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politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » Sunak (tipped on PB when he was 200/1) now betting favourite t

SystemSystem Posts: 12,170
edited March 2020 in General

imagepoliticalbetting.com » Blog Archive » Sunak (tipped on PB when he was 200/1) now betting favourite to succeed Johnson as PM

 One person who is having a good coronavirus crisis is the Chancellor, Rishi Sunak who is now 5/2 favourite to become the next Prime Minister with SportingIndex leapfrogging LAB leader hopeful Kier Starmer in the betting.

Read the full story here


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Comments

  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 27,932
    edited March 2020
    When does Boris go and what brings down Boris that does not also bring down Rishi Sunak?
  • RobDRobD Posts: 59,935

    When does Boris go and what brings down Boris that does not also bring down Sunak?

    It's not beyond the realm of possibility. There is recent precedent for a chancellor to succeed a PM.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 123,139

    When does Boris go and what brings down Boris that does not also bring down Sunak?

    Major took over as PM from Chancellor when Thatcher went, as Brown did from Blair
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 27,932
    Something else: Boris and Dom hate Chancellors and ex-Chancellors so may look to force another one out when the immediate crisis is over, following the Saj, Hammond and Clarke.
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 51,708

    When does Boris go and what brings down Boris that does not also bring down Rishi Sunak?

    A split on extending the Brexit transition?
  • felixfelix Posts: 15,164
    To be sure he would give any Laboue leader of the current options a serious run for their money. He makes starmer look very old and grey in that photo by comparison!
  • FensterFenster Posts: 2,115
    @eadric

    FPT - what you said about emails. SNAP.

    I live on an incessant hamster wheel, where my emails are non-stop. They've dried up and like you, I'm less concerned by my phone.

    I am looking forward to the mental break. If I survive the virus this break will add years to my life!
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,424
    edited March 2020
    HYUFD said:

    When does Boris go and what brings down Boris that does not also bring down Sunak?

    Major took over as PM from Chancellor when Thatcher went, as Brown did from Blair
    Those were, however, the only two incidences in the last 60 years. The previous one was Macmillan in 1957. Since the Second World War it goes:

    1945 Leader of the Opposition (previously Deputy Prime Minister and LEader of the House)
    1951 Leader of the Opposition
    1955 Foreign Secretary
    1957 Chancellor
    1963 Foreign Secretary
    1964 Leader of the Opposition
    1970 Leader of the Opposition
    1974 Leader of the Opposition
    1976 Foreign Secretary
    1979 Leader of the Opposition
    1990 Chancellor
    1997 Leader of the Opposition
    2007 Chancellor
    2010 Leader of the Opposition
    2016 Home Secretary
    2019 Backbencher.

    Of course, that does say something about how stable governments have been once taking office in the last 60 years.
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 27,932
    HYUFD said:

    When does Boris go and what brings down Boris that does not also bring down Sunak?

    Major took over as PM from Chancellor when Thatcher went, as Brown did from Blair
    After ten years in each case. You'd have long since done your money on John Moore or Cecil Parkinson or any other favourite sons. So if Boris is to resign soon, what brings him down that leaves Rishi in place?
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 82,119
    Afternoon fellow Big Brother Contestants....
  • RobDRobD Posts: 59,935

    HYUFD said:

    When does Boris go and what brings down Boris that does not also bring down Sunak?

    Major took over as PM from Chancellor when Thatcher went, as Brown did from Blair
    After ten years in each case. You'd have long since done your money on John Moore or Cecil Parkinson or any other favourite sons. So if Boris is to resign soon, what brings him down that leaves Rishi in place?
    Who says he is resigning soon? ;)
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 82,119
    So we are going for an upgrade of PM from millionaires to billionaires?
  • BluestBlueBluestBlue Posts: 4,556
    Remember how as recently as a week or two ago Labour thought that painting Sunak as Boris' puppet would be a winning strategy for them?
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 82,119
    edited March 2020
    Excel Centre becoming a field hospital is a good idea, but at the same time won't be the last and an insight into just how massive this will be.

    Also, that been said, I would be well pissed off if I lived in London and with all those fancy hotels being made available and instead all I got was a bed in a giant dormitory in a conference centre :-)
  • Afternoon fellow Big Brother Contestants....

    Deay One in tho Big Brutha Hoos...
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 61,806
    It was 251 with boost, at Ladbrokes.

    I did put a tiny sum on, but my concern is that he has to take over as Conservative leader whilst they're still in government.
  • DAlexanderDAlexander Posts: 815
    Maybe if he manages to get in before the bill for all this splurging has to be paid.

    It could be just like Gordon Brown in that case.
  • Fysics_TeacherFysics_Teacher Posts: 6,285
    ydoethur said:

    HYUFD said:

    When does Boris go and what brings down Boris that does not also bring down Sunak?

    Major took over as PM from Chancellor when Thatcher went, as Brown did from Blair
    Those were, however, the only two incidences in the last 60 years. The previous one was Macmillan in 1957. Since the Second World War it goes:

    1945 Leader of the Opposition (previously Deputy Prime Minister and LEader of the House)
    1951 Leader of the Opposition
    1955 Foreign Secretary
    1957 Chancellor
    1963 Foreign Secretary
    1964 Leader of the Opposition
    1970 Leader of the Opposition
    1974 Leader of the Opposition
    1976 Foreign Secretary
    1979 Leader of the Opposition
    1990 Chancellor
    1997 Leader of the Opposition
    2007 Chancellor
    2010 Leader of the Opposition
    2016 Home Secretary
    2019 Backbencher.

    Of course, that does say something about how stable governments have been once taking office in the last 60 years.
    I’m fairly sure the 2019 should have been down as Leader of the Opposition as well...
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 27,932

    When does Boris go and what brings down Boris that does not also bring down Rishi Sunak?

    A split on extending the Brexit transition?
    A Brexit split is more likely to topple the Chancellor than the Prime Minister, especially one like Boris who does not seem to believe in any particular outcome.

    There are other possibilities like Arcurigate or even exhaustion or Boris's bank balance, since the choices exercised to repair Churchill's finances would now be considered scandalous if not illegal. But I shan't be betting on it soon.
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 51,708
    felix said:
    This is a ridiculous narrative. All EU member states are facing the same situation together at the same time. Italy was just slightly ahead of the curve.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 82,119
    edited March 2020

    Afternoon fellow Big Brother Contestants....

    Deay One in tho Big Brutha Hoos...
    I was one of the pre-show contestants, Deay 16 for me.
  • RobDRobD Posts: 59,935

    felix said:
    This is a ridiculous narrative. All EU member states are facing the same situation together at the same time. Italy was just slightly ahead of the curve.
    So a same situation at a different time?
  • BluestBlueBluestBlue Posts: 4,556
    ydoethur said:

    HYUFD said:

    When does Boris go and what brings down Boris that does not also bring down Sunak?

    Major took over as PM from Chancellor when Thatcher went, as Brown did from Blair
    Those were, however, the only two incidences in the last 60 years. The previous one was Macmillan in 1957. Since the Second World War it goes:

    1945 Leader of the Opposition (previously Deputy Prime Minister and LEader of the House)
    1951 Leader of the Opposition
    1955 Foreign Secretary
    1957 Chancellor
    1963 Foreign Secretary
    1964 Leader of the Opposition
    1970 Leader of the Opposition
    1974 Leader of the Opposition
    1976 Foreign Secretary
    1979 Leader of the Opposition
    1990 Chancellor
    1997 Leader of the Opposition
    2007 Chancellor
    2010 Leader of the Opposition
    2016 Home Secretary
    2019 Backbencher.

    Of course, that does say something about how stable governments have been once taking office in the last 60 years.
    May 2016 is the glaring exception that proves the rule in that list. Boris ascending from the backbenches is tecnhically right, but as a recent Foreign Secretary he fits the historical pattern quite well.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 82,119
    edited March 2020
    They have already done 10k+ on I think 2 or 3 occasions. Also not new, this is the number from yesterday. God journalists are having a shit war.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 48,720

    When does Boris go and what brings down Boris that does not also bring down Rishi Sunak?

    Surely the obvious answer is SARDS from Coronavirus?

    PB stats freaks may be interested in this little map by the HSJ, click on the link to see the map.

    https://twitter.com/foxinsoxuk/status/1242416467783622656?s=19

    Numbers of confirmed inpatients are going up quickly here, from 3 on Friday, to 18 yesterday and 26 today. We are still on a steep bit of the curve.
  • JonathanJonathan Posts: 21,675

    When does Boris go and what brings down Boris that does not also bring down Rishi Sunak?

    Sex scandal?
  • GallowgateGallowgate Posts: 19,468
    @Foxy have you had delivery of extra PPE yet?
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 82,119
    edited March 2020
    Jonathan said:

    When does Boris go and what brings down Boris that does not also bring down Rishi Sunak?

    Sex scandal?
    Boris and sex scandal...that is expected as much as it is for one to become a major political figure in France. What do you mean you have never had an affair, what is wrong with you, clearly not qualified to run France.
  • BluestBlueBluestBlue Posts: 4,556
    Jonathan said:

    When does Boris go and what brings down Boris that does not also bring down Rishi Sunak?

    Sex scandal?
    He could use the classic Corbyn defence: 'I was present, but did not participate' :smile:
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 82,119
    edited March 2020
    People face fines starting at £30 for breaking rule about holding gatherings in public

    The fines will initially be set at £30, but the level could increase “significantly” if there is widespread evidence of people refusing to comply with the rules, the spokesman said.

    £30....it needs to be at least x10 that at least. Some guy in Taiwan has just been given $30k fine
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 48,720

    @Foxy have you had delivery of extra PPE yet?

    Matron assures me that if I want to join her in the stock room, she will show me everything that I desire...
  • FossFoss Posts: 1,019

    When does Boris go and what brings down Boris that does not also bring down Rishi Sunak?

    The current situation breaks him as a person and he shuffles off in a year's time?
  • tlg86tlg86 Posts: 26,176
    The Netherlands has reported 63 deaths since the last update:

    https://www.rivm.nl/nieuws/actuele-informatie-over-coronavirus
  • rpjsrpjs Posts: 3,787
    FPT:
    ydoethur said:

    HYUFD said:
    In all seriousness, the issue is if lockdown goes on too long it could cause more deaths than the actual virus. At what point is it not worth pursuing and we just have to do the best we can to minimise infection?
    The problem would still remain that the number of people needing hospitalization or even ICU would suddenly spike, meaning both coronavirus patients and others with severe health needs that might have survived with treatment will die.

    It seems to me that what we need is at least one of a vaccine, some effective treatment or treatments, or a test that shows who has had it with mild or no symptoms and is no longer infectious.

    A vaccine obviously should end the crisis, but is a long way off. Effective treatment(s) should reduce the impact on health services enough that some relaxation may become possible, and hopefully we may have some soon.

    A test of those who've had it should mean those that have had it can, for some values of normal, return to normal activity subject to precautions to not passively spread the virus through contact. (I'm not a virologist or epidemiologist obviously, but it seems logical to me that passive spread through post-infected people carrying it on their skin say due to not washing hands is going to be orders of magnitude less risky than a- or pre-symptomatic people spreading it, happy to be corrected by one of our medical members). It seems such tests may be available soon, but who knows how scalable they'll be.
  • felixfelix Posts: 15,164

    felix said:
    This is a ridiculous narrative. All EU member states are facing the same situation together at the same time. Italy was just slightly ahead of the curve.
    No - the fact that healthcare has never been one of the competencies is a major weakness. No strategy from the top. Selfishness rules.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 48,720
    Foss said:

    When does Boris go and what brings down Boris that does not also bring down Rishi Sunak?

    The current situation breaks him as a person and he shuffles off in a year's time?
    With the grim reaper stalking the land, it need not be resignation.
  • tlg86tlg86 Posts: 26,176
    eadric said:

    Foxy said:

    When does Boris go and what brings down Boris that does not also bring down Rishi Sunak?

    Surely the obvious answer is SARDS from Coronavirus?

    PB stats freaks may be interested in this little map by the HSJ, click on the link to see the map.

    https://twitter.com/foxinsoxuk/status/1242416467783622656?s=19

    Numbers of confirmed inpatients are going up quickly here, from 3 on Friday, to 18 yesterday and 26 today. We are still on a steep bit of the curve.
    Talking of stats, here's some bizarre data.

    We all know Germany is doing well in terms of coronavirus fatalities. But what about critical care?

    The general consensus is that between 5% and 15% of cases become critical, and require significant treatment in hospital.

    This is confirmed in most European countries:

    Italy has 50,400 active cases, 3,200 critical cases

    Spain has 33,200 active cases, 2,400 critical cases

    France has 16,800 active cases, 2,000 critical cases

    but

    Germany has 30,500 cases, and...… 23 critical cases.

    The predictions are about by orders of magnitude. Germany should have 2-4,000 critical cases, it has 23

    What is going on?

    https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/



    They're also reporting 20 for us (it's been that for a long time), so I don't think those numbers are being updated (our's certainly aren't).
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 82,119
    edited March 2020
    Bloody hell, PE with Joe Wicks is clearly very popular. First day he got over 3.7 million people watch it and already 1.8m today. Obviously good for his brand, but still, good idea, good lad.
  • felixfelix Posts: 15,164

    Jonathan said:

    When does Boris go and what brings down Boris that does not also bring down Rishi Sunak?

    Sex scandal?
    He could use the classic Corbyn defence: 'I was present, but did not participate' :smile:
    Yup Diane is still pissed about that one!
  • Beibheirli_CBeibheirli_C Posts: 8,163

    twitter.com/paulwaugh/status/1242447991367221248?s=20

    They have already done 10k+ on I think 2 or 3 occasions. Also not new, this is the number from yesterday. God journalists are having a shit war.
    Religious correspondents?????
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 48,720
    edited March 2020
    Incidentally, could I commend this surveillance app? It is from Kings in London, trying to understand how much COVID19 related symptoms is out there.

    https://twitter.com/foxinsoxuk/status/1242446527005679617?s=19
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 51,708
    felix said:

    felix said:
    This is a ridiculous narrative. All EU member states are facing the same situation together at the same time. Italy was just slightly ahead of the curve.
    No - the fact that healthcare has never been one of the competencies is a major weakness. No strategy from the top. Selfishness rules.
    Dealing with a pandemic is much more than a healthcare issue.
  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 60,216
    Foxy said:

    @Foxy have you had delivery of extra PPE yet?

    Matron assures me that if I want to join her in the stock room, she will show me everything that I desire...
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eNNhuvox43I
  • felixfelix Posts: 15,164

    felix said:

    felix said:
    This is a ridiculous narrative. All EU member states are facing the same situation together at the same time. Italy was just slightly ahead of the curve.
    No - the fact that healthcare has never been one of the competencies is a major weakness. No strategy from the top. Selfishness rules.
    Dealing with a pandemic is much more than a healthcare issue.
    Exactly - and still no strategy from the top.
  • bigjohnowlsbigjohnowls Posts: 22,676

    They have already done 10k+ on I think 2 or 3 occasions. Also not new, this is the number from yesterday. God journalists are having a shit war.
    At 10k a day it will take nearly 3 months to test NHS patient facing staff once without testing a single patient or doing repeat tests

    At 25k a day reduce that to 36 days. We really need the 250k a day Boris mentioned ages ago.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 82,119
    edited March 2020

    They have already done 10k+ on I think 2 or 3 occasions. Also not new, this is the number from yesterday. God journalists are having a shit war.
    At 10k a day it will take nearly 3 months to test NHS patient facing staff once without testing a single patient or doing repeat tests

    At 25k a day reduce that to 36 days. We really need the 250k a day Boris mentioned ages ago.
    South Korea, "the gold standard", did 15k a day at peak. Germany do about 10-15k a day. Also South Korea don't do 15k a day "gold standard" tests, they did lots of faster less accurate road side ones, that were used to funnel people into the gold standard testing procedure.

    Where did he say 250k a day? I have never heard him say that ever and was it a slip of the tongue. And the egg-heads definitely haven't, they have always talked about wanting to get to 25k a day.

    Until there is an instant test, there is a limit to what you can do. And most of the fast tests that have been demo'ed so far aren't anywhere near accurate enough.
  • nichomarnichomar Posts: 7,483

    Excel Centre becoming a field hospital is a good idea, but at the same time won't be the last and an insight into just how massive this will be.

    Also, that been said, I would be well pissed off if I lived in London and with all those fancy hotels being made available and instead all I got was a bed in a giant dormitory in a conference centre :-)

    Madrid did something similar about a week ago in one of the exhibition halls on the ‘reciento Ferial’ with 500 beds they are now on the third hall on the same site. It does show that someone is forward planning which is a good sign.
  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 60,216
    email from TFL

    If you are a key worker and your journey is absolutely essential, please travel later in the day if you can and avoid the early morning.

    If you do travel, follow the expert advice on hand washing and other health measures. We are operating reduced services so that we can keep things running for critical workers.

    Stay safe, stay at home.

    Yours sincerely,

    Vernon Everitt
    Managing Director, Customers, Communication & Technology
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 51,708
    felix said:

    felix said:

    felix said:
    This is a ridiculous narrative. All EU member states are facing the same situation together at the same time. Italy was just slightly ahead of the curve.
    No - the fact that healthcare has never been one of the competencies is a major weakness. No strategy from the top. Selfishness rules.
    Dealing with a pandemic is much more than a healthcare issue.
    Exactly - and still no strategy from the top.
    The EU institutions don't sit above the member states, and as we can see from the US response, even with a true central government, 'strategy' from the top is not necessarily helpful.
  • AlistairAlistair Posts: 23,670
    HYUFD said:

    Alistair said:

    HYUFD said:

    One thing for sure is that the NHS is in no danger of privatisation. In the aftermath of this, it will be elevated to pseudo-religious status, even more than it was before.

    Or we could move to the German public health insurance system
    So you at suggesting we massively increase funding for the NHS?
    We follow the German model of public insurance funded healthcare paid into by employer and employee
    And also the massive increase in funding compared to the UK?
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 82,119
    edited March 2020
    eadric said:

    felix said:

    felix said:
    This is a ridiculous narrative. All EU member states are facing the same situation together at the same time. Italy was just slightly ahead of the curve.
    No - the fact that healthcare has never been one of the competencies is a major weakness. No strategy from the top. Selfishness rules.
    Dealing with a pandemic is much more than a healthcare issue.
    But the pandemic has underlined the essential weakness of the EU: it is neither fish nor fowl. It is not unified enough - a proper Federal state - to take advantage of its economies of scale, as happened in China.

    And this is what the EU top bods said to the BBC in that documentary after Brexit. We aren't integrated enough, we need much closer union. And it is why a vote for Remain, wasn't a vote for the status quo.

    Realistically, it is nearly impossible to react swiftly when you have 27 different nations of different size with massively different economies and political outlooks.
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 51,708
    eadric said:

    As and when this virus rages to a halt, the EU will have to confront this issue, finally, and the polity that emerges will be different to now. It could break up on the edges.

    How the EU handles Hungary after this is over will be an interesting test case.

    https://twitter.com/CommissionerHR/status/1242036471508414464
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 51,708

    eadric said:

    felix said:

    felix said:
    This is a ridiculous narrative. All EU member states are facing the same situation together at the same time. Italy was just slightly ahead of the curve.
    No - the fact that healthcare has never been one of the competencies is a major weakness. No strategy from the top. Selfishness rules.
    Dealing with a pandemic is much more than a healthcare issue.
    But the pandemic has underlined the essential weakness of the EU: it is neither fish nor fowl. It is not unified enough - a proper Federal state - to take advantage of its economies of scale, as happened in China.

    And this is what the EU top bods said to the BBC in that documentary after Brexit. We aren't integrated enough, we need much closer union. And it is why a vote for Remain, wasn't a vote for the status quo.
    History never stands still, so to that extent, there's never any such thing as a vote for the status quo, but Remain was the closest thing to it: a semi-detached relationship within the single market and with a say in the EU institutions. Remain was also about preserving the status quo of the UK union.
  • AlastairMeeksAlastairMeeks Posts: 30,340

    eadric said:

    felix said:

    felix said:
    This is a ridiculous narrative. All EU member states are facing the same situation together at the same time. Italy was just slightly ahead of the curve.
    No - the fact that healthcare has never been one of the competencies is a major weakness. No strategy from the top. Selfishness rules.
    Dealing with a pandemic is much more than a healthcare issue.
    But the pandemic has underlined the essential weakness of the EU: it is neither fish nor fowl. It is not unified enough - a proper Federal state - to take advantage of its economies of scale, as happened in China.

    And this is what the EU top bods said to the BBC in that documentary after Brexit. We aren't integrated enough, we need much closer union. And it is why a vote for Remain, wasn't a vote for the status quo.

    Realistically, it is nearly impossible to react swiftly when you have 27 different nations of different size with massively different economies and political outlooks.
    Good grief, listen to the pair of you. It's like two orcs caught up in a lava flow from Mount Doom speculating on what is going to come of Gondor now that Denethor has popped his clogs.
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 33,464
    Alistair said:

    HYUFD said:

    Alistair said:

    HYUFD said:

    One thing for sure is that the NHS is in no danger of privatisation. In the aftermath of this, it will be elevated to pseudo-religious status, even more than it was before.

    Or we could move to the German public health insurance system
    So you at suggesting we massively increase funding for the NHS?
    We follow the German model of public insurance funded healthcare paid into by employer and employee
    And also the massive increase in funding compared to the UK?
    It was Bismarck's system, wasn't it? Or at least introduced when he was Chancellor.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 48,720
    On topic. It is easy to be popular when spending money like a drunken sailor, any fool can manage that. How popular will Sunak be when the bills roll in, and tax receipts dry up? They are very likely to do so before any leadership contest, grim reaper permitting.

    My advice would be to lay Sunak at present.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 82,119
    edited March 2020

    eadric said:

    felix said:

    felix said:
    This is a ridiculous narrative. All EU member states are facing the same situation together at the same time. Italy was just slightly ahead of the curve.
    No - the fact that healthcare has never been one of the competencies is a major weakness. No strategy from the top. Selfishness rules.
    Dealing with a pandemic is much more than a healthcare issue.
    But the pandemic has underlined the essential weakness of the EU: it is neither fish nor fowl. It is not unified enough - a proper Federal state - to take advantage of its economies of scale, as happened in China.

    And this is what the EU top bods said to the BBC in that documentary after Brexit. We aren't integrated enough, we need much closer union. And it is why a vote for Remain, wasn't a vote for the status quo.

    Realistically, it is nearly impossible to react swiftly when you have 27 different nations of different size with massively different economies and political outlooks.
    Good grief, listen to the pair of you. It's like two orcs caught up in a lava flow from Mount Doom speculating on what is going to come of Gondor now that Denethor has popped his clogs.
    It is the first time I have mentioned in the EU I don't know how many months....you on the other hand...

    I simply pointing out what the EU itself said about the state of the institution and what they feel is the way forward.
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 33,464
    nichomar said:

    Excel Centre becoming a field hospital is a good idea, but at the same time won't be the last and an insight into just how massive this will be.

    Also, that been said, I would be well pissed off if I lived in London and with all those fancy hotels being made available and instead all I got was a bed in a giant dormitory in a conference centre :-)

    Madrid did something similar about a week ago in one of the exhibition halls on the ‘reciento Ferial’ with 500 beds they are now on the third hall on the same site. It does show that someone is forward planning which is a good sign.
    The Ice Palace is now the morgue, apparently.
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 27,932

    So we are going for an upgrade of PM from millionaires to billionaires?

    If it is good enough for America... :)
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 49,868
    Just wait until afterwards.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 82,119

    So we are going for an upgrade of PM from millionaires to billionaires?

    If it is good enough for America... :)
    Hmmmm....well Trump is making America #1 again, just in a slightly different way !
  • nichomarnichomar Posts: 7,483
    edited March 2020
    ..
  • GardenwalkerGardenwalker Posts: 21,298

    eadric said:

    felix said:

    felix said:
    This is a ridiculous narrative. All EU member states are facing the same situation together at the same time. Italy was just slightly ahead of the curve.
    No - the fact that healthcare has never been one of the competencies is a major weakness. No strategy from the top. Selfishness rules.
    Dealing with a pandemic is much more than a healthcare issue.
    But the pandemic has underlined the essential weakness of the EU: it is neither fish nor fowl. It is not unified enough - a proper Federal state - to take advantage of its economies of scale, as happened in China.

    And this is what the EU top bods said to the BBC in that documentary after Brexit. We aren't integrated enough, we need much closer union. And it is why a vote for Remain, wasn't a vote for the status quo.

    Realistically, it is nearly impossible to react swiftly when you have 27 different nations of different size with massively different economies and political outlooks.
    The Brexit-botherers are back.
    Sssh....you’ll wake Big G.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,205
    Remote desktop ? Pile of shite desktop more like
  • GardenwalkerGardenwalker Posts: 21,298
    Brexit botherers have predicted 213 of the last zero EU collapses.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,424

    eadric said:

    As and when this virus rages to a halt, the EU will have to confront this issue, finally, and the polity that emerges will be different to now. It could break up on the edges.

    How the EU handles Hungary after this is over will be an interesting test case.

    https://twitter.com/CommissionerHR/status/1242036471508414464
    With gloves on. Literally.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 82,119
    edited March 2020
    eadric said:
    The spectator had an article the other day which had the average age of German's vs Italians and it was much much lower. Also, the shear number of tests and how many asymptotic ones they have picked up to date, means people are comparing apples with oranges when they simply report the #deaths etc vs # of positives. Germany are at a much different stage to lots of other countries were when they had the same number of positives.

    BUT...they had a quote from some German official or academic, basically saying we have been lucky, when the dust settles we don't expect to be that much different from most countries.

    Obviously with their much bigger ICU capacity and good healthcare system they will do better, but when most countries are talking about 60-70-80% of the population will get it and we are comparing stats based on a 1000-10000s of cases.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,424
    I have just opened my back door for the first time in literally months (I tend to use the conservatory door for access to the back garden).

    I had to go outside and practically kick it down before it would budge.

    The amount of swelling due to the winter's rain has not improved it one iota.
  • OllyTOllyT Posts: 5,006

    Remember how as recently as a week or two ago Labour thought that painting Sunak as Boris' puppet would be a winning strategy for them?

    I think Sunak is doing fine but I really think you are underestimating how quickly things can move in politics. Of course Sunak and Johnson are popular right now, it's what people tend to do in a crisis, rally round.

    Trump has had a popularity bump despite anyone with at least one functioning brain cell knowing that his handling of this crisis id beyond appalling.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 82,119
    edited March 2020
    Question....there was a website showing a map of the spread of the genetic make-ups of the various mutations of CV. Does Germany have the same set of mutations as Italy, France and Spain? I presume they do.
  • GardenwalkerGardenwalker Posts: 21,298
    eadric said:

    Brexit botherers have predicted 213 of the last zero EU collapses.

    Well, the Brexiteers predicted.... Brexit, where the EU lost 12% of its GDP, its biggest city, its 2nd largest economy, a sixth of its population, and its equal most important military. And a whole heap of soft power.

    Not quite a collapse but a very nasty blow.

    Actually, the Brexiters did not predict Brexit.
    Few people did, whatever their feelings toward the EU.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 82,119
    edited March 2020
    I was surprised to learn that Germany has a lower take-up of the annual flu jab by oldies than many other countries.
  • bigjohnowlsbigjohnowls Posts: 22,676

    They have already done 10k+ on I think 2 or 3 occasions. Also not new, this is the number from yesterday. God journalists are having a shit war.
    At 10k a day it will take nearly 3 months to test NHS patient facing staff once without testing a single patient or doing repeat tests

    At 25k a day reduce that to 36 days. We really need the 250k a day Boris mentioned ages ago.
    South Korea, "the gold standard", did 15k a day at peak. Germany do about 10-15k a day. Also South Korea don't do 15k a day "gold standard" tests, they did lots of faster less accurate road side ones, that were used to funnel people into the gold standard testing procedure.

    Where did he say 250k a day? I have never heard him say that ever and was it a slip of the tongue. And the egg-heads definitely haven't, they have always talked about wanting to get to 25k a day.

    Until there is an instant test, there is a limit to what you can do. And most of the fast tests that have been demo'ed so far aren't anywhere near accurate enough.
    He said it a daily briefing here is the FT confirming he said it

    https://www.ft.com/content/dacc0712-6ce1-11ea-9bca-bf503995cd6f
  • eadric said:

    tlg86 said:

    eadric said:

    Foxy said:

    When does Boris go and what brings down Boris that does not also bring down Rishi Sunak?

    Surely the obvious answer is SARDS from Coronavirus?

    PB stats freaks may be interested in this little map by the HSJ, click on the link to see the map.

    https://twitter.com/foxinsoxuk/status/1242416467783622656?s=19

    Numbers of confirmed inpatients are going up quickly here, from 3 on Friday, to 18 yesterday and 26 today. We are still on a steep bit of the curve.
    Talking of stats, here's some bizarre data.

    We all know Germany is doing well in terms of coronavirus fatalities. But what about critical care?

    The general consensus is that between 5% and 15% of cases become critical, and require significant treatment in hospital.

    This is confirmed in most European countries:

    Italy has 50,400 active cases, 3,200 critical cases

    Spain has 33,200 active cases, 2,400 critical cases

    France has 16,800 active cases, 2,000 critical cases

    but

    Germany has 30,500 cases, and...… 23 critical cases.

    The predictions are about by orders of magnitude. Germany should have 2-4,000 critical cases, it has 23

    What is going on?

    https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/



    They're also reporting 20 for us (it's been that for a long time), so I don't think those numbers are being updated (our's certainly aren't).
    Yes, I noticed ours were awry, as well.

    But even if they're not being updated properly, that's a startlingly low figure - like their fatality rate.
    Wouldn't better measures be numbers in hospital/numbers in ICU/numbers at home?
  • Industry news - the Foodservice industry is bleeding money out its arse as the effective shutdown of education, travel, contract catering and quick service restaurant sectors leaves them dangerously short of cash. 70% of their business has disappeared over a couple of days and the threat to them is a threat to NHS care home and prison feeding.

    The Federation of Wholesale Distributors points out that despite the deadline announcements there isn' any government money yet available and when it is a business that has just lost the majority of its customer base and has burned its cash reserves won't be in a position to qualify for the business interruption loans.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 82,119
    edited March 2020

    They have already done 10k+ on I think 2 or 3 occasions. Also not new, this is the number from yesterday. God journalists are having a shit war.
    At 10k a day it will take nearly 3 months to test NHS patient facing staff once without testing a single patient or doing repeat tests

    At 25k a day reduce that to 36 days. We really need the 250k a day Boris mentioned ages ago.
    South Korea, "the gold standard", did 15k a day at peak. Germany do about 10-15k a day. Also South Korea don't do 15k a day "gold standard" tests, they did lots of faster less accurate road side ones, that were used to funnel people into the gold standard testing procedure.

    Where did he say 250k a day? I have never heard him say that ever and was it a slip of the tongue. And the egg-heads definitely haven't, they have always talked about wanting to get to 25k a day.

    Until there is an instant test, there is a limit to what you can do. And most of the fast tests that have been demo'ed so far aren't anywhere near accurate enough.
    He said it a daily briefing here is the FT confirming he said it

    https://www.ft.com/content/dacc0712-6ce1-11ea-9bca-bf503995cd6f
    They are talking about including the instant ‘anti-body’ test kits to see if you have had it in the past. That is as the egg-heads have said is a game changer. It won't tell you if you have it now though, and nobody in the world has that tech yet (at least not approved with proven accuracy that is high enough).

    They aren't talking about the gold standard test to see if you are currently positive. The aim has always been 25k (other than when they had a weird few days where they decided no we won't, before U-Turning, I think after the WHO had a go at them).
  • felixfelix Posts: 15,164

    felix said:

    felix said:

    felix said:
    This is a ridiculous narrative. All EU member states are facing the same situation together at the same time. Italy was just slightly ahead of the curve.
    No - the fact that healthcare has never been one of the competencies is a major weakness. No strategy from the top. Selfishness rules.
    Dealing with a pandemic is much more than a healthcare issue.
    Exactly - and still no strategy from the top.
    The EU institutions don't sit above the member states, and as we can see from the US response, even with a true central government, 'strategy' from the top is not necessarily helpful.
    I'm sure the Italian and Spanish governments will be comforted by your comment.
  • MyBurningEarsMyBurningEars Posts: 3,651

    Afternoon fellow Big Brother Contestants....

    Deay One in tho Big Brutha Hoos...
    I was one of the pre-show contestants, Deay 16 for me.
    I haven't been able to get out since an op at the beginning of Feb and as I'm shielding in what's now called the "extremely vulnerable" category this is going to drag on for many more months yet :-(

    I keep thinking I'm going to be really productive and get loads done, but I need to pull myself away from the news first!!
  • GardenwalkerGardenwalker Posts: 21,298
    The Barclays mortgage holiday phone number is basically off the hook. Just get a BT message saying the number is not accessible.
  • isamisam Posts: 41,118
    Having recently watched Storyville’s ‘Jonestown’ there is a small part of me that wonders if people in the future will ask “Why did they unquestioningly believe it?”. I have bad visions of this being a test run of our obedience to superiors when they tell us to do something we aren’t comfortable with.

    Don’t attack, it’s just a passing thought!
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 33,464
    Apparently Trump has asked S Korea for supplies to help fight coronavirus. President Moon said his government would provide “maximum support” if enough supplies were available.

    That's from the BBC underneath the almost incredible statement that 'India will go into full lockdown" from midnight.
    India in lockdown...... the mind boggles. As it does at the idea of the population keeping 2m apart.
  • MysticroseMysticrose Posts: 4,688
    eadric said:
    I read around the internet, that fabulous source for hard facts, that Germany is massaging the figures. Basically, they're discounting from fatalities and critical condition anyone with an underlying health condition.

    This is denied but it would be one explanation.
  • In Spoons news nice Mr martin as well as unilaterally sacking his staff on the HYUFD package ("sling yer hook"), he's also written to all their suppliers teling them they must provide a moratorium on payments he makes to them until his pubs reopen. That the entire on-trade bar Wetherspoons is pulling together with the brewers etc to work together shouldn't be a surprise...
  • TheValiantTheValiant Posts: 1,878
    HYUFD said:

    When does Boris go and what brings down Boris that does not also bring down Sunak?

    Major took over as PM from Chancellor when Thatcher went, as Brown did from Blair
    And in that universe over there *points that way* Osborne took over from Cameron.

    I wonder how we'd have been managing this now. With no Brexit I mean. Two months away from a required GE. With Osborne in charge......
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 41,999
    eadric said:

    Brexit botherers have predicted 213 of the last zero EU collapses.

    Well, the Brexiteers predicted.... Brexit, where the EU lost 12% of its GDP, its biggest city, its 2nd largest economy, a sixth of its population, and its equal most important military. And a whole heap of soft power.

    Not quite a collapse but a very nasty blow.

    I presume your primary reason for voting Remain was to prevent such a grievous blow to the EU, very selfless of you.

    Or am I getting you mixed up with Byronic?
  • isamisam Posts: 41,118
    We should be on 631 deaths today if this analysis was correct

    https://twitter.com/stephenkb/status/1241702863530799104?s=21
  • TheValiantTheValiant Posts: 1,878

    The Barclays mortgage holiday phone number is basically off the hook. Just get a BT message saying the number is not accessible.

    Nationwide is done online, and I understand (haven't done it yet) is that three months is given, no questions asked. If you want longer you'll have to call.
  • bigjohnowlsbigjohnowls Posts: 22,676
    Try this one Telegraph article dated 19.3.20

    Boris Johnson says the Government is "ramping up testing" to attempt to treat a quarter of a million people a day, as he said the UK could "turn the tide" on coronavirus in 12 weeks.

    The Prime Minister said the first UK patient had entered a clinical trial for treatment of coronavirus, and the Government was hoping to invest in a new "antibody test" for the disease that would allow it to test more people.

    "We're massively increasing the testing to see whether you have it now and ramping up daily testing from 5,000 a day, to 10,000 to 25,000 and then up at 250,000," he said.

    Link behind paywall but here goes

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2020/03/19/boris-johnson-news-latest-schools-coronavirus-emergency-bill/
  • MysticroseMysticrose Posts: 4,688
    edited March 2020
    eadric said:

    Afternoon fellow Big Brother Contestants....

    Deay One in tho Big Brutha Hoos...
    I was one of the pre-show contestants, Deay 16 for me.
    I haven't been able to get out since an op at the beginning of Feb and as I'm shielding in what's now called the "extremely vulnerable" category this is going to drag on for many more months yet :-(

    I keep thinking I'm going to be really productive and get loads done, but I need to pull myself away from the news first!!
    I am similarly unproductive. However I am, bizarrely, doing lots more country walks. And eating better. And drinking less.
    As a fellow writer this isolation is no different from my normal life. I live on my own, rise in the mornings after breakfast and two or three coffees plus a quick peek on here and news channels.

    I start writing around 9 to 10 am depending on my mojo and halt a-Stephen King-esque 2000 words later, which is usually early afternoon. Then I siesta and read until it's time for a brisk walk or spinning workout.

    After my dinner I settle down to watch something and go to bed 10pm ish.

    The only variation is that once a week I'll trundle to my local M&S and buy a week's supply of food.

    For me, nothing inside my home has altered.
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 57,218

    When does Boris go and what brings down Boris that does not also bring down Rishi Sunak?

    CV-19?
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 82,119
    edited March 2020

    Try this one Telegraph article dated 19.3.20

    Boris Johnson says the Government is "ramping up testing" to attempt to treat a quarter of a million people a day, as he said the UK could "turn the tide" on coronavirus in 12 weeks.

    The Prime Minister said the first UK patient had entered a clinical trial for treatment of coronavirus, and the Government was hoping to invest in a new "antibody test" for the disease that would allow it to test more people.

    "We're massively increasing the testing to see whether you have it now and ramping up daily testing from 5,000 a day, to 10,000 to 25,000 and then up at 250,000," he said.

    Link behind paywall but here goes

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2020/03/19/boris-johnson-news-latest-schools-coronavirus-emergency-bill/

    FFS...."antibody test"...that isn't the real time are you positive test...it is the one where you can tell if you had it in the past and didn't know....nobody in the world has this tech yet. It isn't the same as the test you require to use to see if you are currently positive.

    That won't help test the whole of the NHS staff every day to see who is positive, only identify ones that have had it in the past. And it appears like the UK are leading on going for this approach, nobody else has it (although I think a US company say they might have something).

    South Korea, 15k test a day, Germany, 10-15k tests a day, UK, 10k test a day at present, 25k in a couple of weeks. Nobody in the world can screen all their healthcare professional day in day out, the tech doesn't exist.
  • tysontyson Posts: 6,117

    eadric said:
    I read around the internet, that fabulous source for hard facts, that Germany is massaging the figures. Basically, they're discounting from fatalities and critical condition anyone with an underlying health condition.

    This is denied but it would be one explanation.
    Or......Hitler and his assertion about the master race was right along....

  • BarnesianBarnesian Posts: 8,604
    Foxy said:

    Incidentally, could I commend this surveillance app? It is from Kings in London, trying to understand how much COVID19 related symptoms is out there.

    https://twitter.com/foxinsoxuk/status/1242446527005679617?s=19

    Excellent idea. I've downloaded it and forwarded it to 30+ people.
  • bigjohnowlsbigjohnowls Posts: 22,676

    They have already done 10k+ on I think 2 or 3 occasions. Also not new, this is the number from yesterday. God journalists are having a shit war.
    At 10k a day it will take nearly 3 months to test NHS patient facing staff once without testing a single patient or doing repeat tests

    At 25k a day reduce that to 36 days. We really need the 250k a day Boris mentioned ages ago.
    South Korea, "the gold standard", did 15k a day at peak. Germany do about 10-15k a day. Also South Korea don't do 15k a day "gold standard" tests, they did lots of faster less accurate road side ones, that were used to funnel people into the gold standard testing procedure.

    Where did he say 250k a day? I have never heard him say that ever and was it a slip of the tongue. And the egg-heads definitely haven't, they have always talked about wanting to get to 25k a day.

    Until there is an instant test, there is a limit to what you can do. And most of the fast tests that have been demo'ed so far aren't anywhere near accurate enough.
    He said it a daily briefing here is the FT confirming he said it

    https://www.ft.com/content/dacc0712-6ce1-11ea-9bca-bf503995cd6f
    They are talking about including the instant ‘anti-body’ test kits to see if you have had it in the past. That is as the egg-heads have said is a game changer. It won't tell you if you have it now though, and nobody in the world has that tech yet (at least not approved with proven accuracy that is high enough).

    They aren't talking about the gold standard test to see if you are currently positive. The aim has always been 25k (other than when they had a weird few days where they decided no we won't, before U-Turning, I think after the WHO had a go at them).
    The PM Briefing didnt make that clear. When do we get the 250k tests a day that Boris promised whatever type they are?.

    You have gone from he didnt say it to he meant something else.

    You were wrong about the former probably right about the latter but symptomatic of the Communications strategy dont you think.
This discussion has been closed.