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SystemSystem Posts: 12,598
edited June 2016 in General

imagepoliticalbetting.com » Blog Archive » Latest YouGov poll is an Ode to Joy for Leave as Remain goes sub 70% on Betfair for the first time in nearly four weeks

New YouGov EURef poll

Read the full story here


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Comments

  • MP_SEMP_SE Posts: 3,642
    First like Leave.
  • MortimerMortimer Posts: 14,235
    Second like remain.
  • PlatoSaidPlatoSaid Posts: 10,383
    My timeline has just filled with unhappy Remainers saying polls schmolls - look at all our experts!

    :smiley:
  • MortimerMortimer Posts: 14,235
    FPT:
    Estobar said:

    SeanT said:

    TheScreamingEagles said:

    Deleted

    Have you not got a threader on how SHIT the LEAVE campaign is, to console yourself? You ran seventeen fucking thousand of them earlier in the month, despite some of us telling you this was bollocks?

    Surely there's one left? No? Just one? Maybe an earnest nine hundred page analysis by Alistair Meeks? No? Really? Nothing?

    What a farce you have made of this site. A BETTING site. And we warned you, time and again.
    Haha Sean. Come off the fence please?

    Spot on though. This site is crap sometimes.* It got GE2015 utterly wrong, thanks to the thread writers' refusal to remove their blinkers. You'd think they'd have learned some humility but, nope, the same old one-sided garbage thread after thread despite clearly and evidentially flying in the face of public opinion (and the majority of punters on here).


    * Cue kindergarten response of: if you don't like it then leave nah nah nah nah
    Actually the beauty of this site is its diversity. I've just started writing thread headers - which have been graciously published despite my views not aligning with many other headers. And, of course, the comments section can be where the true tips are found!
  • OUTOUT Posts: 569
    C'est la vie.
  • BenedictWhiteBenedictWhite Posts: 1,944
    I wonder what the "vow" will be.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 123,021
    BenedictWhite said:

    I wonder what the "vow" will be.

    Massive emergency break and a referendum on Turkish membership
  • MP_SEMP_SE Posts: 3,642
    PlatoSaid said:

    My timeline has just filled with unhappy Remainers saying polls schmolls - look at all our experts!

    :smiley:

    The denial, the cries of racism, the sheer disbelief, etc., make for truly enjoyable reading.
  • kjohnwkjohnw Posts: 1,456
    Can the unions really shift 6 million votes?
  • MortimerMortimer Posts: 14,235
    Kudos to TSE for staying up to publish polls and threads trending against his own views. Politics can be a fickle master - especially when polls are concerned.
  • viewcodeviewcode Posts: 25,356
    Estobar said:

    Spot on though. This site is crap sometimes.*

    * Cue kindergarten response of: if you don't like it then leave nah nah nah nah

    It's not a kindergarten response. TSE/OGH et al are providing a service to you for free. As you did not pay for it, they have no responsibility to you to perform well or badly. If you feel their product is inadequate, provide a better one.

  • MortimerMortimer Posts: 14,235
    TheScreamingEagles said:

    BenedictWhite said:

    I wonder what the "vow" will be.

    Massive emergency break and a referendum on Turkish membership
    I actually wondered if the UK sovereignty bill had been dropped for just this sort of eventuality...

    High stakes.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 123,021
    Mortimer said:

    FPT:

    Estobar said:

    SeanT said:

    TheScreamingEagles said:

    Deleted

    Have you not got a threader on how SHIT the LEAVE campaign is, to console yourself? You ran seventeen fucking thousand of them earlier in the month, despite some of us telling you this was bollocks?

    Surely there's one left? No? Just one? Maybe an earnest nine hundred page analysis by Alistair Meeks? No? Really? Nothing?

    What a farce you have made of this site. A BETTING site. And we warned you, time and again.
    Haha Sean. Come off the fence please?

    Spot on though. This site is crap sometimes.* It got GE2015 utterly wrong, thanks to the thread writers' refusal to remove their blinkers. You'd think they'd have learned some humility but, nope, the same old one-sided garbage thread after thread despite clearly and evidentially flying in the face of public opinion (and the majority of punters on here).


    * Cue kindergarten response of: if you don't like it then leave nah nah nah nah
    Actually the beauty of this site is its diversity. I've just started writing thread headers - which have been graciously published despite my views not aligning with many other headers. And, of course, the comments section can be where the true tips are found!
    The thing is, people only see what they want to see.

    I wrote a piece a few weeks ago, explaining why the phone polls might be wrong, and why backing Leave might be the best option.

    I wrote pieces criticising Dave and Remain for their silly hyperbole.

    I've written pieces on Dave's falling ratings, and why that's bad for Remain, but people ignore those.
  • BenedictWhiteBenedictWhite Posts: 1,944
    TheScreamingEagles said:

    BenedictWhite said:

    I wonder what the "vow" will be.

    Massive emergency break and a referendum on Turkish membership
    Well, would anyone believe it? I mean, it took ages to get bugger all from the EU and a rabbit is going to come out of a hat?
  • GIN1138GIN1138 Posts: 22,942
    #VapidBilge
  • OUTOUT Posts: 569
    kjohnw said:

    Can the unions really shift 6 million votes?

    No.Most people only join unions for legal protetcion these days.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 123,021
    Mortimer said:

    Kudos to TSE for staying up to publish polls and threads trending against his own views. Politics can be a fickle master - especially when polls are concerned.

    My working day starts in less than six hours, which means I have to be up in 4 hours time.

    Goodnight all.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 99,232
    Estobar said:

    SeanT said:

    TheScreamingEagles said:

    Deleted

    Have you not got a threader on how SHIT the LEAVE campaign is, to console yourself? You ran seventeen fucking thousand of them earlier in the month, despite some of us telling you this was bollocks?

    Surely there's one left? No? Just one? Maybe an earnest nine hundred page analysis by Alistair Meeks? No? Really? Nothing?

    What a farce you have made of this site. A BETTING site. And we warned you, time and again.
    Haha Sean. Come off the fence please?

    Spot on though. This site is crap sometimes.* It got GE2015 utterly wrong, thanks to the thread writers' refusal to remove their blinkers. You'd think they'd have learned some humility but, nope, the same old one-sided garbage thread after thread despite clearly and evidentially flying in the face of public opinion (and the majority of punters on here).


    * Cue kindergarten response of: if you don't like it then leave nah nah nah nah
    I don't personally visit political sites for their prognostication prowess or balanced opinions. Some are better than others, but pundits and the commentariat who flutter around, weirdo political anoraks like us, are wrong much more than we are right, and even the professionals don't let being wrong all the time slow them down.

    I visit sites for interesting discussion and reasonableness of tone, personally. I've been commenting less because the euro ref has turned us all a little bit mad, but decrying the blinkers of political anoraks strikes me as fighting the wrong battle. Somewhere is calling the campaign right but is it interesting and, by Internet standards, hospitable? Possibly, but possibly not. But being right in a thread header or article means little. Dan hodges was right about much of ge 2015, but the comment threads underneath his pieces were not an engaging place to be, though amusing to read.

    I trust that is not kindergarten enough for you, as though whinging is less so.

    I'm a leaver by the way, if that matters.
  • PeterCPeterC Posts: 1,275
    edited June 2016
    BenedictWhite said:

    I wonder what the "vow" will be.

    The trouble is that Cameron is well into a zone of diminishing returns. Trust is gone and his credibility is shot.
  • NeilVWNeilVW Posts: 749
    Now what we don't need is Farage to feck up this progress in the ITV debate with Dodgy Dave. That's my next major concern.
  • MortimerMortimer Posts: 14,235
    TheScreamingEagles said:

    Mortimer said:

    FPT:

    Estobar said:

    SeanT said:

    TheScreamingEagles said:

    Deleted

    Have you not got a threader on how SHIT the LEAVE campaign is, to console yourself? You ran seventeen fucking thousand of them earlier in the month, despite some of us telling you this was bollocks?

    Surely there's one left? No? Just one? Maybe an earnest nine hundred page analysis by Alistair Meeks? No? Really? Nothing?

    What a farce you have made of this site. A BETTING site. And we warned you, time and again.
    Haha Sean. Come off the fence please?

    Spot on though. This site is crap sometimes.* It got GE2015 utterly wrong, thanks to the thread writers' refusal to remove their blinkers. You'd think they'd have learned some humility but, nope, the same old one-sided garbage thread after thread despite clearly and evidentially flying in the face of public opinion (and the majority of punters on here).


    * Cue kindergarten response of: if you don't like it then leave nah nah nah nah
    Actually the beauty of this site is its diversity. I've just started writing thread headers - which have been graciously published despite my views not aligning with many other headers. And, of course, the comments section can be where the true tips are found!
    The thing is, people only see what they want to see.

    I wrote a piece a few weeks ago, explaining why the phone polls might be wrong, and why backing Leave might be the best option.

    I wrote pieces criticising Dave and Remain for their silly hyperbole.

    I've written pieces on Dave's falling ratings, and why that's bad for Remain, but people ignore those.
    Agreed. I've always been of the opinion that the most objective writing is done when questioning/going against one's own beliefs and intentions. I know that I get caught up when writing about things I want to happen - I doubt I'm alone...
  • PaulyPauly Posts: 897
    TheScreamingEagles said:

    Mortimer said:

    FPT:

    Estobar said:

    SeanT said:

    TheScreamingEagles said:

    Deleted

    Have you not got a threader on how SHIT the LEAVE campaign is, to console yourself? You ran seventeen fucking thousand of them earlier in the month, despite some of us telling you this was bollocks?

    Surely there's one left? No? Just one? Maybe an earnest nine hundred page analysis by Alistair Meeks? No? Really? Nothing?

    What a farce you have made of this site. A BETTING site. And we warned you, time and again.
    Haha Sean. Come off the fence please?

    Spot on though. This site is crap sometimes.* It got GE2015 utterly wrong, thanks to the thread writers' refusal to remove their blinkers. You'd think they'd have learned some humility but, nope, the same old one-sided garbage thread after thread despite clearly and evidentially flying in the face of public opinion (and the majority of punters on here).


    * Cue kindergarten response of: if you don't like it then leave nah nah nah nah
    Actually the beauty of this site is its diversity. I've just started writing thread headers - which have been graciously published despite my views not aligning with many other headers. And, of course, the comments section can be where the true tips are found!
    The thing is, people only see what they want to see.

    I wrote a piece a few weeks ago, explaining why the phone polls might be wrong, and why backing Leave might be the best option.

    I wrote pieces criticising Dave and Remain for their silly hyperbole.

    I've written pieces on Dave's falling ratings, and why that's bad for Remain, but people ignore those.
    I've criticised you for similar reasons in the past (I'm a solid leaver) but this latest batch appears reactionary and unfounded. Keep doing what you're doing.
  • RogerRoger Posts: 20,781
    edited June 2016
    Escobar

    Well you got your wish. An ungracious post even by the standards of some pretty ignorant posts recently
  • MP_SEMP_SE Posts: 3,642
    PeterC said:

    BenedictWhite said:

    I wonder what the "vow" will be.

    The trouble is that Cameron is well into a zone of diminishing returns. Trust is gone and his credibility is shot.
    It would also beg the question why he didn't get a better "deal" in the first place.
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 55,298
    Excellent polls for LEAVE - even though the TNS is a little on the old side!
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 56,314
    edited June 2016
    SeanT said:


    Nor, in any case, do they especially care: my guess is that Hollande and Juncker would quite like to see the back of the UK, even if Merkel would regret Brexit. We are a liberal and loosening force, alien to the Frankish conception of the EU.

    France is in turmoil anyway: they might as well amputate the UK during the generalised EU-pain.

    Brexit would turn Frexit from almost impossible to highly unlikely. If that happened then, as they say, this %^&* would get real regarding the future of the whole of Europe.

    I hope this country sees sense before the 23rd. It would be such a morale boost to the whole EU if we vote to stay in now.
  • GIN1138GIN1138 Posts: 22,942
    Sunil_Prasannan said:

    Excellent polls for LEAVE - even though the TNS is a little on the old side!

    #BeLeave
  • TonyTony Posts: 159
    "The Yougov figures also showed trust in figures including Jeremy Corbyn and David Cameron has fallen, with 72 per cent of the public saying they did not trust the Prime Minister"

    Cameron has destroyed himself with Project Fear, he's become a laughing stock.
    Remain need to lock him in a cupboard :)
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 123,021
    SeanT said:

    TheScreamingEagles said:

    Mortimer said:

    Kudos to TSE for staying up to publish polls and threads trending against his own views. Politics can be a fickle master - especially when polls are concerned.

    My working day starts in less than six hours, which means I have to be up in 4 hours time.

    Goodnight all.
    I've been a bit mean to you. So: fair play. And, yes, thankyou.

    We will be friends when it is all over, I hope!

    It's fine, as I said on the previous thread, people are getting way too grumpy over this referendum.

    I've been guest editing PB for four years now, you get used to the insults, bear in my mind, I've been accused of writing pro Labour, pro Lib Dem and pro Tory threads in that time, it amuses me no end.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 123,021
    Peter Mandelson, the Labour peer and former cabinet minsiter, will also give a speech on Monday saying a vote to remain will lay to rest all the “grandiose, mellifluous bullshit” from anti-EU campaigners for the forseeable future.
  • PlatoSaidPlatoSaid Posts: 10,383
    I thought it was interesting that VoteLeave gave Sky their last internal polling. Lots of questions showing majority of voters aren't swayed by Remains endless scaremongering.

    This YouGov is more weight that Leave is working.

    I do wish some here would lay off rubbishing their efforts once in a while.
  • BenedictWhiteBenedictWhite Posts: 1,944
    The thing about the vow is that it didn't come out of the blue. It had been said/hinted that Scotland would get a better deal if it stayed. The SNP called their bluff and wanted to know what it was.

    There has been none of that so there can't be a vow this time.
  • GIN1138GIN1138 Posts: 22,942
    TheScreamingEagles said:

    SeanT said:

    TheScreamingEagles said:

    Mortimer said:

    Kudos to TSE for staying up to publish polls and threads trending against his own views. Politics can be a fickle master - especially when polls are concerned.

    My working day starts in less than six hours, which means I have to be up in 4 hours time.

    Goodnight all.
    I've been a bit mean to you. So: fair play. And, yes, thankyou.

    We will be friends when it is all over, I hope!

    It's fine, as I said on the previous thread, people are getting way too grumpy over this referendum.

    I've been guest editing PB for four years now, you get used to the insults, bear in my mind, I've been accused of writing pro Labour, pro Lib Dem and pro Tory threads in that time, it amuses me no end.
    We'll all be singing kumbaya before this thing is over! :smiley:
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 99,232
    Good news for remain - I've spent some time with some regrettably definitely racist people who despise immigration in all forms at any level, but who despite leave arguments are claiming uncertainty in which way they will vote due to economic fears and dislike of even more right wing Tories. So I guess the arguments are somewhat effective after all.

    Oh, anecdote alert.
  • Richard_TyndallRichard_Tyndall Posts: 33,484
    williamglenn said:

    SeanT said:


    Nor, in any case, do they especially care: my guess is that Hollande and Juncker would quite like to see the back of the UK, even if Merkel would regret Brexit. We are a liberal and loosening force, alien to the Frankish conception of the EU.

    France is in turmoil anyway: they might as well amputate the UK during the generalised EU-pain.

    Brexit would turn Frexit from almost impossible to highly unlikely. If that happened then, as they say, this %^&* would get real regarding the future of the whole of Europe.

    I hope this country sees sense before the 23rd. It would be such a morale boost to the whole EU if we vote to stay in now.
    We are seeing sense. That is why we will hopefully vote to Leave.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 99,232
    SeanT said:

    TheScreamingEagles said:

    Mortimer said:

    Kudos to TSE for staying up to publish polls and threads trending against his own views. Politics can be a fickle master - especially when polls are concerned.

    My working day starts in less than six hours, which means I have to be up in 4 hours time.

    Goodnight all.
    I've been a bit mean to you. So: fair play. And, yes, thankyou.

    We will be friends when it is all over, I hope!

    Aww.
  • BenedictWhiteBenedictWhite Posts: 1,944
    TheScreamingEagles said:

    Peter Mandelson, the Labour peer and former cabinet minsiter, will also give a speech on Monday saying a vote to remain will lay to rest all the “grandiose, mellifluous bullshit” from anti-EU campaigners for the forseeable future.

    That'll help. Oh dear.

    Good night...
  • MortimerMortimer Posts: 14,235
    TheScreamingEagles said:

    Peter Mandelson, the Labour peer and former cabinet minsiter, will also give a speech on Monday saying a vote to remain will lay to rest all the “grandiose, mellifluous bullshit” from anti-EU campaigners for the forseeable future.

    Good grief. That is going to swing a couple of votes in Islington.

    Does he really think that intervention is worth making?
  • PeterCPeterC Posts: 1,275
    Tony said:

    "The Yougov figures also showed trust in figures including Jeremy Corbyn and David Cameron has fallen, with 72 per cent of the public saying they did not trust the Prime Minister"

    Cameron has destroyed himself with Project Fear, he's become a laughing stock.
    Remain need to lock him in a cupboard :)

    He could so easily have followed Harold Wilson's model of maintaining a dignified distance. His hysterical and dishonest campaign has been a big negative for REMAIN.
  • kjohnwkjohnw Posts: 1,456
    TheScreamingEagles said:

    Peter Mandelson, the Labour peer and former cabinet minsiter, will also give a speech on Monday saying a vote to remain will lay to rest all the “grandiose, mellifluous bullshit” from anti-EU campaigners for the forseeable future.

    You know they're screwed when they have to wheel out the dark lord. Didn't Gordon call on his services at ge2010? Lol
  • OUTOUT Posts: 569
    TheScreamingEagles said:

    Peter Mandelson, the Labour peer and former cabinet minsiter, will also give a speech on Monday saying a vote to remain will lay to rest all the “grandiose, mellifluous bullshit” from anti-EU campaigners for the forseeable future.

    Reminds me of scottish nationalists being stone dead when the scottish parliament opened.
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 56,314
    Mortimer said:

    TheScreamingEagles said:

    Peter Mandelson, the Labour peer and former cabinet minsiter, will also give a speech on Monday saying a vote to remain will lay to rest all the “grandiose, mellifluous bullshit” from anti-EU campaigners for the forseeable future.

    Good grief. That is going to swing a couple of votes in Islington.

    Does he really think that intervention is worth making?
    I don't know. He's really exactly the kind of person you'd want representing us in Brussels. "He's a bastard but he's our bastard."

    He almost performed a miracle to resurrect Brown so who knows.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 123,021
    Come on you got to love the headline

    'That latest YouGov poll is an Ode to Joy for Leave
  • PlatoSaidPlatoSaid Posts: 10,383
    Tony said:

    "The Yougov figures also showed trust in figures including Jeremy Corbyn and David Cameron has fallen, with 72 per cent of the public saying they did not trust the Prime Minister"

    Cameron has destroyed himself with Project Fear, he's become a laughing stock.
    Remain need to lock him in a cupboard :)

    Do we know what the numbers are? I've seen at least two dozen tweets from Labourites saying they're very pissed at Jezza and cancelling/considering their membership. It wasn't what they voted for.
  • MonikerDiCanioMonikerDiCanio Posts: 5,792
    TheScreamingEagles said:

    Peter Mandelson, the Labour peer and former cabinet minsiter, will also give a speech on Monday saying a vote to remain will lay to rest all the “grandiose, mellifluous bullshit” from anti-EU campaigners for the forseeable future.

    Mandy's cracked. Remain is going mad.
  • GIN1138GIN1138 Posts: 22,942
    PeterC said:

    Tony said:

    "The Yougov figures also showed trust in figures including Jeremy Corbyn and David Cameron has fallen, with 72 per cent of the public saying they did not trust the Prime Minister"

    Cameron has destroyed himself with Project Fear, he's become a laughing stock.
    Remain need to lock him in a cupboard :)

    He could so easily have followed Harold Wilson's model of maintaining a dignified distance. His hysterical and dishonest campaign has been a big negative for REMAIN.
    The blame for this is probably with Sir Lynton....
  • viewcodeviewcode Posts: 25,356
    TheScreamingEagles said:

    Mortimer said:

    Kudos to TSE for staying up to publish polls and threads trending against his own views. Politics can be a fickle master - especially when polls are concerned.

    My working day starts in less than six hours, which means I have to be up in 4 hours time.

    Goodnight all.
    Speaking of which I gotta be up by 6:45. Laters, alligators.

    (I have £500 on LEAVE@5/2. I may have mentioned it.)
  • BenedictWhiteBenedictWhite Posts: 1,944
    TheScreamingEagles said:

    Come on you got to love the headline

    'That latest YouGov poll is an Ode to Joy for Leave

    Yes. And it's a good tune to boot.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 123,021
    And before I do go to bed, I'm hopeful we'll get at least one phone poll on Monday, the ORB poll for the Telegraph.
  • TonyTony Posts: 159
    edited June 2016

    Do we know what the numbers are? I've seen at least two dozen tweets from Labourites saying they're very pissed at Jezza and cancelling/considering their membership. It wasn't what they voted for.

    http://www.cityam.com/242642/brexit-campaigners-have-been-handed-another-lead-in-the-latest-polling-from-yougov
  • RogerRoger Posts: 20,781
    edited June 2016
    BenedictWhite said:

    TheScreamingEagles said:

    Peter Mandelson, the Labour peer and former cabinet minsiter, will also give a speech on Monday saying a vote to remain will lay to rest all the “grandiose, mellifluous bullshit” from anti-EU campaigners for the forseeable future.

    That'll help. Oh dear.

    Good night...
    It'll help because Remain have used far too few spokespeople. They seem to have realized their mistake a little late in the day
  • MortimerMortimer Posts: 14,235
    williamglenn said:

    Mortimer said:

    TheScreamingEagles said:

    Peter Mandelson, the Labour peer and former cabinet minsiter, will also give a speech on Monday saying a vote to remain will lay to rest all the “grandiose, mellifluous bullshit” from anti-EU campaigners for the forseeable future.

    Good grief. That is going to swing a couple of votes in Islington.

    Does he really think that intervention is worth making?
    I don't know. He's really exactly the kind of person you'd want representing us in Brussels. "He's a bastard but he's our bastard."

    He almost performed a miracle to resurrect Brown so who knows.
    The fact he was an EU Commissioner is the most perfect 'well he would say that' example I've ever seen.

    Someone popular in the current Labour party saying it might help...Oh, wait....
  • BenedictWhiteBenedictWhite Posts: 1,944
    TheScreamingEagles said:

    And before I do go to bed, I'm hopeful we'll get at least one phone poll on Monday, the ORB poll for the Telegraph.

    That'll be interesting. If there is a trend expect squeaky bum time in the EU.
  • MortimerMortimer Posts: 14,235
    TheScreamingEagles said:

    And before I do go to bed, I'm hopeful we'll get at least one phone poll on Monday, the ORB poll for the Telegraph.

    Thanks for the update! Goodnight all.
  • BenedictWhiteBenedictWhite Posts: 1,944
    Roger said:

    BenedictWhite said:

    TheScreamingEagles said:

    Peter Mandelson, the Labour peer and former cabinet minsiter, will also give a speech on Monday saying a vote to remain will lay to rest all the “grandiose, mellifluous bullshit” from anti-EU campaigners for the forseeable future.

    That'll help. Oh dear.

    Good night...
    It'll help because Remain have used far too few spokespeople. They seem to have realized their mistake although a little late in the day
    Seriously? Do you think people warm to him enough to listen to what he says?
  • PlatoSaidPlatoSaid Posts: 10,383
    kjohnw said:

    TheScreamingEagles said:

    Peter Mandelson, the Labour peer and former cabinet minsiter, will also give a speech on Monday saying a vote to remain will lay to rest all the “grandiose, mellifluous bullshit” from anti-EU campaigners for the forseeable future.

    You know they're screwed when they have to wheel out the dark lord. Didn't Gordon call on his services at ge2010? Lol
    Remain have brought out Major, Hezza and Gordon so far. Oh and Clegg. And Blair.

    It's a horror show :smiley:
  • nunununu Posts: 6,024
    TheScreamingEagles said:

    And before I do go to bed, I'm hopeful we'll get at least one phone poll on Monday, the ORB poll for the Telegraph.

    When is project fear gonna go hard on pensions the last few days?
  • NeilVWNeilVW Posts: 749
    edited June 2016
    Mortimer said:

    williamglenn said:

    Mortimer said:

    TheScreamingEagles said:

    Peter Mandelson, the Labour peer and former cabinet minsiter, will also give a speech on Monday saying a vote to remain will lay to rest all the “grandiose, mellifluous bullshit” from anti-EU campaigners for the forseeable future.

    Good grief. That is going to swing a couple of votes in Islington.

    Does he really think that intervention is worth making?
    I don't know. He's really exactly the kind of person you'd want representing us in Brussels. "He's a bastard but he's our bastard."

    He almost performed a miracle to resurrect Brown so who knows.
    The fact he was an EU Commissioner is the most perfect 'well he would say that' example I've ever seen.
    You could say it's a bit MANDY Rice-Davies!

  • kjohnwkjohnw Posts: 1,456
    PlatoSaid said:

    kjohnw said:

    TheScreamingEagles said:

    Peter Mandelson, the Labour peer and former cabinet minsiter, will also give a speech on Monday saying a vote to remain will lay to rest all the “grandiose, mellifluous bullshit” from anti-EU campaigners for the forseeable future.

    You know they're screwed when they have to wheel out the dark lord. Didn't Gordon call on his services at ge2010? Lol
    Remain have brought out Major, Hezza and Gordon so far. Oh and Clegg. And Blair.

    It's a horror show :smiley:
    Don't forget Ed "the winner" Miliband as well plus I see Eddie "the sage" Izzard is on the campaign trail too lol
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 99,232
    I do get why they poll what other countries think we should do, or they would like us to do, but it isn't very helpful. for what can be good and bad reasons they aren't willing to bend on things we would like them to bend on, the effect of which is wanting us to remain in theory but willing to see an exit in practice; hard euroscepticism to the point of potentially leaving is not a recent thing here, they had to know it might happen if we stayed unhappy, even if they didn't think too hard about it. Reasonably or not they gave Cameron as much as they cared to, and were therefore in effect content to see us leave if we didn't like it or they'd have offered more.
  • MonikerDiCanioMonikerDiCanio Posts: 5,792
    NeilVW said:

    Mortimer said:

    williamglenn said:

    Mortimer said:

    TheScreamingEagles said:

    Peter Mandelson, the Labour peer and former cabinet minsiter, will also give a speech on Monday saying a vote to remain will lay to rest all the “grandiose, mellifluous bullshit” from anti-EU campaigners for the forseeable future.

    Good grief. That is going to swing a couple of votes in Islington.

    Does he really think that intervention is worth making?
    I don't know. He's really exactly the kind of person you'd want representing us in Brussels. "He's a bastard but he's our bastard."

    He almost performed a miracle to resurrect Brown so who knows.
    The fact he was an EU Commissioner is the most perfect 'well he would say that' example I've ever seen.
    You could say it's a bit MANDY Rice-Davies!

    Corker.
  • brokenwheelbrokenwheel Posts: 3,352
    TheScreamingEagles said:

    Peter Mandelson, the Labour peer and former cabinet minsiter, will also give a speech on Monday saying a vote to remain will lay to rest all the “grandiose, mellifluous bullshit” from anti-EU campaigners for the forseeable future.

    Clearly christmas has come early for Leave.
  • hunchmanhunchman Posts: 2,591
    edited June 2016
    TheScreamingEagles said:

    Peter Mandelson, the Labour peer and former cabinet minsiter, will also give a speech on Monday saying a vote to remain will lay to rest all the “grandiose, mellifluous bullshit” from anti-EU campaigners for the forseeable future.

    Got woken up by these ferrets in a sack. Up their own ar$es with no idea as to why they're going down like a lead balloon.
  • RogerRoger Posts: 20,781
    edited June 2016
    BenedictWhite said:

    Roger said:

    BenedictWhite said:

    TheScreamingEagles said:

    Peter Mandelson, the Labour peer and former cabinet minsiter, will also give a speech on Monday saying a vote to remain will lay to rest all the “grandiose, mellifluous bullshit” from anti-EU campaigners for the forseeable future.

    That'll help. Oh dear.

    Good night...
    It'll help because Remain have used far too few spokespeople. They seem to have realized their mistake although a little late in the day
    Seriously? Do you think people warm to him enough to listen to what he says?
    They need plenty of voices. The few leading Leave are being given a free ride. The Leavers should be looking like a few nutters but because of some very strange decisions from Remain that hasn't happened. It's Gove and Boris V Cameron and Osborne. Remain have a MUCH bigger talent pool. We should be hearing from them. I'm very much expecting they'll up their game in the next two weeks. John Major was a good start
  • PlatoSaidPlatoSaid Posts: 10,383
    edited June 2016
    Tony said:


    Do we know what the numbers are? I've seen at least two dozen tweets from Labourites saying they're very pissed at Jezza and cancelling/considering their membership. It wasn't what they voted for.

    http://www.cityam.com/242642/brexit-campaigners-have-been-handed-another-lead-in-the-latest-polling-from-yougov

    Super, thanks
  • PlatoSaidPlatoSaid Posts: 10,383
    Localised scaremongering

    http://news.sky.com/story/1707434/brexit-would-bring-economic-shock-to-n-ireland
  • Sean_FSean_F Posts: 39,246
    TheScreamingEagles said:

    Peter Mandelson, the Labour peer and former cabinet minsiter, will also give a speech on Monday saying a vote to remain will lay to rest all the “grandiose, mellifluous bullshit” from anti-EU campaigners for the forseeable future.

    I don't think that's helpful to Remain.
  • BenedictWhiteBenedictWhite Posts: 1,944
    Roger said:

    BenedictWhite said:

    Roger said:

    BenedictWhite said:

    TheScreamingEagles said:

    Peter Mandelson, the Labour peer and former cabinet minsiter, will also give a speech on Monday saying a vote to remain will lay to rest all the “grandiose, mellifluous bullshit” from anti-EU campaigners for the forseeable future.

    That'll help. Oh dear.

    Good night...
    It'll help because Remain have used far too few spokespeople. They seem to have realized their mistake although a little late in the day
    Seriously? Do you think people warm to him enough to listen to what he says?
    They need plenty of voices. The few leading Leave are being given a free ride. The Leavers should be looking like a few nutters but because of some very strange decisions from Remain that hasn't happened. It's Gove and Boris V Cameron and Osborne. Remain have a MUCH bigger talent pool. We should be hearing from them. I'm very much expecting they'll up their game in the next two weeks. John Major was a good start
    John Major has the ERM thing though most think of him as a decent man.

    Mandelson? Does even he think he is a decent man?
  • BenedictWhiteBenedictWhite Posts: 1,944
    The interesting thing about that poll is people are still prepared to vote leave even if they thought they would be worse off.

    So project fear is getting through... but people will vote leave anyway.
  • PlatoSaidPlatoSaid Posts: 10,383
    Sean_F said:

    TheScreamingEagles said:

    Peter Mandelson, the Labour peer and former cabinet minsiter, will also give a speech on Monday saying a vote to remain will lay to rest all the “grandiose, mellifluous bullshit” from anti-EU campaigners for the forseeable future.

    I don't think that's helpful to Remain.
    I'm honestly wondering if they've any self awareness at times like this. Who is going to be persuaded by Mandy?
  • PlatoSaidPlatoSaid Posts: 10,383
    BenedictWhite said:

    The interesting thing about that poll is people are still prepared to vote leave even if they thought they would be worse off.

    So project fear is getting through... but people will vote leave anyway.

    The ICM VoteLeave one was very similar, money isn't everything.
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 56,314
    So far the the posters on here haven't been good at giving advice for what the other side should do.

    On that basis Mandy has got to be one of the big bazookas for Remain.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 123,021
    BenedictWhite said:

    The interesting thing about that poll is people are still prepared to vote leave even if they thought they would be worse off.

    So project fear is getting through... but people will vote leave anyway.

    People thought they'd be worse off under Ed Miliband and still they told pollsters they were going to vote Labour....
  • Wulfrun_PhilWulfrun_Phil Posts: 4,784
    The YouGov fieldwork details: 3,405 people surveyed Wednesday to Friday.

    So as up to date as it gets.

    http://uk.reuters.com/article/uk-britain-eu-poll-yougov-idUKKCN0YR103
  • PlatoSaidPlatoSaid Posts: 10,383
    Great short video

    "I am inviting you to fire me" says @DanHannanMEP in his #bbcsp film on #EUreferendum https://t.co/EVySpAtphD
  • BenedictWhiteBenedictWhite Posts: 1,944
    TheScreamingEagles said:

    BenedictWhite said:

    The interesting thing about that poll is people are still prepared to vote leave even if they thought they would be worse off.

    So project fear is getting through... but people will vote leave anyway.

    People thought they'd be worse off under Ed Miliband and still they told pollsters they were going to vote Labour....
    And then came the tablet...

    True, we'll see. That said this is a different vote.

    Anyway you've got to get to bed and I've stuff to do..
  • PlatoSaidPlatoSaid Posts: 10,383
    williamglenn said:

    So far the the posters on here haven't been good at giving advice for what the other side should do.

    On that basis Mandy has got to be one of the big bazookas for Remain.

    Who do you think he'll appeal to beyond core Remain?
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 56,314
    PlatoSaid said:

    williamglenn said:

    So far the the posters on here haven't been good at giving advice for what the other side should do.

    On that basis Mandy has got to be one of the big bazookas for Remain.

    Who do you think he'll appeal to beyond core Remain?
    He'll get into the heads of Leave and they'll made unforced errors.
  • Wulfrun_PhilWulfrun_Phil Posts: 4,784
    If Remain are seriously trying to bring Labour supporters over to their side, Mandelson is about the last person they should be looking to to make their case.

    If he were included in polling of trust in politicians, he would be at the very bottom of the pile even in a field with plenty of competition (Cameron, Blair?).
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 55,532
    Wulfrun_Phil said:

    If Remain are seriously trying to bring Labour supporters over to their side, Mandelson is about the last person they should be looking to to make their case.

    If he were included in polling of trust in politicians, he would be at the very bottom of the pile even in a field with plenty of competition (Cameron, Blair?).

    Remain are lining up the most spectacular Who's Who of Punchable Politicians.

    Osborne, Blair, Mandelson, Kinnock, Brown, Clegg.....
  • RobDRobD Posts: 60,629
    Blimey!
  • PlatoSaidPlatoSaid Posts: 10,383
    MarqueeMark said:

    Wulfrun_Phil said:

    If Remain are seriously trying to bring Labour supporters over to their side, Mandelson is about the last person they should be looking to to make their case.

    If he were included in polling of trust in politicians, he would be at the very bottom of the pile even in a field with plenty of competition (Cameron, Blair?).

    Remain are lining up the most spectacular Who's Who of Punchable Politicians.

    Osborne, Blair, Mandelson, Kinnock, Brown, Clegg.....
    They'll be ringing Emma Thompson at this rate.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 86,191
    edited June 2016
    Mandy to speak for remain, that should stick a point or two on leave polling. Why would remain what to remind people of a classic example of some major negatives about the eu. It isn't like he is even popular with labour supporters.
  • FishingFishing Posts: 5,744
    I take it the TNS is online?

    Still, bad numbers for Remain, whichever way one looks at it.
  • SouthamObserverSouthamObserver Posts: 40,054
    Dawn in Barcelona. I have spent much of the last three days explaining to incredulous assorted Americans and Europeans that the UK will vote to leave the EU. They just don't get it. The shockwaves that will be caused by the referendum result are going to be significant. We can only hope that they are short-lived. If the Leave establishment have this wrong in the way that Yes were wrong about the benefits of Scottish independence, then a lot of people in the UK face very uncertain, unhappy futures. But that's democracy. It's what the people will have voted for.
  • SouthamObserverSouthamObserver Posts: 40,054
    BenedictWhite said:

    The interesting thing about that poll is people are still prepared to vote leave even if they thought they would be worse off.

    So project fear is getting through... but people will vote leave anyway.

    I remember when people used to say in polls that they'd vote for higher taxes if it meant getting more spending on public services. They never did, though.

  • pinkrosepinkrose Posts: 189
    edited June 2016
    SouthamObserver said:

    BenedictWhite said:

    The interesting thing about that poll is people are still prepared to vote leave even if they thought they would be worse off.

    So project fear is getting through... but people will vote leave anyway.

    I remember when people used to say in polls that they'd vote for higher taxes if it meant getting more spending on public services. They never did, though.

    They did. They voted Labour for 3 general elections in a row and enough for a hung Parliament in 2010. Labour raised taxes inclu NI and massively raised stealth taxes to fund the NHS and an expansion of the Public sector.
  • pinkrosepinkrose Posts: 189
    Leave should not be complacent now. They also need to up their game. Make more use of women like Andrea Leadsom, Giesla Stuart, Kate Hoey and really start to make the most of Leave backers from the Left and outside politics etc. It cannot just be Boris, Gove and Farage.

  • SouthamObserverSouthamObserver Posts: 40,054
    pinkrose said:

    Leave should not be complacent now. They also need to up their game. Make more use of women like Andrea Leadsom, Giesla Stuart, Kate Hoey and really start to make the most of Leave backers from the Left and outside politics etc. It cannot just be Boris, Gove and Farage.

    Leave will be fine. They own immigration. Nothing else is necessary. It never has been.

  • SouthamObserverSouthamObserver Posts: 40,054
    The trade union intervention emphasises just how poor Labour's Remain effort has been. Die-hard Corbynistas would never blame the great leader for this, but there will be a fair few who voted for him - and who have supported him up to now - who will be bitterly disappointed by the result come 24th June. It could just be that Dave and George are not the only casualties of Brexit. Though their departures will be more immediate.
  • asjohnstoneasjohnstone Posts: 1,276
    pinkrose said:

    Leave should not be complacent now. They also need to up their game. Make more use of women like Andrea Leadsom, Giesla Stuart, Kate Hoey and really start to make the most of Leave backers from the Left and outside politics etc. It cannot just be Boris, Gove and Farage.

    I agree. They've made great progress, but I still think they are the underdog at this point. They need many voices, especially from the left. The core Labour vote actually turning up on the day is the only thing that can sink them
  • pinkrosepinkrose Posts: 189
    edited June 2016
    SouthamObserver said:

    The trade union intervention emphasises just how poor Labour's Remain effort has been. Die-hard Corbynistas would never blame the great leader for this, but there will be a fair few who voted for him - and who have supported him up to now - who will be bitterly disappointed by the result come 24th June. It could just be that Dave and George are not the only casualties of Brexit. Though their departures will be more immediate.

    Corbyn is Eurosceptic, he's Bennite at heart, even in the Labour Leadership contest he criticised the EU. If he was not the Labour leader he would be campaigning for out its as simple as that. IMO there is a stronger case for Leave from the Left than even from the Right.
  • Paul_BedfordshirePaul_Bedfordshire Posts: 3,632
    Is the poll with the alleged big Brexit lead that someone jumped the embargo on or is that another one?
  • Paul_BedfordshirePaul_Bedfordshire Posts: 3,632
    edited June 2016
    The most successful, fastest growing and most effective at getting results for its members union in recent times is campaigning for OUT after being instructed to by the membership

    http://www.rmt.org.uk/about/policies/political-circulars-and-submissions/referendum-on-membership-of-the-european-union130516/?preview=true

    "Head Office Circular No. NP/140/16/MC

    To all Branches & Regional Councils


    Friday 13 May 2016

    Dear Colleagues,

    Referendum on Membership of the European Union

    As you may be aware, the referendum campaign surrounding UK membership of the European Union has now begun.

    RMT policy on this matter was decided by rank and file members at the 2015 Annual General Meeting, and the union is campaigning for a Leave vote. The motion carried at the AGM was as follows:

    THE EUROPEAN UNION REFERENDUM....



    This AGM instructs the General Secretary and Council of Executives to work to establish an alliance of trade unions, socialists and democrats calling for a 'No' vote in the coming referendum ....

    RMT has registered as an official “leave” campaigner with the Electoral Commission. .... The union is also campaigning publicly with other unions, socialists and trade unionists who share our position.

    Additionally, RMT will be promoting the following six key points direct to members across all sectors of the transport industry through the RMT NEWS, through branches and reps and through the union’s social media platforms. Copies of the below in leaflets and poster form will shortly be made available to Branches and Regional Councils.

    1. Leave the EU to end attacks on rail workers.....


    2. Leave the EU to end attacks on seafarers and the offshore workers ....

    3. Leave the EU to end attacks on workers’ rights
    It’s a myth that the EU is in favour of workers. In fact the EU is developing a new policy framework to attack trade union rights, collective bargaining, job protections and wages. This is already being enforced in countries which have received EU “bailouts”.

    4. Leave the EU to end Austerity...

    5. Leave the EU to stop the attack on our NHS....
    The Transatlantic Trade and Investment Partnership (TTIP) trade agreement....

    6. Leave the EU to support democracy
    The vast majority of the laws that affects our lives are now made in the EU and not the UK. We have no say over those Laws. As the late Tony Benn said in 1991…

    “We are discussing whether the British people are to be allowed to elect those who make the laws under which they are governed. The argument is nothing to do with whether we should get more maternity leave from Madame Papandreou [a European Commissioner].”

    I would be grateful if you could bring this Circular to the attention of all Branch members and I will keep you informed as to developments and initiatives in the campaign.



    Yours sincerely


    Mick Cash
    General Secretary
  • PlatoSaidPlatoSaid Posts: 10,383
    pinkrose said:

    Leave should not be complacent now. They also need to up their game. Make more use of women like Andrea Leadsom, Giesla Stuart, Kate Hoey and really start to make the most of Leave backers from the Left and outside politics etc. It cannot just be Boris, Gove and Farage.

    Leadsom was on Sky yesterday and LBC, Hoey was on Sky too - Gisela was Friday. I've seen Hoey on the campaign trail too.

    I think there's a perception that some people are all the TV all the time. I've seen less of Farage than Hoey/Leadsom. And Priti is a regular. This isn't helped by some other females reinforcing this - Woollaston for example. I've only seen her complaining about campaign stuff. Hattie is forever grinding this axe as expected.

    The next debates have IIRC 5/6 females - and Boris. Leave has Priti/Leadsom IIRC - Remain has Sturgeon/Rudd/Davidson.
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 62,776
    Good morning, everyone.

    Just caught up with the comments last thread. The Wisdom of Morris Dancer was proven by my wise decision to not watch Top Gear.

    I wouldn't get too giddy over polls. There's over a fortnight to go.
  • PlatoSaidPlatoSaid Posts: 10,383
    edited June 2016
    SouthamObserver said:

    The trade union intervention emphasises just how poor Labour's Remain effort has been. Die-hard Corbynistas would never blame the great leader for this, but there will be a fair few who voted for him - and who have supported him up to now - who will be bitterly disappointed by the result come 24th June. It could just be that Dave and George are not the only casualties of Brexit. Though their departures will be more immediate.

    I mentioned earlier seeing a couple of dozen Labourites very disappointed/talking of/have cancelled their memberships over Corbyn's stance on the EU. They feel cheated. None struck me as hardcore sorts - just average bods who'd thought his EU position was a key factor.

    This whole campaign period has exposed fault lines all over - no one seems impressed by Owen Jones/Paul Mason turning their coats either.
  • PlatoSaidPlatoSaid Posts: 10,383
    pinkrose said:

    SouthamObserver said:

    BenedictWhite said:

    The interesting thing about that poll is people are still prepared to vote leave even if they thought they would be worse off.

    So project fear is getting through... but people will vote leave anyway.

    I remember when people used to say in polls that they'd vote for higher taxes if it meant getting more spending on public services. They never did, though.

    They did. They voted Labour for 3 general elections in a row and enough for a hung Parliament in 2010. Labour raised taxes inclu NI and massively raised stealth taxes to fund the NHS and an expansion of the Public sector.
    They also voted for cuts - twice.
  • PlatoSaidPlatoSaid Posts: 10,383
    Paul_Bedfordshire said:

    Is the poll with the alleged big Brexit lead that someone jumped the embargo on or is that another one?

    There's three mentioned - the voodoo Telegraph one, the old TNS one just released - and a fresh YouGov with a big lead.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 56,095
    Morning all, and Ramadan Kareem to all Muslim PBers.

    Looks like all the polls are heading towards Leave. Catching up on yesterday, Major's interview on Marr will probably help Remain, although again he was talking about people and process rather than trying to make the positive case for the EU.
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