Howdy, Stranger!

It looks like you're new here. Sign in or register to get started.

Options

politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » Getting a sense of proportion over rail fares: the overwhelmin

13

Comments

  • Options
    JonathanDJonathanD Posts: 2,400
    MaxPB said:

    Scott_P said:

    MaxPB said:

    But it was supposed to happen after the vote, again you're avoiding that point

    Article 50 was supposed to happen after the vote.

    It hasn't happened yet. We haven't left. We haven't started leaving. We haven't scheduled the start of the process of beginning leaving.

    again you're avoiding that point...
    The vote to leave was supposed to cause a recession. Please point me in the direction of that data. It's put up or shut up time.
    The Treasury prediction was a recession during the 2 year period after article 50 was triggered and we actually left the EU.
  • Options
    glwglw Posts: 9,554
    TGOHF said:

    Not sure how the Uk negotiation team will cope with the genius who thought Cameron's deal was a terrific one which would prevent Brexit...

    Yes it is a bit like Harland and Wolff losing the "top" naval architect responsible for the Titanic.
  • Options
    williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 48,130
    TGOHF said:

    Not sure how the Uk negotiation team will cope with the genius who thought Cameron's deal was a terrific one which would prevent Brexit...

    Did he think the deal was 'terrific' or did he correctly argue that to achieve something more substantial would require a long-term commitment to treaty negotiation that wouldn't be possible before 2017?
  • Options
    rkrkrkrkrkrk Posts: 7,914

    Brexit: UK's top EU diplomat Sir Ivan Rogers resigns
    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-38498839

    I see the bbc doing a classic 0.1% massive / nothing routine again. Crucial role in brexit but was going to leave in Nov..how can you play a major role in a 2 year process if you are going to leave a few months in.

    You disagree that the top diplomat in Brussels would have played a key role? March until November is 8 months isn't it?

    Clearly he has fallen out with the government - if they had confidence in him and he was delivering- I don't doubt he would have been asked to stay on for a year and a bit to see the talks through.

    That said... Makes sense to have the person you want in place before talks start. But will be a tough job for whoever they choose to build relationships fast with 27 other countries.
  • Options
    EssexitEssexit Posts: 1,956
    @Scott_P - anyone who based an economic forecast on an assumption of David Cameron telling the truth really was having a laugh.
  • Options
    GallowgateGallowgate Posts: 19,086
    I live 6.5 miles away from the office, which is a short car journey southbound on the A1 past the Angel of the North. :smile:
  • Options
    MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 37,618
    TOPPING said:

    MaxPB said:

    MaxPB said:

    I don't know what will happen, I've never really claimed to know. What I do know is that right now the economy is booming, savings are up, the trade deficit is finally falling and now manufacturing is booming due to overseas demand. That's what the data says anyway.

    Given the rosy picture you paint, if you were the one with the responsibility, would you push the Brexit button, not knowing what was going to happen, or would you hope someone else did it so you could avoid the burden?
    I'd respect the will of the people and leave the EU but look to stay in the single market and fix the problem of unskilled immigration by eliminating all in working benefits and introducing social access charges for non-residents.
    But that is not the will of the people. The will of the people is to leave the single market. So you want to respect the will of the people but ignore them when you think it makes sense.

    Of course I appreciate your view is that any kind of out is better than what we had when in but that any kind of out could be quite damaging, couldn't it. Otherwise you would want any kind of out (no single market, etc).
    What I want and what would be acceptable are different. I've said countless times I'd want for the UK to stay in the single market and to fix immigration through domestic means in the benefits system. I'd accept hard-Brexit even if it meant economic damage because the EU isn't favourable for us in the long term. I expect we'd muddle through hard-Brexit for a few years and reset the economy, but stronger on the other side.

    The EU is primarily a political project, one in which we have no interest in continuing to remain a part of. I think 80-85% of the nation would agree with that sentiment, there are a few oddballs who want to fully join but overall the nation is quite sceptical of the "project". I don't see a way we could have, as a country, voted to remain in the "project" and still hold our opt-outs and vetoes in the long term. The two positions were not logical. I'd have probably accepted staying without a vote, ironically. At least our position would have been fairly consistent, but armed with a democratic vote of consent, the EU would have absolutely destroyed our sovereignty and eventually independence.
  • Options
    rkrkrkrkrkrk Posts: 7,914
    MaxPB said:

    MattW said:

    MaxPB said:

    TGOHF said:

    Suspect one reason people commute long distances to work are the eye watering rates of stamp duty - a massive disincentive to moving house.


    Agreed. Stamp duty should be abolished for anyone's main home.

    It just a (huge) Moving Tax.

    Agreed, triple it for second property and keep the 3% surcharge. Make the scum landlords pay through the nose.
    That is rather oafish, bearing in mind that you just made 100s of k tax free from property speculation in a very short time.

    I'd say remove the CGT exemption inside the M25.
    Much more than that actually, but I did live in my flat and spent a pretty large amount on converting the attic. Taxing people on where they live instead of taxing landlords will go down really well, you should suggest it at your next Labour meeting. A property tax for living in your own home, it looks and sounds like a perfect policy for Jez.
    Property taxes aren't that uncommon globally.

    In many ways it makes sense to shift taxation burden to unearned rather than earned income. So less income tax and more tax on property price increases.
  • Options
    Blue_rogBlue_rog Posts: 2,019

    Out of curiosity, how far away from work do most PBers live?

    I'm about 40 odd miles away from work, and about 50 mins on the train/10 mins on the tram from work.

    30 seconds, more if I go downstairs for a cup of tea first :smiley:
  • Options
    SandyRentoolSandyRentool Posts: 20,691
    @Gallowgate - you go the easy way - I used to be one of the poor sods sat in the northbound queue!
  • Options
    williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 48,130
    Scott_P said:
    It makes sense to put Brexiteers in all the key positions. The only way to force them to face up to what they're trying to achieve is to not give them anyone to pass the buck to.
  • Options
    DromedaryDromedary Posts: 1,194
    edited January 2017
    Question: what does Donald Trump share with Julius Caesar and Charles De Gaulle?

    Answer: illeism!

    Has Trump mentioned French politics recently? In his inauguration speech he is bound to speak of foreign countries and how not just the US but other places in the world will be changed for the better during his great presidency. "We can do it!" "We're gonna end it!"

    I recently encountered a twentysomething French guy online who admires Trump and says he would vote for Le Pen were it not for her support for Israel. Personally I think he will vote for her in the second round if there is one. What's interesting about this impressionable right-wing guy, who believes Trump would have won the popular vote if it weren't for George Soros nobbling the voting machines, is just how Americanised a lot of his thinking is. He also says that until recently he was scared to go out of his door because he kept getting called a "sexist" and a "racist", a state from which Trump "liberated" him. I know this is all very very stupid indeed, and at least half crackers, but elections aren't won on intellect and the point is that this guy is French and lives near Paris.


  • Options
    PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 75,986
    edited January 2017
    @MaxPB I know its not your issue anymore but if say London prices *corrected* to 2010 levels and the purchaser of your flat is on say a 10% deposit mortgage does that mean they could have ~ 300k of negative equity :open_mouth: ?!
  • Options
    Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 25,519

    Is it considered out of the question to have double decker trains? I mean this one actually looks quite workable height-wise.
    image

    They have been used in the past on the Southern:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SR_Class_4DD

    Although they were split-level, rather than true double-deckers.

    The costs of introducing them would be massive: it's proving expensive enough to alter parts of the network to cope with enhanced freight clearances.

    The following has details on UK loading gauge, if you're sad enough to be interested:
    https://www.rssb.co.uk/Library/groups-and-committees/2013-guide-vehicle-structure-sic-guide-to-british-gauging-t926.pdf

    People have been increasingly talking about bringing double-deckers back, using advantages of new technology. However there are significant issues. ISTR an underappreciated one is that they take much longer to load and unload at stations: a vital factor on the busy commuter lines on which they will be used. You gain passengers per train, but lose trains per hour.
    Thanks. Yes, I can see it taking longer for people to get off. Would also be more difficult for the guard to check the tickets. The pictured train seems to hang the lower deck level with the wheels, which is very ingenious - it doesn't seem much taller than a standard UK train.

    I am plenty sad enough to be interested in the guages, but don't possess the capacity to make much use of the information, so I'll skip it!
  • Options
    TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 41,403
    MaxPB said:

    TOPPING said:

    MaxPB said:

    MaxPB said:

    I don't know what will happen, I've never really claimed to know. What I do know is that right now the economy is booming, savings are up, the trade deficit is finally falling and now manufacturing is booming due to overseas demand. That's what the data says anyway.

    Given the rosy picture you paint, if you were the one with the responsibility, would you push the Brexit button, not knowing what was going to happen, or would you hope someone else did it so you could avoid the burden?
    I'd respect the will of the people and leave the EU but look to stay in the single market and fix the problem of unskilled immigration by eliminating all in working benefits and introducing social access charges for non-residents.
    But that is not the will of the people. The will of the people is to leave the single market. So you want to respect the will of the people but ignore them when you think it makes sense.

    Of course I appreciate your view is that any kind of out is better than what we had when in but that any kind of out could be quite damaging, couldn't it. Otherwise you would want any kind of out (no single market, etc).
    What I want and what would be acceptable are different. I've said countless times I'd want for the UK to stay in the single market and to fix immigration through domestic means in the benefits system. I'd accept hard-Brexit even if it meant economic damage because the EU isn't favourable for us in the long term. I expect we'd muddle through hard-Brexit for a few years and reset the economy, but stronger on the other side.

    The EU is primarily a political project, one in which we have no interest in continuing to remain a part of. I think 80-85% of the nation would agree with that sentiment, there are a few oddballs who want to fully join but overall the nation is quite sceptical of the "project". I don't see a way we could have, as a country, voted to remain in the "project" and still hold our opt-outs and vetoes in the long term. The two positions were not logical. I'd have probably accepted staying without a vote, ironically. At least our position would have been fairly consistent, but armed with a democratic vote of consent, the EU would have absolutely destroyed our sovereignty and eventually independence.
    I appreciate that. I don't think anyone wants to go over again the pre-vote issues where we discussed all this.
  • Options
    JonathanDJonathanD Posts: 2,400

    Scott_P said:
    It makes sense to put Brexiteers in all the key positions. The only way to force them to face up to what they're trying to achieve is to not give them anyone to pass the buck to.
    Hopefully IDS gets the job - he seems to fancy himself as a hard man negotiator.
  • Options
    SandyRentoolSandyRentool Posts: 20,691
    Why on earth do we have an ambassador to the EU anyway? Does Canada have an ambassador to NAFTA?
  • Options
    'Morale is really high': Lib Dems scent revival in south-west

    Party strategists are pinning hopes on resurgence in former heartland, where party lost all 10 of its seats in last election

    https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2017/jan/03/morale-is-really-high-lib-dems-scent-revival-in-south-west?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter
  • Options
    malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 42,062
    Blue_rog said:

    Out of curiosity, how far away from work do most PBers live?

    I'm about 40 odd miles away from work, and about 50 mins on the train/10 mins on the tram from work.

    30 seconds, more if I go downstairs for a cup of tea first :smiley:
    Same for me , I just go across the landing to my office.
  • Options
    Scott_PScott_P Posts: 51,453
    JonathanD said:

    Hopefully IDS gets the job - he seems to fancy himself as a hard man negotiator.

    @PeterMannionMP: WANTED: Relentlessly optimistic Head of UKREP. No sense of the realpolitik, and a willingness to parrot trite slogans, an advantage.
    #Brexit
  • Options
    rkrkrkrkrkrk Posts: 7,914
    On the subject of commutes... There seem to be a lot of workers from home. I wonder if that's linked with internet forum posting?

    10 minute walk for me.
  • Options
    williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 48,130

    Why on earth do we have an ambassador to the EU anyway? Does Canada have an ambassador to NAFTA?

    No, but they have an ambassador to the EU - http://www.canadainternational.gc.ca/eu-ue/offices-bureaux/ambassador-ambassadeur.aspx?lang=eng - which should help you understand why your question shows your lack of understanding of what the EU is.
  • Options
    JonathanDJonathanD Posts: 2,400

    'Morale is really high': Lib Dems scent revival in south-west

    Party strategists are pinning hopes on resurgence in former heartland, where party lost all 10 of its seats in last election

    https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2017/jan/03/morale-is-really-high-lib-dems-scent-revival-in-south-west?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter

    Its OK, the Tories are winning over lots of UKIP voters in the South East so that will offset the loss of a few Tory-LD switchers in the South West...
  • Options
    MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 37,618
    edited January 2017
    TOPPING said:

    MaxPB said:

    TOPPING said:

    MaxPB said:

    MaxPB said:

    I don't know what will happen, I've never really claimed to know. What I do know is that right now the economy is booming, savings are up, the trade deficit is finally falling and now manufacturing is booming due to overseas demand. That's what the data says anyway.

    Given the rosy picture you paint, if you were the one with the responsibility, would you push the Brexit button, not knowing what was going to happen, or would you hope someone else did it so you could avoid the burden?
    I'd respect the will of the people and leave the EU but look to stay in the single market and fix the problem of unskilled immigration by eliminating all in working benefits and introducing social access charges for non-residents.
    But that is not the will of the people. The will of the people is to leave the single market. So you want to respect the will of the people but ignore them when you think it makes sense.

    Of course I appreciate your view is that any kind of out is better than what we had when in but that any kind of out could be quite damaging, couldn't it. Otherwise you would want any kind of out (no single market, etc).
    What I want and what would be acceptable are different. I've said countless times I'd want for the UK to stay in the single market and to fix immigration through domestic means in the benefits system. I'd accept hard-Brexit even if it meant economic damage because the EU isn't favourable for us in the long term. I expect we'd muddle through hard-Brexit for a few years and reset the economy, but stronger on the other side.

    The EU is primarily a political project, one in which we have no interest in continuing to remain a part of. I think 80-85% of the nation would agree with that sentiment, there are a few oddballs who want to fully join but overall the nation is quite sceptical of the "project". I don't see a way we could have, as a country, voted to remain in the "project" and still hold our opt-outs and vetoes in the long term. The two positions were not logical. I'd have probably accepted staying without a vote, ironically. At least our position would have been fairly consistent, but armed with a democratic vote of consent, the EU would have absolutely destroyed our sovereignty and eventually independence.
    I appreciate that. I don't think anyone wants to go over again the pre-vote issues where we discussed all this.
    No worries, overall I think my position is fairly consistent plus a hefty side order of loathing for Mrs. Merkel.

    Agreed on the latter part!
  • Options
    OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 32,047
    Scott_P said:

    MaxPB said:

    The vote to leave was supposed to cause a recession.

    The vote to leave was supposed to be followed by Article 50

    Please point me in the direction of that happening
    I think you’ll find a few people grieving that 'we haven’t left yet!’ TBH I’m not sure what they meant by ‘leaving’, or were expecting.

    The hospital my wife and I were (separately) in before Christmas had quite a high proportion of nursing and support staff who 'didn’t speak like wot I do!’ Medics were frequently Asian, of course.
  • Options
    Simon St Clare - Reading is further north and further west - I think (well, I know) its the conjunction of lines with the darker red blob.

    tlg86 - cheers - guess its countryside (i.e. with poor buses) with decent-ish connections to at least three or four big cities?
  • Options
    MattWMattW Posts: 18,701
    @MaxPB Since you brought up landlords, how have you found renting in Switzerland so far?

    I think it can be quite interesting.
  • Options
    SandyRentoolSandyRentool Posts: 20,691
    @williamglenn - thanks for the link. So the EU is a free trade area that likes to think it is a sovereign nation state. And Donald Tusk acts like he is the Head of State for this non-existent state.

    Meanwhile NAFTA just does what it ought to be doing.
  • Options
    Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 25,519

    Why on earth do we have an ambassador to the EU anyway? Does Canada have an ambassador to NAFTA?

    No, but they have an ambassador to the EU - http://www.canadainternational.gc.ca/eu-ue/offices-bureaux/ambassador-ambassadeur.aspx?lang=eng - which should help you understand why your question shows your lack of understanding of what the EU is.
    We shall of course need one, and for a long time. I think Michael Portillo would be quite good.
  • Options
    MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 37,618
    MattW said:

    @MaxPB Since you brought up landlords, how have you found renting in Switzerland so far?

    I think it can be quite interesting.

    My partner and I ended up buying so I couldn't really say!
  • Options
    DromedaryDromedary Posts: 1,194

    Why on earth do we have an ambassador to the EU anyway? Does Canada have an ambassador to NAFTA?

    Britain doesn't have an ambassador to the EU. The press have got it wrong. It has a permanent representative. It has permanent representatives to the EU, NATO, OECD, UN, etc.
  • Options
    malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 42,062
    rkrkrk said:

    On the subject of commutes... There seem to be a lot of workers from home. I wonder if that's linked with internet forum posting?

    10 minute walk for me.

    Not mine , I am on holiday today so no issue, most days i will be too busy to post apart from odd times posting whilst taking a breather for a short spell.
  • Options
    TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 41,403
    edited January 2017

    @williamglenn - thanks for the link. So the EU is a free trade area that likes to think it is a sovereign nation state. And Donald Tusk acts like he is the Head of State for this non-existent state.

    Meanwhile NAFTA just does what it ought to be doing.

    I don't think anyone was ever under the illusion that the EU did not have federalist tendencies. And of course successive democratically-elected governments were happy to sign up (fiscal compact excepted, and even then Lab and the LDs screamed blue murder).

    And then of course there was D***'s d***.

    But I myself upthread said how we oughtn't to go over all this again.
  • Options
    TykejohnnoTykejohnno Posts: 7,362
    Bradford bulls,the former super league and world club champions have been liquidated.
  • Options
    Scott_PScott_P Posts: 51,453
    @MrHarryCole: Here they all come.. Lord Mandelson: “Sir Ivan Rogers is second to none in Whitehall. His resignation is a serious loss for us in Brussels."
  • Options
    TGOHFTGOHF Posts: 21,633
    CGT may be a tax on gain but it is only payable upon moving or death.

    So it's not a "good" property tax at all - its a hindrance to a flexible economy.

    Hence why GO and GB were such fans.

  • Options
    Swamp the drain!

    House Republicans have gutted an independent ethics watchdog, putting it under their own control, in a secret ballot hours before the new Congress convened for the first time.

    The unheralded vote severely weakens the Office of Congressional Ethics (OCE), which was set up after a lobbying scandal in 2008 to investigate corruption allegations against members of Congress. The move, led by the head of the House judiciary committee, defied the Republican congressional leadership and was reportedly supported by several legislators currently under OCE scrutiny.

    The amendment was voted through by the House Republican conference over the New Year’s holiday with no prior notice or debate and inserted in a broad rules package the House will vote for on Tuesday. It turns the formerly independent OCE into the Office of Congressional Complaint Review, a subordinate body to the House Ethics Committee, which is currently run by the Republican majority and has a long history of overlooking charges of malfeasance by lawmakers.

    The new body will not be able to receive anonymous tips from members of Congress or make its findings public.

    The vote comes at a time when the Republicans control all three branches of government and are seeking to remove some of the residual constraints on their powers. The rules package to be voted through on Tuesday, for example, will limit the ability of the Democratic minority to block legislation like the repeal of Obama’s Affordable Care Act by staging a filibuster.

    https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2017/jan/03/outcry-after-republicans-vote-to-dismantle-independent-ethics-body?CMP=twt_gu
  • Options
    MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 37,618
    On a side note, I agree with TSE that the main threat to the City is high taxation, both corporate and personal. For that reason I think the government will use the balance sheet tax as a carrot for banks to stay in the UK. A gradual reduction will ensure big banks stay here even if the business environment is made less favourable by Brexit, a real operating cost reduction goes a long way to adding to a company's inertia.
  • Options
    glwglw Posts: 9,554

    Bradford bulls,the former super league and world club champions have been liquidated.

    Hopefully not in the Soviet sense of that word.
  • Options
    mattmatt Posts: 3,789

    Pulpstar said:

    I'd take the bus if it was as quick and convenient as my car.

    It isn't though - couldn't give a hoot if it means people think I'm poor or whatnot.

    I reckon my issue about busses is the lack of seatbelts on them.
    My issue is the passengers.
  • Options
    matt said:

    Pulpstar said:

    I'd take the bus if it was as quick and convenient as my car.

    It isn't though - couldn't give a hoot if it means people think I'm poor or whatnot.

    I reckon my issue about busses is the lack of seatbelts on them.
    My issue is the passengers.
    That too, but I don't want PBers thinking I'm snobby and elitist.
  • Options
    TykejohnnoTykejohnno Posts: 7,362
    @glw ,in the bradford sport sense ;-) bradford bulls,bradford park avenue,bradford dukes and yorkshire cricket.
  • Options
    malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 42,062

    matt said:

    Pulpstar said:

    I'd take the bus if it was as quick and convenient as my car.

    It isn't though - couldn't give a hoot if it means people think I'm poor or whatnot.

    I reckon my issue about busses is the lack of seatbelts on them.
    My issue is the passengers.
    That too, but I don't want PBers thinking I'm snobby and elitist.
    As if we would
  • Options
    DavidLDavidL Posts: 51,371

    Swamp the drain!

    House Republicans have gutted an independent ethics watchdog, putting it under their own control, in a secret ballot hours before the new Congress convened for the first time.

    The unheralded vote severely weakens the Office of Congressional Ethics (OCE), which was set up after a lobbying scandal in 2008 to investigate corruption allegations against members of Congress. The move, led by the head of the House judiciary committee, defied the Republican congressional leadership and was reportedly supported by several legislators currently under OCE scrutiny.

    The amendment was voted through by the House Republican conference over the New Year’s holiday with no prior notice or debate and inserted in a broad rules package the House will vote for on Tuesday. It turns the formerly independent OCE into the Office of Congressional Complaint Review, a subordinate body to the House Ethics Committee, which is currently run by the Republican majority and has a long history of overlooking charges of malfeasance by lawmakers.

    The new body will not be able to receive anonymous tips from members of Congress or make its findings public.

    The vote comes at a time when the Republicans control all three branches of government and are seeking to remove some of the residual constraints on their powers. The rules package to be voted through on Tuesday, for example, will limit the ability of the Democratic minority to block legislation like the repeal of Obama’s Affordable Care Act by staging a filibuster.

    https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2017/jan/03/outcry-after-republicans-vote-to-dismantle-independent-ethics-body?CMP=twt_gu

    Presumably they thought House of Cards was a "how to" documentary.
  • Options
    OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 32,047

    @glw ,in the bradford sport sense ;-) bradford bulls,bradford park avenue,bradford dukes and yorkshire cricket.

    Bradford Park Avenue still exist, although in the lower leagues.
  • Options
    PlatoSaidPlatoSaid Posts: 10,383
    edited January 2017
    Just watching Dexter again - it'd forgotten how brilliant it is. Trying Stranger Things on Netflix too - great IMdb rating - not convinced yet.

    Any recommendations appreciated.
  • Options
    Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 61,002
    Good afternoon, everyone.
  • Options
    Plato

    I've been watching Outlander. Really enjoyed it. For those who like a fair smattering of sex and violence with their history.
  • Options
    NigelbNigelb Posts: 62,792
    Is this likely to have any salience in the French elections:
    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/01/02/almost-1000-cars-torched-around-france-new-years-eve-government/
    Almost 1,000 cars torched around France on New Year's Eve but government insists it 'went particularly well'

    ...or not, given that it seems to have been going on for at least a decade ?
  • Options
    TykejohnnoTykejohnno Posts: 7,362
    edited January 2017
    @Okc,Yes after were no more for years,1984 re-founded.
  • Options
    williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 48,130
    Nigelb said:

    Is this likely to have any salience in the French elections:
    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/01/02/almost-1000-cars-torched-around-france-new-years-eve-government/
    Almost 1,000 cars torched around France on New Year's Eve but government insists it 'went particularly well'

    ...or not, given that it seems to have been going on for at least a decade ?

    The first time it happened Sarkozy famously promised to clean out the problem areas using Kärcher, but it seems to have become a regular feature. This was from 2005:

    image
  • Options
    PlatoSaidPlatoSaid Posts: 10,383
    edited January 2017
    Patrick said:


    Thnx - it comes with Prime and keep forgetting it.

    Have you seen Hell On Wheels? I was quite taken by railroad drama.

  • Options
    PlatoSaid said:

    Just watching Dexter again - it'd forgotten how brilliant it is. Trying Stranger Things on Netflix too - great IMdb rating - not convinced yet.

    Any recommendations appreciated.

    Fleabag (on BBC3) is right up your street.

    Trailer for latest episode at

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/p041bcys/preview-fleabag-trailer-short
  • Options
    Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 25,519
    Patrick said:

    Plato

    I've been watching Outlander. Really enjoyed it. For those who like a fair smattering of sex and violence with their history.

    And no smattering at all of history with their history.
  • Options
    Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 61,002
    Mr. P, taking polls after a vote is about like asking whether or not you should've had sex when the woman's six months pregnant.
  • Options
    rural_voterrural_voter Posts: 2,038
    PlatoSaid said:

    MaxPB said:

    MattW said:

    MaxPB said:

    TGOHF said:

    Suspect one reason people commute long distances to work are the eye watering rates of stamp duty - a massive disincentive to moving house.


    Agreed. Stamp duty should be abolished for anyone's main home.

    It just a (huge) Moving Tax.

    Agreed, triple it for second property and keep the 3% surcharge. Make the scum landlords pay through the nose.
    That is rather oafish, bearing in mind that you just made 100s of k tax free from property speculation in a very short time.

    I'd say remove the CGT exemption inside the M25.
    Much more than that actually, but I did live in my flat and spent a pretty large amount on converting the attic. Taxing people on where they live instead of taxing landlords will go down really well, you should suggest it at your next Labour meeting. A property tax for living in your own home, it looks and sounds like a perfect policy for Jez.
    Vince's Mansion Tax went down a storm with his voters...
    Most countries have a property tax.
    The UK used to, which was based on taxing the imputed rent. Jolly sensible. Landlords have to pay tax on their profit.

    Owner occupiers are subsidised to the hilt. Not surprisingly, many people gamble on prices rising and try for a 90-95% mortgage. It's like being able to buy a version of call options with the expectation recently that they'll increase in value ~4x in the next 2 years; i.e.

    Day one
    Equity £10k Debt £190k

    Prices rise 15% in 2 years
    Equity £40k Debt £190k.
  • Options
    philiphphiliph Posts: 4,704
    edited January 2017
    Scott_P said:
    And your point is?
    Margin of error?
    Meaningless?
    Nonesense?
    Nonsensical?
    Obscure?
    Oblique?
    Pointless?
    Petty?

    The vote is history.
  • Options
    williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 48,130
    philiph said:

    The vote is history.

    Indeed. Now we're dealing with the aftermath. The people's opinion on that is highly relevant in a democracy. It seems people are not convinced that proceeding with Brexit is proving to be all it's cracked up to be.
  • Options
    Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 25,519
    edited January 2017
    I think it's an amazing poll for Leave. Month of remainer chicken lickens in all areas of public life trying to convince everyone the world is falling down around us, and THIS? A measly 1%?

    Remind us what the polling change in favour of 'Yes' was after 'Better Together' won the Indyref?
  • Options
    Scott_PScott_P Posts: 51,453

    Remind us what the polling change in favour of 'Yes' was after 'Better Together' won the Indyref?

    https://twitter.com/neiledwardlovat/status/815868578100604928
  • Options
    TGOHFTGOHF Posts: 21,633
  • Options
    nunununu Posts: 6,024

    Why on earth do we have an ambassador to the EU anyway? Does Canada have an ambassador to NAFTA?

    No, but they have an ambassador to the EU - http://www.canadainternational.gc.ca/eu-ue/offices-bureaux/ambassador-ambassadeur.aspx?lang=eng - which should help you understand why your question shows your lack of understanding of what the EU is.
    False equvilance. Canada is not a member of the E.U only NAFTA but we are a member of the EUSSR.
  • Options
    philiphphiliph Posts: 4,704

    philiph said:

    The vote is history.

    Indeed. Now we're dealing with the aftermath. The people's opinion on that is highly relevant in a democracy. It seems people are not convinced that proceeding with Brexit is proving to be all it's cracked up to be.
    No we are not.

    We are preparing for (be it successful or not) leaving the EU.

    That will be the result of the negotiations between us and EU.

    When we leave we will be dealing with the aftermath. It may be a positive or negative aftermath, anyone who claims to know which is a tosser, as it is all guess work at this stage.
  • Options
    Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 61,002
    Trump opposes move to weaken ethics body:
    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-38494455

    Interesting.
  • Options
    Blue_rogBlue_rog Posts: 2,019
    PlatoSaid said:

    Just watching Dexter again - it'd forgotten how brilliant it is. Trying Stranger Things on Netflix too - great IMdb rating - not convinced yet.

    Any recommendations appreciated.

    It's worth persevering with Stranger Things, it's OK and only one series. I watched a fair few episodes of Dexter but found it a bit too formulaic Not really watching anything atm
  • Options
    Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 25,519
    Scott_P said:

    Remind us what the polling change in favour of 'Yes' was after 'Better Together' won the Indyref?

    https://twitter.com/neiledwardlovat/status/815868578100604928
    A chart that clearly shows that 'Yes' overtook 'No' in the aftermath of the vote, from further back than Brexit.
  • Options
    TGOHFTGOHF Posts: 21,633
    http://reaction.life/farewell-sir-ivan-rogers-unlikely-hero-brexiteers/

    "His departure will no doubt be interpreted in some quarters (Nick Clegg is already weeping and wailing) as a disaster when it is anything but. It is good news that he has resigned, because it will allow Theresa May – with the advice of David Davis at the Department for Exiting the EU – to appoint someone to the post a little less in tune with the faction convinced that Brexit is automatically the end of the world"
  • Options
    CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 59,787
    But Rogers was always planning to go in October 2017. This leaving date – straight after French and German presidential elections – would have left the UK Government without one of its top negotiators just as talks got serious.

    Whatever has prompted his decision to go earlier, it is undoubtedly much better to have someone there who will see out the two years from triggering Article 50, which is still expected in the spring. A new appointment will expect to be in post for the duration.


    https://www.instituteforgovernment.org.uk/blog/brexit-exit-what-does-sir-ivan-rogers-decision-leave-early-mean?platform=hootsuite
  • Options
    Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 25,519
    philiph said:

    philiph said:

    The vote is history.

    Indeed. Now we're dealing with the aftermath. The people's opinion on that is highly relevant in a democracy. It seems people are not convinced that proceeding with Brexit is proving to be all it's cracked up to be.
    No we are not.

    We are preparing for (be it successful or not) leaving the EU.

    That will be the result of the negotiations between us and EU.

    When we leave we will be dealing with the aftermath. It may be a positive or negative aftermath, anyone who claims to know which is a tosser, as it is all guess work at this stage.
    Whether we are successful outside the EU will have very little to do with negotiations with the EU. This is the biggest lie around. The fact that we currently have privileged access to BMW's and olive oil contributes very little to our current success, and being deprived of it will contribute very little to any future failure. Whether we are successful or not will depend on whether we're successful - whether our Government and people can together create a competitive, lean, efficient and robust economy from the debt bubble we've been bequeathed by Osborne and Brown. Leaving the EU will help with that process but it's not a panacea, any more than it's a disaster.
  • Options
    MTimTMTimT Posts: 7,034
    @ Lucky Well said.
  • Options
    MikeSmithsonMikeSmithson Posts: 7,382
    It looks as though I'll be on Newsnight tonight discussing predictions for 2017.
  • Options
    DecrepitJohnLDecrepitJohnL Posts: 13,300

    It looks as though I'll be on Newsnight tonight discussing predictions for 2017.

    Well if you are even hedging your appearance on the programme ...
  • Options
    MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 50,137
    PlatoSaid said:

    Just watching Dexter again - it'd forgotten how brilliant it is. Trying Stranger Things on Netflix too - great IMdb rating - not convinced yet.

    Any recommendations appreciated.

    I wasn't convinced by Stranger Things. An unsatisfying mash-up of Alien and The Goonies....with constant 80s movies references shoe-horned in for the sake of it.

    But there's a second series, so what do I know?
  • Options
    Scott_PScott_P Posts: 51,453

    Whether we are successful outside the EU will have very little to do with negotiations with the EU. This is the biggest lie around. The fact that we currently have privileged access to BMW's and olive oil contributes very little to our current success, and being deprived of it will contribute very little to any future failure.

    Our current access to integrated international supply chains across the EU contributes greatly to our success, and being deprived would contribute greatly to failure
  • Options
    PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 75,986
    @MikeSmithson

    No GE
    Corbyn to stay
    Labour win in Copeland

    :)
  • Options
    So Clegg and Mandelson think Rogers was excellent. Hmmm

    Can only be good news for Leavers, sounds like he was hardly going to bat for the Brexit cause and offend all his EU friends.

    Another negative remoaner bites the dust. Next!
  • Options
    MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 50,137

    It looks as though I'll be on Newsnight tonight discussing predictions for 2017.

    Donald Tusk to resign, and be replaced by Jeremy Paxman.

    And watch their little heads explode.....
  • Options
    Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 61,002
    Mr. Smithson, any idea with whom you'll be appearing?

    If I remember, it'd be the first time I've watched Newsnight in years.
  • Options
    Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 25,519
    Scott_P said:

    Whether we are successful outside the EU will have very little to do with negotiations with the EU. This is the biggest lie around. The fact that we currently have privileged access to BMW's and olive oil contributes very little to our current success, and being deprived of it will contribute very little to any future failure.

    Our current access to integrated international supply chains across the EU contributes greatly to our success, and being deprived would contribute greatly to failure
    The only problem being that it contributes a great deal more to the EU's success in relation to us than it does to our success in relation to them - to the tune of several billion.
  • Options

    It looks as though I'll be on Newsnight tonight discussing predictions for 2017.

    Well if you are even hedging your appearance on the programme ...
    :)
  • Options
    PlatoSaidPlatoSaid Posts: 10,383

    PlatoSaid said:

    Just watching Dexter again - it'd forgotten how brilliant it is. Trying Stranger Things on Netflix too - great IMdb rating - not convinced yet.

    Any recommendations appreciated.

    I wasn't convinced by Stranger Things. An unsatisfying mash-up of Alien and The Goonies....with constant 80s movies references shoe-horned in for the sake of it.

    But there's a second series, so what do I know?
    I'll never understand cancellation of Forever.

    I'm bored stiff of time travelling body swapping drama right now. I can think of three now just on Netflix. They're all the same - oh and another from Australia.

    Forever had charm for 40+ decent audience and great potential.
  • Options
    Scott_PScott_P Posts: 51,453

    The only problem being that it contributes a great deal more to the EU's success in relation to us than it does to our success in relation to them - to the tune of several billion.

    No, it really doesn't
  • Options
    "Whether we are successful outside the EU will have very little to do with negotiations with the EU. This is the biggest lie around."

    Abject nonsense. We will have more chance of attracting investment from outside the EU the more closely integrated into the single market we are. Our ability to do beneficial FTAs with non-EU countries will also be pretty dependent on that. These are issues that will be decided by negotiation with EU member states.
  • Options
    SlackbladderSlackbladder Posts: 9,713
    TGOHF said:

    CGT may be a tax on gain but it is only payable upon moving or death.

    So it's not a "good" property tax at all - its a hindrance to a flexible economy.

    Hence why GO and GB were such fans.

    CGT isn't payable on death. IHT is.
  • Options
    "Can only be good news for Leavers, sounds like he was hardly going to bat for the Brexit cause and offend all his EU friends"

    Yep - clearly our negotiation strategy should be to offend the governments of countries that take over 40% of all our exports.
  • Options
    david_herdsondavid_herdson Posts: 17,420

    @glw ,in the bradford sport sense ;-) bradford bulls,bradford park avenue,bradford dukes and yorkshire cricket.

    Bradford Park Avenue still exist, although in the lower leagues.
    Yes, but they were liquidated and then re-established. Besides, they're basically a pub team.
  • Options
    Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 25,519

    "Whether we are successful outside the EU will have very little to do with negotiations with the EU. This is the biggest lie around."

    Abject nonsense. We will have more chance of attracting investment from outside the EU the more closely integrated into the single market we are. Our ability to do beneficial FTAs with non-EU countries will also be pretty dependent on that. These are issues that will be decided by negotiation with EU member states.

    Yes. All of which is a total side dish to whether we actually have a SUCCESSFUL ECONOMY. You know, by selling things to people? Like the device you're typing on that probably came from a country we don't have a whizz-bang FTA with? Or the clothes on your back which (unless you can afford Italy) probably also came from one of those countries? The Indian call centre you ring, the American TV shows you watch, need I go on?

    It's like the British economy has stopped - interest rates, national debt, public spending - none of it exists any more pending whether the EU are nice to us in the Brexit negotiations!!1!! It's the biggest load of weak-minded one-eyed tripe I've ever heard. And sadly some Leavers are as infected by it (though positive about the outcome) as their Remainer counterparts.
  • Options
    rural_voterrural_voter Posts: 2,038

    TGOHF said:

    CGT may be a tax on gain but it is only payable upon moving or death.

    So it's not a "good" property tax at all - its a hindrance to a flexible economy.

    Hence why GO and GB were such fans.

    CGT isn't payable on death. IHT is.
    CGT is payable on shares or gilts, I think, and on landlord-owned blocks of flats if they're sold to a new freeholder. Why not on private houses?

    Easy ... keep the receipts for any building work carried out; they get deducted from any gains. Exclude inflation, too. No profit = no tax to pay and a tax loss should be allowed in periods like 1992 when values fell in real terms.
  • Options
    DecrepitJohnLDecrepitJohnL Posts: 13,300

    Trump opposes move to weaken ethics body:
    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-38494455

    Interesting.

    A good subject for OGH on Newsnight.

    Arguably Donald Trump is not really a Republican and nor are half the House Republicans (which half is real depends on your point of view) so how they will work together will be interesting to watch, though so far I cannot see a betting angle.
  • Options
    PlatoSaidPlatoSaid Posts: 10,383
    Blue_rog said:

    PlatoSaid said:

    Just watching Dexter again - it'd forgotten how brilliant it is. Trying Stranger Things on Netflix too - great IMdb rating - not convinced yet.

    Any recommendations appreciated.

    It's worth persevering with Stranger Things, it's OK and only one series. I watched a fair few episodes of Dexter but found it a bit too formulaic Not really watching anything atm
    I've 3 seasons on my Netflix, do try Dexter again. I'm eagle eyed and still notice so many clever things I missed. I make a point of watching stuff I didn't like.

    About 30% I change my mind. I hated Jesse in Breaking Bad, second time I got him.

    I still have no time for Better Call Saul - two seasons of bugger all - bored.
  • Options
    Scott_PScott_P Posts: 51,453

    Yes, but they were liquidated and then re-established. Besides, they're basically a pub team.

    Like Rangers...

    Some people didn't see the funny side of this

    https://twitter.com/coral/status/815173793954009092
  • Options
    mattmatt Posts: 3,789

    It looks as though I'll be on Newsnight tonight discussing predictions for 2017.

    Have they booked you 12 months from now to explain their accuracy?
This discussion has been closed.