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politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » The Tory leadership – an alternative view

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  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 57,249

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:
    It surprises me Putin did not invite Trump to the World Cup Final. That America has just been chosen to host (jointly) the one after next would have provided cover.
    I think Trump would find it odd to have a World Cup final where both teams are not American, like the World Series.

    He has tweeted congratulions to France and Russia but clearly he preferred his golf game today and for most Americans soccer comes well below American football, baseball and basketball in terms of interest
    Keep an eye on that: soccer is big in America, especially with the influx of fans from south of the border. They are also very strong in women's football as girls play it at school (hence the so-called soccer moms).
    I went to see Vancouver White Caps play last time I visited my son in Vancouver and it was a good and enjoyable game. Probably Championship level
    We're LAFC season ticket holders, and it's a great atmosphere and fun games. (That LAFC is second in the Western Conference helps too.) It's also the best stadium I've ever been in.

    In fact, I'm taking the kids to see LAFC play Portland this afternoon...
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 63,161
    rcs1000 said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:
    It surprises me Putin did not invite Trump to the World Cup Final. That America has just been chosen to host (jointly) the one after next would have provided cover.
    I think Trump would find it odd to have a World Cup final where both teams are not American, like the World Series.

    He has tweeted congratulions to France and Russia but clearly he preferred his golf game today and for most Americans soccer comes well below American football, baseball and basketball in terms of interest
    Keep an eye on that: soccer is big in America, especially with the influx of fans from south of the border. They are also very strong in women's football as girls play it at school (hence the so-called soccer moms).
    I went to see Vancouver White Caps play last time I visited my son in Vancouver and it was a good and enjoyable game. Probably Championship level
    We're LAFC season ticket holders, and it's a great atmosphere and fun games. (That LAFC is second in the Western Conference helps too.) It's also the best stadium I've ever been in.

    In fact, I'm taking the kids to see LAFC play Portland this afternoon...
    Enjoy the game
  • El_CapitanoEl_Capitano Posts: 4,239
    This is just weird. The people of WOxon (of which I’m one) voted Remain, unlike Robert Courts.
  • OblitusSumMeOblitusSumMe Posts: 9,143

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    Well done France on winning the World Cup but a respectable performance from Croatia too

    And both miles ahead of England
    England lost 3 2 to France last summer, Croatia lost 4 2 to France today.


    It does annoy me the cynicism about England now after the unjustified triumphalism last week. At the end of the day it was our joint best World Cup performance since 1966 when most, including me, thought we would be lucky to get to the quarter finals. We also have a world class goalkeeper now and a shrewd manager and a young team so plenty of room to improve. Though as you are Welsh I know you have no vested interested in England really beyond bring a home nation
    Do not be so silly. I wanted England to win. And befote you dish the Welsh again I am half English.

    England were nowhere near the level of these two teams, nor indeed Belgium.

    Had the draw been different they would not have beaten Brazil.

    I am delighted at their progress but do not wear blinkers
    Sport is sport, anything can happen on the day.

    Yes England are not in the top tier yet but they have made progress this tournament and hopefully there will be more to come
    With lack of opportunities for young English players,WE must send them to the top leagues around Europe.
    What is stopping the top leagues from around Europe buying young English players?

    Maybe they just don't want them.
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 57,249

    SeanT said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    Well done France on winning the World Cup but a respectable performance from Croatia too

    And both miles ahead of England
    England lost 3 2 to France last summer, Croatia lost 4 2 to France today.


    It does annoy me the cynicism about England now after the unjustified triumphalism last week. At the end of the day it was our joint best World Cup performance since 1966 when most, including me, thought we would be lucky to get to the quarter finals. We also have a world class goalkeeper now and a shrewd manager and a young team so plenty of room to improve. Though as you are Welsh I know you have no vested interested in England really beyond bring a home nation
    Do not be so silly. I wanted England to win. And befote you dish the Welsh again I am half English.

    England were nowhere near the level of these two teams, nor indeed Belgium.

    Had the draw been different they would not have beaten Brazil.

    I am delighted at their progress but do not wear blinkers
    Sport is sport, anything can happen on the day.

    Yes England are not in the top tier yet but they have made progress this tournament and hopefully there will be more to come
    England are definitely improving, at all levels, they seem to have learned from the British Olympics Team.


    https://twitter.com/Coral/status/1017691350207041536

    In the next decade or two we will win either the euros or the World Cup. I am willing to bet on it, tho I acccept there is a fair chance I will die of cirrhosis before I need to claim my winnings.
    Only thing Sean,with foriegn owners and manager's,the young players are not getting the chance in the first team.

    Look at Chelsea for example,best young players in the country for the last few years,how many made it to the first team.

    We have to up our talent pool and send them abroad to top leagues in Europe .
    I struggle with the idea that our young players having less competition would make them better. It's like arguing that if we prevented iPhones from coming into the UK then the we'd make a phone that was better than the iPhone.
  • TykejohnnoTykejohnno Posts: 7,362

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    Well done France on winning the World Cup but a respectable performance from Croatia too

    And both miles ahead of England
    England lost 3 2 to France last summer, Croatia lost 4 2 to France today.


    It does annoy me the cynicism about England now after the unjustified triumphalism last week. At the end of the day it was our joint best World Cup performance since 1966 when most, including me, thought we would be lucky to get to the quarter finals. We also have a world class goalkeeper now and a shrewd manager and a young team so plenty of room to improve. Though as you are Welsh I know you have no vested interested in England really beyond bring a home nation
    Do not be so silly. I wanted England to win. And befote you dish the Welsh again I am half English.

    England were nowhere near the level of these two teams, nor indeed Belgium.

    Had the draw been different they would not have beaten Brazil.

    I am delighted at their progress but do not wear blinkers
    Sport is sport, anything can happen on the day.

    Yes England are not in the top tier yet but they have made progress this tournament and hopefully there will be more to come
    With lack of opportunities for young English players,WE must send them to the top leagues around Europe.
    What is stopping the top leagues from around Europe buying young English players?

    Maybe they just don't want them.
    Well the Premier league takes loads of average foriegn players,I'm sure with U-20's and U-17's world cups behind them,we could easily get them to top clubs in Europe to take them instead of rotting in reserve/ youth teams here.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,181
    Odd to say 'in their current form'. What would make its form slightly more acceptable?
  • FenmanFenman Posts: 1,047

    SeanT said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    Well done France on winning the World Cup but a respectable performance from Croatia too

    And both miles ahead of England
    England lost 3 2 to France last summer, Croatia lost 4 2 to France today.


    It does annoy me the cynicism about England now after the unjustified triumphalism last week. At the end of the day it was our joint best World Cup performance since 1966 when most, including me, thought we would be lucky to get to the quarter finals. We also have a world class goalkeeper now and a shrewd manager and a young team so plenty of room to improve. Though as you are Welsh I know you have no vested interested in England really beyond bring a home nation
    Do not be so silly. I wanted England to win. And befote you dish the Welsh again I am half English.

    England were nowhere near the level of these two teams, nor indeed Belgium.

    Had the draw been different they would not have beaten Brazil.

    I am delighted at their progress but do not wear blinkers
    Sport is sport, anything can happen on the day.

    Yes England are not in the top tier yet but they have made progress this tournament and hopefully there will be more to come
    England are definitely improving, at all levels, they seem to have learned from the British Olympics Team.


    https://twitter.com/Coral/status/1017691350207041536

    In the next decade or two we will win either the euros or the World Cup. I am willing to bet on it, tho I acccept there is a fair chance I will die of cirrhosis before I need to claim my winnings.
    Only thing Sean,with foriegn owners and manager's,the young players are not getting the chance in the first team.

    Look at Chelsea for example,best young players in the country for the last few years,how many made it to the first team.

    We have to up our talent pool and send them abroad to top leagues in Europe .
    With a hard Brexit opportunity might be better at home in the future ...
  • surbysurby Posts: 1,227

    Croatia's President looks OK :)

    You should see her in a bikini !
  • DecrepitJohnLDecrepitJohnL Posts: 13,300

    This is just weird. The people of WOxon (of which I’m one) voted Remain, unlike Robert Courts.
    If Robert Courts MP is hoping to see his name on tomorrow's front pages, I fear he might be disappointed.
  • ralphmalphralphmalph Posts: 2,201

    SeanT said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    Well done France on winning the World Cup but a respectable performance from Croatia too

    And both miles ahead of England
    England lost 3 2 to France last summer, Croatia lost 4 2 to France today.


    It does annoy me the cynicism about England now after the unjustified triumphalism last week. At the end of the day it was our joint best World Cup performance since 1966 when most, including me, thought we would be lucky to get to the quarter finals. We also have a world class goalkeeper now and a shrewd manager and a young team so plenty of room to improve. Though as you are Welsh I know you have no vested interested in England really beyond bring a home nation
    Do not be so silly. I wanted England to win. And befote you dish the Welsh again I am half English.

    England were nowhere near the level of these two teams, nor indeed Belgium.

    Had the draw been different they would not have beaten Brazil.

    I am delighted at their progress but do not wear blinkers
    Sport is sport, anything can happen on the day.

    Yes England are not in the top tier yet but they have made progress this tournament and hopefully there will be more to come
    England are definitely improving, at all levels, they seem to have learned from the British Olympics Team.


    https://twitter.com/Coral/status/1017691350207041536

    In the next decade or two we will win either the euros or the World Cup. I am willing to bet on it, tho I acccept there is a fair chance I will die of cirrhosis before I need to claim my winnings.
    Only thing Sean,with foriegn owners and manager's,the young players are not getting the chance in the first team.

    Look at Chelsea for example,best young players in the country for the last few years,how many made it to the first team.

    We have to up our talent pool and send them abroad to top leagues in Europe .
    Hopefully it may be changing, Pep is playing Foden, Pochettino has always played young English talent, Klopp last season bought Trent-Arnold into the team. We used to have managers playing totally foreign born players. Now the top teams have a lot more English players playing for them,
  • surbysurby Posts: 1,227

    Well what do you expect, good manners from a nation of collaborators?

    twitter.com/Dr_Kavoussi/status/1018538909267980289

    Collaborators? You do mean the Croats?

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Independent_State_of_Croatia
    Minus Tito and the communists most Croats collaborated happily. In fact, most are racists even today as are most East Europeans including the Russians.
  • surbysurby Posts: 1,227

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    Well done France on winning the World Cup but a respectable performance from Croatia too

    And both miles ahead of England
    England lost 3 2 to France last summer, Croatia lost 4 2 to France today.


    It does annoy me the cynicism about England now after the unjustified triumphalism last week. At the end of the day it was our joint best World Cup performance since 1966 when most, including me, thought we would be lucky to get to the quarter finals. We also have a world class goalkeeper now and a shrewd manager and a young team so plenty of room to improve. Though as you are Welsh I know you have no vested interested in England really beyond bring a home nation
    Do not be so silly. I wanted England to win. And befote you dish the Welsh again I am half English.

    England were nowhere near the level of these two teams, nor indeed Belgium.

    Had the draw been different they would not have beaten Brazil.

    I am delighted at their progress but do not wear blinkers
    Sport is sport, anything can happen on the day.

    Yes England are not in the top tier yet but they have made progress this tournament and hopefully there will be more to come
    With lack of opportunities for young English players,WE must send them to the top leagues around Europe.
    What is stopping the top leagues from around Europe buying young English players?

    Maybe they just don't want them.
    For some reason, English players, on average, are too expensive !
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 119,701
    surby said:
    Qatar is an awful place to host a world cup on its size.

    It is smaller than Montenegro.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 119,701
    Plus Russia is the last summer world cup we'll experience for eight years.
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 49,888

    Ishmael_Z said:

    Well what do you expect, good manners from a nation of collaborators?

    twitter.com/Dr_Kavoussi/status/1018538909267980289

    Collaborators? You do mean the Croats?

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Independent_State_of_Croatia
    Now these are real collaborators.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indian_Legion

    PS I challenge you to go to Zagreb and call the heirs and people of Tito Nazi collaborators.
    They are also the heirs and people of Slavko Kvaternik.

    And the French are the heirs and people of Charles de Gaulle. And if you refought ww2 with the Channel paved over you'd have found collaborators and resisters here too.
    TSE seems to think only the French collaborated with the Nazis, but there were collaborators in every nation either taken over by the Nazis or which were formally aligned with Germany. Even in the Soviet territory controlled by Nazis.
    "Even"?? They had more excuse than most, given what they had suffered under their own regime.
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 57,249
    surby said:

    Well what do you expect, good manners from a nation of collaborators?

    twitter.com/Dr_Kavoussi/status/1018538909267980289

    Collaborators? You do mean the Croats?

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Independent_State_of_Croatia
    Minus Tito and the communists most Croats collaborated happily. In fact, most are racists even today as are most East Europeans including the Russians.
    And another thing: they're all into stereotyping.
  • YorkcityYorkcity Posts: 4,382
    edited July 2018
    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    Well done France on winning the World Cup but a respectable performance from Croatia too

    And both miles ahead of England
    England lost 3 2 to France last summer, Croatia lost 4 2 to France today.


    It does annoy me the cynicism about England now after the unjustified triumphalism last week. At the end of the day it was our joint best World Cup performance since 1966 when most, including me, thought we would be lucky to get to the quarter finals. We also have a world class goalkeeper now and a shrewd manager and a young team so plenty of room to improve. Though as you are Welsh I know you have no vested interested in England really beyond bring a home nation
    Do not be so silly. I wanted England to win. And befote you dish the Welsh again I am half English.

    England were nowhere near the level of these two teams, nor indeed Belgium.

    Had the draw been different they would not have beaten Brazil.

    I am delighted at their progress but do not wear blinkers
    Sport is sport, anything can happen on the day.

    Yes England are not in the top tier yet but they have made progress this tournament and hopefully there will be more to come
    I agree big g is to negative.England were best team in first half against croatia they should have been two or three up and game over..

    However they missed their best chance of getting to a final , on the easier side of the knockout stages.
  • surbysurby Posts: 1,227
    Croatia loses and a Serb wins!
  • surbysurby Posts: 1,227

    surby said:
    Qatar is an awful place to host a world cup on its size.

    It is smaller than Montenegro.
    Look , Q won fair and square. They paid off more countries and more delegates and FIFA officials than their competitors. They won an auction !
  • SandyRentoolSandyRentool Posts: 22,044
    surby said:

    surby said:
    Qatar is an awful place to host a world cup on its size.

    It is smaller than Montenegro.
    Look , Q won fair and square. They paid off more countries and more delegates and FIFA officials than their competitors. They won an auction !
    All Qatar needs to do now is to persuade enough world class players to take Qatari citizenship and they can lift the trophy.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 48,757
    edited July 2018
    surby said:

    Well what do you expect, good manners from a nation of collaborators?

    twitter.com/Dr_Kavoussi/status/1018538909267980289

    Collaborators? You do mean the Croats?

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Independent_State_of_Croatia
    Minus Tito and the communists most Croats collaborated happily. In fact, most are racists even today as are most East Europeans including the Russians.
    Tito was a Slovene, not a Croat as I recall. He became a Communist while a POW in Russia during WW1.

    Great game, and a very positive atmosphere in both world cup cities that I have seen. A few Africans, many Latin Americans and a surprising number of Indians, Chinese and Israelis here to enjoy the football. No hint of any trouble.

    I dislike their government, but the Russian people are fabulous hosts. Qatar may be surprisingly OK too. Their promotional team here has softened my opinion of their bid.

    Most important of all the dramas have all been on the pitch, not off it. France deserved winners.


  • SandyRentoolSandyRentool Posts: 22,044
    Watching the BBC News Channel - looks like there is a big pro-Tommy Robinson rally in Paris tonight.

    And another one in Zagreb.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 48,757
    What with other events this week, this seems to have not made PB news:

    https://twitter.com/britainelects/status/1017539465399685120?s=19

    The LD lost by a single vote.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 119,701

    Watching the BBC News Channel - looks like there is a big pro-Tommy Robinson rally in Paris tonight.

    And another one in Zagreb.

    https://twitter.com/tseofpb/status/1018538599476686848?s=21
  • old_labourold_labour Posts: 3,238
    Who is Ian Whittaker? Genuine question.
  • Ishmael_ZIshmael_Z Posts: 8,981
    rcs1000 said:

    surby said:

    Well what do you expect, good manners from a nation of collaborators?

    twitter.com/Dr_Kavoussi/status/1018538909267980289

    Collaborators? You do mean the Croats?

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Independent_State_of_Croatia
    Minus Tito and the communists most Croats collaborated happily. In fact, most are racists even today as are most East Europeans including the Russians.
    And another thing: they're all into stereotyping.
    And too fecking thick to see that "most Croats are racist" is an overtly racist claim.
  • MJWMJW Posts: 1,728
    SeanT said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    Well done France on winning the World Cup but a respectable performance from Croatia too

    And both miles ahead of England
    England lost 3 2 to France last summer, Croatia lost 4 2 to France today.


    It does annoy me the cynicism about England now after the unjustified triumphalism last week. . Though as you are Welsh I know you have no vested interested in England really beyond bring a home nation


    I am delighted at their progress but do not wear blinkers
    Sport is sport, anything can happen on the day.

    Yes England are not in the top tier yet but they have made progress this tournament and hopefully there will be more to come
    England are definitely improving, at all levels, they seem to have learned from the British Olympics Team.


    https://twitter.com/Coral/status/1017691350207041536

    In the next decade or two we will win either the euros or the World Cup. I am willing to bet on it, tho I acccept there is a fair chance I will die of cirrhosis before I need to claim my winnings.
    They're definitely improving - although you win a tournament you need luck and everything to come together at the right moment so I think you're being a little too optimistic. After all, the generation of Argentinians including Messi, Tevez, Mascherano, Higuain, Aguero, and Di Maria looks like they'll never win a World Cup. The reason why - that for all that talent they were still missing world class players in key positions - is what I'd worry about with England. One reason Southgate deserves praise is that he devised a system to cope with the fact we're unbelievably light in central midfield. Eventually that got found out by a Croatia side who weren't. Looking at the players coming through, the best of the bunch all look similar to where we're strong already - Foden, Lookman, Sessegnon, Sancho, and Woodburn are all tricky attacking midfield/winger types. Having ten brilliant forwards isn't much good if we're still having to make-do-and-mend in central midfield.

    Also, that France team looks frightening for the future too. Half of them are still very young - and there's a load of young players they left out who probably would've made most other squads.
  • Sean_FSean_F Posts: 37,394
    surby said:

    Well what do you expect, good manners from a nation of collaborators?

    twitter.com/Dr_Kavoussi/status/1018538909267980289

    Collaborators? You do mean the Croats?

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Independent_State_of_Croatia
    Minus Tito and the communists most Croats collaborated happily. In fact, most are racists even today as are most East Europeans including the Russians.
    They make silly generalisations, as well.
  • RogerRoger Posts: 19,914
    I wonder whether Theresa May as Home Secretary would have banned Steve Bannon from entering the country?
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,442
    Ishmael_Z said:

    rcs1000 said:

    surby said:

    Well what do you expect, good manners from a nation of collaborators?

    twitter.com/Dr_Kavoussi/status/1018538909267980289

    Collaborators? You do mean the Croats?

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Independent_State_of_Croatia
    Minus Tito and the communists most Croats collaborated happily. In fact, most are racists even today as are most East Europeans including the Russians.
    And another thing: they're all into stereotyping.
    And too fecking thick to see that "most Croats are racist" is an overtly racist claim.
    Surely xenophobic, not racist?
  • Scrapheap_as_wasScrapheap_as_was Posts: 10,069
    Foxy said:

    surby said:

    Well what do you expect, good manners from a nation of collaborators?

    twitter.com/Dr_Kavoussi/status/1018538909267980289

    Collaborators? You do mean the Croats?

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Independent_State_of_Croatia
    Minus Tito and the communists most Croats collaborated happily. In fact, most are racists even today as are most East Europeans including the Russians.
    Tito was a Slovene, not a Croat as I recall. He became a Communist while a POW in Russia during WW1.

    Great game, and a very positive atmosphere in both world cup cities that I have seen. A few Africans, many Latin Americans and a surprising number of Indians, Chinese and Israelis here to enjoy the football. No hint of any trouble.

    I dislike their government, but the Russian people are fabulous hosts. Qatar may be surprisingly OK too. Their promotional team here has softened my opinion of their bid.

    Most important of all the dramas have all been on the pitch, not off it. France deserved winners.


    Its a tie in the fantasy footie...
  • Ishmael_ZIshmael_Z Posts: 8,981
    ydoethur said:

    Ishmael_Z said:

    rcs1000 said:

    surby said:

    Well what do you expect, good manners from a nation of collaborators?

    twitter.com/Dr_Kavoussi/status/1018538909267980289

    Collaborators? You do mean the Croats?

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Independent_State_of_Croatia
    Minus Tito and the communists most Croats collaborated happily. In fact, most are racists even today as are most East Europeans including the Russians.
    And another thing: they're all into stereotyping.
    And too fecking thick to see that "most Croats are racist" is an overtly racist claim.
    Surely xenophobic, not racist?
    All them Slavs looks the same to me, Guv.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 82,169
    WTF.....

    Elon Musk calls British diver in Thai cave rescue a 'pedo' in baseless attack

    https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2018/jul/15/elon-musk-british-diver-thai-cave-rescue-pedo-twitter
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 48,757

    Foxy said:

    surby said:

    Well what do you expect, good manners from a nation of collaborators?

    twitter.com/Dr_Kavoussi/status/1018538909267980289

    Collaborators? You do mean the Croats?

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Independent_State_of_Croatia
    Minus Tito and the communists most Croats collaborated happily. In fact, most are racists even today as are most East Europeans including the Russians.
    Tito was a Slovene, not a Croat as I recall. He became a Communist while a POW in Russia during WW1.

    Great game, and a very positive atmosphere in both world cup cities that I have seen. A few Africans, many Latin Americans and a surprising number of Indians, Chinese and Israelis here to enjoy the football. No hint of any trouble.

    I dislike their government, but the Russian people are fabulous hosts. Qatar may be surprisingly OK too. Their promotional team here has softened my opinion of their bid.

    Most important of all the dramas have all been on the pitch, not off it. France deserved winners.


    Its a tie in the fantasy footie...
    Time to set up the PB PL one as a tie breaker?
  • FregglesFreggles Posts: 3,486
    Foxy said:

    What with other events this week, this seems to have not made PB news:

    https://twitter.com/britainelects/status/1017539465399685120?s=19

    The LD lost by a single vote.

    even better

    https://twitter.com/chris_brookes97/status/1017546207349170182
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 51,903
    Foxy said:

    surby said:

    Well what do you expect, good manners from a nation of collaborators?

    twitter.com/Dr_Kavoussi/status/1018538909267980289

    Collaborators? You do mean the Croats?

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Independent_State_of_Croatia
    Minus Tito and the communists most Croats collaborated happily. In fact, most are racists even today as are most East Europeans including the Russians.
    Tito was a Slovene, not a Croat as I recall. He became a Communist while a POW in Russia during WW1.

    Great game, and a very positive atmosphere in both world cup cities that I have seen. A few Africans, many Latin Americans and a surprising number of Indians, Chinese and Israelis here to enjoy the football. No hint of any trouble.

    I dislike their government, but the Russian people are fabulous hosts. Qatar may be surprisingly OK too. Their promotional team here has softened my opinion of their bid.

    Most important of all the dramas have all been on the pitch, not off it. France deserved winners.


    My mum visited Russia with a friend last year, and they found the Russians very rude and unfriendly for the most part.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,222

    WTF.....

    Elon Musk calls British diver in Thai cave rescue a 'pedo' in baseless attack

    https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2018/jul/15/elon-musk-british-diver-thai-cave-rescue-pedo-twitter

    He's not tweeted for a few hours...
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 51,903
    edited July 2018
    Foxy said:

    surby said:

    Well what do you expect, good manners from a nation of collaborators?

    twitter.com/Dr_Kavoussi/status/1018538909267980289

    Collaborators? You do mean the Croats?

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Independent_State_of_Croatia
    Minus Tito and the communists most Croats collaborated happily. In fact, most are racists even today as are most East Europeans including the Russians.
    Tito was a Slovene, not a Croat as I recall.
    Croat father, Slovene mother. Born in what is today Croatia.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 48,757
    MJW said:

    SeanT said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    Well done France on winning the World Cup but a respectable performance from Croatia too

    And both miles ahead of England
    England lost 3 2 to France last summer, Croatia lost 4 2 to France today.


    It does annoy me the cynicism about England now after the unjustified triumphalism last week. . Though as you are Welsh I know you have no vested interested in England really beyond bring a home nation


    I am delighted at their progress but do not wear blinkers
    Sport is sport, anything can happen on the day.

    Yes England are not in the top tier yet but they have made progress this tournament and hopefully there will be more to come
    England are definitely improving, at all levels, they seem to have learned from the British Olympics Team.


    https://twitter.com/Coral/status/1017691350207041536

    In the next decade or two we will win either the euros or the World Cup. I am willing to bet on it, tho I acccept there is a fair chance I will die of cirrhosis before I need to claim my winnings.
    They're definitely improving - although you win a tournament you need luck and everything to come together at the right moment so I think you're being a little too optimistic. After all, the generation of Argentinians including Messi, Tevez, Mascherano, Higuain, Aguero, and Di Maria looks like they'll never win a World Cup. The reason why - that for all that talent they were still missing world class players in key positions - is what I'd worry about with England. One reason Southgate deserves praise is that he devised a system to cope with the fact we're unbelievably light in central midfield. Eventually that got found out by a Croatia side who weren't. Looking at the players coming through, the best of the bunch all look similar to where we're strong already - Foden, Lookman, Sessegnon, Sancho, and Woodburn are all tricky attacking midfield/winger types. Having ten brilliant forwards isn't much good if we're still having to make-do-and-mend in central midfield.

    Also, that France team looks frightening for the future too. Half of them are still very young - and there's a load of young players they left out who probably would've made most other squads.
    Leicesters new signing Maddison may well develop very nicely as a CM.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,222
    Pulpstar said:

    WTF.....

    Elon Musk calls British diver in Thai cave rescue a 'pedo' in baseless attack

    https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2018/jul/15/elon-musk-british-diver-thai-cave-rescue-pedo-twitter

    He's not tweeted for a few hours...
    OK - He's deleted his tweets now.
  • TheWhiteRabbitTheWhiteRabbit Posts: 12,454
    Pulpstar said:

    Pulpstar said:

    WTF.....

    Elon Musk calls British diver in Thai cave rescue a 'pedo' in baseless attack

    https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2018/jul/15/elon-musk-british-diver-thai-cave-rescue-pedo-twitter

    He's not tweeted for a few hours...
    OK - He's deleted his tweets now.
    "Hi Elon, this is our lawyer. I know you've got plenty of cash, but I'd like a sizable payment on account unless you delete that"
  • TheWhiteRabbitTheWhiteRabbit Posts: 12,454
    Foxy said:

    MJW said:

    SeanT said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    Well done France on winning the World Cup but a respectable performance from Croatia too

    And both miles ahead of England
    England lost 3 2 to France last summer, Croatia lost 4 2 to France today.


    It does annoy me the cynicism about England now after the unjustified triumphalism last week. . Though as you are Welsh I know you have no vested interested in England really beyond bring a home nation


    I am delighted at their progress but do not wear blinkers
    Sport is sport, anything can happen on the day.

    Yes England are not in the top tier yet but they have made progress this tournament and hopefully there will be more to come
    England are definitely improving, at all levels, they seem to have learned from the British Olympics Team.


    https://twitter.com/Coral/status/1017691350207041536

    In the next decade or two we will win either the euros or the World Cup. I am willing to bet on it, tho I acccept there is a fair chance I will die of cirrhosis before I need to claim my winnings.
    They're definitely improving - although you win a tournament you need luck and everything to come together at the right moment so I think you're being a little too optimistic. After all, the generation of Argentinians including Messi, Tevez, Mascherano, Higuain, Aguero, and Di Maria looks like they'll never win a World Cup. The reason why - that for all that talent they were still missing world class players in key positions - is what I'd worry about with England. One reason Southgate deserves praise is that he devised a system to cope with the fact we're unbelievably light in central midfield. Eventually that got found out by a Croatia side who weren't. Looking at the players coming through, the best of the bunch all look similar to where we're strong already - Foden, Lookman, Sessegnon, Sancho, and Woodburn are all tricky attacking midfield/winger types. Having ten brilliant forwards isn't much good if we're still having to make-do-and-mend in central midfield.

    Also, that France team looks frightening for the future too. Half of them are still very young - and there's a load of young players they left out who probably would've made most other squads.
    Leicesters new signing Maddison may well develop very nicely as a CM.
    Robbed Norwich. Again. Every season.
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 42,741
    Pulpstar said:

    Pulpstar said:

    WTF.....

    Elon Musk calls British diver in Thai cave rescue a 'pedo' in baseless attack

    https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2018/jul/15/elon-musk-british-diver-thai-cave-rescue-pedo-twitter

    He's not tweeted for a few hours...
    OK - He's deleted his tweets now.
    You'd think that Musk'd know that t'Internet never forgets. :)

    In all seriousness, he should do more than just delete them. At the very least an apology, and a sizeable sum to rescue charities that actually know what they're doing might be in order ...
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,222

    Pulpstar said:

    Pulpstar said:

    WTF.....

    Elon Musk calls British diver in Thai cave rescue a 'pedo' in baseless attack

    https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2018/jul/15/elon-musk-british-diver-thai-cave-rescue-pedo-twitter

    He's not tweeted for a few hours...
    OK - He's deleted his tweets now.
    "Hi Elon, this is our lawyer. I know you've got plenty of cash, but I'd like a sizable payment on account unless you delete that"
    He's entitled to defend that his sub idea wasn't a PR stunt (In the same way he clearly donates to ALL political parties in the US) but he needs to apologise for the pedo comment..
  • SquareRootSquareRoot Posts: 7,095
    Too many tweets make a twat..
  • viewcodeviewcode Posts: 22,143
    edited July 2018
    Roger said:

    I wonder whether Theresa May as Home Secretary would have banned Steve Bannon from entering the country?

    With that skin condition, you could argue he's a health risk...

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Incredible_Melting_Man
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 82,169
    edited July 2018
    Musks tweet is the latest in recent string of rather odd behaviour which is made even stranger given how PR savvy he has been in the past.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 48,757

    Foxy said:

    MJW said:

    SeanT said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    Well done France on winning the World Cup but a respectable performance from Croatia too

    And both miles ahead of England
    England lost 3 2 to France last summer, Croatia lost 4 2 to France today.


    It does annoy me the cynicism about England now after the unjustified triumphalism last week. . Though as you are Welsh I know you have no vested interested in England really beyond bring a home nation


    I am delighted at their progress but do not wear blinkers
    Sport is sport, anything can happen on the day.

    Yes England are not in the top tier yet but they have made progress this tournament and hopefully there will be more to come
    England are definitely improving, at all levels, they seem to have learned from the British Olympics Team.


    https://twitter.com/Coral/status/1017691350207041536

    In the next decade or two we will win either the euros or the World Cup. I am willing to bet on it, tho I acccept there is a fair chance I will die of cirrhosis before I need to claim my winnings.
    They're definitely improving - although you win a tournament you need luck and everything to come together at the right moment so I think you're being a little too optimistic. After all, the generation of Argentinians including Messi, Tevez, Mascherano, Higuain, Aguero, and Di Maria looks like they'll never win a World Cup. The reason why - that for all that talent they were still missing world class players in key positions - is what I'd worry about with England. One reason Southgate deserves praise is that he devised a system to cope with the fact we're unbelievably light in central midfield. Eventually that got found out by a Croatia side who weren't. Looking at the players coming through, the best of the bunch all look similar to where we're strong already - Foden, Lookman, Sessegnon, Sancho, and Woodburn are all tricky attacking midfield/winger types. Having ten brilliant forwards isn't much good if we're still having to make-do-and-mend in central midfield.

    Also, that France team looks frightening for the future too. Half of them are still very young - and there's a load of young players they left out who probably would've made most other squads.
    Leicesters new signing Maddison may well develop very nicely as a CM.
    Robbed Norwich. Again. Every season.
    I cannot remember our last signing from Norwich, but Maddison certainly sounds good.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,222

    Musks tweet is the latest in recent string of rather odd behaviour which is made even stranger given how PR savvy he has been in the past.

    This feels a bit like when last rocket blew up.
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 29,414
    edited July 2018
    Foxy said:

    MJW said:

    SeanT said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    Well done France on winning the World Cup but a respectable performance from Croatia too

    And both miles ahead of England
    England lost 3 2 to France last summer, Croatia lost 4 2 to France today.


    It does annoy me the cynicism about England now after the unjustified triumphalism last week. . Though as you are Welsh I know you have no vested interested in England really beyond bring a home nation


    I am delighted at their progress but do not wear blinkers
    Sport is sport, anything can happen on the day.

    Yes England are not in the top tier yet but they have made progress this tournament and hopefully there will be more to come
    England are definitely improving, at all levels, they seem to have learned from the British Olympics Team.


    https://twitter.com/Coral/status/1017691350207041536

    In the next decade or two we will win either the euros or the World Cup. I am willing to bet on it, tho I acccept there is a fair chance I will die of cirrhosis before I need to claim my winnings.
    They're definitely improving - although you win a tournament you need luck and everything to come together at the right moment so I think you're being a little too optimistic. After all, the generation of Argentinians including Messi, Tevez, Mascherano, Higuain, Aguero, and Di Maria looks like they'll never win a World Cup. The reason why - that for all that talent they were still missing world class players in key positions - is what I'd worry about with England. One reason Southgate deserves praise is that he devised a system to cope with the fact we're unbelievably light in central midfield. Eventually that got found out by a Croatia side who weren't. Looking at the players coming through, the best of the bunch all look similar to where we're strong already - Foden, Lookman, Sessegnon, Sancho, and Woodburn are all tricky attacking midfield/winger types. Having ten brilliant forwards isn't much good if we're still having to make-do-and-mend in central midfield.

    Also, that France team looks frightening for the future too. Half of them are still very young - and there's a load of young players they left out who probably would've made most other squads.
    Leicesters new signing Maddison may well develop very nicely as a CM.
    Kieran Dowell is another to watch from the WC under 20's as a CM. He was outstanding on loan at Forest. Needs to play for Everton in PL this season though.
    Another member of that team Lookman did play in the Bundesliga for Leipzig on loan last season. Which should please TykeJohnno.
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 42,741
    Pulpstar said:

    Pulpstar said:

    Pulpstar said:

    WTF.....

    Elon Musk calls British diver in Thai cave rescue a 'pedo' in baseless attack

    https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2018/jul/15/elon-musk-british-diver-thai-cave-rescue-pedo-twitter

    He's not tweeted for a few hours...
    OK - He's deleted his tweets now.
    "Hi Elon, this is our lawyer. I know you've got plenty of cash, but I'd like a sizable payment on account unless you delete that"
    He's entitled to defend that his sub idea wasn't a PR stunt (In the same way he clearly donates to ALL political parties in the US) but he needs to apologise for the pedo comment..
    It'd be interesting to know what went on behind the scenes to create this much mess. It seems odd when people from many nations worked together and got the job done with apparently minimal argument. Yet Musk and his crew turn up and there's totally unnecessary and unneeded drama.

    The sense of entitlement that comes from working at a large prestigious tech company can be rather overwhelming, and I can imagine some engineers putting noses of the 'real' rescuers out of joint by making silly demands for things like access to resources or the site.

    Such is the nature of engineers, who often want to see their creations used.

    Guess who has never worked for a prestigious tech company, yet alone a large one? ;)
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,181
    Pulpstar said:

    Pulpstar said:

    WTF.....

    Elon Musk calls British diver in Thai cave rescue a 'pedo' in baseless attack

    https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2018/jul/15/elon-musk-british-diver-thai-cave-rescue-pedo-twitter

    He's not tweeted for a few hours...
    OK - He's deleted his tweets now.
    I'm not sure if it is a good or bad thing that in this day and age we get to see how silly and petty some billionaires (and the powerful) are through the medium of twitter.
  • TomsToms Posts: 2,478
    edited July 2018
    SeanT said:

    well done France

    image
    Is that Foxy after his bet was landed?
    Oh God, Macron is going to be insufferable.
    Some English still are about ***1966***
  • MJWMJW Posts: 1,728
    Foxy said:

    MJW said:

    SeanT said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    Well done France on winning the World Cup but a respectable performance from Croatia too

    And both miles ahead of England
    England lost 3 2 to France last summer, Croatia lost 4 2 to France today.


    It does annoy me the cynicism about England now after the unjustified triumphalism last week. . Though as you are Welsh I know you have no vested interested in England really beyond bring a home nation


    I am delighted at their progress but do not wear blinkers
    Sport is sport, anything can happen on the day.

    Yes England are not in the top tier yet but they have made progress this tournament and hopefully there will be more to come
    England are definitely improving, at all levels, they seem to have learned from the British Olympics Team.


    https://twitter.com/Coral/status/1017691350207041536

    In the next decade or two we will win either the euros or the World Cup. I am willing to bet on it, tho I acccept there is a fair chance I will die of cirrhosis before I need to claim my winnings.
    They're definitely improving - although you win a tournament you need luck and everything to come together at the right moment so I think you're being a little too optimistic. After all, the generation of Argentinians including Messi, Tevez, Mascherano, Higuain, Aguero, and Di Maria looks like they'll never win a World Cup. The reason why - that for all that talent they were still missing world class players in key positions - is what I'd worry about with England. One reason Southgate deserves praise is that he devised a system to cope with the fact we're unbelievably light in central midfield. Eventually that got found out by a Croatia side who weren't. Looking at the players coming through, the best of the bunch all look similar to where we're strong already - Foden, Lookman, Sessegnon, Sancho, and Woodburn are all tricky attacking midfield/winger types. Having ten brilliant forwards isn't much good if we're still having to make-do-and-mend in central midfield.

    Also, that France team looks frightening for the future too. Half of them are still very young - and there's a load of young players they left out who probably would've made most other squads.
    Leicesters new signing Maddison may well develop very nicely as a CM.
    Good little player Maddison. Quite forward thinking at the moment though - will have to see how he develops in the Prem. Ideally want someone to sit a bit deeper and conduct things and someone to break up the play.
  • FF43FF43 Posts: 17,208
    edited July 2018
    Pulpstar said:

    Pulpstar said:

    Pulpstar said:

    WTF.....

    Elon Musk calls British diver in Thai cave rescue a 'pedo' in baseless attack

    https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2018/jul/15/elon-musk-british-diver-thai-cave-rescue-pedo-twitter

    He's not tweeted for a few hours...
    OK - He's deleted his tweets now.
    "Hi Elon, this is our lawyer. I know you've got plenty of cash, but I'd like a sizable payment on account unless you delete that"
    He's entitled to defend that his sub idea wasn't a PR stunt (In the same way he clearly donates to ALL political parties in the US) but he needs to apologise for the pedo comment..
    I don't think the sub idea was a publicity stunt, but Musk forgot that the dive team had the responsibility to get the boys out alive; he didn't. The team leader took a few seconds to decide the sub wasn't going to work and/or was too risky and that Musk was in the way.

    Musk comes across as somewhat sociopathic.
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 42,741
    Pulpstar said:

    Musks tweet is the latest in recent string of rather odd behaviour which is made even stranger given how PR savvy he has been in the past.

    This feels a bit like when last rocket blew up.
    More like the CRS-7 failure, when SpaceX blamed a supplier. Yet when the NASA report came out, it turned out the supplier was blameless and it was a design error by SpaceX.

    https://www.nasaspaceflight.com/2018/03/nasas-irt-publishes-crs-7-failure/

    "In simpler terms, the steel strut that SpaceX chose was not certified to be used in such conditions. Furthermore, SpaceX did not meet the 4:1 redundancy requirement that the manufacturer had instructed."
  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 60,216

    Pulpstar said:

    Pulpstar said:

    WTF.....

    Elon Musk calls British diver in Thai cave rescue a 'pedo' in baseless attack

    https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2018/jul/15/elon-musk-british-diver-thai-cave-rescue-pedo-twitter

    He's not tweeted for a few hours...
    OK - He's deleted his tweets now.
    You'd think that Musk'd know that t'Internet never forgets. :)

    In all seriousness, he should do more than just delete them. At the very least an apology, and a sizeable sum to rescue charities that actually know what they're doing might be in order ...
    https://twitter.com/RespectableLaw/status/1018543174820794370
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 42,741
    kle4 said:

    Pulpstar said:

    Pulpstar said:

    WTF.....

    Elon Musk calls British diver in Thai cave rescue a 'pedo' in baseless attack

    https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2018/jul/15/elon-musk-british-diver-thai-cave-rescue-pedo-twitter

    He's not tweeted for a few hours...
    OK - He's deleted his tweets now.
    I'm not sure if it is a good or bad thing that in this day and age we get to see how silly and petty some billionaires (and the powerful) are through the medium of twitter.
    It'd be funny if they could show us through the medium of interpretative dance. :)
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 48,757
    On topic, It seems abit tight of schedule to have a Tory leadership contest before the summer break, so I cannot see one happening before party conference. By then there should at least be some indication of how The Chequers Plan has gone down in the EU. Things could change very quickly, but does McVey have the support to make it to a membership ballot? I cannot see it myself.

    There will be twists and turns before it is over, but the Chequers plan is likely to happen. Its not so baad as we do gain the advantage of having well thrashed out EU regulations.
  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 60,216
    edited July 2018
    And the UK press has got it:

    https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/asia/thai-cave-rescue-elon-musk-british-diver-vern-unsworth-twitter-pedo-a8448366.html

    Plucky British hero vs arrogant American billionaire....I wonder whose side they'll pick...?
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 82,169
    I am presuming musk hasn’t claimed his twitter account has been hacked?
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 48,757
    MJW said:

    Foxy said:

    MJW said:

    SeanT said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    Well done France on winning the World Cup but a respectable performance from Croatia too

    And both miles ahead of England
    England lost 3 2 to France last summer, Croatia lost 4 2 to France today.


    It does annoy me the cynicism about England now after the unjustified triumphalism last week. . Though as you are Welsh I know you have no vested interested in England really beyond bring a home nation


    I am delighted at their progress but do not wear blinkers
    Sport is sport, anything can happen on the day.

    Yes England are not in the top tier yet but they have made progress this tournament and hopefully there will be more to come
    England are definitely

    https://twitter.com/Coral/status/1017691350207041536

    In the next decade or two we will win either the euros or the World Cup. I am willing to bet on it, tho I acccept there is a fair chance I will die of cirrhosis before I need to claim my winnings.
    They're definitely improving - although you win a tournament you need luck and everything to come together at the right moment so I think you're being a little too optimistic. After all, the generation of Argentinians including Messi, Tevez, Mascherano, Higuain, Aguero, and Di Maria looks like they'll never win a World Cup. The reason why - that for all that talent they were still missing world class players in key positions - is what I'd worry about with England. One reason Southgate deserves praise is that he devised a system to cope with the fact we're unbelievably light in central midfield. Eventually that got found out by a Croatia side who weren't. Looking at the players coming through, the best of the bunch all look similar to where we're strong already - Foden, Lookman, Sessegnon, Sancho, and Woodburn are all tricky attacking midfield/winger types. Having ten brilliant forwards isn't much good if we're still having to make-do-and-mend in central midfield.

    Also, that France team looks frightening for the future too. Half of them are still very young - and there's a load of young players they left out who probably would've made most other squads.
    Leicesters new signing Maddison may well develop very nicely as a CM.
    Good little player Maddison. Quite forward thinking at the moment though - will have to see how he develops in the Prem. Ideally want someone to sit a bit deeper and conduct things and someone to break up the play.
    Leicesters own Hamza Choudhary? He has made his prem debut and has a cult following.
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 42,741

    And the UK press has got it:

    https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/asia/thai-cave-rescue-elon-musk-british-diver-vern-unsworth-twitter-pedo-a8448366.html

    Plucky British hero vs arrogant American billionaire....I wonder whose side they'll pick...?

    One interesting thing is that Musk's account of the rescue is very different to other peoples. He says: "Water level was actually very low & still (not flowing) — you could literally have swum to Cave 5 with no gear, which is obv how the kids got in."

    Except the water had gone up since the kids got in, and hence the problem. Whilst some of the way in was dry, diving was still necessary to get them out. Unless I've misunderstood something.

    And on another point:; he wants to risk the lives of other divers by sending his pod in to test it. That's a dickish way to try to prove a point.
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 42,020
    Toms said:

    SeanT said:

    well done France

    image
    Is that Foxy after his bet was landed?
    Oh God, Macron is going to be insufferable.
    Some English still are about ***1966***
    And as for those 1066 feckers..
  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 60,216

    And the UK press has got it:

    https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/asia/thai-cave-rescue-elon-musk-british-diver-vern-unsworth-twitter-pedo-a8448366.html

    Plucky British hero vs arrogant American billionaire....I wonder whose side they'll pick...?

    One interesting thing is that Musk's account of the rescue is very different to other peoples. He says: "Water level was actually very low & still (not flowing) — you could literally have swum to Cave 5 with no gear, which is obv how the kids got in."

    Except the water had gone up since the kids got in, and hence the problem. Whilst some of the way in was dry, diving was still necessary to get them out. Unless I've misunderstood something.

    And on another point:; he wants to risk the lives of other divers by sending his pod in to test it. That's a dickish way to try to prove a point.
    He'd earlier criticised the Thai leaders of the operation too:

    https://www.theguardian.com/news/2018/jul/10/elon-musk-queries-expertise-of-thai-cave-rescue-officials

    Billionaire bully pulpit.....I hope he gets cut down to size.
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 34,705

    And the UK press has got it:

    https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/asia/thai-cave-rescue-elon-musk-british-diver-vern-unsworth-twitter-pedo-a8448366.html

    Plucky British hero vs arrogant American billionaire....I wonder whose side they'll pick...?

    One interesting thing is that Musk's account of the rescue is very different to other peoples. He says: "Water level was actually very low & still (not flowing) — you could literally have swum to Cave 5 with no gear, which is obv how the kids got in."

    Except the water had gone up since the kids got in, and hence the problem. Whilst some of the way in was dry, diving was still necessary to get them out. Unless I've misunderstood something.

    And on another point:; he wants to risk the lives of other divers by sending his pod in to test it. That's a dickish way to try to prove a point.
    If it was as easy as Musk says, why did a Thai Navy diver die?
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,222
    GIN1138 said:
    Some 'rallying call', it's behind a blimmin' paywall.
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 34,705
    GIN1138 said:
    "It was almost exactly two years ago that I went into the Durbar Court in the Foreign Office. It was my first day as foreign secretary, and I stood within that vast marble atrium adorned with the busts of explorers, and I announced a vision."


    "...I announced a vision"? FFS!
  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 60,216
    GIN1138 said:
    I announced a vision.

    It wasn’t a policy.


    Boris, in a nutshell.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,181
    edited July 2018
    Pulpstar said:

    GIN1138 said:
    Some 'rallying call', it's behind a blimmin' paywall.
    People don't need to see it. It's about the reporting that Boris has said something, and is not May. I no longer have a subscription to the Telegraph, but I assume it will be stirring but light on content aside from a few core ideas to show distinction from the government position.

    How things play out in the party are in his hands perhaps more than anyone - act now Boris, or your words are the extent of it, and when you do a Corbyn and claim later you would have done better should we believe him just as much as you?
  • Danny565Danny565 Posts: 8,091
    Does she specify whether she means an In/Out referendum or Deal/No Deal referendum?
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,222
    She was going to hold Putney a month or two ago but on today's polls she's likely to lose it.
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 34,705
    Pulpstar said:

    GIN1138 said:
    Some 'rallying call', it's behind a blimmin' paywall.
    Take it from me you aren't missing much; Boris channelling his inner Donald.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,222
    Danny565 said:

    Does she specify whether she means an In/Out referendum or Deal/No Deal referendum?
    Time for @AndyCooke proposed dual question to settle the issue forever*

    Should Britain accept the deal

    Accept/Reject

    If the deal is rejected should Britain

    Remain in the EU/Leave the EU with no deal.

    *Well for a generation, an SNP generation..
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 34,705

    Who is Ian Whittaker? Genuine question.

    Did we get an answer to this? Is Ian a PB poster?
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 82,169
    The last part of the showtime documentary on NYT is currently in, it is essential viewing.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,181
    Further detail is needed as to whether that deals a blow to May's hope of support for her Brexit compromise or not - a referendum on the deal might be the only chance May has of getting it through, given Labour won't support it and she probably doesn't have the MPs to back it either. A referendum to remain or no deal on the other hand would be a blow.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 119,701
    Danny565 said:

    Does she specify whether she means an In/Out referendum or Deal/No Deal referendum?
    In her article Ms Greening says that it will be “unacceptable” for MPs to impose a compromise on the electorate.

    The former minister argues that the second referendum should not be a “divisive, binary choice”, proposing that voters are presented with three choices: the prime minister’s negotiated deal; staying in the EU; or a clean break. The voting system should involve first and second preference votes, she says.

    Ms Greening has support of other Remain-backing Tories including Amber Rudd, the former home secretary. Dominic Grieve, the former attorney-general, is expected to lend qualified backing in the coming days.
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 34,705
    edited July 2018
    Pulpstar said:

    Danny565 said:

    Does she specify whether she means an In/Out referendum or Deal/No Deal referendum?
    Time for @AndyCooke proposed dual question to settle the issue forever*

    Should Britain accept the deal

    Accept/Reject

    If the deal is rejected should Britain

    Remain in the EU/Leave the EU with no deal.

    *Well for a generation, an SNP generation..
    Mmmm that would be an interesting one pair to call.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 119,701
    A Brexit referendum conducted under AV......
  • Ishmael_ZIshmael_Z Posts: 8,981

    Pulpstar said:

    GIN1138 said:
    Some 'rallying call', it's behind a blimmin' paywall.
    Take it from me you aren't missing much; Boris channelling his inner Donald.
    Worth paying up for the extraordinary photo of a misty eyed Boris looking just like the Hitler Youth bloke who sings Tomorrow belongs to Me in Cabaret, against a Union Jack background. The UKIP hypothesis is strengthened.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,181
    edited July 2018

    Danny565 said:

    Does she specify whether she means an In/Out referendum or Deal/No Deal referendum?
    In her article Ms Greening says that it will be “unacceptable” for MPs to impose a compromise on the electorate.

    The former minister argues that the second referendum should not be a “divisive, binary choice”, proposing that voters are presented with three choices: the prime minister’s negotiated deal; staying in the EU; or a clean break. The voting system should involve first and second preference votes, she says.

    Ms Greening has support of other Remain-backing Tories including Amber Rudd, the former home secretary. Dominic Grieve, the former attorney-general, is expected to lend qualified backing in the coming days.
    That is a blow then - remainer MPs are hoping for Remain, rather than accepting the May compromise as being softer than most Tory members want.

    May's deal is pretty dead then, as expected. She hasn't managed to sell it to the membership, and even the remainers, or some of them anyway, won't back it.

    Edit - some interesting wording on it not being a 'divisive, binary choice'. It would still be divisive after all, but it tries to given the impression it wouldn't be.

    It probably is the least worst option left though.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,222
    Ishmael_Z said:

    Pulpstar said:

    GIN1138 said:
    Some 'rallying call', it's behind a blimmin' paywall.
    Take it from me you aren't missing much; Boris channelling his inner Donald.
    Worth paying up for the extraordinary photo of a misty eyed Boris looking just like the Hitler Youth bloke who sings Tomorrow belongs to Me in Cabaret, against a Union Jack background. The UKIP hypothesis is strengthened.
    Oh I've got that bit, and this

    Global Britain is not a vainglorious dream - which sums up Boris
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 34,705
    edited July 2018
    Ishmael_Z said:

    Pulpstar said:

    GIN1138 said:
    Some 'rallying call', it's behind a blimmin' paywall.
    Take it from me you aren't missing much; Boris channelling his inner Donald.
    Worth paying up for the extraordinary photo of a misty eyed Boris looking just like the Hitler Youth bloke who sings Tomorrow belongs to Me in Cabaret, against a Union Jack background. The UKIP hypothesis is strengthened.
    No need to pay up - just register and you get a number of free articles per week/month (can't remember how many or over what period but provides more than enough Torygraph for me!)

    PS Very true about the Tomorrow Belongs To Me guy - and what a chilling song that is.

    PPS What's the UKIP hypothesis?
  • Danny565Danny565 Posts: 8,091

    Danny565 said:

    Does she specify whether she means an In/Out referendum or Deal/No Deal referendum?
    In her article Ms Greening says that it will be “unacceptable” for MPs to impose a compromise on the electorate.

    The former minister argues that the second referendum should not be a “divisive, binary choice”, proposing that voters are presented with three choices: the prime minister’s negotiated deal; staying in the EU; or a clean break. The voting system should involve first and second preference votes, she says.

    Ms Greening has support of other Remain-backing Tories including Amber Rudd, the former home secretary. Dominic Grieve, the former attorney-general, is expected to lend qualified backing in the coming days.
    It sounds like a horrendous idea, and would probably just result in No Deal winning, for the exact same reasons that Brexit won the first referendum ("No Deal" would be the blank slate of those 3 options, and therefore floating voters could just project whatever they wanted onto it).
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 51,903

    A Brexit referendum conducted under AV......

    Adult Videos? :open_mouth:
  • Ishmael_ZIshmael_Z Posts: 8,981

    Ishmael_Z said:

    Pulpstar said:

    GIN1138 said:
    Some 'rallying call', it's behind a blimmin' paywall.
    Take it from me you aren't missing much; Boris channelling his inner Donald.
    Worth paying up for the extraordinary photo of a misty eyed Boris looking just like the Hitler Youth bloke who sings Tomorrow belongs to Me in Cabaret, against a Union Jack background. The UKIP hypothesis is strengthened.
    No need to pay up - just register and you get a number of free articles per week/month (can't remember how many or over what period but provides more than enough Torygraph for me!)

    PS Very true about the Tomorrow Belongs To Me guy - and what a chilling song that is.

    PPS What's the UKIP hypothesis?
    @josiasjessop's theory that BoJo will reinvent himself as the Heir to Farage cos there's nowhere else for him to go.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,181
    Is sending sexts the only thing he did? In which case he might well not be fit to be an MP, but plenty aren't. His association and his constituents will deal with him.
    Danny565 said:

    Danny565 said:

    Does she specify whether she means an In/Out referendum or Deal/No Deal referendum?
    In her article Ms Greening says that it will be “unacceptable” for MPs to impose a compromise on the electorate.

    The former minister argues that the second referendum should not be a “divisive, binary choice”, proposing that voters are presented with three choices: the prime minister’s negotiated deal; staying in the EU; or a clean break. The voting system should involve first and second preference votes, she says.

    Ms Greening has support of other Remain-backing Tories including Amber Rudd, the former home secretary. Dominic Grieve, the former attorney-general, is expected to lend qualified backing in the coming days.
    It sounds like a horrendous idea, and would probably just result in No Deal winning, for the exact same reasons that Brexit won the first referendum ("No Deal" would be the blank slate of those 3 options, and therefore floating voters could just project whatever they wanted onto it).
    Maybe. But remainers, on balance, seem to be going all in, as are the harder leavers. No deal or remain, no one wants a sordid compromise it seems.
  • CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758

    This is just weird. The people of WOxon (of which I’m one) voted Remain, unlike Robert Courts.
    Not necessarily. If they know he is a Leaver perhaps they prefer an MP who will stand on his principles regardless of whether they agree or not.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,222
    edited July 2018
    I don't get why he's stood down as a minister but not as an MP. You tend to resign as a minister (But not an MP) when you have a disagreement with Gov't policy/mislead the house or some such. This is Brooks Newmark Mk II but we're far too far from a general election to make the whole 'I'll stand down at the next election' look vaguely credible for the Tories.
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 34,705
    Ishmael_Z said:

    Ishmael_Z said:

    Pulpstar said:

    GIN1138 said:
    Some 'rallying call', it's behind a blimmin' paywall.
    Take it from me you aren't missing much; Boris channelling his inner Donald.
    Worth paying up for the extraordinary photo of a misty eyed Boris looking just like the Hitler Youth bloke who sings Tomorrow belongs to Me in Cabaret, against a Union Jack background. The UKIP hypothesis is strengthened.
    No need to pay up - just register and you get a number of free articles per week/month (can't remember how many or over what period but provides more than enough Torygraph for me!)

    PS Very true about the Tomorrow Belongs To Me guy - and what a chilling song that is.

    PPS What's the UKIP hypothesis?
    @josiasjessop's theory that BoJo will reinvent himself as the Heir to Farage cos there's nowhere else for him to go.
    Thanks for that (I shall have nightmares now :wink:)
This discussion has been closed.