There is a significant difference, though, between reopening schools when you rates of infection are (as in the US) pretty high, and (as here) pretty low.
If you start with low infection rates and have good control measures in place, the outcomes will be very different. It's the good control measures I'm not entirely confident about.
How do you work that out, given Corona hardly effects children at all?
We know children get infected and can pass on the disease. Granted for younger children, the rate at which they pass it on appears to be lower, but over the age of 10, there doesn't seem to be any great difference ibetween the infectivity of children and adults.
It's also inaccurate to say that it hardly affects children at all - rather, we know that the child mortality rates are extremely low.
There is a significant difference, though, between reopening schools when you rates of infection are (as in the US) pretty high, and (as here) pretty low.
If you start with low infection rates and have good control measures in place, the outcomes will be very different. It's the good control measures I'm not entirely confident about.
How do you work that out, given Corona hardly effects children at all?
We know children get infected and can pass on the disease. Granted for younger children, the rate at which they pass it on appears to be lower, but over the age of 10, there doesn't seem to be any great difference ibetween the infectivity of children and adults.
It's also inaccurate to say that it hardly affects children at all - rather, we know that the child mortality rates are extremely low.
Human beings have passed diseases on to each other since time immemorial. That's how we survive. That is how we build up our immune systems. 40% of your genome is incorporated virus DNA.
Its on this pretext you are denying children an education? goodness
Sounds like Govey is going to be the strategist behind Bettertogether II by default, just by having a tenth of a clue as opposed to the zilch possessed by the rest of the cabinet. Expect more vetted walkabouts in Peterburgh and Fraserhead.
I am beginning to think that the SNP is currenty dictating Tory policy on "safeguarding" the Union.
Of course if we end up with a WTO terms Brexit and no trade deal with the EU and there is a Nationalist majority at Holyrood next year, Boris grants indyref2 and Yes wins then there will be customs posts at Berwick soon after and tariffs on Scottish exports to England and English exports to Scotland
That is only the case if we choose it to be. If England and Scotland came to an agreement on trade there would be no need for any infrastructure. The English government will decide, just as it will decide on whether there is a deal with the EU.
London will be as hard with Edinburgh as Brussels is with London, Scots should expect no favours from Westminster if it votes for independence and over 50% of Scottish exports go to England, under 50% of UK exports go to the EU
It is in England's interest to have an amicable modus vivendi with Scotland at all times, including after separation should it occur. Indeed no true Englishman would deny that a prosperous Scotland would be good for England. And vice-versa. So if and when separation is a fait accompli both governments should, and I am sure will maximise trade and exchange with zero tariffs and minimal hindrances.
On the assumption that you're not being heavily ironical, fair play. I hope that your approach is more common in Unionism than it appears currently to be.
I very much doubt it will be an easy divorce
RUK will want to protect their businesses and attract Scots business over the border and to London
It's naive to think it will be any easier than the UK EU divorce, it it happens of course
There is a significant difference, though, between reopening schools when you rates of infection are (as in the US) pretty high, and (as here) pretty low.
If you start with low infection rates and have good control measures in place, the outcomes will be very different. It's the good control measures I'm not entirely confident about.
How do you work that out, given Corona hardly effects children at all?
We know children get infected and can pass on the disease. Granted for younger children, the rate at which they pass it on appears to be lower, but over the age of 10, there doesn't seem to be any great difference ibetween the infectivity of children and adults.
It's also inaccurate to say that it hardly affects children at all - rather, we know that the child mortality rates are extremely low.
Human beings have passed diseases on to each other since time immemorial. That's how we survive. That is how we build up our immune systems. 40% of your genome is incorporated virus DNA.
Its on this pretext you are denying children an education? goodness
You clearly have comprehension issues. I said upthread that this ought to be doable (see my reply to Scott) - but it requires proper infection control measures. Just ignoring the problem, as you seem to prefer, is not sensible.
Funny how Brexit = Good and Scottish Indy = Bad when, in reality, they are much the same thing.
With our Bluekip Govt, I do not really blame the Scots for wanting Indy but in reality it is as daft as Brexit and for the same reasons.
Not quite the same.
Brexit plus having this bunch of useless tossers imposed on us v. almost certainly being readmitted to the EU plus being able to choose our own useless tossers then kick them out if necessary.
Your arguments for Indy are almost word-for-word the same as the arguments here a few years back justifying Brexit.
I sympathise with your desires, but I doubt Indy would be good for Scotland. Keep an eye on Norn Iron since it will be the test case from Jan 1st.
The EUSSR imposing its evil will on the honest yeomanry of Olde England was largely a chimera, this government of all the tossers otoh is all too real.
I believe that you've made individual arrangements to depart from Brexit UK, no doubt with associated inconvenience, disruption and expense? Think of this as similar, only on a larger scale.
@DavidL - That doesn't sound like much fun for anyone.
He's delighted to be back and see all his pals again but I think that the teachers are finding it pretty tough. They are doing large blocks of time with the same class so that movement through the school is limited. Yesterday my son had 3 hours of statistics, I mean, jeez.
What is clear is that getting kids back into secondary schools safely requires an immense amount of effort and planning affecting every aspect of school life including break times, timetables, meals, work distribution, etc etc. This is not something, if it is to be done right, that schools can start thinking about in September.
The schools I know have been thinking about it since March.
At my school the signs for one way systems have been put in place already and we have an extra training day at the beginning of term to go through which of several scenarios that the senior team have come up with will be the one we use.
I hope your school does not expect children to sit still for three hours at a time.
I did timetable quadruple maths for a group one year which is about that. They were sixth formers doing Maths and Further Maths though, and coped fairly well.
I remember having quadruple maths, for the same reason (Maths / Further Maths), but in different classrooms.
It wasn't so bad really, although we were probably a bit fidgety in 'normal' Maths.
That is just negativity and scaremongering. Anyone can look at Sweden/Denmark , Europe in general and see that is only an issue if you have petty idiots running Westminster....
I'm seeing the flaw in your argument, malcolm.
Enlighten me Nigel, all examples have no border issues that I am aware of
The DM comments section has been a sewer for years. I honestly that that many of them have something wrong with their heads. They certainly seem to have zero empathy...
Unfortunately, a disappointingly large number people are very susceptible to efforts made to dehumanise others, no matter whether it's Jews in 1930s Germany or migrants to 2020 UK.
There is a significant difference, though, between reopening schools when you rates of infection are (as in the US) pretty high, and (as here) pretty low.
If you start with low infection rates and have good control measures in place, the outcomes will be very different. It's the good control measures I'm not entirely confident about.
How do you work that out, given Corona hardly effects children at all?
We know children get infected and can pass on the disease. Granted for younger children, the rate at which they pass it on appears to be lower, but over the age of 10, there doesn't seem to be any great difference ibetween the infectivity of children and adults.
It's also inaccurate to say that it hardly affects children at all - rather, we know that the child mortality rates are extremely low.
Human beings have passed diseases on to each other since time immemorial. That's how we survive. That is how we build up our immune systems. 40% of your genome is incorporated virus DNA.
Its on this pretext you are denying children an education? goodness
You clearly have comprehension issues. I said upthread that this ought to be doable (see my reply to Scott) - but it requires proper infection control measures. Just ignoring the problem, as you seem to prefer, is not sensible.
What are those measures? Spain was and is measures-tastic. Its measures-licious. And yet cases are rising to the extent that we can;'t go there on holiday without two weeks of house arrest.
If you believe, as the good Dr Gupta of the oxford school teaches, that this pandemic rises and fall almost independent of 'measures' then you see the 'measures' for what they are. Or rather for what they aren't
The DM comments section has been a sewer for years. I honestly that that many of them have something wrong with their heads. They certainly seem to have zero empathy...
Funny how Brexit = Good and Scottish Indy = Bad when, in reality, they are much the same thing.
With our Bluekip Govt, I do not really blame the Scots for wanting Indy but in reality it is as daft as Brexit and for the same reasons.
Not quite the same.
Brexit plus having this bunch of useless tossers imposed on us v. almost certainly being readmitted to the EU plus being able to choose our own useless tossers then kick them out if necessary.
Your arguments for Indy are almost word-for-word the same as the arguments here a few years back justifying Brexit.
I sympathise with your desires, but I doubt Indy would be good for Scotland. Keep an eye on Norn Iron since it will be the test case from Jan 1st.
The EUSSR imposing its evil will on the honest yeomanry of Olde England was largely a chimera, this government of all the tossers otoh is all too real.
I believe that you've made individual arrangements to depart from Brexit UK, no doubt with associated inconvenience, disruption and expense? Think of this as similar, only on a larger scale.
Well, I was in Ayrshire at the weekend
You would have been basking in sunshine Bev.
I was. It is less sunny today over in Argyll & Bute.
I know of someone from Scotland who was living in England at the time of the 2014 referendum who voted as they were still on the electoral roll at their parents address.
They voted Yes by the way.
Neil is a tosser , he just wants to rig the vote, he can get his brillo pad back up here if he wants a vote
There is a significant difference, though, between reopening schools when you rates of infection are (as in the US) pretty high, and (as here) pretty low.
If you start with low infection rates and have good control measures in place, the outcomes will be very different. It's the good control measures I'm not entirely confident about.
How do you work that out, given Corona hardly effects children at all?
We know children get infected and can pass on the disease. Granted for younger children, the rate at which they pass it on appears to be lower, but over the age of 10, there doesn't seem to be any great difference ibetween the infectivity of children and adults.
It's also inaccurate to say that it hardly affects children at all - rather, we know that the child mortality rates are extremely low.
hard to believe the amount of fools going about spouting it doesn't affect this and it does affect that, total planks , if they give it to someone in their family they will know all about it.
Funny how Brexit = Good and Scottish Indy = Bad when, in reality, they are much the same thing.
With our Bluekip Govt, I do not really blame the Scots for wanting Indy but in reality it is as daft as Brexit and for the same reasons.
Not quite the same.
Brexit plus having this bunch of useless tossers imposed on us v. almost certainly being readmitted to the EU plus being able to choose our own useless tossers then kick them out if necessary.
Your arguments for Indy are almost word-for-word the same as the arguments here a few years back justifying Brexit.
I sympathise with your desires, but I doubt Indy would be good for Scotland. Keep an eye on Norn Iron since it will be the test case from Jan 1st.
The EUSSR imposing its evil will on the honest yeomanry of Olde England was largely a chimera, this government of all the tossers otoh is all too real.
I believe that you've made individual arrangements to depart from Brexit UK, no doubt with associated inconvenience, disruption and expense? Think of this as similar, only on a larger scale.
Well, I was in Ayrshire at the weekend
You would have been basking in sunshine Bev.
I was. It is less sunny today over in Argyll & Bute.
you should have stayed in Ayrshire , still shining here.
There is a significant difference, though, between reopening schools when you rates of infection are (as in the US) pretty high, and (as here) pretty low.
If you start with low infection rates and have good control measures in place, the outcomes will be very different. It's the good control measures I'm not entirely confident about.
How do you work that out, given Corona hardly effects children at all?
We know children get infected and can pass on the disease. Granted for younger children, the rate at which they pass it on appears to be lower, but over the age of 10, there doesn't seem to be any great difference ibetween the infectivity of children and adults.
It's also inaccurate to say that it hardly affects children at all - rather, we know that the child mortality rates are extremely low.
Human beings have passed diseases on to each other since time immemorial. That's how we survive. That is how we build up our immune systems. 40% of your genome is incorporated virus DNA.
Its on this pretext you are denying children an education? goodness
You clearly have comprehension issues. I said upthread that this ought to be doable (see my reply to Scott) - but it requires proper infection control measures. Just ignoring the problem, as you seem to prefer, is not sensible.
What are those measures? Spain was and is measures-tastic. Its measures-licious. And yet cases are rising to the extent that we can;'t go there on holiday without two weeks of house arrest.
If you believe, as the good Dr Gupta of the oxford school teaches, that this pandemic rises and fall almost independent of 'measures' then you see the 'measures' for what they are. Or rather for what they aren't
Isn't it rising because of the huge numbers of people that went there on holiday? If everyone had stayed locked up I am pretty sure that would not have happened!
Is the summary of the Scottish border debate that the people saying its a Bad Idea as the WTO would impose a physical border are the same people who say Brexit is a Good Idea as the WTO won't impose a physical border?
Sounds like Govey is going to be the strategist behind Bettertogether II by default, just by having a tenth of a clue as opposed to the zilch possessed by the rest of the cabinet. Expect more vetted walkabouts in Peterburgh and Fraserhead.
I am beginning to think that the SNP is currenty dictating Tory policy on "safeguarding" the Union.
Of course if we end up with a WTO terms Brexit and no trade deal with the EU and there is a Nationalist majority at Holyrood next year, Boris grants indyref2 and Yes wins then there will be customs posts at Berwick soon after and tariffs on Scottish exports to England and English exports to Scotland
That is only the case if we choose it to be. If England and Scotland came to an agreement on trade there would be no need for any infrastructure. The English government will decide, just as it will decide on whether there is a deal with the EU.
London will be as hard with Edinburgh as Brussels is with London, Scots should expect no favours from Westminster if it votes for independence and over 50% of Scottish exports go to England, under 50% of UK exports go to the EU
It is in England's interest to have an amicable modus vivendi with Scotland at all times, including after separation should it occur. Indeed no true Englishman would deny that a prosperous Scotland would be good for England. And vice-versa. So if and when separation is a fait accompli both governments should, and I am sure will maximise trade and exchange with zero tariffs and minimal hindrances.
"... no true Englishman... "
"No true Scotsman, or appeal to purity, is an informal fallacy ... i.e., those who perform that action are not part of our group and thus criticism of that action is not criticism of the group"
That is just negativity and scaremongering. Anyone can look at Sweden/Denmark , Europe in general and see that is only an issue if you have petty idiots running Westminster....
I'm seeing the flaw in your argument, malcolm.
Enlighten me Nigel, all examples have no border issues that I am aware of
...an issue if you have petty idiots running Westminster.... I think sums it up.
Funny how Brexit = Good and Scottish Indy = Bad when, in reality, they are much the same thing.
With our Bluekip Govt, I do not really blame the Scots for wanting Indy but in reality it is as daft as Brexit and for the same reasons.
Not quite the same.
Brexit plus having this bunch of useless tossers imposed on us v. almost certainly being readmitted to the EU plus being able to choose our own useless tossers then kick them out if necessary.
Your arguments for Indy are almost word-for-word the same as the arguments here a few years back justifying Brexit.
I sympathise with your desires, but I doubt Indy would be good for Scotland. Keep an eye on Norn Iron since it will be the test case from Jan 1st.
The EUSSR imposing its evil will on the honest yeomanry of Olde England was largely a chimera, this government of all the tossers otoh is all too real.
I believe that you've made individual arrangements to depart from Brexit UK, no doubt with associated inconvenience, disruption and expense? Think of this as similar, only on a larger scale.
Well, I was in Ayrshire at the weekend
You would have been basking in sunshine Bev.
I was. It is less sunny today over in Argyll & Bute.
There is a significant difference, though, between reopening schools when you rates of infection are (as in the US) pretty high, and (as here) pretty low.
If you start with low infection rates and have good control measures in place, the outcomes will be very different. It's the good control measures I'm not entirely confident about.
How do you work that out, given Corona hardly effects children at all?
We know children get infected and can pass on the disease. Granted for younger children, the rate at which they pass it on appears to be lower, but over the age of 10, there doesn't seem to be any great difference ibetween the infectivity of children and adults.
It's also inaccurate to say that it hardly affects children at all - rather, we know that the child mortality rates are extremely low.
Human beings have passed diseases on to each other since time immemorial. That's how we survive. That is how we build up our immune systems. 40% of your genome is incorporated virus DNA.
Its on this pretext you are denying children an education? goodness
You clearly have comprehension issues. I said upthread that this ought to be doable (see my reply to Scott) - but it requires proper infection control measures. Just ignoring the problem, as you seem to prefer, is not sensible.
What are those measures? Spain was and is measures-tastic. Its measures-licious. And yet cases are rising to the extent that we can;'t go there on holiday without two weeks of house arrest.
If you believe, as the good Dr Gupta of the oxford school teaches, that this pandemic rises and fall almost independent of 'measures' then you see the 'measures' for what they are. Or rather for what they aren't
Can you show me the figures for imported Covid cases into the UK from other countries?
Sounds like Govey is going to be the strategist behind Bettertogether II by default, just by having a tenth of a clue as opposed to the zilch possessed by the rest of the cabinet. Expect more vetted walkabouts in Peterburgh and Fraserhead.
I am beginning to think that the SNP is currenty dictating Tory policy on "safeguarding" the Union.
Of course if we end up with a WTO terms Brexit and no trade deal with the EU and there is a Nationalist majority at Holyrood next year, Boris grants indyref2 and Yes wins then there will be customs posts at Berwick soon after and tariffs on Scottish exports to England and English exports to Scotland
That is only the case if we choose it to be. If England and Scotland came to an agreement on trade there would be no need for any infrastructure. The English government will decide, just as it will decide on whether there is a deal with the EU.
London will be as hard with Edinburgh as Brussels is with London, Scots should expect no favours from Westminster if it votes for independence and over 50% of Scottish exports go to England, under 50% of UK exports go to the EU
It is in England's interest to have an amicable modus vivendi with Scotland at all times, including after separation should it occur. Indeed no true Englishman would deny that a prosperous Scotland would be good for England. And vice-versa. So if and when separation is a fait accompli both governments should, and I am sure will maximise trade and exchange with zero tariffs and minimal hindrances.
"... no true Englishman... "
"No true Scotsman, or appeal to purity, is an informal fallacy ... i.e., those who perform that action are not part of our group and thus criticism of that action is not criticism of the group"
The DM comments section has been a sewer for years. I honestly that that many of them have something wrong with their heads. They certainly seem to have zero empathy...
Unfortunately, a disappointingly large number people are very susceptible to efforts made to dehumanise others, no matter whether it's Jews in 1930s Germany or migrants to 2020 UK.
"Unfortunately, a disappointingly large number of people are very susceptible to efforts made to dehumanise others, no matter whether it's Jews in 1930s Germany or migrants to 2020 UK."
There is a significant difference, though, between reopening schools when you rates of infection are (as in the US) pretty high, and (as here) pretty low.
If you start with low infection rates and have good control measures in place, the outcomes will be very different. It's the good control measures I'm not entirely confident about.
How do you work that out, given Corona hardly effects children at all?
We know children get infected and can pass on the disease. Granted for younger children, the rate at which they pass it on appears to be lower, but over the age of 10, there doesn't seem to be any great difference ibetween the infectivity of children and adults.
It's also inaccurate to say that it hardly affects children at all - rather, we know that the child mortality rates are extremely low.
hard to believe the amount of fools going about spouting it doesn't affect this and it does affect that, total planks , if they give it to someone in their family they will know all about it.
IF you are under 40 you have more chance of dying of a bee sting than covid. Far more are dying of from flu and pneumonia than COVID as we speak. Missed cancer diagnoses multiply by the day
But these are just facts. Cling to fear, if you wish.
Probably a controversial opinion but . . . Given that our neighbouring nations that had an original COVID surge all now seem to be having a second wave while we aren't (yet) then it seems like Track & Trace are doing a good job.
Sounds like Govey is going to be the strategist behind Bettertogether II by default, just by having a tenth of a clue as opposed to the zilch possessed by the rest of the cabinet. Expect more vetted walkabouts in Peterburgh and Fraserhead.
I am beginning to think that the SNP is currenty dictating Tory policy on "safeguarding" the Union.
Of course if we end up with a WTO terms Brexit and no trade deal with the EU and there is a Nationalist majority at Holyrood next year, Boris grants indyref2 and Yes wins then there will be customs posts at Berwick soon after and tariffs on Scottish exports to England and English exports to Scotland
That is only the case if we choose it to be. If England and Scotland came to an agreement on trade there would be no need for any infrastructure. The English government will decide, just as it will decide on whether there is a deal with the EU.
London will be as hard with Edinburgh as Brussels is with London, Scots should expect no favours from Westminster if it votes for independence and over 50% of Scottish exports go to England, under 50% of UK exports go to the EU
It is in England's interest to have an amicable modus vivendi with Scotland at all times, including after separation should it occur. Indeed no true Englishman would deny that a prosperous Scotland would be good for England. And vice-versa. So if and when separation is a fait accompli both governments should, and I am sure will maximise trade and exchange with zero tariffs and minimal hindrances.
"... no true Englishman... "
"No true Scotsman, or appeal to purity, is an informal fallacy ... i.e., those who perform that action are not part of our group and thus criticism of that action is not criticism of the group"
Comments
Granted for younger children, the rate at which they pass it on appears to be lower, but over the age of 10, there doesn't seem to be any great difference ibetween the infectivity of children and adults.
It's also inaccurate to say that it hardly affects children at all - rather, we know that the child mortality rates are extremely low.
Its on this pretext you are denying children an education? goodness
I said upthread that this ought to be doable (see my reply to Scott) - but it requires proper infection control measures.
Just ignoring the problem, as you seem to prefer, is not sensible.
https://twitter.com/SiobhanBenita/status/1296053419841662976?s=20
It wasn't so bad really, although we were probably a bit fidgety in 'normal' Maths.
If you believe, as the good Dr Gupta of the oxford school teaches, that this pandemic rises and fall almost independent of 'measures' then you see the 'measures' for what they are. Or rather for what they aren't
Headline - 15
7 Days - 14
Yesterday - 0
"No true Scotsman, or appeal to purity, is an informal fallacy ... i.e., those who perform that action are not part of our group and thus criticism of that action is not criticism of the group"
- https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/No_true_Scotsman
I think sums it up.
BTW, new thread.
largenumber of people are very susceptible to efforts made to dehumanise others, no matter whether it's Jews in 1930s Germany or migrants to 2020 UK."fixed that for you. No charge...
But these are just facts. Cling to fear, if you wish.
NEW THREAD
Anyone agree?