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Starmer starting to look a good bet as an 18% chance to be next PM – politicalbetting.com

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  • Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 65,826
    HYUFD said:

    Tory MP Andrew Rosindell tells Tyrone Mings to focus on football not politics

    https://twitter.com/PoliticsForAlI/status/1414956533025280020?s=20

    *Open mouth, insert foot*

    Rosindell is an idiot. 🤦‍♂️
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 54,040
    Cookie said:

    DavidL said:

    50 deaths today, up 50% in the last 7 days. Hospital admissions also up 50% in the same time. The rate of increase of new cases is slowing a bit but these are not great figures, especially when vaccinations are down to 175k.

    Deaths and hospitalisations kind of reflecting the uptick two and three weeks ago. Not great, but not unexpected. Where does this top out? Not too far off on positives, hopefully.
    As has been kindly pointed out the hospitalisation figure is a full week out of date. It would be really interesting to see what the current rate of admissions is but for the reasons you have indicated it is going to be a lot higher. I agree about cases. I believe that we will see the top this week.
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 42,172
    Carnyx said:

    eek said:

    malcolmg said:

    POLICE Scotland have launched a formal investigation into potential criminality involving SNP fundraising.

    The force, which has been assessing a fraud allegation from a member of the public since late March, said it had escalated its work after consulting with prosecutors.


    https://www.heraldscotland.com/politics/19438528.police-scotland-launch-fraud-probe-snp-fundraising-indyref2/

    Where are Pete and the magpie hiding, the vultures are circling Murrell Towers. Will some try to save their own skins or will they choose to go down with the Ceaușescu's.
    Take it you aren't a Sturgeon fan...
    At last! At last! another PBer with the sentience and intelligence to grasp that not everyone who wants independence for Scotland is a 'nationalist' in whatever sense, or even a SNP voter, let alone follower of any particular leader.
    I’ve heard that on PB you’re never more than a few pixels away from a ‘Scotland’s a one party banana republic’ hot take.
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 43,443

    🚨🚨 | BREAKING: Fans attending sporting events in England after July 19 will require a Covid passport and will be told to wear masks

    Via @TelegraphSport

    Be interesting to see if they take any notice of wear masking.

    Were they supposed to wear them at the Euros?
  • rkrkrkrkrkrk Posts: 8,362
    FF43 said:

    FF43 said:

    This poll on foreign aid may surprise some politicians

    https://twitter.com/SavantaComRes/status/1401927434333835266?s=19

    There is nothing magic about 0.5% or 0.7% of GDP. People who believe in competent and responsible government think when you do things, you should do them properly. This includes winding up programmes. You should not wreck the programme in the search of a cheap headline.
    The programmes aren't being wrecked, others are stepping into the void.

    Andrew Mitchell was on Sky earlier bemoaning how "embarrassing" it is that a program previously funded by Britain is now funded by Bill Gates instead.

    That's not embarrassing to me. If Bill Gates wants to use his vast wealth to ensure that program continues then good for him, if nobody else does the program probably wasn't worth doing.
    Some spin there. Gates et al stepped in to mitigate a small part of the damage.
    The conservative position is simple really:

    Proud we give a lot, proud we are cutting a lot, would like to point out we are not actually cutting that much, wish others would give more, but believes these programs are probably a waste of time, delighted we are saving a lot of lives, but very clear that less money does not mean fewer lives saved.

  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 82,533
    edited July 2021
    Carnyx said:

    🚨🚨 | BREAKING: Fans attending sporting events in England after July 19 will require a Covid passport and will be told to wear masks

    Via @TelegraphSport

    Be interesting to see if they take any notice of wear masking.

    Were they supposed to wear them at the Euros?
    I don't believe so as it was part of the "test" programme.
  • glwglw Posts: 9,956

    🚨🚨 | BREAKING: Fans attending sporting events in England after July 19 will require a Covid passport and will be told to wear masks

    Via @TelegraphSport

    Be interesting to see if they take any notice of wear masking.

    We are definitely moving on from the carrot to the stick phase of "get your vaccine".
  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 60,216
    Hospitalisation Update: Jul 13

    Total hospital occupancy (13 Jul): 3566. England: 2970
    Yesterday (12 Jul): 3394. Eng: 2798
    Last Week (06 Jul): 2455. England: 1998

    Spring Peak: 21687 (12 Apr)
    Winter Peak: 39254 (18 Jan)
    Eng Spring: 18974 (12 Apr)
    Eng Winter: 34336 (18 Jan)


    https://twitter.com/ganeshran/status/1414965949556568070?s=20
  • Richard_NabaviRichard_Nabavi Posts: 30,822
    Brom said:


    Fair to say that if Greens poll 5% let alone 7% it's really hard to find a path for Starmer to Number 10. The Greens really could be on the cusp of a breakthrough in places like Bristol & Norwich if they're on 7% and Starmer can't win round the students and graduates.

    Yeah. Obviously it's not really possible to forecast exactly how this will work out, but it feels plausible that some of those who were keen on Corbyn drift off to the Greens (or don't vote at all), and a further cohort of centrists drift off to the LibDems.
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 43,443

    Carnyx said:

    eek said:

    malcolmg said:

    POLICE Scotland have launched a formal investigation into potential criminality involving SNP fundraising.

    The force, which has been assessing a fraud allegation from a member of the public since late March, said it had escalated its work after consulting with prosecutors.


    https://www.heraldscotland.com/politics/19438528.police-scotland-launch-fraud-probe-snp-fundraising-indyref2/

    Where are Pete and the magpie hiding, the vultures are circling Murrell Towers. Will some try to save their own skins or will they choose to go down with the Ceaușescu's.
    Take it you aren't a Sturgeon fan...
    At last! At last! another PBer with the sentience and intelligence to grasp that not everyone who wants independence for Scotland is a 'nationalist' in whatever sense, or even a SNP voter, let alone follower of any particular leader.
    I’ve heard that on PB you’re never more than a few pixels away from a ‘Scotland’s a one party banana republic’ hot take.
    If that's what they say for a minority government I hate to think what they'd say if the SNP changed the Holyrood system to a FPTP system because Westminster is so obviously the best way to do things. Though I'm not sure which MSP would do the JR-M bit.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 124,051
    DavidL said:

    HYUFD said:

    Scott_xP said:

    MPs voted by 333 to 298 to set new fiscal hurdles before Ministers need again spend 0.7% of GNI on overseas aid. Govt victory. Time will tell if any damage done to reputation of Global Britain or Conservatives, but a reordering of UK foreign policy that may echo round the world.
    https://twitter.com/patrickwintour/status/1414963664285847556

    So Boris has got his overseas aid cut through, despite the opposition of May and some of her and Cameron's allies still in Parliament.

    Despite the smaller government majority of 35 compared to their actual majority of 80 this is the clearest indication yet this Parliament of where Boris has broken with the May and Cameron years in favour of the views of Leavers and the Red Wall
    Well, apart from Brexit.
    May also was committed to deliver Brexit, Boris used her Withdrawal agreement as the basis for his deal with the EU after all, just removed some regulatory alignment for GB.

    Boris' overseas aid cut today aligns him to a policy Farage backed but May and Cameron both strongly opposed, as indeed did John Major
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 36,109
    HYUFD said:

    So Boris has got his overseas aid cut through, despite the opposition of May and some of her and Cameron's allies still in Parliament.

    Despite the smaller government majority of 35 compared to their actual majority of 80 this is the clearest indication yet this Parliament of where Boris has broken with the May and Cameron years in favour of the views of Leavers and the Red Wall

    BoZo has broken with Conservatives in favour of Little Englanders.

    This is not news...
  • Nigel_ForemainNigel_Foremain Posts: 14,352
    malcolmg said:

    Carnyx said:

    malcolmg said:

    POLICE Scotland have launched a formal investigation into potential criminality involving SNP fundraising.

    The force, which has been assessing a fraud allegation from a member of the public since late March, said it had escalated its work after consulting with prosecutors.


    https://www.heraldscotland.com/politics/19438528.police-scotland-launch-fraud-probe-snp-fundraising-indyref2/

    Where are Pete and the magpie hiding, the vultures are circling Murrell Towers. Will some try to save their own skins or will they choose to go down with the Ceaușescu's.
    It is what we expect from nationalists really. The choice for nationalist voters/English haters north of the border might be one bunch led by folk that are under investigation for fraud, or a minnow party led by a man who was described by his own QC as a "bully and a sex pest". And they try and make out the Tories are sleazy! British National Party or Scottish National Party. In the end they both amount to the same. Racists and sleaze bags, mostly!
    Can you really not tell the difference between

    (a) hating the English
    and
    (b) not wanting to be ruled by them?

    That's on a par with regarding the Unitarians as anti-Tory because they don't support the C of E or its rule by HMTQ.
    Carnyx, he is a nasty bellend , a Scottish hater and to be pitied rather than chastised.
    Correction: I have many Scottish friends, and I hate no-one. Based on your abusive, ranting, often incoherent words that roughly pass as posts I could possibly make an exception for yourself. How are the anger management lessons going? Are you still a fan of the fat little toad? Does it bother you that Salmond was described as a "bully and a sex pest" by his QC, or does he still deserve your adoration?

    Sorry too many questions for your very small parochial mind I guess.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 72,314

    This poll on foreign aid may surprise some politicians

    https://twitter.com/SavantaComRes/status/1401927434333835266?s=19

    No surprise.
    Britons are curtain-twitching, Mail-reading, spite-mongers. Who hate freedom (especially other people’s).
    Do you not concede that this poll supports the reduction in foreign aid across all political groups and ages
    I don’t believe in running the country according to whatever lowest-denominator impulses can be discerned from polling.

    Sad that this is another example of your piously refusing to part with a smidgeon of your triple-locked wealth.
    A bit ad hom. , but agreed.
  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 60,216
    HYUFD said:

    Tory MP Andrew Rosindell tells Tyrone Mings to focus on football not politics

    https://twitter.com/PoliticsForAlI/status/1414956533025280020?s=20

    Why doesn't he ask his boss, the last politician who tried to take on a footballer how that turned out.....
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 43,443

    Carnyx said:

    🚨🚨 | BREAKING: Fans attending sporting events in England after July 19 will require a Covid passport and will be told to wear masks

    Via @TelegraphSport

    Be interesting to see if they take any notice of wear masking.

    Were they supposed to wear them at the Euros?
    I don't believe so as it was part of the "test" programme.
    Good grief. I hadn't been keeping track (sorry) of that - but surely that's human experimentation on a vast scale. I wonder who signed off the ethical committee stuff?!
  • eekeek Posts: 28,592
    HYUFD said:

    DavidL said:

    HYUFD said:

    Scott_xP said:

    MPs voted by 333 to 298 to set new fiscal hurdles before Ministers need again spend 0.7% of GNI on overseas aid. Govt victory. Time will tell if any damage done to reputation of Global Britain or Conservatives, but a reordering of UK foreign policy that may echo round the world.
    https://twitter.com/patrickwintour/status/1414963664285847556

    So Boris has got his overseas aid cut through, despite the opposition of May and some of her and Cameron's allies still in Parliament.

    Despite the smaller government majority of 35 compared to their actual majority of 80 this is the clearest indication yet this Parliament of where Boris has broken with the May and Cameron years in favour of the views of Leavers and the Red Wall
    Well, apart from Brexit.
    May also was committed to deliver Brexit, Boris used her Withdrawal agreement as the basis for his deal with the EU after all, just removed some regulatory alignment for GB.

    Boris' overseas aid cut today aligns him to a policy Farage backed but May and Cameron both strongly opposed, as indeed did John Major
    And confirms that the Boris's Tory party are definitely not the Conservative Party people in the South used to vote for.

    The next election is going to be interesting as very long term Conservative seats turn orange...
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 54,040
    edited July 2021
    Carnyx said:

    malcolmg said:

    DavidL said:

    50 deaths today, up 50% in the last 7 days. Hospital admissions also up 50% in the same time. The rate of increase of new cases is slowing a bit but these are not great figures, especially when vaccinations are down to 175k.

    Scottish numbers looking better
    Schools skailed earlier, likewise footie - hopefully a harbinger of a similar fall down south.
    We really need proper acknowledgement of the selflessness of our football team. It would have been so easy to knock in a couple of goals whilst running England ragged but no, the greater good.
  • Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 65,826
    HYUFD said:

    DavidL said:

    HYUFD said:

    Scott_xP said:

    MPs voted by 333 to 298 to set new fiscal hurdles before Ministers need again spend 0.7% of GNI on overseas aid. Govt victory. Time will tell if any damage done to reputation of Global Britain or Conservatives, but a reordering of UK foreign policy that may echo round the world.
    https://twitter.com/patrickwintour/status/1414963664285847556

    So Boris has got his overseas aid cut through, despite the opposition of May and some of her and Cameron's allies still in Parliament.

    Despite the smaller government majority of 35 compared to their actual majority of 80 this is the clearest indication yet this Parliament of where Boris has broken with the May and Cameron years in favour of the views of Leavers and the Red Wall
    Well, apart from Brexit.
    May also was committed to deliver Brexit, Boris used her Withdrawal agreement as the basis for his deal with the EU after all, just removed some regulatory alignment for GB.

    Boris' overseas aid cut today aligns him to a policy Farage backed but May and Cameron both strongly opposed, as indeed did John Major
    Boris's overseas aid "cut" today means he's spending more on foreign aid than Major, Blair or Brown. 🙄

    Its got a lot further to be cut yet potentially.
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 43,515
    Off-topic:

    The Florida condo collapse has spewed out the usual rubbish on the Internet. However, I've found the following channel quite good at looking at what may have happened, from the perspective of a professional in repairing concrete. Even better, he changes his views as the evidence comes in.

    https://www.youtube.com/c/BuildingIntegrity

    There's a possibility that planters on the pool deck were a significant causal factor in the collapse ...

    I've said it before, and I'll say it again; concrete is fascinating, as much an art as a science.

    (From his perspective: he produces a few videos in a sector that is usually uninteresting to people. Then this happens in his state, and I bet his views went up massively.)
  • Nigel_ForemainNigel_Foremain Posts: 14,352
    HYUFD said:

    Tory MP Andrew Rosindell tells Tyrone Mings to focus on football not politics

    https://twitter.com/PoliticsForAlI/status/1414956533025280020?s=20

    Pompous twat.
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 54,040

    Carnyx said:

    eek said:

    malcolmg said:

    POLICE Scotland have launched a formal investigation into potential criminality involving SNP fundraising.

    The force, which has been assessing a fraud allegation from a member of the public since late March, said it had escalated its work after consulting with prosecutors.


    https://www.heraldscotland.com/politics/19438528.police-scotland-launch-fraud-probe-snp-fundraising-indyref2/

    Where are Pete and the magpie hiding, the vultures are circling Murrell Towers. Will some try to save their own skins or will they choose to go down with the Ceaușescu's.
    Take it you aren't a Sturgeon fan...
    At last! At last! another PBer with the sentience and intelligence to grasp that not everyone who wants independence for Scotland is a 'nationalist' in whatever sense, or even a SNP voter, let alone follower of any particular leader.
    I’ve heard that on PB you’re never more than a few pixels away from a ‘Scotland’s a one party banana republic’ hot take.
    That's pretty unfair...ach, its just too obvious.

    Has the government locked up any more journalists recently?
  • StuartinromfordStuartinromford Posts: 17,476

    HYUFD said:

    Tory MP Andrew Rosindell tells Tyrone Mings to focus on football not politics

    https://twitter.com/PoliticsForAlI/status/1414956533025280020?s=20

    *Open mouth, insert foot*

    Rosindell is an idiot. 🤦‍♂️
    No question there.

    But he is also a stonkingly effective campaigner. And "Patriotic And Proud" types on the right will have been stung by recent statements.

    More importantly, I also suspect that Rozza's stream of Conservatism is a lot more numerous than the global libertarian strand.
  • Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 65,826
    Spending on overseas aid should happen because a program is deemed the right thing to do and is value for money.

    Not to hit an artificial domestic percentage of GNI target.
  • Stark_DawningStark_Dawning Posts: 9,716
    HYUFD said:

    Tory MP Andrew Rosindell tells Tyrone Mings to focus on football not politics

    https://twitter.com/PoliticsForAlI/status/1414956533025280020?s=20

    These MPs' bullying private citizens about what political views they should express (i.e. not those critical of Boris Johnson's government) is deeply troubling. This practice started with New Labour (I never recalled it happening hitherto) but is now becoming endemic. Politicians need to learn some grace.
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 43,443
    DavidL said:

    Carnyx said:

    malcolmg said:

    DavidL said:

    50 deaths today, up 50% in the last 7 days. Hospital admissions also up 50% in the same time. The rate of increase of new cases is slowing a bit but these are not great figures, especially when vaccinations are down to 175k.

    Scottish numbers looking better
    Schools skailed earlier, likewise footie - hopefully a harbinger of a similar fall down south.
    We really proper acknowledgement of the selflessness of our football team. It would have been so easy to knock in a couple of goals whilst running England ragged but no, the greater good.
    Oh, I don't know - I quite like the Zen timelessness of never having to worry abourt whether they win anyuthing or not. It's like going coarse fishing with a bottle of Highland Park in the tackle box.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 56,606
    Today, for maybe the first time since March 2020, Camden felt normal. Completely normal

    Masks have almost gone from streets. All the social distance barriers have gone. Shops are dismantling the one way systems (already)

    The place was bustling, the sun shone, even the homeless cracked a smile as we all laughed at them and threw hot broth in their stupid homeless faces

    And, yes, there are lots of shuttered shops and caffs etc, but today I noticed a frenzy of building: new shops, new restaurants, new lets

    Encouraging
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 43,443

    HYUFD said:

    Tory MP Andrew Rosindell tells Tyrone Mings to focus on football not politics

    https://twitter.com/PoliticsForAlI/status/1414956533025280020?s=20

    Pompous twat.
    Bit hard on HYUFD - he's been better recently, no tanks or treason. He actually agreed with me the other day.
  • Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 65,826

    HYUFD said:

    Tory MP Andrew Rosindell tells Tyrone Mings to focus on football not politics

    https://twitter.com/PoliticsForAlI/status/1414956533025280020?s=20

    These MPs' bullying private citizens about what political views they should express (i.e. not those critical of Boris Johnson's government) is deeply troubling. This practice started with New Labour (I never recalled it happening hitherto) but is now becoming endemic. Politicians need to learn some grace.
    Twitter doesn't help. As usual.
  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 60,216
    Meanwhile, in Jersey:

    Jersey press conference latest in this thread...

    Chief Minister:

    •Freedom Day delayed to 5 August
    •We should not risk reopening high risk settings like nightclubs while younger people remain unvaccinated
    •Continue to work from home if you can
    .....

    ... this is a biiiiiiig u-turn on the policies and statements of the past few weeks - flies in the face of what's been said.

    That will be the rub for many, especially given hospital rates are very low.


    https://twitter.com/GaryBurgessCI/status/1414964860991967244?s=20
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830
    Carnyx said:

    malcolmg said:

    DavidL said:

    50 deaths today, up 50% in the last 7 days. Hospital admissions also up 50% in the same time. The rate of increase of new cases is slowing a bit but these are not great figures, especially when vaccinations are down to 175k.

    Scottish numbers looking better
    Schools skailed earlier, likewise footie - hopefully a harbinger of a similar fall down south.
    "Skailed" is excellent. Had to look it up.
  • northern_monkeynorthern_monkey Posts: 1,640

    How others see us...

    ...For his colleague Walter Oppenheimer, Sunday – and indeed the path that had led to the final – revealed some deeper truths about England as both a team and a country.

    “What happens with England when it comes to football happens with other things, too,” wrote Oppenheimer. “While it is a powerful, advanced and often generous country, '[and] a pioneer in disciplines from science to art and thought, it is also a petulant country, incapable of accepting its limitations.”


    https://www.theguardian.com/football/2021/jul/13/england-euro-2020-chaos-wembley-european-press-review

    Those in glass houses shouldn't throw stones.....Hooliganism and overt racism towards players (any by players) is far worse in most European countries.

    For instance, I could link to so many stories of monkey chants at players during Italian games.
    Textbook whataboutery, well done.
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 43,443

    Off-topic:

    The Florida condo collapse has spewed out the usual rubbish on the Internet. However, I've found the following channel quite good at looking at what may have happened, from the perspective of a professional in repairing concrete. Even better, he changes his views as the evidence comes in.

    https://www.youtube.com/c/BuildingIntegrity

    There's a possibility that planters on the pool deck were a significant causal factor in the collapse ...

    I've said it before, and I'll say it again; concrete is fascinating, as much an art as a science.

    (From his perspective: he produces a few videos in a sector that is usually uninteresting to people. Then this happens in his state, and I bet his views went up massively.)

    Absolutely. I came across the same video chap by accident a week or so back - rather good. I hadn't realised he had evolved so will have another look, thanks.
  • FF43FF43 Posts: 17,247

    Spending on overseas aid should happen because a program is deemed the right thing to do and is value for money.

    Not to hit an artificial domestic percentage of GNI target.

    Personally I think suddenly leaving vulnerable people in the lurch for no other reason than Johnson wanted to get a cheap headline and pander to the prejudices of his base is neither value for money nor particularly humane.

    Mileages differ of course.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 82,533
    edited July 2021

    How others see us...

    ...For his colleague Walter Oppenheimer, Sunday – and indeed the path that had led to the final – revealed some deeper truths about England as both a team and a country.

    “What happens with England when it comes to football happens with other things, too,” wrote Oppenheimer. “While it is a powerful, advanced and often generous country, '[and] a pioneer in disciplines from science to art and thought, it is also a petulant country, incapable of accepting its limitations.”


    https://www.theguardian.com/football/2021/jul/13/england-euro-2020-chaos-wembley-european-press-review

    Those in glass houses shouldn't throw stones.....Hooliganism and overt racism towards players (any by players) is far worse in most European countries.

    For instance, I could link to so many stories of monkey chants at players during Italian games.
    Textbook whataboutery, well done.
    From the journalists absolutely.....those terrible racist Brits with all their hooligans, we never have anything like that here.

    When in reality, trouble at grounds in the UK is incredibly rare and isolated these days. That is why it is so shocking when it happens. Same with overt racism. It is headline news when one knuckle dragger makes a monkey gesture and they are rightly banned for life.

    The authorities and clubs take very strong action like banning orders.

    Where as it is totally normal part of football in many European countries in the way it was here in the 80s. Italy the ultras run parts of the stadium, with overt links to extreme politics.

    Even during these Euros, we had Hungarian fans with unashamed racist and homophobic banners.
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 43,443
    IshmaelZ said:

    Carnyx said:

    malcolmg said:

    DavidL said:

    50 deaths today, up 50% in the last 7 days. Hospital admissions also up 50% in the same time. The rate of increase of new cases is slowing a bit but these are not great figures, especially when vaccinations are down to 175k.

    Scottish numbers looking better
    Schools skailed earlier, likewise footie - hopefully a harbinger of a similar fall down south.
    "Skailed" is excellent. Had to look it up.
    It's how you can tell Malky and I aren't Russian bots. Not yet, anyway.
  • tlg86tlg86 Posts: 26,223
    Carnyx said:

    🚨🚨 | BREAKING: Fans attending sporting events in England after July 19 will require a Covid passport and will be told to wear masks

    Via @TelegraphSport

    Be interesting to see if they take any notice of wear masking.

    Were they supposed to wear them at the Euros?
    Probably when not seated. I'd imagine the same was true at Wimbledon. Interestingly, neither the yobs at the football or the poshos at SW19 were particularly keen to wear them.
  • Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 65,826
    FF43 said:

    Spending on overseas aid should happen because a program is deemed the right thing to do and is value for money.

    Not to hit an artificial domestic percentage of GNI target.

    Personally I think suddenly leaving vulnerable people in the lurch for no other reason than Johnson wanted to get a cheap headline and pander to the prejudices of his base is neither value for money nor particularly humane.

    Mileages differ of course.
    Yes they do differ.

    We should be cutting our funding to "organisations" etc and let them use their own funds or raise funds from others.

    We're giving a higher percentage of aid than Blair did or the EU give. So if others won't step up to the plate, that's on them.
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 63,669
    HYUFD said:

    Tory MP Andrew Rosindell tells Tyrone Mings to focus on football not politics

    https://twitter.com/PoliticsForAlI/status/1414956533025280020?s=20

    He is as deaf eared as Natalie Elphicke and @HYUFD
  • algarkirkalgarkirk Posts: 12,902
    Andy_JS said:

    Brendan O'Neill's latest piece in Spiked.

    "Racist football fans? This is a moral panic
    Someone has to say it: the problem of racism in football has been massively blown out of proportion."

    https://www.spiked-online.com/2021/07/13/racist-football-fans-this-is-a-moral-panic/

    One aspect of the overdone nature of things is fairly clear, and there are only one or two solutions.

    I think it is fair to say that overt direct racism of the extreme right wing sort is fairly uncommon. There's lot's of the more subtle sort of course but that's another story.

    In a population of 50 million if one in 10,000 is of the social media keyboard warrior racist type, that is 5,000 people.

    If 5,000 people seriously go to work on racist bile they can create a storm on Twitter and elsewhere.

    In the olden days these people existed in numbers. But just for the last few years every one of these 5,000 people is an international publisher, with free global distribution and, as a bonus, a wider media will give them lots of attention because it fills space.

    As the 1 in 10,000 nutter isn't going away, never has, never will, there are only these solutions:

    ignore
    criminalise, prosecute and imprison with vigour
    make the platforms publishers and criminalise the outlet who allow it on their platform

  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 60,216

    HYUFD said:

    Tory MP Andrew Rosindell tells Tyrone Mings to focus on football not politics

    https://twitter.com/PoliticsForAlI/status/1414956533025280020?s=20

    These MPs' bullying private citizens about what political views they should express (i.e. not those critical of Boris Johnson's government) is deeply troubling. This practice started with New Labour (I never recalled it happening hitherto) but is now becoming endemic. Politicians need to learn some grace.
    Nah - it's been going on forever. My favourite used to be "the Church should keep out of politics" - bit like saying "the Church should keep out of life".

    Now the smartest public figures steer clear of party politics, but saying they should keep out of politics is stupid.
  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 60,216
    SKS:

    The Conservatives have just voted to cut international aid.

    Cutting aid to help the world's poorest during a pandemic is callous - and not in our national interest.

    Boris Johnson is damaging Britain's reputation around the world.


    And possibly improving his own at home.....

    https://twitter.com/Keir_Starmer/status/1414971494308929539?s=20
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 42,172
    edited July 2021
    What a weedy, wee clype!


  • LeonLeon Posts: 56,606
    edited July 2021
    Fuck

    Plague done, war next?


    A Chinese military video from 2 days ago. Threatening first strike nukes against Japan if the Japs try to defend Taiwan

    #CCP Vows to Nuke #Japan if Japan defends #Taiwan. As Japan is the only country that has been nuked, so nuking Japan "will get twice the result with half the effort."
    中共軍事頻道威脅對日本實施連續核打擊,直到日本第二次無條件投降。


    https://twitter.com/jenniferatntd/status/1414971285160005634?s=20

    Seems to be legit, millions of views (in China, on the original military propaganda channel)

    China is flexing its muscles, and they are powerful. Japan will have no choice but to back down. I do not see the West going to nuclear war to defend Taiwan, I do not see how Taiwan can defend itself for that long. Ergo, it is lost
  • noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 23,156

    HYUFD said:

    Tory MP Andrew Rosindell tells Tyrone Mings to focus on football not politics

    https://twitter.com/PoliticsForAlI/status/1414956533025280020?s=20

    These MPs' bullying private citizens about what political views they should express (i.e. not those critical of Boris Johnson's government) is deeply troubling. This practice started with New Labour (I never recalled it happening hitherto) but is now becoming endemic. Politicians need to learn some grace.
    Nah - it's been going on forever. My favourite used to be "the Church should keep out of politics" - bit like saying "the Church should keep out of life".

    Now the smartest public figures steer clear of party politics, but saying they should keep out of politics is stupid.
    Agree it is has been going on since democracies first started. Those with power don't want outsiders butting in.

    If we really believe in participatory democracy, we should welcome participation, especially from the young who tend to be under represented in elections.

    Too many simply believe in their side winning, rather than the democratic process, which includes famous people expressing views they disagree with.
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830

    HYUFD said:

    Tory MP Andrew Rosindell tells Tyrone Mings to focus on football not politics

    https://twitter.com/PoliticsForAlI/status/1414956533025280020?s=20

    These MPs' bullying private citizens about what political views they should express (i.e. not those critical of Boris Johnson's government) is deeply troubling. This practice started with New Labour (I never recalled it happening hitherto) but is now becoming endemic. Politicians need to learn some grace.
    Nah - it's been going on forever. My favourite used to be "the Church should keep out of politics" - bit like saying "the Church should keep out of life".

    Now the smartest public figures steer clear of party politics, but saying they should keep out of politics is stupid.
    Sure, but IF they descend into the political arena, harmless gags about trying not to look like an arthritic duck when taking penalties are in order

    Plus all politics is party politics, an aphorism for which I should go down in history, and it's true.
  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 60,216
    Leon said:

    Japan will have no choice but to back down.

    Or build its own bomb.....

  • Andy_CookeAndy_Cooke Posts: 5,039
    I've gone back to my crude model I mentioned a week or so ago to see how close it has been so far.

    Bearing in mind how simplistic it was, I'll be impressed if it's in the ballpark, but so far, not too bad.

    I'm looking at the 7-day average of cases by speciment date (England-only) and the 7-day average of hospital admissions (England-only) and the hospital occupancy figures (England-only).

    One week in was the 3rd of July. Predictions were 25,510 cases, 333 hospitalisations, 1998 occupancy.
    Actual figures were 24,246 cases, 360 hospitalisations, 1705 occupancy
    (remember that these are 7-day averages and put to the centre of those seven days).

    Not bad.

    Still need a few more days data for 10th July (specimen date cases need to come through and be valid enough for 11, 12, 13 July to get the 7-day average centred on the 10th; the same for hospital admissions).
    Prediction for the 7 day average in England as of the 10th of July was 35,980 cases, 485 hospitalisations, 2811 occupancy.
    The reported figures are encouraging for the cases. If hospitalisations are around 510-520 for the 12th and 525-535 for the 13th, that should make the 7-day average very close to 485. Occupancy was 2429 which is significantly short.

    The model looks at us topping out between 55,000-60,000 cases per day sometime between 28th July and 3rd August, with hospitalisations topping out around 850 per day a week later and hospital occupancy around 4500 or so at around the same time, all of which I had thought looked significantly overoptimistic. The apparent start of a slowdown in cases is rather encouraging. Still early days, though.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 124,051
    Leon said:

    Fuck

    Plague done, war next?


    A Chinese military video from 2 days ago. Threatening first strike nukes against Japan if the Japs try to defend Taiwan

    #CCP Vows to Nuke #Japan if Japan defends #Taiwan. As Japan is the only country that has been nuked, so nuking Japan "will get twice the result with half the effort."
    中共軍事頻道威脅對日本實施連續核打擊,直到日本第二次無條件投降。


    https://twitter.com/jenniferatntd/status/1414971285160005634?s=20

    Seems to be legit, millions of views (in China, on the original military propaganda channel)

    China is flexing its muscles, and they are powerful. Japan will have no choice but to back down. I do not see the West going to nuclear war to defend Taiwan, I do not see how Taiwan can defend itself for that long. Ergo, it is lost

    Simple answer, Taiwan develops its own nukes.

    Taiwan has the scientists to do so and had a nuclear weapons programme in the past


    https://www.nti.org/learn/countries/taiwan/#:~:text=Taiwan does not possess nuclear,such programs in the past.
  • Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 65,826
    What a remarkable collapse at the end of the Pakistani innings.

    Bit late in a 50-over ODI though.

    Setting up an interesting run chase for England. At least its not just an easy walkover like the rest of white ball cricket has been recently.
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 63,669
    Nigelb said:

    This poll on foreign aid may surprise some politicians

    https://twitter.com/SavantaComRes/status/1401927434333835266?s=19

    No surprise.
    Britons are curtain-twitching, Mail-reading, spite-mongers. Who hate freedom (especially other people’s).
    Do you not concede that this poll supports the reduction in foreign aid across all political groups and ages
    I don’t believe in running the country according to whatever lowest-denominator impulses can be discerned from polling.

    Sad that this is another example of your piously refusing to part with a smidgeon of your triple-locked wealth.
    A bit ad hom. , but agreed.
    I am still awaiting an apology as I have always supported cancelling the triple lock, though both my wife and I are pensioners

    I have said so on here on many occasions

    In addition I support the following in case there is any doubt

    The £20 Universal credit uplift made permanent

    100% behind Marcus Rashford's campaign for free school meals

    And I am not alone with conservative mps also supporting these three issues
  • malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 43,529

    malcolmg said:

    Carnyx said:

    malcolmg said:

    POLICE Scotland have launched a formal investigation into potential criminality involving SNP fundraising.

    The force, which has been assessing a fraud allegation from a member of the public since late March, said it had escalated its work after consulting with prosecutors.


    https://www.heraldscotland.com/politics/19438528.police-scotland-launch-fraud-probe-snp-fundraising-indyref2/

    Where are Pete and the magpie hiding, the vultures are circling Murrell Towers. Will some try to save their own skins or will they choose to go down with the Ceaușescu's.
    It is what we expect from nationalists really. The choice for nationalist voters/English haters north of the border might be one bunch led by folk that are under investigation for fraud, or a minnow party led by a man who was described by his own QC as a "bully and a sex pest". And they try and make out the Tories are sleazy! British National Party or Scottish National Party. In the end they both amount to the same. Racists and sleaze bags, mostly!
    Can you really not tell the difference between

    (a) hating the English
    and
    (b) not wanting to be ruled by them?

    That's on a par with regarding the Unitarians as anti-Tory because they don't support the C of E or its rule by HMTQ.
    Carnyx, he is a nasty bellend , a Scottish hater and to be pitied rather than chastised.
    Correction: I have many Scottish friends, and I hate no-one. Based on your abusive, ranting, often incoherent words that roughly pass as posts I could possibly make an exception for yourself. How are the anger management lessons going? Are you still a fan of the fat little toad? Does it bother you that Salmond was described as a "bully and a sex pest" by his QC, or does he still deserve your adoration?

    Sorry too many questions for your very small parochial mind I guess.
    Jog on loser, save your verbal diarrhoea for someone who gives a F**k.
  • northern_monkeynorthern_monkey Posts: 1,640

    How others see us...

    ...For his colleague Walter Oppenheimer, Sunday – and indeed the path that had led to the final – revealed some deeper truths about England as both a team and a country.

    “What happens with England when it comes to football happens with other things, too,” wrote Oppenheimer. “While it is a powerful, advanced and often generous country, '[and] a pioneer in disciplines from science to art and thought, it is also a petulant country, incapable of accepting its limitations.”


    https://www.theguardian.com/football/2021/jul/13/england-euro-2020-chaos-wembley-european-press-review

    Those in glass houses shouldn't throw stones.....Hooliganism and overt racism towards players (any by players) is far worse in most European countries.

    For instance, I could link to so many stories of monkey chants at players during Italian games.
    Textbook whataboutery, well done.
    From the journalists absolutely.....those terrible racist Brits with all their hooligans, we never have anything like that here.

    When in reality, trouble at grounds in the UK is incredibly rare and isolated these days. That is why it is so shocking when it happens. Same with overt racism. It is headline news when one knuckle dragger makes a monkey gesture and they are rightly banned for life.

    The authorities and clubs take very strong action like banning orders.

    Where as it is totally normal part of football in many European countries in the way it was here in the 80s. Italy the ultras run parts of the stadium, with overt links to extreme politics.

    Even during these Euros, we had Hungarian fans with unashamed racist and homophobic banners.
    It's that kind of thin skinned petulance, the refusal to acknowledge our own shortcomings, to refuse to consider that there might be something a teeny tiny bit off at times with our national character, that reinforces precisely what the journalists are saying.
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 43,515
    Carnyx said:

    Off-topic:

    The Florida condo collapse has spewed out the usual rubbish on the Internet. However, I've found the following channel quite good at looking at what may have happened, from the perspective of a professional in repairing concrete. Even better, he changes his views as the evidence comes in.

    https://www.youtube.com/c/BuildingIntegrity

    There's a possibility that planters on the pool deck were a significant causal factor in the collapse ...

    I've said it before, and I'll say it again; concrete is fascinating, as much an art as a science.

    (From his perspective: he produces a few videos in a sector that is usually uninteresting to people. Then this happens in his state, and I bet his views went up massively.)

    Absolutely. I came across the same video chap by accident a week or so back - rather good. I hadn't realised he had evolved so will have another look, thanks.
    TBF, it was mainly in the first few days. But his views are compelling and, unless the rubble provides evidence not available to hi, I bet he's in the ballpark.
  • noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 23,156
    tlg86 said:

    Carnyx said:

    🚨🚨 | BREAKING: Fans attending sporting events in England after July 19 will require a Covid passport and will be told to wear masks

    Via @TelegraphSport

    Be interesting to see if they take any notice of wear masking.

    Were they supposed to wear them at the Euros?
    Probably when not seated. I'd imagine the same was true at Wimbledon. Interestingly, neither the yobs at the football or the poshos at SW19 were particularly keen to wear them.
    At both venues, on entry and moving around you were supposed to wear them, but not once at your seat so similar to the indoor restaurant rules. At Wimbledon it was enforced on entry, at Wembley not really. Once inside the grounds less than 10% compliance at both, probably 1-3% at a guess.
  • Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 65,826
    edited July 2021

    Nigelb said:

    This poll on foreign aid may surprise some politicians

    https://twitter.com/SavantaComRes/status/1401927434333835266?s=19

    No surprise.
    Britons are curtain-twitching, Mail-reading, spite-mongers. Who hate freedom (especially other people’s).
    Do you not concede that this poll supports the reduction in foreign aid across all political groups and ages
    I don’t believe in running the country according to whatever lowest-denominator impulses can be discerned from polling.

    Sad that this is another example of your piously refusing to part with a smidgeon of your triple-locked wealth.
    A bit ad hom. , but agreed.
    I am still awaiting an apology as I have always supported cancelling the triple lock, though both my wife and I are pensioners

    I have said so on here on many occasions

    In addition I support the following in case there is any doubt

    The £20 Universal credit uplift made permanent

    100% behind Marcus Rashford's campaign for free school meals

    And I am not alone with conservative mps also supporting these three issues
    I'm with you on those. Though I'd rather see other reforms to UC (abolishing the taper) as my preferred preference, but nobody in politics is proposing that.

    I think a lot more people care about school meals etc than do 'international aid' to bloated aid 'charities' capable of paying millions per year to people like David Miliband.
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 54,040
    Carnyx said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    Carnyx said:

    malcolmg said:

    DavidL said:

    50 deaths today, up 50% in the last 7 days. Hospital admissions also up 50% in the same time. The rate of increase of new cases is slowing a bit but these are not great figures, especially when vaccinations are down to 175k.

    Scottish numbers looking better
    Schools skailed earlier, likewise footie - hopefully a harbinger of a similar fall down south.
    "Skailed" is excellent. Had to look it up.
    It's how you can tell Malky and I aren't Russian bots. Not yet, anyway.
    Are you looking for sponsorship?
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 51,211
    UK cases by specimen date

    image
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 51,211
    UK cases by specimen date and scaled to 100K

    image
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 51,211
    England PCR positivity

    image
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 51,211
    UK case summary

    image
    image
    image
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 43,443
    DavidL said:

    Carnyx said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    Carnyx said:

    malcolmg said:

    DavidL said:

    50 deaths today, up 50% in the last 7 days. Hospital admissions also up 50% in the same time. The rate of increase of new cases is slowing a bit but these are not great figures, especially when vaccinations are down to 175k.

    Scottish numbers looking better
    Schools skailed earlier, likewise footie - hopefully a harbinger of a similar fall down south.
    "Skailed" is excellent. Had to look it up.
    It's how you can tell Malky and I aren't Russian bots. Not yet, anyway.
    Are you looking for sponsorship?
    No, not like the Scottish Tories and their tennis games - just reflecting on the competition, i.e. likely advances in AI. When the bots can get the Scottish double positive makes a negative idiom right, it'll be horrendous on PB. But I'm sure it fries their little brains.
  • Sean_FSean_F Posts: 37,552
    Leon said:

    Fuck

    Plague done, war next?


    A Chinese military video from 2 days ago. Threatening first strike nukes against Japan if the Japs try to defend Taiwan

    #CCP Vows to Nuke #Japan if Japan defends #Taiwan. As Japan is the only country that has been nuked, so nuking Japan "will get twice the result with half the effort."
    中共軍事頻道威脅對日本實施連續核打擊,直到日本第二次無條件投降。


    https://twitter.com/jenniferatntd/status/1414971285160005634?s=20

    Seems to be legit, millions of views (in China, on the original military propaganda channel)

    China is flexing its muscles, and they are powerful. Japan will have no choice but to back down. I do not see the West going to nuclear war to defend Taiwan, I do not see how Taiwan can defend itself for that long. Ergo, it is lost

    China would have to be insane to attack Taiwan, or to launch nuclear weapons against Japan. When one set flies, they all fly.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 51,211
    UK Hospitals

    image
    image
    image
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 51,211
    UK deaths

    image
    image
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 51,211
    UK R

    image
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 51,211
    Age related data

    image
    image
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 54,040

    Leon said:

    Japan will have no choice but to back down.

    Or build its own bomb.....

    First we got the bomb and that was good...
  • Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 65,826

    UK deaths

    image

    This is the key chart and why it is 100% correct to end legal restrictions, mask mandates, social distancing and the rest of the bollocks this next week.

    Heck it was right to do so last month.
  • NemtynakhtNemtynakht Posts: 2,329

    HYUFD said:

    Tory MP Andrew Rosindell tells Tyrone Mings to focus on football not politics

    https://twitter.com/PoliticsForAlI/status/1414956533025280020?s=20

    Why doesn't he ask his boss, the last politician who tried to take on a footballer how that turned out.....
    Personally I'm getting a bit sick of the footballers putting their oar in.

    I'm not sure who is advising Ming's but to put forward that an Asian home secretary is racist is unfathomable. I don't agree with Patel on a lot of things but I personally think taking the knee has gone too far and is just gesture politics just like the kick it out stuff that used to be trailed at football. Does anyone sane think that footballers doing that has any impact on the level of racism in the world? Are we really saying that the undoubtedly racist people around are going to see the images and think they are wrong for being racist?

    I was listening to radio 4 yesterday and they actually put forward the idea that Saka, Sancho and Rashford were only being criticised for missing their penalties because they are black. Now I don't have to think hard to remember the criticism of previous penalty takers such as southgate and Pearce, and who can forget the gallows and effigy if Beckham after his world cup red card.

    Like 99% of other people I want less racism in the world but it seems that we have entered the twilight zone since Sunday.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 56,606
    Sean_F said:

    Leon said:

    Fuck

    Plague done, war next?


    A Chinese military video from 2 days ago. Threatening first strike nukes against Japan if the Japs try to defend Taiwan

    #CCP Vows to Nuke #Japan if Japan defends #Taiwan. As Japan is the only country that has been nuked, so nuking Japan "will get twice the result with half the effort."
    中共軍事頻道威脅對日本實施連續核打擊,直到日本第二次無條件投降。


    https://twitter.com/jenniferatntd/status/1414971285160005634?s=20

    Seems to be legit, millions of views (in China, on the original military propaganda channel)

    China is flexing its muscles, and they are powerful. Japan will have no choice but to back down. I do not see the West going to nuclear war to defend Taiwan, I do not see how Taiwan can defend itself for that long. Ergo, it is lost

    China would have to be insane to attack Taiwan, or to launch nuclear weapons against Japan. When one set flies, they all fly.
    They just have to bully Japan into submission, then they could probably take Taiwan with threats. And not fire a single bullet. They are close to having that military superiority
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 51,211
    Vaccinations

    image
    image
    image
    image
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 51,211
    Hospital vs cases

    image
    image
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 51,211
    Case rate change

    We are still waiting on alot of data - anything after the 8th is not really useful

    image
  • Sean_FSean_F Posts: 37,552
    Leon said:

    Sean_F said:

    Leon said:

    Fuck

    Plague done, war next?


    A Chinese military video from 2 days ago. Threatening first strike nukes against Japan if the Japs try to defend Taiwan

    #CCP Vows to Nuke #Japan if Japan defends #Taiwan. As Japan is the only country that has been nuked, so nuking Japan "will get twice the result with half the effort."
    中共軍事頻道威脅對日本實施連續核打擊,直到日本第二次無條件投降。


    https://twitter.com/jenniferatntd/status/1414971285160005634?s=20

    Seems to be legit, millions of views (in China, on the original military propaganda channel)

    China is flexing its muscles, and they are powerful. Japan will have no choice but to back down. I do not see the West going to nuclear war to defend Taiwan, I do not see how Taiwan can defend itself for that long. Ergo, it is lost

    China would have to be insane to attack Taiwan, or to launch nuclear weapons against Japan. When one set flies, they all fly.
    They just have to bully Japan into submission, then they could probably take Taiwan with threats. And not fire a single bullet. They are close to having that military superiority
    Why would either Taiwan or Japan allow themselves to be bullied? Without question, if China launched a nuclear strike against Japan, the US would hit back very hard. And, trying to take a heavily defended island, across 100 miles of sea sounds like a prelude to disaster to me.
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 54,040
    Sean_F said:

    Leon said:

    Sean_F said:

    Leon said:

    Fuck

    Plague done, war next?


    A Chinese military video from 2 days ago. Threatening first strike nukes against Japan if the Japs try to defend Taiwan

    #CCP Vows to Nuke #Japan if Japan defends #Taiwan. As Japan is the only country that has been nuked, so nuking Japan "will get twice the result with half the effort."
    中共軍事頻道威脅對日本實施連續核打擊,直到日本第二次無條件投降。


    https://twitter.com/jenniferatntd/status/1414971285160005634?s=20

    Seems to be legit, millions of views (in China, on the original military propaganda channel)

    China is flexing its muscles, and they are powerful. Japan will have no choice but to back down. I do not see the West going to nuclear war to defend Taiwan, I do not see how Taiwan can defend itself for that long. Ergo, it is lost

    China would have to be insane to attack Taiwan, or to launch nuclear weapons against Japan. When one set flies, they all fly.
    They just have to bully Japan into submission, then they could probably take Taiwan with threats. And not fire a single bullet. They are close to having that military superiority
    Why would either Taiwan or Japan allow themselves to be bullied? Without question, if China launched a nuclear strike against Japan, the US would hit back very hard. And, trying to take a heavily defended island, across 100 miles of sea sounds like a prelude to disaster to me.
    Am I the only one that's a bit twitchy that we have a somewhat lightly guarded aircraft carrier steaming happily towards this?
  • RogerRoger Posts: 19,985

    FF43 said:

    Spending on overseas aid should happen because a program is deemed the right thing to do and is value for money.

    Not to hit an artificial domestic percentage of GNI target.

    Personally I think suddenly leaving vulnerable people in the lurch for no other reason than Johnson wanted to get a cheap headline and pander to the prejudices of his base is neither value for money nor particularly humane.

    Mileages differ of course.
    Yes they do differ.

    We should be cutting our funding to "organisations" etc and let them use their own funds or raise funds from others.

    We're giving a higher percentage of aid than Blair did or the EU give. So if others won't step up to the plate, that's on them.
    You remind people daily why they don't like Tories.
  • Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 65,826
    Roger said:

    FF43 said:

    Spending on overseas aid should happen because a program is deemed the right thing to do and is value for money.

    Not to hit an artificial domestic percentage of GNI target.

    Personally I think suddenly leaving vulnerable people in the lurch for no other reason than Johnson wanted to get a cheap headline and pander to the prejudices of his base is neither value for money nor particularly humane.

    Mileages differ of course.
    Yes they do differ.

    We should be cutting our funding to "organisations" etc and let them use their own funds or raise funds from others.

    We're giving a higher percentage of aid than Blair did or the EU give. So if others won't step up to the plate, that's on them.
    You remind people daily why they don't like Tories.
    Bollocks.

    The public would rather the government give money to Rashford's campaign than to David Miliband's.
  • lloydylloydy Posts: 36
    Sean_F said:

    Leon said:

    Fuck

    Plague done, war next?


    A Chinese military video from 2 days ago. Threatening first strike nukes against Japan if the Japs try to defend Taiwan

    #CCP Vows to Nuke #Japan if Japan defends #Taiwan. As Japan is the only country that has been nuked, so nuking Japan "will get twice the result with half the effort."
    中共軍事頻道威脅對日本實施連續核打擊,直到日本第二次無條件投降。


    https://twitter.com/jenniferatntd/status/1414971285160005634?s=20

    Seems to be legit, millions of views (in China, on the original military propaganda channel)

    China is flexing its muscles, and they are powerful. Japan will have no choice but to back down. I do not see the West going to nuclear war to defend Taiwan, I do not see how Taiwan can defend itself for that long. Ergo, it is lost

    China would have to be insane to attack Taiwan, or to launch nuclear weapons against Japan. When one set flies, they all fly.
    Indeed. I couldn't see the yanks not getting involved.
  • BromBrom Posts: 3,760

    HYUFD said:

    Tory MP Andrew Rosindell tells Tyrone Mings to focus on football not politics

    https://twitter.com/PoliticsForAlI/status/1414956533025280020?s=20

    Why doesn't he ask his boss, the last politician who tried to take on a footballer how that turned out.....
    Personally I'm getting a bit sick of the footballers putting their oar in.

    I'm not sure who is advising Ming's but to put forward that an Asian home secretary is racist is unfathomable. I don't agree with Patel on a lot of things but I personally think taking the knee has gone too far and is just gesture politics just like the kick it out stuff that used to be trailed at football. Does anyone sane think that footballers doing that has any impact on the level of racism in the world? Are we really saying that the undoubtedly racist people around are going to see the images and think they are wrong for being racist?

    I was listening to radio 4 yesterday and they actually put forward the idea that Saka, Sancho and Rashford were only being criticised for missing their penalties because they are black. Now I don't have to think hard to remember the criticism of previous penalty takers such as southgate and Pearce, and who can forget the gallows and effigy if Beckham after his world cup red card.

    Like 99% of other people I want less racism in the world but it seems that we have entered the twilight zone since Sunday.
    I think there's a lot to agree with there. Defacing the Rashford mural was apalling behaviour but the BBC describing it as racist showed they have no understanding or memory of the abuse previous England fall guys have faced.
  • HYUFD said:

    Tory MP Andrew Rosindell tells Tyrone Mings to focus on football not politics

    https://twitter.com/PoliticsForAlI/status/1414956533025280020?s=20

    *Open mouth, insert foot*

    Rosindell is an idiot. 🤦‍♂️
    Perhaps it's just the Tory Party descending into further and further shite.

    You support a PM with as much inability to keep his foot out of his mouth - so where does it end Philip?
  • noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 23,156

    HYUFD said:

    Tory MP Andrew Rosindell tells Tyrone Mings to focus on football not politics

    https://twitter.com/PoliticsForAlI/status/1414956533025280020?s=20

    Why doesn't he ask his boss, the last politician who tried to take on a footballer how that turned out.....
    Personally I'm getting a bit sick of the footballers putting their oar in.

    I'm not sure who is advising Ming's but to put forward that an Asian home secretary is racist is unfathomable. I don't agree with Patel on a lot of things but I personally think taking the knee has gone too far and is just gesture politics just like the kick it out stuff that used to be trailed at football. Does anyone sane think that footballers doing that has any impact on the level of racism in the world? Are we really saying that the undoubtedly racist people around are going to see the images and think they are wrong for being racist?

    I was listening to radio 4 yesterday and they actually put forward the idea that Saka, Sancho and Rashford were only being criticised for missing their penalties because they are black. Now I don't have to think hard to remember the criticism of previous penalty takers such as southgate and Pearce, and who can forget the gallows and effigy if Beckham after his world cup red card.

    Like 99% of other people I want less racism in the world but it seems that we have entered the twilight zone since Sunday.
    Footballers are part of the country, they have a right to say what they believe.
    He did not say she was racist, he said she did not support their anti-racism campaign.
    Asians can be racist.
    Yes, I am sane, and the actions and words of the people kids want to be like, make a real difference to the number of racists in the country.

    You are right on a couple of things, taking the knee is indeed gesture politics, by definition, but gesture politics is not always bad. And the coverage has been overblown.
  • Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 65,826

    HYUFD said:

    Tory MP Andrew Rosindell tells Tyrone Mings to focus on football not politics

    https://twitter.com/PoliticsForAlI/status/1414956533025280020?s=20

    *Open mouth, insert foot*

    Rosindell is an idiot. 🤦‍♂️
    Perhaps it's just the Tory Party descending into further and further shite.

    You support a PM with as much inability to keep his foot out of his mouth - so where does it end Philip?
    It never ends. Its just feet in mouth all the way down.
  • contrariancontrarian Posts: 5,818
    https://www.ox.ac.uk/news/2021-04-23-malaria-vaccine-becomes-first-achieve-who-specified-75-efficacy-goal

    Now here is a vaccine I would definitely take....

    What fantastic news
  • eekeek Posts: 28,592
    If only there was a foreign aid budget to pay for some vaccination schemes..
  • RogerRoger Posts: 19,985
    edited July 2021

    SKS:

    The Conservatives have just voted to cut international aid.

    Cutting aid to help the world's poorest during a pandemic is callous - and not in our national interest.

    Boris Johnson is damaging Britain's reputation around the world.


    And possibly improving his own at home.....

    https://twitter.com/Keir_Starmer/status/1414971494308929539?s=20

    I doubt it. Whatever people might say they expect their leaders to have more humane instincts than they have themselves. It's also an easy one to shoot down. Is his wallpaper worth some kids in Gaza going hungry?
  • darkagedarkage Posts: 5,398
    Leon said:

    Fuck

    Plague done, war next?


    A Chinese military video from 2 days ago. Threatening first strike nukes against Japan if the Japs try to defend Taiwan

    #CCP Vows to Nuke #Japan if Japan defends #Taiwan. As Japan is the only country that has been nuked, so nuking Japan "will get twice the result with half the effort."
    中共軍事頻道威脅對日本實施連續核打擊,直到日本第二次無條件投降。


    https://twitter.com/jenniferatntd/status/1414971285160005634?s=20

    Seems to be legit, millions of views (in China, on the original military propaganda channel)

    China is flexing its muscles, and they are powerful. Japan will have no choice but to back down. I do not see the West going to nuclear war to defend Taiwan, I do not see how Taiwan can defend itself for that long. Ergo, it is lost

    I think that it may be a bit early to say the plague is over.

    Regarding China, the reality is that they have just done a defacto invasion of Hong Kong with no consequence, so unless something changes it is only a matter of time until it is game over for Taiwan. They will probably look at sweeping up the islands in the south China sea that they want, and then they will probably stop for a while, at least in terms of their blunt territorial ambitions.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 82,533
    Russia reports 780 new coronavirus deaths, the biggest one-day increase on record, and 24,702 new cases

    https://twitter.com/BNODesk/status/1414978747875446787?s=20
  • SelebianSelebian Posts: 8,832
    Brom said:

    HYUFD said:

    Tory MP Andrew Rosindell tells Tyrone Mings to focus on football not politics

    https://twitter.com/PoliticsForAlI/status/1414956533025280020?s=20

    Why doesn't he ask his boss, the last politician who tried to take on a footballer how that turned out.....
    Personally I'm getting a bit sick of the footballers putting their oar in.

    I'm not sure who is advising Ming's but to put forward that an Asian home secretary is racist is unfathomable. I don't agree with Patel on a lot of things but I personally think taking the knee has gone too far and is just gesture politics just like the kick it out stuff that used to be trailed at football. Does anyone sane think that footballers doing that has any impact on the level of racism in the world? Are we really saying that the undoubtedly racist people around are going to see the images and think they are wrong for being racist?

    I was listening to radio 4 yesterday and they actually put forward the idea that Saka, Sancho and Rashford were only being criticised for missing their penalties because they are black. Now I don't have to think hard to remember the criticism of previous penalty takers such as southgate and Pearce, and who can forget the gallows and effigy if Beckham after his world cup red card.

    Like 99% of other people I want less racism in the world but it seems that we have entered the twilight zone since Sunday.
    I think there's a lot to agree with there. Defacing the Rashford mural was apalling behaviour but the BBC describing it as racist showed they have no understanding or memory of the abuse previous England fall guys have faced.
    Do we know what was written on it? I had assumed from the coverage that the (unquoted) words were racist.

    Had it been "don't dance about like a drunken goat before kicking the ball" then I assume it would have been quoted.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 51,211
    lloydy said:

    Sean_F said:

    Leon said:

    Fuck

    Plague done, war next?


    A Chinese military video from 2 days ago. Threatening first strike nukes against Japan if the Japs try to defend Taiwan

    #CCP Vows to Nuke #Japan if Japan defends #Taiwan. As Japan is the only country that has been nuked, so nuking Japan "will get twice the result with half the effort."
    中共軍事頻道威脅對日本實施連續核打擊,直到日本第二次無條件投降。


    https://twitter.com/jenniferatntd/status/1414971285160005634?s=20

    Seems to be legit, millions of views (in China, on the original military propaganda channel)

    China is flexing its muscles, and they are powerful. Japan will have no choice but to back down. I do not see the West going to nuclear war to defend Taiwan, I do not see how Taiwan can defend itself for that long. Ergo, it is lost

    China would have to be insane to attack Taiwan, or to launch nuclear weapons against Japan. When one set flies, they all fly.
    Indeed. I couldn't see the yanks not getting involved.
    The more they push Japan to acquire nuclear weapons... well, if the Chinese manage that, they will really be out of friends in their part of the world.

    The joker in the pack is if the Taiwanese do a side deal with someone and get their own nukes. Then we are really in the fun zone.
  • Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 65,826
    eek said:

    If only there was a foreign aid budget to pay for some vaccination schemes..
    Or billionaires like Gates willing to pick up the tab.

    Oh. Wait. There is.

    I'm quite happy to see some of the incredible profits Microsoft have made down the years going to paying for this. Why aren't you?
  • noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 23,156
    Taking the knee is the literal definition of gesture politics.

    Gesture politics is bad when people with power do gestures instead of taking real and significant action.

    It is fine when people without power do gestures to take a stand because they have limited power to actually change things.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 72,314
    edited July 2021
    Leon said:

    Fuck

    Plague done, war next?


    A Chinese military video from 2 days ago. Threatening first strike nukes against Japan if the Japs try to defend Taiwan

    #CCP Vows to Nuke #Japan if Japan defends #Taiwan. As Japan is the only country that has been nuked, so nuking Japan "will get twice the result with half the effort."
    中共軍事頻道威脅對日本實施連續核打擊,直到日本第二次無條件投降。


    https://twitter.com/jenniferatntd/status/1414971285160005634?s=20

    Seems to be legit, millions of views (in China, on the original military propaganda channel)

    China is flexing its muscles, and they are powerful. Japan will have no choice but to back down. I do not see the West going to nuclear war to defend Taiwan, I do not see how Taiwan can defend itself for that long. Ergo, it is lost

    It certainly would be if you were in charge.
  • tlg86tlg86 Posts: 26,223

    Taking the knee is the literal definition of gesture politics.

    Gesture politics is bad when people with power do gestures instead of taking real and significant action.

    It is fine when people without power do gestures to take a stand because they have limited power to actually change things.

    Actually, I'd argue the footballers and the wider football world have a lot of power with respect to the issue of the day: online abuse.

    There is a very simple solution. Leave Twitter. Permanently.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 82,533
    edited July 2021
    Following Beckham getting sent off against Argentina, the abuse he got from every quarter was absolutely incredible and unrelenting. It was a total pile on for weeks / months, the media, the fans.

    The mental toughness he must have had to come back from that was quite incredible.
  • sladeslade Posts: 2,082
    Has the latest Redfield and Wilton poll been mentioned? Con 41, Lab 33, LD 12, Gr 6. SNP 4, REF 3, Oth 1.
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 63,669
    Roger said:

    SKS:

    The Conservatives have just voted to cut international aid.

    Cutting aid to help the world's poorest during a pandemic is callous - and not in our national interest.

    Boris Johnson is damaging Britain's reputation around the world.


    And possibly improving his own at home.....

    https://twitter.com/Keir_Starmer/status/1414971494308929539?s=20

    I doubt it. Whatever people might say they expect their leaders to have more humane instincts than they have themselves. It's also an easy one to shoot down. Is his wallpaper worth some kids in Gaza going hungry?
    Actually today's polling does not support that view

    Maybe those supporting foreign aid need to make a better case
  • DougSealDougSeal Posts: 12,541
    Tomorrow's case numbers in England will be big based on
    You live in a country with no malaria but a lot of covid so you decide that the malaria vaccine is the one you'd take. Okay then.
  • RogerRoger Posts: 19,985
    The unlikely hero for 2021 Theresa May! Who'd have thought
  • MikeLMikeL Posts: 7,723
    edited July 2021
    It's surely likely that the more that racism is in the news, the more racism will actually take place.

    The more that racism is seen as a big issue, the more anxious that people and in particular employers are going to be to want to avoid getting caught up in it. So they will be more inclined to take a racist decision - eg in choosing between job applicants in order to avoid the risk of getting caught up in a racial discrimination case at a later date.
This discussion has been closed.