politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » Corbyn’s future – the wait goes on
politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » Corbyn’s future – the wait goes on
Labour’s NEC is deciding whether Corbyn can be on the ballot in the coming leadership election without having to secure the nominations of 51 MPs and MEPs.
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First!
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Second
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Second like the EU.0
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A May 1-20
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This is inspirational politics at its best.0
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iain watson @iainjwatson 6m6 minutes ago
So after losing the vote on the secret ballot better news for Jeremy Corbyn in that the case for automatic inclusion on ballot being heard0 -
Possibly one of the biggest myths it's that it's only New Labourites who oppose Corbyn. I know Labour voters from all walks of life who want Corbyn gone and fear for Labour's future if he stays. None of them liked New Labour or Tony Blair.0
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Mr. Jonathan, why make a decision when you can talk about it for eight bloody hours?
Gove took 5 minutes to knife Boris. He should subcontract his services to Labour.0 -
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This wait is getting boring.0
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iain watson @iainjwatson 3m3 minutes ago
Slight clarification -nec About to hear pro Corbyn legal advice rather than currently in process of hearing it0 -
Why not let him stand for re election and defeat him then, rather than desperately try to keep him off the ballot?The_Apocalypse said:Possibly one of the biggest myths it's that it's only New Labourites who oppose Corbyn. I know Labour voters from all walks of life who want Corbyn gone and fear for Labour's future if he stays. None of them liked New Labour or Tony Blair.
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Why would it not be heard, as it is the whole point of the meeting?bigjohnowls said:iain watson @iainjwatson 6m6 minutes ago
So after losing the vote on the secret ballot better news for Jeremy Corbyn in that the case for automatic inclusion on ballot being heard0 -
Looks at the spreadsheet of NEC members...bigjohnowls said:
I'm not taking that bet....0 -
Martha GillVerified account
@Martha_Gill
4 crates of sandwiches just went into lab hq #LabourNEC
Only the beer needed now and we really are back in the late 1970s.0 -
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I saw Stephen Kinnock being interviewed earlier on Sky News. He was furious about Corbyn wanting Article 50 invoked immediately.
Nice that he cares about the pensions of his old ma and da.0 -
You know that Blair new dawn moment. This is the opposite.
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Mr. T, I like pb.com too, but that's overdoing it a bit.0
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Very little that has happened in this entire saga has made any sense...!Ishmael_X said:
Why would it not be heard, as it is the whole point of the meeting?bigjohnowls said:iain watson @iainjwatson 6m6 minutes ago
So after losing the vote on the secret ballot better news for Jeremy Corbyn in that the case for automatic inclusion on ballot being heard0 -
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Can't find anyone who makes it but here is the recipe for Watney's Red Barrel - should be enough to put you off....rottenborough said:Martha GillVerified account
@Martha_Gill
4 crates of sandwiches just went into lab hq #LabourNEC
Only the beer needed now and we really are back in the late 1970s.
http://barclayperkins.blogspot.co.uk/2016/01/how-to-brew-watneys-red-barrel.html0 -
Probably because the members will re-elect Corbyn and kill the Labour party off in the process.MontyHall said:
Why not let him stand for re election and defeat him then, rather than desperately try to keep him off the ballot?The_Apocalypse said:Possibly one of the biggest myths it's that it's only New Labourites who oppose Corbyn. I know Labour voters from all walks of life who want Corbyn gone and fear for Labour's future if he stays. None of them liked New Labour or Tony Blair.
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And which Labour politician do they say would be better?The_Apocalypse said:Possibly one of the biggest myths it's that it's only New Labourites who oppose Corbyn. I know Labour voters from all walks of life who want Corbyn gone and fear for Labour's future if he stays. None of them liked New Labour or Tony Blair.
We had this with both Gordon Brown and Ed Miliband -- vox pops of people saying "I don't like the current leader, they should replace him".......before a new replacement comes in who is even worse.
Let's hear an actual alternative who would be BETTER than Corbyn (i.e. not Angela Eagle).0 -
'cos he might win if he's on the ballot. Although personally I'm not convinced of this at all, but PLP is.MontyHall said:
Why not let him stand for re election and defeat him then, rather than desperately try to keep him off the ballot?The_Apocalypse said:Possibly one of the biggest myths it's that it's only New Labourites who oppose Corbyn. I know Labour voters from all walks of life who want Corbyn gone and fear for Labour's future if he stays. None of them liked New Labour or Tony Blair.
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Basically anyone who isn't Jeremy Corbyn (except John McDonnell).Danny565 said:
And which Labour politician do they say would be better?The_Apocalypse said:Possibly one of the biggest myths it's that it's only New Labourites who oppose Corbyn. I know Labour voters from all walks of life who want Corbyn gone and fear for Labour's future if he stays. None of them liked New Labour or Tony Blair.
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I'm holding a Stephen Kinnock next Lab leader betting slip tell me about it.rottenborough said:0 -
- and Composite 42, Madam Chairman, smoke filled rooms ......rottenborough said:Martha GillVerified account
@Martha_Gill
4 crates of sandwiches just went into lab hq #LabourNEC
Only the beer needed now and we really are back in the late 1970s.0 -
That's democracy for you, it's a free market not a closed shopThe_Apocalypse said:
Probably because the members will re-elect Corbyn and kill the Labour party off in the process.MontyHall said:
Why not let him stand for re election and defeat him then, rather than desperately try to keep him off the ballot?The_Apocalypse said:Possibly one of the biggest myths it's that it's only New Labourites who oppose Corbyn. I know Labour voters from all walks of life who want Corbyn gone and fear for Labour's future if he stays. None of them liked New Labour or Tony Blair.
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Such as....?The_Apocalypse said:
Basically anyone who isn't Jeremy Corbyn (except John McDonnell).Danny565 said:
And which Labour politician do they say would be better?The_Apocalypse said:Possibly one of the biggest myths it's that it's only New Labourites who oppose Corbyn. I know Labour voters from all walks of life who want Corbyn gone and fear for Labour's future if he stays. None of them liked New Labour or Tony Blair.
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Any of them at this stage. You can't go into a GE, let alone form a govt with your entire parliamentary party having no confidence in you. It would be a bloodbath.Danny565 said:
And which Labour politician do they say would be better?The_Apocalypse said:Possibly one of the biggest myths it's that it's only New Labourites who oppose Corbyn. I know Labour voters from all walks of life who want Corbyn gone and fear for Labour's future if he stays. None of them liked New Labour or Tony Blair.
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To while away a few minutes, here's another meeting of union sorts:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=amZsdpLXcIo0 -
"This will be a day long remembered. It has seen the end of Cameron, and will soon see the end of the Labour Party!"The_Apocalypse said:
Probably because the members will re-elect Corbyn and kill the Labour party off in the process.MontyHall said:
Why not let him stand for re election and defeat him then, rather than desperately try to keep him off the ballot?The_Apocalypse said:Possibly one of the biggest myths it's that it's only New Labourites who oppose Corbyn. I know Labour voters from all walks of life who want Corbyn gone and fear for Labour's future if he stays. None of them liked New Labour or Tony Blair.
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Not quite ..... there won't be any smoke-filled rooms.rottenborough said:Martha GillVerified account
@Martha_Gill
4 crates of sandwiches just went into lab hq #LabourNEC
Only the beer needed now and we really are back in the late 1970s.0 -
Not much fun when all your members are against the PLP and going to deselect them either, double bloodbath with bells on.Jonathan said:
Any of them at this stage. You can't go into a GE, let alone form a govt with your entire parliamentary party having no confidence in you. It would be a bloodbath.Danny565 said:
And which Labour politician do they say would be better?The_Apocalypse said:Possibly one of the biggest myths it's that it's only New Labourites who oppose Corbyn. I know Labour voters from all walks of life who want Corbyn gone and fear for Labour's future if he stays. None of them liked New Labour or Tony Blair.
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He will be on the ballot sooner or later.
Sooner if the NEC, abide by the rules as written.
Later if they force the courts to compel them to abide by the rules as written.
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The public couldn't care less about what the parliamentary party thinks -- after all, two thirds of Labour seats just roundly ignored Labour MPs' recommendation on the EU.Jonathan said:
Any of them at thus stage. You can't go into a GE, let alone form a govt with your entire parliamentary party having no confidence in you. It would be a bloodbath.Danny565 said:
And which Labour politician do they say would be better?The_Apocalypse said:Possibly one of the biggest myths it's that it's only New Labourites who oppose Corbyn. I know Labour voters from all walks of life who want Corbyn gone and fear for Labour's future if he stays. None of them liked New Labour or Tony Blair.
Corbyn's very big problems are his complete lack of charisma, implausibility as a PM, and various principles which the public don't agree with -- but the charisma vacuum of Angela Eagle following the doomed Remain campaign strategy would be even worse on all counts, with a huge party split from infuriated grassroots members thrown in additionally.0 -
I reckon the Conservatives could start again, ditch May and still have a new PM before Labour finish their deliberations.
It makes me want a Corbyn Government though, as in reality it would mean nothing ever happening except biscuits and tea being consumed. Everyone could get on happily with their lives?0 -
Indeed. Labour are looking fucked either way. Only way out is a fresh face somehow miraculously acceptable to both sides. A long shot.malcolmg said:
Not much fun when all your members are against the PLP and going to deselect them either, double bloodbath with bells on.Jonathan said:
Any of them at this stage. You can't go into a GE, let alone form a govt with your entire parliamentary party having no confidence in you. It would be a bloodbath.Danny565 said:
And which Labour politician do they say would be better?The_Apocalypse said:Possibly one of the biggest myths it's that it's only New Labourites who oppose Corbyn. I know Labour voters from all walks of life who want Corbyn gone and fear for Labour's future if he stays. None of them liked New Labour or Tony Blair.
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And the people who said such were right.Danny565 said:
And which Labour politician do they say would be better?The_Apocalypse said:Possibly one of the biggest myths it's that it's only New Labourites who oppose Corbyn. I know Labour voters from all walks of life who want Corbyn gone and fear for Labour's future if he stays. None of them liked New Labour or Tony Blair.
We had this with both Gordon Brown and Ed Miliband -- vox pops of people saying "I don't like the current leader, they should replace him".......before a new replacement comes in who is even worse.
Let's hear an actual alternative who would be BETTER than Corbyn (i.e. not Angela Eagle).
The replacement for Ed Miliband was worse because of the membership and the £3ers. Yvette Cooper would have most likely been better than Ed Miliband. But the membership did not want her.
With Gordon Brown, David Miliband would have probably been better than him (and Ed). But he bottled it, and by the time it came to the 2010 leadership election unions swung it for Ed. Labour's unions and members keep on making the wrong choices.0 -
https://twitter.com/PolhomeEditor/status/752916110606012417SouthamObserver said:
That is beyond embarrassing....0 -
Me too, although only a few pounds as such an outsider. I've tried to cover as many bases as possible on Labour as anything is possible, but proving difficult.TOPPING said:
I'm holding a Stephen Kinnock next Lab leader betting slip tell me about it.rottenborough said:0 -
It's in previous post. Take your pick.Danny565 said:
Such as....?The_Apocalypse said:
Basically anyone who isn't Jeremy Corbyn (except John McDonnell).Danny565 said:
And which Labour politician do they say would be better?The_Apocalypse said:Possibly one of the biggest myths it's that it's only New Labourites who oppose Corbyn. I know Labour voters from all walks of life who want Corbyn gone and fear for Labour's future if he stays. None of them liked New Labour or Tony Blair.
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Which just proves the point: as was the case when people complained about Brown and Miliband before complaining even more when they were replaced, "I don't like the current leader" does not at all mean "I would be happier with a different leader".The_Apocalypse said:
And the people who said such were right.Danny565 said:
And which Labour politician do they say would be better?The_Apocalypse said:Possibly one of the biggest myths it's that it's only New Labourites who oppose Corbyn. I know Labour voters from all walks of life who want Corbyn gone and fear for Labour's future if he stays. None of them liked New Labour or Tony Blair.
We had this with both Gordon Brown and Ed Miliband -- vox pops of people saying "I don't like the current leader, they should replace him".......before a new replacement comes in who is even worse.
Let's hear an actual alternative who would be BETTER than Corbyn (i.e. not Angela Eagle).
The replacement for Ed Miliband was worse because of the membership and the £3ers. Yvette Cooper would have most likely been better than Ed Miliband. But the membership did not want her.
With Gordon Brown, David Miliband would have probably been better than him (and Ed). But he bottled it, and by the time it came to the 2010 leadership election unions swung it for Ed. Labour's unions and members keep on making the wrong choices.
In my view, replacing Corbyn with Angela Eagle would once again be trading a bad leader in for an even worse and even more unelectable one.0 -
Dennis Skinner?The_Apocalypse said:
Basically anyone who isn't Jeremy Corbyn (except John McDonnell).Danny565 said:
And which Labour politician do they say would be better?The_Apocalypse said:Possibly one of the biggest myths it's that it's only New Labourites who oppose Corbyn. I know Labour voters from all walks of life who want Corbyn gone and fear for Labour's future if he stays. None of them liked New Labour or Tony Blair.
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These are all major Corbyn problems, as is his long-time support for various terrorist organisations. But above all else the biggest problem he poses for Labour is that he does not believe that attaining power through winning Parliamentary elections should be the party's priority.Danny565 said:
The public couldn't care less about what the parliamentary party thinks -- after all, two thirds of Labour seats just roundly ignored Labour MPs' recommendation on the EU.Jonathan said:
Any of them at thus stage. You can't go into a GE, let alone form a govt with your entire parliamentary party having no confidence in you. It would be a bloodbath.Danny565 said:
And which Labour politician do they say would be better?The_Apocalypse said:Possibly one of the biggest myths it's that it's only New Labourites who oppose Corbyn. I know Labour voters from all walks of life who want Corbyn gone and fear for Labour's future if he stays. None of them liked New Labour or Tony Blair.
Corbyn's very big problems are his complete lack of charisma, implausibility as a PM, and various principles which the public don't agree with -- but the charisma vacuum of Angela Eagle following the doomed Remain campaign strategy would be even worse on all counts, with a huge party split from infuriated grassroots members thrown in additionally.
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.... or comrades.peter_from_putney said:
Not quite ..... there won't be any smoke-filled rooms.rottenborough said:Martha GillVerified account
@Martha_Gill
4 crates of sandwiches just went into lab hq #LabourNEC
Only the beer needed now and we really are back in the late 1970s.0 -
Many years back - 70s I think - Camra's Good Beer Guide said of Watneys Red Barrel "Avoid like the plague."eek said:
Can't find anyone who makes it but here is the recipe for Watney's Red Barrel - should be enough to put you off....rottenborough said:Martha GillVerified account
@Martha_Gill
4 crates of sandwiches just went into lab hq #LabourNEC
Only the beer needed now and we really are back in the late 1970s.
http://barclayperkins.blogspot.co.uk/2016/01/how-to-brew-watneys-red-barrel.html
Watneys promptly sued, and Camra amended its Red Barrel entry to "avoid at all costs."0 -
You're wrong. Every interview in the campaign will go along the lines of, if your own party don't trust you why should the country. Or how do you plan to pass laws without the support of MPs.Danny565 said:
The public couldn't care less about what the parliamentary party thinks -- after all, two thirds of Labour seats just roundly ignored Labour MPs' recommendation on the EU.Jonathan said:
Any of them at thus stage. You can't go into a GE, let alone form a govt with your entire parliamentary party having no confidence in you. It would be a bloodbath.Danny565 said:
And which Labour politician do they say would be better?The_Apocalypse said:Possibly one of the biggest myths it's that it's only New Labourites who oppose Corbyn. I know Labour voters from all walks of life who want Corbyn gone and fear for Labour's future if he stays. None of them liked New Labour or Tony Blair.
Corbyn's very big problems are his complete lack of charisma, implausibility as a PM, and various principles which the public don't agree with -- but the charisma vacuum of Angela Eagle following the doomed Remain campaign strategy would be even worse on all counts, with a huge party split from infuriated grassroots members thrown in additionally.
Thus is such basic stuff it beggars belief we can be talking about it.0 -
I'd go for any of the I72.The_Apocalypse said:
Basically anyone who isn't Jeremy Corbyn (except John McDonnell).Danny565 said:
And which Labour politician do they say would be better?The_Apocalypse said:Possibly one of the biggest myths it's that it's only New Labourites who oppose Corbyn. I know Labour voters from all walks of life who want Corbyn gone and fear for Labour's future if he stays. None of them liked New Labour or Tony Blair.
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FPT:
Isn't the biggest difference between us and Germany is when they have a change of government they don't have a huge change in policy every five years. We go from Tory to Labour then back again and have big top down reorganization in the public services like education and healthcare whereas the equivalent of the Tory and Labour party there are sometimes in coalition together so it is easier for business to plan especially for industrial businesses that need years of planning and investment before they can even think about making a profit. Very different from most service companies.0 -
God help them if that is their future talentrottenborough said:
Me too, although only a few pounds as such an outsider. I've tried to cover as many bases as possible on Labour as anything is possible, but proving difficult.TOPPING said:
I'm holding a Stephen Kinnock next Lab leader betting slip tell me about it.rottenborough said:0 -
So tomorrow is Cameron's last PMQs he and his team must be having a blast prepping for it as the PLP/NEC is serving up so much cracking material.0
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"Paging Labour party policies. Labour party policies, please report to the PB desk."The_Apocalypse said:
And the people who said such were right.Danny565 said:
And which Labour politician do they say would be better?The_Apocalypse said:Possibly one of the biggest myths it's that it's only New Labourites who oppose Corbyn. I know Labour voters from all walks of life who want Corbyn gone and fear for Labour's future if he stays. None of them liked New Labour or Tony Blair.
We had this with both Gordon Brown and Ed Miliband -- vox pops of people saying "I don't like the current leader, they should replace him".......before a new replacement comes in who is even worse.
Let's hear an actual alternative who would be BETTER than Corbyn (i.e. not Angela Eagle).
The replacement for Ed Miliband was worse because of the membership and the £3ers. Yvette Cooper would have most likely been better than Ed Miliband. But the membership did not want her.
With Gordon Brown, David Miliband would have probably been better than him (and Ed). But he bottled it, and by the time it came to the 2010 leadership election unions swung it for Ed. Labour's unions and members keep on making the wrong choices.
Labour has two duties. One is to hold the government to account. The second is to articulate a clear and attractive vision of Britain that may return it to power. It's not doing either. In political terms it's curled up into the foetal position and is simply waiting to die. Such a shame.
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"You remember it. Remember every bit of it, 'cause we are on the eve of a day that people are going to talk about long after we are dead and gone."Sunil_Prasannan said:
"This will be a day long remembered. It has seen the end of Cameron, and will soon see the end of the Labour Party!"The_Apocalypse said:
Probably because the members will re-elect Corbyn and kill the Labour party off in the process.MontyHall said:
Why not let him stand for re election and defeat him then, rather than desperately try to keep him off the ballot?The_Apocalypse said:Possibly one of the biggest myths it's that it's only New Labourites who oppose Corbyn. I know Labour voters from all walks of life who want Corbyn gone and fear for Labour's future if he stays. None of them liked New Labour or Tony Blair.
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I can almost hear Vic Feather talking about "this great movement of ours" and his "members aspirations." Aspirations was a popular union word in the 70s.stjohn said:
.... or comrades.peter_from_putney said:
Not quite ..... there won't be any smoke-filled rooms.rottenborough said:Martha GillVerified account
@Martha_Gill
4 crates of sandwiches just went into lab hq #LabourNEC
Only the beer needed now and we really are back in the late 1970s.0 -
Will Corbyn pay Cameron a gracious and generous tribute at PMQ's tomorrow?
I feel sure that pretty well everyone else will, but I'll be very surprised if Corbyn manages to spit out even half a dozen kind words, it's simply not his style.0 -
So the PLP is taking industrial action? Did they hold a strike ballot?eek said:
https://twitter.com/PolhomeEditor/status/752916110606012417SouthamObserver said:
That is beyond embarrassing....0 -
Point of order
The thread header really ought to say THE LABOUR PARTY'S FUTURE, because that's what this is really all about.0 -
Mr. Nunu, that is a problem. The electoral cycle is essential for democracy but a certain degree of continuity is in the national interest (things like long-term infrastructure and reducing the deficit). Not easy to square the circle.
Germany's perpetual coalitions probably helps compromise as it's an inherent aspect of governance there.0 -
The public may not care what the PLP thinks, but the public don't tend to have confidence in leaders who cannot command the confidence of their parliamentary parties. See Ed Miliband (who MPs never wanted) Gordon Brown (his MPs tried to stage a coup against him), IDS (his MPs successfully got him to resign) and so on.0
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Corbyn may have resigned by 12 o'clock PMQs in order to reduce his noms target down to 38.ToryJim said:So tomorrow is Cameron's last PMQs he and his team must be having a blast prepping for it as the PLP/NEC is serving up so much cracking material.
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To be fair, Corbyn does not do many interviews so it would not be a big problem for him. He only likes to speak to those who agree with him. That's because he sees himself as the leader of a mass movement of like-minded people, not the leader of a Parliamentary party. He has absolutely no interest at all in becoming Prime Minister. Which is lucky on a few levels, I suppose.Jonathan said:
You're wrong. Every interview in the campaign will go along the lines of, if your own party don't trust you why should the country. Or how do you plan to pass laws without the support of MPs.Danny565 said:
The public couldn't care less about what the parliamentary party thinks -- after all, two thirds of Labour seats just roundly ignored Labour MPs' recommendation on the EU.Jonathan said:
Any of them at thus stage. You can't go into a GE, let alone form a govt with your entire parliamentary party having no confidence in you. It would be a bloodbath.Danny565 said:
And which Labour politician do they say would be better?The_Apocalypse said:Possibly one of the biggest myths it's that it's only New Labourites who oppose Corbyn. I know Labour voters from all walks of life who want Corbyn gone and fear for Labour's future if he stays. None of them liked New Labour or Tony Blair.
Corbyn's very big problems are his complete lack of charisma, implausibility as a PM, and various principles which the public don't agree with -- but the charisma vacuum of Angela Eagle following the doomed Remain campaign strategy would be even worse on all counts, with a huge party split from infuriated grassroots members thrown in additionally.
Thus is such basic stuff it beggars belief we can be talking about it.
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Cameron should shut up and go quietly. Without doubt he has left the country and our political discourse in particular in a worse state than he found it.ToryJim said:So tomorrow is Cameron's last PMQs he and his team must be having a blast prepping for it as the PLP/NEC is serving up so much cracking material.
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Can someone explain who becomes Labour leader if Corbyn doesn't get the nominations? He hasn't resigned and but he also won't technically be leader.0
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I think its more unofficial work to rule....ToryJim said:
So the PLP is taking industrial action? Did they hold a strike ballot?eek said:
https://twitter.com/PolhomeEditor/status/752916110606012417SouthamObserver said:
That is beyond embarrassing....0 -
Welcome to the night of the blunt knives (episode 94)
Seriously, how do any of this rabble think they can be credible leaders of opposition to an entire government when they can't even oppose their own party effectively? It's embarrassing.0 -
Who will Bercow get to ask the very last question to David Cameron?
Think Blair was Ian Paisley.
How about Ken Clarke - and might Dave then bring in the "bloody difficult woman" into his final remarks?0 -
You may be right, I'm just looking at a few outsiders who might suddenly come in on the shortening of odds if the leadership election widens.malcolmg said:
God help them if that is their future talentrottenborough said:
Me too, although only a few pounds as such an outsider. I've tried to cover as many bases as possible on Labour as anything is possible, but proving difficult.TOPPING said:
I'm holding a Stephen Kinnock next Lab leader betting slip tell me about it.rottenborough said:0 -
He will be until a new leader is chosen.MaxPB said:Can someone explain who becomes Labour leader if Corbyn doesn't get the nominations? He hasn't resigned and but he also won't technically be leader.
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he won't get 38... That is why the NEC followed by the courts is his only optionrottenborough said:
Corbyn may have resigned by 12 o'clock PMQs in order to reduce his noms target down to 38.ToryJim said:So tomorrow is Cameron's last PMQs he and his team must be having a blast prepping for it as the PLP/NEC is serving up so much cracking material.
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I don't know about that, Tories united, out of the EU, Labour hopelessly split and stuck between the 70s and 80s. What's not to like?Jonathan said:
Cameron should shut up and go quietly. Without doubt he has left the country and our political discourse in particular in a worse state than he found it.ToryJim said:So tomorrow is Cameron's last PMQs he and his team must be having a blast prepping for it as the PLP/NEC is serving up so much cracking material.
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Surely at that point he will stand down.SouthamObserver said:
He will be until a new leader is chosen.MaxPB said:Can someone explain who becomes Labour leader if Corbyn doesn't get the nominations? He hasn't resigned and but he also won't technically be leader.
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Please explain what Tom Watson should have done differentlyPolruan said:Welcome to the night of the blunt knives (episode 94)
Seriously, how do any of this rabble think they can be credible leaders of opposition to an entire government when they can't even oppose their own party effectively? It's embarrassing.
Unilaterally changing Labour rules isn't an option (quiet at the back, BJO!)0 -
Mr. Eek, it's MPs and MEPs, though. He might get something like 25-30 MPs. Could the MEPs get him over the line?
Mr. Jonathan, worse than the end of the Coalition? Yes. Worse than when he took over from Brown? No.0 -
Indeed Corbyn is weirdly charismatic albeit in a Marmite kind of way.SeanT said:
Corbyn doesn't entirely lack charisma. He's way more charismatic than Cooper, Burnham, Miliband - that's why the members love him. The problem is that the charisma only works on a few hundred thousand people, not the millions Labour need.Danny565 said:
The public couldn't care less about what the parliamentary party thinks -- after all, two thirds of Labour seats just roundly ignored Labour MPs' recommendation on the EU.Jonathan said:
Any of them at thus stage. You can't go into a GE, let alone form a govt with your entire parliamentary party having no confidence in you. It would be a bloodbath.Danny565 said:
And which Labour politician do they say would be better?The_Apocalypse said:Possibly one of the biggest myths it's that it's only New Labourites who oppose Corbyn. I know Labour voters from all walks of life who want Corbyn gone and fear for Labour's future if he stays. None of them liked New Labour or Tony Blair.
Corbyn's very big problems are his complete lack of charisma, implausibility as a PM, and various principles which the public don't agree with -- but the charisma vacuum of Angela Eagle following the doomed Remain campaign strategy would be even worse on all counts, with a huge party split from infuriated grassroots members thrown in additionally.0 -
Mr. Freggles, "Unilaterally changing Labour rules isn't an option (quiet at the back, BJO!)" - this appears to be what the NEC may be doing
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Well remembered, especially when pronounced with a strong northern accent iirc, as in "Aspiraaaaytions"Tim_B said:
I can almost hear Vic Feather talking about "this great movement of ours" and his "members aspirations." Aspirations was a popular union word in the 70s.stjohn said:
.... or comrades.peter_from_putney said:
Not quite ..... there won't be any smoke-filled rooms.rottenborough said:Martha GillVerified account
@Martha_Gill
4 crates of sandwiches just went into lab hq #LabourNEC
Only the beer needed now and we really are back in the late 1970s.0 -
Well it does mean they would be happier with a different leader. The cases of Brown and Miliband however, are somewhat different to Corbyn. In the case of Brown and Miliband it was their unelectability which was the main issue which is why it came down to getting a different leader who was electable, rather than just anyone. With Corbyn at this stage it comes down to the survival of the Labour party, and the aims of what Labour seeks to be. Given that a vast majority of MPs are united on the fact Labour should be a political party with the aim of gaining power to govern, a different leader means basically anyone but Corbyn.Danny565 said:Which just proves the point: as was the case when people complained about Brown and Miliband before complaining even more when they were replaced, "I don't like the current leader" does not at all mean "I would be happier with a different leader".
In my view, replacing Corbyn with Angela Eagle would once again be trading a bad leader in for an even worse and even more unelectable one.
As I've said before, since your so stuck on Eagle, it doesn't have to be her. It can be anyone. Just NOT Corbyn (or McDonnell).0 -
Pound crashed. AAA a distant memory. Nation divided. Democracy screwed. Top Gear rubbish.MaxPB said:
I don't know about that, Tories united, out of the EU, Labour hopelessly split and stuck between the 70s and 80s. What's not to like?Jonathan said:
Cameron should shut up and go quietly. Without doubt he has left the country and our political discourse in particular in a worse state than he found it.ToryJim said:So tomorrow is Cameron's last PMQs he and his team must be having a blast prepping for it as the PLP/NEC is serving up so much cracking material.
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Of all the many complaints I heard from people I heard about Brown and Miliband, I can't say "their MPs don't like them" was ever one of the more frequent ones.The_Apocalypse said:The public may not care what the PLP thinks, but the public don't tend to have confidence in leaders who cannot command the confidence of their parliamentary parties. See Ed Miliband (who MPs never wanted) Gordon Brown (his MPs tried to stage a coup against him), IDS (his MPs successfully got him to resign) and so on.
If anything, the comparison of Miliband and Cameron in the lead-up to 2015 shows just how little MPs' "loyalty to the leader" matters to the public -- Tory MPs had been MUCH more (vocally) critical of Cameron in the run-up to the election, than Lab MPs had been of Miliband, but the public didn't care.0 -
Background information from Private Eye on how Angela Eagle was selected as Labour Candidate for Wallasey. I am sure @The_Apocalypse would approve.
https://twitter.com/Kipperwacker/status/7529256916168540160 -
Quiet at the front, Morris Minor!Morris_Dancer said:Mr. Freggles, "Unilaterally changing Labour rules isn't an option (quiet at the back, BJO!)" - this appears to be what the NEC may be doing
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Jonathan said:
Pound crashed. AAA a distant memory. Nation divided. Democracy screwed. Top Gear rubbish.MaxPB said:
I don't know about that, Tories united, out of the EU, Labour hopelessly split and stuck between the 70s and 80s. What's not to like?Jonathan said:
Cameron should shut up and go quietly. Without doubt he has left the country and our political discourse in particular in a worse state than he found it.ToryJim said:So tomorrow is Cameron's last PMQs he and his team must be having a blast prepping for it as the PLP/NEC is serving up so much cracking material.
that's the ticket.. 0 -
AAA Brown handed over a golden legacy compared to this crock of shit.Morris_Dancer said:Mr. Eek, it's MPs and MEPs, though. He might get something like 25-30 MPs. Could the MEPs get him over the line?
Mr. Jonathan, worse than the end of the Coalition? Yes. Worse than when he took over from Brown? No.0 -
Not just his ma and da. Mrs S Kinnock is also firmly wedded to the EU gravy train.old_labour said:I saw Stephen Kinnock being interviewed earlier on Sky News. He was furious about Corbyn wanting Article 50 invoked immediately.
Nice that he cares about the pensions of his old ma and da.0 -
Competitive exports, lowest borrowing costs on record, nation united in loathing Corbyn, democracy in action, The Grand Tour starting soon.Jonathan said:
Pound crashed. AAA a distant memory. Nation divided. Democracy screwed. Top Gear rubbish.MaxPB said:
I don't know about that, Tories united, out of the EU, Labour hopelessly split and stuck between the 70s and 80s. What's not to like?Jonathan said:
Cameron should shut up and go quietly. Without doubt he has left the country and our political discourse in particular in a worse state than he found it.ToryJim said:So tomorrow is Cameron's last PMQs he and his team must be having a blast prepping for it as the PLP/NEC is serving up so much cracking material.
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No shortage of gravy in that family.GIN1138 said:
Not just his ma and da. Mrs S Kinnock is also firmly wedded to the EU gravy train.old_labour said:I saw Stephen Kinnock being interviewed earlier on Sky News. He was furious about Corbyn wanting Article 50 invoked immediately.
Nice that he cares about the pensions of his old ma and da.0 -
Ben Riley-Smith @benrileysmith 41m41 minutes ago
Team Corbyn furious – moderate lawyer attending NEC giving “point by point rebuttal” of their legal advice. No one doing opposite.0 -
I actually care about having a functioning opposition, believe it or not. That's what I would 'approve' of.old_labour said:Background information from Private Eye on how Angela Eagle was selected as Labour Candidate for Wallasey. I am sure @The_Apocalypse would approve.
https://twitter.com/Kipperwacker/status/7529256916168540160 -
As long as pesky voters do not get in the way. Maybe you are looking at a form of "guided democracy".The_Apocalypse said:
I actually care about having a functioning opposition, believe it or not. That's what I would 'approve' of.old_labour said:Background information from Private Eye on how Angela Eagle was selected as Labour Candidate for Wallasey. I am sure @The_Apocalypse would approve.
https://twitter.com/Kipperwacker/status/7529256916168540160 -
Keir Starmer available at 36 on BF exchange and Stephen Kinnock at 50 on the sportsbook.0
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There wasn't enough gold for a legacy, he'd sold it.Jonathan said:
AAA Brown handed over a golden legacy compared to this crock of shit.Morris_Dancer said:Mr. Eek, it's MPs and MEPs, though. He might get something like 25-30 MPs. Could the MEPs get him over the line?
Mr. Jonathan, worse than the end of the Coalition? Yes. Worse than when he took over from Brown? No.0 -
He had potential but fucked it up because he could not, or would not work with people who disagreed with him even in his own party. He believes his own hype that he is special . Always their downfall.SeanT said:
Yup. For instance I thought his speech at the Durham Miners Gala (jeez, we really are in the 70s) was frankly rather good. Authentic, passionate, fiery, with a hint of wit. Why can't the Blairite drones do this stuff?Jonathan said:
Indeed Corbyn is weirdly charismatic albeit in a Marmite kind of way.SeanT said:
Corbyn doesn't entirely lack charisma. He's way more charismatic than Cooper, Burnham, Miliband - that's why the members love him. The problem is that the charisma only works on a few hundred thousand people, not the millions Labour need.Danny565 said:
The public couldn't care less about what the parliamentary party thinks -- after all, two thirds of Labour seats just roundly ignored Labour MPs' recommendation on the EU.Jonathan said:
Any of them at thus stage. You can't go into a GE, let alone form a govt with your entire parliamentary party having no confidence in you. It would be a bloodbath.Danny565 said:
And which Labour politician do they say would be better?The_Apocalypse said:Possibly one of the biggest myths it's that it's only New Labourites who oppose Corbyn. I know Labour voters from all walks of life who want Corbyn gone and fear for Labour's future if he stays. None of them liked New Labour or Tony Blair.
Corbyn's very big problems are his complete lack of charisma, implausibility as a PM, and various principles which the public don't agree with -- but the charisma vacuum of Angela Eagle following the doomed Remain campaign strategy would be even worse on all counts, with a huge party split from infuriated grassroots members thrown in additionally.
Of course everything Corbyn said was nonsense on analysis, but I I can see why earnest but disillusioned youngsters (and oldsters) find it relatively compelling.0 -
Mr. Smith, that does sound rather unfair.
Mr. Freggles, if we're going Latin I prefer Morris Frontius Agrippa.
Mr. Jonathan, the deficit was over £100bn! [It's still too high now, of course, but the inheritance was atrocious].0 -
I might take that on Keir Starmer. If they can pull through this fiasco, he'd be a very credible leader.MaxPB said:Keir Starmer available at 36 on BF exchange and Stephen Kinnock at 50 on the sportsbook.
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You must be joking :-DMaxPB said:
Surely at that point he will stand down.SouthamObserver said:
He will be until a new leader is chosen.MaxPB said:Can someone explain who becomes Labour leader if Corbyn doesn't get the nominations? He hasn't resigned and but he also won't technically be leader.
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