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Fair few Socialist Workers among the Grenfell residents:
https://twitter.com/warwickhs/status/8757697547825070120 -
Whilst I broadly agree with the point that requisition is a big overreaction, there is an issue as to what to do about quite a number of other blocks with similar cladding.Richard_Nabavi said:
Really? Housing 100 families in a city of 8.6million is an emergency requiring draconian powers to be invoked?bigjohnowls said:Its an emergency
The answer is probably not immediate rehousing on balance, but it might be, and Sajid Javid quite rightly said on Today this morning that, if that was the best advice, that's what would happen. So it may not be 100 families but quite a few times more.0 -
Delivering Brexit as the country voted for is in the country's best interests.OllyT said:
Given where we are it really is about time the Tories started thinking about what will be in the country's best interests not the best way to avoid a party splitCasino_Royale said:It can't be Hammond.
Whoever takes over from May has to be trusted on Brexit and to deliver it, or the party will split.0 -
The mercury is rising... and clearly the best response is to riot and set things on fire. As that will really help those whose lives have been shattered this week.Jonathan said:
What's the weather forecast?oxfordsimon said:I think we may well see some form of rioting over the coming days.
Someone needs to help defuse the tension that is building - and I can't honestly see who can do that.0 -
Surely Corbyn?oxfordsimon said:I think we may well see some form of rioting over the coming days.
Someone needs to help defuse the tension that is building - and I can't honestly see who can do that.0 -
Step away from the TV and get some perspective. 300 people protesting in High St Ken, whilst the other 10 million in London go about enjoying a normal Friday in June is hardly an emergency.bigjohnowls said:
May needs to get a grip TBFkurtjester said:
You need to get a grip. It's what, 100 families affected. And the authorities appear to be doing everything in their powers to clothe, rehouse and care for those affected. They've been turning supplies away, such has been the response.bigjohnowls said:
Its an emergencyoxfordsimon said:The political agitation in Kensington is reprehensible. Not for a single moment do I believe that those driving the invasion of the Council offices were the residents of Grenfell House - the victims and their families are being used for political ends. Aided and abetted by the increasingly hysterical voices from Corbyn and the Labour Party who are stoking the situation with their 'demands'
What has happened is a tragedy and we need to find out what happened and why. That needs to happen quickly. Similarly we need to provide for those who have been affected as quickly and efficiently as possible.
It is really not helpful when the LOTO suggests the illegal requisition of property as part of the solution. How can rational discussions take place when major political figures are advocating breaking the law?
Although she appears incapable.
Surely the DUP will not want to be associated with her0 -
Corbyn? The man whose best friend in Politics this week called for people to take to the streets to force May from office.Chris said:
Surely Corbyn?oxfordsimon said:I think we may well see some form of rioting over the coming days.
Someone needs to help defuse the tension that is building - and I can't honestly see who can do that.
Do you think he wants to calm things?0 -
Quite, look where avoiding splits in the Tory party has got us. Circling the bowl.OllyT said:
Given where we are it really is about time the Tories started thinking about what will be in the country's best interests not the best way to avoid a party splitCasino_Royale said:It can't be Hammond.
Whoever takes over from May has to be trusted on Brexit and to deliver it, or the party will split.0 -
To be fair, the Cameron and Osborne EU Lovers that are trying to politicise the fire (along w the SWP) can at least say there were no riots under their boys pre Brexit
Oh, wait..0 -
I think it would be the coup de grace.oxfordsimon said:
Corbyn? The man whose best friend in Politics this week called for people to take to the streets to force May from office.Chris said:
Surely Corbyn?oxfordsimon said:I think we may well see some form of rioting over the coming days.
Someone needs to help defuse the tension that is building - and I can't honestly see who can do that.
Do you think he wants to calm things?0 -
Perhaps they took their lead from the Daily MailHaroldO said:
Classy twat, if the boot was on the other foot he would never say such a thing.Scrapheap_as_was said:Twit... (toned down)
https://twitter.com/OwenJones84/status/875750091734351873
Modern politics, throwing as much shit at your opponents as possible.0 -
Delivering Brexit as the country voted for is not possible.Casino_Royale said:Delivering Brexit as the country voted for is in the country's best interests.
£350m a week for the NHS, which is Brexit as the country voted for is not deliverable.
Being a member of the single market while ending FoM which is Brexit as the country voted for is not deliverable.
A politician honest and brave enough to admit that could go far right now0 -
In today's world, though, it's 300 people protesting in Kensington while the other 10 million in London discuss it on Twitter.kurtjester said:
Step away from the TV and get some perspective. 300 people protesting in High St Ken, whilst the other 10 million in London go about enjoying a normal Friday in June is hardly an emergency.bigjohnowls said:
May needs to get a grip TBFkurtjester said:
You need to get a grip. It's what, 100 families affected. And the authorities appear to be doing everything in their powers to clothe, rehouse and care for those affected. They've been turning supplies away, such has been the response.bigjohnowls said:
Its an emergencyoxfordsimon said:The political agitation in Kensington is reprehensible. Not for a single moment do I believe that those driving the invasion of the Council offices were the residents of Grenfell House - the victims and their families are being used for political ends. Aided and abetted by the increasingly hysterical voices from Corbyn and the Labour Party who are stoking the situation with their 'demands'
What has happened is a tragedy and we need to find out what happened and why. That needs to happen quickly. Similarly we need to provide for those who have been affected as quickly and efficiently as possible.
It is really not helpful when the LOTO suggests the illegal requisition of property as part of the solution. How can rational discussions take place when major political figures are advocating breaking the law?
Although she appears incapable.
Surely the DUP will not want to be associated with her0 -
Would certain be a coup. And a very, very dangerous one.Chris said:
I think it would be the coup de grace.oxfordsimon said:
Corbyn? The man whose best friend in Politics this week called for people to take to the streets to force May from office.Chris said:
Surely Corbyn?oxfordsimon said:I think we may well see some form of rioting over the coming days.
Someone needs to help defuse the tension that is building - and I can't honestly see who can do that.
Do you think he wants to calm things?0 -
The headbanger Leavers need to decide quickly whether they are ready to unite behind a new leader that implements a rather more limited version of Brexit than they'd hoped for, or whether they prefer to enter into civil war and let Jeremy Corbyn implement Brexit according to his preferences. There simply isn't the Parliamentary majority for the headbangers to insist on everything they want.0
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This weekend May can make her bones. Corbyn will be intoxicated by the revolutionary spirit and make a tit of himself.Chris said:
Surely Corbyn?oxfordsimon said:I think we may well see some form of rioting over the coming days.
Someone needs to help defuse the tension that is building - and I can't honestly see who can do that.0 -
Like Theresa May's approach?Scott_P said:
Delivering Brexit as the country voted for is not possible.Casino_Royale said:Delivering Brexit as the country voted for is in the country's best interests.
£350m a week for the NHS, which is Brexit as the country voted for is not deliverable.
Being a member of the single market while ending FoM which is Brexit as the country voted for is not deliverable.
A politician honest and brave enough to admit that could go far right now
She didn't promise £350m for the NHS. Or membership of the single market. She did promise to end FoM.
It wasn't that which undid her either. It was her awful campaign and hubris.0 -
Just heard R4's "Dead Ringers" for the first time in a long while. The Nigel Farage sketch (about 15mins in) was brilliant as was the Theresa & Arlene sketch.
Catch it on iPlayer if you can
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Nice weather then to get Boris' water cannons out?ThreeQuidder said:
London? 30 degrees and sunny all weekend.Jonathan said:
What's the weather forecast?oxfordsimon said:I think we may well see some form of rioting over the coming days.
Someone needs to help defuse the tension that is building - and I can't honestly see who can do that.0 -
Things are going to "kick off" this weekend aren't they?0
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Go out. Enjoy the sunshine. Drink mint juleps. That is my advice to ALL PBers. The optics of this approach are GREAT.0
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Even AramintaMoonbeamQC said that May demolished Maitis so it must have been very one sided.Big_G_NorthWales said:
She is very determined and I do not think she will fold easily or quickly. Just heard her interviewed by Emily Maitis on the BBC who did not hold back any punches, but she was firm and very focussed.SirNorfolkPassmore said:
Do you mean resigning or actually getting the removal vans in?Big_G_NorthWales said:
I believe that is correct so only three weeks after to the summer recess. I do not see her going before the AutumnMikeL said:
Someone will confirm but I don't think the vote on the QS happens immediately after it.GIN1138 said:I think May goes next week.
Either the QS fails, in which case she resigns.
Or the QS passes and straight after she'll announce her intention to stand down after a Con leadership election.
Either way I think we'll know whats happening next week...
I think there is a debate lasting approx 5 days and then the vote is at the end.
In which case the vote will be the following week.
Isn't after the Queen's Speech vote actually the ideal time to have a leadership election if you're going to have one at all?
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somone over on Digital Spy Politics forum has stated hat the DUP deal may no tbe needed as the Conservatives have opened up talks with the Lib Demsover confidece and supply deal
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I don't know about anyone else, but this weekend I'm leaving root-torn London for the peace and quiet of Northern Ireland.0
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And I, Jeremy Corbyn, am ready to agree with thisBeverley_C said:Just heard R4's "Dead Ringers" for the first time in a long while. The Nigel Farage sketch (about 15mins in) was brilliant as was the Theresa & Arlene sketch.
Catch it on iPlayer if you can
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?oxfordsimon said:
Would certain be a coup. And a very, very dangerous one.Chris said:
I think it would be the coup de grace.oxfordsimon said:
Corbyn? The man whose best friend in Politics this week called for people to take to the streets to force May from office.Chris said:
Surely Corbyn?oxfordsimon said:I think we may well see some form of rioting over the coming days.
Someone needs to help defuse the tension that is building - and I can't honestly see who can do that.
Do you think he wants to calm things?
We're talking out the capital city being on the edge of riotous disorder, and Jeremy Corbyn restoring peace and harmony by being the essence of benevolence, compassion and sweet reason.
Of course it would be a political triumph for him, particularly in contrast with Theresa May, whose every attempt to do the right thing just makes the situation worse.0 -
RIP Helmut Kohl, one of the giants of late 20th century politics and a key figure in the end of the Cold War0
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Jeez just watching a vice news segment on another mob...Evergreen college had a day where all white students were told to not attend under the guise of some pc nonsense and a professor of evolution art biology said that was racist.
A mob formed, screaming at him, no discussion allowed and there have been weeks of protests against this professor. They want him fired, list of requests and interrupt his lectures, despite zero evidence he is in anyway racist.0 -
Fake "options".AlastairMeeks said:The headbanger Leavers need to decide quickly whether they are ready to unite behind a new leader that implements a rather more limited version of Brexit than they'd hoped for, or whether they prefer to enter into civil war and let Jeremy Corbyn implement Brexit according to his preferences. There simply isn't the Parliamentary majority for the headbangers to insist on everything they want.
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Apparently the DUP are holding out for a "sensible Brexit". So far the government are not giving in to their demands.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-402991710 -
Get back to me when you can count to 326.GeoffM said:
Fake "options".AlastairMeeks said:The headbanger Leavers need to decide quickly whether they are ready to unite behind a new leader that implements a rather more limited version of Brexit than they'd hoped for, or whether they prefer to enter into civil war and let Jeremy Corbyn implement Brexit according to his preferences. There simply isn't the Parliamentary majority for the headbangers to insist on everything they want.
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I don't know whether you consider me a "headbanger", or not, but have made it clear I'd accept EEA-EFTA, reluctantly, given the nature of the GE2017 results.AlastairMeeks said:The headbanger Leavers need to decide quickly whether they are ready to unite behind a new leader that implements a rather more limited version of Brexit than they'd hoped for, or whether they prefer to enter into civil war and let Jeremy Corbyn implement Brexit according to his preferences. There simply isn't the Parliamentary majority for the headbangers to insist on everything they want.
However, I won't accept BINO.
If that's where we're going, with a Tory party likely to haemorrhage, split, fail and fall apart anyway, then we may as well resign and let PM Corbyn try.0 -
I wouldn't "get back to you" if you were on fire, to be honest.AlastairMeeks said:
Get back to me when you can count to 326.GeoffM said:
Fake "options".AlastairMeeks said:The headbanger Leavers need to decide quickly whether they are ready to unite behind a new leader that implements a rather more limited version of Brexit than they'd hoped for, or whether they prefer to enter into civil war and let Jeremy Corbyn implement Brexit according to his preferences. There simply isn't the Parliamentary majority for the headbangers to insist on everything they want.
0 -
When May goes the elderly Tory membership will chose a leader that best approximates UKIP's position and won't give a stuff if it harms the economy.Casino_Royale said:
Delivering Brexit as the country voted for is in the country's best interests.OllyT said:
Given where we are it really is about time the Tories started thinking about what will be in the country's best interests not the best way to avoid a party splitCasino_Royale said:It can't be Hammond.
Whoever takes over from May has to be trusted on Brexit and to deliver it, or the party will split.0 -
Why? The Tory membership elected Cameron, the MPs elected May?OllyT said:
When May goes the elderly Tory membership will chose a leader that best approximates UKIP's position and won't give a stuff if it harms the economy.Casino_Royale said:
Delivering Brexit as the country voted for is in the country's best interests.OllyT said:
Given where we are it really is about time the Tories started thinking about what will be in the country's best interests not the best way to avoid a party splitCasino_Royale said:It can't be Hammond.
Whoever takes over from May has to be trusted on Brexit and to deliver it, or the party will split.0 -
Classy remark given recent events.GeoffM said:
I wouldn't "get back to you" if you were on fire, to be honest.AlastairMeeks said:
Get back to me when you can count to 326.GeoffM said:
Fake "options".AlastairMeeks said:The headbanger Leavers need to decide quickly whether they are ready to unite behind a new leader that implements a rather more limited version of Brexit than they'd hoped for, or whether they prefer to enter into civil war and let Jeremy Corbyn implement Brexit according to his preferences. There simply isn't the Parliamentary majority for the headbangers to insist on everything they want.
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Fpt
"3:59PM
My Corbynista girlfriend thinks the Grenfell fire was the explicit fault of the Tory government and evil capitalist landlords.
By contrast, she has suspicions about the Manchester attack, and wonders if it might have been a false flag, or some kind of hoax.
She probably has an IQ of 140 and studies Hindi and Anthropology at SOAS.
Were we this mad at 21? Have the younger generation replaced drugs and booze with conspiracy theories and mass psychosis? I am genuinely bewildered."
Its because of the internet, whereas before if you believed these things you would only find one or two people who thought like you now you will find a whole community to confirm your biases. The more people you find the more confirmation bias you have. Also the left wing young have always blamed the Tory government for everything. So maybe things haven't changed that much.......0 -
Well, whilst you are there, go and stand here and contemplate peace and quiet....AlastairMeeks said:I don't know about anyone else, but this weekend I'm leaving root-torn London for the peace and quiet of Northern Ireland.
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Is that the rumour that was kicked off by Owen Jones?marke09 said:somone over on Digital Spy Politics forum has stated hat the DUP deal may no tbe needed as the Conservatives have opened up talks with the Lib Demsover confidece and supply deal
He made it up....0 -
The ideal solution would be to 'cash in' on the transition controls Blair failed to impose in 2004Scott_P said:
Delivering Brexit as the country voted for is not possible.Casino_Royale said:Delivering Brexit as the country voted for is in the country's best interests.
£350m a week for the NHS, which is Brexit as the country voted for is not deliverable.
Being a member of the single market while ending FoM which is Brexit as the country voted for is not deliverable.
A politician honest and brave enough to admit that could go far right now0 -
According to the Evening Standard tonight the new Labour MP for Kensington was on the Kensington and Chelsea council housing committeenunuone said:Fpt
"3:59PM
My Corbynista girlfriend thinks the Grenfell fire was the explicit fault of the Tory government and evil capitalist landlords.
By contrast, she has suspicions about the Manchester attack, and wonders if it might have been a false flag, or some kind of hoax.
She probably has an IQ of 140 and studies Hindi and Anthropology at SOAS.
Were we this mad at 21? Have the younger generation replaced drugs and booze with conspiracy theories and mass psychosis? I am genuinely bewildered."
Its because of the internet, whereas before if you believed these things you would only find one or two people who thought like you now you will find a whole community to confirm your biases. The more people you find the more confirmation bias you have. Also the left wing young have always blamed the Tory government for everything. So maybe things haven't changed that much.......0 -
Holding their noses after 3 successive GE defeats. In the current environment they would go for a kamikaze Brexiteer, I'd put money on it.HYUFD said:
Why? The Tory membership elected Cameron, the MPs elected May?OllyT said:
When May goes the elderly Tory membership will chose a leader that best approximates UKIP's position and won't give a stuff if it harms the economy.Casino_Royale said:
Delivering Brexit as the country voted for is in the country's best interests.OllyT said:
Given where we are it really is about time the Tories started thinking about what will be in the country's best interests not the best way to avoid a party splitCasino_Royale said:It can't be Hammond.
Whoever takes over from May has to be trusted on Brexit and to deliver it, or the party will split.0 -
GeoffM said:
I wouldn't "get back to you" if you were on fire, to be honest.AlastairMeeks said:
Get back to me when you can count to 326.GeoffM said:
Fake "options".AlastairMeeks said:The headbanger Leavers need to decide quickly whether they are ready to unite behind a new leader that implements a rather more limited version of Brexit than they'd hoped for, or whether they prefer to enter into civil war and let Jeremy Corbyn implement Brexit according to his preferences. There simply isn't the Parliamentary majority for the headbangers to insist on everything they want.
About sums you up really0 -
Resigned 2012 I think.HYUFD said:
According to the Evening Standard tonight the new Labour MP for Kensington was on the Kensington and Chelsea council housing committeenunuone said:Fpt
"3:59PM
My Corbynista girlfriend thinks the Grenfell fire was the explicit fault of the Tory government and evil capitalist landlords.
By contrast, she has suspicions about the Manchester attack, and wonders if it might have been a false flag, or some kind of hoax.
She probably has an IQ of 140 and studies Hindi and Anthropology at SOAS.
Were we this mad at 21? Have the younger generation replaced drugs and booze with conspiracy theories and mass psychosis? I am genuinely bewildered."
Its because of the internet, whereas before if you believed these things you would only find one or two people who thought like you now you will find a whole community to confirm your biases. The more people you find the more confirmation bias you have. Also the left wing young have always blamed the Tory government for everything. So maybe things haven't changed that much.......0 -
I think if Davis gets to a membership vote, he'll win. Will the MPs put him there?OllyT said:
Holding their noses after 3 successive GE defeats. In the current environment they would go for a kamikaze Brexiteer, I'd put money on it.HYUFD said:
Why? The Tory membership elected Cameron, the MPs elected May?OllyT said:
When May goes the elderly Tory membership will chose a leader that best approximates UKIP's position and won't give a stuff if it harms the economy.Casino_Royale said:
Delivering Brexit as the country voted for is in the country's best interests.OllyT said:
Given where we are it really is about time the Tories started thinking about what will be in the country's best interests not the best way to avoid a party splitCasino_Royale said:It can't be Hammond.
Whoever takes over from May has to be trusted on Brexit and to deliver it, or the party will split.0 -
OllyT said:
When May goes the elderly Tory membership will chose a leader that best approximates UKIP's position and won't give a stuff if it harms the economy.Casino_Royale said:
Delivering Brexit as the country voted for is in the country's best interests.OllyT said:
Given where we are it really is about time the Tories started thinking about what will be in the country's best interests not the best way to avoid a party splitCasino_Royale said:It can't be Hammond.
Whoever takes over from May has to be trusted on Brexit and to deliver it, or the party will split.OllyT said:
When May goes the elderly Tory membership will chose a leader that best approximates UKIP's position and won't give a stuff if it harms the economy.Casino_Royale said:
Delivering Brexit as the country voted for is in the country's best interests.OllyT said:
Given where we are it really is about time the Tories started thinking about what will be in the country's best interests not the best way to avoid a party splitCasino_Royale said:It can't be Hammond.
Whoever takes over from May has to be trusted on Brexit and to deliver it, or the party will split.
I suspect that they will not be offered such a choice by the MPs.OllyT said:
When May goes the elderly Tory membership will chose a leader that best approximates UKIP's position and won't give a stuff if it harms the economy.Casino_Royale said:
Delivering Brexit as the country voted for is in the country's best interests.OllyT said:
Given where we are it really is about time the Tories started thinking about what will be in the country's best interests not the best way to avoid a party splitCasino_Royale said:It can't be Hammond.
Whoever takes over from May has to be trusted on Brexit and to deliver it, or the party will split.0 -
Are you sure? SWP signs tend to look very professional.CarlottaVance said:Fair few Socialist Workers among the Grenfell residents:
https://twitter.com/warwickhs/status/8757697547825070120 -
She was on the committee until May 2014 and scrutinised work on Grenfell Towercalum said:
Resigned 2012 I think.HYUFD said:
According to the Evening Standard tonight the new Labour MP for Kensington was on the Kensington and Chelsea council housing committeenunuone said:Fpt
"3:59PM
My Corbynista girlfriend thinks the Grenfell fire was the explicit fault of the Tory government and evil capitalist landlords.
By contrast, she has suspicions about the Manchester attack, and wonders if it might have been a false flag, or some kind of hoax.
She probably has an IQ of 140 and studies Hindi and Anthropology at SOAS.
Were we this mad at 21? Have the younger generation replaced drugs and booze with conspiracy theories and mass psychosis? I am genuinely bewildered."
Its because of the internet, whereas before if you believed these things you would only find one or two people who thought like you now you will find a whole community to confirm your biases. The more people you find the more confirmation bias you have. Also the left wing young have always blamed the Tory government for everything. So maybe things haven't changed that much.......
https://www.google.co.uk/amp/www.standard.co.uk/news/politics/labours-new-kensington-mp-was-on-housing-scrutiny-committee-a3566661.html?amp0 -
Theresa May has announced an £8,333 aid package for each person caught up in the Grenfell tragedy (about 6 months rent in London)
Blood Money0 -
Why? Davis won the first round MPs vote in 2005 but lost the membership voteFF43 said:
I think if Davis gets to a membership vote, he'll win. Will the MPs put him there?OllyT said:
Holding their noses after 3 successive GE defeats. In the current environment they would go for a kamikaze Brexiteer, I'd put money on it.HYUFD said:
Why? The Tory membership elected Cameron, the MPs elected May?OllyT said:
When May goes the elderly Tory membership will chose a leader that best approximates UKIP's position and won't give a stuff if it harms the economy.Casino_Royale said:
Delivering Brexit as the country voted for is in the country's best interests.OllyT said:
Given where we are it really is about time the Tories started thinking about what will be in the country's best interests not the best way to avoid a party splitCasino_Royale said:It can't be Hammond.
Whoever takes over from May has to be trusted on Brexit and to deliver it, or the party will split.0 -
Those were in enemy seats, so they didn't matter.Richard_Nabavi said:
Really? Housing 100 families in a city of 8.6million is an emergency requiring draconian powers to be invoked?bigjohnowls said:Its an emergency
Do you really believe this utter nonsense*?
If so, were you calling on the Labour government to requisition homes in 2006, or on any of the other occasions when hundreds or thousands of families have had to be rehoused at short notice, often in places with far, far fewer properties available than in London?
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/cumbria/4590098.stm0 -
Grow upbigjohnowls said:Theresa May has announced an £8,333 aid package for each person caught up in the Grenfell tragedy (about 6 months rent in London)
Blood Money0 -
Like our pre-modern ancestors, we have an innate sense that, for such a horrifying event to have happened, there must have been great wickedness at work. Like them, we disagree as to who was responsible for the wickedness. Usually, though, just as they did, we blame whomever we already happened not to like. Glancing at this morning’s newspapers, I see that the Guardian blames inequality, the Mail blames eco-regulations, the Express blames EU rules and the Mirror blames the Tories. Simon Jenkins, that champion of harmonious and well-proportioned architecture, blames tower-blocks. Owen Jones, my favourite radical, blames racketeering landlords. For all I know, one or more of these villains may indeed be at fault; but, for now, it is mainly guesswork.
https://capx.co/grenfell-tower-a-great-tragedy-is-not-always-proof-of-great-wickedness/0 -
Take a closer look at the red and orange signs. They look professional and are headed "Socialist Worker"DecrepitJohnL said:
Are you sure? SWP signs tend to look very professional.CarlottaVance said:Fair few Socialist Workers among the Grenfell residents:
https://twitter.com/warwickhs/status/8757697547825070120 -
They will probably only get a choice of 2 of Boris, Davis, Hammond and Rudd, none of whom are 'kamikaze Brexiteers.' The likes of ID'S, Patterson and Rees-Mogg who are 'kamikaze Brexiteers' will not get put to the membershipOllyT said:
Holding their noses after 3 successive GE defeats. In the current environment they would go for a kamikaze Brexiteer, I'd put money on it.HYUFD said:
Why? The Tory membership elected Cameron, the MPs elected May?OllyT said:
When May goes the elderly Tory membership will chose a leader that best approximates UKIP's position and won't give a stuff if it harms the economy.Casino_Royale said:
Delivering Brexit as the country voted for is in the country's best interests.OllyT said:
Given where we are it really is about time the Tories started thinking about what will be in the country's best interests not the best way to avoid a party splitCasino_Royale said:It can't be Hammond.
Whoever takes over from May has to be trusted on Brexit and to deliver it, or the party will split.
Indeed I could well see MPs choosing Hammond and David as the final 2 and Boris failing to make the final cut0 -
Click on the image - I can count 7 - more than any other kind...DecrepitJohnL said:
Are you sure? SWP signs tend to look very professional.CarlottaVance said:Fair few Socialist Workers among the Grenfell residents:
https://twitter.com/warwickhs/status/8757697547825070120 -
So the concerns of pb tories tonight are
1 brexit
2 brexit
3 which leader can deliver the brexit we want
4 the media are stoking the fires
5 brexit
6 they cant say it but as it was only illegal immigrants so why should i worry as long as they don't steal my property
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"Guilty of Murder", fuck meDecrepitJohnL said:
Are you sure? SWP signs tend to look very professional.CarlottaVance said:Fair few Socialist Workers among the Grenfell residents:
https://twitter.com/warwickhs/status/875769754782507012
Third world country here we come
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Please take us through your thinking on that last sentence. Why is it 'blood money' ? Or are you just making sick political capital out of a tragedy?bigjohnowls said:Theresa May has announced an £8,333 aid package for each person caught up in the Grenfell tragedy (about 6 months rent in London)
Blood Money0 -
+1nichomar said:So the concerns of pb tories tonight are
1 brexit
2 brexit
3 which leader can deliver the brexit we want
4 the media are stoking the fires
5 brexit
6 they cant say it but as it was only illegal immigrants so why should i worry as long as they don't steal my property0 -
A large demonstration in Parliament Square/Whitehall now, according to the BBC.
The organisation seems quite efficient.0 -
Taxpayers money actually but fair enough in the circumstancesbigjohnowls said:Theresa May has announced an £8,333 aid package for each person caught up in the Grenfell tragedy (about 6 months rent in London)
Blood Money0 -
If it is a rentamob, the same old faces turn up to all such events. I expect the newspaper journalists are even now looking to see whether any have appeared side by side with Labour leadership figures.
But I'm sure a lot of the anger is very genuine.0 -
Because he's seen as competent, their kind of person and he is seen as delivering Brexit as they want. I would somewhat qualify those observations personally but I believe they think that.HYUFD said:
Why? Davis won the first round MPs vote in 2005 but lost the membership voteFF43 said:
I think if Davis gets to a membership vote, he'll win. Will the MPs put him there?OllyT said:
Holding their noses after 3 successive GE defeats. In the current environment they would go for a kamikaze Brexiteer, I'd put money on it.HYUFD said:
Why? The Tory membership elected Cameron, the MPs elected May?OllyT said:
When May goes the elderly Tory membership will chose a leader that best approximates UKIP's position and won't give a stuff if it harms the economy.Casino_Royale said:
Delivering Brexit as the country voted for is in the country's best interests.OllyT said:
Given where we are it really is about time the Tories started thinking about what will be in the country's best interests not the best way to avoid a party splitCasino_Royale said:It can't be Hammond.
Whoever takes over from May has to be trusted on Brexit and to deliver it, or the party will split.0 -
I sincerely hope you are rightPeterC said:OllyT said:
When May goes the elderly Tory membership will chose a leader that best approximates UKIP's position and won't give a stuff if it harms the economy.Casino_Royale said:
Delivering Brexit as the country voted for is in the country's best interests.OllyT said:
Given where we are it really is about time the Tories started thinking about what will be in the country's best interests not the best way to avoid a party splitCasino_Royale said:It can't be Hammond.
Whoever takes over from May has to be trusted on Brexit and to deliver it, or the party will split.OllyT said:
When May goes the elderly Tory membership will chose a leader that best approximates UKIP's position and won't give a stuff if it harms the economy.Casino_Royale said:
Delivering Brexit as the country voted for is in the country's best interests.OllyT said:
Given where we are it really is about time the Tories started thinking about what will be in the country's best interests not the best way to avoid a party splitCasino_Royale said:It can't be Hammond.
Whoever takes over from May has to be trusted on Brexit and to deliver it, or the party will split.
I suspect that they will not be offered such a choice by the MPs.OllyT said:
When May goes the elderly Tory membership will chose a leader that best approximates UKIP's position and won't give a stuff if it harms the economy.Casino_Royale said:
Delivering Brexit as the country voted for is in the country's best interests.OllyT said:
Given where we are it really is about time the Tories started thinking about what will be in the country's best interests not the best way to avoid a party splitCasino_Royale said:It can't be Hammond.
Whoever takes over from May has to be trusted on Brexit and to deliver it, or the party will split.0 -
For partisans, everything their enemies do is wrong.bigjohnowls said:Theresa May has announced an £8,333 aid package for each person caught up in the Grenfell tragedy (about 6 months rent in London)
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Wake Upoxfordsimon said:
Grow upbigjohnowls said:Theresa May has announced an £8,333 aid package for each person caught up in the Grenfell tragedy (about 6 months rent in London)
Blood Money
Jeremy VineVerified account @theJeremyVine 20h20 hours ago
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Incredulous at this. Faced with a choice between flammable panels and fire-resistant ones, they chose the flammables.
Total saved: £5,0000 -
I'm surprised that London doesn't seem to have an off the shelf disaster recovery plan.0
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I think I've been lucky, I was too young to remember the miners strike so I've avoided the big social strife moments. Looks like that streak is about to be broken.Sean_F said:
For partisans, everything their enemies do is wrong.bigjohnowls said:Theresa May has announced an £8,333 aid package for each person caught up in the Grenfell tragedy (about 6 months rent in London)
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No the discussions were over office allocation in the buildings of the House of Commons. There has not been and will not be any such agreement between the Lib Dems and the Tories this Parliament.nunuone said:
Wtf?!marke09 said:somone over on Digital Spy Politics forum has stated hat the DUP deal may no tbe needed as the Conservatives have opened up talks with the Lib Demsover confidece and supply deal
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Impressive! Didn't know Jeremy Vine was a Quantity Surveyor!bigjohnowls said:
Wake Upoxfordsimon said:
Grow upbigjohnowls said:Theresa May has announced an £8,333 aid package for each person caught up in the Grenfell tragedy (about 6 months rent in London)
Blood Money
Jeremy VineVerified account @theJeremyVine 20h20 hours ago
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Incredulous at this. Faced with a choice between flammable panels and fire-resistant ones, they chose the flammables.
Total saved: £5,0000 -
Just after they had £120,000 spent on each flat, even if they were illegally subletting it.bigjohnowls said:Theresa May has announced an £8,333 aid package for each person caught up in the Grenfell tragedy (about 6 months rent in London)
Blood Money
I wish I could afford to spend £120,000 on my flat.0 -
calum said:
I'm surprised that London doesn't seem to have an off the shelf disaster recovery plan.
It does - WikiLeaks published it.0 -
The anger is very understandable and needs to be expressed but the big danger for Corbyn is that the SWP and Momentum hijack it and make it into a movement to overthrow the government.AlastairMeeks said:If it is a rentamob, the same old faces turn up to all such events. I expect the newspaper journalists are even now looking to see whether any have appeared side by side with Labour leadership figures.
But I'm sure a lot of the anger is very genuine.
Corbyn's behaviour will be in the spotlight more than ever and if those causing problems can be identified with him he could start to unwind his recent success and cause concern amongst the population as a whole as to his suitability to govern0 -
You don't know why that choice was made. It certainly wasn't May phoning up the architect telling him to put them on.bigjohnowls said:
Wake Upoxfordsimon said:
Grow upbigjohnowls said:Theresa May has announced an £8,333 aid package for each person caught up in the Grenfell tragedy (about 6 months rent in London)
Blood Money
Jeremy VineVerified account @theJeremyVine 20h20 hours ago
More
Incredulous at this. Faced with a choice between flammable panels and fire-resistant ones, they chose the flammables.
Total saved: £5,000
Something went wrong, and rather than wanting to find out what went wrong, you're just making sick political capital out of the deaths. In fact, your approach will just lead to it, or something similar, happening again. Because what happened doesn't matter: you've already decided who is to blame.
Remember, this work was part of a project that spent £8.7 million renovating the block.0 -
There's always demonstrations in Parliament Square. It's more unusual for there not to be.Chris said:A large demonstration in Parliament Square/Whitehall now, according to the BBC.
The organisation seems quite efficient.0 -
I'm not sure all the information about the panels is 100% accurate. A couple of hours ago Jim Reed of the BBC was saying it wasn't clear whether the fire-retardant version was available at the time of the work.bigjohnowls said:
Wake Upoxfordsimon said:
Grow upbigjohnowls said:Theresa May has announced an £8,333 aid package for each person caught up in the Grenfell tragedy (about 6 months rent in London)
Blood Money
Jeremy VineVerified account @theJeremyVine 20h20 hours ago
More
Incredulous at this. Faced with a choice between flammable panels and fire-resistant ones, they chose the flammables.
Total saved: £5,0000 -
Dicken's was indeed writing about this, the way in which the poor was being push around London as the train companies bought up land. The explosion in the rookeries (slums) that got worse and worse.calum said:
Not blocks of flats that just had £10m to refurb though, there is a case to be made about the lack of affordable housing but to compare current living conditions to the 19th century is extreme. Unless it's twenty to a room, no running water and no kitchen.0 -
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That's as may be so but on any LA committee your influence is somewhat limited unless you're in the administration.HYUFD said:
According to the Evening Standard tonight the new Labour MP for Kensington was on the Kensington and Chelsea council housing committeenunuone said:Fpt
"3:59PM
My Corbynista girlfriend thinks the Grenfell fire was the explicit fault of the Tory government and evil capitalist landlords.
By contrast, she has suspicions about the Manchester attack, and wonders if it might have been a false flag, or some kind of hoax.
She probably has an IQ of 140 and studies Hindi and Anthropology at SOAS.
Were we this mad at 21? Have the younger generation replaced drugs and booze with conspiracy theories and mass psychosis? I am genuinely bewildered."
Its because of the internet, whereas before if you believed these things you would only find one or two people who thought like you now you will find a whole community to confirm your biases. The more people you find the more confirmation bias you have. Also the left wing young have always blamed the Tory government for everything. So maybe things haven't changed that much.......0 -
But why put something on the flats that could be hazardous? It smacks of politicians wanting to do something to make themselves feel better about those poor people who have to live in those ghastly flats.Chris said:
I'm not sure all the information about the panels is 100% accurate. A couple of hours ago Jim Reed of the BBC was saying it wasn't clear whether the fire-retardant version was available at the time of the work.bigjohnowls said:
Wake Upoxfordsimon said:
Grow upbigjohnowls said:Theresa May has announced an £8,333 aid package for each person caught up in the Grenfell tragedy (about 6 months rent in London)
Blood Money
Jeremy VineVerified account @theJeremyVine 20h20 hours ago
More
Incredulous at this. Faced with a choice between flammable panels and fire-resistant ones, they chose the flammables.
Total saved: £5,0000 -
So if any Labour council has built or renovated any properties and not used 100% guaranteed no expense spared materials you'll be calling for their removal from public office ?bigjohnowls said:
Wake Upoxfordsimon said:
Grow upbigjohnowls said:Theresa May has announced an £8,333 aid package for each person caught up in the Grenfell tragedy (about 6 months rent in London)
Blood Money
Jeremy VineVerified account @theJeremyVine 20h20 hours ago
More
Incredulous at this. Faced with a choice between flammable panels and fire-resistant ones, they chose the flammables.
Total saved: £5,000
Or if the Last Labour government built or renovated any properties and not used 100% guaranteed no expense spared materials you'll be calling for their prosecution ?
I do hope Chesterfield council have got their supplier invoices handy because you'll be down at their offices on Monday morning asking to inspect them wont you ?
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I well remember the miner's strike and this would have to escalate a lot more, and if it does Corbyn will have the most to loseHaroldO said:
I think I've been lucky, I was too young to remember the miners strike so I've avoided the big social strife moments. Looks like that streak is about to be broken.Sean_F said:
For partisans, everything their enemies do is wrong.bigjohnowls said:Theresa May has announced an £8,333 aid package for each person caught up in the Grenfell tragedy (about 6 months rent in London)
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Given that they had £120,000 per flat to spend, it clearly was not shortage of money. It is quite possibly the case that the money was spent badly.bigjohnowls said:
Wake Upoxfordsimon said:
Grow upbigjohnowls said:Theresa May has announced an £8,333 aid package for each person caught up in the Grenfell tragedy (about 6 months rent in London)
Blood Money
Jeremy VineVerified account @theJeremyVine 20h20 hours ago
More
Incredulous at this. Faced with a choice between flammable panels and fire-resistant ones, they chose the flammables.
Total saved: £5,0000 -
Indeed, as has been amply demonstrated on here over the years.Sean_F said:
For partisans, everything their enemies do is wrong.bigjohnowls said:Theresa May has announced an £8,333 aid package for each person caught up in the Grenfell tragedy (about 6 months rent in London)
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Neither Davis nor Hammond are headbangers, a choice between those 2 would be a sensible oneFF43 said:
Because he's seen as competent, their kind of person and he is seen as delivering Brexit as they want. I would somewhat qualify those observations personally but I believe they think that.HYUFD said:
Why? Davis won the first round MPs vote in 2005 but lost the membership voteFF43 said:
I think if Davis gets to a membership vote, he'll win. Will the MPs put him there?OllyT said:
Holding their noses after 3 successive GE defeats. In the current environment they would go for a kamikaze Brexiteer, I'd put money on it.HYUFD said:
Why? The Tory membership elected Cameron, the MPs elected May?OllyT said:
When May goes the elderly Tory membership will chose a leader that best approximates UKIP's position and won't give a stuff if it harms the economy.Casino_Royale said:
Delivering Brexit as the country voted for is in the country's best interests.OllyT said:
Given where we are it really is about time the Tories started thinking about what will be in the country's best interests not the best way to avoid a party splitCasino_Royale said:It can't be Hammond.
Whoever takes over from May has to be trusted on Brexit and to deliver it, or the party will split.0 -
A question for whoever draws up building regulations, surely, but I bet we'll find it had something to do with avoiding climate change.tlg86 said:
But why put something on the flats that could be hazardous?Chris said:
I'm not sure all the information about the panels is 100% accurate. A couple of hours ago Jim Reed of the BBC was saying it wasn't clear whether the fire-retardant version was available at the time of the work.bigjohnowls said:
Wake Upoxfordsimon said:
Grow upbigjohnowls said:Theresa May has announced an £8,333 aid package for each person caught up in the Grenfell tragedy (about 6 months rent in London)
Blood Money
Jeremy VineVerified account @theJeremyVine 20h20 hours ago
More
Incredulous at this. Faced with a choice between flammable panels and fire-resistant ones, they chose the flammables.
Total saved: £5,000
Does anyone think Docklands penthouses are built to any better standard?0 -
I'm from Nottingham, my parents say I was lucky to have been so young when they happened. They remember border checks when they left the county.Big_G_NorthWales said:
I well remember the miner's strike and this would have to escalate a lot more, and if it does Corbyn will have the most to loseHaroldO said:
I think I've been lucky, I was too young to remember the miners strike so I've avoided the big social strife moments. Looks like that streak is about to be broken.Sean_F said:
For partisans, everything their enemies do is wrong.bigjohnowls said:Theresa May has announced an £8,333 aid package for each person caught up in the Grenfell tragedy (about 6 months rent in London)
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We are seeing a potent example of the butterfly effect which started with some bad polling by Yougov........
Cameron being led to believe he was losing the 2015 election offered an extremely minor party to call a referendum......
the rest is a catalogue of errors which led through Brexit to the possible destruction of the Tory Party and the first Marxist government this country has had and the rest is too early to predict.
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The Osborne strategy was based on a vast wealth transfer from the young to the old:
' Student loan debt in the UK has risen to more than £100bn for the first time, underlining the rising costs young people face in order to get a university education.
Outstanding debt on loans jumped by 16.6% to £100.5bn at the end of March, up from £86.2bn a year earlier, according to the Student Loans Company. England accounted for £89.3bn of the total.
Sebastian Burnside, a senior economist at NatWest, said student debt was rising at a faster pace than any other form of debt, and eclipsed credit card debt of £68bn. “These latest figures show student debt is becoming of greater priority with every passing year. Student debt is the fastest growing type of borrowing and is rapidly becoming economically significant.”
Burnside predicted that over the longer term, student loan debt was likely to double to £200bn in six years. '
https://www.theguardian.com/money/2017/jun/15/uk-student-loan-debt-soars-to-more-than-100bn
And IIRC student tuition fees aren't even classed as debt by the BoE but rather as deferred taxation.
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Which 'politicians' are these?tlg86 said:
But why put something on the flats that could be hazardous? It smacks of politicians wanting to do something to make themselves feel better about those poor people who have to live in those ghastly flats.Chris said:
I'm not sure all the information about the panels is 100% accurate. A couple of hours ago Jim Reed of the BBC was saying it wasn't clear whether the fire-retardant version was available at the time of the work.bigjohnowls said:
Wake Upoxfordsimon said:
Grow upbigjohnowls said:Theresa May has announced an £8,333 aid package for each person caught up in the Grenfell tragedy (about 6 months rent in London)
Blood Money
Jeremy VineVerified account @theJeremyVine 20h20 hours ago
More
Incredulous at this. Faced with a choice between flammable panels and fire-resistant ones, they chose the flammables.
Total saved: £5,000
The architects were probably responsible for choosing the type of panels (assuming their directions were followed by builders and suppliers). I'm guessing the only way 'politicians' would have got involved is through the planning process - and then they'd have been more bothered about the final look of the building.0 -
Re the Queens Speech the voting of all the parties should be fascinating0
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David Lammy MP on Grenfell Tower fire: "This is a tale of two cities. This is what Dickens was writing about"0
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Yes - I think that too. It would be sensible of MPs to do that.HYUFD said:
They will probably only get a choice of 2 of Boris, Davis, Hammond and Rudd, none of whom are 'kamikaze Brexiteers.' The likes of ID'S, Patterson and Rees-Mogg who are 'kamikaze Brexiteers' will not get put to the membershipOllyT said:
Holding their noses after 3 successive GE defeats. In the current environment they would go for a kamikaze Brexiteer, I'd put money on it.HYUFD said:
Why? The Tory membership elected Cameron, the MPs elected May?OllyT said:
When May goes the elderly Tory membership will chose a leader that best approximates UKIP's position and won't give a stuff if it harms the economy.Casino_Royale said:
Delivering Brexit as the country voted for is in the country's best interests.OllyT said:
Given where we are it really is about time the Tories started thinking about what will be in the country's best interests not the best way to avoid a party splitCasino_Royale said:It can't be Hammond.
Whoever takes over from May has to be trusted on Brexit and to deliver it, or the party will split.
Indeed I could well see MPs choosing Hammond and David as the final 2 and Boris failing to make the final cut0 -
I wonder whether the panels chosen were "better" from a Climate Change POV?Sean_F said:
Given that they had £120,000 per flat to spend, it clearly was not shortage of money. It is quite possibly the case that the money was spent badly.bigjohnowls said:
Wake Upoxfordsimon said:
Grow upbigjohnowls said:Theresa May has announced an £8,333 aid package for each person caught up in the Grenfell tragedy (about 6 months rent in London)
Blood Money
Jeremy VineVerified account @theJeremyVine 20h20 hours ago
More
Incredulous at this. Faced with a choice between flammable panels and fire-resistant ones, they chose the flammables.
Total saved: £5,0000
