"The Home Office has confirmed 592 people were rescued or intercepted during 16 incidents dealt with by the UK on Thursday, and said the French intercepted 18 crossings, preventing 420 people from setting out on the journey."
That's well over 1,000 people who attempted to cross in a single day and would have done if the French hadn't bothered.
It's absolutely insane. I fancy Blair or even Starmer would have a better grip on this.
If you had these numbers all-year round, and the French didn't bother at all, we'd be talking well over a third of a million pro-rata, comfortably exceeding all other forms of migration, and more than doubling our net immigration total. And there's no natural limit to it either. Why not 2,000 a day? 5,000? 10,000? Why not create "safe and legal routes" for anyone who feels they need it, and extend that into the millions?
This is going to return immigration to the centre of British politics, and it has already done so for Conservative voters.
Your last point may well be true but we don't have all year around sea crossing. It's a summer thing. So far anyway.
Sadly, not true - it's now all year round. There were 150 over the weekend of 9-10th January this year.
This is now a massive problem, and it's not possible to ignore or dismiss it anymore - it must be addressed:
1) Tow their boats to within ten miles of Heligoland and then cast them adrift.
2) Let them in but with the proviso they must live in either Scotland or Northern Ireland.
3) Lifetime indentured labour as fruit pickers, care home workers or whatever is the claimed area of labour shortages.
4) Have their claims processed in the Falklands or Pitcairn after a slow voyage and at a rate of one per hour.
The answer is for British boats to join French boats in French waters and tow every single boat back to France. Face down threats of jumping overboard, or throwing themselves and their children overboard, all authority boats to have divers and swimmers to rescue anyone that does this and prosecute anyone who does so.
The pull factor to France will rapidly reduce, benefiting France, and no-one will bother anymore.
That won't work. If they can't get in they'll give up and most likely end up claiming asylum in France, and the French don't want them.
Irregular migration across Europe is one giant game of pass-the-parcel, in which nobody wants the parcels. You can imagine that the local authorities on the French Channel coast might be in favour of getting as tough as possible, to end the continual flow of migrants and the activity of the criminal trafficking gangs on their shores, but the government in Paris is presumably delighted to see the back of them.
The only effective solution to this, given that the French clearly aren't going to let the British Navy and Coastguard forcibly throw the boat people back onto beaches in the vicinity of Calais, is to intercept all of them before they can get right across and to immediately offshore them, Australia-style. And I don't believe that the current Government, regardless of all the cruelties of which it is accused, is capable of that kind of ruthlessness. So they'll keep pretending to do something, whilst allowing the crossings to continue unchecked. It's what their behaviour to date suggests.
Yanis Varoufakis @yanisvaroufakis I just heard that Kier Starmer expelled Ken Loach from the Labour Party. I hope this is fake news. If not, all he managed is to expel Labour's soul, leaving behind an arid, soulless Labour Party - one that is even poorer than under Blair and his fellow war criminals.
FFS. How long has Loach been in the Labour Party for? He only joined, IIRC, when Corbyn became leader in 2015. HIs films have been shite for years. Kes was okay but only because of Brian Glover.
It's absolutely insane. I fancy Blair or even Starmer would have a better grip on this.
If you had these numbers all-year round, and the French didn't bother at all, we'd be talking well over a third of a million pro-rata, comfortably exceeding all other forms of migration, and more than doubling our net immigration total. And there's no natural limit to it either. Why not 2,000 a day? 5,000? 10,000? Why not create "safe and legal routes" for anyone who feels they need it, and extend that into the millions?
This is going to return immigration to the centre of British politics, and it has already done so for Conservative voters.
Blair's view, as I think I've said before, was that people would tolerate a relatively generous refugee policy so long as it appeared reasonably under control, but they wouldn't tolerate chaos. The two are linked - if we offered a Green Card-like system with a reasonable chance of success if you either have good skills or good English or genuine connections with the UK, the incentive to pay people-smugglers to risk your life would be much diminished. Balance that with 20-year sentences for people-smuggling and serious resources invested in catching them and you change the equation for the smugglers too.
The combination of fierce rhetoric (implying that you have little chance of legal admission) and incompetent deterrence (implying that if you keep trying you'll probably get across) is the worst of both worlds. The refugees are making a rational choice - keep trying illegally and you have a shot at a decent life, stop trying and you almost certainly don't.
It's absolutely insane. I fancy Blair or even Starmer would have a better grip on this.
If you had these numbers all-year round, and the French didn't bother at all, we'd be talking well over a third of a million pro-rata, comfortably exceeding all other forms of migration, and more than doubling our net immigration total. And there's no natural limit to it either. Why not 2,000 a day? 5,000? 10,000? Why not create "safe and legal routes" for anyone who feels they need it, and extend that into the millions?
This is going to return immigration to the centre of British politics, and it has already done so for Conservative voters.
Blair's view, as I think I've said before, was that people would tolerate a relatively generous refugee policy so long as it appeared reasonably under control, but they wouldn't tolerate chaos. The two are linked - if we offered a Green Card-like system with a reasonable chance of success if you either have good skills or good English or genuine connections with the UK, the incentive to pay people-smugglers to risk your life would be much diminished. Balance that with 20-year sentences for people-smuggling and serious resources invested in catching them and you change the equation for the smugglers too.
The combination of fierce rhetoric (implying that you have little chance of legal admission) and incompetent deterrence (implying that if you keep trying you'll probably get across) is the worst of both worlds. The refugees are making a rational choice - keep trying illegally and you have a shot at a decent life, stop trying and you almost certainly don't.
+490 cases in Australia. They're still going in the wrong direction despite the growing lockdown.
You can either have a messy beginning, a messy middle, or a messy end, but no one is getting out of this pandemic unscathed
Certainly true for me. I was rather smugly congratulating myself on negotiating the Lethal Reefs of the Pandemic with some aplomb, and then, bang. NO PARMESAN FLAKES
I will never be smug again. This virus comes for us all, in the end
Covid will get everyone - and anyone it doesn't kill will contract it at regular intervals for the rest of their lives.
Once you've had your vaccinations then you've had as much protection as you're going to get. After that, sitting at home as much as possible, diving out of the way if anyone else gets within twenty feet, shuffling around everywhere in a mask - all this stuff might delay the inevitable, but probably not by very much.
Penny still not dropped about masks being mainly useful for the protection of others ...
+490 cases in Australia. They're still going in the wrong direction despite the growing lockdown.
You can either have a messy beginning, a messy middle, or a messy end, but no one is getting out of this pandemic unscathed
Certainly true for me. I was rather smugly congratulating myself on negotiating the Lethal Reefs of the Pandemic with some aplomb, and then, bang. NO PARMESAN FLAKES
I will never be smug again. This virus comes for us all, in the end
Covid will get everyone - and anyone it doesn't kill will contract it at regular intervals for the rest of their lives.
Once you've had your vaccinations then you've had as much protection as you're going to get. After that, sitting at home as much as possible, diving out of the way if anyone else gets within twenty feet, shuffling around everywhere in a mask - all this stuff might delay the inevitable, but probably not by very much.
Penny still not dropped about masks being mainly useful for the protection of others ...
Protect who ?
Anti-vaxxers ?
Why should anyone inconvenience themselves to do that ?
I was going to post this morning that he needed 168 or so to get there, but didn't want to curse him.
Now he's just got to stay not out.. I haven't done it again have I?
We should declare. Give Root a not out, protect Jimmy's fingers and get a few overs at them tonight.
I can see the appeal, but aren't these "lead" runs supposed to be worth double, or something? If Anderson can be there in the morning.. Oh, and now we can't bowl so go Jimmy!
I was going to post this morning that he needed 168 or so to get there, but didn't want to curse him.
Now he's just got to stay not out.. I haven't done it again have I?
We should declare. Give Root a not out, protect Jimmy's fingers and get a few overs at them tonight.
I can see the appeal, but aren't these "lead" runs supposed to be worth double, or something? If Anderson can be there in the morning.. Oh, and now we can't bowl so go Jimmy!
Just got back from my CrossFit summer barbeque. Went prepared for rain. Came back sunburned. Am drunk.
How well has your CrossFit gym got through the pandemic?
We have now - after much work - become a venue for Crossfit Level 1 courses, and one of the people doing the Certificate on the last one moved gym because he liked the facilities. Which is great news.
"The Home Office has confirmed 592 people were rescued or intercepted during 16 incidents dealt with by the UK on Thursday, and said the French intercepted 18 crossings, preventing 420 people from setting out on the journey."
That's well over 1,000 people who attempted to cross in a single day and would have done if the French hadn't bothered.
It's absolutely insane. I fancy Blair or even Starmer would have a better grip on this.
If you had these numbers all-year round, and the French didn't bother at all, we'd be talking well over a third of a million pro-rata, comfortably exceeding all other forms of migration, and more than doubling our net immigration total. And there's no natural limit to it either. Why not 2,000 a day? 5,000? 10,000? Why not create "safe and legal routes" for anyone who feels they need it, and extend that into the millions?
This is going to return immigration to the centre of British politics, and it has already done so for Conservative voters.
Your last point may well be true but we don't have all year around sea crossing. It's a summer thing. So far anyway.
Sadly, not true - it's now all year round. There were 150 over the weekend of 9-10th January this year.
This is now a massive problem, and it's not possible to ignore or dismiss it anymore - it must be addressed:
1) Tow their boats to within ten miles of Heligoland and then cast them adrift.
2) Let them in but with the proviso they must live in either Scotland or Northern Ireland.
3) Lifetime indentured labour as fruit pickers, care home workers or whatever is the claimed area of labour shortages.
4) Have their claims processed in the Falklands or Pitcairn after a slow voyage and at a rate of one per hour.
The answer is for British boats to join French boats in French waters and tow every single boat back to France. Face down threats of jumping overboard, or throwing themselves and their children overboard, all authority boats to have divers and swimmers to rescue anyone that does this and prosecute anyone who does so.
The pull factor to France will rapidly reduce, benefiting France, and no-one will bother anymore.
That won't work. If they can't get in they'll give up and most likely end up claiming asylum in France, and the French don't want them.
Irregular migration across Europe is one giant game of pass-the-parcel, in which nobody wants the parcels. You can imagine that the local authorities on the French Channel coast might be in favour of getting as tough as possible, to end the continual flow of migrants and the activity of the criminal trafficking gangs on their shores, but the government in Paris is presumably delighted to see the back of them.
The only effective solution to this, given that the French clearly aren't going to let the British Navy and Coastguard forcibly throw the boat people back onto beaches in the vicinity of Calais, is to intercept all of them before they can get right across and to immediately offshore them, Australia-style. And I don't believe that the current Government, regardless of all the cruelties of which it is accused, is capable of that kind of ruthlessness. So they'll keep pretending to do something, whilst allowing the crossings to continue unchecked. It's what their behaviour to date suggests.
Completely correct. If asylum claims were processed in some country south of the Sahara, next to nobody would try to make the journey. And there are enough poorer countries down there that one would be willing to do it for a reasonable fee.
It is complete madness for us to close off low skilled immigration from the EU only to open it by the back door for (often lower skilled) immigration from the rest of the world. We should not be guilted about this either as these people are crossing from safe countries. Frankly, anyone doing that with children should be prosecuted for child endangerment.
"The Home Office has confirmed 592 people were rescued or intercepted during 16 incidents dealt with by the UK on Thursday, and said the French intercepted 18 crossings, preventing 420 people from setting out on the journey."
That's well over 1,000 people who attempted to cross in a single day and would have done if the French hadn't bothered.
It's absolutely insane. I fancy Blair or even Starmer would have a better grip on this.
If you had these numbers all-year round, and the French didn't bother at all, we'd be talking well over a third of a million pro-rata, comfortably exceeding all other forms of migration, and more than doubling our net immigration total. And there's no natural limit to it either. Why not 2,000 a day? 5,000? 10,000? Why not create "safe and legal routes" for anyone who feels they need it, and extend that into the millions?
This is going to return immigration to the centre of British politics, and it has already done so for Conservative voters.
Your last point may well be true but we don't have all year around sea crossing. It's a summer thing. So far anyway.
Sadly, not true - it's now all year round. There were 150 over the weekend of 9-10th January this year.
This is now a massive problem, and it's not possible to ignore or dismiss it anymore - it must be addressed:
1) Tow their boats to within ten miles of Heligoland and then cast them adrift.
2) Let them in but with the proviso they must live in either Scotland or Northern Ireland.
3) Lifetime indentured labour as fruit pickers, care home workers or whatever is the claimed area of labour shortages.
4) Have their claims processed in the Falklands or Pitcairn after a slow voyage and at a rate of one per hour.
The answer is for British boats to join French boats in French waters and tow every single boat back to France. Face down threats of jumping overboard, or throwing themselves and their children overboard, all authority boats to have divers and swimmers to rescue anyone that does this and prosecute anyone who does so.
The pull factor to France will rapidly reduce, benefiting France, and no-one will bother anymore.
That won't work. If they can't get in they'll give up and most likely end up claiming asylum in France, and the French don't want them.
Irregular migration across Europe is one giant game of pass-the-parcel, in which nobody wants the parcels. You can imagine that the local authorities on the French Channel coast might be in favour of getting as tough as possible, to end the continual flow of migrants and the activity of the criminal trafficking gangs on their shores, but the government in Paris is presumably delighted to see the back of them.
The only effective solution to this, given that the French clearly aren't going to let the British Navy and Coastguard forcibly throw the boat people back onto beaches in the vicinity of Calais, is to intercept all of them before they can get right across and to immediately offshore them, Australia-style. And I don't believe that the current Government, regardless of all the cruelties of which it is accused, is capable of that kind of ruthlessness. So they'll keep pretending to do something, whilst allowing the crossings to continue unchecked. It's what their behaviour to date suggests.
I don't agree, actually. There are some who are desperate enough to make any journey anywhere but there are plenty who are active economic migrants targeting Britain exclusively. That's why they plan to get here right from the start and try repeatedly, and determindely, to cross.
However, I do agree that it can't just be controlled there. It also needs to happen in the Med, the Canaries, the Balearics, and in the Aegean, and the Royal Navy should contribute vessels there too - to also turnaround.
Also, we need to invest in and stabilise source countries, yes, through development aid, and make clear we only take bona-fide refugees direct from the camps.
Introduce a 1:100,000 chance lottery for everyone else (subject to an annual cap) so everyone has a bit of hope.
Looks like Floridas's death curve is accelerating.
I've got a liability against DeSantis in the next pres market.
As far as I can remember I think I held off on betting either way in DeSantis but I had very strongly thought about backing him.
I definetly have a post or two on here enumerating his positives for getting the Nom.
Next week or so might be rather crucial for his chances.
DeSantis might be lucky in that Florida is being hit quicker than many other states and so might not be quite the disaster zone more northern states are likely to be this winter.
I am so bored by SKS I just can't stand it. I wish he'd say 'fuck' on R4 or buy an SF90 in Abu Dhabi blue with a crema interior or call for the violent overthrow of the government.
he makes john major look hip and dynamic, could they have picked a bigger nonentity if they tried.
SKS needs to shag Edwina Currie to gain some street cred.
It's absolutely insane. I fancy Blair or even Starmer would have a better grip on this.
If you had these numbers all-year round, and the French didn't bother at all, we'd be talking well over a third of a million pro-rata, comfortably exceeding all other forms of migration, and more than doubling our net immigration total. And there's no natural limit to it either. Why not 2,000 a day? 5,000? 10,000? Why not create "safe and legal routes" for anyone who feels they need it, and extend that into the millions?
This is going to return immigration to the centre of British politics, and it has already done so for Conservative voters.
Blair's view, as I think I've said before, was that people would tolerate a relatively generous refugee policy so long as it appeared reasonably under control, but they wouldn't tolerate chaos. The two are linked - if we offered a Green Card-like system with a reasonable chance of success if you either have good skills or good English or genuine connections with the UK, the incentive to pay people-smugglers to risk your life would be much diminished. Balance that with 20-year sentences for people-smuggling and serious resources invested in catching them and you change the equation for the smugglers too.
The combination of fierce rhetoric (implying that you have little chance of legal admission) and incompetent deterrence (implying that if you keep trying you'll probably get across) is the worst of both worlds. The refugees are making a rational choice - keep trying illegally and you have a shot at a decent life, stop trying and you almost certainly don't.
I think there's a lot in that, and indeed I've said similar myself, but it dodges the question of numbers.
People will tolerate 50k-80k per annum of the type you describe, so such a green-card system would have to have democratic limits.
I agree with your last paragraph. If I was 20-years old and lived in Eritrea and could raise £10k to try it I'd certainly do it.
I was going to post this morning that he needed 168 or so to get there, but didn't want to curse him.
Now he's just got to stay not out.. I haven't done it again have I?
We should declare. Give Root a not out, protect Jimmy's fingers and get a few overs at them tonight.
I can see the appeal, but aren't these "lead" runs supposed to be worth double, or something? If Anderson can be there in the morning.. Oh, and now we can't bowl so go Jimmy!
Root doing the business now.
I think he might already be England's greatest batsman, without even reaching Cook's run record. I'm pretty sure, barring injury, that he will beat it.
What I really love about Root is that he very nearly almost always looks like he's enjoying the game. He might have the cutest ever smile in cricket.
And another wicket as I post.. At least it wasn't Joe!
I was going to post this morning that he needed 168 or so to get there, but didn't want to curse him.
Now he's just got to stay not out.. I haven't done it again have I?
We should declare. Give Root a not out, protect Jimmy's fingers and get a few overs at them tonight.
I can see the appeal, but aren't these "lead" runs supposed to be worth double, or something? If Anderson can be there in the morning.. Oh, and now we can't bowl so go Jimmy!
Root doing the business now.
I think he might already be England's greatest batsman, without even reaching Cook's run record. I'm pretty sure, barring injury, that he will beat it.
What I really love about Root is that he very nearly almost always looks like he's enjoying the game. He might have the cutest ever smile in cricket.
And another wicket as I post.. At least it wasn't Joe!
Well, you get your wish.
Not a great performance by India’s bowlers in the last three overs. Far too many no-balls.
I was going to post this morning that he needed 168 or so to get there, but didn't want to curse him.
Now he's just got to stay not out.. I haven't done it again have I?
We should declare. Give Root a not out, protect Jimmy's fingers and get a few overs at them tonight.
I can see the appeal, but aren't these "lead" runs supposed to be worth double, or something? If Anderson can be there in the morning.. Oh, and now we can't bowl so go Jimmy!
Root doing the business now.
I think he might already be England's greatest batsman, without even reaching Cook's run record. I'm pretty sure, barring injury, that he will beat it.
What I really love about Root is that he very nearly almost always looks like he's enjoying the game. He might have the cutest ever smile in cricket.
And another wicket as I post.. At least it wasn't Joe!
Well, you get your wish.
Not a great performance by India’s bowlers in the last three overs. Far too many no-balls.
Might (hopefully!) affect them when they're next bowling.. I think deliberately under-stepping to compensate can reduce pace and bother bowling rhythm.
"With all its might and hi-tech sophistication, the US has allowed itself to be beaten by medieval dogmatists on horseback."
Rory Stewart
I have not followed the discussion on PB over the past few days, but I presume the link has been made between the problems we are experiencing with refugees and the coming collapse of the pro western regime in Afghanistan. Ie the latter compounds the former.
The disaster in Afghanistan is of a scale that is hard to process. 20 years of foreign policy, ending in this. A total failure.
Comments
I definetly have a post or two on here enumerating his positives for getting the Nom.
Next week or so might be rather crucial for his chances.
Irregular migration across Europe is one giant game of pass-the-parcel, in which nobody wants the parcels. You can imagine that the local authorities on the French Channel coast might be in favour of getting as tough as possible, to end the continual flow of migrants and the activity of the criminal trafficking gangs on their shores, but the government in Paris is presumably delighted to see the back of them.
The only effective solution to this, given that the French clearly aren't going to let the British Navy and Coastguard forcibly throw the boat people back onto beaches in the vicinity of Calais, is to intercept all of them before they can get right across and to immediately offshore them, Australia-style. And I don't believe that the current Government, regardless of all the cruelties of which it is accused, is capable of that kind of ruthlessness. So they'll keep pretending to do something, whilst allowing the crossings to continue unchecked. It's what their behaviour to date suggests.
I was going to post this morning that he needed 168 or so to get there, but didn't want to curse him.
Now he's just got to stay not out.. I haven't done it again have I?
You were talking about 6 wicketkeepers for England in 1981 (five in internationals) and suggested it was a lot.
So far this year the following have kept for England in full internationals.
Buttler
Foakes
Bairstow
Bracey
Simpson
So we’re actually up to that already with some way to go.
The combination of fierce rhetoric (implying that you have little chance of legal admission) and incompetent deterrence (implying that if you keep trying you'll probably get across) is the worst of both worlds. The refugees are making a rational choice - keep trying illegally and you have a shot at a decent life, stop trying and you almost certainly don't.
Another miserable over rate, btw.
Anti-vaxxers ?
Why should anyone inconvenience themselves to do that ?
What went wrong with the world?
We have now - after much work - become a venue for Crossfit Level 1 courses, and one of the people doing the Certificate on the last one moved gym because he liked the facilities. Which is great news.
It is complete madness for us to close off low skilled immigration from the EU only to open it by the back door for (often lower skilled) immigration from the rest of the world. We should not be guilted about this either as these people are crossing from safe countries. Frankly, anyone doing that with children should be prosecuted for child endangerment.
However, I do agree that it can't just be controlled there. It also needs to happen in the Med, the Canaries, the Balearics, and in the Aegean, and the Royal Navy should contribute vessels there too - to also turnaround.
Also, we need to invest in and stabilise source countries, yes, through development aid, and make clear we only take bona-fide refugees direct from the camps.
Introduce a 1:100,000 chance lottery for everyone else (subject to an annual cap) so everyone has a bit of hope.
People will tolerate 50k-80k per annum of the type you describe, so such a green-card system would have to have democratic limits.
I agree with your last paragraph. If I was 20-years old and lived in Eritrea and could raise £10k to try it I'd certainly do it.
What I really love about Root is that he very nearly almost always looks like he's enjoying the game. He might have the cutest ever smile in cricket.
And another wicket as I post.. At least it wasn't Joe!
Not a great performance by India’s bowlers in the last three overs. Far too many no-balls.
Or they might keep giving us no-balls!
Rory Stewart
The disaster in Afghanistan is of a scale that is hard to process. 20 years of foreign policy, ending in this. A total failure.