Assuming BJ wins , who do PBers think will get the chancellor slot?
Raab, Gove or Hunt, I suspect.
He'll need to reward those who got closest to him. I suspect Rory Stewart will be out on his ear, or off to Northern Ireland, mind.
Northern Ireland would probably give Rory a win if he managed to get power sharing restarted though, plus depending on his powers as NI Sec he may have a stake in any Brexit issues affecting the Irish border/backstop. Keeping Rory where he is would be the safest option for Johnson. Rory likes committing to his roles and this would be palatable for both sides, should he choose to serve in a Johnson cabinet.
He's assured of a place in the fnal two now. Why does he need to keep saying this now, before he even knows who else will be on the members' ballot paper? It makes no sense.
Oh, it does. The more he knows it is impossible to no deal without a GE being forced, the more he needs to cement in peoples minds that his intention was to leave by date x, never mind even with no deal more time might be needed to legislate.
He's assured of a place in the fnal two now. Why does he need to keep saying this now, before he even knows who else will be on the members' ballot paper? It makes no sense.
Oh, it does. The more he knows it is impossible to no deal without a GE being forced, the more he needs to cement in peoples minds that his intention was to leave by date x, never mind even with no deal more time might be needed to legislate.
Sorry, I don't follow that.
Hes thinking ahead to a probable GE and the need to lure back BXP voters. Even if under a no deal scenario a short delay was needed it doesnt matter, it wouldn't get that far as parliament would block it and a GE would be needed.
In that situation while Farage would scream betrayal Boris would point to how unequivocal he was about needing to leave by that date, why look even other tories criticised him for brooking no delay. It adds to his narrative that any delay because of a GE was not his fault and he can be trusted to follow through on no deal.
He's assured of a place in the fnal two now. Why does he need to keep saying this now, before he even knows who else will be on the members' ballot paper? It makes no sense.
Actually, I suppose the only way in which it might make sense is if he's saying it for the EU's consumption, to try to convince them he's not bluffing when he holds the No Deal pistol to his head - and everybody else's.
How would Labour campaign if it’s their deal v Remain . And waiting very close to a GE to come out for another vote looks like desperation . And how many pro EU Labour voters would trust Corbyn to deliver .
Perhaps take a neutral position. Allow Labour MPs to campaign on either side.
I don't think it would look desperate to unveil the commitment at GE time - I think it would have great impact and also not appear too cynical because they would clearly have been moving in that direction for a long time.
You can’t take a neutral position on something like Brexit . Either Corbyn wants to leave with his preferred deal or Remain . Can you imagine the mess of a campaign. You’ll have Labour MPs coming out trashing their own cabinets deal , a few Labour Leavers saying the deals fine and then asked what’s Corbyn supposed to say .
Entering a GE with the message of Labour will negotiate its own deal which is still Brexit when the party is losing four times as many votes to pro Remain parties than to the BP is a one way ticket to oblivion . The vast majority of the country is no longer interested in compromise . I’m not interested anymore in a halfway house where the Brexiters will continue to scapegoat the EU and have Farage screaming betrayal . If I’m going to have to put up with that crap at least I’d like to still be enjoying my freedoms as an EU citizen at the same time .
Assuming BJ wins , who do PBers think will get the chancellor slot?
Raab, Gove or Hunt, I suspect.
He'll need to reward those who got closest to him. I suspect Rory Stewart will be out on his ear, or off to Northern Ireland, mind.
Northern Ireland would probably give Rory a win if he managed to get power sharing restarted though, plus depending on his powers as NI Sec he may have a stake in any Brexit issues affecting the Irish border/backstop. Keeping Rory where he is would be the safest option for Johnson. Rory likes committing to his roles and this would be palatable for both sides, should he choose to serve in a Johnson cabinet.
The country is roughly divided equally in three, a third want to leave asap, a third want to remain at all costs and a middle third who either want a pragmatic solution or do not care.
The Labour policy can only appeal to the half of the middle third who do not care. It is going to excite no-one, and is aggravating the other 5/6 of the electorate for differing reasons (being too remainy, too leavy, or being obstructive).
The proportions of the three groups are more skewed to the non-compromisers, and within that, to the Remainers.
Assuming BJ wins , who do PBers think will get the chancellor slot?
Raab, Gove or Hunt, I suspect.
He'll need to reward those who got closest to him. I suspect Rory Stewart will be out on his ear, or off to Northern Ireland, mind.
Northern Ireland would probably give Rory a win if he managed to get power sharing restarted though, plus depending on his powers as NI Sec he may have a stake in any Brexit issues affecting the Irish border/backstop. Keeping Rory where he is would be the safest option for Johnson. Rory likes committing to his roles and this would be palatable for both sides, should he choose to serve in a Johnson cabinet.
Rory to DEFRA seems plausible.
An interesting dilemma is whether he would bring prominent supporter Gavin Williamson back to cabinet. If he did Sedwill might quit (although Johnson might not mind that)
Assuming BJ wins , who do PBers think will get the chancellor slot?
Raab, Gove or Hunt, I suspect.
He'll need to reward those who got closest to him. I suspect Rory Stewart will be out on his ear, or off to Northern Ireland, mind.
Northern Ireland would probably give Rory a win if he managed to get power sharing restarted though, plus depending on his powers as NI Sec he may have a stake in any Brexit issues affecting the Irish border/backstop. Keeping Rory where he is would be the safest option for Johnson. Rory likes committing to his roles and this would be palatable for both sides, should he choose to serve in a Johnson cabinet.
Rory to DEFRA seems plausible.
Hasnt Rory repeatedly said he will not serve in a Boris cabinet? Has that changed? Or is the view when faced with the option he will change his mind/is currently posturing?
Mr. Glenn, one could just as easily say a majority want to leave, a minority to remain. You can look at those stats and draw your preferred conclusion.
From a letter in today's Telegraph SIR – . . . May I remind my fellow Conservatives that the alternatives are the Brexit Party or the Labour Party. The first has only a policy on Brexit and the second has policies on everything but Brexit?
From a letter in today's Telegraph SIR – . . . May I remind my fellow Conservatives that the alternatives are the Brexit Party or the Labour Party. The first has only a policy on Brexit and the second has policies on everything but Brexit?
Stuart Jamieson Eccleston, Lancashire
Brexit/Lab coalition. Reassuringly blue-collar, with policies across the spectrum!
You can’t take a neutral position on something like Brexit . Either Corbyn wants to leave with his preferred deal or Remain . Can you imagine the mess of a campaign. You’ll have Labour MPs coming out trashing their own cabinets deal , a few Labour Leavers saying the deals fine and then asked what’s Corbyn supposed to say .
Entering a GE with the message of Labour will negotiate its own deal which is still Brexit when the party is losing four times as many votes to pro Remain parties than to the BP is a one way ticket to oblivion . The vast majority of the country is no longer interested in compromise . I’m not interested anymore in a halfway house where the Brexiters will continue to scapegoat the EU and have Farage screaming betrayal . If I’m going to have to put up with that crap at least I’d like to still be enjoying my freedoms as an EU citizen at the same time .
There would be a Leave and Remain campaign like last time. Tories and Labour people on either side side since the issue cuts across party lines. Be messy as you say. Any which way of doing a 2nd referendum will be messy. The key point is that it will give you the route to Remain. Like me that is how you would vote. And if we win we cancel Brexit. Why would this not work for you as the Labour offering if we do get the pre-Brexit election? Remember that there is no realistic way to get the referendum other than the election of a Labour government. Or do you think there is? If you do what is it?
You can’t take a neutral position on something like Brexit . Either Corbyn wants to leave with his preferred deal or Remain . Can you imagine the mess of a campaign. You’ll have Labour MPs coming out trashing their own cabinets deal , a few Labour Leavers saying the deals fine and then asked what’s Corbyn supposed to say .
Entering a GE with the message of Labour will negotiate its own deal which is still Brexit when the party is losing four times as many votes to pro Remain parties than to the BP is a one way ticket to oblivion . The vast majority of the country is no longer interested in compromise . I’m not interested anymore in a halfway house where the Brexiters will continue to scapegoat the EU and have Farage screaming betrayal . If I’m going to have to put up with that crap at least I’d like to still be enjoying my freedoms as an EU citizen at the same time .
There would be a Leave and Remain campaign like last time. Tories and Labour people on either side side since the issue cuts across party lines. Be messy as you say. Any which way of doing a 2nd referendum will be messy. The key point is that it will give you the route to Remain. Like me that is how you would vote. And if we win we cancel Brexit. Why would this not work for you as the Labour offering if we do get the pre-Brexit election? Remember that there is no realistic way to get the referendum other than the election of a Labour government. Or do you think there is? If you do what is it?
"And if we win we cancel Brexit."
I think you are contradicting yourself. If the above quote is indeed Labour policy in the manifesto, then we will have already taken a side - the correct side. What we can't do is play wishy washy and then do the above if we are in a position to do so.
I think the best policy for Labour would be to offer a 2nd referendum with Remain as a option. That will be acceptable to most Remainers including many who have gone over to LD and the Greens. Because only Labour or a Labour coalition can actually implement this policy.
Comments
In that situation while Farage would scream betrayal Boris would point to how unequivocal he was about needing to leave by that date, why look even other tories criticised him for brooking no delay. It adds to his narrative that any delay because of a GE was not his fault and he can be trusted to follow through on no deal.
Entering a GE with the message of Labour will negotiate its own deal which is still Brexit when the party is losing four times as many votes to pro Remain parties than to the BP is a one way ticket to oblivion . The vast majority of the country is no longer interested in compromise . I’m not interested anymore in a halfway house where the Brexiters will continue to scapegoat the EU and have Farage screaming betrayal . If I’m going to have to put up with that crap at least I’d like to still be enjoying my freedoms as an EU citizen at the same time .
inevitable
SIR – . . . May I remind my fellow Conservatives that the alternatives are the Brexit Party or the Labour Party. The first has only a policy on Brexit and the second has policies on everything but Brexit?
Stuart Jamieson
Eccleston, Lancashire
I think you are contradicting yourself. If the above quote is indeed Labour policy in the manifesto, then we will have already taken a side - the correct side. What we can't do is play wishy washy and then do the above if we are in a position to do so.
I think the best policy for Labour would be to offer a 2nd referendum with Remain as a option. That will be acceptable to most Remainers including many who have gone over to LD and the Greens. Because only Labour or a Labour coalition can actually implement this policy.
That is what I am saying - offer the 2nd referendum with option to Remain.
And if Remain wins then Brexit is cancelled.