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politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » Boris can’t go on being overruled by Number 10 and remain as F

SystemSystem Posts: 12,264
edited December 2016 in General

imagepoliticalbetting.com » Blog Archive » Boris can’t go on being overruled by Number 10 and remain as Foreign Secretary

No 10 says Foreign Secretary Boris Johnson's comments on Saudi Arabia were "not the government's view". https://t.co/ViVVxk4vvu

Read the full story here


«13

Comments

  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 55,572
    First?
  • theakestheakes Posts: 941
    and they call themselves a government!!!!! Are they having a laugh?
  • logical_songlogical_song Posts: 9,944
    Theresa May only 10:1 for next cabinet exit.
    That's amazing.
  • Tissue_PriceTissue_Price Posts: 9,039
    This is on Boris, surely? However much most of us might agree with his underlying points.

    The more general point about Saudi is that people should be careful what they wish for when they condemn the [very condemnable] regime.
  • Tissue_PriceTissue_Price Posts: 9,039
    logical_song said:

    Theresa May only 10:1 for next cabinet exit.
    That's amazing.

    Or wrong! I can't see it myself.
  • AlastairMeeksAlastairMeeks Posts: 30,340
    Theresa May can't afford to lose Boris Johnson since he's a critically important linkman between her and the Brexit loonies. And his bungling gives her cover for the government's lack of a position on Brexit.

    He's the new John Prescott.
  • rkrkrkrkrkrk Posts: 8,412
    If it really hits the fan a bunch will go at once... Hard to know who would go first though.
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 62,075
    Indeed.

    Mr. Meeks, I'd say the more important aspect is that Boris is a media/spotlight lightning rod.
  • SouthamObserverSouthamObserver Posts: 39,782
    Boris has never been there because May thinks he is the right foreign secretary for the UK. He is there because it suits May politically. Her career is all that matters. It's a red, white and blue career, and anyone who opposes it is doing Britain down :-D

    This is a shambolic government largely populated by mediocrities, at best (Hammond being about the only one who rises above that). Labour being even more shambolic and utterly unelectable does not change that.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,654
    Those listed in the thread header all look like very poor value to me.
  • Tissue_PriceTissue_Price Posts: 9,039
    AlastairMeeks said:

    Theresa May can't afford to lose Boris Johnson since he's a critically important linkman between her and the Brexit loonies. And his bungling gives her cover for the government's lack of a position on Brexit.

    He's the new John Prescott.

    I can't wait for the punchline.
  • Scott_PScott_P Posts: 51,453
    Tissue_Price said:

    This is on Boris, surely? However much most of us might agree with his underlying points.

    The more general point about Saudi is that people should be careful what they wish for when they condemn the [very condemnable] regime.

    I wonder if he feels inspired by Trump? If one blond "maverick" can get away with abandoning decades of diplomatic niceties, why can't he?
  • AlsoIndigoAlsoIndigo Posts: 1,852
    theakes said:

    and they call themselves a government!!!!! Are they having a laugh?

    To paraphrase an old bumper sticker... their government might be old and shambolic, but its been elected and its in front of yours.
  • foxinsoxukfoxinsoxuk Posts: 23,548
    Pulpstar said:

    Those listed in the thread header all look like very poor value to me.

    This is a mugs market. They are pretty much all a bit rubbish, so any could be sacked, or resign over some matter of newly discovered principle
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 52,403
    What's wrong with being candid regarding the Saudi regime?
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 120,385
    The ulitimate, unspinable gaffe from Boris.

    He spoke the truth.

    I've had the feeling Boris wants out of politics since June 30th
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 52,899
    Tissue_Price said:

    AlastairMeeks said:

    Theresa May can't afford to lose Boris Johnson since he's a critically important linkman between her and the Brexit loonies. And his bungling gives her cover for the government's lack of a position on Brexit.

    He's the new John Prescott.

    I can't wait for the punchline.
    Boris punching a Brexiteer would be a fitting way to symbolise the nadir of post-referendum politics.
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 52,403
    Not as bad as OGH "welcoming" the death of LEAVE voters in his Tweet this morning....

    *runs and hides*
  • JobabobJobabob Posts: 3,807
    The government is shambolic and Theresa May talks an endless stream of shite.

    The fact that Corbyn is even more shambolic and talks even more shite doesn't prevent the first fact being true.
  • tysontyson Posts: 6,120
    SouthamObserver said:

    Boris has never been there because May thinks he is the right foreign secretary for the UK. He is there because it suits May politically. Her career is all that matters. It's a red, white and blue career, and anyone who opposes it is doing Britain down :-D

    This is a shambolic government largely populated by mediocrities, at best (Hammond being about the only one who rises above that). Labour being even more shambolic and utterly unelectable does not change that.

    I wonder how far Theresa can go by being vacuous about everything. The red, white and blue Brexit was beyond parody....I don't know how she managed to come out with that sentence without wetting herself.

    The only thing she seems to have a considered view on is that her Foreign Secretary is a joke. Anything else?????? God knows
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 55,572
    Pulpstar said:

    Those listed in the thread header all look like very poor value to me.

    There are 22 members of the cabinet. Any that are below 21/1 need to have a bloody good reason for it.

    I wish I could lay May at 10/1 - she's going nowhere.
  • Stark_DawningStark_Dawning Posts: 9,764
    What's going here? Surely the FO officials check these speeches before Boris delivers them. Or does Boris just go AWOL and read out his own work unabridged?
  • David_EvershedDavid_Evershed Posts: 6,506
    Boris is a leader and May is a follower.

    They should exchange jobs.
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 43,970
    edited December 2016
    Off-topic:

    As recently discussed, 4k coming to BBC via iPlayer:
    http://arstechnica.co.uk/science/2016/12/bbc-planet-earth-ii-4k-hdr-hlg-iplayer/

    And Windows on ARM. Again. But this time it'll work, honest.
    http://arstechnica.co.uk/information-technology/2016/12/windows-10-arm-x86-details/
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 52,899
    Scott_P said:

    Tissue_Price said:

    This is on Boris, surely? However much most of us might agree with his underlying points.

    The more general point about Saudi is that people should be careful what they wish for when they condemn the [very condemnable] regime.

    I wonder if he feels inspired by Trump? If one blond "maverick" can get away with abandoning decades of diplomatic niceties, why can't he?
    Trump got the top job while avoiding becoming beholden to anyone whereas Boris failed to get the top job while becoming beholden to the most long-standing toxic faction in British politics.
  • MikeKMikeK Posts: 9,053
    For once I think OGH has hit the nail on Boris' head.

    Boris cannot go on making foreign policy on the hoof, so to speak, he also contradicts himself to much. I see him on the back benches soon or offered a peerage to get rid of him.
  • Richard_TyndallRichard_Tyndall Posts: 32,726
    It is really funny seeing the first couple of dozen comments on this thread, the vast majority from Remoaners who are seeing their dreams of a second referendum and halting Brexit disappear into the sunset and now are thrashing around for any other solace they might find.

    Given all the shit they have thrown over the last couple of years I am genuinely enjoying their pain.
  • logical_songlogical_song Posts: 9,944
    TheScreamingEagles said:

    The ulitimate, unspinable gaffe from Boris.

    He spoke the truth.

    I've had the feeling Boris wants out of politics since June 30th

    Can't be much fun trying to get something not too much worse than we had before - and realising that it's all your fault.
    Added to which you'll not PM and never will be.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 120,385
    Oooh errr. Carry On Judging

    https://twitter.com/estwebber/status/806880063132078081
  • Stark_DawningStark_Dawning Posts: 9,764
    TheScreamingEagles said:

    The ulitimate, unspinable gaffe from Boris.

    He spoke the truth.

    I've had the feeling Boris wants out of politics since June 30th

    I think you're right. The whole Gove thing, Cameron's career and reputation in tatters - perhaps it's all too traumatic for someone like Boris, who ultimately just wants to be loved.
  • foxinsoxukfoxinsoxuk Posts: 23,548
    TheScreamingEagles said:

    The ulitimate, unspinable gaffe from Boris.

    He spoke the truth.

    I've had the feeling Boris wants out of politics since June 30th

    He is trying to get sacked for being in the right, as it is only a matter of time before he is sacked for being in the wrong, and that is a much harder place to rebuild from.

    Brexit is a shambles and he needs to get out of the car before he reaches the cliff.

  • AlsoIndigoAlsoIndigo Posts: 1,852
    edited December 2016
    MikeK said:

    For once I think OGH has hit the nail on Boris' head.

    Boris cannot go on making foreign policy on the hoof, so to speak, he also contradicts himself to much. I see him on the back benches soon or offered a peerage to get rid of him.

    Or its entirely scripted, Boris gets to say things that May thinks but cannot say, the government then makes a very half hearted disavowal of his comments.. describing his views as "not government policy" is hardly a damning indictment, and is significant for what is doesn't deny, just because it isn't currently policy doesn't means it isn't under consideration, or that the PM doesn't support it. It will also go down well with Trump.
  • shadsyshadsy Posts: 289
    People we've taken the most bets on in this market:
    1. Fox
    2. Hunt
    3. Hammond
    4. Greening
    5. Boris
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 55,572
    Off topic, scumbag ambulance chasing parasite to finally get struck off.

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016/12/08/iraq-human-rights-lawyer-phil-shiner-faces-struck-admittingrecklessness/
  • CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758
    tyson said:

    SouthamObserver said:

    Boris has never been there because May thinks he is the right foreign secretary for the UK. He is there because it suits May politically. Her career is all that matters. It's a red, white and blue career, and anyone who opposes it is doing Britain down :-D

    This is a shambolic government largely populated by mediocrities, at best (Hammond being about the only one who rises above that). Labour being even more shambolic and utterly unelectable does not change that.

    I wonder how far Theresa can go by being vacuous about everything. The red, white and blue Brexit was beyond parody....I don't know how she managed to come out with that sentence without wetting herself.

    The only thing she seems to have a considered view on is that her Foreign Secretary is a joke. Anything else?????? God knows
    To be fair, she was asked if she wanted a White Brexit (soft), a Black Brexit (hard) or a Grey Brexit (somewhere in between)...

    she replied she wanted a "Red, White and Blue" one that worked for all Britons

    Pretty content free, but not unreasonable
  • tysontyson Posts: 6,120
    David_Evershed said:

    Boris is a leader and May is a follower.

    They should exchange jobs.

    I think that's a clever bit of analysis you've got there.
    I cannot for the life of me understand why Theresa May wanted to be PM other than to showcase some nice clothes, and show at 60 she can still be quite stylish.

    She has not shown anything at all since to warrant why she put herself forward, not one single thing. If the Tory party leadership contest had been remotely normal....she would not have won because she hasn't got any vision, she doesn't inspire, she lacks charisma and leadership.

    She doesn't galvnisise any reaction from me...there is nothing to dislike....there again there is nothing to like.
  • Richard_TyndallRichard_Tyndall Posts: 32,726
    foxinsoxuk said:

    TheScreamingEagles said:

    The ulitimate, unspinable gaffe from Boris.

    He spoke the truth.

    I've had the feeling Boris wants out of politics since June 30th

    He is trying to get sacked for being in the right, as it is only a matter of time before he is sacked for being in the wrong, and that is a much harder place to rebuild from.

    Brexit is a shambles and he needs to get out of the car before he reaches the cliff.

    Not seeing any sign of that shambles at the moment. In fact it all seems to be going very well at the moment. Of course the blind Eurofanatics like yourself wouldn't agree but then you have prejudged it all and don't care about reality.
  • SouthamObserverSouthamObserver Posts: 39,782
    Richard_Tyndall said:

    It is really funny seeing the first couple of dozen comments on this thread, the vast majority from Remoaners who are seeing their dreams of a second referendum and halting Brexit disappear into the sunset and now are thrashing around for any other solace they might find.

    Given all the shit they have thrown over the last couple of years I am genuinely enjoying their pain.

    There is no solace in a mediocre, listless government that does not have a clue what it is doing. Boris is our face to the world. And the world thinks he is a fool.

  • Richard_NabaviRichard_Nabavi Posts: 30,822
    AlastairMeeks said:

    Theresa May can't afford to lose Boris Johnson since he's a critically important linkman between her and the Brexit loonies. And his bungling gives her cover for the government's lack of a position on Brexit.

    He's the new John Prescott.

    Yeah, but the difference is that Blair managed to find a place for John Prescott where he could do only limited damage but still have a huge swanky office.
  • SouthamObserverSouthamObserver Posts: 39,782
    edited December 2016
    tyson said:

    David_Evershed said:

    Boris is a leader and May is a follower.

    They should exchange jobs.

    I think that's a clever bit of analysis you've got there.
    I cannot for the life of me understand why Theresa May wanted to be PM other than to showcase some nice clothes, and show at 60 she can still be quite stylish.

    She has not shown anything at all since to warrant why she put herself forward, not one single thing. If the Tory party leadership contest had been remotely normal....she would not have won because she hasn't got any vision, she doesn't inspire, she lacks charisma and leadership.

    She doesn't galvnisise any reaction from me...there is nothing to dislike....there again there is nothing to like.

    May is the best the Tories have. Just look at that list in Mike's lead-in piece. That's how bad it is!

  • MikeKMikeK Posts: 9,053
    Sandpit said:

    Off topic, scumbag ambulance chasing parasite to finally get struck off.

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016/12/08/iraq-human-rights-lawyer-phil-shiner-faces-struck-admittingrecklessness/

    Yes Shiner will hopefully get his deserts, but the government and the elite governing this country let it go on because of their total belief in PC and so called human rights.
  • TCPoliticalBettingTCPoliticalBetting Posts: 10,819
    I agree with OGH on his article.
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 62,075
    Mr. Dawning, agree on Boris. Reminds me of Francis Urquhart's quote about wanting to be liked:
    A fine quality in a spaniel. Or a whore. But not, I think, a Prime Minister.
  • TCPoliticalBettingTCPoliticalBetting Posts: 10,819
    Richard_Nabavi said:

    AlastairMeeks said:

    Theresa May can't afford to lose Boris Johnson since he's a critically important linkman between her and the Brexit loonies. And his bungling gives her cover for the government's lack of a position on Brexit.

    He's the new John Prescott.

    Yeah, but the difference is that Blair managed to find a place for John Prescott where he could do only limited damage but still have a huge swanky office.
    Limited damage? Promised to cut driving down by 50%, which is the main reason why our road network suffered such large underinvestment.
  • Richard_NabaviRichard_Nabavi Posts: 30,822
    Mike is right when he says that "If it wasn’t for Labour TMay’s government would look shambolic", but in fairness I think the LibDems and UKIP both deserve honourable mentions for their contributions as well.
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 52,899
    TCPoliticalBetting said:

    Richard_Nabavi said:

    AlastairMeeks said:

    Theresa May can't afford to lose Boris Johnson since he's a critically important linkman between her and the Brexit loonies. And his bungling gives her cover for the government's lack of a position on Brexit.

    He's the new John Prescott.

    Yeah, but the difference is that Blair managed to find a place for John Prescott where he could do only limited damage but still have a huge swanky office.
    Limited damage? Promised to cut driving down by 50%, which is the main reason why our road network suffered such large underinvestment.
    Not to mention his impact on planning which helped exacerbate the housing crisis.
  • logical_songlogical_song Posts: 9,944
    Richard_Nabavi said:

    Mike is right when he says that "If it wasn’t for Labour TMay’s government would look shambolic", but in fairness I think the LibDems and UKIP both deserve honourable mentions for their contributions as well.

    UKIP and their rotating leadership fiasco, yes I'd agree.
    The LibDems, like them or loathe them, seem to be united and frankly 'winning here' at the moment.
  • Richard_TyndallRichard_Tyndall Posts: 32,726
    SouthamObserver said:

    Richard_Tyndall said:

    It is really funny seeing the first couple of dozen comments on this thread, the vast majority from Remoaners who are seeing their dreams of a second referendum and halting Brexit disappear into the sunset and now are thrashing around for any other solace they might find.

    Given all the shit they have thrown over the last couple of years I am genuinely enjoying their pain.

    There is no solace in a mediocre, listless government that does not have a clue what it is doing. Boris is our face to the world. And the world thinks he is a fool.

    And so they underestimate him. Don't get me wrong. Boris would have been a terrible PM and Gove did us all a massive service which I am sure was completely intentional. But if the rest of the world think that Boris is a fool then that is to his, and our, advantage.
  • Richard_NabaviRichard_Nabavi Posts: 30,822
    logical_song said:

    The LibDems, like them or loathe them, seem to be united and frankly 'winning here' at the moment.

    Yes, but they are united around a completely bonkers proposition - a referendum with no options.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 120,385
    https://twitter.com/BBCSport/status/806910658608558081
  • tysontyson Posts: 6,120
    Richard_Tyndall said:

    foxinsoxuk said:

    TheScreamingEagles said:

    The ulitimate, unspinable gaffe from Boris.

    He spoke the truth.

    I've had the feeling Boris wants out of politics since June 30th

    He is trying to get sacked for being in the right, as it is only a matter of time before he is sacked for being in the wrong, and that is a much harder place to rebuild from.

    Brexit is a shambles and he needs to get out of the car before he reaches the cliff.

    Not seeing any sign of that shambles at the moment. In fact it all seems to be going very well at the moment. Of course the blind Eurofanatics like yourself wouldn't agree but then you have prejudged it all and don't care about reality.
    I think you'll find Fox and I have and other remainers have been calling for a hard/fast Brexit. We trade with most of the rest of the world without a trade deal, and there are plenty of commonwealth countries we can use to staff our NHS and social care providers etc....if we want to.

    It's not the Britain I want, not by a long shot.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 82,554
    Morris_Dancer said:

    Mr. Dawning, agree on Boris. Reminds me of Francis Urquhart's quote about wanting to be liked:
    A fine quality in a spaniel. Or a whore. But not, I think, a Prime Minister.

    You may think that, but I couldn't possibly comment!
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 62,075
    Mr. Eagles, is that not the Autosport spoof?
  • logical_songlogical_song Posts: 9,944
    Richard_Nabavi said:

    logical_song said:

    The LibDems, like them or loathe them, seem to be united and frankly 'winning here' at the moment.

    Yes, but they are united around a completely bonkers proposition - a referendum with no options.
    Is that fair? I thought I'd Google for a second or to - and found this:

    Should we re-run the referendum to overturn the results of the first?

    No. We believe that the Leave campaign lied blatantly, leading many people to believe things such as a vote to leave would mean £350 million a week for the NHS. However, we should not keep re-running the last referendum in order to get the result we wanted.

    Should the British people have the final decision on the government’s negotiated deal?

    Yes. In voting to leave, there was no opportunity to vote for how future trading relationships should be, or how we should work with other countries over things like criminal justice, law and order, ease of travel etc. Voting for a departure is not the same as voting for a destination. When the deal is negotiated, in however many years’ time, the British people must have a chance to say if they would prefer the new arrangement, outside the European Union, or would prefer to remain inside the European Union.
  • FF43FF43 Posts: 17,419
    I assumed Boris Johnson's role in Theresa May's cabinet was to use his perceived charm with the public to sell whatever Brexit deal they could cobble together. In exchange he would be kept out of harm's way in a prestigious sinecure at the Foreign Office. I'm not sure either part of the deal is working out.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 82,554
    JosiasJessop said:

    Off-topic:

    As recently discussed, 4k coming to BBC via iPlayer:
    http://arstechnica.co.uk/science/2016/12/bbc-planet-earth-ii-4k-hdr-hlg-iplayer/

    And Windows on ARM. Again. But this time it'll work, honest.
    http://arstechnica.co.uk/information-technology/2016/12/windows-10-arm-x86-details/

    4 min demo to select group of iPlayer users. Given iPlayer doesn't even buffer at the moment they are going to have to massively overhaul it before they go like netflix.
  • tysontyson Posts: 6,120
    SouthamObserver said:

    tyson said:

    David_Evershed said:

    Boris is a leader and May is a follower.

    They should exchange jobs.

    I think that's a clever bit of analysis you've got there.
    I cannot for the life of me understand why Theresa May wanted to be PM other than to showcase some nice clothes, and show at 60 she can still be quite stylish.

    She has not shown anything at all since to warrant why she put herself forward, not one single thing. If the Tory party leadership contest had been remotely normal....she would not have won because she hasn't got any vision, she doesn't inspire, she lacks charisma and leadership.

    She doesn't galvnisise any reaction from me...there is nothing to dislike....there again there is nothing to like.

    May is the best the Tories have. Just look at that list in Mike's lead-in piece. That's how bad it is!

    Osborne was the best...but he is as welcome in the Tory party as it stands now as Blair is to Labour.
  • Richard_NabaviRichard_Nabavi Posts: 30,822
    logical_song said:

    Is that fair? I thought I'd Google for a second or to - and found this:

    Should we re-run the referendum to overturn the results of the first?

    No. We believe that the Leave campaign lied blatantly, leading many people to believe things such as a vote to leave would mean £350 million a week for the NHS. However, we should not keep re-running the last referendum in order to get the result we wanted.

    Should the British people have the final decision on the government’s negotiated deal?

    Yes. In voting to leave, there was no opportunity to vote for how future trading relationships should be, or how we should work with other countries over things like criminal justice, law and order, ease of travel etc. Voting for a departure is not the same as voting for a destination. When the deal is negotiated, in however many years’ time, the British people must have a chance to say if they would prefer the new arrangement, outside the European Union, or would prefer to remain inside the European Union.

    The second answer contradicts the first, but, even more to the point, the option of 'remaining inside the European Union' won't be available.
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 52,899
    Richard_Nabavi said:

    logical_song said:

    Is that fair? I thought I'd Google for a second or to - and found this:

    Should we re-run the referendum to overturn the results of the first?

    No. We believe that the Leave campaign lied blatantly, leading many people to believe things such as a vote to leave would mean £350 million a week for the NHS. However, we should not keep re-running the last referendum in order to get the result we wanted.

    Should the British people have the final decision on the government’s negotiated deal?

    Yes. In voting to leave, there was no opportunity to vote for how future trading relationships should be, or how we should work with other countries over things like criminal justice, law and order, ease of travel etc. Voting for a departure is not the same as voting for a destination. When the deal is negotiated, in however many years’ time, the British people must have a chance to say if they would prefer the new arrangement, outside the European Union, or would prefer to remain inside the European Union.

    The second answer contradicts the first, but, even more to the point, the option of 'remaining inside the European Union' won't be available.
    You can't say that with any certainty. At the end of the day the 'hard Brexit' or 'no Brexit' options can be put to the public warts and all and then they can decide. If Article 50 is revocable then nothing could prevent such a scenario from playing out.
  • TCPoliticalBettingTCPoliticalBetting Posts: 10,819
    williamglenn said:

    TCPoliticalBetting said:

    Richard_Nabavi said:

    AlastairMeeks said:

    Theresa May can't afford to lose Boris Johnson since he's a critically important linkman between her and the Brexit loonies. And his bungling gives her cover for the government's lack of a position on Brexit.

    He's the new John Prescott.

    Yeah, but the difference is that Blair managed to find a place for John Prescott where he could do only limited damage but still have a huge swanky office.
    Limited damage? Promised to cut driving down by 50%, which is the main reason why our road network suffered such large underinvestment.
    Not to mention his impact on planning which helped exacerbate the housing crisis.
    True. The edict of have a greater % of "affordable" housing which led to lots of flats which became an oversupply in some areas as the key workers wanted houses and we had even in 2005, little boxes unfilled with developers desperately trying to shift them and reduce their losses.
  • SouthamObserverSouthamObserver Posts: 39,782
    I watched some of the Supreme Court proceedings today. I have also sat in on US Supreme Court hearings. They are very different in tone and set-up, but both extremely impressive. The big difference is that oral argument in a US Supreme Court case is generally one hour and clerks do a hell of a lot of the donkey work. I prefer our way of operating.
  • FF43FF43 Posts: 17,419
    Richard_Nabavi said:

    logical_song said:

    The LibDems, like them or loathe them, seem to be united and frankly 'winning here' at the moment.

    Yes, but they are united around a completely bonkers proposition - a referendum with no options.
    Marginally more bonkers than the last one - a referendum that accepted or rejected one option without considering alternatives.
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 52,899
    On Sleaford, I read that UKIP put out a leaflet saying that if you support the EU you should vote Lib Dem. Can anyone confirm this?
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 55,572
    TheScreamingEagles said:

    https://twitter.com/BBCSport/status/806910658608558081

    I've been searching for that all day, thanks for pointing it out.

    Looking for a new challenge at the moment, will apply tomorrow morning.
  • logical_songlogical_song Posts: 9,944
    Richard_Nabavi said:

    logical_song said:

    Is that fair? I thought I'd Google for a second or to - and found this:

    Should we re-run the referendum to overturn the results of the first?

    No. We believe that the Leave campaign lied blatantly, leading many people to believe things such as a vote to leave would mean £350 million a week for the NHS. However, we should not keep re-running the last referendum in order to get the result we wanted.

    Should the British people have the final decision on the government’s negotiated deal?

    Yes. In voting to leave, there was no opportunity to vote for how future trading relationships should be, or how we should work with other countries over things like criminal justice, law and order, ease of travel etc. Voting for a departure is not the same as voting for a destination. When the deal is negotiated, in however many years’ time, the British people must have a chance to say if they would prefer the new arrangement, outside the European Union, or would prefer to remain inside the European Union.

    The second answer contradicts the first, but, even more to the point, the option of 'remaining inside the European Union' won't be available.
    I think that your opinions are valid, but they are just opinions.
    The facts of the matter are that we don't know what Leave means even though June seems a long way away now. When we do find out, the majority might not like it, at which point we need statesmen (okay big problem there) to sort things out, if possible.
    It is a mess, as has been said before, but the LibDems and UKIP have valid and defensible positions, not too sure about the two major parties.
  • Richard_TyndallRichard_Tyndall Posts: 32,726
    williamglenn said:

    On Sleaford, I read that UKIP put out a leaflet saying that if you support the EU you should vote Lib Dem. Can anyone confirm this?

    That wasn't on the leaflet I got from them but we are in a rural area rather than the two main urban areas so they may have targeted the main towns with that.

    I assume it would be an attempt to split the Tory vote.
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 57,912
    Charles said:

    tyson said:

    SouthamObserver said:

    Boris has never been there because May thinks he is the right foreign secretary for the UK. He is there because it suits May politically. Her career is all that matters. It's a red, white and blue career, and anyone who opposes it is doing Britain down :-D

    This is a shambolic government largely populated by mediocrities, at best (Hammond being about the only one who rises above that). Labour being even more shambolic and utterly unelectable does not change that.

    I wonder how far Theresa can go by being vacuous about everything. The red, white and blue Brexit was beyond parody....I don't know how she managed to come out with that sentence without wetting herself.

    The only thing she seems to have a considered view on is that her Foreign Secretary is a joke. Anything else?????? God knows
    To be fair, she was asked if she wanted a White Brexit (soft), a Black Brexit (hard) or a Grey Brexit (somewhere in between)...

    she replied she wanted a "Red, White and Blue" one that worked for all Britons

    Pretty content free, but not unreasonable
    It may be trite, but it's the right answer.
  • Scott_PScott_P Posts: 51,453
    @bbclaurak: 'Boris Johnson has used up all of his lives' says one senior MP
  • AlastairMeeksAlastairMeeks Posts: 30,340
    Scott_P said:

    @bbclaurak: 'Boris Johnson has used up all of his lives' says one senior MP

    I think that underestimates his Timelord-like ability to regenerate.
  • AnorakAnorak Posts: 6,621
    edited December 2016
    Sandpit said:

    TheScreamingEagles said:

    https://twitter.com/BBCSport/status/806910658608558081

    I've been searching for that all day, thanks for pointing it out.

    Looking for a new challenge at the moment, will apply tomorrow morning.
    "Possession of FIA Super Licence will be an advantage"
    "Ideally, you will have a proven track record in skills including steering, braking and, in particular, accelerating"

    Brilliant. A spoof, alas. But still...
  • foxinsoxukfoxinsoxuk Posts: 23,548
    Richard_Tyndall said:

    foxinsoxuk said:

    TheScreamingEagles said:

    The ulitimate, unspinable gaffe from Boris.

    He spoke the truth.

    I've had the feeling Boris wants out of politics since June 30th

    He is trying to get sacked for being in the right, as it is only a matter of time before he is sacked for being in the wrong, and that is a much harder place to rebuild from.

    Brexit is a shambles and he needs to get out of the car before he reaches the cliff.

    Not seeing any sign of that shambles at the moment. In fact it all seems to be going very well at the moment. Of course the blind Eurofanatics like yourself wouldn't agree but then you have prejudged it all and don't care about reality.
    No, I am favouring a Hard Brexit, before rebuilding our links from ground up afterwards. It is the way to get consent from the electorate for any "softer" elements that reduce our sovereignty.

    I do have some knowledge of what is going on in the world of the Department of Brexit, some open source and some not. It is a shambles, a red white snd blue shambles, where we hope to muddle through.
  • AnneJGPAnneJGP Posts: 3,146
    logical_song said:

    Richard_Nabavi said:

    logical_song said:

    The LibDems, like them or loathe them, seem to be united and frankly 'winning here' at the moment.

    Yes, but they are united around a completely bonkers proposition - a referendum with no options.
    Is that fair? I thought I'd Google for a second or to - and found this:

    Should we re-run the referendum to overturn the results of the first?

    No. We believe that the Leave campaign lied blatantly, leading many people to believe things such as a vote to leave would mean £350 million a week for the NHS. However, we should not keep re-running the last referendum in order to get the result we wanted.

    Should the British people have the final decision on the government’s negotiated deal?

    Yes. In voting to leave, there was no opportunity to vote for how future trading relationships should be, or how we should work with other countries over things like criminal justice, law and order, ease of travel etc. Voting for a departure is not the same as voting for a destination. When the deal is negotiated, in however many years’ time, the British people must have a chance to say if they would prefer the new arrangement, outside the European Union, or would prefer to remain inside the European Union.
    When the deal is negotiated it will be too late, according to the EU's rules. It will be too late, just as it has always been when we've been assured we've got it wrong, that isn't the plan, no-one's suggesting what you say they are ..... and then it's too late, the deal's been agreed, we're already signed up to the thing we didn't want & were told wasn't going to happen.

    Good evening, everyone.
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 62,075
    Miss JGP, good evening.
  • Scott_PScott_P Posts: 51,453
    foxinsoxuk said:

    I do have some knowledge of what is going on in the world of the Department of Brexit, some open source and some not. It is a shambles, a red white snd blue shambles, where we hope to muddle through.

    I find it irritating that the department is known a DeExEu

    DeusEx would be much more satisfying
  • AnorakAnorak Posts: 6,621
    Scott_P said:

    foxinsoxuk said:

    I do have some knowledge of what is going on in the world of the Department of Brexit, some open source and some not. It is a shambles, a red white snd blue shambles, where we hope to muddle through.

    I find it irritating that the department is known a DeExEu

    DeusEx would be much more satisfying
    But that's written in foreign!!!!
  • glwglw Posts: 10,011
    Sunil_Prasannan said:

    What's wrong with being candid regarding the Saudi regime?

    Not a lot, the Saudi regime is despicable and we should speak the truth about it.
  • tlg86tlg86 Posts: 26,296
    AlastairMeeks said:

    Theresa May can't afford to lose Boris Johnson since he's a critically important linkman between her and the Brexit loonies. And his bungling gives her cover for the government's lack of a position on Brexit.

    He's the new John Prescott.

    As a loony myself, I don't think Brexiteers particularly care about individuals. FWIW I think Boris is a bit of comedy character. That he chose to side with us leavers is neither here nor there.
  • LadyBucketLadyBucket Posts: 590
    I've just fired off an email to No10 complaining about their treatment of Boris Johnson. If they have to slap his wrists, then do it in private. This is one of the Great Office's of State and they are just making this country a laughing stock, especially as BJ is visiting the Gulf this weekend.

    The problem is BJ is unsuited to this cliché-ridden, 24-hour sound bite media that we have today. I could never see him coping with PMQs.

    I see Kay Burley/Beth Rigby making fun of BJ's colourful jogging shorts. This really has got to stop but they won't of course because they sense blood in the water.
  • AlastairMeeksAlastairMeeks Posts: 30,340
    Scott_P said:

    foxinsoxuk said:

    I do have some knowledge of what is going on in the world of the Department of Brexit, some open source and some not. It is a shambles, a red white snd blue shambles, where we hope to muddle through.

    I find it irritating that the department is known a DeExEu

    DeusEx would be much more satisfying
    I'm looking forward to the department's abolition, because then in my best Björk impression I can sing to myself "DExEU does not exist".
  • MP_SEMP_SE Posts: 3,642
    Richard_Tyndall said:

    foxinsoxuk said:

    TheScreamingEagles said:

    The ulitimate, unspinable gaffe from Boris.

    He spoke the truth.

    I've had the feeling Boris wants out of politics since June 30th

    He is trying to get sacked for being in the right, as it is only a matter of time before he is sacked for being in the wrong, and that is a much harder place to rebuild from.

    Brexit is a shambles and he needs to get out of the car before he reaches the cliff.

    Not seeing any sign of that shambles at the moment. In fact it all seems to be going very well at the moment. Of course the blind Eurofanatics like yourself wouldn't agree but then you have prejudged it all and don't care about reality.
    Brexit and the Tories are a shambles if the Europhiles are to be believed. I think they are hoping that if repeated enough will become true.

    Unfortunately for them Article 50 will be triggered as soon as possible and the Tories will return another majority in 2020.
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 52,899
    MP_SE said:

    Unfortunately for them Article 50 will be triggered as soon as possible

    And when will it be possible?
  • philiphphiliph Posts: 4,704
    williamglenn said:

    MP_SE said:

    Unfortunately for them Article 50 will be triggered as soon as possible

    And when will it be possible?
    Before 31st March 2017?
  • Scott_PScott_P Posts: 51,453
    williamglenn said:

    And when will it be possible?

    After they pass primary legislation, possibly incorporating the Great Repeal Bill...
  • Carolus_RexCarolus_Rex Posts: 1,414
    Scott_P said:

    @bbclaurak: 'Boris Johnson has used up all of his lives' says one senior MP

    Most people thought he'd done that a few months ago.
  • MP_SEMP_SE Posts: 3,642
    philiph said:

    williamglenn said:

    MP_SE said:

    Unfortunately for them Article 50 will be triggered as soon as possible

    And when will it be possible?
    Before 31st March 2017?
    More than likely.

    I wish the HoL luck if they decide to try and sabotage it.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,654
    Phew,

    Camera back from Nikon & working.

    Seeing as the the body was worth ~ 70% of a month's net take home that is a big relief.
  • AnneJGPAnneJGP Posts: 3,146
    Are they counting tonight at Sleaford, please?
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 50,291
    rkrkrk said:

    If it really hits the fan a bunch will go at once... Hard to know who would go first though.

    So a multiple exit gets the bookies off the hook?
  • GeoffMGeoffM Posts: 6,071
    Scott_P said:

    @bbclaurak: 'Boris Johnson has used up all of his lives' says one senior MP

    Whenever someone is referred to as a "senior MP" you have to wonder if his own mother would recognise him in the street.
  • GoupillonGoupillon Posts: 79
    A result at Sleaford is expected around 4am tomorrow. A LD anecdotal report has said the eventual turnout looks like it could be 40% or even lower.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 55,572
    williamglenn said:

    MP_SE said:

    Unfortunately for them Article 50 will be triggered as soon as possible

    And when will it be possible?
    Didn't the House of Commons vote on that last night?
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,654
    IanB2 said:

    rkrkrk said:

    If it really hits the fan a bunch will go at once... Hard to know who would go first though.

    So a multiple exit gets the bookies off the hook?
    Dead heat rules should apply.
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 50,291
    GeoffM said:

    Scott_P said:

    @bbclaurak: 'Boris Johnson has used up all of his lives' says one senior MP

    Whenever someone is referred to as a "senior MP" you have to wonder if his own mother would recognise him in the street.
    The suggestion that he wouldn't mind being sacked, before everything goes pear shaped....
  • AnneJGPAnneJGP Posts: 3,146
    Goupillon said:

    A result at Sleaford is expected around 4am tomorrow. A LD anecdotal report has said the eventual turnout looks like it could be 40% or even lower.

    Thanks.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,654
    Sandpit said:

    williamglenn said:

    MP_SE said:

    Unfortunately for them Article 50 will be triggered as soon as possible

    And when will it be possible?
    Didn't the House of Commons vote on that last night?
    Its happening alright, but I think it is now right that some constitutional law is now developed by the Supreme Court.
  • MP_SEMP_SE Posts: 3,642
    GeoffM said:

    Scott_P said:

    @bbclaurak: 'Boris Johnson has used up all of his lives' says one senior MP

    Whenever someone is referred to as a "senior MP" you have to wonder if his own mother would recognise him in the street.
    Or there is no "senior MP".
  • MP_SEMP_SE Posts: 3,642
    Goupillon said:

    A result at Sleaford is expected around 4am tomorrow. A LD anecdotal report has said the eventual turnout looks like it could be 40% or even lower.

    I would guess turnout will be around 45-50%.
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 52,899
    MP_SE said:

    Goupillon said:

    A result at Sleaford is expected around 4am tomorrow. A LD anecdotal report has said the eventual turnout looks like it could be 40% or even lower.

    I would guess turnout will be around 45-50%.
    20k votes could be enough to take it.
  • RecidivistRecidivist Posts: 4,679
    Richard_Tyndall said:

    williamglenn said:

    On Sleaford, I read that UKIP put out a leaflet saying that if you support the EU you should vote Lib Dem. Can anyone confirm this?

    That wasn't on the leaflet I got from them but we are in a rural area rather than the two main urban areas so they may have targeted the main towns with that.

    I assume it would be an attempt to split the Tory vote.
    If so it is a dangerous tactic as it risks uniting the remain behind the Lib Dems. That might be to UKIP's advantage in Sleaford, but what if it spreads? The out vote split between the Tories and UKIP, with the Lib Dems hoovering up a lot of Tory seats where leave did well. That could be Brexit gone for another generation.
  • Scott_PScott_P Posts: 51,453
    Sandpit said:

    Didn't the House of Commons vote on that last night?

    It was brought up in the Supreme Court today. General feeling seems to be it might have been better had they not mentioned it
This discussion has been closed.