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The money’s still goes on the Republicans winning at least one of the Georgia runoff Senate election

SystemSystem Posts: 12,126
edited December 2020 in General
imageThe money’s still goes on the Republicans winning at least one of the Georgia runoff Senate elections – politicalbetting.com

Chart of Betfair market from Btdata.io

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Comments

  • Scott_xP said:
    Looks we might soon need an update to the Treaty of Utrecht.
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 35,894
    Once again Brexit benefits those not actually in the UK...

    https://twitter.com/faisalislam/status/1344648236053762049
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 53,706
    My guess is that the Republicans win both. But then you already know that.
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 51,308

    Scott_xP said:
    Looks we might soon need an update to the Treaty of Utrecht.
    Last Christmas we took back control
    But the very next day, we gave it away
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 34,578
    FPT:

    Cyclefree said:

    Nigelb said:

    Cyclefree said:

    Apparently, there are only 3 pubs open in England today, all on the Scilly Isles.

    Pubs have been closed on a few hours notice thus losing any stock they had bought in for NY because the government could not be arsed to announce the change before the last day for making orders, something which would have been obvious to anyone with a calendar and the wit to ring somebody up in this business. So clearly well beyond the grasp of this government.

    They cannot claim on insurance and pubs in England get far less help than those in Wales and Scotland. Even the grants announced back in November have still to be paid out. The government seems to expect everyone working in this sector to live permanently on 80% of their previous wages. The grants which have been announced don't go remotely near covering fixed costs. Basically every closed pub and hotel and restaurant and other hospitality venue is now loss-making.

    Whether they will ever reopen again depends on whether (a) they have any savings to use and (b) they whether they think it worth using up their savings. The latter depends trusting the government to manage the vaccination programme effectively so that venues can reopen by Easter latest.

    Effectiveness is not the word one first associates with this government, however.
    I thought if you when I saw Cumbria was going from tier 2 to tier 4. Not good, and as you say, awful timing.

    FWIW, I think the vaccination program will be fine despite the government. As Nick pointed out earlier, the long established infrastructure of the NHS is very well organised to deliver vaccinations and would make it hard for any government to truly fuck up.
    Easter is tight, but I think it should happen.
    What worries me is the difference between promises of 4 million doses and Hancock admitting that they have only actually received half a million.

    NHS infrastructure may be fine but if the doses don't actually arrive on time and/or in the quantities needed, what use is the infrastructure.

    I hope to be proved wrong.
    Be careful mixing up numbers. The MHRA only just issued authorisation.

    Half a million are approved and ready to use next week.

    About 4 million have already been bottled up but they need authorisation.

    About 15 million doses have already been produced and need bottling up and authorising.
    That sounds more positive.

    Source?
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 51,308
    FF43 said:

    Scott_xP said:
    What this shows is that non members can get a lot more of what they want if they get sponsorship from a member. Every member no matter how small has a vote and bagging rights. Something for the UK government to consider...
    Dublin could be the informal capital of the British Isles.
  • TimTTimT Posts: 6,456
    There was a poll yesterday showing the Dems winning both races and the gap widening. However, all the big name pollsters have stayed away from this race (leading Nate Silver to call them chicken), so treat with caution.

    As one operative said, no-one knows who will turn out to vote in an historic fight for the Senate in a post-Trumpian world.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 54,314

    FF43 said:

    Scott_xP said:
    What this shows is that non members can get a lot more of what they want if they get sponsorship from a member. Every member no matter how small has a vote and bagging rights. Something for the UK government to consider...
    Dublin could be the informal capital of the British Isles.
    Belfast.
  • GallowgateGallowgate Posts: 19,420

    FPT:

    Cyclefree said:

    Nigelb said:

    Cyclefree said:

    Apparently, there are only 3 pubs open in England today, all on the Scilly Isles.

    Pubs have been closed on a few hours notice thus losing any stock they had bought in for NY because the government could not be arsed to announce the change before the last day for making orders, something which would have been obvious to anyone with a calendar and the wit to ring somebody up in this business. So clearly well beyond the grasp of this government.

    They cannot claim on insurance and pubs in England get far less help than those in Wales and Scotland. Even the grants announced back in November have still to be paid out. The government seems to expect everyone working in this sector to live permanently on 80% of their previous wages. The grants which have been announced don't go remotely near covering fixed costs. Basically every closed pub and hotel and restaurant and other hospitality venue is now loss-making.

    Whether they will ever reopen again depends on whether (a) they have any savings to use and (b) they whether they think it worth using up their savings. The latter depends trusting the government to manage the vaccination programme effectively so that venues can reopen by Easter latest.

    Effectiveness is not the word one first associates with this government, however.
    I thought if you when I saw Cumbria was going from tier 2 to tier 4. Not good, and as you say, awful timing.

    FWIW, I think the vaccination program will be fine despite the government. As Nick pointed out earlier, the long established infrastructure of the NHS is very well organised to deliver vaccinations and would make it hard for any government to truly fuck up.
    Easter is tight, but I think it should happen.
    What worries me is the difference between promises of 4 million doses and Hancock admitting that they have only actually received half a million.

    NHS infrastructure may be fine but if the doses don't actually arrive on time and/or in the quantities needed, what use is the infrastructure.

    I hope to be proved wrong.
    Be careful mixing up numbers. The MHRA only just issued authorisation.

    Half a million are approved and ready to use next week.

    About 4 million have already been bottled up but they need authorisation.

    About 15 million doses have already been produced and need bottling up and authorising.
    That sounds more positive.

    Source?
    Based on my knowledge of pharma, why would the MHRA "authorise" each batch? Normally you would validate a process and once that process is validated and the product itself authorised, off you go.
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 42,639
    edited December 2020
    Scott_xP said:

    Once again Brexit benefits those not actually in the UK...

    https://twitter.com/faisalislam/status/1344648236053762049

    You mean those "not actually in the non-existent polity but geographical construct called Great Britain and some of the associated [edit] Isles of Britain and Ireland".
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 53,706
    Scott_xP said:
    It's interesting that even France is not supporting ESMA on this. My expectation is that the EU will give way. It will cause chaos in their own markets if they don't.
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 51,308
    Sandpit said:

    FF43 said:

    Scott_xP said:
    What this shows is that non members can get a lot more of what they want if they get sponsorship from a member. Every member no matter how small has a vote and bagging rights. Something for the UK government to consider...
    Dublin could be the informal capital of the British Isles.
    Belfast.
    Who represents Belfast in the European Council?
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 35,894
    Carnyx said:

    You mean those "not actually in the non-existent polity but geographical construct called Great Britain and some of the associated [edit] Isles of Britain and Ireland".

    Obviously...
  • StarryStarry Posts: 110
    Susan Collins is closer to Biden than Trump, or even Mitch. I think the Dems only really need one senate seat to get most of their centrist/soft left (by US standards) policies through. There are other liberal Republicans too of course but Susan could even serve happily in Biden's cabinet without much friction.
  • FPT:

    Cyclefree said:

    Nigelb said:

    Cyclefree said:

    Apparently, there are only 3 pubs open in England today, all on the Scilly Isles.

    Pubs have been closed on a few hours notice thus losing any stock they had bought in for NY because the government could not be arsed to announce the change before the last day for making orders, something which would have been obvious to anyone with a calendar and the wit to ring somebody up in this business. So clearly well beyond the grasp of this government.

    They cannot claim on insurance and pubs in England get far less help than those in Wales and Scotland. Even the grants announced back in November have still to be paid out. The government seems to expect everyone working in this sector to live permanently on 80% of their previous wages. The grants which have been announced don't go remotely near covering fixed costs. Basically every closed pub and hotel and restaurant and other hospitality venue is now loss-making.

    Whether they will ever reopen again depends on whether (a) they have any savings to use and (b) they whether they think it worth using up their savings. The latter depends trusting the government to manage the vaccination programme effectively so that venues can reopen by Easter latest.

    Effectiveness is not the word one first associates with this government, however.
    I thought if you when I saw Cumbria was going from tier 2 to tier 4. Not good, and as you say, awful timing.

    FWIW, I think the vaccination program will be fine despite the government. As Nick pointed out earlier, the long established infrastructure of the NHS is very well organised to deliver vaccinations and would make it hard for any government to truly fuck up.
    Easter is tight, but I think it should happen.
    What worries me is the difference between promises of 4 million doses and Hancock admitting that they have only actually received half a million.

    NHS infrastructure may be fine but if the doses don't actually arrive on time and/or in the quantities needed, what use is the infrastructure.

    I hope to be proved wrong.
    Be careful mixing up numbers. The MHRA only just issued authorisation.

    Half a million are approved and ready to use next week.

    About 4 million have already been bottled up but they need authorisation.

    About 15 million doses have already been produced and need bottling up and authorising.
    That sounds more positive.

    Source?
    Based on my knowledge of pharma, why would the MHRA "authorise" each batch? Normally you would validate a process and once that process is validated and the product itself authorised, off you go.
    The MHRA don't authorise each batch but they do say the procedure through which the batches require accreditation. So now that the vaccine is authorised, the batches need accreditation.

    A long read on this was shared here last night, I think by FrancisUrquhart from memory.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 77,853
    edited December 2020
    The numbers suggest Ossoff has a trickier task than Warnock

    GA Special
    GOP 2,426,120 49.37%
    Dem 2,378,312 48.40%
    Ind 59,205 1.20%
    Lib 35,431 0.72%
    Green 15,293 0.31%

    4,914,361

    GA Regular

    GOP David Perdue (incumbent) 2,462,617 49.73%
    Dem Jon Ossoff 2,374,519 47.95%
    Lib Shane T. Hazel 115,039 2.32%

    4,952,175
  • Sandpit said:

    FF43 said:

    Scott_xP said:
    What this shows is that non members can get a lot more of what they want if they get sponsorship from a member. Every member no matter how small has a vote and bagging rights. Something for the UK government to consider...
    Dublin could be the informal capital of the British Isles.
    Belfast.
    Nope, too bloody small, and full of Ulstermen.
  • Starry said:

    Susan Collins is closer to Biden than Trump, or even Mitch. I think the Dems only really need one senate seat to get most of their centrist/soft left (by US standards) policies through. There are other liberal Republicans too of course but Susan could even serve happily in Biden's cabinet without much friction.

    Doesn't work that way unfortunately. Mitch carries an absurd amount of power, he can just schedule a vote on a vote he would lose
  • Picardo (Gib PM) sounding happy with the agreement with Spain & fulsome in praise for Spanish and UK ministers for coming to an agreement. No compromises on sovereignty - looks like Spanish sensibly did not bring it up - believing they'll catch more flies with honey than vinegar.
  • isamisam Posts: 41,118
    Someone has paid a couple of actors to put my PB rows about mass immigration onto the smallscreen! Almost word for word!

    Which PBer is Jonathan Miller playing? He's captured the mannerisms and debating style of my opponents perfectly. Could be any of half a dozen

    https://youtu.be/MEPtyb9OHP8
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 95,829
    Scott_xP said:
    Ah, the ever present 'Other places are mean about us' rallying cry which people are way way too sensitive about.

    As others have pointed out previously the EU and national leaders are tough, hard nosed operators. They wont treat us more or less generously depending on their views of our leaders, only their policies.

    And no one should ever care if the general public elsewhere dont like the leaders of a different country. We can worry about our crap leaders without feeling embarrassed about it, everyone gets them eventually.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 95,829
    Scott_xP said:
    He does appear very good. I get a Buttegieg feel in how I find his delivery engaging.
  • contrariancontrarian Posts: 5,818
    The Republicans are fatally split between Trump supporters and the old guard. They cannot abide each other.

    Should be easily enough to allow the democrats to win Georgia handily.

    After that, well, all bets are off. America is wide open to the radical left. Green deals, mass immigration, huge tax hikes, identity politics with a vengeance, lockdowns, reparations,

    I suggest bitcoin. Touched 29,000 a little while ago. Still in the foothills. Still at the beginning.

  • kle4kle4 Posts: 95,829

    Picardo (Gib PM) sounding happy with the agreement with Spain & fulsome in praise for Spanish and UK ministers for coming to an agreement. No compromises on sovereignty - looks like Spanish sensibly did not bring it up - believing they'll catch more flies with honey than vinegar.

    I do wonder how much the politicians actually want Gibraltar 'back' and how much it's just an easy thing to say with not much point in pushing it.

    I mean, we all know national borders are a fudge, can they really think that slice of land is theres by divine right or something? No, like the UKs own positions in these matters it surely has to be politics and interests, and is it that big a deal in reality for them?
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,154

    The Republicans are fatally split between Trump supporters and the old guard. They cannot abide each other.

    Should be easily enough to allow the democrats to win Georgia handily.

    So, we add runoff elections to the list of things you don't quite understand.
  • isamisam Posts: 41,118
    isam said:

    Someone has paid a couple of actors to put my PB rows about mass immigration onto the smallscreen! Almost word for word!

    Which PBer is Jonathan Miller playing? He's captured the mannerisms and debating style of my opponents perfectly. Could be any of half a dozen

    /youtu.be/MEPtyb9OHP8

    They go on to agree about India, much to Miller's annnoyance

    https://youtu.be/VsC6GBw9zew
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 95,829
    What would he know? The UN doesn't think he or the people there know what they are talking about on their own status even.
  • AlistairAlistair Posts: 23,670
    TimT said:

    There was a poll yesterday showing the Dems winning both races and the gap widening. However, all the big name pollsters have stayed away from this race (leading Nate Silver to call them chicken), so treat with caution.

    As one operative said, no-one knows who will turn out to vote in an historic fight for the Senate in a post-Trumpian world.

    Emerson have polled and they got Georgia spot on in the General. They had a pair of tight GOP leads.

    But that was well before the 2000 dollar cheque fiasco.
  • contrariancontrarian Posts: 5,818
    ydoethur said:

    The Republicans are fatally split between Trump supporters and the old guard. They cannot abide each other.

    Should be easily enough to allow the democrats to win Georgia handily.

    So, we add runoff elections to the list of things you don't quite understand.
    look I've had enough of insults. Present an argument or go f8ck yourself.
  • Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 65,826
    edited December 2020

    The Republicans are fatally split between Trump supporters and the old guard. They cannot abide each other.

    Should be easily enough to allow the democrats to win Georgia handily.

    After that, well, all bets are off. America is wide open to the radical left. Green deals, mass immigration, huge tax hikes, identity politics with a vengeance, lockdowns, reparations,

    I suggest bitcoin. Touched 29,000 a little while ago. Still in the foothills. Still at the beginning.

    Bitcoin is the biggest Ponzi scheme of all time. I wouldn't put a penny into it.

    It is fundamentally worthless. The technology is interesting but this application of it is not.

    Edit: If you're worried about fiat currency then buy gold, not magic beans.
  • AlistairAlistair Posts: 23,670
    edited December 2020

    The Republicans are fatally split between Trump supporters and the old guard. They cannot abide each other.

    Should be easily enough to allow the democrats to win Georgia handily.

    After that, well, all bets are off. America is wide open to the radical left. Green deals, mass immigration, huge tax hikes, identity politics with a vengeance, lockdowns, reparations,

    I suggest bitcoin. Touched 29,000 a little while ago. Still in the foothills. Still at the beginning.

    I like how by adding Bitcoin boosting you are completing the caricature to a T.

    It is real commitment to the bit (pun intended)
  • contrariancontrarian Posts: 5,818
    Alistair said:

    The Republicans are fatally split between Trump supporters and the old guard. They cannot abide each other.

    Should be easily enough to allow the democrats to win Georgia handily.

    After that, well, all bets are off. America is wide open to the radical left. Green deals, mass immigration, huge tax hikes, identity politics with a vengeance, lockdowns, reparations,

    I suggest bitcoin. Touched 29,000 a little while ago. Still in the foothills. Still at the beginning.

    I like how by adding Bitcoin boosting you are completing the caricature to a T.

    It is real commitment to the bit (pun intended)
    I have no idea what you are talking about.
  • contrariancontrarian Posts: 5,818

    The Republicans are fatally split between Trump supporters and the old guard. They cannot abide each other.

    Should be easily enough to allow the democrats to win Georgia handily.

    After that, well, all bets are off. America is wide open to the radical left. Green deals, mass immigration, huge tax hikes, identity politics with a vengeance, lockdowns, reparations,

    I suggest bitcoin. Touched 29,000 a little while ago. Still in the foothills. Still at the beginning.

    Bitcoin is the biggest Ponzi scheme of all time. I wouldn't put a penny into it.

    It is fundamentally worthless. The technology is interesting but this application of it is not.

    Edit: If you're worried about fiat currency then buy gold, not magic beans.
    I bought quite a lot of gold over Christmas actually.

  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 49,774

    The Republicans are fatally split between Trump supporters and the old guard. They cannot abide each other.

    Should be easily enough to allow the democrats to win Georgia handily.

    After that, well, all bets are off. America is wide open to the radical left. Green deals, mass immigration, huge tax hikes, identity politics with a vengeance, lockdowns, reparations,

    I suggest bitcoin. Touched 29,000 a little while ago. Still in the foothills. Still at the beginning.

    Bitcoin is the biggest Ponzi scheme of all time. I wouldn't put a penny into it.

    It is fundamentally worthless. The technology is interesting but this application of it is not.

    Edit: If you're worried about fiat currency then buy gold, not magic beans.
    I bought quite a lot of gold over Christmas actually.

    Bad timing. The next few months may be bumpy but they will be about optimism. Buy gold in May, when the spectre of inflation appears.
  • StockyStocky Posts: 10,113

    The Republicans are fatally split between Trump supporters and the old guard. They cannot abide each other.

    Should be easily enough to allow the democrats to win Georgia handily.

    After that, well, all bets are off. America is wide open to the radical left. Green deals, mass immigration, huge tax hikes, identity politics with a vengeance, lockdowns, reparations,

    I suggest bitcoin. Touched 29,000 a little while ago. Still in the foothills. Still at the beginning.

    Bitcoin is the biggest Ponzi scheme of all time. I wouldn't put a penny into it.

    It is fundamentally worthless. The technology is interesting but this application of it is not.

    Edit: If you're worried about fiat currency then buy gold, not magic beans.
    I bought quite a lot of gold over Christmas actually.

    How did you actually do that? Buy a gold mining company`s shares? Or gold futures?
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,154
    edited December 2020

    ydoethur said:

    The Republicans are fatally split between Trump supporters and the old guard. They cannot abide each other.

    Should be easily enough to allow the democrats to win Georgia handily.

    So, we add runoff elections to the list of things you don't quite understand.
    look I've had enough of insults. Present an argument or go f8ck yourself.
    There are two candidates in the runoff elections. In this case one is Democrat. And one is Republican.

    Unless you are suggesting that the split in the Republican party will cause one side or the other to back the Democrats or abstain - the former idea being actually insane, and the latter being rather unlikely with control of the Senate at stake - any splits within the party will not therefore be relevant to who wins.

    As for the delicious irony that you, one of the comparatively few genuinely nasty and abusive posters on here and one who has never yet posted a valid argument, has 'had enough of insults...'
  • eekeek Posts: 28,077

    The Republicans are fatally split between Trump supporters and the old guard. They cannot abide each other.

    Should be easily enough to allow the democrats to win Georgia handily.

    After that, well, all bets are off. America is wide open to the radical left. Green deals, mass immigration, huge tax hikes, identity politics with a vengeance, lockdowns, reparations,

    I suggest bitcoin. Touched 29,000 a little while ago. Still in the foothills. Still at the beginning.

    Bitcoin is the biggest Ponzi scheme of all time. I wouldn't put a penny into it.

    It is fundamentally worthless. The technology is interesting but this application of it is not.

    Edit: If you're worried about fiat currency then buy gold, not magic beans.
    Bitcoin has a purpose that gold doesn't have - which is that you can use it as a transfer of wealth across national borders with little risk.
  • AlistairAlistair Posts: 23,670

    Alistair said:

    The Republicans are fatally split between Trump supporters and the old guard. They cannot abide each other.

    Should be easily enough to allow the democrats to win Georgia handily.

    After that, well, all bets are off. America is wide open to the radical left. Green deals, mass immigration, huge tax hikes, identity politics with a vengeance, lockdowns, reparations,

    I suggest bitcoin. Touched 29,000 a little while ago. Still in the foothills. Still at the beginning.

    I like how by adding Bitcoin boosting you are completing the caricature to a T.

    It is real commitment to the bit (pun intended)
    I have no idea what you are talking about.
    The Trump supporting, wake-up-sheeple, Covid denying, Bitcoin ramper?

    Straight from the pages of a comic book. Or Twitter as it is also known as.
  • ChrisChris Posts: 11,736
    isam said:

    Someone has paid a couple of actors to put my PB rows about mass immigration onto the smallscreen! Almost word for word!

    Which PBer is Jonathan Miller playing? He's captured the mannerisms and debating style of my opponents perfectly. Could be any of half a dozen

    https://youtu.be/MEPtyb9OHP8

    Blimey. I was born in the West Midlands, so I've heard "Enoch was right" often enough. But "Enoch is me" is a new one.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,154

    Whenever I hear or read about Bitcoin the smell of Dutch tulips begins to overwhelm me.

    It will flower one day?
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 95,829
    isam said:

    Stocky said:

    The Republicans are fatally split between Trump supporters and the old guard. They cannot abide each other.

    Should be easily enough to allow the democrats to win Georgia handily.

    After that, well, all bets are off. America is wide open to the radical left. Green deals, mass immigration, huge tax hikes, identity politics with a vengeance, lockdowns, reparations,

    I suggest bitcoin. Touched 29,000 a little while ago. Still in the foothills. Still at the beginning.

    Bitcoin is the biggest Ponzi scheme of all time. I wouldn't put a penny into it.

    It is fundamentally worthless. The technology is interesting but this application of it is not.

    Edit: If you're worried about fiat currency then buy gold, not magic beans.
    I bought quite a lot of gold over Christmas actually.

    How did you actually do that? Buy a gold mining company`s shares? Or gold futures?
    Chocolate coins in gold wrappers
    I forget who said it, but it was once suggested the day someone spends real money on edible fake money for their kids is the surest demonstration of how love for children is not entirely rational :)
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 49,774
    Stocky said:

    The Republicans are fatally split between Trump supporters and the old guard. They cannot abide each other.

    Should be easily enough to allow the democrats to win Georgia handily.

    After that, well, all bets are off. America is wide open to the radical left. Green deals, mass immigration, huge tax hikes, identity politics with a vengeance, lockdowns, reparations,

    I suggest bitcoin. Touched 29,000 a little while ago. Still in the foothills. Still at the beginning.

    Bitcoin is the biggest Ponzi scheme of all time. I wouldn't put a penny into it.

    It is fundamentally worthless. The technology is interesting but this application of it is not.

    Edit: If you're worried about fiat currency then buy gold, not magic beans.
    I bought quite a lot of gold over Christmas actually.

    How did you actually do that? Buy a gold mining company`s shares? Or gold futures?
    For ordinary investors, you don’t want to be faffing about with physical gold, which you either have to hide beneath the floorboards or pay some semi-scam company to store for you. The sensible choices are either an ETF linked to the gold price or a reputable fund like Black Rock Gold & General. I have held the latter for years and add to my holding whenever the short to medium term outlook looks grim, and partly sell whenever optimism is in the wind. Over the piece it’s up there with my most successful investments.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 95,829
    edited December 2020
    I dont believe the EU is stupid enough to be so unaffected. I respect it too much to suggest it is that dumb.

    Whether it responds the right way, and what that is, may be another matter, but impacted by it they are.

    Indeed, people often point to how it was impacted by suggesting the killing of of euroscepticism and brexit encouraging the process of cooperation.
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 49,774
    ydoethur said:

    Whenever I hear or read about Bitcoin the smell of Dutch tulips begins to overwhelm me.

    It will flower one day?
    You just need to make sure you aren’t the last idiot in line.
  • contrariancontrarian Posts: 5,818
    ydoethur said:

    ydoethur said:

    The Republicans are fatally split between Trump supporters and the old guard. They cannot abide each other.

    Should be easily enough to allow the democrats to win Georgia handily.

    So, we add runoff elections to the list of things you don't quite understand.
    look I've had enough of insults. Present an argument or go f8ck yourself.
    There are two candidates in the runoff elections. In this case one is Democrat. And one is Republican.

    Unless you are suggesting that the split in the Republican party will cause one side or the other to back the Democrats or abstain - the former idea being actually insane, and the latter being rather unlikely with control of the Senate at stake - any splits within the party will not therefore be relevant to who wins.
    Look at the tweets of Trump supporters and tell me the split in the party isn't very real, very deep and very likely to prompt plenty not to turn up for Georgia.
  • kamskikamski Posts: 5,125
    Half a million fewer tests done in Germany last week compared to the week before, a fall of about a third.
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 49,774
    kamski said:

    Half a million fewer tests done in Germany last week compared to the week before, a fall of about a third.

    Given the holidays, so?
  • RogerRoger Posts: 19,851
    Chris said:

    isam said:

    Someone has paid a couple of actors to put my PB rows about mass immigration onto the smallscreen! Almost word for word!

    Which PBer is Jonathan Miller playing? He's captured the mannerisms and debating style of my opponents perfectly. Could be any of half a dozen

    https://youtu.be/MEPtyb9OHP8

    Blimey. I was born in the West Midlands, so I've heard "Enoch was right" often enough. But "Enoch is me" is a new one.
    Pretty disgusting even when you look at it now. Of course they've nearly all morphed into Leavers which sounds slightly more respectable
  • If you're worried about
    eek said:

    The Republicans are fatally split between Trump supporters and the old guard. They cannot abide each other.

    Should be easily enough to allow the democrats to win Georgia handily.

    After that, well, all bets are off. America is wide open to the radical left. Green deals, mass immigration, huge tax hikes, identity politics with a vengeance, lockdowns, reparations,

    I suggest bitcoin. Touched 29,000 a little while ago. Still in the foothills. Still at the beginning.

    Bitcoin is the biggest Ponzi scheme of all time. I wouldn't put a penny into it.

    It is fundamentally worthless. The technology is interesting but this application of it is not.

    Edit: If you're worried about fiat currency then buy gold, not magic beans.
    Bitcoin has a purpose that gold doesn't have - which is that you can use it as a transfer of wealth across national borders with little risk.
    Well it might if the value of Bitcoin was stable and predictable.

    Considering its advocates rage against fiat currency, fiat currency is far more stable, secure and predicable in value. Bitcoin may serve a purpose in allowing drug dealers to move money, but I'm not convinced there's a stable future in it.

    The very soaring nature of it "$29,000 and just in the foothills" is precisely why it is nothing but one of the most technically elaborate Ponzi schemes ever.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,154

    ydoethur said:

    ydoethur said:

    The Republicans are fatally split between Trump supporters and the old guard. They cannot abide each other.

    Should be easily enough to allow the democrats to win Georgia handily.

    So, we add runoff elections to the list of things you don't quite understand.
    look I've had enough of insults. Present an argument or go f8ck yourself.
    There are two candidates in the runoff elections. In this case one is Democrat. And one is Republican.

    Unless you are suggesting that the split in the Republican party will cause one side or the other to back the Democrats or abstain - the former idea being actually insane, and the latter being rather unlikely with control of the Senate at stake - any splits within the party will not therefore be relevant to who wins.
    Look at the tweets of Trump supporters and tell me the split in the party isn't very real, very deep and very likely to prompt plenty not to turn up for Georgia.
    To let the Dems in and gift them control of the Senate? After Trump has campaigned for both the Rep candidates?

    Don't make the mistake of assuming that Twitter is representative. It represents mostly ill-informed and not very bright lunatic fringe, like Toby Young and the Department for Education.

    As it happens, I think differential turnout will be key, but advertising and the weather are likely to be more important than nuts with keyboards.
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 56,878
    DavidL said:

    My guess is that the Republicans win both. But then you already know that.

    That is my guess too. That being said, I do wonder if Georgia is about to become a Purple state.
  • StockyStocky Posts: 10,113
    IanB2 said:

    Stocky said:

    The Republicans are fatally split between Trump supporters and the old guard. They cannot abide each other.

    Should be easily enough to allow the democrats to win Georgia handily.

    After that, well, all bets are off. America is wide open to the radical left. Green deals, mass immigration, huge tax hikes, identity politics with a vengeance, lockdowns, reparations,

    I suggest bitcoin. Touched 29,000 a little while ago. Still in the foothills. Still at the beginning.

    Bitcoin is the biggest Ponzi scheme of all time. I wouldn't put a penny into it.

    It is fundamentally worthless. The technology is interesting but this application of it is not.

    Edit: If you're worried about fiat currency then buy gold, not magic beans.
    I bought quite a lot of gold over Christmas actually.

    How did you actually do that? Buy a gold mining company`s shares? Or gold futures?
    For ordinary investors, you don’t want to be faffing about with physical gold, which you either have to hide beneath the floorboards or pay some semi-scam company to store for you. The sensible choices are either an ETF linked to the gold price or a reputable fund like Black Rock Gold & General. I have held the latter for years and add to my holding whenever the short to medium term outlook looks grim, and partly sell whenever optimism is in the wind. Over the piece it’s up there with my most successful investments.
    I thought Contrarian was referring to funds rather than physical gold. The BlackRock Gold and General Fund is too highly charged for my taste. I`d go with an ETF.
  • contrariancontrarian Posts: 5,818

    If you're worried about

    eek said:

    The Republicans are fatally split between Trump supporters and the old guard. They cannot abide each other.

    Should be easily enough to allow the democrats to win Georgia handily.

    After that, well, all bets are off. America is wide open to the radical left. Green deals, mass immigration, huge tax hikes, identity politics with a vengeance, lockdowns, reparations,

    I suggest bitcoin. Touched 29,000 a little while ago. Still in the foothills. Still at the beginning.

    Bitcoin is the biggest Ponzi scheme of all time. I wouldn't put a penny into it.

    It is fundamentally worthless. The technology is interesting but this application of it is not.

    Edit: If you're worried about fiat currency then buy gold, not magic beans.
    Bitcoin has a purpose that gold doesn't have - which is that you can use it as a transfer of wealth across national borders with little risk.
    Well it might if the value of Bitcoin was stable and predictable.

    Considering its advocates rage against fiat currency, fiat currency is far more stable, secure and predicable in value. Bitcoin may serve a purpose in allowing drug dealers to move money, but I'm not convinced there's a stable future in it.

    The very soaring nature of it "$29,000 and just in the foothills" is precisely why it is nothing but one of the most technically elaborate Ponzi schemes ever.
    When a big investment firm recently made a bitcoin investment, they did so, they said on the basis it was a hedge against the devaluation of the world's major currencies.

    And that's all it is really, a hedge, and the only way I would suggest anybody takes a look at it, as one among a wide range of investments.

    Now why would the world's major currencies devalue? well, they have been printing money like its going out of fashion and will continue to do so, and the rates offered for some investments in theses currencies are zero or in some cases negative.

  • kamskikamski Posts: 5,125
    IanB2 said:

    kamski said:

    Half a million fewer tests done in Germany last week compared to the week before, a fall of about a third.

    Given the holidays, so?
    So:
    1. I believe there was not such a big drop off in the uk
    2. There are a lot of extra people celebrating New Year unaware that they have coronavirus, or have been in contact with someone with coronavirus.
  • eek said:

    The Republicans are fatally split between Trump supporters and the old guard. They cannot abide each other.

    Should be easily enough to allow the democrats to win Georgia handily.

    After that, well, all bets are off. America is wide open to the radical left. Green deals, mass immigration, huge tax hikes, identity politics with a vengeance, lockdowns, reparations,

    I suggest bitcoin. Touched 29,000 a little while ago. Still in the foothills. Still at the beginning.

    Bitcoin is the biggest Ponzi scheme of all time. I wouldn't put a penny into it.

    It is fundamentally worthless. The technology is interesting but this application of it is not.

    Edit: If you're worried about fiat currency then buy gold, not magic beans.
    Bitcoin has a purpose that gold doesn't have - which is that you can use it as a transfer of wealth across national borders with little risk.
    Does anyone have more than 1% of their wealth in cryptos on here? Would be interested to hear why if so. For the record I have 0%.
  • FeersumEnjineeyaFeersumEnjineeya Posts: 4,363
    edited December 2020

    If you're worried about

    eek said:

    The Republicans are fatally split between Trump supporters and the old guard. They cannot abide each other.

    Should be easily enough to allow the democrats to win Georgia handily.

    After that, well, all bets are off. America is wide open to the radical left. Green deals, mass immigration, huge tax hikes, identity politics with a vengeance, lockdowns, reparations,

    I suggest bitcoin. Touched 29,000 a little while ago. Still in the foothills. Still at the beginning.

    Bitcoin is the biggest Ponzi scheme of all time. I wouldn't put a penny into it.

    It is fundamentally worthless. The technology is interesting but this application of it is not.

    Edit: If you're worried about fiat currency then buy gold, not magic beans.
    Bitcoin has a purpose that gold doesn't have - which is that you can use it as a transfer of wealth across national borders with little risk.
    Well it might if the value of Bitcoin was stable and predictable.

    Considering its advocates rage against fiat currency, fiat currency is far more stable, secure and predicable in value. Bitcoin may serve a purpose in allowing drug dealers to move money, but I'm not convinced there's a stable future in it.

    The very soaring nature of it "$29,000 and just in the foothills" is precisely why it is nothing but one of the most technically elaborate Ponzi schemes ever.
    My lad uses Bitcoin or, more usually, Ethereum, to buy and sell CSGO skins on the internet. Cryptocurrencies are the most convenient medium of exchange for him, but he tries not to hang on to them for too long due to their volatility.

    P.S. Would your believe that such "skins" - basically decorative patterns for virtual weapons - can sell for over £1,000?! Sometimes the world seems a crazy place!
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 53,706
    rcs1000 said:

    DavidL said:

    My guess is that the Republicans win both. But then you already know that.

    That is my guess too. That being said, I do wonder if Georgia is about to become a Purple state.
    It's possible at the Presidential level. Now that Democrats have learned that they can win there they may be more inclined to vote. But the Democratic record in run offs is absymal. They have never won one for the Senate. I personally believe the run off system is designed that way. It penalises a party who may be able to get their marginal voters out for the President but not for anything else.

    Its also worth reflecting on how Texas was supposedly going purple. It wasn't. Not even close.
  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 38,528
    kamski said:

    IanB2 said:

    kamski said:

    Half a million fewer tests done in Germany last week compared to the week before, a fall of about a third.

    Given the holidays, so?
    So:
    1. I believe there was not such a big drop off in the uk
    2. There are a lot of extra people celebrating New Year unaware that they have coronavirus, or have been in contact with someone with coronavirus.
    From what we already know about isolation post testing this would happen either way. In all of Europe the testing system is little more than expensive monitoring of virus trends.
  • contrariancontrarian Posts: 5,818
    Stocky said:

    IanB2 said:

    Stocky said:

    The Republicans are fatally split between Trump supporters and the old guard. They cannot abide each other.

    Should be easily enough to allow the democrats to win Georgia handily.

    After that, well, all bets are off. America is wide open to the radical left. Green deals, mass immigration, huge tax hikes, identity politics with a vengeance, lockdowns, reparations,

    I suggest bitcoin. Touched 29,000 a little while ago. Still in the foothills. Still at the beginning.

    Bitcoin is the biggest Ponzi scheme of all time. I wouldn't put a penny into it.

    It is fundamentally worthless. The technology is interesting but this application of it is not.

    Edit: If you're worried about fiat currency then buy gold, not magic beans.
    I bought quite a lot of gold over Christmas actually.

    How did you actually do that? Buy a gold mining company`s shares? Or gold futures?
    For ordinary investors, you don’t want to be faffing about with physical gold, which you either have to hide beneath the floorboards or pay some semi-scam company to store for you. The sensible choices are either an ETF linked to the gold price or a reputable fund like Black Rock Gold & General. I have held the latter for years and add to my holding whenever the short to medium term outlook looks grim, and partly sell whenever optimism is in the wind. Over the piece it’s up there with my most successful investments.
    I thought Contrarian was referring to funds rather than physical gold. The BlackRock Gold and General Fund is too highly charged for my taste. I`d go with an ETF.
    A combination of ETF and a nice present for Mrs Contrarian, to answer your question.
  • If you're worried about

    eek said:

    The Republicans are fatally split between Trump supporters and the old guard. They cannot abide each other.

    Should be easily enough to allow the democrats to win Georgia handily.

    After that, well, all bets are off. America is wide open to the radical left. Green deals, mass immigration, huge tax hikes, identity politics with a vengeance, lockdowns, reparations,

    I suggest bitcoin. Touched 29,000 a little while ago. Still in the foothills. Still at the beginning.

    Bitcoin is the biggest Ponzi scheme of all time. I wouldn't put a penny into it.

    It is fundamentally worthless. The technology is interesting but this application of it is not.

    Edit: If you're worried about fiat currency then buy gold, not magic beans.
    Bitcoin has a purpose that gold doesn't have - which is that you can use it as a transfer of wealth across national borders with little risk.
    Well it might if the value of Bitcoin was stable and predictable.

    Considering its advocates rage against fiat currency, fiat currency is far more stable, secure and predicable in value. Bitcoin may serve a purpose in allowing drug dealers to move money, but I'm not convinced there's a stable future in it.

    The very soaring nature of it "$29,000 and just in the foothills" is precisely why it is nothing but one of the most technically elaborate Ponzi schemes ever.
    When a big investment firm recently made a bitcoin investment, they did so, they said on the basis it was a hedge against the devaluation of the world's major currencies.

    And that's all it is really, a hedge, and the only way I would suggest anybody takes a look at it, as one among a wide range of investments.

    Now why would the world's major currencies devalue? well, they have been printing money like its going out of fashion and will continue to do so, and the rates offered for some investments in theses currencies are zero or in some cases negative.

    Nonsense is it a hedge. Not a sane one for an ordinary investor at least.

    Gold is a rational hedge, it is inversely linked to the value of what you are hedging against. . Bitcoin isn't linked to anything other that the confidence in Bitcoin. It is a Ponzi.
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 49,774
    kle4 said:

    Scott_xP said:
    Ah, the ever present 'Other places are mean about us' rallying cry which people are way way too sensitive about.

    As others have pointed out previously the EU and national leaders are tough, hard nosed operators. They wont treat us more or less generously depending on their views of our leaders, only their policies.

    And no one should ever care if the general public elsewhere dont like the leaders of a different country. We can worry about our crap leaders without feeling embarrassed about it, everyone gets them eventually.
    But the big picture scenario - that a bunch of charlatan politicians have led a bunch of our elderly voters, who prefer the way the world worked when they were young to the way it actually works nowadays, up a garden path toward what will prove a futile, if not terminal, outcome for our country, is hard to deny.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,154
    MaxPB said:

    kamski said:

    IanB2 said:

    kamski said:

    Half a million fewer tests done in Germany last week compared to the week before, a fall of about a third.

    Given the holidays, so?
    So:
    1. I believe there was not such a big drop off in the uk
    2. There are a lot of extra people celebrating New Year unaware that they have coronavirus, or have been in contact with someone with coronavirus.
    From what we already know about isolation post testing this would happen either way. In all of Europe the testing system is little more than expensive monitoring of virus trends.
    Which makes it slightly unfortunate that our entire education strategy to reopen schools is based on the least accurate form of it.
  • algarkirkalgarkirk Posts: 12,360
    Guardian swiftly moves on/switches sides/joins Mail and Spectator 4 years late.
    You would have to have a heart of stone........

    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2020/dec/31/the-left-brexit-economic-uk
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 56,878

    ydoethur said:

    ydoethur said:

    The Republicans are fatally split between Trump supporters and the old guard. They cannot abide each other.

    Should be easily enough to allow the democrats to win Georgia handily.

    So, we add runoff elections to the list of things you don't quite understand.
    look I've had enough of insults. Present an argument or go f8ck yourself.
    There are two candidates in the runoff elections. In this case one is Democrat. And one is Republican.

    Unless you are suggesting that the split in the Republican party will cause one side or the other to back the Democrats or abstain - the former idea being actually insane, and the latter being rather unlikely with control of the Senate at stake - any splits within the party will not therefore be relevant to who wins.
    Look at the tweets of Trump supporters and tell me the split in the party isn't very real, very deep and very likely to prompt plenty not to turn up for Georgia.
    Oh, the Republican Party needs to be very careful. It's coalition is:

    The Religious Right, who wanted Trump to put Conservative judges on the Supreme Court* to help overturn Roe v Wade, and to stop (and ideally reverse) the Courts in areas such as LBGT rights. This group - as Pat Robertson articulated on TV last week - has never really liked Trump, and saw his Presidency as a trade.

    The Nativists, where it's largely about immigration.

    The Left Behinds, where it's about economic performance in great flyover.

    The Deregulators and the Low Taxers.

    And then there are some who see Trump himself as a hero.

    There are at least two of those groups who aren't actually that keen on Trump himself.

    * The first of those he put on, Neil Goresuch, wrote the majority opinion which led to sexual discrimination law being extended LBGT people, so that's not worked out too well yet.
  • eekeek Posts: 28,077

    If you're worried about

    eek said:

    The Republicans are fatally split between Trump supporters and the old guard. They cannot abide each other.

    Should be easily enough to allow the democrats to win Georgia handily.

    After that, well, all bets are off. America is wide open to the radical left. Green deals, mass immigration, huge tax hikes, identity politics with a vengeance, lockdowns, reparations,

    I suggest bitcoin. Touched 29,000 a little while ago. Still in the foothills. Still at the beginning.

    Bitcoin is the biggest Ponzi scheme of all time. I wouldn't put a penny into it.

    It is fundamentally worthless. The technology is interesting but this application of it is not.

    Edit: If you're worried about fiat currency then buy gold, not magic beans.
    Bitcoin has a purpose that gold doesn't have - which is that you can use it as a transfer of wealth across national borders with little risk.
    Well it might if the value of Bitcoin was stable and predictable.

    Considering its advocates rage against fiat currency, fiat currency is far more stable, secure and predicable in value. Bitcoin may serve a purpose in allowing drug dealers to move money, but I'm not convinced there's a stable future in it.

    The very soaring nature of it "$29,000 and just in the foothills" is precisely why it is nothing but one of the most technically elaborate Ponzi schemes ever.
    I didn't say it was something you should use as a store of wealth rather as a means of moving wealth around under the radar of governments.
  • StockyStocky Posts: 10,113

    Stocky said:

    IanB2 said:

    Stocky said:

    The Republicans are fatally split between Trump supporters and the old guard. They cannot abide each other.

    Should be easily enough to allow the democrats to win Georgia handily.

    After that, well, all bets are off. America is wide open to the radical left. Green deals, mass immigration, huge tax hikes, identity politics with a vengeance, lockdowns, reparations,

    I suggest bitcoin. Touched 29,000 a little while ago. Still in the foothills. Still at the beginning.

    Bitcoin is the biggest Ponzi scheme of all time. I wouldn't put a penny into it.

    It is fundamentally worthless. The technology is interesting but this application of it is not.

    Edit: If you're worried about fiat currency then buy gold, not magic beans.
    I bought quite a lot of gold over Christmas actually.

    How did you actually do that? Buy a gold mining company`s shares? Or gold futures?
    For ordinary investors, you don’t want to be faffing about with physical gold, which you either have to hide beneath the floorboards or pay some semi-scam company to store for you. The sensible choices are either an ETF linked to the gold price or a reputable fund like Black Rock Gold & General. I have held the latter for years and add to my holding whenever the short to medium term outlook looks grim, and partly sell whenever optimism is in the wind. Over the piece it’s up there with my most successful investments.
    I thought Contrarian was referring to funds rather than physical gold. The BlackRock Gold and General Fund is too highly charged for my taste. I`d go with an ETF.
    A combination of ETF and a nice present for Mrs Contrarian, to answer your question.
    A wife-tax is not an investment. (At least not if it is your own wife.)
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 53,706

    If you're worried about

    eek said:

    The Republicans are fatally split between Trump supporters and the old guard. They cannot abide each other.

    Should be easily enough to allow the democrats to win Georgia handily.

    After that, well, all bets are off. America is wide open to the radical left. Green deals, mass immigration, huge tax hikes, identity politics with a vengeance, lockdowns, reparations,

    I suggest bitcoin. Touched 29,000 a little while ago. Still in the foothills. Still at the beginning.

    Bitcoin is the biggest Ponzi scheme of all time. I wouldn't put a penny into it.

    It is fundamentally worthless. The technology is interesting but this application of it is not.

    Edit: If you're worried about fiat currency then buy gold, not magic beans.
    Bitcoin has a purpose that gold doesn't have - which is that you can use it as a transfer of wealth across national borders with little risk.
    Well it might if the value of Bitcoin was stable and predictable.

    Considering its advocates rage against fiat currency, fiat currency is far more stable, secure and predicable in value. Bitcoin may serve a purpose in allowing drug dealers to move money, but I'm not convinced there's a stable future in it.

    The very soaring nature of it "$29,000 and just in the foothills" is precisely why it is nothing but one of the most technically elaborate Ponzi schemes ever.
    The volatility of cryptocurrencies has been their biggest weakness by far. A currency should be a store of value and you should be reasonably confident what that value is at any given point. If any of them can achieve that stability they might well give debauched fiat currencies a run for their money but not until then.
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 56,878
    DavidL said:

    My guess is that the Republicans win both. But then you already know that.

    If the Dems do win both, then Mitch McConnell needs to take some of the blame. His "obstruct at all costs" tactics would probably motivate me to go out and vote Dem.
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 49,774
    Stocky said:

    IanB2 said:

    Stocky said:

    The Republicans are fatally split between Trump supporters and the old guard. They cannot abide each other.

    Should be easily enough to allow the democrats to win Georgia handily.

    After that, well, all bets are off. America is wide open to the radical left. Green deals, mass immigration, huge tax hikes, identity politics with a vengeance, lockdowns, reparations,

    I suggest bitcoin. Touched 29,000 a little while ago. Still in the foothills. Still at the beginning.

    Bitcoin is the biggest Ponzi scheme of all time. I wouldn't put a penny into it.

    It is fundamentally worthless. The technology is interesting but this application of it is not.

    Edit: If you're worried about fiat currency then buy gold, not magic beans.
    I bought quite a lot of gold over Christmas actually.

    How did you actually do that? Buy a gold mining company`s shares? Or gold futures?
    For ordinary investors, you don’t want to be faffing about with physical gold, which you either have to hide beneath the floorboards or pay some semi-scam company to store for you. The sensible choices are either an ETF linked to the gold price or a reputable fund like Black Rock Gold & General. I have held the latter for years and add to my holding whenever the short to medium term outlook looks grim, and partly sell whenever optimism is in the wind. Over the piece it’s up there with my most successful investments.
    I thought Contrarian was referring to funds rather than physical gold. The BlackRock Gold and General Fund is too highly charged for my taste. I`d go with an ETF.
    I am happy with Black Rock because it is broadly based and sits atop the table of positive returns over my lengthy investing history. It’s handy to have a fund like that to retreat into when things look grim, and then sell out of when happiness is in the wind.
  • If you're worried about

    eek said:

    The Republicans are fatally split between Trump supporters and the old guard. They cannot abide each other.

    Should be easily enough to allow the democrats to win Georgia handily.

    After that, well, all bets are off. America is wide open to the radical left. Green deals, mass immigration, huge tax hikes, identity politics with a vengeance, lockdowns, reparations,

    I suggest bitcoin. Touched 29,000 a little while ago. Still in the foothills. Still at the beginning.

    Bitcoin is the biggest Ponzi scheme of all time. I wouldn't put a penny into it.

    It is fundamentally worthless. The technology is interesting but this application of it is not.

    Edit: If you're worried about fiat currency then buy gold, not magic beans.
    Bitcoin has a purpose that gold doesn't have - which is that you can use it as a transfer of wealth across national borders with little risk.
    Well it might if the value of Bitcoin was stable and predictable.

    Considering its advocates rage against fiat currency, fiat currency is far more stable, secure and predicable in value. Bitcoin may serve a purpose in allowing drug dealers to move money, but I'm not convinced there's a stable future in it.

    The very soaring nature of it "$29,000 and just in the foothills" is precisely why it is nothing but one of the most technically elaborate Ponzi schemes ever.
    My lad uses Bitcoin or, more usually, Ethereum, to buy and sell CSGO skins on the internet. Cryptocurrencies are the most convenient medium of exchange for him, but he tries not to hang on to them for too long due to their volatility.

    P.S. Would your believe that such "skins" - basically decorative patterns for virtual weapons - can sell for over £1,000?! Sometimes the world seems a crazy place!
    Is that more crazy than a handbag or a watch for £1,000 when perfectly good ones are available well under £100?
  • FloaterFloater Posts: 14,207
    Bloody hell - this had me in tears

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mard9WrYn2I

    Australian comfort woman Jan Ruff-O'Herne

  • FishingFishing Posts: 4,946
    By the time it was politically possible to do so (late March), it wouldn't have made much difference, as only 0.5% of cases were imported from overseas.
  • FloaterFloater Posts: 14,207
    algarkirk said:

    Guardian swiftly moves on/switches sides/joins Mail and Spectator 4 years late.
    You would have to have a heart of stone........

    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2020/dec/31/the-left-brexit-economic-uk

    That might be the first time I heard that Brexit is progressive.......
  • contrariancontrarian Posts: 5,818

    If you're worried about

    eek said:

    The Republicans are fatally split between Trump supporters and the old guard. They cannot abide each other.

    Should be easily enough to allow the democrats to win Georgia handily.

    After that, well, all bets are off. America is wide open to the radical left. Green deals, mass immigration, huge tax hikes, identity politics with a vengeance, lockdowns, reparations,

    I suggest bitcoin. Touched 29,000 a little while ago. Still in the foothills. Still at the beginning.

    Bitcoin is the biggest Ponzi scheme of all time. I wouldn't put a penny into it.

    It is fundamentally worthless. The technology is interesting but this application of it is not.

    Edit: If you're worried about fiat currency then buy gold, not magic beans.
    Bitcoin has a purpose that gold doesn't have - which is that you can use it as a transfer of wealth across national borders with little risk.
    Well it might if the value of Bitcoin was stable and predictable.

    Considering its advocates rage against fiat currency, fiat currency is far more stable, secure and predicable in value. Bitcoin may serve a purpose in allowing drug dealers to move money, but I'm not convinced there's a stable future in it.

    The very soaring nature of it "$29,000 and just in the foothills" is precisely why it is nothing but one of the most technically elaborate Ponzi schemes ever.
    When a big investment firm recently made a bitcoin investment, they did so, they said on the basis it was a hedge against the devaluation of the world's major currencies.

    And that's all it is really, a hedge, and the only way I would suggest anybody takes a look at it, as one among a wide range of investments.

    Now why would the world's major currencies devalue? well, they have been printing money like its going out of fashion and will continue to do so, and the rates offered for some investments in theses currencies are zero or in some cases negative.

    Nonsense is it a hedge. Not a sane one for an ordinary investor at least.

    Gold is a rational hedge, it is inversely linked to the value of what you are hedging against. . Bitcoin isn't linked to anything other that the confidence in Bitcoin. It is a Ponzi.
    I agree there should be no place for bitcoin or any other similar investment in rational economic world of sound money and positive interest rates. But we are not a rational world.

    We are in a world where western governments are running their economies like Corbynites. Whatever the reasons, that is the truth. And they intend to go on and on. You allow your investments to be destroyed by the corollary of what follows if you wish. Others might like to try to take at least small precautions.

  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 53,706
    algarkirk said:

    Guardian swiftly moves on/switches sides/joins Mail and Spectator 4 years late.
    You would have to have a heart of stone........

    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2020/dec/31/the-left-brexit-economic-uk

    God. Was I wrong after all? Surely if the Guardian thinks it might have been a good idea after all....
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 56,878
    Re Bitcoin, as the only man on here to have bought it at $3, and as I still hang on to well... half a bitcoin... it is worth remembering that it has one massive flaw:

    The way it is architected allows it to only process about 5 to 7 transactions a second.

    And another smaller one...
    It typically takes 15 to 30 minutes to get confirmation of a transaction having been completed, during which the sender could (in theory) walk back the transaction.

    Together, these don't matter, if everyone is just buying it and sitting on it, but it doesn't really allow for it to be used for regular purchases, or indeed to replace "fiat" money or payment networks like Western Union, PayPal or Visa.
  • DavidL said:

    algarkirk said:

    Guardian swiftly moves on/switches sides/joins Mail and Spectator 4 years late.
    You would have to have a heart of stone........

    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2020/dec/31/the-left-brexit-economic-uk

    God. Was I wrong after all? Surely if the Guardian thinks it might have been a good idea after all....
    Larry Elliot has always been a Lexiteer iirc.

  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 53,706
    rcs1000 said:

    DavidL said:

    My guess is that the Republicans win both. But then you already know that.

    If the Dems do win both, then Mitch McConnell needs to take some of the blame. His "obstruct at all costs" tactics would probably motivate me to go out and vote Dem.
    Trump surely would have the personal blame. His disgraceful and undemocratic behaviour since November 5th must have riled up his opponents like nothing else. Hopefully, if it happens, it kills the idea that he might be a candidate in 2024 (always seriously far fetched) stone dead.
  • kamskikamski Posts: 5,125
    MaxPB said:

    kamski said:

    IanB2 said:

    kamski said:

    Half a million fewer tests done in Germany last week compared to the week before, a fall of about a third.

    Given the holidays, so?
    So:
    1. I believe there was not such a big drop off in the uk
    2. There are a lot of extra people celebrating New Year unaware that they have coronavirus, or have been in contact with someone with coronavirus.
    From what we already know about isolation post testing this would happen either way. In all of Europe the testing system is little more than expensive monitoring of virus trends.
    Are you suggesting nobody in Europe isolates after testing positive?

    I know a handful of people who have tested positive, who have then taken isolation very seriously (AFAIK) and lots of people who isolated as a result of being told they had been exposed to someone who tested positive.

    So I know from my own experience that testing is more than "expensive monitoring of virus trends". What a strange thing to say.
  • If you're worried about

    eek said:

    The Republicans are fatally split between Trump supporters and the old guard. They cannot abide each other.

    Should be easily enough to allow the democrats to win Georgia handily.

    After that, well, all bets are off. America is wide open to the radical left. Green deals, mass immigration, huge tax hikes, identity politics with a vengeance, lockdowns, reparations,

    I suggest bitcoin. Touched 29,000 a little while ago. Still in the foothills. Still at the beginning.

    Bitcoin is the biggest Ponzi scheme of all time. I wouldn't put a penny into it.

    It is fundamentally worthless. The technology is interesting but this application of it is not.

    Edit: If you're worried about fiat currency then buy gold, not magic beans.
    Bitcoin has a purpose that gold doesn't have - which is that you can use it as a transfer of wealth across national borders with little risk.
    Well it might if the value of Bitcoin was stable and predictable.

    Considering its advocates rage against fiat currency, fiat currency is far more stable, secure and predicable in value. Bitcoin may serve a purpose in allowing drug dealers to move money, but I'm not convinced there's a stable future in it.

    The very soaring nature of it "$29,000 and just in the foothills" is precisely why it is nothing but one of the most technically elaborate Ponzi schemes ever.
    My lad uses Bitcoin or, more usually, Ethereum, to buy and sell CSGO skins on the internet. Cryptocurrencies are the most convenient medium of exchange for him, but he tries not to hang on to them for too long due to their volatility.

    P.S. Would your believe that such "skins" - basically decorative patterns for virtual weapons - can sell for over £1,000?! Sometimes the world seems a crazy place!
    Is that more crazy than a handbag or a watch for £1,000 when perfectly good ones are available well under £100?
    I suppose they are just two of the myriad ways of signalling to the world that you have money to burn.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 95,829
    IanB2 said:

    kle4 said:

    Scott_xP said:
    Ah, the ever present 'Other places are mean about us' rallying cry which people are way way too sensitive about.

    As others have pointed out previously the EU and national leaders are tough, hard nosed operators. They wont treat us more or less generously depending on their views of our leaders, only their policies.

    And no one should ever care if the general public elsewhere dont like the leaders of a different country. We can worry about our crap leaders without feeling embarrassed about it, everyone gets them eventually.
    But the big picture scenario - that a bunch of charlatan politicians have led a bunch of our elderly voters, who prefer the way the world worked when they were young to the way it actually works nowadays, up a garden path toward what will prove a futile, if not terminal, outcome for our country, is hard to deny.
    I think the terminal bit is pretty easy to deny, people are naturally attracted to fatalism and declinism and so assume irrevocability and fall into the same traps of nostalgia blindness and pre-determination as those they deride.

    Certain options have been closed for the short to medium term, and gloominess may well be warranted, especially with this government.

    But in uncharacteristic optimism, tomorrow is a brand new year and the future is rarely as bad as we imagine, in the modern era anyway.
  • felixfelix Posts: 15,147
    algarkirk said:

    Guardian swiftly moves on/switches sides/joins Mail and Spectator 4 years late.
    You would have to have a heart of stone........

    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2020/dec/31/the-left-brexit-economic-uk

    So funny to think of the Guardian seeing sense before so many of the lemons on here.
  • contrariancontrarian Posts: 5,818
    DavidL said:

    rcs1000 said:

    DavidL said:

    My guess is that the Republicans win both. But then you already know that.

    If the Dems do win both, then Mitch McConnell needs to take some of the blame. His "obstruct at all costs" tactics would probably motivate me to go out and vote Dem.
    Trump surely would have the personal blame. His disgraceful and undemocratic behaviour since November 5th must have riled up his opponents like nothing else. Hopefully, if it happens, it kills the idea that he might be a candidate in 2024 (always seriously far fetched) stone dead.
    Trump's problem is that he claims elections are rigged but still calls on voters to participate in them.

    Its a bit like urging someone to make a bet on something you believe is fixed.

  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 49,586

    FPT:

    Cyclefree said:

    Nigelb said:

    Cyclefree said:

    Apparently, there are only 3 pubs open in England today, all on the Scilly Isles.

    Pubs have been closed on a few hours notice thus losing any stock they had bought in for NY because the government could not be arsed to announce the change before the last day for making orders, something which would have been obvious to anyone with a calendar and the wit to ring somebody up in this business. So clearly well beyond the grasp of this government.

    They cannot claim on insurance and pubs in England get far less help than those in Wales and Scotland. Even the grants announced back in November have still to be paid out. The government seems to expect everyone working in this sector to live permanently on 80% of their previous wages. The grants which have been announced don't go remotely near covering fixed costs. Basically every closed pub and hotel and restaurant and other hospitality venue is now loss-making.

    Whether they will ever reopen again depends on whether (a) they have any savings to use and (b) they whether they think it worth using up their savings. The latter depends trusting the government to manage the vaccination programme effectively so that venues can reopen by Easter latest.

    Effectiveness is not the word one first associates with this government, however.
    I thought if you when I saw Cumbria was going from tier 2 to tier 4. Not good, and as you say, awful timing.

    FWIW, I think the vaccination program will be fine despite the government. As Nick pointed out earlier, the long established infrastructure of the NHS is very well organised to deliver vaccinations and would make it hard for any government to truly fuck up.
    Easter is tight, but I think it should happen.
    What worries me is the difference between promises of 4 million doses and Hancock admitting that they have only actually received half a million.

    NHS infrastructure may be fine but if the doses don't actually arrive on time and/or in the quantities needed, what use is the infrastructure.

    I hope to be proved wrong.
    Be careful mixing up numbers. The MHRA only just issued authorisation.

    Half a million are approved and ready to use next week.

    About 4 million have already been bottled up but they need authorisation.

    About 15 million doses have already been produced and need bottling up and authorising.
    That sounds more positive.

    Source?
    Based on my knowledge of pharma, why would the MHRA "authorise" each batch? Normally you would validate a process and once that process is validated and the product itself authorised, off you go.
    The MHRA don't authorise each batch but they do say the procedure through which the batches require accreditation. So now that the vaccine is authorised, the batches need accreditation.

    A long read on this was shared here last night, I think by FrancisUrquhart from memory.
    Isn't there also random sampling from each batch - as final verification?

    A friend used to work in the IT end of pharma - there was some interesting maths on the sampling methodology IIRC. The history of production sampling is surprisingly interesting......
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 95,829

    If you're worried about

    eek said:

    The Republicans are fatally split between Trump supporters and the old guard. They cannot abide each other.

    Should be easily enough to allow the democrats to win Georgia handily.

    After that, well, all bets are off. America is wide open to the radical left. Green deals, mass immigration, huge tax hikes, identity politics with a vengeance, lockdowns, reparations,

    I suggest bitcoin. Touched 29,000 a little while ago. Still in the foothills. Still at the beginning.

    Bitcoin is the biggest Ponzi scheme of all time. I wouldn't put a penny into it.

    It is fundamentally worthless. The technology is interesting but this application of it is not.

    Edit: If you're worried about fiat currency then buy gold, not magic beans.
    Bitcoin has a purpose that gold doesn't have - which is that you can use it as a transfer of wealth across national borders with little risk.
    Well it might if the value of Bitcoin was stable and predictable.

    Considering its advocates rage against fiat currency, fiat currency is far more stable, secure and predicable in value. Bitcoin may serve a purpose in allowing drug dealers to move money, but I'm not convinced there's a stable future in it.

    The very soaring nature of it "$29,000 and just in the foothills" is precisely why it is nothing but one of the most technically elaborate Ponzi schemes ever.
    My lad uses Bitcoin or, more usually, Ethereum, to buy and sell CSGO skins on the internet. Cryptocurrencies are the most convenient medium of exchange for him, but he tries not to hang on to them for too long due to their volatility.

    P.S. Would your believe that such "skins" - basically decorative patterns for virtual weapons - can sell for over £1,000?! Sometimes the world seems a crazy place!
    Is that more crazy than a handbag or a watch for £1,000 when perfectly good ones are available well under £100?
    Yes, because those still might cost something to make, and skins are the sort of customisable option many games provide as free.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 49,586
    rcs1000 said:

    Re Bitcoin, as the only man on here to have bought it at $3, and as I still hang on to well... half a bitcoin... it is worth remembering that it has one massive flaw:

    The way it is architected allows it to only process about 5 to 7 transactions a second.

    And another smaller one...
    It typically takes 15 to 30 minutes to get confirmation of a transaction having been completed, during which the sender could (in theory) walk back the transaction.

    Together, these don't matter, if everyone is just buying it and sitting on it, but it doesn't really allow for it to be used for regular purchases, or indeed to replace "fiat" money or payment networks like Western Union, PayPal or Visa.

    I get the occasional twinge - I was doing GOPU research back in the day. Had the most powerful GPU yet made on early release from NVIDIA. Fired up BitCoin mining for a laugh. Left it running - by accident - at work over the weekend. This was when mining on a single machine was spewing bitcoins....

    Deleted all the data on Monday and did some real work.
This discussion has been closed.