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politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » Ex-Treasury minister & Brexiter, Angela Leadsom, is having

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    Bob__SykesBob__Sykes Posts: 1,176

    Mr. Sykes, I'd urge you to consider the (sensible) arguments and vote the way you think is in the country's long term interests.

    The campaigns have been dire but the vote isn't about approving either of them, but the fate of the nation.

    Put in those terms, it probably has to be a cautious "safety first" - Remain.

    Or, as that implies an endorsement of BSIE's scare stories and Cameron's non-deal, perhaps "abstain and reluctantly hope for remain".
    Since Remain looks highly likely to win, the aim of the cautious voter should surely be to ensure it's a slim victory so as not to give the victors the cockiness to sign us up to everything going.
    Yes, that's a fair point. I had thought that if, as I assumed some months ago would be the case, Remain was streets ahead I would vote Leave as a "keep them in check" vote.

    But it looks to close for comfort, as things stand anyway....
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    SandyRentoolSandyRentool Posts: 20,617

    I honestly can't think of any Tory MP who seems fit to assume the mantle of PM when Cameron goes, other than (with great reluctance) Osborne or Boris.

    Cameron, Osborne and Boris are the only 3 big beasts in the Tory jungle. It has to be one of them.

    To be honest, assuming he survives next month's outcome, and despite how madly he has infuriated me at times over the past decade, I think the Tories' best hope is to persuade Cameron to do a u turn and win a third term in 2020....

    I think I would add May to the list of big beasts. However, I think a fresher face will be needed by the Tories for 2020, and one of the 2010 intake who has risen to ministerial office now / cabinet by 2018/19 may well be the right choice.
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    tpfkar said:

    On topic, this is a good call. Andrea Leadsom is quite local to me and she is well-regarded in the area as a hard working and credible MP. Who has enhanced their reputation by being part of the Leave Campaign? I'd suggest her, Dominic Raab, Gisela Stuart - and go no further.

    Oddly if I had to suggest the biggest traveller in the other direction, I'd go for Priti Patel. I'm struggling to understand why, but there's something about her views and the way she conducts herself that makes me very nervous about her having a prominent role in Government, even her current role. Is it just me?

    Not just you, I've done a piece for next week on Priti Patel that I'm sure some will call a hatchet job.
    She is quite fit though.
    I'm not that shallow. Ahem
    I am and it probably explains why I was one of Liz's 4%ers
  • Options
    MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 37,607

    Mr. Sykes, I'd urge you to consider the (sensible) arguments and vote the way you think is in the country's long term interests.

    The campaigns have been dire but the vote isn't about approving either of them, but the fate of the nation.

    Put in those terms, it probably has to be a cautious "safety first" - Remain.

    Or, as that implies an endorsement of BSIE's scare stories and Cameron's non-deal, perhaps "abstain and reluctantly hope for remain".
    A vote for remain is a vote for federalisation, it isn't a safety first approach. Unfortunately there isn't a safety first approach.
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    TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 114,456
    What About the Undecideds?

    Voters in the sample who initially told Survation they were undecided were then “squeezed” with the question:

    “If the referendum was today and you had to choose, would you Vote for the UK to leave the European Union / Vote for the UK to remain a member of the European Union, or would you not vote?”


    Some of these undecided respondents then stated their preference for leave or remain after this “squeeze” question. Adding back these respondents the initial leave/remain voting intention had the effect of a slight (1%) boost to the Remain figure:
  • Options
    Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 55,355

    Mr. Sykes, I'd urge you to consider the (sensible) arguments and vote the way you think is in the country's long term interests.

    The campaigns have been dire but the vote isn't about approving either of them, but the fate of the nation.

    Put in those terms, it probably has to be a cautious "safety first" - Remain.

    Or, as that implies an endorsement of BSIE's scare stories and Cameron's non-deal, perhaps "abstain and reluctantly hope for remain".
    Remain isn't a safe vote.

    A Leave vote would force a real and meaningful negotiation with the EU.
    Vote Leave in order to Remain?

    Nope. It could lead to an associate membership or to a brand new treaty. Politically it would have to address the key points of Leave.

    But it would be very different. You don't vote, you don't get.

    You do vote, you get the lot.
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    TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 114,456

    tpfkar said:

    On topic, this is a good call. Andrea Leadsom is quite local to me and she is well-regarded in the area as a hard working and credible MP. Who has enhanced their reputation by being part of the Leave Campaign? I'd suggest her, Dominic Raab, Gisela Stuart - and go no further.

    Oddly if I had to suggest the biggest traveller in the other direction, I'd go for Priti Patel. I'm struggling to understand why, but there's something about her views and the way she conducts herself that makes me very nervous about her having a prominent role in Government, even her current role. Is it just me?

    Not just you, I've done a piece for next week on Priti Patel that I'm sure some will call a hatchet job.
    She is quite fit though.
    I'm not that shallow. Ahem
    I am and it probably explains why I was one of Liz's 4%ers
    In that case you should have been backing Yvette Cooper.
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    TudorRoseTudorRose Posts: 1,662

    So.. why 18% DKs with Survation but only 3% with ORB?

    Something's not right here.

    ORB really do force the choice, the ones who are DK's are in fact WNVs
    No. The DK's in ORB are those who are 10/10 to vote but don't know which way. I know we are an awkward group but we do exist!
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    TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 114,456
    Next scheduled poll is Lord Ashcroft's 5,000 sample poll*, out tomorrow

    *Before anyone gets overexcited, the MOE on that poll is circa 1.5% as opposed to 3% for a 1,000 strong poll.
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    rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 54,001
    MaxPB said:

    I rate Andrea Leadsom highly.

    My view would be her as Chancellor, and Gove as Foreign Secretary, as a Brexit dream team.

    Won't happen. Chancellor is too big a jump and besides, unless you have a new PM, Cameron isn't going to leave Osborne without either other top three job.

    Leadsom at BIS would work.
    I disagree. I think she could do it. She has lots of talent, worked in the City, and has experience as economic secretary to the Treasury.

    BIS would be a bit of an insult, in my view.
    She's a junior minister at the Department of Energy and Climate Change. How on earth would a move to *any* cabinet post - never mind one probably more senior than her current department - be an insult?
    She has worked as Economic Secretary to the Treasury and in the City. She has shown leadership, competence and capability in her brief, and through her TV interviews, press articles and leadership of Fresh Start.

    She is only a junior minister because Osborne has artificially held her career back. And far more qualified for the role than he was with *no* government experience at all when he came to office in 2010, and just a modern history degree and life in politics.

    I see no reason why she shouldn't jump straight into that role and I think she'd do a bloody good job.
    'No' reason? I can think of several, both in terms of government experience and practical politics. I also think it'd be unfair on her to drop her into a position like that as the media scrutiny would be extremely intense following such a promotion and any failings would be magnified more than normal.

    It won't happen though. There are other, bigger, beasts who would have a claim on the Treasury were Osborne to be moved and while they might accept being passed over for one of their own, they'll kick up a fuss if they're all passed over - and Cameron is in a weak position to see off that sort of challenge.
    I would have Leadsom at BIS, Gove at No. 11 and demote Osborne.

    Additionally I would give Patel a promotion. Not sure what to do with Boris.
    I would make Boris Chairman of the Conservative Party. Ultimately, I don't think he's a good enough manager to take on a major ministerial role.
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    Bob__SykesBob__Sykes Posts: 1,176
    MaxPB said:

    Mr. Sykes, I'd urge you to consider the (sensible) arguments and vote the way you think is in the country's long term interests.

    The campaigns have been dire but the vote isn't about approving either of them, but the fate of the nation.

    Put in those terms, it probably has to be a cautious "safety first" - Remain.

    Or, as that implies an endorsement of BSIE's scare stories and Cameron's non-deal, perhaps "abstain and reluctantly hope for remain".
    A vote for remain is a vote for federalisation, it isn't a safety first approach. Unfortunately there isn't a safety first approach.
    The others can progress the federal project if they want. The UK won't be part of that - we'll either leave in the next 2 years after a Leave vote this year, or leave further down the line if the EU doesn't by then split into the federal "core" and the "associates" on the periphery.

    Cameron's deal offered us little, but it clearly put a marker down that the UK won't be frogmarched into a federal superstate.
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    Plato_SaysPlato_Says Posts: 11,822
    Oh dear

    British Airways boss hits back at claims that Brexit would raise air fares | via @telebusiness https://t.co/qRWjdUGmt2

    #Brexit best for UK
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    GIN1138GIN1138 Posts: 20,819
    Has Boy George really been given a pasting by Ms. Eagle? :smiley:
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    SandyRentoolSandyRentool Posts: 20,617
    TudorRose said:

    So.. why 18% DKs with Survation but only 3% with ORB?

    Something's not right here.

    ORB really do force the choice, the ones who are DK's are in fact WNVs
    No. The DK's in ORB are those who are 10/10 to vote but don't know which way. I know we are an awkward group but we do exist!
    Schrodinger's voters.
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    Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 25,454

    What About the Undecideds?

    Voters in the sample who initially told Survation they were undecided were then “squeezed” with the question:

    “If the referendum was today and you had to choose, would you Vote for the UK to leave the European Union / Vote for the UK to remain a member of the European Union, or would you not vote?”


    Some of these undecided respondents then stated their preference for leave or remain after this “squeeze” question. Adding back these respondents the initial leave/remain voting intention had the effect of a slight (1%) boost to the Remain figure:

    Can anyone, ANYONE, tell me why it's a good thing to try and squeeze undecided?
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    Scott_PScott_P Posts: 51,453
    GIN1138 said:

    Has Boy George really been given a pasting by Ms. Eagle? :smiley:

    No
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    taffystaffys Posts: 9,753

    Next scheduled poll is Lord Ashcroft's 5,000 sample poll*, out tomorrow

    *Before anyone gets overexcited, the MOE on that poll is circa 1.5% as opposed to 3% for a 1,000 strong poll.

    Aren't I right in saying the noble Lord's GE2015 polls did not cover themselves in glory?
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    GIN1138GIN1138 Posts: 20,819
    Scott_P said:

    GIN1138 said:

    Has Boy George really been given a pasting by Ms. Eagle? :smiley:

    No
    I think I'll wait for someone a little less "invested" than you to give their verdict, thanks. ;)
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    Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 25,454
    TudorRose said:

    So.. why 18% DKs with Survation but only 3% with ORB?

    Something's not right here.

    ORB really do force the choice, the ones who are DK's are in fact WNVs
    No. The DK's in ORB are those who are 10/10 to vote but don't know which way. I know we are an awkward group but we do exist!
    They do ask that squeeze question though, so surely that's the reason the result is so low, or at least part of it.
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    PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 75,929

    Next scheduled poll is Lord Ashcroft's 5,000 sample poll*, out tomorrow

    *Before anyone gets overexcited, the MOE on that poll is circa 1.5% as opposed to 3% for a 1,000 strong poll.

    Systematic bias is a far bigger issue than any MoE concern. It is obviously there in either the phone polls or the online polls, perhaps even both.
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    TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 114,456

    What About the Undecideds?

    Voters in the sample who initially told Survation they were undecided were then “squeezed” with the question:

    “If the referendum was today and you had to choose, would you Vote for the UK to leave the European Union / Vote for the UK to remain a member of the European Union, or would you not vote?”


    Some of these undecided respondents then stated their preference for leave or remain after this “squeeze” question. Adding back these respondents the initial leave/remain voting intention had the effect of a slight (1%) boost to the Remain figure:

    Can anyone, ANYONE, tell me why it's a good thing to try and squeeze undecided?
    Because we all love a good squeeze?

    I think the reality is, it is felt the DKs are a good indicator of how the campaigns are going.

    For example during the Indyref and AV Ref, DKs were breaking for the status quo, even when the status quo was just ahead or just behind.
  • Options
    TudorRoseTudorRose Posts: 1,662

    TudorRose said:

    So.. why 18% DKs with Survation but only 3% with ORB?

    Something's not right here.

    ORB really do force the choice, the ones who are DK's are in fact WNVs
    No. The DK's in ORB are those who are 10/10 to vote but don't know which way. I know we are an awkward group but we do exist!
    Schrodinger's voters.
    There's still a month to go and I could be persuaded either way (if any of the campaigns are interested in addressing the undecided voter rather than attacking each other or themselves). I do, however, believe that it's a really important decision and I don't want to blame myself later for not having had a say in the result.
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    RodCrosbyRodCrosby Posts: 7,737
    Sounds like Martinez is crossed off the Veep list...
    http://talkingpointsmemo.com/livewire/trump-susana-martinez-not-doing-job
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    TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 114,456
    taffys said:

    Next scheduled poll is Lord Ashcroft's 5,000 sample poll*, out tomorrow

    *Before anyone gets overexcited, the MOE on that poll is circa 1.5% as opposed to 3% for a 1,000 strong poll.

    Aren't I right in saying the noble Lord's GE2015 polls did not cover themselves in glory?
    His polls were his second most embarrassing output of 2015, his bio of Dave was the only thing worse than his polls.

    Remember the bouncy weekly polls?
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    Scott_PScott_P Posts: 51,453
    GIN1138 said:

    I think I'll wait for someone a little less "invested" than you to give their verdict, thanks. ;)

    @IanDunt: Eagle may be reaching a bit to highlight Tory splits over Brexit. Labour in no position to be pointing out other party's divisions.

    Sorry, lefty journalist

    @JGForsyth: Eagle's questions are too long now, mini-speeches which don't work as well as direct questions

    @PolhomeEditor: Labour MPs roared their approval of Angela Eagle at the start of #PMQs. Seem a bit subdued now.

    @PolhomeEditor: Osborne won that hands down IMHO #PMQs
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    Scott_PScott_P Posts: 51,453
    @michaelsavage: I think Angela Eagle just suffered from the #ExpectationGame. Osborne got through that unscathed. #PMQs
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    Scott_PScott_P Posts: 51,453
    @paulwaugh: Lots of glum Labour faces as Osborne waves the Labour's Future report in their faces.
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    Scott_PScott_P Posts: 51,453
    @SpecCoffeeHouse: PMQs: After a strong start, Angela Eagle lost her way https://t.co/HNI3jMEILn by @jgforsyth
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    taffystaffys Posts: 9,753

    taffys said:

    Next scheduled poll is Lord Ashcroft's 5,000 sample poll*, out tomorrow

    *Before anyone gets overexcited, the MOE on that poll is circa 1.5% as opposed to 3% for a 1,000 strong poll.

    Aren't I right in saying the noble Lord's GE2015 polls did not cover themselves in glory?
    His polls were his second most embarrassing output of 2015, his bio of Dave was the only thing worse than his polls.

    Remember the bouncy weekly polls?
    Yes. I'm sure it will be interesting, anyhoo.
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    JonnyJimmyJonnyJimmy Posts: 2,548
    Research Director at the IFS?

    Professor Orazio Pietro Attanasio

    I wonder if he might be a Remainer?
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    foxinsoxukfoxinsoxuk Posts: 23,548
    A big positive as far as I am concerned!

    I would much rather have a diet of Scandanavian Noir, Spanish Cinema and even German comedy to the cast offs of middle american pap. I don't mind a bit of that stuff but I do want variety.

    Too often we get the choice of dozens of identical programmes with only an illusion of choice.
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    Plato_SaysPlato_Says Posts: 11,822
    taffys said:

    taffys said:

    Next scheduled poll is Lord Ashcroft's 5,000 sample poll*, out tomorrow

    *Before anyone gets overexcited, the MOE on that poll is circa 1.5% as opposed to 3% for a 1,000 strong poll.

    Aren't I right in saying the noble Lord's GE2015 polls did not cover themselves in glory?
    His polls were his second most embarrassing output of 2015, his bio of Dave was the only thing worse than his polls.

    Remember the bouncy weekly polls?
    Yes. I'm sure it will be interesting, anyhoo.
    He was treated like a polling God on here.
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    Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 55,355
    TudorRose said:

    TudorRose said:

    So.. why 18% DKs with Survation but only 3% with ORB?

    Something's not right here.

    ORB really do force the choice, the ones who are DK's are in fact WNVs
    No. The DK's in ORB are those who are 10/10 to vote but don't know which way. I know we are an awkward group but we do exist!
    Schrodinger's voters.
    There's still a month to go and I could be persuaded either way (if any of the campaigns are interested in addressing the undecided voter rather than attacking each other or themselves). I do, however, believe that it's a really important decision and I don't want to blame myself later for not having had a say in the result.
    May I humbly suggest my blog, Mr.Rose? https://royaleleseaux.wordpress.com/2016/05/22/eu-referendum-the-choice/
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    foxinsoxukfoxinsoxuk Posts: 23,548

    Research Director at the IFS?

    Professor Orazio Pietro Attanasio

    I wonder if he might be a Remainer?

    He doesn't wear a tinfoil hat or have swivelling eyes, so definitely not a Leaver.
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    Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 55,355

    taffys said:

    Next scheduled poll is Lord Ashcroft's 5,000 sample poll*, out tomorrow

    *Before anyone gets overexcited, the MOE on that poll is circa 1.5% as opposed to 3% for a 1,000 strong poll.

    Aren't I right in saying the noble Lord's GE2015 polls did not cover themselves in glory?
    His polls were his second most embarrassing output of 2015, his bio of Dave was the only thing worse than his polls.

    Remember the bouncy weekly polls?
    I was shocked at how childish and vitriolic it is.

    Sign of a petulant man, I'm afraid.
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    williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 48,071
    RodCrosby said:

    Sounds like Martinez is crossed off the Veep list...
    http://talkingpointsmemo.com/livewire/trump-susana-martinez-not-doing-job

    There was an interesting interview with real estate mogul Barbara Corcoran on CNN a few days ago endorsing Clinton but saying she has absolutely no doubt that Trump will win.
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    Scott_PScott_P Posts: 51,453
    @fx_compared: Less than half of #Britons now worried about #Brexit’s risk to the pound https://t.co/1dGKd0iFiF https://t.co/e1UOrqsAqB
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    TGOHFTGOHF Posts: 21,633
    New Speccie cover - lying toad GO as Pinocchio


    https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CjTfP3fXAAAC0CV.jpg

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    chestnutchestnut Posts: 7,341
    taffys said:

    taffys said:

    Next scheduled poll is Lord Ashcroft's 5,000 sample poll*, out tomorrow

    *Before anyone gets overexcited, the MOE on that poll is circa 1.5% as opposed to 3% for a 1,000 strong poll.

    Aren't I right in saying the noble Lord's GE2015 polls did not cover themselves in glory?
    His polls were his second most embarrassing output of 2015, his bio of Dave was the only thing worse than his polls.

    Remember the bouncy weekly polls?
    Yes. I'm sure it will be interesting, anyhoo.
    Labour supporters hated Ashcroft's polls because they usually put the Tories ahead, and by some distance, from January 2015.

    If anything, they were ahead of the curve.
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    taffystaffys Posts: 9,753
    http://linkis.com/www.cityam.com/24173/cMDLz

    For all those interested in Leadsom, this is her recent article in City am.
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    MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 37,607

    The others can progress the federal project if they want. The UK won't be part of that - we'll either leave in the next 2 years after a Leave vote this year, or leave further down the line if the EU doesn't by then split into the federal "core" and the "associates" on the periphery.

    Cameron's deal offered us little, but it clearly put a marker down that the UK won't be frogmarched into a federal superstate.

    Major and Blair said the same, even Brown tried to say he'd "protected" us in his Lisbon negotiations. Each time our politicians have said we have been protected or opted-out of the political union, and in turn the ECJ has over-ruled our opt-outs of the political union. This new opt-out will be no different to the Major's opt-out or Blair's rebate giveaway or Brown's "protections" for the City.

    This is how it happens:

    The EU proposes a treaty which creates an EU treasury, EU taxation and allows the EU to oversee military co-operation between EU member states. These all apply only to EMU nations, as part of Dave's deal the UK government can't veto this treaty because they have limited it to EMU only. The treaty is ratified. The EU passes a whole raft of tax collection and spending laws and begins operating essentially as the government of bloc, taxing, spending and setting "domestic" policy on where the funds should be spent. We are now in the EU state, but have no say in the governance and policy of it since we aren't in the EMU, we are completely and utterly irrelevant, yet we still contribute to the EU budget through our direct contribution.

    At this point it is put up or shut up time, do we leave or do we go all in? The campaign will be exactly the same as this one, except project fear will be multiplied by 10, leave will result in Britain being left out in the cold forever, the world is moving to large nation blocs and the UK must be part of this one to make our voice heard etc...

    We must avert this by voting to leave today. As I said, neither leave nor remain are safe options, however, with Remain I can't see anything other than another referendum in which the British public are browbeaten by the establishment into voting to become a full part of the EU state.
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    Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 25,454

    Research Director at the IFS?

    Professor Orazio Pietro Attanasio

    I wonder if he might be a Remainer?

    He doesn't wear a tinfoil hat or have swivelling eyes, so definitely not a Leaver.
    Or a certain pb poster sniffing out reds under the bed.
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    RodCrosbyRodCrosby Posts: 7,737
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    JonnyJimmyJonnyJimmy Posts: 2,548

    Research Director at the IFS?

    Professor Orazio Pietro Attanasio

    I wonder if he might be a Remainer?

    He doesn't wear a tinfoil hat or have swivelling eyes, so definitely not a Leaver.
    And I don't think a Leaver would be elected Vice President of the European Economic Association (October 2011 – to serve as president in 2014).
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    logical_songlogical_song Posts: 9,721
    So presumably he's still doing it, but for the other side.
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    SouthamObserverSouthamObserver Posts: 38,937

    Oh dear

    British Airways boss hits back at claims that Brexit would raise air fares | via @telebusiness https://t.co/qRWjdUGmt2

    #Brexit best for UK

    It would not raise BA air fares because the company works to a different business model and as a result its fares are more expensive anyway.

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    glwglw Posts: 9,549

    A big positive as far as I am concerned!

    I would much rather have a diet of Scandanavian Noir, Spanish Cinema and even German comedy to the cast offs of middle american pap. I don't mind a bit of that stuff but I do want variety.

    Too often we get the choice of dozens of identical programmes with only an illusion of choice.

    If people actually wanted to "have a diet of Scandanavian Noir, Spanish Cinema and even German comedy" the likes of Netflix would provide it. Netflix would have no trouble licensing such "entertainment" and can easily afford to do so.

    Netflix unlike the European Commission has a huge amount of data, maybe more than any other organisation on Earth, which reveals what people really want to watch. They take that data and use it to select the programmes they license and produce. Apparently the European Commission thinks it knows Netflix's customers better than Netflix, I doubt that they are correct.
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    Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 49,311
    It's been a while since we had Cross-over on PB :lol:
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    TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 114,456
    The Director General of the WTO will be coming to London in early June and explain why Brexit is bad for the UK.
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    taffystaffys Posts: 9,753

    The Director General of the WTO will be coming to London in early June and explain why Brexit is bad for the UK.

    First class flight? five star hotel? Funded by....???
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    PolruanPolruan Posts: 2,083
    glw said:

    A big positive as far as I am concerned!

    I would much rather have a diet of Scandanavian Noir, Spanish Cinema and even German comedy to the cast offs of middle american pap. I don't mind a bit of that stuff but I do want variety.

    Too often we get the choice of dozens of identical programmes with only an illusion of choice.

    If people actually wanted to "have a diet of Scandanavian Noir, Spanish Cinema and even German comedy" the likes of Netflix would provide it. Netflix would have no trouble licensing such "entertainment" and can easily afford to do so.

    Netflix unlike the European Commission has a huge amount of data, maybe more than any other organisation on Earth, which reveals what people really want to watch. They take that data and use it to select the programmes they license and produce. Apparently the European Commission thinks it knows Netflix's customers better than Netflix, I doubt that they are correct.
    Netflix also carry a lot of content because it's cheap, and don't carry a lot because it's expensive/exclusive. Some of their crap stuff is watched because it's there and presumably most of their data about what people "want" to watch is actually what people choose to watch from the limited selection available on Netflix.

    If you locked hungry people in KFC for a week, the consumption data wouldn't prove that fried chicken was what they really wanted to eat.
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    TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 114,456

    NEW THREAD NEW THREAD

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    foxinsoxukfoxinsoxuk Posts: 23,548
    glw said:

    A big positive as far as I am concerned!

    I would much rather have a diet of Scandanavian Noir, Spanish Cinema and even German comedy to the cast offs of middle american pap. I don't mind a bit of that stuff but I do want variety.

    Too often we get the choice of dozens of identical programmes with only an illusion of choice.

    If people actually wanted to "have a diet of Scandanavian Noir, Spanish Cinema and even German comedy" the likes of Netflix would provide it. Netflix would have no trouble licensing such "entertainment" and can easily afford to do so.

    Netflix unlike the European Commission has a huge amount of data, maybe more than any other organisation on Earth, which reveals what people really want to watch. They take that data and use it to select the programmes they license and produce. Apparently the European Commission thinks it knows Netflix's customers better than Netflix, I doubt that they are correct.
    Its not that they know the audience better, just that they do not want the bad driving out the good. Europe has a fascinating and rich cultural history which I do not want to be steamrollered by middle american schmalz. There is plenty of room for that in the other 80% of programming.

    Virtually all nations support local cultural activities, and ensuring a wider audience for these is a good thing. Our own government does it outside the EU and even Leicester City Council does it for local programmes.

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    Scott_PScott_P Posts: 51,453
    @faisalislam: WTO boss: "pretty much all" UK global trade has to be negotiated post Brexit. Brits "will have to pay" £9bn tariffs: https://t.co/bdhF0cxE6u
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    foxinsoxukfoxinsoxuk Posts: 23,548

    It's been a while since we had Cross-over on PB :lol:
    Aren't you leading the cultural wave on this issue?

    Who wants to Leave home, when they can Remain in the busom of their family ;-)
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    MP_SEMP_SE Posts: 3,642

    A big positive as far as I am concerned!

    I would much rather have a diet of Scandanavian Noir, Spanish Cinema and even German comedy to the cast offs of middle american pap. I don't mind a bit of that stuff but I do want variety.

    Too often we get the choice of dozens of identical programmes with only an illusion of choice.
    Europhiles seem to favour protectionist and nanny state policies. Mandatory quotas on what the likes of Netflix have to show will not drive up standards.

    If you want to watch trendy Scandinavian noir there is nothing stopping you from buying a DVD or signing up to a streaming service that does offer it.
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    anothernickanothernick Posts: 3,578
    Pulpstar said:

    Next scheduled poll is Lord Ashcroft's 5,000 sample poll*, out tomorrow

    *Before anyone gets overexcited, the MOE on that poll is circa 1.5% as opposed to 3% for a 1,000 strong poll.

    Systematic bias is a far bigger issue than any MoE concern. It is obviously there in either the phone polls or the online polls, perhaps even both.
    I understand that the case for saying the online polls overstate Leave is that Leavers are more politically engaged and probably older/retired so have more time to answer online surveys. This (allegedly) means they are likely to respond more quickly than Remainers and because online polling systems stop accepting responses from the various defined groups of voters when sampling quotas have been filled if the split of Leave/Remain amongst quick responders is not the same as the population as a whole the result of the poll will be unrepresentative.

    This theory seems to have some logic to it - and clearly the punters and bookies believe it - but what is the counter-argument against phone polling? If we accept the online polls are right the phone polls must exaggerate Remain so why would Remainers be more likely to respond to phone calls than Leavers?

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    OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 31,997

    Pulpstar said:

    Next scheduled poll is Lord Ashcroft's 5,000 sample poll*, out tomorrow

    *Before anyone gets overexcited, the MOE on that poll is circa 1.5% as opposed to 3% for a 1,000 strong poll.

    Systematic bias is a far bigger issue than any MoE concern. It is obviously there in either the phone polls or the online polls, perhaps even both.
    I understand that the case for saying the online polls overstate Leave is that Leavers are more politically engaged and probably older/retired so have more time to answer online surveys. This (allegedly) means they are likely to respond more quickly than Remainers and because online polling systems stop accepting responses from the various defined groups of voters when sampling quotas have been filled if the split of Leave/Remain amongst quick responders is not the same as the population as a whole the result of the poll will be unrepresentative.

    This theory seems to have some logic to it - and clearly the punters and bookies believe it - but what is the counter-argument against phone polling? If we accept the online polls are right the phone polls must exaggerate Remain so why would Remainers be more likely to respond to phone calls than Leavers?

    Anecdote alert. I almost never answer “unknown” phone calls and, although I get regular emails from Yougov and I’m saving up to get to 5000 points(!) I’ve never been asked about the EU by them.
    I’ve not been canvassed, either, although there have been a couple of pub chats, during one of which I was told that “as I wasn’t really English, I wouldn’t understand why they (the speaker) felt so strongly about Leaving".” The ‘not really English’ is due to me being part Welsh!
    During the other chat, with some Labour Party members, everyone was for RemaIN!
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    AlistairAlistair Posts: 23,670
    Wow, what a rapid rise post world war 2, a boom you might describe it as.
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