David Herdson on Boris’s 16 point best PM lead in today’s YouGov
“These are dreadful results for Starmer, much worse than last time the gap was this big.
Then, he had much more scope to create an impression with the public. Now, the impression has already been formed and will be much harder to shift - not least because it's probably right.”
Just wait until he does Piers Moron....20 point poll bounce incoming.
That will be a proper bit of ‘can’t watch tv’
Will be interesting to see what ratings it gets. That show has been losing viewership for quite a while now.
Who will watch, other than some of the 24% who like him? If they all did the ratings would be pretty good I suppose, without changing his levels
Political journalists will too. I can’t see what’s so interesting about his life that you’d want to make a show about it. Private School, Uni, more uni, Lawyer, knighthood, unpopular, boring politician. Hardly a rollercoaster.
I was about to say I’m surprised Farage hadn’t done it, but of course he has!
Let go of the hate. If he bounces back you'll need hospital treatment. Don't risk it.
No hate here for man like Sir Keir! If he bounces back, good for him
You fool no-one. Well you probably do, but not me. You have really taken against the guy. He epitomises something for you. Something that gets your goat. It's to do with upward mobility and moral rectitude.
Does Boris end up in the history books as initially wanting herd immunity when the pandemic began, hence the high number of deaths?
Interesting. Without vaccines this was a way through this. Horrific though it would have been. We’ve done it before, in pretty much every pandemic since the dawn of time.
While we're talking of gayness and music, can I recommend Elton John's "Me", possibly one of the best celebrity autobiographies I have ever read. Up there with William Goldman, David Niven - but better than them
Mind-boggling gossip, and extremely funny. It is also explains why he is possibly the most successful solo star of all time, and his bravery in being Out and gay so early.
He's a dude, the book is superb
That’s been sitting behind my tv cabinet unread, along with Andrew Ridgey’s book, for about 18 months!
Along with every other book I’ve bought in the last three years other than ‘The Great Betrayal’ by Ian Smith, and ‘Treasure Island’
*and ‘The Friends of Eddie Coyle’ which I lent to my Dad
I entreat you to read it. I bet you will be laughing out loud within 10 pages. It is dazzling, and OMFG the stories. Why is it to entertaining to read of someone fucking up everything in a haze of cocaine, booze, and rent boys, possibly involving the Queen Mother? I dunno, but it is. I guess we all love gossip
To be fair it does decline once he goes sober (sober people are just a bit more boring) but even then it is excellent - as against brilliant
It's a world class autobiography, and he has led a life unmatched by any
I will read it... just no time!
Funny you type this just as a wild mate of mine who has been in AA for about ten years is what’s apping that he is struggling
In his mad days he once went into a Romford brass house, off his head on gear and booze, and shagged every one of them, then left his Oyster card, work tools and wallet behind and his long suffering dad had to go pick them up the next day!
As another mate said ‘how I wish I had that lack of self control’!!
As a prodigious musical genius, Elton John is up there with Mozart. He is basically the gay-clown-shoes-wearing Mozart of our time. I never realised the scale of his achievement until I read his book
AND he had sex with 10,000 people and sniffed metric tonnes of coke, and then got properly serious with the booze and strippers, while buying entire villages and chateaux
100+ member of FIFA have just voted to consider holding the World Cup biennially. That doesn’t make it right.
So, are you saying Palestine shouldn't exist as a state?
Ok. In which case, the people who live there must be Israelis, and therefore should be accorded the same rights as other Israeli citizens.
This is the terrible logic Israel must face
Either it allows Palestinians sovereignty, or it goes the whole hog and becomes an apartheid state, in a single state with lower class Arab citizens (it is already horribly close).
Or it expels all the Palestinians from Palestine, and maybe Israeli Arabs as well
It is hideous choice, but they have made it this way, by insisting on a Jewish state allowing only Jewish immigration and a lesser status for Arabs
Yes. It's an ugly choice.
And expelling millions of people from lands where they were born, who have no other nationality, is nothing less than ethnic cleansing on a massive scale.
Israel's best option was always to have a Palestinian state that was dependent on it. But the settler movement has made a viable Palestinian state a near impossibility.
Yes, somehow Israel took the wrong fork in the road, in the 1970s or 80s, when it still had massive international sympathy, as the plucky little country. Now it is the Evil Oppressor, and that generally doesn't end well
Or is it
A) once their opponents visited UN with pistol in their apparel now it’s slick publicrelations spin B because of E.T. Opponents now fight asymmetric away from battlefields making it harder for decisive victories?
Can I separate the sheep from the goats by asking all those who think the UK’s Eurovision entry will do badly because the nasssty EUssssr hatessss ussss rather than it being crap to put their hands up?
Get well soon JohnO.
A good or bad song can break free of things a bit, as it is hardly a universal rule, but I don't think it is controversial or partisan that people have historically noted some pretty obvious geopolitical points scoring in Eurovision over the years. As an attempt at trolling goes it is a bit below standard. But you can fall back on saying the answer is obsessed with you or something (as you simultaneously seek out idiot unionists online for us all to laugh at)
Perhaps, but a lot of what people take to be politics is often just regional musical trends, and on that note, keep an eye on where there are large ex-pat communities.
On which note, keep an eye on whether Eastern European support for Ukraine materialises.
Not a good enough song.
There may be votes for Russia both from Putinistas and from those who knows the song is a challenge to his agenda.
David Herdson on Boris’s 16 point best PM lead in today’s YouGov
“These are dreadful results for Starmer, much worse than last time the gap was this big.
Then, he had much more scope to create an impression with the public. Now, the impression has already been formed and will be much harder to shift - not least because it's probably right.”
Just wait until he does Piers Moron....20 point poll bounce incoming.
That will be a proper bit of ‘can’t watch tv’
Will be interesting to see what ratings it gets. That show has been losing viewership for quite a while now.
Who will watch, other than some of the 24% who like him? If they all did the ratings would be pretty good I suppose, without changing his levels
Political journalists will too. I can’t see what’s so interesting about his life that you’d want to make a show about it. Private School, Uni, more uni, Lawyer, knighthood, unpopular, boring politician. Hardly a rollercoaster.
I was about to say I’m surprised Farage hadn’t done it, but of course he has!
Let go of the hate. If he bounces back you'll need hospital treatment. Don't risk it.
No hate here for man like Sir Keir! If he bounces back, good for him
You fool no-one. Well you probably do, but not me. You have really taken against the guy. He epitomises something for you. Something that gets your goat. It's to do with upward mobility and moral rectitude.
I just don’t think he has what it takes to beat Boris. That’s all I’ve said from the start, nothing malicious. He seems an upright, decent person.
I don’t like him because he was one of the leading voices in trying to stop Brexit, and I think he comes across as really dull. But that goes for lots of people!
Keir Starmer's tears for his father: Labour leader breaks down in tears on Piers Morgan's Life Stories as he talks for first time about three shattering family tragedies - including how his mother died weeks before he was sworn in as an MP.
Labour leader Sir Keir Starmer has given the most 'searingly honest and intensely emotional' interview of his life, in which he reveals how a series of devastating family tragedies shaped him into the man he is today.
All very interesting but unlikely to shift many votes.
These things can do. Andy Murray with Sue Barker after losing the Wimbledon final in 2012. Instant transformation to national treasure. Also Hugh Grant on Oprah after Devine Brown.
Keir Starmer's tears for his father: Labour leader breaks down in tears on Piers Morgan's Life Stories as he talks for first time about three shattering family tragedies - including how his mother died weeks before he was sworn in as an MP.
Labour leader Sir Keir Starmer has given the most 'searingly honest and intensely emotional' interview of his life, in which he reveals how a series of devastating family tragedies shaped him into the man he is today.
All very interesting but unlikely to shift many votes.
I presume it is going to be part of a wider push to reboot his image.
Starmer's image isn't the problem.
He is a dull speaker, for which he should seek coaching. He needs to nail Boris to the wall. It is no good collecting evidence at PMQs if he never uses it: the electorate is not the Supreme Court bench who will have noted each answer; it is a jury waiting for the summing-up. Some policies would be nice too, though it is hard to create clear blue water against a backdrop of the covid pandemic.
If Blair were LOTO he would be 15 points behind Johnson at this moment in time.
That isn't to say Starmer shouldn't be banging on about Johnsonian corruption, Covid failures, Brexit shortcomings and the rampant inflation just around the corner.
While we're talking of gayness and music, can I recommend Elton John's "Me", possibly one of the best celebrity autobiographies I have ever read. Up there with William Goldman, David Niven - but better than them
Mind-boggling gossip, and extremely funny. It is also explains why he is possibly the most successful solo star of all time, and his bravery in being Out and gay so early.
He's a dude, the book is superb
That’s been sitting behind my tv cabinet unread, along with Andrew Ridgey’s book, for about 18 months!
Along with every other book I’ve bought in the last three years other than ‘The Great Betrayal’ by Ian Smith, and ‘Treasure Island’
*and ‘The Friends of Eddie Coyle’ which I lent to my Dad
I entreat you to read it. I bet you will be laughing out loud within 10 pages. It is dazzling, and OMFG the stories. Why is it to entertaining to read of someone fucking up everything in a haze of cocaine, booze, and rent boys, possibly involving the Queen Mother? I dunno, but it is. I guess we all love gossip
To be fair it does decline once he goes sober (sober people are just a bit more boring) but even then it is excellent - as against brilliant
It's a world class autobiography, and he has led a life unmatched by any
I will read it... just no time!
Funny you type this just as a wild mate of mine who has been in AA for about ten years is what’s apping that he is struggling
In his mad days he once went into a Romford brass house, off his head on gear and booze, and shagged every one of them, then left his Oyster card, work tools and wallet behind and his long suffering dad had to go pick them up the next day!
As another mate said ‘how I wish I had that lack of self control’!!
As a prodigious musical genius, Elton John is up there with Mozart. He is basically the gay-clown-shoes-wearing Mozart of our time. I never realised the scale of his achievement until I read his book
AND he had sex with 10,000 people and sniffed metric tonnes of coke, and then got properly serious with the booze and strippers, while buying entire villages and chateaux
Diana Bashir spilling over into the Sunday papers. Day 5 of this rubbish.
Did he really do anything worse than other journalists of the day? Phone hacking, bribing policemen for stories, searching through rubbish and using freelance paparazzi to harass?
Keir Starmer's tears for his father: Labour leader breaks down in tears on Piers Morgan's Life Stories as he talks for first time about three shattering family tragedies - including how his mother died weeks before he was sworn in as an MP.
Labour leader Sir Keir Starmer has given the most 'searingly honest and intensely emotional' interview of his life, in which he reveals how a series of devastating family tragedies shaped him into the man he is today.
All very interesting but unlikely to shift many votes.
These things can do. Andy Murray with Sue Barker after losing the Wimbledon final in 2012. Instant transformation to national treasure. Also Hugh Grant on Oprah after Devine Brown.
Keir Starmer's tears for his father: Labour leader breaks down in tears on Piers Morgan's Life Stories as he talks for first time about three shattering family tragedies - including how his mother died weeks before he was sworn in as an MP.
Labour leader Sir Keir Starmer has given the most 'searingly honest and intensely emotional' interview of his life, in which he reveals how a series of devastating family tragedies shaped him into the man he is today.
While we're talking of gayness and music, can I recommend Elton John's "Me", possibly one of the best celebrity autobiographies I have ever read. Up there with William Goldman, David Niven - but better than them
Mind-boggling gossip, and extremely funny. It is also explains why he is possibly the most successful solo star of all time, and his bravery in being Out and gay so early.
He's a dude, the book is superb
That’s been sitting behind my tv cabinet unread, along with Andrew Ridgey’s book, for about 18 months!
Along with every other book I’ve bought in the last three years other than ‘The Great Betrayal’ by Ian Smith, and ‘Treasure Island’
*and ‘The Friends of Eddie Coyle’ which I lent to my Dad
I entreat you to read it. I bet you will be laughing out loud within 10 pages. It is dazzling, and OMFG the stories. Why is it to entertaining to read of someone fucking up everything in a haze of cocaine, booze, and rent boys, possibly involving the Queen Mother? I dunno, but it is. I guess we all love gossip
To be fair it does decline once he goes sober (sober people are just a bit more boring) but even then it is excellent - as against brilliant
It's a world class autobiography, and he has led a life unmatched by any
I will read it... just no time!
Funny you type this just as a wild mate of mine who has been in AA for about ten years is what’s apping that he is struggling
In his mad days he once went into a Romford brass house, off his head on gear and booze, and shagged every one of them, then left his Oyster card, work tools and wallet behind and his long suffering dad had to go pick them up the next day!
As another mate said ‘how I wish I had that lack of self control’!!
As a prodigious musical genius, Elton John is up there with Mozart. He is basically the gay-clown-shoes-wearing Mozart of our time. I never realised the scale of his achievement until I read his book
AND he had sex with 10,000 people and sniffed metric tonnes of coke, and then got properly serious with the booze and strippers, while buying entire villages and chateaux
I salute him
Who would have sex with Elton John?
He's an ugly bugger.
I'm not an expert on these things, but I think that they might have been facing the other way.
While we're talking of gayness and music, can I recommend Elton John's "Me", possibly one of the best celebrity autobiographies I have ever read. Up there with William Goldman, David Niven - but better than them
Mind-boggling gossip, and extremely funny. It is also explains why he is possibly the most successful solo star of all time, and his bravery in being Out and gay so early.
He's a dude, the book is superb
That’s been sitting behind my tv cabinet unread, along with Andrew Ridgey’s book, for about 18 months!
Along with every other book I’ve bought in the last three years other than ‘The Great Betrayal’ by Ian Smith, and ‘Treasure Island’
*and ‘The Friends of Eddie Coyle’ which I lent to my Dad
I entreat you to read it. I bet you will be laughing out loud within 10 pages. It is dazzling, and OMFG the stories. Why is it to entertaining to read of someone fucking up everything in a haze of cocaine, booze, and rent boys, possibly involving the Queen Mother? I dunno, but it is. I guess we all love gossip
To be fair it does decline once he goes sober (sober people are just a bit more boring) but even then it is excellent - as against brilliant
It's a world class autobiography, and he has led a life unmatched by any
I will read it... just no time!
Funny you type this just as a wild mate of mine who has been in AA for about ten years is what’s apping that he is struggling
In his mad days he once went into a Romford brass house, off his head on gear and booze, and shagged every one of them, then left his Oyster card, work tools and wallet behind and his long suffering dad had to go pick them up the next day!
As another mate said ‘how I wish I had that lack of self control’!!
As a prodigious musical genius, Elton John is up there with Mozart. He is basically the gay-clown-shoes-wearing Mozart of our time. I never realised the scale of his achievement until I read his book
AND he had sex with 10,000 people and sniffed metric tonnes of coke, and then got properly serious with the booze and strippers, while buying entire villages and chateaux
I salute him
Who would have sex with Elton John?
He's an ugly bugger.
Judging by the book, he is funny, candid, entertaining and smart. MUCH funnier than I expected, TBH
Also he's not that ugly. He's just a bit bald, and slightly round-faced. Set against that an immortal talent, huge intelligence, great sense of humour.... and the personal possession of £100m, and yeah, I can see why he was quite popular. Good for him
He's very funny about his mundane suburban upbringing in Pinner
Diana Bashir spilling over into the Sunday papers. Day 5 of this rubbish.
Did he really do anything worse than other journalists of the day? Phone hacking, bribing policemen for stories, searching through rubbish and using freelance paparazzi to harass?
You saying The Mail and The Sun lambasting that kind of journalism rings hollow because it is so laugh out loud embarrassing from them?
Keir Starmer's tears for his father: Labour leader breaks down in tears on Piers Morgan's Life Stories as he talks for first time about three shattering family tragedies - including how his mother died weeks before he was sworn in as an MP.
Labour leader Sir Keir Starmer has given the most 'searingly honest and intensely emotional' interview of his life, in which he reveals how a series of devastating family tragedies shaped him into the man he is today.
How do "a series of devastating family tragedies" shape him into the boring man he is today?
Boring didn't stop John Major winning a record number of votes in 92.
His rival was not seen as much less boring really. Boris vs Sir Keir is one of the biggest disparity’s in personality scores since polling on it began. I think Thatcher vs Foot and Blair vs Hague might just beat it. But the next IPSOS poll is next month
Diana Bashir spilling over into the Sunday papers. Day 5 of this rubbish.
Did he really do anything worse than other journalists of the day? Phone hacking, bribing policemen for stories, searching through rubbish and using freelance paparazzi to harass?
You saying The Mail and The Sun lambasting that kind of journalism rings hollow because it is so laugh out loud embarrassing from them?
Not just those two. The press were completely out of control at that time.
While we're talking of gayness and music, can I recommend Elton John's "Me", possibly one of the best celebrity autobiographies I have ever read. Up there with William Goldman, David Niven - but better than them
Mind-boggling gossip, and extremely funny. It is also explains why he is possibly the most successful solo star of all time, and his bravery in being Out and gay so early.
He's a dude, the book is superb
That’s been sitting behind my tv cabinet unread, along with Andrew Ridgey’s book, for about 18 months!
Along with every other book I’ve bought in the last three years other than ‘The Great Betrayal’ by Ian Smith, and ‘Treasure Island’
*and ‘The Friends of Eddie Coyle’ which I lent to my Dad
I entreat you to read it. I bet you will be laughing out loud within 10 pages. It is dazzling, and OMFG the stories. Why is it to entertaining to read of someone fucking up everything in a haze of cocaine, booze, and rent boys, possibly involving the Queen Mother? I dunno, but it is. I guess we all love gossip
To be fair it does decline once he goes sober (sober people are just a bit more boring) but even then it is excellent - as against brilliant
It's a world class autobiography, and he has led a life unmatched by any
I will read it... just no time!
Funny you type this just as a wild mate of mine who has been in AA for about ten years is what’s apping that he is struggling
In his mad days he once went into a Romford brass house, off his head on gear and booze, and shagged every one of them, then left his Oyster card, work tools and wallet behind and his long suffering dad had to go pick them up the next day!
As another mate said ‘how I wish I had that lack of self control’!!
As a prodigious musical genius, Elton John is up there with Mozart. He is basically the gay-clown-shoes-wearing Mozart of our time. I never realised the scale of his achievement until I read his book
AND he had sex with 10,000 people and sniffed metric tonnes of coke, and then got properly serious with the booze and strippers, while buying entire villages and chateaux
I salute him
Who would have sex with Elton John?
He's an ugly bugger.
Judging by the book, he is funny, candid, entertaining and smart. MUCH funnier than I expected, TBH
Also he's not that ugly. He's just a bit bald, and slightly round-faced. Set against that an immortal talent, huge intelligence, great sense of humour.... and the personal possession of £100m, and yeah, I can see why he was quite popular. Good for him
He's very funny about his mundane suburban upbringing in Pinner
Keir Starmer's tears for his father: Labour leader breaks down in tears on Piers Morgan's Life Stories as he talks for first time about three shattering family tragedies - including how his mother died weeks before he was sworn in as an MP.
Labour leader Sir Keir Starmer has given the most 'searingly honest and intensely emotional' interview of his life, in which he reveals how a series of devastating family tragedies shaped him into the man he is today.
How do "a series of devastating family tragedies" shape him into the boring man he is today?
Boring didn't stop John Major winning a record number of votes in 92.
His rival was not seen as much less boring really. Boris vs Sir Keir is one of the biggest disparity’s in personality scores since polling on it began. I think Thatcher vs Foot and Blair vs Hague might just beat it. But the next IPSOS poll is next month
Surely you employ someone on basis of character, not personality?
Does Boris end up in the history books as initially wanting herd immunity when the pandemic began, hence the high number of deaths?
Interesting. Without vaccines this was a way through this. Horrific though it would have been. We’ve done it before, in pretty much every pandemic since the dawn of time.
So basically the story is...
“Ministers backed “herd immunity” approach but they were, er, overruled by those people taking the decisions”?
As opposed to, say, “ministers backed herd immunity approach, but they changed course when the health and political consequences of this became apparent”?
While we're talking of gayness and music, can I recommend Elton John's "Me", possibly one of the best celebrity autobiographies I have ever read. Up there with William Goldman, David Niven - but better than them
Mind-boggling gossip, and extremely funny. It is also explains why he is possibly the most successful solo star of all time, and his bravery in being Out and gay so early.
He's a dude, the book is superb
That’s been sitting behind my tv cabinet unread, along with Andrew Ridgey’s book, for about 18 months!
Along with every other book I’ve bought in the last three years other than ‘The Great Betrayal’ by Ian Smith, and ‘Treasure Island’
*and ‘The Friends of Eddie Coyle’ which I lent to my Dad
I entreat you to read it. I bet you will be laughing out loud within 10 pages. It is dazzling, and OMFG the stories. Why is it to entertaining to read of someone fucking up everything in a haze of cocaine, booze, and rent boys, possibly involving the Queen Mother? I dunno, but it is. I guess we all love gossip
To be fair it does decline once he goes sober (sober people are just a bit more boring) but even then it is excellent - as against brilliant
It's a world class autobiography, and he has led a life unmatched by any
I will read it... just no time!
Funny you type this just as a wild mate of mine who has been in AA for about ten years is what’s apping that he is struggling
In his mad days he once went into a Romford brass house, off his head on gear and booze, and shagged every one of them, then left his Oyster card, work tools and wallet behind and his long suffering dad had to go pick them up the next day!
As another mate said ‘how I wish I had that lack of self control’!!
As a prodigious musical genius, Elton John is up there with Mozart. He is basically the gay-clown-shoes-wearing Mozart of our time. I never realised the scale of his achievement until I read his book
AND he had sex with 10,000 people and sniffed metric tonnes of coke, and then got properly serious with the booze and strippers, while buying entire villages and chateaux
I salute him
On a slightly connected note, in my previous life as a purveyor of chaps’ finest second hand clothing I had one of John Reid’s Tommy Nutter suits pass through my hands. It was both horrific and wonderful, 3 piece double breasted in a pale caramel window pane check, silk and wool. I sort of wish I’d kept it but a Japanese tourist made me an offer I couldn’t refuse.
100+ member of FIFA have just voted to consider holding the World Cup biennially. That doesn’t make it right.
So, are you saying Palestine shouldn't exist as a state?
Ok. In which case, the people who live there must be Israelis, and therefore should be accorded the same rights as other Israeli citizens.
This is the terrible logic Israel must face
Either it allows Palestinians sovereignty, or it goes the whole hog and becomes an apartheid state, in a single state with lower class Arab citizens (it is already horribly close).
Or it expels all the Palestinians from Palestine, and maybe Israeli Arabs as well
It is hideous choice, but they have made it this way, by insisting on a Jewish state allowing only Jewish immigration and a lesser status for Arabs
Don't see what's hideous about that choice. It's only one of the options - continued oppression - that's hideous.
It’s a sinister development this week, Israel losing one of these skirmishes leaving the terrorists dancing in their tunnels tonight. Far cry from whipping surprise attack from the whole of the Middle East in just six days.
Ben goes into history books as his watch strutting tough whilst delivering weakness?
Well he thought the Palestinians could be squeezed into irrelevance, forgotten by all. Rethink required. Or rather replacement required in order to make a rethink possible.
Keir Starmer's tears for his father: Labour leader breaks down in tears on Piers Morgan's Life Stories as he talks for first time about three shattering family tragedies - including how his mother died weeks before he was sworn in as an MP.
Labour leader Sir Keir Starmer has given the most 'searingly honest and intensely emotional' interview of his life, in which he reveals how a series of devastating family tragedies shaped him into the man he is today.
How do "a series of devastating family tragedies" shape him into the boring man he is today?
Boring didn't stop John Major winning a record number of votes in 92.
His rival was not seen as much less boring really. Boris vs Sir Keir is one of the biggest disparity’s in personality scores since polling on it began. I think Thatcher vs Foot and Blair vs Hague might just beat it. But the next IPSOS poll is next month
Surely you employ someone on basis of character, not personality?
I’ve never employed anyone. But for political leaders to be seen as lacking in personality, relative to their opponents, is a huge disadvantage
While we're talking of gayness and music, can I recommend Elton John's "Me", possibly one of the best celebrity autobiographies I have ever read. Up there with William Goldman, David Niven - but better than them
Mind-boggling gossip, and extremely funny. It is also explains why he is possibly the most successful solo star of all time, and his bravery in being Out and gay so early.
He's a dude, the book is superb
That’s been sitting behind my tv cabinet unread, along with Andrew Ridgey’s book, for about 18 months!
Along with every other book I’ve bought in the last three years other than ‘The Great Betrayal’ by Ian Smith, and ‘Treasure Island’
*and ‘The Friends of Eddie Coyle’ which I lent to my Dad
I entreat you to read it. I bet you will be laughing out loud within 10 pages. It is dazzling, and OMFG the stories. Why is it to entertaining to read of someone fucking up everything in a haze of cocaine, booze, and rent boys, possibly involving the Queen Mother? I dunno, but it is. I guess we all love gossip
To be fair it does decline once he goes sober (sober people are just a bit more boring) but even then it is excellent - as against brilliant
It's a world class autobiography, and he has led a life unmatched by any
I will read it... just no time!
Funny you type this just as a wild mate of mine who has been in AA for about ten years is what’s apping that he is struggling
In his mad days he once went into a Romford brass house, off his head on gear and booze, and shagged every one of them, then left his Oyster card, work tools and wallet behind and his long suffering dad had to go pick them up the next day!
As another mate said ‘how I wish I had that lack of self control’!!
As a prodigious musical genius, Elton John is up there with Mozart. He is basically the gay-clown-shoes-wearing Mozart of our time. I never realised the scale of his achievement until I read his book
AND he had sex with 10,000 people and sniffed metric tonnes of coke, and then got properly serious with the booze and strippers, while buying entire villages and chateaux
I salute him
Who would have sex with Elton John?
He's an ugly bugger.
Judging by the book, he is funny, candid, entertaining and smart. MUCH funnier than I expected, TBH
Also he's not that ugly. He's just a bit bald, and slightly round-faced. Set against that an immortal talent, huge intelligence, great sense of humour.... and the personal possession of £100m, and yeah, I can see why he was quite popular. Good for him
He's very funny about his mundane suburban upbringing in Pinner
Have you seen the film?
No, is it good?
I absolutely adored the Freddie Mercury movie. Genius (him and the film). But I was told the Elton John movie was poor in comparison, so I didn't bother
While we're talking of gayness and music, can I recommend Elton John's "Me", possibly one of the best celebrity autobiographies I have ever read. Up there with William Goldman, David Niven - but better than them
Mind-boggling gossip, and extremely funny. It is also explains why he is possibly the most successful solo star of all time, and his bravery in being Out and gay so early.
He's a dude, the book is superb
That’s been sitting behind my tv cabinet unread, along with Andrew Ridgey’s book, for about 18 months!
Along with every other book I’ve bought in the last three years other than ‘The Great Betrayal’ by Ian Smith, and ‘Treasure Island’
*and ‘The Friends of Eddie Coyle’ which I lent to my Dad
I entreat you to read it. I bet you will be laughing out loud within 10 pages. It is dazzling, and OMFG the stories. Why is it to entertaining to read of someone fucking up everything in a haze of cocaine, booze, and rent boys, possibly involving the Queen Mother? I dunno, but it is. I guess we all love gossip
To be fair it does decline once he goes sober (sober people are just a bit more boring) but even then it is excellent - as against brilliant
It's a world class autobiography, and he has led a life unmatched by any
I will read it... just no time!
Funny you type this just as a wild mate of mine who has been in AA for about ten years is what’s apping that he is struggling
In his mad days he once went into a Romford brass house, off his head on gear and booze, and shagged every one of them, then left his Oyster card, work tools and wallet behind and his long suffering dad had to go pick them up the next day!
As another mate said ‘how I wish I had that lack of self control’!!
As a prodigious musical genius, Elton John is up there with Mozart. He is basically the gay-clown-shoes-wearing Mozart of our time. I never realised the scale of his achievement until I read his book
AND he had sex with 10,000 people and sniffed metric tonnes of coke, and then got properly serious with the booze and strippers, while buying entire villages and chateaux
I salute him
Who would have sex with Elton John?
He's an ugly bugger.
Judging by the book, he is funny, candid, entertaining and smart. MUCH funnier than I expected, TBH
Also he's not that ugly. He's just a bit bald, and slightly round-faced. Set against that an immortal talent, huge intelligence, great sense of humour.... and the personal possession of £100m, and yeah, I can see why he was quite popular. Good for him
He's very funny about his mundane suburban upbringing in Pinner
Have you seen the film?
No, is it good?
I absolutely adored the Freddie Mercury movie. Genius (him and the film). But I was told the Elton John movie was poor in comparison, so I didn't bother
While we're talking of gayness and music, can I recommend Elton John's "Me", possibly one of the best celebrity autobiographies I have ever read. Up there with William Goldman, David Niven - but better than them
Mind-boggling gossip, and extremely funny. It is also explains why he is possibly the most successful solo star of all time, and his bravery in being Out and gay so early.
He's a dude, the book is superb
That’s been sitting behind my tv cabinet unread, along with Andrew Ridgey’s book, for about 18 months!
Along with every other book I’ve bought in the last three years other than ‘The Great Betrayal’ by Ian Smith, and ‘Treasure Island’
*and ‘The Friends of Eddie Coyle’ which I lent to my Dad
I entreat you to read it. I bet you will be laughing out loud within 10 pages. It is dazzling, and OMFG the stories. Why is it to entertaining to read of someone fucking up everything in a haze of cocaine, booze, and rent boys, possibly involving the Queen Mother? I dunno, but it is. I guess we all love gossip
To be fair it does decline once he goes sober (sober people are just a bit more boring) but even then it is excellent - as against brilliant
It's a world class autobiography, and he has led a life unmatched by any
I will read it... just no time!
Funny you type this just as a wild mate of mine who has been in AA for about ten years is what’s apping that he is struggling
In his mad days he once went into a Romford brass house, off his head on gear and booze, and shagged every one of them, then left his Oyster card, work tools and wallet behind and his long suffering dad had to go pick them up the next day!
As another mate said ‘how I wish I had that lack of self control’!!
As a prodigious musical genius, Elton John is up there with Mozart. He is basically the gay-clown-shoes-wearing Mozart of our time. I never realised the scale of his achievement until I read his book
AND he had sex with 10,000 people and sniffed metric tonnes of coke, and then got properly serious with the booze and strippers, while buying entire villages and chateaux
I salute him
Who would have sex with Elton John?
He's an ugly bugger.
Judging by the book, he is funny, candid, entertaining and smart. MUCH funnier than I expected, TBH
Also he's not that ugly. He's just a bit bald, and slightly round-faced. Set against that an immortal talent, huge intelligence, great sense of humour.... and the personal possession of £100m, and yeah, I can see why he was quite popular. Good for him
He's very funny about his mundane suburban upbringing in Pinner
Have you seen the film?
No, is it good?
I absolutely adored the Freddie Mercury movie. Genius (him and the film). But I was told the Elton John movie was poor in comparison, so I didn't bother
Worth a punt?
I loved the Freddie one, and enjoyed Elton’s too. It’s why I got bought the book for Christmas (2019!) Def worth a punt
But the Star Stories is better! It’s on More4 now to download, absolutely brilliant, you will love it
Last time I watched the Eurovision Song Contest they went through each country that had been awarded between 1 and 12 points. They seem to have scrapped that now, probably because it wasn't exciting enough.
While we're talking of gayness and music, can I recommend Elton John's "Me", possibly one of the best celebrity autobiographies I have ever read. Up there with William Goldman, David Niven - but better than them
Mind-boggling gossip, and extremely funny. It is also explains why he is possibly the most successful solo star of all time, and his bravery in being Out and gay so early.
He's a dude, the book is superb
That’s been sitting behind my tv cabinet unread, along with Andrew Ridgey’s book, for about 18 months!
Along with every other book I’ve bought in the last three years other than ‘The Great Betrayal’ by Ian Smith, and ‘Treasure Island’
*and ‘The Friends of Eddie Coyle’ which I lent to my Dad
I entreat you to read it. I bet you will be laughing out loud within 10 pages. It is dazzling, and OMFG the stories. Why is it to entertaining to read of someone fucking up everything in a haze of cocaine, booze, and rent boys, possibly involving the Queen Mother? I dunno, but it is. I guess we all love gossip
To be fair it does decline once he goes sober (sober people are just a bit more boring) but even then it is excellent - as against brilliant
It's a world class autobiography, and he has led a life unmatched by any
I will read it... just no time!
Funny you type this just as a wild mate of mine who has been in AA for about ten years is what’s apping that he is struggling
In his mad days he once went into a Romford brass house, off his head on gear and booze, and shagged every one of them, then left his Oyster card, work tools and wallet behind and his long suffering dad had to go pick them up the next day!
As another mate said ‘how I wish I had that lack of self control’!!
As a prodigious musical genius, Elton John is up there with Mozart. He is basically the gay-clown-shoes-wearing Mozart of our time. I never realised the scale of his achievement until I read his book
AND he had sex with 10,000 people and sniffed metric tonnes of coke, and then got properly serious with the booze and strippers, while buying entire villages and chateaux
I salute him
Who would have sex with Elton John?
He's an ugly bugger.
Judging by the book, he is funny, candid, entertaining and smart. MUCH funnier than I expected, TBH
Also he's not that ugly. He's just a bit bald, and slightly round-faced. Set against that an immortal talent, huge intelligence, great sense of humour.... and the personal possession of £100m, and yeah, I can see why he was quite popular. Good for him
He's very funny about his mundane suburban upbringing in Pinner
Have you seen the film?
No, is it good?
I absolutely adored the Freddie Mercury movie. Genius (him and the film). But I was told the Elton John movie was poor in comparison, so I didn't bother
Diana Bashir spilling over into the Sunday papers. Day 5 of this rubbish.
Did he really do anything worse than other journalists of the day? Phone hacking, bribing policemen for stories, searching through rubbish and using freelance paparazzi to harass?
You saying The Mail and The Sun lambasting that kind of journalism rings hollow because it is so laugh out loud embarrassing from them?
Not just those two. The press were completely out of control at that time.
Murder in the Car Park, the Channel 4 documentary series about the Daniel Morgan case, available to view on their web site, is strong on the News of the World in particular paying a detective agency that in turn bribed the police for stories. I think it was the second episode.
We should remember some journalists went to prison, including Andy Coulson who worked for David Cameron, so it's not just the BBC with bad judgement.
Keir Starmer's tears for his father: Labour leader breaks down in tears on Piers Morgan's Life Stories as he talks for first time about three shattering family tragedies - including how his mother died weeks before he was sworn in as an MP.
Labour leader Sir Keir Starmer has given the most 'searingly honest and intensely emotional' interview of his life, in which he reveals how a series of devastating family tragedies shaped him into the man he is today.
How do "a series of devastating family tragedies" shape him into the boring man he is today?
Boring didn't stop John Major winning a record number of votes in 92.
His rival was not seen as much less boring really. Boris vs Sir Keir is one of the biggest disparity’s in personality scores since polling on it began. I think Thatcher vs Foot and Blair vs Hague might just beat it. But the next IPSOS poll is next month
Surely you employ someone on basis of character, not personality?
I’ve never employed anyone. But for political leaders to be seen as lacking in personality, relative to their opponents, is a huge disadvantage
You got evidence to support that? I still reckon in final analysis character matters more.
Keir Starmer's tears for his father: Labour leader breaks down in tears on Piers Morgan's Life Stories as he talks for first time about three shattering family tragedies - including how his mother died weeks before he was sworn in as an MP.
Labour leader Sir Keir Starmer has given the most 'searingly honest and intensely emotional' interview of his life, in which he reveals how a series of devastating family tragedies shaped him into the man he is today.
How do "a series of devastating family tragedies" shape him into the boring man he is today?
Boring didn't stop John Major winning a record number of votes in 92.
His rival was not seen as much less boring really. Boris vs Sir Keir is one of the biggest disparity’s in personality scores since polling on it began. I think Thatcher vs Foot and Blair vs Hague might just beat it. But the next IPSOS poll is next month
Surely you employ someone on basis of character, not personality?
I’ve never employed anyone. But for political leaders to be seen as lacking in personality, relative to their opponents, is a huge disadvantage
Depends on the circumstances, that is usually the case but Biden had less personality than Trump, Hollande less personality than Sarkozy, Major less personality than Kinnock they still won
Last time I watched the Eurovision Song Contest they went through each country that had been awarded between 1 and 12 points. They seem to have scrapped that now, probably because it wasn't exciting enough.
While we're talking of gayness and music, can I recommend Elton John's "Me", possibly one of the best celebrity autobiographies I have ever read. Up there with William Goldman, David Niven - but better than them
Mind-boggling gossip, and extremely funny. It is also explains why he is possibly the most successful solo star of all time, and his bravery in being Out and gay so early.
He's a dude, the book is superb
That’s been sitting behind my tv cabinet unread, along with Andrew Ridgey’s book, for about 18 months!
Along with every other book I’ve bought in the last three years other than ‘The Great Betrayal’ by Ian Smith, and ‘Treasure Island’
*and ‘The Friends of Eddie Coyle’ which I lent to my Dad
I entreat you to read it. I bet you will be laughing out loud within 10 pages. It is dazzling, and OMFG the stories. Why is it to entertaining to read of someone fucking up everything in a haze of cocaine, booze, and rent boys, possibly involving the Queen Mother? I dunno, but it is. I guess we all love gossip
To be fair it does decline once he goes sober (sober people are just a bit more boring) but even then it is excellent - as against brilliant
It's a world class autobiography, and he has led a life unmatched by any
I will read it... just no time!
Funny you type this just as a wild mate of mine who has been in AA for about ten years is what’s apping that he is struggling
In his mad days he once went into a Romford brass house, off his head on gear and booze, and shagged every one of them, then left his Oyster card, work tools and wallet behind and his long suffering dad had to go pick them up the next day!
As another mate said ‘how I wish I had that lack of self control’!!
As a prodigious musical genius, Elton John is up there with Mozart. He is basically the gay-clown-shoes-wearing Mozart of our time. I never realised the scale of his achievement until I read his book
AND he had sex with 10,000 people and sniffed metric tonnes of coke, and then got properly serious with the booze and strippers, while buying entire villages and chateaux
Keir Starmer's tears for his father: Labour leader breaks down in tears on Piers Morgan's Life Stories as he talks for first time about three shattering family tragedies - including how his mother died weeks before he was sworn in as an MP.
Labour leader Sir Keir Starmer has given the most 'searingly honest and intensely emotional' interview of his life, in which he reveals how a series of devastating family tragedies shaped him into the man he is today.
How do "a series of devastating family tragedies" shape him into the boring man he is today?
Boring didn't stop John Major winning a record number of votes in 92.
His rival was not seen as much less boring really. Boris vs Sir Keir is one of the biggest disparity’s in personality scores since polling on it began. I think Thatcher vs Foot and Blair vs Hague might just beat it. But the next IPSOS poll is next month
Neither Foot nor Hague were boring. Both were capable of being interesting, thoughtful and amusing. Neither had the looks for television though. Keir does have the looks for television. But he's boring. Not boring as in geeky. Not boring as in dull. Just bereft of any particular interesting features. Like a minor character in a film whose purpose is simply not to detract from the main action.
Diana Bashir spilling over into the Sunday papers. Day 5 of this rubbish.
Did he really do anything worse than other journalists of the day? Phone hacking, bribing policemen for stories, searching through rubbish and using freelance paparazzi to harass?
You saying The Mail and The Sun lambasting that kind of journalism rings hollow because it is so laugh out loud embarrassing from them?
Not just those two. The press were completely out of control at that time.
Murder in the Car Park, the Channel 4 documentary series about the Daniel Morgan case, available to view on their web site, is strong on the News of the World in particular paying a detective agency that in turn bribed the police for stories. I think it was the second episode.
We should remember some journalists went to prison, including Andy Coulson who worked for David Cameron, so it's not just the BBC with bad judgement.
But the point here though, when those organs go on attack with this bad journalistic practice line, does it carry any weight? When Even their own brainwashed readership will cringe and turn to the feature pages. A lot of this weeks Front pages, what a complete waste of time writing them.
Last time I watched the Eurovision Song Contest they went through each country that had been awarded between 1 and 12 points. They seem to have scrapped that now, probably because it wasn't exciting enough.
It’s because there’s too many countries voting and it would take 4 hours
Based on the song, the performance and the general low regard for us in Europe. Nil points was towards the upper end of my expectations for the U.K. entry.
Keir Starmer's tears for his father: Labour leader breaks down in tears on Piers Morgan's Life Stories as he talks for first time about three shattering family tragedies - including how his mother died weeks before he was sworn in as an MP.
Labour leader Sir Keir Starmer has given the most 'searingly honest and intensely emotional' interview of his life, in which he reveals how a series of devastating family tragedies shaped him into the man he is today.
How do "a series of devastating family tragedies" shape him into the boring man he is today?
Boring didn't stop John Major winning a record number of votes in 92.
His rival was not seen as much less boring really. Boris vs Sir Keir is one of the biggest disparity’s in personality scores since polling on it began. I think Thatcher vs Foot and Blair vs Hague might just beat it. But the next IPSOS poll is next month
Surely you employ someone on basis of character, not personality?
I’ve never employed anyone. But for political leaders to be seen as lacking in personality, relative to their opponents, is a huge disadvantage
You got evidence to support that? I still reckon in final analysis character matters more.
Based on the song, the performance and the general low regard for us in Europe. Nil points was towards the upper end of my expectations for the U.K. entry.
Every single year the commentators whinge that our song was better than its score. I strongly beg to differ.
David Herdson on Boris’s 16 point best PM lead in today’s YouGov
“These are dreadful results for Starmer, much worse than last time the gap was this big.
Then, he had much more scope to create an impression with the public. Now, the impression has already been formed and will be much harder to shift - not least because it's probably right.”
Just wait until he does Piers Moron....20 point poll bounce incoming.
That will be a proper bit of ‘can’t watch tv’
Will be interesting to see what ratings it gets. That show has been losing viewership for quite a while now.
Who will watch, other than some of the 24% who like him? If they all did the ratings would be pretty good I suppose, without changing his levels
Political journalists will too. I can’t see what’s so interesting about his life that you’d want to make a show about it. Private School, Uni, more uni, Lawyer, knighthood, unpopular, boring politician. Hardly a rollercoaster.
I was about to say I’m surprised Farage hadn’t done it, but of course he has!
Let go of the hate. If he bounces back you'll need hospital treatment. Don't risk it.
No hate here for man like Sir Keir! If he bounces back, good for him
You fool no-one. Well you probably do, but not me. You have really taken against the guy. He epitomises something for you. Something that gets your goat. It's to do with upward mobility and moral rectitude.
I just don’t think he has what it takes to beat Boris. That’s all I’ve said from the start, nothing malicious. He seems an upright, decent person.
I don’t like him because he was one of the leading voices in trying to stop Brexit, and I think he comes across as really dull. But that goes for lots of people!
If he bounces back I’ll owe you £300 though
That too. Mental anguish PLUS money down. Odds still on your side though. Very much so. But time is on mine.
Kinnock wasn't boring btw. Don't know why you say that. He was Mr Personality vs Grey John Major. And he lost.
But these are different times. Reality TV and social media times. Your pet theory does have some merit. It's not obvious and total bollocks.
Last time I watched the Eurovision Song Contest they went through each country that had been awarded between 1 and 12 points. They seem to have scrapped that now, probably because it wasn't exciting enough.
Andy, it's been like that for a few years now.
I haven't bothered watching it properly for a number of years.
Keir Starmer's tears for his father: Labour leader breaks down in tears on Piers Morgan's Life Stories as he talks for first time about three shattering family tragedies - including how his mother died weeks before he was sworn in as an MP.
Labour leader Sir Keir Starmer has given the most 'searingly honest and intensely emotional' interview of his life, in which he reveals how a series of devastating family tragedies shaped him into the man he is today.
How do "a series of devastating family tragedies" shape him into the boring man he is today?
Boring didn't stop John Major winning a record number of votes in 92.
His rival was not seen as much less boring really. Boris vs Sir Keir is one of the biggest disparity’s in personality scores since polling on it began. I think Thatcher vs Foot and Blair vs Hague might just beat it. But the next IPSOS poll is next month
Surely you employ someone on basis of character, not personality?
I’ve never employed anyone. But for political leaders to be seen as lacking in personality, relative to their opponents, is a huge disadvantage
You got evidence to support that? I still reckon in final analysis character matters more.
Do people actually understand the difference between personality and character traits? Or think they are same thing?
Personality, you get from first birth into your family, funny, extroverted, energetic, optimistic, confident—as well as overly serious, lazy, negative, and shy as some traits.
Character you get from your second birth, into your tribe. traits like honesty, virtue, and kindliness. That treating others in the right way is important. sympathy, loyalty, reciprocity, bravery, respect, fairness, all come from tribe membership.
Tribe you could try to read across as religion, nationalism or society, or the second birth honouring some form of rights of passage, perhaps earn’t in some way by displaying resilience and wisdom.
Wisdom doesn’t burst forth fully developed like Athena out of Zeus’s head; it is built up, small step by small step, from most irrational beginnings.
Character always trumps Personality in GE voting, 2019 fine example. In fact every election has been a fine example.
Keir Starmer's tears for his father: Labour leader breaks down in tears on Piers Morgan's Life Stories as he talks for first time about three shattering family tragedies - including how his mother died weeks before he was sworn in as an MP.
Labour leader Sir Keir Starmer has given the most 'searingly honest and intensely emotional' interview of his life, in which he reveals how a series of devastating family tragedies shaped him into the man he is today.
How do "a series of devastating family tragedies" shape him into the boring man he is today?
Boring didn't stop John Major winning a record number of votes in 92.
His rival was not seen as much less boring really. Boris vs Sir Keir is one of the biggest disparity’s in personality scores since polling on it began. I think Thatcher vs Foot and Blair vs Hague might just beat it. But the next IPSOS poll is next month
Neither Foot nor Hague were boring. Both were capable of being interesting, thoughtful and amusing. Neither had the looks for television though. Keir does have the looks for television. But he's boring. Not boring as in geeky. Not boring as in dull. Just bereft of any particular interesting features. Like a minor character in a film whose purpose is simply not to detract from the main action.
I have my own opinions, but for this argument I defer to IPSOS-MORIs leader image ratings 1979-2021
Based on the song, the performance and the general low regard for us in Europe. Nil points was towards the upper end of my expectations for the U.K. entry.
Every single year the commentators whinge that our song was better than its score. I strongly beg to differ.
Indeed. Bland song, badly sung. Honestly we need to start sending in novelty acts. We're never going to win so let's just send in gimmicks that make the people laugh.
Based on the song, the performance and the general low regard for us in Europe. Nil points was towards the upper end of my expectations for the U.K. entry.
Every single year the commentators whinge that our song was better than its score. I strongly beg to differ.
Indeed. Bland song, badly sung. Honestly we need to start sending in novelty acts. We're never going to win so let's just send in gimmicks that make the people laugh.
Either that, or we could find a decent song from one of our many more than decent bands.
Comments
https://www.channel4.com/programmes/star-stories/on-demand/45162-001
A) once their opponents visited UN with pistol in their apparel now it’s slick publicrelations spin
B because of E.T. Opponents now fight asymmetric away from battlefields making it harder for decisive victories?
There may be votes for Russia both from Putinistas and from those who knows the song is a challenge to his agenda.
I think Germany worth an each way at 251
I don’t like him because he was one of the leading voices in trying to stop Brexit, and I think he comes across as really dull. But that goes for lots of people!
If he bounces back I’ll owe you £300 though
https://twitter.com/lookner/status/1396220294528909313
That isn't to say Starmer shouldn't be banging on about Johnsonian corruption, Covid failures, Brexit shortcomings and the rampant inflation just around the corner.
He's an ugly bugger.
Let the "fun" begin
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Opinion_polling_for_the_next_Spanish_general_election#Voting_intention_estimates
Also he's not that ugly. He's just a bit bald, and slightly round-faced. Set against that an immortal talent, huge intelligence, great sense of humour.... and the personal possession of £100m, and yeah, I can see why he was quite popular. Good for him
He's very funny about his mundane suburban upbringing in Pinner
www.youtube.com/watch?v=3k0rJYtoJz4
“Ministers backed “herd immunity” approach but they were, er, overruled by those people taking the decisions”?
As opposed to, say, “ministers backed herd immunity approach, but they changed course when the health and political consequences of this became apparent”?
Huge waist btw.
I absolutely adored the Freddie Mercury movie. Genius (him and the film). But I was told the Elton John movie was poor in comparison, so I didn't bother
Worth a punt?
lol
But the Star Stories is better! It’s on More4 now to download, absolutely brilliant, you will love it
We should remember some journalists went to prison, including Andy Coulson who worked for David Cameron, so it's not just the BBC with bad judgement.
Confused.
Public voting will add HUNDREDS to the leading countries.
If not they're looking at good lay at 3.9
https://www2.politicalbetting.com/index.php/archives/2020/06/06/the-case-for-making-personality-ratings-a-good-electoral-indicator/
I strongly beg to differ.
Kinnock wasn't boring btw. Don't know why you say that. He was Mr Personality vs Grey John Major. And he lost.
But these are different times. Reality TV and social media times. Your pet theory does have some merit. It's not obvious and total bollocks.
We might get a point from Israel and Australia, that is it (not this time from the latter though it seems)
Personality, you get from first birth into your family, funny, extroverted, energetic, optimistic, confident—as well as overly serious, lazy, negative, and shy as some traits.
Character you get from your second birth, into your tribe. traits like honesty, virtue, and kindliness. That treating others in the right way is important. sympathy, loyalty, reciprocity, bravery, respect, fairness, all come from tribe membership.
Tribe you could try to read across as religion, nationalism or society, or the second birth honouring some form of rights of passage, perhaps earn’t in some way by displaying resilience and wisdom.
Wisdom doesn’t burst forth fully developed like Athena out of Zeus’s head; it is built up, small step by small step, from most irrational beginnings.
Character always trumps Personality in GE voting, 2019 fine example. In fact every election has been a fine example.