When Cameron went to the EU early last year and asked for a few puny concessions that didn't nearly go far enough anyway and he was more or less told to F-Off I personally felt humiliated and angry...
That highlights perfectly Cameron's huge presentational failing in the run-up to the referendum. He thought the charade of pretending to renegotiate would get people on his side but instead he just insulted their intelligence.
Sadly I believe the humiliation and anger will be magnified many times over when the EU is similarly unmoved by our demands for an exit deal all on our terms so we can continue to buy their BMWs and prosecco...
They will wake up when they find that the EU is not budging on the single market. Our Leave liars kept on telling their electorate that with the trade deficit and what not the EU will have no choice but give us non tariff entry.
Bollocks, they will. How many BMW cars will not be sold here even with a 10% tariff. I will still buy it.
Good for you. Others in the same hypothetical situation might prefer a 10% more specced up Jag.
Looks like the Tories might be favourites to win the mayoralty in the West Midlands. Burnham should be okay in Greater Manchester though.
As SO and I have been saying for months, Labour will not win in the West Midlands with the current Labour leadership. Many voters will not forgive the past of Corbo and McMao.
I'm more baffled by the fact that Sion Simon was the answer to any question other than, 'who is the candidate most likely to lose the mayoralty for us?'
TBH I don't think the West Midlands will tell us much either way for that reason, and Corbyn could with some justification pass it off as the electorate rejecting a failed New Labour muppet with no ideas and no will to help ordinary people. Even though Corbyn's unpopularity may exaggerate the scale of the defeat, he will not be the sole reason for it (conversely, however, if by some fluke Simon wins Corbyn should not assume that's an endorsement of his new politics).
You could make a case that the real turning point that led to Brexit was that debate he did with Farage in 2014 in which his approach was found wanting. That should have been a wake up call that mealy-mouthed platitudes wouldn't cut it and the pro-Europeans needed some passion and conviction.
That might have been a strong clue but it really just revealed a reality that went back years. Yes, pro-Europeans should have been making a more positive case but I doubt that even that would have worked.
If you want a date for when the Brexit process began, I give you 8 September 1988.
And I give you 1 January 1973 Leaving was inevitable. It was just the timing.
No, I don't think it was inevitable. There was no inevitability about Delors embarking on either the social programme or the single currency. Sure, the single currency had long been a project the EEC (initially) was keen on - it was a stated objective before Britain joined - but it had been kicked into the long grass for while over a decade before Delors resurrected it. It's also true that Mitterrand and Kohl were keen on the Euro due to what they perceived as the consequences of the end of the Cold War and of German reunification. But again, would it have happened without Delors' guiding hand (and Delors was the exception - no other EU Commission president has gained such power)?
Had the EC decided that the Single Market was the limit of its realistic ambitions, whatever the treaties might say, then Britain would still be a member. And given that it took 40 years just to complete most of the Single Market - a process that still isn't complete in some sectors - that's far from unrealistic.
We don't have an alternative history to judge but I think that if there had been no Eurozone at the time of the 2008 crisis, the idea would have been resurrected at that point as a way of shielding the likes of Greece from being attacked by currency speculators.
Here was I thinking Greece needed to devalue......
Devaluation is no answer . The UK has been devaluing the £ for 70 years without success .
1.1.1953 £1 = DEM 11.70
15.4.2017 £1= DEM 2.3074 [ € 1.179 ]
Devaluation is just a drug ! A short term fix. The problem with this country is productivity. WE produce 20% less per day than the Germans and the French.
43 dead in Syria today. But no posts here on PB. The "wrong" people died. And Jabhat-Al-Nusra are now our allies !
50 people die in Syria every day, don't they? Every one a horror, every one a sadness. But it's a civil war. They are notoriously nasty. What should we do? Bomb them like Trump?
I say: Leave Well Alone, and maybe hope Assad wins. As the least worst of several deeply evil options.
President Assad is actually the only secular leader left.
When Cameron went to the EU early last year and asked for a few puny concessions that didn't nearly go far enough anyway and he was more or less told to F-Off I personally felt humiliated and angry...
That highlights perfectly Cameron's huge presentational failing in the run-up to the referendum. He thought the charade of pretending to renegotiate would get people on his side but instead he just insulted their intelligence.
Sadly I believe the humiliation and anger will be magnified many times over when the EU is similarly unmoved by our demands for an exit deal all on our terms so we can continue to buy their BMWs and prosecco...
They will wake up when they find that the EU is not budging on the single market. Our Leave liars kept on telling their electorate that with the trade deficit and what not the EU will have no choice but give us non tariff entry.
Bollocks, they will. How many BMW cars will not be sold here even with a 10% tariff. I will still buy it.
Good for you. Others in the same hypothetical situation might prefer a 10% more specced up Jag.
43 dead in Syria today. But no posts here on PB. The "wrong" people died. And Jabhat-Al-Nusra are now our allies !
50 people die in Syria every day, don't they? Every one a horror, every one a sadness. But it's a civil war. They are notoriously nasty. What should we do? Bomb them like Trump?
I say: Leave Well Alone, and maybe hope Assad wins. As the least worst of several deeply evil options.
President Assad is actually the only secular leader left.
That's not the only criteria for good leadership. Stalin was fully secular and frequently very anti-religious, but I wouldn't hold him up as a model of good governance.
What a cocksucker Clegg is. Leader of the party which proudly promised an in/out referendum it knew it would never have to deliver, because they would never win. Then, when just such a referendum was offered, it was suddenly a loathsome error and morally wrong?
He is the most odious hypocrite. He should leave politics in shame.
You could make a case that the real turning point that led to Brexit was that debate he did with Farage in 2014 in which his approach was found wanting. That should have been a wake up call that mealy-mouthed platitudes wouldn't cut it and the pro-Europeans needed some passion and conviction.
That might have been a strong clue but it really just revealed a reality that went back years. Yes, pro-Europeans should have been making a more positive case but I doubt that even that would have worked.
If you want a date for when the Brexit process began, I give you 8 September 1988.
And I give you 1 January 1973 Leaving was inevitable. It was just the timing.
No, I don't think it was inevitable. There was no inevitability about Delors embarking on either the social programme or the single currency. Sure, the single currency had long been a project (snip). But again, would it have happened without Delors' guiding hand (and Delors was the exception - no other EU Commission president has gained such power)?
years just to complete most of the Single Market - a process that still isn't complete in some sectors - that's far from unrealistic.
We don't have an alternative history to judge but I think that if there had been no Eurozone at the time of the 2008 crisis, the idea would have been resurrected at that point as a way of shielding the likes of Greece from being attacked by currency speculators.
Here was I thinking Greece needed to devalue......
Devaluation is no answer . The UK has been devaluing the £ for 70 years without success .
Sorry Mark, you are the last person I would listen to on Economics.
Hell, you missed the mother of all recessions if I recall.
The EU is set to inflict a double humiliation on Theresa May, stripping Britain of its European agencies within weeks, while formally rejecting the prime minister’s calls for early trade talks.
The Observer has learned that EU diplomats agreed their uncompromising position at a crunch meeting on Tuesday, held to set out the union’s strategy in the talks due to start next month.
A beauty contest between member states who want the European banking and medicine agencies, currently located in London, will begin within two weeks, with selection criteria to be unveiled by the president of the European council, Donald Tusk.
The European Banking Authority and the European Medicines Agency employ about 1,000 people, many of them British, and provide a hub for businesses in the UK. It is understood that the EU’s chief negotiator hopes the agencies will know their new locations by June, although the process may take longer. Cities such as Frankfurt, Milan, Amsterdam and Paris are competing to take the agencies, which are regarded as among the EU’s crown jewels.
Meanwhile, it has emerged that Britain failed to secure the backing of any of the 27 countries for its case that trade talks should start early in the two years of negotiations allowed by article 50 of the Lisbon treaty. The position will be announced at a Brussels summit on 29 April.
43 dead in Syria today. But no posts here on PB. The "wrong" people died. And Jabhat-Al-Nusra are now our allies !
50 people die in Syria every day, don't they? Every one a horror, every one a sadness. But it's a civil war. They are notoriously nasty. What should we do? Bomb them like Trump?
I say: Leave Well Alone, and maybe hope Assad wins. As the least worst of several deeply evil options.
It’s 1984 isn’t it. Yesterday Eastasia were the enemy. Now they are our allies. Tomorrow they will be our enemies again! Or something like that.
IIRC both sides in the Spanish Civil War were equally nasty, but people in UK regarded one side as good and the other as the devil incarnate. Or the other way round depending on whether one was essentially Left or Right.
The EU is set to inflict a double humiliation on Theresa May, stripping Britain of its European agencies within weeks, while formally rejecting the prime minister’s calls for early trade talks.
The Observer has learned that EU diplomats agreed their uncompromising position at a crunch meeting on Tuesday, held to set out the union’s strategy in the talks due to start next month.
A beauty contest between member states who want the European banking and medicine agencies, currently located in London, will begin within two weeks, with selection criteria to be unveiled by the president of the European council, Donald Tusk.
The European Banking Authority and the European Medicines Agency employ about 1,000 people, many of them British, and provide a hub for businesses in the UK. It is understood that the EU’s chief negotiator hopes the agencies will know their new locations by June, although the process may take longer. Cities such as Frankfurt, Milan, Amsterdam and Paris are competing to take the agencies, which are regarded as among the EU’s crown jewels.
Meanwhile, it has emerged that Britain failed to secure the backing of any of the 27 countries for its case that trade talks should start early in the two years of negotiations allowed by article 50 of the Lisbon treaty. The position will be announced at a Brussels summit on 29 April.
The EU is set to inflict a double humiliation on Theresa May, stripping Britain of its European agencies within weeks, while formally rejecting the prime minister’s calls for early trade talks.
The Observer has learned that EU diplomats agreed their uncompromising position at a crunch meeting on Tuesday, held to set out the union’s strategy in the talks due to start next month.
A beauty contest between member states who want the European banking and medicine agencies, currently located in London, will begin within two weeks, with selection criteria to be unveiled by the president of the European council, Donald Tusk.
The European Banking Authority and the European Medicines Agency employ about 1,000 people, many of them British, and provide a hub for businesses in the UK. It is understood that the EU’s chief negotiator hopes the agencies will know their new locations by June, although the process may take longer. Cities such as Frankfurt, Milan, Amsterdam and Paris are competing to take the agencies, which are regarded as among the EU’s crown jewels.
Meanwhile, it has emerged that Britain failed to secure the backing of any of the 27 countries for its case that trade talks should start early in the two years of negotiations allowed by article 50 of the Lisbon treaty. The position will be announced at a Brussels summit on 29 April.
The EU is set to inflict a double humiliation on Theresa May, stripping Britain of its European agencies within weeks, while formally rejecting the prime minister’s calls for early trade talks.
The Observer has learned that EU diplomats agreed their uncompromising position at a crunch meeting on Tuesday, held to set out the union’s strategy in the talks due to start next month.
A beauty contest between member states who want the European banking and medicine agencies, currently located in London, will begin within two weeks, with selection criteria to be unveiled by the president of the European council, Donald Tusk.
The European Banking Authority and the European Medicines Agency employ about 1,000 people, many of them British, and provide a hub for businesses in the UK. It is understood that the EU’s chief negotiator hopes the agencies will know their new locations by June, although the process may take longer. Cities such as Frankfurt, Milan, Amsterdam and Paris are competing to take the agencies, which are regarded as among the EU’s crown jewels.
Meanwhile, it has emerged that Britain failed to secure the backing of any of the 27 countries for its case that trade talks should start early in the two years of negotiations allowed by article 50 of the Lisbon treaty. The position will be announced at a Brussels summit on 29 April.
The EU is set to inflict a double humiliation on Theresa May, stripping Britain of its European agencies within weeks, while formally rejecting the prime minister’s calls for early trade talks.
The Observer has learned that EU diplomats agreed their uncompromising position at a crunch meeting on Tuesday, held to set out the union’s strategy in the talks due to start next month.
A beauty contest between member states who want the European banking and medicine agencies, currently located in London, will begin within two weeks, with selection criteria to be unveiled by the president of the European council, Donald Tusk.
The European Banking Authority and the European Medicines Agency employ about 1,000 people, many of them British, and provide a hub for businesses in the UK. It is understood that the EU’s chief negotiator hopes the agencies will know their new locations by June, although the process may take longer. Cities such as Frankfurt, Milan, Amsterdam and Paris are competing to take the agencies, which are regarded as among the EU’s crown jewels.
Meanwhile, it has emerged that Britain failed to secure the backing of any of the 27 countries for its case that trade talks should start early in the two years of negotiations allowed by article 50 of the Lisbon treaty. The position will be announced at a Brussels summit on 29 April.
If the EU is intending to humiliate us, as the report claims, then the hardest of hard brexits it will have to be - if they want to humiliate, then the EU was never interested in a meaningful discussion and May can quite rightly claim the EU allowed no options, and so any problems are their fault, since they never even waited to negotiate with May before seeking humiliation.
The biggest risk to the Tory lead is that May gets blamed for a poor deal, but if the EU starts out with a stance that is portrayed, with glee, as humiliation, then May will get a much easier pass - any problems would have been blamed on a truculent EU anyway, but apparently that defence will be 100% accurate.
The EU is set to inflict a double humiliation on Theresa May, stripping Britain of its European agencies within weeks, while formally rejecting the prime minister’s calls for early trade talks.
The Observer has learned that EU diplomats agreed their uncompromising position at a crunch meeting on Tuesday, held to set out the union’s strategy in the talks due to start next month.
A beauty contest between member states who want the European banking and medicine agencies, currently located in London, will begin within two weeks, with selection criteria to be unveiled by the president of the European council, Donald Tusk.
The European Banking Authority and the European Medicines Agency employ about 1,000 people, many of them British, and provide a hub for businesses in the UK. It is understood that the EU’s chief negotiator hopes the agencies will know their new locations by June, although the process may take longer. Cities such as Frankfurt, Milan, Amsterdam and Paris are competing to take the agencies, which are regarded as among the EU’s crown jewels.
Meanwhile, it has emerged that Britain failed to secure the backing of any of the 27 countries for its case that trade talks should start early in the two years of negotiations allowed by article 50 of the Lisbon treaty. The position will be announced at a Brussels summit on 29 April.
The EU is set to inflict a double humiliation on Theresa May, stripping Britain of its European agencies within weeks, while formally rejecting the prime minister’s calls for early trade talks.
The Observer has learned that EU diplomats agreed their uncompromising position at a crunch meeting on Tuesday, held to set out the union’s strategy in the talks due to start next month.
A beauty contest between member states who want the European banking and medicine agencies, currently located in London, will begin within two weeks, with selection criteria to be unveiled by the president of the European council, Donald Tusk.
The European Banking Authority and the European Medicines Agency employ about 1,000 people, many of them British, and provide a hub for businesses in the UK. It is understood that the EU’s chief negotiator hopes the agencies will know their new locations by June, although the process may take longer. Cities such as Frankfurt, Milan, Amsterdam and Paris are competing to take the agencies, which are regarded as among the EU’s crown jewels.
Meanwhile, it has emerged that Britain failed to secure the backing of any of the 27 countries for its case that trade talks should start early in the two years of negotiations allowed by article 50 of the Lisbon treaty. The position will be announced at a Brussels summit on 29 April.
If the EU is intending to humiliate us, as the report claims, then the hardest of hard brexits it will have to be - if they want to humiliate, then the EU was never interested in a meaningful discussion and May can quite rightly claim the EU allowed no options, and so any problems are their fault, since they never even waited to negotiate with May before seeking humiliation.
The biggest risk to the Tory lead is that May gets blamed for a poor deal, but if the EU starts out with a stance that is portrayed, with glee, as humiliation, then May will get a much easier pass - any problems would have been blamed on a truculent EU anyway, but apparently that defence will be 100% accurate.
Indeed so. "Fuck Europe" will be the natural UK attitude.
We can't leave before March 2019 without their agreement. Scottish independence is already baked in. The UK will be defunct by the time this is over.
The EU is set to inflict a double humiliation on Theresa May, stripping Britain of its European agencies within weeks, while formally rejecting the prime minister’s calls for early trade talks.
The Observer has learned that EU diplomats agreed their uncompromising position at a crunch meeting on Tuesday, held to set out the union’s strategy in the talks due to start next month.
A beauty contest between member states who want the European banking and medicine agencies, currently located in London, will begin within two weeks, with selection criteria to be unveiled by the president of the European council, Donald Tusk.
The European Banking Authority and the European Medicines Agency employ about 1,000 people, many of them British, and provide a hub for businesses in the UK. It is understood that the EU’s chief negotiator hopes the agencies will know their new locations by June, although the process may take longer. Cities such as Frankfurt, Milan, Amsterdam and Paris are competing to take the agencies, which are regarded as among the EU’s crown jewels.
Meanwhile, it has emerged that Britain failed to secure the backing of any of the 27 countries for its case that trade talks should start early in the two years of negotiations allowed by article 50 of the Lisbon treaty. The position will be announced at a Brussels summit on 29 April.
The EU is set to inflict a double humiliation on Theresa May, stripping Britain of its European agencies within weeks, while formally rejecting the prime minister’s calls for early trade talks.
The Observer has learned that EU diplomats agreed their uncompromising position at a crunch meeting on Tuesday, held to set out the union’s strategy in the talks due to start next month.
A beauty contest between member states who want the European banking and medicine agencies, currently located in London, will begin within two weeks, with selection criteria to be unveiled by the president of the European council, Donald Tusk.
The European Banking Authority and the European Medicines Agency employ about 1,000 people, many of them British, and provide a hub for businesses in the UK. It is understood that the EU’s chief negotiator hopes the agencies will know their new locations by June, although the process may take longer. Cities such as Frankfurt, Milan, Amsterdam and Paris are competing to take the agencies, which are regarded as among the EU’s crown jewels.
Meanwhile, it has emerged that Britain failed to secure the backing of any of the 27 countries for its case that trade talks should start early in the two years of negotiations allowed by article 50 of the Lisbon treaty. The position will be announced at a Brussels summit on 29 April.
If the EU is intending to humiliate us, as the report claims, then the hardest of hard brexits it will have to be - if they want to humiliate, then the EU was never interested in a meaningful discussion and May can quite rightly claim the EU allowed no options, and so any problems are their fault, since they never even waited to negotiate with May before seeking humiliation.
The biggest risk to the Tory lead is that May gets blamed for a poor deal, but if the EU starts out with a stance that is portrayed, with glee, as humiliation, then May will get a much easier pass - any problems would have been blamed on a truculent EU anyway, but apparently that defence will be 100% accurate.
Indeed so. "Fuck Europe" will be the natural UK attitude.
We can't leave before March 2019 without their agreement. Scottish independence is already baked in. The UK will be defunct by the time this is over.
That is seriously unfortunate and I hope it is not so. But it has to be said that if the EU seeks to humiliate, then they clearly are not the logical, moral organisation we are repeatedly told. Such an organisation would strike the best deal for its members, which surely does not include humiliating neighbouring countries.
The EU is set to inflict a double humiliation on Theresa May, stripping Britain of its European agencies within weeks, while formally rejecting the prime minister’s calls for early trade talks.
The Observer has learned that EU diplomats agreed their uncompromising position at a crunch meeting on Tuesday, held to set out the union’s strategy in the talks due to start next month.
A beauty contest between member states who want the European banking and medicine agencies, currently located in London, will begin within two weeks, with selection criteria to be unveiled by the president of the European council, Donald Tusk.
The European Banking Authority and the European Medicines Agency employ about 1,000 people, many of them British, and provide a hub for businesses in the UK. It is understood that the EU’s chief negotiator hopes the agencies will know their new locations by June, although the process may take longer. Cities such as Frankfurt, Milan, Amsterdam and Paris are competing to take the agencies, which are regarded as among the EU’s crown jewels.
Meanwhile, it has emerged that Britain failed to secure the backing of any of the 27 countries for its case that trade talks should start early in the two years of negotiations allowed by article 50 of the Lisbon treaty. The position will be announced at a Brussels summit on 29 April.
If the EU is intending to humiliate us, as the report claims, then the hardest of hard brexits it will have to be - if they want to humiliate, then the EU was never interested in a meaningful discussion and May can quite rightly claim the EU allowed no options, and so any problems are their fault, since they never even waited to negotiate with May before seeking humiliation.
The biggest risk to the Tory lead is that May gets blamed for a poor deal, but if the EU starts out with a stance that is portrayed, with glee, as humiliation, then May will get a much easier pass - any problems would have been blamed on a truculent EU anyway, but apparently that defence will be 100% accurate.
Indeed so. "Fuck Europe" will be the natural UK attitude.
You could make a case that the real turning point that led to Brexit was that debate he did with Farage in 2014 in which his approach was found wanting. That should have been a wake up call that mealy-mouthed platitudes wouldn't cut it and the pro-Europeans needed some passion and conviction.
That might have been a strong clue but it really just revealed a reality that went back years. Yes, pro-Europeans should have been making a more positive case but I doubt that even that would have worked.
If you want a date for when the Brexit process began, I give you 8 September 1988.
And I give you 1 January 1973 Leaving was inevitable. It was just the timing.
No, I
Had the EC decided that the Single Market was the limit of its realistic ambitions, whatever the treaties might say, then Britain would still be a member. And given that it took 40 years just to complete most of the Single Market - a process that still isn't complete in some sectors - that's far from unrealistic.
We don't have an alternative history to judge but I think that if there had been no Eurozone at the time of the 2008 crisis, the idea would have been resurrected at that point as a way of shielding the likes of Greece from being attacked by currency speculators.
Here was I thinking Greece needed to devalue......
Devaluation is no answer . The UK has been devaluing the £ for 70 years without success .
1.1.1953 £1 = DEM 11.70
15.4.2017 £1= DEM 2.3074 [ € 1.179 ]
Devaluation is just a drug ! A short term fix. The problem with this country is productivity. WE produce 20% less per day than the Germans and the French.
Also delusional. GDP per capita in the UK by PPP is higher than France, Italy and Japan - though less than Germany. With Germany's horrible demographics, probably not solved by importing 1m barely educated Syrians, there's a good chance we will soon overtake Germany and become the richest large country, per head, in Europe.
The EU is set to inflict a double humiliation on Theresa May, stripping Britain of its European agencies within weeks, while formally rejecting the prime minister’s calls for early trade talks.
The Observer has learned that EU diplomats agreed their uncompromising position at a crunch meeting on Tuesday, held to set out the union’s strategy in the talks due to start next month.
A beauty contest between member states who want the European banking and medicine agencies, currently located in London, will begin within two weeks, with selection criteria to be unveiled by the president of the European council, Donald Tusk.
The European Banking Authority and the European Medicines Agency employ about 1,000 people, many of them British, and provide a hub for businesses in the UK. It is understood that the EU’s chief negotiator hopes the agencies will know their new locations by June, although the process may take longer. Cities such as Frankfurt, Milan, Amsterdam and Paris are competing to take the agencies, which are regarded as among the EU’s crown jewels.
Meanwhile, it has emerged that Britain failed to secure the backing of any of the 27 countries for its case that trade talks should start early in the two years of negotiations allowed by article 50 of the Lisbon treaty. The position will be announced at a Brussels summit on 29 April.
If the EU is intending to humiliate us, as the report claims, then the hardest of hard brexits it will have to be - if they want to humiliate, then the EU was never interested in a meaningful discussion and May can quite rightly claim the EU allowed no options, and so any problems are their fault, since they never even waited to negotiate with May before seeking humiliation.
The biggest risk to the Tory lead is that May gets blamed for a poor deal, but if the EU starts out with a stance that is portrayed, with glee, as humiliation, then May will get a much easier pass - any problems would have been blamed on a truculent EU anyway, but apparently that defence will be 100% accurate.
Indeed so. "Fuck Europe" will be the natural UK attitude.
"Love Europe, Fuck the EU"
Even their railways are better than ours. Ours are better than North Korea's.
On CNN, I saw even Turkey has these super fast railways now.
If the EU is intending to humiliate us, as the report claims, then the hardest of hard brexits it will have to be - if they want to humiliate, then the EU was never interested in a meaningful discussion and May can quite rightly claim the EU allowed no options, and so any problems are their fault, since they never even waited to negotiate with May before seeking humiliation.
The biggest risk to the Tory lead is that May gets blamed for a poor deal, but if the EU starts out with a stance that is portrayed, with glee, as humiliation, then May will get a much easier pass - any problems would have been blamed on a truculent EU anyway, but apparently that defence will be 100% accurate.
Indeed so. "Fuck Europe" will be the natural UK attitude.
We can't leave before March 2019 without their agreement. Scottish independence is already baked in. The UK will be defunct by the time this is over.
That is seriously unfortunate and I hope it is not so. But it has to be said that if the EU seeks to humiliate, then they clearly are not the logical, moral organisation we are repeatedly told. Such an organisation would strike the best deal for its members, which surely does not include humiliating neighbouring countries.
The humiliation will be entirely self-inflicted.
It was May's decision to press on with a hard Brexit despite two of the four nations of the UK voting to Remain in the EU. Just think how we would perceive a similar situation if we were talking about another multinational state on the other side of Europe? The political logic from all sides, not least the true Brexit believers, can only lead to the break-up of the UK.
If the EU is intending to humiliate us, as the report claims, then the hardest of hard brexits it will have to be - if they want to humiliate, then the EU was never interested in a meaningful discussion and May can quite rightly claim the EU allowed no options, and so any problems are their fault, since they never even waited to negotiate with May before seeking humiliation.
The biggest risk to the Tory lead is that May gets blamed for a poor deal, but if the EU starts out with a stance that is portrayed, with glee, as humiliation, then May will get a much easier pass - any problems would have been blamed on a truculent EU anyway, but apparently that defence will be 100% accurate.
Indeed so. "Fuck Europe" will be the natural UK attitude.
We can't leave before March 2019 without their agreement. Scottish independence is already baked in. The UK will be defunct by the time this is over.
That is seriously unfortunate and I hope it is not so. But it has to be said that if the EU seeks to humiliate, then they clearly are not the logical, moral organisation we are repeatedly told. Such an organisation would strike the best deal for its members, which surely does not include humiliating neighbouring countries.
Worth noting that plenty here would be happy to go with softer brexit terms, are willing to accomodate the EU, but there is the weird glee from some that the EU humiliating Britain, rather than merely sticking to a hard line, is Britain's fault. Facing some negative consequences is Britain's fault, but the EU seeking humiliation reflects on them, not us, just as us seeking to harm them would reflect on us.
The EU is set to inflict a double humiliation on Theresa May, stripping Britain of its European agencies within weeks, while formally rejecting the prime minister’s calls for early trade talks.
The Observer has learned that EU diplomats agreed their uncompromising position at a crunch meeting on Tuesday, held to set out the union’s strategy in the talks due to start next month.
A beauty contest between member states who want the European banking and medicine agencies, currently located in London, will begin within two weeks, with selection criteria to be unveiled by the president of the European council, Donald Tusk.
The European Banking Authority and the European Medicines Agency employ about 1,000 people, many of them British, and provide a hub for businesses in the UK. It is understood that the EU’s chief negotiator hopes the agencies will know their new locations by June, although the process may take longer. Cities such as Frankfurt, Milan, Amsterdam and Paris are competing to take the agencies, which are regarded as among the EU’s crown jewels.
Meanwhile, it has emerged that Britain failed to secure the backing of any of the 27 countries for its case that trade talks should start early in the two years of negotiations allowed by article 50 of the Lisbon treaty. The position will be announced at a Brussels summit on 29 April.
The EU is set to inflict a double humiliation on Theresa May, stripping Britain of its European agencies within weeks, while formally rejecting the prime minister’s calls for early trade talks.
The Observer has learned that EU diplomats agreed their uncompromising position at a crunch meeting on Tuesday, held to set out the union’s strategy in the talks due to start next month.
A beauty contest between member states who want the European banking and medicine agencies, currently located in London, will begin within two weeks, with selection criteria to be unveiled by the president of the European council, Donald Tusk.
The European Banking Authority and the European Medicines Agency employ about 1,000 people, many of them British, and provide a hub for businesses in the UK. It is understood that the EU’s chief negotiator hopes the agencies will know their new locations by June, although the process may take longer. Cities such as Frankfurt, Milan, Amsterdam and Paris are competing to take the agencies, which are regarded as among the EU’s crown jewels.
Meanwhile, it has emerged that Britain failed to secure the backing of any of the 27 countries for its case that trade talks should start early in the two years of negotiations allowed by article 50 of the Lisbon treaty. The position will be announced at a Brussels summit on 29 April.
If the EU is intending to humiliate us, as the report claims, then the hardest of hard brexits it will have to be - if they want to humiliate, then the EU was never interested in a meaningful discussion and May can quite rightly claim the EU allowed no options, and so any problems are their fault, since they never even waited to negotiate with May before seeking humiliation.
The biggest risk to the Tory lead is that May gets blamed for a poor deal, but if the EU starts out with a stance that is portrayed, with glee, as humiliation, then May will get a much easier pass - any problems would have been blamed on a truculent EU anyway, but apparently that defence will be 100% accurate.
Indeed so. "Fuck Europe" will be the natural UK attitude.
We can't leave before March 2019 without their agreement. Scottish independence is already baked in. The UK will be defunct by the time this is over.
We can leave tomorrow. We just LEAVE. As even europhiles admit, we have been sovereign all along.
We repeal the EEC act of 1973. We're out. We default to WTO. Salutary chaos ensues. Fuck it.
Did you have a row with your latest girl-friend last night. Has she left you with a spare bottle of ‘sauce’?
If the EU is intending to humiliate us, as the report claims, then the hardest of hard brexits it will have to be - if they want to humiliate, then the EU was never interested in a meaningful discussion and May can quite rightly claim the EU allowed no options, and so any problems are their fault, since they never even waited to negotiate with May before seeking humiliation.
The biggest risk to the Tory lead is that May gets blamed for a poor deal, but if the EU starts out with a stance that is portrayed, with glee, as humiliation, then May will get a much easier pass - any problems would have been blamed on a truculent EU anyway, but apparently that defence will be 100% accurate.
Indeed so. "Fuck Europe" will be the natural UK attitude.
We can't leave before March 2019 without their agreement. Scottish independence is already baked in. The UK will be defunct by the time this is over.
That is seriously unfortunate and I hope it is not so. But it has to be said that if the EU seeks to humiliate, then they clearly are not the logical, moral organisation we are repeatedly told. Such an organisation would strike the best deal for its members, which surely does not include humiliating neighbouring countries.
Worth noting that plenty here would be happy to go with softer brexit terms, are willing to accomodate the EU, but there is the weird glee from some that the EU humiliating Britain, rather than merely sticking to a hard line, is Britain's fault. Facing some negative consequences is Britain's fault, but the EU seeking humiliation reflects on them, not us, just as us seeking to harm them would reflect on us.
Isn't it more pour encourager les autres.
I think the EU view is that the post Brexit deal has to be worse than full membership.
If the EU is intending to humiliate us, as the report claims, then the hardest of hard brexits it will have to be - if they want to humiliate, then the EU was never interested in a meaningful discussion and May can quite rightly claim the EU allowed no options, and so any problems are their fault, since they never even waited to negotiate with May before seeking humiliation.
The biggest risk to the Tory lead is that May gets blamed for a poor deal, but if the EU starts out with a stance that is portrayed, with glee, as humiliation, then May will get a much easier pass - any problems would have been blamed on a truculent EU anyway, but apparently that defence will be 100% accurate.
Indeed so. "Fuck Europe" will be the natural UK attitude.
We can't leave before March 2019 without their agreement. Scottish independence is already baked in. The UK will be defunct by the time this is over.
That is seriously unfortunate and I hope it is not so. But it has to be said that if the EU seeks to humiliate, then they clearly are not the logical, moral organisation we are repeatedly told. Such an organisation would strike the best deal for its members, which surely does not include humiliating neighbouring countries.
The humiliation will be entirely self-inflicted.
It was May's decision to press on with a hard Brexit despite two of the four nations of the UK voting to Remain in the EU. Just think how we would perceive a similar situation if we were talking about another multinational state on the other side of Europe? The political logic from all sides, not least the true Brexit believers, can only lead to the break-up of the UK.
You are insane. The EU is seeking to humiliate according to that write up, which means going above and beyond what they need to do to stick up for its members and in fact seeking to be punitive and vindictive, and you blame that on the UK too. The EU has a duty to stick up for its members, it does not have a duty to humiliate or punish, but the motivation appears to be the latter not the former.
The EU is set to inflict a double humiliation on Theresa May, stripping Britain of its European agencies within weeks, while formally rejecting the prime minister’s calls for early trade talks.
The Observer has learned that EU diplomats agreed their uncompromising position at a crunch meeting on Tuesday, held to set out the union’s strategy in the talks due to start next month.
A beauty contest between member states who want the European banking and medicine agencies, currently located in London, will begin within two weeks, with selection criteria to be unveiled by the president of the European council, Donald Tusk.
The European Banking Authority and the European Medicines Agency employ about 1,000 people, many of them British, and provide a hub for businesses in the UK. It is understood that the EU’s chief negotiator hopes the agencies will know their new locations by June, although the process may take longer. Cities such as Frankfurt, Milan, Amsterdam and Paris are competing to take the agencies, which are regarded as among the EU’s crown jewels.
Meanwhile, it has emerged that Britain failed to secure the backing of any of the 27 countries for its case that trade talks should start early in the two years of negotiations allowed by article 50 of the Lisbon treaty. The position will be announced at a Brussels summit on 29 April.
Losing the Medicines Agency has the potential to damage the NHS by far more than can be recovered by a busload of cash.
Losing all EU agencies here was surely always inevitable even with the softest of soft brexits?
Do EU employment laws allow them to sack all their UK staff?
As the new offices are probably going to be quite far away I believe the workers will be entitled to redundancy pay. Small comfort for those losing their jobs though!
The EU is set to inflict a double humiliation on Theresa May, stripping Britain of its European agencies within weeks, while formally rejecting the prime minister’s calls for early trade talks.
The Observer has learned that EU diplomats agreed their uncompromising position at a crunch meeting on Tuesday, held to set out the union’s strategy in the talks due to start next month.
A beauty contest between member states who want the European banking and medicine agencies, currently located in London, will begin within two weeks, with selection criteria to be unveiled by the president of the European council, Donald Tusk.
The European Banking Authority and the European Medicines Agency employ about 1,000 people, many of them British, and provide a hub for businesses in the UK. It is understood that the EU’s chief negotiator hopes the agencies will know their new locations by June, although the process may take longer. Cities such as Frankfurt, Milan, Amsterdam and Paris are competing to take the agencies, which are regarded as among the EU’s crown jewels.
Meanwhile, it has emerged that Britain failed to secure the backing of any of the 27 countries for its case that trade talks should start early in the two years of negotiations allowed by article 50 of the Lisbon treaty. The position will be announced at a Brussels summit on 29 April.
Losing the Medicines Agency has the potential to damage the NHS by far more than can be recovered by a busload of cash.
Losing all EU agencies here was surely always inevitable even with the softest of soft brexits?
A statement of the bleeding obvious. We voted to cut ties with our neighbours, It would be absurd to expect european institutions to be based here post Brexit.
Leavers weren't so delusional as to expect them to stay, surely?
A beauty contest between member states who want the European banking and medicine agencies, currently located in London, will begin within two weeks, with selection criteria to be unveiled by the president of the European council, Donald Tusk.
The European Banking Authority and the European Medicines Agency employ about 1,000 people, many of them British, and provide a hub for businesses in the UK. It is understood that the EU’s chief negotiator hopes the agencies will know their new locations by June, although the process may take longer. Cities such as Frankfurt, Milan, Amsterdam and Paris are competing to take the agencies, which are regarded as among the EU’s crown jewels.
Meanwhile, it has emerged that Britain failed to secure the backing of any of the 27 countries for its case that trade talks should start early in the two years of negotiations allowed by article 50 of the Lisbon treaty. The position will be announced at a Brussels summit on 29 April.
If the EU is intending to humiliate us, as the report claims, then the hardest of hard brexits it will have to be - if they want to humiliate, then the EU was never interested in a meaningful discussion and May can quite rightly claim the EU allowed no options, and so any problems are their fault, since they never even waited to negotiate with May before seeking humiliation.
The biggest risk to the Tory lead is that May gets blamed for a poor deal, but if the EU starts out with a stance that is portrayed, with glee, as humiliation, then May will get a much easier pass - any problems would have been blamed on a truculent EU anyway, but apparently that defence will be 100% accurate.
Indeed so. "Fuck Europe" will be the natural UK attitude.
We can't leave before March 2019 without their agreement. Scottish independence is already baked in. The UK will be defunct by the time this is over.
Nah. We won't allow indyref to 2021. By then we'll be out, and, hopefully, actually at war with the Frogs, Dagos and Krauts. Fuck these arrogrant eurotwats.
If they really want to take us on, let them do it. Ourselves alone. We've done it before. They are making a mistake. Grrrr.
"We Ourselves"
Is Sinn Fein Gaelic for collective pissing of pants?
If the EU is intending to humiliate us, as the report claims, then the hardest of hard brexits it will have to be - if they want to humiliate, then the EU was never interested in a meaningful discussion and May can quite rightly claim the EU allowed no options, and so any problems are their fault, since they never even waited to negotiate with May before seeking humiliation.
The biggest risk to the Tory lead is that May gets blamed for a poor deal, but if the EU starts out with a stance that is portrayed, with glee, as humiliation, then May will get a much easier pass - any problems would have been blamed on a truculent EU anyway, but apparently that defence will be 100% accurate.
Indeed so. "Fuck Europe" will be the natural UK attitude.
We can't leave before March 2019 without their agreement. Scottish independence is already baked in. The UK will be defunct by the time this is over.
That is seriously unfortunate and I hope it is not so. But it has to be said that if the EU seeks to humiliate, then they clearly are not the logical, moral organisation we are repeatedly told. Such an organisation would strike the best deal for its members, which surely does not include humiliating neighbouring countries.
The humiliation will be entirely self-inflicted.
It was May's decision to press on with a hard Brexit despite two of the four nations of the UK voting to Remain in the EU. Just think how we would perceive a similar situation if we were talking about another multinational state on the other side of Europe? The political logic from all sides, not least the true Brexit believers, can only lead to the break-up of the UK.
You are insane. The EU is seeking to humiliate according to that write up, which means going above and beyond what they need to do to stick up for its members and in fact seeking to be punitive and vindictive, and you blame that on the UK too. The EU has a duty to stick up for its members, it does not have a duty to humiliate or punish, but the motivation appears to be the latter not the former.
If the EU is intending to humiliate us, as the report claims, then the hardest of hard brexits it will have to be - if they want to humiliate, then the EU was never interested in a meaningful discussion and May can quite rightly claim the EU allowed no options, and so any problems are their fault, since they never even waited to negotiate with May before seeking humiliation.
The biggest risk to the Tory lead is that May gets blamed for a poor deal, but if the EU starts out with a stance that is portrayed, with glee, as humiliation, then May will get a much easier pass - any problems would have been blamed on a truculent EU anyway, but apparently that defence will be 100% accurate.
Indeed so. "Fuck Europe" will be the natural UK attitude.
We can't leave before March 2019 without their agreement. Scottish independence is already baked in. The UK will be defunct by the time this is over.
That is seriously unfortunate and I hope it is not so. But it has to be said that if the EU seeks to humiliate, then they clearly are not the logical, moral organisation we are repeatedly told. Such an organisation would strike the best deal for its members, which surely does not include humiliating neighbouring countries.
Worts.
Isn't it more pour encourager les autres.
I think the EU view is that the post Brexit deal has to be worse than full membership.
There is a difference between that, which is reasonable, and seeking to humiliate, which we are told this will be, despite all the assurances the EU is a noble organisation.
One means we will incur negative consequences, which was inevitable (the question was whether we are able to seize the positive opportunities that will arise to mitigate those), the other means they will seek to inflict negative consequences for no reason other than to inflict them. That's what seeking to humiliate entails. Doesn't sound very noble to me.
he process may take longer. Cities such as Frankfurt, Milan, Amsterdam and Paris are competing to take the agencies, which are regarded as among the EU’s crown jewels.
Meanwhile, it has emerged that Britain failed to secure the backing of any of the 27 countries for its case that trade talks should start early in the two years of negotiations allowed by article 50 of the Lisbon treaty. The position will be announced at a Brussels summit on 29 April.
If the EU is intending to humiliate us, as the report claims, then the hardest of hard brexits it will have to be - if they want to humiliate, then the EU was never interested in a meaningful discussion and May can quite rightly claim the EU allowed no options, and so any problems are their fault, since they never even waited to negotiate with May before seeking humiliation.
The biggest risk to the Tory lead is that May gets blamed for a poor deal, but if the EU starts out with a stance that is portrayed, with glee, as humiliation, then May will get a much easier pass - any problems would have been blamed on a truculent EU anyway, but apparently that defence will be 100% accurate.
Indeed so. "Fuck Europe" will be the natural UK attitude.
We can't leave before March 2019 without their agreement. Scottish independence is already baked in. The UK will be defunct by the time this is over.
We can leave tomorrow. We just LEAVE. As even europhiles admit, we have been sovereign all along.
We repeal the EEC act of 1973. We're out. We default to WTO. Salutary chaos ensues. Fuck it.
Did you have a row with your latest girl-friend last night. Has she left you with a spare bottle of ‘sauce’?
If the EU is intending to humiliate us, as the report claims, then the hardest of hard brexits it will have to be - if they want to humiliate, then the EU was never interested in a meaningful discussion and May can quite rightly claim the EU allowed no options, and so any problems are their fault, since they never even waited to negotiate with May before seeking humiliation.
The biggest risk to the Tory lead is that May gets blamed for a poor deal, but if the EU starts out with a stance that is portrayed, with glee, as humiliation, then May will get a much easier pass - any problems would have been blamed on a truculent EU anyway, but apparently that defence will be 100% accurate.
Indeed so. "Fuck Europe" will be the natural UK attitude.
We can't leave before March 2019 without their agreement. Scottish independence is already baked in. The UK will be defunct by the time this is over.
That is seriously unfortunate and I hope it is not so. But it has to be said that if the EU seeks to humiliate, then they clearly are not the logical, moral organisation we are repeatedly told. Such an organisation would strike the best deal for its members, which surely does not include humiliating neighbouring countries.
The humiliation will be entirely self-inflicted.
It was May's decision to press on with a hard Brexit despite two of the four nations of the UK voting to Remain in the EU. Just think how we would perceive a similar situation if we were talking about another multinational state on the other side of Europe? The political logic from all sides, not least the true Brexit believers, can only lead to the break-up of the UK.
You are insane. The EU is seeking to humiliate according to that write up, which means going above and beyond what they need to do to stick up for its members and in fact seeking to be punitive and vindictive, and you blame that on the UK too. The EU has a duty to stick up for its members, it does not have a duty to humiliate or punish, but the motivation appears to be the latter not the former.
The EU is set to inflict a double humiliation on Theresa May, stripping Britain of its European agencies within weeks, while formally rejecting the prime minister’s calls for early trade talks.
The Observer has learned that EU diplomats agreed their uncompromising position at a crunch meeting on Tuesday, held to set out the union’s strategy in the talks due to start next month.
A beauty contest between member states who want the European banking and medicine agencies, currently located in London, will begin within two weeks, with selection criteria to be unveiled by the president of the European council, Donald Tusk.
The European Banking Authority and the European Medicines Agency employ about 1,000 people, many of them British, and provide a hub for businesses in the UK. It is understood that the EU’s chief negotiator hopes the agencies will know their new locations by June, although the process may take longer. Cities such as Frankfurt, Milan, Amsterdam and Paris are competing to take the agencies, which are regarded as among the EU’s crown jewels.
Meanwhile, it has emerged that Britain failed to secure the backing of any of the 27 countries for its case that trade talks should start early in the two years of negotiations allowed by article 50 of the Lisbon treaty. The position will be announced at a Brussels summit on 29 April.
The EU is set to inflict a double humiliation on Theresa May, stripping Britain of its European agencies within weeks, while formally rejecting the prime minister’s calls for early trade talks.
The Observer has learned that EU diplomats agreed their uncompromising position at a crunch meeting on Tuesday, held to set out the union’s strategy in the talks due to start next month.
A beauty contest between member states who want the European banking and medicine agencies, currently located in London, will begin within two weeks, with selection criteria to be unveiled by the president of the European council, Donald Tusk.
The European Banking Authority and the European Medicines Agency employ about 1,000 people, many of them British, and provide a hub for businesses in the UK. It is understood that the EU’s chief negotiator hopes the agencies will know their new locations by June, although the process may take longer. Cities such as Frankfurt, Milan, Amsterdam and Paris are competing to take the agencies, which are regarded as among the EU’s crown jewels.
Meanwhile, it has emerged that Britain failed to secure the backing of any of the 27 countries for its case that trade talks should start early in the two years of negotiations allowed by article 50 of the Lisbon treaty. The position will be announced at a Brussels summit on 29 April.
It was May's decision to press on with a hard Brexit despite two of the four nations of the UK voting to Remain in the EU. Just think how we would perceive a similar situation if we were talking about another multinational state on the other side of Europe? The political logic from all sides, not least the true Brexit believers, can only lead to the break-up of the UK.
You are fantastically good at predicting disaster for the country, the government, the Union etc etc. OTOH you presumably foresaw with absolute clarity a decisive Remain victory in the referendum, since nothing else can explain your apathy and can'tbearsedness about campaigning for that result in any productive manner. Perhaps try learning from your mistakes?
If the EU is intending to humiliate us, as the report claims, then the hardest of hard brexits it will have to be - if they want to humiliate, then the EU was never interested in a meaningful discussion and May can quite rightly claim the EU allowed no options, and so any problems are their fault, since they never even waited to negotiate with May before seeking humiliation.
The biggest risk to the Tory lead is that May gets blamed for a poor deal, but if the EU starts out with a stance that is portrayed, with glee, as humiliation, then May will get a much easier pass - any problems would have been blamed on a truculent EU anyway, but apparently that defence will be 100% accurate.
Indeed so. "Fuck Europe" will be the natural UK attitude.
We can't leave before March 2019 without their agreement. Scottish independence is already baked in. The UK will be defunct by the time this is over.
That is seriously unfortunate and I hope it is not so. But it has to be said that if the EU seeks to humiliate, then they clearly are not the logical, moral organisation we are repeatedly told. Such an organisation would strike the best deal for its members, which surely does not include humiliating neighbouring countries.
The humiliation will be entirely self-inflicted.
It was May's decision to press on with a hard Brexit despite two of the four nations of the UK voting to Remain in the EU. Just think how we would perceive a similar situation if we were talking about another multinational state on the other side of Europe? The political logic from all sides, not least the true Brexit believers, can only lead to the break-up of the UK.
You are insane. The EU is seeking to humiliate according to that write up, which means going above and beyond what they need to do to stick up for its members and in fact seeking to be punitive and vindictive, and you blame that on the UK too. The EU has a duty to stick up for its members, it does not have a duty to humiliate or punish, but the motivation appears to be the latter not the former.
You've only just realised?
That I'm insane?
In your desire to see the UK crushed by the EU? Yeah
43 dead in Syria today. But no posts here on PB. The "wrong" people died. And Jabhat-Al-Nusra are now our allies !
50 people die in Syria every day, don't they? Every one a horror, every one a sadness. But it's a civil war. They are notoriously nasty. What should we do? Bomb them like Trump?
I say: Leave Well Alone, and maybe hope Assad wins. As the least worst of several deeply evil options.
It’s 1984 isn’t it. Yesterday Eastasia were the enemy. Now they are our allies. Tomorrow they will be our enemies again! Or something like that.
IIRC both sides in the Spanish Civil War were equally nasty, but people in UK regarded one side as good and the other as the devil incarnate. Or the other way round depending on whether one was essentially Left or Right.
Not sure if one could describe the protagonists as equally nasty in a war in which the Nationalists executed at least three times as many civilians as the Republicans. In any case the latter were the democratically elected government, the former Fascist rebels.
People in the UK (unlike their government) were able to distinguish between the sides enough for over 2k to volunteer for the Republican cause, while barely dozens answered the Nationalists' call.
Every EU Authority and Agency based in the UK will obviously be repatriated back to an EU country as a result of the UK leaving. - If the Guardian article is to be believed, I find it very odd that that should be the EU’s first priority, large pinch of salt needed me thinks.
If the EU is intending to humiliate us, as the report claims, then the hardest of hard brexits it will have to be - if they want to humiliate, then the EU was never interested in a meaningful discussion and May can quite rightly claim the EU allowed no options, and so any problems are their fault, since they never even waited to negotiate with May before seeking humiliation.
The biggest risk to the Tory lead is that May gets blamed for a poor deal, but if the EU starts out with a stance that is portrayed, with glee, as humiliation, then May will get a much easier pass - any problems would have been blamed on a truculent EU anyway, but apparently that defence will be 100% accurate.
Indeed so. "Fuck Europe" will be the natural UK attitude.
We can't leave before March 2019 without their agreement. Scottish independence is already baked in. The UK will be defunct by the time this is over.
That is seriously unfortunate and I hope it is not so. But it has to be said that if the EU seeks to humiliate, then they clearly are not the logical, moral organisation we are repeatedly told. Such an organisation would strike the best deal for its members, which surely does not include humiliating neighbouring countries.
Worth noting that plenty here would be happy to go with softer brexit terms, are willing to accomodate the EU, but there is the weird glee from some that the EU humiliating Britain, rather than merely sticking to a hard line, is Britain's fault. Facing some negative consequences is Britain's fault, but the EU seeking humiliation reflects on them, not us, just as us seeking to harm them would reflect on us.
Isn't it more pour encourager les autres.
I think the EU view is that the post Brexit deal has to be worse than full membership.
There is a difference between that, which is reasonable, and seeking to humiliate, which we are told this will be, despite all the assurances the EU is a noble organisation.
I thought we held all the cards ! Have they slipped out of our fingers and revealed what they really are ?
The EU is set to inflict a double humiliation on Theresa May, stripping Britain of its European agencies within weeks, while formally rejecting the prime minister’s calls for early trade talks.
The Observer has learned that EU diplomats agreed their uncompromising position at a crunch meeting on Tuesday, held to set out the union’s strategy in the talks due to start next month.
A beauty contest between member states who want the European banking and medicine agencies, currently located in London, will begin within two weeks, with selection criteria to be unveiled by the president of the European council, Donald Tusk.
The European Banking Authority and the European Medicines Agency employ about 1,000 people, many of them British, and provide a hub for businesses in the UK. It is understood that the EU’s chief negotiator hopes the agencies will know their new locations by June, although the process may take longer. Cities such as Frankfurt, Milan, Amsterdam and Paris are competing to take the agencies, which are regarded as among the EU’s crown jewels.
Meanwhile, it has emerged that Britain failed to secure the backing of any of the 27 countries for its case that trade talks should start early in the two years of negotiations allowed by article 50 of the Lisbon treaty. The position will be announced at a Brussels summit on 29 April.
The EU is set to inflict a double humiliation on Theresa May, stripping Britain of its European agencies within weeks, while formally rejecting the prime minister’s calls for early trade talks.
The Observer has learned that EU diplomats agreed their uncompromising position at a crunch meeting on Tuesday, held to set out the union’s strategy in the talks due to start next month.
A beauty contest between member states who want the European banking and medicine agencies, currently located in London, will begin within two weeks, with selection criteria to be unveiled by the president of the European council, Donald Tusk.
The European Banking Authority and the European Medicines Agency employ about 1,000 people, many of them British, and provide a hub for businesses in the UK. It is understood that the EU’s chief negotiator hopes the agencies will know their new locations by June, although the process may take longer. Cities such as Frankfurt, Milan, Amsterdam and Paris are competing to take the agencies, which are regarded as among the EU’s crown jewels.
Meanwhile, it has emerged that Britain failed to secure the backing of any of the 27 countries for its case that trade talks should start early in the two years of negotiations allowed by article 50 of the Lisbon treaty. The position will be announced at a Brussels summit on 29 April.
Losing the Medicines Agency has the potential to damage the NHS by far more than can be recovered by a busload of cash.
Losing all EU agencies here was surely always inevitable even with the softest of soft brexits?
A statement of the bleeding obvious. We voted to cut ties with our neighbours, It would be absurd to expect european institutions to be based here post Brexit.
Leavers weren't so delusional as to expect them to stay, surely?
No. Of course they were going to leave. But we expect 20% of EU assets, for which we have paid. Let them work THAT out.
The EU is set to inflict a double humiliation on Theresa May, stripping Britain of its European agencies within weeks, while formally rejecting the prime minister’s calls for early trade talks.
The Observer has learned that EU diplomats agreed their uncompromising position at a crunch meeting on Tuesday, held to set out the union’s strategy in the talks due to start next month.
A beauty contest between member states who want the European banking and medicine agencies, currently located in London, will begin within two weeks, with selection criteria to be unveiled by the president of the European council, Donald Tusk.
The European Banking Authority and the European Medicines Agency employ about 1,000 people, many of them British, and provide a hub for businesses in the UK. It is understood that the EU’s chief negotiator hopes the agencies will know their new locations by June, although the process may take longer. Cities such as Frankfurt, Milan, Amsterdam and Paris are competing to take the agencies, which are regarded as among the EU’s crown jewels.
Meanwhile, it has emerged that Britain failed to secure the backing of any of the 27 countries for its case that trade talks should start early in the two years of negotiations allowed by article 50 of the Lisbon treaty. The position will be announced at a Brussels summit on 29 April.
If the EU is intending to humiliate us, as the report claims, then the hardest of hard brexits it will have to be - if they want to humiliate, then the EU was never interested in a meaningful discussion and May can quite rightly claim the EU allowed no options, and so any problems are their fault, since they never even waited to negotiate with May before seeking humiliation.
The biggest risk to the Tory lead is that May gets blamed for a poor deal, but if the EU starts out with a stance that is portrayed, with glee, as humiliation, then May will get a much easier pass - any problems would have been blamed on a truculent EU anyway, but apparently that defence will be 100% accurate.
Indeed so. "Fuck Europe" will be the natural UK attitude.
We can't leave before March 2019 without their agreement. Scottish independence is already baked in. The UK will be defunct by the time this is over.
We can leave tomorrow. We just LEAVE. As even europhiles admit, we have been sovereign all along.
We repeal the EEC act of 1973. We're out. We default to WTO. Salutary chaos ensues. Fuck it.
So it's 'hard as fuck' Brexit tonight, is it? Hard to keep up.
The EU is set to inflict a double humiliation on Theresa May, stripping Britain of its European agencies within weeks, while formally rejecting the prime minister’s calls for early trade talks.
The Observer has learned that EU diplomats agreed their uncompromising position at a crunch meeting on Tuesday, held to set out the union’s strategy in the talks due to start next month.
A beauty contest between member states who want the European banking and medicine agencies, currently located in London, will begin within two weeks, with selection criteria to be unveiled by the president of the European council, Donald Tusk.
The European Banking Authority and the European Medicines Agency employ about 1,000 people, many of them British, and provide a hub for businesses in the UK. It is understood that the EU’s chief negotiator hopes the agencies will know their new locations by June, although the process may take longer. Cities such as Frankfurt, Milan, Amsterdam and Paris are competing to take the agencies, which are regarded as among the EU’s crown jewels.
Meanwhile, it has emerged that Britain failed to secure the backing of any of the 27 countries for its case that trade talks should start early in the two years of negotiations allowed by article 50 of the Lisbon treaty. The position will be announced at a Brussels summit on 29 April.
If the EU is intending to humiliate us, as the report claims, then the hardest of hard brexits it will have to be - if they want to humiliate, then the EU was never interested in a meaningful discussion and May can quite rightly claim the EU allowed no options, and so any problems are their fault, since they never even waited to negotiate with May before seeking humiliation.
The biggest risk to the Tory lead is that May gets blamed for a poor deal, but if the EU starts out with a stance that is portrayed, with glee, as humiliation, then May will get a much easier pass - any problems would have been blamed on a truculent EU anyway, but apparently that defence will be 100% accurate.
Indeed so. "Fuck Europe" will be the natural UK attitude.
We can't leave before March 2019 without their agreement. Scottish independence is already baked in. The UK will be defunct by the time this is over.
Are you still peddling this tripe?
13% of the EU has just walked away - 16% of GDP. A net contributor.
The EU is set to inflict a double humiliation on Theresa May, stripping Britain of its European agencies within weeks, while formally rejecting the prime minister’s calls for early trade talks.
The Observer has learned that EU diplomats agreed their uncompromising position at a crunch meeting on Tuesday, held to set out the union’s strategy in the talks due to start next month.
A beauty contest between member states who want the European banking and medicine agencies, currently located in London, will begin within two weeks, with selection criteria to be unveiled by the president of the European council, Donald Tusk.
The European Banking Authority and the European Medicines Agency employ about 1,000 people, many of them British, and provide a hub for businesses in the UK. It is understood that the EU’s chief negotiator hopes the agencies will know their new locations by June, although the process may take longer. Cities such as Frankfurt, Milan, Amsterdam and Paris are competing to take the agencies, which are regarded as among the EU’s crown jewels.
Meanwhile, it has emerged that Britain failed to secure the backing of any of the 27 countries for its case that trade talks should start early in the two years of negotiations allowed by article 50 of the Lisbon treaty. The position will be announced at a Brussels summit on 29 April.
If the EU is intending to humiliate us, as the report claims, then the hardest of hard brexits it will have to be - if they want to humiliate, then the EU was never interested in a meaningful discussion and May can quite rightly claim the EU allowed no options, and so any problems are their fault, since they never even waited to negotiate with May before seeking humiliation.
The biggest risk to the Tory lead is that May gets blamed for a poor deal, but if the EU starts out with a stance that is portrayed, with glee, as humiliation, then May will get a much easier pass - any problems would have been blamed on a truculent EU anyway, but apparently that defence will be 100% accurate.
Indeed so. "Fuck Europe" will be the natural UK attitude.
"Love Europe, Fuck the EU"
Even their railways are better than ours. Ours are better than North Korea's.
On CNN, I saw even Turkey has these super fast railways now.
The EU is set to inflict a double humiliation on Theresa May, stripping Britain of its European agencies within weeks, while formally rejecting the prime minister’s calls for early trade talks.
The Observer has learned that EU diplomats agreed their uncompromising position at a crunch meeting on Tuesday, held to set out the union’s strategy in the talks due to start next month.
A beauty contest between member states who want the European banking and medicine agencies, currently located in London, will begin within two weeks, with selection criteria to be unveiled by the president of the European council, Donald Tusk.
The European Banking Authority and the European Medicines Agency employ about 1,000 people, many of them British, and provide a hub for businesses in the UK. It is understood that the EU’s chief negotiator hopes the agencies will know their new locations by June, although the process may take longer. Cities such as Frankfurt, Milan, Amsterdam and Paris are competing to take the agencies, which are regarded as among the EU’s crown jewels.
Meanwhile, it has emerged that Britain failed to secure the backing of any of the 27 countries for its case that trade talks should start early in the two years of negotiations allowed by article 50 of the Lisbon treaty. The position will be announced at a Brussels summit on 29 April.
Losing the Medicines Agency has the potential to damage the NHS by far more than can be recovered by a busload of cash.
Losing all EU agencies here was surely always inevitable even with the softest of soft brexits?
Do EU employment laws allow them to sack all their UK staff?
UK law would be sovereign in this case, no? - employment law is surely based on country in which business is transacted...
The EU will pay whatever they have to pay and more. In the UK, it is a maximum of 24 weeks pay if you work that many years, I believe, unless they have something else in their contracts.
The EU is set to inflict a double humiliation on Theresa May, stripping Britain of its European agencies within weeks, while formally rejecting the prime minister’s calls for early trade talks.
The Observer has learned that EU diplomats agreed their uncompromising position at a crunch meeting on Tuesday, held to set out the union’s strategy in the talks due to start next month.
A beauty contest between member states who want the European banking and medicine agencies, currently located in London, will begin within two weeks, with selection criteria to be unveiled by the president of the European council, Donald Tusk.
The European Banking Authority and the European Medicines Agency employ about 1,000 people, many of them British, and provide a hub for businesses in the UK. It is understood that the EU’s chief negotiator hopes the agencies will know their new locations by June, although the process may take longer. Cities such as Frankfurt, Milan, Amsterdam and Paris are competing to take the agencies, which are regarded as among the EU’s crown jewels.
Meanwhile, it has emerged that Britain failed to secure the backing of any of the 27 countries for its case that trade talks should start early in the two years of negotiations allowed by article 50 of the Lisbon treaty. The position will be announced at a Brussels summit on 29 April.
Losing the Medicines Agency has the potential to damage the NHS by far more than can be recovered by a busload of cash.
Losing all EU agencies here was surely always inevitable even with the softest of soft brexits?
A statement of the bleeding obvious. We voted to cut ties with our neighbours, It would be absurd to expect european institutions to be based here post Brexit.
Leavers weren't so delusional as to expect them to stay, surely?
No. Of course they were going to leave. But we expect 20% of EU assets, for which we have paid. Let them work THAT out.
That is a seperate negotiation on assets and liabilities, but it was always inevitable that these institutions would be moving. It makes sense for that process to start immediately in order to have minimum disruption to their functions.
It is not deliberate humiliation. Brexit is punishment enough, as the wise fellow said.
The EU is set to inflict a double humiliation on Theresa May, stripping Britain of its European agencies within weeks, while formally rejecting the prime minister’s calls for early trade talks.
The Observer has learned that EU diplomats agreed their uncompromising position at a crunch meeting on Tuesday, held to set out the union’s strategy in the talks due to start next month.
A beauty contest between member states who want the European banking and medicine agencies, currently located in London, will begin within two weeks, with selection criteria to be unveiled by the president of the European council, Donald Tusk.
The European Banking Authority and the European Medicines Agency employ about 1,000 people, many of them British, and provide a hub for businesses in the UK. It is understood that the EU’s chief negotiator hopes the agencies will know their new locations by June, although the process may take longer. Cities such as Frankfurt, Milan, Amsterdam and Paris are competing to take the agencies, which are regarded as among the EU’s crown jewels.
Meanwhile, it has emerged that Britain failed to secure the backing of any of the 27 countries for its case that trade talks should start early in the two years of negotiations allowed by article 50 of the Lisbon treaty. The position will be announced at a Brussels summit on 29 April.
If the EU is intending to humiliate us, as the report claims, then the hardest of hard brexits it will have to be - if they want to humiliate, then the EU was never interested in a meaningful discussion and May can quite rightly claim the EU allowed no options, and so any problems are their fault, since they never even waited to negotiate with May before seeking humiliation.
The biggest risk to the Tory lead is that May gets blamed for a poor deal, but if the EU starts out with a stance that is portrayed, with glee, as humiliation, then May will get a much easier pass - any problems would have been blamed on a truculent EU anyway, but apparently that defence will be 100% accurate.
Indeed so. "Fuck Europe" will be the natural UK attitude.
"Love Europe, Fuck the EU"
Even their railways are better than ours. Ours are better than North Korea's.
On CNN, I saw even Turkey has these super fast railways now.
he process may take longer. Cities such as Frankfurt, Milan, Amsterdam and Paris are competing to take the agencies, which are regarded as among the EU’s crown jewels.
Meanwhile, it has emerged that Britain failed to secure the backing of any of the 27 countries for its case that trade talks should start early in the two years of negotiations allowed by article 50 of the Lisbon treaty. The position will be announced at a Brussels summit on 29 April.
If the EU is intending to humiliate us, as the report claims, then the hardest of hard brexits it will have to be - if they want to humiliate, then the EU was never interested in a meaningful discussion and May can quite rightly claim the EU allowed no options, and so any problems are their fault, since they never even waited to negotiate with May before seeking humiliation.
The biggest risk to the Tory lead is that May gets blamed for a poor deal, but if the EU starts out with a stance that is portrayed, with glee, as humiliation, then May will get a much easier pass - any problems would have been blamed on a truculent EU anyway, but apparently that defence will be 100% accurate.
Indeed so. "Fuck Europe" will be the natural UK attitude.
We can't leave before March 2019 without their agreement. Scottish independence is already baked in. The UK will be defunct by the time this is over.
We can leave tomorrow. We just LEAVE. As even europhiles admit, we have been sovereign all along.
We repeal the EEC act of 1973. We're out. We default to WTO. Salutary chaos ensues. Fuck it.
Did you have a row with your latest girl-friend last night. Has she left you with a spare bottle of ‘sauce’?
The EU is set to inflict a double humiliation on Theresa May, stripping Britain of its European agencies within weeks, while formally rejecting the prime minister’s calls for early trade talks.
The Observer has learned that EU diplomats agreed their uncompromising position at a crunch meeting on Tuesday, held to set out the union’s strategy in the talks due to start next month.
A beauty contest between member states who want the European banking and medicine agencies, currently located in London, will begin within two weeks, with selection criteria to be unveiled by the president of the European council, Donald Tusk.
The European Banking Authority and the European Medicines Agency employ about 1,000 people, many of them British, and provide a hub for businesses in the UK. It is understood that the EU’s chief negotiator hopes the agencies will know their new locations by June, although the process may take longer. Cities such as Frankfurt, Milan, Amsterdam and Paris are competing to take the agencies, which are regarded as among the EU’s crown jewels.
Meanwhile, it has emerged that Britain failed to secure the backing of any of the 27 countries for its case that trade talks should start early in the two years of negotiations allowed by article 50 of the Lisbon treaty. The position will be announced at a Brussels summit on 29 April.
If the EU is intending to humiliate us, as the report claims, then the hardest of hard brexits it will have to be - if they want to humiliate, then the EU was never interested in a meaningful discussion and May can quite rightly claim the EU allowed no options, and so any problems are their fault, since they never even waited to negotiate with May before seeking humiliation.
The biggest risk to the Tory lead is that May gets blamed for a poor deal, but if the EU starts out with a stance that is portrayed, with glee, as humiliation, then May will get a much easier pass - any problems would have been blamed on a truculent EU anyway, but apparently that defence will be 100% accurate.
Indeed so. "Fuck Europe" will be the natural UK attitude.
We can't leave before March 2019 without their agreement. Scottish independence is already baked in. The UK will be defunct by the time this is over.
No it won't, and if the EU play hard ball with the UK on a Brexit deal, the SNP will not be popular outwith their core membership if seen to be undermining the UK position even further.
The EU is set to inflict a double humiliation on Theresa May, stripping Britain of its European agencies within weeks, while formally rejecting the prime minister’s calls for early trade talks.
The Observer has learned that EU diplomats agreed their uncompromising position at a crunch meeting on Tuesday, held to set out the union’s strategy in the talks due to start next month.
A beauty contest between member states who want the European banking and medicine agencies, currently located in London, will begin within two weeks, with selection criteria to be unveiled by the president of the European council, Donald Tusk.
The European Banking Authority and the European Medicines Agency employ about 1,000 people, many of them British, and provide a hub for businesses in the UK. It is understood that the EU’s chief negotiator hopes the agencies will know their new locations by June, although the process may take longer. Cities such as Frankfurt, Milan, Amsterdam and Paris are competing to take the agencies, which are regarded as among the EU’s crown jewels.
Meanwhile, it has emerged that Britain failed to secure the backing of any of the 27 countries for its case that trade talks should start early in the two years of negotiations allowed by article 50 of the Lisbon treaty. The position will be announced at a Brussels summit on 29 April.
Losing the Medicines Agency has the potential to damage the NHS by far more than can be recovered by a busload of cash.
Losing all EU agencies here was surely always inevitable even with the softest of soft brexits?
Do EU employment laws allow them to sack all their UK staff?
As the new offices are probably going to be quite far away I believe the workers will be entitled to redundancy pay. Small comfort for those losing their jobs though!
Indeed, but will they have the option to transfer?
It may well be that the relocation takes place before they technically become non-EU citizens.
Are the posts they fill already only open to EU citizens, or will the loss of citizenship not be a reason for them to lose their job without the option of staying?
The EU is set to inflict a double humiliation on Theresa May, stripping Britain of its European agencies within weeks, while formally rejecting the prime minister’s calls for early trade talks.
The Observer has learned that EU diplomats agreed their uncompromising position at a crunch meeting on Tuesday, held to set out the union’s strategy in the talks due to start next month.
A beauty contest between member states who want the European banking and medicine agencies, currently located in London, will begin within two weeks, with selection criteria to be unveiled by the president of the European council, Donald Tusk.
Meanwhile, it has emerged that Britain failed to secure the backing of any of the 27 countries for its case that trade talks should start early in the two years of negotiations allowed by article 50 of the Lisbon treaty. The position will be announced at a Brussels summit on 29 April.
If the EU is intending to humiliate us, as the report claims, then the hardest of hard brexits it will have to be - if they want to humiliate, then the EU was never interested in a meaningful discussion and May can quite rightly claim the EU allowed no options, and so any problems are their fault, since they never even waited to negotiate with May before seeking humiliation.
The biggest risk to the Tory lead is that May gets blamed for a poor deal, but if the EU starts out with a stance that is portrayed, with glee, as humiliation, then May will get a much easier pass - any problems would have been blamed on a truculent EU anyway, but apparently that defence will be 100% accurate.
Indeed so. "Fuck Europe" will be the natural UK attitude.
We can't leave before March 2019 without their agreement. Scottish independence is already baked in. The UK will be defunct by the time this is over.
We can leave tomorrow. We just LEAVE. As even europhiles admit, we have been sovereign all along.
We repeal the EEC act of 1973. We're out. We default to WTO. Salutary chaos ensues. Fuck it.
So it's 'hard as fuck' Brexit tonight, is it? Hard to keep up.
SeanT will be all soft and floppy soon enough. He changes his mind more often than his underpants.
Every EU Authority and Agency based in the UK will obviously be repatriated back to an EU country as a result of the UK leaving. - If the Guardian article is to be believed, I find it very odd that that should be the EU’s first priority, large pinch of salt needed me thinks.
What will replace the European Aviation Safety Authority ?
43 dead in Syria today. But no posts here on PB. The "wrong" people died. And Jabhat-Al-Nusra are now our allies !
50 people die in Syria every day, don't they? Every one a horror, every one a sadness. But it's a civil war. They are notoriously nasty. What should we do? Bomb them like Trump?
I say: Leave Well Alone, and maybe hope Assad wins. As the least worst of several deeply evil options.
It’s 1984 isn’t it. Yesterday Eastasia were the enemy. Now they are our allies. Tomorrow they will be our enemies again! Or something like that.
IIRC both sides in the Spanish Civil War were equally nasty, but people in UK regarded one side as good and the other as the devil incarnate. Or the other way round depending on whether one was essentially Left or Right.
Not sure if one could describe the protagonists as equally nasty in a war in which the Nationalists executed at least three times as many civilians as the Republicans. In any case the latter were the democratically elected government, the former Fascist rebels.
People in the UK (unlike their government) were able to distinguish between the sides enough for over 2k to volunteer for the Republican cause, while barely dozens answered the Nationalists' call.
"Although the war is often portrayed as a struggle between democracy and fascism, some historians consider it more accurately described as a struggle between leftist revolution and rightist counter-revolution.[6]"
"News of the rightist military coup in 1936 unleashed a social revolutionary response, and no republican region escaped revolutionary and anticlerical violence - though in the Basque Country this was minimal.[6] The violence consisted of the killing of tens of thousands of people (including 6,832[7] members of the Catholic clergy, the vast majority in the summer of 1936 in the wake of the military coup), as well as attacks on landowners, industrialists, and politicians, and the desecration and burning of monasteries and churches.[7]"
Every EU Authority and Agency based in the UK will obviously be repatriated back to an EU country as a result of the UK leaving. - If the Guardian article is to be believed, I find it very odd that that should be the EU’s first priority, large pinch of salt needed me thinks.
What will replace the European Aviation Safety Authority ?
British bulldog spirit is all that is needed, our flyboys fly by the seat of their pants!
I come on PB, I see the usual shit being thrown around. I post a sarky comment. And then I leave...
Or do I?
I'm certainly not going to get engaged in another tedious Brexit discussion with people who can't change their minds, and won't change the subject.
But I will attempt to steer the conversation. I have seen three brilliant TV series this year.
Big Little Lies is terrific. Very tense, with some nicely rounded characters. It isn't perfect (all the male characters are weak or shits or both, the conclusion is a bit too well telegraphed), but it is well paced, well scripted and well edited. 9/10.
Goliath is typically well made David E Kelly lawsuit story. It's David (played outstandingly by Billy Bob Thornton) vs Goliath (played by William Hurt). Washed out alcoholic, blah blah. What's brilliant about this is the female supporting characters (and Billy Bob). The plot is ridiculous and the closing trial anti-climatic, but it's well worth a watch. 8.5/10.
Shut Eye is the Sopranos in LA and set around the fortune telling mafia. You know those signs offering physic reading? This is about the organisation that sits behind that. Chillingly dark, and extremely well made. It's a bit unevenly paced, but the premise is good and the characterisation excellent. 8.5/10.
I have no idea where in the UK these shows can be watched, but they are all worth seeing.
Every EU Authority and Agency based in the UK will obviously be repatriated back to an EU country as a result of the UK leaving. - If the Guardian article is to be believed, I find it very odd that that should be the EU’s first priority, large pinch of salt needed me thinks.
What will replace the European Aviation Safety Authority ?
We had a discussion about this on a previous thread. Most of the EASA responsibilities in the UK are done by the Civil Aviation Authority. I suspect in the interim we'd be a bit like Turkey and say we are adopting the rules of the EASA while not being an EU member.
Every EU Authority and Agency based in the UK will obviously be repatriated back to an EU country as a result of the UK leaving. - If the Guardian article is to be believed, I find it very odd that that should be the EU’s first priority, large pinch of salt needed me thinks.
What will replace the European Aviation Safety Authority ?
British bulldog spirit is all that is needed, our flyboys fly by the seat of their pants!
Losing the Medicines Agency has the potential to damage the NHS by far more than can be recovered by a busload of cash.
Losing all EU agencies here was surely always inevitable even with the softest of soft brexits?
A statement of the bleeding obvious. We voted to cut ties with our neighbours, It would be absurd to expect european institutions to be based here post Brexit.
Leavers weren't so delusional as to expect them to stay, surely?
No. Of course they were going to leave. But we expect 20% of EU assets, for which we have paid. Let them work THAT out.
That is a seperate negotiation on assets and liabilities, but it was always inevitable that these institutions would be moving. It makes sense for that process to start immediately in order to have minimum disruption to their functions.
It is not deliberate humiliation. Brexit is punishment enough, as the wise fellow said.
I suspect the Guardian is spinning this in a Remoanery way. As is their wont.
But it reinforces my suspicions that the biggest threat to a Smooth Brexit is the British media, on both sides. The eurosceptic tabloids will demand an insane Smash Bang Brexit, the Remoanery papers will say we are being humiliated, we must stay, reverse the vote, thus firing up sceptics to demand Titanium Brexit.
This whole complex, painful process would be better if we closed all UK media, left and right, Leave and Stay, for the next 24 months
If only there was somebody on PB that was a profit centre for the UK press and might have some influence...
If the EU is intending to humiliate us, as the report claims, then the hardest of hard brexits it will have to be - if they want to humiliate, then the EU was never interested in a meaningful discussion and May can quite rightly claim the EU allowed no options, and so any problems are their fault, since they never even waited to negotiate with May before seeking humiliation.
The biggest risk to the Tory lead is that May gets blamed for a poor deal, but if the EU starts out with a stance that is portrayed, with glee, as humiliation, then May will get a much easier pass - any problems would have been blamed on a truculent EU anyway, but apparently that defence will be 100% accurate.
Indeed so. "Fuck Europe" will be the natural UK attitude.
We can't leave before March 2019 without their agreement. Scottish independence is already baked in. The UK will be defunct by the time this is over.
That is seriously unfortunate and I hope it is not so. But it has to be said that if the EU seeks to humiliate, then they clearly are not the logical, moral organisation we are repeatedly told. Such an organisation would strike the best deal for its members, which surely does not include humiliating neighbouring countries.
The humiliation will be entirely self-inflicted.
It was May's decision to press on with a hard Brexit despite two of the four nations of the UK voting to Remain in the EU. Just think how we would perceive a similar situation if we were talking about another multinational state on the other side of Europe? The political logic from all sides, not least the true Brexit believers, can only lead to the break-up of the UK.
Seriously? Given the choice, who would those parts of the UK who voted to Remain trust the most to have their back in a tight corner, the rest of the UK or Europe?!
I come on PB, I see the usual shit being thrown around. I post a sarky comment. And then I leave...
Or do I?
I'm certainly not going to get engaged in another tedious Brexit discussion with people who can't change their minds, and won't change the subject.
But I will attempt to steer the conversation. I have seen three brilliant TV series this year.
Big Little Lies is terrific. Very tense, with some nicely rounded characters. It isn't perfect (all the male characters are weak or shits or both, the conclusion is a bit too well telegraphed), but it is well paced, well scripted and well edited. 9/10.
Goliath is typically well made David E Kelly lawsuit story. It's David (played outstandingly by Billy Bob Thornton) vs Goliath (played by William Hurt). Washed out alcoholic, blah blah. What's brilliant about this is the female supporting characters (and Billy Bob). The plot is ridiculous and the closing trial anti-climatic, but it's well worth a watch. 8.5/10.
Shut Eye is the Sopranos in LA and set around the fortune telling mafia. You know those signs offering physic reading? This is about the organisation that sits behind that. Chillingly dark, and extremely well made. It's a bit unevenly paced, but the premise is good and the characterisation excellent. 8.5/10.
I have no idea where in the UK these shows can be watched, but they are all worth seeing.
43 dead in Syria today. But no posts here on PB. The "wrong" people died. And Jabhat-Al-Nusra are now our allies !
50 people die in Syria every day, don't they? Every one a horror, every one a sadness. But it's a civil war. They are notoriously nasty. What should we do? Bomb them like Trump?
I say: Leave Well Alone, and maybe hope Assad wins. As the least worst of several deeply evil options.
It’s 1984 isn’t it. Yesterday Eastasia were the enemy. Now they are our allies. Tomorrow they will be our enemies again! Or something like that.
IIRC both sides in the Spanish Civil War were equally nasty, but people in UK regarded one side as good and the other as the devil incarnate. Or the other way round depending on whether one was essentially Left or Right.
Not sure if one could describe the protagonists as equally nasty in a war in which the Nationalists executed at least three times as many civilians as the Republicans. In any case the latter were the democratically elected government, the former Fascist rebels.
People in the UK (unlike their government) were able to distinguish between the sides enough for over 2k to volunteer for the Republican cause, while barely dozens answered the Nationalists' call.
"Although the war is often portrayed as a struggle between democracy and fascism, some historians consider it more accurately described as a struggle between leftist revolution and rightist counter-revolution.[6]"
"News of the rightist military coup in 1936 unleashed a social revolutionary response, and no republican region escaped revolutionary and anticlerical violence - though in the Basque Country this was minimal.[6] The violence consisted of the killing of tens of thousands of people (including 6,832[7] members of the Catholic clergy, the vast majority in the summer of 1936 in the wake of the military coup), as well as attacks on landowners, industrialists, and politicians, and the desecration and burning of monasteries and churches.[7]"
I'm sure you've read Homage to Catalonia. They were both pretty horrible. But here's the thing: would you rather stand up for democratic institutions, even when they delivered a result you didn't like? Or go to war to overthrow them?
If the EU is intending to humiliate us, as the report claims, then the hardest of hard brexits it will have to be - if they want to humiliate, then the EU was never interested in a meaningful discussion and May can quite rightly claim the EU allowed no options, and so any problems are their fault, since they never even waited to negotiate with May before seeking humiliation.
The biggest risk to the Tory lead is that May gets blamed for a poor deal, but if the EU starts out with a stance that is portrayed, with glee, as humiliation, then May will get a much easier pass - any problems would have been blamed on a truculent EU anyway, but apparently that defence will be 100% accurate.
Indeed so. "Fuck Europe" will be the natural UK attitude.
We can't leave before March 2019 without their agreement. Scottish independence is already baked in. The UK will be defunct by the time this is over.
That is seriously unfortunate and I hope it is not so. But it has to be said that if the EU seeks to humiliate, then they clearly are not the logical, moral organisation we are repeatedly told. Such an organisation would strike the best deal for its members, which surely does not include humiliating neighbouring countries.
The humiliation will be entirely self-inflicted.
It was May's decision to press on with a hard Brexit despite two of the four nations of the UK voting to Remain in the EU. Just think how we would perceive a similar situation if we were talking about another multinational state on the other side of Europe? The political logic from all sides, not least the true Brexit believers, can only lead to the break-up of the UK.
You are insane. The EU is seeking to humiliate according to that write up, which means going above and beyond what they need to do to stick up for its members and in fact seeking to be punitive and vindictive, and you blame that on the UK too. The EU has a duty to stick up for its members, it does not have a duty to humiliate or punish, but the motivation appears to be the latter not the former.
The EU is set to inflict a double humiliation on Theresa May, stripping Britain of its European agencies within weeks, while formally rejecting the prime minister’s calls for early trade talks.
The Observer has learned that EU diplomats agreed their uncompromising position at a crunch meeting on Tuesday, held to set out the union’s strategy in the talks due to start next month.
A beauty contest between member states who want the European banking and medicine agencies, currently located in London, will begin within two weeks, with selection criteria to be unveiled by the president of the European council, Donald Tusk.
The European Banking Authority and the European Medicines Agency employ about 1,000 people, many of them British, and provide a hub for businesses in the UK. It is understood that the EU’s chief negotiator hopes the agencies will know their new locations by June, although the process may take longer. Cities such as Frankfurt, Milan, Amsterdam and Paris are competing to take the agencies, which are regarded as among the EU’s crown jewels.
Meanwhile, it has emerged that Britain failed to secure the backing of any of the 27 countries for its case that trade talks should start early in the two years of negotiations allowed by article 50 of the Lisbon treaty. The position will be announced at a Brussels summit on 29 April.
If the EU is intending to humiliate us, as the report claims, then the hardest of hard brexits it will have to be - if they want to humiliate, then the EU was never interested in a meaningful discussion and May can quite rightly claim the EU allowed no options, and so any problems are their fault, since they never even waited to negotiate with May before seeking humiliation.
The biggest risk to the Tory lead is that May gets blamed for a poor deal, but if the EU starts out with a stance that is portrayed, with glee, as humiliation, then May will get a much easier pass - any problems would have been blamed on a truculent EU anyway, but apparently that defence will be 100% accurate.
Indeed.
Being in EverCloserUnion with an organisation that hates and wishes to humiliate Britain will not seem like a good alternative to leaving.
The EU is set to inflict a double humiliation on Theresa May, stripping Britain of its European agencies within weeks, while formally rejecting the prime minister’s calls for early trade talks.
The Observer has learned that EU diplomats agreed their uncompromising position at a crunch meeting on Tuesday, held to set out the union’s strategy in the talks due to start next month.
A beauty contest between member states who want the European banking and medicine agencies, currently located in London, will begin within two weeks, with selection criteria to be unveiled by the president of the European council, Donald Tusk.
The European Banking Authority and the European Medicines Agency employ about 1,000 people, many of them British, and provide a hub for businesses in the UK. It is understood that the EU’s chief negotiator hopes the agencies will know their new locations by June, although the process may take longer. Cities such as Frankfurt, Milan, Amsterdam and Paris are competing to take the agencies, which are regarded as among the EU’s crown jewels.
Meanwhile, it has emerged that Britain failed to secure the backing of any of the 27 countries for its case that trade talks should start early in the two years of negotiations allowed by article 50 of the Lisbon treaty. The position will be announced at a Brussels summit on 29 April.
I come on PB, I see the usual shit being thrown around. I post a sarky comment. And then I leave...
Or do I?
I'm certainly not going to get engaged in another tedious Brexit discussion with people who can't change their minds, and won't change the subject.
But I will attempt to steer the conversation. I have seen three brilliant TV series this year.
Big Little Lies is terrific. Very tense, with some nicely rounded characters. It isn't perfect (all the male characters are weak or shits or both, the conclusion is a bit too well telegraphed), but it is well paced, well scripted and well edited. 9/10.
Goliath is typically well made David E Kelly lawsuit story. It's David (played outstandingly by Billy Bob Thornton) vs Goliath (played by William Hurt). Washed out alcoholic, blah blah. What's brilliant about this is the female supporting characters (and Billy Bob). The plot is ridiculous and the closing trial anti-climatic, but it's well worth a watch. 8.5/10.
Shut Eye is the Sopranos in LA and set around the fortune telling mafia. You know those signs offering physic reading? This is about the organisation that sits behind that. Chillingly dark, and extremely well made. It's a bit unevenly paced, but the premise is good and the characterisation excellent. 8.5/10.
I have no idea where in the UK these shows can be watched, but they are all worth seeing.
Yes, yes, yes, you're now living in LA. Well done. Are you happy now? Frankly, I can't abide PB-ers who come on here to boast about their wealth, success, royalties, girlfriendS, with comments barely disguised as TV critiques or mild observations about AV or forex.
PUKE
It is a complete coincidence that two of the three shows I mentioned are set in beautifully sunny LA.
43 dead in Syria today. But no posts here on PB. The "wrong" people died. And Jabhat-Al-Nusra are now our allies !
50 people die in Syria every day, don't they? Every one a horror, every one a sadness. But it's a civil war. They are notoriously nasty. What should we do? Bomb them like Trump?
I say: Leave Well Alone, and maybe hope Assad wins. As the least worst of several deeply evil options.
It’s 1984 isn’t it. Yesterday Eastasia were the enemy. Now they are our allies. Tomorrow they will be our enemies again! Or something like that.
IIRC both sides in the Spanish Civil War were equally nasty, but people in UK regarded one side as good and the other as the devil incarnate. Or the other way round depending on whether one was essentially Left or Right.
Not sure if one could describe the protagonists as equally nasty in a war in which the Nationalists executed at least three times as many civilians as the Republicans. In any case the latter were the democratically elected government, the former Fascist rebels.
People in the UK (unlike their government) were able to distinguish between the sides enough for over 2k to volunteer for the Republican cause, while barely dozens answered the Nationalists' call.
"Although the war is often portrayed as a struggle between democracy and fascism, some historians consider it more accurately described as a struggle between leftist revolution and rightist counter-revolution.[6]"
"News of the rightist military coup in 1936 unleashed a social revolutionary response, and no republican region escaped revolutionary and anticlerical violence - though in the Basque Country this was minimal.[6] The violence consisted of the killing of tens of thousands of people (including 6,832[7] members of the Catholic clergy, the vast majority in the summer of 1936 in the wake of the military coup), as well as attacks on landowners, industrialists, and politicians, and the desecration and burning of monasteries and churches.[7]"
I'm sure you've read Homage to Catalonia. They were both pretty horrible. But here's the thing: would you rather stand up for democratic institutions, even when they delivered a result you didn't like? Or go to war to overthrow them?
It's almost like there's a lesson here...
Then again Franco did prevaricate in his "alliance" with Hitler, only sending a token force of volunteers to the Eastern Front.
Having the EU financial regulator outside of the City is a recipe for disaster, but mostly for them. The level of oversight that EU banks operating in London will receive from Brussels will undoubtedly lessen as a result.
On TV shows, I had a very interesting chat with a senior producer at SPE TV UK (the guys that make The Crown). He sincerely believes that traditional TV is in its dying days and that on demand is the future which is why their big TV bet has been with Netflix and they have more shows lined up with Netflix than with any single traditional broadcaster. Spotify is killing the radio (though not physical ownership) and Netflix will kill TV (though not physical ownership). I'm also looking forward to the second season of the Crown and an upcoming series they are in talks to the get the rights for.
I come on PB, I see the usual shit being thrown around. I post a sarky comment. And then I leave...
Or do I?
I'm certainly not going to get engaged in another tedious Brexit discussion with people who can't change their minds, and won't change the subject.
But I will attempt to steer the conversation. I have seen three brilliant TV series this year.
Big Little Lies is terrific. Very tense, with some nicely rounded characters. It isn't perfect (all the male characters are weak or shits or both, the conclusion is a bit too well telegraphed), but it is well paced, well scripted and well edited. 9/10.
Goliath is typically well made David E Kelly lawsuit story. It's David (played outstandingly by Billy Bob Thornton) vs Goliath (played by William Hurt). Washed out alcoholic, blah blah. What's brilliant about this is the female supporting characters (and Billy Bob). The plot is ridiculous and the closing trial anti-climatic, but it's well worth a watch. 8.5/10.
Shut Eye is the Sopranos in LA and set around the fortune telling mafia. You know those signs offering physic reading? This is about the organisation that sits behind that. Chillingly dark, and extremely well made. It's a bit unevenly paced, but the premise is good and the characterisation excellent. 8.5/10.
I have no idea where in the UK these shows can be watched, but they are all worth seeing.
One of the reasons PB interests me is that, even with a topic that gets flogged to death, such as Brexit, very occasionally somebody does come up with a new angle (new to me, anyway, in spire of browsing most threads I've time for).
I come on PB, I see the usual shit being thrown around. I post a sarky comment. And then I leave...
Or do I?
I'm certainly not going to get engaged in another tedious Brexit discussion with people who can't change their minds, and won't change the subject.
But I will attempt to steer the conversation. I have seen three brilliant TV series this year.
Big Little Lies is terrific. Very tense, with some nicely rounded characters. It isn't perfect (all the male characters are weak or shits or both, the conclusion is a bit too well telegraphed), but it is well paced, well scripted and well edited. 9/10.
Goliath is typically well made David E Kelly lawsuit story. It's David (played outstandingly by Billy Bob Thornton) vs Goliath (played by William Hurt). Washed out alcoholic, blah blah. What's brilliant about this is the female supporting characters (and Billy Bob). The plot is ridiculous and the closing trial anti-climatic, but it's well worth a watch. 8.5/10.
Shut Eye is the Sopranos in LA and set around the fortune telling mafia. You know those signs offering physic reading? This is about the organisation that sits behind that. Chillingly dark, and extremely well made. It's a bit unevenly paced, but the premise is good and the characterisation excellent. 8.5/10.
I have no idea where in the UK these shows can be watched, but they are all worth seeing.
Yes, yes, yes, you're now living in LA. Well done. Are you happy now? Frankly, I can't abide PB-ers who come on here to boast about their wealth, success, royalties, girlfriendS, with comments barely disguised as TV critiques or mild observations about AV or forex.
PUKE
It is a complete coincidence that two of the three shows I mentioned are set in beautifully sunny LA.
LA is a slightly dull city, in my experience (and I have good friends there and have been to the BEST parties), but I sincerely hope you have fun in in the sun. Just keep an eye on your UK *properties*, eh?
LA seems to be getting left behind in the riot action stakes these days. You only need to drive up the coast to see this happening right now:
I come on PB, I see the usual shit being thrown around. I post a sarky comment. And then I leave...
Or do I?
I'm certainly not going to get engaged in another tedious Brexit discussion with people who can't change their minds, and won't change the subject.
But I will attempt to steer the conversation. I have seen three brilliant TV series this year.
Big Little Lies is terrific. Very tense, with some nicely rounded characters. It isn't perfect (all the male characters are weak or shits or both, the conclusion is a bit too well telegraphed), but it is well paced, well scripted and well edited. 9/10.
Goliath is typically well made David E Kelly lawsuit story. It's David (played outstandingly by Billy Bob Thornton) vs Goliath (played by William Hurt). Washed out alcoholic, blah blah. What's brilliant about this is the female supporting characters (and Billy Bob). The plot is ridiculous and the closing trial anti-climatic, but it's well worth a watch. 8.5/10.
Shut Eye is the Sopranos in LA and set around the fortune telling mafia. You know those signs offering physic reading? This is about the organisation that sits behind that. Chillingly dark, and extremely well made. It's a bit unevenly paced, but the premise is good and the characterisation excellent. 8.5/10.
I have no idea where in the UK these shows can be watched, but they are all worth seeing.
Yes, yes, yes, you're now living in LA. Well done. Are you happy now? Frankly, I can't abide PB-ers who come on here to boast about their wealth, success, royalties, girlfriendS, with comments barely disguised as TV critiques or mild observations about AV or forex.
PUKE
It is a complete coincidence that two of the three shows I mentioned are set in beautifully sunny LA.
LA is a slightly dull city, in my experience (and I have good friends there and have been to the BEST parties), but I sincerely hope you have fun in in the sun. Just keep an eye on your UK *properties*, eh?
LA seems to be getting left behind in the riot action stakes these days. You only need to drive up the coast to see this happening right now:
twitter.com/davidmackau/status/853337412310880258
There are pro-Trump people in Berkeley? They must have spent weeks tracking them down.
I come on PB, I see the usual shit being thrown around. I post a sarky comment. And then I leave...
Or do I?
I'm certainly not going to get engaged in another tedious Brexit discussion with people who can't change their minds, and won't change the subject.
But I will attempt to steer the conversation. I have seen three brilliant TV series this year.
Big Little Lies is terrific. Very tense, with some nicely rounded characters. It isn't perfect (all the male characters are weak or shits or both, the conclusion is a bit too well telegraphed), but it is well paced, well scripted and well edited. 9/10.
Goliath is typically well made David E Kelly lawsuit story. It's David (played outstandingly by Billy Bob Thornton) vs Goliath (played by William Hurt). Washed out alcoholic, blah blah. What's brilliant about this is the female supporting characters (and Billy Bob). The plot is ridiculous and the closing trial anti-climatic, but it's well worth a watch. 8.5/10.
Shut Eye is the Sopranos in LA and set around the fortune telling mafia. You know those signs offering physic reading? This is about the organisation that sits behind that. Chillingly dark, and extremely well made. It's a bit unevenly paced, but the premise is good and the characterisation excellent. 8.5/10.
I have no idea where in the UK these shows can be watched, but they are all worth seeing.
Big Little Lies - Sky Atlantic
Goliath - Amazon Prime
Shut Eye - No UK broadcaster yet
Seen both of the first two. Both good, Goliath was superior viewing I thought.
Every EU Authority and Agency based in the UK will obviously be repatriated back to an EU country as a result of the UK leaving. - If the Guardian article is to be believed, I find it very odd that that should be the EU’s first priority, large pinch of salt needed me thinks.
What will replace the European Aviation Safety Authority ?
British bulldog spirit is all that is needed, our flyboys fly by the seat of their pants!
Or - here is a wild idea . . the CAA who err do a lot of it now could continue to do so.
Comments
TBH I don't think the West Midlands will tell us much either way for that reason, and Corbyn could with some justification pass it off as the electorate rejecting a failed New Labour muppet with no ideas and no will to help ordinary people. Even though Corbyn's unpopularity may exaggerate the scale of the defeat, he will not be the sole reason for it (conversely, however, if by some fluke Simon wins Corbyn should not assume that's an endorsement of his new politics).
Manchester on the other hand...
That is all.
15.4.2017 £1= DEM 2.3074 [ € 1.179 ]
Devaluation is just a drug ! A short term fix. The problem with this country is productivity. WE produce 20% less per day than the Germans and the French.
Well, you had nothing else did you ;-)
The EU is set to inflict a double humiliation on Theresa May, stripping Britain of its European agencies within weeks, while formally rejecting the prime minister’s calls for early trade talks.
The Observer has learned that EU diplomats agreed their uncompromising position at a crunch meeting on Tuesday, held to set out the union’s strategy in the talks due to start next month.
A beauty contest between member states who want the European banking and medicine agencies, currently located in London, will begin within two weeks, with selection criteria to be unveiled by the president of the European council, Donald Tusk.
The European Banking Authority and the European Medicines Agency employ about 1,000 people, many of them British, and provide a hub for businesses in the UK. It is understood that the EU’s chief negotiator hopes the agencies will know their new locations by June, although the process may take longer. Cities such as Frankfurt, Milan, Amsterdam and Paris are competing to take the agencies, which are regarded as among the EU’s crown jewels.
Meanwhile, it has emerged that Britain failed to secure the backing of any of the 27 countries for its case that trade talks should start early in the two years of negotiations allowed by article 50 of the Lisbon treaty. The position will be announced at a Brussels summit on 29 April.
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2017/apr/15/britain-set-to-lose-eu-crown-jewels
Or something like that.
IIRC both sides in the Spanish Civil War were equally nasty, but people in UK regarded one side as good and the other as the devil incarnate. Or the other way round depending on whether one was essentially Left or Right.
Frankly, my dear, I don't give a damn
The biggest risk to the Tory lead is that May gets blamed for a poor deal, but if the EU starts out with a stance that is portrayed, with glee, as humiliation, then May will get a much easier pass - any problems would have been blamed on a truculent EU anyway, but apparently that defence will be 100% accurate.
And yes, I know ‘the people voted”.
Remember, your favourite sterling fell by 17% after June 2016.
On CNN, I saw even Turkey has these super fast railways now.
It was May's decision to press on with a hard Brexit despite two of the four nations of the UK voting to Remain in the EU. Just think how we would perceive a similar situation if we were talking about another multinational state on the other side of Europe? The political logic from all sides, not least the true Brexit believers, can only lead to the break-up of the UK.
I think the EU view is that the post Brexit deal has to be worse than full membership.
Leavers weren't so delusional as to expect them to stay, surely?
Is Sinn Fein Gaelic for collective pissing of pants?
One means we will incur negative consequences, which was inevitable (the question was whether we are able to seize the positive opportunities that will arise to mitigate those), the other means they will seek to inflict negative consequences for no reason other than to inflict them. That's what seeking to humiliate entails. Doesn't sound very noble to me.
At least Brexit has helped them get over austerity.
People in the UK (unlike their government) were able to distinguish between the sides enough for over 2k to volunteer for the Republican cause, while barely dozens answered the Nationalists' call.
13% of the EU has just walked away - 16% of GDP. A net contributor.
Not 8% and a net recipient.
It is not deliberate humiliation. Brexit is punishment enough, as the wise fellow said.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ankara–Istanbul_high-speed_railway
It may well be that the relocation takes place before they technically become non-EU citizens.
Are the posts they fill already only open to EU citizens, or will the loss of citizenship not be a reason for them to lose their job without the option of staying?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spanish_Civil_War
also:
"News of the rightist military coup in 1936 unleashed a social revolutionary response, and no republican region escaped revolutionary and anticlerical violence - though in the Basque Country this was minimal.[6] The violence consisted of the killing of tens of thousands of people (including 6,832[7] members of the Catholic clergy, the vast majority in the summer of 1936 in the wake of the military coup), as well as attacks on landowners, industrialists, and politicians, and the desecration and burning of monasteries and churches.[7]"
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Red_Terror_(Spain)
Or do I?
I'm certainly not going to get engaged in another tedious Brexit discussion with people who can't change their minds, and won't change the subject.
But I will attempt to steer the conversation. I have seen three brilliant TV series this year.
Big Little Lies is terrific. Very tense, with some nicely rounded characters. It isn't perfect (all the male characters are weak or shits or both, the conclusion is a bit too well telegraphed), but it is well paced, well scripted and well edited. 9/10.
Goliath is typically well made David E Kelly lawsuit story. It's David (played outstandingly by Billy Bob Thornton) vs Goliath (played by William Hurt). Washed out alcoholic, blah blah. What's brilliant about this is the female supporting characters (and Billy Bob). The plot is ridiculous and the closing trial anti-climatic, but it's well worth a watch. 8.5/10.
Shut Eye is the Sopranos in LA and set around the fortune telling mafia. You know those signs offering physic reading? This is about the organisation that sits behind that. Chillingly dark, and extremely well made. It's a bit unevenly paced, but the premise is good and the characterisation excellent. 8.5/10.
I have no idea where in the UK these shows can be watched, but they are all worth seeing.
And there were such interesting discussions earlier but now we're back onto the EU again.
Goliath - Amazon Prime
Shut Eye - No UK broadcaster yet
It's almost like there's a lesson here...
Being in EverCloserUnion with an organisation that hates and wishes to humiliate Britain will not seem like a good alternative to leaving.
Slumming it in Weymouth this long weekend, and went to Durdle Door today. Monkey World tomorrow and hopefully Swanage Railway on Monday!
The Telegraph - Austria ready to challenge Germany's autobahn "foreigner tolls" in court
On TV shows, I had a very interesting chat with a senior producer at SPE TV UK (the guys that make The Crown). He sincerely believes that traditional TV is in its dying days and that on demand is the future which is why their big TV bet has been with Netflix and they have more shows lined up with Netflix than with any single traditional broadcaster. Spotify is killing the radio (though not physical ownership) and Netflix will kill TV (though not physical ownership). I'm also looking forward to the second season of the Crown and an upcoming series they are in talks to the get the rights for.
But seriously, 45,000 is about the same number as that other token pro-Axis force, the INA.
https://twitter.com/davidmackau/status/853337412310880258