowing that sometime, maybe quite soon, she will be gone.Big_G_NorthWales said:As far as TM is concerned do not underestimate her. She has made a horlicks of the election but she is ideal for the party right now to deal with Brexit and the fire tragedy and as a party member I do not see anyone either able or willing to challenge her. And no way will I vote for Boris, he is yesterday's candidate
For that reason alone she should be gone already. Even, dare I say it, if that is sub-optimal for the Tory party.
She may or may not resign sometime but for now most seem to just want her to get on with Brexit.
Also on question time last night I was actually quite impressed with Gina Miller (Wow - did I just write that)
Each to his own taste.
For those who didn't read the relevant thread a few months ago I don't really know her well but I'm a friend of one of her fellow litigants from her original legal challenge. That's how our paths crossed.0 -
Which is also why no deal is not in the EU's interest.Scott_P said:0 -
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How do you "balance" reporting of a train wreck?Casino_Royale said:There's no semblance of any balance whatsoever in his Brexit coverage.
"Yes, it's a catastrophe, but those passengers who survive are now free to make their own choice of alternative transport in the future..."0 -
What will you be doing to celebrate Independence Day Scotty?Scott_P said:
How do you "balance" reporting of a train wreck?Casino_Royale said:There's no semblance of any balance whatsoever in his Brexit coverage.
"Yes, it's a catastrophe, but those passengers who survive are now free to make their own choice of alternative transport in the future..." 0 -
Yep - the EU27 were taken so off guard they published their own proposals a couple of weeks ago.TGOHF said:The EU seems to have been caught completely on the hop by May's offer to EU citizens - they are scrabbling around and failing to get a common line in response - are we sure Barnier is up to the job ?
1-0 to the Uk.
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It's neither a catastrophe, nor a train wreck. That's just hyperbolic rhetoric.Scott_P said:
How do you "balance" reporting of a train wreck?Casino_Royale said:There's no semblance of any balance whatsoever in his Brexit coverage.
"Yes, it's a catastrophe, but those passengers who survive are now free to make their own choice of alternative transport in the future..."
Those of us who are not grateful serfs welcome the chance for the UK to make the same kind of decisions over its future that Canada, Australia and New Zealand enjoy.
Remainers love him because he power-charges their confirmation bias.
To the max.0 -
Currently UK citizens wanting to bring a foreign (non-UK/EU spouse) to the UK have to pass a minimum income threshold to do so.rcs1000 said:
What additional right would that have (in the UK)?CarlottaVance said:
Which would have EU citizens having greater rights in the UK than UK citizens. Good luck selling that on the doorstep....SouthamObserver said:
the final settlement is almost certain to be much more favourable to British citizens than the one their government has put on the table.Morris_Dancer said:Mr. Observer, news last night a condition of May's offer was reciprocity for British citizens in the EU...
(Not being an arse, genuinely interested.)
EU citizens do not.
The EU would like this to continue for EU citizens.
https://www.theguardian.com/law/2017/feb/22/supreme-court-backs-minimum-income-rule-for-non-european-spouses0 -
...and we didn't randomly cave in.SouthamObserver said:
Yep - the EU27 were taken so off guard they published their own proposals a couple of weeks ago.TGOHF said:The EU seems to have been caught completely on the hop by May's offer to EU citizens - they are scrabbling around and failing to get a common line in response - are we sure Barnier is up to the job ?
1-0 to the Uk.
*That* is what has taken them by surprise.0 -
As you say, the issue will be who gets jurisdiction as the ultimate arbiter of rights enshrined in the new UK/EU agreement. What the EU will want to avoid - quite reasonably so - is for agreed rights to be subsequently legislated away by the UK Parliament or interpreted by the UK courts in a way that is not compatible with the EU27's understanding of the agreement. Likewise, the UK would presumably want to avoid the same thing happening the other way round with regard to UK citizens living in the EU27. Thus, there will be a compromise on this.Casino_Royale said:
The fight will be over jurisdiction.Big_G_NorthWales said:
May's offer is almost impossible to reject by the EU - if she wins this the narrative could changeTGOHF said:The EU seems to have been caught completely on the hop by May's offer to EU citizens - they are scrabbling around and failing to get a common line in response - are we sure Barnier is up to the job ?
1-0 to the Uk.
I don't think the UK can accept the ECJ ruling on the rights of citizens residing within its own territory.
It won't be the money, or Northern Ireland, or the negotiating timetable that will be the sticking point, it will be this.
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Were they as ludicrous as their £100Bn exit payment proposal ?SouthamObserver said:
Yep - the EU27 were taken so off guard they published their own proposals a couple of weeks ago.TGOHF said:The EU seems to have been caught completely on the hop by May's offer to EU citizens - they are scrabbling around and failing to get a common line in response - are we sure Barnier is up to the job ?
1-0 to the Uk.0 -
The case for Remain
https://twitter.com/acgrayling/status/8778614787154124800 -
I assume all Tories will vote against ?williamglenn said:Interesting move.
https://twitter.com/libdems/status/878170608760127488
& DUP abstain.
How will Labour split ?0 -
The next round of negotiations will be interesting.GeoffM said:
...and we didn't randomly cave in.SouthamObserver said:
Yep - the EU27 were taken so off guard they published their own proposals a couple of weeks ago.TGOHF said:The EU seems to have been caught completely on the hop by May's offer to EU citizens - they are scrabbling around and failing to get a common line in response - are we sure Barnier is up to the job ?
1-0 to the Uk.
*That* is what has taken them by surprise.
"So Mr Davis, any idea what your boss will announce to the press later in the week?"0 -
Didn't know The Donald was even at Glastonbury
https://twitter.com/standardnews/status/8781783141747261450 -
William
Clearly that is the best way forward, attracts widespread public support, and will relieve the economy from crashing out. Several leading Leavers said during the campaign that leaving the Single Market would be an act of a madman. Their words should be repeated back to them at every opportunity.
The ballot paper made no mention of the SM – so we should take this approach so as to do the best by business and workers while respecting the result of the referendum.
So sensible an approach is that, that it is inconceivable that our dullard political masters take it.0 -
There are no good options. Changing leader by a contest would take a long time. Changing leader by coronation isn't ideal either. Even if we change leader, we still don't have a majority government, so and new PM would still lack authority and not be able to guarantee delivery of any compromise deal. An election would just add further dealay and confusion, and risks producing either a similar result or an even worse one, perhaps with even less of a chance of producing a stable government, especially since the opposition is the most unsuited to government that we have had since WWII - and also hasn't a coherent Brexit position.Jonathan said:Maybe right for the party, but absolutely not for the country. She carries no weight. She is damaged goods. The EU can safely ignore her knowing that sometime, maybe quite soon, she will be gone.
For that reason alone she should be gone already. Even, dare I say it, if that is sub-optimal for the Tory party.
It's an unholy mess, but it's the mess which voters delivered. The Conservative Party and government will just have to to try to make the best of it for the country. As we are already seeing, the risk of a disastrous and chaotic Brexit have substantially increased because of the lack of a majority. I see my old mate Dick Newby is even threatening that the Lords could crash the whole thing. apparently oblivious to the fact that the only power the Lords have is to produce the most chaotic and hardest Brexit of all:
Because of the election result, “the Salisbury Convention probably doesn’t apply,” said Dick Newby, leader of the pro-EU Liberal Democrat party in the upper house. Among peers “there’s a large majority that think Brexit is a bad idea,” and so they “could make Theresa May’s Brexit plans more difficult, because one of the things the Lords have is the power of delay, which of course is quite a big power at this point.”
http://www.hl.co.uk/news/2017/6/23/mays-brexit-critics-circle-as-u.k.-parliament-flexes-muscles
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There has been no negotiation yet.GeoffM said:
...and we didn't randomly cave in.SouthamObserver said:
Yep - the EU27 were taken so off guard they published their own proposals a couple of weeks ago.TGOHF said:The EU seems to have been caught completely on the hop by May's offer to EU citizens - they are scrabbling around and failing to get a common line in response - are we sure Barnier is up to the job ?
1-0 to the Uk.
*That* is what has taken them by surprise.
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Ken Clarke?Pulpstar said:
I assume all Tories will vote against ?williamglenn said:Interesting move.
https://twitter.com/libdems/status/878170608760127488
& DUP abstain.
How will Labour split ?0 -
How well do you think it's going on a scale of 1-10?Casino_Royale said:
It's neither a catastrophe, nor a train wreck. That's just hyperbolic rhetoric.Scott_P said:
How do you "balance" reporting of a train wreck?Casino_Royale said:There's no semblance of any balance whatsoever in his Brexit coverage.
"Yes, it's a catastrophe, but those passengers who survive are now free to make their own choice of alternative transport in the future..."
Those of us who are not grateful serfs welcome the chance for the UK to make the same kind of decisions over its future that Canada, Australia and New Zealand enjoy.
Remainers love him because he power-charges their confirmation bias.
To the max.0 -
You are already in a de facto leadership election. By hesitating you're only stretching it out.Richard_Nabavi said:
There are no good options. Changing leader by a contest would take a long time.Jonathan said:Maybe right for the party, but absolutely not for the country. She carries no weight. She is damaged goods. The EU can safely ignore her knowing that sometime, maybe quite soon, she will be gone.
For that reason alone she should be gone already. Even, dare I say it, if that is sub-optimal for the Tory party.
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Could be wrong , but the most often stated is the ability to bring in a Non UK spouse into the UK. There's an income cut-off point for UK citizens 18K+ , which doesn't apply to EU citizens.rcs1000 said:
What additional right would that have (in the UK)?CarlottaVance said:
Which would have EU citizens having greater rights in the UK than UK citizens. Good luck selling that on the doorstep....SouthamObserver said:
the final settlement is almost certain to be much more favourable to British citizens than the one their government has put on the table.Morris_Dancer said:Mr. Observer, news last night a condition of May's offer was reciprocity for British citizens in the EU...
(Not being an arse, genuinely interested.)0 -
How about an interim leader, an old hand who could steady the ship - maybe Ken Clarke ;-) ?Jonathan said:
You are already in a de facto leadership election. By hesitating you're only stretching it out.Richard_Nabavi said:
There are no good options. Changing leader by a contest would take a long time.Jonathan said:Maybe right for the party, but absolutely not for the country. She carries no weight. She is damaged goods. The EU can safely ignore her knowing that sometime, maybe quite soon, she will be gone.
For that reason alone she should be gone already. Even, dare I say it, if that is sub-optimal for the Tory party.0 -
To an extent, yes. Certainly Mrs May's days are numbered.Jonathan said:You are already in a de facto leadership election. By hesitating you're only stretching it out.
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We are about 25 seconds into a 90 minute football match. Both sides have had a throw in.Dura_Ace said:
How well do you think it's going on a scale of 1-10?Casino_Royale said:
It's neither a catastrophe, nor a train wreck. That's just hyperbolic rhetoric.Scott_P said:
How do you "balance" reporting of a train wreck?Casino_Royale said:There's no semblance of any balance whatsoever in his Brexit coverage.
"Yes, it's a catastrophe, but those passengers who survive are now free to make their own choice of alternative transport in the future..."
Those of us who are not grateful serfs welcome the chance for the UK to make the same kind of decisions over its future that Canada, Australia and New Zealand enjoy.
Remainers love him because he power-charges their confirmation bias.
To the max.0 -
If the UK really cared about its relations with countries like New Zealand it would stay in the EU and use our influence to push for the swift conclusion of the comprehensive trade deal currently being worked on. We are no use to anyone for as long as we chose to be fantasy island.
https://www.mfat.govt.nz/en/trade/free-trade-agreements/agreements-under-negotiation/eu-fta/0 -
The odd thing about that quote from the leader of the Lib Dems in the House of Lords is that the Lib Dems abandoned the Salisbury Convention in 2005.Richard_Nabavi said:
There are no good options. Changing leader by a contest would take a long time. Changing leader by coronation isn't ideal either. Even if we change leader, we still don't have a majority government, so and new PM would still lack authority and not be able to guarantee delivery of any compromise deal. An election would just add further dealay and confusion, and risks producing either a similar result or an even worse one, perhaps with even less of a chance of producing a stable government, especially since the opposition is the most unsuited to government that we have had since WWII - and also hasn't a coherent Brexit position.Jonathan said:Maybe right for the party, but absolutely not for the country. She carries no weight. She is damaged goods. The EU can safely ignore her knowing that sometime, maybe quite soon, she will be gone.
For that reason alone she should be gone already. Even, dare I say it, if that is sub-optimal for the Tory party.
It's an unholy mess, but it's the mess which voters delivered. The Conservative Party and government will just have to to try to make the best of it for the country. As we are already seeing, the risk of a disastrous and chaotic Brexit have substantially increased because of the lack of a majority. I see my old mate Dick Newby is even threatening that the Lords could crash the whole thing. apparently oblivious to the fact that the only power the Lords have is to produce the most chaotic and hardest Brexit of all:
Because of the election result, “the Salisbury Convention probably doesn’t apply,” said Dick Newby, leader of the pro-EU Liberal Democrat party in the upper house. Among peers “there’s a large majority that think Brexit is a bad idea,” and so they “could make Theresa May’s Brexit plans more difficult, because one of the things the Lords have is the power of delay, which of course is quite a big power at this point.”
http://www.hl.co.uk/news/2017/6/23/mays-brexit-critics-circle-as-u.k.-parliament-flexes-muscles0 -
He is simply following the example of the President.isam said:Didn't know The Donald was even at Glastonbury
https://twitter.com/standardnews/status/8781783141747261450 -
Nah - far better to have our own bespoke deal without all the fudge poured in from the inflexible dated economies of Europe.williamglenn said:If the UK really cared about its relations with countries like New Zealand it would stay in the EU and use our influence to push for the swift conclusion of the comprehensive trade deal currently being worked on. We are no use to anyone for as long as we chose to be fantasy island.
https://www.mfat.govt.nz/en/trade/free-trade-agreements/agreements-under-negotiation/eu-fta/0 -
No that's simply the case for some people are disorganised idiots. Only the greatest most desperate fools exchange money at airports...Tissue_Price said:The case for Remain
https://twitter.com/acgrayling/status/8778614787154124800 -
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What they need to do is appoint a caretaker and fire the gun on a proper leadership election to get someone in place by conference at the latest.logical_song said:
How about an interim leader, an old hand who could steady the ship - maybe Ken Clarke ;-) ?Jonathan said:
You are already in a de facto leadership election. By hesitating you're only stretching it out.Richard_Nabavi said:
There are no good options. Changing leader by a contest would take a long time.Jonathan said:Maybe right for the party, but absolutely not for the country. She carries no weight. She is damaged goods. The EU can safely ignore her knowing that sometime, maybe quite soon, she will be gone.
For that reason alone she should be gone already. Even, dare I say it, if that is sub-optimal for the Tory party.
I doubt Ken Clarke is the man for party reasons, but he certainly has the ability.
It is bizarre that they are dragging this out. Maybe the moment will be when the QS passes.0 -
It is a tab complicated.... from the Irish Govt websitewilliamglenn said:
Jurisdiction and Northern Ireland coincide as issues since all NI citizens will remain eligible for EU citizenship and the Good Friday Agreement includes provisions for NI's voice to be heard in European institutions.Casino_Royale said:
The fight will be over jurisdiction.Big_G_NorthWales said:
May's offer is almost impossible to reject by the EU - if she wins this the narrative could changeTGOHF said:The EU seems to have been caught completely on the hop by May's offer to EU citizens - they are scrabbling around and failing to get a common line in response - are we sure Barnier is up to the job ?
1-0 to the Uk.
I don't think the UK can accept the ECJ ruling on the rights of citizens residing within its own territory.
It won't be the money, or Northern Ireland, or the negotiating timetable that will be the sticking point, it will be this.
A ) Born in the island of Ireland on or before 31 December 2004: You are entitled to Irish citizenship or you are an Irish citizen
B ) Born on the island of Ireland on or after 1 January 2005: You are entitled to Irish citizenship if one or both of your parents:
- Is British or entitled to live in Northern Ireland or the Irish State without restriction on their residency
- Is a foreign national legally resident in the island of Ireland for 3 out of 4 years immediately prior to your birth
- Has been granted refugee status in Ireland
C ) Child of A, born outside the island of Ireland: An Irish citizen
D ) Child of C and a grandchild of A, born outside the island of Ireland: Entitled to Irish citizenship, but you must first register in the Foreign Births Register
E ) a child of D and a great-grandchild of A, born outside the island of Ireland: Entitled to Irish citizenship, by having your birth registered in the Foreign Births Register, but only if your parent D had registered by the time of your birth.
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The UK cannot have the same chance to make the kinds of decisions that the Canadians, Aussies and Kiwis do because we start from a completely different place. Their security needs are different, their trading patterns are different, their foreign policy needs are different, their manpower needs are different, and so on. Our choices from here on in will be predicated ion the fact that we have left the EU and we will need to find ways to make up the economic losses that has caused. No other country in the world faces that challenge.Casino_Royale said:
It's neither a catastrophe, nor a train wreck. That's just hyperbolic rhetoric.Scott_P said:
How do you "balance" reporting of a train wreck?Casino_Royale said:There's no semblance of any balance whatsoever in his Brexit coverage.
"Yes, it's a catastrophe, but those passengers who survive are now free to make their own choice of alternative transport in the future..."
Those of us who are not grateful serfs welcome the chance for the UK to make the same kind of decisions over its future that Canada, Australia and New Zealand enjoy.
Remainers love him because he power-charges their confirmation bias.
To the max.
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Better for whom? The EU is a much bigger prize for New Zealand and we will now be incapable of influencing the outcome for the benefit of our 'kith and kin'.TGOHF said:
Nah - far better to have our own bespoke deal without all the fudge poured in from the inflexible dated economies of Europe.williamglenn said:If the UK really cared about its relations with countries like New Zealand it would stay in the EU and use our influence to push for the swift conclusion of the comprehensive trade deal currently being worked on. We are no use to anyone for as long as we chose to be fantasy island.
https://www.mfat.govt.nz/en/trade/free-trade-agreements/agreements-under-negotiation/eu-fta/0 -
Wow, he was royally ripped off. The exchange rate is currently 1.24 SF to the £.Tissue_Price said:The case for Remain
https://twitter.com/acgrayling/status/877861478715412480
I suppose he can just be philosophical about it.0 -
Another Osborne successPulpstar said:http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-40372613
Hinkley Point deal 'risky and expensive'0 -
https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/32818c1a-5783-11e7-869c-518339a19c7c
"Foreign investors could sue UK for billions over Brexit"
What is it with sueing when punts go wrong
Can I sue the Tories for my lost Gower bet at the GE ? Or is "business" different...0 -
We need to know what May promised to Nissan.Pulpstar said:https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/32818c1a-5783-11e7-869c-518339a19c7c
"Foreign investors could sue UK for billions over Brexit"0 -
it's the usual "could"Pulpstar said:https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/32818c1a-5783-11e7-869c-518339a19c7c
"Foreign investors could sue UK for billions over Brexit"
What is it with sueing when punts go wrong
Can I sue the Tories for my lost Gower bet at the GE ? Or is "business" different...
0 -
I don't think that's right, and I couldn't find it in the article you linked. The same rules apply whether you're a UK citizen or a non-UK EU citizen. The wrinkle is that you can get around the UK's evil wankery by *living elsewhere in the EU with the foreign spouse first*. However, UK citizens can do this too, at least at the moment.CarlottaVance said:
Currently UK citizens wanting to bring a foreign (non-UK/EU spouse) to the UK have to pass a minimum income threshold to do so.rcs1000 said:
What additional right would that have (in the UK)?CarlottaVance said:
Which would have EU citizens having greater rights in the UK than UK citizens. Good luck selling that on the doorstep....SouthamObserver said:
the final settlement is almost certain to be much more favourable to British citizens than the one their government has put on the table.Morris_Dancer said:Mr. Observer, news last night a condition of May's offer was reciprocity for British citizens in the EU...
(Not being an arse, genuinely interested.)
EU citizens do not.
The EU would like this to continue for EU citizens.
https://www.theguardian.com/law/2017/feb/22/supreme-court-backs-minimum-income-rule-for-non-european-spouses0 -
Pulpstar said:
https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/32818c1a-5783-11e7-869c-518339a19c7c
"Foreign investors could sue UK for billions over Brexit"
What is it with sueing when punts go wrong
Can I sue the Tories for my lost Gower bet at the GE ? Or is "business" different...
Britain has 95 bilateral investment treaties, including with Hong Kong, the United Arab Emirates and Russia, under which companies could bring their cases before arbitration tribunals.
The treaties protect investors from each state in the territory of the other, guaranteeing “fair and equitable treatment”. Some case law suggests that a massive change of regulatory regime counts as a denial of fair treatment. If the UK lost access to the EU single market as a result of Brexit, some lawyers argue, this would frustrate foreign companies’ legitimate expectation of unencumbered trade into the EU.....
...When Spain ripped up its subsidy regime for renewable energy generation in 2013, its government was hit with cases from investors. Companies from Germany to Canada to Abu Dhabi had piled in to take advantage of the favourable policy environment and, when the law changed, they wanted compensation. Many lost their cases, but in May two affiliated companies from Britain and Luxembourg won an award of €128 million. Further claims have still to be decided.0 -
Incidentally, if Conservative-run Kensington and Chelsea Council employing Rydon and Harley Facades to put cladding which turned out to be lethal on a tower block is evidence of heartless Tories cutting corners and showing wilful disregard for the safety of the poor, and proof of the irresponsibility of a Conservative government in terms of fire regulations, what is the political lesson to be drawn from Labour-run Camden Council employing Rydon and Harley Facades to put similar cladding on their tower blocks under a Labour government?0
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Cor the corbynistas must be praying the Maidenhead one goes up
https://twitter.com/dailymailuk/status/8781847633448140810 -
May's offer, AIUI, is related to EU citizens who were here in June and indeed had been for 5 years. They would have the right to remain indefinitely.
What the EU seem to be looking for is additional rights for EU citizens going forward. I cannot see any obvious upsides about agreeing that at the moment. It may well be that EU citizens end up with enhanced rights of access going forward, either a fast track for those coming with a job or with a spouse, but that should be a matter to be considered in the context of trade which is next year (apparently).
The priority now is to give assurance to both UK citizens in the EU and EU citizens here that their existing rights of residence are going to be protected so that they can get on with their lives. I would hope this would be agreed very quickly.0 -
I wonder sometimes if there's ANY situation where the answer for remainers is not "stay in the EU"0
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We will have unique challenges......just like every other independent country ever.SouthamObserver said:
The UK cannot have the same chance to make the kinds of decisions that the Canadians, Aussies and Kiwis do because we start from a completely different place. Their security needs are different, their trading patterns are different, their foreign policy needs are different, their manpower needs are different, and so on. Our choices from here on in will be predicated ion the fact that we have left the EU and we will need to find ways to make up the economic losses that has caused. No other country in the world faces that challenge.Casino_Royale said:
It's neither a catastrophe, nor a train wreck. That's just hyperbolic rhetoric.Scott_P said:
How do you "balance" reporting of a train wreck?Casino_Royale said:There's no semblance of any balance whatsoever in his Brexit coverage.
"Yes, it's a catastrophe, but those passengers who survive are now free to make their own choice of alternative transport in the future..."
Those of us who are not grateful serfs welcome the chance for the UK to make the same kind of decisions over its future that Canada, Australia and New Zealand enjoy.
Remainers love him because he power-charges their confirmation bias.
To the max.0 -
"He accused the Scottish government of "grandstanding" publicly but said he hoped talks with ministers had entered a "a more mature phase".
Nicola has been forced to wind her neck in.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-scotland-politics-403793440 -
I had a feeling it would come out that Labour run councils also have done the same and that Labour would suddenly become a lot more quiet on the subject.Richard_Nabavi said:Incidentally, if Conservative-run Kensington and Chelsea Council employing Rydon and Harley Facades to put cladding which turned out to be lethal on a tower block is evidence of heartless Tories cutting corners and showing wilful disregard for the safety of the poor, and proof of the irresponsibility of a Conservative government in terms of fire regulations, what is the political lesson to be drawn from Labour-run Camden Council employing Rydon and Harley Facades to put similar cladding on their tower blocks under a Labour government?
You would think it could damage Labour after their initial outrage and political shit stirring could be seen as point scoring out of a tragedy. But forget Teflon Tony I think the man made of Teflon is Saint Jezzbollah.0 -
Good= |Thanks to saint JezRichard_Nabavi said:Incidentally, if Conservative-run Kensington and Chelsea Council employing Rydon and Harley Facades to put cladding which turned out to be lethal on a tower block is evidence of heartless Tories cutting corners and showing wilful disregard for the safety of the poor, and proof of the irresponsibility of a Conservative government in terms of fire regulations, what is the political lesson to be drawn from Labour-run Camden Council employing Rydon and Harley Facades to put similar cladding on their tower blocks under a Labour government?
Bad= New Labour policy.0 -
The lesson is that even a caring, loving and socially aware Labour Council can be duped by the evil capitalist system into acts of potential harm.Richard_Nabavi said:Incidentally, if Conservative-run Kensington and Chelsea Council employing Rydon and Harley Facades to put cladding which turned out to be lethal on a tower block is evidence of heartless Tories cutting corners and showing wilful disregard for the safety of the poor, and proof of the irresponsibility of a Conservative government in terms of fire regulations, what is the political lesson to be drawn from Labour-run Camden Council employing Rydon and Harley Facades to put similar cladding on their tower blocks under a Labour government?
Capitalism must go! Vote Corbyn for a warm fuzzy feeling!!!0 -
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https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2017/may/03/may-expected-to-challenge-right-of-eu-citizens-to-bring-family-to-britain-non-european-spouses-brexitedmundintokyo said:
I don't think that's right, and I couldn't find it in the article you linked. The same rules apply whether you're a UK citizen or a non-UK EU citizen. The wrinkle is that you can get around the UK's evil wankery by *living elsewhere in the EU with the foreign spouse first*. However, UK citizens can do this too, at least at the moment.CarlottaVance said:
Currently UK citizens wanting to bring a foreign (non-UK/EU spouse) to the UK have to pass a minimum income threshold to do so.rcs1000 said:
What additional right would that have (in the UK)?CarlottaVance said:
Which would have EU citizens having greater rights in the UK than UK citizens. Good luck selling that on the doorstep....SouthamObserver said:
the final settlement is almost certain to be much more favourable to British citizens than the one their government has put on the table.Morris_Dancer said:Mr. Observer, news last night a condition of May's offer was reciprocity for British citizens in the EU...
(Not being an arse, genuinely interested.)
EU citizens do not.
The EU would like this to continue for EU citizens.
https://www.theguardian.com/law/2017/feb/22/supreme-court-backs-minimum-income-rule-for-non-european-spouses
The then prime minister added: “At the moment, if a British citizen wants to bring, say, a South American partner to the UK, then we ask for proof that they meet an income threshold and can speak English. But EU law means we cannot apply these tests to EU migrants. Their partners can just come straight into our country without any proper controls at all.”0 -
Overly strong pound after all the negotiations are finished and we;ve leftScott_P said:
If the Brexiteers can name a single problem caused by leaving, that wouldn't be fixed by remaining, please let us know...Blue_rog said:I wonder sometimes if there's ANY situation where the answer for remainers is not "stay in the EU"
Not being able to blame Europe for failed policies0 -
You know, the more I think about it, the less sure I am. The Queens Speech will definitely be carried by at least 13 votes and probably by 20 or so (various absences among the opposition parties - the Tories will be 10 lined whip!).Richard_Nabavi said:
To an extent, yes. Certainly Mrs May's days are numbered.Jonathan said:You are already in a de facto leadership election. By hesitating you're only stretching it out.
After that, little happens in Parliament; the Tory muppets all bugga off and chill-out for the long summer break. So she survives until the autumn....then party conference... and odds on are that she copes sufficiently (some remorse, mea culpa...but I have learned the lessons etc).
And without an obvious credible and more electable successor, on she jolly well goes, quite conceivably, depending on the economy, the vicissitudes of the polls, local elections etc etc. beyond Brexit 2019.
Loads and loads of ifs and pitfalls, I grant you, but it is by no means unimaginable that Mrs May could be leading the party into the 2022 election. And who knows, even win it!0 -
Incitement to riot - isn't that a criminal offence?isam said:
I do hope he gets to help the police with their enquiries later.0 -
I'd moan about the inevitability that every 23 June from now on will be a Pavlovian trigger to make all the Leavers batshit mental for the day, but since they spend the rest of the year apparently sincerely believing that the EU is the whore of Babylon, I can't honestly say there's really all that much difference.0
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NOTHING TO SEE HERE!!eek said:
No that's simply the case for some people are disorganised idiots. Only the greatest most desperate fools exchange money at airports...Tissue_Price said:The case for Remain
https://twitter.com/acgrayling/status/8778614787154124800 -
Agree with everything apart from staying on until the election, she just is an awful campaigner.JohnO said:
You know, the more I think about it, the less sure I am. The Queens Speech will definitely be carried by at least 13 votes and probably by 20 or so (various absences among the opposition parties - the Tories will be 10 lined whip!).Richard_Nabavi said:
To an extent, yes. Certainly Mrs May's days are numbered.Jonathan said:You are already in a de facto leadership election. By hesitating you're only stretching it out.
After that, little happens in Parliament; the Tory muppets all bugga off and chill-out for the long summer break. So she survives until the autumn....then party conference... and odds on are that she copes sufficiently (some remorse, mea culpa...but I have learned the lessons etc).
And without an obvious credible and more electable successor, on she jolly well goes, quite conceivably, depending on the economy, the vicissitudes of the polls, local elections etc etc. beyond Brexit 2019.
Loads and loads of ifs and pitfalls, I grant you, but it is by no means unimaginable that Mrs May could be leading the party into the 2022 election. And who knows, even win it!0 -
May had the chance to ditch it and decided against.Alanbrooke said:
Another Osborne successPulpstar said:http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-40372613
Hinkley Point deal 'risky and expensive'
https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2016/sep/14/theresa-may-conditional-approval-hinkley-point-c-nuclear-power-station0 -
Not impossible, but I think the most likely scenario is that she remains until 2019, delivers Brexit, and then stands down. Of course, events might intervene to make that impossible.JohnO said:You know, the more I think about it, the less sure I am. The Queens Speech will definitely be carried by at least 13 votes and probably by 20 or so (various absences among the opposition parties - the Tories will be 10 lined whip!).
After that, little happens in Parliament; the Tory muppets all bugga off and chill-out for the long summer break. So she survives until the autumn....then party conference... and odds on are that she copes sufficiently (some remorse, mea culpa...but I have learned the lessons etc).
And without an obvious credible and more electable successor, on she jolly well goes, quite conceivably, depending on the economy, the vicissitudes of the polls, local elections etc etc. beyond Brexit 2019.
Loads and loads of ifs and pitfalls, I grant you, but it is by no means unimaginable that Mrs May could be leading the party into the 2022 election. And who knows, even win it!
We also shouldn't forget that the problems within Labour haven't gone away, so events might not intervene on only side of the equation..0 -
LOL.JohnO said:
It is by no means unimaginable that Mrs May could be leading the party into the 2022 election. And who knows, even win it!Richard_Nabavi said:
To an extent, yes. Certainly Mrs May's days are numbered.Jonathan said:You are already in a de facto leadership election. By hesitating you're only stretching it out.
0 -
Let's hope all the paperwork hasn't been destroyed.DanSmith said:0 -
Yes, I think May will survive longer than many expect, but will not fight another GE.nunu said:
Agree with everything apart from staying on until the election, she just is an awful campaigner.JohnO said:
You know, the more I think about it, the less sure I am. The Queens Speech will definitely be carried by at least 13 votes and probably by 20 or so (various absences among the opposition parties - the Tories will be 10 lined whip!).Richard_Nabavi said:
To an extent, yes. Certainly Mrs May's days are numbered.Jonathan said:You are already in a de facto leadership election. By hesitating you're only stretching it out.
After that, little happens in Parliament; the Tory muppets all bugga off and chill-out for the long summer break. So she survives until the autumn....then party conference... and odds on are that she copes sufficiently (some remorse, mea culpa...but I have learned the lessons etc).
And without an obvious credible and more electable successor, on she jolly well goes, quite conceivably, depending on the economy, the vicissitudes of the polls, local elections etc etc. beyond Brexit 2019.
Loads and loads of ifs and pitfalls, I grant you, but it is by no means unimaginable that Mrs May could be leading the party into the 2022 election. And who knows, even win it!
0 -
Thanks for that. That'sCarlottaVance said:
Currently UK citizens wanting to bring a foreign (non-UK/EU spouse) to the UK have to pass a minimum income threshold to do so.rcs1000 said:
What additional right would that have (in the UK)?CarlottaVance said:
Which would have EU citizens having greater rights in the UK than UK citizens. Good luck selling that on the doorstep....SouthamObserver said:
the final settlement is almost certain to be much more favourable to British citizens than the one their government has put on the table.Morris_Dancer said:Mr. Observer, news last night a condition of May's offer was reciprocity for British citizens in the EU...
(Not being an arse, genuinely interested.)
EU citizens do not.
The EU would like this to continue for EU citizens.
https://www.theguardian.com/law/2017/feb/22/supreme-court-backs-minimum-income-rule-for-non-european-spouses0 -
Brexit will not be "delivered" in 2019Richard_Nabavi said:Not impossible, but I think the most likely scenario is that she remains until 2019, delivers Brexit, and then stands down.
0 -
The boy George is trying to out do Brown as the worst Chancellor.Alanbrooke said:
Another Osborne successPulpstar said:http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-40372613
Hinkley Point deal 'risky and expensive'
He's given us HS2, a massively over priced Hinkley Point power deal, and austerity cuts that could well have influenced the outcome at Grenfell. Plus he played a key role in the Foxtrot Up Remain campaign. Coupled with editorials that helped Corbyn over the line in marginal seats in London, and his continued spoiled child sniping that drives the meme against May, and it's hard to tell the difference.
0 -
He who laughs last - and I'm just smiling at present - laughs loudest.Bobajob_PB said:
LOL.JohnO said:
It is by no means unimaginable that Mrs May could be leading the party into the 2022 election. And who knows, even win it!Richard_Nabavi said:
To an extent, yes. Certainly Mrs May's days are numbered.Jonathan said:You are already in a de facto leadership election. By hesitating you're only stretching it out.
0 -
0
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Indeed. It's unlikely, but things can change. And in the future where things are going very badly, plenty of would-be successors might prefer to take over after a GE rather than before it. The middlingly bad but recoverable situation is the one where she'll almost certainly go.JohnO said:
You know, the more I think about it, the less sure I am. The Queens Speech will definitely be carried by at least 13 votes and probably by 20 or so (various absences among the opposition parties - the Tories will be 10 lined whip!).Richard_Nabavi said:
To an extent, yes. Certainly Mrs May's days are numbered.Jonathan said:You are already in a de facto leadership election. By hesitating you're only stretching it out.
After that, little happens in Parliament; the Tory muppets all bugga off and chill-out for the long summer break. So she survives until the autumn....then party conference... and odds on are that she copes sufficiently (some remorse, mea culpa...but I have learned the lessons etc).
And without an obvious credible and more electable successor, on she jolly well goes, quite conceivably, depending on the economy, the vicissitudes of the polls, local elections etc etc. beyond Brexit 2019.
Loads and loads of ifs and pitfalls, I grant you, but it is by no means unimaginable that Mrs May could be leading the party into the 2022 election. And who knows, even win it!0 -
She's having a bad weeknunu said:Nicola has been forced to wind her neck in.
@davidtorrance: Struck me at today's #FMQs that Sturgeon finds herself fire-fighting on 6 different fronts: #Brexit, #indyref2, domestic record 1/3
@davidtorrance: From the left (Corbyn), the right (Davidson) and, unusually, internal criticism. One or two of those might be manageable, not all six 2/3
@davidtorrance: Hereafter incidents like tail docking vote will highlight weakness/contradictions that have always been there, but now much more visibly 3/3
Indeed...
@IrvineWelsh: 'Nicky Sturgeon Puppy surgeon' has a 'Margaret Thatcher Milk Snatcher' ring to it. Own goals don't come any bigger or unnecessary.0 -
It will, for better or worse.Scott_P said:
Brexit will not be "delivered" in 2019Richard_Nabavi said:Not impossible, but I think the most likely scenario is that she remains until 2019, delivers Brexit, and then stands down.
0 -
Unless it's a stillbirth.Scott_P said:
Brexit will not be "delivered" in 2019Richard_Nabavi said:Not impossible, but I think the most likely scenario is that she remains until 2019, delivers Brexit, and then stands down.
0 -
Yes - we will have to mitigate the effects of the harm we inflict on ourselves by leaving the Single Market and Customs Union. And every country in the world will know this. That's something that no other nation in the world has to worry about when it is looking to do trade deals. That's our unique challenge.nunu said:
We will have unique challenges......just like every other independent country ever.SouthamObserver said:
The UK cannot have the same chance to make the kinds of decisions that the Canadians, Aussies and Kiwis do because we start from a completely different place. Their security needs are different, their trading patterns are different, their foreign policy needs are different, their manpower needs are different, and so on. Our choices from here on in will be predicated ion the fact that we have left the EU and we will need to find ways to make up the economic losses that has caused. No other country in the world faces that challenge.Casino_Royale said:
It's neither a catastrophe, nor a train wreck. That's just hyperbolic rhetoric.Scott_P said:
How do you "balance" reporting of a train wreck?Casino_Royale said:There's no semblance of any balance whatsoever in his Brexit coverage.
"Yes, it's a catastrophe, but those passengers who survive are now free to make their own choice of alternative transport in the future..."
Those of us who are not grateful serfs welcome the chance for the UK to make the same kind of decisions over its future that Canada, Australia and New Zealand enjoy.
Remainers love him because he power-charges their confirmation bias.
To the max.
0 -
-
Would youScott_P said:
If the Brexiteers can name a single problem caused by leaving, that wouldn't be fixed by remaining, please let us know...Blue_rog said:I wonder sometimes if there's ANY situation where the answer for remainers is not "stay in the EU"
Happy Independence Day mateAlastairMeeks said:I'd moan about the inevitability that every 23 June from now on will be a Pavlovian trigger to make all the Leavers batshit mental for the day, but since they spend the rest of the year apparently sincerely believing that the EU is the whore of Babylon, I can't honestly say there's really all that much difference.
0 -
As a general rule you shouldn't believe things the Prime Minister says, because she's full of shit. However, in this case I think what she's saying is technically correct and matches what I'm saying. The people they can't apply these tests to are people *migrating from the EU*.CarlottaVance said:
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2017/may/03/may-expected-to-challenge-right-of-eu-citizens-to-bring-family-to-britain-non-european-spouses-brexitedmundintokyo said:
I don't think that's right, and I couldn't find it in the article you linked. The same rules apply whether you're a UK citizen or a non-UK EU citizen. The wrinkle is that you can get around the UK's evil wankery by *living elsewhere in the EU with the foreign spouse first*. However, UK citizens can do this too, at least at the moment.CarlottaVance said:
Currently UK citizens wanting to bring a foreign (non-UK/EU spouse) to the UK have to pass a minimum income threshold to do so.rcs1000 said:
What additional right would that have (in the UK)?CarlottaVance said:
Which would have EU citizens having greater rights in the UK than UK citizens. Good luck selling that on the doorstep....SouthamObserver said:
the final settlement is almost certain to be much more favourable to British citizens than the one their government has put on the table.Morris_Dancer said:Mr. Observer, news last night a condition of May's offer was reciprocity for British citizens in the EU...
(Not being an arse, genuinely interested.)
EU citizens do not.
The EU would like this to continue for EU citizens.
https://www.theguardian.com/law/2017/feb/22/supreme-court-backs-minimum-income-rule-for-non-european-spouses
The then prime minister added: “At the moment, if a British citizen wants to bring, say, a South American partner to the UK, then we ask for proof that they meet an income threshold and can speak English. But EU law means we cannot apply these tests to EU migrants. Their partners can just come straight into our country without any proper controls at all.”
This includes UK citizens migrating from the EU, and quite a few UK citizens with non-EU spouses have been moving to another EU country for a while precisely to get through this loophole.0 -
Grenfell was NOT austerity related. See R Nabavi's earlier post.kurtjester said:
The boy George is trying to out do Brown as the worst Chancellor.Alanbrooke said:
Another Osborne successPulpstar said:http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-40372613
Hinkley Point deal 'risky and expensive'
He's given us HS2, a massively over priced Hinkley Point power deal, and austerity cuts that could well have influenced the outcome at Grenfell. Plus he played a key role in the Foxtrot Up Remain campaign. Coupled with editorials that helped Corbyn over the line in marginal seats in London, and his continued spoiled child sniping that drives the meme against May, and it's hard to tell the difference.
The rest is fair comment though.0
