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John Bercow – denied a peerage by BoJo on his retirement – now joins Labour – politicalbetting.com

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Comments

  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 81,961
    Pulpstar said:

    I am.... 40.

    Its all downhill from now.....
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 32,541
    Pulpstar said:

    I am.... 40.

    Being With You
    Smokey Robinson
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 29,397
    Pulpstar said:

    I am.... 40.

    Many happy returns. You get comfortable with it over time. :)
  • isamisam Posts: 41,118
    Pulpstar said:

    I am.... 40.

    Happy Birthday… wish I was!
  • FishingFishing Posts: 5,032
    Pulpstar said:

    I am.... 40.

    As Napoleon said when he started to worry about his age, ""The Emperor Alexander dances, but I do not--​forty is forty"
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 51,588
    Pulpstar said:

    I am.... 40.

    Happy birthday!
  • GallowgateGallowgate Posts: 19,454
    Happy Birthday @Pulpstar
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 32,541
    Happy birthday to Pulpstar.
  • GIN1138GIN1138 Posts: 22,261
    Pulpstar said:

    I am.... 40.

    Happy birthday. :D
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 71,041
    Pulpstar said:

    I am.... 40.

    You sound…. slightly surprised.

    Happy birthday !
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 71,041
    On topic, I am still not quite sure what to make of Bercow. @Cyclefree ’s curate’s egg is probably the right assessment.

    This is the best interview of him I’ve seen.
    https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2019/nov/10/john-bercow-interview-i-may-be-pompous-but-i-am-completely-authentic
  • gealbhangealbhan Posts: 2,362

    I did say it was rather interesting timing that the updated vaccine efficiency numbers came out 3 days after the big decision and badically invalidated all the models (that were already using incorrect numbers).

    The problem is we just know that Johnson wont have asked the tricky, probing questions. He would have just quickly breezed through the meeting blustering around and making jokes.

    Imagine Thatcher chairing this covid Quad of ministers.
    Johnson breezed through one meeting on a scooter, in one door, out the other, shouting “2 Jabs free, 3 for a Pfizer”.

    It looks like a bona Fido 3rd wave on the infections table. Probably too soon from uptick to show on hospitalisation chart yet?
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 49,859

    alex_ said:

    I did say it was rather interesting timing that the updated vaccine efficiency numbers came out 3 days after the big decision and badically invalidated all the models (that were already using incorrect numbers).

    I imagine that should Johnson be following the detail of all this he will be f*cking furious that he has once again been bounced into a lockdown decision.
    He should reverse the decision.
    He does have the two week review date. I suggest he calls in all the data himself and not allow it to be filtered through Hancock.
    I think there's zero chance of them bringing forward the July date. They will say that whatever the detail available on June 14th there were still a large range of possibilities and it was right to be cautious. And that if the vaccines were more effective than thought then that makes an even greater case for delay to allow everyone time to be vaccinated.

    They will reason that this is a far lesser evil than precipitously opening up having admitted they made a mistake only to potentially see something go wrong with the figures shortly afterwards.
    I would say its unlikely but non-zero.

    If it looks like hospitalisations etc have peaked or are nowhere near the graph in a fortnight's time they will be able to say that thanks to the extra data they're now confident.

    But inertia plays now to letting the four weeks play out in full, regrettably.
    I don't think hospitalisations have peaked....

    image
    Prof Spector and Zoe - who are normally a week or two ahead of the case data let alone the indicators with more lag - are saying that things are now levelling off.
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 49,859
    dixiedean said:

    Pulpstar said:

    I am.... 40.

    Many happy returns. You get comfortable with it over time. :)
    Congratulations to pulpy.

    The trouble isn’t being 40, but the wishing that you still were as each subsequent year takes you further away from so being….
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 49,859
    edited June 2021
    Katy Balls: The north-south Tory parliamentary coalition has so far held together on the basis that all sides could win from the government’s message. The byelection result adds to the growing concern among Tory MPs in the south that this is no longer the case.

    John Harris: But what has happened since [Cameron] has been a kind of counter-revolution within the [Tory] party: any anxieties about being seen as “the nasty party” have been blithely sidelined, and a nakedly populist, divisive agenda has been embraced, built on our departure from the EU. The purging of more centrist Conservatives has hardly helped. Not for the first time, what [Davey’s] party seems to have divined is an overlooked part of the electorate who may soon start to change the political weather. They do not like Boris Johnson, or what he is doing with power. Brexit is still uppermost in their minds. If they are watching GB News, it is only for the laughs. And as people like them now embrace home-working and move in ever-increasing numbers from London to its surrounding areas, they ought to be causing the Conservatives’ cleverer minds no end of concern.

    Freedland: Plot it on a graph and the change stares right back at you. Fifty years ago, parties of the left fared best among those with the least education and the lowest income, while the right flourished among those with the most of both. These days, the right still does well among the affluent, but on education the two camps have swapped places: these days, and far too crudely put, if you’re a graduate you vote left; if you’re not, you don’t. [However…] The harder truth is that those who want change will have to speak to voters about the things they, the voters, care about, and in a way that makes sense to them. It will require discipline and coherence, even from those who think they’re doing noble work “widening the debate” or “raising awareness”, when in fact they’re just making progressives look weird. There is no short cut – via Chesham and Amersham or anywhere else.
  • This is typical Johnson: https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/rishi-sunak-v-the-pm-who-only-wants-to-spend-spend-spend-h6lkdslk8

    The wheels are coming off this regime much faster than I thought they would.


    Mike, if you are around, thank you again. You made me smile on Friday morning having taken up your C&A tip twice over. Brilliant betting tip. Thank you.
  • And this is another example: https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2021/06/19/exclusive-matt-hancock-kept-boris-johnson-dark-covid-vaccines/

    I'm afraid that Johnson is hopeless on detail. He bluffs, blusters and blagues but has no grasp of facts, no attention to detail and no capacity to apply himself.
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 49,859
    Matt Hancock failed to tell Boris Johnson about a major Public Health England (PHE) study showing the effectiveness of vaccines against the Indian or delta variant during a key meeting to decide whether to extend Covid restrictions, The Telegraph can disclose....

  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 61,775
    Good morning, everyone.

    Congratulations on your survival (so far), Mr. Pulpstar.

    I see the cantankerous gnome has proved it was a rare correct decision by the PM to deny the umpire-who-would-be-a-player a seat in the Lords.
  • Cocky_cockneyCocky_cockney Posts: 760
    edited June 2021
    It wasn't. It lacked grace and magnanimity.

    Great politicians are secure enough not to be petty.

    Boris Johnson is neither great nor secure.
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 61,775
    F1: race starts at 2pm, apparently. Will start perusing the markets for value, but didn't have a huge number of ideas yesterday.

    Still slightly annoyed over the Gasly bet not coming off last time. Ah well. Good for Vettel to put in a performance like that.
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 33,414
    Good morning folks! And Happy Birthday Mr Pulpstar; Can be a really good decade!
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 48,615
    Pulpstar said:

    I am.... 40.

    Happy Birthday.

    Forty sounds very old, until you hit 50...
  • Dura_AceDura_Ace Posts: 13,677

    And this is another example: https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2021/06/19/exclusive-matt-hancock-kept-boris-johnson-dark-covid-vaccines/

    I'm afraid that Johnson is hopeless on detail. He bluffs, blusters and blagues but has no grasp of facts, no attention to detail and no capacity to apply himself.

    Fucking Hopeless is definitely on the receiving end of a blue-on-blue shock and awe briefing campaign at the moment.
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 33,414
    edited June 2021
    Father's Day as well. I've had half a case of wine; the other half was for my recent birthday.
    And a couple of cards, including one for father-in-law. Which was nice.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,350
    Happy birthday @Pulpstar from a slip of a lad aged 38.
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 33,414
    ydoethur said:

    Father's Day as well. I've had half a case of wine; the other half was for my recent birthday.
    And a couple of cards, including one for father-in-law. Which was nice.

    Half a case of wine before 7 in the morning is quite good going!
    Arrived a day or so ago, so I'm taking it steadily.
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 61,775
    As an aside, I loathe the stupid formatting blogger imposes ever since it was updated a couple of years ago.
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 61,775
    Betting Post

    F1: one of those weekends when it's hard to find much of anything. Backed Sainz at 3 for best of the rest. If I didn't blog every race weekend I suspect I would've skipped this one.

    https://enormo-haddock.blogspot.com/2021/06/france-pre-race-2021.html
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,350
    edited June 2021
    I see that democracy is alive and well in Iran. One man, one vote. And the one man with the one vote, Ayatollah Khamenei, has cast it for a mass murderer.

    You don’t have to be a raging pro-Israeli to agree with much of what is said here:

    Iran election: Israel voices 'grave concern' over Ebrahim Raisi
    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-57541346
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 54,576

    Betting Post

    F1: one of those weekends when it's hard to find much of anything. Backed Sainz at 3 for best of the rest. If I didn't blog every race weekend I suspect I would've skipped this one.

    https://enormo-haddock.blogspot.com/2021/06/france-pre-race-2021.html

    Are there any bets available on today being the most boring race of the season?

    Only a rain dance, will make it anything other than a terrible place to race F1 cars.
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 49,859
    ydoethur said:

    Father's Day as well. I've had half a case of wine; the other half was for my recent birthday.
    And a couple of cards, including one for father-in-law. Which was nice.

    Half a case of wine before 7 in the morning is quite good going!
    And no typos as well!
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 61,775
    Mr. Sandpit, it'll have to work to beat Monaco. But, yeah, not expecting a classic,
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,169

    Pulpstar said:

    I am.... 40.

    So most of your adult life has been on PB
    I spend time on twitter too
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 49,859

    Pulpstar said:

    I am.... 40.

    So most of your adult life has been on PB
    Yes, at 40 comes the realisation that your horizons have narrowed without your noticing previously…..
  • FenmanFenman Posts: 1,047
    Nunu3 said:

    alex_ said:

    Neil Henderson
    @hendopolis
    ·
    2m
    INDEPENDENT DIGITAL: Record demand at A&E puts patient lives ‘at risk’ #TomorrowsPapersToday

    What are all these record A&E presentations presenting with? Because by definition it can't be Covid.
    I know. That's what I'm wondering. Suspect some of this is because some GPs are still refusing to see patients face to face.
    Exactly.

    GP surgeries are the cause of oversubscribed A&E's.
    Actually, I can see my GP any time I want. I just go to the Golf club. But at his surgery? Impossible.
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 33,414
    edited June 2021
    IanB2 said:

    Pulpstar said:

    I am.... 40.

    So most of your adult life has been on PB
    Yes, at 40 comes the realisation that your horizons have narrowed without your noticing previously…..
    They don't need to narrow, just become a bit different. We did a lot more travelling after 40 than before, for example.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,350
    IanB2 said:

    ydoethur said:

    Father's Day as well. I've had half a case of wine; the other half was for my recent birthday.
    And a couple of cards, including one for father-in-law. Which was nice.

    Half a case of wine before 7 in the morning is quite good going!
    And no typos as well!
    Also no blether about aliens...
  • CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758
    The most revealing story I heard about Bercow was a few months ago.

    At the school his kids are at there are 2 parents represented on the board.

    Sally & John Bercow have occupied both of those seats having actively campaigned to win them.

    And, I am told, favour their children’s interests over the broader school community

    Of course this is all third hand gossip, but it does seem entirely plausible
  • JonathanJonathan Posts: 21,633
    IanB2 said:

    Pulpstar said:

    I am.... 40.

    So most of your adult life has been on PB
    Yes, at 40 comes the realisation that your horizons have narrowed without your noticing previously…..
    Your forties are the process that turns someone who looks in their thirties into someone who looks in their fifties. 😬 Good luck.
  • felixfelix Posts: 15,164
    edited June 2021
    Charles said:

    The most revealing story I heard about Bercow was a few months ago.

    At the school his kids are at there are 2 parents represented on the board.

    Sally & John Bercow have occupied both of those seats having actively campaigned to win them.

    And, I am told, favour their children’s interests over the broader school community

    Of course this is all third hand gossip, but it does seem entirely plausible

    I'd have to say he'd come very high on the list of 'defections' any sensible political party would wish to avoid. I struggle to see an obvious voting cohort that would be following him from blue to red. Other reasons why blues might move of course but in Bercow's wake? No.

    As an aside it seems from reports in the press and elsewhere that there may be something of a local difficulty for Labour with the Muslim vote in B & S. Apparently the fact that his wife is half Jewish is not helping their cause. If so what an extraordinary indictment of the party for its courting of factionalism for too many years now.
  • moonshinemoonshine Posts: 5,747
    ydoethur said:

    IanB2 said:

    ydoethur said:

    Father's Day as well. I've had half a case of wine; the other half was for my recent birthday.
    And a couple of cards, including one for father-in-law. Which was nice.

    Half a case of wine before 7 in the morning is quite good going!
    And no typos as well!
    Also no blether about aliens...
    Next week is supposedly the release of the report to congress, so expect the media coverage to ramp up!
  • RogerRoger Posts: 19,884
    edited June 2021
    Bercow is one of my few political heroes in a thin last couple of years. Driving round London with a bumper sticker 'Bugger Brexit' while holding the job of Speaker was direct selling at its best. Another is Stormy Daniels. If you're going to dish the dirt on Donald in a crowded field you need something special and that name does it on its own. Finally the psychopath Dominic Cummings. A case of redemption. The man who could sell sand to the Saudis is now using his humungous talent to rid us of the Frankenstein monster he helped create.
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 33,414
    felix said:

    Charles said:

    The most revealing story I heard about Bercow was a few months ago.

    At the school his kids are at there are 2 parents represented on the board.

    Sally & John Bercow have occupied both of those seats having actively campaigned to win them.

    And, I am told, favour their children’s interests over the broader school community

    Of course this is all third hand gossip, but it does seem entirely plausible

    I'd have to say he'd come very high on the list of 'defections' any sensible political party would wish to avoid. I struggle to see an obvious voting cohort that would be following him from blue to red. Other reasons why blues might move of course but in Bercow's wake? No.

    As an aside it seems from reports in the press and elsewhere that there may be something of a local difficulty for Labour with the Muslim vote in B & S. Apparently the fact that his wife is half Jewish is not helping their cause. If so what an extraordinary indictment of the party for its courting of factionalism for too many years now.
    The Labour candidate in B&S is female.
  • ThomasNasheThomasNashe Posts: 5,331
    IanB2 said:

    Katy Balls: The north-south Tory parliamentary coalition has so far held together on the basis that all sides could win from the government’s message. The byelection result adds to the growing concern among Tory MPs in the south that this is no longer the case.

    John Harris: But what has happened since [Cameron] has been a kind of counter-revolution within the [Tory] party: any anxieties about being seen as “the nasty party” have been blithely sidelined, and a nakedly populist, divisive agenda has been embraced, built on our departure from the EU. The purging of more centrist Conservatives has hardly helped. Not for the first time, what [Davey’s] party seems to have divined is an overlooked part of the electorate who may soon start to change the political weather. They do not like Boris Johnson, or what he is doing with power. Brexit is still uppermost in their minds. If they are watching GB News, it is only for the laughs. And as people like them now embrace home-working and move in ever-increasing numbers from London to its surrounding areas, they ought to be causing the Conservatives’ cleverer minds no end of concern.

    Freedland: Plot it on a graph and the change stares right back at you. Fifty years ago, parties of the left fared best among those with the least education and the lowest income, while the right flourished among those with the most of both. These days, the right still does well among the affluent, but on education the two camps have swapped places: these days, and far too crudely put, if you’re a graduate you vote left; if you’re not, you don’t. [However…] The harder truth is that those who want change will have to speak to voters about the things they, the voters, care about, and in a way that makes sense to them. It will require discipline and coherence, even from those who think they’re doing noble work “widening the debate” or “raising awareness”, when in fact they’re just making progressives look weird. There is no short cut – via Chesham and Amersham or anywhere else.

    As usual, it's Freedland who offers the real insights.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,350

    felix said:

    Charles said:

    The most revealing story I heard about Bercow was a few months ago.

    At the school his kids are at there are 2 parents represented on the board.

    Sally & John Bercow have occupied both of those seats having actively campaigned to win them.

    And, I am told, favour their children’s interests over the broader school community

    Of course this is all third hand gossip, but it does seem entirely plausible

    I'd have to say he'd come very high on the list of 'defections' any sensible political party would wish to avoid. I struggle to see an obvious voting cohort that would be following him from blue to red. Other reasons why blues might move of course but in Bercow's wake? No.

    As an aside it seems from reports in the press and elsewhere that there may be something of a local difficulty for Labour with the Muslim vote in B & S. Apparently the fact that his wife is half Jewish is not helping their cause. If so what an extraordinary indictment of the party for its courting of factionalism for too many years now.
    The Labour candidate in B&S is female.
    Although I suppose it is possible her wife Claire is half Jewish, albeit that seems a total irrelevance to the issues at hand.

    More likely this is Galloway’s campaign making up BS again. Remember how in the Bradford by-election he pretended to be a Muslim?
  • ThomasNasheThomasNashe Posts: 5,331
    Dura_Ace said:

    And this is another example: https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2021/06/19/exclusive-matt-hancock-kept-boris-johnson-dark-covid-vaccines/

    I'm afraid that Johnson is hopeless on detail. He bluffs, blusters and blagues but has no grasp of facts, no attention to detail and no capacity to apply himself.

    Fucking Hopeless is definitely on the receiving end of a blue-on-blue shock and awe briefing campaign at the moment.
    Dura_Ace said:

    And this is another example: https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2021/06/19/exclusive-matt-hancock-kept-boris-johnson-dark-covid-vaccines/

    I'm afraid that Johnson is hopeless on detail. He bluffs, blusters and blagues but has no grasp of facts, no attention to detail and no capacity to apply himself.

    Fucking Hopeless is definitely on the receiving end of a blue-on-blue shock and awe briefing campaign at the moment.
    Yes, that was the first thing that occurred to me too.
  • CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758

    One of the few people who is more discredited than Johnson or Cummings. The worst Speaker of my lifetime who has been driven by self aggrandisement and arrogance. I genuinely pity the Labour Party.

    How long before he starts scheming to be leader?
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,169
    Jonathan said:

    IanB2 said:

    Pulpstar said:

    I am.... 40.

    So most of your adult life has been on PB
    Yes, at 40 comes the realisation that your horizons have narrowed without your noticing previously…..
    Your forties are the process that turns someone who looks in their thirties into someone who looks in their fifties. 😬 Good luck.
    Hair today, gone tommorow
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,350

    Dura_Ace said:

    And this is another example: https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2021/06/19/exclusive-matt-hancock-kept-boris-johnson-dark-covid-vaccines/

    I'm afraid that Johnson is hopeless on detail. He bluffs, blusters and blagues but has no grasp of facts, no attention to detail and no capacity to apply himself.

    Fucking Hopeless is definitely on the receiving end of a blue-on-blue shock and awe briefing campaign at the moment.
    Dura_Ace said:

    And this is another example: https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2021/06/19/exclusive-matt-hancock-kept-boris-johnson-dark-covid-vaccines/

    I'm afraid that Johnson is hopeless on detail. He bluffs, blusters and blagues but has no grasp of facts, no attention to detail and no capacity to apply himself.

    Fucking Hopeless is definitely on the receiving end of a blue-on-blue shock and awe briefing campaign at the moment.
    Yes, that was the first thing that occurred to me too.
    That’s a worrying thought, because if Hancock’s for the chop, that means Williamson and Jenrick might just survive.
  • RogerRoger Posts: 19,884
    felix said:

    Charles said:

    The most revealing story I heard about Bercow was a few months ago.

    At the school his kids are at there are 2 parents represented on the board.

    Sally & John Bercow have occupied both of those seats having actively campaigned to win them.

    And, I am told, favour their children’s interests over the broader school community

    Of course this is all third hand gossip, but it does seem entirely plausible

    I'd have to say he'd come very high on the list of 'defections' any sensible political party would wish to avoid. I struggle to see an obvious voting cohort that would be following him from blue to red. Other reasons why blues might move of course but in Bercow's wake? No.

    As an aside it seems from reports in the press and elsewhere that there may be something of a local difficulty for Labour with the Muslim vote in B & S. Apparently the fact that his wife is half Jewish is not helping their cause. If so what an extraordinary indictment of the party for its courting of factionalism for too many years now.
    What an insulting story to Muslms. Which press? Surely not the Jewish Chronicle? I doubt they sell it in Andalusia
  • ThomasNasheThomasNashe Posts: 5,331
    Charles said:

    The most revealing story I heard about Bercow was a few months ago.

    At the school his kids are at there are 2 parents represented on the board.

    Sally & John Bercow have occupied both of those seats having actively campaigned to win them.

    And, I am told, favour their children’s interests over the broader school community

    Of course this is all third hand gossip, but it does seem entirely plausible

    Sounds plausible to me too - as the kind of story that his enemies would cook up about him, illustrating all his arriviste faults as they see them.
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 57,111
    Charles said:

    The most revealing story I heard about Bercow was a few months ago.

    At the school his kids are at there are 2 parents represented on the board.

    Sally & John Bercow have occupied both of those seats having actively campaigned to win them.

    And, I am told, favour their children’s interests over the broader school community

    Of course this is all third hand gossip, but it does seem entirely plausible

    With an attitude like that, I'm surprised they chose Labour over the LibDems.
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 57,111
    felix said:

    Charles said:

    The most revealing story I heard about Bercow was a few months ago.

    At the school his kids are at there are 2 parents represented on the board.

    Sally & John Bercow have occupied both of those seats having actively campaigned to win them.

    And, I am told, favour their children’s interests over the broader school community

    Of course this is all third hand gossip, but it does seem entirely plausible

    I'd have to say he'd come very high on the list of 'defections' any sensible political party would wish to avoid. I struggle to see an obvious voting cohort that would be following him from blue to red. Other reasons why blues might move of course but in Bercow's wake? No.

    As an aside it seems from reports in the press and elsewhere that there may be something of a local difficulty for Labour with the Muslim vote in B & S. Apparently the fact that his wife is half Jewish is not helping their cause. If so what an extraordinary indictment of the party for its courting of factionalism for too many years now.
    Is Jo Cox's sister gay?
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 53,797
    I have frequently challenged the argument that Boris is just "lucky" but "suffering" a "withering attack" from John Bercow is possibly an argument against me. It will remind many why they voted for him in the first place.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,350
    rcs1000 said:

    Charles said:

    The most revealing story I heard about Bercow was a few months ago.

    At the school his kids are at there are 2 parents represented on the board.

    Sally & John Bercow have occupied both of those seats having actively campaigned to win them.

    And, I am told, favour their children’s interests over the broader school community

    Of course this is all third hand gossip, but it does seem entirely plausible

    With an attitude like that, I'm surprised they chose Labour over the LibDems.
    Is that a snipping noise I hear as OGH cuts you out of his will?
  • theProletheProle Posts: 1,206

    felix said:

    Charles said:

    The most revealing story I heard about Bercow was a few months ago.

    At the school his kids are at there are 2 parents represented on the board.

    Sally & John Bercow have occupied both of those seats having actively campaigned to win them.

    And, I am told, favour their children’s interests over the broader school community

    Of course this is all third hand gossip, but it does seem entirely plausible

    I'd have to say he'd come very high on the list of 'defections' any sensible political party would wish to avoid. I struggle to see an obvious voting cohort that would be following him from blue to red. Other reasons why blues might move of course but in Bercow's wake? No.

    As an aside it seems from reports in the press and elsewhere that there may be something of a local difficulty for Labour with the Muslim vote in B & S. Apparently the fact that his wife is half Jewish is not helping their cause. If so what an extraordinary indictment of the party for its courting of factionalism for too many years now.
    The Labour candidate in B&S is female.
    And a quick google will tell you has a partner called Clare, although you have to go further down the results page than you might expect to find it.

    I would have thought that her being a lesbian would depress the Muslim vote more her partner being half Jewish (presumably non practicing), but being realistic I can't imagine either aspect working in her favour in that particular community.
  • murali_smurali_s Posts: 3,067
    Roger said:

    Bercow is one of my few political heroes in a thin last couple of years. Driving round London with a bumper sticker 'Bugger Brexit' while holding the job of Speaker was direct selling at its best. Another is Stormy Daniels. If you're going to dish the dirt on Donald in a crowded field you need something special and that name does it on its own. Finally the psychopath Dominic Cummings. A case of redemption. The man who could sell sand to the Saudis is now using his humungous talent to rid us of the Frankenstein monster he helped create.

    Spot on!
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 53,797
    ydoethur said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    And this is another example: https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2021/06/19/exclusive-matt-hancock-kept-boris-johnson-dark-covid-vaccines/

    I'm afraid that Johnson is hopeless on detail. He bluffs, blusters and blagues but has no grasp of facts, no attention to detail and no capacity to apply himself.

    Fucking Hopeless is definitely on the receiving end of a blue-on-blue shock and awe briefing campaign at the moment.
    Dura_Ace said:

    And this is another example: https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2021/06/19/exclusive-matt-hancock-kept-boris-johnson-dark-covid-vaccines/

    I'm afraid that Johnson is hopeless on detail. He bluffs, blusters and blagues but has no grasp of facts, no attention to detail and no capacity to apply himself.

    Fucking Hopeless is definitely on the receiving end of a blue-on-blue shock and awe briefing campaign at the moment.
    Yes, that was the first thing that occurred to me too.
    That’s a worrying thought, because if Hancock’s for the chop, that means Williamson and Jenrick might just survive.
    Of those 3 Hancock is indeed the stand out star.
  • murali_smurali_s Posts: 3,067
    Pulpstar said:

    I am.... 40.

    Happy birthday!

    Still a a baby though. Probably one of the youngest on the site looking at the political bias of PB! :)
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 27,855
    Fenman said:

    Nunu3 said:

    alex_ said:

    Neil Henderson
    @hendopolis
    ·
    2m
    INDEPENDENT DIGITAL: Record demand at A&E puts patient lives ‘at risk’ #TomorrowsPapersToday

    What are all these record A&E presentations presenting with? Because by definition it can't be Covid.
    I know. That's what I'm wondering. Suspect some of this is because some GPs are still refusing to see patients face to face.
    Exactly.

    GP surgeries are the cause of oversubscribed A&E's.
    Actually, I can see my GP any time I want. I just go to the Golf club. But at his surgery? Impossible.
    GPs may be one cause of overcrowded A&Es but another is the 111 NHS phone helpline, according to the Telegraph. Patients (including those who can't reach their GPs) call 111 and are told to go to A&E or call an ambulance, whose call-outs are up 20 to 30 per cent on normal.

    Adrian Boyle, the vice-president of the Royal College of Emergency Medicine, said the problem was largely being driven by the NHS 111 algorithm that is "too risk-averse".

    "What we find is that NHS 111 is more likely to send people to either the emergency department, or to the GP, or call for an ambulance, where they don't have a condition, where it's just some call handler following an algorithm," he told The Telegraph.

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2021/06/19/exclusive-risk-averse-nhs-111-algorithm-piling-pressure-ambulances/ (£££)
  • turbotubbsturbotubbs Posts: 17,392
    rcs1000 said:

    felix said:

    Charles said:

    The most revealing story I heard about Bercow was a few months ago.

    At the school his kids are at there are 2 parents represented on the board.

    Sally & John Bercow have occupied both of those seats having actively campaigned to win them.

    And, I am told, favour their children’s interests over the broader school community

    Of course this is all third hand gossip, but it does seem entirely plausible

    I'd have to say he'd come very high on the list of 'defections' any sensible political party would wish to avoid. I struggle to see an obvious voting cohort that would be following him from blue to red. Other reasons why blues might move of course but in Bercow's wake? No.

    As an aside it seems from reports in the press and elsewhere that there may be something of a local difficulty for Labour with the Muslim vote in B & S. Apparently the fact that his wife is half Jewish is not helping their cause. If so what an extraordinary indictment of the party for its courting of factionalism for too many years now.
    Is Jo Cox's sister gay?
    Apparently there is a partner called Claire. First I’ve heard And no ones business I guess but does that have an effect on how would vote?
  • murali_smurali_s Posts: 3,067

    And this is another example: https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2021/06/19/exclusive-matt-hancock-kept-boris-johnson-dark-covid-vaccines/

    I'm afraid that Johnson is hopeless on detail. He bluffs, blusters and blagues but has no grasp of facts, no attention to detail and no capacity to apply himself.

    Johnson = worst PM this country has ever had! No-one is even close in this department.

    Cue the PB Burleys who will now come to defend the disingenuous racist fat fornicator!
  • RogerRoger Posts: 19,884

    felix said:

    Charles said:

    The most revealing story I heard about Bercow was a few months ago.

    At the school his kids are at there are 2 parents represented on the board.

    Sally & John Bercow have occupied both of those seats having actively campaigned to win them.

    And, I am told, favour their children’s interests over the broader school community

    Of course this is all third hand gossip, but it does seem entirely plausible

    I'd have to say he'd come very high on the list of 'defections' any sensible political party would wish to avoid. I struggle to see an obvious voting cohort that would be following him from blue to red. Other reasons why blues might move of course but in Bercow's wake? No.

    As an aside it seems from reports in the press and elsewhere that there may be something of a local difficulty for Labour with the Muslim vote in B & S. Apparently the fact that his wife is half Jewish is not helping their cause. If so what an extraordinary indictment of the party for its courting of factionalism for too many years now.
    The Labour candidate in B&S is female.
    Even murkier! Felix has it on good authority that because the Labour candidate is married to a man whose father was Jewish (had it been his mother you could have done away with the half) Muslims are not going to vote for him! If this is untrue as I suspect it is you are moving from fantasy to rather unpleasant islamaphobia. I think you should post links to these press reports
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,350
    DavidL said:

    ydoethur said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    And this is another example: https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2021/06/19/exclusive-matt-hancock-kept-boris-johnson-dark-covid-vaccines/

    I'm afraid that Johnson is hopeless on detail. He bluffs, blusters and blagues but has no grasp of facts, no attention to detail and no capacity to apply himself.

    Fucking Hopeless is definitely on the receiving end of a blue-on-blue shock and awe briefing campaign at the moment.
    Dura_Ace said:

    And this is another example: https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2021/06/19/exclusive-matt-hancock-kept-boris-johnson-dark-covid-vaccines/

    I'm afraid that Johnson is hopeless on detail. He bluffs, blusters and blagues but has no grasp of facts, no attention to detail and no capacity to apply himself.

    Fucking Hopeless is definitely on the receiving end of a blue-on-blue shock and awe briefing campaign at the moment.
    Yes, that was the first thing that occurred to me too.
    That’s a worrying thought, because if Hancock’s for the chop, that means Williamson and Jenrick might just survive.
    Of those 3 Hancock is indeed the stand out star.
    No he isn’t.

    Williamson makes Humza Yusuf look almost competent.
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 27,855
    Dura_Ace said:

    And this is another example: https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2021/06/19/exclusive-matt-hancock-kept-boris-johnson-dark-covid-vaccines/

    I'm afraid that Johnson is hopeless on detail. He bluffs, blusters and blagues but has no grasp of facts, no attention to detail and no capacity to apply himself.

    Fucking Hopeless is definitely on the receiving end of a blue-on-blue shock and awe briefing campaign at the moment.
    Ah but who is it that is briefing against Hancock, and is the inference that Boris is an innumerate twat whose eyes glaze over when shown a graph collateral damage or blowback?
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,350

    Dura_Ace said:

    And this is another example: https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2021/06/19/exclusive-matt-hancock-kept-boris-johnson-dark-covid-vaccines/

    I'm afraid that Johnson is hopeless on detail. He bluffs, blusters and blagues but has no grasp of facts, no attention to detail and no capacity to apply himself.

    Fucking Hopeless is definitely on the receiving end of a blue-on-blue shock and awe briefing campaign at the moment.
    Ah but who is it that is briefing against Hancock, and is the inference that Boris is an innumerate twat whose eyes glaze over when shown a graph collateral damage or blowback?
    Surely you’ve know that for long enough not to have to infer it?
  • CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758
    rcs1000 said:

    TimS said:

    He joined Labour many years ago.

    As for attack dog for Labour....the Red Wall aren't going to be impressed are they Mike...Mr Stop Brexit as many of them see him giving it large... will just remind all those Brexit voters that between him and Starmer weren't on their side (or that of democracy).

    He isn't a powerful speakers, he comes across as arrogant and pompous.

    True, but maybe the red wall is already lost. I’ve no idea whether Bercow will appeal in the blue wall but it’s true Labour do lack an attack dog.

    Chihuahuas can be quite aggressive yappy dogs, but they rarely do much damage.
    I wish our one was unable to do damage. She's a compulsive ankle biter, and can easily result people requiring a stitch or two.

    But if we take her back to the shelter, she'll be put down, so we're stuck with her for another 15 or so years.
    Get some of those chainmail ankle pieces. She’ll soon learn.
  • RogerRoger Posts: 19,884

    IanB2 said:

    Katy Balls: The north-south Tory parliamentary coalition has so far held together on the basis that all sides could win from the government’s message. The byelection result adds to the growing concern among Tory MPs in the south that this is no longer the case.

    John Harris: But what has happened since [Cameron] has been a kind of counter-revolution within the [Tory] party: any anxieties about being seen as “the nasty party” have been blithely sidelined, and a nakedly populist, divisive agenda has been embraced, built on our departure from the EU. The purging of more centrist Conservatives has hardly helped. Not for the first time, what [Davey’s] party seems to have divined is an overlooked part of the electorate who may soon start to change the political weather. They do not like Boris Johnson, or what he is doing with power. Brexit is still uppermost in their minds. If they are watching GB News, it is only for the laughs. And as people like them now embrace home-working and move in ever-increasing numbers from London to its surrounding areas, they ought to be causing the Conservatives’ cleverer minds no end of concern.

    Freedland: Plot it on a graph and the change stares right back at you. Fifty years ago, parties of the left fared best among those with the least education and the lowest income, while the right flourished among those with the most of both. These days, the right still does well among the affluent, but on education the two camps have swapped places: these days, and far too crudely put, if you’re a graduate you vote left; if you’re not, you don’t. [However…] The harder truth is that those who want change will have to speak to voters about the things they, the voters, care about, and in a way that makes sense to them. It will require discipline and coherence, even from those who think they’re doing noble work “widening the debate” or “raising awareness”, when in fact they’re just making progressives look weird. There is no short cut – via Chesham and Amersham or anywhere else.

    As usual, it's Freedland who offers the real insights.
    Really? I'd say Harris though I often find Freedland to be insightful
  • Dura_AceDura_Ace Posts: 13,677

    Dura_Ace said:

    And this is another example: https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2021/06/19/exclusive-matt-hancock-kept-boris-johnson-dark-covid-vaccines/

    I'm afraid that Johnson is hopeless on detail. He bluffs, blusters and blagues but has no grasp of facts, no attention to detail and no capacity to apply himself.

    Fucking Hopeless is definitely on the receiving end of a blue-on-blue shock and awe briefing campaign at the moment.
    Ah but who is it that is briefing against Hancock, and is the inference that Boris is an innumerate twat whose eyes glaze over when shown a graph collateral damage or blowback?
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8FKiDUmESDE
  • RogerRoger Posts: 19,884

    rcs1000 said:

    felix said:

    Charles said:

    The most revealing story I heard about Bercow was a few months ago.

    At the school his kids are at there are 2 parents represented on the board.

    Sally & John Bercow have occupied both of those seats having actively campaigned to win them.

    And, I am told, favour their children’s interests over the broader school community

    Of course this is all third hand gossip, but it does seem entirely plausible

    I'd have to say he'd come very high on the list of 'defections' any sensible political party would wish to avoid. I struggle to see an obvious voting cohort that would be following him from blue to red. Other reasons why blues might move of course but in Bercow's wake? No.

    As an aside it seems from reports in the press and elsewhere that there may be something of a local difficulty for Labour with the Muslim vote in B & S. Apparently the fact that his wife is half Jewish is not helping their cause. If so what an extraordinary indictment of the party for its courting of factionalism for too many years now.
    Is Jo Cox's sister gay?
    Apparently there is a partner called Claire. First I’ve heard And no ones business I guess but does that have an effect on how would vote?
    Murkier and murkier she's gay but has a half Jewish husband who is losing her the Muslim vote?

    Find out in the next episode of SOAP!
  • ThomasNasheThomasNashe Posts: 5,331
    Roger said:

    IanB2 said:

    Katy Balls: The north-south Tory parliamentary coalition has so far held together on the basis that all sides could win from the government’s message. The byelection result adds to the growing concern among Tory MPs in the south that this is no longer the case.

    John Harris: But what has happened since [Cameron] has been a kind of counter-revolution within the [Tory] party: any anxieties about being seen as “the nasty party” have been blithely sidelined, and a nakedly populist, divisive agenda has been embraced, built on our departure from the EU. The purging of more centrist Conservatives has hardly helped. Not for the first time, what [Davey’s] party seems to have divined is an overlooked part of the electorate who may soon start to change the political weather. They do not like Boris Johnson, or what he is doing with power. Brexit is still uppermost in their minds. If they are watching GB News, it is only for the laughs. And as people like them now embrace home-working and move in ever-increasing numbers from London to its surrounding areas, they ought to be causing the Conservatives’ cleverer minds no end of concern.

    Freedland: Plot it on a graph and the change stares right back at you. Fifty years ago, parties of the left fared best among those with the least education and the lowest income, while the right flourished among those with the most of both. These days, the right still does well among the affluent, but on education the two camps have swapped places: these days, and far too crudely put, if you’re a graduate you vote left; if you’re not, you don’t. [However…] The harder truth is that those who want change will have to speak to voters about the things they, the voters, care about, and in a way that makes sense to them. It will require discipline and coherence, even from those who think they’re doing noble work “widening the debate” or “raising awareness”, when in fact they’re just making progressives look weird. There is no short cut – via Chesham and Amersham or anywhere else.

    As usual, it's Freedland who offers the real insights.
    Really? I'd say Harris though I often find Freedland to be insightful
    I generally sense from most commentators the process of churning out 1,000 words or so to a deadline - sometimes it hits the target, often it doesn't. But with Freedland I am always struck by evidence of deeper thinking and understanding informed by history.
  • turbotubbsturbotubbs Posts: 17,392
    Roger said:

    rcs1000 said:

    felix said:

    Charles said:

    The most revealing story I heard about Bercow was a few months ago.

    At the school his kids are at there are 2 parents represented on the board.

    Sally & John Bercow have occupied both of those seats having actively campaigned to win them.

    And, I am told, favour their children’s interests over the broader school community

    Of course this is all third hand gossip, but it does seem entirely plausible

    I'd have to say he'd come very high on the list of 'defections' any sensible political party would wish to avoid. I struggle to see an obvious voting cohort that would be following him from blue to red. Other reasons why blues might move of course but in Bercow's wake? No.

    As an aside it seems from reports in the press and elsewhere that there may be something of a local difficulty for Labour with the Muslim vote in B & S. Apparently the fact that his wife is half Jewish is not helping their cause. If so what an extraordinary indictment of the party for its courting of factionalism for too many years now.
    Is Jo Cox's sister gay?
    Apparently there is a partner called Claire. First I’ve heard And no ones business I guess but does that have an effect on how would vote?
    Murkier and murkier she's gay but has a half Jewish husband who is losing her the Muslim vote?

    Find out in the next episode of SOAP!
    Clearly some crossed wires here. Is the mix up about George Galloway?
  • alex_alex_ Posts: 7,518
    Charles said:

    The most revealing story I heard about Bercow was a few months ago.

    At the school his kids are at there are 2 parents represented on the board.

    Sally & John Bercow have occupied both of those seats having actively campaigned to win them.

    And, I am told, favour their children’s interests over the broader school community

    Of course this is all third hand gossip, but it does seem entirely plausible

    Why don't the other parents vote them off again then?
  • moonshinemoonshine Posts: 5,747
    Roger said:

    IanB2 said:

    Katy Balls: The north-south Tory parliamentary coalition has so far held together on the basis that all sides could win from the government’s message. The byelection result adds to the growing concern among Tory MPs in the south that this is no longer the case.

    John Harris: But what has happened since [Cameron] has been a kind of counter-revolution within the [Tory] party: any anxieties about being seen as “the nasty party” have been blithely sidelined, and a nakedly populist, divisive agenda has been embraced, built on our departure from the EU. The purging of more centrist Conservatives has hardly helped. Not for the first time, what [Davey’s] party seems to have divined is an overlooked part of the electorate who may soon start to change the political weather. They do not like Boris Johnson, or what he is doing with power. Brexit is still uppermost in their minds. If they are watching GB News, it is only for the laughs. And as people like them now embrace home-working and move in ever-increasing numbers from London to its surrounding areas, they ought to be causing the Conservatives’ cleverer minds no end of concern.

    Freedland: Plot it on a graph and the change stares right back at you. Fifty years ago, parties of the left fared best among those with the least education and the lowest income, while the right flourished among those with the most of both. These days, the right still does well among the affluent, but on education the two camps have swapped places: these days, and far too crudely put, if you’re a graduate you vote left; if you’re not, you don’t. [However…] The harder truth is that those who want change will have to speak to voters about the things they, the voters, care about, and in a way that makes sense to them. It will require discipline and coherence, even from those who think they’re doing noble work “widening the debate” or “raising awareness”, when in fact they’re just making progressives look weird. There is no short cut – via Chesham and Amersham or anywhere else.

    As usual, it's Freedland who offers the real insights.
    Really? I'd say Harris though I often find Freedland to be insightful
    Is Freedland’s “insight” about graduates tending to vote Labour not in large part just ignoring the inverse correlation between age and university attendance?
  • algarkirkalgarkirk Posts: 12,496

    Roger said:

    IanB2 said:

    Katy Balls: The north-south Tory parliamentary coalition has so far held together on the basis that all sides could win from the government’s message. The byelection result adds to the growing concern among Tory MPs in the south that this is no longer the case.

    John Harris: But what has happened since [Cameron] has been a kind of counter-revolution within the [Tory] party: any anxieties about being seen as “the nasty party” have been blithely sidelined, and a nakedly populist, divisive agenda has been embraced, built on our departure from the EU. The purging of more centrist Conservatives has hardly helped. Not for the first time, what [Davey’s] party seems to have divined is an overlooked part of the electorate who may soon start to change the political weather. They do not like Boris Johnson, or what he is doing with power. Brexit is still uppermost in their minds. If they are watching GB News, it is only for the laughs. And as people like them now embrace home-working and move in ever-increasing numbers from London to its surrounding areas, they ought to be causing the Conservatives’ cleverer minds no end of concern.

    Freedland: Plot it on a graph and the change stares right back at you. Fifty years ago, parties of the left fared best among those with the least education and the lowest income, while the right flourished among those with the most of both. These days, the right still does well among the affluent, but on education the two camps have swapped places: these days, and far too crudely put, if you’re a graduate you vote left; if you’re not, you don’t. [However…] The harder truth is that those who want change will have to speak to voters about the things they, the voters, care about, and in a way that makes sense to them. It will require discipline and coherence, even from those who think they’re doing noble work “widening the debate” or “raising awareness”, when in fact they’re just making progressives look weird. There is no short cut – via Chesham and Amersham or anywhere else.

    As usual, it's Freedland who offers the real insights.
    Really? I'd say Harris though I often find Freedland to be insightful
    I generally sense from most commentators the process of churning out 1,000 words or so to a deadline - sometimes it hits the target, often it doesn't. But with Freedland I am always struck by evidence of deeper thinking and understanding informed by history.
    Freedland the better by far. he is outstandingly good. But the fault they both share and don't recognise because it is built in, is that their favoured groups are known to be correct, and the Tory interlopers are in the wrong. The merits of the Tories' appeal to a massive spectrum in the middle, the middling aspirational sort, passes them by. The idea that this Tory government for all its faults is progressive too passes them by. That is the Guardian all over.

  • StereodogStereodog Posts: 692
    You won't hear someone who has worked in Parliament say this very often but I miss Bercow as Speaker. His willingness to ignore convention made Parliament (for good or ill) powerful during Brexit in a way that stands in stark contrast to how supine it's been over COVID.

    Hoyle has his tantrums against the government but ultimately he's not willing to break any rules that might really piss them off. His fatal flaw is that he wants to be liked by his colleagues. He's a bit Michael Martin like in my opinion, although perhaps more intelligent.

    Bercow really hated clerks because they told him that he couldn't do things because of precedent (that is largely their job) and his behaviour could be inexcusable. On the other hand he was wonderful with the other staff such as the security guards, guides, caterers. Always really helpful for things like organising school visits and he opened up Speaker's House to any staff grade for monthly lectures by other politicians.
  • EssexitEssexit Posts: 1,956
    If Starmer really does come to rely on Bercow as an attack dog, Labour is in much bigger trouble than we thought.
  • felixfelix Posts: 15,164
    edited June 2021

    felix said:

    Charles said:

    The most revealing story I heard about Bercow was a few months ago.

    At the school his kids are at there are 2 parents represented on the board.

    Sally & John Bercow have occupied both of those seats having actively campaigned to win them.

    And, I am told, favour their children’s interests over the broader school community

    Of course this is all third hand gossip, but it does seem entirely plausible

    I'd have to say he'd come very high on the list of 'defections' any sensible political party would wish to avoid. I struggle to see an obvious voting cohort that would be following him from blue to red. Other reasons why blues might move of course but in Bercow's wake? No.

    As an aside it seems from reports in the press and elsewhere that there may be something of a local difficulty for Labour with the Muslim vote in B & S. Apparently the fact that his wife is half Jewish is not helping their cause. If so what an extraordinary indictment of the party for its courting of factionalism for too many years now.
    The Labour candidate in B&S is female.
    I was referring to Starmer's wife which was cited in the reports. Re-reading I can see the confusion. I've no knowledge of the Labour candidate beyond her being Jo Cox's sister. The reports i read were talking about the anti-Starmer rumblings. Hilarious that even in the wake of the C & A defeat it is the Labour leader under pressure.
  • alex_alex_ Posts: 7,518
    edited June 2021
    moonshine said:

    Roger said:

    IanB2 said:

    Katy Balls: The north-south Tory parliamentary coalition has so far held together on the basis that all sides could win from the government’s message. The byelection result adds to the growing concern among Tory MPs in the south that this is no longer the case.

    John Harris: But what has happened since [Cameron] has been a kind of counter-revolution within the [Tory] party: any anxieties about being seen as “the nasty party” have been blithely sidelined, and a nakedly populist, divisive agenda has been embraced, built on our departure from the EU. The purging of more centrist Conservatives has hardly helped. Not for the first time, what [Davey’s] party seems to have divined is an overlooked part of the electorate who may soon start to change the political weather. They do not like Boris Johnson, or what he is doing with power. Brexit is still uppermost in their minds. If they are watching GB News, it is only for the laughs. And as people like them now embrace home-working and move in ever-increasing numbers from London to its surrounding areas, they ought to be causing the Conservatives’ cleverer minds no end of concern.

    Freedland: Plot it on a graph and the change stares right back at you. Fifty years ago, parties of the left fared best among those with the least education and the lowest income, while the right flourished among those with the most of both. These days, the right still does well among the affluent, but on education the two camps have swapped places: these days, and far too crudely put, if you’re a graduate you vote left; if you’re not, you don’t. [However…] The harder truth is that those who want change will have to speak to voters about the things they, the voters, care about, and in a way that makes sense to them. It will require discipline and coherence, even from those who think they’re doing noble work “widening the debate” or “raising awareness”, when in fact they’re just making progressives look weird. There is no short cut – via Chesham and Amersham or anywhere else.

    As usual, it's Freedland who offers the real insights.
    Really? I'd say Harris though I often find Freedland to be insightful
    Is Freedland’s “insight” about graduates tending to vote Labour not in large part just ignoring the inverse correlation between age and university attendance?
    And the converse that historically higher levels of education were the preserve of the middle classes and upwards.

    Basically in both cases the link to voting patterns had nothing to do with how "educated" people were, or any sort of link to intelligence. Just a derivative from changing patterns of education provision.
  • noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 22,808
    Dura_Ace said:

    And this is another example: https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2021/06/19/exclusive-matt-hancock-kept-boris-johnson-dark-covid-vaccines/

    I'm afraid that Johnson is hopeless on detail. He bluffs, blusters and blagues but has no grasp of facts, no attention to detail and no capacity to apply himself.

    Fucking Hopeless is definitely on the receiving end of a blue-on-blue shock and awe briefing campaign at the moment.
    Indeed, the spin is because he clearly he has to go soon, purely for the alliterative nickname that cannot be shaken off and shows up the PM as weak, rather than his merits or demerits as health secretary.
  • RochdalePioneersRochdalePioneers Posts: 28,895
    Happy pointless card day all you dads out there
  • turbotubbsturbotubbs Posts: 17,392
    felix said:

    felix said:

    Charles said:

    The most revealing story I heard about Bercow was a few months ago.

    At the school his kids are at there are 2 parents represented on the board.

    Sally & John Bercow have occupied both of those seats having actively campaigned to win them.

    And, I am told, favour their children’s interests over the broader school community

    Of course this is all third hand gossip, but it does seem entirely plausible

    I'd have to say he'd come very high on the list of 'defections' any sensible political party would wish to avoid. I struggle to see an obvious voting cohort that would be following him from blue to red. Other reasons why blues might move of course but in Bercow's wake? No.

    As an aside it seems from reports in the press and elsewhere that there may be something of a local difficulty for Labour with the Muslim vote in B & S. Apparently the fact that his wife is half Jewish is not helping their cause. If so what an extraordinary indictment of the party for its courting of factionalism for too many years now.
    The Labour candidate in B&S is female.
    I was referring to Starmer's wife which was cited in the reports.
    Cheers for clearing up!
  • alex_alex_ Posts: 7,518

    Happy pointless card day all you dads out there

    :)

    I was just wondering if there's any sort of accepted standard of gift for Father's Day? Or is it just a card. Mother's Day is obviously flowers (at a minimum), and probably give her a break by cooking lunch or going out for a meal.

    But Father's Day? Bottle of Scotch? Just because.
  • noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 22,808
    Stereodog said:

    You won't hear someone who has worked in Parliament say this very often but I miss Bercow as Speaker. His willingness to ignore convention made Parliament (for good or ill) powerful during Brexit in a way that stands in stark contrast to how supine it's been over COVID.

    Hoyle has his tantrums against the government but ultimately he's not willing to break any rules that might really piss them off. His fatal flaw is that he wants to be liked by his colleagues. He's a bit Michael Martin like in my opinion, although perhaps more intelligent.

    Bercow really hated clerks because they told him that he couldn't do things because of precedent (that is largely their job) and his behaviour could be inexcusable. On the other hand he was wonderful with the other staff such as the security guards, guides, caterers. Always really helpful for things like organising school visits and he opened up Speaker's House to any staff grade for monthly lectures by other politicians.

    Quite a few similarities with BoJo in there, disliking constraints and convention, thinking breaking them is fine because his side is good and it makes that side more powerful.
  • Daveyboy1961Daveyboy1961 Posts: 3,883
    Foxy said:

    Pulpstar said:

    I am.... 40.

    Happy Birthday.

    Forty sounds very old, until you hit 50...
    ....or 60....
  • StereodogStereodog Posts: 692

    Stereodog said:

    You won't hear someone who has worked in Parliament say this very often but I miss Bercow as Speaker. His willingness to ignore convention made Parliament (for good or ill) powerful during Brexit in a way that stands in stark contrast to how supine it's been over COVID.

    Hoyle has his tantrums against the government but ultimately he's not willing to break any rules that might really piss them off. His fatal flaw is that he wants to be liked by his colleagues. He's a bit Michael Martin like in my opinion, although perhaps more intelligent.

    Bercow really hated clerks because they told him that he couldn't do things because of precedent (that is largely their job) and his behaviour could be inexcusable. On the other hand he was wonderful with the other staff such as the security guards, guides, caterers. Always really helpful for things like organising school visits and he opened up Speaker's House to any staff grade for monthly lectures by other politicians.

    Quite a few similarities with BoJo in there, disliking constraints and convention, thinking breaking them is fine because his side is good and it makes that side more powerful.
    Yeah I can see what you mean although I do genuinely think that Bercow wanted to ensure Parliament's voice was heard over Brexit. If the government had it's way then they would have been ignored entirely. BoJo doesn't really love any institution with the possible exception of Eton.
  • alex_alex_ Posts: 7,518
    edited June 2021
    Stereodog said:

    You won't hear someone who has worked in Parliament say this very often but I miss Bercow as Speaker. His willingness to ignore convention made Parliament (for good or ill) powerful during Brexit in a way that stands in stark contrast to how supine it's been over COVID.

    Hoyle has his tantrums against the government but ultimately he's not willing to break any rules that might really piss them off. His fatal flaw is that he wants to be liked by his colleagues. He's a bit Michael Martin like in my opinion, although perhaps more intelligent.

    Bercow really hated clerks because they told him that he couldn't do things because of precedent (that is largely their job) and his behaviour could be inexcusable. On the other hand he was wonderful with the other staff such as the security guards, guides, caterers. Always really helpful for things like organising school visits and he opened up Speaker's House to any staff grade for monthly lectures by other politicians.

    Parliament was "powerful" during Brexit because the Government had no majority. And no majority for no course of action. And ultimately what did it achieve with this "power"? An outcome far worse than Government opponents would have compromised for with hindsight.

    Parliament could easily be powerful over Covid, even with the large Government majority. That it's not is because the key to limiting Government power is to oppose it on lockdown - because that is where any rebellion from within its own ranks is going to come from. But that won't happen whilst the main opposition is unwilling to exploit this to get its aims. Even if just threatening to vote with rebels to give the Govt the dilemma between following the agenda of the rebels - or following the opposition agenda of increasing financial support for workers and businesses.



  • malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 43,309

    Hoyle os a much better speaker...see how he handled the international aid amendment and also the government not making announcements first in parliament...he quietly but firmly talked to.those involved and found a way forward. No showboating.

    Dreamer , Boris just ignores him , he is a wimp and a useless lickspittle that the Tories just ignore.
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 62,688
    I got on Galloway on BF for B& S at 110 two days ago.

    He is now 4.1.

  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830
    alex_ said:

    Happy pointless card day all you dads out there

    :)

    I was just wondering if there's any sort of accepted standard of gift for Father's Day? Or is it just a card. Mother's Day is obviously flowers (at a minimum), and probably give her a break by cooking lunch or going out for a meal.

    But Father's Day? Bottle of Scotch? Just because.
    The fish merchants in Newlyn are out of lobsters because (they say) of father's day. I shall tell my sons this as a hint for 2022.
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 27,855

    Betting Post

    F1: one of those weekends when it's hard to find much of anything. Backed Sainz at 3 for best of the rest. If I didn't blog every race weekend I suspect I would've skipped this one.

    https://enormo-haddock.blogspot.com/2021/06/france-pre-race-2021.html

    Lewis Hamilton is drifting as Verstappen is backed on Betfair. Now 2.92 and 2 respectively.
  • RochdalePioneersRochdalePioneers Posts: 28,895
    alex_ said:

    Happy pointless card day all you dads out there

    :)

    I was just wondering if there's any sort of accepted standard of gift for Father's Day? Or is it just a card. Mother's Day is obviously flowers (at a minimum), and probably give her a break by cooking lunch or going out for a meal.

    But Father's Day? Bottle of Scotch? Just because.
    I have 3 kids and I love a bottle of single malt. But Fathers Day has never interested me. My kids love me. They don't need to be guilt tripped into having one random day where the card industry makes a bundle of profit for something they made up.
  • prh47bridgeprh47bridge Posts: 452
    Charles said:

    The most revealing story I heard about Bercow was a few months ago.

    At the school his kids are at there are 2 parents represented on the board.

    Sally & John Bercow have occupied both of those seats having actively campaigned to win them.

    And, I am told, favour their children’s interests over the broader school community

    Of course this is all third hand gossip, but it does seem entirely plausible

    It is certainly true that Holland Park School has two elected parent governors and the Bercows occupy those positions, with Mrs Bercow having responsibility for SEND and safeguarding. See https://www.hollandparkschool.co.uk/about/governance
  • noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 22,808

    I got on Galloway on BF for B& S at 110 two days ago.

    He is now 4.1.

    Happy to lay 5.1 if you would like to top up!!

    Lowest matched price is 50 so would query that he ever was 4.1, that was merely a sign of no market at the time.
  • squareroot2squareroot2 Posts: 6,722
    Bercow suffers from LMS imho.That is why he is shouty and unpleasant.
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 33,414
    alex_ said:

    Happy pointless card day all you dads out there

    :)

    I was just wondering if there's any sort of accepted standard of gift for Father's Day? Or is it just a card. Mother's Day is obviously flowers (at a minimum), and probably give her a break by cooking lunch or going out for a meal.

    But Father's Day? Bottle of Scotch? Just because.
    For some reason, the basis for which escapes me, most of my presents these days...... Birthday, Christmas, Fathers Day....... seem to involve alcoholic drinks.
This discussion has been closed.