Surely everybody on this website woukd rather see a prediction of conservatives short of a majority by 10 seats? Imagine the fun of waiting for hours for the result from a south west marginal
Not with these leadership ratings. At this rate Corbyn will be ahead before Thursday.
My dear lady it's the hope that kills you.
Stone dead as the chimes of Big Ben finish at 10:00pm on Thursday and David Dimbledore crushes your hopes in these words :
"Our exit polls shows a Conservatives landslide ..."
I'm just hoping he says "four" as the first word when describing the number of seats for the Tories their exit poll suggests.
Definitely, and further betting opportunities on Tory leadership and Autumn GE...
And Osborne to stand as a Tory candidate in the Autumn GE.
Ooooh
lol
you can smell your desperation
GOWNBPM
I would be so happy if Clegg or Osbourne made a serious challenge to become PM. Clegg especially, he could get me off my arse and campaigning.
I fear Clegg is in the wrong party!
Clegg wouldn't have gotten completely bulldozed like Tiny Tim has. If he became their leader in 2015, and was leading them now, I'm in no doubt that the Lib Dems would be one of the major parties.
Even if the Tories win on Thursday and I think it will still be a comfortable win, Theresa May will not be seen anymore like she was 6 weeks back, Even amongst Tories.
She is actually very poor. No wonder her failures at the Home Office.
Yet she was the best Tory to be PM ?
Entirely depends on how big the win is.
No it doesn't. A lot of things will contribute to the size of any win (I hope it is a win). But whatever happens, excepting any revelations after the event such as illness, May has shown herself to be a very poor performer allowing a poorly constructed manifesto to be published, failing to score through large numbers of open goals and generally projecting an aura of vulnerability and incompetence.
Whatever the result on Thursday many of us who want a Tory win will not forget how much uncertainty and concern she has caused us and this makes us seriously doubt her abilities going forward.
To be fair to May, I think she is a better administrator than she is a campaigner. Given the pitfalls of the Home Office, she survived longer than any other modern politician in that role - you only have to look at the many people who held that office under Blair and Brown and how frequently they left it under a cloud.
She is not a campaigner - but she is the only viable PM candidate we have on offer in 4 days time.
Theresa May lasted six years at the Home Office because Cameron hated reshuffles. It does not mean she was any good. Iain Duncan Smith lasted six years at DWP and no-one's calling for him to be Prime Minister.
Well a good first step would be electing someone who doesn't support Saudi Arabia and isn't a historical supporter of terrorism in the UK. Sadly that seems to be too much to ask for these days.
A good first step would be Don't have a massive Muslim minority in your country. Too late for us, but well done all those nations that avoided this fucking disaster.
Is there anyone who could say that, on balance, the Islamic immigration of the last 50 years has been a net positive for the UK?
Only a mad, blinkered idiot. So about 40% of the country.
TBF if you said it wasn't positive you would be called a racist.
I have actually seen people looking over their shoulders before voicing negative opinions on these matters as they were worried about repercussions.
Yep. Maybe 10 percent of people outside big cities would consider Islamic multiculturalism a positive. And that's probably being generous.
Surely everybody on this website woukd rather see a prediction of conservatives short of a majority by 10 seats? Imagine the fun of waiting for hours for the result from a south west marginal
Not with these leadership ratings. At this rate Corbyn will be ahead before Thursday.
My dear lady it's the hope that kills you.
Stone dead as the chimes of Big Ben finish at 10:00pm on Thursday and David Dimbledore crushes your hopes in these words :
"Our exit polls shows a Conservatives landslide ..."
I'm just hoping he says "four" as the first word when describing the number of seats for the Tories their exit poll suggests.
Definitely, and further betting opportunities on Tory leadership and Autumn GE...
And Osborne to stand as a Tory candidate in the Autumn GE.
Ooooh
lol
you can smell your desperation
GOWNBPM
I would be so happy if Clegg or Osbourne made a serious challenge to become PM. Clegg especially, he could get me off my arse and campaigning.
I fear Clegg is in the wrong party!
Clegg wouldn't have gotten completely bulldozed like Tiny Tim has. If he became their leader in 2015, and was leading them now, I'm in no doubt that the Lib Dems would that one of the major parties.
My big worry, politically speaking is that Corbyn's defeat won't be nearly big enough. It'd be a disaster for the centre and centre-left if he was to retain over 200 seats.
The disaster will be certain if the Labour moderates don't have the guts to strike out on their own. If they can muster 120 (which is ambitious but not impossible) they can become the official opposition, get the soft money and watch as the moderate unions quit Corbyn for a new 'progressive' home
(I hate the word progressive - but it seems a likely name for a new movement)
If Macron can strike out on his own, surely Labour moderates can think of doing the same.
Like I just said, we are facing a civil emergency, potentially a low-level but chronic civil war (when the native population finally fights back - which it will)
23,000 jihadis in the UK. 23,000.
Maybe 200,000 sympathisers. Mind-fucking stats
Imagine if the jihadis up their game - just a bit - and these attacks come at us once a week, with numbing success and regularity. We will be Ulster in the 70s, with extra horror and race/religious hatred. Internment will be inevitable. And worse.
Indeed, it looks like Enoch may have been right. But it is not their blood (Terrorists) but our blood (civilians) that is running like the "River Tiber foaming with much blood".
I suppose one good thing about Brexit will be we make our own laws and will be accountable only to ourselves. We therefore can crackdown on the elements in society who inflame tension and suppress those who indoctrinate and radicalise the enemy within.
Like I just said, we are facing a civil emergency, potentially a low-level but chronic civil war (when the native population finally fights back - which it will)
23,000 jihadis in the UK. 23,000.
Maybe 200,000 sympathisers. Mind-fucking stats
Imagine if the jihadis up their game - just a bit - and these attacks come at us once a week, with numbing success and regularity. We will be Ulster in the 70s, with extra horror and race/religious hatred. Internment will be inevitable. And worse.
Enoch Powell is a strange one. He was a kind of crazy but brilliant physician who completely misdiagnosed the problem (black immigration), but who nonetheless sensed something was very wrong, in the face of received opinion, and then gave absolutely the right prognosis.
Question for you MrT - if I had to read one of your books, which should it be?
Corbyn speech - his Foreign policy one was well received below the line in the Mail
Top comment this time 220 green arrows, 57 red arrows.
Genuine red, Oxford, United Kingdom, 13 minutes ago
So Corbynn is using people's deaths to get votes , this man didn't even want to arm our police , without arms there would have been more deaths . Only a man without honour would use this as an election statement .
With respect, people who comment on newspaper articles tend to be keen. More so in the free to access Guardian and Mail.
Momentum has absolutely swamped the MailOnline comment section in recent weeks. It's a war game. Proportionality in the comments there now means zero in relation to actual reader opinion. Regular Mail types won't bother to struggle to log a POV against such a tide.
They will vote on Thurs though.
Still think they haven't swamped the polling panels too?
My big worry, politically speaking is that Corbyn's defeat won't be nearly big enough. It'd be a disaster for the centre and centre-left if he was to retain over 200 seats.
The disaster will be certain if the Labour moderates don't have the guts to strike out on their own. If they can muster 120 (which is ambitious but not impossible) they can become the official opposition, get the soft money and watch as the moderate unions quit Corbyn for a new 'progressive' home
(I hate the word progressive - but it seems a likely name for a new movement)
If Macron can strike out on his own, surely Labour moderates can think of doing the same.
You don't get it. It is Corbyn who has struck out on his own and changed the political agenda. Labour moderates thought he was a loser but they've discovered, to their amazement, that he is a winner. Win or lose, the Labour party will support Corbyn after this election. He will be seen as a hero.
My big worry, politically speaking is that Corbyn's defeat won't be nearly big enough. It'd be a disaster for the centre and centre-left if he was to retain over 200 seats.
The disaster will be certain if the Labour moderates don't have the guts to strike out on their own. If they can muster 120 (which is ambitious but not impossible) they can become the official opposition, get the soft money and watch as the moderate unions quit Corbyn for a new 'progressive' home
(I hate the word progressive - but it seems a likely name for a new movement)
If Macron can strike out on his own, surely Labour moderates can think of doing the same.
If they wait for a 120 names it will be the end of days
My big worry, politically speaking is that Corbyn's defeat won't be nearly big enough. It'd be a disaster for the centre and centre-left if he was to retain over 200 seats.
The disaster will be certain if the Labour moderates don't have the guts to strike out on their own. If they can muster 120 (which is ambitious but not impossible) they can become the official opposition, get the soft money and watch as the moderate unions quit Corbyn for a new 'progressive' home
(I hate the word progressive - but it seems a likely name for a new movement)
If Macron can strike out on his own, surely Labour moderates can think of doing the same.
You don't get it. It is Corbyn who has struck out on his own and changed the political agenda. Labour moderates thought he was a loser but they've discovered, to their amazement, that he is a winner. Win or lose, the Labour party will support Corbyn after this election. He will be seen as a hero.
May weak on terror Wobbly on the causes of terror.
Corbyn on the side of terror (providing it's Irish Republicans or Palestinians).
provided its anti west you mean
You are quite right, I was being too generous, in fact today might be the first time Corbyn has condemned terrorism without a wheelbarrow full of qualifications.
My big worry, politically speaking is that Corbyn's defeat won't be nearly big enough. It'd be a disaster for the centre and centre-left if he was to retain over 200 seats.
The disaster will be certain if the Labour moderates don't have the guts to strike out on their own. If they can muster 120 (which is ambitious but not impossible) they can become the official opposition, get the soft money and watch as the moderate unions quit Corbyn for a new 'progressive' home
(I hate the word progressive - but it seems a likely name for a new movement)
If Macron can strike out on his own, surely Labour moderates can think of doing the same.
If they wait for a 120 names it will be the end of days
Get Clegg to grab 50 of them, and tell them that after the next GE they'll be the senior leadership of one of the two major parties in the UK.
Like I just said, we are facing a civil emergency, potentially a low-level but chronic civil war (when the native population finally fights back - which it will)
23,000 jihadis in the UK. 23,000.
Maybe 200,000 sympathisers. Mind-fucking stats
Imagine if the jihadis up their game - just a bit - and these attacks come at us once a week, with numbing success and regularity. We will be Ulster in the 70s, with extra horror and race/religious hatred. Internment will be inevitable. And worse.
Enoch Powell is a strange one. He was a kind of crazy but brilliant physician who completely misdiagnosed the problem (black immigration), but who nonetheless sensed something was very wrong, in the face of received opinion, and then gave absolutely the right prognosis.
No. Powell's pronouncements on immigration only tended to pop up when the issue was already in the news. He was an archetypal bandwagon politician in that regard, sniffing out a mood others had engendered and seizing upon it for his own ends.
I've just started a Yougov poll. It started with the usual questions about voting intentions, and moved on to an energy prices question which seemed impossible to move on from - I suspect there must have been a bug in the page. I don't think I'm being uniquely stupid - but I'd expect a lot of surveyees to have given up at this point too. In which case their next survey output might be a bit lacking in sample data.
Like I just said, we are facing a civil emergency, potentially a low-level but chronic civil war (when the native population finally fights back - which it will)
23,000 jihadis in the UK. 23,000.
Maybe 200,000 sympathisers. Mind-fucking stats
Imagine if the jihadis up their game - just a bit - and these attacks come at us once a week, with numbing success and regularity. We will be Ulster in the 70s, with extra horror and race/religious hatred. Internment will be inevitable. And worse.
Enoch Powell is a strange one. He was a kind of crazy but brilliant physician who completely misdiagnosed the problem (black immigration), but who nonetheless sensed something was very wrong, in the face of received opinion, and then gave absolutely the right prognosis.
He was a clever man ruined by a classical education.
Corbyn speech - his Foreign policy one was well received below the line in the Mail
Top comment this time 220 green arrows, 57 red arrows.
Genuine red, Oxford, United Kingdom, 13 minutes ago
So Corbynn is using people's deaths to get votes , this man didn't even want to arm our police , without arms there would have been more deaths . Only a man without honour would use this as an election statement .
With respect, people who comment on newspaper articles tend to be keen. More so in the free to access Guardian and Mail.
Momentum has absolutely swamped the MailOnline comment section in recent weeks. It's a war game. Proportionality in the comments there now means zero in relation to actual reader opinion. Regular Mail types won't bother to struggle to log a POV against such a tide.
They will vote on Thurs though.
Still think they haven't swamped the polling panels too?
All the companies? and the phone polls, and the Scotland and Wales ones?
What I hear as anecdata, and overhead conversations etc supports the polls. I also don't think that it is just the 18-24's, the 25-40's of Gen Y are in the same mood. They have been stiffed by the Tories and are out for revenge.
Lol. Sadiq has been useless tbh. He gave succour to the terrorists by telling Londoners it was part of living in a big city. He needs to row back on that statement.
Like I just said, we are facing a civil emergency, potentially a low-level but chronic civil war (when the native population finally fights back - which it will)
23,000 jihadis in the UK. 23,000.
Maybe 200,000 sympathisers. Mind-fucking stats
Imagine if the jihadis up their game - just a bit - and these attacks come at us once a week, with numbing success and regularity. We will be Ulster in the 70s, with extra horror and race/religious hatred. Internment will be inevitable. And worse.
Enoch Powell is a strange one. He was a kind of crazy but brilliant physician who completely misdiagnosed the problem (black immigration), but who nonetheless sensed something was very wrong, in the face of received opinion, and then gave absolutely the right prognosis.
Please read up on him! He didn't completely misdiagnose the problem. His whole philosophy was based on communalism in India. When he says 'coloured' or 'black' he is referring to Asian immigrants as well as West Indians, generally he said 'commonwealth'
Watch the ten mins from 10:00 he pinpoints the problem with lack of assimilation of Pakistanis in Birmingham in 1965
My big worry, politically speaking is that Corbyn's defeat won't be nearly big enough. It'd be a disaster for the centre and centre-left if he was to retain over 200 seats.
The disaster will be certain if the Labour moderates don't have the guts to strike out on their own. If they can muster 120 (which is ambitious but not impossible) they can become the official opposition, get the soft money and watch as the moderate unions quit Corbyn for a new 'progressive' home
(I hate the word progressive - but it seems a likely name for a new movement)
If Macron can strike out on his own, surely Labour moderates can think of doing the same.
You don't get it. It is Corbyn who has struck out on his own and changed the political agenda. Labour moderates thought he was a loser but they've discovered, to their amazement, that he is a winner. Win or lose, the Labour party will support Corbyn after this election. He will be seen as a hero.
Doesn't that rather depend on the result?
No, unless it is a Tory landslide. If it is a slim Tory majority, say 30, then Mrs May will lose her job before Mr Corbyn loses his.
My big worry, politically speaking is that Corbyn's defeat won't be nearly big enough. It'd be a disaster for the centre and centre-left if he was to retain over 200 seats.
The disaster will be certain if the Labour moderates don't have the guts to strike out on their own. If they can muster 120 (which is ambitious but not impossible) they can become the official opposition, get the soft money and watch as the moderate unions quit Corbyn for a new 'progressive' home
(I hate the word progressive - but it seems a likely name for a new movement)
If Macron can strike out on his own, surely Labour moderates can think of doing the same.
You don't get it. It is Corbyn who has struck out on his own and changed the political agenda. Labour moderates thought he was a loser but they've discovered, to their amazement, that he is a winner. Win or lose, the Labour party will support Corbyn after this election. He will be seen as a hero.
Doesn't that rather depend on the result?
No, unless it is a Tory landslide. If it is a slim Tory majority, say 30, then Mrs May will lose her job before Mr Corbyn loses his.
Surely everybody on this website woukd rather see a prediction of conservatives short of a majority by 10 seats? Imagine the fun of waiting for hours for the result from a south west marginal
My big worry, politically speaking is that Corbyn's defeat won't be nearly big enough. It'd be a disaster for the centre and centre-left if he was to retain over 200 seats.
The disaster will be certain if the Labour moderates don't have the guts to strike out on their own. If they can muster 120 (which is ambitious but not impossible) they can become the official opposition, get the soft money and watch as the moderate unions quit Corbyn for a new 'progressive' home
(I hate the word progressive - but it seems a likely name for a new movement)
If Macron can strike out on his own, surely Labour moderates can think of doing the same.
You don't get it. It is Corbyn who has struck out on his own and changed the political agenda. Labour moderates thought he was a loser but they've discovered, to their amazement, that he is a winner. Win or lose, the Labour party will support Corbyn after this election. He will be seen as a hero.
Doesn't that rather depend on the result?
No, unless it is a Tory landslide. If it is a slim Tory majority, say 30, then Mrs May will lose her job before Mr Corbyn loses his.
Lol. Sadiq has been useless tbh. He gave succour to the terrorists by telling Londoners it was part of living in a big city. He needs to row back on that statement.
Even Tories say that quote was taken out of context, look at the next bit he said.
My big worry, politically speaking is that Corbyn's defeat won't be nearly big enough. It'd be a disaster for the centre and centre-left if he was to retain over 200 seats.
The disaster will be certain if the Labour moderates don't have the guts to strike out on their own. If they can muster 120 (which is ambitious but not impossible) they can become the official opposition, get the soft money and watch as the moderate unions quit Corbyn for a new 'progressive' home
(I hate the word progressive - but it seems a likely name for a new movement)
If Macron can strike out on his own, surely Labour moderates can think of doing the same.
Yes, the only problem is Labour members, politicians and the like believe 100% in the brand. They will not consider mass exodus, the party is their whole world in many cases, the only way forward for Labour or the left is for Corbyn to suffer a 1931 style defeat. Even then it would be touch and go whether he would actually leave of his own volition. If they split then they hand more seats to the Tories.
The Tories in my opinion are going to win big on Thursday, much bigger than the received wisdom of opinion poll followers.
My big worry, politically speaking is that Corbyn's defeat won't be nearly big enough. It'd be a disaster for the centre and centre-left if he was to retain over 200 seats.
The disaster will be certain if the Labour moderates don't have the guts to strike out on their own. If they can muster 120 (which is ambitious but not impossible) they can become the official opposition, get the soft money and watch as the moderate unions quit Corbyn for a new 'progressive' home
(I hate the word progressive - but it seems a likely name for a new movement)
If Macron can strike out on his own, surely Labour moderates can think of doing the same.
You don't get it. It is Corbyn who has struck out on his own and changed the political agenda. Labour moderates thought he was a loser but they've discovered, to their amazement, that he is a winner. Win or lose, the Labour party will support Corbyn after this election. He will be seen as a hero.
Doesn't that rather depend on the result?
No, unless it is a Tory landslide. If it is a slim Tory majority, say 30, then Mrs May will lose her job before Mr Corbyn loses his.
Like I just said, we are facing a civil emergency, potentially a low-level but chronic civil war (when the native population finally fights back - which it will)
23,000 jihadis in the UK. 23,000.
Maybe 200,000 sympathisers. Mind-fucking stats
Imagine if the jihadis up their game - just a bit - and these attacks come at us once a week, with numbing success and regularity. We will be Ulster in the 70s, with extra horror and race/religious hatred. Internment will be inevitable. And worse.
Enoch Powell is a strange one. He was a kind of crazy but brilliant physician who completely misdiagnosed the problem (black immigration), but who nonetheless sensed something was very wrong, in the face of received opinion, and then gave absolutely the right prognosis.
Question for you MrT - if I had to read one of your books, which should it be?
The Ice Twins
Or my next one, When She's Alone - but not out til next year.
Thanks. Your latest sounds like the title of a website...
Lol. Sadiq has been useless tbh. He gave succour to the terrorists by telling Londoners it was part of living in a big city. He needs to row back on that statement.
Even Tories say that quote was taken out of context, look at the next bit he said.
So was Maggie, people don't care what the next sentence is, they care about the big statement. Loads of my fb are liking a comment calling him out.
My big worry, politically speaking is that Corbyn's defeat won't be nearly big enough. It'd be a disaster for the centre and centre-left if he was to retain over 200 seats.
The disaster will be certain if the Labour moderates don't have the guts to strike out on their own. If they can muster 120 (which is ambitious but not impossible) they can become the official opposition, get the soft money and watch as the moderate unions quit Corbyn for a new 'progressive' home
(I hate the word progressive - but it seems a likely name for a new movement)
If Macron can strike out on his own, surely Labour moderates can think of doing the same.
You don't get it. It is Corbyn who has struck out on his own and changed the political agenda. Labour moderates thought he was a loser but they've discovered, to their amazement, that he is a winner. Win or lose, the Labour party will support Corbyn after this election. He will be seen as a hero.
That is right. Corbyn will be an energetic LOTO, and remain a cult figure. He will be too old for 2022, so time will heal the Labour rift. His ideas will be mainstream and his successor PM.
I've just started a Yougov poll. It started with the usual questions about voting intentions, and moved on to an energy prices question which seemed impossible to move on from - I suspect there must have been a bug in the page. I don't think I'm being uniquely stupid - but I'd expect a lot of surveyees to have given up at this point too. In which case their next survey output might be a bit lacking in sample data.
I've just started a Yougov poll. It started with the usual questions about voting intentions, and moved on to an energy prices question which seemed impossible to move on from - I suspect there must have been a bug in the page. I don't think I'm being uniquely stupid - but I'd expect a lot of surveyees to have given up at this point too. In which case their next survey output might be a bit lacking in sample data.
It's subliminal.
Tories are going to freeze your energy prices
More likely to freeze your granny.
Only after we have eaten your babies. Which all good Tories do on a daily basis. I get mine delivered via Ocado. So convenient
Corbyn speech - his Foreign policy one was well received below the line in the Mail
Top comment this time 220 green arrows, 57 red arrows.
Genuine red, Oxford, United Kingdom, 13 minutes ago
So Corbynn is using people's deaths to get votes , this man didn't even want to arm our police , without arms there would have been more deaths . Only a man without honour would use this as an election statement .
With respect, people who comment on newspaper articles tend to be keen. More so in the free to access Guardian and Mail.
Momentum has absolutely swamped the MailOnline comment section in recent weeks. It's a war game. Proportionality in the comments there now means zero in relation to actual reader opinion. Regular Mail types won't bother to struggle to log a POV against such a tide.
They will vote on Thurs though.
Still think they haven't swamped the polling panels too?
My big worry, politically speaking is that Corbyn's defeat won't be nearly big enough. It'd be a disaster for the centre and centre-left if he was to retain over 200 seats.
The disaster will be certain if the Labour moderates don't have the guts to strike out on their own. If they can muster 120 (which is ambitious but not impossible) they can become the official opposition, get the soft money and watch as the moderate unions quit Corbyn for a new 'progressive' home
(I hate the word progressive - but it seems a likely name for a new movement)
If Macron can strike out on his own, surely Labour moderates can think of doing the same.
You don't get it. It is Corbyn who has struck out on his own and changed the political agenda. Labour moderates thought he was a loser but they've discovered, to their amazement, that he is a winner. Win or lose, the Labour party will support Corbyn after this election. He will be seen as a hero.
Doesn't that rather depend on the result?
No, unless it is a Tory landslide. If it is a slim Tory majority, say 30, then Mrs May will lose her job before Mr Corbyn loses his.
I think you're right about that.
I'm not convinced tory MP's could agree on a replacement right now, or in the immediate post-election period.
Hammond? I don't think he wants it. Rudd perhaps? If she keeps her seat.
But that person would still have a huge mandate problem with the rest of the country who had just voted for May's strong and stable.
I think, so long as May has a majority of some kind, she's safe in the short term.
The first major brexit argument will probably topple her though. She may want to go before she's pushed.
My big worry, politically speaking is that Corbyn's defeat won't be nearly big enough. It'd be a disaster for the centre and centre-left if he was to retain over 200 seats.
The disaster will be certain if the Labour moderates don't have the guts to strike out on their own. If they can muster 120 (which is ambitious but not impossible) they can become the official opposition, get the soft money and watch as the moderate unions quit Corbyn for a new 'progressive' home
(I hate the word progressive - but it seems a likely name for a new movement)
If Macron can strike out on his own, surely Labour moderates can think of doing the same.
You don't get it. It is Corbyn who has struck out on his own and changed the political agenda. Labour moderates thought he was a loser but they've discovered, to their amazement, that he is a winner. Win or lose, the Labour party will support Corbyn after this election. He will be seen as a hero.
That is right. Corbyn will be an energetic LOTO, and remain a cult figure. He will be too old for 2022, so time will heal the Labour rift. His ideas will be mainstream and his successor PM.
My big worry, politically speaking is that Corbyn's defeat won't be nearly big enough. It'd be a disaster for the centre and centre-left if he was to retain over 200 seats.
The disaster will be certain if the Labour moderates don't have the guts to strike out on their own. If they can muster 120 (which is ambitious but not impossible) they can become the official opposition, get the soft money and watch as the moderate unions quit Corbyn for a new 'progressive' home
(I hate the word progressive - but it seems a likely name for a new movement)
If Macron can strike out on his own, surely Labour moderates can think of doing the same.
You don't get it. It is Corbyn who has struck out on his own and changed the political agenda. Labour moderates thought he was a loser but they've discovered, to their amazement, that he is a winner. Win or lose, the Labour party will support Corbyn after this election. He will be seen as a hero.
That is right. Corbyn will be an energetic LOTO, and remain a cult figure. He will be too old for 2022, so time will heal the Labour rift. His ideas will be mainstream and his successor PM.
Why on earth would he suddenly become energetic now? He has barely got beyond languid.
And I think you have confused cult for similar word with 'n' rather than 'l'
My big worry, politically speaking is that Corbyn's defeat won't be nearly big enough. It'd be a disaster for the centre and centre-left if he was to retain over 200 seats.
The disaster will be certain if the Labour moderates don't have the guts to strike out on their own. If they can muster 120 (which is ambitious but not impossible) they can become the official opposition, get the soft money and watch as the moderate unions quit Corbyn for a new 'progressive' home
(I hate the word progressive - but it seems a likely name for a new movement)
If Macron can strike out on his own, surely Labour moderates can think of doing the same.
You don't get it. It is Corbyn who has struck out on his own and changed the political agenda. Labour moderates thought he was a loser but they've discovered, to their amazement, that he is a winner. Win or lose, the Labour party will support Corbyn after this election. He will be seen as a hero.
Nah. He's like a crap contestant on a talent show who rides the wave of youth celebrity for a few weeks till everyone realises they're shit. See Jedward or Honey G..
My big worry, politically speaking is that Corbyn's defeat won't be nearly big enough. It'd be a disaster for the centre and centre-left if he was to retain over 200 seats.
The disaster will be certain if the Labour moderates don't have the guts to strike out on their own. If they can muster 120 (which is ambitious but not impossible) they can become the official opposition, get the soft money and watch as the moderate unions quit Corbyn for a new 'progressive' home
(I hate the word progressive - but it seems a likely name for a new movement)
If Macron can strike out on his own, surely Labour moderates can think of doing the same.
You don't get it. It is Corbyn who has struck out on his own and changed the political agenda. Labour moderates thought he was a loser but they've discovered, to their amazement, that he is a winner. Win or lose, the Labour party will support Corbyn after this election. He will be seen as a hero.
Doesn't that rather depend on the result?
I don't think so. Regardless of the result, it is now beyond doubt that Corbyn himself has had a brilliant campaign. It would be churlish to deny that.
Don't forget, about 30 MPs will probably owe him their seat.
I wish it was the SPD/Linke/Greens, but it's really not. Nor is it the AfD. Germans increasingly think she's done a great job. it's not even clear that the AfD will make it over the 5% threshold if their decline continues.
Lol. Sadiq has been useless tbh. He gave succour to the terrorists by telling Londoners it was part of living in a big city. He needs to row back on that statement.
Even Tories say that quote was taken out of context, look at the next bit he said.
Sadiq is just... pitifully boring. He's neither good nor bad. He's an empty vessel. Mediocre. Invisible. The one thing he's done is cancel a bridge.
A grave disappointment to the Labour right.
Let's be fair- he has also reneged on his promise to freeze TfL fares and his promise to plant millions of new trees.
My big worry, politically speaking is that Corbyn's defeat won't be nearly big enough. It'd be a disaster for the centre and centre-left if he was to retain over 200 seats.
The disaster will be certain if the Labour moderates don't have the guts to strike out on their own. If they can muster 120 (which is ambitious but not impossible) they can become the official opposition, get the soft money and watch as the moderate unions quit Corbyn for a new 'progressive' home
(I hate the word progressive - but it seems a likely name for a new movement)
If Macron can strike out on his own, surely Labour moderates can think of doing the same.
You don't get it. It is Corbyn who has struck out on his own and changed the political agenda. Labour moderates thought he was a loser but they've discovered, to their amazement, that he is a winner. Win or lose, the Labour party will support Corbyn after this election. He will be seen as a hero.
Doesn't that rather depend on the result?
I don't think so. Regardless of the result, it is now beyond doubt that Corbyn himself has had a brilliant campaign. It would be churlish to deny that.
Don't forget, about 30 MPs will probably owe him their seat.
Looks like SDP Mark II is now gone.
Won't be much comfort if they still lose 40-50 seats.
My big worry, politically speaking is that Corbyn's defeat won't be nearly big enough. It'd be a disaster for the centre and centre-left if he was to retain over 200 seats.
The disaster will be certain if the Labour moderates don't have the guts to strike out on their own. If they can muster 120 (which is ambitious but not impossible) they can become the official opposition, get the soft money and watch as the moderate unions quit Corbyn for a new 'progressive' home
(I hate the word progressive - but it seems a likely name for a new movement)
If Macron can strike out on his own, surely Labour moderates can think of doing the same.
You don't get it. It is Corbyn who has struck out on his own and changed the political agenda. Labour moderates thought he was a loser but they've discovered, to their amazement, that he is a winner. Win or lose, the Labour party will support Corbyn after this election. He will be seen as a hero.
Doesn't that rather depend on the result?
I don't think so. Regardless of the result, it is now beyond doubt that Corbyn himself has had a brilliant campaign. It would be churlish to deny that.
Don't forget, about 30 MPs will probably owe him their seat.
Looks like SDP Mark II is now gone.
Even the most pessimistic amongst us don't believe that Labour will only be left with 30 MPs. But you may be right.
My big worry, politically speaking is that Corbyn's defeat won't be nearly big enough. It'd be a disaster for the centre and centre-left if he was to retain over 200 seats.
The disaster will be certain if the Labour moderates don't have the guts to strike out on their own. If they can muster 120 (which is ambitious but not impossible) they can become the official opposition, get the soft money and watch as the moderate unions quit Corbyn for a new 'progressive' home
(I hate the word progressive - but it seems a likely name for a new movement)
If Macron can strike out on his own, surely Labour moderates can think of doing the same.
You don't get it. It is Corbyn who has struck out on his own and changed the political agenda. Labour moderates thought he was a loser but they've discovered, to their amazement, that he is a winner. Win or lose, the Labour party will support Corbyn after this election. He will be seen as a hero.
Nah. He's like a crap contestant on a talent show who rides the wave of youth celebrity for a few weeks till everyone realises they're shit. See Jedward or Honey G..
No, I think he's more like Saara Aalto. Everyone thought she was Week 1-4 cannon fodder. But somehow she kept seeing off opponents in the sing off before looking like having a serious chance of winning. But in the end she came up just short and the original favourite won.
Sadly you're right. It's one of the reasons why minorities generally continue to vote Labour/regard them as 'the only option.' And despite Corbyn's many flaws, I don't blame them for doing so.
Like I just said, we are facing a civil emergency, potentially a low-level but chronic civil war (when the native population finally fights back - which it will)
23,000 jihadis in the UK. 23,000.
Maybe 200,000 sympathisers. Mind-fucking stats
Imagine if the jihadis up their game - just a bit - and these attacks come at us once a week, with numbing success and regularity. We will be Ulster in the 70s, with extra horror and race/religious hatred. Internment will be inevitable. And worse.
Enoch Powell is a strange one. He was a kind of crazy but brilliant physician who completely misdiagnosed the problem (black immigration), but who nonetheless sensed something was very wrong, in the face of received opinion, and then gave absolutely the right prognosis.
No. Powell's pronouncements on immigration only tended to pop up when the issue was already in the news. He was an archetypal bandwagon politician in that regard, sniffing out a mood others had engendered and seizing upon it for his own ends.
I've just ordered two books about him. I've grown up with the received idea that he was a clever man who went very badly wrong, but some of the videos Isam links to are pretty blood-chilling in their accuracy. Like it or not, Powell predicted our present situation with absolute precision. When everyone else was whistling Kumbaya.
Did he just get lucky? I need to discover for myself.
My big worry, politically speaking is that Corbyn's defeat won't be nearly big enough. It'd be a disaster for the centre and centre-left if he was to retain over 200 seats.
The disaster will be certain if the Labour moderates don't have the guts to strike out on their own. If they can muster 120 (which is ambitious but not impossible) they can become the official opposition, get the soft money and watch as the moderate unions quit Corbyn for a new 'progressive' home
(I hate the word progressive - but it seems a likely name for a new movement)
If Macron can strike out on his own, surely Labour moderates can think of doing the same.
You don't get it. It is Corbyn who has struck out on his own and changed the political agenda. Labour moderates thought he was a loser but they've discovered, to their amazement, that he is a winner. Win or lose, the Labour party will support Corbyn after this election. He will be seen as a hero.
That is right. Corbyn will be an energetic LOTO, and remain a cult figure. He will be too old for 2022, so time will heal the Labour rift. His ideas will be mainstream and his successor PM.
Corbyn has not been energetic for the last two years, what is suddenly going to change about him. His proponents say he is a conviction politician, his detractors say he is stuck in the past and has terrorist sympathies and a complete disregard for the British state.
The nearest I can think of is Ken Livingstone being London mayor but London is a Labour city the United Kingdom is not a left-wing country. The UK is pretty Conservative, Livingstone lost London in 2008 despite it being a Labour city. Livingstone tried to moderate his views, Corbyn is to the left of Livingstone on the watered down left-wing platform he presented as his manifesto. If Corbyn or a left-wing successor took the helm of Labour for the 2022 election you would probably find Labour even further to the left. The electorate will reject Corbyn or his successor again.
Lol. Sadiq has been useless tbh. He gave succour to the terrorists by telling Londoners it was part of living in a big city. He needs to row back on that statement.
Even Tories say that quote was taken out of context, look at the next bit he said.
Sadiq is just... pitifully boring. He's neither good nor bad. He's an empty vessel. Mediocre. Invisible. The one thing he's done is cancel a bridge.
A grave disappointment to the Labour right.
Let's be fair- he has also reneged on his promise to freeze TfL fares and his promise to plant millions of new trees.
My big worry, politically speaking is that Corbyn's defeat won't be nearly big enough. It'd be a disaster for the centre and centre-left if he was to retain over 200 seats.
The disaster will be certain if the Labour moderates don't have the guts to strike out on their own. If they can muster 120 (which is ambitious but not impossible) they can become the official opposition, get the soft money and watch as the moderate unions quit Corbyn for a new 'progressive' home
(I hate the word progressive - but it seems a likely name for a new movement)
If Macron can strike out on his own, surely Labour moderates can think of doing the same.
After this campaign they will be lucky to muster 20.
When May finally gets the boot, who's there to potentially replace her? The cabinet looks very uninspiring, with the exception of Greg Clark. Currently 100/1 at Ladbrokes.
That is right. Corbyn will be an energetic LOTO, and remain a cult figure. He will be too old for 2022, so time will heal the Labour rift. His ideas will be mainstream and his successor PM.
We'll probably be in a Brexit induced recession by then with a high degree of uncertainty about the way forward and a population that will be fed up with politics. It will be a different landscape.
Lol. Sadiq has been useless tbh. He gave succour to the terrorists by telling Londoners it was part of living in a big city. He needs to row back on that statement.
Even Tories say that quote was taken out of context, look at the next bit he said.
Sadiq is just... pitifully boring. He's neither good nor bad. He's an empty vessel. Mediocre. Invisible. The one thing he's done is cancel a bridge.
A grave disappointment to the Labour right.
Let's be fair- he has also reneged on his promise to freeze TfL fares and his promise to plant millions of new trees.
Corbyn speech - his Foreign policy one was well received below the line in the Mail
Top comment this time 220 green arrows, 57 red arrows.
Genuine red, Oxford, United Kingdom, 13 minutes ago
So Corbynn is using people's deaths to get votes , this man didn't even want to arm our police , without arms there would have been more deaths . Only a man without honour would use this as an election statement .
With respect, people who comment on newspaper articles tend to be keen. More so in the free to access Guardian and Mail.
Momentum has absolutely swamped the MailOnline comment section in recent weeks. It's a war game. Proportionality in the comments there now means zero in relation to actual reader opinion. Regular Mail types won't bother to struggle to log a POV against such a tide.
They will vote on Thurs though.
Still think they haven't swamped the polling panels too?
All the companies? and the phone polls, and the Scotland and Wales ones?
What I hear as anecdata, and overhead conversations etc supports the polls. I also don't think that it is just the 18-24's, the 25-40's of Gen Y are in the same mood. They have been stiffed by the Tories and are out for revenge.
Depends who you talk to. I guess in a hospital you'd hear more pro Corbyn views. I run a small group of betting shops and most of the things I hear from customers (particularly from pensioners) about him aren't repeatable.
I wish it was the SPD/Linke/Greens, but it's really not. Nor is it the AfD. Germans increasingly think she's done a great job. it's not even clear that the AfD will make it over the 5% threshold if their decline continues.
+1. She is set to win in September, Germans have not abandoned her after the Syrian refugees saga, they've embraced her. The Schulz bounce was incredibly short lived. WithTrump in the WH, she is in many ways the leader of the free world now.
I've always been a fan, because her pragmatic approach.
Like I just said, we are facing a civil emergency, potentially a low-level but chronic civil war (when the native population finally fights back - which it will)
23,000 jihadis in the UK. 23,000.
Maybe 200,000 sympathisers. Mind-fucking stats
Imagine if the jihadis up their game - just a bit - and these attacks come at us once a week, with numbing success and regularity. We will be Ulster in the 70s, with extra horror and race/religious hatred. Internment will be inevitable. And worse.
Enoch Powell is a strange one. He was a kind of crazy but brilliant physician who completely misdiagnosed the problem (black immigration), but who nonetheless sensed something was very wrong, in the face of received opinion, and then gave absolutely the right prognosis.
No. Powell's pronouncements on immigration only tended to pop up when the issue was already in the news. He was an archetypal bandwagon politician in that regard, sniffing out a mood others had engendered and seizing upon it for his own ends.
I've just ordered two books about him. I've grown up with the received idea that he was a clever man who went very badly wrong, but some of the videos Isam links to are pretty blood-chilling in their accuracy. Like it or not, Powell predicted our present situation with absolute precision. When everyone else was whistling Kumbaya.
Did he just get lucky? I need to discover for myself.
I went to Brighton Uni in 2010 to study Humanities as a 35 year old leftie who'd just voted for Gordon Brown, and got decent marks for a couple of essays on Marxism.
Then we studied Rivers of Blood... and were literally told to find the racism. I ended up arguing w the lecturer (who I was older than!) over 7/7 (as someone in the city on that day). I didn't want to say the things I was saying but they were true, Enoch was right!
Unfortunately the national Front and BNP agreed with him for different reasons and his name is tainted by association. Contemporary polls (!) re his speech were massive landslides in favour
North East Hampshire: never before seen Labour posters in well-to-do rural villages.
Sunday lunch pub conversation ( same constituency): four oldies, who I would have automatically put in the blue column, livid about winter fuel allowance. Talk of not voting Tory. Where there vote goes instead remains a mystery. Abstention? Damaged Tory core vote?
When May finally gets the boot, who's there to potentially replace her? The cabinet looks very uninspiring, with the exception of Greg Clark. Currently 100/1 at Ladbrokes.
If it happens in the next year, I'd say Gove or Hammond. Boris has absolutely no chance, and Rudd only the most slender.
When May finally gets the boot, who's there to potentially replace her? The cabinet looks very uninspiring, with the exception of Greg Clark. Currently 100/1 at Ladbrokes.
There's likely to be a challenge when the Brexit talks get stuck so it will probably be a battle between the true believer Brexiteers and and an emboldened Remainer. IDS vs Ken Clarke all over again but this time with the whole country on the line.
If one of you could find the time to take a copy of That Horrible Speech and, ignoring the horribleness, mark with one of those fluorescent markers the passages in it which are actually, you know, wrong, that would be immensely helpful.
When you've done that, you can explain whether you think George Washington's view differs from Powell's, and whether he was right? He said
"The policy or advantage of [immigration] taking place in a body (I mean the settling of them in a body) may be much questioned; for, by so doing, they retain the language, habits, and principles (good or bad) which they bring with them. Whereas by an intermixture with our people, they, or their descendants, get assimilated to our customs, measures, and laws: in a word, soon become one people."
As you are thick lefties I have to point out that "Because Enoch Powell" is not an argument which refutes Enoch Powell. And it sure as shit doesn't refute George Washington.
When May finally gets the boot, who's there to potentially replace her? The cabinet looks very uninspiring, with the exception of Greg Clark. Currently 100/1 at Ladbrokes.
There's likely to be a challenge when the Brexit talks get stuck so it will probably be a battle between the true believer Brexiteers and and an emboldened Remainer. IDS vs Ken Clarke all over again but this time with the whole country on the line.
When May finally gets the boot, who's there to potentially replace her? The cabinet looks very uninspiring, with the exception of Greg Clark. Currently 100/1 at Ladbrokes.
If it happens in the next year, I'd say Gove or Hammond. Boris has absolutely no chance, and Rudd only the most slender.
Gove or Hammond... Jesus christ, someone put me out of my misery.
My big worry, politically speaking is that Corbyn's defeat won't be nearly big enough. It'd be a disaster for the centre and centre-left if he was to retain over 200 seats.
The disaster will be certain if the Labour moderates don't have the guts to strike out on their own. If they can muster 120 (which is ambitious but not impossible) they can become the official opposition, get the soft money and watch as the moderate unions quit Corbyn for a new 'progressive' home
(I hate the word progressive - but it seems a likely name for a new movement)
If Macron can strike out on his own, surely Labour moderates can think of doing the same.
You don't get it. It is Corbyn who has struck out on his own and changed the political agenda. Labour moderates thought he was a loser but they've discovered, to their amazement, that he is a winner. Win or lose, the Labour party will support Corbyn after this election. He will be seen as a hero.
That is right. Corbyn will be an energetic LOTO, and remain a cult figure. He will be too old for 2022, so time will heal the Labour rift. His ideas will be mainstream and his successor PM.
5 years of Fred Karno opposition and the Corbyn project will be sunk.
North East Hampshire: never before seen Labour posters in well-to-do rural villages.
Sunday lunch pub conversation ( same constituency): four oldies, who I would have automatically put in the blue column, livid about winter fuel allowance. Talk of not voting Tory. Where there vote goes instead remains a mystery. Abstention? Damaged Tory core vote?
Make of that what you will.
I reckon that the Tory vote in the safe seats is crumbling (I have anecdotal evidence of such a thing), which would imply that they were making ground in marginals, hence enhanced Con majority.
Corbyn speech - his Foreign policy one was well received below the line in the Mail
Top comment this time 220 green arrows, 57 red arrows.
Genuine red, Oxford, United Kingdom, 13 minutes ago
So Corbynn is using people's deaths to get votes , this man didn't even want to arm our police , without arms there would have been more deaths . Only a man without honour would use this as an election statement .
With respect, people who comment on newspaper articles tend to be keen. More so in the free to access Guardian and Mail.
Momentum has absolutely swamped the MailOnline comment section in recent weeks. It's a war game. Proportionality in the comments there now means zero in relation to actual reader opinion. Regular Mail types won't bother to struggle to log a POV against such a tide.
They will vote on Thurs though.
Still think they haven't swamped the polling panels too?
All the companies? and the phone polls, and the Scotland and Wales ones?
What I hear as anecdata, and overhead conversations etc supports the polls. I also don't think that it is just the 18-24's, the 25-40's of Gen Y are in the same mood. They have been stiffed by the Tories and are out for revenge.
Depends who you talk to. I guess in a hospital you'd hear more pro Corbyn views. I run a small group of betting shops and most of the things I hear from customers (particularly from pensioners) about him aren't repeatable.
It is not just overheard conversations from staff, but also patients. I don't think the polls are wrong.
My estimate is modest Tory gains, and a May Brexit with the scales having dropped from Tory eyes.
When May finally gets the boot, who's there to potentially replace her? The cabinet looks very uninspiring, with the exception of Greg Clark. Currently 100/1 at Ladbrokes.
There's likely to be a challenge when the Brexit talks get stuck so it will probably be a battle between the true believer Brexiteers and and an emboldened Remainer. IDS vs Ken Clarke all over again but this time with the whole country on the line.
What if she doesn't get a majority though?
She'll resign Friday, or I'd hate to be Graham Brady's postman.
Comments
Thank you
https://order-order.com/2015/09/10/corbyns-defence-of-britons-who-join-isis/
https://order-order.com/2017/05/29/corbyn-attended-terror-conference-honouring-munich-killer/
https://order-order.com/2015/06/15/corbyn-invited-terrorists-and-war-criminals-into-parliament/
plenty more
(I hate the word progressive - but it seems a likely name for a new movement)
If Macron can strike out on his own, surely Labour moderates can think of doing the same.
I have two threads that should have gone up today that might go up before election day.
You'll love it.
I suppose one good thing about Brexit will be we make our own laws and will be accountable only to ourselves. We therefore can crackdown on the elements in society who inflame tension and suppress those who indoctrinate and radicalise the enemy within.
Liar , Liar as someone likes to say.
But Donald always acts before someone does the thinking on his behalf.
Labour moderates thought he was a loser but they've discovered, to their amazement, that he is a winner. Win or lose, the Labour party will support Corbyn after this election. He will be seen as a hero.
Tories are going to freeze your energy prices
What I hear as anecdata, and overhead conversations etc supports the polls. I also don't think that it is just the 18-24's, the 25-40's of Gen Y are in the same mood. They have been stiffed by the Tories and are out for revenge.
Watch the ten mins from 10:00 he pinpoints the problem with lack of assimilation of Pakistanis in Birmingham in 1965
https://youtu.be/nN6sTBSAp-A
It is a smokescreen to avoid taking action necessary to protect society from the threat of death and destruction at the hands of violent extremists.
The first duty of the state is to protect citizens.
And I don't believe that Corbyn is willing to do what is necessary.
He hedges, he uses weasel words, he refuses to condemn.
We saw it on Friday night, we are seeing it tonight.
Nothing that happened in Manchester or London was because of the reduction in police numbers - it is a lie to suggest otherwise.
He wants to appease those who seek to destroy.
We need to be defiant. The age of toleration has to come to an end.
The Tories in my opinion are going to win big on Thursday, much bigger than the received wisdom of opinion poll followers.
Would they have to split the party ?
Hammond? I don't think he wants it.
Rudd perhaps? If she keeps her seat.
But that person would still have a huge mandate problem with the rest of the country who had just voted for May's strong and stable.
I think, so long as May has a majority of some kind, she's safe in the short term.
The first major brexit argument will probably topple her though. She may want to go before she's pushed.
Lol. What have you been taking?
And I think you have confused cult for similar word with 'n' rather than 'l'
1) Who Mrs May should appoint after the election (assuming she wins). Answer: Not Osborne, it includes threes subtle pop music references
2) A thread about what George Osborne will be doing in 2022.
Don't forget, about 30 MPs will probably owe him their seat.
Looks like SDP Mark II is now gone.
http://www.wahlrecht.de/umfragen/
I wish it was the SPD/Linke/Greens, but it's really not. Nor is it the AfD. Germans increasingly think she's done a great job. it's not even clear that the AfD will make it over the 5% threshold if their decline continues.
Even the most pessimistic amongst us don't believe that Labour will only be left with 30 MPs. But you may be right.
The nearest I can think of is Ken Livingstone being London mayor but London is a Labour city the United Kingdom is not a left-wing country. The UK is pretty Conservative, Livingstone lost London in 2008 despite it being a Labour city. Livingstone tried to moderate his views, Corbyn is to the left of Livingstone on the watered down left-wing platform he presented as his manifesto. If Corbyn or a left-wing successor took the helm of Labour for the 2022 election you would probably find Labour even further to the left. The electorate will reject Corbyn or his successor again.
The magnum opus on AV will be published in those three weeks.
Probably on July 8th or 9th.
I'm at a wedding that weekend, and I'm banned from PB that weekend.
Or if Mrs May is toppled, I'll do a thread on the quasi-AV system Tories use to elect their leaders.
I've always been a fan, because her pragmatic approach.
Then we studied Rivers of Blood... and were literally told to find the racism. I ended up arguing w the lecturer (who I was older than!) over 7/7 (as someone in the city on that day). I didn't want to say the things I was saying but they were true, Enoch was right!
Unfortunately the national Front and BNP agreed with him for different reasons and his name is tainted by association. Contemporary polls (!) re his speech were massive landslides in favour
North East Hampshire: never before seen Labour posters in well-to-do rural villages.
Sunday lunch pub conversation ( same constituency): four oldies, who I would have automatically put in the blue column, livid about winter fuel allowance. Talk of not voting Tory. Where there vote goes instead remains a mystery. Abstention? Damaged Tory core vote?
Make of that what you will.
When you've done that, you can explain whether you think George Washington's view differs from Powell's, and whether he was right? He said
"The policy or advantage of [immigration] taking place in a body (I mean the settling of them in a body) may be much questioned; for, by so doing, they retain the language, habits, and principles (good or bad) which they bring with them. Whereas by an intermixture with our people, they, or their descendants, get assimilated to our customs, measures, and laws: in a word, soon become one people."
As you are thick lefties I have to point out that "Because Enoch Powell" is not an argument which refutes Enoch Powell. And it sure as shit doesn't refute George Washington.
Gove or Hammond... Jesus christ, someone put me out of my misery.
My estimate is modest Tory gains, and a May Brexit with the scales having dropped from Tory eyes.