The danger is that, like the Brexiteers, they think that's a price worth paying or simply underestimate the price, or that they are so tied up in their own bureaucratic log-jam that they are incapable of looking after their own interests.
The EU pushing us off a cliff of our own design would not be the result of bureaucratic failure but of political resolve.
There are swivel-eyed ideologically-obsessed head-bangers on both sides, certainly.
It appears that Leavers are going to persist in the "German car makers insisting" delusion up to and including the moment when it all falls apart, in the teeth of all available evidence.
Then they will no doubt blame the German car makers for not living up to their own delusion.
The other problem is negotiating delays clearly benefit them over us. If it is uncertain whether there will be a UK-EU FTA in place in July 2019, it will have minimal effects on EU firms' investment plans, while it might well have a meaningful effect on ours.
For this reason, I would expect that the EU will only concede on financial services at 11:59pm on the very last day. In this way, some firms shift their presence from the UK to the EU, wven though they needn't have.
Yes, that's true. In the most optimistic interpretation, their logically absurd negotiating position is explained by that.
The danger is that, like the Brexiteers, they think that's a price worth paying or simply underestimate the price, or that they are so tied up in their own bureaucratic log-jam that they are incapable of looking after their own interests.
The EU pushing us off a cliff of our own design would not be the result of bureaucratic failure but of political resolve.
There are swivel-eyed ideologically-obsessed head-bangers on both sides, certainly.
Again this is to mistake what is taking place. It's about power, not ideology. Brexit is a direct assault on the EU by a deluded nationalist movement, and it has to defend itself.
It appears that Leavers are going to persist in the "German car makers insisting" delusion up to and including the moment when it all falls apart, in the teeth of all available evidence.
Then they will no doubt blame the German car makers for not living up to their own delusion.
A no deal hard Brexit would be good or neutral for German car makers ?
Again this is to mistake what is taking place. It's about power, not ideology. Brexit is a direct assault on the EU by a deluded nationalist movement, and it has to defend itself.
No it really isn't. It's an exit by a country which has never been whole-heartedly signed up to the project in the first place, and which has been a drag on integration for three decades.
It appears that Leavers are going to persist in the "German car makers insisting" delusion up to and including the moment when it all falls apart, in the teeth of all available evidence.
Then they will no doubt blame the German car makers for not living up to their own delusion.
A no deal hard Brexit would be good or neutral for German car makers ?
Their top priority is, so they say, defending the single market:
They keep saying it. For some reason Leavers don't seem to be able to absorb it though.
They keep saying it, but what the hell does it mean? It rather seems to me that keeping the trade advantages of having hassle-free trade with the world's fifth or sixth largest economy should be a rather important plank of the defence, but they seem to be implying that they don't care if a large chunk falls off their market.
Again this is to mistake what is taking place. It's about power, not ideology. Brexit is a direct assault on the EU by a deluded nationalist movement, and it has to defend itself.
No it really isn't. It's an exit by a country which has never been whole-heartedly signed up to the project in the first place, and which has been a drag on integration for three decades.
Actually, I get the strong impression that it’s both!
It appears that Leavers are going to persist in the "German car makers insisting" delusion up to and including the moment when it all falls apart, in the teeth of all available evidence.
Then they will no doubt blame the German car makers for not living up to their own delusion.
A no deal hard Brexit would be good or neutral for German car makers ?
Their top priority is, so they say, defending the single market:
The danger is that, like the Brexiteers, they think that's a price worth paying or simply underestimate the price, or that they are so tied up in their own bureaucratic log-jam that they are incapable of looking after their own interests.
The EU pushing us off a cliff of our own design would not be the result of bureaucratic failure but of political resolve.
There are swivel-eyed ideologically-obsessed head-bangers on both sides, certainly.
Again this is to mistake what is taking place. It's about power, not ideology. Brexit is a direct assault on the EU by a deluded nationalist movement, and it has to defend itself.
It appears that Leavers are going to persist in the "German car makers insisting" delusion up to and including the moment when it all falls apart, in the teeth of all available evidence.
Then they will no doubt blame the German car makers for not living up to their own delusion.
A no deal hard Brexit would be good or neutral for German car makers ?
Their top priority is, so they say, defending the single market:
They keep saying it. For some reason Leavers don't seem to be able to absorb it though.
Not sure any of the proposals put forward by the Uk govt put the single market at risk - feel free to point out any.
The UK government continues to want all the benefits of access to the single market with none of the aspects that they find inconvenient or boring. Until they move beyond a binary cake position, they're going to make very little progress.
Again this is to mistake what is taking place. It's about power, not ideology. Brexit is a direct assault on the EU by a deluded nationalist movement, and it has to defend itself.
No it really isn't. It's an exit by a country which has never been whole-heartedly signed up to the project in the first place, and which has been a drag on integration for three decades.
Actually, I get the strong impression that it’s both!
It's an exit by a country which has never been whole-heartedly signed up to the project in the first place, and which has been a drag on integration for three decades which is perceived as a direct assault on the EU by the deluded ever-closer-union zealots in Brussels and elsewhere.
He [Davis] wrote that “both sides need to move swiftly on to discussing our future partnership and we want that to happen after the European Council in October”. So much for constructive ambiguity about what Britain needs. Read Mr Davis’s article closely, and gone is the pretence that Britain can walk away from the table. The phrase “no deal is better than a bad deal” is absent.
Who cares about Osborne's daily bullshit?
No one listened to him when he was CofE, why would they now he's in charge of a free paper?
It appears that Leavers are going to persist in the "German car makers insisting" delusion up to and including the moment when it all falls apart, in the teeth of all available evidence.
Then they will no doubt blame the German car makers for not living up to their own delusion.
A no deal hard Brexit would be good or neutral for German car makers ?
Their top priority is, so they say, defending the single market:
It appears that Leavers are going to persist in the "German car makers insisting" delusion up to and including the moment when it all falls apart, in the teeth of all available evidence.
Then they will no doubt blame the German car makers for not living up to their own delusion.
A no deal hard Brexit would be good or neutral for German car makers ?
Their top priority is, so they say, defending the single market:
Political coverage in the Evening Standard is, unsurprisingly, very much improved since Osborne became editor. His leader pieces in particular are superb - the latest being a good example.
Yeah but the downside is people getting stabbed or having acid thrown in their face in London seems to be less important news than speculation about a policy the editor doesn't like
It appears that Leavers are going to persist in the "German car makers insisting" delusion up to and including the moment when it all falls apart, in the teeth of all available evidence.
Then they will no doubt blame the German car makers for not living up to their own delusion.
A no deal hard Brexit would be good or neutral for German car makers ?
Their top priority is, so they say, defending the single market:
It appears that Leavers are going to persist in the "German car makers insisting" delusion up to and including the moment when it all falls apart, in the teeth of all available evidence.
Then they will no doubt blame the German car makers for not living up to their own delusion.
A no deal hard Brexit would be good or neutral for German car makers ?
Their top priority is, so they say, defending the single market:
They keep saying it. For some reason Leavers don't seem to be able to absorb it though.
Not sure any of the proposals put forward by the Uk govt put the single market at risk - feel free to point out any.
Hasn't the UK government expressly said that it wants to leave the single market?
The government could have taken a different position - which would still have been compatible with the referendum result - but chose not to. That has consequences for the UK.
The EU did not need to make free movement of people essential to the single market or could have been more pragmatic and flexible in its application. But it made its choice - as the UK has - and the result will be disruption to our existing trading arrangements.
God knows what will happen in the medium and long term.
Political coverage in the Evening Standard is, unsurprisingly, very much improved since Osborne became editor. His leader pieces in particular are superb - the latest being a good example.
Yeah but the downside is people getting stabbed or having acid thrown in their face in London seems to be less important news than speculation about a policy the editor doesn't like
Oh I don't know, one of today's lead stories is "‘Hypocrite’ Sarah Harding slammed by Celebrity Big Brother fans as she appears to perform sex act on Chad Johnson", which suggests there's still a continuing healthy coverage of the prime concerns of the readership.
They keep saying it. For some reason Leavers don't seem to be able to absorb it though.
They keep saying it, but what the hell does it mean? It rather seems to me that keeping the trade advantages of having hassle-free trade with the world's fifth or sixth largest economy should be a rather important plank of the defence, but they seem to be implying that they don't care if a large chunk falls off their market.
Oh I completely agree that the EU's current negotiating position is self-defeating and incoherent. You can understand why on an emotional level: when your negotiating partner hasn't really moved beyond "I hate you and I want to see you die", it's hard to take a dispassionate approach. Even those Leavers who fancy themselves as more cerebral seem to have given almost no thought as to the nature of the longterm relationship that they want with an organisation that, like it or not, is likely to be a big part of the neighbourhood for the foreseeable future. That in turn encourages the EU itself to be transactional and to treat the negotiations more as an outlet for internal politics than seriously to engage with the same question in reverse. That doesn't excuse the EU's own failure on this front though.
There's a reason why I think that a car crash Brexit is more likely than not. Neither side has given any thought to what it actually wants that is achievable and stable in the long term.
For the first time ever I had a shred of empathy with the Leavers on Saturday. Due to a bungled fuel calculation we were forced to make a technical stop at the Thurrock services on the M25. In the car park there was a Ukranian sex trafficking operation in a van making a pit stop and an African wedding party that looked more like a circus act. Inside it was overrun with pikeys from east of the Oder and lakes of piss abounded on the toilet floors.
Where I of limited intellectual capacity and a timorous disposition I could easily feel that the country has changed and not for the better. Subsequently a cleansing act of self harm like Brexit might be just the thing to cheer me up.
For the first time ever I had a shred of empathy with the Leavers on Saturday. Due to a bungled fuel calculation we were forced to make a technical stop at the Thurrock services on the M25. In the car park there was a Ukranian sex trafficking operation in a van making a pit stop and an African wedding party that looked more like a circus act. Inside it was overrun with pikeys from east of the Oder and lakes of piss abounded on the toilet floors.
Where I of limited intellectual capacity and a timorous disposition I could easily feel that the country has changed and not for the better. Subsequently a cleansing act of self harm like Brexit might be just the thing to cheer me up.
Oh the irony. Calling Leave voters thick and you can't spell 'were' or hyphenate 'self-harm'.
It appears that Leavers are going to persist in the "German car makers insisting" delusion up to and including the moment when it all falls apart, in the teeth of all available evidence.
Then they will no doubt blame the German car makers for not living up to their own delusion.
A no deal hard Brexit would be good or neutral for German car makers ?
Their top priority is, so they say, defending the single market:
For the first time ever I had a shred of empathy with the Leavers on Saturday. Due to a bungled fuel calculation we were forced to make a technical stop at the Thurrock services on the M25. In the car park there was a Ukranian sex trafficking operation in a van making a pit stop and an African wedding party that looked more like a circus act. Inside it was overrun with pikeys from east of the Oder and lakes of piss abounded on the toilet floors.
Where I of limited intellectual capacity and a timorous disposition I could easily feel that the country has changed and not for the better. Subsequently a cleansing act of self harm like Brexit might be just the thing to cheer me up.
Oh the irony. Calling Leave voters thick and you can't spell 'were' or hyphenate 'self-harm'.
They keep saying it. For some reason Leavers don't seem to be able to absorb it though.
They keep saying it, but what the hell does it mean? It rather seems to me that keeping the trade advantages of having hassle-free trade with the world's fifth or sixth largest economy should be a rather important plank of the defence, but they seem to be implying that they don't care if a large chunk falls off their market.
Even those Leavers who fancy themselves as more cerebral seem to have given almost no thought as to the nature of the longterm relationship that they want with an organisation that, like it or not, is likely to be a big part of the neighbourhood for the foreseeable future.
For the first time ever I had a shred of empathy with the Leavers on Saturday. Due to a bungled fuel calculation we were forced to make a technical stop at the Thurrock services on the M25. In the car park there was a Ukranian sex trafficking operation in a van making a pit stop and an African wedding party that looked more like a circus act. Inside it was overrun with pikeys from east of the Oder and lakes of piss abounded on the toilet floors.
Where I of limited intellectual capacity and a timorous disposition I could easily feel that the country has changed and not for the better. Subsequently a cleansing act of self harm like Brexit might be just the thing to cheer me up.
They keep saying it. For some reason Leavers don't seem to be able to absorb it though.
They keep saying it, but what the hell does it mean? It rather seems to me that keeping the trade advantages of having hassle-free trade with the world's fifth or sixth largest economy should be a rather important plank of the defence, but they seem to be implying that they don't care if a large chunk falls off their market.
Even those Leavers who fancy themselves as more cerebral seem to have given almost no thought as to the nature of the longterm relationship that they want with an organisation that, like it or not, is likely to be a big part of the neighbourhood for the foreseeable future.
They keep saying it. For some reason Leavers don't seem to be able to absorb it though.
They keep saying it, but what the hell does it mean? It rather seems to me that keeping the trade advantages of having hassle-free trade with the world's fifth or sixth largest economy should be a rather important plank of the defence, but they seem to be implying that they don't care if a large chunk falls off their market.
Even those Leavers who fancy themselves as more cerebral seem to have given almost no thought as to the nature of the longterm relationship that they want with an organisation that, like it or not, is likely to be a big part of the neighbourhood for the foreseeable future.
There's a thread header (or two) right there.....
I'm consciously trying to avoid Brexit for a little while in favour of other themes. I may not always resist though.
For the first time ever I had a shred of empathy with the Leavers on Saturday. Due to a bungled fuel calculation we were forced to make a technical stop at the Thurrock services on the M25. In the car park there was a Ukranian sex trafficking operation in a van making a pit stop and an African wedding party that looked more like a circus act. Inside it was overrun with pikeys from east of the Oder and lakes of piss abounded on the toilet floors.
Where I of limited intellectual capacity and a timorous disposition I could easily feel that the country has changed and not for the better. Subsequently a cleansing act of self harm like Brexit might be just the thing to cheer me up.
Oh the irony. Calling Leave voters thick and you can't spell 'were' or hyphenate 'self-harm'.
In his speech, Mr Varadkar said he wanted to outline “Ireland’s place in the world in the years ahead” and sought to cast his announcement as a major statement on Ireland’s future foreign policy.
“Ireland is emerging from what has been a lost decade for many of our citizens, and it is clear to me that we are emerging with a greater sense of self-confidence and ambition for what we can do as a country,” he said.
“That national self-confidence requires that we always be ambitious, visible and active in promoting the interests of our nation on the international stage.”
He said to fulfil the ambition of Ireland as “an island at the centre of the world…we need to greatly increase our international presence”.The Taoiseach said that “some nations have lost their sense of place and self-confidence in this inter dependent world of ours” but added that Ireland and Canada “retain a strong and deep commitment to openness, multilateralism, individual freedom and free trade”.
They keep saying it. For some reason Leavers don't seem to be able to absorb it though.
They keep saying it, but what the hell does it mean? It rather seems to me that keeping the trade advantages of having hassle-free trade with the world's fifth or sixth largest economy should be a rather important plank of the defence, but they seem to be implying that they don't care if a large chunk falls off their market.
Even those Leavers who fancy themselves as more cerebral seem to have given almost no thought as to the nature of the longterm relationship that they want with an organisation that, like it or not, is likely to be a big part of the neighbourhood for the foreseeable future.
There's a thread header (or two) right there.....
I'm consciously trying to avoid Brexit for a little while in favour of other themes. I may not always resist though.
So you think Sarah Harding did actually have sex on CBB?
Comments
Then they will no doubt blame the German car makers for not living up to their own delusion.
https://twitter.com/asabenn/status/899630096067284992
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2017/jul/08/german-industry-warns-uk-over-brexit
http://www.express.co.uk/news/politics/785168/Angela-Merkel-European-Union-interests-ahead-of-German-carmakers-BMW-VW-Brexit-Article-50
They keep saying it. For some reason Leavers don't seem to be able to absorb it though.
If there were another EU referendum, how would you vote?
- Remain: 47%
- Leave: 44%
- Don't know: 5%
An extraordinary lack of enthusiasm for the trek towards the sunlit uplands.
How is this possible?
What you aren't saying is that the other countries may cotton on that the EU aint all that ?
The government could have taken a different position - which would still have been compatible with the referendum result - but chose not to. That has consequences for the UK.
The EU did not need to make free movement of people essential to the single market or could have been more pragmatic and flexible in its application. But it made its choice - as the UK has - and the result will be disruption to our existing trading arrangements.
God knows what will happen in the medium and long term.
There's a reason why I think that a car crash Brexit is more likely than not. Neither side has given any thought to what it actually wants that is achievable and stable in the long term.
Where I of limited intellectual capacity and a timorous disposition I could easily feel that the country has changed and not for the better. Subsequently a cleansing act of self harm like Brexit might be just the thing to cheer me up.
Incidentally, at the moment enthusiasm for the EU seems to be increasing elsewhere in the EU:
http://www.politico.eu/article/forget-brexit-citizens-♥-eu-survey/?utm_content=buffer2b4f4&utm_medium=social&utm_source=twitter.com&utm_campaign=buffer
https://www.irishtimes.com/news/politics/varadkar-pledges-to-increase-ireland-s-diplomatic-force-1.3193324
In his speech, Mr Varadkar said he wanted to outline “Ireland’s place in the world in the years ahead” and sought to cast his announcement as a major statement on Ireland’s future foreign policy.
“Ireland is emerging from what has been a lost decade for many of our citizens, and it is clear to me that we are emerging with a greater sense of self-confidence and ambition for what we can do as a country,” he said.
“That national self-confidence requires that we always be ambitious, visible and active in promoting the interests of our nation on the international stage.”
He said to fulfil the ambition of Ireland as “an island at the centre of the world…we need to greatly increase our international presence”.The Taoiseach said that “some nations have lost their sense of place and self-confidence in this inter dependent world of ours” but added that Ireland and Canada “retain a strong and deep commitment to openness, multilateralism, individual freedom and free trade”.
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