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  • Tissue_PriceTissue_Price Posts: 9,039
    stjohn said:

    stjohn said:

    Interesting to note that with 13 declared runners for the Tory leadership race, eighth in the betting is a non-declared runner, Penny Mordaunt. She is having her conference call with Tory party members this evening - and after that hopefully she will enter the race. What price then?

    Go on Penny, throw your hat in the ring!

    In for a Penny ....

    Top of the (Cabinet) tree, as well: https://www.conservativehome.com/thetorydiary/2019/06/mordaunt-leads-the-pack-in-our-latest-cabinet-league-table.html
    That's very good to see. Do you think she will run?
    I would assume so.
  • Tissue_PriceTissue_Price Posts: 9,039
    isam said:

    Is Raab worth a punt now? Big drift

    He's pretty popular with the members. It looks like MPs might be having doubts though.
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 51,720

    stjohn said:

    Interesting to note that with 13 declared runners for the Tory leadership race, eighth in the betting is a non-declared runner, Penny Mordaunt. She is having her conference call with Tory party members this evening - and after that hopefully she will enter the race. What price then?

    Go on Penny, throw your hat in the ring!

    In for a Penny ....

    Top of the (Cabinet) tree, as well: https://www.conservativehome.com/thetorydiary/2019/06/mordaunt-leads-the-pack-in-our-latest-cabinet-league-table.html
    I was reading that thinking "What did Andrea Leadsom do to lose favour?", forgetting that she'd resigned.
  • anothernickanothernick Posts: 3,591
    Pulpstar said:

    Speaking of investments, if one came into £300k, would it be worth speaking to an investment manager? How would you find one? No need for speculative returns.

    Pay your mortgage off, stick the rest into a basket of trackers.

    If you're renting, buy for cash and secure a big discount.
    Good advice.

    Don't invest in companies directly unless you are 100% sure of what you are doing. And most managed funds are poor value - they cost more than trackers and few beat the market over the longer term. And there is always the risk of a Woodford.......
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 42,710
    Charles said:

    Charles said:

    Foxy said:

    Hmm, wonder if this will spook the markets? Has Brexit trashed another reputation?


    https://twitter.com/FinancialTimes/status/1135799628962631680?s=19

    Good riddance - he’s killed the UK life science sector.

    (Snip)
    In what way, may I ask?
    He took 20-30% stakes in a lot of small companies without proper diligence. That stopped anyone else serious supporting them (no one wanted to be his b1tch).

    So it made them dependent on him for capital and dried up other liquidity in the space. Then when he ran out of money....
    Ah, thanks.
  • AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 29,395
    Updated numbers with the new Jeremy Hunt endorsements. About 60% of Tory MPs have declared so far.

    https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1feCjt98HJcY9tlc5Zx78ZoSOC2fN-j0vRVFD5eUTbUE/edit#gid=0
  • Awb683Awb683 Posts: 80
    Hopefully Trump will repeat his remarks about the Mayor of London.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,217
    Penny's left it too late to declare I think, the pool of available support is drying up.
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 61,808
    Mr. rkrkrk, we aren't talking about smoking and smoking isn't food. Your question is 100% irrelevant.

    One plus of this stupid story is that the James Wong Twitter account (botanygeek) looks quite interesting and I wouldn't've stumbled across it otherwise.
  • stjohnstjohn Posts: 1,861
    Pulpstar said:

    Penny's left it too late to declare I think, the pool of available support is drying up.

    She may have some backers up her sleeve already. Hope so.
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 61,808
    St John, indeed. It'd be especially good if Mordaunt declared and some of Boris' backers jumped ship.
  • OnlyLivingBoyOnlyLivingBoy Posts: 15,798
    The pussy-grabbing racist held me up for half an hour on my way to work today. It put me in a terrible mood, until I saw a hipster being attacked quite viciously by a crow, which cheered me up no end.
  • RogerRoger Posts: 19,914

    Mr. Roger, far from certain. Corbyn could well end up as PM after the next election, given how things are going.

    The population is has become so right wing Rees Mogg has a better chance
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,217
    stjohn said:

    Pulpstar said:

    Penny's left it too late to declare I think, the pool of available support is drying up.

    She may have some backers up her sleeve already. Hope so.
    She needs to dive into the contest today.
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 51,884
    Good morning, my fellow PB Stone Cold Losers :lol:
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 61,808
    Mr. Roger, I think left/right is of limited use, the leave/remain axis is at least as important now.

    I do think a lot of people have gone over towards the no deal side, but a lot have kicked back in the opposite direction as well. Intriguing to consider how the Lib Dems might do in London.
  • Scott_PScott_P Posts: 51,453

    I have to say that I am not at all impressed with TM decision to prolong her resignation as leader until the 7th June. I have been loyal to her, and consider her deal as the best on offer, but that does not mean I cannot have a go at this delay which serves no purpose but creates the space for every man/woman and their dog to stand for leader and then PM

    She made the right decision to continue as interim PM awaiting the election of her successor but the last two weeks have been painful to watch as she became irrelevant and yesterdays story

    We could have been into the leadership election already and for that I do criticise her unreservedly

    https://twitter.com/tnewtondunn/status/1135839613396951040
  • stjohnstjohn Posts: 1,861
    Pulpstar said:

    stjohn said:

    Pulpstar said:

    Penny's left it too late to declare I think, the pool of available support is drying up.

    She may have some backers up her sleeve already. Hope so.
    She needs to dive into the contest today.
    .... and get a lot of supporters out of the pool.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 42,237


    You are a loyal supporter of your party, and getting a bit defensive.

    My point is that if you are a professional voter who wants to avoid disruptive change then the LDs could easily appear the best option at present.

    A professional voter - I like the sound of that. Often thought it was too important to leave to amateurs.
  • JackWJackW Posts: 14,787
    Might I offer a word or two of caution about looking at an upcoming general election simply or mainly through the eyes of BREXIT. Clearly if we have an election in the late autumn then BREXIT will remain an important issue, however general elections rarely revolve around one issue.

    In 1945 the Conservatives, Labour and the world were astonished that Churchill was not returned, let alone demolished at the polls. Being Churchill the great war leader wasn't enough. Labour said "Cheer Churchill but vote Labour" and the masses did.

    In February 74 Heath went to the polls on the seemingly vastly popular "Who Governs Britain?" platform and the voters said not you.

    In 2017 May echoed "Strong and Stable" with massive poll leads against Jezza and then lost her majority.

    Even now we see the BREXIT Euro poll of 32% start to drift away in Westminster voting intentions.

    There is all to play for but BREXIT will not be the only game in town in a general election.

  • QuincelQuincel Posts: 4,042
    JackW said:

    Might I offer a word or two of caution about looking at an upcoming general election simply or mainly through the eyes of BREXIT. Clearly if we have an election in the late autumn then BREXIT will remain an important issue, however general elections rarely revolve around one issue.

    In 1945 the Conservatives, Labour and the world were astonished that Churchill was not returned, let alone demolished at the polls. Being Churchill the great war leader wasn't enough. Labour said "Cheer Churchill but vote Labour" and the masses did.

    In February 74 Heath went to the polls on the seemingly vastly popular "Who Governs Britain?" platform and the voters said not you.

    In 2017 May echoed "Strong and Stable" with massive poll leads against Jezza and then lost her majority.

    Even now we see the BREXIT Euro poll of 32% start to drift away in Westminster voting intentions.

    There is all to play for but BREXIT will not be the only game in town in a general election.

    I agree, it depends a lot when the election happens and the status of Brexit at the time. But as political identities have shifted from parties to Leave/Remain I think there will be significant residual 'Brexitism' as an election issue regardless.
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 60,491
    stjohn said:

    Pulpstar said:

    Penny's left it too late to declare I think, the pool of available support is drying up.

    She may have some backers up her sleeve already. Hope so.
    Let me guess: she looks very good in your book?
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 42,237
    Awb683 said:

    Hopefully Trump will repeat his remarks about the Mayor of London.

    Yes that would be terrific. I'm sure he won't let us down. Guy is a ledge.
  • GIN1138GIN1138 Posts: 22,293
    JackW said:

    Might I offer a word or two of caution about looking at an upcoming general election simply or mainly through the eyes of BREXIT. Clearly if we have an election in the late autumn then BREXIT will remain an important issue, however general elections rarely revolve around one issue.

    In 1945 the Conservatives, Labour and the world were astonished that Churchill was not returned, let alone demolished at the polls. Being Churchill the great war leader wasn't enough. Labour said "Cheer Churchill but vote Labour" and the masses did.

    In February 74 Heath went to the polls on the seemingly vastly popular "Who Governs Britain?" platform and the voters said not you.

    In 2017 May echoed "Strong and Stable" with massive poll leads against Jezza and then lost her majority.

    Even now we see the BREXIT Euro poll of 32% start to drift away in Westminster voting intentions.

    There is all to play for but BREXIT will not be the only game in town in a general election.

    I would guess "Middle England" will be getting pretty twitchy about their houses and gardens after reading todays Daily Mail! :D
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 51,884
    kinabalu said:

    Awb683 said:

    Hopefully Trump will repeat his remarks about the Mayor of London.

    Yes that would be terrific. I'm sure he won't let us down. Guy is a ledge.
    Hurry up and get Crossrail open, Sadiq!
  • ReggieCideReggieCide Posts: 4,312

    Pulpstar said:

    Speaking of investments, if one came into £300k, would it be worth speaking to an investment manager? How would you find one? No need for speculative returns.

    Pay your mortgage off, stick the rest into a basket of trackers.

    If you're renting, buy for cash and secure a big discount.
    Good advice.

    Don't invest in companies directly unless you are 100% sure of what you are doing. And most managed funds are poor value - they cost more than trackers and few beat the market over the longer term. And there is always the risk of a Woodford.......
    Pure UK & USA market trackers (ETFs) are good value, if that's where you want to put your dosh. Very hard for managed funds to do better than trackers in UK & USA. Anywhere else, particularly in emerging markets, then a proven manager and a smaller stake is probably better.
  • Richard_NabaviRichard_Nabavi Posts: 30,821
    edited June 2019

    Speaking of investments, if one came into £300k, would it be worth speaking to an investment manager? How would you find one? No need for speculative returns.

    Yes, unless you already know what you are doing you should definitely get advice from an Independent Financial Advisor. You'll have to pay for it, and the heavy regulatory burden unfortunately makes it a bit cumbersome, although you might be able to get an initial short session for free.

    The key thing will be to get advice on the overall asset allocation (which might include paying off mortgage, some cash, some equities etc) in the light of your overall financial position, attitude to risk, objectives and timescales for those objectives, also taking account of tax.

    However, beware of getting tied into long-term fees; £300K is not enough to justify ongoing investment management advice IMO.

    See here for some sensible advice on finding an IFA:

    https://www.money.co.uk/guides/5-steps-to-finding-an-ifa-you-can-trust.htm
  • NickPalmerNickPalmer Posts: 21,534
    Informative straw poll by Labour List, which on past form attracts a pretty representative sample of members (plus sympathisers):

    https://labourlist.org/2019/06/weekly-survey-results-alastair-campbell-peterborough-and-brexit/

    The email from Sienna Rodgers notes that the 60% who don't want a new leadership election overlaps heavily with the 60% who do want new deputy leadership election - probably an accurate reflection of the continuing strength of Corbynism in the membership. But it also confirm lots of members not voting Labour and majority support for a membership poll on Brexit. As Sienna says, the centre of gravity is pro-Corbyn AND pro-EU. There are a lot of members who don't actually feel that strongly about either, though.
  • stjohnstjohn Posts: 1,861

    stjohn said:

    Pulpstar said:

    Penny's left it too late to declare I think, the pool of available support is drying up.

    She may have some backers up her sleeve already. Hope so.
    Let me guess: she looks very good in your book?
    You guessed right!

    :-)
  • brendan16brendan16 Posts: 2,315
    AndyJS said:

    Updated numbers with the new Jeremy Hunt endorsements. About 60% of Tory MPs have declared so far.

    https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1feCjt98HJcY9tlc5Zx78ZoSOC2fN-j0vRVFD5eUTbUE/edit#gid=0

    Its probably worth pointing out that just because you have publicly endorsed a candidate doesn't mean you will of course vote for them even in the first round. These are Tory MPs we are talking about.
  • Scott_PScott_P Posts: 51,453
    JackW said:

    Might I offer a word or two of caution about looking at an upcoming general election simply or mainly through the eyes of BREXIT. Clearly if we have an election in the late autumn then BREXIT will remain an important issue, however general elections rarely revolve around one issue.

    There is all to play for but BREXIT will not be the only game in town in a general election.

    That may well be true, but I do think as others have noted that the cultural Brexit divide is now more important than the social/class divide in determining personal identity, and that will influence votes.

    I am tempted to suggest the effect might be similar to the evangelical Trump voters, who were likely to vote for Trump if they had no local church to attend. I can't predict how the Brexit effect will play out, but I suspect there will be something similar, where the tendency to vote along Brexit lines will be inversely correlated with some Brexit factor, like immigration
  • CiceroCicero Posts: 3,084
    Cicero said:

    malcolmg said:

    Cicero said:

    malcolmg said:

    isam said:

    tlg86 said:

    tlg86 said:

    How useful do you think that map is?

    I think the insight that the real strategic threat to the Tories comes from the Lib Dems is one of the most important facts in British politics at the moment.
    It really doesn't.
    Imagine we had an election in which neither the Tories nor Labour stood any candidates. Where would the Brexit Party win and where would the Lib Dems win? The Lib Dem wins would overlap with a large number of safe Tory seats.
    It would look a bit like this


    No it wouldn't , they would be lucky to win 1 seat in Scotland.
    Oh Dear Malcolm... as one-eyed as ever. I'll make a bet with you that the Scottish Lib Dems make gains at the next GE... what will you price me?
    what price do you want and how many are you saying they will get
    You said not one gain? They have four now, missed one more by two votes, so lets say the base is five. You still say not one gain above five?
    I'll certainly give you 10-1 on at least one gain and 2-1 they have at least 8 seats next time.. A tenner for 1 gain and 50 quid the other.

    Either way its a crisp hundred nicker if I'm wrong.

    Mind you I'm not a wealthy man as a result of taking all the bad advice on this site :-)
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,217
    Scott_P said:
    Expect astroturfing and ramping of just how brilliant x, y and z's speech was.
  • brendan16brendan16 Posts: 2,315

    kinabalu said:

    Awb683 said:

    Hopefully Trump will repeat his remarks about the Mayor of London.

    Yes that would be terrific. I'm sure he won't let us down. Guy is a ledge.
    Hurry up and get Crossrail open, Sadiq!
    You already have it in Ilford don't you - when Crossrail comes your journey to Liverpool Street will actually take longer as there is an extra stop at Whitechapel. And if you travel on the trains - the noisiest beeping doors ever, uncomfortable seats with negligible cushioning and the horrible seat layout (i.e. 90% of seats facing sidewaya) - maybe Crossrail won't be the customer experience many are hoping.

    I would literally take any other line to avoid using those trains. Still they will be popular with osteopaths and chiropractors!
  • Richard_NabaviRichard_Nabavi Posts: 30,821
    On topic: I'm on 'Boris' and 'China' at Evens, mainly because I think he'll be asked about the first and the second is rather topical.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,217
    Cicero said:

    Cicero said:

    malcolmg said:

    Cicero said:

    malcolmg said:

    isam said:

    tlg86 said:

    tlg86 said:

    How useful do you think that map is?

    I think the insight that the real strategic threat to the Tories comes from the Lib Dems is one of the most important facts in British politics at the moment.
    It really doesn't.
    Imagine we had an election in which neither the Tories nor Labour stood any candidates. Where would the Brexit Party win and where would the Lib Dems win? The Lib Dem wins would overlap with a large number of safe Tory seats.
    It would look a bit like this


    No it wouldn't , they would be lucky to win 1 seat in Scotland.
    Oh Dear Malcolm... as one-eyed as ever. I'll make a bet with you that the Scottish Lib Dems make gains at the next GE... what will you price me?
    what price do you want and how many are you saying they will get
    You said not one gain? They have four now, missed one more by two votes, so lets say the base is five. You still say not one gain above five?
    I'll certainly give you 10-1 on at least one gain and 2-1 they have at least 8 seats next time.. A tenner for 1 gain and 50 quid the other.

    Either way its a crisp hundred nicker if I'm wrong.

    Mind you I'm not a wealthy man as a result of taking all the bad advice on this site :-)
    You're offering 10-1, Lib Dems 5 or more seats but only 2-1 on 8 or more ??!
  • tottenhamWCtottenhamWC Posts: 352
    geoffw said:

    nichomar said:

    geoffw said:


    Bernard Connolly argues that the BP and Cons should form an electoral pact.
    https://blogs.spectator.co.uk/2019/06/why-the-brexit-party-might-be-wise-to-form-a-pact-with-the-tories/
    This is obvious yet it is the solution that dare not speak its name in the Tory hustings.

    There will be no way out of the Brexit conundrum without a general election, and that brings on the blues' fear of a Corbyn apocalypse. But they should not shrink back for that imagined risk. The contortions Labour will have to perform in coming to a clear position in a GE, and the threat from remain supporting LDs means that they will be seriously hampered in setting out a clear policy position. Lab will not get away with avoiding the BREXIT issue a second time.

    The candidates should now be talking about how they will cooperate with the BP in the forthcoming inevitable general election.

    How could they form a pact with a “party” that have only one policy with no idea of what else they stood for.
    There will only be one issue at the next GE.
    That didn't work well last time.... and suspect ends up with PM Corbyn is that's how the Tories define it.
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 51,884
    edited June 2019

    On topic: I'm on 'Boris' and 'China' at Evens, mainly because I think he'll be asked about the first and the second is rather topical.

    30th anniversary of Tiananmen Square this week.

    In 2015, Corbyn was perfectly OK with attending the state banquet of the Chinese President.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 71,238
    Charles said:

    Nigelb said:

    Charles said:

    Foxy said:

    Hmm, wonder if this will spook the markets? Has Brexit trashed another reputation?

    https://twitter.com/FinancialTimes/status/1135799628962631680?s=19

    Good riddance - he’s killed the UK life science sector...
    Any chance of expanding on that ?
    Replied to @JosiasJessop
    Thanks; makes sense, though 'killed' sounded a bit apocalyptic.
  • nunuonenunuone Posts: 1,138
    Fenman said:
    Fu@k off and join the libdems.


    Oh wait Tory majority is only 2 now......nevermind.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,217

    geoffw said:

    nichomar said:

    geoffw said:


    Bernard Connolly argues that the BP and Cons should form an electoral pact.
    https://blogs.spectator.co.uk/2019/06/why-the-brexit-party-might-be-wise-to-form-a-pact-with-the-tories/
    This is obvious yet it is the solution that dare not speak its name in the Tory hustings.

    There will be no way out of the Brexit conundrum without a general election, and that brings on the blues' fear of a Corbyn apocalypse. But they should not shrink back for that imagined risk. The contortions Labour will have to perform in coming to a clear position in a GE, and the threat from remain supporting LDs means that they will be seriously hampered in setting out a clear policy position. Lab will not get away with avoiding the BREXIT issue a second time.

    The candidates should now be talking about how they will cooperate with the BP in the forthcoming inevitable general election.

    How could they form a pact with a “party” that have only one policy with no idea of what else they stood for.
    There will only be one issue at the next GE.
    That didn't work well last time.... and suspect ends up with PM Corbyn is that's how the Tories define it.
    PM Corbyn with Labour going backward... in seats.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 119,679
    Another Richard and I called this a while back, cancel HS2 now.

    Ministers are looking to save billions on the plan put forward for road and rail transport in the north of England by axing Liverpool’s new railway line to HS2.

    Money for a £7bn line linking Liverpool to the HS2 high-speed railway was supposed to have been “in the bag” before October’s budget last year, only for the Treasury to carry out a last minute U-turn.

    Steve Rotheram, metro mayor of the Liverpool City Region, has revealed the government’s preferred option is to connect Liverpool to HS2 via an existing freight line. “It’s not good enough Liverpool gets second-best while London gets what it wants with Crossrail and Crossrail 2,” he said. “This decision can’t be taken in a room in Whitehall.”


    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/liverpool-hs2-link-axed-says-mayor-steve-rotheram-jsh0j0mhz
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 51,884

    Another Richard and I called this a while back, cancel HS2 now.

    Ministers are looking to save billions on the plan put forward for road and rail transport in the north of England by axing Liverpool’s new railway line to HS2.

    Money for a £7bn line linking Liverpool to the HS2 high-speed railway was supposed to have been “in the bag” before October’s budget last year, only for the Treasury to carry out a last minute U-turn.

    Steve Rotheram, metro mayor of the Liverpool City Region, has revealed the government’s preferred option is to connect Liverpool to HS2 via an existing freight line. “It’s not good enough Liverpool gets second-best while London gets what it wants with Crossrail and Crossrail 2,” he said. “This decision can’t be taken in a room in Whitehall.”


    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/liverpool-hs2-link-axed-says-mayor-steve-rotheram-jsh0j0mhz

    Crossrail hasn't even opened yet, Sadiq!
  • Ishmael_ZIshmael_Z Posts: 8,981
    JackW said:

    Might I offer a word or two of caution about looking at an upcoming general election simply or mainly through the eyes of BREXIT. Clearly if we have an election in the late autumn then BREXIT will remain an important issue, however general elections rarely revolve around one issue.

    In 1945 the Conservatives, Labour and the world were astonished that Churchill was not returned, let alone demolished at the polls. Being Churchill the great war leader wasn't enough. Labour said "Cheer Churchill but vote Labour" and the masses did.

    In February 74 Heath went to the polls on the seemingly vastly popular "Who Governs Britain?" platform and the voters said not you.

    In 2017 May echoed "Strong and Stable" with massive poll leads against Jezza and then lost her majority.

    Even now we see the BREXIT Euro poll of 32% start to drift away in Westminster voting intentions.

    There is all to play for but BREXIT will not be the only game in town in a general election.

    Indeed. You can't even make referendums be about what they are explicitly about if the voters want to use the opportunity to give Cameron a smack on the wrist over gay marriage, or just vote against him cos he's a tory toff innit. With elections, it's hopeless.
  • stodgestodge Posts: 13,900
    Morning all :)

    Like some others, I'm not entirely convinced we are witnessing the long heralded "realignment" of British politics. Yes, BXP and to a smaller extent the LDs and Greens have emerged as challengers but these are unusual circumstances in the mid term of a sitting parliament.

    If a week is a long time in politics, 156 (or three years) is an eternity. To assume temporary abandonment of allegiances is permanent would be unwise - after all, a lot of people voted LD in 2010, UKIP in 2015 and Green in 1989 and none of these "surges" lasted.

    The Conservative and Labour parties would have to display disconcerting ineptitude to lose their dominant position - the former are electorally at greater risk as their core of "safe" seats is smaller than that of Labour which can hold 150 seats by retreating into their urban fortresses.

    I think the one point I would note looking further afield is the re-emergence of Green politics around climate change concerns. Now, I'm emphatically not saying the Green Party has any of the answers and would eschew their State-oriented responses. However, encouraging r&d and supporting technological innovation toward the aim of de-carbonising the economy seems entirely laudable. I'm a huge fan of human ingenuity and there are solutions out there.

    I'm not saying there might not have to be significant lifestyle changes but perhaps the objective of a sustainable economy doesn't begin and end with how much energy we use but rather how we live, work and relax in a progressively de-carbonised world.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 42,237
    rkrkrk said:


    Do you want the ban on smoking advertising overturned? Seems obvious to me that's a good thing which has helped people live longer, healthier lives.

    I smoke - proper hard core addict - and would support an outright ban. It would make me stop. I would then probably live an extra 5 years. Might see 2 general elections that I otherwise wouldn't. Not to be sniffed at.
  • CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758
    Pulpstar said:

    Pulpstar said:

    Kent county council ffsake

    Lessons have been learnt
    Lessons have been learnt
    Lessons have been learnt
    Lessons have been learnt
    etc etc etc etc etc etc etc
    Why don't they just use broad trackers ?!
    Because advisers don’t get fees to recommend trackers and pension trustees don’t have the experience to tell advisers to GFT
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,217
    Latest Italian poll...

    LEGA-ENF: 37% (+6) <- Brexit party
    PD-S&D: 24% (+2) <- Labour
    M5S-EFDD: 18% (-5) <- Lib Dems (A very tendentious link I'll admit)
    FI-EPP: 7% (-2) <- Tories

  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 51,884
    Cleverly pulls out of leadership race - SKY News
  • brendan16brendan16 Posts: 2,315
    Pulpstar said:

    Latest Italian poll...

    LEGA-ENF: 37% (+6)

    The LEGA probably have more in common with UKIP - and for the last five years Farage (and latterly the Brexit party) have actually allied with 5 star in the EFDD and are hoping to again.
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 42,005
    Scott_P said:
    Presumably to give him a right old earful about interfering in the Tory leadership contest.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 71,238
    Scott_P said:
    In his official capacity as Environment Secretary, I'm sure...
  • DecrepitJohnLDecrepitJohnL Posts: 13,300
    Is it today that the 1922 Committee changes (or not) the rules?

    Candidates will need 100 supporters and be able to identify Mel Stride on sight, that sort of thing?
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,217
    Who will Stephen Metcalfe, Julian Knight and Colin Clark all support now ?
  • oxfordsimonoxfordsimon Posts: 5,842
    And it increases his chances of promotion under whoever wins
  • GIN1138GIN1138 Posts: 22,293
    Scott_P said:
    Wonder if he ever had any phone lines installed? :D
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 42,005
    brendan16 said:

    Pulpstar said:

    Latest Italian poll...

    LEGA-ENF: 37% (+6)

    The LEGA probably have more in common with UKIP - and for the last five years Farage (and latterly the Brexit party) have actually allied with 5 star in the EFDD and are hoping to again.

    The old slightly xenophobic, mildly racist, gently islamophobic UKIP, or the current full fat version?
  • Tissue_PriceTissue_Price Posts: 9,039
    Pulpstar said:

    Who will Stephen Metcalfe, Julian Knight and Colin Clark all support now ?

    And me. A pity, but clearly the votes weren't there, and he's probably smart to be the first to withdraw. Potentially good news for Mordaunt, who's diving in a similar pool.
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 63,133
    kinabalu said:

    rkrkrk said:


    Do you want the ban on smoking advertising overturned? Seems obvious to me that's a good thing which has helped people live longer, healthier lives.

    I smoke - proper hard core addict - and would support an outright ban. It would make me stop. I would then probably live an extra 5 years. Might see 2 general elections that I otherwise wouldn't. Not to be sniffed at.
    Giving up smoking saved my life according to our practice nurse. I stopped 15 years ago after my daughter told me I would have to wash my hands if I wanted to cuddle my new born granddaughter. It was very difficult but I did it and have saved thousands of pounds and enjoyed health benefits including preventing my copd becoming critical

    Giving up smoking is a no brainer and I do hope you take the courageous decision to stop and enjoy a much enriched life and lots of money saved. Go on, you can do it.
  • Ishmael_ZIshmael_Z Posts: 8,981
    Not sure till I see the polling data.
  • oxfordsimonoxfordsimon Posts: 5,842
    Ishmael_Z said:
    Good old internet shopping taking business away from the High Street
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 42,710

    Another Richard and I called this a while back, cancel HS2 now.

    Ministers are looking to save billions on the plan put forward for road and rail transport in the north of England by axing Liverpool’s new railway line to HS2.

    Money for a £7bn line linking Liverpool to the HS2 high-speed railway was supposed to have been “in the bag” before October’s budget last year, only for the Treasury to carry out a last minute U-turn.

    Steve Rotheram, metro mayor of the Liverpool City Region, has revealed the government’s preferred option is to connect Liverpool to HS2 via an existing freight line. “It’s not good enough Liverpool gets second-best while London gets what it wants with Crossrail and Crossrail 2,” he said. “This decision can’t be taken in a room in Whitehall.”


    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/liverpool-hs2-link-axed-says-mayor-steve-rotheram-jsh0j0mhz

    I can only hope you're read into it a little more deeply than Another_Richard ... ;)

    You are aware that if HS2 gets cancelled, the north doesn't automagically get the money?

    As for the substance of the story: AIUI Liverpool wasn't due to get a dedicated HS line as part of the HS2 project - it's a different project, potentially part of the NPR/HS3 concept that is still nebulous.

    However, there were several campaigns for a dedicated link line to be added. It looks as though they'll be getting a line, but by using an upgraded freight line instead of a dedicated HS line. Quite how this fits into any potential NPR/HS3 links to Liverpool is anyone's guess.
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 51,720
    GIN1138 said:

    Scott_P said:
    Wonder if he ever had any phone lines installed? :D
    The modern equivalent is sock-puppet social media accounts.
  • justin124justin124 Posts: 11,527
    JackW said:

    Might I offer a word or two of caution about looking at an upcoming general election simply or mainly through the eyes of BREXIT. Clearly if we have an election in the late autumn then BREXIT will remain an important issue, however general elections rarely revolve around one issue.

    In 1945 the Conservatives, Labour and the world were astonished that Churchill was not returned, let alone demolished at the polls. Being Churchill the great war leader wasn't enough. Labour said "Cheer Churchill but vote Labour" and the masses did.

    In February 74 Heath went to the polls on the seemingly vastly popular "Who Governs Britain?" platform and the voters said not you.

    In 2017 May echoed "Strong and Stable" with massive poll leads against Jezza and then lost her majority.

    Even now we see the BREXIT Euro poll of 32% start to drift away in Westminster voting intentions.

    There is all to play for but BREXIT will not be the only game in town in a general election.

    +1
  • Sean_FSean_F Posts: 37,381
    Scott_P said:
    Strange to think that Greening started off a right winger.

    Either she'll resign or she'll be deselected.
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 63,133
    Ishmael_Z said:
    Not brexit related. Last year was a record month due to the heatwave and royal wedding and a drop was expected. Furthermore there is a move away from spending on goods towards leisure and other activities

    Additionally the US China trade war is causing great concern
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 61,808
    That Liverpool comment is astute and will carry weight if HS2 is cancelled.

    It may well be seen in the Mystic Lands Far Away From the M25 (what with Crossrail going ahead) as money always being there for London, and always being promised and reneged upon for the North.
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 42,005
    Ishmael_Z said:

    The month the stockpiling stopped? It'll probably start up again September-ish
  • Richard_NabaviRichard_Nabavi Posts: 30,821
    Pity about James Cleverly, I thought he was very impressive in his interviews and had had the right positioning. Still, he had no realistic chance, so it's right for him to acknowledge that. I expect we'll see several more withdrawals before the first ballot, and immediately after; I don't expect that there will be a long-drawn out series of MP ballots.
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 51,884

    That Liverpool comment is astute and will carry weight if HS2 is cancelled.

    It may well be seen in the Mystic Lands Far Away From the M25 (what with Crossrail going ahead) as money always being there for London, and always being promised and reneged upon for the North.

    Mr Dancer, Crossrail should have opened 6 months ago. Probably won't open until 2020.
  • brendan16brendan16 Posts: 2,315
    edited June 2019
    rkrkrk said:

    Jeremy Corbyn unveils plans for 'progressive' tax raid on homes and gardens of the middle class

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2019/06/03/jeremy-corbyn-unveils-new-tax-raid-owners-large-family-homes/

    Anyone got a link to the report? It only seems to have made the news in the telegraph and express for some reason.

    Reform of council tax is obviously well overdue, but am a little concerned from what's reported Labour may be shying away from going for a land value tax.
    Its essentially abolishing council tax and replacing it with a new tax

    paid by homeowners/property owners but not occupiers (i.e. renters) - that would of course require a register of owners
    making it proportionate to property values - a percentage of the value - rather than the current restrictive bands and updating those regularly
    having higher rates of tax for higher value properties.

    This might get around the nonsense where an eligible bachelor oligarch living in his £80m One Hyde park flat only pays £1,200 a year (including his 25% single person discount!) as the Westminster band H tax is only £1,500 (more than the charge for a typical Band D home in most of England).

    Its no wonder London is used for speculative property investment and money laundering with ridiculously low annual tax charges like that!

    Of course cue howls of outrage from the Express - cos its so fair that most people in the country pay less council tax than a billionaire oligarch living in an £80 million apartment?

    It would probably mean most of the country sees their property tax fall - but inner London owners (where band D charges are the lowest in the country) would quite rightly pay more. And it would shake up the property market too - as there would be a real cost to the inefficient use of housing.

    It just requires a government with some guts to do the right thing - as its a very regressive tax currently as the poor pay a far higher proportion of their income now on council tax than the better off. What other tax sees a multi millionaire only paying 3 times the tax in monetary terms as a cleaner who rents on £15k a year?


    https://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/1135890/Jeremy-Corbyn-news-Labour-Party-tax-policy-latest-middle-class-homeowners
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 61,808
    Dr. Prasannan, I'm sure Yorkshire will weep with sorrow that London's latest multi-billion pound transport infrastructure is delayed.

    Mr. Jessop, indeed. What happens instead if HS2 gets cancelled could exacerbate Conservative problems in the North or ameliorate them.

    Given Grayling, my hopes aren't high.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 119,679

    Another Richard and I called this a while back, cancel HS2 now.

    Ministers are looking to save billions on the plan put forward for road and rail transport in the north of England by axing Liverpool’s new railway line to HS2.

    Money for a £7bn line linking Liverpool to the HS2 high-speed railway was supposed to have been “in the bag” before October’s budget last year, only for the Treasury to carry out a last minute U-turn.

    Steve Rotheram, metro mayor of the Liverpool City Region, has revealed the government’s preferred option is to connect Liverpool to HS2 via an existing freight line. “It’s not good enough Liverpool gets second-best while London gets what it wants with Crossrail and Crossrail 2,” he said. “This decision can’t be taken in a room in Whitehall.”


    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/liverpool-hs2-link-axed-says-mayor-steve-rotheram-jsh0j0mhz

    I can only hope you're read into it a little more deeply than Another_Richard ... ;)

    You are aware that if HS2 gets cancelled, the north doesn't automagically get the money?

    As for the substance of the story: AIUI Liverpool wasn't due to get a dedicated HS line as part of the HS2 project - it's a different project, potentially part of the NPR/HS3 concept that is still nebulous.

    However, there were several campaigns for a dedicated link line to be added. It looks as though they'll be getting a line, but by using an upgraded freight line instead of a dedicated HS line. Quite how this fits into any potential NPR/HS3 links to Liverpool is anyone's guess.
    As a daily commuter on the Northern rail network I'm well aware of what I talk about.

    This is all about London getting all the good stuff whilst the peasants oop North get lumbered with pacers because the money keeps on getting cancelled.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 119,679

    Dr. Prasannan, I'm sure Yorkshire will weep with sorrow that London's latest multi-billion pound transport infrastructure is delayed.

    Mr. Jessop, indeed. What happens instead if HS2 gets cancelled could exacerbate Conservative problems in the North or ameliorate them.

    Given Grayling, my hopes aren't high.

    Look on the bright side, all being well Chris Grayling's tenure as Transport Secretary ends next month.
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 51,884
    edited June 2019
    Well at least Meridian Water station opened yesterday!

    https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:Meridian_Water_railway_station

    Pics by yours truly, natch :)
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 60,491

    That Liverpool comment is astute and will carry weight if HS2 is cancelled.

    It may well be seen in the Mystic Lands Far Away From the M25 (what with Crossrail going ahead) as money always being there for London, and always being promised and reneged upon for the North.

    Mr Dancer, Crossrail should have opened 6 months ago. Probably won't open until 2020.
    If we’re lucky.
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 61,808
    Mr. Eagles, we must hope so.
  • TheWhiteRabbitTheWhiteRabbit Posts: 12,454
    brendan16 said:

    rkrkrk said:

    Jeremy Corbyn unveils plans for 'progressive' tax raid on homes and gardens of the middle class

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2019/06/03/jeremy-corbyn-unveils-new-tax-raid-owners-large-family-homes/

    Anyone got a link to the report? It only seems to have made the news in the telegraph and express for some reason.

    Reform of council tax is obviously well overdue, but am a little concerned from what's reported Labour may be shying away from going for a land value tax.
    Its essentially abolishing council tax and replacing it with a new tax

    paid by homeowners/property owners but not occupiers (i.e. renters) - that would of course require a register of owners
    making it proportionate to property values - a percentage of the value - rather than the current restrictive bands and updating those regularly
    having higher rates of tax for higher value properties.

    This might get around the nonsense where an eligible bachelor oligarch living in his £80m One Hyde park flat only pays £1,200 a year (including his 25% single person discount!) as the Westminster band H tax is only £1,500 (more than the charge for a typical Band D home in most of England).

    Its no wonder London is used for speculative property investment and money laundering with ridiculously low annual tax charges like that!

    Of course cue howls of outrage from the Express - cos its so fair that most people in the country pay less council tax than a billionaire oligarch living in an £80 million apartment?

    It would probably mean most of the country sees their property tax fall - but inner London owners (where band D charges are the lowest in the country) would quite rightly pay more. And it would shake up the property market too - as there would be a real cost to the inefficient use of housing.

    It just requires a government with some guts to do the right thing - as its a very regressive tax currently as the poor pay a far higher proportion of their income now on council tax than the better off. What other tax sees a multi millionaire only paying 3 times the tax in monetary terms as a cleaner who rents on £15k a year?


    https://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/1135890/Jeremy-Corbyn-news-Labour-Party-tax-policy-latest-middle-class-homeowners
    None of the proposals atualyl fix that, do they?

    I will pay the same for my flat as the couple next to me who earn half as much and the man on the top floor that earns twice as much?
  • Harris_TweedHarris_Tweed Posts: 1,337
    stodge said:

    Morning all :)

    Like some others, I'm not entirely convinced we are witnessing the long heralded "realignment" of British politics. Yes, BXP and to a smaller extent the LDs and Greens have emerged as challengers but these are unusual circumstances in the mid term of a sitting parliament.

    If a week is a long time in politics, 156 (or three years) is an eternity. To assume temporary abandonment of allegiances is permanent would be unwise - after all, a lot of people voted LD in 2010, UKIP in 2015 and Green in 1989 and none of these "surges" lasted.

    The Conservative and Labour parties would have to display disconcerting ineptitude to lose their dominant position - the former are electorally at greater risk as their core of "safe" seats is smaller than that of Labour which can hold 150 seats by retreating into their urban fortresses.

    You may be right. But I think the issue at hand here is different to previous fizzled-out realignments - there are a sufficient number of voters on both sides who will not accept a compromise on Brexit, that parties hedging their bets will cease to be main parties.

    So it will require either the EU to cease being an issue, or for both to come off their respective fences.

    I presume both are thinking this'll blow over, so pitching for a 'pleasing all of the people' outcome isn't a bad plan. If they're wrong (and without The Deal, I suspect they may be), then a forthcoming general election - though maybe the one after next - will be between Nigel Farage and Jo Swinson.
  • RogerRoger Posts: 19,914

    brendan16 said:

    Pulpstar said:

    Latest Italian poll...

    LEGA-ENF: 37% (+6)

    The LEGA probably have more in common with UKIP - and for the last five years Farage (and latterly the Brexit party) have actually allied with 5 star in the EFDD and are hoping to again.

    The old slightly xenophobic, mildly racist, gently islamophobic UKIP, or the current full fat version?
    LOL!
  • 148grss148grss Posts: 4,155
    edited June 2019
    O/T

    This is somewhat terrifying. Good thing food prices aren't an indicator of violent unrest...

    https://twitter.com/New10_AgEcon/status/1133721493081329665

    https://twitter.com/kulmweatherman/status/1132991763164139521
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 60,491
    Feels like it’s going to be hard for any new entrants to enter the race now, when some of the existing riders are already declaring they’ll be dropping out for the good of the party.
  • TheWhiteRabbitTheWhiteRabbit Posts: 12,454

    Feels like it’s going to be hard for any new entrants to enter the race now, when some of the existing riders are already declaring they’ll be dropping out for the good of the party.

    Patel Baker Brady Mordaunt?
  • Andy_CookeAndy_Cooke Posts: 5,005
    Think it would be completely appropriate (bearing in mind the campaign) if we handed our seat to the Turks.
    That is - we stay in until they get accepted in.
  • CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758

    Speaking of investments, if one came into £300k, would it be worth speaking to an investment manager? How would you find one? No need for speculative returns.

    To be honest - and this is not investment advice because I am not authorised to provide that - you won’t get much value added from a investment manager at that level.

    You should find a good retail platform (like Hargreaves Lansdowne - they are expensive but there are plenty of others). I’d then buy a spread of different investment trackers/ETFs to cover different geographies, sectors and classes (eg fixed income). Vanguard is a good and cheap provider of many of this sort of thing.

    Then stick it in a draw and forget about it.
This discussion has been closed.