.makes you wonder who else in the SNP is a Tory.....
Eck must be a prime suspect.
Throwing the referendum like that...
He's near the top of my list - notable how the party has moved (rhetorically, at any rate) left under Nicola.....mind you, she joined the SNP at 16 too.....the same age that sleeper Thomson was inserted......
THE SNP has been accused of attempting to suppress debate within its own ranks after party HQ watered down a conference resolution calling for a moratorium on fracking to be extended.
Re the Privy Council: someone needs to counsel Jeremy that his credibility with the public is going down the khazi. If you are going to take a principled stand against some archaic procedure, then say so, up front. Don't hide behind some spurious "diary clash".
His place in history isn't even going to merit a footnote at this rate. Just
Michelle Thomson, the beleaguered former SNP MP, is likely to be barred from ever returning to the party, a source close to the first minister claimed last night.
Over a 'non-story'?
That's a bit harsh!
I didn't realise she had resigned the whip. Is this a record for a party "losing" an MP after an election?
@iainmartin1: Corbynites can't seem to decide whether it's brave snub (and he won't go bow in front of Queen, eventually) or he will when diary permits
I disagree with just about everything Corbyn stands for and am also a practical Royalist (I think the current system serves us well but have no interest in the personality cults that surround Royalty)
But I honestly can't see why Corbyn is being criticised for refusing to take part in a ceremony with which he fundamentally disagrees and which, in his eyes, is an unnecessary embellishment to the job of leading the opposition in Parliament. If he were to attend then he would be accused of hypocrisy or betraying his beliefs so, as with the singing of the anthem, I think this is just cheap shots (which may well never the less hit home) and not really worth worrying about.
I disagree with just about everything Corbyn stands for and am also a practical Royalist (I think the current system serves us well but have no interest in the personality cults that surround Royalty)
But I honestly can't see why Corbyn is being criticised for refusing to take part in a ceremony with which he fundamentally disagrees and which, in his eyes, is an unnecessary embellishment to the job of leading the opposition in Parliament. If he were to attend then he would be accused of hypocrisy or betraying his beliefs so, as with the singing of the anthem, I think this is just cheap shots (which may well never the less hit home) and not really worth worrying about.
Isn't the problem that he isn't man enough to say he's not doing the ceremony on principle ?
I disagree with just about everything Corbyn stands for and am also a practical Royalist (I think the current system serves us well but have no interest in the personality cults that surround Royalty)
But I honestly can't see why Corbyn is being criticised for refusing to take part in a ceremony with which he fundamentally disagrees and which, in his eyes, is an unnecessary embellishment to the job of leading the opposition in Parliament. If he were to attend then he would be accused of hypocrisy or betraying his beliefs so, as with the singing of the anthem, I think this is just cheap shots (which may well never the less hit home) and not really worth worrying about.
He is being criticised for telling crap lies. Diary clash my arse. He should just have the balls to say he is having nothing to do with this archaic bollocks. He would get credit for that. Currently he just looks like Kevin the Teenager.
I disagree with just about everything Corbyn stands for and am also a practical Royalist (I think the current system serves us well but have no interest in the personality cults that surround Royalty)
But I honestly can't see why Corbyn is being criticised for refusing to take part in a ceremony with which he fundamentally disagrees and which, in his eyes, is an unnecessary embellishment to the job of leading the opposition in Parliament. If he were to attend then he would be accused of hypocrisy or betraying his beliefs so, as with the singing of the anthem, I think this is just cheap shots (which may well never the less hit home) and not really worth worrying about.
He is being criticised for telling crap lies. Diary clash my arse. He should just have the balls to say he is having nothing to do with this archaic bollocks. He would get credit for that. Currently he just looks like Kevin the Teenager.
That I agree with. He should have had the courage to say he didn't believe in the ceremony and therefore would not be attending as a matter of principle.
I'm amazed at the number of people who think that as they don't like it then Corbyn should be free to ignore it. Honestly, he makes sacrifice of his convictions and swears to the queen to be an MP, it wouldn't be a betrayal to do the same for the privy council and just indicate when he is pm he will get rid of the need for both, there's no need to make a stand on this issue (which he is - even if he does it later, the decision to delay is that stand)
Man decides to put his lifelong beliefs before his chances of winning power. So diminishing his chances of implementing his beliefs through taking power. Brave.
Plus he is lying through his teeth. He has invented an excuse. Pillock is as pillock does.
But I honestly can't see why Corbyn is being criticised for refusing to take part in a ceremony with which he fundamentally disagrees and which, in his eyes, is an unnecessary embellishment to the job of leading the opposition in Parliament.
The criticism is founded on his inability to man up and simply state that he objects to the ceremony and why, choosing instead to be 'washing his hair', or some equally fey, pathetic obviously fabricated excuse.
.makes you wonder who else in the SNP is a Tory.....
Eck must be a prime suspect.
Throwing the referendum like that...
His masterstroke was claiming he would be writing Labour's Budget. That swung us the election. Well done, Agent Kirk...you can soon come home. Just have to oversee Project Croneyism first....
@MichaelLCrick: David Rogers, author of new book on Privy Council doubts whether Corbyn can become PC through an Order in Council without attending himself
I'm amazed at the number of people who think that as they don't like it then Corbyn should be free to ignore it. Honestly, he makes sacrifice of his convictions and swears to the queen to be an MP, it wouldn't be a betrayal to do the same for the privy council and just indicate when he is pm he will get rid of the need for both, there's no need to make a stand on this issue (which he is - even if he does it later, the decision to delay is that stand)
Man decides to put his lifelong beliefs before his chances of winning power. So diminishing his chances of implementing his beliefs through taking power. Brave.
Le Comte de Chambord the legimitist pretender to the French throne, wouldn't give up The White Flag of The Bourbons, refused compromise fly the Tricoleur as national flag, with Fleur de Lys as a royal standard.
Corbyn tries to keep to his principles abandons pragmatism, yet remains a pig headed ideologue or prig. It is another small step towards his abandonment of the pursuit of power.
But I honestly can't see why Corbyn is being criticised for refusing to take part in a ceremony with which he fundamentally disagrees and which, in his eyes, is an unnecessary embellishment to the job of leading the opposition in Parliament.
The criticism is founded on his inability to man up and simply state that he objects to the ceremony and why, choosing instead to be 'washing his hair', or some equally fey, pathetic obviously fabricated excuse.
But be honest, many of those criticising him at the moment would be just as vehement if he had been honest about it. So he is stupid for giving everyone a cheap shot but a fair few of those who are claiming this is just about his excuse are being equally disingenuous.
I think this is just cheap shots (which may well never the less hit home) and not really worth worrying about.
It is essentially deeply trivial - apparently the PC meeting was arranged at the last minute and Corbyn may be on holiday (if so, why not say so?).
However, what it does betray is supreme indifference to the views of millions of voters who will not respond kindly to (however inaccurate) 'Corbyn snubs queen' stories......its yet another unforced error.......
I'm a Bush bear, yes. He lacks the charm of his brother and the gravitas of his father, without any compensating fire. He has the name and some interesting ideas. His campaign has at no point caught light and there are no signs that it is going to. So I'm very comfortable laying him.
On Topic: Could Cameron not stay as Prime Minister up until dissolution but the Tories have a new leader who would fight the election? Kind of like how the Americans do the Presidency? (Obama will stay President while someone else is fighting to become POTUS, etc...?)
Off Topic: LOL@Jezza
It would also solve this thorny problem of whoever is the next leader potentially only being PM for a few months if they lost the election.
The fixed term parliament means the leadership election can be arranged just before the general election. Hold an leadership election in say October and the newly elected leader becomes deputy PM and would lead the party in the election. Cameron stays as PM until after the election and then recommends the leader of which ever party wins as next pm
.makes you wonder who else in the SNP is a Tory.....
Eck must be a prime suspect.
Throwing the referendum like that...
His masterstroke was claiming he would be writing Labour's Budget. That swung us the election. Well done, Agent Kirk...you can soon come home. Just have to oversee Project Croneyism first....
See you, Jimmy!
Salmond is a bit of a prat. I can't see Sturgeon making a similar error.
Even more bizarre was the weird prevarication followed by non-denial denials, and an eventual denial, by Ed Miliband's office that was so belated and conviction-free that no one believed him.
@iainmartin1: Corbynites can't seem to decide whether it's brave snub (and he won't go bow in front of Queen, eventually) or he will when diary permits
I can understand not wanting to kneel, that seems a bit excessive in this day and age. An Englishman stands before his God, let alone his monarch. While a monarchist I would happily get rid of the flummery and silly titles.
So Corbyn could quite easily say, I am not kneeling, no-one should have to.
But you do not, just do not, blow out the Queen because you have "another engagement'. You wouldn't do it to a President either.
But I honestly can't see why Corbyn is being criticised for refusing to take part in a ceremony with which he fundamentally disagrees and which, in his eyes, is an unnecessary embellishment to the job of leading the opposition in Parliament.
The criticism is founded on his inability to man up and simply state that he objects to the ceremony and why, choosing instead to be 'washing his hair', or some equally fey, pathetic obviously fabricated excuse.
But be honest, many of those criticising him at the moment would be just as vehement if he had been honest about it. So he is stupid for giving everyone a cheap shot but a fair few of those who are claiming this is just about his excuse are being equally disingenuous.
There's a huge difference in politics between being criticised for having principles and sticking to them - and being an unconvincing lying toe-rag. Hard to imagine even Corbyn's crazed defenders wanting to die in a ditch for him over the latter...
.makes you wonder who else in the SNP is a Tory.....
Eck must be a prime suspect.
Throwing the referendum like that...
His masterstroke was claiming he would be writing Labour's Budget. That swung us the election. Well done, Agent Kirk...you can soon come home. Just have to oversee Project Croneyism first....
I can't see Sturgeon making a similar error.
Sturgeon has been pretty sure footed - though may yet stumble on 34 Year Tory Sleeper Agent Michelle Thomson 'being the right person for the job' while simultaneously 'knowing nothing about her business'.......
Britain must back deeper integration of the European Union or quit altogether, Francois Hollande, the French president, declared on Wednesday night.
During furious exchanges with Nigel Farage, the Ukip leader, Mr Hollande said British voters who do not like the idea of a “strengthened” EU must take the “logical path” of Brexit.
“There is no other way. It's a horrible path, but it's a logical path. Leave Europe, leave Schengen and leave democracy. Do you really want to participate in a common state? That's the question."
@iainmartin1: Corbynites can't seem to decide whether it's brave snub (and he won't go bow in front of Queen, eventually) or he will when diary permits
I can understand not wanting to kneel, that seems a bit excessive in this day and age. An Englishman stands before his God, let alone his monarch. While a monarchist I would happily get rid of the flummery and silly titles.
So Corbyn could quite easily say, I am not kneeling, no-one should have to.
But you do not, just do not, blow out the Queen because you have "another engagement'. You wouldn't do it to a President either.
If Jeremy Corbyn had said briskly on the first day that the subject had come up "as is well known, I'm not a monarchist and it would be hypocritical of me to kneel. I have the utmost respect for how the Queen has performed her duties and I am quite sure that she won't mind me standing to be inducted" there would have been no issue at all.
Having a "prior commitment" is all very reminiscent of Gordon Brown signing the Treaty of Lisbon on his own.
'This is because one section of the oath reads as follows: "You will keep secret all Matters committed unto you". And, not just merely for emphasis, the word matters commences with a capital letter.'
.makes you wonder who else in the SNP is a Tory.....
Eck must be a prime suspect.
Throwing the referendum like that...
His masterstroke was claiming he would be writing Labour's Budget. That swung us the election. Well done, Agent Kirk...you can soon come home. Just have to oversee Project Croneyism first....
Given it was a general election it was something he probably thought he needed to claim, since otherwise the labour voters he was after might think that an SNP vote would be wasted. Of course in the end they were wasted votes.
Britain must back deeper integration of the European Union or quit altogether, Francois Hollande, the French president, declared on Wednesday night.
During furious exchanges with Nigel Farage, the Ukip leader, Mr Hollande said British voters who do not like the idea of a “strengthened” EU must take the “logical path” of Brexit.
“There is no other way. It's a horrible path, but it's a logical path. Leave Europe, leave Schengen and leave democracy. Do you really want to participate in a common state? That's the question."
The debate where all this was said is repeated on BBC Parliament at 12:35 today if anyone missed it yesterday.
Britain must back deeper integration of the European Union or quit altogether, Francois Hollande, the French president, declared on Wednesday night.
During furious exchanges with Nigel Farage, the Ukip leader, Mr Hollande said British voters who do not like the idea of a “strengthened” EU must take the “logical path” of Brexit.
“There is no other way. It's a horrible path, but it's a logical path. Leave Europe, leave Schengen and leave democracy. Do you really want to participate in a common state? That's the question."
"Leave democracy"? That's a bit fecking rich even for the EU.....
Britain must back deeper integration of the European Union or quit altogether, Francois Hollande, the French president, declared on Wednesday night.
During furious exchanges with Nigel Farage, the Ukip leader, Mr Hollande said British voters who do not like the idea of a “strengthened” EU must take the “logical path” of Brexit.
“There is no other way. It's a horrible path, but it's a logical path. Leave Europe, leave Schengen and leave democracy. Do you really want to participate in a common state? That's the question."
Quite apart from the ridiculous "leave democracy", Britain isn't in Schengen. It's astounding that the French president is so ignorant.
Britain must back deeper integration of the European Union or quit altogether, Francois Hollande, the French president, declared on Wednesday night.
During furious exchanges with Nigel Farage, the Ukip leader, Mr Hollande said British voters who do not like the idea of a “strengthened” EU must take the “logical path” of Brexit.
“There is no other way. It's a horrible path, but it's a logical path. Leave Europe, leave Schengen and leave democracy. Do you really want to participate in a common state? That's the question."
Its almost like there is a negotiation going and tactics are being used.....
I disagree with just about everything Corbyn stands for and am also a practical Royalist (I think the current system serves us well but have no interest in the personality cults that surround Royalty)
But I honestly can't see why Corbyn is being criticised for refusing to take part in a ceremony with which he fundamentally disagrees and which, in his eyes, is an unnecessary embellishment to the job of leading the opposition in Parliament. If he were to attend then he would be accused of hypocrisy or betraying his beliefs so, as with the singing of the anthem, I think this is just cheap shots (which may well never the less hit home) and not really worth worrying about.
He is being criticised for telling crap lies. Diary clash my arse. He should just have the balls to say he is having nothing to do with this archaic bollocks. He would get credit for that. Currently he just looks like Kevin the Teenager.
That I agree with. He should have had the courage to say he didn't believe in the ceremony and therefore would not be attending as a matter of principle.
"Too busy to meet the Queen" goes down well with the egg throwers but most people think its arrogant and disrespectful. Confirms his weird cult status, demeans him as a serious political figure.
Britain must back deeper integration of the European Union or quit altogether, Francois Hollande, the French president, declared on Wednesday night.
During furious exchanges with Nigel Farage, the Ukip leader, Mr Hollande said British voters who do not like the idea of a “strengthened” EU must take the “logical path” of Brexit.
“There is no other way. It's a horrible path, but it's a logical path. Leave Europe, leave Schengen and leave democracy. Do you really want to participate in a common state? That's the question."
Its almost like there is a negotiation going and tactics are being used.....
Expect a few more "tiffs" during the process.
I think the danger in this for Cameron is that if he is forced back into 2017 for the referendum then he runs smack into the French presidential elections. What might seem like positioning as part of negotiations now might not be quite so easily dismissed when Hollande is under pressure to protect French interests.
I disagree with just about everything Corbyn stands for and am also a practical Royalist (I think the current system serves us well but have no interest in the personality cults that surround Royalty)
But I honestly can't see why Corbyn is being criticised for refusing to take part in a ceremony with which he fundamentally disagrees and which, in his eyes, is an unnecessary embellishment to the job of leading the opposition in Parliament. If he were to attend then he would be accused of hypocrisy or betraying his beliefs so, as with the singing of the anthem, I think this is just cheap shots (which may well never the less hit home) and not really worth worrying about.
Since he will never be pm it hardly matters but it will hinder him as LOTO...more fool him
Britain must back deeper integration of the European Union or quit altogether, Francois Hollande, the French president, declared on Wednesday night.
During furious exchanges with Nigel Farage, the Ukip leader, Mr Hollande said British voters who do not like the idea of a “strengthened” EU must take the “logical path” of Brexit.
“There is no other way. It's a horrible path, but it's a logical path. Leave Europe, leave Schengen and leave democracy. Do you really want to participate in a common state? That's the question."
Its almost like there is a negotiation going and tactics are being used.....
Expect a few more "tiffs" during the process.
I think the danger in this for Cameron is that if he is forced back into 2017 for the referendum then he runs smack into the French presidential elections. What might seem like positioning as part of negotiations now might not be quite so easily dismissed when Hollande is under pressure to protect French interests.
Although the big danger is the National Front, who are slamming him from a eurosceptic direction and back the British renegotiation as a precedent for them.
I disagree with just about everything Corbyn stands for and am also a practical Royalist (I think the current system serves us well but have no interest in the personality cults that surround Royalty)
But I honestly can't see why Corbyn is being criticised for refusing to take part in a ceremony with which he fundamentally disagrees and which, in his eyes, is an unnecessary embellishment to the job of leading the opposition in Parliament. If he were to attend then he would be accused of hypocrisy or betraying his beliefs so, as with the singing of the anthem, I think this is just cheap shots (which may well never the less hit home) and not really worth worrying about.
Since he will never be pm it hardly matters but it will hinder him as LOTO...more fool him
Oh absolutely. I don't think he is being very bright here but I also don't think that refusing to take part in an institution you fundamentally disagree with is necessarily a cause for criticism. It is the manner of his refusal that is daft.
.makes you wonder who else in the SNP is a Tory.....
Eck must be a prime suspect.
Throwing the referendum like that...
His masterstroke was claiming he would be writing Labour's Budget. That swung us the election. Well done, Agent Kirk...you can soon come home. Just have to oversee Project Croneyism first....
Given it was a general election it was something he probably thought he needed to claim, since otherwise the labour voters he was after might think that an SNP vote would be wasted. Of course in the end they were wasted votes.
But let's be fair, the SNP will leave their mark on Westminster.
They will have got the name of their favourite Commons bar changed to the Rabbie Burns...
Britain must back deeper integration of the European Union or quit altogether, Francois Hollande, the French president, declared on Wednesday night.
During furious exchanges with Nigel Farage, the Ukip leader, Mr Hollande said British voters who do not like the idea of a “strengthened” EU must take the “logical path” of Brexit.
“There is no other way. It's a horrible path, but it's a logical path. Leave Europe, leave Schengen and leave democracy. Do you really want to participate in a common state? That's the question."
Its almost like there is a negotiation going and tactics are being used.....
Expect a few more "tiffs" during the process.
Cameron's speech in 2013 specifically excluded ever closer union. So the answer to the question is 'no' we do not want to participate in a common state. Plus we are not in the Euro. We are not in Schengen so we cannot leave it. The euro and eurozone means inevitable closer fiscal and thus political union, as well as monetary union. There is a legitimate argument for this... it may turn out to be a brilliant idea for all and sundry. Or not. What Hollande does not want to see is the UK outside of all that but still having votes in the EU. But he does highlight what all the negotiations are really about.
I wonder if Corbyns Diary for today will be leaked..
Is he going to find himself equally 'busy' whenever an event comes up that doesn't interest him? Remembrance Day, State Opening of Parliament, State banquets for visiting heads of state etc etc.
Michelle Thomson, the beleaguered former SNP MP, is likely to be barred from ever returning to the party, a source close to the first minister claimed last night.
Over a 'non-story'?
That's a bit harsh!
I didn't realise she had resigned the whip. Is this a record for a party "losing" an MP after an election?
No idea, but IIRC a Front National MEP decided the party wasn't for her mere days after being elected, so I doubt it's a world record.
Essential to be part of Privy Council to receive intelligence briefings says @AngusRobertson
Making a kneel or not a minor sacrifice. Of course most people won't notice, etc etc, but there's some real meatty subjects to take a stand on or take the fight to, why all these minor things about kneeling and personal attacks?
He may be a crap candidate (so far), but he has depth - as in money and reach and establishment back-up.
I think is price is being held up by the Romney experience in 2012: he was also uninspiring, had the money and back up and eventually became the candidate.
The difference is that Romney was always competitive in the polls and was up against challenger after challenger that turned out to be mere flashes in the pan - eventually the lack of credible alternatives and his staying power him through.
In no way has Jeb Bush matched that, he's been fourth/fifth/sixth in poll after poll, and there are at least two more credible alternatives than he. I just don't see how he breaks out of the (very small) box he is in.
I think this is just cheap shots (which may well never the less hit home) and not really worth worrying about.
It is essentially deeply trivial - apparently the PC meeting was arranged at the last minute and Corbyn may be on holiday (if so, why not say so?).
However, what it does betray is supreme indifference to the views of millions of voters who will not respond kindly to (however inaccurate) 'Corbyn snubs queen' stories......its yet another unforced error.......
It is supreme indifference to the views of millions of voters who would never vote for him anyway. Quite right.
Britain must back deeper integration of the European Union or quit altogether, Francois Hollande, the French president, declared on Wednesday night.
During furious exchanges with Nigel Farage, the Ukip leader, Mr Hollande said British voters who do not like the idea of a “strengthened” EU must take the “logical path” of Brexit.
“There is no other way. It's a horrible path, but it's a logical path. Leave Europe, leave Schengen and leave democracy. Do you really want to participate in a common state? That's the question."
Just a thought - if we get a breakaway Blairite Labour Party - let's call them SDP2 - then if they can take half plus one of Labour's MPs they become the second largest grouping in Parliament.
Can they then argue that they are the official Opposition and should appoint the LotO as one of their own, rather than have the guy who clearly doesn't want the job?
I wonder if Corbyns Diary for today will be leaked..
Is he going to find himself equally 'busy' whenever an event comes up that doesn't interest him? Remembrance Day, State Opening of Parliament, State banquets for visiting heads of state etc etc.
He presumably likes Remembrance Day as long as it focuses on those that fought the Nazis. Those that fought in other wars presumably deserve less respect.
.makes you wonder who else in the SNP is a Tory.....
Eck must be a prime suspect.
Throwing the referendum like that...
His masterstroke was claiming he would be writing Labour's Budget. That swung us the election. Well done, Agent Kirk...you can soon come home. Just have to oversee Project Croneyism first....
Given it was a general election it was something he probably thought he needed to claim, since otherwise the labour voters he was after might think that an SNP vote would be wasted. Of course in the end they were wasted votes.
Britain must back deeper integration of the European Union or quit altogether, Francois Hollande, the French president, declared on Wednesday night.
During furious exchanges with Nigel Farage, the Ukip leader, Mr Hollande said British voters who do not like the idea of a “strengthened” EU must take the “logical path” of Brexit.
“There is no other way. It's a horrible path, but it's a logical path. Leave Europe, leave Schengen and leave democracy. Do you really want to participate in a common state? That's the question."
Its almost like there is a negotiation going and tactics are being used.....
Expect a few more "tiffs" during the process.
Cameron's speech in 2013 specifically excluded ever closer union. So the answer to the question is 'no' we do not want to participate in a common state. Plus we are not in the Euro. We are not in Schengen so we cannot leave it.
... and our domestic political system, while imperfect, is a damned sight more democratic than the EU.
I can't accept the arguments Corbyn not going throgh the ceremony is him being criticised for taking a principled stance. There is no way to applaud that principled stance without him not being principled in taking the oath to become an MP - he could always be an abstentionist MP if his constituents supported that, and he told them beforehand, if principle is that important to him. No, he swears an oath with his fingers crossed or something so he can serve fully. Equally, he could go through a ceremony he thinks is nonsense and wants to abolish (I think he made some good points about limiting the royal prerogative, given it is ministers who exercise it) while making clear he respects the queen as a person but that the whole process is silly.
I fail to see how he could be accused of hypocrisy by anyone but the loonier side of his opponents for that - he would be registering his principled position while making a personal sacrifice, a tiny one, in order to serve fully as LoTo, and he can speak out against it with a clear conscience rather than all this stuff about bookings.
Honestly, I think antifrank is right about how he should have handled it. It isn't a disaster it's still a story now, but it is unnecessary, as his supporters won't destroy him for doing it while making clear he disagrees with it, and it would have removed one area of personal attack against him.
Essential to be part of Privy Council to receive intelligence briefings says @AngusRobertson
@asabenn: Gosh, 22% of Labour voters think their own leader is "security-threatening, terrorist-sympathising, Britain-hating" http://t.co/uQrQRtxUoH
Snubbing the Queen and not getting security briefings will sort that out...
I am imagining the PM and senior members of the Cabinet being briefed by MI5 and MI6 about the threat to security that is the leader of the opposition. It is amusing to think about but really not funny once one understands the implications of it.
Didn't they give him a GCS car, so they know where he is going and who he's meeting?
Britain must back deeper integration of the European Union or quit altogether, Francois Hollande, the French president, declared on Wednesday night.
During furious exchanges with Nigel Farage, the Ukip leader, Mr Hollande said British voters who do not like the idea of a “strengthened” EU must take the “logical path” of Brexit.
“There is no other way. It's a horrible path, but it's a logical path. Leave Europe, leave Schengen and leave democracy. Do you really want to participate in a common state? That's the question."
Quite apart from the ridiculous "leave democracy", Britain isn't in Schengen. It's astounding that the French president is so ignorant.
I suspect there has been a mistranslation
He probably meant something like "if you don't want to accept the democratic wishes of the majority then leave"
If this is the choice on the table, we should leave.
“There is no other way. It's a horrible path, but it's a logical path. Leave Europe, leave Schengen and leave democracy. Do you really want to participate in a common state? That's the question."
Britain must back deeper integration of the European Union or quit altogether, Francois Hollande, the French president, declared on Wednesday night.
During furious exchanges with Nigel Farage, the Ukip leader, Mr Hollande said British voters who do not like the idea of a “strengthened” EU must take the “logical path” of Brexit.
“There is no other way. It's a horrible path, but it's a logical path. Leave Europe, leave Schengen and leave democracy. Do you really want to participate in a common state? That's the question."
Quite apart from the ridiculous "leave democracy", Britain isn't in Schengen. It's astounding that the French president is so ignorant.
I suspect there has been a mistranslation
He probably meant something like "if you don't want to accept the democratic wishes of the majority then leave"
It was the official translator that said it. Genuine question. Is it common for them to make mistakes?
I can't wait for Comrade Corbyn to refuse to wear white tie - Gordon made himself look like Kevin The Teenager for turning up in a lounge suit.
Gordon Brown has broken a habit of a lifetime by wearing white tie to the state banquet at Buckingham Palace in honour of the visiting King Abdullah of Saudi Arabia.
The Prime Minister's purchase of a £3,000 bespoke suit from Gieves & Hawkes marks the end of his decade-long refusal to dress up for formal occasions, most notably his annual Mansion House address to City of London luminaries.
I wonder if Corbyns Diary for today will be leaked..
Is he going to find himself equally 'busy' whenever an event comes up that doesn't interest him? Remembrance Day, State Opening of Parliament, State banquets for visiting heads of state etc etc.
Do Mi5 and Mi6 have any veto over who is allowed onto the privvy council ?
Probably one of the many unwritten rules. The invite to join comes from the PM on behalf of HMQ, but it would be up to the security services who they do or do not brief.
I can't imagine they're too upset right now, but it will be interesting to see what happens when somethings requiring a briefing comes up, the most obvious being Syria or domestic intelligence such as when we took out those two Jihadis the other week. If there's to be a vote on deploying military assets to Syria, will someone from the opposition get a briefing? Is the chief whip trustwortthy enough..?
Britain must back deeper integration of the European Union or quit altogether, Francois Hollande, the French president, declared on Wednesday night.
During furious exchanges with Nigel Farage, the Ukip leader, Mr Hollande said British voters who do not like the idea of a “strengthened” EU must take the “logical path” of Brexit.
“There is no other way. It's a horrible path, but it's a logical path. Leave Europe, leave Schengen and leave democracy. Do you really want to participate in a common state? That's the question."
Quite apart from the ridiculous "leave democracy", Britain isn't in Schengen. It's astounding that the French president is so ignorant.
I suspect there has been a mistranslation
He probably meant something like "if you don't want to accept the democratic wishes of the majority then leave"
It was the official translator that said it. Genuine question. Is it common for them to make mistakes?
Words are easy. Meanings are hard.
I know a translator at the international criminal court... seems like a tough gig to me!
Anyway, the whole debate seems a bit artificial. The EU referendum lies across the gate of rightwing politics like a dragon and until that has been dealt with the question of timetabling the next leadership election is premature. I doubt that Theseus had sorted out his wedding arrangements with Andromeda in advance of dealing with Cetus.
Except, of course, Andromeda was rescued by Perseus rather than Theseus, which is why Andromeda, Perseus, Cassiopea (her mum), Cepheus (her dad) and Pegasus (Perseus's horse) are all together in the same region of the northern sky. Cetus is some distance lower down but Perseus does carry Medusa's head (the star Algol) which is the prototype star for eclipsing binaries.
Anyway, the whole debate seems a bit artificial. The EU referendum lies across the gate of rightwing politics like a dragon and until that has been dealt with the question of timetabling the next leadership election is premature. I doubt that Theseus had sorted out his wedding arrangements with Andromeda in advance of dealing with Cetus.
Except, of course, Andromeda was rescued by Perseus rather than Theseus, which is why Andromeda, Perseus, Cassiopea (her mum), Cepheus (her dad) and Pegasus (Perseus's horse) are all together in the same region of the northern sky. Cetus is some distance lower down but Perseus does carry Medusa's head (the star Algol) which is the prototype star for eclipsing binaries.
Perseus ... Cetus Theseus ... Minotaur
Tut! Tut!
What's really weird about that was that I thought Perseus (and even double-checked on wikipedia that I'd remembered it right) and then wrote Theseus. And it's only on you quoting it that I realised my mistake. Obviously there's some loose wiring up top.
If the LOTO is not briefed on National Security matters how can he guide his party through any subsequent debate on those matters if he is not aware of the inside information..Should his party then abstain and also should the speaker decline to call any of that Party s members to speak..will the Labour MPs so affected voice concerns about this.
If this is the choice on the table, we should leave.
“There is no other way. It's a horrible path, but it's a logical path. Leave Europe, leave Schengen and leave democracy. Do you really want to participate in a common state? That's the question."
I think France expects us to give up our opt-out after a time period. It's like Wolfgang Schaube the other day expected us to eventually join the Euro.
I can't wait for Comrade Corbyn to refuse to wear white tie - Gordon made himself look like Kevin The Teenager for turning up in a lounge suit.
Gordon Brown has broken a habit of a lifetime by wearing white tie to the state banquet at Buckingham Palace in honour of the visiting King Abdullah of Saudi Arabia.
The Prime Minister's purchase of a £3,000 bespoke suit from Gieves & Hawkes marks the end of his decade-long refusal to dress up for formal occasions, most notably his annual Mansion House address to City of London luminaries.
I wonder if Corbyns Diary for today will be leaked..
Is he going to find himself equally 'busy' whenever an event comes up that doesn't interest him? Remembrance Day, State Opening of Parliament, State banquets for visiting heads of state etc etc.
Baby steps Ms Plato - let's start by getting him into a lounge suit that fits, a shirt with a top button and a tie that he knows how to do up.
Once he has mastered that, then let him move on to the more exotic forms of morning and evening wear.
Any tailors on Saville Row up for a big challenge..?
If this is the choice on the table, we should leave.
“There is no other way. It's a horrible path, but it's a logical path. Leave Europe, leave Schengen and leave democracy. Do you really want to participate in a common state? That's the question."
I think France expects us to give up our opt-out after a time period. It's like Wolfgang Schaube the other day expected us to eventually join the Euro.
You wonder who briefs these people. The chances of Britain joining the Euro are roughly the same as the Church of England joining the Roman Catholic church.
Comments
He seems an awful candidate to me. 35% tax free return on your money inside 12 months? Yes please.
THE SNP has been accused of attempting to suppress debate within its own ranks after party HQ watered down a conference resolution calling for a moratorium on fracking to be extended.
http://www.heraldscotland.com/news/13810944.SNP_bosses_accused_of_censoring_debate_over_fracking_ahead_of_party_conference/?ref=mr&lp=2
That's a tremendous by-election result, any chance of him being a live dog at the GE perhaps ?
Jeb Bush 2.79 £72.00 £201.05
There's my punt against Jeb.
Burn the Tory !!
But I honestly can't see why Corbyn is being criticised for refusing to take part in a ceremony with which he fundamentally disagrees and which, in his eyes, is an unnecessary embellishment to the job of leading the opposition in Parliament. If he were to attend then he would be accused of hypocrisy or betraying his beliefs so, as with the singing of the anthem, I think this is just cheap shots (which may well never the less hit home) and not really worth worrying about.
"I'm busy " is weak.
Corbyn tries to keep to his principles abandons pragmatism, yet remains a pig headed ideologue or prig. It is another small step towards his abandonment of the pursuit of power.
However, what it does betray is supreme indifference to the views of millions of voters who will not respond kindly to (however inaccurate) 'Corbyn snubs queen' stories......its yet another unforced error.......
Salmond is a bit of a prat. I can't see Sturgeon making a similar error.
Even more bizarre was the weird prevarication followed by non-denial denials, and an eventual denial, by Ed Miliband's office that was so belated and conviction-free that no one believed him.
What was he thinking? Was he thinking?
So Corbyn could quite easily say, I am not kneeling, no-one should have to.
But you do not, just do not, blow out the Queen because you have "another engagement'. You wouldn't do it to a President either.
10.45 Polishing motorbike/sidecar combination, and dreaming wistfully of Diane and Germany.
11.30 Opening Oxfam Shop Sale in Hornsey
And so on. A day of mundane tasks until 'Cash in the Attic'.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/francois-hollande/11917960/Back-an-integrated-EU-or-quit-Francois-Hollande-warns-Britain.html
Britain must back deeper integration of the European Union or quit altogether, Francois Hollande, the French president, declared on Wednesday night.
During furious exchanges with Nigel Farage, the Ukip leader, Mr Hollande said British voters who do not like the idea of a “strengthened” EU must take the “logical path” of Brexit.
“There is no other way. It's a horrible path, but it's a logical path. Leave Europe, leave Schengen and leave democracy. Do you really want to participate in a common state? That's the question."
Having a "prior commitment" is all very reminiscent of Gordon Brown signing the Treaty of Lisbon on his own.
'This is because one section of the oath reads as follows: "You will keep secret all Matters committed unto you". And, not just merely for emphasis, the word matters commences with a capital letter.'
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-34458190
My view: the fundamentals were still shite for Ed, and good for Dave, and I still don't think he would have won. But Dave wouldn't have his majority.
A result of something like: Lab - 291, Con - 308, LD - 16.. would be my guess.
I think the evidence is the LDs would have been heavily squeezed in any event.
Of course in the end they were wasted votes.
Expect a few more "tiffs" during the process.
norman smith @BBCNormanS
Essential to be part of Privy Council to receive intelligence briefings says @AngusRobertson
They will have got the name of their favourite Commons bar changed to the Rabbie Burns...
Snubbing the Queen and not getting security briefings will sort that out...
The euro and eurozone means inevitable closer fiscal and thus political union, as well as monetary union. There is a legitimate argument for this... it may turn out to be a brilliant idea for all and sundry. Or not. What Hollande does not want to see is the UK outside of all that but still having votes in the EU. But he does highlight what all the negotiations are really about.
The difference is that Romney was always competitive in the polls and was up against challenger after challenger that turned out to be mere flashes in the pan - eventually the lack of credible alternatives and his staying power him through.
In no way has Jeb Bush matched that, he's been fourth/fifth/sixth in poll after poll, and there are at least two more credible alternatives than he. I just don't see how he breaks out of the (very small) box he is in.
Can they then argue that they are the official Opposition and should appoint the LotO as one of their own, rather than have the guy who clearly doesn't want the job?
I don't know what it is about Tory female MPs in marginal seats: Morgan, Soubry, Ellison and Sandys. They're all EUphile ideologues and sell-outs.
I fail to see how he could be accused of hypocrisy by anyone but the loonier side of his opponents for that - he would be registering his principled position while making a personal sacrifice, a tiny one, in order to serve fully as LoTo, and he can speak out against it with a clear conscience rather than all this stuff about bookings.
Honestly, I think antifrank is right about how he should have handled it. It isn't a disaster it's still a story now, but it is unnecessary, as his supporters won't destroy him for doing it while making clear he disagrees with it, and it would have removed one area of personal attack against him.
'Iain Duncan Smith blames 9/11 for his failure as Tory leader
The terrorist attacks on 9/11 and the wars that followed were the cause of Iain Duncan Smith's failure as Conservative leader, he claimed last night.'
http://tinyurl.com/py5rdhh
Didn't they give him a GCS car, so they know where he is going and who he's meeting?
He probably meant something like "if you don't want to accept the democratic wishes of the majority then leave"
@asabenn
Cameron's #cpc15 speech persuaded some voters that Corbyn hates Britain, @HuffPostUKPol/@Survation poll finds pic.twitter.com/aYbFu5LjjW
Not what it shows...!
Genuine question. Is it common for them to make mistakes?
New TNS Scottish parl. poll: SNP 56% (-2), Lab 21% (-2), Tories 12% (N/C), Lib Dems 6% (+1).
SNPonthewayout
I can't imagine they're too upset right now, but it will be interesting to see what happens when somethings requiring a briefing comes up, the most obvious being Syria or domestic intelligence such as when we took out those two Jihadis the other week. If there's to be a vote on deploying military assets to Syria, will someone from the opposition get a briefing? Is the chief whip trustwortthy enough..?
I know a translator at the international criminal court... seems like a tough gig to me!
Perseus ... Cetus
Theseus ... Minotaur
Tut! Tut!
Once he has mastered that, then let him move on to the more exotic forms of morning and evening wear.
Any tailors on Saville Row up for a big challenge..?