I’m amazed that this vast seat in mid Wales is Tory.
The Welsh have never struck me as particularly fond of the blue team.
The Conservatives do well in rural, English-speaking constituencies.
There was quite a lot of coal-mining in the South of the constituency, and it voted Labour from 1939-79. Then it went Conservative, before being won by the Liberals in 1985. and has been a Con/Lib Dem marginal seat ever since.
Tomorrow is the 15th anniversary of the foundation of PB and hundreds of thousands will be heading to London for what looks set to be an even bigger gathering than just before the Iraq invasion.
I hope you will keep a close eye on the cops trying to underplay the numbers Mike?
Thousands will turn out for PB - don't let the cops hide it.
I will probably just take the jail time for my next one. I went to boarding school and served on Ark Royal so I am well accustomed to terrible food and sleeping in close proximity to very enthusiastic wanking.
Wasn't Kwarteng an ex pb tory fave? They come and go so fast.
Is/was the favourite of one erstwhile expat and one current expat PBLeaver.
That doesn't narrow it down much. One is sometimes led to the view that most PB Leavers are firewalled against their pet project by being domiciled outside the UK.
A vociferous erstwhile poster made daily pronouncements on the need for diamond hard Brexit, from his safe house in Queensland.
Can OGH's maxim re. polls that the less you like the numbers in a poll the more likely you are to cast aspersions on the pollster & their methodology, now be applied to petitions?
Michael Heseltine keynote speaker at tomorrow's 'People's Vote' March alongside Nicola Sturgeon, David Lammy, Anna Soubry, Dominic Grieve, Vince Cable and Caroline Lucas
I’m amazed that this vast seat in mid Wales is Tory.
The Welsh have never struck me as particularly fond of the blue team.
That bit is nowadays... Labour around Cardiff/Swansea/Wrexham; then the empty bits are split between PC in the west and Tories in the east (plus Pembrokeshire.. aka "Little England Beyond Wales")
Presumably the green bits (PCY) align with Welsh-speaking areas?
Are you just taking about the fact that the country breakdown doesn't add up to the total number? The data's probably out-of-date. They've slowed the updates of the count right down, presumably to reduce the load, and the query that does the groupings would probably be slower than the count one.
Their statement is that counts are being updated every half hour, and it doesn't exactly take much resource to keep a text file up to date - they should have a half-decent cache setup.
I’m amazed that this vast seat in mid Wales is Tory.
The Welsh have never struck me as particularly fond of the blue team.
The Conservatives do well in rural, English-speaking constituencies.
There was quite a lot of coal-mining in the South of the constituency, and it voted Labour from 1939-79. Then it went Conservative, before being won by the Liberals in 1985. and has been a Con/Lib Dem marginal seat ever since.
And something of Liberal tradition like other rural Welsh seats - the Liberals polled 20% in 1945 for example
The Liberals collapsed more quickly than in other seats. They lost the seat in 1924, after being returned unopposed in 1923, before regaining it in 1985.
They manged to hold on to other Welsh rural seats up till 1950.
Michael Heseltine keynote speaker at tomorrow's 'People's Vote' March alongside Nicola Sturgeon, David Lammy, Anna Soubry, Dominic Grieve, Vince Cable and Caroline Lucas
As the consensus seems to be he will get less than 12 months then we're on to a recall petition and that looks tricky in such a large rural constituency. He may resign voluntarily of course but to date none of the various miscreants amongst the 3 largest parties in parliament have taken that course of action.
Tomorrow is the 15th anniversary of the foundation of PB and hundreds of thousands will be heading to London for what looks set to be an even bigger gathering than just before the Iraq invasion.
The tricks those 'Remain' people go to to swell their numbers
Another in the series of “MPs are stupid”. Looks a great target for the Lib Dems.
This is the issue I have. I don't really mind MPs being crooks. I practically expect them to be. For that matter I don't really mind so much if they're stupid, ditto. But crooked *and* stupid is a bit hard to take.
As with the expenses scandal, it's the triviality that galls. If you're going to be bent, make sure you get yourself a plutonium-powered helicopter or a personal MagLev line from your home to the House of Commons.
Michael Heseltine keynote speaker at tomorrow's 'People's Vote' March alongside Nicola Sturgeon, David Lammy, Anna Soubry, Dominic Grieve, Vince Cable and Caroline Lucas
Great to see Hezza going strong at his ripe age. I was never a fan of his politics but he is a serious guy – and a gentleman to boot.
Tarzan and Sir John Major have gone up greatly in my estimation over these last few years, during this debacle. I judged Major in particular far too harshly, back in the 90s.
Another in the series of “MPs are stupid”. Looks a great target for the Lib Dems.
This is the issue I have. I don't really mind MPs being crooks. I practically expect them to be. For that matter I don't really mind so much if they're stupid, ditto. But crooked *and* stupid is a bit hard to take.
As with the expenses scandal, it's the triviality that galls. If you're going to be bent, make sure you get yourself a plutonium-powered helicopter or a personal MagLev line from your home to the House of Commons.
At least 10 years ago, Tory MP's were billing the taxpayers for their moats and helipads.
Are you just taking about the fact that the country breakdown doesn't add up to the total number? The data's probably out-of-date. They've slowed the updates of the count right down, presumably to reduce the load, and the query that does the groupings would probably be slower than the count one.
Their statement is that counts are being updated every half hour, and it doesn't exactly take much resource to keep a text file up to date - they should have a half-decent cache setup.
We'll see.
They're firefighting to keep the site up. You're right that it doesn't take much resource but that presumes that the site was originally built to handle this level of load, and it wasn't. (A couple of friends of mine were giving them advice on database and webserver tuning last night.)
Another in the series of “MPs are stupid”. Looks a great target for the Lib Dems.
This is the issue I have. I don't really mind MPs being crooks. I practically expect them to be. For that matter I don't really mind so much if they're stupid, ditto. But crooked *and* stupid is a bit hard to take.
As with the expenses scandal, it's the triviality that galls. If you're going to be bent, make sure you get yourself a plutonium-powered helicopter or a personal MagLev line from your home to the House of Commons.
Yes, rather than having wysteria cleared off your chimney or splitting an uninvoiced cash in hand cleaner with your brother and acting all offended anyone might think it iffy
I’m amazed that this vast seat in mid Wales is Tory.
The Welsh have never struck me as particularly fond of the blue team.
The Conservatives do well in rural, English-speaking constituencies.
There was quite a lot of coal-mining in the South of the constituency, and it voted Labour from 1939-79. Then it went Conservative, before being won by the Liberals in 1985. and has been a Con/Lib Dem marginal seat ever since.
Checking, Labour vote was last above 20% in 2001 at 21%.
Last time Tories 48.6%. Lab + Lib Dem 46% (LD - 29%). UKIP notalot. Looks interesting.
Another in the series of “MPs are stupid”. Looks a great target for the Lib Dems.
This is the issue I have. I don't really mind MPs being crooks. I practically expect them to be. For that matter I don't really mind so much if they're stupid, ditto. But crooked *and* stupid is a bit hard to take.
As with the expenses scandal, it's the triviality that galls. If you're going to be bent, make sure you get yourself a plutonium-powered helicopter or a personal MagLev line from your home to the House of Commons.
At least 10 years ago, Tory MP's were billing the taxpayers for their moats and helipads.
£700 is pathetic.
As I said downthread, the problem with expenses fraud is proof. You decide to progress a case when there is a clear pattern of abuse. But the instances you can prove beyond any reasonable doubt are a handful of instances at the tip of an iceberg.
Michael Heseltine keynote speaker at tomorrow's 'People's Vote' March alongside Nicola Sturgeon, David Lammy, Anna Soubry, Dominic Grieve, Vince Cable and Caroline Lucas
Great to see Hezza going strong at his ripe age. I was never a fan of his politics but he is a serious guy – and a gentleman to boot.
Tarzan and Sir John Major have gone up greatly in my estimation over these last few years, during this debacle. I judged Major in particular far too harshly, back in the 90s.
Yes, I think that was true for many of us, me included.
Are you just taking about the fact that the country breakdown doesn't add up to the total number? The data's probably out-of-date. They've slowed the updates of the count right down, presumably to reduce the load, and the query that does the groupings would probably be slower than the count one.
Their statement is that counts are being updated every half hour, and it doesn't exactly take much resource to keep a text file up to date - they should have a half-decent cache setup.
We'll see.
I doubt they have a decent anything set up if they had to reduce a count of 3 million rows to once every half hour. It looks like they were just never expecting a petition this popular.
The MP fiddling £700, reminds me of that story of the city worker on mega bucks who fiddled his train ticket to save a couple of grand a year...what total idiots.
EUref2 would probably win that then but without a majority
Hmm... is it possible... could MP's themselves reach a decisive position.. alight on a solution ..actual functioning of the legislature?
Surely not.
It would not get the enabling bill past the HOC by 12th April and that is mandated for any extension
I do apologise to PB for constant repetition of this issue but it needs to colour everyone' s thoughts
I am not saying it is impossible by the 12th April but I would suggest extremely unlikely
Indeed Hyufd is very knowledgeable and I am surprised he has not refered to the enabling legislation road block
Out of interest, what happens if we haven't passed the necessary legislation by 12th April but then unilaterally revoke on that date?
Do we have to pass the legislation by 12 April (or 13 April, depending on the frantic discussions taking place in Strasbourg right now)? Maybe we can declare our intent by the 12th and get the legislation through in the days following.
Another in the series of “MPs are stupid”. Looks a great target for the Lib Dems.
This is the issue I have. I don't really mind MPs being crooks. I practically expect them to be. For that matter I don't really mind so much if they're stupid, ditto. But crooked *and* stupid is a bit hard to take.
As with the expenses scandal, it's the triviality that galls. If you're going to be bent, make sure you get yourself a plutonium-powered helicopter or a personal MagLev line from your home to the House of Commons.
At least 10 years ago, Tory MP's were billing the taxpayers for their moats and helipads.
£700 is pathetic.
If I have read the facts correctly he was entitled to make this claim but didn't have the supporting documentary evidence . So he falsified it. Stupid and it make him unfit to be an MP just as it would do for an accountant or any other professional who tried the same trick. But it is barely worthy of jail time in the scheme of things.
EUref2 would probably win that then but without a majority
Hmm... is it possible... could MP's themselves reach a decisive position.. alight on a solution ..actual functioning of the legislature?
Surely not.
It would not get the enabling bill past the HOC by 12th April and that is mandated for any extension
I do apologise to PB for constant repetition of this issue but it needs to colour everyone' s thoughts
I am not saying it is impossible by the 12th April but I would suggest extremely unlikely
Indeed Hyufd is very knowledgeable and I am surprised he has not refered to the enabling legislation road block
Out of interest, what happens if we haven't passed the necessary legislation by 12th April but then unilaterally revoke on that date?
Basically no extension beyond 11 April unless legislation passed as it would invalidate the EU parliament if we haven't returned MEPs and essentially break the EU
Michael Heseltine keynote speaker at tomorrow's 'People's Vote' March alongside Nicola Sturgeon, David Lammy, Anna Soubry, Dominic Grieve, Vince Cable and Caroline Lucas
Great to see Hezza going strong at his ripe age. I was never a fan of his politics but he is a serious guy – and a gentleman to boot.
Tarzan and Sir John Major have gone up greatly in my estimation over these last few years, during this debacle. I judged Major in particular far too harshly, back in the 90s.
Many did. I saw Sir JM give a speech at a private function a few years ago, he was excellent. My type of Tory, but sadly a dying breed.
EUref2 would probably win that then but without a majority
Hmm... is it possible... could MP's themselves reach a decisive position.. alight on a solution ..actual functioning of the legislature?
Surely not.
It would not get the enabling bill past the HOC by 12th April and that is mandated for any extension
I do apologise to PB for constant repetition of this issue but it needs to colour everyone' s thoughts
I am not saying it is impossible by the 12th April but I would suggest extremely unlikely
Indeed Hyufd is very knowledgeable and I am surprised he has not refered to the enabling legislation road block
Out of interest, what happens if we haven't passed the necessary legislation by 12th April but then unilaterally revoke on that date?
Basically no extension beyond 11 April unless legislation passed as it would invalidate the EU parliament if we haven't returned MEPs and essentially break the EU
Michael Heseltine keynote speaker at tomorrow's 'People's Vote' March alongside Nicola Sturgeon, David Lammy, Anna Soubry, Dominic Grieve, Vince Cable and Caroline Lucas
Great to see Hezza going strong at his ripe age. I was never a fan of his politics but he is a serious guy – and a gentleman to boot.
Tarzan and Sir John Major have gone up greatly in my estimation over these last few years, during this debacle. I judged Major in particular far too harshly, back in the 90s.
Yes, I think that was true for many of us, me included.
My view of him has gone the other way. This is the man who was taken for a ride by the EU over opt outs, wrote a whining letter to the Commission complaining about it and was only saved from being shown up as completely toothless and inept by losing the election in 97.
His opinion of Brexit is one of those which should be consigned to the bin unopened.
Michael Heseltine keynote speaker at tomorrow's 'People's Vote' March alongside Nicola Sturgeon, David Lammy, Anna Soubry, Dominic Grieve, Vince Cable and Caroline Lucas
Another in the series of “MPs are stupid”. Looks a great target for the Lib Dems.
This is the issue I have. I don't really mind MPs being crooks. I practically expect them to be. For that matter I don't really mind so much if they're stupid, ditto. But crooked *and* stupid is a bit hard to take.
As with the expenses scandal, it's the triviality that galls. If you're going to be bent, make sure you get yourself a plutonium-powered helicopter or a personal MagLev line from your home to the House of Commons.
At least 10 years ago, Tory MP's were billing the taxpayers for their moats and helipads.
Indicative of how thick members of the ERG are. I don't know why they don't just drop the pretence, put knotted hankies on their heads, clench their fists and say "my brain hurts".
EUref2 would probably win that then but without a majority
Hmm... is it possible... could MP's themselves reach a decisive position.. alight on a solution ..actual functioning of the legislature?
Surely not.
It would not get the enabling bill past the HOC by 12th April and that is mandated for any extension
I do apologise to PB for constant repetition of this issue but it needs to colour everyone' s thoughts
I am not saying it is impossible by the 12th April but I would suggest extremely unlikely
Indeed Hyufd is very knowledgeable and I am surprised he has not refered to the enabling legislation road block
Out of interest, what happens if we haven't passed the necessary legislation by 12th April but then unilaterally revoke on that date?
Basically no extension beyond 11 April unless legislation passed as it would invalidate the EU parliament if we haven't returned MEPs and essentially break the EU
If we revoke we would contest the EU Parliament elections anyway
EUref2 would probably win that then but without a majority
Hmm... is it possible... could MP's themselves reach a decisive position.. alight on a solution ..actual functioning of the legislature?
Surely not.
It would not get the enabling bill past the HOC by 12th April and that is mandated for any extension
I do apologise to PB for constant repetition of this issue but it needs to colour everyone' s thoughts
I am not saying it is impossible by the 12th April but I would suggest extremely unlikely
Indeed Hyufd is very knowledgeable and I am surprised he has not refered to the enabling legislation road block
Out of interest, what happens if we haven't passed the necessary legislation by 12th April but then unilaterally revoke on that date?
Basically no extension beyond 11 April unless legislation passed as it would invalidate the EU parliament if we haven't returned MEPs and essentially break the EU
But they can't say no to us revoking.
Yes but without MV3 we fall out on April 11 no deal, if we revoke before then..,,, chaos if the legislation isn't passed
Michael Heseltine keynote speaker at tomorrow's 'People's Vote' March alongside Nicola Sturgeon, David Lammy, Anna Soubry, Dominic Grieve, Vince Cable and Caroline Lucas
Great to see Hezza going strong at his ripe age. I was never a fan of his politics but he is a serious guy – and a gentleman to boot.
Tarzan and Sir John Major have gone up greatly in my estimation over these last few years, during this debacle. I judged Major in particular far too harshly, back in the 90s.
That's partly down to context - in the 1990s big beasts such as Thatcher, Healey, Jenkins, Heath, Hurd etc etc were still around and against them Major and Heseltine do not stand out. But set them against May and Corbyn and today's frontbenchers on both sides and the comparison looks very different.
Can they also hand out pottery shards to be used as ostraka ?
So, it's a secret vote. That should ensure nothing gets a majority as the hardline Brexiteers will only vote for no deal and the remainers will have every incentive to vote only for revocation with complete deniability. Only an open vote will result in a compromise solution.
Michael Heseltine keynote speaker at tomorrow's 'People's Vote' March alongside Nicola Sturgeon, David Lammy, Anna Soubry, Dominic Grieve, Vince Cable and Caroline Lucas
Great to see Hezza going strong at his ripe age. I was never a fan of his politics but he is a serious guy – and a gentleman to boot.
Tarzan and Sir John Major have gone up greatly in my estimation over these last few years, during this debacle. I judged Major in particular far too harshly, back in the 90s.
Yes, I think that was true for many of us, me included.
My view of him has gone the other way. This is the man who was taken for a ride by the EU over opt outs, wrote a whining letter to the Commission complaining about it and was only saved from being shown up as completely toothless and inept by losing the election in 97.
His opinion of Brexit is one of those which should be consigned to the bin unopened.
So more accurately, your opinion of him has never changed.
EUref2 would probably win that then but without a majority
Hmm... is it possible... could MP's themselves reach a decisive position.. alight on a solution ..actual functioning of the legislature?
Surely not.
It would not get the enabling bill past the HOC by 12th April and that is mandated for any extension
I do apologise to PB for constant repetition of this issue but it needs to colour everyone' s thoughts
I am not saying it is impossible by the 12th April but I would suggest extremely unlikely
Indeed Hyufd is very knowledgeable and I am surprised he has not refered to the enabling legislation road block
Out of interest, what happens if we haven't passed the necessary legislation by 12th April but then unilaterally revoke on that date?
Do we have to pass the legislation by 12 April (or 13 April, depending on the frantic discussions taking place in Strasbourg right now)? Maybe we can declare our intent by the 12th and get the legislation through in the days following.
No -
The enabling legislation has to have received royal assent by the 12th April otherwise we cannot stand MEPs in the campaign starting on the 12th April. That is why the EU named this date
Are you just taking about the fact that the country breakdown doesn't add up to the total number? The data's probably out-of-date. They've slowed the updates of the count right down, presumably to reduce the load, and the query that does the groupings would probably be slower than the count one.
Their statement is that counts are being updated every half hour, and it doesn't exactly take much resource to keep a text file up to date - they should have a half-decent cache setup.
We'll see.
I doubt they have a decent anything set up if they had to reduce a count of 3 million rows to once every half hour. It looks like they were just never expecting a petition this popular.
Amateurs, Felix Kjellberg is at 90.77 million now.
Michael Heseltine keynote speaker at tomorrow's 'People's Vote' March alongside Nicola Sturgeon, David Lammy, Anna Soubry, Dominic Grieve, Vince Cable and Caroline Lucas
Great to see Hezza going strong at his ripe age. I was never a fan of his politics but he is a serious guy – and a gentleman to boot.
Tarzan and Sir John Major have gone up greatly in my estimation over these last few years, during this debacle. I judged Major in particular far too harshly, back in the 90s.
I've disconcerted myself that I've done similar with Reagan and various Bushes. There's always something/someone worse round the corner, eh?
EUref2 would probably win that then but without a majority
Hmm... is it possible... could MP's themselves reach a decisive position.. alight on a solution ..actual functioning of the legislature?
Surely not.
It would not get the enabling bill past the HOC by 12th April and that is mandated for any extension
I do apologise to PB for constant repetition of this issue but it needs to colour everyone' s thoughts
I am not saying it is impossible by the 12th April but I would suggest extremely unlikely
Indeed Hyufd is very knowledgeable and I am surprised he has not refered to the enabling legislation road block
Out of interest, what happens if we haven't passed the necessary legislation by 12th April but then unilaterally revoke on that date?
Basically no extension beyond 11 April unless legislation passed as it would invalidate the EU parliament if we haven't returned MEPs and essentially break the EU
If we revoke we would contest the EU Parliament elections anyway
Got to pass the enabling legislation in time though
Michael Heseltine keynote speaker at tomorrow's 'People's Vote' March alongside Nicola Sturgeon, David Lammy, Anna Soubry, Dominic Grieve, Vince Cable and Caroline Lucas
Great to see Hezza going strong at his ripe age. I was never a fan of his politics but he is a serious guy – and a gentleman to boot.
Tarzan and Sir John Major have gone up greatly in my estimation over these last few years, during this debacle. I judged Major in particular far too harshly, back in the 90s.
Yes, I think that was true for many of us, me included.
My view of him has gone the other way. This is the man who was taken for a ride by the EU over opt outs, wrote a whining letter to the Commission complaining about it and was only saved from being shown up as completely toothless and inept by losing the election in 97.
His opinion of Brexit is one of those which should be consigned to the bin unopened.
You don't afford him significant credit over his role in clearing the way to the Good Friday Agreement?
EUref2 would probably win that then but without a majority
Hmm... is it possible... could MP's themselves reach a decisive position.. alight on a solution ..actual functioning of the legislature?
Surely not.
It would not get the enabling bill past the HOC by 12th April and that is mandated for any extension
I do apologise to PB for constant repetition of this issue but it needs to colour everyone' s thoughts
I am not saying it is impossible by the 12th April but I would suggest extremely unlikely
Indeed Hyufd is very knowledgeable and I am surprised he has not refered to the enabling legislation road block
The Boles plan is to pass Norway+ as the political declaration but leave the Withdrawal Agreement unchanged so it can then be passed as a Withdrawal Agreement leading to BINO
EUref2 would probably win that then but without a majority
Hmm... is it possible... could MP's themselves reach a decisive position.. alight on a solution ..actual functioning of the legislature?
Surely not.
It would not get the enabling bill past the HOC by 12th April and that is mandated for any extension
I do apologise to PB for constant repetition of this issue but it needs to colour everyone' s thoughts
I am not saying it is impossible by the 12th April but I would suggest extremely unlikely
Indeed Hyufd is very knowledgeable and I am surprised he has not refered to the enabling legislation road block
Out of interest, what happens if we haven't passed the necessary legislation by 12th April but then unilaterally revoke on that date?
Do we have to pass the legislation by 12 April (or 13 April, depending on the frantic discussions taking place in Strasbourg right now)? Maybe we can declare our intent by the 12th and get the legislation through in the days following.
No -
The enabling legislation has to have received royal assent by the 12th April otherwise we cannot stand MEPs in the campaign starting on the 12th April. That is why the EU named this date
Do you have a link to your source for this, by the way? I'm coming up short on a site wonkish enough to cover this all in detail.
Can OGH's maxim re. polls that the less you like the numbers in a poll the more likely you are to cast aspersions on the pollster & their methodology, now be applied to petitions?
I dislike X.
Therefore X must be incomplete (you can say this about anything), not comprehensive (ditto) contradicted by a subsample (always possible), contradicted by other authoritative sources (ditto) implausible (depends on your head), I refuse to believe it (some people actually do this), it's only down to some bad people (irrelevant), it's obviously fake (it may be fake but it isn't obvious), what kind of people would do this (not relevant), it's obviously Russian bots (might be, might not be).
I’m amazed that this vast seat in mid Wales is Tory.
The Welsh have never struck me as particularly fond of the blue team.
The Conservatives do well in rural, English-speaking constituencies.
There was quite a lot of coal-mining in the South of the constituency, and it voted Labour from 1939-79. Then it went Conservative, before being won by the Liberals in 1985. and has been a Con/Lib Dem marginal seat ever since.
And something of Liberal tradition like other rural Welsh seats - the Liberals polled 20% in 1945 for example
I love the way you point to 20 per cent of the vote over seventy years ago with pride.
There is something irredeemably poignant about the LibDems.
We have the Lab and Tory parties led by seriously flawed individuals, and even then the LibDems can't make progress.
What is the chance that the Labour and Tories will ever be led simultaneously by such incompetent individuals ever again. Under a fraction of a per cent.
Let's be brutally honest. Or just brutal.
If the LibDems can't make progress when Corby and Theresa are their opponents, and when they are the only party advocating what 48 per cent (possibly more now) of the population want in the major issue of the day, then they should pack it in.
EUref2 would probably win that then but without a majority
Hmm... is it possible... could MP's themselves reach a decisive position.. alight on a solution ..actual functioning of the legislature?
Surely not.
It would not get the enabling bill past the HOC by 12th April and that is mandated for any extension
I do apologise to PB for constant repetition of this issue but it needs to colour everyone' s thoughts
I am not saying it is impossible by the 12th April but I would suggest extremely unlikely
Indeed Hyufd is very knowledgeable and I am surprised he has not refered to the enabling legislation road block
Out of interest, what happens if we haven't passed the necessary legislation by 12th April but then unilaterally revoke on that date?
Basically no extension beyond 11 April unless legislation passed as it would invalidate the EU parliament if we haven't returned MEPs and essentially break the EU
If we revoke we would contest the EU Parliament elections anyway
Got to pass the enabling legislation in time though
If we revoke the EU would extend to allow for that as they would then know Parliament has voted to cancel Brexit
Michael Heseltine keynote speaker at tomorrow's 'People's Vote' March alongside Nicola Sturgeon, David Lammy, Anna Soubry, Dominic Grieve, Vince Cable and Caroline Lucas
Great to see Hezza going strong at his ripe age. I was never a fan of his politics but he is a serious guy – and a gentleman to boot.
Tarzan and Sir John Major have gone up greatly in my estimation over these last few years, during this debacle. I judged Major in particular far too harshly, back in the 90s.
I've disconcerted myself that I've done similar with Reagan and various Bushes. There's always something/someone worse round the corner, eh?
Bush snr is one of the most despicable men ever to hold office in the States
Another in the series of “MPs are stupid”. Looks a great target for the Lib Dems.
This is the issue I have. I don't really mind MPs being crooks. I practically expect them to be. For that matter I don't really mind so much if they're stupid, ditto. But crooked *and* stupid is a bit hard to take.
As with the expenses scandal, it's the triviality that galls. If you're going to be bent, make sure you get yourself a plutonium-powered helicopter or a personal MagLev line from your home to the House of Commons.
At least 10 years ago, Tory MP's were billing the taxpayers for their moats and helipads.
Indicative of how thick members of the ERG are. I don't know why they don't just drop the pretence, put knotted hankies on their heads, clench their fists and say "my brain hurts".
£700 is pathetic.
On the other side of the argument, Denis MacShane did much the same.
EUref2 would probably win that then but without a majority
Hmm... is it possible... could MP's themselves reach a decisive position.. alight on a solution ..actual functioning of the legislature?
Surely not.
It would not get the enabling bill past the HOC by 12th April and that is mandated for any extension
I do apologise to PB for constant repetition of this issue but it needs to colour everyone' s thoughts
I am not saying it is impossible by the 12th April but I would suggest extremely unlikely
Indeed Hyufd is very knowledgeable and I am surprised he has not refered to the enabling legislation road block
The Boles plan is to pass Norway+ as the political declaration but leave the Withdrawal Agreement unchanged so it can then be passed as a Withdrawal Agreement leading to BINO
Suspect that option and the second referendum Kyle amendment would probably have the most support, but both likely shy of a majority.
Another in the series of “MPs are stupid”. Looks a great target for the Lib Dems.
This is the issue I have. I don't really mind MPs being crooks. I practically expect them to be. For that matter I don't really mind so much if they're stupid, ditto. But crooked *and* stupid is a bit hard to take.
As with the expenses scandal, it's the triviality that galls. If you're going to be bent, make sure you get yourself a plutonium-powered helicopter or a personal MagLev line from your home to the House of Commons.
At least 10 years ago, Tory MP's were billing the taxpayers for their moats and helipads.
Indicative of how thick members of the ERG are. I don't know why they don't just drop the pretence, put knotted hankies on their heads, clench their fists and say "my brain hurts".
£700 is pathetic.
On the other side of the argument, Denis MacShane did much the same.
Denis macshane expense fiddling was a different order of magnitude.
A system so simple and easy to execute that it is a wonder we didn't do it earlier.
They could do with some sort of system where the voters get to rank the options by order of preference. There must be a name for it?
As an alternative to the present voting system that would enable some sort of instant runoff? What an interesting concept. Perhaps @TheScreamingEagles may consider a thread upon it...
Another in the series of “MPs are stupid”. Looks a great target for the Lib Dems.
This is the issue I have. I don't really mind MPs being crooks. I practically expect them to be. For that matter I don't really mind so much if they're stupid, ditto. But crooked *and* stupid is a bit hard to take.
As with the expenses scandal, it's the triviality that galls. If you're going to be bent, make sure you get yourself a plutonium-powered helicopter or a personal MagLev line from your home to the House of Commons.
At least 10 years ago, Tory MP's were billing the taxpayers for their moats and helipads.
Indicative of how thick members of the ERG are. I don't know why they don't just drop the pretence, put knotted hankies on their heads, clench their fists and say "my brain hurts".
£700 is pathetic.
On the other side of the argument, Denis MacShane did much the same.
There is no 'other side' to the argument. They're all crooks and deserve chokey.
Michael Heseltine keynote speaker at tomorrow's 'People's Vote' March alongside Nicola Sturgeon, David Lammy, Anna Soubry, Dominic Grieve, Vince Cable and Caroline Lucas
Great to see Hezza going strong at his ripe age. I was never a fan of his politics but he is a serious guy – and a gentleman to boot.
Tarzan and Sir John Major have gone up greatly in my estimation over these last few years, during this debacle. I judged Major in particular far too harshly, back in the 90s.
I've disconcerted myself that I've done similar with Reagan and various Bushes. There's always something/someone worse round the corner, eh?
Bush snr is one of the most despicable men ever to hold office in the States
Well, he had wandering hands, but there have been far worse US office holders. Any of Kennedy, Nixon, Clinton, and Trump should have gone to prison.
HMG considering allowing mps to vote on seven alternative brexit options next week
Good news if true
If a referendum commands majority support it could get the enabling legislation through
I think it highly unlikely. MPs seemed to have swallowed the line that another referendum would against democracy and don't seem to be able to grasp how counterintuitive that is. If there still is a majority of Brexit then it still has democratic legitimacy, particularly now more is known. Logic, however, does not drive many of their frothing party activists.
Another in the series of “MPs are stupid”. Looks a great target for the Lib Dems.
This is the issue I have. I don't really mind MPs being crooks. I practically expect them to be. For that matter I don't really mind so much if they're stupid, ditto. But crooked *and* stupid is a bit hard to take.
As with the expenses scandal, it's the triviality that galls. If you're going to be bent, make sure you get yourself a plutonium-powered helicopter or a personal MagLev line from your home to the House of Commons.
At least 10 years ago, Tory MP's were billing the taxpayers for their moats and helipads.
Indicative of how thick members of the ERG are. I don't know why they don't just drop the pretence, put knotted hankies on their heads, clench their fists and say "my brain hurts".
£700 is pathetic.
On the other side of the argument, Denis MacShane did much the same.
Much more money was involved (12,900 pounds), though.
Michael Heseltine keynote speaker at tomorrow's 'People's Vote' March alongside Nicola Sturgeon, David Lammy, Anna Soubry, Dominic Grieve, Vince Cable and Caroline Lucas
EUref2 would probably win that then but without a majority
Hmm... is it possible... could MP's themselves reach a decisive position.. alight on a solution ..actual functioning of the legislature?
Surely not.
It would not get the enabling bill past the HOC by 12th April and that is mandated for any extension
I do apologise to PB for constant repetition of this issue but it needs to colour everyone' s thoughts
I am not saying it is impossible by the 12th April but I would suggest extremely unlikely
Indeed Hyufd is very knowledgeable and I am surprised he has not refered to the enabling legislation road block
Out of interest, what happens if we haven't passed the necessary legislation by 12th April but then unilaterally revoke on that date?
Do we have to pass the legislation by 12 April (or 13 April, depending on the frantic discussions taking place in Strasbourg right now)? Maybe we can declare our intent by the 12th and get the legislation through in the days following.
No -
The enabling legislation has to have received royal assent by the 12th April otherwise we cannot stand MEPs in the campaign starting on the 12th April. That is why the EU named this date
Do you have a link to your source for this, by the way? I'm coming up short on a site wonkish enough to cover this all in detail.
Not really but I have been following this serious issue for weeks and it has been confirmed from various sources here and in the EU, as we could not be in the EU without representation without voiding the EU elections themselves
Another in the series of “MPs are stupid”. Looks a great target for the Lib Dems.
This is the issue I have. I don't really mind MPs being crooks. I practically expect them to be. For that matter I don't really mind so much if they're stupid, ditto. But crooked *and* stupid is a bit hard to take.
As with the expenses scandal, it's the triviality that galls. If you're going to be bent, make sure you get yourself a plutonium-powered helicopter or a personal MagLev line from your home to the House of Commons.
At least 10 years ago, Tory MP's were billing the taxpayers for their moats and helipads.
Indicative of how thick members of the ERG are. I don't know why they don't just drop the pretence, put knotted hankies on their heads, clench their fists and say "my brain hurts".
£700 is pathetic.
On the other side of the argument, Denis MacShane did much the same.
Much more money was involved (12,900 pounds), though.
Denis MacGabble got 6 months.
And that without considering his office / garage fiddle setup.
Comments
A vociferous erstwhile poster made daily pronouncements on the need for diamond hard Brexit, from his safe house in Queensland.
https://twitter.com/BBCNewsPR/status/1109067883655647233
https://twitter.com/Andrew_Adonis/status/1108975301114150912
Surely not.
The petition map looks entirely credible in terms of the geographical spread of signatures. It would be difficult for bots to produce that.
https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/politics/brexit-put-people-march-time-14169830
Uncouple the WA from the PD. Pass the WA and leave on 22/5.
New Tory leader, then a GE with competing visions for the Future Relationship.
We'll see.
They manged to hold on to other Welsh rural seats up till 1950.
https://d3n8a8pro7vhmx.cloudfront.net/lucypowellmp/pages/14/attachments/original/1546882338/Common_Market_2.0_(1).pdf?1546882338
I do apologise to PB for constant repetition of this issue but it needs to colour everyone' s thoughts
I am not saying it is impossible by the 12th April but I would suggest extremely unlikely
Indeed Hyufd is very knowledgeable and I am surprised he has not refered to the enabling legislation road block
A system so simple and easy to execute that it is a wonder we didn't do it earlier.
£700 is pathetic.
We have a deal to leave that has taken 2 years to negotiate and we know for a fact can be implemented straightaway.
So should we (i) check out alternatives and if there aren't any do the deal?
Or should we (ii) reject the deal and THEN go flapping around looking for alternatives?
The correct answer is (i).
Trash your rep, ruin your career for 700 quid. Idiot.
Last time Tories 48.6%. Lab + Lib Dem 46% (LD - 29%). UKIP notalot. Looks interesting.
I wonder if the Tiggers will stand.
I assume many will not be aware of that
If at least 51 people turn up tomorrow, it will be a victory for Remain, and the "will of the people" will have been heard. Fingers tightly crossed.
His opinion of Brexit is one of those which should be consigned to the bin unopened.
The enabling legislation has to have received royal assent by the 12th April otherwise we cannot stand MEPs in the campaign starting on the 12th April. That is why the EU named this date
Therefore X must be incomplete (you can say this about anything), not comprehensive (ditto) contradicted by a subsample (always possible), contradicted by other authoritative sources (ditto) implausible (depends on your head), I refuse to believe it (some people actually do this), it's only down to some bad people (irrelevant), it's obviously fake (it may be fake but it isn't obvious), what kind of people would do this (not relevant), it's obviously Russian bots (might be, might not be).
There is something irredeemably poignant about the LibDems.
We have the Lab and Tory parties led by seriously flawed individuals, and even then the LibDems can't make progress.
What is the chance that the Labour and Tories will ever be led simultaneously by such incompetent individuals ever again. Under a fraction of a per cent.
Let's be brutally honest. Or just brutal.
If the LibDems can't make progress when Corby and Theresa are their opponents, and when they are the only party advocating what 48 per cent (possibly more now) of the population want in the major issue of the day, then they should pack it in.
Good news if true
If a referendum commands majority support it could get the enabling legislation through
Denis MacGabble got 6 months.
I honestly do not want to be sounding awkward