I simply cannot believe what I am hearing in parliament. First you get John Mcdonnell saying that of course the EU will renogotiate with him??? Then you get MP after MP and Lord after Lord saying that we must ignore the referendum and stay in the EU. WFT are these people on. We voted to leave, thats it. If it fucks the country so be it. We voted to leave, therefore we must leave.Len McCluskey ia arguing againts a second referendum as he knows that Leave will win massive. British people will not accept having their democratic decision rejected.
Actually I'd rather our elected representatives chose not to "fuck the country", regardless. Your attitude exemplifies why the country is heading toward disaster.
My attitude?? You fucking twat, what did people die for in the war, to protect the democracy of the UK. Leave won so we fucking leave, get it? I voted remain but remain lost, get that into your thick skull.
Of course. But would it be libellous to say "I think you will soon be arrested" whilst making no allegation about why? I think not (but I'm not about to try it )
I don't know, but I'd think the court would decide from case to case, depending on the anount of information which the reader could be reasonably expected to possess. If it is widely speculated that you may have forged banknotes, saying "I think you will soon be arrested" looks riskier than if I say it about, say, the Pope. If in the same paragraph I discuss your habit of buying paper used in banknotes and your interest in printer's ink that will further reinforce the impression. The court will go on the overall implication of your comments, taken as a whole, rather than on the literal meaning of individual words and sentences.
But there are lawyers here who will know more than me. In another life I'd be quite interested in studying law.
I think this tweet is bad history though. Lawson was always pretty eurosceptic, but he favoured joining the ERM as a method to bring down inflation. He'd basically done it before by shadowing the DM until Mrs Thatcher made him stop. Howe was the real Europe enthusiast who brought her down.
I simply cannot believe what I am hearing in parliament. First you get John Mcdonnell saying that of course the EU will renogotiate with him??? Then you get MP after MP and Lord after Lord saying that we must ignore the referendum and stay in the EU. WFT are these people on. We voted to leave, thats it. If it fucks the country so be it. We voted to leave, therefore we must leave.Len McCluskey ia arguing againts a second referendum as he knows that Leave will win massive. British people will not accept having their democratic decision rejected.
Actually I'd rather our elected representatives chose not to "fuck the country", regardless. Your attitude exemplifies why the country is heading toward disaster.
Leaving no deal now will be a walk in the park compared with 20 years down the line when the EU army is in full swing.
I simply cannot believe what I am hearing in parliament. First you get John Mcdonnell saying that of course the EU will renogotiate with him??? Then you get MP after MP and Lord after Lord saying that we must ignore the referendum and stay in the EU. WFT are these people on. We voted to leave, thats it. If it fucks the country so be it. We voted to leave, therefore we must leave.Len McCluskey ia arguing againts a second referendum as he knows that Leave will win massive. British people will not accept having their democratic decision rejected.
How do you know. For a start 48% will be bloody delighted to have another go.
We voted to leave, therefore we must leave.Len McCluskey ia arguing againts a second referendum as he knows that Leave will win massive. British people will not accept having their democratic decision rejected.
What's unique about British people? I think at its heart your argument is not about democracy but about the belief that the British government must be capable of delivering what people ask of it, so not Brexiting would damage faith in the capacity of the state. There's certainly nothing undemocratic about asking people again if what Brexit means in reality is still what they want.
Labour should follow his lead and vote for the deal or abstain at worst. The vote would be carried, the DUP would be furious and a vote of no confidence would pass and the GE would follow.
We voted to leave, therefore we must leave.Len McCluskey ia arguing againts a second referendum as he knows that Leave will win massive. British people will not accept having their democratic decision rejected.
What's unique about British people? I think at its heart your argument is not about democracy but about the belief that the British government must be capable of delivering what people ask of it, so not Brexiting would damage faith in the capacity of the state. There's certainly nothing undemocratic about asking people again if what Brexit means in reality is still what they want.
If we'd voted remain then that would have been it forever.
You only get asked again if you vote for less EU. See Ireland for another example.
When the Brexit clustertruck finally careens off the road entirely and the police cleanup operation begins, I think there is one man, above every other, who will make an excellent, and so infinitely punchable, scapegoat
When the Brexit clustertruck finally careens off the road entirely and the police cleanup operation begins, I think there is one man, above every other, who will make an excellent, and so infinitely punchable, scapegoat
We voted to leave, therefore we must leave.Len McCluskey ia arguing againts a second referendum as he knows that Leave will win massive. British people will not accept having their democratic decision rejected.
What's unique about British people? I think at its heart your argument is not about democracy but about the belief that the British government must be capable of delivering what people ask of it, so not Brexiting would damage faith in the capacity of the state. There's certainly nothing undemocratic about asking people again if what Brexit means in reality is still what they want.
If we'd voted remain then that would have been it forever.
You only get asked again if you vote for less EU. See Ireland for another example.
As you know I'm a strong Remainer but I think you're very wrong on the first point. If there'd been a narrow Remain win, it would have put rocket-boosters under the Brexiteers and we'd have had a second referendum within a few years.
Seeing it all as starkly laid out as this, I have to say I regret my vote in the AV referendum. Although that was for parliamentary seats not this - but yes this clearly hows why AV is superior (Still STV or Schulz is superior)
As I recall AV was opposed largely because it was thought that the public would not understand it. And the public agreed, rejecting it by a large margin in a referendum on the matter. That's assuming the public understood what they were voting against of course. Perhaps they didn't. Perhaps they didn't understand that AV is too complex for them to understand. But let's say they did. Let's give them the benefit of the doubt. The public was clever enough to realize that AV was too sophisticated for them to mess with.
So if adopted for a 2nd EU referendum we would have the prospect of this same public weighing the merits of a 585 page legal text plus a 26 page aspirational but non binding political declaration, as against an undefinable thing called 'no deal' which almost every MP considers would be catastrophic but which half the public thinks means status quo, as against remaining in the European Union, which most of them vaguely remember voting against a couple of years back and which a fair few of them thought we'd already done.
C'mon powers that be. Shape up for heaven's sake. It's make your mind up time. Cancel brexit or implement the wretched thing. Do not turn tragedy into farce.
So use of the Alternative Vote was opposed on the grounds that people couldn't understand it and yet we went on to entrust the momentous decision on our EU membership to the very same people. What could possibly go wrong?
I think, after the YouGov poll, we need to have a thread:
WHAT THE FRICK IS WRONG WITH LINCOLNSHIRE?
Anyone from Lincolnshire want to have a stab?
Richard Tyndall lives there doesn't he?
Explains a few things.
Indeed. I am very persuasive
Everyone in Lincolnshire says they want No Deal, because otherwise, they whisper in hushed tones, HE will come. They dare not speak his name aloud. But his name is TYNDALLE, DARK LORD OF NODEALIA and he knows no mercy for those that have betrayed him.
Trump leaves George H.W. Bush's state funeral at first opportunity and makes it back to White House before 41st president's casket leaves cathedral grounds
Mr. Glenn, if leaving is impossible, why was it an option?
For that matter, why did the MPs give away so much power, which had been entrusted to them by the electorate, to the EU?
Leaving isn’t impossible. Leaving within 2 years without severe economic harm is possible, and leaving without defining a plan for minimising harm is impractical. It was an option because, against his own expectation, Cameron just wasn’t that good at it.
MPs didn’t give away power, they pooled it due to the judgement that was beneficial for the U.K. In the same vein, you could ask why the electorate have voted to give away so much power over matters right on our doorstep that will continue to affect us regardless of our participation in the E.U.
Labour should follow his lead and vote for the deal or abstain at worst. The vote would be carried, the DUP would be furious and a vote of no confidence would pass and the GE would follow.
Mind you a GE during the run-up to 29 March would be sub-optimal.
Labour should follow his lead and vote for the deal or abstain at worst. The vote would be carried, the DUP would be furious and a vote of no confidence would pass and the GE would follow.
Mind you a GE during the run-up to 29 March would be sub-optimal.
I think if a GE is called, the Council would have no choice to grant an A50 extension.
He's only resigned the whip, not left the Party as you well know.
To his credit, he said he would support the Deal publicly to his constituents and as the line articulated by Vince is the party will oppose he has no option to break ranks.
I, for one, am shocked and appalled to hear the Normans did horrendous things in Yorkshire.
Mr. Polruan, pooled sovereignty is a nonsensical term. Believing the EU is good for the UK is a perfectly valid belief, but pretending we haven't given away rights to determine our own destiny through politicians elected by and accountable to the British public by surrendering vetoes is a sentiment not in accordance with the power of reason.
I think, after the YouGov poll, we need to have a thread:
WHAT THE FRICK IS WRONG WITH LINCOLNSHIRE?
Anyone from Lincolnshire want to have a stab?
Richard Tyndall lives there doesn't he?
Explains a few things.
Indeed. I am very persuasive
Everyone in Lincolnshire says they want No Deal, because otherwise, they whisper in hushed tones, HE will come. They dare not speak his name aloud. But his name is TYNDALLE, DARK LORD OF NODEALIA and he knows no mercy for those that have betrayed him.
LOL.
Much as I like the notoriety I actually favour the Deal as it has more chance of success and we can build on that to increase our separation over time.
We voted to leave, therefore we must leave.Len McCluskey ia arguing againts a second referendum as he knows that Leave will win massive. British people will not accept having their democratic decision rejected.
What's unique about British people? I think at its heart your argument is not about democracy but about the belief that the British government must be capable of delivering what people ask of it, so not Brexiting would damage faith in the capacity of the state. There's certainly nothing undemocratic about asking people again if what Brexit means in reality is still what they want.
If we'd voted remain then that would have been it forever.
You only get asked again if you vote for less EU. See Ireland for another example.
As you know I'm a strong Remainer but I think you're very wrong on the first point. If there'd been a narrow Remain win, it would have put rocket-boosters under the Brexiteers and we'd have had a second referendum within a few years.
Completely disagree.
No referendum for 40 years despite huge euroscepticism. We vote to leave and suddenly another one appears before anything is resolved from the first one.
A narrow remain in a second referendum would mean the matter is settled until it really is impossible to ever leave.
The EU should tell May to go away and come back when she’s got a deal that can pass the Commons. The problem is a deal that can pass that will cause the ERG to bring her down .
The blame being laid on Remainers is ridiculous , it’s the ERG nutjobs which are the problem .
So as ever it’s Tory party infighting that’s causing these problems just as it was with Cameron calling this stupid referendum to begin with .
The ERG are holding the country to ransom and are utterly despicable . The country does not want their version of Brexit, and neither does it want their delusional no deal !
They need to be called out for what they are , a bunch of idealogically obsessed nutjobs who want to turn the UK into a right wing capitalism on steroids cesspit with less rights .
The EU should tell May to go away and come back when she’s got a deal that can pass the Commons. The problem is a deal that can pass that will cause the ERG to bring her down .
The blame being laid on Remainers is ridiculous , it’s the ERG nutjobs which are the problem .
So as ever it’s Tory party infighting that’s causing these problems just as it was with Cameron calling this stupid referendum to begin with .
The ERG are holding the country to ransom and are utterly despicable . The country does not want their version of Brexit, and neither does it want their delusional no deal !
They need to be called out for what they are , a bunch of idealogically obsessed nutjobs who want to turn the UK into a right wing capitalism on steroids cesspit with less rights .
As far as most of the Commons appears to be concerned the only deal they will countenance is Remain. 40 or so ERG nutters out of 650 MPs cannot stop the House voting for a Deal. 500 Remain nutters can.
He was facing almost certain deselection for it anyway.
What a weird and quixotic hill for a Lib Dem to die on.
He's in Eastbourne, God's waiting room won't be a Remainers paradise. I wonder if he'll defect to the Tories/
He's very much got a personal vote. He works really hard, and has made a lot of personal connections. So I think he has a good chance of persuading the local Lib Dems to give him a clear run next time.
The weird thing is I have a feeling that Eastbourne might well swing back to remain. There's a lot of people employed in EFL, and the demographics of the town are changing fast. It is getting to look more like Brighton by the day.
Comments
https://twitter.com/BethRigby/status/1070684172484788229
But there are lawyers here who will know more than me. In another life I'd be quite interested in studying law.
Explains a few things.
At least bullets won't be flying.
For that matter, why did the MPs give away so much power, which had been entrusted to them by the electorate, to the EU?
You only get asked again if you vote for less EU. See Ireland for another example.
https://www.newstatesman.com/politics/elections/2018/12/nick-timothy-wrong-he-one-who-killed-brexit-not-theresa-may
Edit: See it is about that campaign.
Eddie Izzard was supporting the other bloke, so this result should come as no surprise.
Norwich - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/William_of_Norwich
York - http://www.historyofyork.org.uk/themes/norman/the-1190-massacre
Trump leaves George H.W. Bush's state funeral at first opportunity and makes it back to White House before 41st president's casket leaves cathedral grounds
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-6464465/Trump-leaves-George-H-W-Bushs-state-funeral-opportunity.html
MPs didn’t give away power, they pooled it due to the judgement that was beneficial for the U.K. In the same vein, you could ask why the electorate have voted to give away so much power over matters right on our doorstep that will continue to affect us regardless of our participation in the E.U.
https://www.lincolnshire.gov.uk/pictures/916xAny/4/8/1/75481_Lincolnshire-Rail-Diagram.jpg
A-roads = Deal
B-road = No Deal
Not much has changed but they live under water
And Liam Fox's trade deal with the US is nearing completion.
NEW THREAD
To his credit, he said he would support the Deal publicly to his constituents and as the line articulated by Vince is the party will oppose he has no option to break ranks.
May will be in the next GE 2021 or 2022
I, for one, am shocked and appalled to hear the Normans did horrendous things in Yorkshire.
Mr. Polruan, pooled sovereignty is a nonsensical term. Believing the EU is good for the UK is a perfectly valid belief, but pretending we haven't given away rights to determine our own destiny through politicians elected by and accountable to the British public by surrendering vetoes is a sentiment not in accordance with the power of reason.
With the Arlene of Damocles hanging over everyone.
Much as I like the notoriety I actually favour the Deal as it has more chance of success and we can build on that to increase our separation over time.
No referendum for 40 years despite huge euroscepticism. We vote to leave and suddenly another one appears before anything is resolved from the first one.
A narrow remain in a second referendum would mean the matter is settled until it really is impossible to ever leave.
The blame being laid on Remainers is ridiculous , it’s the ERG nutjobs which are the problem .
So as ever it’s Tory party infighting that’s causing these problems just as it was with Cameron calling this stupid referendum to begin with .
The ERG are holding the country to ransom and are utterly despicable . The country does not want their version of Brexit, and neither does it want their delusional no deal !
They need to be called out for what they are , a bunch of idealogically obsessed nutjobs who want to turn the UK into a right wing capitalism on steroids cesspit with less rights .
The weird thing is I have a feeling that Eastbourne might well swing back to remain. There's a lot of people employed in EFL, and the demographics of the town are changing fast. It is getting to look more like Brighton by the day.