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  • IanB2 said:

    Looks like Tory East Sussex council will be the second to go into pre-bankruptcy special measures

    If accurate, this story gets odder and odder. Why is it that these relatively well-off shire counties are falling over first? You would've thought the first councils to roll over and stick their legs up in the air would be in places struggling to meet the needs of deprived communities?
    Tory voters are older and it is social care which is pushing councils over the edge.

    IanB2 said:

    Looks like Tory East Sussex council will be the second to go into pre-bankruptcy special measures

    I doubt it very much. It's a well-run council, which has made a lot of progress in reducing costs.

    It does have a big demographic problem, though - lots of elderly residents.
    I've identified an interesting report suggesting the possible root of the problem for the county councils:

    While all councils have had their funding cut since 2010, counties have been hit particularly hard.

    Their core government grant will fall faster than other types of councils and they also receive less money for key services such as adult social care. As a result, they have become more reliant on using reserves to balance their books.

    Between 2013 and 2018 the total reserves of county councils fell by 31.9%, twice as much as any other type of council.

    Edwards said: “A lot of counties are in trouble.

    “Counties face a toxic cocktail of rising demand, which has not been taken into account in the funding formula, and some of the sharpest reductions in funding despite already being the lowest funded authorities.

    “Counties face a toxic cocktail of rising demand and some of the sharpest reductions in funding”

    “We have to hope [Northamptonshire] has been a wakeup call for everyone, or local government will only be able to provide the barest of bones and you can forget anything else.”


    https://www.thebureauinvestigates.com/stories/2018-03-08/councils-in-crisis-three-more-named-as-showing-signs-of-financial-distress

    As one might have guessed absent any other information, it does look like it's down to lack of central government handouts as much as anything else. The whole piece I link to is worth a read. Authorities of particular concern are listed as Lancashire, Norfolk, Somerset - and East Sussex.

    In January a report published by East Sussex County Council warned that, unless there were new resources from the government, the authority would be left with just a “minimum service offer” by 2021/22, and that it would no longer be able to fund early intervention or prevention services in adult or children’s social care.
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 60,507
    Sean_F said:

    ydoethur said:

    Ishmael_Z said:

    Mr. Eagles, could be worse. He could take it from Brussels ;)

    Bruxelles isn’t the home of the world’s largest paedophile protection network like the Catholic Church.
    Pointless claim, both for evidential reasons and because presumably "largest" is on a gross basis? Adjust to per capita and the Anglicans are well in with a shout.
    If I were feeling malicious I would mention an organisation both Hodge and Corbyn belong to...
    As a student, I was warned by a fairly prominent Conservative activist never to get into a lift on my own with Peter Morrison.

    A friend of mine who was a YC felt someone stroking his bottom in the bar at Conference. he turned round to discover that it was a Cabinet Minister.
    I was invited to join the Carlton Club by him. It was to meet for a drink first with a couple of others.

    None of us accepted.
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 60,507
    surby said:

    Anorak said:
    Finally, he has said something sensible.
    This is actually what May meant when she was talking about citizens of nowhere.
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 57,249

    Sean_F said:

    Mr. Rentool, ha, only had them once or twice.

    Mr. Eagles, we could always tot up the Catholic priests/nuns and the Muslim rape gangs and see who comes ahead, if want to.

    Although I'd rather contemplate the F1 driver market in 2019, to be honest.

    Be interesting to see if Renault operate an equal policy or make Ricciardo their number one chap overtly.

    Somebody already has, the Catholic Church wins hands down
    What else are choirboys there for?
    We all know the Catholic Church would be pro contraception if choirboys could get pregnant.
    Isn't there an Afghanistan proverb that goes something like: ”Women are for children, boys are for pleasure.”?
    I thought it was: women are for children, boys are for love and goats are for pleasure
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 60,507

    HYUFD said:

    Wait until you see my 'Why it is unlikely to Boris' piece on Sunday.

    If it is not Boris prepare for PM Corbyn
    That depends on who it is. But Boris is absolutely not PM material. he is a good salesman but not a chief executive and a party and government led by Boris would be a directionless disaster, driven by whims and with no attention to detail or follow-through.

    But while Boris would significantly increase Corbyn's chances, that doesn't mean that a not-Boris wouldn't do the same - JRM, for example. On the other hand, I suspect that there's a large portion of the electorate which isn't looking for ideology or revolution and just wants effecient, effective government. To them, any Tory leader who looks optimistic, confident and competent will do. You might say that's quite a high bar - and it is - but I do think that Javid/Gove could potentially recreate a lot of what Cameron/Osborne did, though you never really know what a leader would be like until they're in post.
    Were not Cameron and Blair in the good salesman rather than detail category of leaders?

    Was not Brown and May in the detail obsessive but not salesman/woman category of leaders?

    Boris seems more of a Blair or Cameron than a Brown or May. A Chairman more than a Chief Executive.
    Cameron and Blair were good salesmen but also capable enough leaders and chief execs. I agree that an excessive attention to detail and an inability to delegate is a serious failing, especially when combined with a defensive, secretive and untrusting personality. however, Boris goes far too far to the other extreme.
    Boris had lots of help with the detail as foreign secretary where you really just have to absorb a few briefings, build networks and negotiate. Not deliver complex policy or projects or programmes.

    He couldn’t even do that.
  • surbysurby Posts: 1,227
    edited August 2018
    Indians the world over is asking: "where is Pujara". Ans: In Birmingham.
  • John_MJohn_M Posts: 7,503
    HYUFD said:

    I'm loving HYUFD's idea that Boris Johnson is going to sell May's Brexit, that he described as a turd, to the public in a General Election.

    Post-referendum he couldn't even sell his own version of Brexit. His big speech was a disaster that's only remembered for jokes about stag dos and sex tourism.

    Boris would not sell May's Brexit, he would sell No Deal Brexit if we are still in a transition period by December 2020 with no FTA.

    It was also Boris leading Leave which played a key part in the Leave win
    That was then; this is now. Boris has been tried in cabinet and found wanting. There's no particular shame in that; we all have our level, and he peaked as London's mayor during the Olympics.
  • oxfordsimonoxfordsimon Posts: 5,842
    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2018/aug/03/jeremy-corbyn-antisemitism-labour-party

    He just doesn't get it.

    Mealy-mouthed waffle. It will make things worse not better.
  • surbysurby Posts: 1,227
    rcs1000 said:

    Sean_F said:

    Mr. Rentool, ha, only had them once or twice.

    Mr. Eagles, we could always tot up the Catholic priests/nuns and the Muslim rape gangs and see who comes ahead, if want to.

    Although I'd rather contemplate the F1 driver market in 2019, to be honest.

    Be interesting to see if Renault operate an equal policy or make Ricciardo their number one chap overtly.

    Somebody already has, the Catholic Church wins hands down
    What else are choirboys there for?
    We all know the Catholic Church would be pro contraception if choirboys could get pregnant.
    Isn't there an Afghanistan proverb that goes something like: ”Women are for children, boys are for pleasure.”?
    I thought it was: women are for children, boys are for love and goats are for pleasure
    By using Afghanistan, we are getting round the ethnicity question. Most of these jokes are about Pathans.

    The one I know: Lovemaking is like a long playing record. When one side ends, turn it over......
  • MortimerMortimer Posts: 14,127
    John_M said:

    HYUFD said:

    I'm loving HYUFD's idea that Boris Johnson is going to sell May's Brexit, that he described as a turd, to the public in a General Election.

    Post-referendum he couldn't even sell his own version of Brexit. His big speech was a disaster that's only remembered for jokes about stag dos and sex tourism.

    Boris would not sell May's Brexit, he would sell No Deal Brexit if we are still in a transition period by December 2020 with no FTA.

    It was also Boris leading Leave which played a key part in the Leave win
    That was then; this is now. Boris has been tried in cabinet and found wanting. There's no particular shame in that; we all have our level, and he peaked as London's mayor during the Olympics.
    I had a feeling that a fellow Jim Gilmore for Prez. follower would be of the same mind as me re: Boris!
  • surbysurby Posts: 1,227

    surby said:

    Anorak said:
    Finally, he has said something sensible.
    This is actually what May meant when she was talking about citizens of nowhere.
    I thought she was talking about Green.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 123,206
    John_M said:

    HYUFD said:

    I'm loving HYUFD's idea that Boris Johnson is going to sell May's Brexit, that he described as a turd, to the public in a General Election.

    Post-referendum he couldn't even sell his own version of Brexit. His big speech was a disaster that's only remembered for jokes about stag dos and sex tourism.

    Boris would not sell May's Brexit, he would sell No Deal Brexit if we are still in a transition period by December 2020 with no FTA.

    It was also Boris leading Leave which played a key part in the Leave win
    That was then; this is now. Boris has been tried in cabinet and found wanting. There's no particular shame in that; we all have our level, and he peaked as London's mayor during the Olympics.
    Boris is the only Tory with the charisma and appeal to Tory to UKIP voters to beat Corbyn in my view at the moment.
  • Richard_NabaviRichard_Nabavi Posts: 30,821
    edited August 2018

    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2018/aug/03/jeremy-corbyn-antisemitism-labour-party

    He just doesn't get it.

    Mealy-mouthed waffle. It will make things worse not better.

    That is why I want to make it absolutely clear that any government I lead will take whatever measures are necessary to guarantee the security of Jewish communities, Jewish schools, Jewish places of worship, Jewish social care, Jewish culture and Jewish life as a whole in this country.

    Well that's a relief, Jeremy. We all thought you'd be letting the mobs torch synagogues as they pleased.
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 60,507

    "Mathematically Corbyn’s LAB’s influence is declining because it is shedding MPs, O’Mara and Woodcock for instance. This reduces the number under Corbyn’s command which has never been sufficient to bring down the government even with the support of all the other parties bar the DUP.

    There’s also increasing talk at the moment of splinters within the parliamentary party though I’ll believe that only when it happens."


    In terms of being able to achieve positive action, yes. However, on a parliamentary VoNC, I'd expect that O'Mara, Woodcock and any SDP2 would still line up alongside Corbyn in the Aye lobby. Bringing down the Tories is something that would unite them (possibly not O'Mara depending on how selfish he was feeling).

    I’m not sure I could, actually.

    I don’t think Woodcock would do anything that risked putting Corbyn in power.

    I think we’d find he had urgent longstanding constituency commitments.
  • AlastairMeeksAlastairMeeks Posts: 30,340
    When Theresa May talked of citizens of nowhere, she was telling the hateful Leavers that it was ok to hate their opponents. They took her at her word, and have spent the last couple of years steadily ramping up the hate levels.
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 60,507

    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2018/aug/03/jeremy-corbyn-antisemitism-labour-party

    He just doesn't get it.

    Mealy-mouthed waffle. It will make things worse not better.

    That is why I want to make it absolutely clear that any government I lead will take whatever measures are necessary to guarantee the security of Jewish communities, Jewish schools, Jewish places of worship, Jewish social care, Jewish culture and Jewish life as a whole in this country.

    Well that's a relief, Jeremy. We all thought you'd be letting the mobs torch synagogues as they pleased.
    “I’m against the torching of all religious buildings.”
  • RecidivistRecidivist Posts: 4,679
    I think citizens of nowhere refers to rootless internationalist who travel the world and settle anywhere that suits their cosmopolitan tastes. Or it might mean inhabitants of Bognor.
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 52,628
    ...and he walks off...

    5 down
  • AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 29,395
    edited August 2018
    Edgbaston is famous for low scoring matches that are finished in a short time. So why did they start on a Wednesday? They've sold out the weekend but we may not get that far.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 119,701
    edited August 2018
    AndyJS said:

    Edgbaston is famous for low scoring matches that are finished in a short time. So why did they start on a Wednesday? They've sold out the weekend but we may not get that far.

    So Lord's test could start on a Thursday.

    Plus I don't think they sold out the weekend.

    They don't usually sell tickets for a fifth day.
  • tlg86tlg86 Posts: 26,180

    When Theresa May talked of citizens of nowhere, she was telling the hateful Leavers that it was ok to hate their opponents. They took her at her word, and have spent the last couple of years steadily ramping up the hate levels.

    Fake news.
  • John_MJohn_M Posts: 7,503

    When Theresa May talked of citizens of nowhere, she was telling the hateful Leavers that it was ok to hate their opponents. They took her at her word, and have spent the last couple of years steadily ramping up the hate levels.

    Blimey, it's six o'clock. Time to knock off the ramping and go down the pub.
  • PClippPClipp Posts: 2,138
    HYUFD said:

    John_M said:

    HYUFD said:

    I'm loving HYUFD's idea that Boris Johnson is going to sell May's Brexit, that he described as a turd, to the public in a General Election.
    Post-referendum he couldn't even sell his own version of Brexit. His big speech was a disaster that's only remembered for jokes about stag dos and sex tourism.

    Boris would not sell May's Brexit, he would sell No Deal Brexit if we are still in a transition period by December 2020 with no FTA.
    It was also Boris leading Leave which played a key part in the Leave win
    That was then; this is now. Boris has been tried in cabinet and found wanting. There's no particular shame in that; we all have our level, and he peaked as London's mayor during the Olympics.
    Boris is the only Tory with the charisma and appeal to Tory to UKIP voters to beat Corbyn in my view at the moment.
    Please can you explain to me, Mr HYUFD, what is this charisma of which you speak? I had not notice any. Just buffoonery and incompetence.
  • When Theresa May talked of citizens of nowhere, she was telling the hateful Leavers that it was ok to hate their opponents. They took her at her word, and have spent the last couple of years steadily ramping up the hate levels.

    Oh, good evening Lord Adonis!
  • MortimerMortimer Posts: 14,127
    edited August 2018
    John_M said:

    When Theresa May talked of citizens of nowhere, she was telling the hateful Leavers that it was ok to hate their opponents. They took her at her word, and have spent the last couple of years steadily ramping up the hate levels.

    Blimey, it's six o'clock. Time to knock off the ramping and go down the pub.
    +1

    Posting from a paddling pool in the back guardian. A tremendous investment.
  • grabcocquegrabcocque Posts: 4,234
    edited August 2018
    Theresa May's a terrible politician, so I don't think we should expend too much energy worrying about what she meant with her shitty little dogwhistle, if indeed she meant anything at all.

    When dogwhistling for the Daily Express one doesn't mean to be 'understood' in any conventional fashion. One only intends to elicit a non-specific grunt of angry paranoia.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 71,304
    John_M said:

    When Theresa May talked of citizens of nowhere, she was telling the hateful Leavers that it was ok to hate their opponents. They took her at her word, and have spent the last couple of years steadily ramping up the hate levels.

    Blimey, it's six o'clock. Time to knock off the ramping and go down the pub.
    Been there since 5.10...

  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 123,206
    edited August 2018

    I think citizens of nowhere refers to rootless internationalist who travel the world and settle anywhere that suits their cosmopolitan tastes. Or it might mean inhabitants of Bognor.

    The type of rich jetsetters in the US, France or the UK who are more familiar with London and New York City and LA or Paris than provincial France, the rustbelt US and deep South or the north and Midlands and Wales in their own country.

    They have more in common with each other than Trump, Le Pen or Leave voters
  • Theresa May's a terrible politician, so I don't think we should expend too much energy worrying about what she meant with her shitty little dogwhistle.

    She wanted a phrase that sounded a lot like 'rootless cosmopolitan'?
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 60,507

    When Theresa May talked of citizens of nowhere, she was telling the hateful Leavers that it was ok to hate their opponents. They took her at her word, and have spent the last couple of years steadily ramping up the hate levels.

    No she wasn’t.

    I agree that in hindsight the language was poorly chosen, however.
  • CookieCookie Posts: 13,863

    When Theresa May talked of citizens of nowhere, she was telling the hateful Leavers that it was ok to hate their opponents. They took her at her word, and have spent the last couple of years steadily ramping up the hate levels.

    Alastair, you write a weekly column here on how absolutely awful Leavers are. You surely can't be complaining about others hating their opponents?
  • On BBC at the moment: Brits on holiday in Spain, complaining about how hot it is there.

    If you don't want to feel like you are "melting" then don't go to Spain in August. This is not a difficult concept to grasp.

    Morons.
  • Theresa May's a terrible politician, so I don't think we should expend too much energy worrying about what she meant with her shitty little dogwhistle.

    She wanted a phrase that sounded a lot like 'rootless cosmopolitan'?
    Cosmopolitan? I would have thought Theresa was more of a Woman's Own?
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 34,705

    Theresa May's a terrible politician, so I don't think we should expend too much energy worrying about what she meant with her shitty little dogwhistle.

    She wanted a phrase that sounded a lot like 'rootless cosmopolitan'?
    She wanted to sound like Stalin??
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 60,507

    On BBC at the moment: Brits on holiday in Spain, complaining about how hot it is there.

    If you don't want to feel like you are "melting" then don't go to Spain in August. This is not a difficult concept to grasp.

    Morons.

    I think Brits just generally love moaning about the weather, whatever it is and wherever they are.
  • Theresa May's a terrible politician, so I don't think we should expend too much energy worrying about what she meant with her shitty little dogwhistle.

    She wanted a phrase that sounded a lot like 'rootless cosmopolitan'?
    Cosmopolitan? I would have thought Theresa was more of a Woman's Own?
    Woman's Weekly, surely?
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 123,206
    edited August 2018
    PClipp said:

    HYUFD said:

    John_M said:

    HYUFD said:

    I'm loving HYUFD's idea that Boris Johnson is going to sell May's Brexit, that he described as a turd, to the public in a General Election.
    Post-referendum he couldn't even sell his own version of Brexit. His big speech was a disaster that's only remembered for jokes about stag dos and sex tourism.

    Boris would not sell May's Brexit, he would sell No Deal Brexit if we are still in a transition period by December 2020 with no FTA.
    It was also Boris leading Leave which played a key part in the Leave win
    That was then; this is now. Boris has been tried in cabinet and found wanting. There's no particular shame in that; we all have our level, and he peaked as London's mayor during the Olympics.
    Boris is the only Tory with the charisma and appeal to Tory to UKIP voters to beat Corbyn in my view at the moment.
    Please can you explain to me, Mr HYUFD, what is this charisma of which you speak? I had not notice any. Just buffoonery and incompetence.
    It has nothing to do with being dull serious and competent, otherwise Hammond would be charismatic.

    It has to do with the ability to connect with people from all backgrounds and excite emotion and ideally be able to speak in such a way as to rouse a crowd. Corbyn to be fair has charisma too, certainly more than Brown and Ed Miliband did as did Cameron as did Blair as does Farage.

    Most elections today are won not on policy but who has the more charismatic leader

  • GardenwalkerGardenwalker Posts: 21,298

    When Theresa May talked of citizens of nowhere, she was telling the hateful Leavers that it was ok to hate their opponents. They took her at her word, and have spent the last couple of years steadily ramping up the hate levels.

    No she wasn’t.

    I agree that in hindsight the language was poorly chosen, however.
    I don’t think May personally has it in for the metropolitan elite, and she can be forgiven for not understanding their values.

    What was incredible though was the bad judgment on using such language. It - and the accompanying failure to condemn an overheated tabloid press - was unmistakeably divisive at a time when statesmanship and unity was called for.

    It set the tone for Brexit as a whole, and by extension the government and the Conservative party. Ironic that it came from the lady who recognised that the party had become “nasty” in what now seems like a halcyon era.
  • Theresa May's a terrible politician, so I don't think we should expend too much energy worrying about what she meant with her shitty little dogwhistle.

    She wanted a phrase that sounded a lot like 'rootless cosmopolitan'?
    She wanted to sound like Stalin??
    Well Vince Cable said Gordon Brown was like Stalin, and we all know my description of Mrs May as a pound shop Gordon Brown.
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 49,881

    IanB2 said:

    Looks like Tory East Sussex council will be the second to go into pre-bankruptcy special measures

    If accurate, this story gets odder and odder. Why is it that these relatively well-off shire counties are falling over first? You would've thought the first councils to roll over and stick their legs up in the air would be in places struggling to meet the needs of deprived communities?
    Old people who live longer are the principal source of additional costs that cannot be avoided. Areas with lots of these tend to be rural and Tory.
  • brendan16brendan16 Posts: 2,315
    IanB2 said:

    Looks like Tory East Sussex council will be the second to go into pre-bankruptcy special measures

    When it comes to elderly social care many councils have already cut services to the bare statutory minimum. If you get old and frail or are a relative of an old and frail person you are very much on your own unless you are lucky enough to wangle NHS continuing health care which is a pure lottery process.

    https://www.theguardian.com/society/2018/aug/03/local-council-funding-crisis-east-sussex-cuts-services
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 123,206

    On BBC at the moment: Brits on holiday in Spain, complaining about how hot it is there.

    If you don't want to feel like you are "melting" then don't go to Spain in August. This is not a difficult concept to grasp.

    Morons.

    To be fair though Spain today is more like Dubai in August than a Med resort
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 34,705

    Theresa May's a terrible politician, so I don't think we should expend too much energy worrying about what she meant with her shitty little dogwhistle.

    She wanted a phrase that sounded a lot like 'rootless cosmopolitan'?
    Cosmopolitan? I would have thought Theresa was more of a Woman's Own?
    Hello!
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 54,635

    surby said:

    Anorak said:
    Finally, he has said something sensible.
    This is actually what May meant when she was talking about citizens of nowhere.
    Exactly. She was talking about large multinational businesses and individuals like Richard Branson and Philip Green, who find ways to make sure the money ends up offshore and untaxable.
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 34,705
    HYUFD said:

    On BBC at the moment: Brits on holiday in Spain, complaining about how hot it is there.

    If you don't want to feel like you are "melting" then don't go to Spain in August. This is not a difficult concept to grasp.

    Morons.

    To be fair though Spain today is more like Dubai in August than a Med resort
    Where's @Hunchman when you need him to tell us about the impending ice age?
  • Scott_PScott_P Posts: 51,453
    Looks like Jezza has finally put the Anti-Semitism story to bed.

    Nothing his critics can say now...
  • stodgestodge Posts: 13,910

    IanB2 said:

    Looks like Tory East Sussex council will be the second to go into pre-bankruptcy special measures

    I doubt it very much. It's a well-run council, which has made a lot of progress in reducing costs.

    It does have a big demographic problem, though - lots of elderly residents.
    The budget for Adult Social Care at East Sussex rose from £240.3 million in financial year 16-17 to £255 million in 18-19. The spend on Children has fallen in the same period from £309.4 million to £288.4 million.

    On the Income side the Council Tax brings in £280.4 million this year compared with £261.5 million in 17-18. I understand ESCC see their "hole" at about £20 million but they spend £790 million so that isn't a big gap.

    Basically, a County Council, however "well run" is going to have to put up its Council Tax precept by 5-6% every year simply to keep with the growing demand for adult social care.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,181

    A party whose supporters are unhinged enough to be willing to see a return to violence in Northern Ireland or Scotland independent if that secures Brexit cannot be assumed to be sane enough to reject Boris Johnson.

    The MPs stand as gatekeepers. 80 headbangers might be enough to inflict him on us all. Can anyone say with confidence that there aren't 80 headbanging Conservative MPs?

    There are at least that many.

    I don't like Boris, but if he gets to the final two I think he wins.
  • oxfordsimonoxfordsimon Posts: 5,842
    Scott_P said:

    Looks like Jezza has finally put the Anti-Semitism story to bed.

    Nothing his critics can say now...

    Yes - that is so clear from the BBC report which focuses on all of those who say it has changed nothing...!
  • RogerRoger Posts: 19,914
    edited August 2018
    A few weeks away from the news and the first headline is Jeremy Corbyn saying 'we are determined to root out anti-semitism like it's a new McCarthyism. Secret cells of Jew haters lurking in the bowels of the Labour Party........

    Second item was Rees Mogg complaining that Mark Carney has been seen interfering in Bank of England business.....Bloody colonials

    Bonkers!

  • AlastairMeeksAlastairMeeks Posts: 30,340
    Cookie said:

    When Theresa May talked of citizens of nowhere, she was telling the hateful Leavers that it was ok to hate their opponents. They took her at her word, and have spent the last couple of years steadily ramping up the hate levels.

    Alastair, you write a weekly column here on how absolutely awful Leavers are. You surely can't be complaining about others hating their opponents?
    I rarely write about Brexit, at least not as the main theme. There hasn’t been that much interesting to say about it for a while.

    That has been changing recently. I expect I’ll write a bit more about it in the near future. One of the most important developments has been the emerging clarity about just how obsessive many Leavers are, regarding almost any amount of damage to Britain as an acceptable price to pay for Brexit. This has many important implications for British politics and needs to be very fully explored.

    In retrospect, Theresa May’s signal to them that it was ok to hate was a landmark moment. The hate levels have ratcheted up inexorably.
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 60,507

    When Theresa May talked of citizens of nowhere, she was telling the hateful Leavers that it was ok to hate their opponents. They took her at her word, and have spent the last couple of years steadily ramping up the hate levels.

    No she wasn’t.

    I agree that in hindsight the language was poorly chosen, however.
    I don’t think May personally has it in for the metropolitan elite, and she can be forgiven for not understanding their values.

    What was incredible though was the bad judgment on using such language. It - and the accompanying failure to condemn an overheated tabloid press - was unmistakeably divisive at a time when statesmanship and unity was called for.

    It set the tone for Brexit as a whole, and by extension the government and the Conservative party. Ironic that it came from the lady who recognised that the party had become “nasty” in what now seems like a halcyon era.
    I agree with you. It divided rather than healed.
  • Richard_NabaviRichard_Nabavi Posts: 30,821
    stodge said:

    IanB2 said:

    Looks like Tory East Sussex council will be the second to go into pre-bankruptcy special measures

    I doubt it very much. It's a well-run council, which has made a lot of progress in reducing costs.

    It does have a big demographic problem, though - lots of elderly residents.
    The budget for Adult Social Care at East Sussex rose from £240.3 million in financial year 16-17 to £255 million in 18-19. The spend on Children has fallen in the same period from £309.4 million to £288.4 million.

    On the Income side the Council Tax brings in £280.4 million this year compared with £261.5 million in 17-18. I understand ESCC see their "hole" at about £20 million but they spend £790 million so that isn't a big gap.

    Basically, a County Council, however "well run" is going to have to put up its Council Tax precept by 5-6% every year simply to keep with the growing demand for adult social care.
    Yes, but they haven't been allowed to, and the government hasn't been filling the gap.

    Clearly that will have to change. The only question is where the dosh comes from.
  • HYUFD said:

    On BBC at the moment: Brits on holiday in Spain, complaining about how hot it is there.

    If you don't want to feel like you are "melting" then don't go to Spain in August. This is not a difficult concept to grasp.

    Morons.

    To be fair though Spain today is more like Dubai in August than a Med resort
    Yes, but honestly - people will insist on taking their holidays in hot countries at the hottest time of the year, and then expressing astonishment if it turns out to be a bit hotter than usual.

    If you went there in November and found it was 40°C+ at midday then you'd have more justification for feeling somewhat miffed.
  • Theresa May's a terrible politician, so I don't think we should expend too much energy worrying about what she meant with her shitty little dogwhistle.

    She wanted a phrase that sounded a lot like 'rootless cosmopolitan'?
    She wanted to sound like Stalin??
    Well Vince Cable said Gordon Brown was like Stalin, and we all know my description of Mrs May as a pound shop Gordon Brown.
    Vince said that Brown went "from Stalin to Mr Bean".
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 54,635
    edited August 2018
    HYUFD said:

    On BBC at the moment: Brits on holiday in Spain, complaining about how hot it is there.

    If you don't want to feel like you are "melting" then don't go to Spain in August. This is not a difficult concept to grasp.

    Morons.

    To be fair though Spain today is more like Dubai in August than a Med resort
    Hello from Dubai in August. Where your sunglasses steam up as you leave the house, it’s 45°C and 70% humidity during the day, dropping to about 37°C and 80% humidity overnight. Two minutes outside leaves you wanting a change of shirt, and having to park your car outside during the day means you’ll come back to a sauna.

    Dubai’s a lovely place in the winter, but it’s brutal in the summer. Anyone who can get out has left until at least September, witness all the Arabs in London at this time of year.

    Every year a bunch of uninformed Brits turn up though, seeing the fantastic rates at the beach hotels and thinking it can’t be that bad...
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,181

    The administrative incompetence of the Labour party hierarchy is quite something.

    In fairness I doubt the tory party has great administration either, but we certainly do get a lot of examples of Labour's procedures or compliance being pretty astounding.
  • I tell you who also copied and pasted stuff off the internet....

    https://twitter.com/ShippersUnbound/status/1025436233927991296
  • oxfordsimonoxfordsimon Posts: 5,842
    Ouch - that is damning. Rehashing a 3-month old article under the current circumstances is beneath contempt.
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 62,778
    Scott_P said:

    Looks like Jezza has finally put the Anti-Semitism story to bed.

    Nothing his critics can say now...

    https://twitter.com/stephenpollard/status/1025433290021523456

    I am sure Jews are reassured.

    Really why can't all his nutjob fans see what a nasty piece of work he is?
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 123,206
    edited August 2018

    HYUFD said:

    On BBC at the moment: Brits on holiday in Spain, complaining about how hot it is there.

    If you don't want to feel like you are "melting" then don't go to Spain in August. This is not a difficult concept to grasp.

    Morons.

    To be fair though Spain today is more like Dubai in August than a Med resort
    Yes, but honestly - people will insist on taking their holidays in hot countries at the hottest time of the year, and then expressing astonishment if it turns out to be a bit hotter than usual.

    If you went there in November and found it was 40°C+ at midday then you'd have more justification for feeling somewhat miffed.
    If these sunny British summers continue you may be better off taking autumn or winter holidays certainly
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 82,163
    edited August 2018

    I tell you who also copied and pasted stuff off the internet....

    twitter.com/ShippersUnbound/status/1025436233927991296

    Well the one thing we know about Jezza, he hasn't changed his opinion on anything for over 40 years...so why would he in the past 3 months.

    Also, cut n pasting speeches, its Trumpian....
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 123,206
    Sandpit said:

    HYUFD said:

    On BBC at the moment: Brits on holiday in Spain, complaining about how hot it is there.

    If you don't want to feel like you are "melting" then don't go to Spain in August. This is not a difficult concept to grasp.

    Morons.

    To be fair though Spain today is more like Dubai in August than a Med resort
    Hello from Dubai in August. Where your sunglasses steam up as you leave the house, it’s 45°C and 70% humidity during the day, dropping to about 37°C and 80% humidity overnight. Two minutes outside leaves you wanting a change of shirt, and having to park your car outside during the day means you’ll come back to a sauna.

    Dubai’s a lovely place in the winter, but it’s brutal in the summer. Anyone who can get out has left until at least September, witness all the Arabs in London at this time of year.

    Every year a bunch of uninformed Brits turn up though, seeing the fantastic rates at the beach hotels and thinking it can’t be that bad...
    Yes Dubai in December and January is heaven, Dubai in July and August anything but
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 82,163
    edited August 2018

    twitter.com/Evan_Rosenfeld/status/1025406172688314370

    What has it been doing with all those millions of membership subs?
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 54,635

    I tell you who also copied and pasted stuff off the internet....

    https://twitter.com/ShippersUnbound/status/1025436233927991296

    Oh dear oh dear oh dear. This isn’t going away, and is now probably going on most of tomorrow’s front pages. Way to shut down the story Labour!
  • Sandpit said:

    I tell you who also copied and pasted stuff off the internet....

    https://twitter.com/ShippersUnbound/status/1025436233927991296

    Oh dear oh dear oh dear. This isn’t going away, and is now probably going on most of tomorrow’s front pages. Way to shut down the story Labour!
    Thick as shit...
  • AnorakAnorak Posts: 6,621

    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2018/aug/03/jeremy-corbyn-antisemitism-labour-party

    He just doesn't get it.

    Mealy-mouthed waffle. It will make things worse not better.

    That is why I want to make it absolutely clear that any government I lead will take whatever measures are necessary to guarantee the security of Jewish communities, Jewish schools, Jewish places of worship, Jewish social care, Jewish culture and Jewish life as a whole in this country.

    Well that's a relief, Jeremy. We all thought you'd be letting the mobs torch synagogues as they pleased.
    His comment is just bloody sinister.
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 34,705
    edited August 2018

    Theresa May's a terrible politician, so I don't think we should expend too much energy worrying about what she meant with her shitty little dogwhistle.

    She wanted a phrase that sounded a lot like 'rootless cosmopolitan'?
    She wanted to sound like Stalin??
    Well Vince Cable said Gordon Brown was like Stalin, and we all know my description of Mrs May as a pound shop Gordon Brown.
    Vince said that Brown went "from Stalin to Mr Bean".
    Actually tbh Theresa has got more in common with Mr Bean.

    You can imagine Mr Bean trying to make a conference speech where he is given a P45, loses his voice and the slogan behind him starts to fall off the wall. No, wait, that is just too far-fetched...
  • twitter.com/Evan_Rosenfeld/status/1025406172688314370

    What has it been doing with all those millions of membership subs?
    1) Been spending more than it receives (Overspent by $46 million in 2016)

    2) Become a financial pariah as banking and financial services avoid the NRA like you avoid an ex with the clap.
  • mattmatt Posts: 3,789

    I think citizens of nowhere refers to rootless internationalist who travel the world and settle anywhere that suits their cosmopolitan tastes. Or it might mean inhabitants of Bognor.

    It’s an odd phrase. I probably hit it in some peoples’ eyes. But the only time I’ve really recognised it in action is when flying Qatar. When one flies BA, AA, DLH or Air France they’re recognisably of their nationality. Qatar could be anywhere but certainly isn’t Arabian Gulf.
  • AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 29,395
    edited August 2018
    Sandpit said:

    HYUFD said:

    On BBC at the moment: Brits on holiday in Spain, complaining about how hot it is there.

    If you don't want to feel like you are "melting" then don't go to Spain in August. This is not a difficult concept to grasp.

    Morons.

    To be fair though Spain today is more like Dubai in August than a Med resort
    Hello from Dubai in August. Where your sunglasses steam up as you leave the house, it’s 45°C and 70% humidity during the day, dropping to about 37°C and 80% humidity overnight. Two minutes outside leaves you wanting a change of shirt, and having to park your car outside during the day means you’ll come back to a sauna.

    Dubai’s a lovely place in the winter, but it’s brutal in the summer. Anyone who can get out has left until at least September, witness all the Arabs in London at this time of year.

    Every year a bunch of uninformed Brits turn up though, seeing the fantastic rates at the beach hotels and thinking it can’t be that bad...
    I've only been to Dubai Airport once but I was astonished that we had to get out of the plane onto the tarmac and wait for a bus. Luckily it was 7am in winter and therefore only about 20 degrees but if you had to do that in the middle of the day in summertime it would be awful.
  • twitter.com/Evan_Rosenfeld/status/1025406172688314370

    What has it been doing with all those millions of membership subs?
    1) Been spending more than it receives (Overspent by $46 million in 2016)

    2) Become a financial pariah as banking and financial services avoid the NRA like you avoid an ex with the clap.
    Spending on what? Lobbying?
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,181
    Anorak said:

    Can't wait to see Jacob talk his way around the massive Brexit recession that's coming.

    He'll be too busy though, over in Dublin.

    "It was all Theresa May's fault for not negotiating properly." - we've seen the excuse trailed a few times already.
    .
    It will, and it will be a lie. If they had the numbers to pursue a different path they would have, and they certainly have the numbers to have had a vote of no confidence a long time ago. Even if they lost, they could prove they tried to stop it.
  • stodge said:

    IanB2 said:

    Looks like Tory East Sussex council will be the second to go into pre-bankruptcy special measures

    I doubt it very much. It's a well-run council, which has made a lot of progress in reducing costs.

    It does have a big demographic problem, though - lots of elderly residents.
    The budget for Adult Social Care at East Sussex rose from £240.3 million in financial year 16-17 to £255 million in 18-19. The spend on Children has fallen in the same period from £309.4 million to £288.4 million.

    On the Income side the Council Tax brings in £280.4 million this year compared with £261.5 million in 17-18. I understand ESCC see their "hole" at about £20 million but they spend £790 million so that isn't a big gap.

    Basically, a County Council, however "well run" is going to have to put up its Council Tax precept by 5-6% every year simply to keep with the growing demand for adult social care.
    Yes, but they haven't been allowed to, and the government hasn't been filling the gap.

    Clearly that will have to change. The only question is where the dosh comes from.
    The more I look into this subject the more nightmarish it appears. Council funding from central Government appears to vary wildly between authorities, council tax itself is an outdated and unfair system that nobody seems to have the imagination or willpower to attempt to replace, and council tax remains capped in any event. When Government relaxes the cap it's (a) by wholly inadequate amounts and (b) all the extra money is directed to specific areas of spending. If this continues then local government will end up having progressively more of its budget set for it by the Treasury, and it'll end up having nothing to do except designate service providers and act as a lightning rod for complaints whenever things go wrong with them. Which is probably the general idea.

    The dosh for social care will continue to come from all of the other services, until all the libraries, museums and leisure centres are shut and sold off for housing, the parks and roadside verges go untended, the roads go unrepaired, and the bins are only collected once a month. All of which will be blamed on the councils, of course, which will then end up going bankrupt anyway.

    At that point central Government will have to dig its hands into its pockets to pay someone to mop up old people's wee and save children in failing families from being tortured and raped. At this point we shall have no local democracy left at all, very few local services, and the Government will finally get the blame for everything. But it'll be too late to put all the damage right by then, won't it?
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 62,778

    Sandpit said:

    I tell you who also copied and pasted stuff off the internet....

    https://twitter.com/ShippersUnbound/status/1025436233927991296

    Oh dear oh dear oh dear. This isn’t going away, and is now probably going on most of tomorrow’s front pages. Way to shut down the story Labour!
    Thick as shit...
    Yeh, but Milne isn't. They just don't care.
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 49,881
    Ooh, I just got a limbo thread come up from 2010 with only one comment under it. Now it's gone.
  • twitter.com/Evan_Rosenfeld/status/1025406172688314370

    What has it been doing with all those millions of membership subs?
    1) Been spending more than it receives (Overspent by $46 million in 2016)

    2) Become a financial pariah as banking and financial services avoid the NRA like you avoid an ex with the clap.
    Spending on what? Lobbying?
    Yup but mostly on PR.

    There's been a spate of shootings recently and they've had to get the spinners on.

    The Orlando nightclub shooting took a lot of spinning, a Muslim terrorist shooting gays was hard to spin as a second amendment right.
  • Sean_FSean_F Posts: 37,392

    stodge said:

    IanB2 said:

    Looks like Tory East Sussex council will be the second to go into pre-bankruptcy special measures

    I doubt it very much. It's a well-run council, which has made a lot of progress in reducing costs.

    It does have a big demographic problem, though - lots of elderly residents.
    The budget for Adult Social Care at East Sussex rose from £240.3 million in financial year 16-17 to £255 million in 18-19. The spend on Children has fallen in the same period from £309.4 million to £288.4 million.

    On the Income side the Council Tax brings in £280.4 million this year compared with £261.5 million in 17-18. I understand ESCC see their "hole" at about £20 million but they spend £790 million so that isn't a big gap.

    Basically, a County Council, however "well run" is going to have to put up its Council Tax precept by 5-6% every year simply to keep with the growing demand for adult social care.
    Yes, but they haven't been allowed to, and the government hasn't been filling the gap.

    Clearly that will have to change. The only question is where the dosh comes from.
    Fortunately, the government has more fiscal room to manoeuvre than it thought it had.
  • GardenwalkerGardenwalker Posts: 21,298
    Corbyn’s get tough response has dissolved within seconds.

    It am trying to give him a break as I hate to jump on the anti-semite bandwagon, but it is not clear to me that he gives a stale shit.
  • RobDRobD Posts: 59,936

    Corbyn’s get tough response has dissolved within seconds.

    It am trying to give him a break as I hate to jump on the anti-semite bandwagon, but it is not clear to me that he gives a stale shit.

    Given that it's just a copy/paste of a previous statement, I think you are right.
  • stodgestodge Posts: 13,910
    Sean_F said:


    Fortunately, the government has more fiscal room to manoeuvre than it thought it had.

    They are also supposed to be producing a Green Paper on the subject in the Autumn but a guarantee of say £5 billion to cover costs for three years to all local authorities should help.

  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,181
    Scott_P said:
    Well at least he says it's a problem. I'm sure that will stop his core people from denying that...
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 34,705

    Corbyn’s get tough response has dissolved within seconds.

    It am trying to give him a break as I hate to jump on the anti-semite bandwagon, but it is not clear to me that he gives a stale shit.

    I think this is the beginning of the end for JC.
  • GardenwalkerGardenwalker Posts: 21,298

    twitter.com/Evan_Rosenfeld/status/1025406172688314370

    What has it been doing with all those millions of membership subs?
    1) Been spending more than it receives (Overspent by $46 million in 2016)

    2) Become a financial pariah as banking and financial services avoid the NRA like you avoid an ex with the clap.
    Spending on what? Lobbying?
    Yup but mostly on PR.

    There's been a spate of shootings recently and they've had to get the spinners on.

    The Orlando nightclub shooting took a lot of spinning, a Muslim terrorist shooting gays was hard to spin as a second amendment right.
    What about remittances from Russia?
    You’d think that would have offset some of the cost.
  • HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    On BBC at the moment: Brits on holiday in Spain, complaining about how hot it is there.

    If you don't want to feel like you are "melting" then don't go to Spain in August. This is not a difficult concept to grasp.

    Morons.

    To be fair though Spain today is more like Dubai in August than a Med resort
    Yes, but honestly - people will insist on taking their holidays in hot countries at the hottest time of the year, and then expressing astonishment if it turns out to be a bit hotter than usual.

    If you went there in November and found it was 40°C+ at midday then you'd have more justification for feeling somewhat miffed.
    If these sunny British summers continue you may be better off taking autumn or winter holidays certainly
    If the Summers continue to get worse then I may start taking my holidays in Iceland just to get away from it for a bit.

    Actually, I wonder if there might be a bit of reverse tourism in future? Britain and Scandinavia could be ideal destinations for desperate Iberians looking for a bit of light relief from it all.
  • AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 29,395
    edited August 2018

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    On BBC at the moment: Brits on holiday in Spain, complaining about how hot it is there.

    If you don't want to feel like you are "melting" then don't go to Spain in August. This is not a difficult concept to grasp.

    Morons.

    To be fair though Spain today is more like Dubai in August than a Med resort
    Yes, but honestly - people will insist on taking their holidays in hot countries at the hottest time of the year, and then expressing astonishment if it turns out to be a bit hotter than usual.

    If you went there in November and found it was 40°C+ at midday then you'd have more justification for feeling somewhat miffed.
    If these sunny British summers continue you may be better off taking autumn or winter holidays certainly
    If the Summers continue to get worse then I may start taking my holidays in Iceland just to get away from it for a bit.

    Actually, I wonder if there might be a bit of reverse tourism in future? Britain and Scandinavia could be ideal destinations for desperate Iberians looking for a bit of light relief from it all.
    Oslo and Stockholm were just as hot as London the other day. 33 degrees.
  • AlastairMeeksAlastairMeeks Posts: 30,340
    Even now there’s the possibility of a Jeremy Corbyn Jewish redemption story. It entails him asking to meet a diverse panel of Jewish spokespeople of all political and denominational leanings, sitting, listening and reflecting. He then needs to explain his perspective and seek their help with reconciling this with their concerns about the Labour party. Common ground can be found. This is less about the range of acceptable political views about Israel and more about the expression of those views, and being alive to how legitimate views can be expressed illegitimately and giving cover to those holding illegitimate views.

    That, however, would require him to change his political perspective to some extent, not just presentationally but substantively. I can’t see him doing that.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,181
    PClipp said:

    HYUFD said:

    John_M said:

    HYUFD said:

    I'm loving HYUFD's idea that Boris Johnson is going to sell May's Brexit, that he described as a turd, to the public in a General Election.
    Post-referendum he couldn't even sell his own version of Brexit. His big speech was a disaster that's only remembered for jokes about stag dos and sex tourism.

    Boris would not sell May's Brexit, he would sell No Deal Brexit if we are still in a transition period by December 2020 with no FTA.
    It was also Boris leading Leave which played a key part in the Leave win
    That was then; this is now. Boris has been tried in cabinet and found wanting. There's no particular shame in that; we all have our level, and he peaked as London's mayor during the Olympics.
    Boris is the only Tory with the charisma and appeal to Tory to UKIP voters to beat Corbyn in my view at the moment.
    Please can you explain to me, Mr HYUFD, what is this charisma of which you speak? I had not notice any. Just buffoonery and incompetence.
    He has charisma. He's engaging in a way many are not. But a level of charisma is not enough, if paired with negatives at least as high or even greater.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,181
    RobD said:

    Corbyn’s get tough response has dissolved within seconds.

    It am trying to give him a break as I hate to jump on the anti-semite bandwagon, but it is not clear to me that he gives a stale shit.

    Given that it's just a copy/paste of a previous statement, I think you are right.
    So it will work then. His previous efforts manage to kick the can down the road no matter if people say enough is enough.
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 52,628
    It would be rather joyous if the NRA were to fold on Trump's watch.
  • AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 29,395
    "Face to face with Matteo Salvini, Italy’s far-right Deputy PM"

    https://www.channel4.com/news/face-to-face-with-matteo-salvini-italys-far-right-deputy-pm
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,181

    stodge said:

    IanB2 said:

    Looks like Tory East Sussex council will be the second to go into pre-bankruptcy special measures

    I doubt it very much. It's a well-run council, which has made a lot of progress in reducing costs.

    It does have a big demographic problem, though - lots of elderly residents.
    The budget for Adult Social Care at East Sussex rose from £240.3 million in financial year 16-17

    On the Income side the Council Tax brings in £280.4 million this year compared with £261.5 million in 17-18. I understand ESCC see their "hole" at about £20 million but they spend £790 million so that isn't a big gap.

    Basically, a County Council, however "well run" is going to have to put up its Council Tax precept by 5-6% every year simply to keep with the growing demand for adult social care.
    Yes, but they haven't om.
    The more I look into this subject the more nightmarish it appears. Council funding from central Government appears to vary wildly between authorities, council tax itself is an outdated and unfair system that nobody seems to have the imagination or willpower to attempt to replace, and council tax remains capped in any event. When Government relaxes the cap it's (a) by wholly inadequate amounts and (b) all the extra money is directed to specific areas of spending. If this continues then local government will end up having progressively more of its budget set for it by the Treasury, and it'll end up having nothing to do except designate service providers and act as a lightning rod for complaints whenever things go wrong with them. Which is probably the general idea.

    The dosh for social care will continue to come from all of the other services, until all the libraries, museums and leisure centres are shut and sold off for housing, the parks and roadside verges go untended, the roads go unrepaired, and the bins are only collected once a month. All of which will be blamed on the councils, of course, which will then end up going bankrupt anyway.

    At that point central Government will have to dig its hands into its pockets to pay someone to mop up old people's wee and save children in failing families from being tortured and raped. At this point we shall have no local democracy left at all, very few local services, and the Government will finally get the blame for everything. But it'll be too late to put all the damage right by then, won't it?
    It's possible. I work in local government , and while most are not at the cliff edge, the funding situation is very inadequate. The Gov clearly know this which is why they had the social care levy to get around needing referendums on larger council tax rises.
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 52,628

    Corbyn’s get tough response has dissolved within seconds.

    It am trying to give him a break as I hate to jump on the anti-semite bandwagon, but it is not clear to me that he gives a stale shit.

    You do yourself no favours by denigrating righteous anger as the "anti-semite bandwagon".
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,181

    Ouch - that is damning. Rehashing a 3-month old article under the current circumstances is beneath contempt.
    It certainly speaks to competence regardless of anything else.
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 34,705

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    On BBC at the moment: Brits on holiday in Spain, complaining about how hot it is there.

    If you don't want to feel like you are "melting" then don't go to Spain in August. This is not a difficult concept to grasp.

    Morons.

    To be fair though Spain today is more like Dubai in August than a Med resort
    Yes, but honestly - people will insist on taking their holidays in hot countries at the hottest time of the year, and then expressing astonishment if it turns out to be a bit hotter than usual.

    If you went there in November and found it was 40°C+ at midday then you'd have more justification for feeling somewhat miffed.
    If these sunny British summers continue you may be better off taking autumn or winter holidays certainly
    If the Summers continue to get worse then I may start taking my holidays in Iceland just to get away from it for a bit.

    Actually, I wonder if there might be a bit of reverse tourism in future? Britain and Scandinavia could be ideal destinations for desperate Iberians looking for a bit of light relief from it all.
    Aviemore could become a hill station I guess.
This discussion has been closed.