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  • Plato_SaysPlato_Says Posts: 11,822
    Are you a trade union official in the NHS?

    I'm struggling to recall another single issue moaner like you on here. Kraken is lite in comparison.
    Chris_A said:

    And here's Jeremy Hunt in his own words to the Chairman of the Health Select Committee - it's a reasonably good and accurate letter. You will note that it nowhere mentions "junior doctors" at all. So what has the last 8 weeks been all about? As a doctor quoted in Private Eye put it we have a "macho tit of a health secretary [who] enjoys confrontation."

    http://www.parliament.uk/documents/commons-committees/Health/Correspondence/2015-16/Letter-from- the-Secretary-of-State-for-Health-to-the-Chair-on-seven-day NHS hospital services.pdf

  • Danny565Danny565 Posts: 8,091

    Are you a trade union official in the NHS?

    I'm struggling to recall another single issue moaner like you on here. Kraken is lite in comparison.

    Chris_A said:

    And here's Jeremy Hunt in his own words to the Chairman of the Health Select Committee - it's a reasonably good and accurate letter. You will note that it nowhere mentions "junior doctors" at all. So what has the last 8 weeks been all about? As a doctor quoted in Private Eye put it we have a "macho tit of a health secretary [who] enjoys confrontation."

    http://www.parliament.uk/documents/commons-committees/Health/Correspondence/2015-16/Letter-from- the-Secretary-of-State-for-Health-to-the-Chair-on-seven-day NHS hospital services.pdf

    What about me when I was going on about tax credits for a good few months? ;)
  • RogerRoger Posts: 20,062
    OT

    Interesting that there should be such outrage at the Russians killing one of their citizens abroad.

    Didn't Maggie murder a couple of British citizens in Gibraltar (to great acclaim) some years ago?

    Perhaps Litvinenco deserved it less than those men on the 'Rock' but I'm not sure the principle differs very much

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Death_on_the_Rock

  • AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 25,738
    edited 2016 21
    Roger said:

    OT

    Interesting that there should be such outrage at the Russians killing one of their citizens abroad.

    Didn't Maggie murder a couple of British citizens in Gibraltar (to great acclaim) some years ago?

    Perhaps Litvinenco deserved it less than those men on the 'Rock' but I'm not sure the principle differs very much

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Death_on_the_Rock

    I don't think she did it personally.

    And the three who got shot would strongly object to being called brits.
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 58,161

    Is this accurate?

    Glen OHara
    Here's some more gloom for you: if another recession, the UK is much, much worse equipped to fight back in policy terms than in 2007.

    @PlatoSays Much higher debt and deficit in public sector, no room to cut interest rates, QE alr ramped up.

    It's true and not true.

    Government debt is higher almost everywhere.

    *But*. (And it's a big but.)

    Almost all of the increase in government debt worldwide has been bought by central banks through quantitive easing programmes.

    If you don't pay interest on a debt, and there is no realistic proposition that you will ever have to repay it, is it really debt?

    I think all QE debt needs to be removed from notional debt-to-GDP calculations.
  • Plato_SaysPlato_Says Posts: 11,822
    Nah. You post about all sorts. No idea fixe.
    Danny565 said:

    Are you a trade union official in the NHS?

    I'm struggling to recall another single issue moaner like you on here. Kraken is lite in comparison.

    Chris_A said:

    And here's Jeremy Hunt in his own words to the Chairman of the Health Select Committee - it's a reasonably good and accurate letter. You will note that it nowhere mentions "junior doctors" at all. So what has the last 8 weeks been all about? As a doctor quoted in Private Eye put it we have a "macho tit of a health secretary [who] enjoys confrontation."

    http://www.parliament.uk/documents/commons-committees/Health/Correspondence/2015-16/Letter-from- the-Secretary-of-State-for-Health-to-the-Chair-on-seven-day NHS hospital services.pdf

    What about me when I was going on about tax credits for a good few months? ;)
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 62,138
    Good evening, everyone.
  • OmniumOmnium Posts: 11,141

    Omnium said:

    He's right up there in the idiot stakes in my view. However surely there must be some measure of economic pundits success that one might access. Perhaps there isn't such a thing?

    Anyway my opinion of him is that he couldn't predict a sunny day on mercury, but I'd be the first to admit that's based on simple prejudice.
    They don't tend to put quantities into the predictions, so its easy to wriggle.

    I think there'd be some merit in someone organising a scorecard for these loud mouths. 5 questions a month, out % chances and Brier score the shit out of it.
    Wouldn't use Brier, not sure what mind. You wouldn't need to get them to provide any regular stuff, but just judge them on their pronouncements. The difficulty is that Economists say things like "If the market drops substantially then there will be a buying opportunity". The chance of such a statement being wrong is of course almost exactly zero.
  • Chris_AChris_A Posts: 1,237

    Are you a trade union official in the NHS?

    I'm struggling to recall another single issue moaner like you on here. Kraken is lite in comparison.

    Chris_A said:

    And here's Jeremy Hunt in his own words to the Chairman of the Health Select Committee - it's a reasonably good and accurate letter. You will note that it nowhere mentions "junior doctors" at all. So what has the last 8 weeks been all about? As a doctor quoted in Private Eye put it we have a "macho tit of a health secretary [who] enjoys confrontation."

    http://www.parliament.uk/documents/commons-committees/Health/Correspondence/2015-16/Letter-from- the-Secretary-of-State-for-Health-to-the-Chair-on-seven-day NHS hospital services.pdf

    Not read it I presume. You'll note that I praise Mr Hunt for his letter. Healthcare is expensive, it is becoming increasingly more so. We are one of few countries spending less and less on it. It'll either have to come from taxes for directly from consumers if we're not to fall behind.

    And no I'm not a trade union official and have been posting here for far longer than you have.
  • It is difficult to separate, morally, what our governments do, in the name of national security, and the government of Russia do in the name of their national security. Obama doesn't flinch from unleashing drone strikes in 3rd party countries such as Pakistan, and bugger the collateral consequences, and it appears Putin thought the same about Litvinenko. I have to admit that I was a little uneasy about the extra judicial executions of British citizens, but I'm pragmatic enough to know that it was realistically the only option.
    As KLE states down thread, all governments do dark stuff,it's just that we feel we're in the right.
  • JohnLilburneJohnLilburne Posts: 6,372
    Roger said:

    OT

    Interesting that there should be such outrage at the Russians killing one of their citizens abroad.

    Didn't Maggie murder a couple of British citizens in Gibraltar (to great acclaim) some years ago?

    Perhaps Litvinenco deserved it less than those men on the 'Rock' but I'm not sure the principle differs very much

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Death_on_the_Rock

    I think you're clutching at straws here in your desire to shill for Putin. If three Russian domestic terrorists were killed on Russian-controlled territory by Russian security forces, most people would have very little problem with that. A bid different from having a man murdered abroad because you don't like the cut of his jib.
  • OmniumOmnium Posts: 11,141

    Good evening, everyone.

    Evening wise man with bells on :)

    Trump=Populist Roman Emperor, discuss!

    I don't think there's anything in the annuls of Rome really - there is perhaps in the annuls of the Papacy (not sure they have annuls mind you)

    If there are to be Presidents along the lines of Trump, then perhaps we can imagine a future Historian (or dancer of jiggs) making observations about such a wild succession.
  • MikeKMikeK Posts: 9,053
    I wonder what Tim Montgomery thinks about this?
    https://twitter.com/drapermark37/status/690216510804008960
  • LondonBobLondonBob Posts: 467
    edited 2016 21
    Alistair said:

    Russia are dropping iron bombs from helicopters in built up areas.

    Their and the Western powers' bombing campaign in Syria is not even remotely comparable.

    Fifteen months of airstrikes by the US led Coalition and Baghdadi’s “Caliphate” has barely lost any ground. True, Ramadi was reclaimed by the Iraqi army recently, in a very publicized effort, but the town was basically reduced to a pile of rubble. Ramadi is a sort of Iraqi equivalent to Kobane, the Kurdish town that US airstrikes saved from Baghdadi’s Jihadis. Going to Kobane and having a look at the result of that “great” victory against the throat-cutters brings backs memories of Ben Tre: “we had to destroy it to save it”. The same goes basically for Ramadi.

    Besides, the ongoing campaign against the “Islamic State” has already cost the US taxpayers some 5.5 billion dollars and the return on investment doesn’t look great so far. Talk about a winning strategy! No there really is no comparison at all.

    In the three months since the Russians launched their air campaign, at a cost of under one billion dollars per year, the Russians have not just stabilised Assad and made sure no military victory is possible anymore for the rebels. They have also boosted Russia's image as a major power, at the cost of antagonizing the Saudis and to a lesser degree Turkey (even if it seems the opposite in the short run), but they have also designed a global strategy that encompasses military, diplomatic/political and economic aspects. They have local allies on the ground, something the US can only dream about in that magnitude. And they are implementing a battle-plan that is not relying on yet another revisited version of COIN, but on the hard edge of conventional military combat and manoeuver in the Soviet style. Negotiated truce and evacuations have managed to minimise casualties in built up areas.

    http://www.latimes.com/world/middleeast/la-fg-syria-war-20160118-story.html

    Jordanians are on board now too, as I said a few days ago.

    https://now.mmedia.me/lb/en/NewsReports/566514-daraa-rebels-ordered-to-stop-fighting-syria-regime-report
  • MP_SEMP_SE Posts: 3,642
    edited 2016 21
    .
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 63,833

    Is this accurate?

    Glen OHara
    Here's some more gloom for you: if another recession, the UK is much, much worse equipped to fight back in policy terms than in 2007.

    @PlatoSays Much higher debt and deficit in public sector, no room to cut interest rates, QE alr ramped up.

    Certainly there is no ammunition on the monetary side (e.g. interest rates), although I suppose we could go into the negative rate adventure and thereby force banks not to hoard money. More QE might also be brought to bear. Osborne's deficit plan would be in tatters if we do have another serious recession.
  • John_MJohn_M Posts: 7,503

    Scott_P said:

    @MrHarryCole: Hear Kat Fletcher is not a happy bunny either. Sources say 3 factions now in Team Corbyn: Milne/Fisher V old guard V the Livingstonions. : (

    Evening all,

    Well the socialists Left do love their factions. Popcorn again.
    Splitters!
  • saddenedsaddened Posts: 2,245
    Roger said:

    OT

    Interesting that there should be such outrage at the Russians killing one of their citizens abroad.

    Didn't Maggie murder a couple of British citizens in Gibraltar (to great acclaim) some years ago?

    Perhaps Litvinenco deserved it less than those men on the 'Rock' but I'm not sure the principle differs very much

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Death_on_the_Rock

    You've got a scoop their Roger. Litvinenco, had a car bomb and was going to murder members of a military band., who knew?
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 62,138
    Mr. Omnium, Roman emperors often didn't court popularity, because it was the military they needed onside. Nobody voted for emperors, after all. [Well, there were rare cases. I think Pupienus and Balbinus were voted for by the Senate during Maximin's tyranny. And they got killed pretty promptly, if memory serves].

    It's no madder than Elagabalus ascending to the purple.
  • flightpath01flightpath01 Posts: 4,903
    saddened said:

    Roger said:

    OT

    Interesting that there should be such outrage at the Russians killing one of their citizens abroad.

    Didn't Maggie murder a couple of British citizens in Gibraltar (to great acclaim) some years ago?

    Perhaps Litvinenco deserved it less than those men on the 'Rock' but I'm not sure the principle differs very much

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Death_on_the_Rock

    You've got a scoop their Roger. Litvinenco, had a car bomb and was going to murder members of a military band., who knew?
    Agreed.
    More crass and odious moral equivocation. To see people falling over themselves to defend Putin is sickening.
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 58,161

    saddened said:

    Roger said:

    OT

    Interesting that there should be such outrage at the Russians killing one of their citizens abroad.

    Didn't Maggie murder a couple of British citizens in Gibraltar (to great acclaim) some years ago?

    Perhaps Litvinenco deserved it less than those men on the 'Rock' but I'm not sure the principle differs very much

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Death_on_the_Rock

    You've got a scoop their Roger. Litvinenco, had a car bomb and was going to murder members of a military band., who knew?
    Agreed.
    More crass and odious moral equivocation. To see people falling over themselves to defend Putin is sickening.
    To be fair, you'd defend him if you were being paid
  • flightpath01flightpath01 Posts: 4,903

    Is this accurate?

    Glen OHara
    Here's some more gloom for you: if another recession, the UK is much, much worse equipped to fight back in policy terms than in 2007.

    @PlatoSays Much higher debt and deficit in public sector, no room to cut interest rates, QE alr ramped up.

    Certainly there is no ammunition on the monetary side (e.g. interest rates), although I suppose we could go into the negative rate adventure and thereby force banks not to hoard money. More QE might also be brought to bear. Osborne's deficit plan would be in tatters if we do have another serious recession.
    Record UK car production announced today.
    The economic cycle is inevitable. A recession is 2 quarters of negative growth. This is not necessarily the same as a crash which wipes about 7% of the economic capacity of the country, bankrupts its banks and leaves a deficit of £160bn and a devastated tax base...
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,755
    edited 2016 21
    In contrast to Mike, I've just topped up on Cruz a touch. Cruz and Trump dutch at ~ 55% of the market on Betfair.

    Simply amazing that Cruz is within a couple of points of Jeb Bush pricewise.
  • OmniumOmnium Posts: 11,141

    Mr. Omnium, Roman emperors often didn't court popularity, because it was the military they needed onside. Nobody voted for emperors, after all. [Well, there were rare cases. I think Pupienus and Balbinus were voted for by the Senate during Maximin's tyranny. And they got killed pretty promptly, if memory serves].

    It's no madder than Elagabalus ascending to the purple.

    Mr Dancer

    Democracy with however many million people is much like the systems of old. the many millions are essentially directed by the few (newspapers etc).

    I was thinking about the Popes I guess - (from memory, and thus likely to be wrong) Sextus VI was appointed on some anti-nepotism ticket and proceeded to appoint his family to all the top roles - the parallel being (if i recall) that he was almost an accidental Pope.

    You know the way that Rome goes from leaders of legitimacy and wisdom and drifts into random noisy people (my feeling, may not be true) - well I think that's what we have with our leaders.
  • AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 25,738

    Is this accurate?

    Glen OHara
    Here's some more gloom for you: if another recession, the UK is much, much worse equipped to fight back in policy terms than in 2007.

    @PlatoSays Much higher debt and deficit in public sector, no room to cut interest rates, QE alr ramped up.

    Certainly there is no ammunition on the monetary side (e.g. interest rates), although I suppose we could go into the negative rate adventure and thereby force banks not to hoard money. More QE might also be brought to bear. Osborne's deficit plan would be in tatters if we do have another serious recession.
    Record UK car production announced today.
    The economic cycle is inevitable. A recession is 2 quarters of negative growth. This is not necessarily the same as a crash which wipes about 7% of the economic capacity of the country, bankrupts its banks and leaves a deficit of £160bn and a devastated tax base...
    UK record was in the 1970s,
  • SimonStClareSimonStClare Posts: 7,976
    Scott_P said:

    Lucy Powell is the least of Labour's worries right now.

    Yup, I suspect some "moderate" labour MPs are pining for the heady days of her slick press operation right now
    Indeed – Never thought I’d see Lucy knocked from the podium, but Milne is doing his best...!
  • SquareRootSquareRoot Posts: 7,095
    edited 2016 21
    If Blanchflower keeps predicting doom and gloom, one day he will be proved right and tell everyone I told you so.. A stopped clock and all that..
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,755

    If Blanchflower keeps predicting doom and gloom, one day he will be proved right and tell everyone I told you so.. A sopped clock and all that..

    He's got some way to go to claim to be the new Dan Hodges.
  • TheWhiteRabbitTheWhiteRabbit Posts: 12,454
    Pulpstar said:

    In contrast to Mike, I've just topped up on Cruz a touch. Cruz and Trump dutch at ~ 55% of the market on Betfair.

    Simply amazing that Cruz is within a couple of points of Jeb Bush pricewise.

    I've equalised my positions a touch, by topping up Trump.

    Honestly I cannot see a route for Rubio. Trump or Cruz wins Iowa. Trump wins NH, let's assume Rubio grabs second, a narrow lead over the others. But then what? Trump leads by a country mile literally every state that has been polled since 1 January.
  • mattmatt Posts: 3,789
    MikeK said:

    I wonder what Tim Montgomery thinks about this?
    https://twitter.com/drapermark37/status/690216510804008960

    I imagine that he would think that thinking women are bitches is the act of a simpleton bigot. You'd be happy with it I'd expect.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,755

    Pulpstar said:

    In contrast to Mike, I've just topped up on Cruz a touch. Cruz and Trump dutch at ~ 55% of the market on Betfair.

    Simply amazing that Cruz is within a couple of points of Jeb Bush pricewise.

    I've equalised my positions a touch, by topping up Trump.

    Honestly I cannot see a route for Rubio. Trump or Cruz wins Iowa. Trump wins NH, let's assume Rubio grabs second, a narrow lead over the others. But then what? Trump leads by a country mile literally every state that has been polled since 1 January.
    Cruz is a better result for me actually now by £40. I reckon he wins Iowa, might well equalise after that. If Donald gets on a 1.01 train - I'll take that for sure though.
  • TheWhiteRabbitTheWhiteRabbit Posts: 12,454
    Pulpstar said:

    Pulpstar said:

    In contrast to Mike, I've just topped up on Cruz a touch. Cruz and Trump dutch at ~ 55% of the market on Betfair.

    Simply amazing that Cruz is within a couple of points of Jeb Bush pricewise.

    I've equalised my positions a touch, by topping up Trump.

    Honestly I cannot see a route for Rubio. Trump or Cruz wins Iowa. Trump wins NH, let's assume Rubio grabs second, a narrow lead over the others. But then what? Trump leads by a country mile literally every state that has been polled since 1 January.
    Cruz is a better result for me actually now by £40. I reckon he wins Iowa, might well equalise after that. If Donald gets on a 1.01 train - I'll take that for sure though.
    I have it Rubio acceptable losses (-£100), Trump + Cruz good win (+£300). I'm please with where I am now with some other smaller amounts on NH and Iowa.
  • flightpath01flightpath01 Posts: 4,903

    Is this accurate?

    Glen OHara
    Here's some more gloom for you: if another recession, the UK is much, much worse equipped to fight back in policy terms than in 2007.

    @PlatoSays Much higher debt and deficit in public sector, no room to cut interest rates, QE alr ramped up.

    Certainly there is no ammunition on the monetary side (e.g. interest rates), although I suppose we could go into the negative rate adventure and thereby force banks not to hoard money. More QE might also be brought to bear. Osborne's deficit plan would be in tatters if we do have another serious recession.
    Record UK car production announced today.
    The economic cycle is inevitable. A recession is 2 quarters of negative growth. This is not necessarily the same as a crash which wipes about 7% of the economic capacity of the country, bankrupts its banks and leaves a deficit of £160bn and a devastated tax base...
    UK record was in the 1970s,
    Record exports though. The all time 1972 record is expected to be beaten by 2020. I am happy to applaud success.
  • flightpath01flightpath01 Posts: 4,903
    LondonBob said:

    Alistair said:

    Russia are dropping iron bombs from helicopters in built up areas.

    Their and the Western powers' bombing campaign in Syria is not even remotely comparable.

    Fifteen months of airstrikes by the US led Coalition and Baghdadi’s “Caliphate” has barely lost any ground. True, Ramadi was reclaimed by the Iraqi army recently, in a very publicized effort, but the town was basically reduced to a pile of rubble. Ramadi is a sort of Iraqi equivalent to Kobane, the Kurdish town that US airstrikes saved from Baghdadi’s Jihadis. Going to Kobane and having a look at the result of that “great” victory against the throat-cutters brings backs memories of Ben Tre: “we had to destroy it to save it”. The same goes basically for Ramadi.

    Besides, the ongoing campaign against the “Islamic State” has already cost the US taxpayers some 5.5 billion dollars and the return on investment doesn’t look great so far. Talk about a winning strategy! No there really is no comparison at all.

    In the three months since the Russians launched their air campaign, at a cost of under one billion dollars per year, the Russians have not just stabilised Assad and made sure no military victory is possible anymore for the rebels. They have also boosted Russia's image as a major power, at the cost of antagonizing the Saudis and to a lesser degree Turkey (even if it seems the opposite in the short run), but they have also designed a global strategy that encompasses military, diplomatic/political and economic aspects. They have local allies on the ground, something the US can only dream about in that magnitude. And they are implementing a battle-plan that is not relying on yet another revisited version of COIN, but on the hard edge of conventional military combat and manoeuver in the Soviet style. Negotiated truce and evacuations have managed to minimise casualties in built up areas.

    http://www.latimes.com/world/middleeast/la-fg-syria-war-20160118-story.html

    Jordanians are on board now too, as I said a few days ago.

    https://now.mmedia.me/lb/en/NewsReports/566514-daraa-rebels-ordered-to-stop-fighting-syria-regime-report
    Are you for real? Or have you just escaped from an institution?
  • Plato_SaysPlato_Says Posts: 11,822
    He's just accused me of being unable to read and rubbished my link to his 5m claim on Twitter

    That was his first response to my polite comment.

    If Blanchflower keeps predicting doom and gloom, one day he will be proved right and tell everyone I told you so.. A stopped clock and all that..

  • AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 25,738
    edited 2016 21

    Is this accurate?

    Glen OHara
    Here's some more gloom for you: if another recession, the UK is much, much worse equipped to fight back in policy terms than in 2007.

    @PlatoSays Much higher debt and deficit in public sector, no room to cut interest rates, QE alr ramped up.

    Certainly there is no ammunition on the monetary side (e.g. interest rates), although I suppose we could go into the negative rate adventure and thereby force banks not to hoard money. More QE might also be brought to bear. Osborne's deficit plan would be in tatters if we do have another serious recession.
    Record UK car production announced today.
    The economic cycle is inevitable. A recession is 2 quarters of negative growth. This is not necessarily the same as a crash which wipes about 7% of the economic capacity of the country, bankrupts its banks and leaves a deficit of £160bn and a devastated tax base...
    UK record was in the 1970s,
    Record exports though. The all time 1972 record is expected to be beaten by 2020. I am happy to applaud success.
    Nah you're just spinning fact free as ever.

    The SMMT predicts 2 million cars about once decade and never hit it because the next recession comes first.
  • malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 43,756

    Is this accurate?

    Glen OHara
    Here's some more gloom for you: if another recession, the UK is much, much worse equipped to fight back in policy terms than in 2007.

    @PlatoSays Much higher debt and deficit in public sector, no room to cut interest rates, QE alr ramped up.

    Certainly there is no ammunition on the monetary side (e.g. interest rates), although I suppose we could go into the negative rate adventure and thereby force banks not to hoard money. More QE might also be brought to bear. Osborne's deficit plan would be in tatters if we do have another serious recession.
    Record UK car production announced today.
    The economic cycle is inevitable. A recession is 2 quarters of negative growth. This is not necessarily the same as a crash which wipes about 7% of the economic capacity of the country, bankrupts its banks and leaves a deficit of £160bn and a devastated tax base...
    UK record was in the 1970s,
    He cannot be expected to go back more than a day Alan.
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 52,641
    Pulpstar said:

    Pulpstar said:

    In contrast to Mike, I've just topped up on Cruz a touch. Cruz and Trump dutch at ~ 55% of the market on Betfair.

    Simply amazing that Cruz is within a couple of points of Jeb Bush pricewise.

    I've equalised my positions a touch, by topping up Trump.

    Honestly I cannot see a route for Rubio. Trump or Cruz wins Iowa. Trump wins NH, let's assume Rubio grabs second, a narrow lead over the others. But then what? Trump leads by a country mile literally every state that has been polled since 1 January.
    Cruz is a better result for me actually now by £40. I reckon he wins Iowa, might well equalise after that. If Donald gets on a 1.01 train - I'll take that for sure though.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/British_Rail_Class_101 :lol:
  • AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 25,738
    malcolmg said:

    Is this accurate?

    Glen OHara
    Here's some more gloom for you: if another recession, the UK is much, much worse equipped to fight back in policy terms than in 2007.

    @PlatoSays Much higher debt and deficit in public sector, no room to cut interest rates, QE alr ramped up.

    Certainly there is no ammunition on the monetary side (e.g. interest rates), although I suppose we could go into the negative rate adventure and thereby force banks not to hoard money. More QE might also be brought to bear. Osborne's deficit plan would be in tatters if we do have another serious recession.
    Record UK car production announced today.
    The economic cycle is inevitable. A recession is 2 quarters of negative growth. This is not necessarily the same as a crash which wipes about 7% of the economic capacity of the country, bankrupts its banks and leaves a deficit of £160bn and a devastated tax base...
    UK record was in the 1970s,
    He cannot be expected to go back more than a day Alan.
    Yo malc. how's things ?

    Haven't caught up with you for a while, hope you had a good break and are getting in the malt for Burns Night.
  • MTimTMTimT Posts: 7,034
    SeanT said:

    Btw are there any other PB-ers who have changed their views on a fundamental issue during their time on the site? I reckon it's a good thing.

    I've also changed my mind on electoral reform. Thanks to PB. Used to be opposed. Now I support.

    Changed my mind on reform of the Lords (against to for) and climate change (sceptic, to almost convinced but avoid policy-making based on models that clearly aren't fit for that purpose).
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 58,161

    Pulpstar said:

    In contrast to Mike, I've just topped up on Cruz a touch. Cruz and Trump dutch at ~ 55% of the market on Betfair.

    Simply amazing that Cruz is within a couple of points of Jeb Bush pricewise.

    I've equalised my positions a touch, by topping up Trump.

    Honestly I cannot see a route for Rubio. Trump or Cruz wins Iowa. Trump wins NH, let's assume Rubio grabs second, a narrow lead over the others. But then what? Trump leads by a country mile literally every state that has been polled since 1 January.
    The Rubio route is obvious, if difficult.

    In Iowa, Trump underperforms massively as (a) he has weak organisational strength on the ground, and (b) his supporters are not natural caucus goers. Sure, he's second, but on c. 20-22%; a relative failure. Simultaneously, the Iowa process narrows down the tier two players massively: the guy who's on his own supporting Christie... doesn't want to stand on his own... where's the obvious place to go? Rubio. So, I'd reckon Rubio ends up on 16-18%. Something that will be spun as a big victory for him.

    Going into New Hampshire, we see a couple of the tier three candidates drop out. Rubio is the candidate with a bit of momentum, and notches up a second placed result ahead of Trump, albeit only in the low 20s again.

    South Carolina goes to Trump, but by now the non-Trump candidates are getting thin on the ground. Nevada - another caucus state - goes surprisingly Rubio.

    That's how he might win. Sure it's not a 30% probability, or even a 20% one. But it's certainly a 10-15% possibility.
  • malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 43,756

    LondonBob said:

    Alistair said:

    Russia are dropping iron bombs from helicopters in built up areas.

    Their and the Western powers' bombing campaign in Syria is not even remotely comparable.

    Fifteen months of airstrikes by the US led Coalition and Baghdadi’s “Caliphate” has barely lost any ground. True, Ramadi was reclaimed by the Iraqi army recently, in a very publicized effort, but the town was basically reduced to a pile of rubble. Ramadi is a sort of Iraqi equivalent to Kobane, the Kurdish town that US airstrikes saved from Baghdadi’s Jihadis. Going to Kobane and having a look at the result of that “great” victory against the throat-cutters brings backs memories of Ben Tre: “we had to destroy it to save it”. The same goes basically for Ramadi.

    Besides, the ongoing campaign against the “Islamic State” has already cost the US taxpayers some 5.5 billion dollars and the return on investment doesn’t look great so far. Talk about a winning strategy! No there really is no comparison at all.



    http://www.latimes.com/world/middleeast/la-fg-syria-war-20160118-story.html

    Jordanians are on board now too, as I said a few days ago.

    https://now.mmedia.me/lb/en/NewsReports/566514-daraa-rebels-ordered-to-stop-fighting-syria-regime-report
    Are you for real? Or have you just escaped from an institution?
    Poor Bob , ranged against PB's most right wing armchair General. Lookout Bob he will be telling you our contribution is changing the balance next.
  • flightpath01flightpath01 Posts: 4,903
    Chris_A said:

    Perhaps The King's Fund is a loony left organisation too, or it could just be that the government's claims to be generous to the NHS are a load of hot air?

    http://www.kingsfund.org.uk/blog/2016/01/how-does-nhs-spending-compare-health-spending-internationally

    Of course it is generous to the NHS in the context of a 160bn deficit. Where do you expect this money, this extra money you want, to come from?
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,755

    Pulpstar said:

    Pulpstar said:

    In contrast to Mike, I've just topped up on Cruz a touch. Cruz and Trump dutch at ~ 55% of the market on Betfair.

    Simply amazing that Cruz is within a couple of points of Jeb Bush pricewise.

    I've equalised my positions a touch, by topping up Trump.

    Honestly I cannot see a route for Rubio. Trump or Cruz wins Iowa. Trump wins NH, let's assume Rubio grabs second, a narrow lead over the others. But then what? Trump leads by a country mile literally every state that has been polled since 1 January.
    Cruz is a better result for me actually now by £40. I reckon he wins Iowa, might well equalise after that. If Donald gets on a 1.01 train - I'll take that for sure though.
    I have it Rubio acceptable losses (-£100), Trump + Cruz good win (+£300). I'm please with where I am now with some other smaller amounts on NH and Iowa.
    Trump +479
    Cruz +524
    Rubio -321
    Bush -462
    for me.

    Rubio is +167 the presidency, though.


  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 82,624
    edited 2016 21
    LondonBob said:

    Alistair said:

    Russia are dropping iron bombs from helicopters in built up areas.

    Their and the Western powers' bombing campaign in Syria is not even remotely comparable.

    Fifteen months of airstrikes by the US led Coalition and Baghdadi’s “Caliphate” has barely lost any ground. True, Ramadi was reclaimed by the Iraqi army recently, in a very publicized effort, but the town was basically reduced to a pile of rubble. Ramadi is a sort of Iraqi equivalent to Kobane, the Kurdish town that US airstrikes saved from Baghdadi’s Jihadis. Going to Kobane and having a look at the result of that “great” victory against the throat-cutters brings backs memories of Ben Tre: “we had to destroy it to save it”. The same goes basically for Ramadi.

    Besides, the ongoing campaign against the “Islamic State” has already cost the US taxpayers some 5.5 billion dollars and the return on investment doesn’t look great so far. Talk about a winning strategy! No there really is no comparison at all.

    In the three months since the Russians launched their air campaign, at a cost of under one billion dollars per year, the Russians have not just stabilised Assad and made sure no military victory is possible anymore for the rebels. They have also boosted Russia's image as a major power, at the cost of antagonizing the Saudis and to a lesser degree Turkey (even if it seems the opposite in the short run), but they have also designed a global strategy that encompasses military, diplomatic/political and economic aspects. They have local allies on the ground, something the US can only dream about in that magnitude. And they are implementing a battle-plan that is not relying on yet another revisited version of COIN, but on the hard edge of conventional military combat and manoeuver in the Soviet style. Negotiated truce and evacuations have managed to minimise casualties in built up areas.

    http://www.latimes.com/world/middleeast/la-fg-syria-war-20160118-story.html

    Jordanians are on board now too, as I said a few days ago.

    https://now.mmedia.me/lb/en/NewsReports/566514-daraa-rebels-ordered-to-stop-fighting-syria-regime-report
    By not any ground, you mean basically the whole of the North of Syria...At current rate of progress the Kurds will cut them off completely from Turkey, and the Kurds say quite clearly it wouldn't be possible without all the targetted airstrikes going in.
  • Plato_SaysPlato_Says Posts: 11,822
    edited 2016 21
    TBH, I'm still a bit WTF that he used jam rags as an insult a couple of weeks ago.

    Just ewww. 14yrs old stuff.
    matt said:

    MikeK said:

    I wonder what Tim Montgomery thinks about this?
    https://twitter.com/drapermark37/status/690216510804008960

    I imagine that he would think that thinking women are bitches is the act of a simpleton bigot. You'd be happy with it I'd expect.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,755
    rcs1000 said:

    But it's certainly a 10-15% possibility.

    Well I'd reback him at 8-1 :D
  • malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 43,756

    malcolmg said:

    Is this accurate?

    Glen OHara
    Here's some more gloom for you: if another recession, the UK is much, much worse equipped to fight back in policy terms than in 2007.

    @PlatoSays Much higher debt and deficit in public sector, no room to cut interest rates, QE alr ramped up.

    Certainly there is no ammunition on the monetary side (e.g. interest rates), although I suppose we could go into the negative rate adventure and thereby force banks not to hoard money. More QE might also be brought to bear. Osborne's deficit plan would be in tatters if we do have another serious recession.
    Record UK car production announced today.
    The economic cycle is inevitable. A recession is 2 quarters of negative growth. This is not necessarily the same as a crash which wipes about 7% of the economic capacity of the country, bankrupts its banks and leaves a deficit of £160bn and a devastated tax base...
    UK record was in the 1970s,
    He cannot be expected to go back more than a day Alan.
    Yo malc. how's things ?

    Haven't caught up with you for a while, hope you had a good break and are getting in the malt for Burns Night.
    Hello Alan, yes all well, plenty of supplies and haggis and neeps as well. I am still toiling , living in hope of big payoff but not much chance of either payoff or big way things are going. Need to start winding down. Hope you and family are well.
  • AlastairMeeksAlastairMeeks Posts: 30,340
    If the European Commission are going to try to scrap the Dublin Regulation, they look as though they are going to run into opposition outside Britain - cf the Dutch Prime Minister's comments in particular:

    http://www.theguardian.com/world/2016/jan/21/dutch-pm-says-refugee-crisis-could-shut-down-europes-open-borders-for-good?CMP=twt_b-gdnnews

    Belatedly, the idea of prevention of movement rather than acceptance of migrants seems to be becoming the preferred approach among European leaders.
  • AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 25,738
    malcolmg said:

    malcolmg said:

    Is this accurate?

    Glen OHara
    Here's some more gloom for you: if another recession, the UK is much, much worse equipped to fight back in policy terms than in 2007.

    @PlatoSays Much higher debt and deficit in public sector, no room to cut interest rates, QE alr ramped up.

    Certainly there is no ammunition on the monetary side (e.g. interest rates), although I suppose we could go into the negative rate adventure and thereby force banks not to hoard money. More QE might also be brought to bear. Osborne's deficit plan would be in tatters if we do have another serious recession.
    Record UK car production announced today.
    The economic cycle is inevitable. A recession is 2 quarters of negative growth. This is not necessarily the same as a crash which wipes about 7% of the economic capacity of the country, bankrupts its banks and leaves a deficit of £160bn and a devastated tax base...
    UK record was in the 1970s,
    He cannot be expected to go back more than a day Alan.
    Yo malc. how's things ?

    Haven't caught up with you for a while, hope you had a good break and are getting in the malt for Burns Night.
    Hello Alan, yes all well, plenty of supplies and haggis and neeps as well. I am still toiling , living in hope of big payoff but not much chance of either payoff or big way things are going. Need to start winding down. Hope you and family are well.
    You're in the wrong bit of your employer, my missus is being offered payoffs about once every 6 months.
  • AlistairAlistair Posts: 23,670
    I am +652 across the field for the nomination. Unfortunately that's pence rather than pounds.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,755
    edited 2016 21
    Alistair said:

    I am +652 across the field for the nomination. Unfortunately that's pence rather than pounds.

    :D A profit is a profit :)
  • flightpath01flightpath01 Posts: 4,903
    malcolmg said:

    LondonBob said:

    Alistair said:

    Russia are dropping iron bombs from helicopters in built up areas.

    Their and the Western powers' bombing campaign in Syria is not even remotely comparable.

    Fifteen months of airstrikes by the US led Coalition and Baghdadi’s “Caliphate” has barely lost any ground. True, Ramadi was reclaimed by the Iraqi army recently, in a very publicized effort, but the town was basically reduced to a pile of rubble. Ramadi is a sort of Iraqi equivalent to Kobane, the Kurdish town that US airstrikes saved from Baghdadi’s Jihadis. Going to Kobane and having a look at the result of that “great” victory against the throat-cutters brings backs memories of Ben Tre: “we had to destroy it to save it”. The same goes basically for Ramadi.

    Besides, the ongoing campaign against the “Islamic State” has already cost the US taxpayers some 5.5 billion dollars and the return on investment doesn’t look great so far. Talk about a winning strategy! No there really is no comparison at all.



    http://www.latimes.com/world/middleeast/la-fg-syria-war-20160118-story.html

    Jordanians are on board now too, as I said a few days ago.

    https://now.mmedia.me/lb/en/NewsReports/566514-daraa-rebels-ordered-to-stop-fighting-syria-regime-report
    Are you for real? Or have you just escaped from an institution?
    Poor Bob , ranged against PB's most right wing armchair General. Lookout Bob he will be telling you our contribution is changing the balance next.
    Watchout the dogs are splashing through the marshes, they've got your scent. You will be back in the hulk before long.
  • malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 43,756

    malcolmg said:

    malcolmg said:

    Is this accurate?

    Glen OHara
    Here's some more gloom for you: if another recession, the UK is much, much worse equipped to fight back in policy terms than in 2007.

    @PlatoSays Much higher debt and deficit in public sector, no room to cut interest rates, QE alr ramped up.

    Certainly there is no ammunition on the monetary side (e.g. interest rates), although I suppose we could go into the negative rate adventure and thereby force banks not to hoard money. More QE might also be brought to bear. Osborne's deficit plan would be in tatters if we do have another serious recession.
    Record UK car production announced today.
    The economic cycle is inevitable. A recession is 2 quarters of negative growth. This is not necessarily the same as a crash which wipes about 7% of the economic capacity of the country, bankrupts its banks and leaves a deficit of £160bn and a devastated tax base...
    UK record was in the 1970s,
    He cannot be expected to go back more than a day Alan.
    Yo malc. how's things ?

    Haven't caught up with you for a while, hope you had a good break and are getting in the malt for Burns Night.
    Hello Alan, yes all well, plenty of supplies and haggis and neeps as well. I am still toiling , living in hope of big payoff but not much chance of either payoff or big way things are going. Need to start winding down. Hope you and family are well.
    You're in the wrong bit of your employer, my missus is being offered payoffs about once every 6 months.
    We have people go, not as many as other areas , but they just laugh at me asking.
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 58,161
    Alistair said:

    I am +652 across the field for the nomination. Unfortunately that's pence rather than pounds.

    I'm long Cruz for the nomination, short for the Presidency.
    Short Trump and Rubio for the nomination, long for the Presidency.

    So long as Rubio doesn't win the nomination and fail against Hillary, I reckon I'm in good shape.
  • malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 43,756

    malcolmg said:

    LondonBob said:

    Alistair said:

    Russia are dropping iron bombs from helicopters in built up areas.

    Their and the Western powers' bombing campaign in Syria is not even remotely comparable.

    Fifteen months of airstrikes by the US led Coalition and Baghdadi’s “Caliphate” has barely lost any ground. True, Ramadi was reclaimed by the Iraqi army recently, in a very publicized effort, but the town was basically reduced to a pile of rubble. Ramadi is a sort of Iraqi equivalent to Kobane, the Kurdish town that US airstrikes saved from Baghdadi’s Jihadis. Going to Kobane and having a look at the result of that “great” victory against the throat-cutters brings backs memories of Ben Tre: “we had to destroy it to save it”. The same goes basically for Ramadi.

    Besides, the ongoing campaign against the “Islamic State” has already cost the US taxpayers some 5.5 billion dollars and the return on investment doesn’t look great so far. Talk about a winning strategy! No there really is no comparison at all.



    http://www.latimes.com/world/middleeast/la-fg-syria-war-20160118-story.html

    Jordanians are on board now too, as I said a few days ago.

    https://now.mmedia.me/lb/en/NewsReports/566514-daraa-rebels-ordered-to-stop-fighting-syria-regime-report
    Are you for real? Or have you just escaped from an institution?
    Poor Bob , ranged against PB's most right wing armchair General. Lookout Bob he will be telling you our contribution is changing the balance next.
    Watchout the dogs are splashing through the marshes, they've got your scent. You will be back in the hulk before long.
    LOL, you are not the full shilling
  • AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 25,738
    malcolmg said:

    malcolmg said:

    malcolmg said:

    Is this accurate?

    Glen OHara
    Here's some more gloom for you: if another recession, the UK is much, much worse equipped to fight back in policy terms than in 2007.

    @PlatoSays Much higher debt and deficit in public sector, no room to cut interest rates, QE alr ramped up.

    Certainly there is no ammunition on the monetary side (e.g. interest rates), although I suppose we could go into the negative rate adventure and thereby force banks not to hoard money. More QE might also be brought to bear. Osborne's deficit plan would be in tatters if we do have another serious recession.
    Record UK car production announced today.
    The economic cycle is inevitable. A recession is 2 quarters of negative growth. This is not necessarily the same as a crash which wipes about 7% of the economic capacity of the country, bankrupts its banks and leaves a deficit of £160bn and a devastated tax base...
    UK record was in the 1970s,
    He cannot be expected to go back more than a day Alan.
    Yo malc. how's things ?

    Haven't caught up with you for a while, hope you had a good break and are getting in the malt for Burns Night.
    Hello Alan, yes all well, plenty of supplies and haggis and neeps as well. I am still toiling , living in hope of big payoff but not much chance of either payoff or big way things are going. Need to start winding down. Hope you and family are well.
    You're in the wrong bit of your employer, my missus is being offered payoffs about once every 6 months.
    We have people go, not as many as other areas , but they just laugh at me asking.
    LOL your PBC rating is too high !

    Loaf about and tell them to do their own work, you'll soon get it down :-)
  • SimonStClareSimonStClare Posts: 7,976

    If the European Commission are going to try to scrap the Dublin Regulation, they look as though they are going to run into opposition outside Britain - cf the Dutch Prime Minister's comments in particular:

    http://www.theguardian.com/world/2016/jan/21/dutch-pm-says-refugee-crisis-could-shut-down-europes-open-borders-for-good?CMP=twt_b-gdnnews

    Belatedly, the idea of prevention of movement rather than acceptance of migrants seems to be becoming the preferred approach among European leaders.

    Dutch PM says refugee crisis could shut down Europe's open borders for good.

    This often happens when harsh reality confronts principled altruism.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,755
    edited 2016 21
    @rcs1000 You look a bit off colour today.
  • perdixperdix Posts: 1,806

    It is difficult to separate, morally, what our governments do, in the name of national security, and the government of Russia do in the name of their national security. Obama doesn't flinch from unleashing drone strikes in 3rd party countries such as Pakistan, and bugger the collateral consequences, and it appears Putin thought the same about Litvinenko. I have to admit that I was a little uneasy about the extra judicial executions of British citizens, but I'm pragmatic enough to know that it was realistically the only option.
    As KLE states down thread, all governments do dark stuff,it's just that we feel we're in the right.

    The extra-judicial executions of British citizens was justified on the basis that they planned to come and kill some of us. Litvinenko's "crime" was to criticise Putin.

  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 82,624
    A Labour government could give employees the right to take over their companies if they are sold, dissolved or floated on the stock market.

    http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-politics-35370234

    Right lads, Cadbury's is being sold for many billions. Lets have a whip round in the canteen and see if we can get the money together...
  • TheWhiteRabbitTheWhiteRabbit Posts: 12,454
    Pulpstar said:

    Pulpstar said:

    Pulpstar said:

    In contrast to Mike, I've just topped up on Cruz a touch. Cruz and Trump dutch at ~ 55% of the market on Betfair.

    Simply amazing that Cruz is within a couple of points of Jeb Bush pricewise.

    I've equalised my positions a touch, by topping up Trump.

    Honestly I cannot see a route for Rubio. Trump or Cruz wins Iowa. Trump wins NH, let's assume Rubio grabs second, a narrow lead over the others. But then what? Trump leads by a country mile literally every state that has been polled since 1 January.
    Cruz is a better result for me actually now by £40. I reckon he wins Iowa, might well equalise after that. If Donald gets on a 1.01 train - I'll take that for sure though.
    I have it Rubio acceptable losses (-£100), Trump + Cruz good win (+£300). I'm please with where I am now with some other smaller amounts on NH and Iowa.
    Trump +479
    Cruz +524
    Rubio -321
    Bush -462
    for me.

    Rubio is +167 the presidency, though.


    Ha a similar shape, you've just done better :)
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 52,556

    Chris_A said:

    Perhaps The King's Fund is a loony left organisation too, or it could just be that the government's claims to be generous to the NHS are a load of hot air?

    http://www.kingsfund.org.uk/blog/2016/01/how-does-nhs-spending-compare-health-spending-internationally

    Of course it is generous to the NHS in the context of a 160bn deficit. Where do you expect this money, this extra money you want, to come from?
    In everyday life, what do you make of someone who boasts how he spend a river of cash on his car, his house etc?

    Normal people talk about how they got a good deal for what they had to spend.

    Perhaps there is a lesson in that for politicians.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 120,757
    edited 2016 21
    Will people stop posting their potential profits on Trump being the nominee.
  • malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 43,756

    malcolmg said:

    malcolmg said:

    malcolmg said:

    Is this accurate?

    Glen OHara
    Here's some more gloom for you: if another recession, the UK is much, much worse equipped to fight back in policy terms than in 2007.

    @PlatoSays Much higher debt and deficit in public sector, no room to cut interest rates, QE alr ramped up.

    Certainly there is no ammunition on the monetary side (e.g. interest rates), although I suppose we could go into the negative rate adventure and thereby force banks not to hoard money. More QE might also be brought to bear. Osborne's deficit plan would be in tatters if we do have another serious recession.
    Record UK car production announced today.
    The economic cycle is inevitable. A recession is 2 quarters of negative growth. This is not necessarily the same as a crash which wipes about 7% of the economic capacity of the country, bankrupts its banks and leaves a deficit of £160bn and a devastated tax base...
    UK record was in the 1970s,
    He cannot be expected to go back more than a day Alan.
    Yo malc. how's things ?

    Haven't caught up with you for a while, hope you had a good break and are getting in the malt for Burns Night.
    Hello Alan, yes all well, plenty of supplies and haggis and neeps as well. I am still toiling , living in hope of big payoff but not much chance of either payoff or big way things are going. Need to start winding down. Hope you and family are well.
    You're in the wrong bit of your employer, my missus is being offered payoffs about once every 6 months.
    We have people go, not as many as other areas , but they just laugh at me asking.
    LOL your PBC rating is too high !

    Loaf about and tell them to do their own work, you'll soon get it down :-)
    That is what the wife says as well. I need to start putting the feet up.
  • flightpath01flightpath01 Posts: 4,903

    Is this accurate?

    Glen OHara
    Here's some more gloom for you: if another recession, the UK is much, much worse equipped to fight back in policy terms than in 2007.

    @PlatoSays Much higher debt and deficit in public sector, no room to cut interest rates, QE alr ramped up.

    Certainly there is no ammunition on the monetary side (e.g. interest rates), although I suppose we could go into the negative rate adventure and thereby force banks not to hoard money. More QE might also be brought to bear. Osborne's deficit plan would be in tatters if we do have another serious recession.
    Record UK car production announced today.
    The economic cycle is inevitable. A recession is 2 quarters of negative growth. This is not necessarily the same as a crash which wipes about 7% of the economic capacity of the country, bankrupts its banks and leaves a deficit of £160bn and a devastated tax base...
    UK record was in the 1970s,
    Record exports though. The all time 1972 record is expected to be beaten by 2020. I am happy to applaud success.
    Nah you're just spinning fact free as ever.

    The SMMT predicts 2 million cars about once decade and never hit it because the next recession comes first.
    You are really embarrassed by our car industry aren't you. You must hate Sunderland. But over the last decade Jaguar Land Rover have increased production to 489,000. They are no the largest car manufacturer in Britain, overtaking Nissan. Take a look where they were 10 years ago. JLR produce high value products on a par with BMW. Their numbers are going to keep on rising.

    Good Night.
  • AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 25,738
    edited 2016 21
    malcolmg said:

    malcolmg said:

    malcolmg said:

    malcolmg said:

    Is this accurate?

    Glen OHara
    Here's some more gloom for you: if another recession, the UK is much, much worse equipped to fight back in policy terms than in 2007.

    @PlatoSays Much higher debt and deficit in public sector, no room to cut interest rates, QE alr ramped up.

    Certainly there is no ammunition on the monetary side (e.g. interest rates), although I suppose we could go into the negative rate adventure and thereby force banks not to hoard money. More QE might also be brought to bear. Osborne's deficit plan would be in tatters if we do have another serious recession.
    Record UK car production announced today.
    The economic cycle is inevitable. A recession is 2 quarters of negative growth. This is not necessarily the same as a crash which wipes about 7% of the economic capacity of the country, bankrupts its banks and leaves a deficit of £160bn and a devastated tax base...
    UK record was in the 1970s,
    He cannot be expected to go back more than a day Alan.
    Yo malc. how's things ?

    Haven't caught up with you for a while, hope you had a good break and are getting in the malt for Burns Night.
    Hello Alan, yes all well, plenty of supplies and haggis and neeps as well. I am still toiling , living in hope of big payoff but not much chance of either payoff or big way things are going. Need to start winding down. Hope you and family are well.
    You're in the wrong bit of your employer, my missus is being offered payoffs about once every 6 months.
    We have people go, not as many as other areas , but they just laugh at me asking.
    LOL your PBC rating is too high !

    Loaf about and tell them to do their own work, you'll soon get it down :-)
    That is what the wife says as well. I need to start putting the feet up.
    A colleague of the wife wants to go in the next 12 months and has been managing his rating downwards for 2 years so he doesn't get blocked.
  • alex.alex. Posts: 4,658
    If it hasn't been mentioned.

    http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2016/jan/21/lancashire-police-criticise-bbc-over-terrorist-house-story

    Interesting to read that the guardian are investigating their publication of the story as well.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 52,556
    Roger said:

    OT

    Interesting that there should be such outrage at the Russians killing one of their citizens abroad.

    Didn't Maggie murder a couple of British citizens in Gibraltar (to great acclaim) some years ago?

    Perhaps Litvinenco deserved it less than those men on the 'Rock' but I'm not sure the principle differs very much

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Death_on_the_Rock

    1) She didn't order them shot
    2) They were shot because it was believed by the men who shot them that they were in possession of the detonator of a car bomb.
    3) They actually did have a car bomb - though it turned out that they'd left it parked in Spain to do some more recon of their target.

    Your idea needs some work - bit like your idea that the Cologne was about working girls ripping off innocent men...
  • AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 25,738

    Is this accurate?

    Glen OHara
    Here's some more gloom for you: if another recession, the UK is much, much worse equipped to fight back in policy terms than in 2007.

    @PlatoSays Much higher debt and deficit in public sector, no room to cut interest rates, QE alr ramped up.

    Certainly there is no ammunition on the monetary side (e.g. interest rates), although I suppose we could go into the negative rate adventure and thereby force banks not to hoard money. More QE might also be brought to bear. Osborne's deficit plan would be in tatters if we do have another serious recession.
    Record UK car production announced today.
    The economic cycle is inevitable. A recession is 2 quarters of negative growth. This is not necessarily the same as a crash which wipes about 7% of the economic capacity of the country, bankrupts its banks and leaves a deficit of £160bn and a devastated tax base...
    UK record was in the 1970s,
    Record exports though. The all time 1972 record is expected to be beaten by 2020. I am happy to applaud success.
    Nah you're just spinning fact free as ever.

    The SMMT predicts 2 million cars about once decade and never hit it because the next recession comes first.
    You are really embarrassed by our car industry aren't you. You must hate Sunderland. But over the last decade Jaguar Land Rover have increased production to 489,000. They are no the largest car manufacturer in Britain, overtaking Nissan. Take a look where they were 10 years ago. JLR produce high value products on a par with BMW. Their numbers are going to keep on rising.

    Good Night.
    LOL

    I worked in UK car manufacturing for the best part of 25 years.

    I just point out bollocks when it's being posted if you don't liked being called out stop posting crap.
  • malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 43,756

    malcolmg said:

    malcolmg said:

    malcolmg said:

    malcolmg said:

    Is this accurate?

    Glen OHara
    Here's some more gloom for you: if another recession, the UK is much, much worse equipped to fight back in policy terms than in 2007.

    @PlatoSays Much higher debt and deficit in public sector, no room to cut interest rates, QE alr ramped up.

    Certainly there is no ammunition on the monetary side (e.g. interest rates), although I suppose we could go into the negative rate adventure and thereby force banks not to hoard money. More QE might also be brought to bear. Osborne's deficit plan would be in tatters if we do have another serious recession.
    Record UK car production announced today.
    The economic cycle is inevitable. A recession is 2 quarters of negative growth. This is not necessarily the same as a crash which wipes about 7% of the economic capacity of the country, bankrupts its banks and leaves a deficit of £160bn and a devastated tax base...
    UK record was in the 1970s,
    He cannot be expected to go back more than a day Alan.
    Yo malc. how's things ?

    Haven't caught up with you for a while, hope you had a good break and are getting in the malt for Burns Night.
    Hello Alan, yes all well, plenty of supplies and haggis and neeps as well. I am still toiling , living in hope of big payoff but not much chance of either payoff or big way things are going. Need to start winding down. Hope you and family are well.
    You're in the wrong bit of your employer, my missus is being offered payoffs about once every 6 months.
    We have people go, not as many as other areas , but they just laugh at me asking.
    LOL your PBC rating is too high !

    Loaf about and tell them to do their own work, you'll soon get it down :-)
    That is what the wife says as well. I need to start putting the feet up.
    A colleague of the wife wants to go in the next 12 months and has been managing his rating downwards for 2 years so he doesn't get blocked.
    That is my plan, or hope there is a big one. I think they will be trying to do on the cheap from now though. Anything not customer based will be toast for sure.
  • Plato_SaysPlato_Says Posts: 11,822
    Big cock up by BBC and Guardian. PCC is pissed off.

    Noticed Guardian took down their article.
    alex. said:

    If it hasn't been mentioned.

    http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2016/jan/21/lancashire-police-criticise-bbc-over-terrorist-house-story

    Interesting to read that the guardian are investigating their publication of the story as well.

  • Plato_SaysPlato_Says Posts: 11,822
    edited 2016 21
    @Alanbrooke You're relentlessly negative though. It makes your comments redundant too often.

    Being uber negative is no better than positive.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,755

    Will people stop posting their potential profits on Trump being the nominee.

    Perhaps Nate Silver's latest piece will help calm your nerves :)http://fivethirtyeight.com/
  • AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 25,738
    edited 2016 21

    You're relentlessly negative though. It makes your comments redundant too often.

    Being uber negative is no better than positive.

    malcolmg said:

    malcolmg said:

    malcolmg said:

    malcolmg said:

    malcolmg said:

    Is this accurate?

    Glen OHara
    Here's some more gloom for you: if another recession, the UK is much, much worse equipped to fight back in policy terms than in 2007.

    @PlatoSays Much higher debt and deficit in public sector, no room to cut interest rates, QE alr ramped up.

    Certainly there is no ammters if we do have another serious recession.
    Record UK car production announced today.
    The economic cycle is inevitable. A recession is 2 quarters of negative growth. This is not necessarily the same as a crash which wipes about 7% of the economic capacity of the country, bankrupts its banks and leaves a deficit of £160bn and a devastated tax base...
    UK record was in the 1970s,
    He cannot be expected to go back more than a day Alan.
    Yo malc. how's things ?

    Haven't caught up with you for a while, hope you had a good break and are getting in the malt for Burns Night.
    Hello Alan, are going. Need to start winding down. Hope you and family are well.
    You're in the wrong bit of your employer, my missus is being offered payoffs about once every 6 months.
    We have people go, not as many as other areas , but they just laugh at me asking.
    LOL your PBC rating is too high !

    Loaf about and tell them to do their own work, you'll soon get it down :-)
    That is what the wife says as well. I need to start putting the feet up.
    A colleague of the wife wants to go in the next 12 months and has been managing his rating downwards for 2 years so he doesn't get blocked.
    That is my plan, or hope there is a big one. I think they will be trying to do on the cheap from now though. Anything not customer based will be toast for sure.
    Nonsense miss P, I can assure you that when it comes to Scotland's prospects post Indy malc's anything but negative.
  • SpeedySpeedy Posts: 12,100

    Will people stop posting their potential profits on Trump being the nominee.

    You know you should have listened to me back in May when I said about Trump, he was at 100/1 odds.
    If this guy can be President, so can Trump:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uO46ii3W07U
  • TheWhiteRabbitTheWhiteRabbit Posts: 12,454

    Will people stop posting their potential profits on Trump being the nominee.

    I win £150 if he wins New Hampshire, by the way. Hehe.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,755
    edited 2016 21

    Will people stop posting their potential profits on Trump being the nominee.

    I win £150 if he wins New Hampshire, by the way. Hehe.
    NICE !

    Your position is better than mine actually :D
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,755
    edited 2016 21
    How much did you get on at 100s, @Speedy :D
  • dr_spyndr_spyn Posts: 11,302

    Roger said:

    OT

    Interesting that there should be such outrage at the Russians killing one of their citizens abroad.

    Didn't Maggie murder a couple of British citizens in Gibraltar (to great acclaim) some years ago?

    Perhaps Litvinenco deserved it less than those men on the 'Rock' but I'm not sure the principle differs very much

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Death_on_the_Rock

    1) She didn't order them shot
    2) They were shot because it was believed by the men who shot them that they were in possession of the detonator of a car bomb.
    3) They actually did have a car bomb - though it turned out that they'd left it parked in Spain to do some more recon of their target.

    Your idea needs some work - bit like your idea that the Cologne was about working girls ripping off innocent men...
    Private Eye on that inquest.

    http://www.private-eye.co.uk/covers/cover-698
  • Plato_SaysPlato_Says Posts: 11,822
    I'm referring to yours.

    You're relentlessly negative though. It makes your comments redundant too often.

    Being uber negative is no better than positive.

    malcolmg said:

    malcolmg said:

    malcolmg said:

    malcolmg said:

    malcolmg said:

    Is this accurate?

    Glen OHara
    Here's some more gloom for you: if another recession, the UK is much, much worse equipped to fight back in policy terms than in 2007.

    @PlatoSays Much higher debt and deficit in public sector, no room to cut interest rates, QE alr ramped up.

    Certainly there is no ammters if we do have another serious recession.
    Record UK car production announced today.
    The economic cycle is inevitable. A recession is 2 quarters of negative growth. This is not necessarily the same as a crash which wipes about 7% of the economic capacity of the country, bankrupts its banks and leaves a deficit of £160bn and a devastated tax base...
    UK record was in the 1970s,
    He cannot be expected to go back more than a day Alan.
    Yo malc. how's things ?

    Haven't caught up with you for a while, hope you had a good break and are getting in the malt for Burns Night.
    Hello Alan, are going. Need to start winding down. Hope you and family are well.
    You're in the wrong bit of your employer, my missus is being offered payoffs about once every 6 months.
    We have people go, not as many as other areas , but they just laugh at me asking.
    LOL your PBC rating is too high !

    Loaf about and tell them to do their own work, you'll soon get it down :-)
    That is what the wife says as well. I need to start putting the feet up.
    A colleague of the wife wants to go in the next 12 months and has been managing his rating downwards for 2 years so he doesn't get blocked.
    That is my plan, or hope there is a big one. I think they will be trying to do on the cheap from now though. Anything not customer based will be toast for sure.
    Nonsense miss P, I can assure you that when it comes to Scotland's prospects post Indy malc's anything but negative.

  • AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 25,738
    edited 2016 21

    I'm referring to yours.

    You're relentlessly negative though. It makes your comments redundant too often.

    Being uber negative is no better than positive.

    malcolmg said:

    malcolmg said:

    malcolmg said:

    malcolmg said:

    malcolmg said:

    Is this accurate?

    Glen OHara
    Here's some more gloom for you: if another recession, the UK is much, much worse equipped to fight back in policy terms than in 2007.

    @PlatoSays Much higher debt and deficit in public sector, no room to cut interest rates, QE alr ramped up.

    Certainly there is no ammters if we do have another serious recession.
    Record UK car tax base...
    UK record was in the 1970s,
    He cannot be expected to go back more than a day Alan.
    Yo malc. how's things ?

    Haven't caught up with you for a while, hope you had a good break and are getting in the malt for Burns Night.
    Hello Alan, are going. Need to start winding down. Hope you and family are well.
    You're in the wrong bit of your employer, my missus is being offered payoffs about once every 6 months.
    We have people go, not as many as other areas , but they just laugh at me asking.
    LOL your PBC rating is too high !

    Loaf about and tell them to do their own work, you'll soon get it down :-)
    That is what the wife says as well. I need to start putting the feet up.
    A colleague of the wife wants to go in the next 12 months and has been managing his rating downwards for 2 years so he doesn't get blocked.
    That is my plan, or hope there is a big one. I think they will be trying to do on the cheap from now though. Anything not customer based will be toast for sure.
    Nonsense miss P, I can assure you that when it comes to Scotland's prospects post Indy malc's anything but negative.


    That's even better.

    When you get to a certain age and see the same nonsense going around for the third time why you you treat it with anything else but ridicule ?
  • Chris_AChris_A Posts: 1,237

    Chris_A said:

    Perhaps The King's Fund is a loony left organisation too, or it could just be that the government's claims to be generous to the NHS are a load of hot air?

    http://www.kingsfund.org.uk/blog/2016/01/how-does-nhs-spending-compare-health-spending-internationally

    Of course it is generous to the NHS in the context of a 160bn deficit. Where do you expect this money, this extra money you want, to come from?
    In everyday life, what do you make of someone who boasts how he spend a river of cash on his car, his house etc?

    Normal people talk about how they got a good deal for what they had to spend.

    Perhaps there is a lesson in that for politicians.
    It has to come from somewhere. The fairest way would be from taxation.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 52,556
    dr_spyn said:

    Roger said:

    OT

    Interesting that there should be such outrage at the Russians killing one of their citizens abroad.

    Didn't Maggie murder a couple of British citizens in Gibraltar (to great acclaim) some years ago?

    Perhaps Litvinenco deserved it less than those men on the 'Rock' but I'm not sure the principle differs very much

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Death_on_the_Rock

    1) She didn't order them shot
    2) They were shot because it was believed by the men who shot them that they were in possession of the detonator of a car bomb.
    3) They actually did have a car bomb - though it turned out that they'd left it parked in Spain to do some more recon of their target.

    Your idea needs some work - bit like your idea that the Cologne was about working girls ripping off innocent men...
    Private Eye on that inquest.

    http://www.private-eye.co.uk/covers/cover-698
    I always find the upset at overkill interesting. A friend, years ago, was asked by a farmer to help shoot a fox that was regularly attacking the chicken run. She did so with rifle that would stop a rhino. The idea was that it is easy to miss and wound a fox - with this gun there was no chance that the fox could survive being hit anywhere.

    The local animal rights types got very bent out of shape by the fact that the fox basically vapourised when hit.
  • Plato_SaysPlato_Says Posts: 11,822
    One can be sceptical, without rubbishing.

    I've seen same behaviour 3x and got bored myself. Then another made it work.

    I'm referring to yours.

    You're relentlessly negative though. It makes your comments redundant too often.

    Being uber negative is no better than positive.

    malcolmg said:

    malcolmg said:

    malcolmg said:

    malcolmg said:

    malcolmg said:

    Is this accurate?

    Glen OHara
    Here's some more gloom for you: if another recession, the UK is much, much worse equipped to fight back in policy terms than in 2007.

    @PlatoSays Much higher debt and deficit in public sector, no room to cut interest rates, QE alr ramped up.

    Certainly there is no ammters if we do have another serious recession.
    Record UK car tax base...
    UK record was in the 1970s,
    He cannot be expected to go back more than a day Alan.
    Yo malc. how's things ?

    Haven't caught up with you for a while, hope you had a good break and are getting in the malt for Burns Night.
    Hello Alan, are going. Need to start winding down. Hope you and family are well.
    You're in the wrong bit of your employer, my missus is being offered payoffs about once every 6 months.
    We have people go, not as many as other areas , but they just laugh at me asking.
    LOL your PBC rating is too high !

    Loaf about and tell them to do their own work, you'll soon get it down :-)
    That is what the wife says as well. I need to start putting the feet up.
    A colleague of the wife wants to go in the next 12 months and has been managing his rating downwards for 2 years so he doesn't get blocked.
    That is my plan, or hope there is a big one. I think they will be trying to do on the cheap from now though. Anything not customer based will be toast for sure.
    Nonsense miss P, I can assure you that when it comes to Scotland's prospects post Indy malc's anything but negative.
    That's even better.

    When you get to a certain age and see the same nonsense going around for the third time why you you treat it with anything else but ridicule ?

  • Chris_AChris_A Posts: 1,237

    Chris_A said:

    Perhaps The King's Fund is a loony left organisation too, or it could just be that the government's claims to be generous to the NHS are a load of hot air?

    http://www.kingsfund.org.uk/blog/2016/01/how-does-nhs-spending-compare-health-spending-internationally

    Of course it is generous to the NHS in the context of a 160bn deficit. Where do you expect this money, this extra money you want, to come from?
    Sorry I replied to the wrong poster. It's not what I want but rather what the public might expect from a health service. Someone has to put the money in - we're living longer, drugs are becoming ever more expensive and treatments more elaborate. We could have a fairly basic health service when our European neighbours are getting the latest treatment options - that's the way it is going.
  • WandererWanderer Posts: 3,838


    I worked in UK car manufacturing for the best part of 25 years.

    I just point out bollocks when it's being posted if you don't liked being called out stop posting crap.

    What is your assessment of our car manufacturing prospects? (If it's something you can express in a few words. I realise it could take a book to answer fully.)
  • Plato_SaysPlato_Says Posts: 11,822
    I wonder what our old friends in The Scottish Resistance think of the Litvinenko verdict?

    Oh. https://t.co/7e30bGEHgx
  • RogerRoger Posts: 20,062
    Plato

    "Nah. You post about all sorts. No idea fixe."

    Franglais?
  • watford30watford30 Posts: 3,474
    edited 2016 21

    I wonder what our old friends in The Scottish Resistance think of the Litvinenko verdict?

    Oh. https://t.co/7e30bGEHgx

    Talking of which, there must be a few CyberNats on Moscow's payroll, operating out of Mother Russia.
  • DecrepitJohnLDecrepitJohnL Posts: 13,300

    Pulpstar said:

    http://fivethirtyeight.com/features/one-big-reason-to-be-less-skeptical-of-trump/

    But so far, the party isn’t doing much to stop Trump. Instead, it’s making such an effort against Cruz. Consider:

    The governor of Iowa, Terry Branstad, said he wanted Cruz defeated.

    Bob Dole warned of “cataclysmic” losses if Cruz was the nominee, and said Trump would fare better.

    Mitch McConnell and other Republicans senators have been decidedly unhelpful to Cruz when discussing his constitutional eligibility to be president.

    An anti-Cruz PAC has formed, with plans to run advertisements in Iowa. (By contrast, no PAC advertising has run against Trump so far in January.)

    You can find lots of other examples like these.
    Might explain the up-tick in betting on Kasich.
    Nate Silver looks like he's come round to the idea of the Donald being GOP nominee.
    Pffft. What the eff does Nate Silver know about American politics?

    He knows sod all about football. Brazil FFS.
  • WandererWanderer Posts: 3,838
    Chris_A said:

    Chris_A said:

    Perhaps The King's Fund is a loony left organisation too, or it could just be that the government's claims to be generous to the NHS are a load of hot air?

    http://www.kingsfund.org.uk/blog/2016/01/how-does-nhs-spending-compare-health-spending-internationally

    Of course it is generous to the NHS in the context of a 160bn deficit. Where do you expect this money, this extra money you want, to come from?
    Sorry I replied to the wrong poster. It's not what I want but rather what the public might expect from a health service. Someone has to put the money in - we're living longer, drugs are becoming ever more expensive and treatments more elaborate. We could have a fairly basic health service when our European neighbours are getting the latest treatment options - that's the way it is going.
    Personally, and although I am fiscally conservative generally, I would not object to a tax increase that funded higher spending on the NHS.

    I think we are going to want to spend more of our GDP on health. In fact, I think we should be setting ambitious targets for increased healthy longevity. And it will cost serious money.

    Of course there are alternative models for healthcare but the NHS is what we have. We are not going to change it fundamentally so we should give it the resources to deliver what we want.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 125,154
    Speedy said:

    Will people stop posting their potential profits on Trump being the nominee.

    You know you should have listened to me back in May when I said about Trump, he was at 100/1 odds.
    If this guy can be President, so can Trump:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uO46ii3W07U
    Bush was likeable and had charisma and preached compassion for the poor and made great efforts to reach out to Hispanics and minorities to reflect America's future, Trump makes bombastic speeches preaching hate and alienating the very minorities who the GOP needs to win back. This election was a very winnable one for the GOP, Hillary was a very beatable candidate, she will be crossing her fingers and praying Trump is her opponent, Clinton-Castro would lock up the female and Hispanic vote, no matter how many angry white men Trump has behind him!
  • dr_spyndr_spyn Posts: 11,302
    edited 2016 21
    Lord Winston said he will be dead before the party returns to power. - See more at: https://www.politicshome.com/party-politics/articles/story/labour-shambles-and-has-already-lost-2020-election-says-tv-personality#sthash.5dd8EqvK.dpuf

    A decent man, shocked by the fools in charge of a party he has supported for years.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 125,154
    Great quip by Theresa May

    "She told a packed reception for the Journalists’ Charity that she was full of admiration and praise that journalists were raising funds to allow those of their colleagues who had fallen on hard times to be looked after in a care home.

    Mrs May said politicians did a similar thing: 'We just call it the House of Lords.'”
    http://www.standard.co.uk/news/londoners-diary/londoners-diary-mariella-needs-help-to-choose-the-best-erotica-a3161946.html
  • Scott_PScott_P Posts: 51,453
    The juxtaposition of these 2 stories is amusing

    @politicshome: EXCL: Labour is a "shambles" and has already lost the next election, says top peer https://t.co/iNbl76bfDp https://t.co/AoqlPcB5cW

    @e_casalicchio: EXCL: @jeremycorbyn ally says Labour left is 'f*cked' if party loses in 2020 - https://t.co/Y7RZ2BsCw9 https://t.co/XK2vQRFLDS
  • AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 25,738
    edited 2016 21

    One can be sceptical, without rubbishing.

    I've seen same behaviour 3x and got bored myself. Then another made it work.

    I'm referring to yours.

    You're relentlessly negative though. It makes your comments redundant too often.

    Being uber negative is no better than positive.

    malcolmg said:

    rottenborough">

    Is this accurate?

    Glen OHara
    Here's some more gloom for you: if another recession, the UK is much, much worse equipped to fight back in policy terms than in 2007.

    @PlatoSays Much hi QE alr ramped up.

    Certainly there is no ammters if we do have another serious recession.
    Record UK car tax base...
    UK record was in the 1970s,
    He cannot be expected to go back more than a day Alan.
    Yo malc. how's things ?

    Haven't e malt for Burns Night.
    Hello Alan, are going you and family are well.
    You're in the wrong bit of your employer, my missus is being offered payoffs about once every 6 months.
    We have peoe asking.







    Nonsense miss P, I can assure you that when it comes to Scotland's prospects post Indy malc's anything but negative.



    That's even better.

    When you get to a certain age and see the same nonsense going around for the third time why you you treat it with anything else but ridicule ?



    If something is factually wrong it is wrong, that's rubbishing only in so far as pointing out the facts. Since we have so many happy clappy party rampers on the site then an occasional brush with reality doesn't hurt.

    TBF your beef seems to be more about the shift in the site. Compared to say 2009 when we both were about, we;ve lost a substantial numbers of lefty posters from Labour and LDs. There is no longer such a clear split down left \ right lines. It's been pretty clear for years the left has run out of bullets so now the policy challenges to HMG come from the Right rather than the Left, something which appears to upset you.
  • CookieCookie Posts: 14,400

    A Labour government could give employees the right to take over their companies if they are sold, dissolved or floated on the stock market.

    http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-politics-35370234

    Right lads, Cadbury's is being sold for many billions. Lets have a whip round in the canteen and see if we can get the money together...

    Surely they already have this right?
  • AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 25,738
    Wanderer said:


    I worked in UK car manufacturing for the best part of 25 years.

    I just point out bollocks when it's being posted if you don't liked being called out stop posting crap.

    What is your assessment of our car manufacturing prospects? (If it's something you can express in a few words. I realise it could take a book to answer fully.)
    We'll peak out about 1,8 million cars mostly high value luxury marques. Successful cos like JLR are already opening plants overseas so that's where they'll shift more production.

    But the industry itself will be much more successful than in 1972 as the cars are profitable and desirable. It could be even more so if we could improve the supply chain and engineering infrastructure but the HMG has no real appetitie to do this.
  • WandererWanderer Posts: 3,838
    HYUFD said:


    Bush was likeable and had charisma and preached compassion for the poor and made great efforts to reach out to Hispanics and minorities to reflect America's future

    That's true. Post 9/11 and Iraq we have a different impression of W, and I don't think he ever played well in Europe, but he was a decent candidate in 2000. (One can't say exactly a strong candidate. He did kind-of lose to Al Gore.)
This discussion has been closed.