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politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » Gains for the LDs and Greens the highlights of this week’s local elections

Caol and Mallig on Highland (SNP defence) First Preferences: Con 183 (9% unchanged on last time), Lib Dem 658 (31% +22% on last time), Campbell (Ind) 98 (5%), MacKinnon (Ind) 146 (7%), SNP 574 (27%, Wood (Ind) 454 (21%) (No Lab candidate this time -6%, Total Independent vote: 698 (33% -19% on last time) Liberal Democrat lead of 84 (4%) on a swing of 20.5% from Ind to Lib Dem No candidate elected on first count, Campbell (Ind) eliminated Second Count: Con +5, Lib Dem +13, MacKinnon (Ind) +30, SNP +37, Wood (Ind) +17 Non Transferable 16 No candidate elected on second count, MacKinnion (Ind) eliminated Third Count: Con +12, Lib Dem +35, SNP +24, Wood (Ind) +68 Non Transferable 53 No candidate elected on third count, Con eliminated Fourth Count: Lib Dem +85, SNP +2, Wood (Ind) +41 Non Transferable 125 No candidate elected on fourth count, Wood (Ind) eliminated Fifth Count: Lib Dem +177, SNP +120 Non Transferable 408 Liberal Democrat GAIN from SNP on fifth count

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Mortimer

First, like Leave.

Scott_P

https://twitter.com/PolhomeEditor/status/982331790911295491

Elliot

Sandpit said:

Big_G_NorthWales said:

David_Evershed said:

glw said:

CD13 said:

Mr GLW,

"Yushchenko was poisoned with dioxin but survived."

He was meant to survive, you don't use dioxins to kill someone. Acutely, it causes a condition called chloracne. On the face the skin gets lumpy and spotty - just the sort of thing to put off voters in a Presidential election. Nasty but not fatal.

A fair point. I'm really taking issue with this idea that the FSB is some sort of infallible killing machine, and that a victim surviving, or innocents becoming victims, somehow proves that it can't have been the FSB. That is nonsense. Sometimes state sponsored murders are downright crude, and at other times sophisticated, and they don't always work.

The West did not respond when Russia invaded the Crimea and Eastern Ukraine.

Two Russians get poisoned and the West responds.

What's changed?

It is cumulative with the gas attacks in Syria, interference in the US elections and Brexit and Salisbury is the catalyst to say no more without consequences .

Report today is that Putin did not expect the response from the west and of course the US has hit his personal friends hard in the US today with freezing their assets and companies

Yep, with everything else that was in the news about Russia, this incident pushed the West over the line in their dealings with Putin and friends. There will be more sanctions coming, and more financial controls on Russians in the West.

I still think the World Cup boycot might happen, if Russia tries anything else silly in the next couple of months it will certainly be on the table. Putin and FIFA, two birds, one stone.

I don't know why it always takes so long to deal firmly with such people. All dictators repress their own people but most are happy to maintain peaceful relations with other countries. Those dictators that like to rebel against the system, however, only get bolder with time if left unchecked.

Scott_P

@MSmithsonPB: This doesn't sound like a party intent on being firm again Jew hate racism https://twitter.com/GdnPolitics/status/982320150606000128

Foxy

Nice gains for LDs and Greens.

Elliot

Foxy said:

Nice gains for LDs and Greens.

I don't say this lightly buy I had a drink with some Labour supporters last night and there was definitely a change among them. One of them said he had suddenly had the realisation that maybe Corbyn was just an idiot and therefore not fit to be Prime Minister.

houndtang

Poor results for Labour albeit in very safe Conservative seats. Did they not even run a candidate in Taunton Deane?

Sean_F

Elliot said:

Sandpit said:

Big_G_NorthWales said:

David_Evershed said:

glw said:

CD13 said:

Mr GLW,

"Yushchenko was poisoned with dioxin but survived."

He was meant to survive, you don't use dioxins to kill someone. Acutely, it causes a condition called chloracne. On the face the skin gets lumpy and spotty - just the sort of thing to put off voters in a Presidential election. Nasty but not fatal.

A fair point. I'm really taking issue with this idea that the FSB is some sort of infallible killing machine, and that a victim surviving, or innocents becoming victims, somehow proves that it can't have been the FSB. That is nonsense. Sometimes state sponsored murders are downright crude, and at other times sophisticated, and they don't always work.

The West did not respond when Russia invaded the Crimea and Eastern Ukraine.

Two Russians get poisoned and the West responds.

What's changed?

It is cumulative with the gas attacks in Syria, interference in the US elections and Brexit and Salisbury is the catalyst to say no more without consequences .

Report today is that Putin did not expect the response from the west and of course the US has hit his personal friends hard in the US today with freezing their assets and companies

Yep, with everything else that was in the news about Russia, this incident pushed the West over the line in their dealings with Putin and friends. There will be more sanctions coming, and more financial controls on Russians in the West.

I still think the World Cup boycot might happen, if Russia tries anything else silly in the next couple of months it will certainly be on the table. Putin and FIFA, two birds, one stone.

I don't know why it always takes so long to deal firmly with such people. All dictators repress their own people but most are happy to maintain peaceful relations with other countries. Those dictators that like to rebel against the system, however, only get bolder with time if left unchecked.

There's a kind of laziness and apathy in human nature, that leads people to think you can buy off people who are aggressive towards you. All that you do is teach such people to be aggressive in future.

Big_G_NorthWales

houndtang said:

Poor results for Labour albeit in very safe Conservative seats. Did they not even run a candidate in Taunton Deane?

No 1 for any PM is to be seen to defend the Nation

May did Corbyn prevaricated - maybe too early to say but could have been noticed

ReggieCide

OT

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-43640475

FrancisUrquhart

Scott_P said:

@MSmithsonPB: This doesn't sound like a party intent on being firm again Jew hate racism https://twitter.com/GdnPolitics/status/982320150606000128

Tough on anti-semitism, tough on the causes of anti-semitism ...or perhaps not.

Big_G_NorthWales

Who would have thought that such an English City as Salisbury could be the scene of an International assassination attempt by Russia propelling Theresa May onto the World stage and seeing the West unite against Russia and give Putin a bloody nose while stirring the US to hit him hard today by freezing his friends assets and companies.

Despite Boris's stupidity TM seems to be receiving plaudits from across the political spectrum (outside Corbyn ) on her measured response.

Who said a week is a long time in politics?

Barnesian

SeanT said:

Elliot said:

Foxy said:

Nice gains for LDs and Greens.

I don't say this lightly buy I had a drink with some Labour supporters last night and there was definitely a change among them. One of them said he had suddenly had the realisation that maybe Corbyn was just an idiot and therefore not fit to be Prime Minister.

MASSIVE ANECDOTE ALERT

I got a ride from a woman Plymouth minicab driver yesterday. She was finishing her box of fish and chips as she collected me at my hotel. She was in a talkative mood and wanted to talk politics following a news story on the radio. From her accent I'd say she was Plymouth working class.

I can't imagine a more perfectly swingy swing voter than a female working class Plymouth minicab driver.

Her verdict? And I swear this is true. Even if it sounds like Roger.

"That Corbyn, he's an idiot, isn't he? And a liar. This tuition fees stuff, where's the money coming from? Who's gonna pay for it?"

Then she volunteered the idea:

"Theresa May. She's doing alright. She's OK. She's the only one I like."

I didn't venture a single opinion apart from the usual bland "I don't trust any of them".

(to be honest I wasn't in the mood for a long debate)

If this tiny anecdote has any weight, then Corbyn is heading for a massive defeat, disguised by protest polling. Put it another way: if working class working women in Plymouth despise him, he is fucked.

And Theresa May might have more support (albeit stunted and grudging) than we have imagined.

In my experience, all cab drivers are UKIP or Tories.

FrancisUrquhart

SeanT said:

Elliot said:

Foxy said:

Nice gains for LDs and Greens.

I don't say this lightly buy I had a drink with some Labour supporters last night and there was definitely a change among them. One of them said he had suddenly had the realisation that maybe Corbyn was just an idiot and therefore not fit to be Prime Minister.

MASSIVE ANECDOTE ALERT

I got a ride from a woman Plymouth minicab driver yesterday. She was finishing her box of fish and chips as she collected me at my hotel. She was in a talkative mood and wanted to talk politics following a news story on the radio. From her accent I'd say she was Plymouth working class.

I can't imagine a more perfectly swingy swing voter than a female working class Plymouth minicab driver.

Her verdict? And I swear this is true. Even if it sounds like Roger.

"That Corbyn, he's an idiot, isn't he? And a liar. This tuition fees stuff, where's the money coming from? Who's gonna pay for it?"

Then she volunteered the idea:

"Theresa May. She's doing alright. She's OK. She's the only one I like."

I didn't venture a single opinion apart from the usual bland "I don't trust any of them".

(to be honest I wasn't in the mood for a long debate)

If this tiny anecdote has any weight, then Corbyn is heading for a massive defeat, disguised by protest polling. Put it another way: if working class working women in Plymouth despise him, he is fucked.

And Theresa May might have more support (albeit stunted and grudging) than we have imagined.

That is what all the vox pops in the first week of the GE campaign were like, even in traditionally strong labour areas....then people saw mrs weak and wobbly and decided the terrorist sympathiser and his Marxist mate were worth a punt after all.

Big_G_NorthWales

Barnesian said:

SeanT said:

Elliot said:

Foxy said:

Nice gains for LDs and Greens.

I don't say this lightly buy I had a drink with some Labour supporters last night and there was definitely a change among them. One of them said he had suddenly had the realisation that maybe Corbyn was just an idiot and therefore not fit to be Prime Minister.

MASSIVE ANECDOTE ALERT

I got a ride from a woman Plymouth minicab driver yesterday. She was finishing her box of fish and chips as she collected me at my hotel. She was in a talkative mood and wanted to talk politics following a news story on the radio. From her accent I'd say she was Plymouth working class.

I can't imagine a more perfectly swingy swing voter than a female working class Plymouth minicab driver.

Her verdict? And I swear this is true. Even if it sounds like Roger.

"That Corbyn, he's an idiot, isn't he? And a liar. This tuition fees stuff, where's the money coming from? Who's gonna pay for it?"

Then she volunteered the idea:

"Theresa May. She's doing alright. She's OK. She's the only one I like."

I didn't venture a single opinion apart from the usual bland "I don't trust any of them".

(to be honest I wasn't in the mood for a long debate)

If this tiny anecdote has any weight, then Corbyn is heading for a massive defeat, disguised by protest polling. Put it another way: if working class working women in Plymouth despise him, he is fucked.

And Theresa May might have more support (albeit stunted and grudging) than we have imagined.

In my experience, all cab drivers are UKIP or Tories.

Denial maybe ?

Barnesian

FPT

Sandpit said:

MarqueeMark said:

Sandpit said:

The_Apocalypse said:

Re CarlottaVance’s post from Populus: unbelievable that only 4% have noticed the anti-Semitism story, with all the publicity and coverage that it’s received in the last week or so. Similarly, not many noticed the spy-gate stories either. Corbyn really is very lucky - for whatever reason the public do not seem to be interested these kind of stories concerning Corbyn.

It’s not 4% that have noticed it at all, it’s 4% that mentioned it first when asked what was in the news this week.

And the 31% who mentioned the spy poisoning story as their primary may not have had the same take on it as Jeremy Corbyn...

I would have said the Chinese space station if asked the question, and that didn’t even make the top 10.

I would have had the Chinese space station above the Corbyn story. In fact I wouldn't have mentioned the Corbyn story as news. My reaction to it was "the usual suspects" trying to smear Corbyn and I read no further. It made zero impression on me and faded rapidly from my memory.

Barnesian

Big_G_NorthWales said:

Barnesian said:

SeanT said:

Elliot said:

Foxy said:

Nice gains for LDs and Greens.

I don't say this lightly buy I had a drink with some Labour supporters last night and there was definitely a change among them. One of them said he had suddenly had the realisation that maybe Corbyn was just an idiot and therefore not fit to be Prime Minister.

MASSIVE ANECDOTE ALERT

I got a ride from a woman Plymouth minicab driver yesterday. She was finishing her box of fish and chips as she collected me at my hotel. She was in a talkative mood and wanted to talk politics following a news story on the radio. From her accent I'd say she was Plymouth working class.

I can't imagine a more perfectly swingy swing voter than a female working class Plymouth minicab driver.

Her verdict? And I swear this is true. Even if it sounds like Roger.

"That Corbyn, he's an idiot, isn't he? And a liar. This tuition fees stuff, where's the money coming from? Who's gonna pay for it?"

Then she volunteered the idea:

"Theresa May. She's doing alright. She's OK. She's the only one I like."

I didn't venture a single opinion apart from the usual bland "I don't trust any of them".

(to be honest I wasn't in the mood for a long debate)

If this tiny anecdote has any weight, then Corbyn is heading for a massive defeat, disguised by protest polling. Put it another way: if working class working women in Plymouth despise him, he is fucked.

And Theresa May might have more support (albeit stunted and grudging) than we have imagined.

In my experience, all cab drivers are UKIP or Tories.

Denial maybe ?

I can honestly say I've never had a Labour supporting cab driver.

EDIT: Have you? Can you remember one? I bet you can remember UKIP ones.

Big_G_NorthWales

FrancisUrquhart said:

SeanT said:

Elliot said:

Foxy said:

Nice gains for LDs and Greens.

I don't say this lightly buy I had a drink with some Labour supporters last night and there was definitely a change among them. One of them said he had suddenly had the realisation that maybe Corbyn was just an idiot and therefore not fit to be Prime Minister.

MASSIVE ANECDOTE ALERT

I got a ride from a woman Plymouth minicab driver yesterday. She was finishing her box of fish and chips as she collected me at my hotel. She was in a talkative mood and wanted to talk politics following a news story on the radio. From her accent I'd say she was Plymouth working class.

I can't imagine a more perfectly swingy swing voter than a female working class Plymouth minicab driver.

Her verdict? And I swear this is true. Even if it sounds like Roger.

"That Corbyn, he's an idiot, isn't he? And a liar. This tuition fees stuff, where's the money coming from? Who's gonna pay for it?"

Then she volunteered the idea:

"Theresa May. She's doing alright. She's OK. She's the only one I like."

I didn't venture a single opinion apart from the usual bland "I don't trust any of them".

(to be honest I wasn't in the mood for a long debate)

If this tiny anecdote has any weight, then Corbyn is heading for a massive defeat, disguised by protest polling. Put it another way: if working class working women in Plymouth despise him, he is fucked.

And Theresa May might have more support (albeit stunted and grudging) than we have imagined.

That is what all the vox pops in the first week of the GE campaign were like, even in traditionally strong labour areas....then people saw mrs weak and wobbly and decided the terrorist sympathiser and his Marxist mate were worth a punt after all.

Once bitten, twice shy

AndyJS

SeanT said:

PS

The other strong impression I got from my Plymouth minicab epiphany was just how much Corbyn is perceived as another posh London politician, no different (i.e. no more or less posh or elitist) than anyone else in Westminster. He's seen as rich and deluded, with no clue how real people live. Like the rest: Labour or Tory

Clearly this is from people outside the Corbynista bubble, but that's where we need to look

Corbyn seemed to go down particularly well in Cornwall though, with Labour almost winning seats like Truro & Falmouth where they usually come third or fourth.

FrancisUrquhart

Barnesian said:

Big_G_NorthWales said:

Barnesian said:

SeanT said:

Elliot said:

Foxy said:

Nice gains for LDs and Greens.

I don't say this lightly buy I had a drink with some Labour supporters last night and there was definitely a change among them. One of them said he had suddenly had the realisation that maybe Corbyn was just an idiot and therefore not fit to be Prime Minister.

MASSIVE ANECDOTE ALERT

I got a ride from a woman Plymouth minicab driver yesterday. She was finishing her box of fish and chips as she collected me at my hotel. She was in a talkative mood and wanted to talk politics following a news story on the radio. From her accent I'd say she was Plymouth working class.

I can't imagine a more perfectly swingy swing voter than a female working class Plymouth minicab driver.

Her verdict? And I swear this is true. Even if it sounds like Roger.

"That Corbyn, he's an idiot, isn't he? And a liar. This tuition fees stuff, where's the money coming from? Who's gonna pay for it?"

Then she volunteered the idea:

"Theresa May. She's doing alright. She's OK. She's the only one I like."

I didn't venture a single opinion apart from the usual bland "I don't trust any of them".

(to be honest I wasn't in the mood for a long debate)

If this tiny anecdote has any weight, then Corbyn is heading for a massive defeat, disguised by protest polling. Put it another way: if working class working women in Plymouth despise him, he is fucked.

And Theresa May might have more support (albeit stunted and grudging) than we have imagined.

In my experience, all cab drivers are UKIP or Tories.

Denial maybe ?

I can honestly say I've never had a Labour supporting cab driver.

I don’t mean to be funny by many cab / mini cab / Uber drivers are from immigrant backgrounds, especially Asian descent. That particular demographic isn’t exactly known as natural Tory supporters.

MarqueeMark

Elliot said:

Foxy said:

Nice gains for LDs and Greens.

I don't say this lightly buy I had a drink with some Labour supporters last night and there was definitely a change among them. One of them said he had suddenly had the realisation that maybe Corbyn was just an idiot and therefore not fit to be Prime Minister.

Mirrors what I am hearing too.

TheJezziah

They were finding plenty of people who didn't like Corbyn and weren't going to vote for him before.

The key would be finding voters who did vote for him (or voted Labour) in 2017 and had changed their mind in decent numbers. Someone who has never liked Corbyn from the start and is willing to vote Conservative in most cases already has.

Big_G_NorthWales

Barnesian said:

Big_G_NorthWales said:

Barnesian said:

SeanT said:

Elliot said:

Foxy said:

Nice gains for LDs and Greens.

I don't say this lightly buy I had a drink with some Labour supporters last night and there was definitely a change among them. One of them said he had suddenly had the realisation that maybe Corbyn was just an idiot and therefore not fit to be Prime Minister.

MASSIVE ANECDOTE ALERT

I got a ride from a woman Plymouth minicab driver yesterday. She was finishing her box of fish and chips as she collected me at my hotel. She was in a talkative mood and wanted to talk politics following a news story on the radio. From her accent I'd say she was Plymouth working class.

I can't imagine a more perfectly swingy swing voter than a female working class Plymouth minicab driver.

Her verdict? And I swear this is true. Even if it sounds like Roger.

"That Corbyn, he's an idiot, isn't he? And a liar. This tuition fees stuff, where's the money coming from? Who's gonna pay for it?"

Then she volunteered the idea:

"Theresa May. She's doing alright. She's OK. She's the only one I like."

I didn't venture a single opinion apart from the usual bland "I don't trust any of them".

(to be honest I wasn't in the mood for a long debate)

If this tiny anecdote has any weight, then Corbyn is heading for a massive defeat, disguised by protest polling. Put it another way: if working class working women in Plymouth despise him, he is fucked.

And Theresa May might have more support (albeit stunted and grudging) than we have imagined.

In my experience, all cab drivers are UKIP or Tories.

Denial maybe ?

I can honestly say I've never had a Labour supporting cab driver.

EDIT: Have you? Can you remember one? I bet you can remember UKIP ones.

To be honest I haven't used a taxi for years.

Mind you I will next month to take me from Euston to Paddington

FrancisUrquhart

SeanT said:

PS

The other strong impression I got from my Plymouth minicab epiphany was just how much Corbyn is perceived as another posh London politician, no different (i.e. no more or less posh or elitist) than anyone else in Westminster. He's seen as rich and deluded, with no clue how real people live. Like the rest: Labour or Tory

Clearly this is from people outside the Corbynista bubble, but that's where we need to look

The spin machine that jezza is man of the people is of course nonsense. Comfortable upbringing, went to one of the best state schools in the country and then never had a proper job outside politics. That description also matches miliband.

Barnesian

FrancisUrquhart said:

Barnesian said:

Big_G_NorthWales said:

Barnesian said:

SeanT said:

Elliot said:

Foxy said:

Nice gains for LDs and Greens.

I don't say this lightly buy I had a drink with some Labour supporters last night and there was definitely a change among them. One of them said he had suddenly had the realisation that maybe Corbyn was just an idiot and therefore not fit to be Prime Minister.

MASSIVE ANECDOTE ALERT

I got a ride from a woman Plymouth minicab driver yesterday. She was finishing her box of fish and chips as she collected me at my hotel. She was in a talkative mood and wanted to talk politics following a news story on the radio. From her accent I'd say she was Plymouth working class.

I can't imagine a more perfectly swingy swing voter than a female working class Plymouth minicab driver.

Her verdict? And I swear this is true. Even if it sounds like Roger.

"That Corbyn, he's an idiot, isn't he? And a liar. This tuition fees stuff, where's the money coming from? Who's gonna pay for it?"

Then she volunteered the idea:

"Theresa May. She's doing alright. She's OK. She's the only one I like."

I didn't venture a single opinion apart from the usual bland "I don't trust any of them".

(to be honest I wasn't in the mood for a long debate)

If this tiny anecdote has any weight, then Corbyn is heading for a massive defeat, disguised by protest polling. Put it another way: if working class working women in Plymouth despise him, he is fucked.

And Theresa May might have more support (albeit stunted and grudging) than we have imagined.

In my experience, all cab drivers are UKIP or Tories.

Denial maybe ?

I can honestly say I've never had a Labour supporting cab driver.

I don’t mean to be funny by many cab / mini cab / Uber drivers are from immigrant backgrounds, especially Asian descent. That particular demographic isn’t exactly known as natural Tory supporters.

In my experience, the Uber drivers, who I agree are usually from immigrant backgrounds, don't talk much at all, and never about politics. I guess I'm basing my observation on white London taxi-cab drivers who invariably are mouthy right wingers. No idea about Rotherham.

Foxy

SeanT said:

Elliot said:

Foxy said:

Nice gains for LDs and Greens.

I don't say this lightly buy I had a drink with some Labour supporters last night and there was definitely a change among them. One of them said he had suddenly had the realisation that maybe Corbyn was just an idiot and therefore not fit to be Prime Minister.

MASSIVE ANECDOTE ALERT

I got a ride from a woman Plymouth minicab driver yesterday. She was finishing her box of fish and chips as she collected me at my hotel. She was in a talkative mood and wanted to talk politics following a news story on the radio. From her accent I'd say she was Plymouth working class.

I can't imagine a more perfectly swingy swing voter than a female working class Plymouth minicab driver.

Her verdict? And I swear this is true. Even if it sounds like Roger.

"That Corbyn, he's an idiot, isn't he? And a liar. This tuition fees stuff, where's the money coming from? Who's gonna pay for it?"

Then she volunteered the idea:

"Theresa May. She's doing alright. She's OK. She's the only one I like."

I didn't venture a single opinion apart from the usual bland "I don't trust any of them".

(to be honest I wasn't in the mood for a long debate)

If this tiny anecdote has any weight, then Corbyn is heading for a massive defeat, disguised by protest polling. Put it another way: if working class working women in Plymouth despise him, he is fucked.

And Theresa May might have more support (albeit stunted and grudging) than we have imagined.

We heard lots of that sort of guff a year ago. What happened next?

I have just had a few days on the Wight, with relatives galore, from my Kipper dad, to Corbynite nephews and JRM supporting Uncle.

A fair bit of political talk amongst the other rainy day entertainments. No one made comment on either the anti-semitism row or made any party political points about Salisbury. Sorry to disappoint, but in our political family neither reached the surface.

Sean_F

SeanT said:

PS

The other strong impression I got from my Plymouth minicab epiphany was just how much Corbyn is perceived as another posh London politician, no different (i.e. no more or less posh or elitist) than anyone else in Westminster. He's seen as rich and deluded, with no clue how real people live. Like the rest: Labour or Tory

Clearly this is from people outside the Corbynista bubble, but that's where we need to look

Corbyn's weakness on defence and security issues was theoretical in 2017. Now, it's been shown to have some grounding in reality.

Bear in mind though, the Tories (pre Salisbury) have done a lot to trash their own reputation on defence and security.

ReggieCide

Barnesian said:

SeanT said:

Elliot said:

Foxy said:

Nice gains for LDs and Greens.

I don't say this lightly buy I had a drink with some Labour supporters last night and there was definitely a change among them. One of them said he had suddenly had the realisation that maybe Corbyn was just an idiot and therefore not fit to be Prime Minister.

MASSIVE ANECDOTE ALERT

I got a ride from a woman Plymouth minicab driver yesterday. She was finishing her box of fish and chips as she collected me at my hotel. She was in a talkative mood and wanted to talk politics following a news story on the radio. From her accent I'd say she was Plymouth working class.

I can't imagine a more perfectly swingy swing voter than a female working class Plymouth minicab driver.

Her verdict? And I swear this is true. Even if it sounds like Roger.

"That Corbyn, he's an idiot, isn't he? And a liar. This tuition fees stuff, where's the money coming from? Who's gonna pay for it?"

Then she volunteered the idea:

"Theresa May. She's doing alright. She's OK. She's the only one I like."

I didn't venture a single opinion apart from the usual bland "I don't trust any of them".

(to be honest I wasn't in the mood for a long debate)

If this tiny anecdote has any weight, then Corbyn is heading for a massive defeat, disguised by protest polling. Put it another way: if working class working women in Plymouth despise him, he is fucked.

And Theresa May might have more support (albeit stunted and grudging) than we have imagined.

In my experience, all cab drivers are UKIP or Tories.

Do you poll them before deciding on a tip?

Barnesian

SeanT said:

Barnesian said:

Big_G_NorthWales said:

Barnesian said:

SeanT said:

Elliot said:

Foxy said:

Nice gains for LDs and Greens.

I don't say this lightly buy I had a drink with some Labour supporters last night and there was definitely a change among them. One of them said he had suddenly had the realisation that maybe Corbyn was just an idiot and therefore not fit to be Prime Minister.

MASSIVE ANECDOTE ALERT

I got a ride from a woman Plymouth minicab driver yesterday. She was finishing her box of fish and chips as she collected me at my hotel. She was in a talkative mood and wanted to talk politics following a news story on the radio. From her accent I'd say she was Plymouth working class.

I can't imagine a more perfectly swingy swing voter than a female working class Plymouth minicab driver.

Her verdict? And I swear this is true. Even if it sounds like Roger.

"That Corbyn, he's an idiot, isn't he? And a liar. This tuition fees stuff, where's the money coming from? Who's gonna pay for it?"

Then she volunteered the idea:

"Theresa May. She's doing alright. She's OK. She's the only one I like."

I didn't venture a single opinion apart from the usual bland "I don't trust any of them".

(to be honest I wasn't in the mood for a long debate)

If this tiny anecdote has any weight, then Corbyn is heading for a massive defeat, disguised by protest polling. Put it another way: if working class working women in Plymouth despise him, he is fucked.

And Theresa May might have more support (albeit stunted and grudging) than we have imagined.

In my experience, all cab drivers are UKIP or Tories.

Denial maybe ?

I can honestly say I've never had a Labour supporting cab driver.

EDIT: Have you? Can you remember one? I bet you can remember UKIP ones.

Try being a vulnerable 14 year old girl in a Labour run northern city in about 2011. Not sure many of those cab drivers voted UKIP. You fucking idiot.

I can honestly say I've never had a Labour supporting cab driver.

I've never been a vulnerable 14 year old girl in a Labour run northern city so I don't have that experience.

Ishmael_Z

Scott_P said:

@MSmithsonPB: This doesn't sound like a party intent on being firm again Jew hate racism https://twitter.com/GdnPolitics/status/982320150606000128

I seriously think the name "antisemitic" is obscure, misleading and counterproductive. "Semitic" = "descended from Shem, not Ham" which about 1 person in 10,000 understands; there would be better understanding if judeophobic were used instead.

Barnesian

Big_G_NorthWales said:

Barnesian said:

Big_G_NorthWales said:

Barnesian said:

SeanT said:

Elliot said:

Foxy said:

Nice gains for LDs and Greens.

I don't say this lightly buy I had a drink with some Labour supporters last night and there was definitely a change among them. One of them said he had suddenly had the realisation that maybe Corbyn was just an idiot and therefore not fit to be Prime Minister.

MASSIVE ANECDOTE ALERT

I got a ride from a woman Plymouth minicab driver yesterday. She was finishing her box of fish and chips as she collected me at my hotel. She was in a talkative mood and wanted to talk politics following a news story on the radio. From her accent I'd say she was Plymouth working class.

I can't imagine a more perfectly swingy swing voter than a female working class Plymouth minicab driver.

Her verdict? And I swear this is true. Even if it sounds like Roger.

"That Corbyn, he's an idiot, isn't he? And a liar. This tuition fees stuff, where's the money coming from? Who's gonna pay for it?"

Then she volunteered the idea:

"Theresa May. She's doing alright. She's OK. She's the only one I like."

I didn't venture a single opinion apart from the usual bland "I don't trust any of them".

(to be honest I wasn't in the mood for a long debate)

If this tiny anecdote has any weight, then Corbyn is heading for a massive defeat, disguised by protest polling. Put it another way: if working class working women in Plymouth despise him, he is fucked.

And Theresa May might have more support (albeit stunted and grudging) than we have imagined.

In my experience, all cab drivers are UKIP or Tories.

Denial maybe ?

I can honestly say I've never had a Labour supporting cab driver.

EDIT: Have you? Can you remember one? I bet you can remember UKIP ones.

To be honest I haven't used a taxi for years.

Mind you I will next month to take me from Euston to Paddington

See what you think about the driver

another_richard

Sean_F said:

SeanT said:

PS

The other strong impression I got from my Plymouth minicab epiphany was just how much Corbyn is perceived as another posh London politician, no different (i.e. no more or less posh or elitist) than anyone else in Westminster. He's seen as rich and deluded, with no clue how real people live. Like the rest: Labour or Tory

Clearly this is from people outside the Corbynista bubble, but that's where we need to look

Corbyn's weakness on defence and security issues was theoretical in 2017. Now, it's been shown to have some grounding in reality.

Bear in mind though, the Tories (pre Salisbury) have done a lot to trash their own reputation on defence and security.

But don't forget the UK is now an 'Aid Superpower'.

Big_G_NorthWales

Barnesian said:

Big_G_NorthWales said:

Barnesian said:

Big_G_NorthWales said:

Barnesian said:

SeanT said:

Elliot said:

Foxy said:

Nice gains for LDs and Greens.

I don't say this lightly buy I had a drink with some Labour supporters last night and there was definitely a change among them. One of them said he had suddenly had the realisation that maybe Corbyn was just an idiot and therefore not fit to be Prime Minister.

MASSIVE ANECDOTE ALERT

I got a ride from a woman Plymouth minicab driver yesterday. She was finishing her box of fish and chips as she collected me at my hotel. She was in a talkative mood and wanted to talk politics following a news story on the radio. From her accent I'd say she was Plymouth working class.

I can't imagine a more perfectly swingy swing voter than a female working class Plymouth minicab driver.

Her verdict? And I swear this is true. Even if it sounds like Roger.

"That Corbyn, he's an idiot, isn't he? And a liar. This tuition fees stuff, where's the money coming from? Who's gonna pay for it?"

Then she volunteered the idea:

"Theresa May. She's doing alright. She's OK. She's the only one I like."

I didn't venture a single opinion apart from the usual bland "I don't trust any of them".

(to be honest I wasn't in the mood for a long debate)

If this tiny anecdote has any weight, then Corbyn is heading for a massive defeat, disguised by protest polling. Put it another way: if working class working women in Plymouth despise him, he is fucked.

And Theresa May might have more support (albeit stunted and grudging) than we have imagined.

In my experience, all cab drivers are UKIP or Tories.

Denial maybe ?

I can honestly say I've never had a Labour supporting cab driver.

EDIT: Have you? Can you remember one? I bet you can remember UKIP ones.

To be honest I haven't used a taxi for years.

Mind you I will next month to take me from Euston to Paddington

See what you think about the driver

Also need one to take me back 3 weeks later so will use two taxis - then will let you know.

ReggieCide

SeanT said:

Barnesian said:

SeanT said:

Elliot said:

Foxy said:

Nice gains for LDs and Greens.

I don't say this lightly buy I had a drink with some Labour supporters last night and there was definitely a change among them. One of them said he had suddenly had the realisation that maybe Corbyn was just an idiot and therefore not fit to be Prime Minister.

MASSIVE ANECDOTE ALERT

I got a ride from a woman Plymouth minicab driver yesterday. She was finishing her box of fish and chips as she collected me at my hotel. She was in a talkative mood and wanted to talk politics following a news story on the radio. From her accent I'd say she was Plymouth working class.

I can't imagine a more perfectly swingy swing voter than a female working class Plymouth minicab driver.

Her verdict? And I swear this is true. Even if it sounds like Roger.

"That Corbyn, he's an idiot, isn't he? And a liar. This tuition fees stuff, where's the money coming from? Who's gonna pay for it?"

Then she volunteered the idea:

"Theresa May. She's doing alright. She's OK. She's the only one I like."

I didn't venture a single opinion apart from the usual bland "I don't trust any of them".

(to be honest I wasn't in the mood for a long debate)

If this tiny anecdote has any weight, then Corbyn is heading for a massive defeat, disguised by protest polling. Put it another way: if working class working women in Plymouth despise him, he is fucked.

And Theresa May might have more support (albeit stunted and grudging) than we have imagined.

In my experience, all cab drivers are UKIP or Tories.

Oh, I'd guess quite a lot of working class Muslim minicab drivers in, say, Rotherham, have been quite consistently pro-Labour, in recent decades.

Don't you?

Same is true of non black cabs in London.

Barnesian

ReggieCide said:

Barnesian said:

SeanT said:

Elliot said:

Foxy said:

Nice gains for LDs and Greens.

I don't say this lightly buy I had a drink with some Labour supporters last night and there was definitely a change among them. One of them said he had suddenly had the realisation that maybe Corbyn was just an idiot and therefore not fit to be Prime Minister.

MASSIVE ANECDOTE ALERT

I got a ride from a woman Plymouth minicab driver yesterday. She was finishing her box of fish and chips as she collected me at my hotel. She was in a talkative mood and wanted to talk politics following a news story on the radio. From her accent I'd say she was Plymouth working class.

I can't imagine a more perfectly swingy swing voter than a female working class Plymouth minicab driver.

Her verdict? And I swear this is true. Even if it sounds like Roger.

"That Corbyn, he's an idiot, isn't he? And a liar. This tuition fees stuff, where's the money coming from? Who's gonna pay for it?"

Then she volunteered the idea:

"Theresa May. She's doing alright. She's OK. She's the only one I like."

I didn't venture a single opinion apart from the usual bland "I don't trust any of them".

(to be honest I wasn't in the mood for a long debate)

If this tiny anecdote has any weight, then Corbyn is heading for a massive defeat, disguised by protest polling. Put it another way: if working class working women in Plymouth despise him, he is fucked.

And Theresa May might have more support (albeit stunted and grudging) than we have imagined.

In my experience, all cab drivers are UKIP or Tories.

Do you poll them before deciding on a tip?

I don't have to. They mouth off. I'm talking about black cab drivers - not Ubers.

EDIT: That's white black cab drivers!

Foxy

AndyJS said:

SeanT said:

PS

The other strong impression I got from my Plymouth minicab epiphany was just how much Corbyn is perceived as another posh London politician, no different (i.e. no more or less posh or elitist) than anyone else in Westminster. He's seen as rich and deluded, with no clue how real people live. Like the rest: Labour or Tory

Clearly this is from people outside the Corbynista bubble, but that's where we need to look

Corbyn seemed to go down particularly well in Cornwall though, with Labour almost winning seats like Truro & Falmouth where they usually come third or fourth.

Indeed Labour took Plymouth Sutton and Devenport last year despite @SeanT predicting that Corbyn would be destroyed because of his IRA and Islamist sympathies. I believe the seat is long in Navy tradition.

So I think @SeanT is once again speaking out his arse.

ReggieCide

SeanT said:

Barnesian said:

Big_G_NorthWales said:

Barnesian said:

SeanT said:

Elliot said:

Foxy said:

Nice gains for LDs and Greens.

I don't say this lightly buy I had a drink with some Labour supporters last night and there was definitely a change among them. One of them said he had suddenly had the realisation that maybe Corbyn was just an idiot and therefore not fit to be Prime Minister.

MASSIVE ANECDOTE ALERT

I got a ride from a woman Plymouth minicab driver yesterday. She was finishing her box of fish and chips as she collected me at my hotel. She was in a talkative mood and wanted to talk politics following a news story on the radio. From her accent I'd say she was Plymouth working class.

I can't imagine a more perfectly swingy swing voter than a female working class Plymouth minicab driver.

Her verdict? And I swear this is true. Even if it sounds like Roger.

"That Corbyn, he's an idiot, isn't he? And a liar. This tuition fees stuff, where's the money coming from? Who's gonna pay for it?"

Then she volunteered the idea:

"Theresa May. She's doing alright. She's OK. She's the only one I like."

I didn't venture a single opinion apart from the usual bland "I don't trust any of them".

(to be honest I wasn't in the mood for a long debate)

If this tiny anecdote has any weight, then Corbyn is heading for a massive defeat, disguised by protest polling. Put it another way: if working class working women in Plymouth despise him, he is fucked.

And Theresa May might have more support (albeit stunted and grudging) than we have imagined.

In my experience, all cab drivers are UKIP or Tories.

Denial maybe ?

I can honestly say I've never had a Labour supporting cab driver.

EDIT: Have you? Can you remember one? I bet you can remember UKIP ones.

Try being a vulnerable 14 year old girl in a Labour run northern city in about 2011. Not sure many of those cab drivers voted UKIP. You fucking idiot.

Not sure much has changed since 2011, significantly courtesy of Labour Councils

CarlottaVance

https://twitter.com/IainDale/status/982240011046146049

Sean_F

another_richard said:

Sean_F said:

SeanT said:

PS

The other strong impression I got from my Plymouth minicab epiphany was just how much Corbyn is perceived as another posh London politician, no different (i.e. no more or less posh or elitist) than anyone else in Westminster. He's seen as rich and deluded, with no clue how real people live. Like the rest: Labour or Tory

Clearly this is from people outside the Corbynista bubble, but that's where we need to look

Corbyn's weakness on defence and security issues was theoretical in 2017. Now, it's been shown to have some grounding in reality.

Bear in mind though, the Tories (pre Salisbury) have done a lot to trash their own reputation on defence and security.

But don't forget the UK is now an 'Aid Superpower'.

There's no point banging on about what a threat Corbyn is when you:-

1. Slash the armed forces,
2. Fund litigation against the armed forces,
3. Slash police numbers,
4. Prioritise overseas aid.

Hammond was probably the worst Defence Secretary ever.

ReggieCide

FrancisUrquhart said:

SeanT said:

PS

The other strong impression I got from my Plymouth minicab epiphany was just how much Corbyn is perceived as another posh London politician, no different (i.e. no more or less posh or elitist) than anyone else in Westminster. He's seen as rich and deluded, with no clue how real people live. Like the rest: Labour or Tory

Clearly this is from people outside the Corbynista bubble, but that's where we need to look

The spin machine that jezza is man of the people is of course nonsense. Comfortable upbringing, went to one of the best state schools in the country and then never had a proper job outside politics. That description also matches miliband.

He's not Jewish is he?

Barnesian

SeanT said:

Barnesian said:

FrancisUrquhart said:

Barnesian said:

Big_G_NorthWales said:

Barnesian said:

SeanT said:

Elliot said:

Foxy said:

Nice gains for LDs and Greens.

I don't say this lightly buy I had a drink with some Labour supporters last night and there was definitely a change among them. One of them said he had suddenly had the realisation that maybe Corbyn was just an idiot and therefore not fit to be Prime Minister.

MASSIVE ANECDOTE ALERT

I got a ride from a woman Plymouth minicab driver yesterday. She was finishing her box of fish and chips as she collected me at my hotel. She was in a talkative mood and wanted to talk politics following a news story on the radio. From her accent I'd say she was Plymouth working class.

I can't imagine a more perfectly swingy swing voter than a female working class Plymouth minicab driver.

Her verdict? And I swear this is true. Even if it sounds like Roger.

"That Corbyn, he's an idiot, isn't he? And a liar. This tuition fees stuff, where's the money coming from? Who's gonna pay for it?"

Then she volunteered the idea:

"Theresa May. She's doing alright. She's OK. She's the only one I like."

I didn't venture a single opinion apart from the usual bland "I don't trust any of them".

(to be honest I wasn't in the mood for a long debate)

If this tiny anecdote has any weight, then Corbyn is heading for a massive defeat, disguised by protest polling. Put it another way: if working class working women in Plymouth despise him, he is fucked.

And Theresa May might have more support (albeit stunted and grudging) than we have imagined.

In my experience, all cab drivers are UKIP or Tories.

Denial maybe ?

I can honestly say I've never had a Labour supporting cab driver.

I don’t mean to be funny by many cab / mini cab / Uber drivers are from immigrant backgrounds, especially Asian descent. That particular demographic isn’t exactly known as natural Tory supporters.

In my experience, the Uber drivers, who I agree are usually from immigrant backgrounds, don't talk much at all, and never about politics. I guess I'm basing my observation on white London taxi-cab drivers who invariably are mouthy right wingers. No idea about Rotherham.

"No idea about Rotherham". Really? From the evidence, from the Jay report, can't you have a wild guess where most of the minicab driving Muslim vote was directed?

Go on, knock yourself out, you deep fried dildo of a man.

I'll treasure that one!

Sean_F

Foxy said:

AndyJS said:

SeanT said:

PS

The other strong impression I got from my Plymouth minicab epiphany was just how much Corbyn is perceived as another posh London politician, no different (i.e. no more or less posh or elitist) than anyone else in Westminster. He's seen as rich and deluded, with no clue how real people live. Like the rest: Labour or Tory

Clearly this is from people outside the Corbynista bubble, but that's where we need to look

Corbyn seemed to go down particularly well in Cornwall though, with Labour almost winning seats like Truro & Falmouth where they usually come third or fourth.

Indeed Labour took Plymouth Sutton and Devenport last year despite @SeanT predicting that Corbyn would be destroyed because of his IRA and Islamist sympathies. I believe the seat is long in Navy tradition.

So I think @SeanT is once again speaking out his arse.

Johnny Mercer's seat is actually the successor to the historic Devonport Costituency, and he did very well. The divergence in the results in Plymouth was startling.

FrancisUrquhart

SeanT said:

Foxy said:

SeanT said:

Elliot said:

Foxy said:

Nice gains for LDs and Greens.

I don't say this lightly buy I had a drink with some Labour supporters last night and there was definitely a change among them. One of them said he had suddenly had the realisation that maybe Corbyn was just an idiot and therefore not fit to be Prime Minister.

MASSIVE ANECDOTE ALERT

I got a ride from a woman Plymouth minicab driver yesterday. She was finishing her box of fish and chips as she collected me at my hotel. She was in a talkative mood and wanted to talk politics following a news story on the radio. From her accent I'd say she was Plymouth working class.

I can't imagine a more perfectly swingy swing voter than a female working class Plymouth minicab driver.

Her verdict? And I swear this is true. Even if it sounds like Roger.

"That Corbyn, he's an idiot, isn't he? And a liar. This tuition fees stuff, where's the money coming from? Who's gonna pay for it?"

Then she volunteered the idea:

"Theresa May. She's doing alright. She's OK. She's the only one I like."

I didn't venture a single opinion apart from the usual bland "I don't trust any of them".

(to be honest I wasn't in the mood for a long debate)

If this tiny anecdote has any weight, then Corbyn is heading for a massive defeat, disguised by protest polling. Put it another way: if working class working women in Plymouth despise him, he is fucked.

And Theresa May might have more support (albeit stunted and grudging) than we have imagined.

We heard lots of that sort of guff a year ago. What happened next?

I have just had a few days on the Wight, with relatives galore, from my Kipper dad, to Corbynite nephews and JRM supporting Uncle.

A fair bit of political talk amongst the other rainy day entertainments. No one made comment on either the anti-semitism row or made any party political points about Salisbury. Sorry to disappoint, but in our political family neither reached the surface.

Sure, I did say this was a ridiculous generalisation from one single encounter. I'm probably wrong.

But sometimes I get it really right (I remember being alone here in predicting the SNP resurgence after a NO indy-vote) and I am sensing a swing against Corbyn,

Part of his problem is simply that he has so long to go, until he has another chance. He's already seen as a bit boring, weird, treacherous and derelict, the idea he will carry any of his Corbynista "enthusiasm" to 2022 is borderline nuts.

Don't under estimate the cult. A lot of people seem to have hung their hopes and dreams on the cult of corbyn, regardless of the truth eg that polling showing leavers thinking he was for leave and remainers thinking he was for remain.

ReggieCide

Barnesian said:

SeanT said:

Barnesian said:

Big_G_NorthWales said:

Barnesian said:

SeanT said:

Elliot said:

Foxy said:

Nice gains for LDs and Greens.

I don't say this lightly buy I had a drink with some Labour supporters last night and there was definitely a change among them. One of them said he had suddenly had the realisation that maybe Corbyn was just an idiot and therefore not fit to be Prime Minister.

MASSIVE ANECDOTE ALERT

I got a ride from a woman Plymouth minicab driver yesterday. She was finishing her box of fish and chips as she collected me at my hotel. She was in a talkative mood and wanted to talk politics following a news story on the radio. From her accent I'd say she was Plymouth working class.

I can't imagine a more perfectly swingy swing voter than a female working class Plymouth minicab driver.

Her verdict? And I swear this is true. Even if it sounds like Roger.

"That Corbyn, he's an idiot, isn't he? And a liar. This tuition fees stuff, where's the money coming from? Who's gonna pay for it?"

Then she volunteered the idea:

"Theresa May. She's doing alright. She's OK. She's the only one I like."

I didn't venture a single opinion apart from the usual bland "I don't trust any of them".

(to be honest I wasn't in the mood for a long debate)

If this tiny anecdote has any weight, then Corbyn is heading for a massive defeat, disguised by protest polling. Put it another way: if working class working women in Plymouth despise him, he is fucked.

And Theresa May might have more support (albeit stunted and grudging) than we have imagined.

In my experience, all cab drivers are UKIP or Tories.

Denial maybe ?

I can honestly say I've never had a Labour supporting cab driver.

EDIT: Have you? Can you remember one? I bet you can remember UKIP ones.

Try being a vulnerable 14 year old girl in a Labour run northern city in about 2011. Not sure many of those cab drivers voted UKIP. You fucking idiot.

I can honestly say I've never had a Labour supporting cab driver.

I've never been a vulnerable 14 year old girl in a Labour run northern city so I don't have that experience.

Your last sentence shows you for what you are.

ReggieCide

Barnesian said:

ReggieCide said:

Barnesian said:

SeanT said:

Elliot said:

Foxy said:

Nice gains for LDs and Greens.

I don't say this lightly buy I had a drink with some Labour supporters last night and there was definitely a change among them. One of them said he had suddenly had the realisation that maybe Corbyn was just an idiot and therefore not fit to be Prime Minister.

MASSIVE ANECDOTE ALERT

I got a ride from a woman Plymouth minicab driver yesterday. She was finishing her box of fish and chips as she collected me at my hotel. She was in a talkative mood and wanted to talk politics following a news story on the radio. From her accent I'd say she was Plymouth working class.

I can't imagine a more perfectly swingy swing voter than a female working class Plymouth minicab driver.

Her verdict? And I swear this is true. Even if it sounds like Roger.

"That Corbyn, he's an idiot, isn't he? And a liar. This tuition fees stuff, where's the money coming from? Who's gonna pay for it?"

Then she volunteered the idea:

"Theresa May. She's doing alright. She's OK. She's the only one I like."

I didn't venture a single opinion apart from the usual bland "I don't trust any of them".

(to be honest I wasn't in the mood for a long debate)

If this tiny anecdote has any weight, then Corbyn is heading for a massive defeat, disguised by protest polling. Put it another way: if working class working women in Plymouth despise him, he is fucked.

And Theresa May might have more support (albeit stunted and grudging) than we have imagined.

In my experience, all cab drivers are UKIP or Tories.

Do you poll them before deciding on a tip?

I don't have to. They mouth off. I'm talking about black cab drivers - not Ubers.

EDIT: That's white black cab drivers!

all singing and dancing then

Casino_Royale

Sean_F said:

another_richard said:

Sean_F said:

SeanT said:

PS

The other strong impression I got from my Plymouth minicab epiphany was just how much Corbyn is perceived as another posh London politician, no different (i.e. no more or less posh or elitist) than anyone else in Westminster. He's seen as rich and deluded, with no clue how real people live. Like the rest: Labour or Tory

Clearly this is from people outside the Corbynista bubble, but that's where we need to look

Corbyn's weakness on defence and security issues was theoretical in 2017. Now, it's been shown to have some grounding in reality.

Bear in mind though, the Tories (pre Salisbury) have done a lot to trash their own reputation on defence and security.

But don't forget the UK is now an 'Aid Superpower'.

There's no point banging on about what a threat Corbyn is when you:-

1. Slash the armed forces,
2. Fund litigation against the armed forces,
3. Slash police numbers,
4. Prioritise overseas aid.

Hammond was probably the worst Defence Secretary ever.

I was ashamed of what the Conservatives did to Defence during the 2010 Parliament.

They should have frozen the Defence budget, got to grips with the £38bn funding hole, and then rebuilt it. Not slashed it.

Casino_Royale

Sean_F said:

SeanT said:

PS

The other strong impression I got from my Plymouth minicab epiphany was just how much Corbyn is perceived as another posh London politician, no different (i.e. no more or less posh or elitist) than anyone else in Westminster. He's seen as rich and deluded, with no clue how real people live. Like the rest: Labour or Tory

Clearly this is from people outside the Corbynista bubble, but that's where we need to look

Corbyn's weakness on defence and security issues was theoretical in 2017. Now, it's been shown to have some grounding in reality.

Bear in mind though, the Tories (pre Salisbury) have done a lot to trash their own reputation on defence and security.

Be that as it may, Corbyn would be actively dangerous to our safety as PM.

He'd naively fail to act on security threats and warnings, and ideologically slash anything "expeditionary" about our armed forces (i.e. most of it) he could get away with.

Sean_F

Sean_F said:

Foxy said:

AndyJS said:

SeanT said:

PS

The other strong impression I got from my Plymouth minicab epiphany was just how much Corbyn is perceived as another posh London politician, no different (i.e. no more or less posh or elitist) than anyone else in Westminster. He's seen as rich and deluded, with no clue how real people live. Like the rest: Labour or Tory

Clearly this is from people outside the Corbynista bubble, but that's where we need to look

Corbyn seemed to go down particularly well in Cornwall though, with Labour almost winning seats like Truro & Falmouth where they usually come third or fourth.

Indeed Labour took Plymouth Sutton and Devenport last year despite @SeanT predicting that Corbyn would be destroyed because of his IRA and Islamist sympathies. I believe the seat is long in Navy tradition.

So I think @SeanT is once again speaking out his arse.

Johnny Mercer's seat is actually the successor to the historic Devonport Costituency, and he did very well. The divergence in the results in Plymouth was startling.

Following on, Labour led by 30% in Devonport in 2001, but were 11% behind in Moor View in 2017 (on similar boundaries) a huge turnaround. Overall, the South West has been excellent for the Tories in recent years.

Foxy

SeanT said:

Foxy said:

AndyJS said:

SeanT said:

PS

The other strong impression I got from my Plymouth minicab epiphany was just how much Corbyn is perceived as another posh London politician, no different (i.e. no more or less posh or elitist) than anyone else in Westminster. He's seen as rich and deluded, with no clue how real people live. Like the rest: Labour or Tory

Clearly this is from people outside the Corbynista bubble, but that's where we need to look

Corbyn seemed to go down particularly well in Cornwall though, with Labour almost winning seats like Truro & Falmouth where they usually come third or fourth.

Indeed Labour took Plymouth Sutton and Devenport last year despite @SeanT predicting that Corbyn would be destroyed because of his IRA and Islamist sympathies. I believe the seat is long in Navy tradition.

So I think @SeanT is once again speaking out his arse.

Then you will be up for a bet? The point of the site?

My £100 says that IF Labour are led by Corbyn in the next GE, then they will LOSE votes and seats, compared to the last election.

Deal?

No, not for me. The next election is too far into an uncertain post Brexit future to be determined by whether Jezza retains his followers.

Casino_Royale

SeanT said:

Elliot said:

Foxy said:

Nice gains for LDs and Greens.

I don't say this lightly buy I had a drink with some Labour supporters last night and there was definitely a change among them. One of them said he had suddenly had the realisation that maybe Corbyn was just an idiot and therefore not fit to be Prime Minister.

MASSIVE ANECDOTE ALERT

I got a ride from a woman Plymouth minicab driver yesterday. She was finishing her box of fish and chips as she collected me at my hotel. She was in a talkative mood and wanted to talk politics following a news story on the radio. From her accent I'd say she was Plymouth working class.

I can't imagine a more perfectly swingy swing voter than a female working class Plymouth minicab driver.

Her verdict? And I swear this is true. Even if it sounds like Roger.

"That Corbyn, he's an idiot, isn't he? And a liar. This tuition fees stuff, where's the money coming from? Who's gonna pay for it?"

Then she volunteered the idea:

"Theresa May. She's doing alright. She's OK. She's the only one I like."

I didn't venture a single opinion apart from the usual bland "I don't trust any of them".

(to be honest I wasn't in the mood for a long debate)

If this tiny anecdote has any weight, then Corbyn is heading for a massive defeat, disguised by protest polling. Put it another way: if working class working women in Plymouth despise him, he is fucked.

And Theresa May might have more support (albeit stunted and grudging) than we have imagined.

Such voters are the core of Theresa's new support, IMHO.

another_richard

Sean_F said:

Foxy said:

AndyJS said:

SeanT said:

PS

The other strong impression I got from my Plymouth minicab epiphany was just how much Corbyn is perceived as another posh London politician, no different (i.e. no more or less posh or elitist) than anyone else in Westminster. He's seen as rich and deluded, with no clue how real people live. Like the rest: Labour or Tory

Clearly this is from people outside the Corbynista bubble, but that's where we need to look

Corbyn seemed to go down particularly well in Cornwall though, with Labour almost winning seats like Truro & Falmouth where they usually come third or fourth.

Indeed Labour took Plymouth Sutton and Devenport last year despite @SeanT predicting that Corbyn would be destroyed because of his IRA and Islamist sympathies. I believe the seat is long in Navy tradition.

So I think @SeanT is once again speaking out his arse.

Johnny Mercer's seat is actually the successor to the historic Devonport Costituency, and he did very well. The divergence in the results in Plymouth was startling.

Likewise in Southampton.

FrancisUrquhart

SeanT said:

FrancisUrquhart said:

SeanT said:

Foxy said:

SeanT said:

Elliot said:

Foxy said:

Nice gains for LDs and Greens.

I don't say this lightly buy I had a drink with some Labour supporters last night and there was definitely a change among them. One of them said he had suddenly had the realisation that maybe Corbyn was just an idiot and therefore not fit to be Prime Minister.

MASSIVE ANECDOTE ALERT

I got a ride from a woman Plymouth minicab driver yesterday. She was finishing her box of fish and chips as she collected me at my hotel. She was in a talkative mood and wanted to talk politics following a news story on the radio. From her accent I'd say she was Plymouth working class.

I can't imagine a more perfectly swingy swing voter than a female working class Plymouth minicab driver.

Her verdict? And I swear this is true. Even if it sounds like Roger.

"That Corbyn, he's an idiot, isn't he? And a liar. This tuition fees stuff, where's the money coming from? Who's gonna pay for it?"

Then she volunteered the idea:

"Theresa May. She's doing alright. She's OK. She's the only one I like."

I didn't venture a single opinion apart from the usual bland "I don't trust any of them".

(to be honest I wasn't in the mood for a long debate)

If this tiny anecdote has any weight, then Corbyn is heading for a massive defeat, disguised by protest polling. Put it another way: if working class working women in Plymouth despise him, he is fucked.

And Theresa May might have more support (albeit stunted and grudging) than we have imagined.

We heard lot reached the surface.

Sure, I did say this was a ridiculous generalisation from one single encounter. I'm probably wrong.

But sometimes I get it really right (I remember being alone here in predicting the SNP resurgence after a NO indy-vote) and I am sensing a swing against Corbyn,

Part of his problem is simply that he has so long to go, until he has another chance. He's already seen as a bit boring, weird, treacherous and derelict, the idea he will carry any of his Corbynista "enthusiasm" to 2022 is borderline nuts.

Don't under estimate the cult. A lot of people seem to have hung their hopes and dreams on the cult of corbyn, regardless of the truth eg that polling showing leavers thinking he was for leave and remainers thinking he was for remain.

Nah it's a cult, and dwindling already.

I am not so not confident. There are a hell of a lot of unhappy / dissatisfied with their lot and the Tories are offering basically nothing and do a very poor job of countering the narrative that capitalism is evil, enslaved the masses and real socialism is the solution.

another_richard

Casino_Royale said:

Sean_F said:

another_richard said:

Sean_F said:

SeanT said:

PS

The other strong impression I got from my Plymouth minicab epiphany was just how much Corbyn is perceived as another posh London politician, no different (i.e. no more or less posh or elitist) than anyone else in Westminster. He's seen as rich and deluded, with no clue how real people live. Like the rest: Labour or Tory

Clearly this is from people outside the Corbynista bubble, but that's where we need to look

Corbyn's weakness on defence and security issues was theoretical in 2017. Now, it's been shown to have some grounding in reality.

Bear in mind though, the Tories (pre Salisbury) have done a lot to trash their own reputation on defence and security.

But don't forget the UK is now an 'Aid Superpower'.

There's no point banging on about what a threat Corbyn is when you:-

1. Slash the armed forces,
2. Fund litigation against the armed forces,
3. Slash police numbers,
4. Prioritise overseas aid.

Hammond was probably the worst Defence Secretary ever.

I was ashamed of what the Conservatives did to Defence during the 2010 Parliament.

They should have frozen the Defence budget, got to grips with the £38bn funding hole, and then rebuilt it. Not slashed it.

Many PB Tories went very quiet on defence issues after May 2010.

Casino_Royale

another_richard said:

Casino_Royale said:

Sean_F said:

another_richard said:

Sean_F said:

SeanT said:

PS

The other strong impression I got from my Plymouth minicab epiphany was just how much Corbyn is perceived as another posh London politician, no different (i.e. no more or less posh or elitist) than anyone else in Westminster. He's seen as rich and deluded, with no clue how real people live. Like the rest: Labour or Tory

Clearly this is from people outside the Corbynista bubble, but that's where we need to look

Corbyn's weakness on defence and security issues was theoretical in 2017. Now, it's been shown to have some grounding in reality.

Bear in mind though, the Tories (pre Salisbury) have done a lot to trash their own reputation on defence and security.

But don't forget the UK is now an 'Aid Superpower'.

There's no point banging on about what a threat Corbyn is when you:-

1. Slash the armed forces,
2. Fund litigation against the armed forces,
3. Slash police numbers,
4. Prioritise overseas aid.

Hammond was probably the worst Defence Secretary ever.

I was ashamed of what the Conservatives did to Defence during the 2010 Parliament.

They should have frozen the Defence budget, got to grips with the £38bn funding hole, and then rebuilt it. Not slashed it.

Many PB Tories went very quiet on defence issues after May 2010.

I resigned my membership, and didn't rejoin until 2015.

Toms

It gives me a little thrill to hear that the Skripals and the cop that went to help them are recovering. Ever nosy I am curious to know how they were treated. I wonder whether poisoner assassins are ever hoist by their own petards, possibly with complicated after effects.

Yorkcity

Casino_Royale said:

SeanT said:

Elliot said:

Foxy said:

Nice gains for LDs and Greens.

I don't say this lightly buy I had a drink with some Labour supporters last night and there was definitely a change among them. One of them said he had suddenly had the realisation that maybe Corbyn was just an idiot and therefore not fit to be Prime Minister.

MASSIVE ANECDOTE ALERT

I got a ride from a woman Plymouth minicab driver yesterday. She was finishing her box of fish and chips as she collected me at my hotel. She was in a talkative mood and wanted to talk politics following a news story on the radio. From her accent I'd say she was Plymouth working class.

I can't imagine a more perfectly swingy swing voter than a female working class Plymouth minicab driver.

Her verdict? And I swear this is true. Even if it sounds like Roger.

"That Corbyn, he's an idiot, isn't he? And a liar. This tuition fees stuff, where's the money coming from? Who's gonna pay for it?"

Then she volunteered the idea:

"Theresa May. She's doing alright. She's OK. She's the only one I like."

I didn't venture a single opinion apart from the usual bland "I don't trust any of them".

(to be honest I wasn't in the mood for a long debate)

If this tiny anecdote has any weight, then Corbyn is heading for a massive defeat, disguised by protest polling. Put it another way: if working class working women in Plymouth despise him, he is fucked.

And Theresa May might have more support (albeit stunted and grudging) than we have imagined.

Such voters are the core of Theresa's new support, IMHO.

Boring twats.

Big_G_NorthWales

Foxy said:

SeanT said:

Foxy said:

AndyJS said:

SeanT said:

PS

The other strong impression I got from my Plymouth minicab epiphany was just how much Corbyn is perceived as another posh London politician, no different (i.e. no more or less posh or elitist) than anyone else in Westminster. He's seen as rich and deluded, with no clue how real people live. Like the rest: Labour or Tory

Clearly this is from people outside the Corbynista bubble, but that's where we need to look

Corbyn seemed to go down particularly well in Cornwall though, with Labour almost winning seats like Truro & Falmouth where they usually come third or fourth.

Indeed Labour took Plymouth Sutton and Devenport last year despite @SeanT predicting that Corbyn would be destroyed because of his IRA and Islamist sympathies. I believe the seat is long in Navy tradition.

So I think @SeanT is once again speaking out his arse.

Then you will be up for a bet? The point of the site?

My £100 says that IF Labour are led by Corbyn in the next GE, then they will LOSE votes and seats, compared to the last election.

Deal?

No, not for me. The next election is too far into an uncertain post Brexit future to be determined by whether Jezza retains his followers.

Not even £100 on Jeremy - vote of no confidence in him then

nielh

SeanT said:

FrancisUrquhart said:

SeanT said:

Foxy said:

SeanT said:

Elliot said:

Foxy said:

Nice gains for LDs and Greens.

I don't say this lightly buy I had a drink with some Labour supporters last night and there was definitely a change among them. One of them said he had suddenly had the realisation that maybe Corbyn was just an idiot and therefore not fit to be Prime Minister.

edit
And Theresa May might have more support (albeit stunted and grudging) than we have imagined.

We heard lot reached the surface.

Sure, I did say this was a ridiculous generalisation from one single encounter. I'm probably wrong.

But sometimes I get it really right (I remember being alone here in predicting the SNP resurgence after a NO indy-vote) and I am sensing a swing against Corbyn,

Part of his problem is simply that he has so long to go, until he has another chance. He's already seen as a bit boring, weird, treacherous and derelict, the idea he will carry any of his Corbynista "enthusiasm" to 2022 is borderline nuts.

Don't under estimate the cult. A lot of people seem to have hung their hopes and dreams on the cult of corbyn, regardless of the truth eg that polling showing leavers thinking he was for leave and remainers thinking he was for remain.

Nah it's a cult, and dwindling already.

I'm not sure this matters though. The point is that Corbyn is there. He is the alternative. It doesn't matter how many screw ups he makes. All that needs to happen is something goes wrong the for the tories (like the 2017 election campaign) and he is there to take advantage of it. So it can still all work out for him.

williamglenn

Foxy said:

SeanT said:

Elliot said:

Foxy said:

Nice gains for LDs and Greens.

I don't say this lightly buy I had a drink with some Labour supporters last night and there was definitely a change among them. One of them said he had suddenly had the realisation that maybe Corbyn was just an idiot and therefore not fit to be Prime Minister.

MASSIVE ANECDOTE ALERT

I got a ride from a woman Plymouth minicab driver yesterday. She was finishing her box of fish and chips as she collected me at my hotel. She was in a talkative mood and wanted to talk politics following a news story on the radio. From her accent I'd say she was Plymouth working class.

I can't imagine a more perfectly swingy swing voter than a female working class Plymouth minicab driver.

Her verdict? And I swear this is true. Even if it sounds like Roger.

"That Corbyn, he's an idiot, isn't he? And a liar. This tuition fees stuff, where's the money coming from? Who's gonna pay for it?"

Then she volunteered the idea:

"Theresa May. She's doing alright. She's OK. She's the only one I like."

I didn't venture a single opinion apart from the usual bland "I don't trust any of them".

(to be honest I wasn't in the mood for a long debate)

If this tiny anecdote has any weight, then Corbyn is heading for a massive defeat, disguised by protest polling. Put it another way: if working class working women in Plymouth despise him, he is fucked.

And Theresa May might have more support (albeit stunted and grudging) than we have imagined.

We heard lots of that sort of guff a year ago. What happened next?

The difference is that May has now had ample chance to prove herself as a flinty, 'bloody difficult woman' who won't be kept down, and people are more willing to give her a break.

nielh

another_richard said:

Casino_Royale said:

Sean_F said:

another_richard said:

Sean_F said:

SeanT said:

PS

The other strong impression I got from my Plymouth minicab epiphany was just how much Corbyn is perceived as another posh London politician, no different (i.e. no more or less posh or elitist) than anyone else in Westminster. He's seen as rich and deluded, with no clue how real people live. Like the rest: Labour or Tory

Clearly this is from people outside the Corbynista bubble, but that's where we need to look

Corbyn's weakness on defence and security issues was theoretical in 2017. Now, it's been shown to have some grounding in reality.

Bear in mind though, the Tories (pre Salisbury) have done a lot to trash their own reputation on defence and security.

But don't forget the UK is now an 'Aid Superpower'.

There's no point banging on about what a threat Corbyn is when you:-

1. Slash the armed forces,
2. Fund litigation against the armed forces,
3. Slash police numbers,
4. Prioritise overseas aid.

Hammond was probably the worst Defence Secretary ever.

I was ashamed of what the Conservatives did to Defence during the 2010 Parliament.

They should have frozen the Defence budget, got to grips with the £38bn funding hole, and then rebuilt it. Not slashed it.

Many PB Tories went very quiet on defence issues after May 2010.

Anyone one remember the attempt to privatise defence procurement? What happened to that bright idea?

Sean_F

Casino_Royale said:

Sean_F said:

another_richard said:

Sean_F said:

SeanT said:

PS

The other strong impression I got from my Plymouth minicab epiphany was just how much Corbyn is perceived as another posh London politician, no different (i.e. no more or less posh or elitist) than anyone else in Westminster. He's seen as rich and deluded, with no clue how real people live. Like the rest: Labour or Tory

Clearly this is from people outside the Corbynista bubble, but that's where we need to look

Corbyn's weakness on defence and security issues was theoretical in 2017. Now, it's been shown to have some grounding in reality.

Bear in mind though, the Tories (pre Salisbury) have done a lot to trash their own reputation on defence and security.

But don't forget the UK is now an 'Aid Superpower'.

There's no point banging on about what a threat Corbyn is when you:-

1. Slash the armed forces,
2. Fund litigation against the armed forces,
3. Slash police numbers,
4. Prioritise overseas aid.

Hammond was probably the worst Defence Secretary ever.

I was ashamed of what the Conservatives did to Defence during the 2010 Parliament.

They should have frozen the Defence budget, got to grips with the £38bn funding hole, and then rebuilt it. Not slashed it.

Hammond went out of his way to cause maximum damage, even allowing for cuts in funding.

Big_G_NorthWales

Yorkcity said:

Casino_Royale said:

SeanT said:

Elliot said:

Foxy said:

Nice gains for LDs and Greens.

I don't say this lightly buy I had a drink with some Labour supporters last night and there was definitely a change among them. One of them said he had suddenly had the realisation that maybe Corbyn was just an idiot and therefore not fit to be Prime Minister.

MASSIVE ANECDOTE ALERT

I got a ride from a woman Plymouth minicab driver yesterday. She was finishing her box of fish and chips as she collected me at my hotel. She was in a talkative mood and wanted to talk politics following a news story on the radio. From her accent I'd say she was Plymouth working class.

I can't imagine a more perfectly swingy swing voter than a female working class Plymouth minicab driver.

Her verdict? And I swear this is true. Even if it sounds like Roger.

"That Corbyn, he's an idiot, isn't he? And a liar. This tuition fees stuff, where's the money coming from? Who's gonna pay for it?"

Then she volunteered the idea:

"Theresa May. She's doing alright. She's OK. She's the only one I like."

I didn't venture a single opinion apart from the usual bland "I don't trust any of them".

(to be honest I wasn't in the mood for a long debate)

If this tiny anecdote has any weight, then Corbyn is heading for a massive defeat, disguised by protest polling. Put it another way: if working class working women in Plymouth despise him, he is fucked.

And Theresa May might have more support (albeit stunted and grudging) than we have imagined.

Such voters are the core of Theresa's new support, IMHO.

Boring twats.

Not like you to use that kind of language

Big_G_NorthWales

Toms said:

It gives me a little thrill to hear that the Skripals and the cop that went to help them are recovering. Ever nosy I am curious to know how they were treated. I wonder whether poisoner assassins are ever hoist by their own petards, possibly with complicated after effects.

There have been several good articles on the treatment of nerve agents and apparently our ambulances carry some of the medication. Also details on possible long term effects but I am not sure where I read them but the Guardian is quite good

Foxy

Big_G_NorthWales said:

Foxy said:

SeanT said:

Foxy said:

AndyJS said:

SeanT said:

PS

The other strong impression I got from my Plymouth minicab epiphany was just how much Corbyn is perceived as another posh London politician, no different (i.e. no more or less posh or elitist) than anyone else in Westminster. He's seen as rich and deluded, with no clue how real people live. Like the rest: Labour or Tory

Clearly this is from people outside the Corbynista bubble, but that's where we need to look

Corbyn seemed to go down particularly well in Cornwall though, with Labour almost winning seats like Truro & Falmouth where they usually come third or fourth.

Indeed Labour took Plymouth Sutton and Devenport last year despite @SeanT predicting that Corbyn would be destroyed because of his IRA and Islamist sympathies. I believe the seat is long in Navy tradition.

So I think @SeanT is once again speaking out his arse.

Then you will be up for a bet? The point of the site?

My £100 says that IF Labour are led by Corbyn in the next GE, then they will LOSE votes and seats, compared to the last election.

Deal?

No, not for me. The next election is too far into an uncertain post Brexit future to be determined by whether Jezza retains his followers.

Not even £100 on Jeremy - vote of no confidence in him then

Nope, just that I prefer to keep bets a bit more contemporaneous. I have cashed out on my next leaders markets too, as I cannot see any change in the offing, keeping only a few low stakes long shots.

Sean_F

nielh said:

SeanT said:

FrancisUrquhart said:

SeanT said:

Foxy said:

SeanT said:

Elliot said:

Foxy said:

Nice gains for LDs and Greens.

I don't say this lightly buy I had a drink with some Labour supporters last night and there was definitely a change among them. One of them said he had suddenly had the realisation that maybe Corbyn was just an idiot and therefore not fit to be Prime Minister.

edit
And Theresa May might have more support (albeit stunted and grudging) than we have imagined.

We heard lot reached the surface.

Sure, I did say this was a ridiculous generalisation from one single encounter. I'm probably wrong.

But sometimes I get it really right (I remember being alone here in predicting the SNP resurgence after a NO indy-vote) and I am sensing a swing against Corbyn,

Part of his problem is simply that he has so long to go, until he has another chance. He's already seen as a bit boring, weird, treacherous and derelict, the idea he will carry any of his Corbynista "enthusiasm" to 2022 is borderline nuts.

Don't under estimate the cult. A lot of people seem to have hung their hopes and dreams on the cult of corbyn, regardless of the truth eg that polling showing leavers thinking he was for leave and remainers thinking he was for remain.

Nah it's a cult, and dwindling already.

I'm not sure this matters though. The point is that Corbyn is there. He is the alternative. It doesn't matter how many screw ups he makes. All that needs to happen is something goes wrong the for the tories (like the 2017 election campaign) and he is there to take advantage of it. So it can still all work out for him.

He's the alternative, but the gloss is wearing off.

Big_G_NorthWales

williamglenn said:

Foxy said:

SeanT said:

Elliot said:

Foxy said:

Nice gains for LDs and Greens.

I don't say this lightly buy I had a drink with some Labour supporters last night and there was definitely a change among them. One of them said he had suddenly had the realisation that maybe Corbyn was just an idiot and therefore not fit to be Prime Minister.

MASSIVE ANECDOTE ALERT

I got a ride from a woman Plymouth minicab driver yesterday. She was finishing her box of fish and chips as she collected me at my hotel. She was in a talkative mood and wanted to talk politics following a news story on the radio. From her accent I'd say she was Plymouth working class.

I can't imagine a more perfectly swingy swing voter than a female working class Plymouth minicab driver.

Her verdict? And I swear this is true. Even if it sounds like Roger.

"That Corbyn, he's an idiot, isn't he? And a liar. This tuition fees stuff, where's the money coming from? Who's gonna pay for it?"

Then she volunteered the idea:

"Theresa May. She's doing alright. She's OK. She's the only one I like."

I didn't venture a single opinion apart from the usual bland "I don't trust any of them".

(to be honest I wasn't in the mood for a long debate)

If this tiny anecdote has any weight, then Corbyn is heading for a massive defeat, disguised by protest polling. Put it another way: if working class working women in Plymouth despise him, he is fucked.

And Theresa May might have more support (albeit stunted and grudging) than we have imagined.

We heard lots of that sort of guff a year ago. What happened next?

The difference is that May has now had ample chance to prove herself as a flinty, 'bloody difficult woman' who won't be kept down, and people are more willing to give her a break.

And a softer Brexit maybe

Yorkcity

Big_G_NorthWales said:

Yorkcity said:

Casino_Royale said:

SeanT said:

Elliot said:

Foxy said:

Nice gains for LDs and Greens.

I don't say this lightly buy I had a drink with some Labour supporters last night and there was definitely a change among them. One of them said he had suddenly had the realisation that maybe Corbyn was just an idiot and therefore not fit to be Prime Minister.

MASSIVE ANECDOTE ALERT

I got a ride from a woman Plymouth minicab driver yesterday. She was finishing her box of fish and chips as she collected me at my hotel. She was in a talkative mood and wanted to talk politics following a news story on the radio. From her accent I'd say she was Plymouth working class.

I can't imagine a more perfectly swingy swing voter than a female working class Plymouth minicab driver.

Her verdict? And I swear this is true. Even if it sounds like Roger.

"That Corbyn, he's an idiot, isn't he? And a liar. This tuition fees stuff, where's the money coming from? Who's gonna pay for it?"

Then she volunteered the idea:

"Theresa May. She's doing alright. She's OK. She's the only one I like."

I didn't venture a single opinion apart from the usual bland "I don't trust any of them".

(to be honest I wasn't in the mood for a long debate)

If this tiny anecdote has any weight, then Corbyn is heading for a massive defeat, disguised by protest polling. Put it another way: if working class working women in Plymouth despise him, he is fucked.

And Theresa May might have more support (albeit stunted and grudging) than we have imagined.

Such voters are the core of Theresa's new support, IMHO.

Boring twats.

Not like you to use that kind of language

True , May is the sensible choice , but Corbyn made politics interesting for many.Wether you like him or hate him.There was a buzz at the last election.Great to see people engaged again.

Foxy

williamglenn said:

Foxy said:

SeanT said:

Elliot said:

Foxy said:

Nice gains for LDs and Greens.

I don't say this lightly buy I had a drink with some Labour supporters last night and there was definitely a change among them. One of them said he had suddenly had the realisation that maybe Corbyn was just an idiot and therefore not fit to be Prime Minister.

MASSIVE ANECDOTE ALERT

I got a ride from a woman Plymouth minicab driver yesterday. She was finishing her box of fish and chips as she collected me at my hotel. She was in a talkative mood and wanted to talk politics following a news story on the radio. From her accent I'd say she was Plymouth working class.

I can't imagine a more perfectly swingy swing voter than a female working class Plymouth minicab driver.

Her verdict? And I swear this is true. Even if it sounds like Roger.

"That Corbyn, he's an idiot, isn't he? And a liar. This tuition fees stuff, where's the money coming from? Who's gonna pay for it?"

Then she volunteered the idea:

"Theresa May. She's doing alright. She's OK. She's the only one I like."

I didn't venture a single opinion apart from the usual bland "I don't trust any of them".

(to be honest I wasn't in the mood for a long debate)

If this tiny anecdote has any weight, then Corbyn is heading for a massive defeat, disguised by protest polling. Put it another way: if working class working women in Plymouth despise him, he is fucked.

And Theresa May might have more support (albeit stunted and grudging) than we have imagined.

We heard lots of that sort of guff a year ago. What happened next?

The difference is that May has now had ample chance to prove herself as a flinty, 'bloody difficult woman' who won't be kept down, and people are more willing to give her a break.

Tongue in cheek? It hasn't been too bloody difficult to sign up to Barniers first round and transition deals.

Big_G_NorthWales

Foxy said:

Big_G_NorthWales said:

Foxy said:

SeanT said:

Foxy said:

AndyJS said:

SeanT said:

PS

The other strong impression I got from my Plymouth minicab epiphany was just how much Corbyn is perceived as another posh London politician, no different (i.e. no more or less posh or elitist) than anyone else in Westminster. He's seen as rich and deluded, with no clue how real people live. Like the rest: Labour or Tory

Clearly this is from people outside the Corbynista bubble, but that's where we need to look

Corbyn seemed to go down particularly well in Cornwall though, with Labour almost winning seats like Truro & Falmouth where they usually come third or fourth.

Indeed Labour took Plymouth Sutton and Devenport last year despite @SeanT predicting that Corbyn would be destroyed because of his IRA and Islamist sympathies. I believe the seat is long in Navy tradition.

So I think @SeanT is once again speaking out his arse.

Then you will be up for a bet? The point of the site?

My £100 says that IF Labour are led by Corbyn in the next GE, then they will LOSE votes and seats, compared to the last election.

Deal?

No, not for me. The next election is too far into an uncertain post Brexit future to be determined by whether Jezza retains his followers.

Not even £100 on Jeremy - vote of no confidence in him then

Nope, just that I prefer to keep bets a bit more contemporaneous. I have cashed out on my next leaders markets too, as I cannot see any change in the offing, keeping only a few low stakes long shots.

I saw an opportunity to tease you !!!

williamglenn

Big_G_NorthWales said:

williamglenn said:

Foxy said:

SeanT said:

Elliot said:

Foxy said:

Nice gains for LDs and Greens.

I don't say this lightly buy I had a drink with some Labour supporters last night and there was definitely a change among them. One of them said he had suddenly had the realisation that maybe Corbyn was just an idiot and therefore not fit to be Prime Minister.

MASSIVE ANECDOTE ALERT

I got a ride from a woman Plymouth minicab driver yesterday. She was finishing her box of fish and chips as she collected me at my hotel. She was in a talkative mood and wanted to talk politics following a news story on the radio. From her accent I'd say she was Plymouth working class.

I can't imagine a more perfectly swingy swing voter than a female working class Plymouth minicab driver.

Her verdict? And I swear this is true. Even if it sounds like Roger.

"That Corbyn, he's an idiot, isn't he? And a liar. This tuition fees stuff, where's the money coming from? Who's gonna pay for it?"

Then she volunteered the idea:

"Theresa May. She's doing alright. She's OK. She's the only one I like."

I didn't venture a single opinion apart from the usual bland "I don't trust any of them".

(to be honest I wasn't in the mood for a long debate)

If this tiny anecdote has any weight, then Corbyn is heading for a massive defeat, disguised by protest polling. Put it another way: if working class working women in Plymouth despise him, he is fucked.

And Theresa May might have more support (albeit stunted and grudging) than we have imagined.

We heard lots of that sort of guff a year ago. What happened next?

The difference is that May has now had ample chance to prove herself as a flinty, 'bloody difficult woman' who won't be kept down, and people are more willing to give her a break.

And a softer Brexit maybe

The real coup de grace for Corbyn would be a second referendum. It would be politically catastrophic for him.

Big_G_NorthWales

Yorkcity said:

Big_G_NorthWales said:

Yorkcity said:

Casino_Royale said:

SeanT said:

Elliot said:

Foxy said:

Nice gains for LDs and Greens.

I don't say this lightly buy I had a drink with some Labour supporters last night and there was definitely a change among them. One of them said he had suddenly had the realisation that maybe Corbyn was just an idiot and therefore not fit to be Prime Minister.

MASSIVE ANECDOTE ALERT

I got a ride from a woman Plymouth minicab driver yesterday. She was finishing her box of fish and chips as she collected me at my hotel. She was in a talkative mood and wanted to talk politics following a news story on the radio. From her accent I'd say she was Plymouth working class.

I can't imagine a more perfectly swingy swing voter than a female working class Plymouth minicab driver.

Her verdict? And I swear this is true. Even if it sounds like Roger.

"That Corbyn, he's an idiot, isn't he? And a liar. This tuition fees stuff, where's the money coming from? Who's gonna pay for it?"

Then she volunteered the idea:

"Theresa May. She's doing alright. She's OK. She's the only one I like."

I didn't venture a single opinion apart from the usual bland "I don't trust any of them".

(to be honest I wasn't in the mood for a long debate)

If this tiny anecdote has any weight, then Corbyn is heading for a massive defeat, disguised by protest polling. Put it another way: if working class working women in Plymouth despise him, he is fucked.

And Theresa May might have more support (albeit stunted and grudging) than we have imagined.

Such voters are the core of Theresa's new support, IMHO.

Boring twats.

Not like you to use that kind of language

True , May is the sensible choice , but Corbyn made politics interesting for many.Wether you like him or hate him.There was a buzz at the last election.Great to see people engaged again.

I agree but he has not had a good 2018 so far

OchEye

Sean_F said:

Casino_Royale said:

Sean_F said:

another_richard said:

Sean_F said:

SeanT said:

PS

The other strong impression I got from my Plymouth minicab epiphany was just how much Corbyn is perceived as another posh London politician, no different (i.e. no more or less posh or elitist) than anyone else in Westminster. He's seen as rich and deluded, with no clue how real people live. Like the rest: Labour or Tory

Clearly this is from people outside the Corbynista bubble, but that's where we need to look

Corbyn's weakness on defence and security issues was theoretical in 2017. Now, it's been shown to have some grounding in reality.

Bear in mind though, the Tories (pre Salisbury) have done a lot to trash their own reputation on defence and security.

But don't forget the UK is now an 'Aid Superpower'.

There's no point banging on about what a threat Corbyn is when you:-

1. Slash the armed forces,
2. Fund litigation against the armed forces,
3. Slash police numbers,
4. Prioritise overseas aid.

Hammond was probably the worst Defence Secretary ever.

I was ashamed of what the Conservatives did to Defence during the 2010 Parliament.

They should have frozen the Defence budget, got to grips with the £38bn funding hole, and then rebuilt it. Not slashed it.

Hammond went out of his way to cause maximum damage, even allowing for cuts in funding.

And Fox screwed Defence by destroying the Harrier and Nimrod fleets, just after both had been upgraded at considerable expense His funeral in the Kremlin wall is guaranteed.....

Sean_F

OchEye said:

Sean_F said:

Casino_Royale said:

Sean_F said:

another_richard said:

Sean_F said:

SeanT said:

PS

The other strong impression I got from my Plymouth minicab epiphany was just how much Corbyn is perceived as another posh London politician, no different (i.e. no more or less posh or elitist) than anyone else in Westminster. He's seen as rich and deluded, with no clue how real people live. Like the rest: Labour or Tory

Clearly this is from people outside the Corbynista bubble, but that's where we need to look

Corbyn's weakness on defence and security issues was theoretical in 2017. Now, it's been shown to have some grounding in reality.

Bear in mind though, the Tories (pre Salisbury) have done a lot to trash their own reputation on defence and security.

But don't forget the UK is now an 'Aid Superpower'.

There's no point banging on about what a threat Corbyn is when you:-

1. Slash the armed forces,
2. Fund litigation against the armed forces,
3. Slash police numbers,
4. Prioritise overseas aid.

Hammond was probably the worst Defence Secretary ever.

I was ashamed of what the Conservatives did to Defence during the 2010 Parliament.

They should have frozen the Defence budget, got to grips with the £38bn funding hole, and then rebuilt it. Not slashed it.

Hammond went out of his way to cause maximum damage, even allowing for cuts in funding.

And Fox screwed Defence by destroying the Harrier and Nimrod fleets, just after both had been upgraded at considerable expense His funeral in the Kremlin wall is guaranteed.....

I'd forgotten Fox was Defence Secretary. Yes, he was awful too.

Andrew

SeanT said:

Personally I find her almost unbearably awkward. I am convinced she is ASD. But this is only a problem during election campaigns and if she is facing 72 year old Jeremy Corbyn, next time, she should be able to muddle through (and I presume she will have better media advisors).

Actually turning up would be an improvement. The election was like the time Scotland played in Estonia, and the Estonians got the start time wrong, so the match kicked off with only 11 men on the pitch ....

Not bothering to campaign is just about the biggest FU you can give to the electorate, who unsurprisingly were not impressed.

viewcode

Taxi drivers (not the black-cab ones and not Uber) have certain characteristics that inform their politics:

* they tend to be self employed, either entirely or getting trade from a local cab firm
* they have gigantic expenses. They maintain their own cars to council standards (they have to renew periodically) and that plate at the back costs. The insurance is large too.
* they work long non-office hours. 4pm to 2am or 10pm to 6am is not uncommon.
* they hate segregated lanes in which they cannot travel.
* when they take holidays, it tends to be atypical: six months in NZ or four days in Greece, not your two weeks on the 'reef
* they are disproportionately immigrants, and the older generation of Asians is gradually being displaced by eastern Europeans, at least dahn sarf england (dunno about the North and Celtic bits).
* they are mostly nice; you can get the full-on psycho nutter (has happened: is scary) but mostly they're OK.

Try not to talk politics with taxi drivers, it'll either annoy them or you. If you want to engage with them, ask them when they started their shift or say "nice cab: how long you had it?", but mostly conversation wanders. if they ask you how you are, make it brief and ask them back. Skoda Superbs are...well, superb. Mondeos OK but not great. If you can give the exact change for the fare then that is good. Try not to complain if they are a little late: at times of high demand they may have been first notified of your call when they were some way away and the journey time to you was long. Be firm when telling them to stop: some will travel an extra ten-twenty yards to add 20p to your fare and it annoys the arse out of me.

Casino_Royale

Sean_F said:

Casino_Royale said:

Sean_F said:

another_richard said:

Sean_F said:

SeanT said:

PS

The other strong impression I got from my Plymouth minicab epiphany was just how much Corbyn is perceived as another posh London politician, no different (i.e. no more or less posh or elitist) than anyone else in Westminster. He's seen as rich and deluded, with no clue how real people live. Like the rest: Labour or Tory

Clearly this is from people outside the Corbynista bubble, but that's where we need to look

Corbyn's weakness on defence and security issues was theoretical in 2017. Now, it's been shown to have some grounding in reality.

Bear in mind though, the Tories (pre Salisbury) have done a lot to trash their own reputation on defence and security.

But don't forget the UK is now an 'Aid Superpower'.

There's no point banging on about what a threat Corbyn is when you:-

1. Slash the armed forces,
2. Fund litigation against the armed forces,
3. Slash police numbers,
4. Prioritise overseas aid.

Hammond was probably the worst Defence Secretary ever.

I was ashamed of what the Conservatives did to Defence during the 2010 Parliament.

They should have frozen the Defence budget, got to grips with the £38bn funding hole, and then rebuilt it. Not slashed it.

Hammond went out of his way to cause maximum damage, even allowing for cuts in funding.

Osborne had few scruples too, even though I think he belatedly realised by 2015 that he’d gone too far.

JWisemann

Love the idea that Sean is calling the next election on the evidence of finding a single right wing cab driver. About as much of an open and shut case as the ludicrous and embarassing Salisbury nonsense.

Charles

Big_G_NorthWales said:

Barnesian said:

Big_G_NorthWales said:

Barnesian said:

SeanT said:

Elliot said:

Foxy said:

Nice gains for LDs and Greens.

I don't say this lightly buy I had a drink with some Labour supporters last night and there was definitely a change among them. One of them said he had suddenly had the realisation that maybe Corbyn was just an idiot and therefore not fit to be Prime Minister.

MASSIVE ANECDOTE ALERT

I got a ride from a woman Plymouth minicab driver yesterday. She was finishing her box of fish and chips as she collected me at my hotel. She was in a talkative mood and wanted to talk politics following a news story on the radio. From her accent I'd say she was Plymouth working class.

I can't imagine a more perfectly swingy swing voter than a female working class Plymouth minicab driver.

Her verdict? And I swear this is true. Even if it sounds like Roger.

"That Corbyn, he's an idiot, isn't he? And a liar. This tuition fees stuff, where's the money coming from? Who's gonna pay for it?"

Then she volunteered the idea:

"Theresa May. She's doing alright. She's OK. She's the only one I like."

I didn't venture a single opinion apart from the usual bland "I don't trust any of them".

(to be honest I wasn't in the mood for a long debate)

If this tiny anecdote has any weight, then Corbyn is heading for a massive defeat, disguised by protest polling. Put it another way: if working class working women in Plymouth despise him, he is fucked.

And Theresa May might have more support (albeit stunted and grudging) than we have imagined.

In my experience, all cab drivers are UKIP or Tories.

Denial maybe ?

I can honestly say I've never had a Labour supporting cab driver.

EDIT: Have you? Can you remember one? I bet you can remember UKIP ones.

To be honest I haven't used a taxi for years.

Mind you I will next month to take me from Euston to Paddington

Tube is far better for that trip

Casino_Royale

Sean_F said:

Casino_Royale said:

Sean_F said:

another_richard said:

Sean_F said:

SeanT said:

PS

The other strong impression I got from my Plymouth minicab epiphany was just how much Corbyn is perceived as another posh London politician, no different (i.e. no more or less posh or elitist) than anyone else in Westminster. He's seen as rich and deluded, with no clue how real people live. Like the rest: Labour or Tory

Clearly this is from people outside the Corbynista bubble, but that's where we need to look

Corbyn's weakness on defence and security issues was theoretical in 2017. Now, it's been shown to have some grounding in reality.

Bear in mind though, the Tories (pre Salisbury) have done a lot to trash their own reputation on defence and security.

But don't forget the UK is now an 'Aid Superpower'.

There's no point banging on about what a threat Corbyn is when you:-

1. Slash the armed forces,
2. Fund litigation against the armed forces,
3. Slash police numbers,
4. Prioritise overseas aid.

Hammond was probably the worst Defence Secretary ever.

I was ashamed of what the Conservatives did to Defence during the 2010 Parliament.

They should have frozen the Defence budget, got to grips with the £38bn funding hole, and then rebuilt it. Not slashed it.

Hammond went out of his way to cause maximum damage, even allowing for cuts in funding.

I don’t understand the appetite for him to be PM.

I think he’d be noteably worse than May. Tim Shipman’s book ‘Fallout’ brings out his flaws very well.

another_richard

OchEye said:

Sean_F said:

Casino_Royale said:

Sean_F said:

another_richard said:

Sean_F said:

SeanT said:

PS

The other strong impression I got from my Plymouth minicab epiphany was just how much Corbyn is perceived as another posh London politician, no different (i.e. no more or less posh or elitist) than anyone else in Westminster. He's seen as rich and deluded, with no clue how real people live. Like the rest: Labour or Tory

Clearly this is from people outside the Corbynista bubble, but that's where we need to look

Corbyn's weakness on defence and security issues was theoretical in 2017. Now, it's been shown to have some grounding in reality.

Bear in mind though, the Tories (pre Salisbury) have done a lot to trash their own reputation on defence and security.

But don't forget the UK is now an 'Aid Superpower'.

There's no point banging on about what a threat Corbyn is when you:-

1. Slash the armed forces,
2. Fund litigation against the armed forces,
3. Slash police numbers,
4. Prioritise overseas aid.

Hammond was probably the worst Defence Secretary ever.

I was ashamed of what the Conservatives did to Defence during the 2010 Parliament.

They should have frozen the Defence budget, got to grips with the £38bn funding hole, and then rebuilt it. Not slashed it.

Hammond went out of his way to cause maximum damage, even allowing for cuts in funding.

And Fox screwed Defence by destroying the Harrier and Nimrod fleets, just after both had been upgraded at considerable expense His funeral in the Kremlin wall is guaranteed.....

I never understood the point of actually destroying the planes.

Couldn't they have been stored in a hanger instead.

Casino_Royale

OchEye said:

Sean_F said:

Casino_Royale said:

Sean_F said:

another_richard said:

Sean_F said:

SeanT said:

PS

The other strong impression I got from my Plymouth minicab epiphany was just how much Corbyn is perceived as another posh London politician, no different (i.e. no more or less posh or elitist) than anyone else in Westminster. He's seen as rich and deluded, with no clue how real people live. Like the rest: Labour or Tory

Clearly this is from people outside the Corbynista bubble, but that's where we need to look

Corbyn's weakness on defence and security issues was theoretical in 2017. Now, it's been shown to have some grounding in reality.

Bear in mind though, the Tories (pre Salisbury) have done a lot to trash their own reputation on defence and security.

But don't forget the UK is now an 'Aid Superpower'.

There's no point banging on about what a threat Corbyn is when you:-

1. Slash the armed forces,
2. Fund litigation against the armed forces,
3. Slash police numbers,
4. Prioritise overseas aid.

Hammond was probably the worst Defence Secretary ever.

I was ashamed of what the Conservatives did to Defence during the 2010 Parliament.

They should have frozen the Defence budget, got to grips with the £38bn funding hole, and then rebuilt it. Not slashed it.

Hammond went out of his way to cause maximum damage, even allowing for cuts in funding.

And Fox screwed Defence by destroying the Harrier and Nimrod fleets, just after both had been upgraded at considerable expense His funeral in the Kremlin wall is guaranteed.....

I’m still angry about that, even today.

williamglenn

SeanT said:

Personally I find her almost unbearably awkward. I am convinced she is ASD.

Perhaps it's just an example of power-induced 'brain damage'.

https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2017/07/power-causes-brain-damage/528711/

The historian Henry Adams was being metaphorical, not medical, when he described power as “a sort of tumor that ends by killing the victim’s sympathies.” But that’s not far from where Dacher Keltner, a psychology professor at UC Berkeley, ended up after years of lab and field experiments. Subjects under the influence of power, he found in studies spanning two decades, acted as if they had suffered a traumatic brain injury—becoming more impulsive, less risk-aware, and, crucially, less adept at seeing things from other people’s point of view.

Tykejohnno

SeanT said:

Sean_F said:

OchEye said:

Sean_F said:

Casino_Royale said:

Sean_F said:

another_richard said:

Sean_F said:

SeanT said:

PS

The other strong impression I got from my Plymouth minicab epiphany was just how much Corbyn is perceived as another posh London politician, no different (i.e. no more or less posh or elitist) than anyone else in Westminster. He's seen as rich and deluded, with no clue how real people live. Like the rest: Labour or Tory

Clearly this is from people outside the Corbynista bubble, but that's where we need to look

Corbyn's weakness on defence and security issues was theoretical in 2017. Now, it's been shown to have some grounding in reality.

Bear in mind though, the Tories (pre Salisbury) have done a lot to trash their own reputation on defence and security.

But don't forget the UK is now an 'Aid Superpower'.

There's no point banging on about what a threat Corbyn is when you:-

1. Slash the armed forces,
2. Fund litigation against the armed forces,
3. Slash police numbers,
4. Prioritise overseas aid.

Hammond was probably the worst Defence Secretary ever.

I was ashamed of what the Conservatives did to Defence during the 2010 Parliament.

They should have frozen the Defence budget, got to grips with the £38bn funding hole, and then rebuilt it. Not slashed it.

Hammond went out of his way to cause maximum damage, even allowing for cuts in funding.

And Fox screwed Defence by destroying the Harrier and Nimrod fleets, just after both had been upgraded at considerable expense His funeral in the Kremlin wall is guaranteed.....

I'd forgotten Fox was Defence Secretary. Yes, he was awful too.

Liam Fox is a total idiot.

The police numbers cuts keep coming back on the tories and especially Theresa May the former home secretary who implemented the cuts.

Just look at the last GE,the Manchester bombing.I think this did hurt the tories with labour promising more police and the cons getting hammered over the cuts.

It will hurt the tories even more if Theresa is still the leader going into the next GE with the murders and crime rising.

The tories need police numbers up.

another_richard

The failure to do this before the election cost the Conservatives their majority.

' Former students will be able to earn more before they have to start paying back their tuition fee loans.

English and Welsh students who took out loans from September 2012 onwards - when fees in England rose to up to £9,000 a year - will now start to pay back when they earn £25,000 a year instead of £21,000. '

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/education-43629399

Big_G_NorthWales

Charles said:

Big_G_NorthWales said:

Barnesian said:

Big_G_NorthWales said:

Barnesian said:

SeanT said:

Elliot said:

Foxy said:

Nice gains for LDs and Greens.

I don't say this lightly buy I had a drink with some Labour supporters last night and there was definitely a change among them. One of them said he had suddenly had the realisation that maybe Corbyn was just an idiot and therefore not fit to be Prime Minister.

MASSIVE ANECDOTE ALERT

I got a ride from a woman Plymouth minicab driver yesterday. She was finishing her box of fish and chips as she collected me at my hotel. She was in a talkative mood and wanted to talk politics following a news story on the radio. From her accent I'd say she was Plymouth working class.

I can't imagine a more perfectly swingy swing voter than a female working class Plymouth minicab driver.

Her verdict? And I swear this is true. Even if it sounds like Roger.

"That Corbyn, he's an idiot, isn't he? And a liar. This tuition fees stuff, where's the money coming from? Who's gonna pay for it?"

Then she volunteered the idea:

"Theresa May. She's doing alright. She's OK. She's the only one I like."

I didn't venture a single opinion apart from the usual bland "I don't trust any of them".

(to be honest I wasn't in the mood for a long debate)

If this tiny anecdote has any weight, then Corbyn is heading for a massive defeat, disguised by protest polling. Put it another way: if working class working women in Plymouth despise him, he is fucked.

And Theresa May might have more support (albeit stunted and grudging) than we have imagined.

In my experience, all cab drivers are UKIP or Tories.

Denial maybe ?

I can honestly say I've never had a Labour supporting cab driver.

EDIT: Have you? Can you remember one? I bet you can remember UKIP ones.

To be honest I haven't used a taxi for years.

Mind you I will next month to take me from Euston to Paddington

Tube is far better for that trip

Not with our cruise luggage but thanks for the suggestion

Rhubarb

another_richard said:

OchEye said:

Sean_F said:

Casino_Royale said:

Sean_F said:

another_richard said:

Sean_F said:

SeanT said:

PS

The other strong impression I got from my Plymouth minicab epiphany was just how much Corbyn is perceived as another posh London politician, no different (i.e. no more or less posh or elitist) than anyone else in Westminster. He's seen as rich and deluded, with no clue how real people live. Like the rest: Labour or Tory

Clearly this is from people outside the Corbynista bubble, but that's where we need to look

Corbyn's weakness on defence and security issues was theoretical in 2017. Now, it's been shown to have some grounding in reality.

Bear in mind though, the Tories (pre Salisbury) have done a lot to trash their own reputation on defence and security.

But don't forget the UK is now an 'Aid Superpower'.

There's no point banging on about what a threat Corbyn is when you:-

1. Slash the armed forces,
2. Fund litigation against the armed forces,
3. Slash police numbers,
4. Prioritise overseas aid.

Hammond was probably the worst Defence Secretary ever.

I was ashamed of what the Conservatives did to Defence during the 2010 Parliament.

They should have frozen the Defence budget, got to grips with the £38bn funding hole, and then rebuilt it. Not slashed it.

Hammond went out of his way to cause maximum damage, even allowing for cuts in funding.

And Fox screwed Defence by destroying the Harrier and Nimrod fleets, just after both had been upgraded at considerable expense His funeral in the Kremlin wall is guaranteed.....

I never understood the point of actually destroying the planes.

Couldn't they have been stored in a hanger instead.

The Americans have a bloody great lump of desert they park these kinds of thing in.

FrancisUrquhart

SeanT said:

Andrew said:

SeanT said:

Personally I find her almost unbearably awkward. I am convinced she is ASD. But this is only a problem during election campaigns and if she is facing 72 year old Jeremy Corbyn, next time, she should be able to muddle through (and I presume she will have better media advisors).

Actually turning up would be an improvement. The election was like the time Scotland played in Estonia, and the Estonians got the start time wrong, so the match kicked off with only 11 men on the pitch ....

Not bothering to campaign is just about the biggest FU you can give to the electorate, who unsurprisingly were not impressed.

Completely agree. The absolute nadir was her refusal to attend the debates, on the grounds that "I don't know what Jeremy Corbyn is doing, with his electioneering, but I'm trying to negotiate Brexit"

You what?? You fucking CALLED the election, you ridiculous Aspergery heifer.

It was absurd and insulting and she was rightfully punished by the voters.

My fairly firm belief that she would do better next time, against Corbyn, is based on the solid evidence that it would be hard for her to do worse. She is ungainly, she lacks empathy, she will never be loved, but she exudes a hint of common sense and intelligence.

Corbyn, I think, is the political equivalent of fashion reaching an extreme, for a moment, then pulling back - like pinched corsets in 19th century London, or flared trousers in my childhood in the 70s. By 2022 he might seem absurd and embarrassing, certainly he won't be The Thing any more. If it's May v Corbyn in 2022, she wins easily.

What was extra specially dumb was the no, not doing them, come what may. Did they not learn from Cameron who played it both ways, just showing enough leg to encourage the tv channels that he would do something and in the end they jumped at his proposal that was very safe option and no chance for a "I agree with Nick" type stuff.

Sean_F

SeanT said:

Andrew said:

SeanT said:

Personally I find her almost unbearably awkward. I am convinced she is ASD. But this is only a problem during election campaigns and if she is facing 72 year old Jeremy Corbyn, next time, she should be able to muddle through (and I presume she will have better media advisors).

Actually turning up would be an improvement. The election was like the time Scotland played in Estonia, and the Estonians got the start time wrong, so the match kicked off with only 11 men on the pitch ....

Not bothering to campaign is just about the biggest FU you can give to the electorate, who unsurprisingly were not impressed.

Completely agree. The absolute nadir was her refusal to attend the debates, on the grounds that "I don't know what Jeremy Corbyn is doing, with his electioneering, but I'm trying to negotiate Brexit"

You what?? You fucking CALLED the election, you ridiculous Aspergery heifer.

It was absurd and insulting and she was rightfully punished by the voters.

My fairly firm belief that she would do better next time, against Corbyn, is based on the solid evidence that it would be hard for her to do worse. She is ungainly, she lacks empathy, she will never be loved, but she exudes a hint of common sense and intelligence.

Corbyn, I think, is the political equivalent of fashion reaching an extreme, for a moment, then pulling back - like pinched corsets in 19th century London, or flared trousers in my childhood in the 70s. By 2022 he might seem absurd and embarrassing, certainly he won't be The Thing any more. If it's May v Corbyn in 2022, she wins easily.

It was bizarre to run a Presidential campaign where the main candidate didn't want to meet the voters.

Tykejohnno

SeanT said:

Tykejohnno said:

SeanT said:

Sean_F said:

OchEye said:

Sean_F said:

Casino_Royale said:

Sean_F said:

another_richard said:

Sean_F said:

SeanT said:

PS

The other strong impression I got from my Plymouth minicab epiphany was just how much Corbyn is perceived as another posh London politician, no different (i.e. no more or less posh or elitist) than anyone else in Westminster. He's seen as rich and deluded, with no clue how real people live. Like the rest: Labour or Tory

Clearly this is from people outside the Corbynista bubble, but that's where we need to look

Corbyn's weakness on defence and security issues was theoretical in 2017. Now, it's been shown to have some grounding in reality.

Bear in mind though, the Tories (pre Salisbury) have done a lot to trash their own reputation on defence and security.

But don't forget the UK is now an 'Aid Superpower'.

There's no point banging on about what a threat Corbyn is when you:-

1. Slash the armed forces,
2. Fund litigation against the armed forces,
3. Slash police numbers,
4. Prioritise overseas aid.

Hammond was probably the worst Defence Secretary ever.

I was ashamed of what the Conservatives did to Defence during the 2010 Parliament.

They should have frozen the Defence budget, got to grips with the £38bn funding hole, and then rebuilt it. Not slashed it.

Hammond went out of his way to cause maximum damage, even allowing for cuts in funding.

And Fox screwed Defence by destroying the Harrier and Nimrod fleets, just after both had been upgraded at considerable expense His funeral in the Kremlin wall is guaranteed.....

I'd forgotten Fox was Defence Secretary. Yes, he was awful too.

Liam Fox is a total idiot.

The police numbers cuts keep coming back on the tories and especially Theresa May the former home secretary who implemented the cuts.

Just look at the last GE,the Manchester bombing.I think this did hurt the tories with labour promising more police and the cons getting hammered over the cuts.

It will hurt the tories even more if Theresa is still the leader going into the next GE with the murders and crime rising.

The tories need police numbers up.

As I've said many times, with a better leader - a mix of Blair and Corbyn - Labour would win the next election, with some ease. But they seem to be saddled with pure Corbyn, and he can never win.

I posted a Macron type leader but with some back story = Johnny Mercer.

JackW

SeanT said:

I think this is right. By simply clinging on, when all of us presumed that smoother operators would depose her, she has proved herself quite impressively stubborn - and even moderately effective. Who now remembers, or recalls, her ineptitude over Grenfell, when the Labour London mayor so badly handles 50 murders in 15 weeks?

She's never gonna be Churchill, Atlee, or Thatcher. But I do think people are beginning to give her the benefit of the doubt, given the paucity of alternatives.

Personally I find her almost unbearably awkward. I am convinced she is ASD. But this is only a problem during election campaigns and if she is facing 72 year old Jeremy Corbyn, next time, she should be able to muddle through (and I presume she will have better media advisors).

You've hit on the significant election problem for the Conservatives - May is a lousy performer - stiff, lacking in "political empathy" and rarely nimble on her feet. She will also have five more years of baggage to carry.

In contrast Jezza loves campaigning, is engaging and will comfortably spout the most unbelievable tripe to a gullible audience with a smile on his face. In difficult times people prefer hope to hard truth even if, as we saw in 2017, it come bound in Marxist gift wrap

FrancisUrquhart

another_richard said:

The failure to do this before the election cost the Conservatives their majority.

' Former students will be able to earn more before they have to start paying back their tuition fee loans.

English and Welsh students who took out loans from September 2012 onwards - when fees in England rose to up to £9,000 a year - will now start to pay back when they earn £25,000 a year instead of £21,000. '

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/education-43629399

I said straight away Jezza was going to promise free uni as soon as GE was called. It was so predictable, yet Tories seem to be taken aback when he finally announced it.

Also another massive mistake....not promising say £200 million a week (in tiny print, by 2022)...in real terms it is a very modest increase and we will probably end up with anyway with the cost of the oldies, but it would allow them to say basically that thing on the side of the bus wasn't a million miles out and had allowed them to send Boris out to do what Boris does.

AndyJS

If the next election is Corbyn vs a new Tory leader one gets the feeling the Conservatives would probably win, and if it's May against a new Labour leader they (Labour) would win. Difficult to say what would happen if they both have new leaders or if it's May v Corbyn again.

HYUFD

AndyJS said:

If the next election is Corbyn vs a new Tory leader one gets the feeling the Conservatives would probably win, and if it's May against a new Labour leader they (Labour) would win. Difficult to say what would happen if they both have new leaders or if it's May v Corbyn again.

Only of its Corbyn v a charismatic Tory leader, which probably means Boris.

Let us also not forget although she lost the Tory majority May still got the highest Tory voteshare since 1983, when the Tories faced an equally hard left Labour Party

Yorkcity

Sean_F said:

SeanT said:

Andrew said:

SeanT said:

Personally I find her almost unbearably awkward. I am convinced she is ASD. But this is only a problem during election campaigns and if she is facing 72 year old Jeremy Corbyn, next time, she should be able to muddle through (and I presume she will have better media advisors).

Actually turning up would be an improvement. The election was like the time Scotland played in Estonia, and the Estonians got the start time wrong, so the match kicked off with only 11 men on the pitch ....

Not bothering to campaign is just about the biggest FU you can give to the electorate, who unsurprisingly were not impressed.

Completely agree. The absolute nadir was her refusal to attend the debates, on the grounds that "I don't know what Jeremy Corbyn is doing, with his electioneering, but I'm trying to negotiate Brexit"

You what?? You fucking CALLED the election, you ridiculous Aspergery heifer.

It was absurd and insulting and she was rightfully punished by the voters.

My fairly firm belief that she would do better next time, against Corbyn, is based on the solid evidence that it would be hard for her to do worse. She is ungainly, she lacks empathy, she will never be loved, but she exudes a hint of common sense and intelligence.

Corbyn, I think, is the political equivalent of fashion reaching an extreme, for a moment, then pulling back - like pinched corsets in 19th century London, or flared trousers in my childhood in the 70s. By 2022 he might seem absurd and embarrassing, certainly he won't be The Thing any more. If it's May v Corbyn in 2022, she wins easily.

It was bizarre to run a Presidential campaign where the main candidate didn't want to meet the voters.

It was , there was a sense of entitlement about May and a big majority.

Richard_Nabavi

Scott_P said:

@MSmithsonPB: This doesn't sound like a party intent on being firm again Jew hate racism https://twitter.com/GdnPolitics/status/982320150606000128

More smears from the right-wing press, I see.

steve_garner

AndyJS said:

If the next election is Corbyn vs a new Tory leader one gets the feeling the Conservatives would probably win, and if it's May against a new Labour leader they (Labour) would win. Difficult to say what would happen if they both have new leaders or if it's May v Corbyn again.

Way too early to say any of those things, with respect.

AndyJS

steve_garner said:

AndyJS said:

If the next election is Corbyn vs a new Tory leader one gets the feeling the Conservatives would probably win, and if it's May against a new Labour leader they (Labour) would win. Difficult to say what would happen if they both have new leaders or if it's May v Corbyn again.

Way too early to say any of those things, with respect.

I agree, it is too early.

MarqueeMark

Rhubarb said:

another_richard said:

OchEye said:

Sean_F said:

Casino_Royale said:

Sean_F said:

another_richard said:

Sean_F said:

SeanT said:

PS

The other strong impression I got from my Plymouth minicab epiphany was just how much Corbyn is perceived as another posh London politician, no different (i.e. no more or less posh or elitist) than anyone else in Westminster. He's seen as rich and deluded, with no clue how real people live. Like the rest: Labour or Tory

Clearly this is from people outside the Corbynista bubble, but that's where we need to look

Corbyn's weakness on defence and security issues was theoretical in 2017. Now, it's been shown to have some grounding in reality.

Bear in mind though, the Tories (pre Salisbury) have done a lot to trash their own reputation on defence and security.

But don't forget the UK is now an 'Aid Superpower'.

There's no point banging on about what a threat Corbyn is when you:-

1. Slash the armed forces,
2. Fund litigation against the armed forces,
3. Slash police numbers,
4. Prioritise overseas aid.

Hammond was probably the worst Defence Secretary ever.

I was ashamed of what the Conservatives did to Defence during the 2010 Parliament.

They should have frozen the Defence budget, got to grips with the £38bn funding hole, and then rebuilt it. Not slashed it.

Hammond went out of his way to cause maximum damage, even allowing for cuts in funding.

And Fox screwed Defence by destroying the Harrier and Nimrod fleets, just after both had been upgraded at considerable expense His funeral in the Kremlin wall is guaranteed.....

I never understood the point of actually destroying the planes.

Couldn't they have been stored in a hanger instead.

The Americans have a bloody great lump of desert they park these kinds of thing in.

I remember being on Mt. Lemmon in Arizona (on a birding trip) and scanning with my telescope across a mind-blowing expanse of parked jets. They went on for ever.

another_richard

A very unedifying tale:

' The death blow came when investors refused to pump £125m into the company. But that followed three profit warnings in as many weeks, the first of which was blamed on an arithmetical error by a member of the finance team. A week later, Conviviality revealed it had also forgotten that it owed £30m to HM Revenue and Customs. '

https://www.theguardian.com/business/2018/apr/05/conviviality-administration-bargain-booze-wine-rack-owner-acquisitions

Auditors should be surcharged when companies go bust after they've had their accounts approved.

AndyJS

Interesting — Newsnight Review seems to have returned to BBC2 after a long absence.