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And while we wait for Congress to formalise Biden’s victory…. – politicalbetting.com

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  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,204
    Onto the first of the popcorn states - Arizona
  • At least this might worry Sky and the BBC

    https://twitter.com/Peston/status/1346773996319203330?s=09
  • Has to be said, this whole process is painfully backwards and stupid.

    A bit like the Vice President.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,204
    It's Klob !
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,204
    Here comes the objection...
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 51,696
    Trump is now dancing to YMCA behind a wall of bulletproof glass.
  • BOOM. First objection.
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 49,868
    Applause for the objection to the Arizona declaration.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,126
    So many members of Congress proud to be making baseless objections (baseless given the multiple failed changes to prove any basis) just to save their arses. So little dignity.
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 62,766

    BOOM. First objection.

    GOP down the rabbit hole that leads to the end of the US as a democratic republic. Madness.

    Hopefully the history books will record these dangerous fools.
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 49,868
    Two hours of debate on the AZ objection.

    A shameful day for US democracy
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 62,766
    Jeez - this is going to take days.

  • solarflaresolarflare Posts: 3,706
    Does this congress session go as long as needed regardless of how many objections and 2 hour debates, or do they at some point give in and call it a day and come back tomorrow etc.?
  • I did enjoy the objection to Pelosi refusing to let Republicans give each other Covid
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,126

    At least this might worry Sky and the BBC

    https://twitter.com/Peston/status/1346773996319203330?s=09

    Or it might be an entirely niche outlet that dribbles along due to private financing, we'll see.
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 49,868
    edited January 2021

    Does this congress session go as long as needed regardless of how many objections and 2 hour debates, or do they at some point give in and call it a day and come back tomorrow etc.?

    Depends on the Reps. Stock up on popcorn nevertheless

    CNN suggesting both GA and PA are likely to go through the same process
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 50,361

    Trump is now dancing to YMCA behind a wall of bulletproof glass.

    DCMA take down for performing a copyrighted work with authorisation or payment?
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 52,600
    Putin must be laughing like a drain.

    And the top of the Chinese Communist Party.

    American democracy being debased in real time.
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 62,766

    Trump is now dancing to YMCA behind a wall of bulletproof glass.

    DCMA take down for performing a copyrighted work with authorisation or payment?
    has he stopped playing neil young songs yet?
  • I do prefer the immediacy of UK elections, where you get booted out by the voters in some provincial leisure centre, have to thank the tellers, and then get your coat.
  • malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 43,355
    kle4 said:

    At least this might worry Sky and the BBC

    https://twitter.com/Peston/status/1346773996319203330?s=09

    Or it might be an entirely niche outlet that dribbles along due to private financing, we'll see.
    Yes with several has beens fronting it , like that diddy Neil.
  • WhisperingOracleWhisperingOracle Posts: 9,165
    edited January 2021
    kle4 said:

    At least this might worry Sky and the BBC

    https://twitter.com/Peston/status/1346773996319203330?s=09

    Or it might be an entirely niche outlet that dribbles along due to private financing, we'll see.
    I see the Legatum Institute, of Shanker Singham, Gisela Stuart and other Brexiters, are among the backers. The agenda looks fairly clear, but without more sloppy media regulation they'll struggle.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,126

    Jeez - this is going to take days.

    You know the saying of the Founding Fathers and their successors:

    If a job is worth doing, it is worth doing it with as many procedural steps as possible, as slowly as possible, and as with as much needless grandiosity as possible.
  • solarflaresolarflare Posts: 3,706


    American democracy being debased in real time.

    Real slow time at that, by the sounds of it.
  • Daveyboy1961Daveyboy1961 Posts: 3,883

    At least this might worry Sky and the BBC

    https://twitter.com/Peston/status/1346773996319203330?s=09

    Not sure why. Unless it has a space on the dial at Sky or Freeview I can't see many people seeing it apart from streamers.
  • AnabobazinaAnabobazina Posts: 23,486
    edited January 2021
    Lol. A few virgins with flags. Who cares?
  • rpjsrpjs Posts: 3,787
    kle4 said:

    Jeez - this is going to take days.

    You know the saying of the Founding Fathers and their successors:

    If a job is worth doing, it is worth doing it with as many procedural steps as possible, as slowly as possible, and as with as much needless grandiosity as possible.
    I think the phrase you're looking for is "checks and balances".
  • QuincelQuincel Posts: 4,042
    This seems to me a rather strong piece of evidence against Trump 2024. He needs the oxygen of the media to continue to shape the party. They might cover him again post-Presidency, or enough of the right-wing media might for him to be a force in the primaries, but if his tweets and speeches and so on stop getting news coverage it will be a significant force in a possibly rapid fade from relevance.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 50,361

    I do prefer the immediacy of UK elections, where you get booted out by the voters in some provincial leisure centre, have to thank the tellers, and then get your coat.

    I'm trying to remember who it was, who after losing his election, in the council sports hall, went next door to the local boozer and spent the rest of the night buying his opponents champagne. Which being an old style British boozer, they had to send for.
  • RH1992RH1992 Posts: 788

    At least this might worry Sky and the BBC

    https://twitter.com/Peston/status/1346773996319203330?s=09

    Not sure why. Unless it has a space on the dial at Sky or Freeview I can't see many people seeing it apart from streamers.
    It has carriage agreements on Sky and Freeview. It's serious enough in it's availability, but will the British people like tabloid opinion piece news on their TV screen?
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 62,766

    kle4 said:

    At least this might worry Sky and the BBC

    https://twitter.com/Peston/status/1346773996319203330?s=09

    Or it might be an entirely niche outlet that dribbles along due to private financing, we'll see.
    I see the Legatum Institute, of Shanker Singham, Gisela Stuart and other Brexiters, are among the backers. The agenda looks fairly clear, but without more sloppy media regulation they'll struggle.
    To get us out of the EU?
  • RobDRobD Posts: 59,933

    At least this might worry Sky and the BBC

    https://twitter.com/Peston/status/1346773996319203330?s=09

    Not sure why. Unless it has a space on the dial at Sky or Freeview I can't see many people seeing it apart from streamers.
    It will be on Sky and Freeview.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,126
    rpjs said:

    kle4 said:

    Jeez - this is going to take days.

    You know the saying of the Founding Fathers and their successors:

    If a job is worth doing, it is worth doing it with as many procedural steps as possible, as slowly as possible, and as with as much needless grandiosity as possible.
    I think the phrase you're looking for is "checks and balances".
    Well yes, but I cannot make fun of that.
  • GallowgateGallowgate Posts: 19,468
    I’m watching CNN and my only comment is: the absolute state of these utter pineapples.
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 49,868
    Reminds me of my first budget meeting as a new councillor in 1995. The Tories had lost control of the council for the first time since its creation in 1964. Tory councillors were so shell shocked at a budget going through against their opposition that they tabled 29 amendments, insisted on debating them all separately, and demanded a roll call vote on each one. The debate continued until nearly 4 am the next morning, when the Labour/LibDem budget was finally carried.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 123,127
    edited January 2021
    Very good letter by the Vice President, though some Trumpites are already calling him a traitor on twitter so it may not do his 2024 nomination chances a great deal of good.

    Get on Cruz then who will lodge an objection to the casting of the EC votes on behalf of Trump.

    Any GOP Senator who fails to lodge an objection will have a black mark against them ahead of 2024 with the GOP base so can likely be ruled out of the nomination battle and they or any GOP Representative who fails to object will also face a Trumpite primary challenge when next up for re election
  • RochdalePioneersRochdalePioneers Posts: 28,902
    edited January 2021
    Deleted the tweet as already posted. Glad to see angry loons trying to storm the capitol whilst Trump slinks off to the White House
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 28,381
    Quincel said:

    This seems to me a rather strong piece of evidence against Trump 2024. He needs the oxygen of the media to continue to shape the party. They might cover him again post-Presidency, or enough of the right-wing media might for him to be a force in the primaries, but if his tweets and speeches and so on stop getting news coverage it will be a significant force in a possibly rapid fade from relevance.
    He'll hopefully be out of site, out of mind, holed up in Turnberry.
  • I’m watching CNN and my only comment is: the absolute state of these utter pineapples.

    There's nothing more tedious than filibuster tactics. All these idiots have got is 'they voted for the wrong candidate'.
  • WhisperingOracleWhisperingOracle Posts: 9,165
    edited January 2021

    kle4 said:

    At least this might worry Sky and the BBC

    https://twitter.com/Peston/status/1346773996319203330?s=09

    Or it might be an entirely niche outlet that dribbles along due to private financing, we'll see.
    I see the Legatum Institute, of Shanker Singham, Gisela Stuart and other Brexiters, are among the backers. The agenda looks fairly clear, but without more sloppy media regulation they'll struggle.
    To get us out of the EU?
    Probably both a deregulatory and some sort of populist emphasis to go with the current phase of Brexit - but for the kind of all-singing, all-dancing opinionated TV news they probably want, to get ratings and distinguish themselves, without a law change they'll most likely to struggle.
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 52,600
    I'm SO looking forward to the US press ripping the piss out of the UK after the events of today.....

    That legendary sense of superiority taken a knock, much?
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 60,487
    Quincel said:

    This seems to me a rather strong piece of evidence against Trump 2024. He needs the oxygen of the media to continue to shape the party. They might cover him again post-Presidency, or enough of the right-wing media might for him to be a force in the primaries, but if his tweets and speeches and so on stop getting news coverage it will be a significant force in a possibly rapid fade from relevance.
    Yes, that's my view.
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 29,410

    Deleted the tweet as already posted. Glad to see angry loons trying to storm the capitol whilst Trump slinks off to the White House

    That's strange.
    US Police normally have a pretty good idea how to stop such things.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,126
    Aren't a lot of police in the USA pretty Trumpian? Must be a weird moment for them.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,126
    dixiedean said:

    Deleted the tweet as already posted. Glad to see angry loons trying to storm the capitol whilst Trump slinks off to the White House

    That's strange.
    US Police normally have a pretty good idea how to stop such things.
    Without bullets?
  • contrariancontrarian Posts: 5,818

    The storming of the bad steal.

    Very good.
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 49,868

    I’m watching CNN and my only comment is: the absolute state of these utter pineapples.

    If only they were that valuable
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 123,127
    It looks a bit like the storming of the Winter Palace in St Petersburg in 1917 or the storming of the Bastille in 1789

    https://twitter.com/Phil_Lewis_/status/1346883077524639748?s=20
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 52,600
    dixiedean said:

    Deleted the tweet as already posted. Glad to see angry loons trying to storm the capitol whilst Trump slinks off to the White House

    That's strange.
    US Police normally have a pretty good idea how to stop such things.
    If only these angry loons were black, eh?
  • OnlyLivingBoyOnlyLivingBoy Posts: 15,798
    https://metro.co.uk/2021/01/05/tory-said-fat-mums-in-pot-noodle-stained-leggings-are-filling-ae-13850016

    Love it when Tories say what they're really thinking. The dangers of going on Twitter when pissed.
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 60,487

    The storming of the bad steal.

    No more Pence sitting.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,421
    IanB2 said:

    Does this congress session go as long as needed regardless of how many objections and 2 hour debates, or do they at some point give in and call it a day and come back tomorrow etc.?

    Depends on the Reps. Stock up on popcorn nevertheless

    CNN suggesting both GA and PA are likely to go through the same process
    Would be funny as hell if the Dems tabled an objection to Norh Carolina. Which, given the amount of voter suppression, intimidation and graft in that state, they could do perfectly legitimately.
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 49,868
    McConnell laying into the objectors on the Senate Floor
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,126
    HYUFD said:

    It looks a bit like the storming of the Winter Palace in St Petersburg in 1917 or the storming of the Bastille in 1789

    https://twitter.com/Phil_Lewis_/status/1346883077524639748?s=20

    Given that it seems 100% that some of that crowd have weapons on them, hopefully it just remains pushing and shoving.
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 29,410
    malcolmg said:

    kle4 said:

    At least this might worry Sky and the BBC

    https://twitter.com/Peston/status/1346773996319203330?s=09

    Or it might be an entirely niche outlet that dribbles along due to private financing, we'll see.
    Yes with several has beens fronting it , like that diddy Neil.
    Yes.
    What the media landscape is so sorely missing is the opinion of wealthy, right wing boomer males.
    I've often wondered what they thought.
  • McConnell - "we are asking should we overrule the voters". FFS even he says Trump lost
  • GallowgateGallowgate Posts: 19,468
    Moscow Mitch making a very good speech.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,204
    Even Mitch wants to get rid of Trump now :D
  • CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758
    Alistair said:

    JACK_W said:

    CNN - Biden nominates Merrick Garland as AG

    Absolute Wanker Move. Peak Biden.
    It looks like he is just rehiring the blokes he knew from Obama’s presidency. My concern is this is going to be a very lacklustre 4 years when there is a lot that needs to be done to fix America and the world
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 60,487
    edited January 2021

    dixiedean said:

    Deleted the tweet as already posted. Glad to see angry loons trying to storm the capitol whilst Trump slinks off to the White House

    That's strange.
    US Police normally have a pretty good idea how to stop such things.
    If only these angry loons were black, eh?
    I was thinking that.

    Edit: although they are probably under strict instructions to not be provoked or use any violence in case that blows up the nation.
  • They should market McConnell's voice as a sleep inducing drug.
  • CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758

    CNN showing a bit of Trump. Literally blithering utter nonsense. Throwing Pence under the bus.

    Yes. Either Pence does something outrageous and unconstitutional or Trump throws him off the bus to Jonestown
    Pence made his Faustian pact 4 years ago and now it’s time to collect
  • Moscow Mitch making a very good speech.

    Please, it is Cocaine Mitch.
  • "President Trump on "weak" Republican lawmakers not supporting objections to the Electoral College vote count:
    "We've got to get rid of them."

    He name checks Rep. Liz Cheney, the third highest-ranking Republican in the House"

    Republican internecine strife incoming.

    All these guys are getting primaried. And they are going to lose.
    Some may indeed be opposed by true Trumpskyites in primaries. BUT not all. AND not all who ARE opposed will lose their nomination.

    For example, methinks that any wingnut running against US Sen. John Thune in South Dakota, will discover they are running into a freaking brick wall.

    AND if wingnut DOES prevail, could well end up handing the seat to the Democrats. Like the wingnuts did re: Kansas governor.
  • contrariancontrarian Posts: 5,818
    Pulpstar said:

    Even Mitch wants to get rid of Trump now :D

    Soon, it will be the other way around.

    Trump has the numbers.
  • YorkcityYorkcity Posts: 4,382

    So the question that I think needs to be asked.

    Are these Republican politicians mad enough to actually believe that the election was stolen and they can overturn it? Or are they conniving and mad enough to know it is rubbish but think they can actually overturn it anyway?

    Either way they seem to have utterly lost the plot. And all for a man who would stab them in the back at a second's notice if he thought it would serve his ends.

    Yes agree totally.
    Been watching it live on CNN.
    Really brings it home to you how fragile democracy can be, without the correct checks and balances in place, against a dictator.
    History shows as in Germany after ww1 how democracy can change so quickly.
    Hope we do not ever have to learn those lessons again.
    Relying on good people to do the correct thing is not enough.
    I believe the UK should strengthen an official constitution to help prevent it ever happening here.

  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 28,381

    Trump's reaction to losing the election is a bit like some pro-Europeans reaction to losing the 2016 Referendum.

    If he'd put as much effort into actually winning the election as he has put into overturning it then he might have actually won the election in the first place.

    That's a stupid point on both counts. Remainers accepted they lost the 2016 referendum, and Trump campaigned very hard to win the election.
    Reading this forum there is scant evidence remainers have accepted they lost in 2016
    You always say stuff like this without basis. Just like you pretend that this forum is full of labour supporters when its actually quite balanced.
    There is one particular poster who tweets daily anti brexit comments as he has not accepted brexit and there are others in the same vain

    Actually it seems there is a good contingent of lib dems on here who will never accept brexit
    Scott, like me can claim the Bill Cash Amendment.

    The UK is still a democracy, things change. My ghost will be cheering on the day we join a Federal United States of Europe.

    By the way it's all kicking off in DC.
  • Wowsers. McConnell has decided its time to take the GOP back from the Trump family. This is why the Donald has booked the flight to Scotland - get the hell out of dodge whilst still possible
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 82,092
    edited January 2021
    CNN definitely won't be calling this a mostly peaceful protest.

    What a state the US is in. In Portland and Seattle, the lefties are still smashing the place up on a regular basis and on the right we have all these Trump nutters wiped up into a frenzy storming buildings. And, lets hope that the decision not to press charges against the officers in Jacob Blake shooting doesn't set off another round of violence / looting.
  • Mate of mine has just texted "McConnell having his Geoffrey Howe moment"
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,421

    Mate of mine has just texted "McConnell having his Geoffrey Howe moment"

    Being a baaa-dass?
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 28,381

    Pulpstar said:

    Even Mitch wants to get rid of Trump now :D

    Soon, it will be the other way around.

    Trump has the numbers.
    Are you suggesting the Commander in Chief has been keeping his powder dry for a domestic event?
  • Moscow Mitch making a very good speech.

    Please, it is Cocaine Mitch.
    A couple of lines might wake him up for the benefit of everyone watching.
  • contrariancontrarian Posts: 5,818

    Wowsers. McConnell has decided its time to take the GOP back from the Trump family. This is why the Donald has booked the flight to Scotland - get the hell out of dodge whilst still possible

    Polls show 75% of GOP voters think the election was stolen. Mitch & Co do not have the numbers. The whole point of this is for the masses of the repubs to see the 'betrayal' in the flesh. That's why Trump is doing this, probably.

  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 49,868
    McConnell trying to claim the Dems started it in 2016
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,126
    Did...did McDonnell really say that the US cannot divide itself into separate tribes with separate facts and separate realities?

    It's quite clear that's what a lot of the US, on several sides, wants.
  • contrariancontrarian Posts: 5,818

    Pulpstar said:

    Even Mitch wants to get rid of Trump now :D

    Soon, it will be the other way around.

    Trump has the numbers.
    Are you suggesting the Commander in Chief has been keeping his powder dry for a domestic event?
    No, Trump is going.

    But the old Repub party is totally finished. People who didn't fight with Trump are going to get primaried in the next two years and beaten.
  • CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758
    kle4 said:

    Trump on Stacey Abrams: "I beat her with a bad candidate a couple of years ago, Brian Kemp."

    Trump seems to have a particular problem with Abrams. I'm sure it is a mystery why.
    Well I can think of 2 - I’m sure there are others - so it’s a bit of a mystery which
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 50,361
    Yorkcity said:

    So the question that I think needs to be asked.

    Are these Republican politicians mad enough to actually believe that the election was stolen and they can overturn it? Or are they conniving and mad enough to know it is rubbish but think they can actually overturn it anyway?

    Either way they seem to have utterly lost the plot. And all for a man who would stab them in the back at a second's notice if he thought it would serve his ends.

    Yes agree totally.
    Been watching it live on CNN.
    Really brings it home to you how fragile democracy can be, without the correct checks and balances in place, against a dictator.
    History shows as in Germany after ww1 how democracy can change so quickly.
    Hope we do not ever have to learn those lessons again.
    Relying on good people to do the correct thing is not enough.
    I believe the UK should strengthen an official constitution to help prevent it ever happening here.

    The US is demonstrating that a Constitution does not safeguard democracy.

    The voters and politicians do.

    In the UK, 98%+ of the population will accept the result of the next election. No MPs (or ex MPs) will be claiming the election was stolen or demanding the Houses of Parliament be stormed.

    In the US.....
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,126
    What this lot need is a ceremonial leader who stays in place regardless of electoral cycles so they don't have to get really mad every few years about who rules, and just get made about grubby little legislators instead.
  • contrariancontrarian Posts: 5,818
    He is shaken because he and his ilk are finished.
  • HYUFD said:

    It looks a bit like the storming of the Winter Palace in St Petersburg in 1917 or the storming of the Bastille in 1789

    https://twitter.com/Phil_Lewis_/status/1346883077524639748?s=20

    Full on Banana Republic territory. Well, the USA had a good run.
  • CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758

    Pulpstar said:

    Pence has got to head off after he does the Electoral count, he's about to be as welcome as Brutus was in Rome shortly.

    But Brutus was an honourable man...
    So were they all, all honourable men
  • WhisperingOracleWhisperingOracle Posts: 9,165
    edited January 2021

    Wowsers. McConnell has decided its time to take the GOP back from the Trump family. This is why the Donald has booked the flight to Scotland - get the hell out of dodge whilst still possible

    Polls show 75% of GOP voters think the election was stolen. Mitch & Co do not have the numbers. The whole point of this is for the masses of the repubs to see the 'betrayal' in the flesh. That's why Trump is doing this, probably.

    The problem is very, very far from 75% of GOP congressional representatives think the election was stolen. Therein presages the massive internal strife ahead for the Republican Party.
  • Pulpstar said:

    Even Mitch wants to get rid of Trump now :D

    Soon, it will be the other way around.

    Trump has the numbers.
    How, McConnell was recently re-elected.

    He's going to have wait about five years to primary McConnell.
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 28,381

    Pulpstar said:

    Even Mitch wants to get rid of Trump now :D

    Soon, it will be the other way around.

    Trump has the numbers.
    Are you suggesting the Commander in Chief has been keeping his powder dry for a domestic event?
    No, Trump is going.

    But the old Repub party is totally finished. People who didn't fight with Trump are going to get primaried in the next two years and beaten.
    A very fair, and likely accurate analysis.
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 49,868

    Trump's reaction to losing the election is a bit like some pro-Europeans reaction to losing the 2016 Referendum.

    If he'd put as much effort into actually winning the election as he has put into overturning it then he might have actually won the election in the first place.

    That's a stupid point on both counts. Remainers accepted they lost the 2016 referendum, and Trump campaigned very hard to win the election.
    Reading this forum there is scant evidence remainers have accepted they lost in 2016
    You always say stuff like this without basis. Just like you pretend that this forum is full of labour supporters when its actually quite balanced.
    There is one particular poster who tweets daily anti brexit comments as he has not accepted brexit and there are others in the same vain

    Actually it seems there is a good contingent of lib dems on here who will never accept brexit
    Scott, like me can claim the Bill Cash Amendment.

    The UK is still a democracy, things change. My ghost will be cheering on the day we join a Federal United States of Europe.

    By the way it's all kicking off in DC.
    Only just a democracy, when we can be confined to our homes for up to three months by law, and a parliamentary vote (after the law is enacted) is only granted as some kind of favour to the government party’s own backbenchers.
  • FloaterFloater Posts: 14,207
    Some guy in the crowd shouting that now is the time to fight...

    This is going to end well
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 50,361

    Pulpstar said:

    Even Mitch wants to get rid of Trump now :D

    Soon, it will be the other way around.

    Trump has the numbers.
    Are you suggesting the Commander in Chief has been keeping his powder dry for a domestic event?
    No, Trump is going.

    But the old Repub party is totally finished. People who didn't fight with Trump are going to get primaried in the next two years and beaten.
    Third party nailed on, I think - Lincoln Project either takes back the Republicans, or more likely starts a new party.
This discussion has been closed.