Mr. Owls, if Labour tries comparing May to Corbyn on terrorism it won't go well for the self-declared friend of Hamas and Hezbollah.
Misquoting him again Mr Dancer as you must well know The Tories let the family in and Made Libya a terrorist haven May cut Police numbers by 200k May cut all the armed services numbers The police missed Abedi on Mays watch May told the Police in 2015 they were crying wolf over the effect of frontline cuts All this happened while the threat level was severe
Corbyn spoke to some Irish bloke 30 years ago well after Thatcher was doing so in secret
Jezza said keep murdering, Maggie said stop
bit of a difference
Yeah, and I don't recall Thatcher inviting Gerry Adams over for tea and biscuits a week after the Brighton bombing either.
Mr. Owls, if Labour tries comparing May to Corbyn on terrorism it won't go well for the self-declared friend of Hamas and Hezbollah.
Misquoting him again Mr Dancer as you must well know The Tories let the family in and Made Libya a terrorist haven May cut Police numbers by 200k May cut all the armed services numbers The police missed Abedi on Mays watch May told the Police in 2015 they were crying wolf over the effect of frontline cuts All this happened while the threat level was severe
Corbyn spoke to some Irish bloke 30 years ago well after Thatcher was doing so in secret
Jezza said keep murdering, Maggie said stop
bit of a difference
Yeah, and I don't recall Thatcher inviting Gerry Adams over for tea and biscuits a week after the Brighton bombing either.
Mr. Owls, if Labour tries comparing May to Corbyn on terrorism it won't go well for the self-declared friend of Hamas and Hezbollah.
Misquoting him again Mr Dancer as you must well know The Tories let the family in and Made Libya a terrorist haven May cut Police numbers by 200k May cut all the armed services numbers The police missed Abedi on Mays watch May told the Police in 2015 they were crying wolf over the effect of frontline cuts All this happened while the threat level was severe
Corbyn spoke to some Irish bloke 30 years ago well after Thatcher was doing so in secret
Jezza said keep murdering, Maggie said stop
bit of a difference
Keep murdering
That would be strange for a man who condemns all bombing
Who has fought for peace all his life.
Tories and Labour when they were the war criminal party vote for more bombing at every chance without a post war strategy making things worse each time.
Corbyn, McDonnell and Abbott wanted the enemy to win.
Mr. Owls, if Labour tries comparing May to Corbyn on terrorism it won't go well for the self-declared friend of Hamas and Hezbollah.
Misquoting him again Mr Dancer as you must well know The Tories let the family in and Made Libya a terrorist haven May cut Police numbers by 200k May cut all the armed services numbers The police missed Abedi on Mays watch May told the Police in 2015 they were crying wolf over the effect of frontline cuts All this happened while the threat level was severe
Corbyn spoke to some Irish bloke 30 years ago well after Thatcher was doing so in secret
Jezza said keep murdering, Maggie said stop
bit of a difference
Yeah, and I don't recall Thatcher inviting Gerry Adams over for tea and biscuits a week after the Brighton bombing either.
Mr. Owls, if Labour tries comparing May to Corbyn on terrorism it won't go well for the self-declared friend of Hamas and Hezbollah.
Misquoting him again Mr Dancer as you must well know The Tories let the family in and Made Libya a terrorist haven May cut Police numbers by 200k May cut all the armed services numbers The police missed Abedi on Mays watch May told the Police in 2015 they were crying wolf over the effect of frontline cuts All this happened while the threat level was severe
Corbyn spoke to some Irish bloke 30 years ago well after Thatcher was doing so in secret
Jezza said keep murdering, Maggie said stop
bit of a difference
Keep murdering
That would be strange for a man who condemns all bombing
Who has fought for peace all his life.
Tories and Labour when they were the war criminal party vote for more bombing at every chance without a post war strategy making things worse each time.
Fought for peace all his life? As the Ricky Jervais character in Extras says, "Are havin a laff?". Corbyn was a supporter of violent Republicanism throughout the Troubles. He never made a single attempt to achieve peace or reconciliation. He was not interested in dialogue, only in the victory of the IRA. This is a man who stood at a Troops Out rally in 1987 for a minute's silence to honour dead IRA terrorists, who was deeply involved in the ultra-left London Labour Briefing group which vigorously defended the Brighton bombing and who was arrested in 1986 at an Old Bailey demo in support of the IRA. He was an unabashed apologist for the Provisionals, Even the Irish nationalists in the the Labour Party, like Kevin McNamara, were appalled by him. As was I . I spent 10 years in Corbyn's Islington North Labour Party, becoming Assistant Secretary for several years, but as someone who was born and brought up in Belfast during the Troubles, I was always sickened by his Republicanism. I am afraid that you are indulging in a deceitful exercise in re-writing the history of my homeland.
Yet voted against the Peace Agreement in Northern Ireland. Bizarre.
This was debunked the other day (unless it has been undebunked).
Corbyn voted for the Good Friday Agreement but, along with Unionist and some Conservative MPs, against the earlier Anglo-Irish Agreement.
I spent half a day reading Hansard and couldn't definitely say he voted either way on the GF Agreement. He did speak against it though, and in favour of a united Ireland. He may have been one of the few abstainers.
THIS, however, could be bad for TMay. She was Home Secretary at the time. Though I suppose the argument is that it's more of a cock-up by MI5 or the cops. Hm.
That kind of thing drives me nuts. How on earth are they supposed to follow every single little whisper? Unless somebody can prove TM was handed the guy's name and address with a picture of him making a bomb, and she then forgot to tell somebody, I'd take it with a massive pinch of salt.
snip
It is a political point and you, Nick, should be embarrassed at making it.
You dont want a review of mistakes made in this case?
Why not?
Ah, the not so subtle use of the word "mistake" showing that you understand absolutely zilch about the process of intelligence analysis...
What would you call it a catastrophic fook up ....... ON MAYS WATCH?
I'm no fan of May by any means and yes the Tories talk a good game on security & immigration but fail to deliver, but she is up against Corbyn, McDonnell and Abbott. That's all that needs to be said.
You can tell that BJO is twitchy over this. In the 2015 spending review Osborne actually announced zero cuts in the police budgets ... “Now is the time to back our police and give them the tools do the job. I am today announcing there will be no cuts in the police budget at all. “There will be real terms protection for police funding. The police protect us, and we’re going to protect the police.” Protecting overall police spending in real terms means an increase of £900million in cash by 2019/20. At the same time there was announced a 30 per cent increase in the dedicated counter-terrorism budget. £2.8 billion will be spent through the Single Intelligence Account, which includes the budgets of MI5 and MI6, by 2021 – an increase of around a third. THe defence budget is being increased from £34 billion to £40 billion.
Mrs May was the Home Secretary who lobbied for these issues.
In 2015 She told the Police to stop crying wolf over cuts to police numbers and went on to say we must reform further. There is no ducking the fact that police spending will have to come down again.
NP he may have all sorts of negative indicators too - so perhaps he didn't post on some site or other, and he'd never visited some place, and he'd never eaten fish and chips without vinegar. You can't really put together all the binary flags that are against him without including all the binary flags that are with him. The only question really is was there a big red flag against his name - if there was and it wasn't followed up then that's bad. We can't though judge the process of raising those red flags with the incomplete information we have.
The media asking such questions is going to be a big part of the news in coming days
Omnium: sure - that's why I say it's difficult for us armchair critics to judge. But it's a reasonable quesition to want reviewed, and no, Topping, I don't think that's making a political point. I'd be surprised if Mrs May disagreed.
We'll never know though NP. Well maybe you will, but if you did you couldn't say. A post-outcome list of indicators isn't helpful in any way. Maybe England have lost all the football matches they've played on tuesdays following the 13th of the month.
The Americans seem to be making a point of ignoring the UK request to button up. It looks to me a bit like a very senior partner of two, in an intelligence and defence relationship, unashamedly stating who will be the boss.
THIS, however, could be bad for TMay. She was Home Secretary at the time. Though I suppose the argument is that it's more of a cock-up by MI5 or the cops. Hm.
That kind of thing drives me nuts. How on earth are they supposed to follow every single little whisper? Unless somebody can prove TM was handed the guy's name and address with a picture of him making a bomb, and she then forgot to tell somebody, I'd take it with a massive pinch of salt.
snip
It is a political point and you, Nick, should be embarrassed at making it.
You dont want a review of mistakes made in this case?
Why not?
Ah, the not so subtle use of the word "mistake" showing that you understand absolutely zilch about the process of intelligence analysis...
What would you call it a catastrophic fook up ....... ON MAYS WATCH?
I'm no fan of May by any means and yes the Tories talk a good game on security & immigration but fail to deliver, but she is up against Corbyn, McDonnell and Abbott. That's all that needs to be said.
You can tell that BJO is twitchy over this. In the 2015 spending review Osborne actually announced zero cuts in the police budgets ... “Now is the time to back our police and give them the tools do the job. I am today announcing there will be no cuts in the police budget at all. “There will be real terms protection for police funding. The police protect us, and we’re going to protect the police.” Protecting overall police spending in real terms means an increase of £900million in cash by 2019/20. At the same time there was announced a 30 per cent increase in the dedicated counter-terrorism budget. £2.8 billion will be spent through the Single Intelligence Account, which includes the budgets of MI5 and MI6, by 2021 – an increase of around a third. THe defence budget is being increased from £34 billion to £40 billion.
Mrs May was the Home Secretary who lobbied for these issues.
In 2015 She told the Police to stop crying wolf over cuts to police numbers and went on to say we must reform further. There is no ducking the fact that police spending will have to come down again.
Not sure increased police/spending would have helped. How many of those would be on counter-terrorism vs how many monitoring twitter. More spending dedicated to intelligence is what is needed.
My, the father and brother of the suicide bomber arrested for plotting terror attacks in Libya.
Nice family with nice friends
So, when and where were they radicalised.
I see big john is getting excited - so John, what do we do with all the people who are flagged as problems with extremist views?
Shall we remove their freedoms?
Shall we retain open door immigration or shut the borders?
Oh dear ex extremist (Adam something of quillian foundation) on sky pointing out it really is tenets of their faith that drive extremists - not exactly on message is he.
The guy was reported twice flew ISIS flags told everybody he knew he thought suicide bombers were right was flying off to Libyan training camps
Shall we remove their freedoms?
I would have thought stopping them visiting Libya in the circumstances would have been sensible
I guess had we not completely destabilised Libya that might not have been necessary
Shall we retain open door immigration or shut the borders?
May does the former at record levels whilst pretending to want to bring it down
I take it that the lunch pint at the Labour Club turned into an afternoon session.
These may sound like full board Tory points on the IRA etc, but actually they're not.
I'll name someone who definitely wasn't a Tory and deserves full credit, and made a massive contribution to peace in Northern Ireland.
Her name : Mo Mowlam.
SHE WAS the left wing voice of peace and reconciliation who fought hard to bring about a better Northern Ireland. How utterly disgusting to her memory that Diane Abbott, John McDonnell and Jeremy Corbyn are at the top of the Labour tree now.
Mr. Owls, if Labour tries comparing May to Corbyn on terrorism it won't go well for the self-declared friend of Hamas and Hezbollah.
Misquoting him again Mr Dancer as you must well know The Tories let the family in and Made Libya a terrorist haven May cut Police numbers by 200k May cut all the armed services numbers The police missed Abedi on Mays watch May told the Police in 2015 they were crying wolf over the effect of frontline cuts All this happened while the threat level was severe
Corbyn spoke to some Irish bloke 30 years ago well after Thatcher was doing so in secret
Jezza said keep murdering, Maggie said stop
bit of a difference
Keep murdering
That would be strange for a man who condemns all bombing
Who has fought for peace all his life.
Tories and Labour when they were the war criminal party vote for more bombing at every chance without a post war strategy making things worse each time.
Where's TSE's handy 'years since majority' bar chart when you need it?
Although you could also argue the last time a truly Thatcherite Tory Party, socially and economically rightwing, won was 30 years ago, even if May wins a majority
The Americans seem to be making a point of ignoring the UK request to button up. It looks to me a bit like a very senior partner of two, in an intelligence and defence relationship, unashamedly stating who will be the boss.
Suspect it has more to do with the Trump/Russia angle than anything else.
THIS, however, could be bad for TMay. She was Home Secretary at the time. Though I suppose the argument is that it's more of a cock-up by MI5 or the cops. Hm.
It is a political point and you, Nick, should be embarrassed at making it.
You dont want a review of mistakes made in this case?
Why not?
Ah, the not so subtle use of the word "mistake" showing that you understand absolutely zilch about the process of intelligence analysis...
What would you call it a catastrophic fook up ....... ON MAYS WATCH?
I'm no fan of May by any means and yes the Tories talk a good game on security & immigration but fail to deliver, but she is up against Corbyn, McDonnell and Abbott. That's all that needs to be said.
You can tell that BJO is twitchy over this. In the 2015 spending review Osborne actually announced zero cuts in the police budgets ... “Now is the time to back our police and give them the tools do the job. I am today announcing there will be no cuts in the police budget at all. “There will be real terms protection for police funding. The police protect us, and we’re going to protect the police.” Protecting overall police spending in real terms means an increase of £900million in cash by 2019/20. At the same time there was announced a 30 per cent increase in the dedicated counter-terrorism budget. £2.8 billion will be spent through the Single Intelligence Account, which includes the budgets of MI5 and MI6, by 2021 – an increase of around a third. THe defence budget is being increased from £34 billion to £40 billion.
Mrs May was the Home Secretary who lobbied for these issues.
In 2015 She told the Police to stop crying wolf over cuts to police numbers and went on to say we must reform further. There is no ducking the fact that police spending will have to come down again.
No ducking the fact that you are talking a load of Horlicks. Its not simply the police but the security services, like MI5, who follow up terrorist leads and watch prime suspects 24 hours a day - something which is very stressful and takes up huge resources. The budgets for GCHQ and MI5 have been increased staff numbers are being increased and May as Home Secretary will have had a big say in this.
Your dead cat is failing to bounce - have the decency to go out and bury it.
The Americans seem to be making a point of ignoring the UK request to button up. It looks to me a bit like a very senior partner of two, in an intelligence and defence relationship, unashamedly stating who will be the boss.
That presumes there is a functioning chain of command actively taking decisions.......rather than anarchy.....
THIS, however, could be bad for TMay. She was Home Secretary at the time. Though I suppose the argument is that it's more of a cock-up by MI5 or the cops. Hm.
It is a political point and you, Nick, should be embarrassed at making it.
You dont want a review of mistakes made in this case?
Why not?
Ah, the not so subtle use of the word "mistake" showing that you understand absolutely zilch about the process of intelligence analysis...
What would you call it a catastrophic fook up ....... ON MAYS WATCH?
I'm no fan of May by any means and yes the Tories talk a good game on security & immigration but fail to deliver, but she is up against Corbyn, McDonnell and Abbott. That's all that needs to be said.
You can tell that BJO is twitchy over this. In the 2015 spending review Osborne actually announced zero cuts in the police budgets ... “Now is the time to back our police and give them the tools do the job. I am today announcing there will be no cuts in the police budget at all. “There will be real terms protection for police funding. The police protect us, and we’re going to protect the police.” Protecting overall police spending in real terms means an increase of £900million in cash by 2019/20. At the same time there was announced a 30 per cent increase in the dedicated counter-terrorism budget. £2.8 billion will be spent through the Single Intelligence Account, which includes the budgets of MI5 and MI6, by 2021 – an increase of around a third. THe defence budget is being increased from £34 billion to £40 billion.
Mrs May was the Home Secretary who lobbied for these issues.
In 2015 She told the Police to stop crying wolf over cuts to police numbers and went on to say we must reform further. There is no ducking the fact that police spending will have to come down again.
Not sure increased police/spending would have helped. How many of those would be on counter-terrorism vs how many monitoring twitter. More spending dedicated to intelligence is what is needed.
Two friends of mine have just retired from the Police after long careers. They tell me morale has never been so low due to the incessant cuts and increasing workload. Yet the May apologists pretend this cannot be reversed through increased spending.
Yet voted against the Peace Agreement in Northern Ireland. Bizarre.
This was debunked the other day (unless it has been undebunked).
Corbyn voted for the Good Friday Agreement but, along with Unionist and some Conservative MPs, against the earlier Anglo-Irish Agreement.
I spent half a day reading Hansard and couldn't definitely say he voted either way on the GF Agreement. He did speak against it though, and in favour of a united Ireland. He may have been one of the few abstainers.
He voted for the Northern Ireland Bill, which established the NI Assembly, at both second and third reading, but I can't immediately find a debate on the GFA itself.
The Americans seem to be making a point of ignoring the UK request to button up. It looks to me a bit like a very senior partner of two, in an intelligence and defence relationship, unashamedly stating who will be the boss.
Suspect it has more to do with the Trump/Russia angle than anything else.
How? I would have thought this plays into Trump's hands by making them look out of control.
Mr. Owls, if Labour tries comparing May to Corbyn on terrorism it won't go well for the self-declared friend of Hamas and Hezbollah.
Misquoting him again Mr Dancer as you must well know The Tories let the family in and Made Libya a terrorist haven May cut Police numbers by 200k May cut all the armed services numbers The police missed Abedi on Mays watch May told the Police in 2015 they were crying wolf over the effect of frontline cuts All this happened while the threat level was severe
Corbyn spoke to some Irish bloke 30 years ago well after Thatcher was doing so in secret
Jezza said keep murdering, Maggie said stop
bit of a difference
Keep murdering
That would be strange for a man who condemns all bombing
Who has fought for peace all his life.
Tories and Labour when they were the war criminal party vote for more bombing at every chance without a post war strategy making things worse each time.
Fought for peace all his life? As the Ricky Jervais character in Extras says, "Are havin a laff?". Corbyn was a supporter of violent Republicanism throughout the Troubles. He never made a single attempt to achieve peace or reconciliation. He was not interested in dialogue, only in the victory of the IRA. This is a man who stood at a Troops Out rally in 1987 for a minute's silence to honour dead IRA terrorists, who was deeply involved in the ultra-left London Labour Briefing group which vigorously defended the Brighton bombing and who was arrested in 1986 at an Old Bailey demo in support of the IRA. He was an unabashed apologist for the Provisionals, Even the Irish nationalists in the the Labour Party, like Kevin McNamara, were appalled by him. As was I . I spent 10 years in Corbyn's Islington North Labour Party, becoming Assistant Secretary for several years, but as someone who was born and brought up in Belfast during the Troubles, I was always sickened by his Republicanism. I am afraid that you are indulging in a deceitful exercise in re-writing the history of my homeland.
Can anyone point to a moment in modern British history when someone failed to declare that morale in any part of public sector workforce - police, teachers, lecturers, social workers, doctors, nurses, local government officials, civil servants etc - had "never been so low." I have been hearing this dreary mantra throughout my adult life.
Two friends of mine have just retired from the Police after long careers. They tell me morale has never been so low due to the incessant cuts and increasing workload. Yet the May apologists pretend this cannot be reversed through increased spending.
Robotic leader, robotic leadees.
I don't think I said that, I just said it probably wouldn't have actually made much difference because the overwhelming majority of any new officers would not be doing anything related to counter-terrorism.
These may sound like full board Tory points on the IRA etc, but actually they're not.
I'll name someone who definitely wasn't a Tory and deserves full credit, and made a massive contribution to peace in Northern Ireland.
Her name : Mo Mowlam.
SHE WAS the leftYes. wing voice of peace and reconciliation who fought hard to bring about a better Northern Ireland. How utterly disgusting to her memory that Diane Abbott, John McDonnell and Jeremy Corbyn are at the top of the Labour tree now.
In other words as Labour Uncut point out, 'This is not the argument of a lonely peacemaker, working to achieve dialogue with an intransigent IRA, but that of someone who deferred to Sinn Féin’s then-policy on Irish issues.' and 'Corbyn’s talks did not produce anything of the framework upon which the Good Friday Agreement and the rest of the peace process was built.'
These may sound like full board Tory points on the IRA etc, but actually they're not.
I'll name someone who definitely wasn't a Tory and deserves full credit, and made a massive contribution to peace in Northern Ireland.
Her name : Mo Mowlam.
SHE WAS the left wing voice of peace and reconciliation who fought hard to bring about a better Northern Ireland. How utterly disgusting to her memory that Diane Abbott, John McDonnell and Jeremy Corbyn are at the top of the Labour tree now.
There's also a true Labour man who is probably spinning in his grave at the likes of Corbyn.
Roy Mason, absolute legend and top Yorkshireman, was Labour's Northern Ireland Secretary between 1976 and 1979
His years in Ulster saw more terrible atrocities, among them the IRA's special achievement in burning to death 12 party-goers at La Mon House Hotel. And yet terrorist violence was contained and diminished. In 1976 there were 297 deaths in the province; in the next three years the figures were 112, 81, 113 and it was an IRA man who acknowledged that "we were almost beaten by Mason".
Not surprisingly he was admired by many Unionists (although he had no time for Ian Paisley and loathed the loyalist extremists). But the greatest compliments to Mason have come from the other side. Even now Sinn Fein and the large penumbra of republican fellow-travellers in Ulster and Dublin spit at the mention of Mason's name. And for why? Quite simply because, as Martin McGuinness said, "Mason beat the shit out of us".
The Americans seem to be making a point of ignoring the UK request to button up. It looks to me a bit like a very senior partner of two, in an intelligence and defence relationship, unashamedly stating who will be the boss.
Suspect it has more to do with the Trump/Russia angle than anything else.
How? I would have thought this plays into Trump's hands by making them look out of control.
It could even be Trump's people doing the leaking!
Can anyone point to a moment in modern British history when someone failed to declare that morale in any part of public sector workforce - police, teachers, lecturers, social workers, doctors, nurses, local government officials, civil servants etc - had "never been so low." I have been hearing this dreary mantra throughout my adult life.
It's right up there with "the NHS is on the point of collapse".
Can anyone point to a moment in modern British history when someone failed to declare that morale in any part of public sector workforce - police, teachers, lecturers, social workers, doctors, nurses, local government officials, civil servants etc - had "never been so low." I have been hearing this dreary mantra throughout my adult life.
They tend to complain less under Labour governments, even New Labour, than they do under Tory governments but then the private sector complains more when the Tories get in but which party is in power does not normally that much difference to their fortunes more the character and abilities of the figures in No 10 and No 11
These may sound like full board Tory points on the IRA etc, but actually they're not.
I'll name someone who definitely wasn't a Tory and deserves full credit, and made a massive contribution to peace in Northern Ireland.
Her name : Mo Mowlam.
SHE WAS the left wing voice of peace and reconciliation who fought hard to bring about a better Northern Ireland. How utterly disgusting to her memory that Diane Abbott, John McDonnell and Jeremy Corbyn are at the top of the Labour tree now.
There's no history in this though. May, Corbyn, Farron - they're all almost certain to be wrong in how they see the future. Even if they were right then their cures for our future ills are almost certain to be wrong too. The question we face when electing a government is basically who will mess us up the least in times of quiet, and who will make the least bad decisions in times of peril. Allowing politicians to actually do stuff isn't a good plan. We should be very circumspect - they do have a history.
Can anyone point to a moment in modern British history when someone failed to declare that morale in any part of public sector workforce - police, teachers, lecturers, social workers, doctors, nurses, local government officials, civil servants etc - had "never been so low." I have been hearing this dreary mantra throughout my adult life.
It's right up there with "the NHS is on the point of collapse".
And 'The most vicious GE Campaign in living memory' (only applies to those younger than 4 or 5....)
Question for RobD (I think, apologies if I have this wrong).
After the Conservative manifesto you were I think pleased that there would be a change to fptp for Mayor and Police Commissioner elections. The only arguments I can recall for fptp is a (usually) decisive result in an election (ie one party wins a majority) and the link between the elected and electors by constituency. As both these are irrelevant to these elections what is the justification to going for fptp and what is the reasoning of Conservatives to make this change?
Question for RobD (I think, apologies if I have this wrong).
After the Conservative manifesto you were I think pleased that there would be a change to fptp for Mayor and Police Commissioner elections. The only arguments I can recall for fptp is a (usually) decisive result in an election (ie one party wins a majority) and the link between the elected and electors by constituency. As both these are irrelevant to these elections what is the justification to going for fptp and what is the reasoning of Conservatives to make this change?
Other than FPTP is the most superb voting system known to man?
In all seriousness, yeah.. for elections like these I think there is a strong argument for including preferences in the voting system. Still seems unfair that the losers get multiple picks though.
Mr. Owls, if Labour tries comparing May to Corbyn on terrorism it won't go well for the self-declared friend of Hamas and Hezbollah.
Misquoting him again Mr Dancer as you must well know The Tories let the family in and Made Libya a terrorist haven May cut Police numbers by 200k May cut all the armed services numbers The police missed Abedi on Mays watch May told the Police in 2015 they were crying wolf over the effect of frontline cuts All this happened while the threat level was severe
Corbyn spoke to some Irish bloke 30 years ago well after Thatcher was doing so in secret
Jezza said keep murdering, Maggie said stop
bit of a difference
Keep murdering
That would be strange for a man who condemns all bombing
Who has fought for peace all his life.
Tories and Labour when they were the war criminal party vote for more bombing at every chance without a post war strategy making things worse each time.
Fought for peace all his life? As the Ricky Jervais character in Extras says, "Are havin a laff?". Corbyn was a supporter of violent Republicanism throughout the Troubles. He never made a single attempt to achieve peace or reconciliation. He was not interested in dialogue, only in the victory of the IRA. This is a man who stood at a Troops Out rally in 1987 for a minute's silence to honour dead IRA terrorists, who was deeply involved in the ultra-left London Labour Briefing group which vigorously defended the Brighton bombing and who was arrested in 1986 at an Old Bailey demo in support of the IRA. He was an unabashed apologist for the Provisionals, Even the Irish nationalists in the the Labour Party, like Kevin McNamara, were appalled by him. As was I . I spent 10 years in Corbyn's Islington North Labour Party, becoming Assistant Secretary for several years, but as someone who was born and brought up in Belfast during the Troubles, I was always sickened by his Republicanism. I am afraid that you are indulging in a deceitful exercise in re-writing the history of my homeland.
Honest to good f**k, those looking for any party political partisan angle on Manchester, wise up. Political facts in a situation are not the same as seeing everything through your party colours.
Police resources: In NI, where active human and technical watch activity was less than 150 targets at most, there were around 8,500 regular police officers and about 4500-5000 reservists many of whom were full time. You 10's of thousands of UK military at peak, you had 6000 UDR. You had MI5 and to a smaller extent had MI6.
You had a quite widespread informant network that took about 10 years to build and grew into a monster.
Even with extensive resources and sources like that, far in excess of anything the UK government has to hand in proportion today, they had to rely heavily on informants as well as routine policing activities because they just didn't have enough to keep watch on all critical people in the way some people think you can.
You can't, get over it.
There are several hundred Abedis alone, travellers who raise suspicion. are seen in the wrong places, but don't have any firm action behind them on domestic soil. On top you have former fighters, proper grenade throwing, trigger pulling types, you have logistics support, facilitators, encouragers many of which might just decide to go to Allah even after you weed out those who won't do the pointy stick bit yet still may be of high interest. Several thousand then. Chances are they are picking sub-two hundred to sit on at any one time.
As for Libya, anyone who can remember the apparently off topic rantings of this madman back in 2016 in particular will see a few posts on Islamic extremists working out of Libya, training and inserting people into Europe and reports on Western military interest.
Anyone who thinks Islamic extremists just popped up after Gaddafi went forget it, again talking through their party political hole, get an education. They have been churning out high grade extremists for decades.
Mr. Owls, if Labour tries comparing May to Corbyn on terrorism it won't go well for the self-declared friend of Hamas and Hezbollah.
Misquoting him again Mr Dancer as you must well know The Tories let the family in and Made Libya a terrorist haven May cut Police numbers by 200k May cut all the armed services numbers The police missed Abedi on Mays watch May told the Police in 2015 they were crying wolf over the effect of frontline cuts All this happened while the threat level was severe
Corbyn spoke to some Irish bloke 30 years ago well after Thatcher was doing so in secret
Jezza said keep murdering, Maggie said stop
bit of a difference
Keep murdering
That would be strange for a man who condemns all bombing
Who has fought for peace all his life.
Tories and Labour when they were the war criminal party vote for more bombing at every chance without a post war strategy making things worse each time.
Where's TSE's handy 'years since majority' bar chart when you need it?
Although you could also argue the last time a truly Thatcherite Tory Party, socially and economically rightwing, won was 30 years ago, even if May wins a majority
In the interests of fairness I think this shows it's time for a Liberal government.
I have read so many posts on PB (and other sites) and I could hold back no longer !
When are the good people of the UK going to 'wake up' and realise the dangers of electing a Labour government (particularly this one) - I mean come on do you really want the likes of comrades Corbyn, McDonnell, Long-Bailey, Rayner, Abbott and Thornberry running the country...........??
They couldn't run a bath let alone the fifth biggest economy in the developed world - they are both fiscally and (in most cases) morally 'inept'.
Wake up people they will BANKRUPT the country............AGAIN !!
And then there is Farron and Sturgeon - don't get me started on them...........what is it with them, there is no SOFT Brexit or HARD/EXTREME Brexit...........it is just Brexit for gods sake........AAAAARRRRRGGGGGHHHHHH.
Believe me I am no die hard fan of the Conservatives, and in particular TM, but there really is no other choice this time around - we must extinguish these Marxist 'muppets' once and for all.
That's all I have to say for now - have got it off my chest and need to go and lie down in a dark room until 8 June !!!!!
Fought for peace all his life? (...) Corbyn was a supporter of violent Republicanism throughout the Troubles. He never made a single attempt to achieve peace or reconciliation. He was not interested in dialogue, only in the victory of the IRA. This is a man who stood at a Troops Out rally in 1987 for a minute's silence to honour dead IRA terrorists, who was deeply involved in the ultra-left London Labour Briefing group which vigorously defended the Brighton bombing and who was arrested in 1986 at an Old Bailey demo in support of the IRA. He was an unabashed apologist for the Provisionals, Even the Irish nationalists in the the Labour Party, like Kevin McNamara, were appalled by him. As was I. I spent 10 years in Corbyn's Islington North Labour Party, becoming Assistant Secretary for several years, but as someone who was born and brought up in Belfast during the Troubles, I was always sickened by his Republicanism. I am afraid that you are indulging in a deceitful exercise in re-writing the history of my homeland.
Leo, you didn't mention that you write for the Sunday Telegraph, Daily Mail, and Daily Express, nor that you have written that Harriet Harman pushes "feminist fascism". London Labour Briefing was not "ultra left". Some were Trotskyists, some were left social democrats. "Ultra-leftists" oppose Leninism and social democracy and reject parliamentarism. Most also reject national liberationism. Nor did you mention that you are an Ulster Protestant (so I'd be more interested in your view of the UDA) and that in 1999 you called Gerry Adams a "hero of the peace process".
In 1999 you wrote:
"Despite the success of the Northern Ireland peace process, a querulous spirit of hostility still prevails in some unionist circles. Clinging to the ancient certainties of a divided Ulster, some continue to predict-even desire-disaster. (...) At every turn, from the Stormont talks to the referendum, they have been wrong."
"And on no single issue have they been more completely wrong than on Gerry Adams’s leadership of Irish Republicanism. We have heard all sorts of warnings: that Adams was just using the talks as a manoeuvre to disarm the security forces or get his people out of prison; that the IRA would split over the peace deal; that he would never renounce violence. None of this has happened. Instead, Adams has achieved what was unthinkable a decade ago: compelling Republicans to abandon armed struggle while recognising the principle of consent for the people of Ulster. Adams should now be seen as a hero of the peace process (...)"
"When the peace process began in the early 1990s, I was cynical about Adams. But, as the pace of the talks quickened, and the second IRA ceasefire held, I gradually came to admire the way that Adams had persuaded Republicans to abandon the armalite."
Comments
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-16366413
That's the difference.
https://twitter.com/thinkdefence/status/867439055696523268
https://twitter.com/thinkdefence/status/867439101091426304
https://twitter.com/thinkdefence/status/867439238526234624
we must reform further.
There is no ducking the fact that police spending will have to come down again.
I'll name someone who definitely wasn't a Tory and deserves full credit, and made a massive contribution to peace in Northern Ireland.
Her name : Mo Mowlam.
SHE WAS the left wing voice of peace and reconciliation who fought hard to bring about a better Northern Ireland.
How utterly disgusting to her memory that Diane Abbott, John McDonnell and Jeremy Corbyn are at the top of the Labour tree now.
Its not simply the police but the security services, like MI5, who follow up terrorist leads and watch prime suspects 24 hours a day - something which is very stressful and takes up huge resources. The budgets for GCHQ and MI5 have been increased staff numbers are being increased and May as Home Secretary will have had a big say in this.
Your dead cat is failing to bounce - have the decency to go out and bury it.
Labour Uncut -
http://labour-uncut.co.uk/2015/08/07/the-idea-that-jeremy-corbyn-laid-the-foundations-for-peace-in-northern-ireland-is-total-fantasy/
''The idea that Jeremy Corbyn laid the foundations for peace in Northern Ireland is total fantasy''
In opposing the '85 Anglo Irish Agreement Corbyn said ... 'We believe that the agreement strengthens rather than weakens the border between the six and the twenty-six counties, and those of us who wish to see a united Ireland oppose the agreement for that reason.'
In other words as Labour Uncut point out, 'This is not the argument of a lonely peacemaker, working to achieve dialogue with an intransigent IRA, but that of someone who deferred to Sinn Féin’s then-policy on Irish issues.'
and
'Corbyn’s talks did not produce anything of the framework upon which the Good Friday Agreement and the rest of the peace process was built.'
Roy Mason, absolute legend and top Yorkshireman, was Labour's Northern Ireland Secretary between 1976 and 1979
His years in Ulster saw more terrible atrocities, among them the IRA's special achievement in burning to death 12 party-goers at La Mon House Hotel. And yet terrorist violence was contained and diminished. In 1976 there were 297 deaths in the province; in the next three years the figures were 112, 81, 113 and it was an IRA man who acknowledged that "we were almost beaten by Mason".
Not surprisingly he was admired by many Unionists (although he had no time for Ian Paisley and loathed the loyalist extremists). But the greatest compliments to Mason have come from the other side. Even now Sinn Fein and the large penumbra of republican fellow-travellers in Ulster and Dublin spit at the mention of Mason's name. And for why? Quite simply because, as Martin McGuinness said, "Mason beat the shit out of us".
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/comment/personal-view/3604965/A-happy-80th-birthday-to-the-IRAs-most-deadly-foe.html
After the Conservative manifesto you were I think pleased that there would be a change to fptp for Mayor and Police Commissioner elections. The only arguments I can recall for fptp is a (usually) decisive result in an election (ie one party wins a majority) and the link between the elected and electors by constituency. As both these are irrelevant to these elections what is the justification to going for fptp and what is the reasoning of Conservatives to make this change?
https://twitter.com/IainDale/status/867444585685020673
In all seriousness, yeah.. for elections like these I think there is a strong argument for including preferences in the voting system. Still seems unfair that the losers get multiple picks though.
Police resources: In NI, where active human and technical watch activity was less than 150 targets at most, there were around 8,500 regular police officers and about 4500-5000 reservists many of whom were full time. You 10's of thousands of UK military at peak, you had 6000 UDR. You had MI5 and to a smaller extent had MI6.
You had a quite widespread informant network that took about 10 years to build and grew into a monster.
Even with extensive resources and sources like that, far in excess of anything the UK government has to hand in proportion today, they had to rely heavily on informants as well as routine policing activities because they just didn't have enough to keep watch on all critical people in the way some people think you can.
You can't, get over it.
There are several hundred Abedis alone, travellers who raise suspicion. are seen in the wrong places, but don't have any firm action behind them on domestic soil. On top you have former fighters, proper grenade throwing, trigger pulling types, you have logistics support, facilitators, encouragers many of which might just decide to go to Allah even after you weed out those who won't do the pointy stick bit yet still may be of high interest. Several thousand then. Chances are they are picking sub-two hundred to sit on at any one time.
As for Libya, anyone who can remember the apparently off topic rantings of this madman back in 2016 in particular will see a few posts on Islamic extremists working out of Libya, training and inserting people into Europe and reports on Western military interest.
Anyone who thinks Islamic extremists just popped up after Gaddafi went forget it, again talking through their party political hole, get an education. They have been churning out high grade extremists for decades.
http://m.huffpost.com/uk/entry/uk_5925d9f0e4b062f96a336e5f
When are the good people of the UK going to 'wake up' and realise the dangers of electing a Labour government (particularly this one) - I mean come on do you really want the likes of comrades Corbyn, McDonnell, Long-Bailey, Rayner, Abbott and Thornberry running the country...........??
They couldn't run a bath let alone the fifth biggest economy in the developed world - they are both fiscally and (in most cases) morally 'inept'.
Wake up people they will BANKRUPT the country............AGAIN !!
And then there is Farron and Sturgeon - don't get me started on them...........what is it with them, there is no SOFT Brexit or HARD/EXTREME Brexit...........it is just Brexit for gods sake........AAAAARRRRRGGGGGHHHHHH.
Believe me I am no die hard fan of the Conservatives, and in particular TM, but there really is no other choice this time around - we must extinguish these Marxist 'muppets' once and for all.
That's all I have to say for now - have got it off my chest and need to go and lie down in a dark room until 8 June !!!!!
In 1999 you wrote:
"Despite the success of the Northern Ireland peace process, a querulous spirit of hostility still prevails in some unionist circles. Clinging to the ancient certainties of a divided Ulster, some continue to predict-even desire-disaster. (...) At every turn, from the Stormont talks to the referendum, they have been wrong."
"And on no single issue have they been more completely wrong than on Gerry Adams’s leadership of Irish Republicanism. We have heard all sorts of warnings: that Adams was just using the talks as a manoeuvre to disarm the security forces or get his people out of prison; that the IRA would split over the peace deal; that he would never renounce violence. None of this has happened. Instead, Adams has achieved what was unthinkable a decade ago: compelling Republicans to abandon armed struggle while recognising the principle of consent for the people of Ulster. Adams should now be seen as a hero of the peace process (...)"
"When the peace process began in the early 1990s, I was cynical about Adams. But, as the pace of the talks quickened, and the second IRA ceasefire held, I gradually came to admire the way that Adams had persuaded Republicans to abandon the armalite."