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  • isamisam Posts: 41,118
    I was the big loser!

    Got off the phone to see Ed "won".. clickety click, £66 done in cold blood
  • foxinsoxukfoxinsoxuk Posts: 23,548

    Tabman said:

    MP_SE said:

    Why are the establishment political parties so proud of the NHS's overreliance on foreign workers to prop it up. The biggest scandal is why they have failed to train sufficient doctors and nurses for so long.

    The BMC artificially suppressed the numbers to keep their price and influence up.
    Not true. The numbers trained are decided by the Department of Health. The BMA has always supported medical immigration, which tends to dilute the influence and income of UK trained Doctors.
    Why would the BMA want that?
    I do not think that they do. My phrasing was not good. Tabman suggested that the BMA restricted the numbers trained. If that were their motivation they would oppose medical immigration, but they have consistently opposed any cap on this.

    The BMA is a useless spineless organisation, but restricting the number of doctors is not their doing.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,591

    SNP bloke on QT is absolutely useless, Jo Swinson slaughtered him.

    I'm going to take a wild guess that any SNP people who comment will scoff at that remark. Just a guess.

    Night all

    hunchman said:

    tyson said:

    AndyJS said:

    RodCrosby said:

    Pulpstar said:

    Watford anecdote alert:

    My friend who now lives there is reporting masses of Yellow Peril signs about. He reckons they may win.

    Just like the anecdotes we heard in 2005 and 2010...
    Apparently Oxford West would have been LD in 1983, 1987 and 1992 if numbers of posters were the yardstick.
    Oxford West has changed it's boundaries to include lots of despicable Tories from Abingdon.
    Where I lived in Oxford North it was yellow peril all the way. Why anyone (unless they were a Tory) would ever want to venture into Abingdon, god only knows. Full of Tories and depressingly white.
    Lib Dems have regularly won seats on the Vale of White Horse council in Abingdon. The following makes clear that Nicola Blackwood was successful in minimising the deficit in the north Oxford wards, and just about carried the day with the rural wards outside of Oxford and Abingdon in the constituency:

    http://www.electoralcalculus.co.uk/cgi-bin/seatdetails.pl?seat=Oxford West and Abingdon
    One thing to be careful with that site is it doesn't take account of actual candidates. e.g. it has the Greens getting 4.5% in Hertsmere but they're not standing there
    Huh, predicts the LDs to only lose Redcar by about 7 pts. A lot better than I'd guess.
  • RodCrosbyRodCrosby Posts: 7,737
    Alan Johnson calling for electoral reform, suspiciously close to a version of PR^2.
  • surbitonsurbiton Posts: 13,549
    AndyJS said:

    FPT
    I thought Nicola and the Indian girl, Leanne, did best :)

    Indian?
    She had the perfect Mumbai accent !
  • GIN1138GIN1138 Posts: 22,387
    edited April 2015
    RodCrosby said:

    Alan Johnson calling for electoral reform, suspiciously close to a version of PR^2.

    He's always supported electoral reform. One of those that thinks PR will lock the Tories out of power forever.

    But while FPTP does such a good job at keeping the Tories out, Labour will never ditch it.
  • IOSIOS Posts: 1,450
    HYUFD

    I am not saying those Lib Dems would have voted Con. I am saying that the Tories would have come across as less of a threat and frankly not off the fcking chain. It would have only taken a 30 extra seats for Blair to have lost his majority but Howard manage to screw it good and proper.
  • foxinsoxukfoxinsoxuk Posts: 23,548

    OT but with a political slant.

    I am a big fan of UK comics (the type you read not the joke tellers). In particular 2000AD which I have collected for the last 37 years.

    Flicking through this month's Judge Dredd Megazine I was impressed to come across a full page painting of Dredd's face with the following words:

    "He says Democracy's not for the people.
    You believe everything the man tells you?
    Exercise your right to vote 7 May 2015"

    I am immensely heartened by this. It is great that the people at 2000AD are taking it upon themselves to try and reach out in a novel fashion to a section of society that may not have the greatest turnout and elections and try to persuade them to vote.

    2000 AD is one of my favourites.

    Be Pure, Be Vigilant, Behave.
  • KentRisingKentRising Posts: 2,917
    GIN1138 said:

    GIN1138 said:

    hunchman said:

    tyson said:

    AndyJS said:

    RodCrosby said:

    Pulpstar said:

    Watford anecdote alert:

    My friend who now lives there is reporting masses of Yellow Peril signs about. He reckons they may win.

    Just like the anecdotes we heard in 2005 and 2010...
    Apparently Oxford West would have been LD in 1983, 1987 and 1992 if numbers of posters were the yardstick.
    Oxford West has changed it's boundaries to include lots of despicable Tories from Abingdon.
    Where I lived in Oxford North it was yellow peril all the way. Why anyone (unless they were a Tory) would ever want to venture into Abingdon, god only knows. Full of Tories and depressingly white.
    Lib Dems have regularly won seats on the Vale of White Horse council in Abingdon. The following makes clear that Nicola Blackwood was successful in minimising the deficit in the north Oxford wards, and just about carried the day with the rural wards outside of Oxford and Abingdon in the constituency:

    http://www.electoralcalculus.co.uk/cgi-bin/seatdetails.pl?seat=Oxford West and Abingdon
    One thing to be careful with that site is it doesn't take account of actual candidates. e.g. it has the Greens getting 4.5% in Hertsmere but they're not standing there
    Carswell looked very uncomfortable when Piers Morgan was berating him over Farage's HIV comments...
    Those same comments that would not have been unpopular in Clacton and similar constituencies.
    Apparently Carswell's father is an eminent Dr in the field of HIV.

    Must have made for some interesting dinner conversations I imagine...
    Yes, he was one of the first to diagnose HIV. Doesn't automatically mean he would disagree with Farage's views, but I take your point.
  • AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 29,395
    Useless facts: it was 25 degrees in Gravesend yesterday, 15 today, and forecast to be 11 tomorrow.

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/weather/2648187
  • surbitonsurbiton Posts: 13,549


    Ed Conway @EdConwaySky

    Big vote of support for @george_Osborne from @lagarde: “When u look at growth rates it’s obvious that what happened in the UK has worked”

    She could be in a prison soon !
  • Chris_AChris_A Posts: 1,237



    There is a reason that Philipinos are now one of the fastest growing immigrant populations. Excellent well trained nurses they are too. So are the Portuguese though I am less convinced by the Spanish trained.

    Quite give me a Filipino nurse over a South African one any day.

  • AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 29,395

    AndyJS said:

    FPT
    I thought Nicola and the Indian girl, Leanne, did best :)

    Indian?
    [sigh]
    http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/south_asia/4328733.stm
    Sorry, I hadn't seen that before. Interesting.
  • KentRisingKentRising Posts: 2,917
    IOS said:

    HYUFD

    I am not saying those Lib Dems would have voted Con. I am saying that the Tories would have come across as less of a threat and frankly not off the fcking chain. It would have only taken a 30 extra seats for Blair to have lost his majority but Howard manage to screw it good and proper.

    The 2005 Tories were right about immigration, just five years ahead of public opinion.
  • surbitonsurbiton Posts: 13,549
    AndyJS said:

    Useless facts: it was 25 degrees in Gravesend yesterday, 15 today, and forecast to be 11 tomorrow.

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/weather/2648187

    UKIP country, isn't it ?
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 52,149
    SMukesh said:

    SMukesh said:

    And Cameron has got no choice but to debate Ed.

    Who will he debating Ed with?

    ?
    You need to insert the word "with".
  • TykejohnnoTykejohnno Posts: 7,362

    QT in two weeks time is each leader in turn. From memory that's the same as in 2005 isn't it?

    Do we know which order they'll speak in or will it be decided by lots? Do we know how long each leaders segment is?

    Do we know if the audience will be balanced ?

    Yes we do. It's on the BBC so it won't be.

    What do you make of the new allegations on the tragedy?
    Terrible nigel,but I do believe it was a tragedy that was just waiting to happen.

    On the allegations of Heginbotham’s Businesses,that's different matter.

  • AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 29,395
    Nicola Sturgeon showed a bit of class by being the only one to shake hands with Farage.
  • Tissue_PriceTissue_Price Posts: 9,039
    isam said:

    I was the big loser!

    Got off the phone to see Ed "won".. clickety click, £66 done in cold blood

    You're £4 better off than me, then :)

    Tbf Farage failing to win with a 20% UKIP (exc. undecided) sample is pretty poor - he didn't dominate the Tories like I thought he would.

    Tories broke:

    Ed 19%
    Nige 39%
    Natalie 4%
    Nicola 36% (!)
    Leanne 2%
  • FlightpathFlightpath Posts: 4,012
    AndyJS said:

    Nicola Sturgeon showed a bit of class by being the only one to shake hands with Farage.

    She was stood next to him.
  • IOS said:

    HYUFD

    I am not saying those Lib Dems would have voted Con. I am saying that the Tories would have come across as less of a threat and frankly not off the fcking chain. It would have only taken a 30 extra seats for Blair to have lost his majority but Howard manage to screw it good and proper.

    Just being Howard was all the screwing up it took lets be honest here.
  • TykejohnnoTykejohnno Posts: 7,362

    QT in two weeks time is each leader in turn. From memory that's the same as in 2005 isn't it?

    Do we know which order they'll speak in or will it be decided by lots? Do we know how long each leaders segment is?

    Do we know if the audience will be balanced ?

    Why does there even need to be an audience? Ditto the ITV debate. And tonight.
    Agree.

  • Tissue_PriceTissue_Price Posts: 9,039
    AndyJS said:

    Nicola Sturgeon showed a bit of class by being the only one to shake hands with Farage.

    Well she's the only one to be leader of a country, and understands what statesmanship is about.
  • IOSIOS Posts: 1,450
    Kent Rising

    Its how you sell it. That manifesto Cameron wrote was a disaster.
  • nigel4englandnigel4england Posts: 4,800

    QT in two weeks time is each leader in turn. From memory that's the same as in 2005 isn't it?

    Do we know which order they'll speak in or will it be decided by lots? Do we know how long each leaders segment is?

    Do we know if the audience will be balanced ?

    Yes we do. It's on the BBC so it won't be.

    What do you make of the new allegations on the tragedy?
    Terrible nigel,but I do believe it was a tragedy that was just waiting to happen.

    On the allegations of Heginbotham’s Businesses,that's different matter.

    I don't even want to contemplate that it was anything other than a terrible tragedy, i believe the Kings Cross fire started a similar way.
  • FlightpathFlightpath Posts: 4,012
    Chris_A said:



    There is a reason that Philipinos are now one of the fastest growing immigrant populations. Excellent well trained nurses they are too. So are the Portuguese though I am less convinced by the Spanish trained.

    Quite give me a Filipino nurse over a South African one any day.

    Our local Spanish nurses seem OK. My mum in law thinks Spanish nurses in tenerife are terrible. Could they have come from south America
  • isamisam Posts: 41,118
    Mirror for Ukip!

    Julian Deverell (@JulianDeverell)
    April 16
    Ukip manifesto: The 11 weirdly sensible money policies other parties should look at - Mirror Online mirror.co.uk/money/ukip-man…
  • foxinsoxukfoxinsoxuk Posts: 23,548

    AndyJS said:

    Nicola Sturgeon showed a bit of class by being the only one to shake hands with Farage.

    She was stood next to him.

    AndyJS said:

    Nicola Sturgeon showed a bit of class by being the only one to shake hands with Farage.

    She was stood next to him.
    There was a 3 way girly hug before she went over to Nigel.

    Sturgeon is a far more talented politician than Salmond. He has been eclipsed. She also has a lot more experience of public debates over the last year or so than any of the others. She is match fit while they are rusty.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,415

    isam said:

    I was the big loser!

    Got off the phone to see Ed "won".. clickety click, £66 done in cold blood

    You're £4 better off than me, then :)

    Tbf Farage failing to win with a 20% UKIP (exc. undecided) sample is pretty poor - he didn't dominate the Tories like I thought he would.

    Tories broke:

    Ed 19%
    Nige 39%
    Natalie 4%
    Nicola 36% (!)
    Leanne 2%
    They've clearly all piled on the Nats.
  • Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 65,826

    QT in two weeks time is each leader in turn. From memory that's the same as in 2005 isn't it?

    Do we know which order they'll speak in or will it be decided by lots? Do we know how long each leaders segment is?

    Do we know if the audience will be balanced ?

    Why does there even need to be an audience? Ditto the ITV debate. And tonight.
    Agree.

    To be fair it wouldn't be Question Time without an audience.

    The problem tonight was that it was supposed to be a debate and not Question Time.
  • isamisam Posts: 41,118
    AndyJS said:

    Nicola Sturgeon showed a bit of class by being the only one to shake hands with Farage.

    Paul Dockerty (@pdockerty)
    April 16
    The reason to vote #UKIP in one simple image. pic.twitter.com/EinGtYQ5Jn
  • John_NJohn_N Posts: 389
    PB heads' average predictions at Nojam.com: CON 289, LAB 271, SNP 42, LD 26, UKIP 3, GRN 1, OTH 18. You're Cameron. What would you do? It's almost a no-brainer: make concessions to the SNP. Sure, you could try for a deal with LD and some UU's, but that wouldn't be stable and why would the LD go for it? If the UU were to hold the government to ransom and bring it down, the LD wouldn't look that distinguishable from CON. Here are the alternatives if those are the numbers: 1) CON-SNP, 2) RAINBOW.
  • FlightpathFlightpath Posts: 4,012

    QT in two weeks time is each leader in turn. From memory that's the same as in 2005 isn't it?

    Do we know which order they'll speak in or will it be decided by lots? Do we know how long each leaders segment is?

    Do we know if the audience will be balanced ?

    Why does there even need to be an audience? Ditto the ITV debate. And tonight.
    The BBC had 2 audiences, one with the worm, one booing.
    Then another on QT.
  • TykejohnnoTykejohnno Posts: 7,362

    QT in two weeks time is each leader in turn. From memory that's the same as in 2005 isn't it?

    Do we know which order they'll speak in or will it be decided by lots? Do we know how long each leaders segment is?

    Do we know if the audience will be balanced ?

    Yes we do. It's on the BBC so it won't be.

    What do you make of the new allegations on the tragedy?
    Terrible nigel,but I do believe it was a tragedy that was just waiting to happen.

    On the allegations of Heginbotham’s Businesses,that's different matter.

    I don't even want to contemplate that it was anything other than a terrible tragedy, i believe the Kings Cross fire started a similar way.
    I've been in that old stand (built I think in 1908) and it was a fire death trap,wooden floors with space below where rubbish gathered and tar roofing.

    Like I said,a tragedy waiting to happen.

  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 52,149
    edited April 2015
    AndyJS said:

    AndyJS said:

    FPT
    I thought Nicola and the Indian girl, Leanne, did best :)

    Indian?
    [sigh]
    http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/south_asia/4328733.stm
    Sorry, I hadn't seen that before. Interesting.
    No worries, I didn't realise how old that article was!

    There was also the sketch in the Two Ronnies where Ronnie Corbett tried to escape a dystopian feminist England into Wales via a checkpoint ("manned" by Diana Dors!) where he put on an Indian accent instead of a Welsh one!

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sSlekcIMbqM
  • KentRisingKentRising Posts: 2,917
    AndyJS said:

    Nicola Sturgeon showed a bit of class by being the only one to shake hands with Farage.

    In fairness Miliband made his way over eventually.

    The Green and the Welsh were just rude.

  • EPGEPG Posts: 6,653
    isam said:

    AndyJS said:

    Nicola Sturgeon showed a bit of class by being the only one to shake hands with Farage.

    Paul Dockerty (@pdockerty)
    April 16
    The reason to vote #UKIP in one simple image. pic.twitter.com/EinGtYQ5Jn
    Tweeted by a self-proclaimed proud descendant of the Donegal High Kings. This Donegal place is presumably part of the UK that the immigrants are going to be kept out of.
  • scotslassscotslass Posts: 912
    The Telegraph is surprisingly good value on the debates with all their columnists giving it to Sturgeon albeit through gritted teeth ! The one single exception is Iain Martin who just comes across as a sour and very silly man.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 123,987
    edited April 2015
    IOS/KentRising/RealAle 2005 was all about the Iraq War, less so immigration and the high LD vote and Clarke is the only Tory who could have squeezed those LD voters in enough key marginals to produce a hung parliament
  • Tissue_PriceTissue_Price Posts: 9,039
    Excluding undecideds, Miliband won that "best PM" question 44-42%. But if the panel's VI had matched May2015's poll-of-polls, Cameron would have won 46-44%.
  • IOSIOS Posts: 1,450
    HYUFD

    That is totally wrong. The Iraq war wasn't even a major issue according to the polls. It was the economy and immigration and the NHS and etc etc etc
  • Tissue_PriceTissue_Price Posts: 9,039
    scotslass said:

    The Telegraph is surprisingly good value on the debates with all their columnists giving it to Sturgeon albeit through gritted teeth ! The one single exception is Iain Martin who just comes across as a sour and very silly man.

    I thought the right-wing press would give it to Sturgeon; that suits Cameron best.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,415
    John_N said:

    PB heads' average predictions at Nojam.com: CON 289, LAB 271, SNP 42, LD 26, UKIP 3, GRN 1, OTH 18. You're Cameron. What would you do? It's almost a no-brainer: make concessions to the SNP. Sure, you could try for a deal with LD and some UU's, but that wouldn't be stable and why would the LD go for it? If the UU were to hold the government to ransom and bring it down, the LD wouldn't look that distinguishable from CON. Here are the alternatives if those are the numbers: 1) CON-SNP, 2) RAINBOW.

    The SNP will not do a deal with the Conservatives.

    This is the biggest cert of the election.
  • scotslassscotslass Posts: 912
    Not just the right wing press but the left wing Scots, Survation's Scottish sample votes overwhelmingly for Sturgeon!
  • nigel4englandnigel4england Posts: 4,800
    Must be something wrong with me but much prefer Miranda Green to Leanne Wood
  • Tissue_PriceTissue_Price Posts: 9,039
    scotslass said:

    Not just the right wing press but the left wing Scots, Survation's Scottish sample votes overwhelmingly for Sturgeon!

    Yes. But the debate was a triumph for Miliband and a disaster for Cameron (see thread earlier).
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,415
    Just seen the Sun front page

    "Loser Ed to pinch PM's job"

    I mean... REALLY.
  • Tissue_PriceTissue_Price Posts: 9,039
    Pulpstar said:

    John_N said:

    PB heads' average predictions at Nojam.com: CON 289, LAB 271, SNP 42, LD 26, UKIP 3, GRN 1, OTH 18. You're Cameron. What would you do? It's almost a no-brainer: make concessions to the SNP. Sure, you could try for a deal with LD and some UU's, but that wouldn't be stable and why would the LD go for it? If the UU were to hold the government to ransom and bring it down, the LD wouldn't look that distinguishable from CON. Here are the alternatives if those are the numbers: 1) CON-SNP, 2) RAINBOW.

    The SNP will not do a deal with the Conservatives.

    This is the biggest cert of the election.
    I'll take 50/1 on a deal of some sort...
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,415
    Margaret Curran has called the debate for

    No - go on guess :D
  • isamisam Posts: 41,118
    EPG said:

    isam said:

    AndyJS said:

    Nicola Sturgeon showed a bit of class by being the only one to shake hands with Farage.

    Paul Dockerty (@pdockerty)
    April 16
    The reason to vote #UKIP in one simple image. pic.twitter.com/EinGtYQ5Jn
    Tweeted by a self-proclaimed proud descendant of the Donegal High Kings. This Donegal place is presumably part of the UK that the immigrants are going to be kept out of.
    Zzzzzzzzzzzzz

    Don't you ever get bored of that one joke ?
  • FlightpathFlightpath Posts: 4,012

    AndyJS said:

    Nicola Sturgeon showed a bit of class by being the only one to shake hands with Farage.

    She was stood next to him.

    AndyJS said:

    Nicola Sturgeon showed a bit of class by being the only one to shake hands with Farage.

    She was stood next to him.
    There was a 3 way girly hug before she went over to Nigel.

    Sturgeon is a far more talented politician than Salmond. He has been eclipsed. She also has a lot more experience of public debates over the last year or so than any of the others. She is match fit while they are rusty.
    Yes I know that.
    A far left 3way girly hug.
    Sturgeon can pick what she says with ease, she will never have to justify it to a go wide electorate.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,415

    Pulpstar said:

    John_N said:

    PB heads' average predictions at Nojam.com: CON 289, LAB 271, SNP 42, LD 26, UKIP 3, GRN 1, OTH 18. You're Cameron. What would you do? It's almost a no-brainer: make concessions to the SNP. Sure, you could try for a deal with LD and some UU's, but that wouldn't be stable and why would the LD go for it? If the UU were to hold the government to ransom and bring it down, the LD wouldn't look that distinguishable from CON. Here are the alternatives if those are the numbers: 1) CON-SNP, 2) RAINBOW.

    The SNP will not do a deal with the Conservatives.

    This is the biggest cert of the election.
    I'll take 50/1 on a deal of some sort...
    Seeing as I regard you as a more serious poster than some of the fantasists that have suggested such a deal, what deal would you envisage :) ?

    I can't lay 50-1 I'm afraid ;)
  • asjohnstoneasjohnstone Posts: 1,276
    Pulpstar said:

    John_N said:

    PB heads' average predictions at Nojam.com: CON 289, LAB 271, SNP 42, LD 26, UKIP 3, GRN 1, OTH 18. You're Cameron. What would you do? It's almost a no-brainer: make concessions to the SNP. Sure, you could try for a deal with LD and some UU's, but that wouldn't be stable and why would the LD go for it? If the UU were to hold the government to ransom and bring it down, the LD wouldn't look that distinguishable from CON. Here are the alternatives if those are the numbers: 1) CON-SNP, 2) RAINBOW.

    The SNP will not do a deal with the Conservatives.

    This is the biggest cert of the election.
    Exactly, it'd be suicide in 2016. Impossible to happen
  • EPGEPG Posts: 6,653
    isam said:

    EPG said:

    isam said:

    AndyJS said:

    Nicola Sturgeon showed a bit of class by being the only one to shake hands with Farage.

    Paul Dockerty (@pdockerty)
    April 16
    The reason to vote #UKIP in one simple image. pic.twitter.com/EinGtYQ5Jn
    Tweeted by a self-proclaimed proud descendant of the Donegal High Kings. This Donegal place is presumably part of the UK that the immigrants are going to be kept out of.
    Zzzzzzzzzzzzz

    Don't you ever get bored of that one joke ?
    Ukip in one-issue accusation shocker!
  • NickPalmerNickPalmer Posts: 21,569
    Cyclefree said:

    I would prefer to have a Labour majority than a Labour government dependant on the SNP.

    I tried that line on a Tory this afternoon, just for fun - shouldn't you vote Labour to ensure a healthy majority not dependent on the SNP? She laughed and said, "Nice try..."
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,415
    I think if Dave is in power with the help say of the Lib Dems then the SNP will do deals whilst he is in Gov't if the Lib Dem majority combined majority is wafer thin (EVEL for FFA perhaps ?) but not to get him in. Just can't see it - I'd be intrigued to know what deal is envisaged between CON and SNP. They won't abstain on Queen's speech. They'll vote against.
  • TykejohnnoTykejohnno Posts: 7,362
    Pulpstar said:

    Just seen the Sun front page

    "Loser Ed to pinch PM's job"

    I mean... REALLY.

    Just thinking about the sun newspaper,wonder if they will come to be a tory supporting paper for the next five years if miliband wins

    The sun becomes to the tories what the mirror is to the labour party.

  • Tissue_PriceTissue_Price Posts: 9,039
    Pulpstar said:

    Pulpstar said:

    John_N said:

    PB heads' average predictions at Nojam.com: CON 289, LAB 271, SNP 42, LD 26, UKIP 3, GRN 1, OTH 18. You're Cameron. What would you do? It's almost a no-brainer: make concessions to the SNP. Sure, you could try for a deal with LD and some UU's, but that wouldn't be stable and why would the LD go for it? If the UU were to hold the government to ransom and bring it down, the LD wouldn't look that distinguishable from CON. Here are the alternatives if those are the numbers: 1) CON-SNP, 2) RAINBOW.

    The SNP will not do a deal with the Conservatives.

    This is the biggest cert of the election.
    I'll take 50/1 on a deal of some sort...
    Seeing as I regard you as a more serious poster than some of the fantasists that have suggested such a deal, what deal would you envisage :) ?

    I can't lay 50-1 I'm afraid ;)
    In a circumstance where EICIPM isn't really viable such as

    Con 295
    LD 20
    Lab 255
    SNP 55
    Oth 7
    NI 18

    they might cut a deal: devolution for EV4EL
  • FlightpathFlightpath Posts: 4,012

    AndyJS said:

    Nicola Sturgeon showed a bit of class by being the only one to shake hands with Farage.

    She was stood next to him.

    AndyJS said:

    Nicola Sturgeon showed a bit of class by being the only one to shake hands with Farage.

    She was stood next to him.
    There was a 3 way girly hug before she went over to Nigel.

    Sturgeon is a far more talented politician than Salmond. He has been eclipsed. She also has a lot more experience of public debates over the last year or so than any of the others. She is match fit while they are rusty.
    Yes I know that.
    A far left 3way girly hug.
    Sturgeon can pick what she says with ease, she will never have to justify it to a go wide electorate.
    "UK wide electorate "!
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,415

    Pulpstar said:

    Pulpstar said:

    John_N said:

    PB heads' average predictions at Nojam.com: CON 289, LAB 271, SNP 42, LD 26, UKIP 3, GRN 1, OTH 18. You're Cameron. What would you do? It's almost a no-brainer: make concessions to the SNP. Sure, you could try for a deal with LD and some UU's, but that wouldn't be stable and why would the LD go for it? If the UU were to hold the government to ransom and bring it down, the LD wouldn't look that distinguishable from CON. Here are the alternatives if those are the numbers: 1) CON-SNP, 2) RAINBOW.

    The SNP will not do a deal with the Conservatives.

    This is the biggest cert of the election.
    I'll take 50/1 on a deal of some sort...
    Seeing as I regard you as a more serious poster than some of the fantasists that have suggested such a deal, what deal would you envisage :) ?

    I can't lay 50-1 I'm afraid ;)
    In a circumstance where EICIPM isn't really viable such as

    Con 295
    LD 20
    Lab 255
    SNP 55
    Oth 7
    NI 18

    they might cut a deal: devolution for EV4EL
    I forsee lower air passenger duty in Belfast in that scenario tbh ;)
  • Tissue_PriceTissue_Price Posts: 9,039
    edited April 2015

    Pulpstar said:

    John_N said:

    PB heads' average predictions at Nojam.com: CON 289, LAB 271, SNP 42, LD 26, UKIP 3, GRN 1, OTH 18. You're Cameron. What would you do? It's almost a no-brainer: make concessions to the SNP. Sure, you could try for a deal with LD and some UU's, but that wouldn't be stable and why would the LD go for it? If the UU were to hold the government to ransom and bring it down, the LD wouldn't look that distinguishable from CON. Here are the alternatives if those are the numbers: 1) CON-SNP, 2) RAINBOW.

    The SNP will not do a deal with the Conservatives.

    This is the biggest cert of the election.
    Exactly, it'd be suicide in 2016. Impossible to happen
    Depends what the Tories give them. Agree it's very unlikely but the arithmetic and the pursuit of power might conspire.
  • Tissue_PriceTissue_Price Posts: 9,039
    Pulpstar said:

    Pulpstar said:

    Pulpstar said:

    John_N said:

    PB heads' average predictions at Nojam.com: CON 289, LAB 271, SNP 42, LD 26, UKIP 3, GRN 1, OTH 18. You're Cameron. What would you do? It's almost a no-brainer: make concessions to the SNP. Sure, you could try for a deal with LD and some UU's, but that wouldn't be stable and why would the LD go for it? If the UU were to hold the government to ransom and bring it down, the LD wouldn't look that distinguishable from CON. Here are the alternatives if those are the numbers: 1) CON-SNP, 2) RAINBOW.

    The SNP will not do a deal with the Conservatives.

    This is the biggest cert of the election.
    I'll take 50/1 on a deal of some sort...
    Seeing as I regard you as a more serious poster than some of the fantasists that have suggested such a deal, what deal would you envisage :) ?

    I can't lay 50-1 I'm afraid ;)
    In a circumstance where EICIPM isn't really viable such as

    Con 295
    LD 20
    Lab 255
    SNP 55
    Oth 7
    NI 18

    they might cut a deal: devolution for EV4EL
    I forsee lower air passenger duty in Belfast in that scenario tbh ;)
    Neither DC nor EM want an effective majority of <10. Like last time, Con would arguably be better off scoring 320 than 330.
  • Tabman said:

    Tabman said:

    kle4 said:

    I must confess, despite reading the manifestos at an election for the first time (rather than scanning them last time) and watching every debate and event I can, I am pretty undecided still. I generally lean somewhere between Con and LD, but I see no point in voting LD when they are going to be slaughtered and then probably tack left anyway, and Con don't enthuse me. Lab haven't learned their lessons and assume if I don't vote directly for the Tories I must hate them with a fiery passion, which irritates me, UKIP I want to do well but don't match up with my views in too many areas, and the Greens are pretty crazy, but might get a vote for entertainment value to see how high the Green vote can get.

    An electorally successful party somewhere between the Tories and LDs would not be totally amiss. Some LDs are there, but the party as a whole? And in the future?

    I do not expect the LDs to win in my seat, indeed I expect the vote to go down, but I shall be voting LD anyway. I am an orange booker and while I do not agree with all LD policies, I do agree with more than any other party. I do quite like the Greens too...
    Me too; we're an endangered species. However I view the Greens as watermelons.
    Sure. The Greens have some bonkers ideas, but there are some good ones in there too. In particular tuition fees.
    What's their view on tuition fees?
    People who don't go to university should pay more tax to pay the fees of those that do.

  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,415
    Labour abstain the Queen's speech in that scenario ?
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,415
    Con 295
    LD 20
    Lab 255
    SNP 55
    Oth 7
    NI 18

    That'd be a corker of a result.

    My company needs Sterling to weaken a touch ;)
  • Tissue_PriceTissue_Price Posts: 9,039
    edited April 2015
    Pulpstar said:

    Labour abstain the Queen's speech in that scenario ?

    Yes, and that's when the SNP cut a deal. After the Queen's speech.

    The assumption that Lab or Con would automatically vote the other side out at the first opportunity doesn't always hold true.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,415

    Pulpstar said:

    Labour abstain the Queen's speech in that scenario ?

    Yes, and that's when the SNP cut a deal. After the Queen's speech.
    The SNP would love that.

    Labour let the Tories in :D

    Labour would truly be dead and bruied in Scotland for the next 30 years.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 123,987
    IOS No, it was the Iraq War which shifted 2001 Labour voters to the LDs, had Clarke led the Tories he may have shifted some of them to him
  • CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758

    Straight contest between David Cameron and Ed Miliband to be Prime Minister?
    David Cameron - 40%
    Ed Miliband - 45%
    Would not vote - 10%
    Don’t know - 5%

    That is rather out of sync with normal polling. Be interesting to see the demographics of the people they polled, as they is way way out from what we normally see.

    If it repeated elsewhere, obviously Cameron is absolutely and utterly screwed.

    Of course, this is also the single most propitious moment to ask that question in the whole campaign and get EM as an answer.
    Was the question asked last after that long list of was EdM best on X, Y, Z?

    If so, surely influenced by the foregoing?
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,415
    Deal after Queen's speech is perfectly possible tbh.

    But obviously behind closed doors etc etc abstentions not votes for blah blah.

    Just not before ;)

    As I've said a few times I have Labour down as far more likely to let Dave stay in than the SNP.
  • Tissue_PriceTissue_Price Posts: 9,039
    Charles said:

    Straight contest between David Cameron and Ed Miliband to be Prime Minister?
    David Cameron - 40%
    Ed Miliband - 45%
    Would not vote - 10%
    Don’t know - 5%

    That is rather out of sync with normal polling. Be interesting to see the demographics of the people they polled, as they is way way out from what we normally see.

    If it repeated elsewhere, obviously Cameron is absolutely and utterly screwed.

    Of course, this is also the single most propitious moment to ask that question in the whole campaign and get EM as an answer.
    Was the question asked last after that long list of was EdM best on X, Y, Z?

    If so, surely influenced by the foregoing?
    Yes, it's garbage on lots of levels. Biased sample, priming questions, and of course the debate itself would have been a primer too.

    http://survation.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/04/Post-Debate-Poll-Tables.pdf

    Even then 6% of Labour voters went for Dave.
  • Danny565Danny565 Posts: 8,091
    edited April 2015
    Pulpstar said:

    Con 295
    LD 20
    Lab 255
    SNP 55
    Oth 7
    NI 18

    That'd be a corker of a result.

    My company needs Sterling to weaken a touch ;)

    We would have another election before August on such numbers IMO.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,415

    Charles said:

    Straight contest between David Cameron and Ed Miliband to be Prime Minister?
    David Cameron - 40%
    Ed Miliband - 45%
    Would not vote - 10%
    Don’t know - 5%

    That is rather out of sync with normal polling. Be interesting to see the demographics of the people they polled, as they is way way out from what we normally see.

    If it repeated elsewhere, obviously Cameron is absolutely and utterly screwed.

    Of course, this is also the single most propitious moment to ask that question in the whole campaign and get EM as an answer.
    Was the question asked last after that long list of was EdM best on X, Y, Z?

    If so, surely influenced by the foregoing?
    Yes, it's garbage on lots of levels. Biased sample, priming questions, and of course the debate itself would have been a primer too.

    http://survation.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/04/Post-Debate-Poll-Tables.pdf

    Even then 6% of Labour voters went for Dave.
    Hmm indeed.

    Not a poll to change strategy on quite frankly.

    More the closing of the MORI gap that is the best news for Ed I reckon.

    Only 6% behind Dave is pretty good for him.

    But indeed this poll is garbage.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,415
    Danny565 said:

    Pulpstar said:

    Con 295
    LD 20
    Lab 255
    SNP 55
    Oth 7
    NI 18

    That'd be a corker of a result.

    My company needs Sterling to weaken a touch ;)

    We would have another election before August on such numbers IMO.
    Turmoil, chaos, hopefully some betting opportunities.
  • KentRisingKentRising Posts: 2,917
    Pulpstar said:

    Con 295
    LD 20
    Lab 255
    SNP 55
    Oth 7
    NI 18

    That'd be a corker of a result.

    My company needs Sterling to weaken a touch ;)

    That looks to me like another Con-LD coalition with help from UKIP and N.Ireland.
  • nigel4englandnigel4england Posts: 4,800

    Pulpstar said:

    Con 295
    LD 20
    Lab 255
    SNP 55
    Oth 7
    NI 18

    That'd be a corker of a result.

    My company needs Sterling to weaken a touch ;)

    That looks to me like another Con-LD coalition with help from UKIP and N.Ireland.
    Though I am a Kipper I would be very happy with five more years of a Con-LD coalition, they have done a superb job so far.
  • Danny565Danny565 Posts: 8,091

    Pulpstar said:

    Con 295
    LD 20
    Lab 255
    SNP 55
    Oth 7
    NI 18

    That'd be a corker of a result.

    My company needs Sterling to weaken a touch ;)

    That looks to me like another Con-LD coalition with help from UKIP and N.Ireland.
    That assumes the Lib Dems, with presumably even most of the survivors now sitting on small majorities, would be up for a new round of bloodletting.

    And it assumes the DUP would be up for signing up to spending cuts which would have a disproportionately large effect on the Northern Irish economy.

    And even if by some miracle those two conditions are met, it relies on the Nadine Dorries's and Peter Bones not rebelling on a single vote.
  • Tissue_PriceTissue_Price Posts: 9,039

    Pulpstar said:

    Con 295
    LD 20
    Lab 255
    SNP 55
    Oth 7
    NI 18

    That'd be a corker of a result.

    My company needs Sterling to weaken a touch ;)

    That looks to me like another Con-LD coalition with help from UKIP and N.Ireland.
    What UKIP? I have 4 PC, Lucas, Galloway & Bercow ;)
  • Danny565Danny565 Posts: 8,091

    Pulpstar said:

    Con 295
    LD 20
    Lab 255
    SNP 55
    Oth 7
    NI 18

    That'd be a corker of a result.

    My company needs Sterling to weaken a touch ;)

    That looks to me like another Con-LD coalition with help from UKIP and N.Ireland.
    Though I am a Kipper I would be very happy with five more years of a Con-LD coalition, they have done a superb job so far.
    Including on immigration? ;)
  • CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758
    IOS said:

    JohnO

    No. I just stick in the odd £50 and campaign every now and then.

    How's your Cornish ground game?
  • Tissue_PriceTissue_Price Posts: 9,039
    Danny565 said:

    Pulpstar said:

    Con 295
    LD 20
    Lab 255
    SNP 55
    Oth 7
    NI 18

    That'd be a corker of a result.

    My company needs Sterling to weaken a touch ;)

    That looks to me like another Con-LD coalition with help from UKIP and N.Ireland.
    That assumes the Lib Dems, with presumably even most of the survivors now sitting on small majorities, would be up for a new round of bloodletting.

    And it assumes the DUP would be up for signing up to spending cuts which would have a disproportionately large effect on the Northern Irish economy.

    And even if by some miracle those two conditions are met, it relies on the Nadine Dorries's and Peter Bones not rebelling on a single vote.
    Exactly. That is why a Con-SNP deal might get done.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,415

    Pulpstar said:

    Con 295
    LD 20
    Lab 255
    SNP 55
    Oth 7
    NI 18

    That'd be a corker of a result.

    My company needs Sterling to weaken a touch ;)

    That looks to me like another Con-LD coalition with help from UKIP and N.Ireland.
    What UKIP? I have 4 PC, Lucas, Galloway & Bercow ;)
    Constitutional question are 326 votes needed to pass a Queen speech or just a majority
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 52,149
    Pulpstar said:

    Pulpstar said:

    Con 295
    LD 20
    Lab 255
    SNP 55
    Oth 7
    NI 18

    That'd be a corker of a result.

    My company needs Sterling to weaken a touch ;)

    That looks to me like another Con-LD coalition with help from UKIP and N.Ireland.
    What UKIP? I have 4 PC, Lucas, Galloway & Bercow ;)
    Constitutional question are 326 votes needed to pass a Queen speech or just a majority
    323 without SF?
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 123,987
    Dan565 LDs have said they will go with largest party, DUP want an EU referendum
  • KentRisingKentRising Posts: 2,917

    Pulpstar said:

    Con 295
    LD 20
    Lab 255
    SNP 55
    Oth 7
    NI 18

    That'd be a corker of a result.

    My company needs Sterling to weaken a touch ;)

    That looks to me like another Con-LD coalition with help from UKIP and N.Ireland.
    What UKIP? I have 4 PC, Lucas, Galloway & Bercow ;)
    I've long forecast three UKIP - Carswell with ease, Reckless by a whisker and one from elsewhere, maybe Farage or Grimsby.

  • Tissue_PriceTissue_Price Posts: 9,039
    Pulpstar said:

    Pulpstar said:

    Con 295
    LD 20
    Lab 255
    SNP 55
    Oth 7
    NI 18

    That'd be a corker of a result.

    My company needs Sterling to weaken a touch ;)

    That looks to me like another Con-LD coalition with help from UKIP and N.Ireland.
    What UKIP? I have 4 PC, Lucas, Galloway & Bercow ;)
    Constitutional question are 326 votes needed to pass a Queen speech or just a majority
    Just a majority on the division
  • Tissue_PriceTissue_Price Posts: 9,039

    Pulpstar said:

    Con 295
    LD 20
    Lab 255
    SNP 55
    Oth 7
    NI 18

    That'd be a corker of a result.

    My company needs Sterling to weaken a touch ;)

    That looks to me like another Con-LD coalition with help from UKIP and N.Ireland.
    What UKIP? I have 4 PC, Lucas, Galloway & Bercow ;)
    I've long forecast three UKIP - Carswell with ease, Reckless by a whisker and one from elsewhere, maybe Farage or Grimsby.

    Was only joking before - I think Carswell will hold on. The others aren't looking so good, though the Northern targets are getting interesting. UKIP might fall between two stools.
  • AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 29,395
    edited April 2015
    I had the impression UKIP had dropped a bit in recent polls but the UKPR polling average is still putting them on 15%:

    http://ukpollingreport.co.uk/uk-polling-report-average-2
  • asjohnstoneasjohnstone Posts: 1,276
    Pulpstar said:

    Pulpstar said:

    Con 295
    LD 20
    Lab 255
    SNP 55
    Oth 7
    NI 18

    That'd be a corker of a result.

    My company needs Sterling to weaken a touch ;)

    That looks to me like another Con-LD coalition with help from UKIP and N.Ireland.
    What UKIP? I have 4 PC, Lucas, Galloway & Bercow ;)
    Constitutional question are 326 votes needed to pass a Queen speech or just a majority
    Just a majority; it's not different to any other commons vote.
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 52,149
    AndyJS said:

    I had the impression UKIP had dropped a bit in recent polls but the UKPR polling average is still putting them on 15%:

    http://ukpollingreport.co.uk/uk-polling-report-average-2

    Out of date. This week's 11 polls have them on 12.8 by simple average or 13.3 in ELBOW aggregate.
  • RobDRobD Posts: 60,044
    AndyJS said:

    I had the impression UKIP had dropped a bit in recent polls but the UKPR polling average is still putting them on 15%:

    http://ukpollingreport.co.uk/uk-polling-report-average-2

    UKPR doesn't include ICM?
  • In their latest forecast, Chris Hanretty's 2015 UK Parliamentary Election Forecast shows Labour to be within three seats of the Tories, where 277 plays 280.
    Slowly but inexorably the Tories are losing this election, no doubt about it. Sad to say they have been lacklustre and seemingly on the defensive throughout.
    There will probably more bad news for them from Stephen Fisher's updated GE projection in the morning.
  • trubluetrublue Posts: 103
    Ed Miliband now odds on to be next PM on Betfair. Most seats still stuck in the 1.5s for Tories but surely due a big move out soon.

    A very disappointing election campaign for the Conservatives so far. Nothing looks like working. Hung parliament for sure but I'm thinking it'll be Labour most seats even with the bloodbath for them in Scotland.
  • trubluetrublue Posts: 103
    Cyclefree said:

    I would prefer to have a Labour majority than a Labour government dependant on the SNP.

    I rather worryingly had a similar thought tonight. Which makes me wonder about the dangers of the current Conservative messaging imagine Ed in the pocket of Nicola trying to run the country.
  • fitalassfitalass Posts: 4,320
    edited April 2015
    The fact that the Labour party as the main Opposition have steadily lost the comfortable lead they enjoyed in the polls over the last few months would suggest that the Conservatives are far from losing this GE as the incumbent Government party with a clear edge on most popular Leader/PM and economy competence. This 1992 all over again.

    In their latest forecast, Chris Hanretty's 2015 UK Parliamentary Election Forecast shows Labour to be within three seats of the Tories, where 277 plays 280.
    Slowly but inexorably the Tories are losing this election, no doubt about it. Sad to say they have been lacklustre and seemingly on the defensive throughout.
    There will probably more bad news for them from Stephen Fisher's updated GE projection in the morning.

  • fitalassfitalass Posts: 4,320
    A donation that big, and that late, in a GE campaign would suggest that the Express's Desmond thinks that there is going to be an imminent change of Leadership within Ukip following the GE result.
    bunnco said:

    SunNation twitter worm shows big loser is Daily Express's Desmond who saw £1.3m vanish into a puff of smoke.

  • edmundintokyoedmundintokyo Posts: 17,708
    trublue said:

    Cyclefree said:

    I would prefer to have a Labour majority than a Labour government dependant on the SNP.

    I rather worryingly had a similar thought tonight. Which makes me wonder about the dangers of the current Conservative messaging imagine Ed in the pocket of Nicola trying to run the country.
    Weird, isn't it? "My opponent may not quite get enough votes, which will be disastrous for Britain!" Maybe it's aimed at boosting the SNP in Scotland at Labour's expense?
  • asjohnstoneasjohnstone Posts: 1,276
    People clinging to "1992" fantasies are completely ignoring the fact that the polling industry was re-invented post '92.

    It's very probable there was no late swing to the tories in '92, they probably led all along
  • Tissue_PriceTissue_Price Posts: 9,039

    People clinging to "1992" fantasies are completely ignoring the fact that the polling industry was re-invented post '92.

    It's very probable there was no late swing to the tories in '92, they probably led all along

    People thinking the polls are definitely right are completely ignoring the fact that our party dynamic has been practically re-invented post 2010.

    I'm not saying the polls are wrong, but I'm a layer of NOM at 1.13 three weeks out. They could be wrong in either direction, of course.
  • IndigoIndigo Posts: 9,966

    People clinging to "1992" fantasies are completely ignoring the fact that the polling industry was re-invented post '92.

    Because the polling industry got the Israel vote spot on a couple of week ago.... oh wait!
This discussion has been closed.