It is entirely possible the concept of brexit will be irrelevant in 12 months time as no one know what the global economic situation will be. It would have taken all of 20 seconds to say we are focused on the virus and will seek an extension if that is the correct action to take. To blindly say it’s business as usual was in my mind silly. What emerges from this situation will be anybodies guess but it won’t be business as usual for a long time.
The Chinese state sought to cover up the virus at outbreak, and its charming measures have included welding people into their homes. If that state had instead cracked down on trading rare animals and wet markets, this pandemic may very well never have happened.
This x 1000.
Somebody posted a report a few days ago from 2007 which predicted it was only a matter of time that this would happen in China. They have known that bats carry corona type viruses and did nothing to stop them being sold and used in the live markets. Live markets and traditional Chinese "medicine" really need to be outlawed.
China needs to be shamed into acting now but I suspect it won't and a few years down the line the same thing will happen again. It would be bad enough if it only affected China but their actions are going to bring the entire world to its knees.
If anyone could repost that report I would be grateful if they would repost it.
Mr. B, it could go various ways (and will, of course, a demographic bloc doesn't have a uniform opinion). The coronavirus might be seen as an actual real problem versus the hot air of climate change, and others may see it as an essentially more compressed and acute forerunner, a lesson in long term thinking etc.
Mr. Mark, not so sure about that.
An extension would, I think, mostly have support. It is true that some Leavers would see it the way you describe, but many would not.
You're the only person on this site (the only one) still totally obsessed by it.
That makes you a real fanatic and weirdo.
It's the British government that has decided that pandemics do not alter its timetable, ready or not. As if Britain won't have had enough disruption by then.
But the nut-nut Leavers adamantly refuse to condemn that insane priority.
I open PB this morning only to see you still ranting on about brexit when people are losing their jobs, people are scared and worried for their families, and yes people are dying
Brexit is of no concern to the vast majority and you are looking obsessed and ridiculous
You are better than this Alastair
@Big_G_NorthWales the government continues to affirm that it wishes to stick to the same timetable for the transition, despite not having the time to open talks. Do you not think that in the circumstances that is both wicked and insane?
Johnson has a very weak character. I don't think he's actually pushing Brexit forward. Problem is he doesn't have the strength of character to say, Brexit isn't our priority, we'll come back to it when circumstances allow. It's like when his friend phoned up to help beat someone up and he played along and also his refusal to accept paternity of his own children.
Johnson isn't the prime minister we need at this time, but he's the one we have got. We must collectively keep challenging him, I think.
There is a recurring pattern in this governments communications.
Chuck a rock in the pond with a big announcement and then disappear leaving big, obvious questions answered. They do not to be appear to be good with detail and or to have done their homework. Whether that is true or not remains to be seen, but it really undermines confidence.
You're the only person on this site (the only one) still totally obsessed by it.
That makes you a real fanatic and weirdo.
It's the British government that has decided that pandemics do not alter its timetable, ready or not. As if Britain won't have had enough disruption by then.
But the nut-nut Leavers adamantly refuse to condemn that insane priority.
I open PB this morning only to see you still ranting on about brexit when people are losing their jobs, people are scared and worried for their families, and yes people are dying
Brexit is of no concern to the vast majority and you are looking obsessed and ridiculous
You are better than this Alastair
It is the government that is carrying on with Brexit, whilst cancelling everything else. Surely that is inappropriate. Are GCSEs less important than Brexit?
You cannot cancel brexit. It has happened
You know and I know that is not really true. The transitional arrangements can be extended and the whole thing kicked in the long grass. That should happen now for the good of the country, but for ideological reasons it hasn't.
You do realise that more than half the country would just see this as Remainers STILL TRYING TO FUCKING CHEAT ON BREXIT. Which, when you are trying keep the country together and focussed on Covid-19, is not a helpful outcome.
Remainers, just STFU about Brexit for a few months, huh?
We are agreed. The government could achieve that effortlessly by saying "Brexit is not a priority, it is delayed to 2021". Let's hope they do it, rather than it being the only thing that is weirdly not delayed.
You're the only person on this site (the only one) still totally obsessed by it.
That makes you a real fanatic and weirdo.
It's the British government that has decided that pandemics do not alter its timetable, ready or not. As if Britain won't have had enough disruption by then.
But the nut-nut Leavers adamantly refuse to condemn that insane priority.
I open PB this morning only to see you still ranting on about brexit when people are losing their jobs, people are scared and worried for their families, and yes people are dying
Brexit is of no concern to the vast majority and you are looking obsessed and ridiculous
You are better than this Alastair
It is the government that is carrying on with Brexit, whilst cancelling everything else. Surely that is inappropriate. Are GCSEs less important than Brexit?
You cannot cancel brexit. It has happened
You know and I know that is not really true. The transitional arrangements can be extended and the whole thing kicked in the long grass. That should happen now for the good of the country, but for ideological reasons it hasn't.
You do realise that more than half the country would just see this as Remainers STILL TRYING TO FUCKING CHEAT ON BREXIT. Which, when you are trying keep the country together and focussed on Covid-19, is not a helpful outcome.
Remainers, just STFU about Brexit for a few months, huh?
The Chinese state sought to cover up the virus at outbreak, and its charming measures have included welding people into their homes. If that state had instead cracked down on trading rare animals and wet markets, this pandemic may very well never have happened.
This x 1000.
Somebody posted a report a few days ago from 2007 which predicted it was only a matter of time that this would happen in China. They have known that bats carry corona type viruses and did nothing to stop them being sold and used in the live markets. Live markets and traditional Chinese "medicine" really need to be outlawed.
China needs to be shamed into acting now but I suspect it won't and a few years down the line the same thing will happen again. It would be bad enough if it only affected China but their actions are going to bring the entire world to its knees.
If anyone could repost that report I would be grateful if they would repost it.
China will, without fanfare outlaw all these traditions very quietly. It’s economic miracle has been derailed and it won’t risk it happening again.
...There are two large reasons to believe the political echo of this crisis will last much longer than the crisis itself.
The first is that many of the people whose expectations and routines are most dramatically upended by the pandemic are students. The interruption, and in some cases irreplaceable loss, of important experiences in their education, as campuses empty and untold events are canceled, will likely shape their consciousness in more lasting ways than for the rest of us.
Like most catastrophes, the pandemic’s malign consequences will fall most heavily on the underprivileged. Unlike most catastrophes, its costs are also being paid heavily by some segments of the most privileged. Those college seniors whose spring terms and graduation ceremonies are suddenly deleted include many people who are future leaders of the public and private sectors. No, it’s not the end of the world for them. But it’s a piercing loss even so—one being paid more for the benefit of older, less healthy people than for pure self-protection.
More profoundly, the dynamics of the coronavirus moment likely will resemble the dynamics of other great public policy issues shadowing the next generation. In particular, the global pandemic and the harsh choices it imposes offer—in highly concentrated fashion in coming months—much the same choices that responses to global climate change will impose in coming decades....
I think this remarkable event will rocket climate change to the top of the agenda.
It is psychologically similar. It brings home the fragility of our place on this planet and the need to be careful and kind. For co-operation over competition. For participants, not winners and losers.
Same sentiment expressed nicely on Twitter by Frankie Boyle -
Feels like we're at a crossroads where either this crisis is seen as a foreshadowing of climate collapse, and we transition away from this rotten system, or the human project is stillborn. Have a great Wednesday everyone!
The Chinese state sought to cover up the virus at outbreak, and its charming measures have included welding people into their homes. If that state had instead cracked down on trading rare animals and wet markets, this pandemic may very well never have happened.
This x 1000.
Somebody posted a report a few days ago from 2007 which predicted it was only a matter of time that this would happen in China. They have known that bats carry corona type viruses and did nothing to stop them being sold and used in the live markets. Live markets and traditional Chinese "medicine" really need to be outlawed.
China needs to be shamed into acting now but I suspect it won't and a few years down the line the same thing will happen again. It would be bad enough if it only affected China but their actions are going to bring the entire world to its knees.
If anyone could repost that report I would be grateful if they would repost it.
You're the only person on this site (the only one) still totally obsessed by it.
That makes you a real fanatic and weirdo.
It's the British government that has decided that pandemics do not alter its timetable, ready or not. As if Britain won't have had enough disruption by then.
But the nut-nut Leavers adamantly refuse to condemn that insane priority.
I open PB this morning only to see you still ranting on about brexit when people are losing their jobs, people are scared and worried for their families, and yes people are dying
Brexit is of no concern to the vast majority and you are looking obsessed and ridiculous
You are better than this Alastair
It is the government that is carrying on with Brexit, whilst cancelling everything else. Surely that is inappropriate. Are GCSEs less important than Brexit?
You cannot cancel brexit. It has happened
You know and I know that is not really true. The transitional arrangements can be extended and the whole thing kicked in the long grass. That should happen now for the good of the country, but for ideological reasons it hasn't.
You do realise that more than half the country would just see this as Remainers STILL TRYING TO FUCKING CHEAT ON BREXIT. Which, when you are trying keep the country together and focussed on Covid-19, is not a helpful outcome.
Remainers, just STFU about Brexit for a few months, huh?
You're the only person on this site (the only one) still totally obsessed by it.
That makes you a real fanatic and weirdo.
It's the British government that has decided that pandemics do not alter its timetable, ready or not. As if Britain won't have had enough disruption by then.
But the nut-nut Leavers adamantly refuse to condemn that insane priority.
I open PB this morning only to see you still ranting on about brexit when people are losing their jobs, people are scared and worried for their families, and yes people are dying
Brexit is of no concern to the vast majority and you are looking obsessed and ridiculous
You are better than this Alastair
@Big_G_NorthWales the government continues to affirm that it wishes to stick to the same timetable for the transition, despite not having the time to open talks. Do you not think that in the circumstances that is both wicked and insane?
The desire to impose sanctions on ourselves by means of Brexit seemed like a bit of a larf when the economy was relatively healthy. Now that we're heading into a massive global depression the transition will be extended by a very long time followed by BINO.
That is possible as are other scenarios
But to get in a state over brexit just now is irrational as there is only one focus covid 19
We have self isolated since tuesday as we are in the highest risk group .
However our Asda delivery today has revealed no milk, bread,weetabix, oranges and other routine weekly buys including beans and spaghetti.
It goes without saying there are no toilet rolls, hand santisers or kitchen surface cleaners
How on earth are the isolated going to manage when the supermarkets cannot provide the normal essentials.
All this will do is to see the high risk elderly going out to the shops seeking their needs
Big G that's like not being worried about about a lump you find on your body because you are dealing with a broken leg.
Gordon Brown (from ~0810 on R4) on saving the world redux.
Doom laden homilies as per usual, emphasizing employment protection. "We need to copy what the Danes or the Swedes or the Germans are doing".. Against helicopter money ("scattergun").. World needs leadership.. Needs coordinated fiscal stimulus as we did in 2008.. ECB action is not fiscal stimulus.. wrt London, we need to step in now with [confused waffle] .. profiteering..country needs to come together .. Govt needs to take the right steps .. re Brexit the big issue will be how we can restore trade not tariffs
...There are two large reasons to believe the political echo of this crisis will last much longer than the crisis itself.
The first is that many of the people whose expectations and routines are most dramatically upended by the pandemic are students. The interruption, and in some cases irreplaceable loss, of important experiences in their education, as campuses empty and untold events are canceled, will likely shape their consciousness in more lasting ways than for the rest of us.
Like most catastrophes, the pandemic’s malign consequences will fall most heavily on the underprivileged. Unlike most catastrophes, its costs are also being paid heavily by some segments of the most privileged. Those college seniors whose spring terms and graduation ceremonies are suddenly deleted include many people who are future leaders of the public and private sectors. No, it’s not the end of the world for them. But it’s a piercing loss even so—one being paid more for the benefit of older, less healthy people than for pure self-protection.
More profoundly, the dynamics of the coronavirus moment likely will resemble the dynamics of other great public policy issues shadowing the next generation. In particular, the global pandemic and the harsh choices it imposes offer—in highly concentrated fashion in coming months—much the same choices that responses to global climate change will impose in coming decades....
Also worth noting that the young are being asked to sacrifice the most, in terms of lifestyle, for the relatively disproportionate benefit of the elderly. You'd expect this to play into politics post-crisis somehow.
Gordon actually very sensible on R4. Let’s be honest, he understands this stuff much better than Boris. Rishi is impressive, but so far he’s letting hundreds of thousands of jobs go to the wall, while sick-in-the-head loyalists like HYUFD advocate broth.
Gordon is great and obviously gives a shit, would take him over the current circus in a heartbeat. He is a damn sight more constructive than the Conservatives were in the last crisis.
Let’s be honest, he understands this stuff much better than Boris.
Rishi is impressive, but so far he’s letting hundreds of thousands of jobs go to the wall, while sick-in-the-head loyalists like HYUFD advocate broth.
Not government-issued broth you understand. Baxters Broth. Bought with money from their savings.
Meanwhile in the real World, walked the girl to school. Teaching staff haven't a clue what the plan is for next week - most of the teachers have kids in school. Other schools. "I'm a key worker. Am I teaching someone else's kids or mine?"
The Chinese state sought to cover up the virus at outbreak, and its charming measures have included welding people into their homes. If that state had instead cracked down on trading rare animals and wet markets, this pandemic may very well never have happened.
This x 1000.
Somebody posted a report a few days ago from 2007 which predicted it was only a matter of time that this would happen in China. They have known that bats carry corona type viruses and did nothing to stop them being sold and used in the live markets. Live markets and traditional Chinese "medicine" really need to be outlawed.
China needs to be shamed into acting now but I suspect it won't and a few years down the line the same thing will happen again. It would be bad enough if it only affected China but their actions are going to bring the entire world to its knees.
If anyone could repost that report I would be grateful if they would repost it.
China will, without fanfare outlaw all these traditions very quietly. It’s economic miracle has been derailed and it won’t risk it happening again.
I suspect that is true. But it will take a fair amount of time.
...There are two large reasons to believe the political echo of this crisis will last much longer than the crisis itself.
The first is that many of the people whose expectations and routines are most dramatically upended by the pandemic are students. The interruption, and in some cases irreplaceable loss, of important experiences in their education, as campuses empty and untold events are canceled, will likely shape their consciousness in more lasting ways than for the rest of us.
Like most catastrophes, the pandemic’s malign consequences will fall most heavily on the underprivileged. Unlike most catastrophes, its costs are also being paid heavily by some segments of the most privileged. Those college seniors whose spring terms and graduation ceremonies are suddenly deleted include many people who are future leaders of the public and private sectors. No, it’s not the end of the world for them. But it’s a piercing loss even so—one being paid more for the benefit of older, less healthy people than for pure self-protection.
More profoundly, the dynamics of the coronavirus moment likely will resemble the dynamics of other great public policy issues shadowing the next generation. In particular, the global pandemic and the harsh choices it imposes offer—in highly concentrated fashion in coming months—much the same choices that responses to global climate change will impose in coming decades....
Also worth noting that the young are being asked to sacrifice the most, in terms of lifestyle, for the relatively disproportionate benefit of the elderly. You'd expect this to play into politics post-crisis somehow.
Let’s be honest, he understands this stuff much better than Boris.
Rishi is impressive, but so far he’s letting hundreds of thousands of jobs go to the wall, while sick-in-the-head loyalists like HYUFD advocate broth.
Not government-issued broth you understand. Baxters Broth. Bought with money from their savings.
Meanwhile in the real World, walked the girl to school. Teaching staff haven't a clue what the plan is for next week - most of the teachers have kids in school. Other schools. "I'm a key worker. Am I teaching someone else's kids or mine?"
And then the bus. Full of pensioners.
I am ordered to let my contractors go this week. I don’t know their situations. Some will have savings, some not. Some mortgages, most rent.
Morning all. @Big_G_NorthWales I sent you a message via Vanilla. If you would like me to post over a small bottle of sanitiser to you, I would be happy to do so. You mentioned yesterday you had little/none and were self-isolating. Just get in touch via the Vanilla inbox/messaging system if the sanitiser would be helpful.
...There are two large reasons to believe the political echo of this crisis will last much longer than the crisis itself.
The first is that many of the people whose expectations and routines are most dramatically upended by the pandemic are students. The interruption, and in some cases irreplaceable loss, of important experiences in their education, as campuses empty and untold events are canceled, will likely shape their consciousness in more lasting ways than for the rest of us.
Like most catastrophes, the pandemic’s malign consequences will fall most heavily on the underprivileged. Unlike most catastrophes, its costs are also being paid heavily by some segments of the most privileged. Those college seniors whose spring terms and graduation ceremonies are suddenly deleted include many people who are future leaders of the public and private sectors. No, it’s not the end of the world for them. But it’s a piercing loss even so—one being paid more for the benefit of older, less healthy people than for pure self-protection.
More profoundly, the dynamics of the coronavirus moment likely will resemble the dynamics of other great public policy issues shadowing the next generation. In particular, the global pandemic and the harsh choices it imposes offer—in highly concentrated fashion in coming months—much the same choices that responses to global climate change will impose in coming decades....
One inyteresting aspect of this crisis is that in many parts of the world the air being breathed and the water running in the rivers is cleaner than it has been for decades. I wonder if that will get noticed.
Gordon actually very sensible on R4. Let’s be honest, he understands this stuff much better than Boris. Rishi is impressive, but so far he’s letting hundreds of thousands of jobs go to the wall, while sick-in-the-head loyalists like HYUFD advocate broth.
Gordon is great and obviously gives a shit, would take him over the current circus in a heartbeat. He is a damn sight more constructive than the Conservatives were in the last crisis.
Not sure - he has no off valve as we saw 2003 - 2007. Not to say that it would be a problem in the short term but I would worry for the eventual economic health of the country. And I say this as someone who is largely a Krugman-ite on austerity.
GB spent too much at too rapid a rate, after the necessary catch-up following admitted under-funding of many of our services to 1997 and I'm not sure giving him the keys to the till would be the right way forward now.
All moot of course.
And I'm off to work (ie downstairs). Good day all.
Morning all. @Big_G_NorthWales I sent you a message via Vanilla. If you would like me to post over a small bottle of sanitiser to you, I would be happy to do so. You mentioned yesterday you had little/none and were self-isolating. Just get in touch via the Vanilla inbox/messaging system if the sanitiser would be helpful.
Isnt the advice that soap and hot water is actually better - and if you are self isolating, why would you need satitiser? just asking.
I am ordered to let my contractors go this week. I don’t know their situations. Some will have savings, some not. Some mortgages, most rent.
They won’t find another job for the foreseeable.
The Tories have always been laisse-faire when it comes to unemployment - it is a function of capitalism. However, mass unemployment on a vast scale isn't something they can just say "on your bike" to. Diseased bat-eaters won't get it, but a lot of money will need to be handed unconditionally to a lot of people. Quickly. For the preservation of our capitalist system...
The pound has fallen sharply against the dollar, as the Chancellor's £330bn bailout package has not been well received by the markets. This is to cover 3 months support for the economy. I think the government will have great difficulty maintaining the current restrictions for the whole of the rest of this year, as it will become increasingly difficult to finance. This is partly due to the plan to end the transitional arrangements with the EU in December 2020, which has undermined confidence in the economy. As the next few weeks pass the current situation will start to seem normal. The government will need to have answers to many questions about various sectors of the economy where difficulties will be accumulating.
This may be the second time in my life I find myself agreeing with Gordon Brown (I didn't hear what he said) but is this really the priority: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-51955389?
It seems to me that Ms Legarde is fighting the war of 2008 when the Euro was under threat not the war of 2020 when the whole economy is in danger of collapsing because of want of demand. Its really important that they get a grip
It is up to Governments to sort out the demand issues - but I'm not 100% sure how the ECB can resolve that when Germany isn't willing to pick up even part of the bill. So I suspect letting Governments borrow money is all that it can do..
I cannot see how the Euro is going to survive this though as it's finally confirmed that it's one rule for Germany and another for everyone else.
I do not see how any government can hope to sort this out without aggressive monetary policy such as we are seeing from the BoE and the Fed. If Germany prevents that there will indeed be a threat to the Euro but it really doesn't need to be that way.
I heard Wuhan is a tinderbox. There's massive anger at the way the local government allowed the virus to develop. The government is keeping a lid on it now because of quarantine, but a reckoning is likely.
Trump's "Chinese virus" rhetoric is playing into this, because a fair number of Chinese agree. The Chinese government is furious with America.
Incidentally, I doubt welding people into their homes is much of a thing. There's plenty of fake news on the anti-Government side outside of China, largely driven by the Falun Gong.
Morning all. @Big_G_NorthWales I sent you a message via Vanilla. If you would like me to post over a small bottle of sanitiser to you, I would be happy to do so. You mentioned yesterday you had little/none and were self-isolating. Just get in touch via the Vanilla inbox/messaging system if the sanitiser would be helpful.
Isnt the advice that soap and hot water is actually better - and if you are self isolating, why would you need satitiser? just asking.
Even those self-isolating might need to go out on occasion, hence the request.
...There are two large reasons to believe the political echo of this crisis will last much longer than the crisis itself.
The first is that many of the people whose expectations and routines are most dramatically upended by the pandemic are students. The interruption, and in some cases irreplaceable loss, of important experiences in their education, as campuses empty and untold events are canceled, will likely shape their consciousness in more lasting ways than for the rest of us.
Like most catastrophes, the pandemic’s malign consequences will fall most heavily on the underprivileged. Unlike most catastrophes, its costs are also being paid heavily by some segments of the most privileged. Those college seniors whose spring terms and graduation ceremonies are suddenly deleted include many people who are future leaders of the public and private sectors. No, it’s not the end of the world for them. But it’s a piercing loss even so—one being paid more for the benefit of older, less healthy people than for pure self-protection.
More profoundly, the dynamics of the coronavirus moment likely will resemble the dynamics of other great public policy issues shadowing the next generation. In particular, the global pandemic and the harsh choices it imposes offer—in highly concentrated fashion in coming months—much the same choices that responses to global climate change will impose in coming decades....
Also worth noting that the young are being asked to sacrifice the most, in terms of lifestyle, for the relatively disproportionate benefit of the elderly. You'd expect this to play into politics post-crisis somehow.
Disproportionate? Your comment displays disproportionality. The young may lose some months of school and hanging out. Yes youngish adults (like you?) have been had their work and careers paused, though govt measures aim to help tide them over. But the elderly face a ghastly death in isolation on Russian roulette odds if they catch it. Shame on you.
Let’s be honest, he understands this stuff much better than Boris.
Rishi is impressive, but so far he’s letting hundreds of thousands of jobs go to the wall, while sick-in-the-head loyalists like HYUFD advocate broth.
I really don`t think is is right or accurate to be party-political over this.
HYUFD is an excellent poster on this site, and whether or not you agree with his ideology (of course he won`t agree with your similarly) his posts are usually just factual and his breadth and depth of knowledge on all things political, both present and historical, is simply astonishing.
The Chancellor is not letting jobs go to the wall. This was an inevitable consequence of a lockdown or quasi-lockdown policy which many of us warned about.
My suspicion (which may be unfair I admit) is that many who cheerleaded for a lockdown policy, thus trashing the economy and our freedoms and making health the sole driver, are public sector workers who have good jobs, will be paid in full by the taxpayer during a lockdown, have defined benefit pensions (thus not affected by the market collapse) and will have jobs to go back to when the lockdown ends.
You're the only person on this site (the only one) still totally obsessed by it.
That makes you a real fanatic and weirdo.
It's the British government that has decided that pandemics do not alter its timetable, ready or not. As if Britain won't have had enough disruption by then.
But the nut-nut Leavers adamantly refuse to condemn that insane priority.
I think you'll find in reality the British governments sole priority now is this pandemic so they're simply not dealing with Brexit talks at all and are just batting away questions on that with a flat bat right now in a way to make Boycott proud. It is the likes of you still thinking about that.
When the time is right after the pandemic is resolved the government can calmly and rationally either get a deal agreed or request an extension. They have no reason to do so now and it's foolhardy to bring it up now.
Or the government are not prepared to delay the policy closest to their heart, despite the fact such a delay is obvious and beneficial to the country. All that is required is for the PM to say "Brexit is not our priority and will be delayed".
He said...... blustered and waffled ....... yesterday that it wouldn't.
He also declares on a daily basis that he has "absolute certainty" that the current strategy will deal with the pandemic. As the strategy changes in response to events, as it must...
What on earth do you expect him to say, that we are all doomed? You're being silly.
...There are two large reasons to believe the political echo of this crisis will last much longer than the crisis itself.
The first is that many of the people whose expectations and routines are most dramatically upended by the pandemic are students. The interruption, and in some cases irreplaceable loss, of important experiences in their education, as campuses empty and untold events are canceled, will likely shape their consciousness in more lasting ways than for the rest of us.
Like most catastrophes, the pandemic’s malign consequences will fall most heavily on the underprivileged. Unlike most catastrophes, its costs are also being paid heavily by some segments of the most privileged. Those college seniors whose spring terms and graduation ceremonies are suddenly deleted include many people who are future leaders of the public and private sectors. No, it’s not the end of the world for them. But it’s a piercing loss even so—one being paid more for the benefit of older, less healthy people than for pure self-protection.
More profoundly, the dynamics of the coronavirus moment likely will resemble the dynamics of other great public policy issues shadowing the next generation. In particular, the global pandemic and the harsh choices it imposes offer—in highly concentrated fashion in coming months—much the same choices that responses to global climate change will impose in coming decades....
Also worth noting that the young are being asked to sacrifice the most, in terms of lifestyle, for the relatively disproportionate benefit of the elderly. You'd expect this to play into politics post-crisis somehow.
The twitterati after the "herding theory"press briefing. Boris wants all the oldies and vulnerable to die. Hastag ButcherBoris.
Twitterati now: We are having our futures sacrificed just to protect the oldies. Hastag Sooounfair.
The Chinese state sought to cover up the virus at outbreak, and its charming measures have included welding people into their homes. If that state had instead cracked down on trading rare animals and wet markets, this pandemic may very well never have happened.
That state, yep. And others, too. But it’s only the state that can deal with the consequences.
If as some claim the Chinese state caused coronavirus as it jumped from a research lab, is that a force for good ?
North Korea the statiest of statists claims it has zero CV19, should we all imitate their system ?
It's the shittest conspiracy theory ever.
"Let's design a virus that only kills the elderly and vulnerable and destroys the world economy! That will teach our enemies! Mwhahaha!"
That's not the contention, it's they were mucking around in a virology lab to see what developed and it escaped unintentionally. The paranoia is simply the internet getting in to gear
Yeah, and like all conspiracy theories it evolves to circumvent the most credible rebuttals.
The idea Chinese scientists just "muck around" in labs to see what viral weapons they can come up with is a lot of nonsense.
This has jumped over to humans from bats who are great incubators of viruses -and maybe pandolins - as has been well documented.
So what do research virologists do all day, then?
Plonking over-certainty on matters on which we can at best explore probabilities seems to be a thing for the PB righties.
If you want to support fake news then you are part of the problem and will all but guarantee another outbreak in future.
So what do research virologists do all day, then?
Occasionally they have to spend valuable time debunking conspiracy theories....
...There are two large reasons to believe the political echo of this crisis will last much longer than the crisis itself.
The first is that many of the people whose expectations and routines are most dramatically upended by the pandemic are students. The interruption, and in some cases irreplaceable loss, of important experiences in their education, as campuses empty and untold events are canceled, will likely shape their consciousness in more lasting ways than for the rest of us.
Like most catastrophes, the pandemic’s malign consequences will fall most heavily on the underprivileged. Unlike most catastrophes, its costs are also being paid heavily by some segments of the most privileged. Those college seniors whose spring terms and graduation ceremonies are suddenly deleted include many people who are future leaders of the public and private sectors. No, it’s not the end of the world for them. But it’s a piercing loss even so—one being paid more for the benefit of older, less healthy people than for pure self-protection.
More profoundly, the dynamics of the coronavirus moment likely will resemble the dynamics of other great public policy issues shadowing the next generation. In particular, the global pandemic and the harsh choices it imposes offer—in highly concentrated fashion in coming months—much the same choices that responses to global climate change will impose in coming decades....
I have to say that I do not think that students per se are especially hard hit by this crisis. The most obvoius point is that young adults are least affected medically, and generally have more flexibility in their lives. OK so young adults party harder, but I think that they will be able to take two or three months without parties in their stride. There will be some system put in place so that current A-level and university students will get their qualifications, even if it does take a while to agree what that is. Tere are simply too many in this category to ignore them.
The group for whom this crisis will have a critical effect on are those who have precarious jobs, in sectors which will be hit by the sudden dissapearance of cash flow. Most of these people will have very few savings and will not be able to financially ride out the storm. Of course many of these people ARE students, at least the ones who have to work through uni, and young adults.
The £ has gone to rock bottom largely because we dropped interest rates back down to the lowest level and announced unlimited QE. Plus the flight to safety with the bigger currencies and especially the $ being seen as safer.
But you'd think, if we are right to be relatively reassured by our response to the medical crisis so far ('relatively' meaning as compared to the US and some but not all EU countries), that the £ now represents a buy, especially against the $.
If things turn as bad in the US as many now expect, surely the $ becomes a sell.
You're the only person on this site (the only one) still totally obsessed by it.
That makes you a real fanatic and weirdo.
It's the British government that has decided that pandemics do not alter its timetable, ready or not. As if Britain won't have had enough disruption by then.
But the nut-nut Leavers adamantly refuse to condemn that insane priority.
I think you'll find in reality the British governments sole priority now is this pandemic so they're simply not dealing with Brexit talks at all and are just batting away questions on that with a flat bat right now in a way to make Boycott proud. It is the likes of you still thinking about that.
When the time is right after the pandemic is resolved the government can calmly and rationally either get a deal agreed or request an extension. They have no reason to do so now and it's foolhardy to bring it up now.
Absolutely right. I shared the other day my experience of leadership of my council during the riots. You just go from one meeting to the next dealing with one pressing issue after another, and spend a lot of time communicating, sharing messages and priorities and joining up with all the other people and organisations involved with the crisis.
Doubtless there are a few civil servants with nothing else to do working away on some drafting in a back room, but our leading politicians wont be giving any attention to anything that isn't going to happen in the next few weeks, for sure.
I heard Wuhan is a tinderbox. There's massive anger at the way the local government allowed the virus to develop. The government is keeping a lid on it now because of quarantine, but a reckoning is likely.
Trump's "Chinese virus" rhetoric is playing into this, because a fair number of Chinese agree. The Chinese government is furious with America.
Incidentally, I doubt welding people into their homes is much of a thing. There's plenty of fake news on the anti-Government side outside of China, largely driven by the Falun Gong.
Who knows? But the videos would take a lot more faking than just getting your mate to lie down and play dead in the street - many of them have uniformed police, marked police cars etc as well as heavy welding gear. Note also that confining thss infected in their own homes was standard practice in 1665 per pepys and defoe.
...There are two large reasons to believe the political echo of this crisis will last much longer than the crisis itself.
The first is that many of the people whose expectations and routines are most dramatically upended by the pandemic are students. The interruption, and in some cases irreplaceable loss, of important experiences in their education, as campuses empty and untold events are canceled, will likely shape their consciousness in more lasting ways than for the rest of us.
Like most catastrophes, the pandemic’s malign consequences will fall most heavily on the underprivileged. Unlike most catastrophes, its costs are also being paid heavily by some segments of the most privileged. Those college seniors whose spring terms and graduation ceremonies are suddenly deleted include many people who are future leaders of the public and private sectors. No, it’s not the end of the world for them. But it’s a piercing loss even so—one being paid more for the benefit of older, less healthy people than for pure self-protection.
More profoundly, the dynamics of the coronavirus moment likely will resemble the dynamics of other great public policy issues shadowing the next generation. In particular, the global pandemic and the harsh choices it imposes offer—in highly concentrated fashion in coming months—much the same choices that responses to global climate change will impose in coming decades....
I have to say that I do not think that students per se are especially hard hit by this crisis. The most obvoius point is that young adults are least affected medically, and generally have more flexibility in their lives. OK so young adults party harder, but I think that they will be able to take two or three months without parties in their stride. There will be some system put in place so that current A-level and university students will get their qualifications, even if it does take a while to agree what that is. Tere are simply too many in this category to ignore them.
The group for whom this crisis will have a critical effect on are those who have precarious jobs, in sectors which will be hit by the sudden dissapearance of cash flow. Most of these people will have very few savings and will not be able to financially ride out the storm. Of course many of these people ARE students, at least the ones who have to work through uni, and young adults.
And the UK and US have disproportionate numbers of these, thanks to their economic model. Unless the UK government acts soon, the effects will be disastrous.
You're the only person on this site (the only one) still totally obsessed by it.
That makes you a real fanatic and weirdo.
It's the British government that has decided that pandemics do not alter its timetable, ready or not. As if Britain won't have had enough disruption by then.
But the nut-nut Leavers adamantly refuse to condemn that insane priority.
I think you'll find in reality the British governments sole priority now is this pandemic so they're simply not dealing with Brexit talks at all and are just batting away questions on that with a flat bat right now in a way to make Boycott proud. It is the likes of you still thinking about that.
When the time is right after the pandemic is resolved the government can calmly and rationally either get a deal agreed or request an extension. They have no reason to do so now and it's foolhardy to bring it up now.
Absolutely right. I shared the other day my experience of leadership of my council during the riots. You just go from one meeting to the next dealing with one pressing issue after another, and spend a lot of time communicating, sharing messages and priorities and joining up with all the other people and organisations involved with the crisis.
Doubtless there are a few civil servants with nothing else to do working away on some drafting in a back room, but our leading politicians wont be giving any attention to anything that isn't going to happen in the next few weeks, for sure.
Weeks? Sufficient unto the day methinks.
Exams are weeks away, as are many of the events being cancelled. Credit a bit of forward planning!
Consensus is that it was the Spanish Kansas Flu - not only was the US ineffectual at containing it they shipped it in troopships across to Europe....
If I have it correct, it got the name Spanish Flu as they were the only major western country to be open about it. Everyone else was at war, so tried to cover it up, at first anyway.
Let’s be honest, he understands this stuff much better than Boris.
Rishi is impressive, but so far he’s letting hundreds of thousands of jobs go to the wall, while sick-in-the-head loyalists like HYUFD advocate broth.
I really don`t think is is right or accurate to be party-political over this.
HYUFD is an excellent poster on this site, and whether or not you agree with his ideology (of course he won`t agree with your similarly) his posts are usually just factual and his breadth and depth of knowledge on all things political, both present and historical, is simply astonishing.
Not often that you see someone say that HY's posts are "usually just factual", TBH
What the virus crisis teaches us: 1. The world is complex and interconnected. 2. There are no easy solutions. 3. Experts are absolutely essential. 4. The market does not have all the answers. 5. The state is a force for good. 6. Populism is a fake prospectus. 7. Solidarity wins. Discuss.
It's remarkable how current events seem to reinforce views you already hold. I'm shocked.
Libertarians and small staters love to quote that joke that the scariest words are "I'm from the government and I've come to help"
Funny thing is the minute there is a problem like this virus or flooding even they they go very quiet and join everyone else in expecting the state to solve the problems for them.
Except that in the case of flooding, the floods have been massively exacerbated by the state, because the levels of riverbeds have been steadily rising due to an EU directive strongly discouraging dredging, and the UK Environment agency enforcing this with religious zeal. The UK rains. A lot. It always has. All very lovely of the state to march in and 'solve' a problem it caused in the first place.
February was, by some margin, the wettest ever recorded in the UK. Yet you still manage to blame the EU for the consequent flooding?
Details can wait - we need broad brush strokes. "In the circumstances the best thing to do is to suspend the rest of the academic year. We will try to get your children back to school as soon as we can, but be prepared for it not being before the normal summer holidays.
That means that students due to sit exams will not be able to do so. All students who sit GCSEs and A-Levels submit work for assessment throughout their course. Having spoken to OFQUAL it has been agreed that the principle is that predicted grades based on assessed work will be used to award qualifications. No student will miss out on their college or university place as a result of this"
What the virus crisis teaches us: 1. The world is complex and interconnected. 2. There are no easy solutions. 3. Experts are absolutely essential. 4. The market does not have all the answers. 5. The state is a force for good. 6. Populism is a fake prospectus. 7. Solidarity wins. Discuss.
It's remarkable how current events seem to reinforce views you already hold. I'm shocked.
Libertarians and small staters love to quote that joke that the scariest words are "I'm from the government and I've come to help"
Funny thing is the minute there is a problem like this virus or flooding even they they go very quiet and join everyone else in expecting the state to solve the problems for them.
Except that in the case of flooding, the floods have been massively exacerbated by the state, because the levels of riverbeds have been steadily rising due to an EU directive strongly discouraging dredging, and the UK Environment agency enforcing this with religious zeal. The UK rains. A lot. It always has. All very lovely of the state to march in and 'solve' a problem it caused in the first place.
Nevertheless the minute there are floods every vox pox is filled with people screaming that the government (state) must do something. Nobody wants the state to interfere, everyone wants their taxes reduced but the minute they have a problem they want the state to sort it out and pay for it. It has ever been thus.
The £ has gone to rock bottom largely because we dropped interest rates back down to the lowest level and announced unlimited QE. Plus the flight to safety with the bigger currencies and especially the $ being seen as safer.
But you'd think, if we are right to be relatively reassured by our response to the medical crisis so far ('relatively' meaning as compared to the US and some but not all EU countries), that the £ now represents a buy, especially against the $.
If things turn as bad in the US as many now expect, surely the $ becomes a sell.
The government's strange determination to continue with exactly the same Brexit timetable, which seems eccentric even to many Leavers at the moment, may also be contributing to the pound's fall. It's not the dollar, and the UK may now be placing itself at even greater systemic risk towards the end of the year than the Eurozone if it doesn't delay. The market will be aware of this and pricing that in.
Consensus is that it was the Spanish Kansas Flu - not only was the US ineffectual at containing it they shipped it in troopships across to Europe....
If I have it correct, it got the name Spanish Flu as they were the only major western country to be open about it. Everyone else was at war, so tried to cover it up, at first anyway.
The Chinese state sought to cover up the virus at outbreak, and its charming measures have included welding people into their homes. If that state had instead cracked down on trading rare animals and wet markets, this pandemic may very well never have happened.
That state, yep. And others, too. But it’s only the state that can deal with the consequences.
If as some claim the Chinese state caused coronavirus as it jumped from a research lab, is that a force for good ?
North Korea the statiest of statists claims it has zero CV19, should we all imitate their system ?
It's the shittest conspiracy theory ever.
"Let's design a virus that only kills the elderly and vulnerable and destroys the world economy! That will teach our enemies! Mwhahaha!"
That's not the contention, it's they were mucking around in a virology lab to see what developed and it escaped unintentionally. The paranoia is simply the internet getting in to gear
Yeah, and like all conspiracy theories it evolves to circumvent the most credible rebuttals.
The idea Chinese scientists just "muck around" in labs to see what viral weapons they can come up with is a lot of nonsense.
This has jumped over to humans from bats who are great incubators of viruses -and maybe pandolins - as has been well documented.
So what do research virologists do all day, then?
Plonking over-certainty on matters on which we can at best explore probabilities seems to be a thing for the PB righties.
If you want to support fake news then you are part of the problem and will all but guarantee another outbreak in future.
So what do research virologists do all day, then?
Occasionally they have to spend valuable time debunking conspiracy theories....
You genuinely can't tell a statement about probabilities from a "conspiracy theory," can you? Or from a debunking of one. You are squawking "fake news!" When you share an attack line with the orange man, you are doing it wrong.
Let’s be honest, he understands this stuff much better than Boris.
Rishi is impressive, but so far he’s letting hundreds of thousands of jobs go to the wall, while sick-in-the-head loyalists like HYUFD advocate broth.
I really don`t think is is right or accurate to be party-political over this.
HYUFD is an excellent poster on this site, and whether or not you agree with his ideology (of course he won`t agree with your similarly) his posts are usually just factual and his breadth and depth of knowledge on all things political, both present and historical, is simply astonishing.
Not often that you see someone say that HY's posts are "usually just factual", TBH
We all get cross with one another on this site - and that is inevitable and fine. I just think HYUFD gets far more stick than is justified and is a very valuable contributor.
Let’s be honest, he understands this stuff much better than Boris.
Rishi is impressive, but so far he’s letting hundreds of thousands of jobs go to the wall, while sick-in-the-head loyalists like HYUFD advocate broth.
I honestly think it is too early to tell. His announcements at the press conference showed he got the scale of what is needed. His announcements on protecting employment, wages and the flow of money through the economy are keenly awaited. Its a lot more difficult and we can only hope that he gets it right.
The £ has gone to rock bottom largely because we dropped interest rates back down to the lowest level and announced unlimited QE. Plus the flight to safety with the bigger currencies and especially the $ being seen as safer.
But you'd think, if we are right to be relatively reassured by our response to the medical crisis so far ('relatively' meaning as compared to the US and some but not all EU countries), that the £ now represents a buy, especially against the $.
If things turn as bad in the US as many now expect, surely the $ becomes a sell.
No, it's because the UK has a huge, huge current account deficit and the economy is propped up by £100bn of FDI per year. There's no chance of that happening this year so Sterling is tanking which will put the current account into balance.
Details can wait - we need broad brush strokes. "In the circumstances the best thing to do is to suspend the rest of the academic year. We will try to get your children back to school as soon as we can, but be prepared for it not being before the normal summer holidays.
That means that students due to sit exams will not be able to do so. All students who sit GCSEs and A-Levels submit work for assessment throughout their course. Having spoken to OFQUAL it has been agreed that the principle is that predicted grades based on assessed work will be used to award qualifications. No student will miss out on their college or university place as a result of this"
Done. Details later. Broad plan now.
Not sure I agree. We need enough details to be able to answer kids legitimate questions. With a son who was due to sit GCSEs, the information provided yesterday afternoon was inadequate.
Let’s be honest, he understands this stuff much better than Boris.
Rishi is impressive, but so far he’s letting hundreds of thousands of jobs go to the wall, while sick-in-the-head loyalists like HYUFD advocate broth.
I really don`t think is is right or accurate to be party-political over this.
HYUFD is an excellent poster on this site, and whether or not you agree with his ideology (of course he won`t agree with your similarly) his posts are usually just factual and his breadth and depth of knowledge on all things political, both present and historical, is simply astonishing.
The Chancellor is not letting jobs go to the wall. This was an inevitable consequence of a lockdown or quasi-lockdown policy which many of us warned about.
My suspicion (which may be unfair I admit) is that many who cheerleaded for a lockdown policy, thus trashing the economy and our freedoms and making health the sole driver, are public sector workers who have good jobs, will be paid in full by the taxpayer during a lockdown, have defined benefit pensions (thus not affected by the market collapse) and will have jobs to go back to when the lockdown ends.
Lockdown, test and quarantine....this is how you control the pandemic until it goes. The tighter the lockdown measures, greater testing and building capacity (or measures) for quarantine- and the quicker it goes, and the less impact on the real economy.
Any other thinking.,....like the Govt's early on was absolute bonkers, and has only made matters worse
Do explain why it isn't as simple as "there's a pandemic so we'll come back to this next year?" Do explain why this needs any "optics" at all.
Because it's not a priority. The government has more important things on its plate and this is in the "deal with this later" pile. As it should be.
It's not dealing with it later. It is repeatedly reaffirming its position. It's dealing with it now and the way it is dealing with it now is to keep it as a priority.
No they have just said that the law is the law and they have said the talks have been suspended. That's it. Not saying anything else.
It would take an Act of Parliament now to request an extension (as it did under May) and why on Earth when Parliament is self-isolating and the government is in the grips of this pandemic should the government decide to bring everyone into the Commons Chamber to debate that!? When there's no issue for months or nearly a year.
You're utterly insane if you think the government should be dealing with that right now as its priority. The government has to deal with the virus now and nothing else matters - as far as Brexit is concerned the law is the law unless or until the law is changed.
You're the only person on this site (the only one) still totally obsessed by it.
That makes you a real fanatic and weirdo.
It's the British government that has decided that pandemics do not alter its timetable, ready or not. As if Britain won't have had enough disruption by then.
But the nut-nut Leavers adamantly refuse to condemn that insane priority.
I think you'll find in reality the British governments sole priority now is this pandemic so they're simply not dealing with Brexit talks at all and are just batting away questions on that with a flat bat right now in a way to make Boycott proud. It is the likes of you still thinking about that.
When the time is right after the pandemic is resolved the government can calmly and rationally either get a deal agreed or request an extension. They have no reason to do so now and it's foolhardy to bring it up now.
Or the government are not prepared to delay the policy closest to their heart, despite the fact such a delay is obvious and beneficial to the country. All that is required is for the PM to say "Brexit is not our priority and will be delayed".
He said...... blustered and waffled ....... yesterday that it wouldn't.
He also declares on a daily basis that he has "absolute certainty" that the current strategy will deal with the pandemic. As the strategy changes in response to events, as it must...
What on earth do you expect him to say, that we are all doomed? You're being silly.
No. But there is no such thing as "absolute certainty", particularly when you're forced publicly to execute partial about turns on policy in the space of a week.
My point (and it is not just mine; I've heard the sentiment expressed by quite a few I know who voted Conservative at the last election) is that the expression of mindless, as opposed to cautious optimism tends to undermine confidence in leaders.
Let’s be honest, he understands this stuff much better than Boris.
Rishi is impressive, but so far he’s letting hundreds of thousands of jobs go to the wall, while sick-in-the-head loyalists like HYUFD advocate broth.
I really don`t think is is right or accurate to be party-political over this.
HYUFD is an excellent poster on this site, and whether or not you agree with his ideology (of course he won`t agree with your similarly) his posts are usually just factual and his breadth and depth of knowledge on all things political, both present and historical, is simply astonishing.
Not often that you see someone say that HY's posts are "usually just factual", TBH
Broth If you die of pneumonia supervening on COVID 19 you have not died of COVID 19 Boris will invade Scotland
The £ has gone to rock bottom largely because we dropped interest rates back down to the lowest level and announced unlimited QE. Plus the flight to safety with the bigger currencies and especially the $ being seen as safer.
But you'd think, if we are right to be relatively reassured by our response to the medical crisis so far ('relatively' meaning as compared to the US and some but not all EU countries), that the £ now represents a buy, especially against the $.
If things turn as bad in the US as many now expect, surely the $ becomes a sell.
The pound was already falling rapidly before the worries about covid-19 began. Its decent started when Boris set out his hardline stance on Brexit negotiations.
And the UK and US have disproportionate numbers of these, thanks to their economic model. Unless the UK government acts soon, the effects will be disastrous.
Yes. The millions of people in low paid jobs. No savings. No security of contract. Or of accommodation if they are private sector renters.
And WFH is not possible because the work is real rather than virtual.
Another day, another lot of whining from the media. Oh schools are shut but why haven’t they told us how the precious dears are going to get their exam results yet? Why must everything be instant? This insatiable appetite for knowing everything now is bordering on the absurd.
I heard Wuhan is a tinderbox. There's massive anger at the way the local government allowed the virus to develop. The government is keeping a lid on it now because of quarantine, but a reckoning is likely.
Trump's "Chinese virus" rhetoric is playing into this, because a fair number of Chinese agree. The Chinese government is furious with America.
Incidentally, I doubt welding people into their homes is much of a thing. There's plenty of fake news on the anti-Government side outside of China, largely driven by the Falun Gong.
Who knows? But the videos would take a lot more faking than just getting your mate to lie down and play dead in the street - many of them have uniformed police, marked police cars etc as well as heavy welding gear. Note also that confining thss infected in their own homes was standard practice in 1665 per pepys and defoe.
People were, and in many cases still are, confined to their own homes with guards appointed by residents and local committees checking comings and goings. Chinese as a national characteristic are well organised and good at this kind of thing. I'm sure they would be horrified by the idea of people being sealed off, and by implication left to die. Any welding is probably on secondary exits to ensure people pass through the controls.
Look, it isn't often I would defend the Tories, but they have done OK with the school closure, not brilliantly, but OK. We have contingency plans in place for e.g. loss of site, weather events, even terrorist incident involving loss of staff, but as a small rural school we don't generally plan for 'outbreak of worldwide pandemic with Europe as the epicentre'.
Most schools plan for a temporary closure, even a long term one due to fire/flood or similar, would not be predicated on the restrictions of movement we're likely to see in the forthcoming weeks.
(I cannot believe I am typing these words, four weeks ago I was on a mini break at half term, eating a lovely dinner with my partner in Paris. Christ).
...There are two large reasons to believe the political echo of this crisis will last much longer than the crisis itself.
The first is that many of the people whose expectations and routines are most dramatically upended by the pandemic are students. The interruption, and in some cases irreplaceable loss, of important experiences in their education, as campuses empty and untold events are canceled, will likely shape their consciousness in more lasting ways than for the rest of us.
Like most catastrophes, the pandemic’s malign consequences will fall most heavily on the underprivileged. Unlike most catastrophes, its costs are also being paid heavily by some segments of the most privileged. Those college seniors whose spring terms and graduation ceremonies are suddenly deleted include many people who are future leaders of the public and private sectors. No, it’s not the end of the world for them. But it’s a piercing loss even so—one being paid more for the benefit of older, less healthy people than for pure self-protection.
More profoundly, the dynamics of the coronavirus moment likely will resemble the dynamics of other great public policy issues shadowing the next generation. In particular, the global pandemic and the harsh choices it imposes offer—in highly concentrated fashion in coming months—much the same choices that responses to global climate change will impose in coming decades....
Also worth noting that the young are being asked to sacrifice the most, in terms of lifestyle, for the relatively disproportionate benefit of the elderly. You'd expect this to play into politics post-crisis somehow.
The twitterati after the "herding theory"press briefing. Boris wants all the oldies and vulnerable to die. Hastag ButcherBoris.
Twitterati now: We are having our futures sacrificed just to protect the oldies. Hastag Sooounfair.
Just what you'd expect if the twitterati were led by Russian troll bots whose aim is to sow dissent. #TheresAlwaysAnotherConspiracyTheory
...There are two large reasons to believe the political echo of this crisis will last much longer than the crisis itself.
The first is that many of the people whose expectations and routines are most dramatically upended by the pandemic are students. The interruption, and in some cases irreplaceable loss, of important experiences in their education, as campuses empty and untold events are canceled, will likely shape their consciousness in more lasting ways than for the rest of us.
Like most catastrophes, the pandemic’s malign consequences will fall most heavily on the underprivileged. Unlike most catastrophes, its costs are also being paid heavily by some segments of the most privileged. Those college seniors whose spring terms and graduation ceremonies are suddenly deleted include many people who are future leaders of the public and private sectors. No, it’s not the end of the world for them. But it’s a piercing loss even so—one being paid more for the benefit of older, less healthy people than for pure self-protection.
More profoundly, the dynamics of the coronavirus moment likely will resemble the dynamics of other great public policy issues shadowing the next generation. In particular, the global pandemic and the harsh choices it imposes offer—in highly concentrated fashion in coming months—much the same choices that responses to global climate change will impose in coming decades....
One inyteresting aspect of this crisis is that in many parts of the world the air being breathed and the water running in the rivers is cleaner than it has been for decades. I wonder if that will get noticed.
I suspect we will also see noticeable effects of global cooling in the upper atmosphere at least. I doubt that there will be half as many flights, especially long distance ones, next year as there was last. The huge reduction in traffic movements will also make a difference. It may buy us more time to adapt and change. (That's my optimistic thought for the day, I am keeping them rationed).
Another day, another lot of whining from the media. Oh schools are shut but why haven’t they told us how the precious dears are going to get their exam results yet? Why must everything be instant? This insatiable appetite for knowing everything now is bordering on the absurd.
Yes it is - though understand that my daughter (and many other children) is distraught that the GCSEs that she has worked so hard towards will not not happen when planned.
Do explain why it isn't as simple as "there's a pandemic so we'll come back to this next year?" Do explain why this needs any "optics" at all.
Because it's not a priority. The government has more important things on its plate and this is in the "deal with this later" pile. As it should be.
It's not dealing with it later. It is repeatedly reaffirming its position. It's dealing with it now and the way it is dealing with it now is to keep it as a priority.
No they have just said that the law is the law and they have said the talks have been suspended. That's it. Not saying anything else.
It would take an Act of Parliament now to request an extension (as it did under May) and why on Earth when Parliament is self-isolating and the government is in the grips of this pandemic should the government decide to bring everyone into the Commons Chamber to debate that!? When there's no issue for months or nearly a year.
You're utterly insane if you think the government should be dealing with that right now as its priority. The government has to deal with the virus now and nothing else matters - as far as Brexit is concerned the law is the law unless or until the law is changed.
I've linked directly to Dominic Raab saying on Tuesday that he was opposed to any delay. Since you missed it, here it is again:
The Chinese state sought to cover up the virus at outbreak, and its charming measures have included welding people into their homes. If that state had instead cracked down on trading rare animals and wet markets, this pandemic may very well never have happened.
This x 1000.
Somebody posted a report a few days ago from 2007 which predicted it was only a matter of time that this would happen in China. They have known that bats carry corona type viruses and did nothing to stop them being sold and used in the live markets. Live markets and traditional Chinese "medicine" really need to be outlawed.
China needs to be shamed into acting now but I suspect it won't and a few years down the line the same thing will happen again. It would be bad enough if it only affected China but their actions are going to bring the entire world to its knees.
If anyone could repost that report I would be grateful if they would repost it.
China will, without fanfare outlaw all these traditions very quietly. It’s economic miracle has been derailed and it won’t risk it happening again.
I hope you are right and if anyone can they can. They still need to be held accountable for the current mess. As I have said before I remain convinced China is massaging the figures now to try and face for a major humiliation.
Hope you are managing OK, we were on our way to Javea shortly but all cancelled now.
Do explain why it isn't as simple as "there's a pandemic so we'll come back to this next year?" Do explain why this needs any "optics" at all.
Because it's not a priority. The government has more important things on its plate and this is in the "deal with this later" pile. As it should be.
It's not dealing with it later. It is repeatedly reaffirming its position. It's dealing with it now and the way it is dealing with it now is to keep it as a priority.
No they have just said that the law is the law and they have said the talks have been suspended. That's it. Not saying anything else.
It would take an Act of Parliament now to request an extension (as it did under May) and why on Earth when Parliament is self-isolating and the government is in the grips of this pandemic should the government decide to bring everyone into the Commons Chamber to debate that!? When there's no issue for months or nearly a year.
You're utterly insane if you think the government should be dealing with that right now as its priority. The government has to deal with the virus now and nothing else matters - as far as Brexit is concerned the law is the law unless or until the law is changed.
If its Brexit policy and timetable weakens the pound over the course of the year, relative to the Euro's comparable position, the UK govt will have to act, whatever it takes, and to coin a phrase. This is particularly if the currency markets are making the calculus that many Brexit supporters believe to be unreal - that the UK will be in a weaker position to emerge from the crisis towards the end of the year than the Eurozone, if the current timetable goes ahead.
The £ has gone to rock bottom largely because we dropped interest rates back down to the lowest level and announced unlimited QE. Plus the flight to safety with the bigger currencies and especially the $ being seen as safer.
But you'd think, if we are right to be relatively reassured by our response to the medical crisis so far ('relatively' meaning as compared to the US and some but not all EU countries), that the £ now represents a buy, especially against the $.
If things turn as bad in the US as many now expect, surely the $ becomes a sell.
Some bounce back against the Euro this morning but it has been a substantial fall. I am not sure interest rates had much to do with it, we are still above ECB levels. I've actually struggled to find a convincing reason.
Absolutely gutted, my favourite restaurant group is pretty much over. #FeckCoronavirus
The Sushi fast food chain, YO! Sushi, has revealed that 54 of its restaurants will permanently close at the end of service on Wednesday.
In an email sent to employees seen by the Guardian, the company said that the decision had come “in light of the escalating uncertainty of Covid-19” and followed “some very difficult decisions”.
“Regrettably, we have had to take this action as it is clearly in the interests of public health to do so and there is nothing more important than that, in particular our responsibilities to the elderly and vulnerable,” the email said.
It currently unclear which restaurants will be included, but at least one branch in London is set to shut.
One employee, who wished to remain anonymous, said: “This is a lot to come to terms with. A week ago we were all talking about the future and what we can do with the restaurant, now we’re shut. It’s so much to process in such a short space of time.”
YO! Sushi has almost 100 restaurants operating across 8 countries, 70 of which are located in the UK.
The £ has gone to rock bottom largely because we dropped interest rates back down to the lowest level and announced unlimited QE. Plus the flight to safety with the bigger currencies and especially the $ being seen as safer.
But you'd think, if we are right to be relatively reassured by our response to the medical crisis so far ('relatively' meaning as compared to the US and some but not all EU countries), that the £ now represents a buy, especially against the $.
If things turn as bad in the US as many now expect, surely the $ becomes a sell.
Some bounce back against the Euro this morning but it has been a substantial fall. I am not sure interest rates had much to do with it, we are still above ECB levels. I've actually struggled to find a convincing reason.
Let’s be honest, he understands this stuff much better than Boris.
Rishi is impressive, but so far he’s letting hundreds of thousands of jobs go to the wall, while sick-in-the-head loyalists like HYUFD advocate broth.
I really don`t think is is right or accurate to be party-political over this.
HYUFD is an excellent poster on this site, and whether or not you agree with his ideology (of course he won`t agree with your similarly) his posts are usually just factual and his breadth and depth of knowledge on all things political, both present and historical, is simply astonishing.
Not often that you see someone say that HY's posts are "usually just factual", TBH
We all get cross with one another on this site - and that is inevitable and fine. I just think HYUFD gets far more stick than is justified and is a very valuable contributor.
I disagree (with the stick bit, not the valuable contributor bit, which he is). This is not a party political thing and in many conversations I have had with him I have tried to make that point by picking up on something which I don't necessarily disagree with him on, so I have no reason to argue with him on the opinion. But the logic.... It just wants to make you scream.
So contribution of fact and information - great. Ability to debate in a logical manner - useless Acceptance that you may just in a blue moon have got something wrong - impossible.
Another day, another lot of whining from the media. Oh schools are shut but why haven’t they told us how the precious dears are going to get their exam results yet? Why must everything be instant? This insatiable appetite for knowing everything now is bordering on the absurd.
Yes it is - though understand that my daughter (and many other children) is distraught that the GCSEs that she has worked so hard towards will not not happen when planned.
Yes, my lad is in the same position. Contrary to what you might expect, he and most of his pals are not at all happy about their GCSEs being cancelled. As I have said before, we will owe our youth a large debt of gratitude for the sacrifices they are making for the sake of their grandparents.
Let’s be honest, he understands this stuff much better than Boris.
Rishi is impressive, but so far he’s letting hundreds of thousands of jobs go to the wall, while sick-in-the-head loyalists like HYUFD advocate broth.
I really don`t think is is right or accurate to be party-political over this.
HYUFD is an excellent poster on this site, and whether or not you agree with his ideology (of course he won`t agree with your similarly) his posts are usually just factual and his breadth and depth of knowledge on all things political, both present and historical, is simply astonishing.
Not often that you see someone say that HY's posts are "usually just factual", TBH
We all get cross with one another on this site - and that is inevitable and fine. I just think HYUFD gets far more stick than is justified
When he says things along the lines of "renters have been told they wont be evicted for a few months, what more do they want?" there isn't a stick long enough.
The Chinese state sought to cover up the virus at outbreak, and its charming measures have included welding people into their homes. If that state had instead cracked down on trading rare animals and wet markets, this pandemic may very well never have happened.
This x 1000.
Somebody posted a report a few days ago from 2007 which predicted it was only a matter of time that this would happen in China. They have known that bats carry corona type viruses and did nothing to stop them being sold and used in the live markets. Live markets and traditional Chinese "medicine" really need to be outlawed.
China needs to be shamed into acting now but I suspect it won't and a few years down the line the same thing will happen again. It would be bad enough if it only affected China but their actions are going to bring the entire world to its knees.
If anyone could repost that report I would be grateful if they would repost it.
Thanks, I had seen that but what I was thinking of was at the conclusion from a report in 2007 which basically said that bats together with Chinese practices made it inevitable that this would happen sooner or later.
What the virus crisis teaches us: 1. The world is complex and interconnected. 2. There are no easy solutions. 3. Experts are absolutely essential. 4. The market does not have all the answers. 5. The state is a force for good. 6. Populism is a fake prospectus. 7. Solidarity wins. Discuss.
It's remarkable how current events seem to reinforce views you already hold. I'm shocked.
Libertarians and small staters love to quote that joke that the scariest words are "I'm from the government and I've come to help"
Funny thing is the minute there is a problem like this virus or flooding even they they go very quiet and join everyone else in expecting the state to solve the problems for them.
Except that in the case of flooding, the floods have been massively exacerbated by the state, because the levels of riverbeds have been steadily rising due to an EU directive strongly discouraging dredging, and the UK Environment agency enforcing this with religious zeal. The UK rains. A lot. It always has. All very lovely of the state to march in and 'solve' a problem it caused in the first place.
Dredging is waaaaaay down the list of things that would help.
Whilst the focus is on Europe and the US what is happening in the less developed nations, I see a trickle of news from such countries showing slowly increasing infection numbers. Is this going to end up being far more disastrous to the third word with no help available to Minimize the impact. Also lack of info from Russia and those countries under their umbrella is sparse. Can we believe the Indian sub continent numbers? More questions than answers.
Another day, another lot of whining from the media. Oh schools are shut but why haven’t they told us how the precious dears are going to get their exam results yet? Why must everything be instant? This insatiable appetite for knowing everything now is bordering on the absurd.
Yes it is - though understand that my daughter (and many other children) is distraught that the GCSEs that she has worked so hard towards will not not happen when planned.
Yes, my lad is in the same position. Contrary to what you might expect, he and most of his pals are not at all happy about their GCSEs being cancelled. As I have said before, we will owe our youth a large debt of gratitude for the sacrifices they are making for the sake of their grandparents.
What are you hearing is the likely outcome? GCSEs put back to September?
Another day, another lot of whining from the media. Oh schools are shut but why haven’t they told us how the precious dears are going to get their exam results yet? Why must everything be instant? This insatiable appetite for knowing everything now is bordering on the absurd.
Yes it is - though understand that my daughter (and many other children) is distraught that the GCSEs that she has worked so hard towards will not not happen when planned.
Yes, my lad is in the same position. Contrary to what you might expect, he and most of his pals are not at all happy about their GCSEs being cancelled. As I have said before, we will owe our youth a large debt of gratitude for the sacrifices they are making for the sake of their grandparents.
The £ has gone to rock bottom largely because we dropped interest rates back down to the lowest level and announced unlimited QE. Plus the flight to safety with the bigger currencies and especially the $ being seen as safer.
But you'd think, if we are right to be relatively reassured by our response to the medical crisis so far ('relatively' meaning as compared to the US and some but not all EU countries), that the £ now represents a buy, especially against the $.
If things turn as bad in the US as many now expect, surely the $ becomes a sell.
The pound was already falling rapidly before the worries about covid-19 began. Its decent started when Boris set out his hardline stance on Brexit negotiations.
I think Johnson's problem is not that he's hard-line, but he's weak of character. He's unwilling to face up to reality
Add. Johnson isn't the prime minister we need, but he's the one we have got. We need him to make a relative success of handling this virus. Keep pushing him.
Whilst the focus is on Europe and the US what is happening in the less developed nations, I see a trickle of news from such countries showing slowly increasing infection numbers. Is this going to end up being far more disastrous to the third word with no help available to Minimize the impact. Also lack of info from Russia and those countries under their umbrella is sparse. Can we believe the Indian sub continent numbers? More questions than answers.
Unless the emerging view that Corona doesn't do well in climates that are both warm and humid comes to their rescue. Plus their very young demographics.
Whilst the focus is on Europe and the US what is happening in the less developed nations, I see a trickle of news from such countries showing slowly increasing infection numbers. Is this going to end up being far more disastrous to the third word with no help available to Minimize the impact. Also lack of info from Russia and those countries under their umbrella is sparse. Can we believe the Indian sub continent numbers? More questions than answers.
The age profile of some areas, especially in Africa, might mean it is harder to spot the effect, though it may compound other health issues.
Do explain why it isn't as simple as "there's a pandemic so we'll come back to this next year?" Do explain why this needs any "optics" at all.
Because it's not a priority. The government has more important things on its plate and this is in the "deal with this later" pile. As it should be.
It's not dealing with it later. It is repeatedly reaffirming its position. It's dealing with it now and the way it is dealing with it now is to keep it as a priority.
No they have just said that the law is the law and they have said the talks have been suspended. That's it. Not saying anything else.
It would take an Act of Parliament now to request an extension (as it did under May) and why on Earth when Parliament is self-isolating and the government is in the grips of this pandemic should the government decide to bring everyone into the Commons Chamber to debate that!? When there's no issue for months or nearly a year.
You're utterly insane if you think the government should be dealing with that right now as its priority. The government has to deal with the virus now and nothing else matters - as far as Brexit is concerned the law is the law unless or until the law is changed.
I've linked directly to Dominic Raab saying on Tuesday that he was opposed to any delay. Since you missed it, here it is again:
The government continues actively to set this as a priority. It - and you - are utterly insane for thinking this is remotely appropriate.
And he'll continue to say he's opposed to a delay unless or until a delay is agreed. Doesn't mean one won't be. The Premier League said matches were suspended until April 4, doesn't mean I expect the Merseyside Derby to be played that week.
What was actually said by him was he wants a deal agreed speedily so we can move on, but for now the talks are suspended so that's not possible. The government's just not dealing with it right now nor should it. Once things calm down they can either agree a deal if possible (preference) and we move on - or if it isn't possible because talks were suspended for too long them agree a short extension to talks to make up for lost time.
That's a problem for the future though not now. Just STFU about Brexit for a while, it doesn't matter right now.
Whilst the focus is on Europe and the US what is happening in the less developed nations, I see a trickle of news from such countries showing slowly increasing infection numbers. Is this going to end up being far more disastrous to the third word with no help available to Minimize the impact. Also lack of info from Russia and those countries under their umbrella is sparse. Can we believe the Indian sub continent numbers? More questions than answers.
Indeed. If air quality damaging lungs WAS an aggravating factor in China, you really have to worry for places like Delhi.
I heard Wuhan is a tinderbox. There's massive anger at the way the local government allowed the virus to develop. The government is keeping a lid on it now because of quarantine, but a reckoning is likely.
Trump's "Chinese virus" rhetoric is playing into this, because a fair number of Chinese agree. The Chinese government is furious with America.
Incidentally, I doubt welding people into their homes is much of a thing. There's plenty of fake news on the anti-Government side outside of China, largely driven by the Falun Gong.
Who knows? But the videos would take a lot more faking than just getting your mate to lie down and play dead in the street - many of them have uniformed police, marked police cars etc as well as heavy welding gear. Note also that confining thss infected in their own homes was standard practice in 1665 per pepys and defoe.
People were, and in many cases still are, confined to their own homes with guards appointed by residents and local committees checking comings and goings. Chinese as a national characteristic are well organised and good at this kind of thing. I'm sure they would be horrified by the idea of people being sealed off, and by implication left to die. Any welding is probably on secondary exits to ensure people pass through the controls.
"probably."
Look at the videos - I won't, on principle, link to Twitter, but they aren't hard to find - and decide for yourself.
What the virus crisis teaches us: 1. The world is complex and interconnected. 2. There are no easy solutions. 3. Experts are absolutely essential. 4. The market does not have all the answers. 5. The state is a force for good. 6. Populism is a fake prospectus. 7. Solidarity wins. Discuss.
It's remarkable how current events seem to reinforce views you already hold. I'm shocked.
Libertarians and small staters love to quote that joke that the scariest words are "I'm from the government and I've come to help"
Funny thing is the minute there is a problem like this virus or flooding even they they go very quiet and join everyone else in expecting the state to solve the problems for them.
Except that in the case of flooding, the floods have been massively exacerbated by the state, because the levels of riverbeds have been steadily rising due to an EU directive strongly discouraging dredging, and the UK Environment agency enforcing this with religious zeal. The UK rains. A lot. It always has. All very lovely of the state to march in and 'solve' a problem it caused in the first place.
Dredging is waaaaaay down the list of things that would help.
And can be counterproductive. Far better to work out where it is least damaging to allow rivers to top their banks and concentrate on holding flood waters there. Its the way rivers are supposed to work.
Another day, another lot of whining from the media. Oh schools are shut but why haven’t they told us how the precious dears are going to get their exam results yet? Why must everything be instant? This insatiable appetite for knowing everything now is bordering on the absurd.
Yes it is - though understand that my daughter (and many other children) is distraught that the GCSEs that she has worked so hard towards will not not happen when planned.
Yes, my lad is in the same position. Contrary to what you might expect, he and most of his pals are not at all happy about their GCSEs being cancelled. As I have said before, we will owe our youth a large debt of gratitude for the sacrifices they are making for the sake of their grandparents.
What are you hearing is the likely outcome? GCSEs put back to September?
I thought they were awarding results based on work done?
...There are two large reasons to believe the political echo of this crisis will last much longer than the crisis itself.
The first is that many of the people whose expectations and routines are most dramatically upended by the pandemic are students. The interruption, and in some cases irreplaceable loss, of important experiences in their education, as campuses empty and untold events are canceled, will likely shape their consciousness in more lasting ways than for the rest of us.
Like most catastrophes, the pandemic’s malign consequences will fall most heavily on the underprivileged. Unlike most catastrophes, its costs are also being paid heavily by some segments of the most privileged. Those college seniors whose spring terms and graduation ceremonies are suddenly deleted include many people who are future leaders of the public and private sectors. No, it’s not the end of the world for them. But it’s a piercing loss even so—one being paid more for the benefit of older, less healthy people than for pure self-protection.
More profoundly, the dynamics of the coronavirus moment likely will resemble the dynamics of other great public policy issues shadowing the next generation. In particular, the global pandemic and the harsh choices it imposes offer—in highly concentrated fashion in coming months—much the same choices that responses to global climate change will impose in coming decades....
The group for whom this crisis will have a critical effect on are those who have precarious jobs, in sectors which will be hit by the sudden dissapearance of cash flow. Most of these people will have very few savings and will not be able to financially ride out the storm. Of course many of these people ARE students, at least the ones who have to work through uni, and young adults.
Do explain why it isn't as simple as "there's a pandemic so we'll come back to this next year?" Do explain why this needs any "optics" at all.
Because it's not a priority. The government has more important things on its plate and this is in the "deal with this later" pile. As it should be.
It's not dealing with it later. It is repeatedly reaffirming its position. It's dealing with it now and the way it is dealing with it now is to keep it as a priority.
No they have just said that the law is the law and they have said the talks have been suspended. That's it. Not saying anything else.
It would take an Act of Parliament now to request an extension (as it did under May) and why on Earth when Parliament is self-isolating and the government is in the grips of this pandemic should the government decide to bring everyone into the Commons Chamber to debate that!? When there's no issue for months or nearly a year.
You're utterly insane if you think the government should be dealing with that right now as its priority. The government has to deal with the virus now and nothing else matters - as far as Brexit is concerned the law is the law unless or until the law is changed.
I've linked directly to Dominic Raab saying on Tuesday that he was opposed to any delay. Since you missed it, here it is again:
The government continues actively to set this as a priority. It - and you - are utterly insane for thinking this is remotely appropriate.
And he'll continue to say he's opposed to a delay unless or until a delay is agreed. Doesn't mean one won't be. The Premier League said matches were suspended until April 4, doesn't mean I expect the Merseyside Derby to be played that week.
What was actually said by him was he wants a deal agreed speedily so we can move on, but for now the talks are suspended so that's not possible. The government's just not dealing with it right now nor should it. Once things calm down they can either agree a deal if possible (preference) and we move on - or if it isn't possible because talks were suspended for too long them agree a short extension to talks to make up for lost time.
That's a problem for the future though not now. Just STFU about Brexit for a while, it doesn't matter right now.
The government can put the gun down and stop pointing it at us. It chooses not to because it is ideologically obsessed. Your defence of the indefensible is shameful.
You're the only person on this site (the only one) still totally obsessed by it.
That makes you a real fanatic and weirdo.
It's the British government that has decided that pandemics do not alter its timetable, ready or not. As if Britain won't have had enough disruption by then.
But the nut-nut Leavers adamantly refuse to condemn that insane priority.
I think you'll find in reality the British governments sole priority now is this pandemic so they're simply not dealing with Brexit talks at all and are just batting away questions on that with a flat bat right now in a way to make Boycott proud. It is the likes of you still thinking about that.
When the time is right after the pandemic is resolved the government can calmly and rationally either get a deal agreed or request an extension. They have no reason to do so now and it's foolhardy to bring it up now.
Absolutely right. I shared the other day my experience of leadership of my council during the riots. You just go from one meeting to the next dealing with one pressing issue after another, and spend a lot of time communicating, sharing messages and priorities and joining up with all the other people and organisations involved with the crisis.
Doubtless there are a few civil servants with nothing else to do working away on some drafting in a back room, but our leading politicians wont be giving any attention to anything that isn't going to happen in the next few weeks, for sure.
Weeks? Sufficient unto the day methinks.
Exams are weeks away, as are many of the events being cancelled. Credit a bit of forward planning!
I know. My son is in at school this morning desperately trying to complete course work before his school closes tomorrow night. He's worked so bloody hard for these exams, far harder than I ever did. I feel really sorry for him.
But the politicians in government are in the mode of making the decisions that have to be made today now and everything else is going to have to wait. I don't blame them, sometimes that is all that you can do.
Absolutely gutted, my favourite restaurant group is pretty much over. #FeckCoronavirus
The Sushi fast food chain, YO! Sushi, has revealed that 54 of its restaurants will permanently close at the end of service on Wednesday.
In an email sent to employees seen by the Guardian, the company said that the decision had come “in light of the escalating uncertainty of Covid-19” and followed “some very difficult decisions”.
“Regrettably, we have had to take this action as it is clearly in the interests of public health to do so and there is nothing more important than that, in particular our responsibilities to the elderly and vulnerable,” the email said.
It currently unclear which restaurants will be included, but at least one branch in London is set to shut.
One employee, who wished to remain anonymous, said: “This is a lot to come to terms with. A week ago we were all talking about the future and what we can do with the restaurant, now we’re shut. It’s so much to process in such a short space of time.”
YO! Sushi has almost 100 restaurants operating across 8 countries, 70 of which are located in the UK.
Yo! Sushi serves terrible sushi.
It serves far, far better sushi than supermarkets or most other alternatives around here though.
...There are two large reasons to believe the political echo of this crisis will last much longer than the crisis itself.
The first is that many of the people whose expectations and routines are most dramatically upended by the pandemic are students. The interruption, and in some cases irreplaceable loss, of important experiences in their education, as campuses empty and untold events are canceled, will likely shape their consciousness in more lasting ways than for the rest of us.
Like most catastrophes, the pandemic’s malign consequences will fall most heavily on the underprivileged. Unlike most catastrophes, its costs are also being paid heavily by some segments of the most privileged. Those college seniors whose spring terms and graduation ceremonies are suddenly deleted include many people who are future leaders of the public and private sectors. No, it’s not the end of the world for them. But it’s a piercing loss even so—one being paid more for the benefit of older, less healthy people than for pure self-protection.
More profoundly, the dynamics of the coronavirus moment likely will resemble the dynamics of other great public policy issues shadowing the next generation. In particular, the global pandemic and the harsh choices it imposes offer—in highly concentrated fashion in coming months—much the same choices that responses to global climate change will impose in coming decades....
One inyteresting aspect of this crisis is that in many parts of the world the air being breathed and the water running in the rivers is cleaner than it has been for decades. I wonder if that will get noticed.
I suspect we will also see noticeable effects of global cooling in the upper atmosphere at least. I doubt that there will be half as many flights, especially long distance ones, next year as there was last. The huge reduction in traffic movements will also make a difference. It may buy us more time to adapt and change. (That's my optimistic thought for the day, I am keeping them rationed).
Comments
This x 1000.
Somebody posted a report a few days ago from 2007 which predicted it was only a matter of time that this would happen in China. They have known that bats carry corona type viruses and did nothing to stop them being sold and used in the live markets. Live markets and traditional Chinese "medicine" really need to be outlawed.
China needs to be shamed into acting now but I suspect it won't and a few years down the line the same thing will happen again. It would be bad enough if it only affected China but their actions are going to bring the entire world to its knees.
If anyone could repost that report I would be grateful if they would repost it.
Mr. Mark, not so sure about that.
An extension would, I think, mostly have support. It is true that some Leavers would see it the way you describe, but many would not.
Johnson isn't the prime minister we need at this time, but he's the one we have got. We must collectively keep challenging him, I think.
https://twitter.com/WhiteHouse/status/1240345890159824901?ref_src=twsrc^tfw|twcamp^tweetembed|twterm^1240345890159824901&ref_url=https://www.telegraph.co.uk/global-health/science-and-disease/coronavirus-news-uk-schools-cases-deaths-london-lockdown/
Chuck a rock in the pond with a big announcement and then disappear leaving big, obvious questions answered. They do not to be appear to be good with detail and or to have done their homework. Whether that is true or not remains to be seen, but it really undermines confidence.
You evaded Poland.
It is psychologically similar. It brings home the fragility of our place on this planet and the need to be careful and kind. For co-operation over competition. For participants, not winners and losers.
Same sentiment expressed nicely on Twitter by Frankie Boyle -
https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/why-have-so-many-of-our-recent-viruses-come-from-bats-
Not from 2007, but refers to Ridley's book of ~ 20 years ago.
Let’s be honest, he understands this stuff much better than Boris.
Rishi is impressive, but so far he’s letting hundreds of thousands of jobs go to the wall, while sick-in-the-head loyalists like HYUFD advocate broth.
Meanwhile in the real World, walked the girl to school. Teaching staff haven't a clue what the plan is for next week - most of the teachers have kids in school. Other schools. "I'm a key worker. Am I teaching someone else's kids or mine?"
And then the bus. Full of pensioners.
I don’t know their situations. Some will have savings, some not. Some mortgages, most rent.
They won’t find another job for the foreseeable.
GB spent too much at too rapid a rate, after the necessary catch-up following admitted under-funding of many of our services to 1997 and I'm not sure giving him the keys to the till would be the right way forward now.
All moot of course.
And I'm off to work (ie downstairs). Good day all.
Trump's "Chinese virus" rhetoric is playing into this, because a fair number of Chinese agree. The Chinese government is furious with America.
Incidentally, I doubt welding people into their homes is much of a thing. There's plenty of fake news on the anti-Government side outside of China, largely driven by the Falun Gong.
Shame on you.
HYUFD is an excellent poster on this site, and whether or not you agree with his ideology (of course he won`t agree with your similarly) his posts are usually just factual and his breadth and depth of knowledge on all things political, both present and historical, is simply astonishing.
The Chancellor is not letting jobs go to the wall. This was an inevitable consequence of a lockdown or quasi-lockdown policy which many of us warned about.
My suspicion (which may be unfair I admit) is that many who cheerleaded for a lockdown policy, thus trashing the economy and our freedoms and making health the sole driver, are public sector workers who have good jobs, will be paid in full by the taxpayer during a lockdown, have defined benefit pensions (thus not affected by the market collapse) and will have jobs to go back to when the lockdown ends.
Twitterati now: We are having our futures sacrificed just to protect the oldies. Hastag Sooounfair.
The proximal origin of SARS-CoV-2
https://www.nature.com/articles/s41591-020-0820-9
The group for whom this crisis will have a critical effect on are those who have precarious jobs, in sectors which will be hit by the sudden dissapearance of cash flow. Most of these people will have very few savings and will not be able to financially ride out the storm. Of course many of these people ARE students, at least the ones who have to work through uni, and young adults.
But you'd think, if we are right to be relatively reassured by our response to the medical crisis so far ('relatively' meaning as compared to the US and some but not all EU countries), that the £ now represents a buy, especially against the $.
If things turn as bad in the US as many now expect, surely the $ becomes a sell.
That means that students due to sit exams will not be able to do so. All students who sit GCSEs and A-Levels submit work for assessment throughout their course. Having spoken to OFQUAL it has been agreed that the principle is that predicted grades based on assessed work will be used to award qualifications. No student will miss out on their college or university place as a result of this"
Done. Details later. Broad plan now.
Any other thinking.,....like the Govt's early on was absolute bonkers, and has only made matters worse
(You can send it to me if your like. Got any bum wipe to go with it?)
It would take an Act of Parliament now to request an extension (as it did under May) and why on Earth when Parliament is self-isolating and the government is in the grips of this pandemic should the government decide to bring everyone into the Commons Chamber to debate that!? When there's no issue for months or nearly a year.
You're utterly insane if you think the government should be dealing with that right now as its priority. The government has to deal with the virus now and nothing else matters - as far as Brexit is concerned the law is the law unless or until the law is changed.
But there is no such thing as "absolute certainty", particularly when you're forced publicly to execute partial about turns on policy in the space of a week.
My point (and it is not just mine; I've heard the sentiment expressed by quite a few I know who voted Conservative at the last election) is that the expression of mindless, as opposed to cautious optimism tends to undermine confidence in leaders.
If you die of pneumonia supervening on COVID 19 you have not died of COVID 19
Boris will invade Scotland
And WFH is not possible because the work is real rather than virtual.
Most schools plan for a temporary closure, even a long term one due to fire/flood or similar, would not be predicated on the restrictions of movement we're likely to see in the forthcoming weeks.
(I cannot believe I am typing these words, four weeks ago I was on a mini break at half term, eating a lovely dinner with my partner in Paris. Christ).
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/coronavirus-brexit-dominic-raab-uk-cuba-foreign-secretary-a9406736.html
The government continues actively to set this as a priority. It - and you - are utterly insane for thinking this is remotely appropriate.
I hope you are right and if anyone can they can. They still need to be held accountable for the current mess. As I have said before I remain convinced China is massaging the figures now to try and face for a major humiliation.
Hope you are managing OK, we were on our way to Javea shortly but all cancelled now.
So contribution of fact and information - great.
Ability to debate in a logical manner - useless
Acceptance that you may just in a blue moon have got something wrong - impossible.
Add. Johnson isn't the prime minister we need, but he's the one we have got. We need him to make a relative success of handling this virus. Keep pushing him.
What was actually said by him was he wants a deal agreed speedily so we can move on, but for now the talks are suspended so that's not possible. The government's just not dealing with it right now nor should it. Once things calm down they can either agree a deal if possible (preference) and we move on - or if it isn't possible because talks were suspended for too long them agree a short extension to talks to make up for lost time.
That's a problem for the future though not now. Just STFU about Brexit for a while, it doesn't matter right now.
Last I heard South Africa was getting worried.
Look at the videos - I won't, on principle, link to Twitter, but they aren't hard to find - and decide for yourself.
I will look for that news report
But the politicians in government are in the mode of making the decisions that have to be made today now and everything else is going to have to wait. I don't blame them, sometimes that is all that you can do.
I prefer to make it at home though.
"Release the bats...."