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  • StereotomyStereotomy Posts: 4,092
    MaxPB said:

    SeanT said:



    I am genuinely curious. What streets of London do you feel you cannot go down, and why can't you go down them??

    Britain used to be known for its civility and good manners. If this is dying I'd like to know where, and how, and why. And what we must do to stop it.

    Whitechapel...
    *Really*?
  • NeilNeil Posts: 7,983


    The point I was making is regarding the hypocrisy of the Zionists
    in the media and on here

    If you want to find hypocrisy you will find plenty under the rock you recently crawled out from under.
  • bigjohnowlsbigjohnowls Posts: 22,736

    Roger said:

    Though Ed isn't to everyone's taste there is a side of Dave that also turns people off. I think we saw it yesterday when he looked both slippery and Sloaney. He hides it well but if Labour could pinpoint it and then lampoon it it could be very effective.

    Being slippery and Sloaney never harmed Blair. Arguably it has harmed Miliband.

    SeanT said:

    Remember I used to make weak jokes on pb about anti-Semitism in Britain?

    They don't seem funny any more.

    People spitting at Jews on the street, no, not in Berlin in 1936, in Bradford in 2015.

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2964984/Fight-Jewish-scum-Shocking-anti-Semitism-streets-BRITAIN-Jewish-journalist-spat-abused-stalked-happens-Copenhagen.html

    Sick and tired of hearing about the rise in Anti Semitism...the major increase here has been in
    attacks against muslims recently yet most of the Tory press and some posters on here continue to flag up every odd anti Jew attack as somehow comparable to the 30s

    Any increase that there even is in Jewish attacks is entirely down to the actions of the Israeli government both in last years mass murders and even recently in Mr Ns moronic address to US legislators which further showed how extreme and isolated the hated pariah state Israel now is in the world

    This is why I maintain that Labour supporters are moral incompetents. It's not just no marks like this imbecile: it goes right to the top. Miliband ate a bacon sandwich to prove he's not a Jew, because he felt being seen as a Jew would reduce his electoral appeal to the kind of people who gob in the street at Jews.

    Making things up to justify your hatred of millions of your fellow citizens says a lot more about you than it does about them.

    The truth hurts, clearly.

    You made your moral choices, so wear them. Just don't expect not to be called out.
    Except you wouldn't recognise truth if it smashed you in the face
  • john_zimsjohn_zims Posts: 3,399
    @SouthamObserver

    'Yep, the hard left is no different to the hard right.'

    It's the left, full point.
  • GIN1138GIN1138 Posts: 22,386
    edited March 2015
    TGOHF said:

    Tom Newton Dunn ‏@tnewtondunn 4m4 minutes ago
    I hear ITV contemplating going unilateral and hosting a 7 way debate as per No10 offer, as they have 1st one. Would send BBC/Sky apoplectic.

    Hhahahahahahahah.... :smiley:

  • Patrick said:

    The sickeningly hypocritical thing is that lefties like to bang on endlessly about multiculti Britain and will defend muslims onto the death no matter what some of their more deranged co-religionists get up to - but somehow a british jew is fair game because of the policy decisions of the government of Israel. WTF? Having a seriously negative view of Israel is anyone's right if they so wish (SeanT has been pretty damn vocal on that score in the past) but to confuse that with the basic rights and civil liberties of a section of our community says alot about the hard left.

    Yep, the hard left is no different to the hard right.
    Reading Nick Cohen's 'What's Left?' as a 17 year old was a genuinely politically enlightening moment for me on this topic. Prior to that I was pretty standard guardian reading anti-war left wing, but discovering that much of the left was in bed with the worst elements of islamic fascism helped my political journey to the 'liberal interventionist' positon. I'm the only person i know who started opposing the Iraq war before going on to support it!
  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 39,064

    MaxPB said:

    Patrick said:

    The sickeningly hypocritical thing is that lefties like to bang on endlessly about multiculti Britain and will defend muslims onto the death no matter what some of their more deranged co-religionists get up to - but somehow a british jew is fair game because of the policy decisions of the government of Israel. WTF? Having a seriously negative view of Israel is anyone's right if they so wish (SeanT has been pretty damn vocal on that score in the past) but to confuse that with the basic rights and civil liberties of a section of our community says alot about the hard left.

    Yep, the hard left is no different to the hard right.
    The problem is that it isn't the hard left that lets this behaviour slide. It is the mainstream left that has allowed Muslim anti-Semitism become so common by not allowing any criticism of Muslims by screaming racism at anyone that did. Now we have parts of Britain which are inaccessible to certain people.

    Really? Can you show the heroic battles the mainstream right has fought against this? The language Tory leaders use about Moslems looks almost identical tot he language labour leaders use; "Religion of peace", "not true Moslems" etc. Cameron and Co come out with it all the time.

    Yet it is right wing supporters who call the government and Conservative leadership on that bullshit double speak when they spout it but leftists nod along furiously. You are dancing on the head of a pin here, it has been clear for many, many years that the mainstream right in the UK is more sceptical towards Islam than the left and on a number of occasions any criticism by someone on the right has been shouted down as racism by the left. We are in this situation because of it, however much you want to deny it. The left needs to take a very long and hard look at what it has done over the last 10 years to court the Muslim vote and think about whether it is worth continuing down this path.
  • MaxPB said:

    Patrick said:

    The sickeningly hypocritical thing is that lefties like to bang on endlessly about multiculti Britain and will defend muslims onto the death no matter what some of their more deranged co-religionists get up to - but somehow a british jew is fair game because of the policy decisions of the government of Israel. WTF? Having a seriously negative view of Israel is anyone's right if they so wish (SeanT has been pretty damn vocal on that score in the past) but to confuse that with the basic rights and civil liberties of a section of our community says alot about the hard left.

    Yep, the hard left is no different to the hard right.
    The problem is that it isn't the hard left that lets this behaviour slide. It is the mainstream left that has allowed Muslim anti-Semitism become so common by not allowing any criticism of Muslims by screaming racism at anyone that did. Now we have parts of Britain which are inaccessible to certain people.
    Quite so.
  • SouthamObserverSouthamObserver Posts: 39,672
    SeanT said:

    There have been no-go areas in major towns and cities for many a long year. When I was a teenager in North London in the late 70s/early 80s there were plenty of places you would not venture out in at night unless you were looking for a fight.

    That's completely different. Straw man.

    You avoided areas because they were rough (as we all do), you did not avoid them because they were racist.

    I didn't. But that's because I am white and straight and not a woman.

  • SouthamObserverSouthamObserver Posts: 39,672
    SeanT said:

    Patrick said:

    SeanT said:

    Sean_F said:

    SeanT said:

    taffys said:

    It's an easy stunt to pull.

    True but none of us are saying we are sick of people talking about islamophobia and its all the fault of islamic state that muslims in Europe are getting this treatment

    The video also makes it clear that there are streets in Britain where it is literally not safe to be openly Jewish. Perhaps I was naive, but I am genuinely shocked, and saddened. My feelings are shared by many others, as Twitter reveals.

    The video therefore has value. Dismissing it is "a stunt" is imbecilic.
    I think there are streets in the UK that any one of us would avoid, for fear of the reception we'd get.

    But, it's still very disturbing, nonetheless.
    Maybe I am astoundingly naive?
    Ever been to Belfast?
    True, but a fairly unique case, and not mainland Britain.

    Anyway my naivety ended today.

    Same thing in many parts of Scotland.
  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 39,064

    MaxPB said:

    SeanT said:



    I am genuinely curious. What streets of London do you feel you cannot go down, and why can't you go down them??

    Britain used to be known for its civility and good manners. If this is dying I'd like to know where, and how, and why. And what we must do to stop it.

    Whitechapel...
    *Really*?
    Try being a teenage white girl in Whitechapel.
  • isamisam Posts: 41,118
    SeanT said:

    Sean_F said:

    SeanT said:

    taffys said:

    It's an easy stunt to pull.

    True but none of us are saying we are sick of people talking about islamophobia and its all the fault of islamic state that muslims in Europe are getting this treatment

    The video also makes it clear that there are streets in Britain where it is literally not safe to be openly Jewish. Perhaps I was naive, but I am genuinely shocked, and saddened. My feelings are shared by many others, as Twitter reveals.

    The video therefore has value. Dismissing it is "a stunt" is imbecilic.
    I think there are streets in the UK that any one of us would avoid, for fear of the reception we'd get.

    But, it's still very disturbing, nonetheless.
    There are perhaps a few British streets I'd avoid, at night, because of crime, but there are no streets I'd avoid simply because I am white, simply because of who I am.

    I sincerely hope - and until today believed - the same could be said of any Briton, Jew, Muslim, black, whatever. We don't tolerate open racism in Britain: that's what I thought.

    Yet here it is. Virulent.

    Maybe I am astoundingly naive?
    The part of Tower Hamlets that isn't full of city millionaires.. wouldn't want to be walking round there late at night if I wasnt a muslim

    http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/aug/07/flag-isis-jihadi-islamic-state-flown-poplar-east-london

  • SouthamObserverSouthamObserver Posts: 39,672
    MaxPB said:

    MaxPB said:

    Patrick said:

    The sickeningly hypocritical thing is that lefties like to bang on endlessly about multiculti Britain and will defend muslims onto the death no matter what some of their more deranged co-religionists get up to - but somehow a british jew is fair game because of the policy decisions of the government of Israel. WTF? Having a seriously negative view of Israel is anyone's right if they so wish (SeanT has been pretty damn vocal on that score in the past) but to confuse that with the basic rights and civil liberties of a section of our community says alot about the hard left.

    Yep, the hard left is no different to the hard right.
    The problem is that it isn't the hard left that lets this behaviour slide. It is the mainstream left that has allowed Muslim anti-Semitism become so common by not allowing any criticism of Muslims by screaming racism at anyone that did. Now we have parts of Britain which are inaccessible to certain people.

    Really? Can you show the heroic battles the mainstream right has fought against this? The language Tory leaders use about Moslems looks almost identical tot he language labour leaders use; "Religion of peace", "not true Moslems" etc. Cameron and Co come out with it all the time.

    Yet it is right wing supporters who call the government and Conservative leadership on that bullshit double speak when they spout it but leftists nod along furiously. You are dancing on the head of a pin here, it has been clear for many, many years that the mainstream right in the UK is more sceptical towards Islam than the left and on a number of occasions any criticism by someone on the right has been shouted down as racism by the left. We are in this situation because of it, however much you want to deny it. The left needs to take a very long and hard look at what it has done over the last 10 years to court the Muslim vote and think about whether it is worth continuing down this path.

    The invasions of Iraq and Afghanistan were, of course, a huge vote winner for the mainstream left.

  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 0
    edited March 2015

    SeanT said:

    Patrick said:

    SeanT said:

    Sean_F said:

    SeanT said:

    taffys said:

    It's an easy stunt to pull.

    True but none of us are saying we are sick of people talking about islamophobia and its all the fault of islamic state that muslims in Europe are getting this treatment

    The video also makes it clear that there are streets in Britain where it is literally not safe to be openly Jewish. Perhaps I was naive, but I am genuinely shocked, and saddened. My feelings are shared by many others, as Twitter reveals.

    The video therefore has value. Dismissing it is "a stunt" is imbecilic.
    I think there are streets in the UK that any one of us would avoid, for fear of the reception we'd get.

    But, it's still very disturbing, nonetheless.
    Maybe I am astoundingly naive?
    Ever been to Belfast?
    True, but a fairly unique case, and not mainland Britain.

    Anyway my naivety ended today.

    Same thing in many parts of Scotland.
    That's very true. I know alot of English who work in Aberdeen or Glasgow and have the occasional horror story to tell. And the taffs seem not to be quite so much into cottage burning these days but it's fair to say our celtic fringe is not always a welcoming place for the anglo-saxons among us!
  • NeilNeil Posts: 7,983
    isam said:

    SeanT said:

    Sean_F said:

    SeanT said:

    taffys said:

    It's an easy stunt to pull.

    True but none of us are saying we are sick of people talking about islamophobia and its all the fault of islamic state that muslims in Europe are getting this treatment

    The video also makes it clear that there are streets in Britain where it is literally not safe to be openly Jewish. Perhaps I was naive, but I am genuinely shocked, and saddened. My feelings are shared by many others, as Twitter reveals.

    The video therefore has value. Dismissing it is "a stunt" is imbecilic.
    I think there are streets in the UK that any one of us would avoid, for fear of the reception we'd get.

    But, it's still very disturbing, nonetheless.
    There are perhaps a few British streets I'd avoid, at night, because of crime, but there are no streets I'd avoid simply because I am white, simply because of who I am.

    I sincerely hope - and until today believed - the same could be said of any Briton, Jew, Muslim, black, whatever. We don't tolerate open racism in Britain: that's what I thought.

    Yet here it is. Virulent.

    Maybe I am astoundingly naive?
    The part of Tower Hamlets that isn't full of city millionaires.. wouldn't want to be walking round there late at night if I wasnt a muslim

    http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/aug/07/flag-isis-jihadi-islamic-state-flown-poplar-east-london

    You shouldnt be such a scaredy cat.
  • SouthamObserverSouthamObserver Posts: 39,672
    MaxPB said:

    MaxPB said:

    SeanT said:



    I am genuinely curious. What streets of London do you feel you cannot go down, and why can't you go down them??

    Britain used to be known for its civility and good manners. If this is dying I'd like to know where, and how, and why. And what we must do to stop it.

    Whitechapel...
    *Really*?
    Try being a teenage white girl in Whitechapel.

    And try being a teenage Bengali there 30 or 40 years ago.

  • taffystaffys Posts: 9,753
    Outstanding post from MaxPB...
  • TGOHFTGOHF Posts: 21,633
    Guido now suggesting ITV are ready to go with their debate studio and set up.

  • richardDoddrichardDodd Posts: 5,472
    A marriage is about to take place... Sturgeon has dropped the Trident removal for her deal with Labour A marriage made in hell methinks
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 42,155

    SeanT said:

    Patrick said:

    SeanT said:

    Sean_F said:

    SeanT said:

    taffys said:

    It's an easy stunt to pull.

    True but none of us are saying we are sick of people talking about islamophobia and its all the fault of islamic state that muslims in Europe are getting this treatment

    The video also makes it clear that there are streets in Britain where it is literally not safe to be openly Jewish. Perhaps I was naive, but I am genuinely shocked, and saddened. My feelings are shared by many others, as Twitter reveals.

    The video therefore has value. Dismissing it is "a stunt" is imbecilic.
    I think there are streets in the UK that any one of us would avoid, for fear of the reception we'd get.

    But, it's still very disturbing, nonetheless.
    Maybe I am astoundingly naive?
    Ever been to Belfast?
    True, but a fairly unique case, and not mainland Britain.

    Anyway my naivety ended today.

    Same thing in many parts of Scotland.
    Which parts are those then?
  • SouthamObserverSouthamObserver Posts: 39,672

    SeanT said:

    Patrick said:

    SeanT said:

    Sean_F said:

    SeanT said:

    taffys said:

    It's an easy stunt to pull.

    True but none of us are saying we are sick of people talking about islamophobia and its all the fault of islamic state that muslims in Europe are getting this treatment

    The video also makes it clear that there are streets in Britain where it is literally not safe to be openly Jewish. Perhaps I was naive, but I am genuinely shocked, and saddened. My feelings are shared by many others, as Twitter reveals.

    The video therefore has value. Dismissing it is "a stunt" is imbecilic.
    I think there are streets in the UK that any one of us would avoid, for fear of the reception we'd get.

    But, it's still very disturbing, nonetheless.
    Maybe I am astoundingly naive?
    Ever been to Belfast?
    True, but a fairly unique case, and not mainland Britain.

    Anyway my naivety ended today.

    Same thing in many parts of Scotland.
    Which parts are those then?

    The blue and green bits.

  • StereotomyStereotomy Posts: 4,092
    MaxPB said:

    MaxPB said:

    SeanT said:



    I am genuinely curious. What streets of London do you feel you cannot go down, and why can't you go down them??

    Britain used to be known for its civility and good manners. If this is dying I'd like to know where, and how, and why. And what we must do to stop it.

    Whitechapel...
    *Really*?
    Try being a teenage white girl in Whitechapel.
    I'm not sure how I could do that. I can try walking down it though, which is what I thought we were talking about, and in fact I have on multiple occasions.
  • isamisam Posts: 41,118
    Neil said:

    isam said:

    SeanT said:

    Sean_F said:

    SeanT said:

    taffys said:

    It's an easy stunt to pull.

    True but none of us are saying we are sick of people talking about islamophobia and its all the fault of islamic state that muslims in Europe are getting this treatment

    The video also makes it clear that there are streets in Britain where it is literally not safe to be openly Jewish. Perhaps I was naive, but I am genuinely shocked, and saddened. My feelings are shared by many others, as Twitter reveals.

    The video therefore has value. Dismissing it is "a stunt" is imbecilic.
    I think there are streets in the UK that any one of us would avoid, for fear of the reception we'd get.

    But, it's still very disturbing, nonetheless.
    There are perhaps a few British streets I'd avoid, at night, because of crime, but there are no streets I'd avoid simply because I am white, simply because of who I am.

    I sincerely hope - and until today believed - the same could be said of any Briton, Jew, Muslim, black, whatever. We don't tolerate open racism in Britain: that's what I thought.

    Yet here it is. Virulent.

    Maybe I am astoundingly naive?
    The part of Tower Hamlets that isn't full of city millionaires.. wouldn't want to be walking round there late at night if I wasnt a muslim

    http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/aug/07/flag-isis-jihadi-islamic-state-flown-poplar-east-london

    You shouldnt be such a scaredy cat.
    To be fair I would go there more often but I don't speak the language
  • TykejohnnoTykejohnno Posts: 7,362
    SeanT said:

    There have been no-go areas in major towns and cities for many a long year. When I was a teenager in North London in the late 70s/early 80s there were plenty of places you would not venture out in at night unless you were looking for a fight.

    That's completely different. Straw man.

    You avoided areas because they were rough (as we all do), you did not avoid them because they were racist.
    Sean,they are parts of Bradford you do not go if your white ,I have running for my life to prove it.

  • TGOHFTGOHF Posts: 21,633
    Every man for himself now - the media cartel in danger of collapsing.
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 42,155

    SeanT said:

    Patrick said:

    SeanT said:

    Sean_F said:

    SeanT said:

    taffys said:

    It's an easy stunt to pull.

    True but none of us are saying we are sick of people talking about islamophobia and its all the fault of islamic state that muslims in Europe are getting this treatment

    The video also makes it clear that there are streets in Britain where it is literally not safe to be openly Jewish. Perhaps I was naive, but I am genuinely shocked, and saddened. My feelings are shared by many others, as Twitter reveals.

    The video therefore has value. Dismissing it is "a stunt" is imbecilic.
    I think there are streets in the UK that any one of us would avoid, for fear of the reception we'd get.

    But, it's still very disturbing, nonetheless.
    Maybe I am astoundingly naive?
    Ever been to Belfast?
    True, but a fairly unique case, and not mainland Britain.

    Anyway my naivety ended today.

    Same thing in many parts of Scotland.
    Which parts are those then?

    The blue and green bits.

    Which are?


  • NeilNeil Posts: 7,983
    isam said:

    Neil said:

    isam said:

    SeanT said:

    Sean_F said:

    SeanT said:

    taffys said:

    It's an easy stunt to pull.

    True but none of us are saying we are sick of people talking about islamophobia and its all the fault of islamic state that muslims in Europe are getting this treatment

    The video also makes it clear that there are streets in Britain where it is literally not safe to be openly Jewish. Perhaps I was naive, but I am genuinely shocked, and saddened. My feelings are shared by many others, as Twitter reveals.

    The video therefore has value. Dismissing it is "a stunt" is imbecilic.
    I think there are streets in the UK that any one of us would avoid, for fear of the reception we'd get.

    But, it's still very disturbing, nonetheless.
    There are perhaps a few British streets I'd avoid, at night, because of crime, but there are no streets I'd avoid simply because I am white, simply because of who I am.

    I sincerely hope - and until today believed - the same could be said of any Briton, Jew, Muslim, black, whatever. We don't tolerate open racism in Britain: that's what I thought.

    Yet here it is. Virulent.

    Maybe I am astoundingly naive?
    The part of Tower Hamlets that isn't full of city millionaires.. wouldn't want to be walking round there late at night if I wasnt a muslim

    http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/aug/07/flag-isis-jihadi-islamic-state-flown-poplar-east-london

    You shouldnt be such a scaredy cat.
    To be fair I would go there more often but I don't speak the language
    Typical of the English. Never try to integrate.

  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 39,064
    edited March 2015

    MaxPB said:

    MaxPB said:

    Patrick said:

    The sickeningly hypocritical thing is that lefties like to bang on endlessly about multiculti Britain and will defend muslims onto the death no matter what some of their more deranged co-religionists get up to - but somehow a british jew is fair game because of the policy decisions of the government of Israel. WTF? Having a seriously negative view of Israel is anyone's right if they so wish (SeanT has been pretty damn vocal on that score in the past) but to confuse that with the basic rights and civil liberties of a section of our community says alot about the hard left.

    Yep, the hard left is no different to the hard right.
    The problem is that it isn't the hard left that lets this behaviour slide. It is the mainstream left that has allowed Muslim anti-Semitism become so common by not allowing any criticism of Muslims by screaming racism at anyone that did. Now we have parts of Britain which are inaccessible to certain people.

    Really? Can you show the heroic battles the mainstream right has fought against this? The language Tory leaders use about Moslems looks almost identical tot he language labour leaders use; "Religion of peace", "not true Moslems" etc. Cameron and Co come out with it all the time.

    Yet it is right wing supporters who call the government and Conservative leadership on that bullshit double speak when they spout it but leftists nod along furiously. You are dancing on the head of a pin here, it has been clear for many, many years that the mainstream right in the UK is more sceptical towards Islam than the left and on a number of occasions any criticism by someone on the right has been shouted down as racism by the left. We are in this situation because of it, however much you want to deny it. The left needs to take a very long and hard look at what it has done over the last 10 years to court the Muslim vote and think about whether it is worth continuing down this path.

    The invasions of Iraq and Afghanistan were, of course, a huge vote winner for the mainstream left.

    You continue to dance on the head of a pin. You are making an intellectually bankrupt argument.

    Also, you are on the mainstream left and defending this kind of bullshit racism, thereby proving my point.
  • TGOHFTGOHF Posts: 21,633

    SeanT said:

    Patrick said:

    SeanT said:

    Sean_F said:

    SeanT said:

    taffys said:

    It's an easy stunt to pull.

    True but none of us are saying we are sick of people talking about islamophobia and its all the fault of islamic state that muslims in Europe are getting this treatment

    The video also makes it clear that there are streets in Britain where it is literally not safe to be openly Jewish. Perhaps I was naive, but I am genuinely shocked, and saddened. My feelings are shared by many others, as Twitter reveals.

    The video therefore has value. Dismissing it is "a stunt" is imbecilic.
    I think there are streets in the UK that any one of us would avoid, for fear of the reception we'd get.

    But, it's still very disturbing, nonetheless.
    Maybe I am astoundingly naive?
    Ever been to Belfast?
    True, but a fairly unique case, and not mainland Britain.

    Anyway my naivety ended today.

    Same thing in many parts of Scotland.
    Which parts are those then?
    Corrour Railway Station on a Monday night can be well dodgy.
  • GIN1138GIN1138 Posts: 22,386
    edited March 2015

    A marriage is about to take place... Sturgeon has dropped the Trident removal for her deal with Labour A marriage made in hell methinks

    If Lab/SNP (with Green Caroline thrown in?) does happen it will be the funniest government we've ever had! :smiley:
  • volcanopetevolcanopete Posts: 2,078
    Shadsy's Glasgow total seats markets offer a potentially rewarding dutch of 49.5% return.LAB-SNP 4-3 @12-1 and SNP-LAB 4-3 @10-1.The battle for Glasgow is a key feature of GE2015.
  • TGOHFTGOHF Posts: 21,633
    edited March 2015

    SeanT said:

    Patrick said:

    SeanT said:

    Sean_F said:

    SeanT said:

    taffys said:

    It's an easy stunt to pull.

    True but none of us are saying we are sick of people talking about islamophobia and its all the fault of islamic state that muslims in Europe are getting this treatment

    The video also makes it clear that there are streets in Britain where it is literally not safe to be openly Jewish. Perhaps I was naive, but I am genuinely shocked, and saddened. My feelings are shared by many others, as Twitter reveals.

    The video therefore has value. Dismissing it is "a stunt" is imbecilic.
    I think there are streets in the UK that any one of us would avoid, for fear of the reception we'd get.

    But, it's still very disturbing, nonetheless.
    Maybe I am astoundingly naive?
    Ever been to Belfast?
    True, but a fairly unique case, and not mainland Britain.

    Anyway my naivety ended today.

    Same thing in many parts of Scotland.
    Which parts are those then?

    The blue and green bits.

    More utter drivel from King Turnip and know nothing SO.
  • NeilNeil Posts: 7,983
    MaxPB said:

    MaxPB said:

    MaxPB said:

    Patrick said:

    The sickeningly hypocritical thing is that lefties like to bang on endlessly about multiculti Britain and will defend muslims onto the death no matter what some of their more deranged co-religionists get up to - but somehow a british jew is fair game because of the policy decisions of the government of Israel. WTF? Having a seriously negative view of Israel is anyone's right if they so wish (SeanT has been pretty damn vocal on that score in the past) but to confuse that with the basic rights and civil liberties of a section of our community says alot about the hard left.

    Yep, the hard left is no different to the hard right.
    The problem is that it isn't the hard left that lets this behaviour slide. It is the mainstream left that has allowed Muslim anti-Semitism become so common by not allowing any criticism of Muslims by screaming racism at anyone that did. Now we have parts of Britain which are inaccessible to certain people.

    Really? Can you show the heroic battles the mainstream right has fought against this? The language Tory leaders use about Moslems looks almost identical tot he language labour leaders use; "Religion of peace", "not true Moslems" etc. Cameron and Co come out with it all the time.

    Yet it is right wing supporters who call the government and Conservative leadership on that bullshit double speak when they spout it but leftists nod along furiously. You are dancing on the head of a pin here, it has been clear for many, many years that the mainstream right in the UK is more sceptical towards Islam than the left and on a number of occasions any criticism by someone on the right has been shouted down as racism by the left. We are in this situation because of it, however much you want to deny it. The left needs to take a very long and hard look at what it has done over the last 10 years to court the Muslim vote and think about whether it is worth continuing down this path.

    The invasions of Iraq and Afghanistan were, of course, a huge vote winner for the mainstream left.

    You continue to dance on the head of a pin. You are making an intellectually bankrupt argument.

    Also, you are on the mainstream left and defending this kind of bullshit racism, thereby proving my point.
    Tell us more of your adventures as a teenage white girl in Whitechapel!

  • isamisam Posts: 41,118
    Neil said:

    isam said:

    Neil said:

    isam said:

    SeanT said:

    Sean_F said:

    SeanT said:

    taffys said:

    It's an easy stunt to pull.

    True but none of us are saying we are sick of people talking about islamophobia and its all the fault of islamic state that muslims in Europe are getting this treatment

    The video also makes it clear that there are streets in Britain where it is literally not safe to be openly Jewish. Perhaps I was naive, but I am genuinely shocked, and saddened. My feelings are shared by many others, as Twitter reveals.

    The video therefore has value. Dismissing it is "a stunt" is imbecilic.
    I think there are streets in the UK that any one of us would avoid, for fear of the reception we'd get.

    But, it's still very disturbing, nonetheless.
    There are perhaps a few British streets I'd avoid, at night, because of crime, but there are no streets I'd avoid simply because I am white, simply because of who I am.

    I sincerely hope - and until today believed - the same could be said of any Briton, Jew, Muslim, black, whatever. We don't tolerate open racism in Britain: that's what I thought.

    Yet here it is. Virulent.

    Maybe I am astoundingly naive?
    The part of Tower Hamlets that isn't full of city millionaires.. wouldn't want to be walking round there late at night if I wasnt a muslim

    http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/aug/07/flag-isis-jihadi-islamic-state-flown-poplar-east-london

    You shouldnt be such a scaredy cat.
    To be fair I would go there more often but I don't speak the language
    Typical of the English. Never try to integrate.

    Oh I thought the people there were English? Just because their parents were from Bangladesh doesn't mean they cant be English Enoch
  • TGOHF said:

    Every man for himself now - the media cartel in danger of collapsing.
    Dave has played the media brilliantly.
  • richardDoddrichardDodd Posts: 5,472
    Neil maybe someone can tell you of the adventures of a white girl in some northern cities
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,411

    Shadsy's Glasgow total seats markets offer a potentially rewarding dutch of 49.5% return.LAB-SNP 4-3 @12-1 and SNP-LAB 4-3 @10-1.The battle for Glasgow is a key feature of GE2015.

    You're getting just under 7-1 on the pair. It's an OK bet, but I won't be putting any more on this one, as I followed @Antifrank's bets/advice a while back on this one.
  • SouthamObserverSouthamObserver Posts: 39,672
    MaxPB said:

    MaxPB said:

    MaxPB said:

    Patrick said:

    The sickeningly hypocritical thing is that lefties like to bang on endlessly about multiculti Britain and will defend muslims onto the death no matter what some of their more deranged co-religionists get up to - but somehow a british jew is fair game because of the policy decisions of the government of Israel. WTF? Having a seriously negative view of Israel is anyone's right if they so wish (SeanT has been pretty damn vocal on that score in the past) but to confuse that with the basic rights and civil liberties of a section of our community says alot about the hard left.

    Yep, the hard left is no different to the hard right.
    The problem is that it isn't the hard left that lets this behaviour slide. It is the mainstream left that has allowed Muslim anti-Semitism become so common by not allowing any criticism of Muslims by screaming racism at anyone that did. Now we have parts of Britain which are inaccessible to certain people.

    Really? Can you show the heroic battles the mainstream right has fought against this? The language Tory leaders use about Moslems looks almost identical tot he language labour leaders use; "Religion of peace", "not true Moslems" etc. Cameron and Co come out with it all the time.

    Yet it is right wing supporters who call the government and Conservative leadership on that bullshit double speak when they spout it but leftists nod along furiously. You are dancing on the head of a pin here, it has been clear for many, many years that the mainstream right in the UK is more sceptical towards Islam than the left and on a number of occasions any criticism by someone on the right has been shouted down as racism by the left. We are in this situation because of it, however much you want to deny it. The left needs to take a very long and hard look at what it has done over the last 10 years to court the Muslim vote and think about whether it is worth continuing down this path.

    The invasions of Iraq and Afghanistan were, of course, a huge vote winner for the mainstream left.

    You continue to dance on the head of a pin. You are making an intellectually bankrupt argument.

    No I am not. I am disagreeing with you and questioning your comfort blanket. If the mainstream left was so concerned to court the Moslem vote, why did the Labour government take us into Iraq and Afghanistan?

    The fact is that governments of both parties have done very little to challenge the rise of Moslem extremism and anti-semitism in this country. And there have been voices on the left and right who have questioned this.

  • NeilNeil Posts: 7,983
    isam said:

    Neil said:

    isam said:

    Neil said:

    isam said:

    SeanT said:

    Sean_F said:

    SeanT said:

    taffys said:

    It's an easy stunt to pull.

    True but none of us are saying we are sick of people talking about islamophobia and its all the fault of islamic state that muslims in Europe are getting this treatment

    The video also makes it clear that there are streets in Britain where it is literally not safe to be openly Jewish. Perhaps I was naive, but I am genuinely shocked, and saddened. My feelings are shared by many others, as Twitter reveals.

    The video therefore has value. Dismissing it is "a stunt" is imbecilic.
    I think there are streets in the UK that any one of us would avoid, for fear of the reception we'd get.

    But, it's still very disturbing, nonetheless.
    There are perhaps a few British streets I'd avoid, at night, because of crime, but there are no streets I'd avoid simply because I am white, simply because of who I am.

    I sincerely hope - and until today believed - the same could be said of any Briton, Jew, Muslim, black, whatever. We don't tolerate open racism in Britain: that's what I thought.

    Yet here it is. Virulent.

    Maybe I am astoundingly naive?
    The part of Tower Hamlets that isn't full of city millionaires.. wouldn't want to be walking round there late at night if I wasnt a muslim

    http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/aug/07/flag-isis-jihadi-islamic-state-flown-poplar-east-london

    You shouldnt be such a scaredy cat.
    To be fair I would go there more often but I don't speak the language
    Typical of the English. Never try to integrate.

    Oh I thought the people there were English? Just because their parents were from Bangladesh doesn't mean they cant be English Enoch
    I wasnt talking about them. But I accept the comparison to your demigod. I dont think you've ever praised a fellow poster so highly so I feel honoured.

  • dugarbandierdugarbandier Posts: 2,596
    MaxPB said:


    Yet it is right wing supporters who call the government and Conservative leadership on that bullshit double speak when they spout it but leftists nod along furiously. You are dancing on the head of a pin here, it has been clear for many, many years that the mainstream right in the UK is more sceptical towards Islam than the left and on a number of occasions any criticism by someone on the right has been shouted down as racism by the left.
    <.</p>

    a good deal of it shouted down as racism because that's exactly what it was. even a stopped clock tells the right time twice a day, as the man says
  • SouthamObserverSouthamObserver Posts: 39,672

    SeanT said:

    Patrick said:

    SeanT said:

    Sean_F said:

    SeanT said:

    taffys said:

    It's an easy stunt to pull.

    True but none of us are saying we are sick of people talking about islamophobia and its all the fault of islamic state that muslims in Europe are getting this treatment

    The video also makes it clear that there are streets in Britain where it is literally not safe to be openly Jewish. Perhaps I was naive, but I am genuinely shocked, and saddened. My feelings are shared by many others, as Twitter reveals.

    The video therefore has value. Dismissing it is "a stunt" is imbecilic.
    I think there are streets in the UK that any one of us would avoid, for fear of the reception we'd get.

    But, it's still very disturbing, nonetheless.
    Maybe I am astoundingly naive?
    Ever been to Belfast?
    True, but a fairly unique case, and not mainland Britain.

    Anyway my naivety ended today.

    Same thing in many parts of Scotland.
    Which parts are those then?

    The blue and green bits.

    Which are?


    You might want to read up on this:

    http://www.educationscotland.gov.uk/inclusionandequalities/equalities/challengingsectarianism/

    There's no equivalent elsewhere in mainland Britain.

  • isamisam Posts: 41,118
    Neil said:

    isam said:

    Neil said:

    isam said:

    Neil said:

    isam said:

    SeanT said:

    Sean_F said:

    SeanT said:

    taffys said:

    It's an easy stunt to pull.

    True but none of us are saying we are sick of people talking about islamophobia and its all the fault of islamic state that muslims in Europe are getting this treatment

    The video also makes it clear that there are streets in Britain where it is literally not safe to be openly Jewish. Perhaps I was naive, but I am genuinely shocked, and saddened. My feelings are shared by many others, as Twitter reveals.

    The video therefore has value. Dismissing it is "a stunt" is imbecilic.
    I think there are streets in the UK that any one of us would avoid, for fear of the reception we'd get.

    But, it's still very disturbing, nonetheless.
    There are perhaps a few British streets I'd avoid, at night, because of crime, but there are no streets I'd avoid simply because I am white, simply because of who I am.

    I sincerely hope - and until today believed - the same could be said of any Briton, Jew, Muslim, black, whatever. We don't tolerate open racism in Britain: that's what I thought.

    Yet here it is. Virulent.

    Maybe I am astoundingly naive?
    The part of Tower Hamlets that isn't full of city millionaires.. wouldn't want to be walking round there late at night if I wasnt a muslim

    http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/aug/07/flag-isis-jihadi-islamic-state-flown-poplar-east-london

    You shouldnt be such a scaredy cat.
    To be fair I would go there more often but I don't speak the language
    Typical of the English. Never try to integrate.

    Oh I thought the people there were English? Just because their parents were from Bangladesh doesn't mean they cant be English Enoch
    I wasnt talking about them. But I accept the comparison to your demigod. I dont think you've ever praised a fellow poster so highly so I feel honoured.

    No I thought you were talking about me as "English".. but the people in Tower Hamlets are English too aren't they? Who are these non integrating English?
  • TGOHFTGOHF Posts: 21,633

    TGOHF said:

    Every man for himself now - the media cartel in danger of collapsing.
    Dave has played the media brilliantly.
    C4 and the BBC thought they could organise a Smiths concert without Morrissey onboard...

  • madasafishmadasafish Posts: 659

    TGOHF said:

    Every man for himself now - the media cartel in danger of collapsing.
    Dave has played the media brilliantly.
    Gamed them you mean...
  • TykejohnnoTykejohnno Posts: 7,362
    Neil said:

    isam said:

    Neil said:

    isam said:

    SeanT said:

    Sean_F said:

    SeanT said:

    taffys said:

    It's an easy stunt to pull.

    True but none of us are saying we are sick of people talking about islamophobia and its all the fault of islamic state that muslims in Europe are getting this treatment

    The video also makes it clear that there are streets in Britain where it is literally not safe to be openly Jewish. Perhaps I was naive, but I am genuinely shocked, and saddened. My feelings are shared by many others, as Twitter reveals.

    The video therefore has value. Dismissing it is "a stunt" is imbecilic.
    I think there are streets in the UK that any one of us would avoid, for fear of the reception we'd get.

    But, it's still very disturbing, nonetheless.
    There are perhaps a few British streets I'd avoid, at night, because of crime, but there are no streets I'd avoid simply because I am white, simply because of who I am.

    I sincerely hope - and until today believed - the same could be said of any Briton, Jew, Muslim, black, whatever. We don't tolerate open racism in Britain: that's what I thought.

    Yet here it is. Virulent.

    Maybe I am astoundingly naive?
    The part of Tower Hamlets that isn't full of city millionaires.. wouldn't want to be walking round there late at night if I wasnt a muslim

    http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/aug/07/flag-isis-jihadi-islamic-state-flown-poplar-east-london

    You shouldnt be such a scaredy cat.
    To be fair I would go there more often but I don't speak the language
    Typical of the English. Never try to integrate.

    I agree with some of that,where I live with mass immigration,it was my fellow white bradfordians who moved out of the area,the Bradford riots didn't help.

  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,411
    Lauren Goodger "The only way is Dave"
  • FloaterFloater Posts: 14,207

    Smarmeron said:

    @TheWatcher
    You win some you lose some. Cameron's buddies now have to be careful about calling Ed weak in future broadcast interviews.

    Cameron won't be bullied by the TV companies, Ed won't be bullied by Len McClusky?
    You can tell what sort of man Ed is by the way he laid into the Mirror over phone hacking.


    Oh.
  • TGOHF said:

    TGOHF said:

    Every man for himself now - the media cartel in danger of collapsing.
    Dave has played the media brilliantly.
    C4 and the BBC thought they could organise a Smiths concert without Morrissey onboard...

    Or as I nearly wrote the other day, "A Leaders' debate without the Prime Minister seems as brilliant as having an orgy on your own"
  • richardDoddrichardDodd Posts: 5,472
    More Green lunacy..apparently the Government is planning to use the disused fracking boreholes to get rid of nuclear waste..where do all these whackos come from.
  • Pulpstar said:

    Lauren Goodger "The only way is Dave"

    Damnit that my stint as guest editor ended 26 mins ago, or this would have been the afternoon thread

    https://instagram.com/p/z4vwL_nII5/
  • welshowlwelshowl Posts: 4,464
    TGOHF said:

    TGOHF said:

    Every man for himself now - the media cartel in danger of collapsing.
    Dave has played the media brilliantly.
    C4 and the BBC thought they could organise a Smiths concert without Morrissey onboard...

    This Charming Man
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 33,712
    isam said:

    SeanT said:

    Sean_F said:

    SeanT said:

    taffys said:

    It's an easy stunt to pull.

    True but none of us are saying we are sick of people talking about islamophobia and its all the fault of islamic state that muslims in Europe are getting this treatment

    The video also makes it clear that there are streets in Britain where it is literally not safe to be openly Jewish. Perhaps I was naive, but I am genuinely shocked, and saddened. My feelings are shared by many others, as Twitter reveals.

    The video therefore has value. Dismissing it is "a stunt" is imbecilic.
    I think there are streets in the UK that any one of us would avoid, for fear of the reception we'd get.

    But, it's still very disturbing, nonetheless.
    There are perhaps a few British streets I'd avoid, at night, because of crime, but there are no streets I'd avoid simply because I am white, simply because of who I am.

    I sincerely hope - and until today believed - the same could be said of any Briton, Jew, Muslim, black, whatever. We don't tolerate open racism in Britain: that's what I thought.

    Yet here it is. Virulent.

    Maybe I am astoundingly naive?
    The part of Tower Hamlets that isn't full of city millionaires.. wouldn't want to be walking round there late at night if I wasnt a muslim

    http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/aug/07/flag-isis-jihadi-islamic-state-flown-poplar-east-london

    Story from 6 months ago!
  • Tissue_PriceTissue_Price Posts: 9,039
    edited March 2015
    Pulpstar said:

    Shadsy's Glasgow total seats markets offer a potentially rewarding dutch of 49.5% return.LAB-SNP 4-3 @12-1 and SNP-LAB 4-3 @10-1.The battle for Glasgow is a key feature of GE2015.

    You're getting just under 7-1 on the pair. It's an OK bet, but I won't be putting any more on this one, as I followed @Antifrank's bets/advice a while back on this one.
    Just under 5/1. (1/13 + 1/11 ≈ 1/6).

    Bear in mind that I may not know anything about bookies' odds.
  • TGOHFTGOHF Posts: 21,633
    welshowl said:

    TGOHF said:

    TGOHF said:

    Every man for himself now - the media cartel in danger of collapsing.
    Dave has played the media brilliantly.
    C4 and the BBC thought they could organise a Smiths concert without Morrissey onboard...

    This Charming Man
    Farage was Johnny Marr.

    Ed was Ken out of Bros.
  • isamisam Posts: 41,118

    isam said:

    SeanT said:

    Sean_F said:

    SeanT said:

    taffys said:

    It's an easy stunt to pull.

    True but none of us are saying we are sick of people talking about islamophobia and its all the fault of islamic state that muslims in Europe are getting this treatment

    The video also makes it clear that there are streets in Britain where it is literally not safe to be openly Jewish. Perhaps I was naive, but I am genuinely shocked, and saddened. My feelings are shared by many others, as Twitter reveals.

    The video therefore has value. Dismissing it is "a stunt" is imbecilic.
    I think there are streets in the UK that any one of us would avoid, for fear of the reception we'd get.

    But, it's still very disturbing, nonetheless.
    There are perhaps a few British streets I'd avoid, at night, because of crime, but there are no streets I'd avoid simply because I am white, simply because of who I am.

    I sincerely hope - and until today believed - the same could be said of any Briton, Jew, Muslim, black, whatever. We don't tolerate open racism in Britain: that's what I thought.

    Yet here it is. Virulent.

    Maybe I am astoundingly naive?
    The part of Tower Hamlets that isn't full of city millionaires.. wouldn't want to be walking round there late at night if I wasnt a muslim

    http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/aug/07/flag-isis-jihadi-islamic-state-flown-poplar-east-london

    Story from 6 months ago!
    Yes I know!!!

    All changed for the better since has it?
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 42,155

    SeanT said:

    Patrick said:

    SeanT said:

    Sean_F said:

    SeanT said:

    taffys said:

    It's an easy stunt to pull.

    True but none of us are saying we are sick of people talking about islamophobia and its all the fault of islamic state that muslims in Europe are getting this treatment

    The video also makes it clear that there are streets in Britain where it is literally not safe to be openly Jewish. Perhaps I was naive, but I am genuinely shocked, and saddened. My feelings are shared by many others, as Twitter reveals.

    The video therefore has value. Dismissing it is "a stunt" is imbecilic.
    I think there are streets in the UK that any one of us would avoid, for fear of the reception we'd get.

    But, it's still very disturbing, nonetheless.
    Maybe I am astoundingly naive?
    Ever been to Belfast?
    True, but a fairly unique case, and not mainland Britain.

    Anyway my naivety ended today.

    Same thing in many parts of Scotland.
    Which parts are those then?

    The blue and green bits.

    Which are?


    You might want to read up on this:

    http://www.educationscotland.gov.uk/inclusionandequalities/equalities/challengingsectarianism/

    There's no equivalent elsewhere in mainland Britain.

    So nothing about streets that can't be walked down? Thought not.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,411

    Pulpstar said:

    Shadsy's Glasgow total seats markets offer a potentially rewarding dutch of 49.5% return.LAB-SNP 4-3 @12-1 and SNP-LAB 4-3 @10-1.The battle for Glasgow is a key feature of GE2015.

    You're getting just under 7-1 on the pair. It's an OK bet, but I won't be putting any more on this one, as I followed @Antifrank's bets/advice a while back on this one.
    Just under 5/1. (1/13 + 1/11 ≈ 1/6).

    Bear in mind that I may not know anything about bookies' odds.
    Haha ye I added 1 instead of subtracted. xD
  • FloaterFloater Posts: 14,207
    JackW said:

    Floater said:

    JackW said:

    Icarus said:

    JackW said:

    On the feminist side of this issue Mrs JackW opined to me last night in terms that :

    Mrs Ed Miliband Will Never Be The Prime Minister 's Wife

    Sorry Jack haven't been concentrating -how is your ARSE looking these days?
    Shapely, pert and in excellent fettle ....

    Ensure you are in touching distance tomorrow morning for its first Saturday unveiling.

    I can't be alone in being quite excited at the thought of waking up to Jack's ARSE tomorrow......
    A weekend treat for the next few weeks to be sure.

    I can't help feeling I'm overindulging PBers but heck it's only a brief but scintillating comet over the electoral skyline every five years.

    You spoil us Jack :-)
  • IndigoIndigo Posts: 9,966

    isam said:

    SeanT said:

    Sean_F said:

    SeanT said:

    taffys said:

    It's an easy stunt to pull.

    True but none of us are saying we are sick of people talking about islamophobia and its all the fault of islamic state that muslims in Europe are getting this treatment

    The video also makes it clear that there are streets in Britain where it is literally not safe to be openly Jewish. Perhaps I was naive, but I am genuinely shocked, and saddened. My feelings are shared by many others, as Twitter reveals.

    The video therefore has value. Dismissing it is "a stunt" is imbecilic.
    I think there are streets in the UK that any one of us would avoid, for fear of the reception we'd get.

    But, it's still very disturbing, nonetheless.
    There are perhaps a few British streets I'd avoid, at night, because of crime, but there are no streets I'd avoid simply because I am white, simply because of who I am.

    I sincerely hope - and until today believed - the same could be said of any Briton, Jew, Muslim, black, whatever. We don't tolerate open racism in Britain: that's what I thought.

    Yet here it is. Virulent.

    Maybe I am astoundingly naive?
    The part of Tower Hamlets that isn't full of city millionaires.. wouldn't want to be walking round there late at night if I wasnt a muslim

    http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/aug/07/flag-isis-jihadi-islamic-state-flown-poplar-east-london

    Story from 6 months ago!
    Is it better, or worse now ?
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,411
    edited March 2015
    Aarav "Extras" Singh is doing a sterling job for India today, must be a top notch batsman.
  • TheWatcherTheWatcher Posts: 5,262
    TGOHF said:

    welshowl said:

    TGOHF said:

    TGOHF said:

    Every man for himself now - the media cartel in danger of collapsing.
    Dave has played the media brilliantly.
    C4 and the BBC thought they could organise a Smiths concert without Morrissey onboard...

    This Charming Man
    Farage was Johnny Marr.

    Ed was Ken out of Bros.
    Except Ken became a very successful A&R man, and the twins lucked out.
  • TGOHFTGOHF Posts: 21,633

    TGOHF said:

    welshowl said:

    TGOHF said:

    TGOHF said:

    Every man for himself now - the media cartel in danger of collapsing.
    Dave has played the media brilliantly.
    C4 and the BBC thought they could organise a Smiths concert without Morrissey onboard...

    This Charming Man
    Farage was Johnny Marr.

    Ed was Ken out of Bros.
    Except Ken became a very successful A&R man, and the twins lucked out.
    I'm sure Ed will have a successful career outside politics - starting in June.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,411
    Murphy will pump resources into holding his seat now. No room on the SLAB lifeboat for wee Dougie and Margaret !
  • DairDair Posts: 6,108
    Indigo said:

    Roger said:


    I heard the other day that Manchester was the first nuclear free zone in the UK. If only they had realised what a style icon they were turning down

    London was expected to be devastated by two to four bombs of up to five megatons each exploding over the city. Glasgow, Birmingham and Manchester were each said to be in line for one or two "airbursts" of up to five megatons.

    http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/jun/05/uk-government-top-secret-list-probable-nuclear-targets-1970s
    Have a play with

    http://nuclearsecrecy.com/nukemap/

    and scare yourself about how big the blast radius is, 5mt on Big Ben for example would reach Watford with the thermal radiation flash.
    More important, go to Moscow and see how little damage a 100kt W76 actually does to a country the size of Russia. We have 32 available and 64 max even with extra missiles we only have around 120 warheads.

    That's not a lot of damage. It is not even viable as a "deterent".
  • Pulpstar said:

    Murphy will pump resources into holding his seat now. No room on the SLAB lifeboat for wee Dougie and Margaret !
    You can see the Nats throwing everything to try and topple Jim Murphy
  • Tissue_PriceTissue_Price Posts: 9,039
    Pulpstar said:

    Aarav "Extras" Singh is doing a sterling job for India today, must be a top notch batsman.

    nb = 3. Runs scored off the free hits = 0.

    India are England's likely QF opponents if they can negotiate Bangladesh and Afghanistan (and NZ don't stitch us up by losing to Bangladesh.

    30.0 on betfair is almost tempting.
  • IndigoIndigo Posts: 9,966

    Portillo gets it.

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/islamic-state/11453846/Cage-director-Asim-Qureshi-refuses-to-condemn-stoning-of-adulterous-women.html

    The director of the Muslim rights group Cage has repeatedly refused to condemn the stoning of adulterous women by Islamic extremists.

    Pressed by Andrew Neil, the show’s presenter, to condemn a series of extreme positions, including claims that Jews are descended from pigs and homosexuality is evil.
    He repeatedly refused to engage, saying: “I’m not a theologian.”

    Michael Portillo, the former defence secretary and one of the show's regular guests, told Mr Qureshi: "I wonder what the hell the BBC is doing giving you all this airtime."
  • Tissue_PriceTissue_Price Posts: 9,039
    Pulpstar said:

    Murphy will pump resources into holding his seat now. No room on the SLAB lifeboat for wee Dougie and Margaret !
    Murphy would probably find Dougie sinking quite funny. If it weren't for the fact that it would reflect rather badly on him.

    Labour insider on Murphy v Alexander: “There is history between them. Jim is more street fighter and Alpha. Douglasis more strategic, more analytical….They just never got on from the moment that they met. There has been a thawing recently because their interests are aligned. But there is definitely a difference in style: chalk and cheese….After the fall of Gordon, there is now tension over who is now Labour’s big beast in Scotland.”

    http://blogs.ft.com/westminster/2015/03/douglas-alexander-in-the-words-of-his-colleagues/
  • Back in 2010, if anyone had said what would be the odds on Labour not to win a seat in Scotland, I think the odds would have been close to 12,000/1
  • nigel4englandnigel4england Posts: 4,800


    Yet it is right wing supporters who call the government and Conservative leadership on that bullshit double speak when they spout it but leftists nod along furiously. You are dancing on the head of a pin here, it has been clear for many, many years that the mainstream right in the UK is more sceptical towards Islam than the left and on a number of occasions any criticism by someone on the right has been shouted down as racism by the left. We are in this situation because of it, however much you want to deny it. The left needs to take a very long and hard look at what it has done over the last 10 years to court the Muslim vote and think about whether it is worth continuing down this path.



    The invasions of Iraq and Afghanistan were, of course, a huge vote winner for the mainstream left.



    You continue to dance on the head of a pin. You are making an intellectually bankrupt argument.



    No I am not. I am disagreeing with you and questioning your comfort blanket. If the mainstream left was so concerned to court the Moslem vote, why did the Labour government take us into Iraq and Afghanistan?

    The fact is that governments of both parties have done very little to challenge the rise of Moslem extremism and anti-semitism in this country. And there have been voices on the left and right who have questioned this.



    One voice on the far right who questioned it was Griffin, and he got banged up even though he was right
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,411

    Pulpstar said:

    Murphy will pump resources into holding his seat now. No room on the SLAB lifeboat for wee Dougie and Margaret !
    Murphy would probably find Dougie sinking quite funny. If it weren't for the fact that it would reflect rather badly on him.

    Labour insider on Murphy v Alexander: “There is history between them. Jim is more street fighter and Alpha. Douglasis more strategic, more analytical….They just never got on from the moment that they met. There has been a thawing recently because their interests are aligned. But there is definitely a difference in style: chalk and cheese….After the fall of Gordon, there is now tension over who is now Labour’s big beast in Scotland.”

    http://blogs.ft.com/westminster/2015/03/douglas-alexander-in-the-words-of-his-colleagues/
    Murphy is likely to hold his seat, I don't think the same is true of Dougie.
  • Tissue_PriceTissue_Price Posts: 9,039
    Dair said:

    Indigo said:

    Roger said:


    I heard the other day that Manchester was the first nuclear free zone in the UK. If only they had realised what a style icon they were turning down

    London was expected to be devastated by two to four bombs of up to five megatons each exploding over the city. Glasgow, Birmingham and Manchester were each said to be in line for one or two "airbursts" of up to five megatons.

    http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/jun/05/uk-government-top-secret-list-probable-nuclear-targets-1970s
    Have a play with

    http://nuclearsecrecy.com/nukemap/

    and scare yourself about how big the blast radius is, 5mt on Big Ben for example would reach Watford with the thermal radiation flash.
    More important, go to Moscow and see how little damage a 100kt W76 actually does to a country the size of Russia. We have 32 available and 64 max even with extra missiles we only have around 120 warheads.

    That's not a lot of damage. It is not even viable as a "deterent".
    One dropped on the centre of Moscow appears to kill a quarter of a million people. Might put me off a bit.
  • AlistairAlistair Posts: 23,670
    antifrank said:

    Alistair said:

    antifrank said:

    Alistair said:

    antifrank said:

    DavidL said:

    I would think the Scottish tories will end up with 2 seats namely their current one and Berwickshire. I think they will be very close in Dumfries and Galloway and possibly in Kincardine but they risk being overtaken by the SNP in both seats.

    A pretty poor return for nearly 500K votes but that is the way it goes up here.

    The latest Scottish constituency polls for Lord Ashcroft are stunningly good for the SNP and stunningly bad for everyone else, the Conservatives included. I'm having a complete rethink about the outcome in Scotland and if I can get my thoughts together, I'll be putting another post up over the weekend.
    It should start with "...anyone who was thinking of laying off their SNP bets is a moron"
    When the facts change, I change my opinions.

    I don't think it has yet generally sunk in just how sensational the latest batch of Scottish constituency polls are and how they blew apart the emerging consensus of what the SNP coalition looks like.
    I solidly include myself in the moron camp. MY GE15 game prediction of 52 SNP seats is no longer looking like a high end punt to win the competition and more like a conservative estimate.

    I am still mentally subtracting 5 percentage points from any SNP lead in a constituency but that still leaves them with whaking great leads
    I think your thoughts on Tuesday night were eminently sensible in the light of the information we had at the time. We have a lot of new and unexpected information. None of us are blessed with perfect foresight, or political betting would be very straightforward.

    52 SNP MPs looks something like the par outcome as of today's date. When I put my post on hypothetical hung Parliament negotiations together in early December, I used 31 MPs as my high end estimate for the SNP and thought I was being quite racy. Now it would be a real disappointment for the SNP.
    Yes, I can't quite get my head around it. I am genuinely struggling with the thought that Mundell is in a neck and neck race with the SNP.

    Back in 2010, if anyone had said what would be the odds on Labour not to win a seat in Scotland, I think the odds would have been close to 12,000/1

    Are we surr antifrank didn't get on at that price?
  • taffystaffys Posts: 9,753
    edited March 2015
    "I wonder what the hell the BBC is doing giving you all this airtime."

    In what world is that Qureshi's fault. He'd have been better off asking Brillo that question.

    Or even, perhaps, refusing to share a platform with this person.
  • FloaterFloater Posts: 14,207

    Floater said:

    I see CAGE are continuing to cover themselves in glory......

    What have they done now?
    Spokesman refuses to condemn stoning of adulterous women.

    Same guy who said "John" was a really nice guy who was always nice to animals but just not to Kuffirs
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,411
    Alistair said:

    antifrank said:

    Alistair said:

    antifrank said:

    Alistair said:

    antifrank said:

    DavidL said:

    I would think the Scottish tories will end up with 2 seats namely their current one and Berwickshire. I think they will be very close in Dumfries and Galloway and possibly in Kincardine but they risk being overtaken by the SNP in both seats.

    A pretty poor return for nearly 500K votes but that is the way it goes up here.

    The latest Scottish constituency polls for Lord Ashcroft are stunningly good for the SNP and stunningly bad for everyone else, the Conservatives included. I'm having a complete rethink about the outcome in Scotland and if I can get my thoughts together, I'll be putting another post up over the weekend.
    It should start with "...anyone who was thinking of laying off their SNP bets is a moron"
    When the facts change, I change my opinions.

    I don't think it has yet generally sunk in just how sensational the latest batch of Scottish constituency polls are and how they blew apart the emerging consensus of what the SNP coalition looks like.
    I solidly include myself in the moron camp. MY GE15 game prediction of 52 SNP seats is no longer looking like a high end punt to win the competition and more like a conservative estimate.

    I am still mentally subtracting 5 percentage points from any SNP lead in a constituency but that still leaves them with whaking great leads
    I think your thoughts on Tuesday night were eminently sensible in the light of the information we had at the time. We have a lot of new and unexpected information. None of us are blessed with perfect foresight, or political betting would be very straightforward.

    52 SNP MPs looks something like the par outcome as of today's date. When I put my post on hypothetical hung Parliament negotiations together in early December, I used 31 MPs as my high end estimate for the SNP and thought I was being quite racy. Now it would be a real disappointment for the SNP.
    Yes, I can't quite get my head around it. I am genuinely struggling with the thought that Mundell is in a neck and neck race with the SNP.

    Back in 2010, if anyone had said what would be the odds on Labour not to win a seat in Scotland, I think the odds would have been close to 12,000/1

    Are we surr antifrank didn't get on at that price?
    Some PBer has got on Labour 0-5 seats at 125-1 and stands to collect around £10k. That is the true betting genius of these forums.
  • TheWatcherTheWatcher Posts: 5,262
    Dair said:

    Indigo said:

    Roger said:


    I heard the other day that Manchester was the first nuclear free zone in the UK. If only they had realised what a style icon they were turning down

    London was expected to be devastated by two to four bombs of up to five megatons each exploding over the city. Glasgow, Birmingham and Manchester were each said to be in line for one or two "airbursts" of up to five megatons.

    http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/jun/05/uk-government-top-secret-list-probable-nuclear-targets-1970s
    Have a play with

    http://nuclearsecrecy.com/nukemap/

    and scare yourself about how big the blast radius is, 5mt on Big Ben for example would reach Watford with the thermal radiation flash.
    More important, go to Moscow and see how little damage a 100kt W76 actually does to a country the size of Russia. We have 32 available and 64 max even with extra missiles we only have around 120 warheads.

    That's not a lot of damage. It is not even viable as a "deterent".
    It's accurate enough to wipe out any number of cities, ports and military sites. I'd say that was a deterrent.
  • SouthamObserverSouthamObserver Posts: 39,672
    Indigo said:


    Portillo gets it.

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/islamic-state/11453846/Cage-director-Asim-Qureshi-refuses-to-condemn-stoning-of-adulterous-women.html


    The director of the Muslim rights group Cage has repeatedly refused to condemn the stoning of adulterous women by Islamic extremists.

    Pressed by Andrew Neil, the show’s presenter, to condemn a series of extreme positions, including claims that Jews are descended from pigs and homosexuality is evil.
    He repeatedly refused to engage, saying: “I’m not a theologian.”

    Michael Portillo, the former defence secretary and one of the show's regular guests, told Mr Qureshi: "I wonder what the hell the BBC is doing giving you all this airtime."


    It's a tricky one.

    There is a strong argument for shining a light on opinions like this, but at the same time there is a danger that in doing so you make them come across as far more mainstream than they may actually be.

    Of course, if they are mainstream views within the Moslem community then we do need to hear them being aired because it makes it much harder for politicians of all kind to pretend that they are not.

  • Tissue_PriceTissue_Price Posts: 9,039
    Alistair said:

    antifrank said:

    Alistair said:

    antifrank said:

    Alistair said:

    antifrank said:

    DavidL said:

    I would think the Scottish tories will end up with 2 seats namely their current one and Berwickshire. I think they will be very close in Dumfries and Galloway and possibly in Kincardine but they risk being overtaken by the SNP in both seats.

    A pretty poor return for nearly 500K votes but that is the way it goes up here.

    The latest Scottish constituency polls for Lord Ashcroft are stunningly good for the SNP and stunningly bad for everyone else, the Conservatives included. I'm having a complete rethink about the outcome in Scotland and if I can get my thoughts together, I'll be putting another post up over the weekend.
    It should start with "...anyone who was thinking of laying off their SNP bets is a moron"
    When the facts change, I change my opinions.

    I don't think it has yet generally sunk in just how sensational the latest batch of Scottish constituency polls are and how they blew apart the emerging consensus of what the SNP coalition looks like.
    I solidly include myself in the moron camp. MY GE15 game prediction of 52 SNP seats is no longer looking like a high end punt to win the competition and more like a conservative estimate.

    I am still mentally subtracting 5 percentage points from any SNP lead in a constituency but that still leaves them with whaking great leads
    I think your thoughts on Tuesday night were eminently sensible in the light of the information we had at the time. We have a lot of new and unexpected information. None of us are blessed with perfect foresight, or political betting would be very straightforward.

    52 SNP MPs looks something like the par outcome as of today's date. When I put my post on hypothetical hung Parliament negotiations together in early December, I used 31 MPs as my high end estimate for the SNP and thought I was being quite racy. Now it would be a real disappointment for the SNP.
    Yes, I can't quite get my head around it. I am genuinely struggling with the thought that Mundell is in a neck and neck race with the SNP.

    Back in 2010, if anyone had said what would be the odds on Labour not to win a seat in Scotland, I think the odds would have been close to 12,000/1

    Are we surr antifrank didn't get on at that price?
    Five years out, no party should be bigger than 1000/1 to win 0 seats in the whole of the UK.
  • AlistairAlistair Posts: 23,670
    Pulpstar said:

    Alistair said:

    antifrank said:

    Alistair said:

    antifrank said:

    Alistair said:

    antifrank said:

    DavidL said:

    I would think the Scottish tories will end up with 2 seats namely their current one and Berwickshire. I think they will be very close in Dumfries and Galloway and possibly in Kincardine but they risk being overtaken by the SNP in both seats.

    A pretty poor return for nearly 500K votes but that is the way it goes up here.

    The latest Scottish constituency polls for Lord Ashcroft are stunningly good for the SNP and stunningly bad for everyone else, the Conservatives included. I'm having a complete rethink about the outcome in Scotland and if I can get my thoughts together, I'll be putting another post up over the weekend.
    It should start with "...anyone who was thinking of laying off their SNP bets is a moron"
    When the facts change, I change my opinions.

    I don't think it has yet generally sunk in just how sensational the latest batch of Scottish constituency polls are and how they blew apart the emerging consensus of what the SNP coalition looks like.
    I solidly include myself in the moron camp. MY GE15 game prediction of 52 SNP seats is no longer looking like a high end punt to win the competition and more like a conservative estimate.

    I am still mentally subtracting 5 percentage points from any SNP lead in a constituency but that still leaves them with whaking great leads
    I think your thoughts on Tuesday night were eminently sensible in the light of the information we had at the time. We have a lot of new and unexpected information. None of us are blessed with perfect foresight, or political betting would be very straightforward.

    52 SNP MPs looks something like the par outcome as of today's date. When I put my post on hypothetical hung Parliament negotiations together in early December, I used 31 MPs as my high end estimate for the SNP and thought I was being quite racy. Now it would be a real disappointment for the SNP.
    Yes, I can't quite get my head around it. I am genuinely struggling with the thought that Mundell is in a neck and neck race with the SNP.

    Back in 2010, if anyone had said what would be the odds on Labour not to win a seat in Scotland, I think the odds would have been close to 12,000/1

    Are we surr antifrank didn't get on at that price?
    Some PBer has got on Labour 0-5 seats at 125-1 and stands to collect around £10k. That is the true betting genius of these forums.
    I regret only dabbling on that at 40 to 1
  • AlastairMeeksAlastairMeeks Posts: 30,340
    Pulpstar said:

    Alistair said:

    antifrank said:

    Alistair said:

    antifrank said:

    Alistair said:

    antifrank said:

    DavidL said:

    I would think the Scottish tories will end up with 2 seats namely their current one and Berwickshire. I think they will be very close in Dumfries and Galloway and possibly in Kincardine but they risk being overtaken by the SNP in both seats.

    A pretty poor return for nearly 500K votes but that is the way it goes up here.

    The latest Scottish constituency polls for Lord Ashcroft are stunningly good for the SNP and stunningly bad for everyone else, the Conservatives included. I'm having a complete rethink about the outcome in Scotland and if I can get my thoughts together, I'll be putting another post up over the weekend.
    It should start with "...anyone who was thinking of laying off their SNP bets is a moron"
    When the facts change, I change my opinions.

    I don't think it has yet generally sunk in just how sensational the latest batch of Scottish constituency polls are and how they blew apart the emerging consensus of what the SNP coalition looks like.
    I solidly include myself in the moron camp. MY GE15 game prediction of 52 SNP seats is no longer looking like a high end punt to win the competition and more like a conservative estimate.

    I am still mentally subtracting 5 percentage points from any SNP lead in a constituency but that still leaves them with whaking great leads
    I think your thoughts on Tuesday night were eminently sensible in the light of the information we had at the time. We have a lot of new and unexpected information. None of us are blessed with perfect foresight, or political betting would be very straightforward.

    52 SNP MPs looks something like the par outcome as of today's date. When I put my post on hypothetical hung Parliament negotiations together in early December, I used 31 MPs as my high end estimate for the SNP and thought I was being quite racy. Now it would be a real disappointment for the SNP.
    Yes, I can't quite get my head around it. I am genuinely struggling with the thought that Mundell is in a neck and neck race with the SNP.

    Back in 2010, if anyone had said what would be the odds on Labour not to win a seat in Scotland, I think the odds would have been close to 12,000/1

    Are we surr antifrank didn't get on at that price?
    Some PBer has got on Labour 0-5 seats at 125-1 and stands to collect around £10k. That is the true betting genius of these forums.
    That's the bet of the year. Sadly, it's not mine.
  • nu123nu123 Posts: 25
    "Labour have bled support across the country to the SNP, UKIP and more recently the Greens."

    Has there been an actual analysis of where green support is coming from like the UKIP vote has been analysed. Of course you would assume it is mainly coming from Labour and the LibDems we do we know for sure?

  • TykejohnnoTykejohnno Posts: 7,362
    taffys said:

    "I wonder what the hell the BBC is doing giving you all this airtime."

    In what world is that Qureshi's fault. He'd have been better off asking Brillo that question.

    Or even, perhaps, refusing to share a platform with this person.

    Mr taffy,may I ask why your posting less on PB,you mentioned down thread.
  • isamisam Posts: 41,118
    edited March 2015
    Floater said:

    Floater said:

    I see CAGE are continuing to cover themselves in glory......

    What have they done now?
    Spokesman refuses to condemn stoning of adulterous women.

    Same guy who said "John" was a really nice guy who was always nice to animals but just not to Kuffirs
    Ukips idea was to ask such 'spokesman' to sign a charter saying they condemned extremism and jihad.. If they didn't, fine but at least we knew then how they felt before the event

    Guardianistas and Conservatives on here screamed like little lambs that it was islamaphobia
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,411
    nu123 said:

    "Labour have bled support across the country to the SNP, UKIP and more recently the Greens."

    Has there been an actual analysis of where green support is coming from like the UKIP vote has been analysed. Of course you would assume it is mainly coming from Labour and the LibDems we do we know for sure?

    Its from 2010 Lib Dems, all cross-tabs etc pretty much confirm this. A little bit from Labour, but mainly 2010 Lib Dems and some non voters.
  • FloaterFloater Posts: 14,207

    SeanT said:

    Remember I used to make weak jokes on pb about anti-Semitism in Britain?

    They don't seem funny any more.

    People spitting at Jews on the street, no, not in Berlin in 1936, in Bradford in 2015.

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2964984/Fight-Jewish-scum-Shocking-anti-Semitism-streets-BRITAIN-Jewish-journalist-spat-abused-stalked-happens-Copenhagen.html

    Sick and tired of hearing about the rise in Anti Semitism...the major increase here has been in
    attacks against muslims recently yet most of the Tory press and some posters on here continue to flag up every odd anti Jew attack as somehow comparable to the 30s

    Any increase that there even is in Jewish attacks is entirely down to the actions of the Israeli government both in last years mass murders and even recently in Mr Ns moronic address to US legislators which further showed how extreme and isolated the hated pariah state Israel now is in the world


    Actually attacks on muslims are down and attacks on jews are up.

    You really are a tool.
  • VerulamiusVerulamius Posts: 1,550
    Is there a quad play market for the order of parties based on number of seats in Scotland?
  • VerulamiusVerulamius Posts: 1,550
    Or quint play if you wish to include pandas!
  • FloaterFloater Posts: 14,207

    Yep.. Coolagorna is definitely PB dolt of the year..Whoever beats him is gonna be a total lulu.
    He is sick and tired of hearing about anti semitic attacks..poor lad.

    it seems "they deserve it" in his sick twisted mind.
  • BenMBenM Posts: 1,795
    Comment thread on PB.com gets bad tempered for the 12,638th time...
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,411
    Conservatives could end up with more seats than Labour in Scotland - now there's a thought.

    Lib Dems could be equal with Labour :O
  • RicardoRicardo Posts: 7
    Test
  • TheWatcherTheWatcher Posts: 5,262
    edited March 2015
    Floater said:

    Yep.. Coolagorna is definitely PB dolt of the year..Whoever beats him is gonna be a total lulu.
    He is sick and tired of hearing about anti semitic attacks..poor lad.

    it seems "they deserve it" in his sick twisted mind.
    Coolagorna is clearly very bored, and knows exactly which buttons to press to get a response here.
  • DairDair Posts: 6,108

    Pulpstar said:

    Murphy will pump resources into holding his seat now. No room on the SLAB lifeboat for wee Dougie and Margaret !
    You can see the Nats throwing everything to try and topple Jim Murphy
    The Nats don't have to throw everything in.

    Average 1600 members per seat. That's about 30 doors per member.
  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 39,064


    No I am not. I am disagreeing with you and questioning your comfort blanket. If the mainstream left was so concerned to court the Moslem vote, why did the Labour government take us into Iraq and Afghanistan?

    The fact is that governments of both parties have done very little to challenge the rise of Moslem extremism and anti-semitism in this country. And there have been voices on the left and right who have questioned this.

    It could be that Blair was just a mad man who lied to Parliament?

    As I said earlier, both mainstream parties have a lamentable record on combating Islamic extremists and generally poor attitudes about law and order among the general Muslim population, the difference is that on the right there are many, many more voices of dissent who are willing to call their side out on the apparent relaxed attitude to it by the party leadership, there are very, very few voices on the left willing to break ranks.
This discussion has been closed.