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politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » LAB moves to 19% deficit with YouGov, drops vote share in all

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    rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 58,426
    kle4 said:

    Kate Osamor - the solution to Lab's problems is to get out and knock on doors.

    "It may take many years for people to accept that Jeremy wants to say something different on behalf of the majority.”

    http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/entry/kate-osamor-interview-labour-has-neglected-its-heartlands-there-are-no-safe-seats-anymore_uk_58bf1d1ae4b054a0ea65b100?9od2t9&utm_hp_ref=uk

    Eh? 'The people', who I presume are the majority, need to accept Corbyn is saying something new on their behalf?

    For their benefit, even if they don't see that, I can accept (if disagree with).

    Well, maybe the rest of the article is less silly sounding, lets see.
    To me it sounds suspiciously like the old Marxist, "false consciousness" argument.
  • Options
    kle4kle4 Posts: 92,048
    edited March 2017
    GeoffM said:



    Tax the robots, as Bill Gates is proposing.

    Will they get the vote too?

    "No taxation without representation!"
    Worked on Futurama - the first robot president won voters over when he pledged not to go on a killing spree, but like all politicians he promised more than he could deliver.
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    Sean_FSean_F Posts: 35,967

    valleyboy said:


    What most people do not know is that a sizable portion of a self-employed person's income is not even declared to begin with. Everyone is not a lawyer or an accountant. Do you think all of the earnings of a self-employed restaurant owner or the corner shop actually gets declared ?

    Over the years I had 2 solicitors who actively encouraged me to pay in cash, no invoice. Almost everyone's on the make. Instinctively I want to criticise Hammond, but he was probably right with this.
    I think the Inland Revenue are well aware of this. Tax inspectors have been known to sit in a car outside a Chinese takeway counting the number of customers for a sufficient period. They then visit the owner and issue a tax bill.

    However, I know a lot of honest businesses who always issue an invoice and are paid by cheque or bank credit. They're penalised by the assumption that everyone's dishonest because HMRC seems to make tax investigations at random and these can ruin the life of innocent people.

    One reason I favour CGT on houses is that owners would have to keep the receipts for building maintenance (to reduce the chargeable capital gain) and builders would have to issue invoices. Makes evasion slightly harder.

    In my experience, HMRC often make a huge fuss over relatively small issues, while allowing a lot of big abuses to go unchallenged.
  • Options
    Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 61,006
    F1: electrical problem for the Honda engine, same as yesterday.
  • Options
    PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 76,002
    « Sans penser au candidat qui a votre préférence, parmi les candidats suivants à l’élection présidentielle, lequel a selon vous marqué le plus de points au cours de la semaine passée ? »

    Disregarding your favourite candidate, which of the candidates has impressed you the most over the past week. (I think)

    Macron 46%, way way out ahead.

    Le Pen 19%,

    Fillon 8%.
  • Options
    kle4kle4 Posts: 92,048
    edited March 2017

    kle4 said:

    Kate Osamor - the solution to Lab's problems is to get out and knock on doors.

    "It may take many years for people to accept that Jeremy wants to say something different on behalf of the majority.”

    http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/entry/kate-osamor-interview-labour-has-neglected-its-heartlands-there-are-no-safe-seats-anymore_uk_58bf1d1ae4b054a0ea65b100?9od2t9&utm_hp_ref=uk

    Eh? 'The people', who I presume are the majority, need to accept Corbyn is saying something new on their behalf?

    For their benefit, even if they don't see that, I can accept (if disagree with).

    Well, maybe the rest of the article is less silly sounding, lets see.
    To me it sounds suspiciously like the old Marxist, "false consciousness" argument.
    That's why I can accept it as an argument to argue you are doing it for the people even if the people disagree (while thinking that argument does not stand up), but claiming to do it on behalf of the majority supposes actual support for your ideas from the majority, which makes no sense given the situation.

    Reminds me of crazy on Greens mere days after the GE talking on behalf of the people - what nonsense. It's like, ok, out voting system means a majority of seats on less than a majority of votes total, but even if, like me, you'd prefer a different voting system, the winners were still the most popular of the options.
  • Options
    Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 61,006
    Six Nations: was thinking of backing Scotland to win. Surprised they're only 5, though. Hmm. [I think that's accurate or maybe a bit longer than reality, but I was expecting more hubris to make the odds longer].
  • Options
    PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 76,002
    Sean_F said:

    valleyboy said:


    What most people do not know is that a sizable portion of a self-employed person's income is not even declared to begin with. Everyone is not a lawyer or an accountant. Do you think all of the earnings of a self-employed restaurant owner or the corner shop actually gets declared ?

    Over the years I had 2 solicitors who actively encouraged me to pay in cash, no invoice. Almost everyone's on the make. Instinctively I want to criticise Hammond, but he was probably right with this.
    I think the Inland Revenue are well aware of this. Tax inspectors have been known to sit in a car outside a Chinese takeway counting the number of customers for a sufficient period. They then visit the owner and issue a tax bill.

    However, I know a lot of honest businesses who always issue an invoice and are paid by cheque or bank credit. They're penalised by the assumption that everyone's dishonest because HMRC seems to make tax investigations at random and these can ruin the life of innocent people.

    One reason I favour CGT on houses is that owners would have to keep the receipts for building maintenance (to reduce the chargeable capital gain) and builders would have to issue invoices. Makes evasion slightly harder.
    In my experience, HMRC often make a huge fuss over relatively small issues, while allowing a lot of big abuses to go unchallenged.


    Having dipped my toes into p2p last year, I note that alot of lenders are especially wary about loaning to solicitors.
  • Options
    not_on_firenot_on_fire Posts: 4,341
    Sean_F said:

    valleyboy said:


    What most people do not know is that a sizable portion of a self-employed person's income is not even declared to begin with. Everyone is not a lawyer or an accountant. Do you think all of the earnings of a self-employed restaurant owner or the corner shop actually gets declared ?

    Over the years I had 2 solicitors who actively encouraged me to pay in cash, no invoice. Almost everyone's on the make. Instinctively I want to criticise Hammond, but he was probably right with this.
    I think the Inland Revenue are well aware of this. Tax inspectors have been known to sit in a car outside a Chinese takeway counting the number of customers for a sufficient period. They then visit the owner and issue a tax bill.

    However, I know a lot of honest businesses who always issue an invoice and are paid by cheque or bank credit. They're penalised by the assumption that everyone's dishonest because HMRC seems to make tax investigations at random and these can ruin the life of innocent people.

    One reason I favour CGT on houses is that owners would have to keep the receipts for building maintenance (to reduce the chargeable capital gain) and builders would have to issue invoices. Makes evasion slightly harder.
    In my experience, HMRC often make a huge fuss over relatively small issues, while allowing a lot of big abuses to go unchallenged.


    If people paying cash to avoid self-employment taxes is a problem, surely the problem is going to be exacerbated with higher tax rates? More people will be tempted to cheat.
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    PlatoSaidPlatoSaid Posts: 10,383
    The NYT have been caught memory holing - did they think we wouldn't notice?

    It's destroying themselves Part 94

    http://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2017/03/new-york-times-goes-back-and-changes-january-headline-from-wiretapped-to-intercepted-to-bash-trump/
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    SandpitSandpit Posts: 49,941
    Afternoon all. Been away for a few days and catching up on the budget stuff. It certainly looks like the Chancellor has got a good debate going on National Insurance contributions, especially when pretty much the entire Commentariat is in the situation of losing out.

    Watching from afar all that stands out is the somewhat unreasonable hyperbole about people who do quite well being a couple of pints a week worse off, if their accountant can't find a way of putting those couple of pints down as expenses, that is.

    David Cameron was of course right to describe Employer NI as a tax on jobs, it needs to be drastically reduced if we wish to encourage employment and discourage the shadier side of contracting. Hopefully the green paper to come in the autumn will start a much needed discussion about how to move forward, although it's going to be difficult to do with such a small government majority and with government debt still rising.

    Oh, and YouGov. 19 points. Nineteen. Na na na na nineteen - as I believe was once sung (or sampled) by Paul Hardcastle. Time bomb under Corbyn has surely started ticking.
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    PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 76,002

    Sean_F said:

    valleyboy said:


    What most people do not know is that a sizable portion of a self-employed person's income is not even declared to begin with. Everyone is not a lawyer or an accountant. Do you think all of the earnings of a self-employed restaurant owner or the corner shop actually gets declared ?

    Over the years I had 2 solicitors who actively encouraged me to pay in cash, no invoice. Almost everyone's on the make. Instinctively I want to criticise Hammond, but he was probably right with this.
    I think the Inland Revenue are well aware of this. Tax inspectors have been known to sit in a car outside a Chinese takeway counting the number of customers for a sufficient period. They then visit the owner and issue a tax bill.

    However, I know a lot of honest businesses who always issue an invoice and are paid by cheque or bank credit. They're penalised by the assumption that everyone's dishonest because HMRC seems to make tax investigations at random and these can ruin the life of innocent people.

    One reason I favour CGT on houses is that owners would have to keep the receipts for building maintenance (to reduce the chargeable capital gain) and builders would have to issue invoices. Makes evasion slightly harder.
    In my experience, HMRC often make a huge fuss over relatively small issues, while allowing a lot of big abuses to go unchallenged.
    If people paying cash to avoid self-employment taxes is a problem, surely the problem is going to be exacerbated with higher tax rates? More people will be tempted to cheat.

    I expect anyone whose revenue drops sharply will receive a visit from the revenue...
  • Options
    SandpitSandpit Posts: 49,941

    rkrkrk said:



    If you actually bother to read what I wrote it said the 95% was the growth in jobs not the existing jobs

    That isn't true either.

    https://fullfact.org/economy/foreigners-working-uk/
    Nope, Fullfact are being utterly dishonest by misquoting the Times article. The article stated correctly that 95% of the growth in jobs had been taken by those not born in the UK. The Fullfact article changes that claim to non British which brings it down to just over 50%. It is simply Fullfact trying to nullify a statistic they don't like by changing the terms to something more palatable and then claiming it is wrong.
    So you have an issue with jobs going to Brits born overseas? When I was younger I lived for a few years in Australia, my brother who is 16 years younger than me was born while we were there. He is a British citizen, not an Australian and has no right to live or work in Australia. He has also lived in the UK since he was 15 months old (when we returned home to the UK). He turned 18 last year. Is there an issue with him joining the workforce since he's a British citizen born overseas?
    I have no problem with it at all as long as the employers take responsibility when they import labour. And you know as well as I do that the data is not relating to the tiny number of people in your brother's situation.
    Employers hiring British citizens aren't importing labour. These are already our citizens. Employers hiring migrants already living here and already have right to work here aren't importing labour either. Employers hiring non Brits from overseas are importing labour. The solution to companies importing labour if you want one is a sponsorship arrangement like other nations already have.

    My wife is in a similar situation, born and bred in South Africa but her father is from Edinburgh and she is dual nationality British/South African. She moved here as a British citizen then looked for work. Also appears in your stats. Considering citizenship is available to anyone born overseas with parents or grandparents who are British these are not untypical cases or a tiny number.
    There are increasing numbers of British citizens born overseas as migration patterns change. My two nephews were born here in Dubai, one thing for sure is that they will never be Emiratis.
  • Options
    isamisam Posts: 41,002
    Lip reader on Daily Politics confirms Cameron said to Fallon "Breaking a manifesto commitment.. how stupid can you get?"
  • Options
    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 117,164

    Pulpstar said:

    rcs1000 said:


    I would get rid of employer's national insurance contributions altogether. We want to encourage job creation, not discourage it.

    Will cost the exchequer quite a few quid though. How would you pay for it ? Roll some into income tax ?
    Start by being honest about. National "Insurance" insures nothing. It funds next week's pension payments. Call it "Pension fund payments" and see how that goes down.

    Really, it needs to rolled into Income Tax because that is really what it is.
    No. The state pension and contributions based JSA is based on NI contributions and hopefully the budget signals NI will be more used to pay for social care,we need more of a shift from income tax to NI not the reverse
  • Options
    Richard_NabaviRichard_Nabavi Posts: 30,820

    One reason I favour CGT on houses is that owners would have to keep the receipts for building maintenance (to reduce the chargeable capital gain) and builders would have to issue invoices. Makes evasion slightly harder.

    Building maintenance work wouldn't count as a cost you could set against CGT, surely? Only actual capital improvements, such as building an extension, would count.
  • Options
    BojabobBojabob Posts: 642

    Six Nations: was thinking of backing Scotland to win. Surprised they're only 5, though. Hmm. [I think that's accurate or maybe a bit longer than reality, but I was expecting more hubris to make the odds longer].

    Think the Scots would have been a great bet with Laidlaw. Without him, I simply think we'll grind out the victory. Should be a good game, nevertheless.
  • Options
    SandpitSandpit Posts: 49,941

    F1: electrical problem for the Honda engine, same as yesterday.

    Things really not looking good for Honda, after much was promised. Fingers crossed it's just teething problems, although Alonso's comments the other day suggest that the relationship between engine manufacturer and the team is already close to breaking point.
  • Options
    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 117,164
    edited March 2017
    BudG said:

    French election. Opinionway daily rolling poll:

    Macron up 1 point to 26, now level with Le Pen. His highest rating yet in this poll.

    Fillon down 1 mmto 20

    Macron now shows a 30 point lead over Le Pen in second round.

    http://presicote.factoviz.com/index/more/id/qoo_lew_1

    Macron and Le Pen are tied in round 1 and I round 2 Macron leads Le Pen 65% to 35%. However if you add Le Pen' s 26% and the 20% for Fillon you get to 46%, add in a few more from Melenchon and DuPont Aignan and she is over 50% and wins. To win the presidency against the odds that is the runoff coalition she has to build
  • Options
    Sean_FSean_F Posts: 35,967
    Pulpstar said:

    Sean_F said:

    valleyboy said:


    What most people do not know is that a sizable portion of a self-employed person's income is not even declared to begin with. Everyone is not a lawyer or an accountant. Do you think all of the earnings of a self-employed restaurant owner or the corner shop actually gets declared ?

    Over the years I had 2 solicitors who actively encouraged me to pay in cash, no invoice. Almost everyone's on the make. Instinctively I want to criticise Hammond, but he was probably right with this.
    I think the Inland Revenue are well aware of this. Tax inspectors have been known to sit in a car outside a Chinese takeway counting the number of customers for a sufficient period. They then visit the owner and issue a tax bill.

    In my experience, HMRC often make a huge fuss over relatively small issues, while allowing a lot of big abuses to go unchallenged.
    Having dipped my toes into p2p last year, I note that alot of lenders are especially wary about loaning to solicitors.
    Pulpstar said:

    Sean_F said:

    valleyboy said:


    What most people do not know is that a sizable portion of a self-employed person's income is not even declared to begin with. Everyone is not a lawyer or an accountant. Do you think all of the earnings of a self-employed restaurant owner or the corner shop actually gets declared ?

    Over the years I had 2 solicitors who actively encouraged me to pay in cash, no invoice. Almost everyone's on the make. Instinctively I want to criticise Hammond, but he was probably right with this.
    I think the Inland Revenue are well aware of this. Tax inspectors have been known to sit in a car outside a Chinese takeway counting the number of customers for a sufficient period. They then visit the owner and issue a tax bill.

    However, I know a lot of honest businesses who always issue an invoice and are paid by cheque or bank credit. They're penalised by the assumption that everyone's dishonest because HMRC seems to make tax investigations at random and these can ruin the life of innocent people.

    One reason I favour CGT on houses is that owners would have to keep the receipts for building maintenance (to reduce the chargeable capital gain) and builders would have to issue invoices. Makes evasion slightly harder.
    In my experience, HMRC often make a huge fuss over relatively small issues, while allowing a lot of big abuses to go unchallenged.
    Having dipped my toes into p2p last year, I note that alot of lenders are especially wary about loaning to solicitors.

    A number of big law firms have gone bust in recent times.
  • Options
    rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 54,068
    edited March 2017
    Pulpstar said:

    « Sans penser au candidat qui a votre préférence, parmi les candidats suivants à l’élection présidentielle, lequel a selon vous marqué le plus de points au cours de la semaine passée ? »

    Disregarding your favourite candidate, which of the candidates has impressed you the most over the past week. (I think)

    Macron 46%, way way out ahead.

    Le Pen 19%,

    Fillon 8%.

    A couple of weeks ago, there was a question in one of the polls saying: "If your favoured candidate is not in the second round, who would you vote for?" Macron was the favourite second preference of Le Pen voters! (Which goes to show how much voter choice is driver by emotion, likeability, etc., and not on policies.)
  • Options
    williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 48,146

    One reason I favour CGT on houses is that owners would have to keep the receipts for building maintenance (to reduce the chargeable capital gain) and builders would have to issue invoices. Makes evasion slightly harder.

    Building maintenance work wouldn't count as a cost you could set against CGT, surely? Only actual capital improvements, such as building an extension, would count.
    Does HMRC not watch property porn? Simply putting some twigs in a vase counts as a capital improvement in some quarters.
  • Options
    Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 61,006
    Mr. Sandpit, understandable, far more so than Red Bull's bitching at Renault in recent times.

    The Honda engine has never been fast and has usually been unreliable. A year or two of teething problems may be forgiven, but it's beyond a joke now.

    Mr. Bojabob, I agree Laidlaw's a loss for Scotland, although England may be without Farrell.
    http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/39229803
  • Options
    Richard_NabaviRichard_Nabavi Posts: 30,820

    One reason I favour CGT on houses is that owners would have to keep the receipts for building maintenance (to reduce the chargeable capital gain) and builders would have to issue invoices. Makes evasion slightly harder.

    Building maintenance work wouldn't count as a cost you could set against CGT, surely? Only actual capital improvements, such as building an extension, would count.
    Does HMRC not watch property porn? Simply putting some twigs in a vase counts as a capital improvement in some quarters.
    Yes, in practice it's often not easy to tell the difference between maintenance and improvement.
  • Options
    justin124justin124 Posts: 11,527
    FPT
    TheScreamingEagles said:

    'Let's not get too excited.

    Labour had 31% leads in early 1999'

    RobD said:
    'Might need a reminder on how the 2001 election went'

    Labour won the 2001 election by circa 9%
  • Options
    kle4kle4 Posts: 92,048
    isam said:

    Lip reader on Daily Politics confirms Cameron said to Fallon "Breaking a manifesto commitment.. how stupid can you get?"

    I like Cameron, but that's nonsense. How'd the 'eliminate the deficit' plan go, Dave? (If that was not a manifesto commitment, I apologise Dave, but it was promised enough). Perhaps offscreen he added 'for not a good enough reason'.
  • Options
    BudGBudG Posts: 711
    edited March 2017
    HYUFD said:

    BudG said:

    French election. Opinionway daily rolling poll:

    Macron up 1 point to 26, now level with Le Pen. His highest rating yet in this poll.

    Fillon down 1 mmto 20

    Macron now shows a 30 point lead over Le Pen in second round.

    http://presicote.factoviz.com/index/more/id/qoo_lew_1

    Macron and Le Pen are tied in round 1 and I round 2 Macron leads Le Pen 65% to 35%. However if you add Le Pen' s 26% and the 20% for Fillon you get to 46%, add in a few more from Melenchon and DuPont Aignan and she is over 50% and wins. To win the presidency against the odds that is the runoff coalition she has to build
    Yes, but presumably the majority of the 20% of people who said they would vote for Fillon have already decided not to vote for Le Pen second round if their man gets knocked out, hence the 65-35% result of the head to head. Most of the additional support she wil get will come from Fillon voters, but according to that head to head, she will get less than half of them
  • Options
    SandpitSandpit Posts: 49,941
    PlatoSaid said:

    The NYT have been caught memory holing - did they think we wouldn't notice?

    It's destroying themselves Part 94

    http://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2017/03/new-york-times-goes-back-and-changes-january-headline-from-wiretapped-to-intercepted-to-bash-trump/

    WTF? If that original front page is correct, then the point is pretty much proven that the US mainstream media has now completely jumped the shark when it comes to Trump. They're literally making stuff up now, confirming the President's opinion of them!

    BTW that was a fantastic video of the gender-swapped debate posted a couple of days ago, enlightening as to why Trump was able to convince certain sections of the population to vote for him, also why the Hilary campaign failed outside Dem heartlands because their candidate had nothing substantive to say.
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    Dura_AceDura_Ace Posts: 13,030
    Sandpit said:

    F1: electrical problem for the Honda engine, same as yesterday.

    Things really not looking good for Honda, after much was promised. Fingers crossed it's just teething problems, although Alonso's comments the other day suggest that the relationship between engine manufacturer and the team is already close to breaking point.
    Motorsport used to be the career making posting in Honda but now its a bit of backwater as the top engineering talent try go into hybrid powertrains as that's where you make your name in Honda now. Honda have had similar, though not as bad, problems with power delivery of their MotoGP engine. That effort has been redeemed only by the god-like talent of Marc Marquez.
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    NigelbNigelb Posts: 62,811

    Mr. Sandpit, understandable, far more so than Red Bull's bitching at Renault in recent times.

    The Honda engine has never been fast and has usually been unreliable. A year or two of teething problems may be forgiven, but it's beyond a joke now.

    Mr. Bojabob, I agree Laidlaw's a loss for Scotland, although England may be without Farrell.
    http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/39229803

    Good afternoon, Mr. D.
    I told you the Ferrari looks quick...
    :-)
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    rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 58,426
    edited March 2017
    HYUFD said:

    Pulpstar said:

    rcs1000 said:


    I would get rid of employer's national insurance contributions altogether. We want to encourage job creation, not discourage it.

    Will cost the exchequer quite a few quid though. How would you pay for it ? Roll some into income tax ?
    Start by being honest about. National "Insurance" insures nothing. It funds next week's pension payments. Call it "Pension fund payments" and see how that goes down.

    Really, it needs to rolled into Income Tax because that is really what it is.
    No. The state pension and contributions based JSA is based on NI contributions and hopefully the budget signals NI will be more used to pay for social care,we need more of a shift from income tax to NI not the reverse
    The NI Fund was 2,260,584,000 in the red in 2014-15.

    Edit: that's on the annual figures. The overall balance was: 20,935,278,000


    https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/472142/National_Insurance_Fund_Accounts_Great_Britain_2014_to_2015.pdf
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    Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 61,006
    Mr. 124, saw a graphic on Twitter indicating the polls have overestimated the Conservatives once in the last 50 years or so.

    Here we are: https://twitter.com/MattSingh_/status/840151266747539456
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    Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 61,006
    Mr. Ace, Gilles Simon has just left Honda, reportedly because his engine ideas weren't being adopted.

    Mr. B, your bet is looking promising. Red Bull reliability could also prove helpful in that regard.
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    Ishmael_ZIshmael_Z Posts: 8,981
    isam said:

    Lip reader on Daily Politics confirms Cameron said to Fallon "Breaking a manifesto commitment.. how stupid can you get?"

    Well, Dave, adhering to a manifesto commitment to have an EUref, and then throwing the EUref out of conceit and laziness - that's how stupid you can get.
  • Options
    madasafishmadasafish Posts: 659
    kle4 said:

    isam said:

    Lip reader on Daily Politics confirms Cameron said to Fallon "Breaking a manifesto commitment.. how stupid can you get?"

    I like Cameron, but that's nonsense. How'd the 'eliminate the deficit' plan go, Dave? (If that was not a manifesto commitment, I apologise Dave, but it was promised enough). Perhaps offscreen he added 'for not a good enough reason'.
    I seem to remember an unbreakable commitment to reduce immigration to under 100k a year..from Mr Cameron no less..
  • Options
    NigelbNigelb Posts: 62,811
    Sandpit said:

    F1: electrical problem for the Honda engine, same as yesterday.

    Things really not looking good for Honda, after much was promised. Fingers crossed it's just teething problems, although Alonso's comments the other day suggest that the relationship between engine manufacturer and the team is already close to breaking point.
    The one small chink of light is that they are free to develop the engines this year.
    I don't think Honda can contemplate just walking away from F1, considering the prospective massive loss of reputation. They have to throw resources at the problem and fix it quickly.
  • Options
    Dura_AceDura_Ace Posts: 13,030

    Mr. Ace, Gilles Simon has just left Honda, reportedly because his engine ideas weren't being adopted.

    They have a special file for gaijin ideas at Honda. It's labelled: Things We Don't Give a Fuck About.
  • Options
    NigelbNigelb Posts: 62,811

    Mr. Ace, Gilles Simon has just left Honda, reportedly because his engine ideas weren't being adopted.

    Mr. B, your bet is looking promising. Red Bull reliability could also prove helpful in that regard.

    his engine ideas weren't being adopted.

    Was he suggesting an engine that worked ?
  • Options
    williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 48,146
    Ishmael_Z said:

    isam said:

    Lip reader on Daily Politics confirms Cameron said to Fallon "Breaking a manifesto commitment.. how stupid can you get?"

    Well, Dave, adhering to a manifesto commitment to have an EUref, and then throwing the EUref out of conceit and laziness - that's how stupid you can get.
    Throwing the EUref out of conceit and laziness? But Brexiteers say that his greatest crime was campaigning hard for Remain...
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    david_herdsondavid_herdson Posts: 17,422

    Mr. 124, saw a graphic on Twitter indicating the polls have overestimated the Conservatives once in the last 50 years or so.

    Here we are: https://twitter.com/MattSingh_/status/840151266747539456

    Although it's possibly telling that that one occasion was when Labour was at its weakest and most unpopular and when the Con lead was greatest. Shy Lab Syndrome?
  • Options
    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 117,164

    HYUFD said:

    Pulpstar said:

    rcs1000 said:


    I would get rid of employer's national insurance contributions altogether. We want to encourage job creation, not discourage it.

    Will cost the exchequer quite a few quid though. How would you pay for it ? Roll some into income tax ?
    Start by being honest about. National "Insurance" insures nothing. It funds next week's pension payments. Call it "Pension fund payments" and see how that goes down.

    Really, it needs to rolled into Income Tax because that is really what it is.
    No. The state pension and contributions based JSA is based on NI contributions and hopefully the budget signals NI will be more used to pay for social care,we need more of a shift from income tax to NI not the reverse
    The NI Fund was 2,260,584,000 in the red in 2014-15.

    Edit: that's on the annual figures. The overall balance was: 20,935,278,000


    https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/472142/National_Insurance_Fund_Accounts_Great_Britain_2014_to_2015.pdf
    Even more reason to shift tax increases from income tax to National Insurance and use the latter to fund the bulk of state pensions, welfare and health and social care
  • Options
    SandpitSandpit Posts: 49,941
    edited March 2017
    Dura_Ace said:

    Sandpit said:

    F1: electrical problem for the Honda engine, same as yesterday.

    Things really not looking good for Honda, after much was promised. Fingers crossed it's just teething problems, although Alonso's comments the other day suggest that the relationship between engine manufacturer and the team is already close to breaking point.
    Motorsport used to be the career making posting in Honda but now its a bit of backwater as the top engineering talent try go into hybrid powertrains as that's where you make your name in Honda now. Honda have had similar, though not as bad, problems with power delivery of their MotoGP engine. That effort has been redeemed only by the god-like talent of Marc Marquez.
    Somewhat ironically, Honda have been getting rave reviews for their new NSX hybrid supercar, although that was developed out of the US rather than by the Japanese operation making the F1 engines.

    Maybe I'm a little blinkered when it comes to McLaren Honda, given that as a ten year old watching the epic battle between Senna and Prost got me hooked on F1 in the first place. I'm also a huge fan of what McLaren have done in recent years with the road cars and have been lucky to drive a few of them. They're bloody good cars, as well as being a great source of British pride - and hundreds of skilled jobs both at Woking and in the supply chain.
  • Options
    Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 61,006
    edited March 2017
    Mr. B, meow!

    Mr. Ace, gaijin = Western/Occidental?

    Edited extra bit: Mr. B (2), this year's gone for Honda, even with that. They could, conceivably, get into better shape for next season.
  • Options
    justin124justin124 Posts: 11,527
    The Yougov poll is clearly very good for the Tories – though perhaps a bit rushed to have fully absorbed the post – Budget reaction. It will be interesting to see whether other pollsters confirm these findings over the next week or so.
    Yougov has now being showing the lowest Labour poll ratings consistently over the last 6 months – so there now appears to be evidence of a clear house effect there. It first gave Labour a 25% rating at the beginning of December last year so the party appears to have held its ground over the last 3 months or so. Cold comfort for Labour though!
  • Options
    CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 59,787
    isam said:

    Lip reader on Daily Politics confirms Cameron said to Fallon "Breaking a manifesto commitment.. how stupid can you get?"

    "Brave" thing to say to a Lib Dem......
  • Options
    rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 54,068

    Mr. 124, saw a graphic on Twitter indicating the polls have overestimated the Conservatives once in the last 50 years or so.

    Here we are: https://twitter.com/MattSingh_/status/840151266747539456

    The three times Labour was understated were all when the Liberals/Alliance/LibDems were riding high in the polls. Presumably it was their putative voters returning home.
  • Options
    Richard_NabaviRichard_Nabavi Posts: 30,820
    kle4 said:

    isam said:

    Lip reader on Daily Politics confirms Cameron said to Fallon "Breaking a manifesto commitment.. how stupid can you get?"

    I like Cameron, but that's nonsense. How'd the 'eliminate the deficit' plan go, Dave? (If that was not a manifesto commitment, I apologise Dave, but it was promised enough). Perhaps offscreen he added 'for not a good enough reason'.
    There seems to be a lot of confusion about the difference between things which governments can control (such as whether or not they increase the basic rate of tax), and goals they set themselves (such as reducing the deficit, or getting immigration down). You can't break a manifesto commitment or reasonably be accused of dishonesty if you miss a target, you can if you deliberately decide to do something different from what you said you would do.
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    SandpitSandpit Posts: 49,941

    Mr. Ace, Gilles Simon has just left Honda, reportedly because his engine ideas weren't being adopted.

    Mr. B, your bet is looking promising. Red Bull reliability could also prove helpful in that regard.

    Gilles Simon left because his face didn't fit. Quite literally, it has been said.
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    CyanCyan Posts: 1,262
    Nicolas Dupont-Aignan at a meeting yesterday:

    https://twitter.com/floregalaud/status/840129800727486467
  • Options
    Beverley_CBeverley_C Posts: 6,256
    PlatoSaid said:

    The NYT have been caught memory holing - did they think we wouldn't notice?

    It's destroying themselves Part 94

    http://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2017/03/new-york-times-goes-back-and-changes-january-headline-from-wiretapped-to-intercepted-to-bash-trump/

    Maybe you would not notice because it did not happen.

    http://www.snopes.com/nytimes-wiretap-articles/
  • Options
    PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 76,002

    isam said:

    Lip reader on Daily Politics confirms Cameron said to Fallon "Breaking a manifesto commitment.. how stupid can you get?"

    "Brave" thing to say to a Lib Dem......
    I wasn't aware Fallon had joined the yellow peril.
  • Options

    HYUFD said:

    Pulpstar said:

    rcs1000 said:


    I would get rid of employer's national insurance contributions altogether. We want to encourage job creation, not discourage it.

    Will cost the exchequer quite a few quid though. How would you pay for it ? Roll some into income tax ?
    Start by being honest about. National "Insurance" insures nothing. It funds next week's pension payments. Call it "Pension fund payments" and see how that goes down.

    Really, it needs to rolled into Income Tax because that is really what it is.
    No. The state pension and contributions based JSA is based on NI contributions and hopefully the budget signals NI will be more used to pay for social care,we need more of a shift from income tax to NI not the reverse
    The NI Fund was 2,260,584,000 in the red in 2014-15.

    Edit: that's on the annual figures. The overall balance was: 20,935,278,000


    https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/472142/National_Insurance_Fund_Accounts_Great_Britain_2014_to_2015.pdf
    Any NIF shortfall is made by from time to time the Treasury anyway. So...there is in practice no special link or hypothecation from NICs to pension payments. All the money goes into and comes out of the Treasury and loses all direct traceability in the process. we run a 'pay as you go' pension system.
  • Options
    PlatoSaidPlatoSaid Posts: 10,383
    edited March 2017
    Sandpit said:

    PlatoSaid said:

    The NYT have been caught memory holing - did they think we wouldn't notice?

    It's destroying themselves Part 94

    http://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2017/03/new-york-times-goes-back-and-changes-january-headline-from-wiretapped-to-intercepted-to-bash-trump/

    WTF? If that original front page is correct, then the point is pretty much proven that the US mainstream media has now completely jumped the shark when it comes to Trump. They're literally making stuff up now, confirming the President's opinion of them!

    BTW that was a fantastic video of the gender-swapped debate posted a couple of days ago, enlightening as to why Trump was able to convince certain sections of the population to vote for him, also why the Hilary campaign failed outside Dem heartlands because their candidate had nothing substantive to say.
    It was very funny that Hillary was even more disliked when played by a guy was my favourite. The lady Trump actress was so reminiscent of Jewish mother - I kept thinking of Rhoda.

    Wind in 7 mins

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YtT4ZtfhlQI
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    rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 54,068
    edited March 2017
    Cyan said:

    Nicolas Dupont-Aignan at a meeting yesterday:

    https://twitter.com/floregalaud/status/840129800727486467

    I like NPA, and wish he was the face of French Euroscepticism rather than MLP.

    (Edit to add: the problem with that video is that you can't see how big the crowds are. The only people there could the ones in shot.)
  • Options
    Dura_AceDura_Ace Posts: 13,030
    Sandpit said:

    I'm also a huge fan of what McLaren have done in recent years with the road cars and have been lucky to drive a few of them. They're bloody good cars, as well as being a great source of British pride - and hundreds of skilled jobs both at Woking and in the supply chain.


    I don't think McLaren are in road cars for the long haul. McAutomotive will get sold to somebody Renault-Nissan who need a no excuses prestige brand.
  • Options
    PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 76,002
    Just when will people stop getting Michael Farron and Tim Fallon mixed up ! :>
  • Options
    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 117,164
    BudG said:

    HYUFD said:

    BudG said:

    French election. Opinionway daily rolling poll:

    Macron up 1 point to 26, now level with Le Pen. His highest rating yet in this poll.

    Fillon down 1 mmto 20

    Macron now shows a 30 point lead over Le Pen in second round.

    http://presicote.factoviz.com/index/more/id/qoo_lew_1

    Macron and Le Pen are tied in round 1 and I round 2 Macron leads Le Pen 65% to 35%. However if you add Le Pen' s 26% and the 20% for Fillon you get to 46%, add in a few more from Melenchon and DuPont Aignan and she is over 50% and wins. To win the presidency against the odds that is the runoff coalition she has to build
    Yes, but presumably the majority of the 20% of people who said they would vote for Fillon have already decided not to vote for Le Pen second round if their man gets knocked out, hence the 65-35% result of the head to head. Most of the additional support she wil get will come from Fillon voters, but according to that head to head, she will get less than half of them
    Opionway is showing better than average results for Macron, Ifop for example now has Le Pen winning a narrow plurality of Fillon voters in the runoff against Macron with about a third abstaining. She needs to convert those abstentions into Le Pen votes and squeeze the votes of Fillon voters currently switching to Macron plus add a few from Melenchon. DuPont Aignan voters are probably already for her in the runoff, Macron and Hamon voters will not touch her in the runoff and she can ignore them on the whole
  • Options
    rcs1000 said:

    Mr. 124, saw a graphic on Twitter indicating the polls have overestimated the Conservatives once in the last 50 years or so.

    Here we are: https://twitter.com/MattSingh_/status/840151266747539456

    The three times Labour was understated were all when the Liberals/Alliance/LibDems were riding high in the polls. Presumably it was their putative voters returning home.
    That chart is a bit of an indictment of the polling industry and its methodologies.
  • Options
    Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 65,826
    Pulpstar said:

    isam said:

    Lip reader on Daily Politics confirms Cameron said to Fallon "Breaking a manifesto commitment.. how stupid can you get?"

    "Brave" thing to say to a Lib Dem......
    I wasn't aware Fallon had joined the yellow peril.
    It's a running joke ...
  • Options
    Beverley_CBeverley_C Posts: 6,256
    edited March 2017
    Pulpstar said:

    Just when will people stop getting Michael Farron and Tim Fallon mixed up ! :>

    There's two of them???? :astonished:
  • Options
    BojabobBojabob Posts: 642
    Pulpstar said:

    Just when will people stop getting Michael Farron and Tim Fallon mixed up ! :>

    http://www.ibtimes.co.uk/brexit-liberal-democrats-election-campaign-pledge-return-uk-eu-1567519

    :)
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    williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 48,146
    Pulpstar said:

    Just when will people stop getting Michael Farron and Tim Fallon mixed up ! :>

    That Tim Fillon should resign from the Lib Dems after paying his wife all that money!
  • Options
    Beverley_CBeverley_C Posts: 6,256

    Pulpstar said:

    Just when will people stop getting Michael Farron and Tim Fallon mixed up ! :>

    That Tim Fillon should resign from the Lib Dems after paying his wife all that money!
    Now there are THREE of them..... Argghhh!!! :astonished::astonished::astonished:
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    PlatoSaidPlatoSaid Posts: 10,383

    PlatoSaid said:

    The NYT have been caught memory holing - did they think we wouldn't notice?

    It's destroying themselves Part 94

    http://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2017/03/new-york-times-goes-back-and-changes-january-headline-from-wiretapped-to-intercepted-to-bash-trump/

    Maybe you would not notice because it did not happen.

    http://www.snopes.com/nytimes-wiretap-articles/
    Snopes is pretty much discredited. They've been caught out re political agendas. Let them stick to BigFoot.
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    Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 65,826
    Sandpit said:

    rkrkrk said:



    If you actually bother to read what I wrote it said the 95% was the growth in jobs not the existing jobs

    That isn't true either.

    https://fullfact.org/economy/foreigners-working-uk/
    Nope, Fullfact are being utterly dishonest by misquoting the Times article. The article stated correctly that 95% of the growth in jobs had been taken by those not born in the UK. The Fullfact article changes that claim to non British which brings it down to just over 50%. It is simply Fullfact trying to nullify a statistic they don't like by changing the terms to something more palatable and then claiming it is wrong.
    So you have an issue with jobs going to Brits born overseas? When I was younger I lived for a few years in Australia, my brother who is 16 years younger than me was born while we were there. He is a British citizen, not an Australian and has no right to live or work in Australia. He has also lived in the UK since he was 15 months old (when we returned home to the UK). He turned 18 last year. Is there an issue with him joining the workforce since he's a British citizen born overseas?
    I have no problem with it at all as long as the employers take responsibility when they import labour. And you know as well as I do that the data is not relating to the tiny number of people in your brother's situation.
    Employers hiring British citizens aren't importing labour. These are already our citizens. Employers hiring migrants already living here and already have right to work here aren't importing labour either. Employers hiring non Brits from overseas are importing labour. The solution to companies importing labour if you want one is a sponsorship arrangement like other nations already have.

    My wife is in a similar situation, born and bred in South Africa but her father is from Edinburgh and she is dual nationality British/South African. She moved here as a British citizen then looked for work. Also appears in your stats. Considering citizenship is available to anyone born overseas with parents or grandparents who are British these are not untypical cases or a tiny number.
    There are increasing numbers of British citizens born overseas as migration patterns change. My two nephews were born here in Dubai, one thing for sure is that they will never be Emiratis.
    Precisely. The idea these are inconsequential cases is a nonsense. That is why citizenship matters.
  • Options
    logical_songlogical_song Posts: 9,727
    Pulpstar said:

    Just when will people stop getting Michael Farron and Tim Fallon mixed up ! :>

    Don't you mean Nigel Fillon and Francois Farage.
  • Options
    Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 65,826
    PlatoSaid said:

    PlatoSaid said:

    The NYT have been caught memory holing - did they think we wouldn't notice?

    It's destroying themselves Part 94

    http://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2017/03/new-york-times-goes-back-and-changes-january-headline-from-wiretapped-to-intercepted-to-bash-trump/

    Maybe you would not notice because it did not happen.

    http://www.snopes.com/nytimes-wiretap-articles/
    Snopes is pretty much discredited. They've been caught out re political agendas. Let them stick to BigFoot.
    Their methodology in the article is all there in writing. It may be discredited by those who dislike what they have to say but try shooting the message and not the messenger.
  • Options
    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 117,164
    edited March 2017
    Patrick said:

    HYUFD said:

    Pulpstar said:

    rcs1000 said:


    I would get rid of employer's national insurance contributions altogether. We want to encourage job creation, not discourage it.

    Will cost the exchequer quite a few quid though. How would you pay for it ? Roll some into income tax ?
    Start by being honest about. National "Insurance" insures nothing. It funds next week's pension payments. Call it "Pension fund payments" and see how that goes down.

    Really, it needs to rolled into Income Tax because that is really what it is.
    No. The state pension and contributions based JSA is based on NI contributions and hopefully the budget signals NI will be more used to pay for social care,we need more of a shift from income tax to NI not the reverse
    The NI Fund was 2,260,584,000 in the red in 2014-15.

    Edit: that's on the annual figures. The overall balance was: 20,935,278,000


    https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/472142/National_Insurance_Fund_Accounts_Great_Britain_2014_to_2015.pdf
    Any NIF shortfall is made by from time to time the Treasury anyway. So...there is in practice no special link or hypothecation from NICs to pension payments. All the money goes into and comes out of the Treasury and loses all direct traceability in the process. we run a 'pay as you go' pension system.
    Yet state pension entitlement is still based on NI contributions and credits
  • Options
    Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 61,006
    Mr. Sandpit, sounds a bit like when Ferrari goes through one of its "We must all be Italian" phases and the best engineers all work elsewhere.

    Mr. 1000, an interesting observation. The only near equivalent today would be the SNP in Scotland. Not sure I see those voters 'going home' though.
  • Options
    logical_songlogical_song Posts: 9,727

    PlatoSaid said:

    PlatoSaid said:

    The NYT have been caught memory holing - did they think we wouldn't notice?

    It's destroying themselves Part 94

    http://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2017/03/new-york-times-goes-back-and-changes-january-headline-from-wiretapped-to-intercepted-to-bash-trump/

    Maybe you would not notice because it did not happen.

    http://www.snopes.com/nytimes-wiretap-articles/
    Snopes is pretty much discredited. They've been caught out re political agendas. Let them stick to BigFoot.
    Their methodology in the article is all there in writing. It may be discredited by those who dislike what they have to say but try shooting the message and not the messenger.
    I was a bit concerned that Snopes had been discredited but then I noticed who had posted it.
  • Options
    Ishmael_ZIshmael_Z Posts: 8,981
    edited March 2017

    PlatoSaid said:

    The NYT have been caught memory holing - did they think we wouldn't notice?

    It's destroying themselves Part 94

    http://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2017/03/new-york-times-goes-back-and-changes-january-headline-from-wiretapped-to-intercepted-to-bash-trump/

    Maybe you would not notice because it did not happen.

    http://www.snopes.com/nytimes-wiretap-articles/
    That article is a non-denial denial. You must not assume that because an organisation promotes itself as factchecking/mythbusting etc. is therefore automatically above suspicion of peddling fake news (or fake metanews, perhaps). The argument that you are not wiretapping someone's calls because there was another party to the calls is baffling; most phone calls have two parties to them.

    And on Snopes, http://dailycaller.com/2016/12/21/snopes-co-founder-accused-of-embezzling-company-money-spending-it-on-prostitutes/

    Has Snopes mythbusted the specific story in that link, do you happen to know?
  • Options
    Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 65,826
    HYUFD said:

    Patrick said:

    HYUFD said:

    Pulpstar said:

    rcs1000 said:


    I would get rid of employer's national insurance contributions altogether. We want to encourage job creation, not discourage it.

    Will cost the exchequer quite a few quid though. How would you pay for it ? Roll some into income tax ?
    Start by being honest about. National "Insurance" insures nothing. It funds next week's pension payments. Call it "Pension fund payments" and see how that goes down.

    Really, it needs to rolled into Income Tax because that is really what it is.
    No. The state pension and contributions based JSA is based on NI contributions and hopefully the budget signals NI will be more used to pay for social care,we need more of a shift from income tax to NI not the reverse
    The NI Fund was 2,260,584,000 in the red in 2014-15.

    Edit: that's on the annual figures. The overall balance was: 20,935,278,000


    https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/472142/National_Insurance_Fund_Accounts_Great_Britain_2014_to_2015.pdf
    Any NIF shortfall is made by from time to time the Treasury anyway. So...there is in practice no special link or hypothecation from NICs to pension payments. All the money goes into and comes out of the Treasury and loses all direct traceability in the process. we run a 'pay as you go' pension system.
    Yet state pension entitlement is still based on NI contributions and credits
    No it isn't. It is based on credits it is entirely possible to get a credit with zero contributions since the threshold at getting a credit and the threshold of paying contributions are not the same.
  • Options
    SandpitSandpit Posts: 49,941
    edited March 2017
    Dura_Ace said:

    Sandpit said:

    I'm also a huge fan of what McLaren have done in recent years with the road cars and have been lucky to drive a few of them. They're bloody good cars, as well as being a great source of British pride - and hundreds of skilled jobs both at Woking and in the supply chain.

    I don't think McLaren are in road cars for the long haul. McAutomotive will get sold to somebody Renault-Nissan who need a no excuses prestige brand.
    I disagree, I think they're in it very much for the long haul. The only thing I could see that would cause a near-term sale would have been the coming EU emissions regs, which are set per manufacturer and might as well have been written by Fiat (Ferrari) and VW (Lamborghini, Porsche) to annoy small British operations like McLaren and Lotus.

    Bloody awesome cars though, the way they've taken the game to the Italians in only six years is nothing short of astonishing - the newly announced 720S has 50bhp more than the competitor Ferrari 488, even if the Italians still have a slight edge in the looks department.
    http://cars.mclaren.com/super-series/720s
  • Options
    williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 48,146
    Leading Brexiteer calls for special migration deal with EU 'because it's closer than India and China'.

    https://twitter.com/michaelpdeacon/status/839753210252386305
  • Options
    PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 76,002

    Pulpstar said:

    Just when will people stop getting Michael Farron and Tim Fallon mixed up ! :>

    Don't you mean Nigel Fillon and Francois Farage.
    Ooh la la
  • Options
    CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 59,787
    edited March 2017
    Some grim numbers for Labour in YouGov

    Which would be better (vs March 16, dif vs Cameron for Con)

    Helping people get onto the housing ladder?
    A Labour Govt led by Jeremy Corbyn: 20 (-5)
    A Conservative Govt led by Theresa May: 26 (+1)

    Managing the economy?
    A Labour government led by Jeremy Corbyn : 11 (-7)
    A Conservative government led by Theresa May 43 (+8)

    Providing more jobs?
    A Labour government led by Jeremy Corbyn : 17 (-9)
    A Conservative government led by Theresa May: 32 (+5)

    Improving standards of living for people like you?
    A Labour government led by Jeremy Corbyn : 19 (-9)
    A Conservative government led by Theresa May: 30 (+3)

    Tackling the government's deficit?
    A Labour government led by Jeremy Corbyn: 9 (-5)
    A Conservative government led by Theresa May: 45 (+7)

    The one area where Labour still leads has seen a substantial shift to the Conservatives:

    Reducing the number of people in poverty?
    A Labour government led by Jeremy Corbyn: 28 (-10)
    A Conservative government led by Theresa May: 21 (+6)
  • Options
    SandpitSandpit Posts: 49,941
    edited March 2017
    PlatoSaid said:

    PlatoSaid said:

    The NYT have been caught memory holing - did they think we wouldn't notice?

    It's destroying themselves Part 94

    http://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2017/03/new-york-times-goes-back-and-changes-january-headline-from-wiretapped-to-intercepted-to-bash-trump/

    Maybe you would not notice because it did not happen.

    http://www.snopes.com/nytimes-wiretap-articles/
    Snopes is pretty much discredited. They've been caught out re political agendas. Let them stick to BigFoot.
    Surely the headline from a newspaper printed six weeks ago is a clear matter of public record?

    Either "Wiretapped" was in the headline, or it wasn't. Either way it should be really easy to check!
  • Options
    rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 58,426

    Leading Brexiteer calls for special migration deal with EU 'because it's closer than India and China'.

    https://twitter.com/michaelpdeacon/status/839753210252386305

    Way, way beyond the WTF point on the scale.
  • Options
    Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 61,006
    Anyway, I must be off. The post-Test 2 article will be perhaps more intriguing than I had thought it might be.
  • Options
    PlatoSaidPlatoSaid Posts: 10,383

    PlatoSaid said:

    PlatoSaid said:

    The NYT have been caught memory holing - did they think we wouldn't notice?

    It's destroying themselves Part 94

    http://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2017/03/new-york-times-goes-back-and-changes-january-headline-from-wiretapped-to-intercepted-to-bash-trump/

    Maybe you would not notice because it did not happen.

    http://www.snopes.com/nytimes-wiretap-articles/
    Snopes is pretty much discredited. They've been caught out re political agendas. Let them stick to BigFoot.
    Their methodology in the article is all there in writing. It may be discredited by those who dislike what they have to say but try shooting the message and not the messenger.
    No, they've lost credibility having been caught out before. There's a reason why conservative voters have little faith in so called fact checkers - which are almost exclusively written by liberal left cherry picking sources.

    I'm reflecting the views of GOP/majority of independent voters. When trust is lost...
  • Options
    PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 76,002

    Leading Brexiteer calls for special migration deal with EU 'because it's closer than India and China'.

    https://twitter.com/michaelpdeacon/status/839753210252386305

    Way, way beyond the WTF point on the scale.
    Oh dear Oh dear Oh dear Oh dear.
  • Options
    BojabobBojabob Posts: 642

    Leading Brexiteer calls for special migration deal with EU 'because it's closer than India and China'.

    https://twitter.com/michaelpdeacon/status/839753210252386305

    Way, way beyond the WTF point on the scale.
    A true LOL moment.

    LOL.
  • Options
    CyanCyan Posts: 1,262
    edited March 2017
    rcs1000 said:

    Cyan said:

    Nicolas Dupont-Aignan at a meeting yesterday:

    https://twitter.com/floregalaud/status/840129800727486467

    I like NPA, and wish he was the face of French Euroscepticism rather than MLP.

    (Edit to add: the problem with that video is that you can't see how big the crowds are. The only people there could the ones in shot.)
    HuffPo says 9000; Le Figaro says the room is for 800 but was overflowing.

    (Edit: Le Figaro is right. The largest room at the conference centre seats 854.)

    NDA is acting almost monarchical. Responding to the idea that he is squeezed between Le Pen and Fillon, one of his supporters said "Nicolas is above all that". He has even announced who he would like to be in his ideal government: Rama Yade as Foreign Minister (served under Sarkozy), Henri Guaino (LR, wrote speeches for Sarkozy) at Defence, Jean Lassalle (in Bayrou's party) at ~Economic Development (Aménagement du Territoire), Natacha Polony (writer) at Education, Malek Boutih (Socialist Party) at Urban Policy.
  • Options
    PlatoSaidPlatoSaid Posts: 10,383
    Sandpit said:

    PlatoSaid said:

    PlatoSaid said:

    The NYT have been caught memory holing - did they think we wouldn't notice?

    It's destroying themselves Part 94

    http://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2017/03/new-york-times-goes-back-and-changes-january-headline-from-wiretapped-to-intercepted-to-bash-trump/

    Maybe you would not notice because it did not happen.

    http://www.snopes.com/nytimes-wiretap-articles/
    Snopes is pretty much discredited. They've been caught out re political agendas. Let them stick to BigFoot.
    Surely the headline from a newspaper printed six weeks ago is a clear matter of public record?

    Either "Wiretapped" was in the headline, or it wasn't. Either way it should be really easy to check!
    There's dozens of screenshots of it above the fold - hence the Gotcha.
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    Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 65,826
    PlatoSaid said:

    PlatoSaid said:

    PlatoSaid said:

    The NYT have been caught memory holing - did they think we wouldn't notice?

    It's destroying themselves Part 94

    http://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2017/03/new-york-times-goes-back-and-changes-january-headline-from-wiretapped-to-intercepted-to-bash-trump/

    Maybe you would not notice because it did not happen.

    http://www.snopes.com/nytimes-wiretap-articles/
    Snopes is pretty much discredited. They've been caught out re political agendas. Let them stick to BigFoot.
    Their methodology in the article is all there in writing. It may be discredited by those who dislike what they have to say but try shooting the message and not the messenger.
    No, they've lost credibility having been caught out before. There's a reason why conservative voters have little faith in so called fact checkers - which are almost exclusively written by liberal left cherry picking sources.

    I'm reflecting the views of GOP/majority of independent voters. When trust is lost...
    It literally quotes the words from the articles concerned. No third party sources or anything else it is all there black and white.
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    rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 58,426
    Interestingly, the document I linked earlier about NI Fund says that Class 2 debt has become a major risk (that is non-payment of Class 2 contribs by punters). The solution appears to have been to remove millions of people from the need to pay (or not pay in many cases) by removing Class 2 altogether.
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    PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 76,002
    Tim Martin Brexit, he'll have to fix it.
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    BojabobBojabob Posts: 642

    Pulpstar said:

    Just when will people stop getting Michael Farron and Tim Fallon mixed up ! :>

    That Tim Fillon should resign from the Lib Dems after paying his wife all that money!

    I think you are getting mixed up with Tim Farnham MP. Easily done.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thomas_Farnham_(MP)
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    PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 76,002

    Interestingly, the document I linked earlier about NI Fund says that Class 2 debt has become a major risk (that is non-payment of Class 2 contribs by punters). The solution appears to have been to remove millions of people from the need to pay (or not pay in many cases) by removing Class 2 altogether.

    Time to up the NIC threshold to £16,050 for all !!
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    PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 76,002
    Bojabob said:

    Pulpstar said:

    Just when will people stop getting Michael Farron and Tim Fallon mixed up ! :>

    That Tim Fillon should resign from the Lib Dems after paying his wife all that money!

    I think you are getting mixed up with Tim Farnham MP. Easily done.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thomas_Farnham_(MP)
    David Davies and David Davis are another pair.
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    Beverley_CBeverley_C Posts: 6,256
    Ishmael_Z said:

    PlatoSaid said:

    The NYT have been caught memory holing - did they think we wouldn't notice?

    It's destroying themselves Part 94

    http://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2017/03/new-york-times-goes-back-and-changes-january-headline-from-wiretapped-to-intercepted-to-bash-trump/

    Maybe you would not notice because it did not happen.

    http://www.snopes.com/nytimes-wiretap-articles/
    That article is a non-denial denial.
    ...
    And on Snopes, http://dailycaller.com/2016/12/21/snopes-co-founder-accused-of-embezzling-company-money-spending-it-on-prostitutes/

    Has Snopes mythbusted the specific story in that link, do you happen to know?
    Apparently the "Snopes arrested for embezzlement" story appeared in a satirical magazine, and is not real but I am sure that is fake fake non-not-fake unreal denial news......

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    BojabobBojabob Posts: 642
    Meanwhile, I note that Guy Verhofstadt is pushing harder for letting Brits keep their EU citizenship after Brexit. If it cost, say £100 a year, I would certainly keep mine.

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-39228245
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    Beverley_CBeverley_C Posts: 6,256
    Bojabob said:

    Meanwhile, I note that Guy Verhofstadt is pushing harder for letting Brits keep their EU citizenship after Brexit. If it cost, say £100 a year, I would certainly keep mine.

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-39228245

    :+1:
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    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 117,164

    HYUFD said:

    Patrick said:

    HYUFD said:

    Pulpstar said:

    rcs1000 said:


    I would get rid of employer's national insurance contributions altogether. We want to encourage job creation, not discourage it.

    Will cost the exchequer quite a few quid though. How would you pay for it ? Roll some into income tax ?
    Start by being honest about. National "Insurance" insures nothing. It funds next week's pension payments. Call it "Pension fund payments" and see how that goes down.

    Really, it needs to rolled into Income Tax because that is really what it is.
    No. The state pension and contributions based JSA is based on NI contributions and hopefully the budget signals NI will be more used to pay for social care,we need more of a shift from income tax to NI not the reverse
    The NI Fund was 2,260,584,000 in the red in 2014-15.

    Edit: that's on the annual figures. The overall balance was: 20,935,278,000


    https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/472142/National_Insurance_Fund_Accounts_Great_Britain_2014_to_2015.pdf
    Any NIF shortfall is made by from time to time the Treasury anyway. So...there is in practice no special link or hypothecation from NICs to pension payments. All the money goes into and comes out of the Treasury and loses all direct traceability in the process. we run a 'pay as you go' pension system.
    Yet state pension entitlement is still based on NI contributions and credits
    No it isn't. It is based on credits it is entirely possible to get a credit with zero contributions since the threshold at getting a credit and the threshold of paying contributions are not the same.
    You can get a NI credit through JSA until you earn enough to start paying NI contributions again but state pension entitlement is still based on NI contributions and credits exactly as I said
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    Ishmael_ZIshmael_Z Posts: 8,981
    Bojabob said:

    Meanwhile, I note that Guy Verhofstadt is pushing harder for letting Brits keep their EU citizenship after Brexit. If it cost, say £100 a year, I would certainly keep mine.

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-39228245

    Almost as if the government's tough stance on reciprocity over expatriates had led to a softening on the other side. Who could have foreseen such a thing?
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    PAWPAW Posts: 1,074
    edited March 2017
    I had lunch with someone that works for McClaren a few weeks ago. I heard that Mercedes are suspected of adding additives to the sump oil, and then pumping the oil into the air intake. To avoid the additive checks on the fuel. The proof apparently is their smokey exhaust. But it may be old news to F1 watchers.
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    BojabobBojabob Posts: 642
    Pulpstar said:

    Bojabob said:

    Pulpstar said:

    Just when will people stop getting Michael Farron and Tim Fallon mixed up ! :>

    That Tim Fillon should resign from the Lib Dems after paying his wife all that money!

    I think you are getting mixed up with Tim Farnham MP. Easily done.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thomas_Farnham_(MP)
    John Collins was replaced at Fulham FC in the early noughties by Collins John.
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    kjhkjh Posts: 10,673
    PlatoSaid said:

    PlatoSaid said:

    The NYT have been caught memory holing - did they think we wouldn't notice?

    It's destroying themselves Part 94

    http://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2017/03/new-york-times-goes-back-and-changes-january-headline-from-wiretapped-to-intercepted-to-bash-trump/

    Maybe you would not notice because it did not happen.

    http://www.snopes.com/nytimes-wiretap-articles/
    Snopes is pretty much discredited. They've been caught out re political agendas. Let them stick to BigFoot.
    So the web page you read doesn't have a political agenda? I think to most normal people looking at it would think its agenda rather one sided and extreme. And you dismiss another site (which also probably has an agenda as most do) without even looking at the content for this story which was analytical and without researching in any depth did seem credible.

    Your posts on Trump are cult like in the extreme. You are happy to accept the most convoluted conspiracies to explain anything. The man can do no wrong in your eyes and the Democrats and media are just evil bastards.

    The posts on this site range from left to right but nobody defends who they support like you do. Your insight into the Trump campaign and regime is really interesting but your god like adulation just isn't normal.
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    TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 41,403
    Pulpstar said:

    Bojabob said:

    Pulpstar said:

    Just when will people stop getting Michael Farron and Tim Fallon mixed up ! :>

    That Tim Fillon should resign from the Lib Dems after paying his wife all that money!

    I think you are getting mixed up with Tim Farnham MP. Easily done.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thomas_Farnham_(MP)
    David Davies and David Davis are another pair.
    Don't you start...
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    BojabobBojabob Posts: 642
    Ishmael_Z said:

    Bojabob said:

    Meanwhile, I note that Guy Verhofstadt is pushing harder for letting Brits keep their EU citizenship after Brexit. If it cost, say £100 a year, I would certainly keep mine.

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-39228245

    Almost as if the government's tough stance on reciprocity over expatriates had led to a softening on the other side. Who could have foreseen such a thing?
    Not really. He's been flying such a kite for a while. He has simply pushed it again today.
This discussion has been closed.