Ref immigration .... some years ago several Afghan families hijacked a plane which landed in England. They were allowed to stay with no (reported) penalty iirc. I wonder what their status is today. Crime does pay?
Petulant and arrogant. Dismissing the entire press corps as unworthy of his time is incredibly stupid. They'll write about him, and he won't influence the end copy.
I'm on the train to Edinburgh to cover Corbyn's visit tomorrow and just been told he won't be speaking to journalists. Well worth the trip.
Seriously WTF is wrong with this guy.
The press will rue the day they crossed the Great Leader. He'll treat them with well deserved disdain while his elite Twittertroopers storm the social media barricades.
Honestly, it's ghastly yet oddly fascinating; like watching someone self-harm in the street.
I wonder if the increased concern about immigration might be because you can be concerned about immigration to the UK in an anti-immigration way, but also concern about immigration in a compassionate way. I might not be concerned about the numbers entering the UK, but I may be concerned that immigrants/refugees throughout Europe, which is an issue affecting the UK, should be well treated.
Petulant and arrogant. Dismissing the entire press corps as unworthy of his time is incredibly stupid. They'll write about him, and he won't influence the end copy.
I'm on the train to Edinburgh to cover Corbyn's visit tomorrow and just been told he won't be speaking to journalists. Well worth the trip.
Seriously WTF is wrong with this guy.
The press will rue the day they crossed the Great Leader. He'll treat them with well deserved disdain while his elite Twittertroopers storm the social media barricades.
Honestly, it's ghastly yet oddly fascinating; like watching someone self-harm in the street.
I'm on the train to Edinburgh to cover Corbyn's visit tomorrow and just been told he won't be speaking to journalists. Well worth the trip.
Seriously WTF is wrong with this guy.
What is he expecting the journalists to do, fill pages of copy repeating that the LotO hates journalists and drags them around the country, only to tell them to go screw themselves when they get there..?
What he said: "I am not a leader who wants to impose leadership lines all the time"
What he meant: I tried imposing my view on Trident, but Unite voted it down, so I had better pretend the new politics is all about open and listening leadership... until I can bring in new rules to give the supporters who voted for me the power over policy.
I'm on the train to Edinburgh to cover Corbyn's visit tomorrow and just been told he won't be speaking to journalists. Well worth the trip.
Seriously WTF is wrong with this guy.
What is he expecting the journalists to do, fill pages of copy repeating that the LotO hates journalists and drags them around the country, only to tell them to go screw themselves when they get there..?
I'm on the train to Edinburgh to cover Corbyn's visit tomorrow and just been told he won't be speaking to journalists. Well worth the trip.
Seriously WTF is wrong with this guy.
What is he expecting the journalists to do, fill pages of copy repeating that the LotO hates journalists and drags them around the country, only to tell them to go screw themselves when they get there..?
His cohorts from the loony left will love it.. it will be played as putting two fingers up at Murdoch.... and in the end people will leave Labour or just not vote and the real Labour stalwarts won't do the donkey work. That's if they haven't been purged first. I feel for the Labour party, its in its death throws.
''What he meant: I tried imposing my view on Trident, but Unite voted it down, so I had better pretend the new politics is all about open and listening leadership... until I can bring in new rules to give the supporters who voted for me the power over policy.''
Quite. And this is why anybody who thinks Tom Watson is the real labour leader is talking utter cr8p.
The MPs, including him, are eventually going to lose on every issue.
I'm on the train to Edinburgh to cover Corbyn's visit tomorrow and just been told he won't be speaking to journalists. Well worth the trip.
Seriously WTF is wrong with this guy.
What is he expecting the journalists to do, fill pages of copy repeating that the LotO hates journalists and drags them around the country, only to tell them to go screw themselves when they get there..?
His cohorts from the loony left will love it.. it will be played as putting two fingers up at Murdoch.... and in the end people will leave Labour or just not vote and the real Labour stalwarts won't do the donkey work. That's if they haven't been purged first. I feel for the Labour party, its in its death throws.
Labour are supremely lucky that Clegg entered coalition with Cameron and broke his tuition fees promise. Labour won't die without a major schism as there is no alternative, if the Lib Dems were sized as they were previously they'd be seriously threatening to become Her Majesty's Loyal Opposition next election.
If Corbyn gets control of Labour completely (he seems to have NEC, has a mnadate [as he likes to remind people] and only needs to rid himself of some pesky MPs) the press can write what it likes and he won't be moved.
Mind you, Labour tremble at the prospect of knifing a leader anyway.
Great piece on this in the Times today by The Fink.
"The Party has had 17 leaders and it has not pushed out a single one between elections. Labour has only deposed a leader once in any circumstances. This came immediately after the 1922 election, when John Clynes was superseded by Ramsay MacDonald, who was returning to the leadership upon re-election to Parliament."
I wonder if the increased concern about immigration might be because you can be concerned about immigration to the UK in an anti-immigration way, but also concern about immigration in a compassionate way. I might not be concerned about the numbers entering the UK, but I may be concerned that immigrants/refugees throughout Europe, which is an issue affecting the UK, should be well treated.
If Corbyn gets control of Labour completely (he seems to have NEC, has a mnadate [as he likes to remind people] and only needs to rid himself of some pesky MPs) the press can write what it likes and he won't be moved.
Mind you, Labour tremble at the prospect of knifing a leader anyway.
Great piece on this in the Times today by The Fink.
"The Party has had 17 leaders and it has not pushed out a single one between elections. Labour has only deposed a leader once in any circumstances. This came immediately after the 1922 election, when John Clynes was superseded by Ramsay MacDonald, who was returning to the leadership upon re-election to Parliament."
I wonder if the increased concern about immigration might be because you can be concerned about immigration to the UK in an anti-immigration way, but also concern about immigration in a compassionate way. I might not be concerned about the numbers entering the UK, but I may be concerned that immigrants/refugees throughout Europe, which is an issue affecting the UK, should be well treated.
Highly unlikely
If I say "refugees" how is that recorded?
I think the number of people answering
"What do you see as the most important issue concerning Britain today"
with
"The way refugees that are not here yet will be treated"
is so low as to be insignificant, so it wouldn't be a cause of immigration being at record levels of concern
I'm on the train to Edinburgh to cover Corbyn's visit tomorrow and just been told he won't be speaking to journalists. Well worth the trip.
Seriously WTF is wrong with this guy.
What is he expecting the journalists to do, fill pages of copy repeating that the LotO hates journalists and drags them around the country, only to tell them to go screw themselves when they get there..?
His cohorts from the loony left will love it.. it will be played as putting two fingers up at Murdoch.... and in the end people will leave Labour or just not vote and the real Labour stalwarts won't do the donkey work. That's if they haven't been purged first. I feel for the Labour party, its in its death throws.
Given that the BBC and the Guardian have been going for him in the last couple of days, he is rapidly running out of friends and has made it quite clear to everyone that he doesn't want to play the game.
The Morning Star giving him a puff piece isn't going to win an election. Is today the day the Labour party started to eat itself alive?
If Corbyn gets control of Labour completely (he seems to have NEC, has a mnadate [as he likes to remind people] and only needs to rid himself of some pesky MPs) the press can write what it likes and he won't be moved.
Mind you, Labour tremble at the prospect of knifing a leader anyway.
Great piece on this in the Times today by The Fink.
"The Party has had 17 leaders and it has not pushed out a single one between elections. Labour has only deposed a leader once in any circumstances. This came immediately after the 1922 election, when John Clynes was superseded by Ramsay MacDonald, who was returning to the leadership upon re-election to Parliament."
Although...
Tony Blair was basically kicked out. Sure, he was allowed to go on from September 2006 to June 2007 and it wasn't especially bloody but he was pretty much forcibly removed from office by Brown and the Forces From Hell.
I wonder if the increased concern about immigration might be because you can be concerned about immigration to the UK in an anti-immigration way, but also concern about immigration in a compassionate way. I might not be concerned about the numbers entering the UK, but I may be concerned that immigrants/refugees throughout Europe, which is an issue affecting the UK, should be well treated.
Highly unlikely
If I say "refugees" how is that recorded?
I think the number of people answering
"What do you see as the most important issue concerning Britain today"
with
"The way refugees that are not here yet will be treated"
is so low as to be insignificant
I'd just like us to stop importing the population of Cardiff every year. It's not helpful.
Do you remember the Conservative election poster saying- Labours Policy on Arms- with our soldiers holding up their arms in surrender? Well, Labour have just reissued it themselves. Its a new kinder way of doing politics.
I wonder if the increased concern about immigration might be because you can be concerned about immigration to the UK in an anti-immigration way, but also concern about immigration in a compassionate way. I might not be concerned about the numbers entering the UK, but I may be concerned that immigrants/refugees throughout Europe, which is an issue affecting the UK, should be well treated.
Highly unlikely
If I say "refugees" how is that recorded?
I think the number of people answering
"What do you see as the most important issue concerning Britain today"
with
"The way refugees that are not here yet will be treated"
is so low as to be insignificant
I was thinking more "refugee crisis", that sort of thing...
I don't think it will be mroe than a few percent in any case, just wanted to know.
I'm on the train to Edinburgh to cover Corbyn's visit tomorrow and just been told he won't be speaking to journalists. Well worth the trip.
Seriously WTF is wrong with this guy.
What is he expecting the journalists to do, fill pages of copy repeating that the LotO hates journalists and drags them around the country, only to tell them to go screw themselves when they get there..?
His cohorts from the loony left will love it.. it will be played as putting two fingers up at Murdoch.... and in the end people will leave Labour or just not vote and the real Labour stalwarts won't do the donkey work. That's if they haven't been purged first. I feel for the Labour party, its in its death throws.
Given that the BBC and the Guardian have been going for him in the last couple of days, he is rapidly running out of friends and has made it quite clear to everyone that he doesn't want to play the game.
The Morning Star giving him a puff piece isn't going to win an election. Is today the day the Labour party started to eat itself alive?
Playing Devils Advocate here, and I am never going to vote for Corbyn, but Mike has written many threads on the decreasing influence of the dead tree press, and Corbyn won the Labour leadership despite every media outlet slaughtering him.. Corbyn himself has slaughtered them back recently, so I just don't see the surprise... he may be wrong to think it, but he obviously thinks he can succeed without their support, or maybe even attract voters because of the lack of establishment support
NEC now majority of Corbyn backers - changes to rules he wants to make now look possible + once rules change, big policy shifts more likely
That looks like a Corbyn slam dunk. I did not think he would manage it so swiftly, if at all. Of all the great news the Tories have had this week, this is the best for them.
NEC now majority of Corbyn backers - changes to rules he wants to make now look possible + once rules change, big policy shifts more likely
That looks like a Corbyn slam dunk. I did not think he would manage it so swiftly, if at all. Of all the great news the Tories have had this week, this is the best for them.
I linked to the Stephen Bush piece on that yesterday. It's soon or never for the PLP.
"Says someone who apparently has enumerated the word count of another poster on an Internet forum. I may include you as a late submission for "Dull Men of Great Britain" per the Telegraph article."
First thing this morning we get a facial analysis of Eamon Holmes while he's interviewing Corbyn on Breakfast TV at which point you think it can't get any worse but that's just the start. Then a quote from anyone anywhere who has something derogatory to say however uninteresting
It's just inexorable tedium and if you find it interesting I'd hate to be stuck in a lift with you
You've now written over a thousand posts in a week and all about Corbyn. Surely no one can be that dull?
I think it's time you stopped the misogynistic harassment of this poster. You and surbiton have been doing it for several days now - it's become so nuLabour 2015 style.
I'm on the train to Edinburgh to cover Corbyn's visit tomorrow and just been told he won't be speaking to journalists. Well worth the trip.
Seriously WTF is wrong with this guy.
What is he expecting the journalists to do, fill pages of copy repeating that the LotO hates journalists and drags them around the country, only to tell them to go screw themselves when they get there..?
His cohorts from the loony left will love it.. it will be played as putting two fingers up at Murdoch.... and in the end people will leave Labour or just not vote and the real Labour stalwarts won't do the donkey work. That's if they haven't been purged first. I feel for the Labour party, its in its death throws.
Given that the BBC and the Guardian have been going for him in the last couple of days, he is rapidly running out of friends and has made it quite clear to everyone that he doesn't want to play the game.
The Morning Star giving him a puff piece isn't going to win an election. Is today the day the Labour party started to eat itself alive?
Playing Devils Advocate here, and I am never going to vote for Corbyn, but Mike has written many threads on the decreasing influence of the dead tree press, and Corbyn won the Labour leadership despite every media outlet slaughtering him.. Corbyn himself has slaughtered them back recently, so I just don't see the surprise... he may be wrong to think it, but he obviously thinks he can succeed without their support, or maybe even attract voters because of the lack of establishment support
Agree with your Devil's advocacy - he's obviously decided he doesn't need the media, in which case all he's left with is the Twitter echo chamber and a mightily pissed-off press corps. After this week of being given the run-around, will they all just ignore him from now on? Only one thing worse than being talked about...
< sarcasm > Surely the Tories will be smooching them with Champers next week, Cameron can probably make a speech announcing the compulsory killing of first-born sons and he'll still get good front pages. < / sarcasm >
If Corbyn gets control of Labour completely (he seems to have NEC, has a mnadate [as he likes to remind people] and only needs to rid himself of some pesky MPs) the press can write what it likes and he won't be moved.
Mind you, Labour tremble at the prospect of knifing a leader anyway.
Great piece on this in the Times today by The Fink.
"The Party has had 17 leaders and it has not pushed out a single one between elections. Labour has only deposed a leader once in any circumstances. This came immediately after the 1922 election, when John Clynes was superseded by Ramsay MacDonald, who was returning to the leadership upon re-election to Parliament."
Although...
Tony Blair was basically kicked out. Sure, he was allowed to go on from September 2006 to June 2007 and it wasn't especially bloody but he was pretty much forcibly removed from office by Brown and the Forces From Hell.
Indeed and Thatcher and IDS are the only leaders the Tories have kicked out between elections too, Blair was Labour's three times election winner kicked out like Maggie Corbyn could be their IDS kicked out after 2 to 3 years if his polls do not improve
NEC now majority of Corbyn backers - changes to rules he wants to make now look possible + once rules change, big policy shifts more likely
Splendid stuff.
As predicted by me from the off. Take over. Eaten from within. Invasion of the body snatchers. In a short while we will not have the labour party we thought we had any more. The only question is, ironically, will the PLP go for the nuclear option rather than a long war of attrition.
I wonder if the increased concern about immigration might be because you can be concerned about immigration to the UK in an anti-immigration way, but also concern about immigration in a compassionate way. I might not be concerned about the numbers entering the UK, but I may be concerned that immigrants/refugees throughout Europe, which is an issue affecting the UK, should be well treated.
Highly unlikely
If I say "refugees" how is that recorded?
I think the number of people answering
"What do you see as the most important issue concerning Britain today"
with
"The way refugees that are not here yet will be treated"
is so low as to be insignificant
I'd just like us to stop importing the population of Cardiff every year. It's not helpful.
Too right ... Have to seen Cardiff of a Saturday night?
I wonder if the increased concern about immigration might be because you can be concerned about immigration to the UK in an anti-immigration way, but also concern about immigration in a compassionate way. I might not be concerned about the numbers entering the UK, but I may be concerned that immigrants/refugees throughout Europe, which is an issue affecting the UK, should be well treated.
Highly unlikely
If I say "refugees" how is that recorded?
I think the number of people answering
"What do you see as the most important issue concerning Britain today"
with
"The way refugees that are not here yet will be treated"
is so low as to be insignificant
I was thinking more "refugee crisis", that sort of thing...
I don't think it will be mroe than a few percent in any case, just wanted to know.
I agree although, and this is v likely me thinking everyone thinks like me, I think most people see it as a negative, esp when saying its a "concern"
Using only publicly available information and a basic understanding of probability, “superforecasters” — those who performed in the top 2 percent of participants in the tournament — were able to predict future political events 30 percent more accurately than intelligence analysts with access to classified information.
And this was no fluke: superforecasters from the tournament in year two increased their lead over other forecasters the next year, rather than reverting to the mean. These superforecasters were open-minded, skillful at distilling signals from the noise of everyday news as they updated their beliefs, and highly self-aware about their own potential biases and flawed assumptions.
NEC now majority of Corbyn backers - changes to rules he wants to make now look possible + once rules change, big policy shifts more likely
That looks like a Corbyn slam dunk. I did not think he would manage it so swiftly, if at all. Of all the great news the Tories have had this week, this is the best for them.
NEC now majority of Corbyn backers - changes to rules he wants to make now look possible + once rules change, big policy shifts more likely
That looks like a Corbyn slam dunk. I did not think he would manage it so swiftly, if at all. Of all the great news the Tories have had this week, this is the best for them.
I linked to the Stephen Bush piece on that yesterday. It's soon or never for the PLP.
It is never. They have no back bone when it comes to useless Leaders, Thank goodness.
Using only publicly available information and a basic understanding of probability, “superforecasters” — those who performed in the top 2 percent of participants in the tournament — were able to predict future political events 30 percent more accurately than intelligence analysts with access to classified information.
And this was no fluke: superforecasters from the tournament in year two increased their lead over other forecasters the next year, rather than reverting to the mean. These superforecasters were open-minded, skillful at distilling signals from the noise of everyday news as they updated their beliefs, and highly self-aware about their own potential biases and flawed assumptions.
This peace-loving, kindly grandfather, let us not forget, is against NATO intervention, to prevent the ongoing genocide of his own people by Bashar Assad in Syria. He has no problem, however, with Russian intervention. But there is one place his leadership is taken perfectly seriously. His ascent has been greeted happily by PressTV, mouthpiece of the Iran’s brutal regime. Not least because he is a former presenter for the channel, but also because he advocates for the regime’s involvement in Syria.
If Corbyn gets control of Labour completely (he seems to have NEC, has a mnadate [as he likes to remind people] and only needs to rid himself of some pesky MPs) the press can write what it likes and he won't be moved.
Mind you, Labour tremble at the prospect of knifing a leader anyway.
Great piece on this in the Times today by The Fink.
"The Party has had 17 leaders and it has not pushed out a single one between elections. Labour has only deposed a leader once in any circumstances. This came immediately after the 1922 election, when John Clynes was superseded by Ramsay MacDonald, who was returning to the leadership upon re-election to Parliament."
Although...
Tony Blair was basically kicked out. Sure, he was allowed to go on from September 2006 to June 2007 and it wasn't especially bloody but he was pretty much forcibly removed from office by Brown and the Forces From Hell.
Mr. Flightpath, trying to turn the Corbyn problem into the Labour problem, so people think Labour as a party can't be trusted rather than an individual leader of the party can't be trusted.
I'm on the train to Edinburgh to cover Corbyn's visit tomorrow and just been told he won't be speaking to journalists. Well worth the trip.
Seriously WTF is wrong with this guy.
What is he expecting the journalists to do, fill pages of copy repeating that the LotO hates journalists and drags them around the country, only to tell them to go screw themselves when they get there..?
The Morning Star giving him a puff piece isn't going to win an election. Is today the day the Labour party started to eat itself alive?
Playing Devils Advocate here, and I am never going to vote for Corbyn, but Mike has written many threads on the decreasing influence of the dead tree press, and Corbyn won the Labour leadership despite every media outlet slaughtering him.. Corbyn himself has slaughtered them back recently, so I just don't see the surprise... he may be wrong to think it, but he obviously thinks he can succeed without their support, or maybe even attract voters because of the lack of establishment support
Agree with your Devil's advocacy - he's obviously decided he doesn't need the media, in which case all he's left with is the Twitter echo chamber and a mightily pissed-off press corps. After this week of being given the run-around, will they all just ignore him from now on? Only one thing worse than being talked about...
< sarcasm > Surely the Tories will be smooching them with Champers next week, Cameron can probably make a speech announcing the compulsory killing of first-born sons and he'll still get good front pages. < / sarcasm >
Farage tried to be the anti establishment figure at the GE, and I think UKIP are... but ex City men in suits dont look anti establishment, and so it doesn't really work. It definitely plays to the vanity of Corbynista's to be made to feel anti establishment/victims, it is their ambition to be that... I don't think that sits as well with Kippers, who generally want to get on
To me Russell Brand is an establishment figure, but because of his look and act he puts on, many think he is Che Guevera.. Corbyn is tapping into that.. despite almost every lefty cause being establishment backed (political correctness, comprehensive schooling, mass immigration)
@JohnRentoul: Cameron calling him "the Labour leader" on #skynews & "You cannot trust Labour with the national security of the UK."
What is the significance of calling him 'the labour leader'??
Trying to make sure the whole Labour party is covered in Corbyn's sh1t, I would have thought.
Even if he is forced out, any new contest will be held with the same 'selectorate' and with Corbyn eligible to restand if he wishes. The best hope for the party is that he's completely knackered within a few weeks, and that the MPs can behave themselves this time and give the party a choice between a couple of sensible moderates. But oh what fun that would be, another four months just like the last four!!
OT. I was going to suggest anyone who hasn't seen it should look at an I-Player copy of a documentary shown a couple of nights ago (BBC4 I think) called "A Syrian Love Story". In my opinion It was brilliant. About the break up of a Syrian family caught up in the Syrian civil war.
Honorius was an abysmal emperor, but held the post for decades, though few men deserved it less. Let's hope Corbyn has a more curtailed leadership.
Thank you, but it's not me that needs sympathy. Corbyn Labour does not want the support of Red Tories like me; which is kind of lucky, as it is not going to get it ;-)
You said this about Thomson hours before she was binned.
My first comments on Thomson was that there was no evidence of her having any involvement mortgage fraud (which remains the case) and that her involvement in distress purchase property made her incompatible with being an SNP MP.
That was when the story first broke and nothing has changed since then.
Yet more unionist lies.
Yet you say the T in the Park story has no legs.
Apart from an SNP candidate who happens to be the bae of the Westminster leader quitting ...
"However, Ms Dempsie announced she would abandon her campaign to become an SNP list MSP at next year’s Scottish Parliament elections.
In the posting on her social media page, Ms Dempsie said: “I have decided I will not be taking forward my nominations across the Highlands and Islands to be a list SNP MSP for the region.”
Ms Dempsie, the partner of Nationalist Westminster leader Angus Robertson, was a special adviser to First Minister Mr Salmond from 2007 to 2009, then worked for the SNP for four years before starting work as a public relations consultant."
Nepotism is the appointment of a relative or friend to a position based on that relationship and not their ability to do the job. Dempsie left government to work in PR.
And just as any marketing company wanting to bid for Ladbrokes business would in all likelihood hire a consultant who used to work for Ladbrokes, business do the same when they want to pitch to government.
If no-ones getting a kickback and there's no criminality, there isn't anything wrong with this. You can't go around deciding that anyone who ever worked as a SPAD can never hold a private sector job that might include access to government. That would be ridiculous (and probably illegal).
That's why it's a non story.
The whole reason why T in the Park was at Balado was because the Labour administration wanted it to become a rural based event. The same policy is being carried forward by the SNP. DF could make more money moving back to Strathclyde Park but the policy is to keep the festival in rural Scotland. £150k bung to achieve that seems good value.
If Corbyn gets control of Labour completely (he seems to have NEC, has a mnadate [as he likes to remind people] and only needs to rid himself of some pesky MPs) the press can write what it likes and he won't be moved.
Mind you, Labour tremble at the prospect of knifing a leader anyway.
Great piece on this in the Times today by The Fink.
"The Party has had 17 leaders and it has not pushed out a single one between elections. Labour has only deposed a leader once in any circumstances. This came immediately after the 1922 election, when John Clynes was superseded by Ramsay MacDonald, who was returning to the leadership upon re-election to Parliament."
Roger, you seem to being worked from the back by tim..
tim started slagging off Plato for pasting twitter comments , but as soon as he realised it could be used to slag off Dave, he copied her. Now he's retired fighting old battles on GO genius whilst you continue to attack Plato...
You need to have a look in the mirror, from an old fool your are now turning into a misogynistic shit. So STFU, no one cares what you think of Plato.
Just done a bizarre interview with Lord Falconer. He slammed JC on the nuclear button & refused to endorse him as a good potential PM.
To be honest, Falconer's appointment to the Cabinet just looked like he had chosen to be a time bomb, set to go off to do maximum damage to Corbyn.... His inclusion was a Huh??? moment.
'Corbyn Labour does not want the support of Red Tories like me; which is kind of lucky, as it is not going to get it ;-)"
I don't agree . He's raised some interesting points. Whether a leader can survive without the usual party disciplines is an open question but it's time orthodoxies like Trident were debated and BC they just never would or could be. Similarly our various international alliances which I think all on the left should welcome
"To be honest, Falconer's appointment to the Cabinet just looked like he had chosen to be a time bomb'
I wondered whether he was chosen for his buffoon like qualities. Anyone hankering after a return to Blair can remind themselves what that looks like. I've never heard a less articulate barrister.
I don't need to name names as you'll all know to who I refer, but surely even the right wingers here must surely think the small handful of problem-children who do nothing but copy and paste stuff from one or two tabloid sources with zero informed opinion of their own are a teensy bit of a tedious waste of time?
If Corbyn gets control of Labour completely (he seems to have NEC, has a mnadate [as he likes to remind people] and only needs to rid himself of some pesky MPs) the press can write what it likes and he won't be moved.
Mind you, Labour tremble at the prospect of knifing a leader anyway.
Great piece on this in the Times today by The Fink.
"The Party has had 17 leaders and it has not pushed out a single one between elections. Labour has only deposed a leader once in any circumstances. This came immediately after the 1922 election, when John Clynes was superseded by Ramsay MacDonald, who was returning to the leadership upon re-election to Parliament."
Blair did not want to go
He had said he wouldn't serve a full term.
But he did not want to go then. He did all he could to stay to stop Brown becoming PM. He was forced out not at a time of his choosing. But I am not suggesting it will be easy to get rid of Corbyn. But I think the will will be there, I am not sure a out the competence to do the deed though.
'Corbyn Labour does not want the support of Red Tories like me; which is kind of lucky, as it is not going to get it ;-)"
I don't agree . He's raised some interesting points. Whether a leader can survive without the usual party disciplines is an open question but it's time orthodoxies like Trident were debated and BC they just never would or could be. Similarly our various international alliances which I think all on the left should welcome
I am no Corbyn fan but happy to see a proper debate developing over Trident, and on the wisdom of bombing mid-East states. Weeding out the private sector hyenas devouring the NHS, Republicanism and the National Anthem too. It is a pity that he is bonkers on so much else.
''Whether a leader can survive without the usual party disciplines is an open question but it's time orthodoxies like Trident were debated and BC they just never would or could be. ''
Corbyn's conduct shows he has zero interest in 'debating' Trident or any other issue. He is making tactical retreats until he can use membership support to get rid of everybody who disagrees with him
I don't need to name names as you'll all know to who I refer, but surely even the right wingers here must surely think the small handful of problem-children who do nothing but copy and paste stuff from one or two tabloid sources with zero informed opinion of their own are a teensy bit of a tedious waste of time?
I would dispute anyone does 'nothing but' that, and I also don't think any one person could adequately judge the worth of others contributions.
'Corbyn Labour does not want the support of Red Tories like me; which is kind of lucky, as it is not going to get it ;-)"
I don't agree . He's raised some interesting points. Whether a leader can survive without the usual party disciplines is an open question but it's time orthodoxies like Trident were debated and BC they just never would or could be. Similarly our various international alliances which I think all on the left should welcome
I'm not this is wise, but I agree with Roger.There too many "givens" for all major and almost major political parties and, given that we have the FTPA, it's the appopriate time to have such "orthodxies" were seriously challenged.
I know nothing about Plato other than as the most prolific poster on here and therefore impossible to avoid. It is like an 8 year old shouting and scribbling on a blackboard. It is near impossible for interesting and sensible debate to take place around it.
I know nothing about Plato other than as the most prolific poster on here and therefore impossible to avoid. It is like an 8 year old shouting and scribbling on a blackboard. It is near impossible for interesting and sensible debate to take place around it.
Much is mildly amusing nowadays (and probably then too, as it is deliberately lightly written) but the section on the national anthem talks about standing, not singing: The British do not treat the flag as such an important symbol as we do. But they pay more frequent respect to their National Anthem. In peace or war "God Save the King" ... is played at the conclusion of all public gatherings such as theater performances. The British consider it bad form not to stand at attention, even if it means missing the last bus.
You need to have a look in the mirror, from an old fool your are now turning into a misogynistic shit.
I very rarely find myself on the same side of the table as Roger, but can someone tell me why his anti-Plato posts are misogynistic? I've seen a degree of unpleasantness - but not nearly as severe as that heaped on NPXMP recently - but none of what I've seen makes reference to gender.
I hope we're not at a stage where slagging off a poster is off-limits because said poster is lacking a winkie.
If I were to give TSE or Sunil or Max a verbal pasting, would that make me racist?
'Corbyn Labour does not want the support of Red Tories like me; which is kind of lucky, as it is not going to get it ;-)"
I don't agree . He's raised some interesting points. Whether a leader can survive without the usual party disciplines is an open question but it's time orthodoxies like Trident were debated and BC they just never would or could be. Similarly our various international alliances which I think all on the left should welcome
I'm not this is wise, but I agree with Roger.There too many "givens" for all major and almost major political parties and, given that we have the FTPA, it's the appopriate time to have such "orthodxies" were seriously challenged.
By all means. Go to challenge the Kremlin go to challenge north Korea go to challenge the dirty bomb makers. Go to challenge the logic of multilateral as opposed to unilateral disarmament.
'Corbyn Labour does not want the support of Red Tories like me; which is kind of lucky, as it is not going to get it ;-)"
I don't agree . He's raised some interesting points. Whether a leader can survive without the usual party disciplines is an open question but it's time orthodoxies like Trident were debated and BC they just never would or could be. Similarly our various international alliances which I think all on the left should welcome
I am no Corbyn fan but happy to see a proper debate developing over Trident, and on the wisdom of bombing mid-East states. Weeding out the private sector hyenas devouring the NHS, Republicanism and the National Anthem too. It is a pity that he is bonkers on so much else.
Silly The reason he is bonkers is he has a closed mind. So your debate will be a dialogue of the deaf. But it seems to me all you want is him to agree to your particular list of odd prejudices.
I'm on the train to Edinburgh to cover Corbyn's visit tomorrow and just been told he won't be speaking to journalists. Well worth the trip.
Seriously WTF is wrong with this guy.
What is he expecting the journalists to do, fill pages of copy repeating that the LotO hates journalists and drags them around the country, only to tell them to go screw themselves when they get there..?
His cohorts from the loony left will love it.. it will be played as putting two fingers up at Murdoch.... and in the end people will leave Labour or just not vote and the real Labour stalwarts won't do the donkey work. That's if they haven't been purged first. I feel for the Labour party, its in its death throws.
Given that the BBC and the Guardian have been going for him in the last couple of days, he is rapidly running out of friends and has made it quite clear to everyone that he doesn't want to play the game.
The Morning Star giving him a puff piece isn't going to win an election. Is today the day the Labour party started to eat itself alive?
Playing Devils Advocate here, and I am never going to vote for Corbyn, but Mike has written many threads on the decreasing influence of the dead tree press, and Corbyn won the Labour leadership despite every media outlet slaughtering him.. Corbyn himself has slaughtered them back recently, so I just don't see the surprise... he may be wrong to think it, but he obviously thinks he can succeed without their support, or maybe even attract voters because of the lack of establishment support
Then he doesn't understand the game he's playing.
Corbyn won the Labour leadership because the vocal left found a cause and a process. That's ok in terms of an election with half a million voters; it's grossly inadequate when there are 30 million. Obviously, some of the Labour loyalists will stick with their party, though the more sensible will be doing whatever is possible to shift him from office but floating voters will drift off.
The dead tree press is not as significant as it once was but:
1. There are still around seven million national newspapers published daily, which will be well over 10 million readers. 2. Those who read papers will be disproportionately voters. 3. The circulation figures represent only the dead wood section. There are over 35 million visits per day on average to the main newspaper websites 4. The TV and radio news coverage remains heavily influenced by papers.
Comments
senior scottish legal expert: the law society statement is bollocks.
"Speaking to BBC Newsnight on Tuesday, Volkswagen board member Olaf Lies said ..."
Honestly, it's ghastly yet oddly fascinating; like watching someone self-harm in the street.
What fairweather friends these Nats are! Could do with learning some loyalty and solidarity.
I feel for the Labour party, its in its death throws.
Quite. And this is why anybody who thinks Tom Watson is the real labour leader is talking utter cr8p.
The MPs, including him, are eventually going to lose on every issue.
You've now written over a thousand posts in a week and all about Corbyn. Surely no one can be that dull?
"The Party has had 17 leaders and it has not pushed out a single one between elections. Labour has only deposed a leader once in any circumstances. This came immediately after the 1922 election, when John Clynes was superseded by Ramsay MacDonald, who was returning to the leadership upon re-election to Parliament."
Would you detonate "The Bomb" if your home on the Cote D'Azure was under threat?
I may include you as a late submission for "Dull Men of Great Britain" per the Telegraph article.
"What do you see as the most important issue concerning Britain today"
with
"The way refugees that are not here yet will be treated"
is so low as to be insignificant, so it wouldn't be a cause of immigration being at record levels of concern
The Morning Star giving him a puff piece isn't going to win an election. Is today the day the Labour party started to eat itself alive?
Tony Blair was basically kicked out. Sure, he was allowed to go on from September 2006 to June 2007 and it wasn't especially bloody but he was pretty much forcibly removed from office by Brown and the Forces From Hell.
I don't think it will be mroe than a few percent in any case, just wanted to know.
Honorius was an abysmal emperor, but held the post for decades, though few men deserved it less. Let's hope Corbyn has a more curtailed leadership.
"Says someone who apparently has enumerated the word count of another poster on an Internet forum. I may include you as a late submission for "Dull Men of Great Britain" per the Telegraph article."
First thing this morning we get a facial analysis of Eamon Holmes while he's interviewing Corbyn on Breakfast TV at which point you think it can't get any worse but that's just the start. Then a quote from anyone anywhere who has something derogatory to say however uninteresting
It's just inexorable tedium and if you find it interesting I'd hate to be stuck in a lift with you
< sarcasm >
Surely the Tories will be smooching them with Champers next week, Cameron can probably make a speech announcing the compulsory killing of first-born sons and he'll still get good front pages. < / sarcasm >
The only question is, ironically, will the PLP go for the nuclear option rather than a long war of attrition.
So, rebel now, oust Corbyn and face the wrath of the membership.
Or wait and enjoy a slow extinction.
What a choice!
Cameron's own political demise remains to be seen.
Using only publicly available information and a basic understanding of probability, “superforecasters” — those who performed in the top 2 percent of participants in the tournament — were able to predict future political events 30 percent more accurately than intelligence analysts with access to classified information.
And this was no fluke: superforecasters from the tournament in year two increased their lead over other forecasters the next year, rather than reverting to the mean. These superforecasters were open-minded, skillful at distilling signals from the noise of everyday news as they updated their beliefs, and highly self-aware about their own potential biases and flawed assumptions.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/monkey-cage/wp/2015/09/30/pundits-are-regularly-outpredicted-by-people-youve-never-heard-of-heres-how-to-change-that/
Punters are better than pundits because the latter are paid based on who wants to listen to them, and the former are paid based on competence.
Does this mean labour will be going into 2020 with a manifesto that would make Hugo Chavez blush??
'Why don't you get on with it, and ask her out for a date?"
We could go and play Russian roulette on the M1. Even if I lost it would be a relief
Remember, the Chairman wants you to be nice to people.
Even if he is forced out, any new contest will be held with the same 'selectorate' and with Corbyn eligible to restand if he wishes. The best hope for the party is that he's completely knackered within a few weeks, and that the MPs can behave themselves this time and give the party a choice between a couple of sensible moderates. But oh what fun that would be, another four months just like the last four!!
@IainDale
Just done a bizarre interview with Lord Falconer. He slammed JC on the nuclear button & refused to endorse him as a good potential PM.
I came on this site to mention it
"Mr. Roger, that's rather ungallant of you.
Remember, the Chairman wants you to be nice to people."
Sorry MD. No more Mr Nice Guy. After a thousand identical posts I've snapped.
tim started slagging off Plato for pasting twitter comments , but as soon as he realised it could be used to slag off Dave, he copied her. Now he's retired fighting old battles on GO genius whilst you continue to attack Plato...
You need to have a look in the mirror, from an old fool your are now turning into a misogynistic shit.
So STFU, no one cares what you think of Plato.
http://www.nhs.uk/conditions/male-menopause/Pages/Introduction.aspx
'Corbyn Labour does not want the support of Red Tories like me; which is kind of lucky, as it is not going to get it ;-)"
I don't agree . He's raised some interesting points. Whether a leader can survive without the usual party disciplines is an open question but it's time orthodoxies like Trident were debated and BC they just never would or could be. Similarly our various international alliances which I think all on the left should welcome
"To be honest, Falconer's appointment to the Cabinet just looked like he had chosen to be a time bomb'
I wondered whether he was chosen for his buffoon like qualities. Anyone hankering after a return to Blair can remind themselves what that looks like. I've never heard a less articulate barrister.
New Thread New Thread
But I am not suggesting it will be easy to get rid of Corbyn. But I think the will will be there, I am not sure a out the competence to do the deed though.
Corbyn's conduct shows he has zero interest in 'debating' Trident or any other issue. He is making tactical retreats until he can use membership support to get rid of everybody who disagrees with him
Then he will get exactly what he wants.
"So STFU, no one cares what you think of Plato."
I know nothing about Plato other than as the most prolific poster on here and therefore impossible to avoid. It is like an 8 year old shouting and scribbling on a blackboard. It is near impossible for interesting and sensible debate to take place around it.
This (hat-tip reddit) is a WW2 guide for American forces stationed in Britain:
http://www.hardscrabblefarm.com/ww2/britain.htm
Much is mildly amusing nowadays (and probably then too, as it is deliberately lightly written) but the section on the national anthem talks about standing, not singing:
The British do not treat the flag as such an important symbol as we do. But they pay more frequent respect to their National Anthem. In peace or war "God Save the King" ... is played at the conclusion of all public gatherings such as theater performances. The British consider it bad form not to stand at attention, even if it means missing the last bus.
So this may actually be a generational thing.
I hope we're not at a stage where slagging off a poster is off-limits because said poster is lacking a winkie.
If I were to give TSE or Sunil or Max a verbal pasting, would that make me racist?
Go to challenge the logic of multilateral as opposed to unilateral disarmament.
The reason he is bonkers is he has a closed mind. So your debate will be a dialogue of the deaf. But it seems to me all you want is him to agree to your particular list of odd prejudices.
Corbyn won the Labour leadership because the vocal left found a cause and a process. That's ok in terms of an election with half a million voters; it's grossly inadequate when there are 30 million. Obviously, some of the Labour loyalists will stick with their party, though the more sensible will be doing whatever is possible to shift him from office but floating voters will drift off.
The dead tree press is not as significant as it once was but:
1. There are still around seven million national newspapers published daily, which will be well over 10 million readers.
2. Those who read papers will be disproportionately voters.
3. The circulation figures represent only the dead wood section. There are over 35 million visits per day on average to the main newspaper websites
4. The TV and radio news coverage remains heavily influenced by papers.
They're still players.