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politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » Trump moves to new high in first poll carried out entirely

SystemSystem Posts: 12,222
edited December 2015 in General

imagepoliticalbetting.com » Blog Archive » Trump moves to new high in first poll carried out entirely AFTER his controversial Muslim immigration statement

Trump reaches new high in Zogby poll conducted AFTER Muslim statement
Trump: 38%
Carson: 13%
Rubio: 12%
Cruz: 8%
Bush: 7%
Christie: 4%

Read the full story here


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Comments

  • Scary
  • RobDRobD Posts: 60,046
    edited December 2015

    Scary

    You know what's scary? The fact the AV thread is mere DAYS away :o
  • RobD said:

    Scary

    You know what's scary? The fact the AV thread is mere DAYS away :o
    There will be NO AV thread during 2015.
  • RobDRobD Posts: 60,046

    RobD said:

    Scary

    You know what's scary? The fact the AV thread is mere DAYS away :o
    There will be NO AV thread during 2015.
    Do we get a vote on the matter? By AV perchance? :p
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 61,986
    edited December 2015
    Mr. Smithson is quite right to rule out an AV thread. Only the most degenerate of deviants would salivate at the prospect of such depravity.

    Edited extra bit: anyway, must go do some exercise. If I don't return for a while, as per last thread, it's likely my monitor's just died.
  • Plato_SaysPlato_Says Posts: 11,822
    Is there nothing Donald can do to lose votes?! I'm finding this all most amusing.
  • Hardly a surprise. Huge swathes of the Muslim community won't integrate here in the UK, and I expect it's the same in the US. Nobody wants a parallel society in their country that dislikes if not outright hates them. I find it baffling that politicians and media types don't seem able to understand this
  • MP_SEMP_SE Posts: 3,642
    The thought of Trump getting the nomination is worrying as he will hand Hilary Clinton the keys to the White House.
  • Is there nothing Donald can do to lose votes?! I'm finding this all most amusing.

    makes me nervous. what if he got the nomination and they voted him in?
  • My immediate reaction to Trump's statement was that he had blown it. Then after a few minutes thought I decided it was the reverse. He had appealed to his hard core just when he needs them to turn out in two or three week's time in Iowa.

    As it is I have steered clear of betting on Trump. Can't bring myself to. Looking more positively Rubio has secured some major GOP donors in last few days. Maybe the establishment is finally coming to a conclusion as to who they want to stop Trump (Bush having now pretty clearly blown it by looks of things).

  • SimonStClareSimonStClare Posts: 7,976
    edited December 2015
    Those who were predicting, including punters on Betfair, that Donald Trump’s controversial Muslim immigration statement would be a negative might have read it wrongly.

    It was daft to make such predictions without waiting for the poll reaction of Americans.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 120,016
    edited December 2015
    The more I think about it, the more Trump reminds me of George Wallace.

    Let us hope Trump recants his views in the way Wallace did.

    Edit: Hopefully without the need of any bullets.
  • Scott_PScott_P Posts: 51,453
    @realDonaldTrump: The United Kingdom is trying hard to disguise their massive Muslim problem. Everybody is wise to what is happening, very sad! Be honest.

    @Gary_Bainbridge: @aljwhite @realDonaldTrump I am worried about this massive Muslim. How tall is he?
  • RobD said:

    Scary

    You know what's scary? The fact the AV thread is mere DAYS away :o
    There will be NO AV thread during 2015.
    Boo.
  • MonikerDiCanioMonikerDiCanio Posts: 5,792
    edited December 2015
    I was struck that in the Frank Luntz focus group arranged to sample popular reaction to Trump's Muslim immigration to the US proposal that the African Americans were uniformly supportive of Donald. Maybe Trump can attract more African Americans to the Republicans than has hitherto been done.
  • Sean_FSean_F Posts: 37,564

    Hardly a surprise. Huge swathes of the Muslim community won't integrate here in the UK, and I expect it's the same in the US. Nobody wants a parallel society in their country that dislikes if not outright hates them. I find it baffling that politicians and media types don't seem able to understand this

    Most US Muslims are professional people who are generally well-integrated.
  • Sean_FSean_F Posts: 37,564

    The more I think about it, the more Trump reminds me of George Wallace.

    Let us hope Trump recants his views in the way Wallace did.

    Edit: Hopefully without the need of any bullets.

    His vice-Presidential running mate, Curtis Le May, once advocated nuking Switzerland to increase the value of US gold reserves.
  • In more dismal US news, the Klu Klux Klan has apparently had to upgrade its web servers following a spike of interest thanks to Trump.
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 52,333

    Looking more positively Rubio has secured some major GOP donors in last few days. Maybe the establishment is finally coming to a conclusion as to who they want to stop Trump (Bush having now pretty clearly blown it by looks of things).

    If it's Rubio, I'd bet heavily on Clinton. He's not up to it.

    Rubio really shows himself up in this clip from the Foreign Relations Committee. First he doesn't listen to what Ash Carter says and comes away with exactly the opposite sound-bite from what was actually said, then sticks to his script to attack John Kerry despite having already been told that his main point was wrong.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tp6sTe1cNqs
  • Sean_F said:

    The more I think about it, the more Trump reminds me of George Wallace.

    Let us hope Trump recants his views in the way Wallace did.

    Edit: Hopefully without the need of any bullets.

    His vice-Presidential running mate, Curtis Le May, once advocated nuking Switzerland to increase the value of US gold reserves.
    Curtis Le May always struck me as a bit odd, he only stood as Wallace's running mate because he thought Wallace was strong on national security

    The fact he was in charge of the US Air Force and the nuclear deterrent made him sound like something out of Doctor Strangelove
  • RobD said:

    Scary

    You know what's scary? The fact the AV thread is mere DAYS away :o
    There will be NO AV thread during 2015.
    Boo.
    its going to be an AMS thread!
  • This alarms me, as I'm someone who uses his iPad a lot on public transport

    A Muslim was forced off a Tube in north London after a commuter complained he used an iPad "suspiciously", it is claimed.

    The man was apparently told to leave the Piccadilly Line train near Finsbury Park last night after he switched off his tablet device when the commuter looked at it.

    Witnesses described how the man appeared shocked before getting off the train at Wood Green station, despite other commuters rushing to his defence.

    One onlooker, who asked only to be named as Jonny, said several people on board called the abuser racist, but he was unfazed.

    http://bit.ly/1NLWhvp
  • I was struck that in the Frank Luntz focus group arranged to sample popular reaction to Trump's Muslim immigration to the US proposal that the African Americans were uniformly supportive of Donald. Maybe Trump can attract more African Americans to the Republicans than has hitherto been done.

    what, even the muslim african americans supported the donald?
  • Shark has been jumped. Respected? Respected?

    @realDonaldTrump: Thank you to respected columnist Katie Hopkins of Daily http://Mail.com for her powerful writing on the U.K.'s Muslim problems
  • WandererWanderer Posts: 3,838
    What must Muslim Americans be thinking?

    I'm trying to think what I would do if the leading candidate for Labour or Conservative leader said that people like me should be excluded from the country and their polling improved. Start packing my bags?
  • felixfelix Posts: 15,175

    Hardly a surprise. Huge swathes of the Muslim community won't integrate here in the UK, and I expect it's the same in the US. Nobody wants a parallel society in their country that dislikes if not outright hates them. I find it baffling that politicians and media types don't seem able to understand this

    It's a mystery - every time there's a twitter outrage - the good old public respond with an almighty one fingered response.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,422
    Amazing.
  • Sean_F said:

    The more I think about it, the more Trump reminds me of George Wallace.

    Let us hope Trump recants his views in the way Wallace did.

    Edit: Hopefully without the need of any bullets.

    His vice-Presidential running mate, Curtis Le May, once advocated nuking Switzerland to increase the value of US gold reserves.
    Curtis Le May always struck me as a bit odd, he only stood as Wallace's running mate because he thought Wallace was strong on national security

    The fact he was in charge of the US Air Force and the nuclear deterrent made him sound like something out of Doctor Strangelove
    I'd have expected more sympathy for the Iron Eagle from someone with your nom de guerre.
  • felix said:

    Hardly a surprise. Huge swathes of the Muslim community won't integrate here in the UK, and I expect it's the same in the US. Nobody wants a parallel society in their country that dislikes if not outright hates them. I find it baffling that politicians and media types don't seem able to understand this

    It's a mystery - every time there's a twitter outrage - the good old public respond with an almighty one fingered response.
    Crazy, right? it's almost as if Twitter isn't indicative of public opinion ;)
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 52,333

    Shark has been jumped. Respected? Respected?

    @realDonaldTrump: Thank you to respected columnist Katie Hopkins of Daily http://Mail.com for her powerful writing on the U.K.'s Muslim problems

    You realise she could get a US media career off the back of this?
  • I was struck that in the Frank Luntz focus group arranged to sample popular reaction to Trump's Muslim immigration to the US proposal that the African Americans were uniformly supportive of Donald. Maybe Trump can attract more African Americans to the Republicans than has hitherto been done.

    what, even the muslim african americans supported the donald?
    Alas Luntz's focus group was Muslimrein.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,422
    Ben Carson looks good value at 120.0 on Betfair btw.
  • Shark has been jumped. Respected? Respected?

    @realDonaldTrump: Thank you to respected columnist Katie Hopkins of Daily http://Mail.com for her powerful writing on the U.K.'s Muslim problems

    they're two of a kind really aren't they. Imagine if Hannan got his way, the tory party was all open primaries, and Katie Hopkins was yr candidate !
  • Shark has been jumped. Respected? Respected?

    @realDonaldTrump: Thank you to respected columnist Katie Hopkins of Daily http://Mail.com for her powerful writing on the U.K.'s Muslim problems

    You realise she could get a US media career off the back of this?
    Brilliant, she should head off to America
  • Shark has been jumped. Respected? Respected?

    @realDonaldTrump: Thank you to respected columnist Katie Hopkins of Daily http://Mail.com for her powerful writing on the U.K.'s Muslim problems

    You realise she could get a US media career off the back of this?
    that is her plan, presumably
  • Wanderer said:

    What must Muslim Americans be thinking?

    I'm trying to think what I would do if the leading candidate for Labour or Conservative leader said that people like me should be excluded from the country and their polling improved. Start packing my bags?

    Well my advice to the Muslim community would be, "fit in or f*** off". And if our esteemed politicians had made that clear from the beginning, certain areas of our green and pleasant land wouldn't be overrun with barbarous religious savages.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 120,016
    edited December 2015

    Shark has been jumped. Respected? Respected?

    @realDonaldTrump: Thank you to respected columnist Katie Hopkins of Daily http://Mail.com for her powerful writing on the U.K.'s Muslim problems

    they're two of a kind really aren't they. Imagine if Hannan got his way, the tory party was all open primaries, and Katie Hopkins was yr candidate !
    During the election campaign the only moment when I had real doubts that the Tories would win was when Ms Hopkins said she'd emigrate if Ed Miliband became PM.

    Even I contemplated voting Labour for an hour or two.
  • DairDair Posts: 6,108

    RobD said:

    Scary

    You know what's scary? The fact the AV thread is mere DAYS away :o
    There will be NO AV thread during 2015.
    How about a vote, with campaigns No2AVTHreads and YES!ToFairerThreads arguing the case.


  • Well my advice to the Muslim community would be, "fit in or f*** off". And if our esteemed politicians had made that clear from the beginning, certain areas of our green and pleasant land wouldn't be overrun with barbarous religious savages.

    yeah, cause that kind of welcoming talk makes it really easy to fit in. You can't integrate on yr own
  • blackburn63blackburn63 Posts: 4,492
    Although I disagree with what Trump said I'm thoroughly enjoying the reaction.

    It's an example of a society without perspective, those older than me that lived through wars and suffered real hardship really don't know what the fuss is all about. An overseas candidate "said" something, some people must have empty and dull lives to get so excited about it.
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 52,333

    Shark has been jumped. Respected? Respected?

    @realDonaldTrump: Thank you to respected columnist Katie Hopkins of Daily http://Mail.com for her powerful writing on the U.K.'s Muslim problems

    they're two of a kind really aren't they. Imagine if Hannan got his way, the tory party was all open primaries, and Katie Hopkins was yr candidate !
    "Donald J. Trump ‏@realDonaldTrump 16m16 minutes ago

    The politicians of the U.K. should watch Katie Hopkins of Daily http://Mail.com on @FoxNews. Many people in the U.K. agree with me!"
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,597

    RobD said:

    Scary

    You know what's scary? The fact the AV thread is mere DAYS away :o
    There will be NO AV thread during 2015.
    I trust there will be something to compensate in its place? When OGH takes away withone hand...
  • DairDair Posts: 6,108

    Shark has been jumped. Respected? Respected?

    @realDonaldTrump: Thank you to respected columnist Katie Hopkins of Daily http://Mail.com for her powerful writing on the U.K.'s Muslim problems

    That is probably the greatest Tweet I have ever read.
  • blackburn63blackburn63 Posts: 4,492
    Wanderer said:

    What must Muslim Americans be thinking?

    I'm trying to think what I would do if the leading candidate for Labour or Conservative leader said that people like me should be excluded from the country and their polling improved. Start packing my bags?

    The chances of it happening are so remotely slim I think you can relax for a little while longer.

    It'll be Ukip that drag you from the house in the middle of the night and herd you onto a train.


  • The politicians of the U.K. should watch Katie Hopkins of Daily http://Mail.com on @FoxNews. Many people in the U.K. agree with me!"

    haha, she doesn't hang around, you can say that for her!
  • malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 43,535

    Is there nothing Donald can do to lose votes?! I'm finding this all most amusing.

    He is in touch with the people, the bubble livers on here cannot grasp reality. People are sick of your average lying troughing politician same as we have here, soon they will be happy to vote any nutter but the lying incumbent warmongering troughers.


  • Well my advice to the Muslim community would be, "fit in or f*** off". And if our esteemed politicians had made that clear from the beginning, certain areas of our green and pleasant land wouldn't be overrun with barbarous religious savages.

    yeah, cause that kind of welcoming talk makes it really easy to fit in. You can't integrate on yr own
    They've had plenty of time to make an effort - they've chosen not to integrate, and the longer they leave it, the harder it'll be. I doubt the public's patience will last forever.
  • kle4 said:

    RobD said:

    Scary

    You know what's scary? The fact the AV thread is mere DAYS away :o
    There will be NO AV thread during 2015.
    I trust there will be something to compensate in its place? When OGH takes away withone hand...
    I'll rebadge it as an electoral reform thread.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,597
    malcolmg said:

    Is there nothing Donald can do to lose votes?! I'm finding this all most amusing.

    He is in touch with the people, the bubble livers on here cannot grasp reality. People are sick of your average lying troughing politician same as we have here, soon they will be happy to vote any nutter but the lying incumbent warmongering troughers.
    I get that people are 'sick' of normal politicians, with all their faults, but there have to be options besides nutters, as you term them. Being sick of normal politicians was supposed to be one reason people voted SNP and swept away SLAB, and for all I dislike their ultimate aim, most people opposed to them would not say the SNP are nutters, it surely cannot be hard to find not nutter alternatives, or shouldn't be.
  • malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 43,535

    In more dismal US news, the Klu Klux Klan has apparently had to upgrade its web servers following a spike of interest thanks to Trump.

    Every cloud though , will be a boost for sheet manufacturers
  • blackburn63blackburn63 Posts: 4,492
    Who/what is OGH?
  • NickPalmerNickPalmer Posts: 21,572
    MP_SE said:

    The thought of Trump getting the nomination is worrying as he will hand Hilary Clinton the keys to the White House.

    That's why lefties like him. Though I wouldn't say that we're that convinced by Hillary either. The perfect leftie scenario is that Hillary reaches the convention with Bernie on her heels, then pulls out for some reason and there's no time to find someone else; then the GOP chooses Trump, and he manages to insult enough people to make Bernie President.

    Hey, it's almost Christmas (excuse me, Winterval), we can dream. Failing that, Hillary will do fine.


  • They've had plenty of time to make an effort - they've chosen not to integrate, and the longer they leave it, the harder it'll be. I doubt the public's patience will last forever.

    it sounds like you've chosen not to integrate
  • DairDair Posts: 6,108
    On the subject of who should be POTUS, perhaps it should be Shia Le Beouf.

    https://twitter.com/Independent/status/674935379716272128

    It's really impossible now to decide if he truly is insane or is just operating on a plane so much higher than the rest of us that he should be the new God.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,422

    Who/what is OGH?

    He's ours.
    He's genial
    And he's a host.
  • malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 43,535
    edited December 2015
    kle4 said:

    malcolmg said:

    Is there nothing Donald can do to lose votes?! I'm finding this all most amusing.

    He is in touch with the people, the bubble livers on here cannot grasp reality. People are sick of your average lying troughing politician same as we have here, soon they will be happy to vote any nutter but the lying incumbent warmongering troughers.
    I get that people are 'sick' of normal politicians, with all their faults, but there have to be options besides nutters, as you term them. Being sick of normal politicians was supposed to be one reason people voted SNP and swept away SLAB, and for all I dislike their ultimate aim, most people opposed to them would not say the SNP are nutters, it surely cannot be hard to find not nutter alternatives, or shouldn't be.
    Kle4, the SNP have done very well but when people hate the establishment they will go for what else is on the table and it is not always guaranteed to be good, there is every chance you will get some nutters. We see Trumps numbers going ever upward, not so many people are laughing now , he could feasibly make it.
  • Richard_NabaviRichard_Nabavi Posts: 30,822
    edited December 2015
    Surely the stand-out bet is simply Hillary for Prez at around 1.75 (net of commission at Betfair or at the bookies)?

    (You can even get 1.73 on the Dems chez Paddy, if you don't want to be exposed to Hillary-specific risk).
  • MP_SE said:

    The thought of Trump getting the nomination is worrying as he will hand Hilary Clinton the keys to the White House.

    That's why lefties like him. Though I wouldn't say that we're that convinced by Hillary either. The perfect leftie scenario is that Hillary reaches the convention with Bernie on her heels, then pulls out for some reason and there's no time to find someone else; then the GOP chooses Trump, and he manages to insult enough people to make Bernie President.

    Hey, it's almost Christmas (excuse me, Winterval), we can dream. Failing that, Hillary will do fine.
    I fear president Bernie would be bumped off by the CIA (or just some nutters) before you could say Jack robinson
  • On topic, you shouldn't pay too much attention to the polls at this point. It's actual votes that count, and it's the establishment that counts them.
  • NickPalmerNickPalmer Posts: 21,572

    Wanderer said:

    What must Muslim Americans be thinking?

    I'm trying to think what I would do if the leading candidate for Labour or Conservative leader said that people like me should be excluded from the country and their polling improved. Start packing my bags?

    Well my advice to the Muslim community would be, "fit in or f*** off". And if our esteemed politicians had made that clear from the beginning, certain areas of our green and pleasant land wouldn't be overrun with barbarous religious savages.
    Sheesh. If Britain became a country where one had to fit in with ideas like yours, it'd be time to leave.
  • On topic, you shouldn't pay too much attention to the polls at this point. It's actual votes that count, and it's the establishment that counts them.

    Certainly the case in Iowa but not in the full primary states where elections run by state authorities

  • blackburn63blackburn63 Posts: 4,492

    Wanderer said:

    What must Muslim Americans be thinking?

    I'm trying to think what I would do if the leading candidate for Labour or Conservative leader said that people like me should be excluded from the country and their polling improved. Start packing my bags?

    Well my advice to the Muslim community would be, "fit in or f*** off". And if our esteemed politicians had made that clear from the beginning, certain areas of our green and pleasant land wouldn't be overrun with barbarous religious savages.
    Sheesh. If Britain became a country where one had to fit in with ideas like yours, it'd be time to leave.
    Out of interest Mr Palmer where would you go?

  • Well it doesn't take a brain surgeon to see that wherever Islam meets non-Islam (or even slightly different Islam) in large numbers anywhere in the world it results in a violent struggle.

    The political class and media might pretend that it is all a big racist conspiracy, but it no longer washes with the general public.
  • MarkHopkinsMarkHopkins Posts: 5,584

    Trump trumpets himself and triumphs in the polls.

    The headlines are just going to write themselves when Trump is president.

  • Wanderer said:

    What must Muslim Americans be thinking?

    I'm trying to think what I would do if the leading candidate for Labour or Conservative leader said that people like me should be excluded from the country and their polling improved. Start packing my bags?

    Well my advice to the Muslim community would be, "fit in or f*** off". And if our esteemed politicians had made that clear from the beginning, certain areas of our green and pleasant land wouldn't be overrun with barbarous religious savages.
    Sheesh. If Britain became a country where one had to fit in with ideas like yours, it'd be time to leave.
    Because adapting to fit into a country that *you have chosen to emigrate to* is soooo oppressive right? The horror.
  • viewcodeviewcode Posts: 22,432

    Wanderer said:

    What must Muslim Americans be thinking?

    I'm trying to think what I would do if the leading candidate for Labour or Conservative leader said that people like me should be excluded from the country and their polling improved. Start packing my bags?

    Well my advice to the Muslim community would be, "fit in or f*** off". And if our esteemed politicians had made that clear from the beginning, certain areas of our green and pleasant land wouldn't be overrun with barbarous religious savages.
    You could arguably do that in the UK. But the US has laws against federal imposition of religion. It's legal to be a barbarous religious savage if you obey the law. Margaret Thatcher once defined liberty as "freedom under the law" - you can do what you like provided you don't break the law. A lot of people seem to be forgetting this.
  • weejonnieweejonnie Posts: 3,820



    Well my advice to the Muslim community would be, "fit in or f*** off". And if our esteemed politicians had made that clear from the beginning, certain areas of our green and pleasant land wouldn't be overrun with barbarous religious savages.

    yeah, cause that kind of welcoming talk makes it really easy to fit in. You can't integrate on yr own
    FDR basically told immigrants to America to do just that. They got the ones they wanted. Tony Blair told immigrants the opposite . . .
  • Although I disagree with what Trump said I'm thoroughly enjoying the reaction.

    It's an example of a society without perspective, those older than me that lived through wars and suffered real hardship really don't know what the fuss is all about. An overseas candidate "said" something, some people must have empty and dull lives to get so excited about it.


    'Wossisname, Hitler? He sez he's gonna get rid of all the Joos if he gets to be Reichschancellor. Load of stuff'n'nonsense if you arsk me. Now where's me Daily Mail?'
  • DairDair Posts: 6,108
    Polling Post.

    Just completed a "we need to update your profile" for Populous.

    The update was to answer the question "how interested are you in politics".

    I see a potential flaw with their methodological update.
  • geoffwgeoffw Posts: 8,775
    Many people laughed at Ronald Reagan's candidacy, and when POTUS he was the favourite butt of comedians' jokes. Spitting Image was cruel. In "Back to the Future" it raised the biggest laugh in the cinema. Yet arguably he turned out to be the greatest post WWII president. Could "The Donald" be similar?
  • Wanderer said:

    What must Muslim Americans be thinking?

    I'm trying to think what I would do if the leading candidate for Labour or Conservative leader said that people like me should be excluded from the country and their polling improved. Start packing my bags?

    Well my advice to the Muslim community would be, "fit in or f*** off". And if our esteemed politicians had made that clear from the beginning, certain areas of our green and pleasant land wouldn't be overrun with barbarous religious savages.
    Sheesh. If Britain became a country where one had to fit in with ideas like yours, it'd be time to leave.
    Out of interest Mr Palmer where would you go?

    Dr Palmer has expressed a wish to retire to miranetless Switzerland once his mischief making in the UK is finished.
  • blackburn63blackburn63 Posts: 4,492
    viewcode said:

    Wanderer said:

    What must Muslim Americans be thinking?

    I'm trying to think what I would do if the leading candidate for Labour or Conservative leader said that people like me should be excluded from the country and their polling improved. Start packing my bags?

    Well my advice to the Muslim community would be, "fit in or f*** off". And if our esteemed politicians had made that clear from the beginning, certain areas of our green and pleasant land wouldn't be overrun with barbarous religious savages.
    You could arguably do that in the UK. But the US has laws against federal imposition of religion. It's legal to be a barbarous religious savage if you obey the law. Margaret Thatcher once defined liberty as "freedom under the law" - you can do what you like provided you don't break the law. A lot of people seem to be forgetting this.
    It's the "freedom under the law" bit I struggle with. The right to freedom of speech is linked with the right to be offended, I fear that jails will soon be full of people that offended someone else.

    At least they'll be given an ipad.

  • isamisam Posts: 41,118
    edited December 2015

    Wanderer said:

    What must Muslim Americans be thinking?

    I'm trying to think what I would do if the leading candidate for Labour or Conservative leader said that people like me should be excluded from the country and their polling improved. Start packing my bags?

    Well my advice to the Muslim community would be, "fit in or f*** off". And if our esteemed politicians had made that clear from the beginning, certain areas of our green and pleasant land wouldn't be overrun with barbarous religious savages.
    Sheesh. If Britain became a country where one had to fit in with ideas like yours, it'd be time to leave.
    Because adapting to fit into a country that *you have chosen to emigrate to* is soooo oppressive right? The horror.
    You leave Nick alone.. He and other lefties are just as supportive of Brits in the Costa del Sol who don't speak a word of Spanish, eat fried breakfasts, roast dinners and watch Sky tv you know

    Any Spaniard who doesn't embrace it is a xenophobe
  • felixfelix Posts: 15,175
    Of course Trump is wrong but here is someone who I'd vote for:
    "LOCAL MAYOR REFUSES TO REMOVE PORK FROM SCHOOL CANTEEN MENU AND EXPLAINS WHY.
    Muslim parents have demanded the abolition of pork in all the school
    canteens of a Montreal suburb. It seems it is offensive to the Muslim
    families and shows much disrespect.
    The mayor of the Montreal suburb of Dorval, has refused, and the town
    clerk sent a note to all parents in the municipality to explain why.
    The following is what the note stated:
    “Muslims must understand that they have to adapt to Canada and
    Quebec, its customs, its traditions, its way of life, because that is
    where they chose to immigrate. They must understand that they have to
    integrate and learn to live in Quebec. They must understand that it is
    for them to change their lifestyle, not the Canadians who so
    generously welcomed them.”
    “They must understand that Canadians are neither racist nor
    xenophobic, they accepted many immigrants before Muslims (Whereas the
    reverse is not true, in that ALL Muslim states do not accept
    non-Muslim immigrants.).
    “They must also understand that, no more than other nations, Canadians
    are not willing to give up their identity nor their culture. And if
    Canada is a land of welcome, it is not just the Mayor of Dorval who
    welcomes foreigners, but the Canadian-Quebecois people as a whole. “
    “Finally, they must understand that in Canada (Quebec) with its
    Judeo-Christian roots, Christmas trees, churches and religious
    festivals, religion must remain in the private domain. Therefore, the
    municipality of Dorval was right to refuse any concessions to Islam
    and Sharia.”
    “For Muslims who disagree with secularism and do not feel comfortable
    in Canada, there are 57 beautiful Muslim countries in the world, most
    of them under-populated and ready to receive them with open halal arms
    in accordance with Shariah law. If you left your country for Canada,
    and not for other Muslim countries, it is because you have considered
    that life is better in Canada than elsewhere. So, ask yourself the
    question, just once, “Why is it better here in Canada than where you
    come from?”
    “A canteen with pork is part of the answer.”
  • blackburn63blackburn63 Posts: 4,492

    Although I disagree with what Trump said I'm thoroughly enjoying the reaction.

    It's an example of a society without perspective, those older than me that lived through wars and suffered real hardship really don't know what the fuss is all about. An overseas candidate "said" something, some people must have empty and dull lives to get so excited about it.


    'Wossisname, Hitler? He sez he's gonna get rid of all the Joos if he gets to be Reichschancellor. Load of stuff'n'nonsense if you arsk me. Now where's me Daily Mail?'
    What a strange response.

  • geoffw said:

    Many people laughed at Ronald Reagan's candidacy, and when POTUS he was the favourite butt of comedians' jokes. Spitting Image was cruel. In "Back to the Future" it raised the biggest laugh in the cinema. Yet arguably he turned out to be the greatest post WWII president. Could "The Donald" be similar?

    no
  • blackburn63blackburn63 Posts: 4,492

    Wanderer said:

    What must Muslim Americans be thinking?

    I'm trying to think what I would do if the leading candidate for Labour or Conservative leader said that people like me should be excluded from the country and their polling improved. Start packing my bags?

    Well my advice to the Muslim community would be, "fit in or f*** off". And if our esteemed politicians had made that clear from the beginning, certain areas of our green and pleasant land wouldn't be overrun with barbarous religious savages.
    Sheesh. If Britain became a country where one had to fit in with ideas like yours, it'd be time to leave.
    Out of interest Mr Palmer where would you go?

    Dr Palmer has expressed a wish to retire to miranetless Switzerland once his mischief making in the UK is finished.
    Surely he'd prefer to join a country within the EU?
  • WandererWanderer Posts: 3,838
    edited December 2015
    geoffw said:

    Many people laughed at Ronald Reagan's candidacy, and when POTUS he was the favourite butt of comedians' jokes. Spitting Image was cruel. In "Back to the Future" it raised the biggest laugh in the cinema. Yet arguably he turned out to be the greatest post WWII president. Could "The Donald" be similar?

    Reagan was an experienced and very talented politician though, a two-term Governor of California.
  • Wanderer said:

    What must Muslim Americans be thinking?

    I'm trying to think what I would do if the leading candidate for Labour or Conservative leader said that people like me should be excluded from the country and their polling improved. Start packing my bags?

    Well my advice to the Muslim community would be, "fit in or f*** off". And if our esteemed politicians had made that clear from the beginning, certain areas of our green and pleasant land wouldn't be overrun with barbarous religious savages.
    Sheesh. If Britain became a country where one had to fit in with ideas like yours, it'd be time to leave.
    Out of interest Mr Palmer where would you go?

    Dr Palmer has expressed a wish to retire to miranetless Switzerland once his mischief making in the UK is finished.
    Surely he'd prefer to join a country within the EU?
    Oddly not.
    He's also a great fan of Norway.
  • richardDoddrichardDodd Posts: 5,472
    NPXMP2...byeeee...oh and don't head for Australia...they have much the same attitude there too..
  • DairDair Posts: 6,108
    Nicola Sturgeon absolutely ripped Labour apart at FMQs. A litany of quotes from senior SLABbers objecting to the Queensferry Crossing pretty much kills any political benefit Labour could try to accrue.
  • felix said:

    Of course Trump is wrong but here is someone who I'd vote for:
    "LOCAL MAYOR REFUSES TO REMOVE PORK FROM SCHOOL CANTEEN MENU AND EXPLAINS WHY.
    Muslim parents have demanded the abolition of pork in all the school
    canteens of a Montreal suburb. It seems it is offensive to the Muslim
    families and shows much disrespect.
    The mayor of the Montreal suburb of Dorval, has refused, and the town
    clerk sent a note to all parents in the municipality to explain why.
    The following is what the note stated:
    “Muslims must understand that they have to adapt to Canada and
    Quebec, its customs, its traditions, its way of life, because that is
    where they chose to immigrate. They must understand that they have to
    integrate and learn to live in Quebec. They must understand that it is
    for them to change their lifestyle, not the Canadians who so
    generously welcomed them.”
    “They must understand that Canadians are neither racist nor
    xenophobic, they accepted many immigrants before Muslims (Whereas the
    reverse is not true, in that ALL Muslim states do not accept
    non-Muslim immigrants.).
    “They must also understand that, no more than other nations, Canadians
    are not willing to give up their identity nor their culture. And if
    Canada is a land of welcome, it is not just the Mayor of Dorval who
    welcomes foreigners, but the Canadian-Quebecois people as a whole. “
    “Finally, they must understand that in Canada (Quebec) with its
    Judeo-Christian roots, Christmas trees, churches and religious
    festivals, religion must remain in the private domain. Therefore, the
    municipality of Dorval was right to refuse any concessions to Islam
    and Sharia.”
    “For Muslims who disagree with secularism and do not feel comfortable
    in Canada, there are 57 beautiful Muslim countries in the world, most
    of them under-populated and ready to receive them with open halal arms
    in accordance with Shariah law. If you left your country for Canada,
    and not for other Muslim countries, it is because you have considered
    that life is better in Canada than elsewhere. So, ask yourself the
    question, just once, “Why is it better here in Canada than where you
    come from?”
    “A canteen with pork is part of the answer.”

    A brilliant response. If only it was the UK government saying that. But of course they won't because it's - all together now - RAAAAAAACCIISSTT!!!!!! *rolls eyes*
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,422
    geoffw said:

    Many people laughed at Ronald Reagan's candidacy, and when POTUS he was the favourite butt of comedians' jokes. Spitting Image was cruel. In "Back to the Future" it raised the biggest laugh in the cinema. Yet arguably he turned out to be the greatest post WWII president. Could "The Donald" be similar?

    Where the Donald is going, they don't need muslims.
  • blackburn63blackburn63 Posts: 4,492
    geoffw said:

    Many people laughed at Ronald Reagan's candidacy, and when POTUS he was the favourite butt of comedians' jokes. Spitting Image was cruel. In "Back to the Future" it raised the biggest laugh in the cinema. Yet arguably he turned out to be the greatest post WWII president. Could "The Donald" be similar?

    Ronnie said:

    Government's first duty is to protect the people, not run their lives.

    Amen to that.

  • Although I disagree with what Trump said I'm thoroughly enjoying the reaction.

    It's an example of a society without perspective, those older than me that lived through wars and suffered real hardship really don't know what the fuss is all about. An overseas candidate "said" something, some people must have empty and dull lives to get so excited about it.


    'Wossisname, Hitler? He sez he's gonna get rid of all the Joos if he gets to be Reichschancellor. Load of stuff'n'nonsense if you arsk me. Now where's me Daily Mail?'
    What a strange response.

    You suggested that the older generation that 'lived through wars and suffered real hardship' habitually ignore the wilder statements of overseas candidates. On the dangerous assumption that you're right, do you think that was a sensible position in, say, 1933?
  • John_MJohn_M Posts: 7,503
    Sean_F said:

    The more I think about it, the more Trump reminds me of George Wallace.

    Let us hope Trump recants his views in the way Wallace did.

    Edit: Hopefully without the need of any bullets.

    His vice-Presidential running mate, Curtis Le May, once advocated nuking Switzerland to increase the value of US gold reserves.
    In fairness, Curtis never saw a city that he didn't want to bomb.
  • William_HWilliam_H Posts: 346
    edited December 2015
    felix said:

    Of course Trump is wrong but here is someone who I'd vote for:
    "LOCAL MAYOR REFUSES TO REMOVE PORK FROM SCHOOL CANTEEN MENU AND EXPLAINS WHY.
    Muslim parents have demanded the abolition of pork in all the school
    canteens of a Montreal suburb. It seems it is offensive to the Muslim
    families and shows much disrespect.
    The mayor of the Montreal suburb of Dorval, has refused, and the town
    clerk sent a note to all parents in the municipality to explain why.
    The following is what the note stated:
    “Muslims must understand that they have to adapt to Canada and
    Quebec, its customs, its traditions, its way of life, because that is
    where they chose to immigrate. They must understand that they have to
    integrate and learn to live in Quebec. They must understand that it is
    for them to change their lifestyle, not the Canadians who so
    generously welcomed them.”
    “They must understand that Canadians are neither racist nor
    xenophobic, they accepted many immigrants before Muslims (Whereas the
    reverse is not true, in that ALL Muslim states do not accept
    non-Muslim immigrants.).
    “They must also understand that, no more than other nations, Canadians
    are not willing to give up their identity nor their culture. And if
    Canada is a land of welcome, it is not just the Mayor of Dorval who
    welcomes foreigners, but the Canadian-Quebecois people as a whole. “
    “Finally, they must understand that in Canada (Quebec) with its
    Judeo-Christian roots, Christmas trees, churches and religious
    festivals, religion must remain in the private domain. Therefore, the
    municipality of Dorval was right to refuse any concessions to Islam
    and Sharia.”
    “For Muslims who disagree with secularism and do not feel comfortable
    in Canada, there are 57 beautiful Muslim countries in the world, most
    of them under-populated and ready to receive them with open halal arms
    in accordance with Shariah law. If you left your country for Canada,
    and not for other Muslim countries, it is because you have considered
    that life is better in Canada than elsewhere. So, ask yourself the
    question, just once, “Why is it better here in Canada than where you
    come from?”
    “A canteen with pork is part of the answer.”

    Well, unfortunately for you he doesn't exist. And he was originally Belgian (but still fake)

    http://www.snopes.com/politics/religion/belgiumpork.asp
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 54,041
    I don't agree with what Trump said and I think even less of him (if that is possible) for the cynicism that he had in saying it. But without going all MikeK on this, it would be ridiculous to think that the reputation of Islam has not been affected by the conduct of significant numbers of its adherents over the last 20 years. I fear that Trump is indeed tapping into something real.
  • WandererWanderer Posts: 3,838

    Wanderer said:

    What must Muslim Americans be thinking?

    I'm trying to think what I would do if the leading candidate for Labour or Conservative leader said that people like me should be excluded from the country and their polling improved. Start packing my bags?

    Well my advice to the Muslim community would be, "fit in or f*** off". And if our esteemed politicians had made that clear from the beginning, certain areas of our green and pleasant land wouldn't be overrun with barbarous religious savages.
    The overwhelming majority of American Muslims are productive, law-abiding citizens. They are no more prone to barbarism than American atheists, Christians, Jews etc. But you know this perfectly well.
  • blackburn63blackburn63 Posts: 4,492

    Although I disagree with what Trump said I'm thoroughly enjoying the reaction.

    It's an example of a society without perspective, those older than me that lived through wars and suffered real hardship really don't know what the fuss is all about. An overseas candidate "said" something, some people must have empty and dull lives to get so excited about it.


    'Wossisname, Hitler? He sez he's gonna get rid of all the Joos if he gets to be Reichschancellor. Load of stuff'n'nonsense if you arsk me. Now where's me Daily Mail?'
    What a strange response.

    You suggested that the older generation that 'lived through wars and suffered real hardship' habitually ignore the wilder statements of overseas candidates. On the dangerous assumption that you're right, do you think that was a sensible position in, say, 1933?
    You might remember we declared war on Hitler in 1939, quite rightly. But it wasn't because of anything he said.
  • blackburn63blackburn63 Posts: 4,492
    Wanderer said:

    Wanderer said:

    What must Muslim Americans be thinking?

    I'm trying to think what I would do if the leading candidate for Labour or Conservative leader said that people like me should be excluded from the country and their polling improved. Start packing my bags?

    Well my advice to the Muslim community would be, "fit in or f*** off". And if our esteemed politicians had made that clear from the beginning, certain areas of our green and pleasant land wouldn't be overrun with barbarous religious savages.
    The overwhelming majority of American Muslims are productive, law-abiding citizens. They are no more prone to barbarism than American atheists, Christians, Jews etc. But you know this perfectly well.
    Genuine question: what % of US is muslim?

    I don't see them causing an awful lot of bother.
  • isamisam Posts: 41,118
    edited December 2015

    Wanderer said:

    Wanderer said:

    What must Muslim Americans be thinking?

    I'm trying to think what I would do if the leading candidate for Labour or Conservative leader said that people like me should be excluded from the country and their polling improved. Start packing my bags?

    Well my advice to the Muslim community would be, "fit in or f*** off". And if our esteemed politicians had made that clear from the beginning, certain areas of our green and pleasant land wouldn't be overrun with barbarous religious savages.
    The overwhelming majority of American Muslims are productive, law-abiding citizens. They are no more prone to barbarism than American atheists, Christians, Jews etc. But you know this perfectly well.
    Genuine question: what % of US is muslim?

    I don't see them causing an awful lot of bother.
    0.9%

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islam_in_the_United_States

    The problems start when it reaches 4-5%

    5-10% and it causes big problems

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islam_in_Europe

    We can, and will, go around in circles for years debating the Koran, the good guys/the bad guys etc, but all that matters are numbers

    Too simple for anything to be done, politicians like to look clever
  • WandererWanderer Posts: 3,838
    edited December 2015

    Wanderer said:

    Wanderer said:

    What must Muslim Americans be thinking?

    I'm trying to think what I would do if the leading candidate for Labour or Conservative leader said that people like me should be excluded from the country and their polling improved. Start packing my bags?

    Well my advice to the Muslim community would be, "fit in or f*** off". And if our esteemed politicians had made that clear from the beginning, certain areas of our green and pleasant land wouldn't be overrun with barbarous religious savages.
    The overwhelming majority of American Muslims are productive, law-abiding citizens. They are no more prone to barbarism than American atheists, Christians, Jews etc. But you know this perfectly well.
    Genuine question: what % of US is muslim?

    I don't see them causing an awful lot of bother.
    It's about 3 million so about 1%, generally very well integrated.
  • John_MJohn_M Posts: 7,503

    Wanderer said:

    Wanderer said:

    What must Muslim Americans be thinking?

    I'm trying to think what I would do if the leading candidate for Labour or Conservative leader said that people like me should be excluded from the country and their polling improved. Start packing my bags?

    Well my advice to the Muslim community would be, "fit in or f*** off". And if our esteemed politicians had made that clear from the beginning, certain areas of our green and pleasant land wouldn't be overrun with barbarous religious savages.
    The overwhelming majority of American Muslims are productive, law-abiding citizens. They are no more prone to barbarism than American atheists, Christians, Jews etc. But you know this perfectly well.
    Genuine question: what % of US is muslim?

    I don't see them causing an awful lot of bother.
    0.9% according to Wikipedia. Versus 4.5% in the UK.
  • GaiusGaius Posts: 227
    viewcode said:

    Wanderer said:

    What must Muslim Americans be thinking?

    I'm trying to think what I would do if the leading candidate for Labour or Conservative leader said that people like me should be excluded from the country and their polling improved. Start packing my bags?

    Well my advice to the Muslim community would be, "fit in or f*** off". And if our esteemed politicians had made that clear from the beginning, certain areas of our green and pleasant land wouldn't be overrun with barbarous religious savages.
    You could arguably do that in the UK. But the US has laws against federal imposition of religion. It's legal to be a barbarous religious savage if you obey the law. Margaret Thatcher once defined liberty as "freedom under the law" - you can do what you like provided you don't break the law. A lot of people seem to be forgetting this.
    Unfortunately, it's the devout muslims that are going around breaking the law by committing terrorist mass murder.
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 54,041

    Wanderer said:

    What must Muslim Americans be thinking?

    I'm trying to think what I would do if the leading candidate for Labour or Conservative leader said that people like me should be excluded from the country and their polling improved. Start packing my bags?

    Well my advice to the Muslim community would be, "fit in or f*** off". And if our esteemed politicians had made that clear from the beginning, certain areas of our green and pleasant land wouldn't be overrun with barbarous religious savages.
    Are you sure about your moniker?
  • blackburn63blackburn63 Posts: 4,492
    Wanderer said:

    Wanderer said:

    Wanderer said:

    What must Muslim Americans be thinking?

    I'm trying to think what I would do if the leading candidate for Labour or Conservative leader said that people like me should be excluded from the country and their polling improved. Start packing my bags?

    Well my advice to the Muslim community would be, "fit in or f*** off". And if our esteemed politicians had made that clear from the beginning, certain areas of our green and pleasant land wouldn't be overrun with barbarous religious savages.
    The overwhelming majority of American Muslims are productive, law-abiding citizens. They are no more prone to barbarism than American atheists, Christians, Jews etc. But you know this perfectly well.
    Genuine question: what % of US is muslim?

    I don't see them causing an awful lot of bother.
    It's about 3 million so about 1%, generally very well integrated.
    Thank you, it confirms my point that although I disagree with what Trump said it really is much ado about nothing.

  • GaiusGaius Posts: 227

    Wanderer said:

    What must Muslim Americans be thinking?

    I'm trying to think what I would do if the leading candidate for Labour or Conservative leader said that people like me should be excluded from the country and their polling improved. Start packing my bags?

    Well my advice to the Muslim community would be, "fit in or f*** off". And if our esteemed politicians had made that clear from the beginning, certain areas of our green and pleasant land wouldn't be overrun with barbarous religious savages.
    Sheesh. If Britain became a country where one had to fit in with ideas like yours, it'd be time to leave.
    Out of interest Mr Palmer where would you go?

    Dr Palmer has expressed a wish to retire to miranetless Switzerland once his mischief making in the UK is finished.
    Surely he'd prefer to join a country within the EU?
    Oddly not.
    He's also a great fan of Norway.
    You mean Palmer doesn't want to go to countries than enforce the sort of policies that he wanted to impose on the UK because those policies result in a shit place to live in for ordinary people.

    Shirley not.

    Say it ain't so Nick.

This discussion has been closed.