It is the logical conclusion affirmed by the opening passage in the Treaty of Rome. It is no myth.
You may construe it that way. I do not. And looking at the policy of France, Germany, and the U.K. within the EU over the last decade or so - neither do they.
Happily what you construe is of only incidental interest
To quote Sir Thomas More
The world must construe according to its wits; this court must construe according to the law.
Your Brexiteering Utopia has very little chance of becoming reality. Hopefully you realise this before we 48 percenters are consigned to the Tower!
It is the logical conclusion affirmed by the opening passage in the Treaty of Rome. It is no myth.
You may construe it that way. I do not. And looking at the policy of France, Germany, and the U.K. within the EU over the last decade or so - neither do they.
Happily what you construe is of only incidental interest
To quote Sir Thomas More
The world must construe according to its wits; this court must construe according to the law.
Your Brexiteering Utopia has very little chance of becoming reality. Hopefully you realise this before we 48 percenters are consigned to the Tower!
It is the logical conclusion affirmed by the opening passage in the Treaty of Rome. It is no myth.
You may construe it that way. I do not. And looking at the policy of France, Germany, and the U.K. within the EU over the last decade or so - neither do they.
Happily what you construe is of only incidental interest
To quote Sir Thomas More
The world must construe according to its wits; this court must construe according to the law.
Your Brexiteering Utopia has very little chance of becoming reality. Hopefully you realise this before we 48 percenters are consigned to the Tower!
Massive cheers to Jessica Ennis Hill. A better role model for modern Britain would be very hard to find. She had my vote for Spoty in 12 and 15 and will have it again this year. You were fab Jess!
And jeers to Tesco. If the anglish poond drops by more than 15%, prices are going to go up. Period. I noticed petrol was up by 2p at my local BP on the way home. This is the cost of taking back control.
We already knew that every unpopular decision would be blamed on the Leave vote, whether or not it had anything to do with it. A 10% price rise on a product made entirely within the UK has nothing at all to do with it...
Marmite's the tip of the iceberg. Dream On! Inflationary pressure is now here.
By the way, your premise that the EU has a logical conclusion through dissolution of the nation state is a sad, Brexit myth. It doesn't stand up to reason, or the facts.
No it is not. When has the EU ever stopped seeking to centralise more and more power to itself, and when has it tolerated any meaningful moves to return competences to member states? The commitment to ever closer union is enshrined in the Treaty of Rome and taken very seriously.
Besides, it won't let go of the Euro for love nor money, and that alone requires a federal treasury accountable to a federal government to make it work.
The Comission, like all bureaucracies, will always try to centralise more power. Separately, the nation states have consistently found more things to cooperate on.
But this is not the same thing as nation states dissolving themselves. Indeed, in the tussle between nation states and the Commission, the former do come out on top.
I'm certainly not saying EU governance is perfect - far from! - but the idea that it is a one way traffic to supranational serfdom is simply wrong. And very dangerous; it creates a mythical monster against which we are seem willing to sacrifice actual prosperity.
It isn't wrong. It is the basic raison d'etre of the EU. It is written right there in the treaties and is confirmed each time the ECJ makes a decision based on those treaties. It was the openly stated aim of the founders of the EEC and has continued to be the basic direction of travel for the EEC/EU over the last 40 years.
Just as well Dave got us an opt-out then wasn't it.
By the way, your premise that the EU has a logical conclusion through dissolution of the nation state is a sad, Brexit myth. It doesn't stand up to reason, or the facts.
No it is not. When has the EU ever stopped seeking to centralise more and more power to itself, and when has it tolerated any meaningful moves to return competences to member states? The commitment to ever closer union is enshrined in the Treaty of Rome and taken very seriously.
Besides, it won't let go of the Euro for love nor money, and that alone requires a federal treasury accountable to a federal government to make it work.
The Comission, like all bureaucracies, will always try to centralise more power. Separately, the nation states have consistently found more things to cooperate on.
But this is not the same thing as nation states dissolving themselves. Indeed, in the tussle between nation states and the Commission, the former do come out on top.
I'm certainly not saying EU governance is perfect - far from! - but the idea that it is a one way traffic to supranational serfdom is simply wrong. And very dangerous; it creates a mythical monster against which we are seem willing to sacrifice actual prosperity.
1. If the Eurozone fails to federalise then how is the single currency ever to be made to work properly? The vast economic disparities between the member states can only be addressed through the issuance of common debt, by a common government that can raise common taxes, and by outright fiscal transfers - not through a combination of punitive austerity measures and massive loans (which, in the Greek case at least, the supplicant debtors have no realistic chance of ever repaying.)
2. If the Eurozone federalises then it therefore follows that (a) states within it will cease to exist as sovereign entities, and (b) remaining non-Euro states will probably find themselves as fax democracies a la Norway.
We thankfully avoided the Euro. What the Euro nations do is up to them. If they want to self-liquidate, so be it.
The fax democracy description of Norway is another one of those tags that doesn't really help. It takes on a load of single market regulation so that it can trade effectively. Doesn't mean its not a sovereign nation.
George Eaton ✔ @georgeeaton EU president Donald Tusk: “The only real alternative to a hard Brexit is no Brexit." Europe's political priority is to avoid "soft" deal.
By the way, your premise that the EU has a logical conclusion through dissolution of the nation state is a sad, Brexit myth. It doesn't stand up to reason, or the facts.
No it is not. When has the EU ever stopped seeking to centralise more and more power to itself, and when has it tolerated any meaningful moves to return competences to member states? The commitment to ever closer union is enshrined in the Treaty of Rome and taken very seriously.
Besides, it won't let go of the Euro for love nor money, and that alone requires a federal treasury accountable to a federal government to make it work.
The Comission, like all bureaucracies, will always try to centralise more power. Separately, the nation states have consistently found more things to cooperate on.
But this is not the same thing as nation states dissolving themselves. Indeed, in the tussle between nation states and the Commission, the former do come out on top.
I'm certainly not saying EU governance is perfect - far from! - but the idea that it is a one way traffic to supranational serfdom is simply wrong. And very dangerous; it creates a mythical monster against which we are seem willing to sacrifice actual prosperity.
1. If the Eurozone fails to federalise then how is the single currency ever to be made to work properly? The vast economic disparities between the member states can only be addressed through the issuance of common debt, by a common government that can raise common taxes, and by outright fiscal transfers - not through a combination of punitive austerity measures and massive loans (which, in the Greek case at least, the supplicant debtors have no realistic chance of ever repaying.)
2. If the Eurozone federalises then it therefore follows that (a) states within it will cease to exist as sovereign entities, and (b) remaining non-Euro states will probably find themselves as fax democracies a la Norway.
We thankfully avoided the Euro. What the Euro nations do is up to them. If they want to self-liquidate, so be it.
The fax democracy description of Norway is another one of those tags that doesn't really help. It takes on a load of single market regulation so that it can trade effectively. Doesn't mean its not a sovereign nation.
The fax democracy claim is also utterly false - another myth perpetuated by the Pro-EU lobby
Only the Suffolk, North Carolina poll was done after the debate, you have to look at the date of the surveys.
Using only the national polls done after the debate it's an average Hillary lead nationally of 3.6%.
She is leading by 2 in N.Carolina, by 3 in Florida by 2 on average in Nevada, all consistent with a national lead for Hillary of around 4 points.
You are behind the curve, the debate did wonders for Trump and cancelled the Tape.
You keep repeating this "Trump's debate victory" myth.
All the polls showed a Clinton win. You relate to other polls regularly but choose to ignore the debate polls. Very odd.
Imagine there were no polls on the debate at all, and look at all the other evidence of the campaign and other polling data. You would have to conclude that there was an event on Sunday that was favourable to Trump.
No you'd be seeing a reversion to mean after the shock of the tapes wore off.
It is the logical conclusion affirmed by the opening passage in the Treaty of Rome. It is no myth.
You may construe it that way. I do not. And looking at the policy of France, Germany, and the U.K. within the EU over the last decade or so - neither do they.
Happily what you construe is of only incidental interest
To quote Sir Thomas More
The world must construe according to its wits; this court must construe according to the law.
Your Brexiteering Utopia has very little chance of becoming reality. Hopefully you realise this before we 48 percenters are consigned to the Tower!
By the way, your premise that the EU has a logical conclusion through dissolution of the nation state is a sad, Brexit myth. It doesn't stand up to reason, or the facts.
No it is not. When has the EU ever stopped seeking to centralise more and more power to itself, and when has it tolerated any meaningful moves to return competences to member states? The commitment to ever closer union is enshrined in the Treaty of Rome and taken very seriously.
Besides, it won't let go of the Euro for love nor money, and that alone requires a federal treasury accountable to a federal government to make it work.
The Comission, like all bureaucracies, will always try to centralise more power. Separately, the nation states have consistently found more things to cooperate on.
But this is not the same thing as nation states dissolving themselves. Indeed, in the tussle between nation states and the Commission, the former do come out on top.
I'm certainly not saying EU governance is perfect - far from! - but the idea that it is a one way traffic to supranational serfdom is simply wrong. And very dangerous; it creates a mythical monster against which we are seem willing to sacrifice actual prosperity.
It isn't wrong. It is the basic raison d'etre of the EU. It is written right there in the treaties and is confirmed each time the ECJ makes a decision based on those treaties. It was the openly stated aim of the founders of the EEC and has continued to be the basic direction of travel for the EEC/EU over the last 40 years.
Just as well Dave got us an opt-out then wasn't it.
Still fighting yesterday's battles Topping? You already lost that one back in June.
Trump in full flow. This is what a loser sounds like.
Wrong. If he can bring out this kind of performance in the final debate he will win.
Too late. No ground game. No spend on ads. Insulted every demographic. It's over.
He's running an ad campaign concentrating on calling Clinton ill and physically weak, and the NRA are running a big ad too. Many signs being held up saying "Blacks for Trump".
By the way, your premise that the EU has a logical conclusion through dissolution of the nation state is a sad, Brexit myth. It doesn't stand up to reason, or the facts.
No it is not. When has the EU ever stopped seeking to centralise more and more power to itself, and when has it tolerated any meaningful moves to return competences to member states? The commitment to ever closer union is enshrined in the Treaty of Rome and taken very seriously.
Besides, it won't let go of the Euro for love nor money, and that alone requires a federal treasury accountable to a federal government to make it work.
The Comission, like all bureaucracies, will always try to centralise more power. Separately, the nation states have consistently found more things to cooperate on.
But this is not the same thing as nation states dissolving themselves. Indeed, in the tussle between nation states and the Commission, the former do come out on top.
I'm certainly not saying EU governance is perfect - far from! - but the idea that it is a one way traffic to supranational serfdom is simply wrong. And very dangerous; it creates a mythical monster against which we are seem willing to sacrifice actual prosperity.
1. If the Eurozone fails to federalise then how is the single currency ever to be made to work properly? The vast economic disparities between the member states can only be addressed through the issuance of common debt, by a common government that can raise common taxes, and by outright fiscal transfers - not through a combination of punitive austerity measures and massive loans (which, in the Greek case at least, the supplicant debtors have no realistic chance of ever repaying.)
2. If the Eurozone federalises then it therefore follows that (a) states within it will cease to exist as sovereign entities, and (b) remaining non-Euro states will probably find themselves as fax democracies a la Norway.
We thankfully avoided the Euro. What the Euro nations do is up to them. If they want to self-liquidate, so be it.
The fax democracy description of Norway is another one of those tags that doesn't really help. It takes on a load of single market regulation so that it can trade effectively. Doesn't mean its not a sovereign nation.
Same with EU membership. We were a sovereign nation despite us agreeing to a set of common rules in order for mutual benefit.
Trump - "The highly respected Rasmussen poll .... "
Laugh .... I nearly choked on my low calorie "meal" ....
It was highly respected when it had Clinton in the lead - and so was the LA Times poll.
No by me.
Rasmussen is a basket case. Apparently 24% AA are voting Trump ... who knew ?!? and to make the LA Times tracker viable, 538 have to add +5 to the Clinton score.
Trump in full flow. This is what a loser sounds like.
Wrong. If he can bring out this kind of performance in the final debate he will win.
Too late. No ground game. No spend on ads. Insulted every demographic. It's over.
With all the UK media reporting how terrible Trump is, one could get the impression that it is all over. The problem is there is no sense of balance or quoting facts or analysing the credibility of polls. Just very poor journalism. As usual.
I'm certainly not saying EU governance is perfect - far from! - but the idea that it is a one way traffic to supranational serfdom is simply wrong. And very dangerous; it creates a mythical monster against which we are seem willing to sacrifice actual prosperity.
Can you name one power assumed by the EU which on reflection they decided more correctly lay with the nation states in accordance with the principles of subsidiarity ? No ? Neither can I.
I cannot. But it is hardly likely the EU (Commission) would do so. You might ask the same of Westminster, or even your local parish council.
It is for the nation states to repatriate powers if they think it advisable. The U.K. has been relatively unsuccessful at pushing this agenda probably because it has preferred and been quite successful at securing the individual opt-out.
The thing is, Westminster and my local parish council were not mandated to do exactly that Article 5(3) of the Maastricht Treaty, guess which organisation was
It is the logical conclusion affirmed by the opening passage in the Treaty of Rome. It is no myth.
You may construe it that way. I do not. And looking at the policy of France, Germany, and the U.K. within the EU over the last decade or so - neither do they.
Happily what you construe is of only incidental interest
To quote Sir Thomas More
The world must construe according to its wits; this court must construe according to the law.
Your Brexiteering Utopia has very little chance of becoming reality. Hopefully you realise this before we 48 percenters are consigned to the Tower!
You lost.
We all lost.
Labour especially and particularly Corbyn.
British politics is two tramps fighting over the dregs in a can of Stella. The winner later discovers the dregs are piss.
I'm certainly not saying EU governance is perfect - far from! - but the idea that it is a one way traffic to supranational serfdom is simply wrong. And very dangerous; it creates a mythical monster against which we are seem willing to sacrifice actual prosperity.
Can you name one power assumed by the EU which on reflection they decided more correctly lay with the nation states in accordance with the principles of subsidiarity ? No ? Neither can I.
I cannot. But it is hardly likely the EU (Commission) would do so. You might ask the same of Westminster, or even your local parish council.
It is for the nation states to repatriate powers if they think it advisable. The U.K. has been relatively unsuccessful at pushing this agenda probably because it has preferred and been quite successful at securing the individual opt-out.
Erm. Westminster has devolved vast amounts of power to Scotland, Wales and N. Ireland as well as to the regions and district councils at various times. I think that is a rather poor example for you to use.
Trump: "This is our moment of reckoning as a society, and as a civilisation. I didn't need to do this. Believe me. (...) I'm doing it because this country has given me so much (...) and I feel so strongly that it's my turn to give back to the country that I love."
"In my former life, I was an insider (...) Now I'm being punished for leaving the special club and revealing to you the terrible things that are going on."
"Because I used to be part of the club, I'm the only one who can fix it".
"The dark clouds hanging over our government can be lifted (...) It all depends on whether we let the corrupt media decide our future (...) or the American people decide our future"
It is the logical conclusion affirmed by the opening passage in the Treaty of Rome. It is no myth.
You may construe it that way. I do not. And looking at the policy of France, Germany, and the U.K. within the EU over the last decade or so - neither do they.
Happily what you construe is of only incidental interest
To quote Sir Thomas More
The world must construe according to its wits; this court must construe according to the law.
Your Brexiteering Utopia has very little chance of becoming reality. Hopefully you realise this before we 48 percenters are consigned to the Tower!
You lost.
We all lost.
Not at all. Proudest day of my life.
Disappointing to see you've bought into the Remain camp wholesale.
By the way, your premise that the EU has a logical conclusion through dissolution of the nation state is a sad, Brexit myth. It doesn't stand up to reason, or the facts.
No it is not. When has the EU ever stopped seeking to centralise more and more power to itself, and when has it tolerated any meaningful moves to return competences to member states? The commitment to ever closer union is enshrined in the Treaty of Rome and taken very seriously.
Besides, it won't let go of the Euro for love nor money, and that alone requires a federal treasury accountable to a federal government to make it work.
The Comission, like all bureaucracies, will always try to centralise more power. Separately, the nation states have consistently found more things to cooperate on.
But this is not the same thing as nation states dissolving themselves. Indeed, in the tussle between nation states and the Commission, the former do come out on top.
I'm certainly not saying EU governance is perfect - far from! - but the idea that it is a one way traffic to supranational serfdom is simply wrong. And very dangerous; it creates a mythical monster against which we are seem willing to sacrifice actual prosperity.
It isn't wrong. It is the basic raison d'etre of the EU. It is written right there in the treaties and is confirmed each time the ECJ makes a decision based on those treaties. It was the openly stated aim of the founders of the EEC and has continued to be the basic direction of travel for the EEC/EU over the last 40 years.
Just as well Dave got us an opt-out then wasn't it.
Still fighting yesterday's battles Topping? You already lost that one back in June.
Nah. I lost that one but am ashamed of myself that I find it amusing to dangle a bone in front of the Brexiters before whisking it away as they snap.
It is the logical conclusion affirmed by the opening passage in the Treaty of Rome. It is no myth.
You may construe it that way. I do not. And looking at the policy of France, Germany, and the U.K. within the EU over the last decade or so - neither do they.
Happily what you construe is of only incidental interest
To quote Sir Thomas More
The world must construe according to its wits; this court must construe according to the law.
Your Brexiteering Utopia has very little chance of becoming reality. Hopefully you realise this before we 48 percenters are consigned to the Tower!
Massive cheers to Jessica Ennis Hill. A better role model for modern Britain would be very hard to find. She had my vote for Spoty in 12 and 15 and will have it again this year. You were fab Jess!
And jeers to Tesco. If the anglish poond drops by more than 15%, prices are going to go up. Period. I noticed petrol was up by 2p at my local BP on the way home. This is the cost of taking back control.
We already knew that every unpopular decision would be blamed on the Leave vote, whether or not it had anything to do with it. A 10% price rise on a product made entirely within the UK has nothing at all to do with it...
Marmite's the tip of the iceberg. Dream On! Inflationary pressure is now here.
As Mervyn King told us a couple of days ago he had been trying to get higher interest rates and inflation for three years as Bank of England policy, and now we are suppose to believe this is a bad thing ?
Trump - "The highly respected Rasmussen poll .... "
Laugh .... I nearly choked on my low calorie "meal" ....
It was highly respected when it had Clinton in the lead - and so was the LA Times poll.
No by me.
Rasmussen is a basket case. Apparently 24% AA are voting Trump ... who knew ?!? and to make the LA Times tracker viable, 538 have to add +5 to the Clinton score.
I add 6 to the LAT tracker, and from experience it lags about 5-7 days.
By the way, your premise that the EU has a logical conclusion through dissolution of the nation state is a sad, Brexit myth. It doesn't stand up to reason, or the facts.
No it is not. When has the EU ever stopped seeking to centralise more and more power to itself, and when has it tolerated any meaningful moves to return competences to member states? The commitment to ever closer union is enshrined in the Treaty of Rome and taken very seriously.
Besides, it won't let go of the Euro for love nor money, and that alone requires a federal treasury accountable to a federal government to make it work.
The Comission, like all bureaucracies, will always try to centralise more power. Separately, the nation states have consistently found more things to cooperate on.
But this is not the same thing as nation states dissolving themselves. Indeed, in the tussle between nation states and the Commission, the former do come out on top.
I'm certainly not saying EU governance is perfect - far from! - but the idea that it is a one way traffic to supranational serfdom is simply wrong. And very dangerous; it creates a mythical monster against which we are seem willing to sacrifice actual prosperity.
It isn't wrong. It is the basic raison d'etre of the EU. It is written right there in the treaties and is confirmed each time the ECJ makes a decision based on those treaties. It was the openly stated aim of the founders of the EEC and has continued to be the basic direction of travel for the EEC/EU over the last 40 years.
Nope. What Monnet may have dreamt is pretty irrelevant 60 years on. Let's play realpolitik, please. If you can point to an instance where the ECJ has ruled for the dissolution of a sovereign entity by reference to the preamble of the a Treaty of Rome, I will gladly reconsider.
It is the logical conclusion affirmed by the opening passage in the Treaty of Rome. It is no myth.
You may construe it that way. I do not. And looking at the policy of France, Germany, and the U.K. within the EU over the last decade or so - neither do they.
Happily what you construe is of only incidental interest
To quote Sir Thomas More
The world must construe according to its wits; this court must construe according to the law.
Your Brexiteering Utopia has very little chance of becoming reality. Hopefully you realise this before we 48 percenters are consigned to the Tower!
You lost.
We all lost.
Labour especially and particularly Corbyn.
British politics is two tramps fighting over the dregs in a can of Stella. The winner later discovers the dregs are piss.
Enjoy your victory.
It must be sad to so hate your country and everything it stands for.
Aarrgghh the nasty EU man has a straight banana. Quick, let's trash the economy and make foreigners feel so uncomfortable here, they'll leave.
No one minded the straight banana. It was the EU making it illegal to sell the bent one, causing perfectly good food to go to landfill while people starved in Ethiopia that grated
By the way, your premise that the EU has a logical conclusion through dissolution of the nation state is a sad, Brexit myth. It doesn't stand up to reason, or the facts.
No it is not. When has the EU ever stopped seeking to centralise more and more power to itself, and when has it tolerated any meaningful moves to return competences to member states? The commitment to ever closer union is enshrined in the Treaty of Rome and taken very seriously.
Besides, it won't let go of the Euro for love nor money, and that alone requires a federal treasury accountable to a federal government to make it work.
The Comission, like all bureaucracies, will always try to centralise more power. Separately, the nation states have consistently found more things to cooperate on.
But this is not the same thing as nation states dissolving themselves. Indeed, in the tussle between nation states and the Commission, the former do come out on top.
I'm certainly not saying EU governance is perfect - far from! - but the idea that it is a one way traffic to supranational serfdom is simply wrong. And very dangerous; it creates a mythical monster against which we are seem willing to sacrifice actual prosperity.
1. If the Eurozone fails to federalise then how is the single currency ever to be made to work properly? The vast economic disparities between the member states can only be addressed through the issuance of common debt, by a common government that can raise common taxes, and by outright fiscal transfers - not through a combination of punitive austerity measures and massive loans (which, in the Greek case at least, the supplicant debtors have no realistic chance of ever repaying.)
2. If the Eurozone federalises then it therefore follows that (a) states within it will cease to exist as sovereign entities, and (b) remaining non-Euro states will probably find themselves as fax democracies a la Norway.
We thankfully avoided the Euro. What the Euro nations do is up to them. If they want to self-liquidate, so be it.
The fax democracy description of Norway is another one of those tags that doesn't really help. It takes on a load of single market regulation so that it can trade effectively. Doesn't mean its not a sovereign nation.
The fax democracy claim is also utterly false - another myth perpetuated by the Pro-EU lobby
It is the logical conclusion affirmed by the opening passage in the Treaty of Rome. It is no myth.
You may construe it that way. I do not. And looking at the policy of France, Germany, and the U.K. within the EU over the last decade or so - neither do they.
Happily what you construe is of only incidental interest
To quote Sir Thomas More
The world must construe according to its wits; this court must construe according to the law.
Your Brexiteering Utopia has very little chance of becoming reality. Hopefully you realise this before we 48 percenters are consigned to the Tower!
By the way, your premise that the EU has a logical conclusion through dissolution of the nation state is a sad, Brexit myth. It doesn't stand up to reason, or the facts.
No it is not. When has the EU ever stopped seeking to centralise more and more power to itself, and when has it tolerated any meaningful moves to return competences to member states? The commitment to ever closer union is enshrined in the Treaty of Rome and taken very seriously.
Besides, it won't let go of the Euro for love nor money, and that alone requires a federal treasury accountable to a federal government to make it work.
The Comission, like all bureaucracies, will always try to centralise more power. Separately, the nation states have consistently found more things to cooperate on.
But this is not the same thing as nation states dissolving themselves. Indeed, in the tussle between nation states and the Commission, the former do come out on top.
I'm certainly not saying EU governance is perfect - far from! - but the idea that it is a one way traffic to supranational serfdom is simply wrong. And very dangerous; it creates a mythical monster against which we are seem willing to sacrifice actual prosperity.
It isn't wrong. It is the basic raison d'etre of the EU. It is written right there in the treaties and is confirmed each time the ECJ makes a decision based on those treaties. It was the openly stated aim of the founders of the EEC and has continued to be the basic direction of travel for the EEC/EU over the last 40 years.
Just as well Dave got us an opt-out then wasn't it.
It is the logical conclusion affirmed by the opening passage in the Treaty of Rome. It is no myth.
You may construe it that way. I do not. And looking at the policy of France, Germany, and the U.K. within the EU over the last decade or so - neither do they.
Happily what you construe is of only incidental interest
To quote Sir Thomas More
The world must construe according to its wits; this court must construe according to the law.
Your Brexiteering Utopia has very little chance of becoming reality. Hopefully you realise this before we 48 percenters are consigned to the Tower!
Massive cheers to Jessica Ennis Hill. A better role model for modern Britain would be very hard to find. She had my vote for Spoty in 12 and 15 and will have it again this year. You were fab Jess!
And jeers to Tesco. If the anglish poond drops by more than 15%, prices are going to go up. Period. I noticed petrol was up by 2p at my local BP on the way home. This is the cost of taking back control.
We already knew that every unpopular decision would be blamed on the Leave vote, whether or not it had anything to do with it. A 10% price rise on a product made entirely within the UK has nothing at all to do with it...
Marmite's the tip of the iceberg. Dream On! Inflationary pressure is now here.
As Mervyn King told us a couple of days ago he had been trying to get higher interest rates and inflation for three years as Bank of England policy, and now we are suppose to believe this is a bad thing ?
As someone who doesn't actually live here I don't expect you'll get these things but once ordinary people are paying more to live, particularly on their mortgages if interest rates rise, and as always happens in the UK wages run behind, then they'll not have a great deal of time for Mervyn King or his view of inflation.
It is the logical conclusion affirmed by the opening passage in the Treaty of Rome. It is no myth.
You may construe it that way. I do not. And looking at the policy of France, Germany, and the U.K. within the EU over the last decade or so - neither do they.
Happily what you construe is of only incidental interest
To quote Sir Thomas More
The world must construe according to its wits; this court must construe according to the law.
Your Brexiteering Utopia has very little chance of becoming reality. Hopefully you realise this before we 48 percenters are consigned to the Tower!
You lost.
We all lost.
Not at all. Proudest day of my life.
Disappointing to see you've bought into the Remain camp wholesale.
The way Brexit is playing out is hugely upsetting. The way May and Rudd played it last week was hugely damaging. I am very angry.
I should not have to explain to friends it's safe to visit the UK.
Trump in full flow. This is what a loser sounds like.
Wrong. If he can bring out this kind of performance in the final debate he will win.
Too late. No ground game. No spend on ads. Insulted every demographic. It's over.
With all the UK media reporting how terrible Trump is, one could get the impression that it is all over. The problem is there is no sense of balance or quoting facts or analysing the credibility of polls. Just very poor journalism. As usual.
Which means very good potential profit opportunities.
It is the logical conclusion affirmed by the opening passage in the Treaty of Rome. It is no myth.
You may construe it that way. I do not. And looking at the policy of France, Germany, and the U.K. within the EU over the last decade or so - neither do they.
Happily what you construe is of only incidental interest
To quote Sir Thomas More
The world must construe according to its wits; this court must construe according to the law.
Your Brexiteering Utopia has very little chance of becoming reality. Hopefully you realise this before we 48 percenters are consigned to the Tower!
You lost.
We all lost.
Labour especially and particularly Corbyn.
British politics is two tramps fighting over the dregs in a can of Stella. The winner later discovers the dregs are piss.
Enjoy your victory.
It must be sad to so hate your country and everything it stands for.
It is the logical conclusion affirmed by the opening passage in the Treaty of Rome. It is no myth.
You may construe it that way. I do not. And looking at the policy of France, Germany, and the U.K. within the EU over the last decade or so - neither do they.
Happily what you construe is of only incidental interest
To quote Sir Thomas More
The world must construe according to its wits; this court must construe according to the law.
Your Brexiteering Utopia has very little chance of becoming reality. Hopefully you realise this before we 48 percenters are consigned to the Tower!
You lost.
We all lost.
No, 52% of us won.
I thing we can all agree than everyone won except 3 people:
Not a very credible tracker, they didn't show any plunge for Trump during the Tape.
They showed him gaining during the Tape, and it's not a 7 day tracker, it's only a 2 day tracker so they have no excuse.
They don't seem to respond with events.
Is it panel based ? We saw the same happen in GE2015 with "panel based pollsters" which gave us more or less the same result for months, with people on here wondering not unreasonable why if you asked more or less the same people more or less the same question why you expected their answers to change over time.
By the way, your premise that the EU has a logical conclusion through dissolution of the nation state is a sad, Brexit myth. It doesn't stand up to reason, or the facts.
No it is not. When has the EU ever stopped seeking to centralise more and more power to itself, and when has it tolerated any meaningful moves to return competences to member states? The commitment to ever closer union is enshrined in the Treaty of Rome and taken very seriously.
Besides, it won't let go of the Euro for love nor money, and that alone requires a federal treasury accountable to a federal government to make it work.
The Comission, like all bureaucracies, will always try to centralise more power. Separately, the nation states have consistently found more things to cooperate on.
But this is not the same thing as nation states dissolving themselves. Indeed, in the tussle between nation states and the Commission, the former do come out on top.
I'm certainly not saying EU governance is perfect - far from! - but the idea that it is a one way traffic to supranational serfdom is simply wrong. And very dangerous; it creates a mythical monster against which we are seem willing to sacrifice actual prosperity.
It isn't wrong. It is the basic raison d'etre of the EU. It is written right there in the treaties and is confirmed each time the ECJ makes a decision based on those treaties. It was the openly stated aim of the founders of the EEC and has continued to be the basic direction of travel for the EEC/EU over the last 40 years.
Nope. What Monnet may have dreamt is pretty irrelevant 60 years on. Let's play realpolitik, please. If you can point to an instance where the ECJ has ruled for the dissolution of a sovereign entity by reference to the preamble of the a Treaty of Rome, I will gladly reconsider.
A stupid request since you don't dissolve a sovereign state overnight. What you do is slowly remove powers from the state and transfer them to the supra national entity. And when the states object you use the ECJ to overrule them. Now can anyone think of an example where that has been happening for the last 50 years or so?
It is the logical conclusion affirmed by the opening passage in the Treaty of Rome. It is no myth.
You may construe it that way. I do not. And looking at the policy of France, Germany, and the U.K. within the EU over the last decade or so - neither do they.
Happily what you construe is of only incidental interest
To quote Sir Thomas More
The world must construe according to its wits; this court must construe according to the law.
Your Brexiteering Utopia has very little chance of becoming reality. Hopefully you realise this before we 48 percenters are consigned to the Tower!
Massive cheers to Jessica Ennis Hill. A better role model for modern Britain would be very hard to find. She had my vote for Spoty in 12 and 15 and will have it again this year. You were fab Jess!
And jeers to Tesco. If the anglish poond drops by more than 15%, prices are going to go up. Period. I noticed petrol was up by 2p at my local BP on the way home. This is the cost of taking back control.
We already knew that every unpopular decision would be blamed on the Leave vote, whether or not it had anything to do with it. A 10% price rise on a product made entirely within the UK has nothing at all to do with it...
Marmite's the tip of the iceberg. Dream On! Inflationary pressure is now here.
As Mervyn King told us a couple of days ago he had been trying to get higher interest rates and inflation for three years as Bank of England policy, and now we are suppose to believe this is a bad thing ?
Well if there had been a 10% px increase at Tesco then in the fog of war that would have been put down to Brexit.
We are now in a world where instead of having to take responsibility for their actions, a prime reason for PB Leavers for voting Out, governments and corporates will blame anything bad on the EU.
I'm certainly not saying EU governance is perfect - far from! - but the idea that it is a one way traffic to supranational serfdom is simply wrong. And very dangerous; it creates a mythical monster against which we are seem willing to sacrifice actual prosperity.
Can you name one power assumed by the EU which on reflection they decided more correctly lay with the nation states in accordance with the principles of subsidiarity ? No ? Neither can I.
I cannot. But it is hardly likely the EU (Commission) would do so. You might ask the same of Westminster, or even your local parish council.
It is for the nation states to repatriate powers if they think it advisable. The U.K. has been relatively unsuccessful at pushing this agenda probably because it has preferred and been quite successful at securing the individual opt-out.
Erm. Westminster has devolved vast amounts of power to Scotland, Wales and N. Ireland as well as to the regions and district councils at various times. I think that is a rather poor example for you to use.
Sorry, my sloppy language.
My point is that bureaucracies do not devolve.
Politicians do however, as Blair did with the nations and Osborne tried to do with the metros.
It is the logical conclusion affirmed by the opening passage in the Treaty of Rome. It is no myth.
You may construe it that way. I do not. And looking at the policy of France, Germany, and the U.K. within the EU over the last decade or so - neither do they.
Happily what you construe is of only incidental interest
To quote Sir Thomas More
The world must construe according to its wits; this court must construe according to the law.
Your Brexiteering Utopia has very little chance of becoming reality. Hopefully you realise this before we 48 percenters are consigned to the Tower!
You lost.
We all lost.
Labour especially and particularly Corbyn.
British politics is two tramps fighting over the dregs in a can of Stella. The winner later discovers the dregs are piss.
Enjoy your victory.
It must be sad to so hate your country and everything it stands for.
By the way, your premise that the EU has a logical conclusion through dissolution of the nation state is a sad, Brexit myth. It doesn't stand up to reason, or the facts.
No it is not. When has the EU ever stopped seeking to centralise more and more power to itself, and when has it tolerated any meaningful moves to return competences to member states? The commitment to ever closer union is enshrined in the Treaty of Rome and taken very seriously.
Besides, it won't let go of the Euro for love nor money, and that alone requires a federal treasury accountable to a federal government to make it work.
The Comission, like all bureaucracies, will always try to centralise more power. Separately, the nation states have consistently found more things to cooperate on.
But this is not the same thing as nation states dissolving themselves. Indeed, in the tussle between nation states and the Commission, the former do come out on top.
I'm certainly not saying EU governance is perfect - far from! - but the idea that it is a one way traffic to supranational serfdom is simply wrong. And very dangerous; it creates a mythical monster against which we are seem willing to sacrifice actual prosperity.
1. If the Eurozone fails to federalise then how is the single currency ever to be made to work properly? The vast economic disparities between the member states can only be addressed through the issuance of common debt, by a common government that can raise common taxes, and by outright fiscal transfers - not through a combination of punitive austerity measures and massive loans (which, in the Greek case at least, the supplicant debtors have no realistic chance of ever repaying.)
2. If the Eurozone federalises then it therefore follows that (a) states within it will cease to exist as sovereign entities, and (b) remaining non-Euro states will probably find themselves as fax democracies a la Norway.
We thankfully avoided the Euro. What the Euro nations do is up to them. If they want to self-liquidate, so be it.
The fax democracy description of Norway is another one of those tags that doesn't really help. It takes on a load of single market regulation so that it can trade effectively. Doesn't mean its not a sovereign nation.
Same with EU membership. We were a sovereign nation despite us agreeing to a set of common rules in order for mutual benefit.
By Article 1 of the Montevideo Convention, the EU qualifies as a state and its "member states" might not, as qualification (d) is restricted.
George Eaton ✔ @georgeeaton EU president Donald Tusk: “The only real alternative to a hard Brexit is no Brexit." Europe's political priority is to avoid "soft" deal.'
So no need for endless time wasting debate in the HoC of soft v hard brexit,Tusk has clarified it for us.
It is the logical conclusion affirmed by the opening passage in the Treaty of Rome. It is no myth.
You may construe it that way. I do not. And looking at the policy of France, Germany, and the U.K. within the EU over the last decade or so - neither do they.
Happily what you construe is of only incidental interest
To quote Sir Thomas More
The world must construe according to its wits; this court must construe according to the law.
Your Brexiteering Utopia has very little chance of becoming reality. Hopefully you realise this before we 48 percenters are consigned to the Tower!
Massive cheers to Jessica Ennis Hill. A better role model for modern Britain would be very hard to find. She had my vote for Spoty in 12 and 15 and will have it again this year. You were fab Jess!
And jeers to Tesco. If the anglish poond drops by more than 15%, prices are going to go up. Period. I noticed petrol was up by 2p at my local BP on the way home. This is the cost of taking back control.
We already knew that every unpopular decision would be blamed on the Leave vote, whether or not it had anything to do with it. A 10% price rise on a product made entirely within the UK has nothing at all to do with it...
Marmite's the tip of the iceberg. Dream On! Inflationary pressure is now here.
As Mervyn King told us a couple of days ago he had been trying to get higher interest rates and inflation for three years as Bank of England policy, and now we are suppose to believe this is a bad thing ?
Well if there had been a 10% px increase at Tesco then in the fog of war that would have been put down to Brexit.
We are now in a world where instead of having to take responsibility for their actions, a prime reason for PB Leavers for voting Out, governments and corporates will blame anything bad on the EU.
But thankfully in this day and age there are plenty of resources to use to show that they are being dishonest - just as happened to Unilever today.
I sometimes think that even after 20 years or more of the internet and information on demand (even if it does need to be filtered through a haze of misinformation at times) governments and corporations still haven't got the new reality yet.
Trump: "This is our moment of reckoning as a society, and as a civilisation. I didn't need to do this. Believe me. (...) I'm doing it because this country has given me so much (...) and I feel so strongly that it's my turn to give back to the country that I love."
"In my former life, I was an insider (...) Now I'm being punished for leaving the special club and revealing to you the terrible things that are going on."
"Because I used to be part of the club, I'm the only one who can fix it".
"The dark clouds hanging over our government can be lifted (...) It all depends on whether we let the corrupt media decide our future (...) or the American people decide our future"
Speech clealy written by Fargle.
Trump even said in the speech that 8 Nov would be "independence day".
Aarrgghh the nasty EU man has a straight banana. Quick, let's trash the economy and make foreigners feel so uncomfortable here, they'll leave.
No one minded the straight banana. It was the EU making it illegal to sell the bent one, causing perfectly good food to go to landfill while people starved in Ethiopia that grated
Such a tangled web of propaganda has addled your brain.
The banana issue is far more complex than the absurdities of defining a banana that any trade agreement that covers bananas deals with.
It is the logical conclusion affirmed by the opening passage in the Treaty of Rome. It is no myth.
You may construe it that way. I do not. And looking at the policy of France, Germany, and the U.K. within the EU over the last decade or so - neither do they.
Happily what you construe is of only incidental interest
To quote Sir Thomas More
The world must construe according to its wits; this court must construe according to the law.
Your Brexiteering Utopia has very little chance of becoming reality. Hopefully you realise this before we 48 percenters are consigned to the Tower!
Massive cheers to Jessica Ennis Hill. A better role model for modern Britain would be very hard to find. She had my vote for Spoty in 12 and 15 and will have it again this year. You were fab Jess!
And jeers to Tesco. If the anglish poond drops by more than 15%, prices are going to go up. Period. I noticed petrol was up by 2p at my local BP on the way home. This is the cost of taking back control.
We already knew that every unpopular decision would be blamed on the Leave vote, whether or not it had anything to do with it. A 10% price rise on a product made entirely within the UK has nothing at all to do with it...
Marmite's the tip of the iceberg. Dream On! Inflationary pressure is now here.
As Mervyn King told us a couple of days ago he had been trying to get higher interest rates and inflation for three years as Bank of England policy, and now we are suppose to believe this is a bad thing ?
As someone who doesn't actually live here I don't expect you'll get these things but once ordinary people are paying more to live, particularly on their mortgages if interest rates rise, and as always happens in the UK wages run behind, then they'll not have a great deal of time for Mervyn King or his view of inflation.
As someone not intimately acquainted with my personal affairs you have no idea who or what I am paying for in the UK so perhaps we can avoid badly informed personal comments ?
Let me see if I have this straight, Carney supposed Remain, he's a good chap, King supported Leave, he's satan ? Both did the same job for the same government for three years.
George Eaton ✔ @georgeeaton EU president Donald Tusk: “The only real alternative to a hard Brexit is no Brexit." Europe's political priority is to avoid "soft" deal.'
So no need for endless time wasting debate in the HoC of soft v hard brexit,Tusk has clarified it for us.
I'm not surprised.
As I said the EU is too emotional right now to react rationally, proper negotiations can only start after we leave the EU and things have cooled down.
It is the logical conclusion affirmed by the opening passage in the Treaty of Rome. It is no myth.
You may construe it that way. I do not. And looking at the policy of France, Germany, and the U.K. within the EU over the last decade or so - neither do they.
Happily what you construe is of only incidental interest
To quote Sir Thomas More
The world must construe according to its wits; this court must construe according to the law.
Your Brexiteering Utopia has very little chance of becoming reality. Hopefully you realise this before we 48 percenters are consigned to the Tower!
You lost.
We all lost.
Labour especially and particularly Corbyn.
British politics is two tramps fighting over the dregs in a can of Stella. The winner later discovers the dregs are piss.
Enjoy your victory.
It must be sad to so hate your country and everything it stands for.
I love my country. I hate it being trashed.
Its not being trashed - except by people like you describing it as a can of piss.
But thankfully in this day and age there are plenty of resources to use to show that they are being dishonest - just as happened to Unilever today.
I sometimes think that even after 20 years or more of the internet and information on demand (even if it does need to be filtered through a haze of misinformation at times) governments and corporations still haven't got the new reality yet.
By the way, your premise that the EU has a logical conclusion through dissolution of the nation state is a sad, Brexit myth. It doesn't stand up to reason, or the facts.
No it is not. When has the EU ever stopped seeking to centralise more and more power to itself, and when has it tolerated any meaningful moves to return competences to member states? The commitment to ever closer union is enshrined in the Treaty of Rome and taken very seriously.
Besides, it won't let go of the Euro for love nor money, and that alone requires a federal treasury accountable to a federal government to make it work.
The Comission, like all bureaucracies, will always try to centralise more power. Separately, the nation states have consistently found more things to cooperate on.
But this is not the same thing as nation states dissolving themselves. Indeed, in the tussle between nation states and the Commission, the former do come out on top.
I'm certainly not saying EU governance is perfect - far from! - but the idea that it is a one way traffic to supranational serfdom is simply wrong. And very dangerous; it creates a mythical monster against which we are seem willing to sacrifice actual prosperity.
It isn't wrong. It is the basic raison d'etre of the EU. It is written right there in the treaties and is confirmed each time the ECJ makes a decision based on those treaties. It was the openly stated aim of the founders of the EEC and has continued to be the basic direction of travel for the EEC/EU over the last 40 years.
Nope. What Monnet may have dreamt is pretty irrelevant 60 years on. Let's play realpolitik, please. If you can point to an instance where the ECJ has ruled for the dissolution of a sovereign entity by reference to the preamble of the a Treaty of Rome, I will gladly reconsider.
A stupid request since you don't dissolve a sovereign state overnight. What you do is slowly remove powers from the state and transfer them to the supra national entity. And when the states object you use the ECJ to overrule them. Now can anyone think of an example where that has been happening for the last 50 years or so?
Well, you can. I just see a political construct which we, as a sovereign nation and signatory, can attempt to influence - or not.
As it is, two of the EU's finest achievements - maybe THE two achievements: the single market and east European enlargement - were British initiatives. You can add the ECHR to that although not part of the EU machinery per se.
Trump: "This is our moment of reckoning as a society, and as a civilisation. I didn't need to do this. Believe me. (...) I'm doing it because this country has given me so much (...) and I feel so strongly that it's my turn to give back to the country that I love."
"In my former life, I was an insider (...) Now I'm being punished for leaving the special club and revealing to you the terrible things that are going on."
"Because I used to be part of the club, I'm the only one who can fix it".
"The dark clouds hanging over our government can be lifted (...) It all depends on whether we let the corrupt media decide our future (...) or the American people decide our future"
Speech clealy written by Fargle.
Trump even said in the speech that 8 Nov would be "independence day".
It is the logical conclusion affirmed by the opening passage in the Treaty of Rome. It is no myth.
You may construe it that way. I do not. And looking at the policy of France, Germany, and the U.K. within the EU over the last decade or so - neither do they.
Happily what you construe is of only incidental interest
To quote Sir Thomas More
The world must construe according to its wits; this court must construe according to the law.
Your Brexiteering Utopia has very little chance of becoming reality. Hopefully you realise this before we 48 percenters are consigned to the Tower!
You lost.
We all lost.
No, 52% of us won.
Leave won a Pyrrhic victory that will destroy their case morally, intellectually and economically in the fullness of time.
It is the logical conclusion affirmed by the opening passage in the Treaty of Rome. It is no myth.
You may construe it that way. I do not. And looking at the policy of France, Germany, and the U.K. within the EU over the last decade or so - neither do they.
Happily what you construe is of only incidental interest
To quote Sir Thomas More
The world must construe according to its wits; this court must construe according to the law.
Your Brexiteering Utopia has very little chance of becoming reality. Hopefully you realise this before we 48 percenters are consigned to the Tower!
You lost.
We all lost.
Not at all. Proudest day of my life.
Disappointing to see you've bought into the Remain camp wholesale.
The way Brexit is playing out is hugely upsetting. The way May and Rudd played it last week was hugely damaging. I am very angry.
.
Mrs May clearly did this to Remainers at the Tory Conference:
It is the logical conclusion affirmed by the opening passage in the Treaty of Rome. It is no myth.
You may construe it that way. I do not. And looking at the policy of France, Germany, and the U.K. within the EU over the last decade or so - neither do they.
Happily what you construe is of only incidental interest
To quote Sir Thomas More
The world must construe according to its wits; this court must construe according to the law.
Your Brexiteering Utopia has very little chance of becoming reality. Hopefully you realise this before we 48 percenters are consigned to the Tower!
You lost.
We all lost.
Not at all. Proudest day of my life.
Disappointing to see you've bought into the Remain camp wholesale.
The way Brexit is playing out is hugely upsetting. The way May and Rudd played it last week was hugely damaging. I am very angry.
I should not have to explain to friends it's safe to visit the UK.
You must live in a very strange little bubble. I can safely say that I have not had to apologise to or reassure a single non British friend or colleague since the referendum.
By the way, your premise that the EU has a logical conclusion through dissolution of the nation state is a sad, Brexit myth. It doesn't stand up to reason, or the facts.
No it is not. When has the EU ever stopped seeking to centralise more and more power to itself, and when has it tolerated any meaningful moves to return competences to member states? The commitment to ever closer union is enshrined in the Treaty of Rome and taken very seriously.
Besides, it won't let go of the Euro for love nor money, and that alone requires a federal treasury accountable to a federal government to make it work.
The Comission, like all bureaucracies, will always try to centralise more power. Separately, the nation states have consistently found more things to cooperate on.
But this is not the same thing as nation states dissolving themselves. Indeed, in the tussle between nation states and the Commission, the former do come out on top.
I'm certainly not saying EU governance is perfect - far from! - but the idea that it is a one way traffic to supranational serfdom is simply wrong. And very dangerous; it creates a mythical monster against which we are seem willing to sacrifice actual prosperity.
It isn't wrong. It is the basic raison d'etre of the EU. It is written right there in the treaties and is confirmed each time the ECJ makes a decision based on those treaties. It was the openly stated aim of the founders of the EEC and has continued to be the basic direction of travel for the EEC/EU over the last 40 years.
Nope. What Monnet may have dreamt is pretty irrelevant 60 years on. Let's play realpolitik, please. If you can point to an instance where the ECJ has ruled for the dissolution of a sovereign entity by reference to the preamble of the a Treaty of Rome, I will gladly reconsider.
A stupid request since you don't dissolve a sovereign state overnight. What you do is slowly remove powers from the state and transfer them to the supra national entity. And when the states object you use the ECJ to overrule them. Now can anyone think of an example where that has been happening for the last 50 years or so?
Well, you can. I just see a political construct which we, as a sovereign nation and signatory, can attempt to influence - or not.
As it is, two of the EU's finest achievements - maybe THE two achievements: the single market and east European enlargement - were British initiatives. You can add the ECHR to that although not part of the EU machinery per se.
It is the logical conclusion affirmed by the opening passage in the Treaty of Rome. It is no myth.
You may construe it that way. I do not. And looking at the policy of France, Germany, and the U.K. within the EU over the last decade or so - neither do they.
Happily what you construe is of only incidental interest
To quote Sir Thomas More
The world must construe according to its wits; this court must construe according to the law.
Your Brexiteering Utopia has very little chance of becoming reality. Hopefully you realise this before we 48 percenters are consigned to the Tower!
You lost.
We all lost.
Not at all. Proudest day of my life.
Disappointing to see you've bought into the Remain camp wholesale.
The way Brexit is playing out is hugely upsetting. The way May and Rudd played it last week was hugely damaging. I am very angry.
I should not have to explain to friends it's safe to visit the UK.
It is the logical conclusion affirmed by the opening passage in the Treaty of Rome. It is no myth.
You may construe it that way. I do not. And looking at the policy of France, Germany, and the U.K. within the EU over the last decade or so - neither do they.
Happily what you construe is of only incidental interest
To quote Sir Thomas More
The world must construe according to its wits; this court must construe according to the law.
Your Brexiteering Utopia has very little chance of becoming reality. Hopefully you realise this before we 48 percenters are consigned to the Tower!
You lost.
We all lost.
No, 52% of us won.
Leave won a Pyrrhic victory that will destroy their case morally, intellectually and economically in the fullness of time.
It is the logical conclusion affirmed by the opening passage in the Treaty of Rome. It is no myth.
You may construe it that way. I do not. And looking at the policy of France, Germany, and the U.K. within the EU over the last decade or so - neither do they.
Happily what you construe is of only incidental interest
To quote Sir Thomas More
The world must construe according to its wits; this court must construe according to the law.
Your Brexiteering Utopia has very little chance of becoming reality. Hopefully you realise this before we 48 percenters are consigned to the Tower!
You lost.
We all lost.
No, 52% of us won.
I thing we can all agree than everyone won except 3 people:
It is the logical conclusion affirmed by the opening passage in the Treaty of Rome. It is no myth.
You may construe it that way. I do not. And looking at the policy of France, Germany, and the U.K. within the EU over the last decade or so - neither do they.
Happily what you construe is of only incidental interest
To quote Sir Thomas More
The world must construe according to its wits; this court must construe according to the law.
Your Brexiteering Utopia has very little chance of becoming reality. Hopefully you realise this before we 48 percenters are consigned to the Tower!
You lost.
We all lost.
Not at all. Proudest day of my life.
Disappointing to see you've bought into the Remain camp wholesale.
The way Brexit is playing out is hugely upsetting. The way May and Rudd played it last week was hugely damaging. I am very angry.
.
Mrs May clearly did this to Remainers at the Tory Conference:
But thankfully in this day and age there are plenty of resources to use to show that they are being dishonest - just as happened to Unilever today.
I sometimes think that even after 20 years or more of the internet and information on demand (even if it does need to be filtered through a haze of misinformation at times) governments and corporations still haven't got the new reality yet.
It is the logical conclusion affirmed by the opening passage in the Treaty of Rome. It is no myth.
You may construe it that way. I do not. And looking at the policy of France, Germany, and the U.K. within the EU over the last decade or so - neither do they.
Happily what you construe is of only incidental interest
To quote Sir Thomas More
The world must construe according to its wits; this court must construe according to the law.
Your Brexiteering Utopia has very little chance of becoming reality. Hopefully you realise this before we 48 percenters are consigned to the Tower!
You lost.
We all lost.
No, 52% of us won.
I thing we can all agree than everyone won except 3 people:
It is the logical conclusion affirmed by the opening passage in the Treaty of Rome. It is no myth.
You may construe it that way. I do not. And looking at the policy of France, Germany, and the U.K. within the EU over the last decade or so - neither do they.
Happily what you construe is of only incidental interest
To quote Sir Thomas More
The world must construe according to its wits; this court must construe according to the law.
Your Brexiteering Utopia has very little chance of becoming reality. Hopefully you realise this before we 48 percenters are consigned to the Tower!
You lost.
We all lost.
No, 52% of us won.
Leave won a Pyrrhic victory that will destroy their case morally, intellectually and economically in the fullness of time.
It is the logical conclusion affirmed by the opening passage in the Treaty of Rome. It is no myth.
You may construe it that way. I do not. And looking at the policy of France, Germany, and the U.K. within the EU over the last decade or so - neither do they.
Happily what you construe is of only incidental interest
To quote Sir Thomas More
The world must construe according to its wits; this court must construe according to the law.
Your Brexiteering Utopia has very little chance of becoming reality. Hopefully you realise this before we 48 percenters are consigned to the Tower!
You lost.
We all lost.
Not at all. Proudest day of my life.
Disappointing to see you've bought into the Remain camp wholesale.
The way Brexit is playing out is hugely upsetting. The way May and Rudd played it last week was hugely damaging. I am very angry.
I should not have to explain to friends it's safe to visit the UK.
I can see you're angry. But it's still the same old Britain. The trouble is that Brexit is such a big event that any, and every, development can (and is) being directly attributed to it; it sells copy, and no news story can be overexaggerated.
You can unpick virtually everything by looking at the detail; from the total non-story of marmitegate to so-called "surges" in hate crime.
I expect we have a very bumpy ride ahead of us for the next 3 years.
George Eaton ✔ @georgeeaton EU president Donald Tusk: “The only real alternative to a hard Brexit is no Brexit." Europe's political priority is to avoid "soft" deal.
George Eaton ✔ @georgeeaton EU president Donald Tusk: “The only real alternative to a hard Brexit is no Brexit." Europe's political priority is to avoid "soft" deal.
Of course. He speaks the truth.
There is Real Brexit or eternal subservience.
I suspect that May will win a very substantial majority on a platform of Real Brexit in a general election next year. I also suspect that she is going to do things much more sharply than either the EU or SNP will be able to cope with. There is little point giving the initiative to them.
It is the logical conclusion affirmed by the opening passage in the Treaty of Rome. It is no myth.
You may construe it that way. I do not. And looking at the policy of France, Germany, and the U.K. within the EU over the last decade or so - neither do they.
Happily what you construe is of only incidental interest
To quote Sir Thomas More
The world must construe according to its wits; this court must construe according to the law.
Your Brexiteering Utopia has very little chance of becoming reality. Hopefully you realise this before we 48 percenters are consigned to the Tower!
You lost.
We all lost.
Not at all. Proudest day of my life.
Disappointing to see you've bought into the Remain camp wholesale.
The way Brexit is playing out is hugely upsetting. The way May and Rudd played it last week was hugely damaging. I am very angry.
.
Mrs May clearly did this to Remainers at the Tory Conference:
Struggling to follow. Does that mean Brexiters are sitting in their armchairs shouting "I love my brick"?
If so, you're spot on.
No the remainers were just starting to quieten down when they tripped over and then got hit on the head by Mrs May wielding brick (tripping oved the brick being a metaphor for Article 50 by March 31st followed by Brexit Means hard Brexit when she metaphorically threw the brick at them)
It is the logical conclusion affirmed by the opening passage in the Treaty of Rome. It is no myth.
You may construe it that way. I do not. And looking at the policy of France, Germany, and the U.K. within the EU over the last decade or so - neither do they.
Happily what you construe is of only incidental interest
To quote Sir Thomas More
The world must construe according to its wits; this court must construe according to the law.
Your Brexiteering Utopia has very little chance of becoming reality. Hopefully you realise this before we 48 percenters are consigned to the Tower!
You lost.
We all lost.
Labour especially and particularly Corbyn.
British politics is two tramps fighting over the dregs in a can of Stella. The winner later discovers the dregs are piss.
George Eaton ✔ @georgeeaton EU president Donald Tusk: “The only real alternative to a hard Brexit is no Brexit." Europe's political priority is to avoid "soft" deal.
Think I might have mentioned it once of twice over the past six months At this stage and after the promises made at the CPC the "No BrExit" option would result in pitchforks in the street which means eventually it's hard BrExit. That being the case is there any merit in pissing around with it for two years ?
It is the logical conclusion affirmed by the opening passage in the Treaty of Rome. It is no myth.
You may construe it that way. I do not. And looking at the policy of France, Germany, and the U.K. within the EU over the last decade or so - neither do they.
Happily what you construe is of only incidental interest
To quote Sir Thomas More
The world must construe according to its wits; this court must construe according to the law.
Your Brexiteering Utopia has very little chance of becoming reality. Hopefully you realise this before we 48 percenters are consigned to the Tower!
You lost.
We all lost.
Not at all. Proudest day of my life.
Disappointing to see you've bought into the Remain camp wholesale.
The way Brexit is playing out is hugely upsetting. The way May and Rudd played it last week was hugely damaging. I am very angry.
I should not have to explain to friends it's safe to visit the UK.
You must live in a very strange little bubble. I can safely say that I have not had to apologise to or reassure a single non British friend or colleague since the referendum.
I have had to reassure non-British employees. Only natural to be concerned when your residency status becomes a political football (this is independent of the argument for or against Brexit though).
It is the logical conclusion affirmed by the opening passage in the Treaty of Rome. It is no myth.
You may construe it that way. I do not. And looking at the policy of France, Germany, and the U.K. within the EU over the last decade or so - neither do they.
Happily what you construe is of only incidental interest
To quote Sir Thomas More
The world must construe according to its wits; this court must construe according to the law.
Your Brexiteering Utopia has very little chance of becoming reality. Hopefully you realise this before we 48 percenters are consigned to the Tower!
You lost.
We all lost.
Labour especially and particularly Corbyn.
British politics is two tramps fighting over the dregs in a can of Stella. The winner later discovers the dregs are piss.
Enjoy your victory.
I'm certainly enjoying our victory.
A surprising number of people seem to think the EU is our lifeline and, if we cut the umbilical cord linking us to it, the whole UK economy will collapse.
In reality, the worst that happens according to the most contorted Osbornomics available is (apart from the short-term disruption) that we grow slightly more slowly than we might have done had we stayed.
You have to feel sorry for right wing women. They are apparently living in a culture where it's normal behaviour for men to: - brag about groping women without permission - walk in on 15 year olds while they are naked - insert their genitals into a dead pig's mouth
And before anyone denies one of those, remember we are talking about what right wing women have defended as normal behaviour, not whether the accounts were accurate or not.
You have to feel sorry for right wing women. They are apparently living in a culture where it's normal behaviour for men to: - brag about groping women without permission - walk in on 15 year olds while they are naked - insert their genitals into a dead pig's mouth
And before anyone denies one of those, remember we are talking about what right wing women have defended as normal behaviour, not whether the accounts were accurate or not.
Remind me again, which parties have never elected a female leader?
It is the logical conclusion affirmed by the opening passage in the Treaty of Rome. It is no myth.
You may construe it that way. I do not. And looking at the policy of France, Germany, and the U.K. within the EU over the last decade or so - neither do they.
Happily what you construe is of only incidental interest
To quote Sir Thomas More
The world must construe according to its wits; this court must construe according to the law.
Your Brexiteering Utopia has very little chance of becoming reality. Hopefully you realise this before we 48 percenters are consigned to the Tower!
You lost.
We all lost.
No, 52% of us won.
Leave won a Pyrrhic victory that will destroy their case morally, intellectually and economically in the fullness of time.
Keep dreaming William.
One of the first casualties is your integrity given your prior vehement advocacy of the EEA option.
You have to feel sorry for right wing women. They are apparently living in a culture where it's normal behaviour for men to: - brag about groping women without permission - walk in on 15 year olds while they are naked - insert their genitals into a dead pig's mouth And before anyone denies one of those, remember we are talking about what right wing women have defended as normal behaviour, not whether the accounts were accurate or not.
The right wing women in my life get treated like queens and princesses and know where to deliver a verbal or physical blow if any scumbags take liberties.
Massive cheers to Jessica Ennis Hill. A better role model for modern Britain would be very hard to find. She had my vote for Spoty in 12 and 15 and will have it again this year. You were fab Jess!
And jeers to Tesco. If the anglish poond drops by more than 15%, prices are going to go up. Period. I noticed petrol was up by 2p at my local BP on the way home. This is the cost of taking back control.
We already knew that every unpopular decision would be blamed on the Leave vote, whether or not it had anything to do with it. A 10% price rise on a product made entirely within the UK has nothing at all to do with it...
Marmite's the tip of the iceberg. Dream On! Inflationary pressure is now here.
As Mervyn King told us a couple of days ago he had been trying to get higher interest rates and inflation for three years as Bank of England policy, and now we are suppose to believe this is a bad thing ?
Monksfield:
As someone who doesn't actually live here I don't expect you'll get these things but once ordinary people are paying more to live, particularly on their mortgages if interest rates rise, and as always happens in the UK wages run behind, then they'll not have a great deal of time for Mervyn King or his view of inflation.
Indigo:
As someone not intimately acquainted with my personal affairs you have no idea who or what I am paying for in the UK so perhaps we can avoid badly informed personal comments ?
Let me see if I have this straight, Carney supposed Remain, he's a good chap, King supported Leave, he's satan ? Both did the same job for the same government for three years.
Monksfield:
You didn't get anything straight because you didn't respond to my point. We are going to have inflation and ordinary people will suffer most. The inflation is being driven by Brexit.
King and Carney are both irrelevant, I don't give a monkeys dongle about either of them, although I thought the recent drop in interest rates instigated by the latter was frankly idiotic. My personal view is that a return to higher interest rates is long overdue but I don't pretend that won't hurt many of my compatriots.
You have to feel sorry for right wing women. They are apparently living in a culture where it's normal behaviour for men to: - brag about groping women without permission - walk in on 15 year olds while they are naked - insert their genitals into a dead pig's mouth
And before anyone denies one of those, remember we are talking about what right wing women have defended as normal behaviour, not whether the accounts were accurate or not.
Remind me again, which parties have never elected a female leader?
So women should be free to be whatever they want as long as it's a sex object or Tory leader?
George Eaton ✔ @georgeeaton EU president Donald Tusk: “The only real alternative to a hard Brexit is no Brexit." Europe's political priority is to avoid "soft" deal.
Think I might have mentioned it once of twice over the past six months At this stage and after the promises made at the CPC the "No BrExit" option would result in pitchforks in the street which means eventually it's hard BrExit. That being the case is there any merit in pissing around with it for two years ?
Yes absolutely there is because we will get a hard Brexit with some form of trade deal. No negotiations and we get no deal at all.
George Eaton ✔ @georgeeaton EU president Donald Tusk: “The only real alternative to a hard Brexit is no Brexit." Europe's political priority is to avoid "soft" deal.
Think I might have mentioned it once of twice over the past six months At this stage and after the promises made at the CPC the "No BrExit" option would result in pitchforks in the street which means eventually it's hard BrExit. That being the case is there any merit in pissing around with it for two years ?
I am coming round to that view as well. The EU is probably incapable of rational actions that are in the best interest of itself and its members. Where is the reform proposal that a rational body would have started to table by now?
Comments
Clinton 44 .. Trump 36
https://luc.id/2016-presidential-tracker/
The fax democracy description of Norway is another one of those tags that doesn't really help. It takes on a load of single market regulation so that it can trade effectively. Doesn't mean its not a sovereign nation.
George Eaton ✔ @georgeeaton
EU president Donald Tusk: “The only real alternative to a hard Brexit is no Brexit." Europe's political priority is to avoid "soft" deal.
Rasmussen is a basket case. Apparently 24% AA are voting Trump ... who knew ?!? and to make the LA Times tracker viable, 538 have to add +5 to the Clinton score.
They showed him gaining during the Tape, and it's not a 7 day tracker, it's only a 2 day tracker so they have no excuse.
They don't seem to respond with events.
Enjoy your victory.
Disappointing to see you've bought into the Remain camp wholesale.
Edit: @SquareRoot OK, it was an obvious reply.
I should not have to explain to friends it's safe to visit the UK.
David Cameron, George Osborne, and TSE.
We are now in a world where instead of having to take responsibility for their actions, a prime reason for PB Leavers for voting Out, governments and corporates will blame anything bad on the EU.
My point is that bureaucracies do not devolve.
Politicians do however, as Blair did with the nations and Osborne tried to do with the metros.
'May be a hard Brexit is inevitable?
George Eaton ✔ @georgeeaton
EU president Donald Tusk: “The only real alternative to a hard Brexit is no Brexit." Europe's political priority is to avoid "soft" deal.'
So no need for endless time wasting debate in the HoC of soft v hard brexit,Tusk has clarified it for us.
I sometimes think that even after 20 years or more of the internet and information on demand (even if it does need to be filtered through a haze of misinformation at times) governments and corporations still haven't got the new reality yet.
The banana issue is far more complex than the absurdities of defining a banana that any trade agreement that covers bananas deals with.
https://www.theguardian.com/world/1999/mar/05/eu.wto3
Let me see if I have this straight, Carney supposed Remain, he's a good chap, King supported Leave, he's satan ? Both did the same job for the same government for three years.
As I said the EU is too emotional right now to react rationally, proper negotiations can only start after we leave the EU and things have cooled down.
I just see a political construct which we, as a sovereign nation and signatory, can attempt to influence - or not.
As it is, two of the EU's finest achievements - maybe THE two achievements: the single market and east European enlargement - were British initiatives. You can add the ECHR to that although not part of the EU machinery per se.
https://youtu.be/R1ZU6UMDfgY
Does that mean Brexiters are sitting in their armchairs shouting "I love my brick"?
If so, you're spot on.
You can unpick virtually everything by looking at the detail; from the total non-story of marmitegate to so-called "surges" in hate crime.
I expect we have a very bumpy ride ahead of us for the next 3 years.
"There is no alternative!"
There is Real Brexit or eternal subservience.
I suspect that May will win a very substantial majority on a platform of Real Brexit in a general election next year. I also suspect that she is going to do things much more sharply than either the EU or SNP will be able to cope with. There is little point giving the initiative to them.
:-)
Only natural to be concerned when your residency status becomes a political football (this is independent of the argument for or against Brexit though).
In reality, the worst that happens according to the most contorted Osbornomics available is (apart from the short-term disruption) that we grow slightly more slowly than we might have done had we stayed.
- brag about groping women without permission
- walk in on 15 year olds while they are naked
- insert their genitals into a dead pig's mouth
And before anyone denies one of those, remember we are talking about what right wing women have defended as normal behaviour, not whether the accounts were accurate or not.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-37650234
Fasal IslamScottP (re)tweeting about it.What does Pasty_Scott do for a living?
Behind 2 doors is a Fasal Islam tweet and behind the other is a ScottP re(tweet)...You pick a door and the host asks if you want stick or switch...
Answer...Doesn't matter, you get the same answer whichever door is opened.
Clinton 45 .. Trump 39
http://www.ktnv.com/news/ralston/heck-hanging-onto-lead-trump-falling-behind-in-new-gop-poll
As someone who doesn't actually live here I don't expect you'll get these things but once ordinary people are paying more to live, particularly on their mortgages if interest rates rise, and as always happens in the UK wages run behind, then they'll not have a great deal of time for Mervyn King or his view of inflation.
Indigo:
As someone not intimately acquainted with my personal affairs you have no idea who or what I am paying for in the UK so perhaps we can avoid badly informed personal comments ?
Let me see if I have this straight, Carney supposed Remain, he's a good chap, King supported Leave, he's satan ? Both did the same job for the same government for three years.
Monksfield:
You didn't get anything straight because you didn't respond to my point. We are going to have inflation and ordinary people will suffer most. The inflation is being driven by Brexit.
King and Carney are both irrelevant, I don't give a monkeys dongle about either of them, although I thought the recent drop in interest rates instigated by the latter was frankly idiotic. My personal view is that a return to higher interest rates is long overdue but I don't pretend that won't hurt many of my compatriots.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3836773/Armed-keepers-chase-Gorilla-escaped-London-Zoo.html