politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » Well this won’t make John Bercow happy but grumpy if only he h
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The thing about the French and their system is that there are alaways between 70-75% of the voting population who will vote against the National Front and they're made up of left right and centre. I wish I had as much confidence in this countryMortimer said:
That seals it. Rogerdamus has spoken.Roger said:
She has no chance whatsoever.Mortimer said:
I've been thinking the same this week.GnomeinZurich said:
For the first time ever I'm tempted to put tuppence ha penny on a Le Pen.HYUFD said:
There are now compromising photos of Macron circulating in Paris apparently after his denials of a homosexual affairScott_P said:
https://twitter.com/evanoconnell/status/829336357684256770Sandpit said:That's getting awfully close.
Maybe she will do it after all. France's establishment can't really blame anyone but themselves if she does...0 -
5 days of Paris riots give her ammunition and of course Roger says no chance......Mortimer said:
I've been thinking the same this week.GnomeinZurich said:
For the first time ever I'm tempted to put tuppence ha penny on a Le Pen.HYUFD said:
There are now compromising photos of Macron circulating in Paris apparently after his denials of a homosexual affairScott_P said:
https://twitter.com/evanoconnell/status/829336357684256770Sandpit said:That's getting awfully close.
Maybe she will do it after all. France's establishment can't really blame anyone but themselves if she does...
So odds on really :-)0 -
Hmmmm. Does it pass the smell test?Scott_P said:0 -
When you look at who has the least favourable view of Muslim immigration - the Polish - it makes me wonder what really bubbles beneath the surface in London.HYUFD said:Right on cue for Le Pen a new Chatham House poll has 55% of European voters wanting to end all immigration from majority Islamic nations
http://www.westmonster.com/shock-poll-55-of-europeans-want-to-end-immigration-from-muslim-countries/
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Does tonight suggest Boundary changes have a bit more chance of passing than maybe we thought - ie good party management by Theresa May, MPs less inclined to rebel.
Still will be on a knife edge for sure, but maybe a pointer.0 -
Was she in Brighton at the time?Sean_F said:
I remember Mme. Cresson expressing the opinion that most English men were homosexual.HYUFD said:
I think France electing a nationalist, protectionist, anti Euro President may be rather more dramatic than her gender though of course it would also be a story (albeit France has had a female PM, Edith Cresson)Mortimer said:Imagine if France elects a female Pres before either of the 'progressive' parties in the U.K. Have had a female leader. FRANCE!
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Parliamentlive reckons this is the ninth division, so I think this is the last amendment before the substantive vote.0
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60-65%, but it depends who the opponent is. Le Pen might win against Hamon.Roger said:
The thing about the French and their system is that there are alaways between 70-75% of the voting population who will vote against the National Front and they're made up of left right and centre. I wish I had as much confidence in this countryMortimer said:
That seals it. Rogerdamus has spoken.Roger said:
She has no chance whatsoever.Mortimer said:
I've been thinking the same this week.GnomeinZurich said:
For the first time ever I'm tempted to put tuppence ha penny on a Le Pen.HYUFD said:
There are now compromising photos of Macron circulating in Paris apparently after his denials of a homosexual affairScott_P said:
https://twitter.com/evanoconnell/status/829336357684256770Sandpit said:That's getting awfully close.
Maybe she will do it after all. France's establishment can't really blame anyone but themselves if she does...0 -
Who fills the role of the National Front equivalent in this country? If UKIP they got less than 13%, and any of the other options got far far less. Seems like we aren't doing too bad on that front.Roger said:
The thing about the French and their system is that there are alaways between 70-75% of the voting population who will vote against the National Front and they're made up of left right and centre. I wish I had as much confidence in this countryMortimer said:
That seals it. Rogerdamus has spoken.Roger said:
She has no chance whatsoever.Mortimer said:
I've been thinking the same this week.GnomeinZurich said:
For the first time ever I'm tempted to put tuppence ha penny on a Le Pen.HYUFD said:
There are now compromising photos of Macron circulating in Paris apparently after his denials of a homosexual affairScott_P said:
https://twitter.com/evanoconnell/status/829336357684256770Sandpit said:That's getting awfully close.
Maybe she will do it after all. France's establishment can't really blame anyone but themselves if she does...0 -
Not quite so true actually, the latest poll has hard left voters voting for Le Pen over Fillon and over a quarter of centre left voters tooRoger said:
The thing about the French and their system is that there are alaways between 70-75% of the voting population who will vote against the National Front and they're made up of left right and centre. I wish I had as much confidence in this countryMortimer said:
That seals it. Rogerdamus has spoken.Roger said:
She has no chance whatsoever.Mortimer said:
I've been thinking the same this week.GnomeinZurich said:
For the first time ever I'm tempted to put tuppence ha penny on a Le Pen.HYUFD said:
There are now compromising photos of Macron circulating in Paris apparently after his denials of a homosexual affairScott_P said:
https://twitter.com/evanoconnell/status/829336357684256770Sandpit said:That's getting awfully close.
Maybe she will do it after all. France's establishment can't really blame anyone but themselves if she does...0 -
Yes, probably about the one thing she is remembered forSean_F said:
I remember Mme. Cresson expressing the opinion that most English men were homosexual.HYUFD said:
I think France electing a nationalist, protectionist, anti Euro President may be rather more dramatic than her gender though of course it would also be a story (albeit France has had a female PM, Edith Cresson)Mortimer said:Imagine if France elects a female Pres before either of the 'progressive' parties in the U.K. Have had a female leader. FRANCE!
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Don't argue with stupid Dwarves, it's not big and it's not clever.........GnomeinZurich said:
Dwarfs don't grow silly, thats why there dwarfs.ReggieCide said:
You omitted one quite important factor. Bercow becomes more turd-like by the day. We just have to hope that he doesn't start to grow.kle4 said:This whole Trump state visit business and its aftermath seems to be a whole series of events where I intently dislike the focus of ire and his policies, that is to say Trump, but find myself erring on the side of those defending what happened, or at least not agreeing that the best response is to throw great big wobblies about it.
Therefore, while I didn't think May should have offered Trump a state visit quite as soon as she did (he's a US President, we'd have to at some point, probably), it's not really viable to take it away once it has been offered, since any of the reasons not to - he's a boorish racist, that sort of thing - applies to plenty of others who have been given a visit, and who usually lead even worse regimes.
And therefore while I don't want Trump to be invited to address parliament, Bercow getting up on his soapbox to talk about how he wouldn't permit it even if it was offered, which it hadn't, and deliberately didn't even give a heads up to the other people who consider such requests, struck me as diminishing the position of Speaker - if he merely wanted to reflect the will of the house, which is at best divided on whether Trump should be granted such an address, should one be offered, then he could and should have replied to the effect that he knew many members had concerns about such an event, which he shared, and that he would raise those concerns very seriously with the other two people involved in the decision.
And therefore while I think Bercow has undermined himself quite considerably through his behaviour, I don't know that leading a coup against him is the best move at this time, perhaps further enforcing the idea the instant a Speaker does something you don't like they should be ousted.
Now the third I am not settled on. Some would say Bercow has crossed the line before and enough is enough, and others even if he has, knifing him in this fashion would be disproportionate and more harmful than merely taking steps to ensure he is not re-elected as Speaker some day, even if that means waiting some while.0 -
I'm pretty sure most of us expect it to pass. JustinShortStraw doesnt, but says it so often that it has become tiresome.MikeL said:Does tonight suggest Boundary changes have a bit more chance of passing than maybe we thought - ie good party management by Theresa May, MPs less inclined to rebel.
Still will be on a knife edge for sure, but maybe a pointer.0 -
What about the attendance allowances for the poor impoverished dears?logical_song said:
No point in existing if they don't do their job.ReggieCide said:
I think it's an existential decision for the Lords and they must surely know it.Sandpit said:
Tory whips doing a very good job of getting everyone in, with the exception of Ken Clarke.MikeL said:Govt wins on EU nationals:
332-290
Not much difference from other votes.
A lot of pressure now on the Lords to pass the bill unamended, following both the wishes of the Commons and the People in the referendum.0 -
@michaelsavage: Lewis resigns.0
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Bill goes through unamended.0
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If there had been no EU referendum who knows what UKIP would have got in 2020kle4 said:
Who fills the role of the National Front equivalent in this country? If UKIP they got less than 13%, and any of the other options got far far less. Seems like we aren't doing too bad on that front.Roger said:
The thing about the French and their system is that there are alaways between 70-75% of the voting population who will vote against the National Front and they're made up of left right and centre. I wish I had as much confidence in this countryMortimer said:
That seals it. Rogerdamus has spoken.Roger said:
She has no chance whatsoever.Mortimer said:
I've been thinking the same this week.GnomeinZurich said:
For the first time ever I'm tempted to put tuppence ha penny on a Le Pen.HYUFD said:
There are now compromising photos of Macron circulating in Paris apparently after his denials of a homosexual affairScott_P said:
https://twitter.com/evanoconnell/status/829336357684256770Sandpit said:That's getting awfully close.
Maybe she will do it after all. France's establishment can't really blame anyone but themselves if she does...0 -
I'm afraid this isn't 2002 anymore. The situation has worsened and Marine's nimbler than her father. She'll win.Roger said:
The thing about the French and their system is that there are alaways between 70-75% of the voting population who will vote against the National Front and they're made up of left right and centre. I wish I had as much confidence in this countryMortimer said:
That seals it. Rogerdamus has spoken.Roger said:
She has no chance whatsoever.Mortimer said:
I've been thinking the same this week.GnomeinZurich said:
For the first time ever I'm tempted to put tuppence ha penny on a Le Pen.HYUFD said:
There are now compromising photos of Macron circulating in Paris apparently after his denials of a homosexual affairScott_P said:
https://twitter.com/evanoconnell/status/829336357684256770Sandpit said:That's getting awfully close.
Maybe she will do it after all. France's establishment can't really blame anyone but themselves if she does...0 -
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@tnewtondunn: Breaking: Clive Lewis resigns. How long before he challenges Corbyn for leader?0
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There is an outside chance she beats Fillon too nowSean_F said:
60-65%, but it depends who the opponent is. Le Pen might win against Hamon.Roger said:
The thing about the French and their system is that there are alaways between 70-75% of the voting population who will vote against the National Front and they're made up of left right and centre. I wish I had as much confidence in this countryMortimer said:
That seals it. Rogerdamus has spoken.Roger said:
She has no chance whatsoever.Mortimer said:
I've been thinking the same this week.GnomeinZurich said:
For the first time ever I'm tempted to put tuppence ha penny on a Le Pen.HYUFD said:
There are now compromising photos of Macron circulating in Paris apparently after his denials of a homosexual affairScott_P said:
https://twitter.com/evanoconnell/status/829336357684256770Sandpit said:That's getting awfully close.
Maybe she will do it after all. France's establishment can't really blame anyone but themselves if she does...0 -
That would depend on how desirable being in these pilots is perceived to be, how many did apply, and why of all those who did Surrey were chosen. It's likely to be above board but provide much fodder for comment, I'd guess.TheWhiteRabbit said:
Exactly Scott, not sure why you crossed that out.Scott_P said:
All councils are free to apply. No special treatment.0 -
Not only does this make it difficult for the Lords but as others have mentioned, we've had every possible amendment also voted down.Sandpit said:Bill goes through unamended.
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If I may venture to say so without being rude, that post is an excellent and an amazing reflection of the state of the Labour party.kle4 said:Surely the good thing about being a Labour MP uncertain if you want to enter the Shadow Cabinet but knowing you are one of the few left who has not resigned from it or committed to not being in even if asked, is if things go badly something will come along in a few months which will give you a reason to resign as well, limiting the damage, and there are so many former shadow cabinet members most people probably won't remember you were in it, nor will you have spent that much time with Jeremy himself, since depending on your portfolio he probably ignored you anyway. And of course on the off chance things go well, you reap the reward for being a loyal trooper for that unlikely event.
Or, more succinctly, ... eh?
Good evening everyone.0 -
Not quite. She's also remembered as the worst ever French PM, and for bringing down the entire European Commission. Not many can match that record of failure at the highest level.HYUFD said:
Yes, probably about the one thing she is remembered forSean_F said:
I remember Mme. Cresson expressing the opinion that most English men were homosexual.HYUFD said:
I think France electing a nationalist, protectionist, anti Euro President may be rather more dramatic than her gender though of course it would also be a story (albeit France has had a female PM, Edith Cresson)Mortimer said:Imagine if France elects a female Pres before either of the 'progressive' parties in the U.K. Have had a female leader. FRANCE!
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@momentumtrumpt1: Operation Clive is go! Operation Clive is go! Owen Jones, press send on the press release!0
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By having been talked of as a potential successor, he has in effect challenged him by resigning. Formally challenge? After the locals maybe? (as I think Labour will win the parliamentary by-elections)Scott_P said:@tnewtondunn: Breaking: Clive Lewis resigns. How long before he challenges Corbyn for leader?
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Yes, somewhat concerningchestnut said:
When you look at who has the least favourable view of Muslim immigration - the Polish - it makes me wonder what really bubbles beneath the surface in London.HYUFD said:Right on cue for Le Pen a new Chatham House poll has 55% of European voters wanting to end all immigration from majority Islamic nations
http://www.westmonster.com/shock-poll-55-of-europeans-want-to-end-immigration-from-muslim-countries/0 -
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popcorn, popcorn, get yer popcorn.......0
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Trump 'not my President'?Scott_P said:BoJo not running for President...
https://twitter.com/wsj/status/8293957152521707560 -
Perhaps explains why the French were rather reluctant to elect another socialist female leader in 2007 when Sarkozy beat Royalwilliamglenn said:
Not quite. She's also remembered as the worst ever French PM, and for bringing down the entire European Commission. Not many can match that record of failure at the highest level.HYUFD said:
Yes, probably about the one thing she is remembered forSean_F said:
I remember Mme. Cresson expressing the opinion that most English men were homosexual.HYUFD said:
I think France electing a nationalist, protectionist, anti Euro President may be rather more dramatic than her gender though of course it would also be a story (albeit France has had a female PM, Edith Cresson)Mortimer said:Imagine if France elects a female Pres before either of the 'progressive' parties in the U.K. Have had a female leader. FRANCE!
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@KateEMcCann: Baby in Commons has started crying. Presumably at the news of Clive Lewis resignation.0
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Well, perhaps I could have split it across more than 2 sentences, 90% of them in one sentence.AnneJGP said:
If I may venture to say so without being rude, that post is an excellent and an amazing reflection of the state of the Labour party.kle4 said:Surely the good thing about being a Labour MP uncertain if you want to enter the Shadow Cabinet but knowing you are one of the few left who has not resigned from it or committed to not being in even if asked, is if things go badly something will come along in a few months which will give you a reason to resign as well, limiting the damage, and there are so many former shadow cabinet members most people probably won't remember you were in it, nor will you have spent that much time with Jeremy himself, since depending on your portfolio he probably ignored you anyway. And of course on the off chance things go well, you reap the reward for being a loyal trooper for that unlikely event.
Or, more succinctly, ... eh?
But in short:
A lot of people have resigned from the shadow cabinet
Not many are left who are available to fill the posts
Many who have filled previous vacancies have then resigned not long after
Therefore one can accept a position, knowing a reason for resignation will come along if needed to save face
So many have served in the shadow cabinet you can probably avoid criticism for doing so, since few will remember you amid the crowd
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I suspect a new thread any minute now.....Lewis is only marginally better than Corbyn but at least he'll unblock the U-bend0
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off the cuff thenScott_P said:0 -
@paulwaugh: Lab MPs point out Clive Lewis voted for Govt clause + still resigned. They claim he didn't know what he'd voted for.
"What a knob" one says0 -
Shit.Roger said:
She has no chance whatsoever.Mortimer said:
I've been thinking the same this week.GnomeinZurich said:
For the first time ever I'm tempted to put tuppence ha penny on a Le Pen.HYUFD said:
There are now compromising photos of Macron circulating in Paris apparently after his denials of a homosexual affairScott_P said:
https://twitter.com/evanoconnell/status/829336357684256770Sandpit said:That's getting awfully close.
Maybe she will do it after all. France's establishment can't really blame anyone but themselves if she does...0 -
I am getting so fat eating all this popcorn over the past year....Floater said:popcorn, popcorn, get yer popcorn.......
https://media.giphy.com/media/pmpTiiqJlgccU/giphy.gif0 -
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Well I don't know.Mortimer said:
I'm pretty sure most of us expect it to pass. JustinShortStraw doesnt, but says it so often that it has become tiresome.MikeL said:Does tonight suggest Boundary changes have a bit more chance of passing than maybe we thought - ie good party management by Theresa May, MPs less inclined to rebel.
Still will be on a knife edge for sure, but maybe a pointer.
DUP and UUP are against. Carswell may well vote against to keep his seat unchanged.
Effective majority is 14 assuming Con don't win Copeland or Stoke. Could go lower with any by-election loss in next 21 months.
I think it's knife-edge at best. Even if passes Commons, could lose in Lords.
No Ping Pong on Statutory Instruments - but I imagine they could reintroduce it, with a trivial change if legally required - eg change name of one seat.0 -
@bbcnickrobinson: Brexit means Cl-exit ... twitter.com/bbcbreaking/st…0
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Well he was sacked from local bbc for being as thick as two short planks and knowing bugger all about politics.dr_spyn said:Knives are out.
https://twitter.com/paulwaugh/status/8294212706934497290 -
@PolhomeEditor: BREAKING: Diane Abbott votes FOR triggering Article 50.0
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During the London Riots, up in Hoxton, the Polish and Vietnamese communities got on famously. At the back, behind the shops and restaurants, they were sitting together - the Vietnamese chefs (meat cleavers and machetes) the Polish off-license owners (baseball bats) - drinking beers and sharing cigarettes as they waited for the rioters to show up. It was a happy band of brothers....HYUFD said:
Yes, somewhat concerningchestnut said:
When you look at who has the least favourable view of Muslim immigration - the Polish - it makes me wonder what really bubbles beneath the surface in London.HYUFD said:Right on cue for Le Pen a new Chatham House poll has 55% of European voters wanting to end all immigration from majority Islamic nations
http://www.westmonster.com/shock-poll-55-of-europeans-want-to-end-immigration-from-muslim-countries/0 -
@jonwalker121: MPs in the Commons Chamber singing Ode to Joy as voting takes place. Deputy Speaker Lindsay Hoyle tells them to stop #brexit0
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With Russia trying to game the election just as they did in the States, you might be right.MonikerDiCanio said:
I'm afraid this isn't 2002 anymore. The situation has worsened and Marine's nimbler than her father. She'll win.Roger said:
The thing about the French and their system is that there are alaways between 70-75% of the voting population who will vote against the National Front and they're made up of left right and centre. I wish I had as much confidence in this countryMortimer said:
That seals it. Rogerdamus has spoken.Roger said:
She has no chance whatsoever.Mortimer said:
I've been thinking the same this week.GnomeinZurich said:
For the first time ever I'm tempted to put tuppence ha penny on a Le Pen.HYUFD said:
There are now compromising photos of Macron circulating in Paris apparently after his denials of a homosexual affairScott_P said:
https://twitter.com/evanoconnell/status/829336357684256770Sandpit said:That's getting awfully close.
Maybe she will do it after all. France's establishment can't really blame anyone but themselves if she does...0 -
Clive Lewis @ 5.2 / 6.6 on BF
Difficult to read movement in next few days, though in truth it's too short.0 -
I do find it amusing that Brexit Britain — almost like Nazi Germany if you listen to some people — is one of the less reactionary EU nations.chestnut said:
When you look at who has the least favourable view of Muslim immigration - the Polish - it makes me wonder what really bubbles beneath the surface in London.HYUFD said:Right on cue for Le Pen a new Chatham House poll has 55% of European voters wanting to end all immigration from majority Islamic nations
http://www.westmonster.com/shock-poll-55-of-europeans-want-to-end-immigration-from-muslim-countries/0 -
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That one MP being the Honourable Member for Islington Northdr_spyn said:Knives are out.
https://twitter.com/paulwaugh/status/8294212706934497290 -
Did Lindsay Hoyle just give some MPs a rollocking for singing Ode to Joy?0
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Voting both ways?dr_spyn said:0 -
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Yep. I'll leave to guess from which party.ThreeQuidder said:Did Lindsay Hoyle just give some MPs a rollocking for singing Ode to Joy?
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That's a funny name for Tim Farron.Scott_P said:@KateEMcCann: Baby in Commons has started crying. Presumably at the news of Clive Lewis resignation.
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Sounds like ideal material for a Labour leader.FrancisUrquhart said:
Well he was sacked from local bbc for being as thick as two short planks and knowing bugger all about politics.dr_spyn said:Knives are out.
https://twitter.com/paulwaugh/status/8294212706934497290 -
By "some MPs" you mean the SNP mob - the same lot who applaud as if they were at a county council meeting or something like that.ThreeQuidder said:Did Lindsay Hoyle just give some MPs a rollocking for singing Ode to Joy?
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Sounds like the Koreans during the LA riots of '92.Malmesbury said:
During the London Riots, up in Hoxton, the Polish and Vietnamese communities got on famously. At the back, behind the shops and restaurants, they were sitting together - the Vietnamese chefs (meat cleavers and machetes) the Polish off-license owners (baseball bats) - drinking beers and sharing cigarettes as they waited for the rioters to show up. It was a happy band of brothers....HYUFD said:
Yes, somewhat concerningchestnut said:
When you look at who has the least favourable view of Muslim immigration - the Polish - it makes me wonder what really bubbles beneath the surface in London.HYUFD said:Right on cue for Le Pen a new Chatham House poll has 55% of European voters wanting to end all immigration from majority Islamic nations
http://www.westmonster.com/shock-poll-55-of-europeans-want-to-end-immigration-from-muslim-countries/0 -
@paulwaugh: Leading Tory Remainer: "Done - for now"0
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Yes, more top work from Hoyle.ThreeQuidder said:Did Lindsay Hoyle just give some MPs a rollocking for singing Ode to Joy?
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If I'd guessed I would have said eurosceptics being ironic, but apparently notSandpit said:
Yep. I'll leave to guess from which party.ThreeQuidder said:Did Lindsay Hoyle just give some MPs a rollocking for singing Ode to Joy?
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I will join you in that toast.Floater said:I can't see them shafting the poison dwarf just now.
But I would raise a glass or 2 if he does get toppled.
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Clive Lewis going for it, left wing but anti Brexit0
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It was rather amusing. He does seem to have drawn his style more from Betty Boothroyd than from her successors.MikeL said:
Yes, more top work from Hoyle.ThreeQuidder said:Did Lindsay Hoyle just give some MPs a rollocking for singing Ode to Joy?
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Owen delivers the black spot...
@OwenJones84: Clive Lewis is genuinely one of the most principled people I've ever met, he resigned on a point of principle and that is commendable pic.twitter.com/39GVuh0DIn0 -
I have spent the last 2 days in Copeland. I stayed overnight in the Trout Inn in Cockermouth where apparently Bing Crosby was a regular visitor back in the day (for the fishing apparently). My general observation is that you would not know there is a bye-election taken place. I drove the whole of the constituency on the A595 and saw precisely 3 posters: one for the LDs on the road out of Keswick, one for Labour in Whitehaven, and one for the Conservatives in Bootle - probably the home of the candidate. So expect a poor turnout. The local churches have arranged a hustings on Saturday but apparently the Labour candidate has refused to attend- replaced by tub of lard?0
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Has Lewis shot himself in the foot by voting for the Govt clauses?
He probably just thought he had to oppose 3rd Reading.
Shows how careful you need to be - it's a schoolboy error - some may say it's technical so who cares - but if you want to be PM you have to get the basics right.0 -
@paulwaugh: "He does look nice in his funeral suit" one Lab MP says of @labourlewis. 52 Lab rebels, inc Lewis, on Brexit bill 3rd reading.0
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494-122. Bill read the Third time, and passed.0
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494-122 on the bill itself. Lots of rebels there.0
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Hoyle's declared the Noes having it so often today he's got stuck...0
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@paulwaugh: Diane Abbott was "helped through" the Aye lobby by Keith Vaz, MP tells me.0
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Nothing quite like explaining European fencing to a Vietnamese chef - with a Polish audience.wasd said:
Sounds like the Koreans during the LA riots of '92.Malmesbury said:
During the London Riots, up in Hoxton, the Polish and Vietnamese communities got on famously. At the back, behind the shops and restaurants, they were sitting together - the Vietnamese chefs (meat cleavers and machetes) the Polish off-license owners (baseball bats) - drinking beers and sharing cigarettes as they waited for the rioters to show up. It was a happy band of brothers....HYUFD said:
Yes, somewhat concerningchestnut said:
When you look at who has the least favourable view of Muslim immigration - the Polish - it makes me wonder what really bubbles beneath the surface in London.HYUFD said:Right on cue for Le Pen a new Chatham House poll has 55% of European voters wanting to end all immigration from majority Islamic nations
http://www.westmonster.com/shock-poll-55-of-europeans-want-to-end-immigration-from-muslim-countries/
A grand bunch.0 -
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@paulwaugh: Debbie Abrahams voted for Brexit bill, despite having told shad cabinet this wk to do so wd be "morally untenable" (shadmn source tells me)0
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Shot himself in the foot while digging a hole for himself perhaps?MikeL said:Has Lewis shot himself in the foot by voting for the Govt clauses?
Eh, who can predict thesedays, if he goes for it and looks and sounds credible, the technicalities or specifics of his positions will be easily overlooked.
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...the Commons.ThreeQuidder said:494-122. Bill read the Third time, and passed.
Still the Lords to go! And then possibly Ping Pong.0 -
What happens if you vote down all amendments, but then vote down the "put the bill as it stands to a vote" vote?0
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Posters have gone massively out of fashion since the 1990s when even safe seats used to be plastered with them. I don't think people like to be thought of as election anoraks these days.slade said:I have spent the last 2 days in Copeland. I stayed overnight in the Trout Inn in Cockermouth where apparently Bing Crosby was a regular visitor back in the day (for the fishing apparently). My general observation is that you would not know there is a bye-election taken place. I drove the whole of the constituency on the A595 and saw precisely 3 posters: one for the LDs on the road out of Keswick, one for Labour in Whitehaven, and one for the Conservatives in Bootle - probably the home of the candidate. So expect a poor turnout. The local churches have arranged a hustings on Saturday but apparently the Labour candidate has refused to attend- replaced by tub of lard?
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I believe he loses his U.S. nationality automatically the moment he becomes the foreign minister of another country. The assumption is that his allegiance is to the country he is foreign minister of and as such would work against U.S. interests. This would be incompatible with his U.S. nationality.
https://travel.state.gov/content/travel/en/legal-considerations/us-citizenship-laws-policies/citizenship-and-dual-nationality/citizenship-and-seeking-public-office.htmlScott_P said:BoJo not running for President...
https://twitter.com/wsj/status/829395715252170756
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"Because there is no administrative presumption that U.S. nationals who hold policy-level positions in foreign governments necessarily intend to retain their U.S. nationality , efforts are made to adjudicate fully such cases to determine the individual's intent. Certain policy level positions are inherently incompatible with retaining U.S. nationality. Cases of this nature generally involve heads of state or foreign ministers. Except with respect to these positions, the Department will not typically consider employment in a policy-level position to lead to loss of nationality if the individual says that he or she did not intend to lose their U.S. nationality and if the individual’s actions were consistent with the retention of U.S. nationality. Actions consistent with the retention of U.S. nationality include, but are not limited to, travel on a U.S. passport, voting in U.S. elections, payment of U.S. taxes, maintenance of a residence in the United States, etc.. In any event each policy-level position case is fully evaluated on a case-by-case basis."FF43 said:
I believe he loses his U.S. nationality automatically the moment he becomes the foreign minister of another country. The assumption is that his allegiance is to the country he is foreign minister of and as such would work against U.S. interests. This would be incompatible with his U.S. nationality.
https://travel.state.gov/content/travel/en/legal-considerations/us-citizenship-laws-policies/citizenship-and-dual-nationality/citizenship-and-seeking-public-office.htmlScott_P said:BoJo not running for President...
https://twitter.com/wsj/status/829395715252170756
As soon as the US send him the letter, he'd have to give it up. T'was only a matter of time.0 -
Then the Bill fails and never gets to the Lords.TheWhiteRabbit said:What happens if you vote down all amendments, but then vote down the "put the bill as it stands to a vote" vote?
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Yes, they should be showing respect for the mother of parliaments in the prescribed way.CornishBlue said:
By "some MPs" you mean the SNP mob - the same lot who applaud as if they were at a county council meeting or something like that.ThreeQuidder said:Did Lindsay Hoyle just give some MPs a rollocking for singing Ode to Joy?
Barking, bellowing, jeering, finger pointing and the like.0 -
Well, yes. But if the Lords play silly buggers in the face of the votes of both the people and the Commons, the threat of certain measures can bring them in line.CornishBlue said:
...the Commons.ThreeQuidder said:494-122. Bill read the Third time, and passed.
Still the Lords to go! And then possibly Ping Pong.0 -
So why not concentrate fire on that one then?ThreeQuidder said:
Then the Bill fails and never gets to the Lords.TheWhiteRabbit said:What happens if you vote down all amendments, but then vote down the "put the bill as it stands to a vote" vote?
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What?! But we is so cool!AndyJS said:
Posters have gone massively out of fashion since the 1990s when even safe seats used to be plastered with them. I don't think people like to be thought of as election anoraks these days.slade said:I have spent the last 2 days in Copeland. I stayed overnight in the Trout Inn in Cockermouth where apparently Bing Crosby was a regular visitor back in the day (for the fishing apparently). My general observation is that you would not know there is a bye-election taken place. I drove the whole of the constituency on the A595 and saw precisely 3 posters: one for the LDs on the road out of Keswick, one for Labour in Whitehaven, and one for the Conservatives in Bootle - probably the home of the candidate. So expect a poor turnout. The local churches have arranged a hustings on Saturday but apparently the Labour candidate has refused to attend- replaced by tub of lard?
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I thought he gave it up a while ago, they threatened to make him pay Federal taxesFF43 said:
I believe he loses his U.S. nationality automatically the moment he becomes the foreign minister of another country. The assumption is that his allegiance is to the country he is foreign minister of and as such would work against U.S. interests. This would be incompatible with his U.S. nationality.
https://travel.state.gov/content/travel/en/legal-considerations/us-citizenship-laws-policies/citizenship-and-dual-nationality/citizenship-and-seeking-public-office.htmlScott_P said:BoJo not running for President...
https://twitter.com/wsj/status/8293957152521707560 -
If you can defeat a Bill at third reading you should be able to defeat it at second reading.TheWhiteRabbit said:
So why not concentrate fire on that one then?ThreeQuidder said:
Then the Bill fails and never gets to the Lords.TheWhiteRabbit said:What happens if you vote down all amendments, but then vote down the "put the bill as it stands to a vote" vote?
The problem is that once it gets to the third reading the Commons has already agreed that the Bill should, in principle, be passed (as that's what giving the bill its second reading means). According to Wikipedia (yes, I know) only one post-war government Bill has been defeated in the Commons at third reading.
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I think the 'eh' was because you started the second sentence with a conjunction ("And"): if you ever feel like doing that, change the full stop for a colon and omit the 'And'.kle4 said:
Well, perhaps I could have split it across more than 2 sentences, 90% of them in one sentence.AnneJGP said:
If I may venture to say so without being rude, that post is an excellent and an amazing reflection of the state of the Labour party.kle4 said:Surely the good thing about being a Labour MP uncertain if you want to enter the Shadow Cabinet but knowing you are one of the few left who has not resigned from it or committed to not being in even if asked, is if things go badly something will come along in a few months which will give you a reason to resign as well, limiting the damage, and there are so many former shadow cabinet members most people probably won't remember you were in it, nor will you have spent that much time with Jeremy himself, since depending on your portfolio he probably ignored you anyway. And of course on the off chance things go well, you reap the reward for being a loyal trooper for that unlikely event.
Or, more succinctly, ... eh?
But in short:
A lot of people have resigned from the shadow cabinet
Not many are left who are available to fill the posts
Many who have filled previous vacancies have then resigned not long after
Therefore one can accept a position, knowing a reason for resignation will come along if needed to save face
So many have served in the shadow cabinet you can probably avoid criticism for doing so, since few will remember you amid the crowd0 -
I meant, of the two votes tonight - the actual vote and the preceding "put it to a vote" vote - presumably both kill the bill, so why is there a difference in opposition?ThreeQuidder said:
If you can defeat a Bill at third reading you should be able to defeat it at second reading.TheWhiteRabbit said:
So why not concentrate fire on that one then?ThreeQuidder said:
Then the Bill fails and never gets to the Lords.TheWhiteRabbit said:What happens if you vote down all amendments, but then vote down the "put the bill as it stands to a vote" vote?
The problem is that once it gets to the third reading the Commons has already agreed that the Bill should, in principle, be passed (as that's what giving the bill its second reading means). According to Wikipedia (yes, I know) only one post-war government Bill has been defeated in the Commons at third reading.0 -
Getting really mad at clapping is perhaps overdone. Getting precious and deliberately flouting a convention of the house (and it is, admittedly, not a firm rule as far as I know) as though it is some grand stand is not exactly an amazing act of defiance either.Theuniondivvie said:
Yes, they should be showing respect for the mother of parliaments in the prescribed way.CornishBlue said:
By "some MPs" you mean the SNP mob - the same lot who applaud as if they were at a county council meeting or something like that.ThreeQuidder said:Did Lindsay Hoyle just give some MPs a rollocking for singing Ode to Joy?
Barking, bellowing, jeering, finger pointing and the like.
The convention on generally not clapping is a quirk of the house, and harmless to boot, but if due to more frequent exception the custom dies out, it won't be the end of the world. Quite why the SNP, en masse, think it is such a big deal as to flout it with regularity in the first place I cannot quite figure out. It's not like, objectively, banging one's hands together is any more or less dignified than jeering or cheering. They just disrupt in a different way.
A pedant will be along shortly to say the expression mother of parliaments was a reference to england, not the parliament of the uk, but I would counter the pedant by saying that may have been what it was first used for, but that the term is and has been more broadly used for a long time.0 -
I doubt that anything would make Theresa May happier than Lib Dem and Labour lords blocking the Brexit Bill. Hello April election and a 150 majority.ThreeQuidder said:
Well, yes. But if the Lords play silly buggers in the face of the votes of both the people and the Commons, the threat of certain measures can bring them in line.CornishBlue said:
...the Commons.ThreeQuidder said:494-122. Bill read the Third time, and passed.
Still the Lords to go! And then possibly Ping Pong.0
