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The more voters are educated the more likely they are to be negative about Johnson – politicalbettin

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  • Options
    FlatlanderFlatlander Posts: 3,885
    edited July 2021

    eek said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    DougSeal said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    murali_s said:

    Thickos like Johnson, clever people hate Johnson.

    No surprise there as Johnson is a disingenuous racist fat fornicator - i.e. a c*nt!

    I love Johnson

    Dr IshmaelZ MA Oxon MA Exon PhD
    "MA Oxon..." please.
    Why not? If you’re offered a free (or nearly free) upgrade take it.
    Ugh, it's just a fake title. I have one too but I would never put it on my CV.
    1. It winds people up into paroxysms of fury
    2. I feel that having a proper one from a proper university retrospectively validates it
    3. It is a sign of high intelligence, because it says that at 17 you were bright enough to choose a university where you get an M for the price of a B.
    I always felt it devalues a genuine M and those who work hard for a M.
    Oxbridge postgrads on Masters courses used to complain they only got a BSc (so they'd have an MA for their first degree and a BSc for their second, which few people recognised). These days, it is quite hard to get a 3-year bachelor degree, especially in the sciences, as they've gone to 4-year courses for MPhys or MCompSci or whatever. Chemistry at Oxford always was a 4-year course but now for an MChem rather than a BA. One celebrity example that has just popped into my head is Dudley Moore MA BMus, where the BMus is a higher degree and the MA isn't.
    The Oxford DPhil is going out of fashion, I gather, as its holders discover no-one knows what it means, so they put PhD instead.

    Speaking of which, Oxbridge used to, and maybe still does, dish out free PhDs as well, if you'd got one from the other place.
    Most Universities will dish out their PhD if you've got one from elsewhere and start working at a that University.
    The latests Americanism is the granting of the title of "Professor" to anyone doing teaching....
    Ah yes, professors, associate professors and so on. And increasingly these days, much of the teaching is delegated to specialist lecturers.
    Given grade inflation etc, around 2050, everyone at the age of 16 will automatically become Doktor Professor.

    Anyone who thinks I am joking should take a look at the increasing rates of 2:1 and 1st in universities. The day when everyone gets a first is not especially far away.
    Sounds like an interesting Doctoral thesis! Apparently now folk refer to a "good" 1st. Apparently there are now good ones and poorer ones. Perhaps this will evolve into a 1:1 and a 1:2? The good old "Desmond", aka "The Drinkers Degree" will soon be a thing of the past
    Oxford has already reached 95% firsts and upper seconds.
    Yes. I checked these the other day when an ex-professor friend of mine* implied that a first wasn't what it used to be.

    In sciences, 43% got a first! Ridiculous. It used to be 10% or thereabouts.

    And in some humanities subjects, Desmonds were as low as 1%.

    Is this down to students having to pay?


    *he may have had an additional reason to say this as he had an incident with his University when he refused to upgrade some students
  • Options
    DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 24,341
    edited July 2021

    MaxPB said:

    Boris is trash. His speech was bullshit and the pretence that he isn't robbing the south to bribe voters in the north is no longer credible. Honestly, it's time for the toy party to pull the trigger and get rid.

    Dominic Cummings agrees with you. Guess who the ‘Clown Prince of shit pundits’ is.

    https://twitter.com/dominic2306/status/1415633761337757699

    “When even the Clown Prince of shit pundits doesn't know what dictation he's supposed to be taking, you know your slogan, speech & execution are really really bad”
    Hold on. Cummings quotes Hodges quotes Guido. If Boris has lost Guido, what's going on?
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    TazTaz Posts: 11,144
    MaxPB said:

    Boris is trash. His speech was bullshit and the pretence that he isn't robbing the south to bribe voters in the north is no longer credible. Honestly, it's time for the toy party to pull the trigger and get rid.

    Robbing the south 🤡🤡🤡🤡
  • Options
    Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 65,826
    Andy_JS said:

    Levelling up has been tried before in the 1960s, when the government was concerned that the West Midlands was becoming too prosperous compared to the rest of the country. It was a total disaster on that occasion, which ended up making the West Midlands an economic disaster zone 15 years later.

    Which is why Boris quite rightly said that kind of policy isn't the intention. A levelling up as opposed to a levelling down.
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    Nigel_ForemainNigel_Foremain Posts: 13,781
    Watching Johnson yesterday in parliament it occurred to me that his ridiculous hairstyle must be contrived. It has got considerably worse. I can only conclude that some focus group has suggested that some people like their PM to not only behave like a clown but also to look like one, something that Johnson seems to be achieving on both fronts!
  • Options
    SandpitSandpit Posts: 49,881
    eek said:

    Andy_JS said:

    How was BoJo's speech?

    Underwhelming.
    Merely underwhelming - so it exceeded expectations.
    If all the journalists in London follow the @MaxPB line, and describe it as stealing from the south to bribe the north, then it’s probably doing exactly what No.10 intended.
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    FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 76,285

    Watching Johnson yesterday in parliament it occurred to me that his ridiculous hairstyle must be contrived. It has got considerably worse. I can only conclude that some focus group has suggested that some people like their PM to not only behave like a clown but also to look like one, something that Johnson seems to be achieving on both fronts!

    I think its more to do with him balding.
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    Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 32,887
    That narrows down what Boris Johnson means when he says "levelling up".

    For the person who had "A jam spreading operation" in the sweep stake, I'm sorry but you haven't won this time.
    https://twitter.com/Peston/status/1415616642197958656
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    NigelbNigelb Posts: 62,541
    MaxPB said:

    Boris is trash. His speech was bullshit and the pretence that he isn't robbing the south to bribe voters in the north is no longer credible. Honestly, it's time for the toy party to pull the trigger and get rid.

    "The toy party" :smile:
  • Options
    Nigel_ForemainNigel_Foremain Posts: 13,781
    Taz said:

    MaxPB said:

    Boris is trash. His speech was bullshit and the pretence that he isn't robbing the south to bribe voters in the north is no longer credible. Honestly, it's time for the toy party to pull the trigger and get rid.

    Robbing the south 🤡🤡🤡🤡
    Hmmm! It is good to see though that others who are right of centre are catching up on what many of us have known for quite a few years now; Boris Johnson is a joke.
  • Options
    SandpitSandpit Posts: 49,881
    eek said:

    eek said:

    eek said:

    gealbhan said:

    The usual incoherent ramble from Bozo. Good grief.

    I’m surprised minders have let him say no one will be feeling pinch in their pocket next couple of years.

    In the years leading up to next election people are going to feel pinch in the housekeeping pot, why make big promise they won’t be?
    Boris has just told you the next election is in May 2023 - did you not pick that up.
    What makes you say that?

    July or August 2023 makes much more sense since the new boundaries will be in place by then.
    The fact people won't be feeling poorer due to rises. If the new boundaries are in July 2023 then it's going to be October 2023 - the one thing we do know is that Boris (or any other leader) won't risk waiting until May 2024.
    What makes you think people will be feeling poorer in 2024?

    We seem well set now for an economic boom and a good few years of wages rising and full employment.
    I don't - but you don't leave an election to the last second because "events, dear boy, events".
    The two recent examples of waiting are 1997 and 2010. Which should be enough said.
  • Options
    TazTaz Posts: 11,144

    Taz said:

    MaxPB said:

    Boris is trash. His speech was bullshit and the pretence that he isn't robbing the south to bribe voters in the north is no longer credible. Honestly, it's time for the toy party to pull the trigger and get rid.

    Robbing the south 🤡🤡🤡🤡
    Hmmm! It is good to see though that others who are right of centre are catching up on what many of us have known for quite a few years now; Boris Johnson is a joke.
    Lol,

    The idea he is robbing the south is for the birds. It’s crazy. Not surprised you buy into it.
  • Options
    Nigel_ForemainNigel_Foremain Posts: 13,781

    MaxPB said:

    Boris is trash. His speech was bullshit and the pretence that he isn't robbing the south to bribe voters in the north is no longer credible. Honestly, it's time for the toy party to pull the trigger and get rid.

    The question is will the Tory party have the courage to pull the plug on somebody who won a big election victory, or keep telling themselves but but he wins elections until he doesn't.....a bit like waiting too long to lockdown for COVID, they keep telling themselves but cases are still low.
    No they won't. It is like a company that has hired a dud having been convinced at interview that he/she is the real deal. They just don't want to accept their mistake, so they just keep asserting that he was great at interview as though that was all that counted.
  • Options
    NigelbNigelb Posts: 62,541
    Posted a link to this Atlantic article yesterday, but worth reposting.

    What it's like to live through a modern genocide. Right now, in our own time, not in history books, not in a movie.
    https://twitter.com/anneapplebaum/status/1415427928171634688
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    gealbhangealbhan Posts: 2,362

    Dominos in Japan have created a fish and chips pizza and I have to say I'm intrigued.

    https://www.leeds-live.co.uk/best-in-leeds/whats-on-news/dominos-defends-insulting-pizza-topping-21050354

    That looks epic
    Is that slices of lemon?
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    Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 65,826
    Sandpit said:

    eek said:

    eek said:

    eek said:

    gealbhan said:

    The usual incoherent ramble from Bozo. Good grief.

    I’m surprised minders have let him say no one will be feeling pinch in their pocket next couple of years.

    In the years leading up to next election people are going to feel pinch in the housekeeping pot, why make big promise they won’t be?
    Boris has just told you the next election is in May 2023 - did you not pick that up.
    What makes you say that?

    July or August 2023 makes much more sense since the new boundaries will be in place by then.
    The fact people won't be feeling poorer due to rises. If the new boundaries are in July 2023 then it's going to be October 2023 - the one thing we do know is that Boris (or any other leader) won't risk waiting until May 2024.
    What makes you think people will be feeling poorer in 2024?

    We seem well set now for an economic boom and a good few years of wages rising and full employment.
    I don't - but you don't leave an election to the last second because "events, dear boy, events".
    The two recent examples of waiting are 1997 and 2010. Which should be enough said.
    There's also 2015 which worked OK for the PM, but not for his coalition allies.
  • Options
    Nigel_ForemainNigel_Foremain Posts: 13,781
    Taz said:

    Taz said:

    MaxPB said:

    Boris is trash. His speech was bullshit and the pretence that he isn't robbing the south to bribe voters in the north is no longer credible. Honestly, it's time for the toy party to pull the trigger and get rid.

    Robbing the south 🤡🤡🤡🤡
    Hmmm! It is good to see though that others who are right of centre are catching up on what many of us have known for quite a few years now; Boris Johnson is a joke.
    Lol,

    The idea he is robbing the south is for the birds. It’s crazy. Not surprised you buy into it.
    I didn't, so the lols are on you. That is why I said "Hmmm!". My comment related to the realisation on behalf of @MaxPB that Boris Johnson is trash.

    Try and keep up!
  • Options
    Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 65,826

    Taz said:

    MaxPB said:

    Boris is trash. His speech was bullshit and the pretence that he isn't robbing the south to bribe voters in the north is no longer credible. Honestly, it's time for the toy party to pull the trigger and get rid.

    Robbing the south 🤡🤡🤡🤡
    Hmmm! It is good to see though that others who are right of centre are catching up on what many of us have known for quite a few years now; Boris Johnson is a joke.
    I'd rather a good joke than an authoritarian xenophobe like he replaced.
  • Options
    Nigel_ForemainNigel_Foremain Posts: 13,781

    Watching Johnson yesterday in parliament it occurred to me that his ridiculous hairstyle must be contrived. It has got considerably worse. I can only conclude that some focus group has suggested that some people like their PM to not only behave like a clown but also to look like one, something that Johnson seems to be achieving on both fronts!

    I think its more to do with him balding.
    Blimey if he goes bald on top and keeps the hair at the sides he will look even more like his namesake! https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bozo_the_Clown#/media/File:Bob_bell_bozo_roy_brown_cooky_1976.JPG
  • Options
    MaxPB said:

    Boris is trash. His speech was bullshit and the pretence that he isn't robbing the south to bribe voters in the north is no longer credible. Honestly, it's time for the toy party to pull the trigger and get rid.

    Max, I find myself agreeing with you once again, are we more politically aligned than I thought?
  • Options
    TazTaz Posts: 11,144

    Taz said:

    Taz said:

    MaxPB said:

    Boris is trash. His speech was bullshit and the pretence that he isn't robbing the south to bribe voters in the north is no longer credible. Honestly, it's time for the toy party to pull the trigger and get rid.

    Robbing the south 🤡🤡🤡🤡
    Hmmm! It is good to see though that others who are right of centre are catching up on what many of us have known for quite a few years now; Boris Johnson is a joke.
    Lol,

    The idea he is robbing the south is for the birds. It’s crazy. Not surprised you buy into it.
    I didn't, so the lols are on you. That is why I said "Hmmm!". My comment related to the realisation on behalf of @MaxPB that Boris Johnson is trash.

    Try and keep up!
    Ah, that’s good.

    Bless.

    👍
  • Options
    NigelbNigelb Posts: 62,541

    Taz said:

    MaxPB said:

    Boris is trash. His speech was bullshit and the pretence that he isn't robbing the south to bribe voters in the north is no longer credible. Honestly, it's time for the toy party to pull the trigger and get rid.

    Robbing the south 🤡🤡🤡🤡
    Hmmm! It is good to see though that others who are right of centre are catching up on what many of us have known for quite a few years now; Boris Johnson is a joke.
    I'd rather a good joke than an authoritarian xenophobe like he replaced.
    Bad joke, though.
  • Options
    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 116,983
    edited July 2021
    MaxPB said:

    Boris is trash. His speech was bullshit and the pretence that he isn't robbing the south to bribe voters in the north is no longer credible. Honestly, it's time for the toy party to pull the trigger and get rid.

    Rubbish, the main reason the Tories have a majority of 80 and seats in white working class former Labour heartlands in the North and Midlands is down to Boris.

    Anyway, even if the Tories saw a 10% swing to the LDs in the South in 2023/24 the LDs would still only pick up about 25 seats, which would still give a narrow Tory majority of 30 if Boris held the Red Wall.

    Boris is the most successful Tory election winner since Thatcher and when they got rid of her it did not end well. The Tories then proceeded to lose 3 out of the next 4 general elections and even when they returned to power in 2010 it was without a majority
  • Options
    contrariancontrarian Posts: 5,818

    MaxPB said:

    Boris is trash. His speech was bullshit and the pretence that he isn't robbing the south to bribe voters in the north is no longer credible. Honestly, it's time for the toy party to pull the trigger and get rid.

    Max, I find myself agreeing with you once again, are we more politically aligned than I thought?
    I am also in complete agreement with Max.

    This is getting weird.
  • Options
    Nigel_ForemainNigel_Foremain Posts: 13,781

    Taz said:

    MaxPB said:

    Boris is trash. His speech was bullshit and the pretence that he isn't robbing the south to bribe voters in the north is no longer credible. Honestly, it's time for the toy party to pull the trigger and get rid.

    Robbing the south 🤡🤡🤡🤡
    Hmmm! It is good to see though that others who are right of centre are catching up on what many of us have known for quite a few years now; Boris Johnson is a joke.
    I'd rather a good joke than an authoritarian xenophobe like he replaced.
    I think you are suffering from a condition known as psychological projection. Or it could just be misogyny perhaps?
    Mrs May wasn't very good, but she was/is neither of those things.
  • Options
    GallowgateGallowgate Posts: 19,078

    eek said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    DougSeal said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    murali_s said:

    Thickos like Johnson, clever people hate Johnson.

    No surprise there as Johnson is a disingenuous racist fat fornicator - i.e. a c*nt!

    I love Johnson

    Dr IshmaelZ MA Oxon MA Exon PhD
    "MA Oxon..." please.
    Why not? If you’re offered a free (or nearly free) upgrade take it.
    Ugh, it's just a fake title. I have one too but I would never put it on my CV.
    1. It winds people up into paroxysms of fury
    2. I feel that having a proper one from a proper university retrospectively validates it
    3. It is a sign of high intelligence, because it says that at 17 you were bright enough to choose a university where you get an M for the price of a B.
    I always felt it devalues a genuine M and those who work hard for a M.
    Oxbridge postgrads on Masters courses used to complain they only got a BSc (so they'd have an MA for their first degree and a BSc for their second, which few people recognised). These days, it is quite hard to get a 3-year bachelor degree, especially in the sciences, as they've gone to 4-year courses for MPhys or MCompSci or whatever. Chemistry at Oxford always was a 4-year course but now for an MChem rather than a BA. One celebrity example that has just popped into my head is Dudley Moore MA BMus, where the BMus is a higher degree and the MA isn't.
    The Oxford DPhil is going out of fashion, I gather, as its holders discover no-one knows what it means, so they put PhD instead.

    Speaking of which, Oxbridge used to, and maybe still does, dish out free PhDs as well, if you'd got one from the other place.
    Most Universities will dish out their PhD if you've got one from elsewhere and start working at a that University.
    The latests Americanism is the granting of the title of "Professor" to anyone doing teaching....
    Ah yes, professors, associate professors and so on. And increasingly these days, much of the teaching is delegated to specialist lecturers.
    Given grade inflation etc, around 2050, everyone at the age of 16 will automatically become Doktor Professor.

    Anyone who thinks I am joking should take a look at the increasing rates of 2:1 and 1st in universities. The day when everyone gets a first is not especially far away.
    Sounds like an interesting Doctoral thesis! Apparently now folk refer to a "good" 1st. Apparently there are now good ones and poorer ones. Perhaps this will evolve into a 1:1 and a 1:2? The good old "Desmond", aka "The Drinkers Degree" will soon be a thing of the past
    Oxford has already reached 95% firsts and upper seconds.
    Surely you’d expect that as they take the best of the best, in theory.
  • Options
    StuartinromfordStuartinromford Posts: 14,417
    Sandpit said:

    eek said:

    eek said:

    eek said:

    gealbhan said:

    The usual incoherent ramble from Bozo. Good grief.

    I’m surprised minders have let him say no one will be feeling pinch in their pocket next couple of years.

    In the years leading up to next election people are going to feel pinch in the housekeeping pot, why make big promise they won’t be?
    Boris has just told you the next election is in May 2023 - did you not pick that up.
    What makes you say that?

    July or August 2023 makes much more sense since the new boundaries will be in place by then.
    The fact people won't be feeling poorer due to rises. If the new boundaries are in July 2023 then it's going to be October 2023 - the one thing we do know is that Boris (or any other leader) won't risk waiting until May 2024.
    What makes you think people will be feeling poorer in 2024?

    We seem well set now for an economic boom and a good few years of wages rising and full employment.
    I don't - but you don't leave an election to the last second because "events, dear boy, events".
    The two recent examples of waiting are 1997 and 2010. Which should be enough said.
    Isn't that mixing cause and effect, though?
    Without fixed term parliaments, you don't go before year 4 (cut and run, makes people suspicious), but then you go as soon as you're reasonably confident of winning.

    The reason that Major and Brown played it long was that they weren't confident of winning, so they had to wait and see if anything turned up. Which it didn't.
  • Options
    Nigel_ForemainNigel_Foremain Posts: 13,781
    HYUFD said:

    MaxPB said:

    Boris is trash. His speech was bullshit and the pretence that he isn't robbing the south to bribe voters in the north is no longer credible. Honestly, it's time for the toy party to pull the trigger and get rid.

    Rubbish, the main reason the Tories have a majority of 80 and seats in white working class former Labour heartlands in the North and Midlands is down to Boris.

    Anyway, even if the Tories saw a 10% swing to the LDs in the South in 2023/24 the LDs would still only pick up about 25 seats, which would still give a narrow Tory majority of 30 if Boris held the Red Wall.

    Boris is the most successful Tory election winner since Thatcher and when they got rid of her it did not end well. The Tories then proceeded to lose 3 out of the next 4 general elections and even when they returned to power in 2010 it was without a majority
    See my comment on interviews below. The fact that he won elections does not necessarily make him fit for office. It is a massive weakness of our democratic system, though it has rarely been a problem in the past. The fact that he emphatically won a beauty contest against an even uglier opponent does not make him fit to be CEO.
  • Options
    Richard_NabaviRichard_Nabavi Posts: 30,820
    MaxPB said:

    Boris is trash. His speech was bullshit and the pretence that he isn't robbing the south to bribe voters in the north is no longer credible. Honestly, it's time for the toy party to pull the trigger and get rid.

    He's not even proposing to rob the south to bribe voters in the north. At least that would be a policy with some content. Instead the whole thing is hot air from beginning to end. He hasn't the faintest idea what 'levelling up' is supposed to be or how he might achieve it.
  • Options
    Nigel_ForemainNigel_Foremain Posts: 13,781

    MaxPB said:

    Boris is trash. His speech was bullshit and the pretence that he isn't robbing the south to bribe voters in the north is no longer credible. Honestly, it's time for the toy party to pull the trigger and get rid.

    He's not even proposing to rob the south to bribe voters in the north. At least that would be a policy with some content. Instead the whole thing is hot air from beginning to end. He hasn't the faintest idea what 'levelling up' is supposed to be or how he might achieve it.
    The back of the fag packet wasnt big enough.
  • Options
    Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 65,826

    Taz said:

    MaxPB said:

    Boris is trash. His speech was bullshit and the pretence that he isn't robbing the south to bribe voters in the north is no longer credible. Honestly, it's time for the toy party to pull the trigger and get rid.

    Robbing the south 🤡🤡🤡🤡
    Hmmm! It is good to see though that others who are right of centre are catching up on what many of us have known for quite a few years now; Boris Johnson is a joke.
    I'd rather a good joke than an authoritarian xenophobe like he replaced.
    I think you are suffering from a condition known as psychological projection. Or it could just be misogyny perhaps?
    Mrs May wasn't very good, but she was/is neither of those things.
    PMSL.

    Mrs May wasn't authoritarian? Or xenophobic?

    The Home Secretary who presided over the Hostile Environment policy for years and chose to send GO HOME vans into ethnic minority areas had not a hint of authoritarianism or xenophobia to you? 😂😂😂

    If you can't see anything authoritarian or xenophobic in any of that then you're just as bad as Farage. Thank goodness she's not PM and he's not an MEP anymore.
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    Ah, but the reason why that has changed is nothing to do with the US ... and everything to with house price inflation.

    If you are a lecturer in a leafy University town, you won't be able to afford to buy a house on a lecturer's salary.

    So, the University has to promote you to a Professor quickly ... otherwise you will just leave and do something else.

    Hence, you end up with Departments that are 100 per cent Professors.

    In fact, in some leafy University towns, the new Professors still can't afford a house (though the older ones bought their houses 20 years ago and are sitting on massive gains)

    This is misleading. There are 2 things that have changed in the past 20 years.

    Firstly, UK universities have all embraced "personal chairs" (i.e. Professor as the highest rank/grade) rather than having a rationed number of named/endowed chairs. Many eminent scholars had ended their careers as Reader (the highest non-rationed rank) because the professor in the named chair for their field did not die before they retired. So, there are more "full professors" (i.e. rank of Professor) than before. I think this change was pretty much completed by the turn of the millennium, though I guess more people have become eligible for personal chairs (and it is likely the career stage is closer now to readerships in the "old" UK system).

    Secondly, and separately, some UK universities have embraced American-style job titles. Hence, a lecturer or senior lecturer in old money is now Assistant Professor or Associate Professor. I've never met an academic who likes this change, but it is said to be something scientists wanted as they were upset when Americans thought they were "untenured" at conferences. The American-style titles are unhelpful, as assistant denies the fact that lecturers are researchers and course leaders in their own right; while Associate makes it sound like a deputy or affiliated staffer to a professor. But the Assistant and Associate Professors are paid at the same grade as under old titles: So not very relevant to house prices and salaries.
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    Nigel_ForemainNigel_Foremain Posts: 13,781

    Taz said:

    MaxPB said:

    Boris is trash. His speech was bullshit and the pretence that he isn't robbing the south to bribe voters in the north is no longer credible. Honestly, it's time for the toy party to pull the trigger and get rid.

    Robbing the south 🤡🤡🤡🤡
    Hmmm! It is good to see though that others who are right of centre are catching up on what many of us have known for quite a few years now; Boris Johnson is a joke.
    I'd rather a good joke than an authoritarian xenophobe like he replaced.
    I think you are suffering from a condition known as psychological projection. Or it could just be misogyny perhaps?
    Mrs May wasn't very good, but she was/is neither of those things.
    PMSL.

    Mrs May wasn't authoritarian? Or xenophobic?

    The Home Secretary who presided over the Hostile Environment policy for years and chose to send GO HOME vans into ethnic minority areas had not a hint of authoritarianism or xenophobia to you? 😂😂😂

    If you can't see anything authoritarian or xenophobic in any of that then you're just as bad as Farage. Thank goodness she's not PM and he's not an MEP anymore.
    Philip, I know your are desperately trying to reposition yourself away from the right wing nutjob that we all know you actually are, but it really isn't kidding anyone, we remember a lot of your silly posts that make Farage look like a man of restraint and reason. You might want to do a SeanT if you want to reinvent yourself, and set up a new account.
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    ChelyabinskChelyabinsk Posts: 488
    edited July 2021

    Given grade inflation etc, around 2050, everyone at the age of 16 will automatically become Doktor Professor.

    Anyone who thinks I am joking should take a look at the increasing rates of 2:1 and 1st in universities. The day when everyone gets a first is not especially far away.

    Sounds like an interesting Doctoral thesis! Apparently now folk refer to a "good" 1st. Apparently there are now good ones and poorer ones. Perhaps this will evolve into a 1:1 and a 1:2? The good old "Desmond", aka "The Drinkers Degree" will soon be a thing of the past
    Oxford has already reached 95% firsts and upper seconds.
    Yes. I checked these the other day when an ex-professor friend of mine* implied that a first wasn't what it used to be.

    In sciences, 43% got a first! Ridiculous. It used to be 10% or thereabouts.

    And in some humanities subjects, Desmonds were as low as 1%.

    Is this down to students having to pay?

    'The regression results imply that a student with a (hypothetical) SAT score of 0 can expect a 1.19 units lower grade from a Republican professor than from a Democratic one, while for a student with a SAT score of 700 (the lowest score in the sample) the difference is 0.54 grade units. In contrast, a student with a perfect SAT score of 1,600 can expect a 0.30 units higher grade from a Republican professor than from a Democratic one.' (Talia Bar and Asaf Zussman, 'Partisan Grading,' American Economic Journal: Applied Economics vol. 4 no. 1 (2012), p.39)

    So assuming right and left wingers have the same proclivities in the UK as in the US, if universities were increasingly staffed with people on the left wing of politics then you'd expect to see steady grade inflation at the bottom and a smaller flattening out of the very top grades. However, as it's been conclusively proven on this thread that increasingly left-wing university faculties are just a figment of the imagination, such a phenomenon can't possibly be contributing to grade inflation...
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    SouthamObserverSouthamObserver Posts: 38,925
    It's almost as if our famously bone idle, mendacious, grifting Prime Minister is winging the whole levelling-up thing, isn't it?
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    noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 20,732

    MaxPB said:

    Boris is trash. His speech was bullshit and the pretence that he isn't robbing the south to bribe voters in the north is no longer credible. Honestly, it's time for the toy party to pull the trigger and get rid.

    He's not even proposing to rob the south to bribe voters in the north. At least that would be a policy with some content. Instead the whole thing is hot air from beginning to end. He hasn't the faintest idea what 'levelling up' is supposed to be or how he might achieve it.
    Angela Rayner is spot on with the observation that he has "no plan for the future of our country other than pitching people and towns against each other". Thats it. Levelling up is a mix of virtue signalling, creating a them vs us division and a reward for those who bend the knee for Dear Leader.
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    gealbhangealbhan Posts: 2,362
    eek said:

    eek said:

    eek said:

    gealbhan said:

    The usual incoherent ramble from Bozo. Good grief.

    I’m surprised minders have let him say no one will be feeling pinch in their pocket next couple of years.

    In the years leading up to next election people are going to feel pinch in the housekeeping pot, why make big promise they won’t be?
    Boris has just told you the next election is in May 2023 - did you not pick that up.
    What makes you say that?

    July or August 2023 makes much more sense since the new boundaries will be in place by then.
    The fact people won't be feeling poorer due to rises. If the new boundaries are in July 2023 then it's going to be October 2023 - the one thing we do know is that Boris (or any other leader) won't risk waiting until May 2024.
    What makes you think people will be feeling poorer in 2024?

    We seem well set now for an economic boom and a good few years of wages rising and full employment.
    I don't - but you don't leave an election to the last second because "events, dear boy, events".
    So neither of you think it’s a tricky economic period? You don’t think we are all going to be hit in our pockets very soon now?

    The whole world economy’s had an economic shock. UK economy is rewriting itself post Brexit. Green taxes were always coming in this period that alone hits our pocket, Covid debt repayment is coming at same time, especially if inflation leaps meaning the debt cost rises.

    Add to government take increasing, cuts, as government draws back spend. That quite likely means job losses. Inflation means things we pay for cost more, particularly things you can’t say no to, food, energy.

    Nor has globalisation gone away with exit from EU. Neither has balancing economy and society from industrial to post industrial. And the rise of automation.

    Difficult couple of years ahead for a government promising sun lit uplands, levelling up for everyone and no pinch in any pocket.
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    MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 44,362
    Taz said:

    This whole idea that the affluent south is being robbed and money lavished on the north is an extension of the small minded NIMBYism which saw the Lib Dem’s home in the Chesham and Amersham by election.

    You only have to see from investment in transport and infrastructure in the past that the south and London has been disproportionately funded while other regions had scraps off the table.

    It is about time the regions had some proper investment.

    One sensible thing was ending the use of the economic return calculation - which meant that the more the London economy over heated, relative to the rest of the UK, the more the apparent return from investing in the South East...
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    FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 76,285
    edited July 2021
    gealbhan said:

    eek said:

    eek said:

    eek said:

    gealbhan said:

    The usual incoherent ramble from Bozo. Good grief.

    I’m surprised minders have let him say no one will be feeling pinch in their pocket next couple of years.

    In the years leading up to next election people are going to feel pinch in the housekeeping pot, why make big promise they won’t be?
    Boris has just told you the next election is in May 2023 - did you not pick that up.
    What makes you say that?

    July or August 2023 makes much more sense since the new boundaries will be in place by then.
    The fact people won't be feeling poorer due to rises. If the new boundaries are in July 2023 then it's going to be October 2023 - the one thing we do know is that Boris (or any other leader) won't risk waiting until May 2024.
    What makes you think people will be feeling poorer in 2024?

    We seem well set now for an economic boom and a good few years of wages rising and full employment.
    I don't - but you don't leave an election to the last second because "events, dear boy, events".
    So neither of you think it’s a tricky economic period? You don’t think we are all going to be hit in our pockets very soon now?

    The whole world economy’s had an economic shock. UK economy is rewriting itself post Brexit. Green taxes were always coming in this period that alone hits our pocket, Covid debt repayment is coming at same time, especially if inflation leaps meaning the debt cost rises.

    Add to government take increasing, cuts, as government draws back spend. That quite likely means job losses. Inflation means things we pay for cost more, particularly things you can’t say no to, food, energy.

    Nor has globalisation gone away with exit from EU. Neither has balancing economy and society from industrial to post industrial. And the rise of automation.

    Difficult couple of years ahead for a government promising sun lit uplands, levelling up for everyone and no pinch in any pocket.
    That presumes this conservative government acts likes a traditional conservative government.

    The US have said they don't think inflation is going to be a problem, treat covid as a one off, going to borrow big and continue to do so, worry about it all in 10-15 years. Interests rates are low, good time to make big investment in state backed transition to green tech, infrastructure building etc etc etc.

    Now the above statement concerns me, but that is their stated position, as saying inflation isn't a problem is rather Brown I've abolished boom and bust. Who says this current government doesn't follow the same path. I mean who would have thought a conservative government would have done half the times they have in the past 2 years.
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    Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 65,826

    Taz said:

    MaxPB said:

    Boris is trash. His speech was bullshit and the pretence that he isn't robbing the south to bribe voters in the north is no longer credible. Honestly, it's time for the toy party to pull the trigger and get rid.

    Robbing the south 🤡🤡🤡🤡
    Hmmm! It is good to see though that others who are right of centre are catching up on what many of us have known for quite a few years now; Boris Johnson is a joke.
    I'd rather a good joke than an authoritarian xenophobe like he replaced.
    I think you are suffering from a condition known as psychological projection. Or it could just be misogyny perhaps?
    Mrs May wasn't very good, but she was/is neither of those things.
    PMSL.

    Mrs May wasn't authoritarian? Or xenophobic?

    The Home Secretary who presided over the Hostile Environment policy for years and chose to send GO HOME vans into ethnic minority areas had not a hint of authoritarianism or xenophobia to you? 😂😂😂

    If you can't see anything authoritarian or xenophobic in any of that then you're just as bad as Farage. Thank goodness she's not PM and he's not an MEP anymore.
    Philip, I know your are desperately trying to reposition yourself away from the right wing nutjob that we all know you actually are, but it really isn't kidding anyone, we remember a lot of your silly posts that make Farage look like a man of restraint and reason. You might want to do a SeanT if you want to reinvent yourself, and set up a new account.
    I am economically right wing yes but I have always been socially liberal and opposed to racism. That's why I am one of the few right wingers who has been in favour of BLM and was in favour of pulling down Colson's statue.

    I saw May's xenophobia, her speech to Conference in 2015 disgusted me while I was sat in the audience, I saw her creating the Hostile Environment so I quit the party due to her xenophobia when she was in charge.

    You saw her Hostile Environment and thought "great lets have more of that".

    That you don't see any xenophobia in the hostile environment that she presided over speaks wonders.
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    Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 60,976
    Mr. Above, the division began with BLM. The right may react to the culture war but it isn't the right that's started referring to mothers as 'birthing people', or have been tearing down statues.
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    sladeslade Posts: 1,930
    Andy_JS said:

    slade said:

    Did anyone watch the England v. India T20 last night? Must say I was impressed by the batting, especially Wyatt and Mandhana. The bowling- not so much.

    What channel was it on? I would have liked to watch it.
    Surprisingly - BBC2
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    GallowgateGallowgate Posts: 19,078
    edited July 2021

    Mr. Above, the division began with BLM. The right may react to the culture war but it isn't the right that's started referring to mothers as 'birthing people', or have been tearing down statues.

    Nobody refers to mothers as “birthing people” ffs.

    What a ridiculous post. Pure reactionary “reds under the bed” nonsense.
  • Options

    Mr. Above, the division began with BLM. The right may react to the culture war but it isn't the right that's started referring to mothers as 'birthing people', or have been tearing down statues.

    No the right vandalise murals of black football players instead
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    TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 41,282
    HYUFD said:

    MaxPB said:

    Boris is trash. His speech was bullshit and the pretence that he isn't robbing the south to bribe voters in the north is no longer credible. Honestly, it's time for the toy party to pull the trigger and get rid.

    Rubbish, the main reason the Tories have a majority of 80 and seats in white working class former Labour heartlands in the North and Midlands is down to Boris.

    Anyway, even if the Tories saw a 10% swing to the LDs in the South in 2023/24 the LDs would still only pick up about 25 seats, which would still give a narrow Tory majority of 30 if Boris held the Red Wall.

    Boris is the most successful Tory election winner since Thatcher and when they got rid of her it did not end well. The Tories then proceeded to lose 3 out of the next 4 general elections and even when they returned to power in 2010 it was without a majority
    Careful now, tiger - dismissing me yesterday and @MaxPB today (both of whom, I'm guessing, voted Cons in 2019) is making your "who cares" work even harder.

    What would Oscar say in such a situation...
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    Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 65,826

    Mr. Above, the division began with BLM. The right may react to the culture war but it isn't the right that's started referring to mothers as 'birthing people', or have been tearing down statues.

    That you don't think there were any divisions before BLM is kind of the issue.

    Maybe you should stop for a second and listen to what BLM have to say. They didn't just spark in a vacuum.
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    noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 20,732

    Mr. Above, the division began with BLM. The right may react to the culture war but it isn't the right that's started referring to mothers as 'birthing people', or have been tearing down statues.

    Nobody refers to mothers “birthing people” ffs.

    What a ridiculous post.
    Come on you non birthing person, lets just admit this is how we would speak to each other if the right didnt watch over our language! Its a fair cop!
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    Not sure Johnson's "levelling up" speech was worth cancelling the England team reception for (the reason Number 19 ludicrously gave). Utterly vacuous shite.
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    GallowgateGallowgate Posts: 19,078

    Mr. Above, the division began with BLM. The right may react to the culture war but it isn't the right that's started referring to mothers as 'birthing people', or have been tearing down statues.

    Nobody refers to mothers “birthing people” ffs.

    What a ridiculous post.
    Come on you non birthing person, lets just admit this is how we would speak to each other if the right didnt watch over our language! Its a fair cop!
    I think you mean: “it’s a fair defunded community support officer”
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    CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 39,674
    gealbhan said:

    eek said:

    eek said:

    eek said:

    gealbhan said:

    The usual incoherent ramble from Bozo. Good grief.

    I’m surprised minders have let him say no one will be feeling pinch in their pocket next couple of years.

    In the years leading up to next election people are going to feel pinch in the housekeeping pot, why make big promise they won’t be?
    Boris has just told you the next election is in May 2023 - did you not pick that up.
    What makes you say that?

    July or August 2023 makes much more sense since the new boundaries will be in place by then.
    The fact people won't be feeling poorer due to rises. If the new boundaries are in July 2023 then it's going to be October 2023 - the one thing we do know is that Boris (or any other leader) won't risk waiting until May 2024.
    What makes you think people will be feeling poorer in 2024?

    We seem well set now for an economic boom and a good few years of wages rising and full employment.
    I don't - but you don't leave an election to the last second because "events, dear boy, events".
    So neither of you think it’s a tricky economic period? You don’t think we are all going to be hit in our pockets very soon now?

    The whole world economy’s had an economic shock. UK economy is rewriting itself post Brexit. Green taxes were always coming in this period that alone hits our pocket, Covid debt repayment is coming at same time, especially if inflation leaps meaning the debt cost rises.

    Add to government take increasing, cuts, as government draws back spend. That quite likely means job losses. Inflation means things we pay for cost more, particularly things you can’t say no to, food, energy.

    Nor has globalisation gone away with exit from EU. Neither has balancing economy and society from industrial to post industrial. And the rise of automation.

    Difficult couple of years ahead for a government promising sun lit uplands, levelling up for everyone and no pinch in any pocket.

    It's almost as if our famously bone idle, mendacious, grifting Prime Minister is winging the whole levelling-up thing, isn't it?

    Is Mr Johnson thinking he won't have to do the hard work of clearing up after the Bullingdon dinner-level economic mess? Maybe heading off into the sunset soon?
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    CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 39,674

    Not sure Johnson's "levelling up" speech was worth cancelling the England team reception for (the reason Number 19 ludicrously gave). Utterly vacuous shite.

    Does No 19 have some occult meaning, perchance?

    But otherwise quite so.
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    Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 60,976
    Mr. Gate and Mr. Above, https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/antenatal-guru-milli-hill-dropped-by-charity-after-insisting-its-women-not-birthing-people-ncl88m8gx

    Mr. Battery, I oppose destruction and damage to property.

    Mr. Thompson, the division, the argument we're having now is about whether aping BLM, which until recently organisations were just delighted to loudly and proudly endorse, is a sensible move. You can oppose racism and still think the kneeling nonsense is a daft distraction at best.
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    Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 26,566
    slade said:

    Andy_JS said:

    slade said:

    Did anyone watch the England v. India T20 last night? Must say I was impressed by the batting, especially Wyatt and Mandhana. The bowling- not so much.

    What channel was it on? I would have liked to watch it.
    Surprisingly - BBC2
    Thanks.
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    eekeek Posts: 24,964
    gealbhan said:

    eek said:

    eek said:

    eek said:

    gealbhan said:

    The usual incoherent ramble from Bozo. Good grief.

    I’m surprised minders have let him say no one will be feeling pinch in their pocket next couple of years.

    In the years leading up to next election people are going to feel pinch in the housekeeping pot, why make big promise they won’t be?
    Boris has just told you the next election is in May 2023 - did you not pick that up.
    What makes you say that?

    July or August 2023 makes much more sense since the new boundaries will be in place by then.
    The fact people won't be feeling poorer due to rises. If the new boundaries are in July 2023 then it's going to be October 2023 - the one thing we do know is that Boris (or any other leader) won't risk waiting until May 2024.
    What makes you think people will be feeling poorer in 2024?

    We seem well set now for an economic boom and a good few years of wages rising and full employment.
    I don't - but you don't leave an election to the last second because "events, dear boy, events".
    So neither of you think it’s a tricky economic period? You don’t think we are all going to be hit in our pockets very soon now?

    The whole world economy’s had an economic shock. UK economy is rewriting itself post Brexit. Green taxes were always coming in this period that alone hits our pocket, Covid debt repayment is coming at same time, especially if inflation leaps meaning the debt cost rises.

    Add to government take increasing, cuts, as government draws back spend. That quite likely means job losses. Inflation means things we pay for cost more, particularly things you can’t say no to, food, energy.

    Nor has globalisation gone away with exit from EU. Neither has balancing economy and society from industrial to post industrial. And the rise of automation.

    Difficult couple of years ahead for a government promising sun lit uplands, levelling up for everyone and no pinch in any pocket.
    The election has to be before May 2024 - so you can't delay things for ever.

    And it takes a long time for any feel good factor to return as the economy picks up so you probably want an election asap. You then look at the benefits from the boundary changes and its clear that Boris will want to wait for that so you are talking about October 23...
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    CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 39,674

    HYUFD said:

    MaxPB said:

    Boris is trash. His speech was bullshit and the pretence that he isn't robbing the south to bribe voters in the north is no longer credible. Honestly, it's time for the toy party to pull the trigger and get rid.

    Rubbish, the main reason the Tories have a majority of 80 and seats in white working class former Labour heartlands in the North and Midlands is down to Boris.

    Anyway, even if the Tories saw a 10% swing to the LDs in the South in 2023/24 the LDs would still only pick up about 25 seats, which would still give a narrow Tory majority of 30 if Boris held the Red Wall.

    Boris is the most successful Tory election winner since Thatcher and when they got rid of her it did not end well. The Tories then proceeded to lose 3 out of the next 4 general elections and even when they returned to power in 2010 it was without a majority
    See my comment on interviews below. The fact that he won elections does not necessarily make him fit for office. It is a massive weakness of our democratic system, though it has rarely been a problem in the past. The fact that he emphatically won a beauty contest against an even uglier opponent does not make him fit to be CEO.
    THat's a bit unfair on Messrs Gove and Stewart.
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    Alphabet_SoupAlphabet_Soup Posts: 2,744


    Ah, but the reason why that has changed is nothing to do with the US ... and everything to with house price inflation.

    If you are a lecturer in a leafy University town, you won't be able to afford to buy a house on a lecturer's salary.

    So, the University has to promote you to a Professor quickly ... otherwise you will just leave and do something else.

    Hence, you end up with Departments that are 100 per cent Professors.

    In fact, in some leafy University towns, the new Professors still can't afford a house (though the older ones bought their houses 20 years ago and are sitting on massive gains)

    This is misleading. There are 2 things that have changed in the past 20 years.

    Firstly, UK universities have all embraced "personal chairs" (i.e. Professor as the highest rank/grade) rather than having a rationed number of named/endowed chairs. Many eminent scholars had ended their careers as Reader (the highest non-rationed rank) because the professor in the named chair for their field did not die before they retired. So, there are more "full professors" (i.e. rank of Professor) than before. I think this change was pretty much completed by the turn of the millennium, though I guess more people have become eligible for personal chairs (and it is likely the career stage is closer now to readerships in the "old" UK system).

    Secondly, and separately, some UK universities have embraced American-style job titles. Hence, a lecturer or senior lecturer in old money is now Assistant Professor or Associate Professor. I've never met an academic who likes this change, but it is said to be something scientists wanted as they were upset when Americans thought they were "untenured" at conferences. The American-style titles are unhelpful, as assistant denies the fact that lecturers are researchers and course leaders in their own right; while Associate makes it sound like a deputy or affiliated staffer to a professor. But the Assistant and Associate Professors are paid at the same grade as under old titles: So not very relevant to house prices and salaries.
    My observation as a faculty husband is that most staff "lecture", a few can only "read" and others merely "profess". Why the pay scale runs upwards rather than downwards has always been a mystery.
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    Mr. Gate and Mr. Above, https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/antenatal-guru-milli-hill-dropped-by-charity-after-insisting-its-women-not-birthing-people-ncl88m8gx

    Mr. Battery, I oppose destruction and damage to property.

    Mr. Thompson, the division, the argument we're having now is about whether aping BLM, which until recently organisations were just delighted to loudly and proudly endorse, is a sensible move. You can oppose racism and still think the kneeling nonsense is a daft distraction at best.

    Then why don't you condemn the racist vandalising of Rashford's mural? Instead you just go on at BLM
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    LeonLeon Posts: 47,059
    Nigelb said:

    Posted a link to this Atlantic article yesterday, but worth reposting.

    What it's like to live through a modern genocide. Right now, in our own time, not in history books, not in a movie.
    https://twitter.com/anneapplebaum/status/1415427928171634688

    Some beautiful writing in there

    A salt lake shines ‘like a mirror tossed into the desert’
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    TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 41,282
    Carnyx said:

    Not sure Johnson's "levelling up" speech was worth cancelling the England team reception for (the reason Number 19 ludicrously gave). Utterly vacuous shite.

    Does No 19 have some occult meaning, perchance?

    But otherwise quite so.
    Didn't Danny Welbeck used to play at No.19 for England? I thought it meant that.
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    FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 76,285
    edited July 2021

    Not sure Johnson's "levelling up" speech was worth cancelling the England team reception for (the reason Number 19 ludicrously gave). Utterly vacuous shite.

    The reality is lots of the players are already gone on holiday. After been in the bubble for a month, all most of them wanted to do is spend time with friends and family.

    If they had won, now that would have been all much trickier for all concerned.
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    gealbhan said:

    James_M said:


    I disagree with dixiedean a little. Yes, being an excellent researcher doesn't automatically equate with being a good teacher and vice versa; they are different skills. However there is a push to ensure that teaching is research informed. Students, we are told, want to learn from those who are doing the research and that seems fair enough to me.

    The key is training. My role is principally research, but I am strongly encouraged to build my teaching skills and gain suitable accreditation qualifications here. I am, for example, a Senior Fellow of the Higher Education Academy. Personally, I think the more common assumption that needs tackling is that Professors are best suited to do management/leadership tasks. While training can again help, I think ring-fencing management/leadership within departments to senior researchers is often unhelpful.

    Ultimately the technology changes in teaching may well help researchers enhance their teaching by working with course designers to communicate their work. It is blended learning after all that will be the future of HE education I think.

    So research is done and something is published, that is so often similar and along same lines as everything else researched and on same lines as everything published on the subject. Is this lack of creative thinking in the research process?

    A teacher would be more creative to engage and impart knowledge?

    So when Government go to academics for help, they are going to researcher skill sets, not creative thinking skill sets, hence poor pieces of work, such as on planning for something?
    Discussion of the research-teaching link probably needs to consider different academic disciplines, picking up on the proposition they should be separated.

    In humanities and social sciences, there is not really a split between research and teaching staff - as the design and content of modules, especially in final year, are based on sharing research methods and experience with the students.

    As a point of principle, I certainly see that researchers and teachers in these disciplines are better for doing both. It is very common for 3rd year modules to be based around a book the lecturer is completing and for the acknowledgements to cite the students whose questions pushed the author to look at questions and evidence afresh. As the old adage goes, you only really understand something when you can explain it to people.

    In practice, there is a growth of exploitative, short-term contracts to meet teaching demands in these departments, but even then they recruit people on the strength of their research as well as their classroom style - even though, in many cases, they don't allocate any time for the temporary lecturer to do any research to enhance their CV for the future. Meanwhile, even senior professors would still teach seminars, as well as give lecturers, as there's no equivalent of laboratory demonstrators for non-lab subjects. (Though I agree with James M that management/admin roles that shift workload away from teaching should be allocated for competence, not seniority, and I think that often remains true in practice as the Head of Department will suffer most from people doing other roles poorly).

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    TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 41,282

    Mr. Gate and Mr. Above, https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/antenatal-guru-milli-hill-dropped-by-charity-after-insisting-its-women-not-birthing-people-ncl88m8gx

    Mr. Battery, I oppose destruction and damage to property.

    Mr. Thompson, the division, the argument we're having now is about whether aping BLM, which until recently organisations were just delighted to loudly and proudly endorse, is a sensible move. You can oppose racism and still think the kneeling nonsense is a daft distraction at best.

    Morris can you let us know some of the BLM movement's founding articles? You must be very familiar with them as I'm sure you aren't just going down the "destroy capitalism/marxist" line of criticism?
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    Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 65,826

    Mr. Gate and Mr. Above, https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/antenatal-guru-milli-hill-dropped-by-charity-after-insisting-its-women-not-birthing-people-ncl88m8gx

    Mr. Battery, I oppose destruction and damage to property.

    Mr. Thompson, the division, the argument we're having now is about whether aping BLM, which until recently organisations were just delighted to loudly and proudly endorse, is a sensible move. You can oppose racism and still think the kneeling nonsense is a daft distraction at best.

    Kneeling is not a daft distraction it is saying enough is enough and we don't want to put up with it anymore.

    Gestures matter.
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    NigelbNigelb Posts: 62,541
    TOPPING said:

    HYUFD said:

    MaxPB said:

    Boris is trash. His speech was bullshit and the pretence that he isn't robbing the south to bribe voters in the north is no longer credible. Honestly, it's time for the toy party to pull the trigger and get rid.

    Rubbish, the main reason the Tories have a majority of 80 and seats in white working class former Labour heartlands in the North and Midlands is down to Boris.

    Anyway, even if the Tories saw a 10% swing to the LDs in the South in 2023/24 the LDs would still only pick up about 25 seats, which would still give a narrow Tory majority of 30 if Boris held the Red Wall.

    Boris is the most successful Tory election winner since Thatcher and when they got rid of her it did not end well. The Tories then proceeded to lose 3 out of the next 4 general elections and even when they returned to power in 2010 it was without a majority
    Careful now, tiger - dismissing me yesterday and @MaxPB today (both of whom, I'm guessing, voted Cons in 2019) is making your "who cares" work even harder.

    What would Oscar say in such a situation...
    Foxtrot ?
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    noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 20,732

    Mr. Gate and Mr. Above, https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/antenatal-guru-milli-hill-dropped-by-charity-after-insisting-its-women-not-birthing-people-ncl88m8gx

    Mr. Battery, I oppose destruction and damage to property.

    Mr. Thompson, the division, the argument we're having now is about whether aping BLM, which until recently organisations were just delighted to loudly and proudly endorse, is a sensible move. You can oppose racism and still think the kneeling nonsense is a daft distraction at best.

    Are there some ridiculous people about who use weird and unnecessary language? Sure, and they should be ignored. It does not make it common place or justify some bizarre "they started it" excuse for the PM to further divide the country.
  • Options
    CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 39,674
    edited July 2021

    MaxPB said:

    Boris is trash. His speech was bullshit and the pretence that he isn't robbing the south to bribe voters in the north is no longer credible. Honestly, it's time for the toy party to pull the trigger and get rid.

    Dominic Cummings agrees with you. Guess who the ‘Clown Prince of shit pundits’ is.

    https://twitter.com/dominic2306/status/1415633761337757699

    “When even the Clown Prince of shit pundits doesn't know what dictation he's supposed to be taking, you know your slogan, speech & execution are really really bad”
    I (unusually) liked the Guido dig:

    'Of course, there were also a few classic Borisisms that did little to add clarity: apparently “Levelling up is not a jam spreading operation”, and “the most important factor in levelling up, the yeast, the magic sauce, the ketchup of catch up… is leadership”. This was not the anticipated delineation of cake-ism in theory and practice.'
  • Options
    MattWMattW Posts: 18,500
    BBC WATO talking to some people from Darlington: "Are you noticing any improvement to your town centre?".

    Answer: Generally, yes.

    Naughty Darlington. How *dare* they.
  • Options
    AnabobazinaAnabobazina Posts: 19,952
    Irrational hatred and jealousy of That London and That Down South might carry Bozza a fair old way with the Red Wall. But as a policy it's completely vacuous. The government is quite aware that the prosperity of the entire UK relies on London and environs, so even they aren't stupid enough to rob the south to feather the beds of the north.
  • Options
    GallowgateGallowgate Posts: 19,078

    Mr. Gate and Mr. Above, https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/antenatal-guru-milli-hill-dropped-by-charity-after-insisting-its-women-not-birthing-people-ncl88m8gx

    Mr. Battery, I oppose destruction and damage to property.

    Mr. Thompson, the division, the argument we're having now is about whether aping BLM, which until recently organisations were just delighted to loudly and proudly endorse, is a sensible move. You can oppose racism and still think the kneeling nonsense is a daft distraction at best.

    Just because the press makes you believe something is true it doesn’t mean it is.

    I know plenty of young Corbynista BLM types and not one of them uses “birthing people” or other nonsense.

    This is just the 2020s version of “you cant say baa baa blacksheep anymore”.
  • Options
    Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 65,826

    Irrational hatred and jealousy of That London and That Down South might carry Bozza a fair old way with the Red Wall. But as a policy it's completely vacuous. The government is quite aware that the prosperity of the entire UK relies on London and environs, so even they aren't stupid enough to rob the south to feather the beds of the north.

    Which is why levelling up is not about "robbing the south".
  • Options
    GallowgateGallowgate Posts: 19,078
    MattW said:

    BBC WATO talking to some people from Darlington: "Are you noticing any improvement to your town centre?".

    Answer: Generally, yes.

    Naughty Darlington. How *dare* they.

    Not sure what point you’re making here
  • Options
    NigelbNigelb Posts: 62,541
    Leon said:

    Nigelb said:

    Posted a link to this Atlantic article yesterday, but worth reposting.

    What it's like to live through a modern genocide. Right now, in our own time, not in history books, not in a movie.
    https://twitter.com/anneapplebaum/status/1415427928171634688

    Some beautiful writing in there

    A salt lake shines ‘like a mirror tossed into the desert’
    This bit got to me.
    ...“I’m going to ask you something,” I said to Merhaba, “and you have to promise me you’ll do it.”

    “What is it? Tell me first,” she said.

    “I’m serious. Promise me first,” I said firmly.

    “All right,” she replied quietly.

    “If they arrest me, don’t lose yourself. Don’t make inquiries about me, don’t go looking for help, don’t spend money trying to get me out. This time isn’t like any time before. They are planning something dark. There is no notifying families or inquiring at police stations this time. So don’t trouble yourself with that. Keep our family affairs in order, take good care of our daughters, let life go on as if I were still here. I’m not afraid of prison. I am afraid of you and the girls struggling and hurting when I’m gone. So I want you to remember what I’m saying.”...
  • Options
    LeonLeon Posts: 47,059
    The bitter historic irony in China’s truly appalling mistreatment of the Turkic Muslim Uighurs, is that China is doing to them what Muslims have done to Jews and Christians for many centuries, as authorized in the Koran. The Uighurs are made into an inherently second class people who are specially taxed, and thereby allowed to exist

    China’s treatment of the Turkic Uighurs has yet to reach the cruelty of Turkish dealings with Armenians
  • Options
    MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 44,362

    Mr. Gate and Mr. Above, https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/antenatal-guru-milli-hill-dropped-by-charity-after-insisting-its-women-not-birthing-people-ncl88m8gx

    Mr. Battery, I oppose destruction and damage to property.

    Mr. Thompson, the division, the argument we're having now is about whether aping BLM, which until recently organisations were just delighted to loudly and proudly endorse, is a sensible move. You can oppose racism and still think the kneeling nonsense is a daft distraction at best.

    Are there some ridiculous people about who use weird and unnecessary language? Sure, and they should be ignored. It does not make it common place or justify some bizarre "they started it" excuse for the PM to further divide the country.
    The Green party is currently tearing itself to pieces over this. As are portions of the Labour Party. In Scotland, there are also some considerable rumblings on the political scene due the issue relating to what you describe as "weird and unnecessary language".....

    I do not believe this will disappear from the political scene any time soon.
  • Options
    NigelbNigelb Posts: 62,541
    Carnyx said:

    MaxPB said:

    Boris is trash. His speech was bullshit and the pretence that he isn't robbing the south to bribe voters in the north is no longer credible. Honestly, it's time for the toy party to pull the trigger and get rid.

    Dominic Cummings agrees with you. Guess who the ‘Clown Prince of shit pundits’ is.

    https://twitter.com/dominic2306/status/1415633761337757699

    “When even the Clown Prince of shit pundits doesn't know what dictation he's supposed to be taking, you know your slogan, speech & execution are really really bad”
    I (unusually) liked the Guido dig:

    'Of course, there were also a few classic Borisisms that did little to add clarity: apparently “Levelling up is not a jam spreading operation”, and “the most important factor in levelling up, the yeast, the magic sauce, the ketchup of catch up… is leadership”. This was not the anticipated delineation of cake-ism in theory and practice.'
    With all those ingredients, it sounds less well conceived than a pineapple pizza.
  • Options
    CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 39,674

    Irrational hatred and jealousy of That London and That Down South might carry Bozza a fair old way with the Red Wall. But as a policy it's completely vacuous. The government is quite aware that the prosperity of the entire UK relies on London and environs, so even they aren't stupid enough to rob the south to feather the beds of the north.

    Well, TSE was telling us only this morning that he and his chum were discussing the possibility of London Independence. Mr Johnson is merely carrying on the same sensitivity and tact that he has hitherto displayed as soi-disant minister for the Union.
  • Options
    eekeek Posts: 24,964

    MattW said:

    BBC WATO talking to some people from Darlington: "Are you noticing any improvement to your town centre?".

    Answer: Generally, yes.

    Naughty Darlington. How *dare* they.

    Not sure what point you’re making here
    +1

    My viewpoint would be Darlington still has it's department store (House of Fraser rather than Debenhams) and a lot of new cafes / bars are opening up.
  • Options
    CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 39,674
    Nigelb said:

    Carnyx said:

    MaxPB said:

    Boris is trash. His speech was bullshit and the pretence that he isn't robbing the south to bribe voters in the north is no longer credible. Honestly, it's time for the toy party to pull the trigger and get rid.

    Dominic Cummings agrees with you. Guess who the ‘Clown Prince of shit pundits’ is.

    https://twitter.com/dominic2306/status/1415633761337757699

    “When even the Clown Prince of shit pundits doesn't know what dictation he's supposed to be taking, you know your slogan, speech & execution are really really bad”
    I (unusually) liked the Guido dig:

    'Of course, there were also a few classic Borisisms that did little to add clarity: apparently “Levelling up is not a jam spreading operation”, and “the most important factor in levelling up, the yeast, the magic sauce, the ketchup of catch up… is leadership”. This was not the anticipated delineation of cake-ism in theory and practice.'
    With all those ingredients, it sounds less well conceived than a pineapple pizza.
    It does sound like the sort of cake a three-year-old might try to make when his parents are distracted, yes. I didn't hear the speech, so don't know if these figures of speech were expressed as closely together as Guido makes it sound, to be fair.
  • Options
    Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 60,976
    Mr. Battery, pretty sure I did condemn it at the time.

    I go on about BLM because they're the ones the England team and others are aping by gesture.

    Mr. Thompson, they sure do. It's making people feel a part of something. Unfortunately it beggars belief to run around throwing Vulcan salutes then getting annoyed when people call you a Trekkie.

    There wasn't this division with the Kick It Out campaign. This division was born by the iconoclastic BLM, before whom the police were kneeling meekly.

    Mr. Above, the PM's a moron about whom there are a great many legitimate criticisms. He is, however, merely reactive to the culture war, not an instigator.
  • Options
    FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 76,285
    Long queues across KZN as people search for food, petrol

    https://twitter.com/News24/status/1415569845626736640?s=20
  • Options
    CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 39,674
    edited July 2021

    ...

    MD - do edit your second line instantly. I am sure you don't mean it, but even an accidental ...
  • Options
    noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 20,732

    Mr. Gate and Mr. Above, https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/antenatal-guru-milli-hill-dropped-by-charity-after-insisting-its-women-not-birthing-people-ncl88m8gx

    Mr. Battery, I oppose destruction and damage to property.

    Mr. Thompson, the division, the argument we're having now is about whether aping BLM, which until recently organisations were just delighted to loudly and proudly endorse, is a sensible move. You can oppose racism and still think the kneeling nonsense is a daft distraction at best.

    Are there some ridiculous people about who use weird and unnecessary language? Sure, and they should be ignored. It does not make it common place or justify some bizarre "they started it" excuse for the PM to further divide the country.
    The Green party is currently tearing itself to pieces over this. As are portions of the Labour Party. In Scotland, there are also some considerable rumblings on the political scene due the issue relating to what you describe as "weird and unnecessary language".....

    I do not believe this will disappear from the political scene any time soon.
    Party political members a bit weird and obsessive? Perhaps this is not the appropriate website to say I am not at all surprised, but I am not at all surprised. In normal life, no-one calls mums birthing people.
  • Options
    Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 55,317
    Nigelb said:

    Posted a link to this Atlantic article yesterday, but worth reposting.

    What it's like to live through a modern genocide. Right now, in our own time, not in history books, not in a movie.
    https://twitter.com/anneapplebaum/status/1415427928171634688

    Future generations will wonder why we were so obsessed with virtue signalling to each other about historic slavery and genocide rather than doing anything about this.
  • Options
    contrariancontrarian Posts: 5,818
    Leon said:

    The bitter historic irony in China’s truly appalling mistreatment of the Turkic Muslim Uighurs, is that China is doing to them what Muslims have done to Jews and Christians for many centuries, as authorized in the Koran. The Uighurs are made into an inherently second class people who are specially taxed, and thereby allowed to exist

    China’s treatment of the Turkic Uighurs has yet to reach the cruelty of Turkish dealings with Armenians

    We hear a great deal from some muslims in Britain about standing in solidarity with their brothers in Palestine.

    Standing in solidarity with their Uighur brothers in China, rather less so. Or maybe I have missed it.
  • Options
    FloaterFloater Posts: 14,195

    Leon said:

    The bitter historic irony in China’s truly appalling mistreatment of the Turkic Muslim Uighurs, is that China is doing to them what Muslims have done to Jews and Christians for many centuries, as authorized in the Koran. The Uighurs are made into an inherently second class people who are specially taxed, and thereby allowed to exist

    China’s treatment of the Turkic Uighurs has yet to reach the cruelty of Turkish dealings with Armenians

    We hear a great deal from some muslims in Britain about standing in solidarity with their brothers in Palestine.

    Standing in solidarity with their Uighur brothers in China, rather less so. Or maybe I have missed it.
    Not just in Britain
  • Options
    GallowgateGallowgate Posts: 19,078

    There wasn't this division with the Kick It Out campaign. This division was born by the iconoclastic BLM, before whom the police were kneeling meekly.

    What’s the point of even having this debate if you’re not open to reason?

    For one, the Black Lives Matter movement is separate to Black Lives Matter, the organisation. Therefore although there is significant overlap, the people pulling down statues are not the same people kneeling.

    Secondly, the police were not “kneeling meekly before BLM”, they were simply doing a new anti-racism gesture. You can pretend otherwise if it makes you feel better but you’re wrong.

    The fact is you’ve decided that you hate anything remotely to do with “BLM” without any sort of critical thinking or nuance and that’s that. So like I said, pointless even discussing.
  • Options
    Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 60,976
    Mr. Gate, well, I did post a link indicating it happens... if you don't want evidence there's not much I can do to persuade you.

    Stalin was mostly nice to Kaganovich. That doesn't mean he was nice to every Jew.

    Anyway, fun as it is replying to half a dozen people at once I should do something could approximately be described as work.

    Have a good day, everyone.
  • Options
    MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 44,362

    Mr. Gate and Mr. Above, https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/antenatal-guru-milli-hill-dropped-by-charity-after-insisting-its-women-not-birthing-people-ncl88m8gx

    Mr. Battery, I oppose destruction and damage to property.

    Mr. Thompson, the division, the argument we're having now is about whether aping BLM, which until recently organisations were just delighted to loudly and proudly endorse, is a sensible move. You can oppose racism and still think the kneeling nonsense is a daft distraction at best.

    Are there some ridiculous people about who use weird and unnecessary language? Sure, and they should be ignored. It does not make it common place or justify some bizarre "they started it" excuse for the PM to further divide the country.
    The Green party is currently tearing itself to pieces over this. As are portions of the Labour Party. In Scotland, there are also some considerable rumblings on the political scene due the issue relating to what you describe as "weird and unnecessary language".....

    I do not believe this will disappear from the political scene any time soon.
    Party political members a bit weird and obsessive? Perhaps this is not the appropriate website to say I am not at all surprised, but I am not at all surprised. In normal life, no-one calls mums birthing people.
    What you call normal life is the social circle that you move in.

    It is quite important to realise that such a circle is somewhat self selecting and self limiting.

    Consider the effort that some people have put into er.... cancelling people such as JK Rowling.

    The people in question exist, and passionately believe in their cause.

  • Options
    Alphabet_SoupAlphabet_Soup Posts: 2,744
    Wouldn't 'levelling up the north' be a popular policy in places like Chesham and Amersham where people are apparently concerned about the consequences of over-development? London may currently be the UK's economic powerhouse (not so sure of that myself) but it's a mixed blessing if all it brings to the rest of the South East is concrete and glass.
  • Options
    LeonLeon Posts: 47,059
    Nigelb said:

    Leon said:

    Nigelb said:

    Posted a link to this Atlantic article yesterday, but worth reposting.

    What it's like to live through a modern genocide. Right now, in our own time, not in history books, not in a movie.
    https://twitter.com/anneapplebaum/status/1415427928171634688

    Some beautiful writing in there

    A salt lake shines ‘like a mirror tossed into the desert’
    This bit got to me.
    ...“I’m going to ask you something,” I said to Merhaba, “and you have to promise me you’ll do it.”

    “What is it? Tell me first,” she said.

    “I’m serious. Promise me first,” I said firmly.

    “All right,” she replied quietly.

    “If they arrest me, don’t lose yourself. Don’t make inquiries about me, don’t go looking for help, don’t spend money trying to get me out. This time isn’t like any time before. They are planning something dark. There is no notifying families or inquiring at police stations this time. So don’t trouble yourself with that. Keep our family affairs in order, take good care of our daughters, let life go on as if I were still here. I’m not afraid of prison. I am afraid of you and the girls struggling and hurting when I’m gone. So I want you to remember what I’m saying.”...
    It’s a sobering and sometimes lyrical essay. Thanks for the link

    The parallels with Nazi Germany grow eerier by the day. And here it is, happening in plain sight, again

    The difference is that this time there is nothing we can do. We can’t fight China. It is the world’s dominant trading power and will soon be the biggest economic power, then comes Chinese military superiority. Meanwhile China (often via Russia) divides us and roils us with our own social media, along racial and political fault-lines

    They are winning. I see very few signs of meaningful western resistance
  • Options
    GallowgateGallowgate Posts: 19,078

    Mr. Gate, well, I did post a link indicating it happens... if you don't want evidence there's not much I can do to persuade you.

    Stalin was mostly nice to Kaganovich. That doesn't mean he was nice to every Jew.

    Anyway, fun as it is replying to half a dozen people at once I should do something could approximately be described as work.

    Have a good day, everyone.

    Yeah, but it doesn’t happen in real life anywhere near enough to justify the hysterical bed wetting.
  • Options
    Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 55,317
    Carnyx said:

    MaxPB said:

    Boris is trash. His speech was bullshit and the pretence that he isn't robbing the south to bribe voters in the north is no longer credible. Honestly, it's time for the toy party to pull the trigger and get rid.

    Dominic Cummings agrees with you. Guess who the ‘Clown Prince of shit pundits’ is.

    https://twitter.com/dominic2306/status/1415633761337757699

    “When even the Clown Prince of shit pundits doesn't know what dictation he's supposed to be taking, you know your slogan, speech & execution are really really bad”
    I (unusually) liked the Guido dig:

    'Of course, there were also a few classic Borisisms that did little to add clarity: apparently “Levelling up is not a jam spreading operation”, and “the most important factor in levelling up, the yeast, the magic sauce, the ketchup of catch up… is leadership”. This was not the anticipated delineation of cake-ism in theory and practice.'
    That does actually mean something though, if you accept Boris at his word.

    It means he's not levelling up through socialist tax & spend redistribution; he's doing it through government championing and some pump-prime funding to lead private sector investment.
  • Options
    GallowgateGallowgate Posts: 19,078

    Mr. Gate and Mr. Above, https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/antenatal-guru-milli-hill-dropped-by-charity-after-insisting-its-women-not-birthing-people-ncl88m8gx

    Mr. Battery, I oppose destruction and damage to property.

    Mr. Thompson, the division, the argument we're having now is about whether aping BLM, which until recently organisations were just delighted to loudly and proudly endorse, is a sensible move. You can oppose racism and still think the kneeling nonsense is a daft distraction at best.

    Are there some ridiculous people about who use weird and unnecessary language? Sure, and they should be ignored. It does not make it common place or justify some bizarre "they started it" excuse for the PM to further divide the country.
    The Green party is currently tearing itself to pieces over this. As are portions of the Labour Party. In Scotland, there are also some considerable rumblings on the political scene due the issue relating to what you describe as "weird and unnecessary language".....

    I do not believe this will disappear from the political scene any time soon.
    Party political members a bit weird and obsessive? Perhaps this is not the appropriate website to say I am not at all surprised, but I am not at all surprised. In normal life, no-one calls mums birthing people.
    What you call normal life is the social circle that you move in.

    It is quite important to realise that such a circle is somewhat self selecting and self limiting.

    Consider the effort that some people have put into er.... cancelling people such as JK Rowling.

    The people in question exist, and passionately believe in their cause.

    You can dislike JK Rowling for being a “TERF” while still using the word “mother”.

    Like I said — hysterical bed wetting on the same level as “you can’t say baa baa blacksheep anymore”.
  • Options
    DavidLDavidL Posts: 51,231
    Leon said:

    Nigelb said:

    Leon said:

    Nigelb said:

    Posted a link to this Atlantic article yesterday, but worth reposting.

    What it's like to live through a modern genocide. Right now, in our own time, not in history books, not in a movie.
    https://twitter.com/anneapplebaum/status/1415427928171634688

    Some beautiful writing in there

    A salt lake shines ‘like a mirror tossed into the desert’
    This bit got to me.
    ...“I’m going to ask you something,” I said to Merhaba, “and you have to promise me you’ll do it.”

    “What is it? Tell me first,” she said.

    “I’m serious. Promise me first,” I said firmly.

    “All right,” she replied quietly.

    “If they arrest me, don’t lose yourself. Don’t make inquiries about me, don’t go looking for help, don’t spend money trying to get me out. This time isn’t like any time before. They are planning something dark. There is no notifying families or inquiring at police stations this time. So don’t trouble yourself with that. Keep our family affairs in order, take good care of our daughters, let life go on as if I were still here. I’m not afraid of prison. I am afraid of you and the girls struggling and hurting when I’m gone. So I want you to remember what I’m saying.”...
    It’s a sobering and sometimes lyrical essay. Thanks for the link

    The parallels with Nazi Germany grow eerier by the day. And here it is, happening in plain sight, again

    The difference is that this time there is nothing we can do. We can’t fight China. It is the world’s dominant trading power and will soon be the biggest economic power, then comes Chinese military superiority. Meanwhile China (often via Russia) divides us and roils us with our own social media, along racial and political fault-lines

    They are winning. I see very few signs of meaningful western resistance
    The disease that they unleashed upon the world, negligently or not, has so far killed over 4m people worldwide officially and almost certainly many, many more. And yet we do nothing. It's cowardice, really.
  • Options
    noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 20,732

    Mr. Gate and Mr. Above, https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/antenatal-guru-milli-hill-dropped-by-charity-after-insisting-its-women-not-birthing-people-ncl88m8gx

    Mr. Battery, I oppose destruction and damage to property.

    Mr. Thompson, the division, the argument we're having now is about whether aping BLM, which until recently organisations were just delighted to loudly and proudly endorse, is a sensible move. You can oppose racism and still think the kneeling nonsense is a daft distraction at best.

    Are there some ridiculous people about who use weird and unnecessary language? Sure, and they should be ignored. It does not make it common place or justify some bizarre "they started it" excuse for the PM to further divide the country.
    The Green party is currently tearing itself to pieces over this. As are portions of the Labour Party. In Scotland, there are also some considerable rumblings on the political scene due the issue relating to what you describe as "weird and unnecessary language".....

    I do not believe this will disappear from the political scene any time soon.
    Party political members a bit weird and obsessive? Perhaps this is not the appropriate website to say I am not at all surprised, but I am not at all surprised. In normal life, no-one calls mums birthing people.
    What you call normal life is the social circle that you move in.

    It is quite important to realise that such a circle is somewhat self selecting and self limiting.

    Consider the effort that some people have put into er.... cancelling people such as JK Rowling.

    The people in question exist, and passionately believe in their cause.

    They do exist and are passionate but are a tiny proportion of the public, and miles from the mainstream.

    Pre internet no-one would have even known they exist except as parodies as there are so few of them. Now the right and populist media amplify every absurd statement they make. It would be far far better to simply ignore them.
  • Options
    StuartinromfordStuartinromford Posts: 14,417
    TOPPING said:

    HYUFD said:

    MaxPB said:

    Boris is trash. His speech was bullshit and the pretence that he isn't robbing the south to bribe voters in the north is no longer credible. Honestly, it's time for the toy party to pull the trigger and get rid.

    Rubbish, the main reason the Tories have a majority of 80 and seats in white working class former Labour heartlands in the North and Midlands is down to Boris.

    Anyway, even if the Tories saw a 10% swing to the LDs in the South in 2023/24 the LDs would still only pick up about 25 seats, which would still give a narrow Tory majority of 30 if Boris held the Red Wall.

    Boris is the most successful Tory election winner since Thatcher and when they got rid of her it did not end well. The Tories then proceeded to lose 3 out of the next 4 general elections and even when they returned to power in 2010 it was without a majority
    Careful now, tiger - dismissing me yesterday and @MaxPB today (both of whom, I'm guessing, voted Cons in 2019) is making your "who cares" work even harder.

    What would Oscar say in such a situation...
    It does highlight the strategic dilemma the Conservatives have wandered into.

    Johnson and Johnsonism are a potent electoral brew. On many levels, it baffles me, but there's no questioning the fact that lots of people vote for Boris. And Johnson-style cakeism is an obvious vote-winner. It doesn't work when you try to turn slogans into reality, but the slogans are fabulous.

    Only Johnson has got the nerve to keep so many contradictions coming out of his mouth at once. Any successor will have to come down on one side or another. And then bits of the 80 majority start falling off.
  • Options
    MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 44,362

    Wouldn't 'levelling up the north' be a popular policy in places like Chesham and Amersham where people are apparently concerned about the consequences of over-development? London may currently be the UK's economic powerhouse (not so sure of that myself) but it's a mixed blessing if all it brings to the rest of the South East is concrete and glass.

    In the South east, apparently, they want an absence of over development, but all the money spent on them. They want no development, but are very angry that they can't build houses on the spare pieces of land they own.

    Unicorn ponies are definably wanted....
  • Options
    DavidLDavidL Posts: 51,231

    Leon said:

    The bitter historic irony in China’s truly appalling mistreatment of the Turkic Muslim Uighurs, is that China is doing to them what Muslims have done to Jews and Christians for many centuries, as authorized in the Koran. The Uighurs are made into an inherently second class people who are specially taxed, and thereby allowed to exist

    China’s treatment of the Turkic Uighurs has yet to reach the cruelty of Turkish dealings with Armenians

    We hear a great deal from some muslims in Britain about standing in solidarity with their brothers in Palestine.

    Standing in solidarity with their Uighur brothers in China, rather less so. Or maybe I have missed it.
    Even the Taliban seemed to have abandoned them now calling China a "friend".
This discussion has been closed.