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  • Byronic said:

    As a way of calming things, here's some soothing if off-topic news

    THE SWEDISH NAVY IS RETURNING TO ITS VAST UNDERGROUND LAIR

    https://www.theguardian.com/world/2019/sep/30/swedish-navy-returns-to-vast-underground-hq-amid-russia-fears

    Blimey!
  • nichomar said:

    Mortimer said:

    I think this means a full time (35 hours a week working 233 days a year) wage is about £17,100 in 2024, but that equates to about £15,500 today, in real terms, so not quite as generous as it looks in nominal.

    I’d hope The Saj would cut employer NI rates to help them pay for it too, and mitigate impact on employment.

    Noone works 35 hours a week.
    Quite a lot of people I know work a 35 hour week.
    Never heard of zero hours contracts Mr B?
    How could I have missed them with Corbyn spouting some rubbish about them every PMQs? But what's that got to do with a 35 hour working week.
  • nichomarnichomar Posts: 7,483
    Drutt said:

    Drutt said:

    SunnyJim said:

    Drutt said:



    It's 5.5% a year. Average wage inflation is 4% right now.

    CPI is running at 1.7%.

    The Tories are offering OVER 3 TIMES the current rate of inflation to the lowest paid in society.

    You would have to be a swivel-eyed Labour drone to criticize that.

    If you look back through my postings you'll recognise I'm nothing of the sort. I don't like the idea of a government telling employees and employers what the price of the former's labour must be at all. I do, though, like to see a greater labour share of income. I don't think NMW or NLW is the best way to go about it

    But the figures are the figures. It's an increase, but in the context of current wage growth it's a modest increase. We shouldn't lose our shit over it.
    I, for one, am totally losing my shit over it.

    Labour were a calling with their banning of private schools and 32 hours.

    But Tories have just played their pocket rockets.

    I judge parties by their policies and I can sit on the fence no more.
    The 32 hours a week policy, on the same review, is actually a policy that nobody gets a pay rise for eight years but at the end you'll only be working four days a week.

    Also bear in mind that if you're on NMW now, the best way to get a raise over a five year period is not to wait for HMG to mandate it for you
    What’s the difference between nation living wage and the minimum wage? Is one voluntary?
  • Scott_P said:

    If I laugh any harder I will injure myself...

    https://twitter.com/EmmaKennedy/status/1178708715857416192

    Gove is always on manoeuvres. He can’t help himself.

    It’s why I’ve got him covered as next PM.
  • rpjsrpjs Posts: 3,787
    Byronic said:

    As a way of calming things, here's some soothing if off-topic news

    THE SWEDISH NAVY IS RETURNING TO ITS VAST UNDERGROUND LAIR

    https://www.theguardian.com/world/2019/sep/30/swedish-navy-returns-to-vast-underground-hq-amid-russia-fears

    Hmm, "Blofeld" sounds pretty Swedish when you think about it.
  • JonathanJonathan Posts: 21,675
    edited September 2019

    Scott_P said:

    If I laugh any harder I will injure myself...

    https://twitter.com/EmmaKennedy/status/1178708715857416192

    Gove is always on manoeuvres. He can’t help himself.

    It’s why I’ve got him covered as next PM.
    Maybe that’s the master plan all along. Cummings and Gove hype Boris up to do mad things. Gove inherits the Earth as a moderating influence. Cummings and Gove were close.
  • ByronicByronic Posts: 3,578

    Scott_P said:

    If I laugh any harder I will injure myself...

    https://twitter.com/EmmaKennedy/status/1178708715857416192

    Gove is always on manoeuvres. He can’t help himself.

    It’s why I’ve got him covered as next PM.
    Weirdly, I suspect Gove would make a pretty good PM in terms of his cleverness and adaptability.

    Trouble is he is horribly tainted now, and he looks a bit like something out Eraserhead, the Director's Cut.
  • Richard_NabaviRichard_Nabavi Posts: 30,821
    edited September 2019
    Byronic said:

    Scott_P said:

    If I laugh any harder I will injure myself...

    https://twitter.com/EmmaKennedy/status/1178708715857416192

    Gove is always on manoeuvres. He can’t help himself.

    It’s why I’ve got him covered as next PM.
    Weirdly, I suspect Gove would make a pretty good PM in terms of his cleverness and adaptability.

    Trouble is he is horribly tainted now, and he looks a bit like something out Eraserhead, the Director's Cut.
    Any replacement Tory PM would immediately be impaled on the do-or-die deadline, which is now firmly established as the most solemn vow of the Tory death-cult.
  • Jonathan said:

    Scott_P said:

    If I laugh any harder I will injure myself...

    https://twitter.com/EmmaKennedy/status/1178708715857416192

    Gove is always on manoeuvres. He can’t help himself.

    It’s why I’ve got him covered as next PM.
    Maybe that’s the master plan all along. Cummings and Gove hype Boris up to do mad things. Gove inherits the Earth as a moderating influence. Cummings and Gove were close.
    You mean Cummings has wargamed this?
  • JonathanJonathan Posts: 21,675

    Byronic said:

    Scott_P said:

    If I laugh any harder I will injure myself...

    https://twitter.com/EmmaKennedy/status/1178708715857416192

    Gove is always on manoeuvres. He can’t help himself.

    It’s why I’ve got him covered as next PM.
    Weirdly, I suspect Gove would make a pretty good PM in terms of his cleverness and adaptability.

    Trouble is he is horribly tainted now, and he looks a bit like something out Eraserhead, the Director's Cut.
    Any replacement Tory MP would immediately be impaled on the do-or-die deadline, which is now firmly established as the most solemn vow of the Tory death-cult.
    Wouldn’t ‘die’ have been the outcome?
  • Byronic said:

    Scott_P said:

    If I laugh any harder I will injure myself...

    https://twitter.com/EmmaKennedy/status/1178708715857416192

    Gove is always on manoeuvres. He can’t help himself.

    It’s why I’ve got him covered as next PM.
    Weirdly, I suspect Gove would make a pretty good PM in terms of his cleverness and adaptability.

    Trouble is he is horribly tainted now, and he looks a bit like something out Eraserhead, the Director's Cut.
    We’re finding out (in slow motion) just why Gove knifed him the first time round.

    Maybe this is the ultimate vindication for him.
  • Jonathan said:

    Byronic said:

    Scott_P said:

    If I laugh any harder I will injure myself...

    https://twitter.com/EmmaKennedy/status/1178708715857416192

    Gove is always on manoeuvres. He can’t help himself.

    It’s why I’ve got him covered as next PM.
    Weirdly, I suspect Gove would make a pretty good PM in terms of his cleverness and adaptability.

    Trouble is he is horribly tainted now, and he looks a bit like something out Eraserhead, the Director's Cut.
    Any replacement Tory MP would immediately be impaled on the do-or-die deadline, which is now firmly established as the most solemn vow of the Tory death-cult.
    Wouldn’t ‘die’ have been the outcome?
    Yes, but the replacement would be expected to honour the pledge.
  • JonathanJonathan Posts: 21,675

    Jonathan said:

    Scott_P said:

    If I laugh any harder I will injure myself...

    https://twitter.com/EmmaKennedy/status/1178708715857416192

    Gove is always on manoeuvres. He can’t help himself.

    It’s why I’ve got him covered as next PM.
    Maybe that’s the master plan all along. Cummings and Gove hype Boris up to do mad things. Gove inherits the Earth as a moderating influence. Cummings and Gove were close.
    You mean Cummings has wargamed this?
    It is surely one of the infinite possibilities he has navigated.
  • Has there ever been a Prime Minister less fit for the role than Boris Johnson?
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 123,151
    edited September 2019
    Byronic said:

    Scott_P said:

    If I laugh any harder I will injure myself...

    https://twitter.com/EmmaKennedy/status/1178708715857416192

    Gove is always on manoeuvres. He can’t help himself.

    It’s why I’ve got him covered as next PM.
    Weirdly, I suspect Gove would make a pretty good PM in terms of his cleverness and adaptability.

    Trouble is he is horribly tainted now, and he looks a bit like something out Eraserhead, the Director's Cut.
    Gove is unelectable, perhaps the only way Corbyn could win a general election would be to face Gove.

    Gove is a behind the scenes man not a leader, in any case even if he ceases to be PM rather than agree an extension Boris would remain Tory leader and Leader of the Opposition so no vacancy for Gove. Corbyn is certainly not going to make Gove PM to extend
  • justin124justin124 Posts: 11,527

    malcolmg said:

    https://twitter.com/EdConwaySky/status/1178680485574299653?s=20

    I've voting Tory.

    Hello everyone, my name is JBriskinindref2 - and I am now officially a PB Tory

    The only Tory in the village
    Tories are third in my constituency, LDs lost, or came close to, losing their deposit.

    I might have a flutter.
    So you have decided to surrender your humanity?
  • Jonathan said:

    Byronic said:

    Scott_P said:

    If I laugh any harder I will injure myself...

    https://twitter.com/EmmaKennedy/status/1178708715857416192

    Gove is always on manoeuvres. He can’t help himself.

    It’s why I’ve got him covered as next PM.
    Weirdly, I suspect Gove would make a pretty good PM in terms of his cleverness and adaptability.

    Trouble is he is horribly tainted now, and he looks a bit like something out Eraserhead, the Director's Cut.
    Any replacement Tory MP would immediately be impaled on the do-or-die deadline, which is now firmly established as the most solemn vow of the Tory death-cult.
    Wouldn’t ‘die’ have been the outcome?
    Yes, but the replacement would be expected to honour the pledge.
    I don’t think so.
  • malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 43,362
    SunnyJim said:

    malcolmg said:

    I see Boris is trying to get Scotland back on side.

    Boris Johnson tells ScotTories he will block Scotland's First Minister from COP26 global climate change summit in Glasgow and cover it in union flags

    If Boris gets Brexit done either pre or post GE what would you estimate the likelihood of Sindyref 2 being won by the SNP?

    It would surely be greater than 50/50 would it not?
    I would expect it to be won for sure. The Tories seem hellbent on forcing the issue.
  • JonathanJonathan Posts: 21,675

    Jonathan said:

    Byronic said:

    Scott_P said:

    If I laugh any harder I will injure myself...

    https://twitter.com/EmmaKennedy/status/1178708715857416192

    Gove is always on manoeuvres. He can’t help himself.

    It’s why I’ve got him covered as next PM.
    Weirdly, I suspect Gove would make a pretty good PM in terms of his cleverness and adaptability.

    Trouble is he is horribly tainted now, and he looks a bit like something out Eraserhead, the Director's Cut.
    Any replacement Tory MP would immediately be impaled on the do-or-die deadline, which is now firmly established as the most solemn vow of the Tory death-cult.
    Wouldn’t ‘die’ have been the outcome?
    Yes, but the replacement would be expected to honour the pledge.
    The sequel. Do or die harder? Seriously, why don’t all the headbangers have a week in charge. The party would be back to its senses by Christmas. And we can all move on.
  • malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 43,362
    Scott_P said:

    If I laugh any harder I will injure myself...

    https://twitter.com/EmmaKennedy/status/1178708715857416192

    I have to agree, Gove is such a bellend.
  • ByronicByronic Posts: 3,578
    edited September 2019
    OFFICIAL ANNOUNCEMENT

    I am going to start a new party.

    THE PRETEND BREXIT NEVER HAPPENED PARTY

    Our manifesto will, boldly and explicitly, make no mention of Brexit at all. Our policy is not to Brexit, or not Brexit, not to revoke, go to No Deal, press for a referendum, or endlessly extend. No, all those are for parallel universes where this odd thing tried to occur.

    In our brand new and brilliant party, Brexit simply never happened, so does not need addressing, furthermore, any mentions of "Brexit", whatever that is, will be met with a notarised raised eyebrow and a EU-compatible puzzled glance. Those who persist in mentioning Brexit, whether "Remain" or "Leave" will be given calming valerian sweets.

    Within a year of attaining power, all mentions of Brexit in print, online, on walls, and in government documents, will be entirely expunged like the hieroglyphs of Akhenaten, after the fall of the monotheistic pharaoh of Akhetaten.

    Thankyou.



  • SunnyJimSunnyJim Posts: 1,106
    malcolmg said:


    I would expect it to be won for sure. The Tories seem hellbent on forcing the issue.

    I'm 110% behind you!
  • ByronicByronic Posts: 3,578

    Has there ever been a Prime Minister less fit for the role than Boris Johnson?

    Yes. Theresa May and, oddly, David Cameron.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 123,151
    SunnyJim said:

    malcolmg said:

    I see Boris is trying to get Scotland back on side.

    Boris Johnson tells ScotTories he will block Scotland's First Minister from COP26 global climate change summit in Glasgow and cover it in union flags

    If Boris gets Brexit done either pre or post GE what would you estimate the likelihood of Sindyref 2 being won by the SNP?

    It would surely be greater than 50/50 would it not?
    Only if No Deal
  • JonathanJonathan Posts: 21,675

    Has there ever been a Prime Minister less fit for the role than Boris Johnson?

    No. Not yet at least.
  • malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 43,362
    Noo said:

    malcolmg said:

    I see Boris is trying to get Scotland back on side.

    Boris Johnson tells ScotTories he will block Scotland's First Minister from COP26 global climate change summit in Glasgow and cover it in union flags
    https://twitter.com/PhantomPower14/status/1178621160046632960

    Do you think he would be doing that if the FM was a Conservative?
    LOL, we would have some two bit nobody lording it over us with saltire banned , mind you we already have the two bit nobody in place.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 123,151
    kinabalu said:

    HYUFD said:

    Good move from Javid to promise to raise the minimum wage, targeted at precisely the working class Leave voters the Tories need to win a Tory majority

    What about nationalising the trains?

    Tomorrow?
    There are limits, rewarding work is a Tory policy, nationalising industries is not
  • malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 43,362
    HYUFD said:

    Byronic said:

    Scott_P said:

    If I laugh any harder I will injure myself...

    https://twitter.com/EmmaKennedy/status/1178708715857416192

    Gove is always on manoeuvres. He can’t help himself.

    It’s why I’ve got him covered as next PM.
    Weirdly, I suspect Gove would make a pretty good PM in terms of his cleverness and adaptability.

    Trouble is he is horribly tainted now, and he looks a bit like something out Eraserhead, the Director's Cut.
    Gove is unelectable, perhaps the only way Corbyn could win a general election would be to face Gove.

    Gove is a behind the scenes man not a leader, in any case even if he ceases to be PM rather than agree an extension Boris would remain Tory leader and Leader of the Opposition so no vacancy for Gove. Corbyn is certainly not going to make Gove PM to extend
    He has a face for radio but not the voice to go with it
  • malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 43,362
    HYUFD said:

    SunnyJim said:

    malcolmg said:

    I see Boris is trying to get Scotland back on side.

    Boris Johnson tells ScotTories he will block Scotland's First Minister from COP26 global climate change summit in Glasgow and cover it in union flags

    If Boris gets Brexit done either pre or post GE what would you estimate the likelihood of Sindyref 2 being won by the SNP?

    It would surely be greater than 50/50 would it not?
    Only if No Deal
    Rubbish
  • JonathanJonathan Posts: 21,675
    Javid surprisingly weak, is it just me? Is his heart in it?
  • rpjsrpjs Posts: 3,787
    Byronic said:

    OFFICIAL ANNOUNCEMENT

    I am going to start a new party.

    THE PRETEND BREXIT NEVER HAPPENED PARTY

    Our manifesto will, boldly and explicitly, make no mention of Brexit at all. Our policy is not to Brexit, or not Brexit, not to revoke, go to No Deal, press for a referendum, or endlessly extend. No, all those are for parallel universes where this odd thing tried to occur.

    In our brand new and brilliant party, Brexit simply never happened, so does not need addressing, furthermore, any mentions of "Brexit", whatever that is, will be met with a notarised raised eyebrow and a EU-compatible puzzled glance. Those who persist in mentioning Brexit, whether "Remain" or "Leave" will be given calming valerian sweets.

    Within a year of attaining power, all mentions of Brexit in print, online, on walls, and in government documents, will be entirely expunged like the hieroglyphs of Akhenaten, after the fall of the monotheistic pharaoh of Akhetaten.

    Thankyou.



    "He who controls the present controls the past. He who controls the past controls the future." You could call it the English Socialism Party.
  • viewcodeviewcode Posts: 22,131

    viewcode said:

    viewcode said:

    I was in Waterstones on Saturday, buying "The Rise and Fall of the British Nation: A Twentieth-Century History" (David Edgerton, ISBN: 9780141975979) when I noticed "The Cold War" by John Lewis Gaddis. I had a look at his Waterstone's page[1] and he looks interesting. Has anybody read Gaddis and if so, what did you think?


    [1] https://www.waterstones.com/author/john-lewis-gaddis/60177

    Ii have not see that!

    Might be worth a look!
    Which one: Edgerton or Gaddis?
    Both! I am drawn to the former!
    Edgerton is good, although these days he ploughs a lonely furrow. His thesis is that the modern view of twentieth-century Britain as a nation in decline is not borne out by the experiences of those at the time nor the facts, and that it and its Empire was an equal to the US and USSR and capable of remarkable innovation and growth. I figure the Leavers would like him because he regards the EU as unnecessary, and the Labour would like him because he regards Thatcher as a diversion. As the Anglosphere Leavers intend to treat the UK like the Daleks intended to treat the Earth, I think this might be a good way forward for the left instead of the hollowed-out shell of Corbynism. If OGH permits, I'll do a review next year.
  • Jonathan said:

    Javid surprisingly weak, is it just me? Is his heart in it?

    He's never been a very good speaker.
  • nico67nico67 Posts: 4,502
    For those that like courtroom drama .

    A new case set to start in Scotland later in the week to effectively allow a remedy if Bozo refuses to sign the extension letter.

    This is likely to end up in the Supreme Court and centres around the nobile officium.

    Essentially a clerk of the Scottish court can sign the extension letter to effect remedy .

    This does bring up though a difficult scenario for the EU who don’t want to be drawn in to this and would rather just have an extension letter from the PM.
  • rpjsrpjs Posts: 3,787

    Has there ever been a Prime Minister less fit for the role than Boris Johnson?

    Lord North. Possibly.
  • Byronic said:

    OFFICIAL ANNOUNCEMENT

    I am going to start a new party.

    THE PRETEND BREXIT NEVER HAPPENED PARTY

    Our manifesto will, boldly and explicitly, make no mention of Brexit at all. Our policy is not to Brexit, or not Brexit, not to revoke, go to No Deal, press for a referendum, or endlessly extend. No, all those are for parallel universes where this odd thing tried to occur.

    In our brand new and brilliant party, Brexit simply never happened, so does not need addressing, furthermore, any mentions of "Brexit", whatever that is, will be met with a notarised raised eyebrow and a EU-compatible puzzled glance. Those who persist in mentioning Brexit, whether "Remain" or "Leave" will be given calming valerian sweets.

    Within a year of attaining power, all mentions of Brexit in print, online, on walls, and in government documents, will be entirely expunged like the hieroglyphs of Akhenaten, after the fall of the monotheistic pharaoh of Akhetaten.

    Thankyou.



    I used to not be sure you were SeanT, but now..
  • Byronic said:

    OFFICIAL ANNOUNCEMENT

    I am going to start a new party.

    THE PRETEND BREXIT NEVER HAPPENED PARTY

    Our manifesto will, boldly and explicitly, make no mention of Brexit at all. Our policy is not to Brexit, or not Brexit, not to revoke, go to No Deal, press for a referendum, or endlessly extend. No, all those are for parallel universes where this odd thing tried to occur.

    In our brand new and brilliant party, Brexit simply never happened, so does not need addressing, furthermore, any mentions of "Brexit", whatever that is, will be met with a notarised raised eyebrow and a EU-compatible puzzled glance. Those who persist in mentioning Brexit, whether "Remain" or "Leave" will be given calming valerian sweets.

    Within a year of attaining power, all mentions of Brexit in print, online, on walls, and in government documents, will be entirely expunged like the hieroglyphs of Akhenaten, after the fall of the monotheistic pharaoh of Akhetaten.

    Thankyou.



    So, in short, the Labour Party?
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 123,151
    malcolmg said:

    HYUFD said:

    Byronic said:

    Scott_P said:

    If I laugh any harder I will injure myself...

    https://twitter.com/EmmaKennedy/status/1178708715857416192

    Gove is always on manoeuvres. He can’t help himself.

    It’s why I’ve got him covered as next PM.
    Weirdly, I suspect Gove would make a pretty good PM in terms of his cleverness and adaptability.

    Trouble is he is horribly tainted now, and he looks a bit like something out Eraserhead, the Director's Cut.
    Gove is unelectable, perhaps the only way Corbyn could win a general election would be to face Gove.

    Gove is a behind the scenes man not a leader, in any case even if he ceases to be PM rather than agree an extension Boris would remain Tory leader and Leader of the Opposition so no vacancy for Gove. Corbyn is certainly not going to make Gove PM to extend
    He has a face for radio but not the voice to go with it
    That did make me laugh!
  • spudgfshspudgfsh Posts: 1,494

    Has there ever been a Prime Minister less fit for the role than Boris Johnson?

    You could name a few because of the disasters that they unleashed on the country but very few have been shown up so quickly.
  • TGOHF2TGOHF2 Posts: 584
    edited September 2019
    Scott tweets a random Arsenal fan who seems to like all of his own tweets.

    I’m convinced...



  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 123,151
    Byronic said:

    Has there ever been a Prime Minister less fit for the role than Boris Johnson?

    Yes. Theresa May and, oddly, David Cameron.
    And Gordon Brown
  • The_TaxmanThe_Taxman Posts: 2,979
    viewcode said:

    viewcode said:

    viewcode said:

    I was in Waterstones on Saturday, buying "The Rise and Fall of the British Nation: A Twentieth-Century History" (David Edgerton, ISBN: 9780141975979) when I noticed "The Cold War" by John Lewis Gaddis. I had a look at his Waterstone's page[1] and he looks interesting. Has anybody read Gaddis and if so, what did you think?


    [1] https://www.waterstones.com/author/john-lewis-gaddis/60177

    Ii have not see that!

    Might be worth a look!
    Which one: Edgerton or Gaddis?
    Both! I am drawn to the former!
    Edgerton is good, although these days he ploughs a lonely furrow. His thesis is that the modern view of twentieth-century Britain as a nation in decline is not borne out by the experiences of those at the time nor the facts, and that it and its Empire was an equal to the US and USSR and capable of remarkable innovation and growth. I figure the Leavers would like him because he regards the EU as unnecessary, and the Labour would like him because he regards Thatcher as a diversion. As the Anglosphere Leavers intend to treat the UK like the Daleks intended to treat the Earth, I think this might be a good way forward for the left instead of the hollowed-out shell of Corbynism. If OGH permits, I'll do a review next year.
    Thank you for the synopsis!

    I will try to look at this!

  • justin124 said:

    malcolmg said:

    https://twitter.com/EdConwaySky/status/1178680485574299653?s=20

    I've voting Tory.

    Hello everyone, my name is JBriskinindref2 - and I am now officially a PB Tory

    The only Tory in the village
    Tories are third in my constituency, LDs lost, or came close to, losing their deposit.

    I might have a flutter.
    So you have decided to surrender your humanity?
    It is a shame. But I'm a policy focused kinda guy. And 10 fifty was just what the doctor ordered.
  • Byronic said:
    The kindest possible spin you can put on this is that the man is an imbecile.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 123,151
    edited September 2019
    spudgfsh said:

    Has there ever been a Prime Minister less fit for the role than Boris Johnson?

    You could name a few because of the disasters that they unleashed on the country but very few have been shown up so quickly.
    Boris hasn't been shown up, he is just willing to fight the diehard Remainers in the Commons and they can't stand being talked back to rather than having a PM they ignored and walked all over like May
  • The_TaxmanThe_Taxman Posts: 2,979
    HYUFD said:

    Byronic said:

    Has there ever been a Prime Minister less fit for the role than Boris Johnson?

    Yes. Theresa May and, oddly, David Cameron.
    And Gordon Brown
    Boris Johnson is as bad as GB!
  • JonathanJonathan Posts: 21,675
    spudgfsh said:

    Has there ever been a Prime Minister less fit for the role than Boris Johnson?

    You could name a few because of the disasters that they unleashed on the country but very few have been shown up so quickly.
    I suppose that’s progress. We’re getting better at exposing the duds. I begin to wonder if the job is doable in the Internet age. It would be a massive shock to the country if we ended up with a really decent, effective, competent PM. Hard to remember what that feels like.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 42,237

    Has there ever been a Prime Minister less fit for the role than Boris Johnson?

    He has some great qualities but PM is not the right outlet for them. He would be better suited to a more ceremonial role. High viz but without too much - and preferably any - direct power. Something like a mascot.
  • JonathanJonathan Posts: 21,675
    HYUFD said:

    spudgfsh said:

    Has there ever been a Prime Minister less fit for the role than Boris Johnson?

    You could name a few because of the disasters that they unleashed on the country but very few have been shown up so quickly.
    Boris hasn't been shown up, he is just willing to fight the diehard Remainers in the Commons and they can't stand being talked back to rather than having a PM they ignored and walked all over like May
    Boris is the Hans Gruber of British Politics.
  • malcolmg said:

    HYUFD said:

    Byronic said:

    Scott_P said:

    If I laugh any harder I will injure myself...

    https://twitter.com/EmmaKennedy/status/1178708715857416192

    Gove is always on manoeuvres. He can’t help himself.

    It’s why I’ve got him covered as next PM.
    Weirdly, I suspect Gove would make a pretty good PM in terms of his cleverness and adaptability.

    Trouble is he is horribly tainted now, and he looks a bit like something out Eraserhead, the Director's Cut.
    Gove is unelectable, perhaps the only way Corbyn could win a general election would be to face Gove.

    Gove is a behind the scenes man not a leader, in any case even if he ceases to be PM rather than agree an extension Boris would remain Tory leader and Leader of the Opposition so no vacancy for Gove. Corbyn is certainly not going to make Gove PM to extend
    He has a face for radio but not the voice to go with it
    Gove is that kid at school that nobody likes.
  • ByronicByronic Posts: 3,578

    Byronic said:
    The kindest possible spin you can put on this is that the man is an imbecile.
    Rowland or Hammond?
  • AnabobazinaAnabobazina Posts: 23,504

    Byronic said:

    As a way of calming things, here's some soothing if off-topic news

    THE SWEDISH NAVY IS RETURNING TO ITS VAST UNDERGROUND LAIR

    https://www.theguardian.com/world/2019/sep/30/swedish-navy-returns-to-vast-underground-hq-amid-russia-fears

    Blimey!
    How top secret can a base on an island of just 11 square miles be? Presumably one could quite easily find it?
  • SunnyJimSunnyJim Posts: 1,106
    TGOHF2 said:

    Scott tweets a random Arsenal fan who seems to like all of his own tweets.

    I’m convinced...



    The guy was even replying to himself repeatedly before a couple of remainers half-hardheartedly arrived to offer vague support of the hopeful kind.

    I think it is reasonable to infer the well of succour for remainers is pretty much dry.
  • NooNoo Posts: 2,380

    Jonathan said:

    Javid surprisingly weak, is it just me? Is his heart in it?

    He's never been a very good speaker.
    You actually listen to him? I just stare at him wondering how he managed to cram his mouth, eyes and nose into the bottom quarter of this head.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 123,151
    Jonathan said:

    Javid surprisingly weak, is it just me? Is his heart in it?

    https://twitter.com/sajidjavid/status/1178692865221939201?s=20
  • dyedwooliedyedwoolie Posts: 7,786
    Jonathan said:

    HYUFD said:

    spudgfsh said:

    Has there ever been a Prime Minister less fit for the role than Boris Johnson?

    You could name a few because of the disasters that they unleashed on the country but very few have been shown up so quickly.
    Boris hasn't been shown up, he is just willing to fight the diehard Remainers in the Commons and they can't stand being talked back to rather than having a PM they ignored and walked all over like May
    Boris is the Hans Gruber of British Politics.
    Sitting on a beach earning 20 percent
  • Byronic said:

    OFFICIAL ANNOUNCEMENT

    I am going to start a new party.

    THE PRETEND BREXIT NEVER HAPPENED PARTY

    Our manifesto will, boldly and explicitly, make no mention of Brexit at all. Our policy is not to Brexit, or not Brexit, not to revoke, go to No Deal, press for a referendum, or endlessly extend. No, all those are for parallel universes where this odd thing tried to occur.

    In our brand new and brilliant party, Brexit simply never happened, so does not need addressing, furthermore, any mentions of "Brexit", whatever that is, will be met with a notarised raised eyebrow and a EU-compatible puzzled glance. Those who persist in mentioning Brexit, whether "Remain" or "Leave" will be given calming valerian sweets.

    Within a year of attaining power, all mentions of Brexit in print, online, on walls, and in government documents, will be entirely expunged like the hieroglyphs of Akhenaten, after the fall of the monotheistic pharaoh of Akhetaten.

    Thankyou.



    I used to not be sure you were SeanT, but now..
    https://twitter.com/thomasknox/status/1178726306529325057?s=19
  • AnabobazinaAnabobazina Posts: 23,504
    TGOHF2 said:

    Scott tweets a random Arsenal fan who seems to like all of his own tweets.

    I’m convinced...




    Is that William of Orange on your avatar?
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 42,892
    kinabalu said:

    Has there ever been a Prime Minister less fit for the role than Boris Johnson?

    He has some great qualities but PM is not the right outlet for them. He would be better suited to a more ceremonial role. High viz but without too much - and preferably any - direct power. Something like a mascot.
    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2015/jun/23/partick-thistle-mascot-david-shrigley-kingley

    Like this one? But it's in Glasgow, so probably neither he nor the city would regard each other as suitable.
  • spudgfshspudgfsh Posts: 1,494
    Jonathan said:

    spudgfsh said:

    Has there ever been a Prime Minister less fit for the role than Boris Johnson?

    You could name a few because of the disasters that they unleashed on the country but very few have been shown up so quickly.
    I suppose that’s progress. We’re getting better at exposing the duds. I begin to wonder if the job is doable in the Internet age. It would be a massive shock to the country if we ended up with a really decent, effective, competent PM. Hard to remember what that feels like.
    Tony Blair in the 1990s, up to and including 10/09/2001. He knew what he could do and more importantly what he couldn't. he brought the country with him for some of the major changes he made. it can be seen by the fact that they haven't been repealed. (only GBs overly complex tax credits got that)
  • JohnOJohnO Posts: 4,291

    Byronic said:

    OFFICIAL ANNOUNCEMENT

    I am going to start a new party.

    THE PRETEND BREXIT NEVER HAPPENED PARTY

    Our manifesto will, boldly and explicitly, make no mention of Brexit at all. Our policy is not to Brexit, or not Brexit, not to revoke, go to No Deal, press for a referendum, or endlessly extend. No, all those are for parallel universes where this odd thing tried to occur.

    In our brand new and brilliant party, Brexit simply never happened, so does not need addressing, furthermore, any mentions of "Brexit", whatever that is, will be met with a notarised raised eyebrow and a EU-compatible puzzled glance. Those who persist in mentioning Brexit, whether "Remain" or "Leave" will be given calming valerian sweets.

    Within a year of attaining power, all mentions of Brexit in print, online, on walls, and in government documents, will be entirely expunged like the hieroglyphs of Akhenaten, after the fall of the monotheistic pharaoh of Akhetaten.

    Thankyou.



    I used to not be sure you were SeanT, but now..
    https://twitter.com/thomasknox/status/1178726306529325057?s=19
    Coincidences happen all the time: doesn’t mean a thing. Byronic was simply plagiarising an above average insight from Sean Thomas. I agree he should have acknowledged the reference but it’s hardly a capital offence.
  • JonathanJonathan Posts: 21,675
    JohnO said:

    Byronic said:

    OFFICIAL ANNOUNCEMENT

    I am going to start a new party.

    THE PRETEND BREXIT NEVER HAPPENED PARTY

    Our manifesto will, boldly and explicitly, make no mention of Brexit at all. Our policy is not to Brexit, or not Brexit, not to revoke, go to No Deal, press for a referendum, or endlessly extend. No, all those are for parallel universes where this odd thing tried to occur.

    In our brand new and brilliant party, Brexit simply never happened, so does not need addressing, furthermore, any mentions of "Brexit", whatever that is, will be met with a notarised raised eyebrow and a EU-compatible puzzled glance. Those who persist in mentioning Brexit, whether "Remain" or "Leave" will be given calming valerian sweets.

    Within a year of attaining power, all mentions of Brexit in print, online, on walls, and in government documents, will be entirely expunged like the hieroglyphs of Akhenaten, after the fall of the monotheistic pharaoh of Akhetaten.

    Thankyou.



    I used to not be sure you were SeanT, but now..
    https://twitter.com/thomasknox/status/1178726306529325057?s=19
    Coincidences happen all the time: doesn’t mean a thing. Byronic was simply plagiarising an above average insight from Sean Thomas. I agree he should have acknowledged the reference but it’s hardly a capital offence.
    JohnO are you still a Conservative (ie have you left the party)?
  • HYUFD said:

    kinabalu said:

    HYUFD said:

    Good move from Javid to promise to raise the minimum wage, targeted at precisely the working class Leave voters the Tories need to win a Tory majority

    What about nationalising the trains?

    Tomorrow?
    There are limits, rewarding work is a Tory policy, nationalising industries is not
    Tories reward inheritance more than work.
  • viewcodeviewcode Posts: 22,131
    edited September 2019
    JohnO said:

    Byronic said:

    OFFICIAL ANNOUNCEMENT

    I am going to start a new party.

    THE PRETEND BREXIT NEVER HAPPENED PARTY

    Our manifesto will, boldly and explicitly, make no mention of Brexit at all. Our policy is not to Brexit, or not Brexit, not to revoke, go to No Deal, press for a referendum, or endlessly extend. No, all those are for parallel universes where this odd thing tried to occur.

    In our brand new and brilliant party, Brexit simply never happened, so does not need addressing, furthermore, any mentions of "Brexit", whatever that is, will be met with a notarised raised eyebrow and a EU-compatible puzzled glance. Those who persist in mentioning Brexit, whether "Remain" or "Leave" will be given calming valerian sweets.

    Within a year of attaining power, all mentions of Brexit in print, online, on walls, and in government documents, will be entirely expunged like the hieroglyphs of Akhenaten, after the fall of the monotheistic pharaoh of Akhetaten.

    Thankyou.



    I used to not be sure you were SeanT, but now..
    https://twitter.com/thomasknox/status/1178726306529325057?s=19
    Coincidences happen all the time: doesn’t mean a thing. Byronic was simply plagiarising an above average insight from Sean Thomas. I agree he should have acknowledged the reference but it’s hardly a capital offence.
    Indeed. It's merely a coincidence. What other explanation could there possibly be?
  • JohnOJohnO Posts: 4,291
    Jonathan said:

    JohnO said:

    Byronic said:

    OFFICIAL ANNOUNCEMENT

    I am going to start a new party.

    THE PRETEND BREXIT NEVER HAPPENED PARTY

    Our manifesto will, boldly and explicitly, make no mention of Brexit at all. Our policy is not to Brexit, or not Brexit, not to revoke, go to No Deal, press for a referendum, or endlessly extend. No, all those are for parallel universes where this odd thing tried to occur.

    In our brand new and brilliant party, Brexit simply never happened, so does not need addressing, furthermore, any mentions of "Brexit", whatever that is, will be met with a notarised raised eyebrow and a EU-compatible puzzled glance. Those who persist in mentioning Brexit, whether "Remain" or "Leave" will be given calming valerian sweets.

    Within a year of attaining power, all mentions of Brexit in print, online, on walls, and in government documents, will be entirely expunged like the hieroglyphs of Akhenaten, after the fall of the monotheistic pharaoh of Akhetaten.

    Thankyou.



    I used to not be sure you were SeanT, but now..
    https://twitter.com/thomasknox/status/1178726306529325057?s=19
    Coincidences happen all the time: doesn’t mean a thing. Byronic was simply plagiarising an above average insight from Sean Thomas. I agree he should have acknowledged the reference but it’s hardly a capital offence.
    JohnO are you still a Conservative (ie have you left the party)?
    I am very much a Conservative and Indeed the life and soul of the Party.
  • ByronicByronic Posts: 3,578
    Jonathan said:

    spudgfsh said:

    Has there ever been a Prime Minister less fit for the role than Boris Johnson?

    You could name a few because of the disasters that they unleashed on the country but very few have been shown up so quickly.
    I suppose that’s progress. We’re getting better at exposing the duds. I begin to wonder if the job is doable in the Internet age. It would be a massive shock to the country if we ended up with a really decent, effective, competent PM. Hard to remember what that feels like.
    I sincerely wonder if democracy itself is doable in the internet age, amidst the whirling madness of social media. China has it right, in some ways. Tragically,
  • ByronicByronic Posts: 3,578
    JohnO said:

    Byronic said:

    OFFICIAL ANNOUNCEMENT

    I am going to start a new party.

    THE PRETEND BREXIT NEVER HAPPENED PARTY

    Our manifesto will, boldly and explicitly, make no mention of Brexit at all. Our policy is not to Brexit, or not Brexit, not to revoke, go to No Deal, press for a referendum, or endlessly extend. No, all those are for parallel universes where this odd thing tried to occur.

    In our brand new and brilliant party, Brexit simply never happened, so does not need addressing, furthermore, any mentions of "Brexit", whatever that is, will be met with a notarised raised eyebrow and a EU-compatible puzzled glance. Those who persist in mentioning Brexit, whether "Remain" or "Leave" will be given calming valerian sweets.

    Within a year of attaining power, all mentions of Brexit in print, online, on walls, and in government documents, will be entirely expunged like the hieroglyphs of Akhenaten, after the fall of the monotheistic pharaoh of Akhetaten.

    Thankyou.



    I used to not be sure you were SeanT, but now..
    https://twitter.com/thomasknox/status/1178726306529325057?s=19
    Coincidences happen all the time: doesn’t mean a thing. Byronic was simply plagiarising an above average insight from Sean Thomas. I agree he should have acknowledged the reference but it’s hardly a capital offence.
    SeanT must be lurking on here, watching what I write! Wanker.
  • DruttDrutt Posts: 1,124
    edited September 2019

    Byronic said:

    OFFICIAL ANNOUNCEMENT

    I am going to start a new party.

    THE PRETEND BREXIT NEVER HAPPENED PARTY

    Our manifesto will, boldly and explicitly, make no mention of Brexit at all. Our policy is not to Brexit, or not Brexit, not to revoke, go to No Deal, press for a referendum, or endlessly extend. No, all those are for parallel universes where this odd thing tried to occur.

    In our brand new and brilliant party, Brexit simply never happened, so does not need addressing, furthermore, any mentions of "Brexit", whatever that is, will be met with a notarised raised eyebrow and a EU-compatible puzzled glance. Those who persist in mentioning Brexit, whether "Remain" or "Leave" will be given calming valerian sweets.

    Within a year of attaining power, all mentions of Brexit in print, online, on walls, and in government documents, will be entirely expunged like the hieroglyphs of Akhenaten, after the fall of the monotheistic pharaoh of Akhetaten.

    Thankyou.



    I used to not be sure you were SeanT, but now..
    https://twitter.com/thomasknox/status/1178726306529325057?s=19
    Credit to SeanT for leading us on for this long (or to Byronic for having laid this tempting trail of 18th dynasty breadcrumbs)

    Ps it's culturally insensitive not to refer to Akhetaten by his chosen pronoun Amenhotep III.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 123,151
    edited September 2019
    Byronic said:

    Jonathan said:

    spudgfsh said:

    Has there ever been a Prime Minister less fit for the role than Boris Johnson?

    You could name a few because of the disasters that they unleashed on the country but very few have been shown up so quickly.
    I suppose that’s progress. We’re getting better at exposing the duds. I begin to wonder if the job is doable in the Internet age. It would be a massive shock to the country if we ended up with a really decent, effective, competent PM. Hard to remember what that feels like.
    I sincerely wonder if democracy itself is doable in the internet age, amidst the whirling madness of social media. China has it right, in some ways. Tragically,
    No it doesn't, China has brutal suppression of opposition, human rights abuses and slowing economic growth.

    Democratic India does it better
  • NooNoo Posts: 2,380

    HYUFD said:

    kinabalu said:

    HYUFD said:

    Good move from Javid to promise to raise the minimum wage, targeted at precisely the working class Leave voters the Tories need to win a Tory majority

    What about nationalising the trains?

    Tomorrow?
    There are limits, rewarding work is a Tory policy, nationalising industries is not
    Tories reward inheritance more than work.
    +1
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 123,151

    HYUFD said:

    kinabalu said:

    HYUFD said:

    Good move from Javid to promise to raise the minimum wage, targeted at precisely the working class Leave voters the Tories need to win a Tory majority

    What about nationalising the trains?

    Tomorrow?
    There are limits, rewarding work is a Tory policy, nationalising industries is not
    Tories reward inheritance more than work.
    They reward both, creating wealth and preserving it for your family
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 123,151
    Jonathan said:

    spudgfsh said:

    Has there ever been a Prime Minister less fit for the role than Boris Johnson?

    You could name a few because of the disasters that they unleashed on the country but very few have been shown up so quickly.
    I suppose that’s progress. We’re getting better at exposing the duds. I begin to wonder if the job is doable in the Internet age. It would be a massive shock to the country if we ended up with a really decent, effective, competent PM. Hard to remember what that feels like.
    Margaret Thatcher
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 42,892

    HYUFD said:

    kinabalu said:

    HYUFD said:

    Good move from Javid to promise to raise the minimum wage, targeted at precisely the working class Leave voters the Tories need to win a Tory majority

    What about nationalising the trains?

    Tomorrow?
    There are limits, rewarding work is a Tory policy, nationalising industries is not
    Tories reward inheritance more than work.
    But only of approved nuclear families. Even nephews and nieces don't count.
  • SunnyJimSunnyJim Posts: 1,106
    spudgfsh said:


    Tony Blair in the 1990s, up to and including 10/09/2001. He knew what he could do and more importantly what he couldn't. he brought the country with him for some of the major changes he made. it can be seen by the fact that they haven't been repealed. (only GBs overly complex tax credits got that)

    Blair forced Brown to follow Tory spending plans for the first term continuing on the excellent economic work of the Conservatives.

    In fact, as I recall, around 2001 they could have almost abolished income tax with the budget surplus they had accrued following Conservatives plans.

    ABOLISH INCOME TAX...let than sink in for a moment in the context of the boost to the economy we could have had.
  • spudgfsh said:

    Jonathan said:

    spudgfsh said:

    Has there ever been a Prime Minister less fit for the role than Boris Johnson?

    You could name a few because of the disasters that they unleashed on the country but very few have been shown up so quickly.
    I suppose that’s progress. We’re getting better at exposing the duds. I begin to wonder if the job is doable in the Internet age. It would be a massive shock to the country if we ended up with a really decent, effective, competent PM. Hard to remember what that feels like.
    Tony Blair in the 1990s, up to and including 10/09/2001. He knew what he could do and more importantly what he couldn't. he brought the country with him for some of the major changes he made. it can be seen by the fact that they haven't been repealed. (only GBs overly complex tax credits got that)
    The only one of importance was the one that will bring about the ending of Unity on these islands.

    I have always hated Tony Blair.
  • spudgfshspudgfsh Posts: 1,494
    SunnyJim said:

    spudgfsh said:


    Tony Blair in the 1990s, up to and including 10/09/2001. He knew what he could do and more importantly what he couldn't. he brought the country with him for some of the major changes he made. it can be seen by the fact that they haven't been repealed. (only GBs overly complex tax credits got that)

    Blair forced Brown to follow Tory spending plans for the first term continuing on the excellent economic work of the Conservatives.

    In fact, as I recall, around 2001 they could have almost abolished income tax with the budget surplus they had accrued following Conservatives plans.

    ABOLISH INCOME TAX...let than sink in for a moment in the context of the boost to the economy we could have had.
    The budget surplus was because GB sold the gold reserves at $500 an ounce. just before it went to $1000 an ounce
  • justin124justin124 Posts: 11,527

    justin124 said:

    malcolmg said:

    https://twitter.com/EdConwaySky/status/1178680485574299653?s=20

    I've voting Tory.

    Hello everyone, my name is JBriskinindref2 - and I am now officially a PB Tory

    The only Tory in the village
    Tories are third in my constituency, LDs lost, or came close to, losing their deposit.

    I might have a flutter.
    So you have decided to surrender your humanity?
    It is a shame. But I'm a policy focused kinda guy. And 10 fifty was just what the doctor ordered.
    Apparently Labour is already committed to £10 an hour from 2020 - thereafter increased with inflation. Likely to imply £11 by 2024.
  • TGOHF2TGOHF2 Posts: 584

    TGOHF2 said:

    Scott tweets a random Arsenal fan who seems to like all of his own tweets.

    I’m convinced...




    Is that William of Orange on your avatar?
    Who brought us the glorious revolution...
  • NooNoo Posts: 2,380
    Byronic said:

    Jonathan said:

    spudgfsh said:

    Has there ever been a Prime Minister less fit for the role than Boris Johnson?

    You could name a few because of the disasters that they unleashed on the country but very few have been shown up so quickly.
    I suppose that’s progress. We’re getting better at exposing the duds. I begin to wonder if the job is doable in the Internet age. It would be a massive shock to the country if we ended up with a really decent, effective, competent PM. Hard to remember what that feels like.
    I sincerely wonder if democracy itself is doable in the internet age, amidst the whirling madness of social media. China has it right, in some ways. Tragically,
    China has concentration camps for Muslims. That's not quite Conservative policy. Yet.
  • CyclefreeCyclefree Posts: 25,318
    edited September 2019
    viewcode said:

    I was in Waterstones on Saturday, buying "The Rise and Fall of the British Nation: A Twentieth-Century History" (David Edgerton, ISBN: 9780141975979) when I noticed "The Cold War" by John Lewis Gaddis. I had a look at his Waterstone's page[1] and he looks interesting. Has anybody read Gaddis and if so, what did you think?


    [1] https://www.waterstones.com/author/john-lewis-gaddis/60177

    I have. A few years ago but recall finding it interesting. Note it does not pretend to be a comprehensive account of the Cold War. More an analysis of key aspects of it.
  • JohnO said:

    Byronic said:

    OFFICIAL ANNOUNCEMENT

    I am going to start a new party.

    THE PRETEND BREXIT NEVER HAPPENED PARTY

    Our manifesto will, boldly and explicitly, make no mention of Brexit at all. Our policy is not to Brexit, or not Brexit, not to revoke, go to No Deal, press for a referendum, or endlessly extend. No, all those are for parallel universes where this odd thing tried to occur.

    In our brand new and brilliant party, Brexit simply never happened, so does not need addressing, furthermore, any mentions of "Brexit", whatever that is, will be met with a notarised raised eyebrow and a EU-compatible puzzled glance. Those who persist in mentioning Brexit, whether "Remain" or "Leave" will be given calming valerian sweets.

    Within a year of attaining power, all mentions of Brexit in print, online, on walls, and in government documents, will be entirely expunged like the hieroglyphs of Akhenaten, after the fall of the monotheistic pharaoh of Akhetaten.

    Thankyou.



    I used to not be sure you were SeanT, but now..
    https://twitter.com/thomasknox/status/1178726306529325057?s=19
    Coincidences happen all the time: doesn’t mean a thing. Byronic was simply plagiarising an above average insight from Sean Thomas. I agree he should have acknowledged the reference but it’s hardly a capital offence.
    As Byron himself would have known, bad poets borrow, great poets steal.
  • HYUFD said:

    kinabalu said:

    HYUFD said:

    Good move from Javid to promise to raise the minimum wage, targeted at precisely the working class Leave voters the Tories need to win a Tory majority

    What about nationalising the trains?

    Tomorrow?
    There are limits, rewarding work is a Tory policy, nationalising industries is not
    Tories reward inheritance more than work.
    Not to mention buy to let.
  • justin124justin124 Posts: 11,527
    HYUFD said:

    Jonathan said:

    spudgfsh said:

    Has there ever been a Prime Minister less fit for the role than Boris Johnson?

    You could name a few because of the disasters that they unleashed on the country but very few have been shown up so quickly.
    I suppose that’s progress. We’re getting better at exposing the duds. I begin to wonder if the job is doable in the Internet age. It would be a massive shock to the country if we ended up with a really decent, effective, competent PM. Hard to remember what that feels like.
    Margaret Thatcher
    But she was malign in a different way - thoroughly unchristian PM.
  • justin124 said:

    justin124 said:

    malcolmg said:

    https://twitter.com/EdConwaySky/status/1178680485574299653?s=20

    I've voting Tory.

    Hello everyone, my name is JBriskinindref2 - and I am now officially a PB Tory

    The only Tory in the village
    Tories are third in my constituency, LDs lost, or came close to, losing their deposit.

    I might have a flutter.
    So you have decided to surrender your humanity?
    It is a shame. But I'm a policy focused kinda guy. And 10 fifty was just what the doctor ordered.
    Apparently Labour is already committed to £10 an hour from 2020 - thereafter increased with inflation. Likely to imply £11 by 2024.
    I'd rather have the Tories in control of national finances. Labour seem to struggle with a calculator nowadays (or under Brown, basic Keynsian economics)
  • spudgfshspudgfsh Posts: 1,494

    spudgfsh said:

    Jonathan said:

    spudgfsh said:

    Has there ever been a Prime Minister less fit for the role than Boris Johnson?

    You could name a few because of the disasters that they unleashed on the country but very few have been shown up so quickly.
    I suppose that’s progress. We’re getting better at exposing the duds. I begin to wonder if the job is doable in the Internet age. It would be a massive shock to the country if we ended up with a really decent, effective, competent PM. Hard to remember what that feels like.
    Tony Blair in the 1990s, up to and including 10/09/2001. He knew what he could do and more importantly what he couldn't. he brought the country with him for some of the major changes he made. it can be seen by the fact that they haven't been repealed. (only GBs overly complex tax credits got that)
    The only one of importance was the one that will bring about the ending of Unity on these islands.

    I have always hated Tony Blair.
    if it had been a change to a federal system (with the English regions getting devolved government) it would have worked better.
  • spudgfsh said:

    SunnyJim said:

    spudgfsh said:


    Tony Blair in the 1990s, up to and including 10/09/2001. He knew what he could do and more importantly what he couldn't. he brought the country with him for some of the major changes he made. it can be seen by the fact that they haven't been repealed. (only GBs overly complex tax credits got that)

    Blair forced Brown to follow Tory spending plans for the first term continuing on the excellent economic work of the Conservatives.

    In fact, as I recall, around 2001 they could have almost abolished income tax with the budget surplus they had accrued following Conservatives plans.

    ABOLISH INCOME TAX...let than sink in for a moment in the context of the boost to the economy we could have had.
    The budget surplus was because GB sold the gold reserves at $500 an ounce. just before it went to $1000 an ounce
    What are the council houses worth now?
  • SunnyJim said:

    spudgfsh said:


    Tony Blair in the 1990s, up to and including 10/09/2001. He knew what he could do and more importantly what he couldn't. he brought the country with him for some of the major changes he made. it can be seen by the fact that they haven't been repealed. (only GBs overly complex tax credits got that)

    Blair forced Brown to follow Tory spending plans for the first term continuing on the excellent economic work of the Conservatives.

    In fact, as I recall, around 2001 they could have almost abolished income tax with the budget surplus they had accrued following Conservatives plans.

    ABOLISH INCOME TAX...let than sink in for a moment in the context of the boost to the economy we could have had.
    You'd be roughly doubling everyone's take-home pay in that scenario. I suspect the inflationary implications would be non-trivial.
  • kinabalu said:

    Has there ever been a Prime Minister less fit for the role than Boris Johnson?

    He has some great qualities but PM is not the right outlet for them. He would be better suited to a more ceremonial role. High viz but without too much - and preferably any - direct power. Something like a mascot.
    More likely would be as a warning to others of how not to get things done...
  • JonathanJonathan Posts: 21,675
    One month to go to do or die Brexit day and no-one has the foggiest clue what is going to happen. Whatever your politics, that's not a great state of affairs.
  • spudgfsh said:

    spudgfsh said:

    Jonathan said:

    spudgfsh said:

    Has there ever been a Prime Minister less fit for the role than Boris Johnson?

    You could name a few because of the disasters that they unleashed on the country but very few have been shown up so quickly.
    I suppose that’s progress. We’re getting better at exposing the duds. I begin to wonder if the job is doable in the Internet age. It would be a massive shock to the country if we ended up with a really decent, effective, competent PM. Hard to remember what that feels like.
    Tony Blair in the 1990s, up to and including 10/09/2001. He knew what he could do and more importantly what he couldn't. he brought the country with him for some of the major changes he made. it can be seen by the fact that they haven't been repealed. (only GBs overly complex tax credits got that)
    The only one of importance was the one that will bring about the ending of Unity on these islands.

    I have always hated Tony Blair.
    if it had been a change to a federal system (with the English regions getting devolved government) it would have worked better.
    I'm all for a Federal UK. As has been hinted at already on this thread, the break-up of these islands is now on the cards.
  • justin124justin124 Posts: 11,527

    justin124 said:

    justin124 said:

    malcolmg said:

    https://twitter.com/EdConwaySky/status/1178680485574299653?s=20

    I've voting Tory.

    Hello everyone, my name is JBriskinindref2 - and I am now officially a PB Tory

    The only Tory in the village
    Tories are third in my constituency, LDs lost, or came close to, losing their deposit.

    I might have a flutter.
    So you have decided to surrender your humanity?
    It is a shame. But I'm a policy focused kinda guy. And 10 fifty was just what the doctor ordered.
    Apparently Labour is already committed to £10 an hour from 2020 - thereafter increased with inflation. Likely to imply £11 by 2024.
    I'd rather have the Tories in control of national finances. Labour seem to struggle with a calculator nowadays (or under Brown, basic Keynsian economics)
    Despite having found their own Magic Moneytree? The Tories left the country facing economic crisis in both October 1964 and March 1974.
  • HYUFD said:

    spudgfsh said:

    Has there ever been a Prime Minister less fit for the role than Boris Johnson?

    You could name a few because of the disasters that they unleashed on the country but very few have been shown up so quickly.
    Boris hasn't been shown up, he is just willing to fight the diehard Remainers in the Commons and they can't stand being talked back to rather than having a PM they ignored and walked all over like May
    If he was 'willing to fight the diehard Remainers in the Commons' why did he try to shut it down for 5 weeks?

    Your man is a dud.
  • justin124 said:

    justin124 said:

    justin124 said:

    malcolmg said:

    https://twitter.com/EdConwaySky/status/1178680485574299653?s=20

    I've voting Tory.

    Hello everyone, my name is JBriskinindref2 - and I am now officially a PB Tory

    The only Tory in the village
    Tories are third in my constituency, LDs lost, or came close to, losing their deposit.

    I might have a flutter.
    So you have decided to surrender your humanity?
    It is a shame. But I'm a policy focused kinda guy. And 10 fifty was just what the doctor ordered.
    Apparently Labour is already committed to £10 an hour from 2020 - thereafter increased with inflation. Likely to imply £11 by 2024.
    I'd rather have the Tories in control of national finances. Labour seem to struggle with a calculator nowadays (or under Brown, basic Keynsian economics)
    Despite having found their own Magic Moneytree? The Tories left the country facing economic crisis in both October 1964 and March 1974.
    I was born 79 - my first political memories were of Major and despising Tony Blair for his tory lite agenda (my dad was a labour man)
  • viewcodeviewcode Posts: 22,131
    Byronic said:

    JohnO said:

    Byronic said:

    OFFICIAL ANNOUNCEMENT

    I am going to start a new party.

    THE PRETEND BREXIT NEVER HAPPENED PARTY

    Our manifesto will, boldly and explicitly, make no mention of Brexit at all. Our policy is not to Brexit, or not Brexit, not to revoke, go to No Deal, press for a referendum, or endlessly extend. No, all those are for parallel universes where this odd thing tried to occur.

    In our brand new and brilliant party, Brexit simply never happened, so does not need addressing, furthermore, any mentions of "Brexit", whatever that is, will be met with a notarised raised eyebrow and a EU-compatible puzzled glance. Those who persist in mentioning Brexit, whether "Remain" or "Leave" will be given calming valerian sweets.

    Within a year of attaining power, all mentions of Brexit in print, online, on walls, and in government documents, will be entirely expunged like the hieroglyphs of Akhenaten, after the fall of the monotheistic pharaoh of Akhetaten.

    Thankyou.



    I used to not be sure you were SeanT, but now..
    https://twitter.com/thomasknox/status/1178726306529325057?s=19
    Coincidences happen all the time: doesn’t mean a thing. Byronic was simply plagiarising an above average insight from Sean Thomas. I agree he should have acknowledged the reference but it’s hardly a capital offence.
    SeanT must be lurking on here, watching what I write! Wanker.
    No wonder. As a crossdressing international male model transitioning to a woman with a small cottage in Greece, your life is truly inspirational. It's certainly incredible.
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 57,236
    Surely, though, a GoNAfaE would only exist to:

    (1) ask for (and secure) an extension
    (2) No Confidence itself

    That could happen over the length of a Kenneth Clarke lunch.
  • TGOHF2 said:

    TGOHF2 said:

    Scott tweets a random Arsenal fan who seems to like all of his own tweets.

    I’m convinced...




    Is that William of Orange on your avatar?
    Who brought us the glorious revolution...
    That filthy foreign migrant...
This discussion has been closed.