I've been predicting for some time that immigration would fall by using the simple method of being so unpleasant to foreigners that they would get the message. Clearly that's working.
It lacks the elegance of your method of ensuring Brexit by telling most Brits they're racist scum.
I'm sorry that it upsets you so much to be reminded that Brexit was secured through xenophobic lies, but it's the essential reason why Brexit is the enduring disaster of the age for the country.
People whose lives were ruined by mass immigration don't need politicians to lie for them to vote against it
How have the lives of pensioners living in low areas of immigration been ruined by mass immigration?
Again, this is an aggregate statistic which includes Ozil, Hazard, etc. I don't see them leaving any time soon. The ONS figures does say that net immigration from the EU8 is at it's lowest since 2004.
YouGov are polling again. They're asking both a general who are you going to vote for and then asking again with named/partied candidates for your constituency.
YouGov are polling again. They're asking both a general who are you going to vote for and then asking again with named/partied candidates for your constituency.
Again, this is an aggregate statistic which includes Ozil, Hazard, etc. I don't see them leaving any time soon. The ONS figures does say that net immigration from the EU8 is at it's lowest since 2004.
Give it two weeks and when the supreme leader is elected all the foreign footballers will be off.
I've been predicting for some time that immigration would fall by using the simple method of being so unpleasant to foreigners that they would get the message. Clearly that's working.
Yup. People like foreign care workers have thought *screw it* why should I deal with this unpleasantness. I'll go *home* or to X country, earn a little less, pay a lot less for my housing and make a life for myself there.
Our elderly must now pay much higher wages to (often) lower quality *British* careworkers - which will involve liquidating their housing assets en masse.
That's what they voted for.
Our elderly must pay the rate required for the care they need (alongside some councils who pay less than is required to cover unavoidable costs while paying someone the national living wage).
Whether Eastern Europeans go home or not the price of care is going to rise 50% or so simply because the tax avoidance measures and fake self-employment zero hour contracts many home care companies use have to disappear.
Also there is a very simple reason why immigration is down slightly. Last year you earned €1.30 for every £1 sterling now its €1.12. That's a 10% drop in wages compared to Germany...
Again, this is an aggregate statistic which includes Ozil, Hazard, etc. I don't see them leaving any time soon. The ONS figures does say that net immigration from the EU8 is at it's lowest since 2004.
Yes, if the only Europeans in the UK were sportsmen, bankers, lawyers and doctors, the figure would be much higher. We don't need more baristas, car washers and Big Issue sellers.
Security is now off the table as a Brexit negotiating tool. Though, to be fair, only deluded anti-European right wingers ever thought otherwise.
Remainer glee at any potential setback for the Uk is the main reason they lost the referendum.
A setback for swivel-eyed, right wing, anti-Europeans is not a setback for Britain. Their wish to increase the dangers faced by British citizens at home and abroad was sickening.
Again, this is an aggregate statistic which includes Ozil, Hazard, etc. I don't see them leaving any time soon. The ONS figures does say that net immigration from the EU8 is at it's lowest since 2004.
Give it two weeks and when the supreme leader is elected all the foreign footballers will be off.
Late to the discussion but a few comments on topic.
Firstly, an excellent piece from Alastair. I don't agree with it all but it's very good to read a well-argued piece from a left-of-centre perspective; he and it are a credit to the site.
And on the substance, and the point on which I dissent, the election is about Brexit but it's also about more than that. Most obviously, as Zac found in Richmond, elections are ultimately about whatever the public want them to be about, not what the politicians (or some of them) say it is.
But beyond that, this election, as with most elections, is about leadership. Who do you trust to lead the country. Sure, that means who do you trust to get the best deal for Britain on leaving the EU: who has the head for detail; who can master the competing dynamics and best work them to produce a favourable outcome; who is pragmatic enough to cut a deal where necessary but firm enough to stand solid over red line; indeed, who best understands what the red lines should be? But it also means leadership on the economy: who do you trust to deliver sustainable growth and employment, and not to crash the car from recklessness and under-maintenance? It means leadership on security: who do you trust to keep us as safe as possible while balancing that against essential liberties; who do you trust to oversee the security services and military? It means leadership on public services: who do you trust to act in the interests of the citizen and not client groups, while recognising that those client groups both might have legitimate points and are probably essential to delivering those services.
And the choice on offer is May, Hammond, Davis and so on, on the one hand, and Corbyn, McDonnell, Abbott and co on the other. Those are the binary options. Certainly, other parties are available but none of them can win, so a vote for them is to delegate the most crucial decision to other voters.
The question I asked myself about this election is: who has the best instincts to deal with the unexpected? Manifesto pledges are all well and good but the unexpected always arises.
I didn't find it a difficult question to answer, to be honest.
I think the question people will be asking is who is likely to create the sort of society I want to live in. Opponents are clear about what the other side want to do (profligate spending, lax on security, lurch to the left on the one hand; nasty cuts, NHS not safe, for the few not the many on the other) but not so great about their own vision.
As someone put it on here very well, Cons are saying we are all going to hell in a hand cart and we are the only ones able to drive the cart. Lab? Not sure (but then as a Tory I wouldn't spend time working it out - fairness I suppose but what does that mean?).
I've been predicting for some time that immigration would fall by using the simple method of being so unpleasant to foreigners that they would get the message. Clearly that's working.
Are the wrong type of foreigners leaving ?
Probably. That at least is what I'm picking up from my limited conversations with 'foreigners'. (I put that in inverted commas because the ones I know best have been in this country a very long time and many have come to regard it as home.)
YouGov are polling again. They're asking both a general who are you going to vote for and then asking again with named/partied candidates for your constituency.
Who precisely is shocked at any of this information about identity and bombs, and did these maiden aunts think the forensic teams in the white coveralls shown on or in British media were painters and decorators?
None of this is exactly new with the US. During the Falklands, info was far more forthcoming from the US than it was from the MOD iirc.
Just watching Sky News and I'm struck by the media's desire to speculate wildly and without evidence on things. Yesterday they were claiming the flat raided at lunchtime was an 'air b and b' and have had to row back and explain that was false information. What purpose did reporting that yesterday serve? It's utterly irrelevant, and symptomatic of their need to seem like news hounds with their finger on the pulse. Dangerous idiots.
BBC - Net migration to the UK was estimated to be 248,000 in 2016 - a fall of 84,000 from 2015, figures show.
The Office for National Statistics said the change was driven by "a statistically significant" increase of 40,000 people leaving the country.
These were mostly EU citizens - 117,000 emigrated, up 31,000 from 2015.
"Notably the number of people moving to the UK to study at university also fell by 32,000 to 136,000."
At the moment I think EU student pay same as UK. But post Brexit I expect that would change and lead to Europeans being hit by the higher fees charge to those from the rest of the world.
I've been predicting for some time that immigration would fall by using the simple method of being so unpleasant to foreigners that they would get the message. Clearly that's working.
It is more likely the fall in sterling which meant a sharp drop in wages calculated against the "home" currency: euros, zlotys or whatever.
Again, this is an aggregate statistic which includes Ozil, Hazard, etc. I don't see them leaving any time soon. The ONS figures does say that net immigration from the EU8 is at it's lowest since 2004.
Give it two weeks and when the supreme leader is elected all the foreign footballers will be off.
All off to low tax France ? Lol.
It isn't about tax levels, No maximum wage there....Also no top footballer goes to france, standard of football is shit and wages not great.
China on the other hand are willing to pay even more stupid money than uk.
Just watching Sky News and I'm struck by the media's desire to speculate wildly and without evidence on things. Yesterday they were claiming the flat raided at lunchtime was an 'air b and b' and have had to row back and explain that was false information. What purpose did reporting that yesterday serve? It's utterly irrelevant, and symptomatic of their need to seem like news hounds with their finger on the pulse. Dangerous idiots.
It filled time and the problem with 24 hour news is that you have to fill 24 hours with news even when there isn't any...
Security is now off the table as a Brexit negotiating tool. Though, to be fair, only deluded anti-European right wingers ever thought otherwise.
Remainer glee at any potential setback for the Uk is the main reason they lost the referendum.
A setback for swivel-eyed, right wing, anti-Europeans is not a setback for Britain. Their wish to increase the dangers faced by British citizens at home and abroad was sickening.
Just watching Sky News and I'm struck by the media's desire to speculate wildly and without evidence on things. Yesterday they were claiming the flat raided at lunchtime was an 'air b and b' and have had to row back and explain that was false information. What purpose did reporting that yesterday serve? It's utterly irrelevant, and symptomatic of their need to seem like news hounds with their finger on the pulse. Dangerous idiots.
Unfortunately it is something we have imported from the US. Just repeating known fact don't get the rainfall.
Just watching Sky News and I'm struck by the media's desire to speculate wildly and without evidence on things. Yesterday they were claiming the flat raided at lunchtime was an 'air b and b' and have had to row back and explain that was false information. What purpose did reporting that yesterday serve? It's utterly irrelevant, and symptomatic of their need to seem like news hounds with their finger on the pulse. Dangerous idiots.
Unfortunately it is something we have imported from the US. Just repeating known fact don't get the rainfall.
24 hour rolling news has a lot of time to fill, particularly as the majority of the audience only tunes in briefly and expects to see coverage of the big story when they do so.
I've been predicting for some time that immigration would fall by using the simple method of being so unpleasant to foreigners that they would get the message. Clearly that's working.
It lacks the elegance of your method of ensuring Brexit by telling most Brits they're racist scum.
I'm sorry that it upsets you so much to be reminded that Brexit was secured through xenophobic lies, but it's the essential reason why Brexit is the enduring disaster of the age for the country.
Or...Brexit was secured by hectoring, smug, superior arses, thinking that the argument for the EU was so fucking obvious that it made itself - but we'll gratuitously insult the intellects of the voters by the by.
These hand-wringers could have a) formulated the reasons why staying in the EU was full off benefits, even for the dumbest fucks in society b) made that case to them in measured terms c) got out to the hell-holes where these Leave voters lived and talked them over, on the doorsteps.
NOW they bitch and moan. Twelve months ago was the time to get engaged, if they truly thought it was the defining moment of our age.
What did you do in the Great Referendum War, daddy?
I've been predicting for some time that immigration would fall by using the simple method of being so unpleasant to foreigners that they would get the message. Clearly that's working.
It lacks the elegance of your method of ensuring Brexit by telling most Brits they're racist scum.
I'm sorry that it upsets you so much to be reminded that Brexit was secured through xenophobic lies, but it's the essential reason why Brexit is the enduring disaster of the age for the country.
People whose lives were ruined by mass immigration don't need politicians to lie for them to vote against it
How have the lives of pensioners living in low areas of immigration been ruined by mass immigration?
Believe it or not Southam, people do actually move from area to area. Shockingly, most retirees would like to live somewhere that does not make them feel like a foreigner in their own country.
This phenomenon will only accelerate as Britain becomes more diverse.
I've been predicting for some time that immigration would fall by using the simple method of being so unpleasant to foreigners that they would get the message. Clearly that's working.
It is more likely the fall in sterling which meant a sharp drop in wages calculated against the "home" currency: euros, zlotys or whatever.
I've been predicting for some time that immigration would fall by using the simple method of being so unpleasant to foreigners that they would get the message. Clearly that's working.
It lacks the elegance of your method of ensuring Brexit by telling most Brits they're racist scum.
I'm sorry that it upsets you so much to be reminded that Brexit was secured through xenophobic lies, but it's the essential reason why Brexit is the enduring disaster of the age for the country.
Or...Brexit was secured by hectoring, smug, superior arses, thinking that the argument for the EU was so fucking obvious that it made itself - but we'll gratuitously insult the intellects of the voters by the by.
These hand-wringers could have a) formulated the reasons why staying in the EU was full off benefits, even for the dumbest fucks in society b) made that case to them in measured terms c) got out to the hell-holes where these Leave voters lived and talked them over, on the doorsteps.
NOW they bitch and moan. Twelve months ago was the time to get engaged, if they truly thought it was the defining moment of our age.
What did you do in the Great Referendum War, daddy?
In your case, smirk while xenophobic lies were told.
I've been predicting for some time that immigration would fall by using the simple method of being so unpleasant to foreigners that they would get the message. Clearly that's working.
It lacks the elegance of your method of ensuring Brexit by telling most Brits they're racist scum.
I'm sorry that it upsets you so much to be reminded that Brexit was secured through xenophobic lies, but it's the essential reason why Brexit is the enduring disaster of the age for the country.
Or...Brexit was secured by hectoring, smug, superior arses, thinking that the argument for the EU was so fucking obvious that it made itself - but we'll gratuitously insult the intellects of the voters by the by.
These hand-wringers could have a) formulated the reasons why staying in the EU was full off benefits, even for the dumbest fucks in society b) made that case to them in measured terms c) got out to the hell-holes where these Leave voters lived and talked them over, on the doorsteps.
NOW they bitch and moan. Twelve months ago was the time to get engaged, if they truly thought it was the defining moment of our age.
What did you do in the Great Referendum War, daddy?
In your case, smirk while xenophobic lies were told.
How many people did you try and win over in Jaywick?
I've been predicting for some time that immigration would fall by using the simple method of being so unpleasant to foreigners that they would get the message. Clearly that's working.
It lacks the elegance of your method of ensuring Brexit by telling most Brits they're racist scum.
I'm sorry that it upsets you so much to be reminded that Brexit was secured through xenophobic lies, but it's the essential reason why Brexit is the enduring disaster of the age for the country.
Or...Brexit was secured by hectoring, smug, superior arses, thinking that the argument for the EU was so fucking obvious that it made itself - but we'll gratuitously insult the intellects of the voters by the by.
These hand-wringers could have a) formulated the reasons why staying in the EU was full off benefits, even for the dumbest fucks in society b) made that case to them in measured terms c) got out to the hell-holes where these Leave voters lived and talked them over, on the doorsteps.
NOW they bitch and moan. Twelve months ago was the time to get engaged, if they truly thought it was the defining moment of our age.
What did you do in the Great Referendum War, daddy?
In your case, smirk while xenophobic lies were told.
The Remain campaign was cheated ? Was the result stolen ? The voters were wrong ?
I've been predicting for some time that immigration would fall by using the simple method of being so unpleasant to foreigners that they would get the message. Clearly that's working.
It is more likely the fall in sterling which meant a sharp drop in wages calculated against the "home" currency: euros, zlotys or whatever.
That is a very good point.
But immigration hasn't fallen - last year's figure was comparable with the level every year back to 2007. People are still coming. The fall arises because last year a larger batch of EU people emigrated back home, reducing the net migration figure.
I've been predicting for some time that immigration would fall by using the simple method of being so unpleasant to foreigners that they would get the message. Clearly that's working.
It lacks the elegance of your method of ensuring Brexit by telling most Brits they're racist scum.
I'm sorry that it upsets you so much to be reminded that Brexit was secured through xenophobic lies, but it's the essential reason why Brexit is the enduring disaster of the age for the country.
People whose lives were ruined by mass immigration don't need politicians to lie for them to vote against it
How have the lives of pensioners living in low areas of immigration been ruined by mass immigration?
Believe it or not Southam, people do actually move from area to area. Shockingly, most retirees would like to live somewhere that does not make them feel like a foreigner in their own country.
This phenomenon will only accelerate as Britain becomes more diverse.
So how many pensioners have moved to the North East or the South Wales vallies? If you live in an area of low immigration, surely you are less likely to feel like a foreigner in your own country.
I've been predicting for some time that immigration would fall by using the simple method of being so unpleasant to foreigners that they would get the message. Clearly that's working.
It lacks the elegance of your method of ensuring Brexit by telling most Brits they're racist scum.
I'm sorry that it upsets you so much to be reminded that Brexit was secured through xenophobic lies, but it's the essential reason why Brexit is the enduring disaster of the age for the country.
Or...Brexit was secured by hectoring, smug, superior arses, thinking that the argument for the EU was so fucking obvious that it made itself - but we'll gratuitously insult the intellects of the voters by the by.
These hand-wringers could have a) formulated the reasons why staying in the EU was full off benefits, even for the dumbest fucks in society b) made that case to them in measured terms c) got out to the hell-holes where these Leave voters lived and talked them over, on the doorsteps.
NOW they bitch and moan. Twelve months ago was the time to get engaged, if they truly thought it was the defining moment of our age.
What did you do in the Great Referendum War, daddy?
In your case, smirk while xenophobic lies were told.
How many people did you try and win over in Jaywick?
Why Brexit is a disaster is because far too many people were comfortable with using xenophobic lies in pursuit of their marginal obsession. As a result, the country has become unhappier, more divided and more racist and will continue down that path until those who did so accept that race-baiting in pursuit of votes is a recipe for disaster, the more so if the pursuit is successful.
There really isn't much that the Remain campaign could do to stop the Leave campaign stooping to such depths. But those in charge of the Leave campaign were too stupid to see that winning on those terms was itself a defeat.
I think if ukip was still led by farage rather than walty mitty, may could have been in a bit of trouble with all those voters who have recently jumped ship.
I've been predicting for some time that immigration would fall by using the simple method of being so unpleasant to foreigners that they would get the message. Clearly that's working.
It is more likely the fall in sterling which meant a sharp drop in wages calculated against the "home" currency: euros, zlotys or whatever.
That is a very good point.
But immigration hasn't fallen - last year's figure was comparable with the level every year back to 2007. People are still coming. The fall arises because last year a larger batch of EU people emigrated back home, reducing the net migration figure.
Looks like it has been going up/down quite a bit, although the latest peak was markedly higher
I've been predicting for some time that immigration would fall by using the simple method of being so unpleasant to foreigners that they would get the message. Clearly that's working.
It is more likely the fall in sterling which meant a sharp drop in wages calculated against the "home" currency: euros, zlotys or whatever.
That is a very good point.
But immigration hasn't fallen - last year's figure was comparable with the level every year back to 2007. People are still coming. The fall arises because last year a larger batch of EU people emigrated back home, reducing the net migration figure.
For some the fall in the pound has probably meant it's not worth staying on. For others coming, it might still be worth it.
I've been predicting for some time that immigration would fall by using the simple method of being so unpleasant to foreigners that they would get the message. Clearly that's working.
It lacks the elegance of your method of ensuring Brexit by telling most Brits they're racist scum.
I'm sorry that it upsets you so much to be reminded that Brexit was secured through xenophobic lies, but it's the essential reason why Brexit is the enduring disaster of the age for the country.
Or...Brexit was secured by hectoring, smug, superior arses, thinking that the argument for the EU was so fucking obvious that it made itself - but we'll gratuitously insult the intellects of the voters by the by.
These hand-wringers could have a) formulated the reasons why staying in the EU was full off benefits, even for the dumbest fucks in society b) made that case to them in measured terms c) got out to the hell-holes where these Leave voters lived and talked them over, on the doorsteps.
NOW they bitch and moan. Twelve months ago was the time to get engaged, if they truly thought it was the defining moment of our age.
What did you do in the Great Referendum War, daddy?
In your case, smirk while xenophobic lies were told.
How many people did you try and win over in Jaywick?
Why Brexit is a disaster is because far too many people were comfortable with using xenophobic lies in pursuit of their marginal obsession. As a result, the country has become unhappier, more divided and more racist and will continue down that path until those who did so accept that race-baiting in pursuit of votes is a recipe for disaster, the more so if the pursuit is successful.
There really isn't much that the Remain campaign could do to stop the Leave campaign stooping to such depths. But those in charge of the Leave campaign were too stupid to see that winning on those terms was itself a defeat.
Today shows the yin and yang of AlastairMeeks. A great thread header, but then the comments...oh dear.
Who precisely is shocked at any of this information about identity and bombs, and did these maiden aunts think the forensic teams in the white coveralls shown on or in British media were painters and decorators?
None of this is exactly new with the US. During the Falklands, info was far more forthcoming from the US than it was from the MOD iirc.
Likewise July 7.
Lord Blair was on the Today programme this morning and said it was exactly the same back then. The UK police and security provided their US counterparts with sensitive information on the understanding that it would be handled sensitively, but it was leaked all over the media. The UK complained, as it has done this time, but nothing changed.
I think if ukip was still led by farage rather than walty mitty, may could have been in a bit of trouble with all those voters who have recently jumped ship.
I've been predicting for some time that immigration would fall by using the simple method of being so unpleasant to foreigners that they would get the message. Clearly that's working.
It is more likely the fall in sterling which meant a sharp drop in wages calculated against the "home" currency: euros, zlotys or whatever.
That is a very good point.
But immigration hasn't fallen - last year's figure was comparable with the level every year back to 2007. People are still coming. The fall arises because last year a larger batch of EU people emigrated back home, reducing the net migration figure.
For some the fall in the pound has probably meant it's not worth staying on. For others coming, it might still be worth it.
The interesting question is whether the batch of EU people leaving is balanced by just-as-many-as-usual coming, or whether immigration too has dropped from the EU and has instead picked up from non-EU regions such as South Asia, as some on the Brexit side were *bold* enough to say that they wanted? Maybe our curry houses are safe after all?
I've been predicting for some time that immigration would fall by using the simple method of being so unpleasant to foreigners that they would get the message. Clearly that's working.
It lacks the elegance of your method of ensuring Brexit by telling most Brits they're racist scum.
I'm sorry that it upsets you so much to be reminded that Brexit was secured through xenophobic lies, but it's the essential reason why Brexit is the enduring disaster of the age for the country.
Or...Brexit was secured by hectoring, smug, superior arses, thinking that the argument for the EU was so fucking obvious that it made itself - but we'll gratuitously insult the intellects of the voters by the by.
These hand-wringers could have a) formulated the reasons why staying in the EU was full off benefits, even for the dumbest fucks in society b) made that case to them in measured terms c) got out to the hell-holes where these Leave voters lived and talked them over, on the doorsteps.
NOW they bitch and moan. Twelve months ago was the time to get engaged, if they truly thought it was the defining moment of our age.
What did you do in the Great Referendum War, daddy?
In your case, smirk while xenophobic lies were told.
Xenophobic is the lazy slur of the half-educated. Yes, the ancient Greeks were better than the barbarians. Do you disagree ?
I think if ukip was still led by farage rather than walty mitty, may could have been in a bit of trouble with all those voters who have recently jumped ship.
Has Dr. Nuttall promised 100,000 gynecologists yet ?
I've been predicting for some time that immigration would fall by using the simple method of being so unpleasant to foreigners that they would get the message. Clearly that's working.
Yup. People like foreign care workers have thought *screw it* why should I deal with this unpleasantness. I'll go *home* or to X country, earn a little less, pay a lot less for my housing and make a life for myself there.
Our elderly must now pay much higher wages to (often) lower quality *British* careworkers - which will involve liquidating their housing assets en masse.
That's what they voted for.
Our elderly must pay the rate required for the care they need (alongside some councils who pay less than is required to cover unavoidable costs while paying someone the national living wage).
Whether Eastern Europeans go home or not the price of care is going to rise 50% or so simply because the tax avoidance measures and fake self-employment zero hour contracts many home care companies use have to disappear.
Also there is a very simple reason why immigration is down slightly. Last year you earned €1.30 for every £1 sterling now its €1.12. That's a 10% drop in wages compared to Germany...
Sterling is actually €1.155 and has generally been in the €1.15-1.20 band since last November, so while that's still down on this time last year, it's not as significant a drop as you make out.
I think if ukip was still led by farage rather than walty mitty, may could have been in a bit of trouble with all those voters who have recently jumped ship.
I agree with Francis
I reckon UKIP could yet get close to catching LDs
I certainly think UKIP's average % per seat will exceed the Lib Dems.
I've been predicting for some time that immigration would fall by using the simple method of being so unpleasant to foreigners that they would get the message. Clearly that's working.
It lacks the elegance of your method of ensuring Brexit by telling most Brits they're racist scum.
I'm sorry that it upsets you so much to be reminded that Brexit was secured through xenophobic lies, but it's the essential reason why Brexit is the enduring disaster of the age for the country.
People whose lives were ruined by mass immigration don't need politicians to lie for them to vote against it
How have the lives of pensioners living in low areas of immigration been ruined by mass immigration?
Believe it or not Southam, people do actually move from area to area. Shockingly, most retirees would like to live somewhere that does not make them feel like a foreigner in their own country.
This phenomenon will only accelerate as Britain becomes more diverse.
So how many pensioners have moved to the North East or the South Wales vallies? If you live in an area of low immigration, surely you are less likely to feel like a foreigner in your own country.
Good point; not many. The phenomenon I described is much more prevalent in the Home Counties and areas around the West Midlands conurbation. However, people in Merthyr and Alnwick know that if mass immigration is not significantly reduced, its effects will reach even them eventually.
The growth of nostalgia in politics is one of the most interesting trends. You see it both on the left and the right. It's a reaction to the massive change we're seeing in technology and globalisation.
I think if ukip was still led by farage rather than walty mitty, may could have been in a bit of trouble with all those voters who have recently jumped ship.
I agree with Francis
I reckon UKIP could yet get close to catching LDs
I certainly think UKIP's average % per seat will exceed the Lib Dems.
It depends. UKIP to Tory was the story of the first week of the campaign, but LibDem (and some SNP/Green) to Labour was the story of the second week. That too may reverse if Labour fails the security test.
I've been predicting for some time that immigration would fall by using the simple method of being so unpleasant to foreigners that they would get the message. Clearly that's working.
It lacks the elegance of your method of ensuring Brexit by telling most Brits they're racist scum.
I'm sorry that it upsets you so much to be reminded that Brexit was secured through xenophobic lies, but it's the essential reason why Brexit is the enduring disaster of the age for the country.
Or...Brexit was secured by hectoring, smug, superior arses, thinking that the argument for the EU was so fucking obvious that it made itself - but we'll gratuitously insult the intellects of the voters by the by.
These hand-wringers could have a) formulated the reasons why staying in the EU was full off benefits, even for the dumbest fucks in society b) made that case to them in measured terms c) got out to the hell-holes where these Leave voters lived and talked them over, on the doorsteps.
NOW they bitch and moan. Twelve months ago was the time to get engaged, if they truly thought it was the defining moment of our age.
What did you do in the Great Referendum War, daddy?
In your case, smirk while xenophobic lies were told.
How many people did you try and win over in Jaywick?
I was in Jaywick during the Clacton by-election and was astonished at how few immigrants there appeared to be there, and how much hostility there was to immigration.
Just watching Sky News and I'm struck by the media's desire to speculate wildly and without evidence on things. Yesterday they were claiming the flat raided at lunchtime was an 'air b and b' and have had to row back and explain that was false information. What purpose did reporting that yesterday serve? It's utterly irrelevant, and symptomatic of their need to seem like news hounds with their finger on the pulse. Dangerous idiots.
It filled time and the problem with 24 hour news is that you have to fill 24 hours with news even when there isn't any...
And an associated problem is that because they fill the spare time with discussion and opinion, that then becomes seen within the news teams as legitimate aspects of news-reporting, so filtering over into the bulletins proper.
NOW they bitch and moan. Twelve months ago was the time to get engaged, if they truly thought it was the defining moment of our age.
What did you do in the Great Referendum War, daddy?
The curse of the angry Leaver... Leave will never forgive the Remain campaign for being so weak that they lost the referendum, thereby forcing Brexitism to move beyond being an impotent cry of protest against Britain's place in the modern world.
The Brexit negotiations should really be considered the trial of Euroscepticism, and case for the prosecution is getting stronger by the day.
I think if ukip was still led by farage rather than walty mitty, may could have been in a bit of trouble with all those voters who have recently jumped ship.
I agree with Francis
I reckon UKIP could yet get close to catching LDs
I certainly think UKIP's average % per seat will exceed the Lib Dems.
UKIP not standing in a lot of seats.
Lib Dems just not standing in Buckingham because Tim Farron says he has been sufficiently intimidated by the Speaker to block the Region's selected candidate from standing.
I think if ukip was still led by farage rather than walty mitty, may could have been in a bit of trouble with all those voters who have recently jumped ship.
I agree with Francis
I reckon UKIP could yet get close to catching LDs
I certainly think UKIP's average % per seat will exceed the Lib Dems.
UKIP not standing in a lot of seats.
Lib Dems just not standing in Buckingham because Tim Farron says he has been sufficiently intimidated by the Speaker to block the Region's selected candidate from standing.
That's why I said per seat, not overall. A result of UKIP 5%, Lib Dem 8% would see the kipper vote average higher.
I think if ukip was still led by farage rather than walty mitty, may could have been in a bit of trouble with all those voters who have recently jumped ship.
I agree with Francis
I reckon UKIP could yet get close to catching LDs
I certainly think UKIP's average % per seat will exceed the Lib Dems.
UKIP not standing in a lot of seats.
Lib Dems just not standing in Buckingham because Tim Farron says he has been sufficiently intimidated by the Speaker to block the Region's selected candidate from standing.
@bbclaurak: UKIP putting attack on May at centre of manifesto launch - all but blaming her for Manchester because of policy during time at Home Office
It's a decent line of attack - haven't heard any response from the Cons to Manchester other than "more of the same approach".
I would be surprised that when GE starts again they don't come out talking tough as it will also able them to point at team twat and shout weak, danger to national security, etc etc etc.
It's moronic. Will these people not get old and receive pensions and social care?
A lot of them will return home to retire. But if they have paid tax all their working lives why shouldn't they get a pension like the rest of us?
So we impoverish ourselves two-fold; we increase the number of people in the country who will be net beneficiaries of public spending over their lifetime, and the number who will spend their pensions abroad, and thus worsen our balance of payments and other aspects of the economy.
I've been predicting for some time that immigration would fall by using the simple method of being so unpleasant to foreigners that they would get the message. Clearly that's working.
It lacks the elegance of your method of ensuring Brexit by telling most Brits they're racist scum.
I'm sorry that it upsets you so much to be reminded that Brexit was secured through xenophobic lies, but it's the essential reason why Brexit is the enduring disaster of the age for the country.
Or...Brexit was secured by hectoring, smug, superior arses, thinking that the argument for the EU was so fucking obvious that it made itself - but we'll gratuitously insult the intellects of the voters by the by.
These hand-wringers could have a) formulated the reasons why staying in the EU was full off benefits, even for the dumbest fucks in society b) made that case to them in measured terms c) got out to the hell-holes where these Leave voters lived and talked them over, on the doorsteps.
NOW they bitch and moan. Twelve months ago was the time to get engaged, if they truly thought it was the defining moment of our age.
What did you do in the Great Referendum War, daddy?
In your case, smirk while xenophobic lies were told.
Xenophobic is the lazy slur of the half-educated. Yes, the ancient Greeks were better than the barbarians. Do you disagree ?
Curiously, the Greeks themselves were by no means unanimous on that one. Alexander's adoption of Persian dress and customs is a case in point.
@bbclaurak: UKIP putting attack on May at centre of manifesto launch - all but blaming her for Manchester because of policy during time at Home Office
It's a decent line of attack - haven't heard any response from the Cons to Manchester other than "more of the same approach".
I would be surprised that when GE starts again they don't come out talking tough as it will also able them to point at team twat and shout weak, danger to national security, etc etc etc.
Probably - but I doubt there will be any new policies.
@bbclaurak: UKIP putting attack on May at centre of manifesto launch - all but blaming her for Manchester because of policy during time at Home Office
It's a decent line of attack - haven't heard any response from the Cons to Manchester other than "more of the same approach".
While the timing might not be ideal to make such a comment, the fact remains that the security services have done very well at preventing terrorism over the last decade or so and that stopping every attack is an impossible objective. The policy, practices and resources should certainly be reviewed post-Manchester but by and large, "more of the same" is probably a good starting point.
UKIP should have called on the candidate in my parents' constituency to draft their manifesto. Making the Circle Line back into a circle is humdrum compared with mining expeditions to the asteroid belt.
you know I have been thinking internment for the people who fight with ISIS and return here is necessary. As reluctant as I used to be, we are just understanding the scale of the problem. Ofcourse if possible we should stip them of citizenship aswell. Those Daily Mail comments are not even close to the maddest ones I've seen.
you know I have been thinking internment for the people who fight with ISIS and return here is necessary. As reluctant as I used to be, we are just understanding the scale of the problem. Ofcourse if possible we should stip them of citizenship aswell. Those Daily Mail comments are not even close to the maddest ones I've seen.
You should have listened to Lord Blair and Frank Gardner on the Today programme this morning. They knocked that one straight on the head.
Anyway, I think it's completely wrong to think that "the rest of the campaign is likely to be dominated by security concerns".
When Jo Cox was murdered people thought it would dominate the Brexit campaign, but within a few days it was as though it had never happened, as far as the campaign was concerned.
@bbclaurak: UKIP putting attack on May at centre of manifesto launch - all but blaming her for Manchester because of policy during time at Home Office
It's a decent line of attack - haven't heard any response from the Cons to Manchester other than "more of the same approach".
While the timing might not be ideal to make such a comment, the fact remains that the security services have done very well at preventing terrorism over the last decade or so and that stopping every attack is an impossible objective. The policy, practices and resources should certainly be reviewed post-Manchester but by and large, "more of the same" is probably a good starting point.
Thank goodness for a touch of common sense this mornng, David - like a breath of fresh air.
NOW they bitch and moan. Twelve months ago was the time to get engaged, if they truly thought it was the defining moment of our age.
What did you do in the Great Referendum War, daddy?
The curse of the angry Leaver... Leave will never forgive the Remain campaign for being so weak that they lost the referendum, thereby forcing Brexitism to move beyond being an impotent cry of protest against Britain's place in the modern world.
The Brexit negotiations should really be considered the trial of Euroscepticism, and case for the prosecution is getting stronger by the day.
Comments
"My goal is to encourage Scots to stay in Scotland, build their businesses and employ their fellow Scots."
Scots for Scotland !
Asking one general twice may lead to a large MoE.
Whether Eastern Europeans go home or not the price of care is going to rise 50% or so simply because the tax avoidance measures and fake self-employment zero hour contracts many home care companies use have to disappear.
Also there is a very simple reason why immigration is down slightly. Last year you earned €1.30 for every £1 sterling now its €1.12. That's a 10% drop in wages compared to Germany...
We don't need more baristas, car washers and Big Issue sellers.
As someone put it on here very well, Cons are saying we are all going to hell in a hand cart and we are the only ones able to drive the cart. Lab? Not sure (but then as a Tory I wouldn't spend time working it out - fairness I suppose but what does that mean?).
During the Falklands, info was far more forthcoming from the US than it was from the MOD iirc.
What purpose did reporting that yesterday serve? It's utterly irrelevant, and symptomatic of their need to seem like news hounds with their finger on the pulse. Dangerous idiots.
At the moment I think EU student pay same as UK. But post Brexit I expect that would change and lead to Europeans being hit by the higher fees charge to those from the rest of the world.
China on the other hand are willing to pay even more stupid money than uk.
https://twitter.com/tnyzm/status/867512476023365632
It filled time and the problem with 24 hour news is that you have to fill 24 hours with news even when there isn't any...
These hand-wringers could have
a) formulated the reasons why staying in the EU was full off benefits, even for the dumbest fucks in society
b) made that case to them in measured terms
c) got out to the hell-holes where these Leave voters lived and talked them over, on the doorsteps.
NOW they bitch and moan. Twelve months ago was the time to get engaged, if they truly thought it was the defining moment of our age.
What did you do in the Great Referendum War, daddy?
This phenomenon will only accelerate as Britain becomes more diverse.
There really isn't much that the Remain campaign could do to stop the Leave campaign stooping to such depths. But those in charge of the Leave campaign were too stupid to see that winning on those terms was itself a defeat.
https://twitter.com/robertfulton78/status/867128336056807424
(scroll down to the graph at 10:27)
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/live/2017/may/25/general-election-2017-campaign-resumes-may-nato-summit-politics-live
Lord Blair was on the Today programme this morning and said it was exactly the same back then. The UK police and security provided their US counterparts with sensitive information on the understanding that it would be handled sensitively, but it was leaked all over the media. The UK complained, as it has done this time, but nothing changed.
I reckon UKIP could yet get close to catching LDs
Potheads: DR MAX PEMBERTON asks if marijuana is a factor in jihadi murders as he says the liberal elite who push for looser drug laws should be shamed
https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2017/may/24/greg-gianforte-bodyslams-reporter-ben-jacobs-montana?CMP=edit_2221
Shocking
The Brexit negotiations should really be considered the trial of Euroscepticism, and case for the prosecution is getting stronger by the day.
What a bunch of meanies ^_~;;
Lib Dems just not standing in Buckingham because Tim Farron says he has been sufficiently intimidated by the Speaker to block the Region's selected candidate from standing.
Will the FBI be investigating this too?
When Jo Cox was murdered people thought it would dominate the Brexit campaign, but within a few days it was as though it had never happened, as far as the campaign was concerned.