I was just thinking Kasper Schmeichel.....that's the second shocking incident he has witnessed close up on a football field in the past few years (the other being the helicopter crash at Leicester).
Apparently yesterday he consoled Eriksen's wife, who thought he had died.
All this ein Reich stuff very much has the air of we fucked it so now we have to mightily overcompensate and hope people don't notice.
Definitely an air of “The lady doth protest too much, methinks”.
Also curiously tin eared for such a populist government. I'd imagine more than half the populations of Eng, Wal & Sco would be actively hostile to being told that the don't have their own nations. NI is of course it's own case, but I'd bet at least half won't like being told 'you're British and there's an end to it!'
I was just thinking Kasper Schmeichel.....that's the second shocking incident he has witnessed close up on a football field in the past few years (the other being the helicopter crash at Leicester).
Apparently yesterday he consoled Eriksen's wife, who thought he had died.
All this ein Reich stuff very much has the air of we fucked it so now we have to mightily overcompensate and hope people don't notice.
Ha ha. If we are one country why are we playing against ourselves in the football?
I don't think that's entirely fair. The Home Nations' teams are an artefact of the 19th century, before a reasonably consistent structure of international sports based around teams representing sovereign states had properly taken off. If football had only become a big thing in the 1950s then I dare say these separate teams wouldn't exist.
However - on the broader point, the notion that the Government were really that interested in operating the UK as a smooth an harmonious whole would make a lot more sense if successive administrations hadn't indulged lop-sided, ad hoc, dog's breakfast devolution for the last two decades. Either you have the unitary state, an even structure of regional/federal government, or dissolution. The present arrangements don't work and there's no willingness at all from the idiots in Parliament to change them.
The absolute state of English PBers wanting England to lose. Absolutely effing pathetic. Take a careful note to never listen to any of these morons whenever they pontificate about patriotism.
That's fair. The outrage over this is vastly, vastly overdone. I don't think much of BLM either but the players evidently think they're doing something important to them to protest against racial prejudice. Whether you view these demonstrations as important and valuable or empty and fatuous, they don't strike me as particularly offensive. They certainly don't deserve to be abused for them.
I was just thinking Kasper Schmeichel.....that's the second shocking incident he has witnessed close up on a football field in the past few years (the other being the helicopter crash at Leicester).
Apparently yesterday he consoled Eriksen's wife, who thought he had died.
He did, him and the Captain
I seemed to remember he ran towards the helicopter to try and help. Seems like a stand up guy.
The absolute state of English PBers wanting England to lose. Absolutely effing pathetic. Take a careful note to never listen to any of these morons whenever they pontificate about patriotism.
Plus a HUNDRED.
Yep. They're all on a list now. Take a lot to get off it too.
Now that’s one thing I’d be happy to see flop. The hundred.
The absolute state of English PBers wanting England to lose. Absolutely effing pathetic. Take a careful note to never listen to any of these morons whenever they pontificate about patriotism.
Plus a HUNDRED.
Yep. They're all on a list now. Take a lot to get off it too.
Now that’s one thing I’d be happy to see flop. The hundred.
All this ein Reich stuff very much has the air of we fucked it so now we have to mightily overcompensate and hope people don't notice.
Definitely an air of “The lady doth protest too much, methinks”.
Also curiously tin eared for such a populist government. I'd imagine more than half the populations of Eng, Wal & Sco would be actively hostile to being told that the don't have their own nations. NI is of course it's own case, but I'd bet at least half won't like being told 'you're British and there's an end to it!'
Doubtless they'll be telling their mates at the RFU to pull out of that festival of woke, the offensively named "Six Nations."
"Mixed reception as England players take the knee England 0-0 Croatia
Phil McNulty
BBC Sport chief football writer at Wembley
Still booing from a large number of England fans as they take the knee before kick-off but the jeers were also met with a response of loud and prolonged applause. Mixed reaction."
The absolute state of English PBers wanting England to lose. Absolutely effing pathetic. Take a careful note to never listen to any of these morons whenever they pontificate about patriotism.
Plus a HUNDRED.
Yep. They're all on a list now. Take a lot to get off it too.
Now that’s one thing I’d be happy to see flop. The hundred.
The Hundred is the Hawaiian pizza of cricket.
That’s a great line and I’m nicking it for,future use,
The level of hysteria on here regarding lockdown is a thing of beauty…
There is nothing hysterical about pointing out that current restrictions:- - make many businesses dependant on social closeness unviable and unprofitable - such businesses have spent much of the last 16 months closed and have exhausted any reserves - many such businesses employ the young, those starting out etc - summer business at full capacity is essential to allowing such businesses to survive, let alone become profitable - continuing restrictions over the summer - let alone beyond then - will destroy many such businesses. Once gone, there is little chance of them being replaced for who would take a chance on investing in such businesses in such a climate - the economic and social effects of this in very many parts of the country and in the young, in particular, will be very grave.
Also the government support is a fixed duration thing and is ending timed to freedom day. If that day gets pushed back further and further the government show no sign of rolling support further back, and that wouldn't cover losses stocking and resourcing up for unlock events that are now cancelled.
The entertainment and hospitality sectors really will be in ruins by the end.
Indeed. The total silence on continuation of support makes me fear the worst - that restrictions will continue, support will be withdrawn and the government will simply ignore the wave of bankruptcies, closures and lost jobs that will result.
Still there all those with large savings who can pay for it all - an 80% super tax on them should do it I reckon. And they'll be happy to pay, won't they?
Raab was asked today if the month's delay would be final and complete and he gave no assurance whatever. Nothing is ever, ever ruled out. He said they did not want to yo-yo, but again gave no assurance whatever.
The government's assertion that the month's delay was to give business 'certainty' is therefore complete rank bullsh8t.
All businesses are facing is an everlasting uncertainty, and its clear that after this delay many will say you know what, that is it.
Airlines. Hotels. Pubs. Conferencing. Weddings and events. These industries are getting crushed permanently.
Yeah the pubs are open but many are trading at a loss. They are not really 'open' in many cases. They have not been for a year.
The absolute state of English PBers wanting England to lose. Absolutely effing pathetic. Take a careful note to never listen to any of these morons whenever they pontificate about patriotism.
People are entitled to show complete indifference to an event they find totally inconsequential. Not sure what it has to do with patriotism - particularly as England, Wales & Scotland are effectively regions of Great Briain rather than countries in their own right.
The absolute state of English PBers wanting England to lose. Absolutely effing pathetic. Take a careful note to never listen to any of these morons whenever they pontificate about patriotism.
It's fucking awful. I'm cheering England on enthusiastically, and I'm bloody Scottish. #comeonengland.
It is very pleasing to see the majority of fans being true patriots and supporting the England football team and not booing them. The way the media go on about taking the knee you would think it goes on forever but they only do it for about five seconds. Bunch of snowflakes getting offended about nothing.
I am not even a football fan but I am proud to be supporting my country today as I am sure most decent people are.
The absolute state of English PBers wanting England to lose. Absolutely effing pathetic. Take a careful note to never listen to any of these morons whenever they pontificate about patriotism.
It's fucking awful. I'm cheering England on enthusiastically, and I'm bloody Scottish. #comeonengland.
The absolute state of English PBers wanting England to lose. Absolutely effing pathetic. Take a careful note to never listen to any of these morons whenever they pontificate about patriotism.
Plus a HUNDRED.
Yep. They're all on a list now. Take a lot to get off it too.
Now that’s one thing I’d be happy to see flop. The hundred.
All this ein Reich stuff very much has the air of we fucked it so now we have to mightily overcompensate and hope people don't notice.
Definitely an air of “The lady doth protest too much, methinks”.
Also curiously tin eared for such a populist government. I'd imagine more than half the populations of Eng, Wal & Sco would be actively hostile to being told that the don't have their own nations. NI is of course it's own case, but I'd bet at least half won't like being told 'you're British and there's an end to it!'
They don't, they are ceremonial countries only and in reality just regions of the UK, the only sovereign nation in GB and Northern Ireland
The absolute state of English PBers wanting England to lose. Absolutely effing pathetic. Take a careful note to never listen to any of these morons whenever they pontificate about patriotism.
It's fucking awful. I'm cheering England on enthusiastically, and I'm bloody Scottish. #comeonengland.
Ditto. Not planning to do so when Scotland visit though.
Really don't understand Trippier instead of Shaw. The latter has been United's best winger this year by a considerable margin.
The absolute state of English PBers wanting England to lose. Absolutely effing pathetic. Take a careful note to never listen to any of these morons whenever they pontificate about patriotism.
Plus a HUNDRED.
Yep. They're all on a list now. Take a lot to get off it too.
Now that’s one thing I’d be happy to see flop. The hundred.
The Hundred is the Hawaiian pizza of cricket.
Hawaiian pizza is tasty and popular.
Can't see The Hundred being either.
I remember the glorious Angela Harnett telling a tale where she dumped a guy she was dating as he had a Hawaiian pizza. What a woman.
Boris is holding a press conference in Cornwall right now.
Boris went to Eton and is a rugby man, he does not have much interest in soccer
Did you miss his intervention over the Super League?
That does not mean he is not willing to try and get a few votes out of it from soccer loving voters in the Red Wall, however I doubt Boris ever watches a football match unless he sees a camera near by
All this ein Reich stuff very much has the air of we fucked it so now we have to mightily overcompensate and hope people don't notice.
Definitely an air of “The lady doth protest too much, methinks”.
Also curiously tin eared for such a populist government. I'd imagine more than half the populations of Eng, Wal & Sco would be actively hostile to being told that the don't have their own nations. NI is of course it's own case, but I'd bet at least half won't like being told 'you're British and there's an end to it!'
They don't, they are ceremonial countries only and in reality just regions of the UK, the only sovereign nation in GB and Northern Ireland
You do talk arrogant nonsense
They all have devolved administrations and first ministers
Indeed each has handled covid differently and their administrations are elected by their populace
All this ein Reich stuff very much has the air of we fucked it so now we have to mightily overcompensate and hope people don't notice.
Definitely an air of “The lady doth protest too much, methinks”.
Also curiously tin eared for such a populist government. I'd imagine more than half the populations of Eng, Wal & Sco would be actively hostile to being told that the don't have their own nations. NI is of course it's own case, but I'd bet at least half won't like being told 'you're British and there's an end to it!'
They don't, they are ceremonial countries only and in reality just regions of the UK, the only sovereign nation in GB and Northern Ireland
You do talk arrogant nonsense
They all have devolved administrations and first ministers
Indeed each has handled covid differently and their administrations are elected by their populace
All this ein Reich stuff very much has the air of we fucked it so now we have to mightily overcompensate and hope people don't notice.
Definitely an air of “The lady doth protest too much, methinks”.
Also curiously tin eared for such a populist government. I'd imagine more than half the populations of Eng, Wal & Sco would be actively hostile to being told that the don't have their own nations. NI is of course it's own case, but I'd bet at least half won't like being told 'you're British and there's an end to it!'
They don't, they are ceremonial countries only and in reality just regions of the UK, the only sovereign nation in GB and Northern Ireland
You do talk arrogant nonsense
They all have devolved administrations and first ministers
Indeed each has handled covid differently and their administrations are elected by their populace
All this ein Reich stuff very much has the air of we fucked it so now we have to mightily overcompensate and hope people don't notice.
Definitely an air of “The lady doth protest too much, methinks”.
Also curiously tin eared for such a populist government. I'd imagine more than half the populations of Eng, Wal & Sco would be actively hostile to being told that the don't have their own nations. NI is of course it's own case, but I'd bet at least half won't like being told 'you're British and there's an end to it!'
They don't, they are ceremonial countries only and in reality just regions of the UK, the only sovereign nation in GB and Northern Ireland
You do talk arrogant nonsense
They all have devolved administrations and first ministers
Indeed each has handled covid differently and their administrations are elected by their populace
England doesn't, but hey-ho, what do we matter?
As long as we keep subsidising them then we matter.
All this ein Reich stuff very much has the air of we fucked it so now we have to mightily overcompensate and hope people don't notice.
Definitely an air of “The lady doth protest too much, methinks”.
Also curiously tin eared for such a populist government. I'd imagine more than half the populations of Eng, Wal & Sco would be actively hostile to being told that the don't have their own nations. NI is of course it's own case, but I'd bet at least half won't like being told 'you're British and there's an end to it!'
They don't, they are ceremonial countries only and in reality just regions of the UK, the only sovereign nation in GB and Northern Ireland
You do talk arrogant nonsense
They all have devolved administrations and first ministers
Indeed each has handled covid differently and their administrations are elected by their populace
England doesn't, but hey-ho, what do we matter?
Westminster is the de facto English parliament and controls the colonies as well.
Currently 2-1 to Tsitsipas in the first set over in Paris. He took seven minutes to win his first service game but much more comfortable second time around. Encouraging early signs for a good match.
The absolute state of English PBers wanting England to lose. Absolutely effing pathetic. Take a careful note to never listen to any of these morons whenever they pontificate about patriotism.
It's fucking awful. I'm cheering England on enthusiastically, and I'm bloody Scottish. #comeonengland.
And the government’s culture warmongering would almost be less objectionable were it not so transparently cynical and inauthentic. The anti-woke playbook says oppose taking the knee but the polling shows salt-of-the-earth-red-wall-association-football-fans like the England squad https://twitter.com/MattChorley/status/1404021277279633408
You don't half post some guff.
Polling shows a majority don't support taking the knee. Boris statement the other day was about as middling as middling could be, suppprt right to do so, without saying he supported it. That's a perfectly valid position and actually the polling shows one shared by a significant percentage of the nation.
But I bet and hope that if you asked the public if they positively approved of the BOOing the "yes" percentage would be very low indeed. Much lower than those who just don't support the team making the gesture.
You know why? Because it would (by and large) be just 2 categories of people (with significant overlap) who thankfully do not constitute a large slice of our population.
The 2 categories are as follows:
(i) Right wing culture warriors with a BLM "marxist" hang up.
(ii) Racists.
This is the truth I write here on this gorgeous Sunday morning. So nobody should bother even thinking about demurring.
The Match - I'm not confident. I'm on the 1/1 draw.
Unfortunately, we had the numbers upthread.
About half of fans support the knee thing and oppose the booing.
About 30% oppose the knee thing and support the booing.
Although it's not confirmed, hard not to imagine it's the same 30% and 50% each time.
The 30% feels a bit like a defiant rage against the dying of a certain sort of light.
That's of football fans. I refuse to believe as many as 30% of the general population actively support the booing. If that is the case, the country is further gone than I thought.
I think the kneeling is pointless virtue signalling which does nothing to help anyone. But at the same time the booing has an added dimension of being pretty offensive as the 'virtue' it seems to be signalling is opposition to people making a peaceful point on a matter we should all reasonably be in agreement about.
Lots of people do virtue signalling in many different ways. Almost all of the time it is pointless at best but going as far as to boo those doing it does seem at least mildly offensive to me.
Mind you I am not a great fan of bladder kicking either so I probably don't see the point in any of the activities going on inside Wembley stadium from start to finish.
Exactly. You - not a footie fan - wouldn't boo the team and disapprove of that happening even though you don't support the Knee. Because you're not a right wing culture warrior and you're not racist. There'll be loads like you. For once you are not niche here. That's why I say there'll be nothing like 30% of the population in favour of the booing.
I see little wrong in virtue signalling btw. In fact I see nothing wrong in it. People who consider virtue signalling to be one of the top things to fret about in the world should imo take a long hard look in the mirror and have a long hard word with their reflection.
Again I agree. worrying about virtue signalling is like worrying about the kneeling. I think it is rather silly and can, in some circumstances, be counter productive, but it wouldn't rate in my top 500 things that are wrong in the world.
I kind of think of booing people taking the knee as being like me, as an atheist, booing people walking into church. It would be pointless, silly and, most importantly, extremely rude.
There is more than enough room in this world for a diverse range of different beliefs, customs and priorities. Getting offended by something you don't personally agree with with shows a real lack of imagination and empathy.
I think that's a rather poor analogy.
The crowd are having a gesture forced on them in their own environment, and are being patronised when they refuse to kowtow.
It is more like either a church congregation booing Dawkins who has barged his way in an is preaching his opinions, or the a Leicester Secular Society meeting booing a church choir that has paraded in and is walking round singing "Lift High the Cross" (Which has nine verses).
My analogy isn't quite right either, but it highlighs the offence of a partisan political gesture being imposed in people's own environment, where it has neither been consulted upon nor is universally accepted.
I'm not a dedicated footie fan, so fortunately I have not got this pushed in my face.
Extraordinary this...Biden links arms with Macron and the EU not our PM. It is not the US relationship with the UK that is special now, it is the US one with leaders of the EU. https://twitter.com/tobyhelm/status/1404005189384867844
And the government’s culture warmongering would almost be less objectionable were it not so transparently cynical and inauthentic. The anti-woke playbook says oppose taking the knee but the polling shows salt-of-the-earth-red-wall-association-football-fans like the England squad https://twitter.com/MattChorley/status/1404021277279633408
You don't half post some guff.
Polling shows a majority don't support taking the knee. Boris statement the other day was about as middling as middling could be, suppprt right to do so, without saying he supported it. That's a perfectly valid position and actually the polling shows one shared by a significant percentage of the nation.
But I bet and hope that if you asked the public if they positively approved of the BOOing the "yes" percentage would be very low indeed. Much lower than those who just don't support the team making the gesture.
You know why? Because it would (by and large) be just 2 categories of people (with significant overlap) who thankfully do not constitute a large slice of our population.
The 2 categories are as follows:
(i) Right wing culture warriors with a BLM "marxist" hang up.
(ii) Racists.
This is the truth I write here on this gorgeous Sunday morning. So nobody should bother even thinking about demurring.
The Match - I'm not confident. I'm on the 1/1 draw.
Unfortunately, we had the numbers upthread.
About half of fans support the knee thing and oppose the booing.
About 30% oppose the knee thing and support the booing.
Although it's not confirmed, hard not to imagine it's the same 30% and 50% each time.
The 30% feels a bit like a defiant rage against the dying of a certain sort of light.
That's of football fans. I refuse to believe as many as 30% of the general population actively support the booing. If that is the case, the country is further gone than I thought.
I think the kneeling is pointless virtue signalling which does nothing to help anyone. But at the same time the booing has an added dimension of being pretty offensive as the 'virtue' it seems to be signalling is opposition to people making a peaceful point on a matter we should all reasonably be in agreement about.
Lots of people do virtue signalling in many different ways. Almost all of the time it is pointless at best but going as far as to boo those doing it does seem at least mildly offensive to me.
Mind you I am not a great fan of bladder kicking either so I probably don't see the point in any of the activities going on inside Wembley stadium from start to finish.
Exactly. You - not a footie fan - wouldn't boo the team and disapprove of that happening even though you don't support the Knee. Because you're not a right wing culture warrior and you're not racist. There'll be loads like you. For once you are not niche here. That's why I say there'll be nothing like 30% of the population in favour of the booing.
I see little wrong in virtue signalling btw. In fact I see nothing wrong in it. People who consider virtue signalling to be one of the top things to fret about in the world should imo take a long hard look in the mirror and have a long hard word with their reflection.
Again I agree. worrying about virtue signalling is like worrying about the kneeling. I think it is rather silly and can, in some circumstances, be counter productive, but it wouldn't rate in my top 500 things that are wrong in the world.
I kind of think of booing people taking the knee as being like me, as an atheist, booing people walking into church. It would be pointless, silly and, most importantly, extremely rude.
There is more than enough room in this world for a diverse range of different beliefs, customs and priorities. Getting offended by something you don't personally agree with with shows a real lack of imagination and empathy.
I think that's a rather poor analogy.
The crowd are having a gesture forced on them in their own environment, and are being patronised when they refuse to kowtow.
It is more like either a church congregation booing Dawkins who has barged his way in an is preaching his opinions, or the a Leicester Secular Society meeting booing a church choir that has paraded in and is walking round singing "Lift High the Cross" (Which has nine verses).
My analogy isn't quite right either, but it highlighs the offence of a partisan political gesture being imposed in people's own environment, where it has neither been consulted upon nor is universally accepted.
I'm not a dedicated footie fan, so fortunately I have not got this pushed in my face.
And the government’s culture warmongering would almost be less objectionable were it not so transparently cynical and inauthentic. The anti-woke playbook says oppose taking the knee but the polling shows salt-of-the-earth-red-wall-association-football-fans like the England squad https://twitter.com/MattChorley/status/1404021277279633408
You don't half post some guff.
Polling shows a majority don't support taking the knee. Boris statement the other day was about as middling as middling could be, suppprt right to do so, without saying he supported it. That's a perfectly valid position and actually the polling shows one shared by a significant percentage of the nation.
But I bet and hope that if you asked the public if they positively approved of the BOOing the "yes" percentage would be very low indeed. Much lower than those who just don't support the team making the gesture.
You know why? Because it would (by and large) be just 2 categories of people (with significant overlap) who thankfully do not constitute a large slice of our population.
The 2 categories are as follows:
(i) Right wing culture warriors with a BLM "marxist" hang up.
(ii) Racists.
This is the truth I write here on this gorgeous Sunday morning. So nobody should bother even thinking about demurring.
The Match - I'm not confident. I'm on the 1/1 draw.
Unfortunately, we had the numbers upthread.
About half of fans support the knee thing and oppose the booing.
About 30% oppose the knee thing and support the booing.
Although it's not confirmed, hard not to imagine it's the same 30% and 50% each time.
The 30% feels a bit like a defiant rage against the dying of a certain sort of light.
That's of football fans. I refuse to believe as many as 30% of the general population actively support the booing. If that is the case, the country is further gone than I thought.
I think the kneeling is pointless virtue signalling which does nothing to help anyone. But at the same time the booing has an added dimension of being pretty offensive as the 'virtue' it seems to be signalling is opposition to people making a peaceful point on a matter we should all reasonably be in agreement about.
Lots of people do virtue signalling in many different ways. Almost all of the time it is pointless at best but going as far as to boo those doing it does seem at least mildly offensive to me.
Mind you I am not a great fan of bladder kicking either so I probably don't see the point in any of the activities going on inside Wembley stadium from start to finish.
Exactly. You - not a footie fan - wouldn't boo the team and disapprove of that happening even though you don't support the Knee. Because you're not a right wing culture warrior and you're not racist. There'll be loads like you. For once you are not niche here. That's why I say there'll be nothing like 30% of the population in favour of the booing.
I see little wrong in virtue signalling btw. In fact I see nothing wrong in it. People who consider virtue signalling to be one of the top things to fret about in the world should imo take a long hard look in the mirror and have a long hard word with their reflection.
Again I agree. worrying about virtue signalling is like worrying about the kneeling. I think it is rather silly and can, in some circumstances, be counter productive, but it wouldn't rate in my top 500 things that are wrong in the world.
I kind of think of booing people taking the knee as being like me, as an atheist, booing people walking into church. It would be pointless, silly and, most importantly, extremely rude.
There is more than enough room in this world for a diverse range of different beliefs, customs and priorities. Getting offended by something you don't personally agree with with shows a real lack of imagination and empathy.
I think that's a rather poor analogy.
The crowd are having a gesture forced on them in their own environment, and are being patronised when they refuse to kowtow.
It is more like either a church congregation booing Dawkins who has barged his way in an is preaching his opinions, or the a Leicester Secular Society meeting booing a church choir that has paraded in and is walking round singing "Lift High the Cross" (Which has nine verses).
My analogy isn't quite right either, but it highlighs the offence of a partisan political gesture being imposed in people's own environment, where it has neither been consulted upon nor is universally accepted.
I'm not a dedicated footie fan, so fortunately I have not got this pushed in my face.
Taking the knee is what it is.
'I'm thrusting my right arm out and clicking my heels to protest against 'climate change'
And the government’s culture warmongering would almost be less objectionable were it not so transparently cynical and inauthentic. The anti-woke playbook says oppose taking the knee but the polling shows salt-of-the-earth-red-wall-association-football-fans like the England squad https://twitter.com/MattChorley/status/1404021277279633408
You don't half post some guff.
Polling shows a majority don't support taking the knee. Boris statement the other day was about as middling as middling could be, suppprt right to do so, without saying he supported it. That's a perfectly valid position and actually the polling shows one shared by a significant percentage of the nation.
But I bet and hope that if you asked the public if they positively approved of the BOOing the "yes" percentage would be very low indeed. Much lower than those who just don't support the team making the gesture.
You know why? Because it would (by and large) be just 2 categories of people (with significant overlap) who thankfully do not constitute a large slice of our population.
The 2 categories are as follows:
(i) Right wing culture warriors with a BLM "marxist" hang up.
(ii) Racists.
This is the truth I write here on this gorgeous Sunday morning. So nobody should bother even thinking about demurring.
The Match - I'm not confident. I'm on the 1/1 draw.
Unfortunately, we had the numbers upthread.
About half of fans support the knee thing and oppose the booing.
About 30% oppose the knee thing and support the booing.
Although it's not confirmed, hard not to imagine it's the same 30% and 50% each time.
The 30% feels a bit like a defiant rage against the dying of a certain sort of light.
That's of football fans. I refuse to believe as many as 30% of the general population actively support the booing. If that is the case, the country is further gone than I thought.
I think the kneeling is pointless virtue signalling which does nothing to help anyone. But at the same time the booing has an added dimension of being pretty offensive as the 'virtue' it seems to be signalling is opposition to people making a peaceful point on a matter we should all reasonably be in agreement about.
Lots of people do virtue signalling in many different ways. Almost all of the time it is pointless at best but going as far as to boo those doing it does seem at least mildly offensive to me.
Mind you I am not a great fan of bladder kicking either so I probably don't see the point in any of the activities going on inside Wembley stadium from start to finish.
Exactly. You - not a footie fan - wouldn't boo the team and disapprove of that happening even though you don't support the Knee. Because you're not a right wing culture warrior and you're not racist. There'll be loads like you. For once you are not niche here. That's why I say there'll be nothing like 30% of the population in favour of the booing.
I see little wrong in virtue signalling btw. In fact I see nothing wrong in it. People who consider virtue signalling to be one of the top things to fret about in the world should imo take a long hard look in the mirror and have a long hard word with their reflection.
Again I agree. worrying about virtue signalling is like worrying about the kneeling. I think it is rather silly and can, in some circumstances, be counter productive, but it wouldn't rate in my top 500 things that are wrong in the world.
I kind of think of booing people taking the knee as being like me, as an atheist, booing people walking into church. It would be pointless, silly and, most importantly, extremely rude.
There is more than enough room in this world for a diverse range of different beliefs, customs and priorities. Getting offended by something you don't personally agree with with shows a real lack of imagination and empathy.
I think that's a rather poor analogy.
The crowd are having a gesture forced on them in their own environment, and are being patronised when they refuse to kowtow.
It is more like either a church congregation booing Dawkins who has barged his way in an is preaching his opinions, or the a Leicester Secular Society meeting booing a church choir that has paraded in and is walking round singing "Lift High the Cross" (Which has nine verses).
My analogy isn't quite right either, but it highlighs the offence of a partisan political gesture being imposed in people's own environment, where it has neither been consulted upon nor is universally accepted.
I'm not a dedicated footie fan, so fortunately I have not got this pushed in my face.
That Dawkins sermon would be lasting 3 seconds.
I would be surprised if he hasn't preached a sermon at some point, and engaged in debates. Many places welcome dialogue with contrarians.
And the government’s culture warmongering would almost be less objectionable were it not so transparently cynical and inauthentic. The anti-woke playbook says oppose taking the knee but the polling shows salt-of-the-earth-red-wall-association-football-fans like the England squad https://twitter.com/MattChorley/status/1404021277279633408
You don't half post some guff.
Polling shows a majority don't support taking the knee. Boris statement the other day was about as middling as middling could be, suppprt right to do so, without saying he supported it. That's a perfectly valid position and actually the polling shows one shared by a significant percentage of the nation.
But I bet and hope that if you asked the public if they positively approved of the BOOing the "yes" percentage would be very low indeed. Much lower than those who just don't support the team making the gesture.
You know why? Because it would (by and large) be just 2 categories of people (with significant overlap) who thankfully do not constitute a large slice of our population.
The 2 categories are as follows:
(i) Right wing culture warriors with a BLM "marxist" hang up.
(ii) Racists.
This is the truth I write here on this gorgeous Sunday morning. So nobody should bother even thinking about demurring.
The Match - I'm not confident. I'm on the 1/1 draw.
Unfortunately, we had the numbers upthread.
About half of fans support the knee thing and oppose the booing.
About 30% oppose the knee thing and support the booing.
Although it's not confirmed, hard not to imagine it's the same 30% and 50% each time.
The 30% feels a bit like a defiant rage against the dying of a certain sort of light.
That's of football fans. I refuse to believe as many as 30% of the general population actively support the booing. If that is the case, the country is further gone than I thought.
I think the kneeling is pointless virtue signalling which does nothing to help anyone. But at the same time the booing has an added dimension of being pretty offensive as the 'virtue' it seems to be signalling is opposition to people making a peaceful point on a matter we should all reasonably be in agreement about.
Lots of people do virtue signalling in many different ways. Almost all of the time it is pointless at best but going as far as to boo those doing it does seem at least mildly offensive to me.
Mind you I am not a great fan of bladder kicking either so I probably don't see the point in any of the activities going on inside Wembley stadium from start to finish.
Exactly. You - not a footie fan - wouldn't boo the team and disapprove of that happening even though you don't support the Knee. Because you're not a right wing culture warrior and you're not racist. There'll be loads like you. For once you are not niche here. That's why I say there'll be nothing like 30% of the population in favour of the booing.
I see little wrong in virtue signalling btw. In fact I see nothing wrong in it. People who consider virtue signalling to be one of the top things to fret about in the world should imo take a long hard look in the mirror and have a long hard word with their reflection.
Again I agree. worrying about virtue signalling is like worrying about the kneeling. I think it is rather silly and can, in some circumstances, be counter productive, but it wouldn't rate in my top 500 things that are wrong in the world.
I kind of think of booing people taking the knee as being like me, as an atheist, booing people walking into church. It would be pointless, silly and, most importantly, extremely rude.
There is more than enough room in this world for a diverse range of different beliefs, customs and priorities. Getting offended by something you don't personally agree with with shows a real lack of imagination and empathy.
I think that's a rather poor analogy.
The crowd are having a gesture forced on them in their own environment, and are being patronised when they refuse to kowtow.
It is more like either a church congregation booing Dawkins who has barged his way in an is preaching his opinions, or the a Leicester Secular Society meeting booing a church choir that has paraded in and is walking round singing "Lift High the Cross" (Which has nine verses).
My analogy isn't quite right either, but it highlighs the offence of a partisan political gesture being imposed in people's own environment, where it has neither been consulted upon nor is universally accepted.
I'm not a dedicated footie fan, so fortunately I have not got this pushed in my face.
That Dawkins sermon would be lasting 3 seconds.
I would be surprised if he hasn't preached a sermon at some point, and engaged in debates. Many places welcome dialogue with contrarians.
Yes - but I mean the Knee only lasts 3 seconds. It's not as intrusive as per your analogy.
And the government’s culture warmongering would almost be less objectionable were it not so transparently cynical and inauthentic. The anti-woke playbook says oppose taking the knee but the polling shows salt-of-the-earth-red-wall-association-football-fans like the England squad https://twitter.com/MattChorley/status/1404021277279633408
You don't half post some guff.
Polling shows a majority don't support taking the knee. Boris statement the other day was about as middling as middling could be, suppprt right to do so, without saying he supported it. That's a perfectly valid position and actually the polling shows one shared by a significant percentage of the nation.
But I bet and hope that if you asked the public if they positively approved of the BOOing the "yes" percentage would be very low indeed. Much lower than those who just don't support the team making the gesture.
You know why? Because it would (by and large) be just 2 categories of people (with significant overlap) who thankfully do not constitute a large slice of our population.
The 2 categories are as follows:
(i) Right wing culture warriors with a BLM "marxist" hang up.
(ii) Racists.
This is the truth I write here on this gorgeous Sunday morning. So nobody should bother even thinking about demurring.
The Match - I'm not confident. I'm on the 1/1 draw.
Unfortunately, we had the numbers upthread.
About half of fans support the knee thing and oppose the booing.
About 30% oppose the knee thing and support the booing.
Although it's not confirmed, hard not to imagine it's the same 30% and 50% each time.
The 30% feels a bit like a defiant rage against the dying of a certain sort of light.
That's of football fans. I refuse to believe as many as 30% of the general population actively support the booing. If that is the case, the country is further gone than I thought.
I think the kneeling is pointless virtue signalling which does nothing to help anyone. But at the same time the booing has an added dimension of being pretty offensive as the 'virtue' it seems to be signalling is opposition to people making a peaceful point on a matter we should all reasonably be in agreement about.
Lots of people do virtue signalling in many different ways. Almost all of the time it is pointless at best but going as far as to boo those doing it does seem at least mildly offensive to me.
Mind you I am not a great fan of bladder kicking either so I probably don't see the point in any of the activities going on inside Wembley stadium from start to finish.
Exactly. You - not a footie fan - wouldn't boo the team and disapprove of that happening even though you don't support the Knee. Because you're not a right wing culture warrior and you're not racist. There'll be loads like you. For once you are not niche here. That's why I say there'll be nothing like 30% of the population in favour of the booing.
I see little wrong in virtue signalling btw. In fact I see nothing wrong in it. People who consider virtue signalling to be one of the top things to fret about in the world should imo take a long hard look in the mirror and have a long hard word with their reflection.
Again I agree. worrying about virtue signalling is like worrying about the kneeling. I think it is rather silly and can, in some circumstances, be counter productive, but it wouldn't rate in my top 500 things that are wrong in the world.
I kind of think of booing people taking the knee as being like me, as an atheist, booing people walking into church. It would be pointless, silly and, most importantly, extremely rude.
There is more than enough room in this world for a diverse range of different beliefs, customs and priorities. Getting offended by something you don't personally agree with with shows a real lack of imagination and empathy.
I think that's a rather poor analogy.
The crowd are having a gesture forced on them in their own environment, and are being patronised when they refuse to kowtow.
It is more like either a church congregation booing Dawkins who has barged his way in an is preaching his opinions, or the a Leicester Secular Society meeting booing a church choir that has paraded in and is walking round singing "Lift High the Cross" (Which has nine verses).
My analogy isn't quite right either, but it highlighs the offence of a partisan political gesture being imposed in people's own environment, where it has neither been consulted upon nor is universally accepted.
I'm not a dedicated footie fan, so fortunately I have not got this pushed in my face.
That Dawkins sermon would be lasting 3 seconds.
I would be surprised if he hasn't preached a sermon at some point, and engaged in debates. Many places welcome dialogue with contrarians.
Yes - but I mean the Knee only lasts 3 seconds. It's not as intrusive as per your analogy.
OK - I get your point.
I was imaging 73 year old lady Churchwardens swinging their staffs of office.
Organists would do that - churchwardens would be slower but more thorough.
And the government’s culture warmongering would almost be less objectionable were it not so transparently cynical and inauthentic. The anti-woke playbook says oppose taking the knee but the polling shows salt-of-the-earth-red-wall-association-football-fans like the England squad https://twitter.com/MattChorley/status/1404021277279633408
You don't half post some guff.
Polling shows a majority don't support taking the knee. Boris statement the other day was about as middling as middling could be, suppprt right to do so, without saying he supported it. That's a perfectly valid position and actually the polling shows one shared by a significant percentage of the nation.
But I bet and hope that if you asked the public if they positively approved of the BOOing the "yes" percentage would be very low indeed. Much lower than those who just don't support the team making the gesture.
You know why? Because it would (by and large) be just 2 categories of people (with significant overlap) who thankfully do not constitute a large slice of our population.
The 2 categories are as follows:
(i) Right wing culture warriors with a BLM "marxist" hang up.
(ii) Racists.
This is the truth I write here on this gorgeous Sunday morning. So nobody should bother even thinking about demurring.
The Match - I'm not confident. I'm on the 1/1 draw.
Unfortunately, we had the numbers upthread.
About half of fans support the knee thing and oppose the booing.
About 30% oppose the knee thing and support the booing.
Although it's not confirmed, hard not to imagine it's the same 30% and 50% each time.
The 30% feels a bit like a defiant rage against the dying of a certain sort of light.
That's of football fans. I refuse to believe as many as 30% of the general population actively support the booing. If that is the case, the country is further gone than I thought.
I can easily believe that figure because I suspect that number of people, encompassing all ages, genders and political leanings, simply dislike non-white and foreign people, or anyone who is an ‘other’. I think it’s probably hard-wired into us as a species, an evolutionary caution. Unfortunately. And Boris, and his advisers, have clocked on to that and are exploiting it successfully. Unfortunately.
Yes. It isn't open racism. It is subconscious prejudice against anyone who isn't you. The other takes many forms depending on the environment - EU migrant whites, swarthy asylum seekers, various kinds of people from the sub-continent who always get labelled for the post-war country created out of India, travellers, people from the neighbouring county / town/ village.
So of course a chunk of people identify more with the people booing than they do the people represented by taking the knee. "I'm not racist" so anything that suggests my prejudice against the other is wrong. Boooo.
Question - I haven't see this problem north of the wall. I know there are pockets of it but is it widespread as it is in England? How about Wales? Either way, I have too look on this anguish over booing taking the knee as someone else's problem. If booing the Engerland team makes people feel like proper England fans then whatever.
You haven’t yet heard your fellow Shire residents pontificating about Weegies yet, then?
Comments
These tossers deserve to be castrated for sounding like Scot Nats.
Apparently yesterday he consoled Eriksen's wife, who thought he had died.
However - on the broader point, the notion that the Government were really that interested in operating the UK as a smooth an harmonious whole would make a lot more sense if successive administrations hadn't indulged lop-sided, ad hoc, dog's breakfast devolution for the last two decades. Either you have the unitary state, an even structure of regional/federal government, or dissolution. The present arrangements don't work and there's no willingness at all from the idiots in Parliament to change them.
So, on we totter towards the cliff edge. That's fair. The outrage over this is vastly, vastly overdone. I don't think much of BLM either but the players evidently think they're doing something important to them to protest against racial prejudice. Whether you view these demonstrations as important and valuable or empty and fatuous, they don't strike me as particularly offensive. They certainly don't deserve to be abused for them.
Also NI, I mean just look at the Northern Ireland protocol.
I did see Foden hit the post mind you
England 0-0 Croatia
Phil McNulty
BBC Sport chief football writer at Wembley
Still booing from a large number of England fans as they take the knee before kick-off but the jeers were also met with a response of loud and prolonged applause. Mixed reaction."
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/live/football/50940652
The lies might be exposed faster in places which have an effective opposition
https://twitter.com/NickHudsonCT/status/1403799406348996609?s=20
It’s rather hard to watch.
I am not even a football fan but I am proud to be supporting my country today as I am sure most decent people are.
Hard to see past a win for Djokovic here, but you never know...
Plus the idea the average England football fan is desperate to watch the PM's press conference at the G7 is laughable anyway
Can't see The Hundred being either.
Really don't understand Trippier instead of Shaw. The latter has been United's best winger this year by a considerable margin.
They all have devolved administrations and first ministers
Indeed each has handled covid differently and their administrations are elected by their populace
NEW THREAD
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England doesn't, but hey-ho, what do we matter?
Westminster is the de facto English parliament and controls the colonies as well.
#onecountry
One of the most enjoyable pre game events in International football is an England-Liechtenstein match. Oh the confusion!
The crowd are having a gesture forced on them in their own environment, and are being patronised when they refuse to kowtow.
It is more like either a church congregation booing Dawkins who has barged his way in an is preaching his opinions, or the a Leicester Secular Society meeting booing a church choir that has paraded in and is walking round singing "Lift High the Cross" (Which has nine verses).
My analogy isn't quite right either, but it highlighs the offence of a partisan political gesture being imposed in people's own environment, where it has neither been consulted upon nor is universally accepted.
I'm not a dedicated footie fan, so fortunately I have not got this pushed in my face.
'I'm thrusting my right arm out and clicking my heels to protest against 'climate change'
'Mate, its a Nazi salute'
Thoughts. And. Prayers.
I was imaging 73 year old lady Churchwardens swinging their staffs of office.
Organists would do that - churchwardens would be slower but more thorough.