Howdy, Stranger!

It looks like you're new here. Sign in or register to get started.

politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » New Survation Scottish poll finds No would have a 6% lead i

13

Comments

  • felix said:

    One thing is for sure - Populus either know something the other pollsters are missing or they are massively inflating the big 2 at the expense of the rest.

    Regarding the critcisms on here of Kelly Tollhurst by BenM & Roger -their views can be discounted as both are Labour supporters but to then denigrate the primary voters for choosing her does show a more serious contempt for the electors. Certainly in Roger's rather strange world Tory voters barely deserve the right to vote. Politics really shouldn't be that nasty.

    Iirc Conservative posters were similarly unimpressed by Kelly Tolhurst's performance to date, or as an advert for primaries. After seeing Kelly on the hustings, CCHQ seems to have joined Labour in sitting this one out.
  • FloaterFloater Posts: 14,207
    BenM said:

    Financier said:

    DC's warning about a potential global economic problem is very true, but will be ignored by many short-term thinking politicians in the UK and Western Europe. These politicians tend to put political reform/control far ahead of the economic well-being of their electorate.

    The Americas, Asia and Africa and Australasia can now manage very well without bothering about Western Europe - it is about time our politicians work up to reality and that wage increases are no longer the norm - do they want us to eat dirt before they come to their selfish and self-serving senses?

    The biggest risks to the UK economy are domestic.
    Totally agree, another Labour government so soon would be a disaster.
  • Ishmael_XIshmael_X Posts: 3,664
    felix said:

    One thing is for sure - Populus either know something the other pollsters are missing or they are massively inflating the big 2 at the expense of the rest.

    Regarding the critcisms on here of Kelly Tollhurst by BenM & Roger -their views can be discounted as both are Labour supporters but to then denigrate the primary voters for choosing her does show a more serious contempt for the electors. Certainly in Roger's rather strange world Tory voters barely deserve the right to vote. Politics really shouldn't be that nasty.

    Bizarre argument, can we not criticise any elected politician for fear of showing contempt for the electorate?

    You obviously haven't seen or heard Kelly in action.

  • felix said:

    One thing is for sure - Populus either know something the other pollsters are missing or they are massively inflating the big 2 at the expense of the rest.

    Regarding the critcisms on here of Kelly Tollhurst by BenM & Roger -their views can be discounted as both are Labour supporters but to then denigrate the primary voters for choosing her does show a more serious contempt for the electors. Certainly in Roger's rather strange world Tory voters barely deserve the right to vote. Politics really shouldn't be that nasty.

    The amusing thing is that those who lay into Ms Tolhurst are often the same people who complain about 'professional politicians' with Oxford PPE degrees and who keep saying they want MPs to be more like the electorate, have had proper jobs, etc. That's why it's so funny that it's the 'People's Army' candidate who's the Christ Church PPE graduate, who has never done a proper job in his life, just banking and law.
  • TGOHF said:

    Isam - fancy the job with the Kippers that might soon be available ? The donors must be fewmin..


    http://www.breitbart.com/Breitbart-London/2014/11/17/Moves-To-Remove-OFlynn-After-Anti-Business-Newsnight-Interview

    "Senior members of UKIP are campaigning behind the scenes to have Patrick O'Flynn MEP removed as economic spokesman after his appearance on the BBC's Newsnight programme last Monday night."

    "His opponents are now circulating a letter calling for him to go, which they hope to publish this week. One source who is not involved with the letter told Breitbart London: “He really does need to shut up with all talk of aggressive tax avoidance and bashing big business... It's a real mistake to have a pinko in such an important position."

    If someone was ever again going to call someone a "pinko", it was surely going to have to be in UKIP. Just wouldn't have expected it to be one of their own they were talking about.

    Ferrets in a sack....
    Pinko is such a poor insult.

    Traitorous Pigdog on the other hand
    Knock Knock Knock can we have a word sir

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1190119/Man-charged-racial-harassment-alleged-pig-dog-insult-German-neighbour.html
    I would never insult the Germans.

    They are one of my favourite peoples/nations

    They make awesome motor vehicles and keep on invading the Frogs, which causes us and The Yanks (and the Cannucks) to liberate them, which upsets the French psyche.
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 52,937
    edited November 2014

    TGOHF said:

    Isam - fancy the job with the Kippers that might soon be available ? The donors must be fewmin..


    http://www.breitbart.com/Breitbart-London/2014/11/17/Moves-To-Remove-OFlynn-After-Anti-Business-Newsnight-Interview

    "Senior members of UKIP are campaigning behind the scenes to have Patrick O'Flynn MEP removed as economic spokesman after his appearance on the BBC's Newsnight programme last Monday night."

    "His opponents are now circulating a letter calling for him to go, which they hope to publish this week. One source who is not involved with the letter told Breitbart London: “He really does need to shut up with all talk of aggressive tax avoidance and bashing big business... It's a real mistake to have a pinko in such an important position."

    If someone was ever again going to call someone a "pinko", it was surely going to have to be in UKIP. Just wouldn't have expected it to be one of their own they were talking about.

    Ferrets in a sack....
    Pinko is such a poor insult.

    Traitorous Pigdog on the other hand
    Knock Knock Knock can we have a word sir

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1190119/Man-charged-racial-harassment-alleged-pig-dog-insult-German-neighbour.html
    Are the Germans a race? When it was East Germany and West Germany, were they distinctly two races?
  • isam said:

    isam said:

    Moses_ said:

    Mr. Moses, Hitchens can sometimes make interesting comments, but he's utterly bonkers.

    Indeed and he used to be a fairly down the middle commentator years ago. I have no issue about him going one way or the other but at least be sensible when you do it (though tricky of course the further to the left you move I suppose? )

    He is the Tories Dan hodges but interesting they both write in right of centre media. Good for a laugh if nowt else.
    He has moved to the left? Interesting view as he used to be a trot
    Peter Hitchins is a Tory, are you thinking of the late Christopher Hitchens?
    Nope, Peter. He was a Trotskyist in the 60s and 70s until he saw the light. Hence he is well placed to call out the centrists who increasingly try to inflict commie ideas upon us
    Didn't realise you were going back that far, he joined the Tory Party in 1997.
  • isam said:

    isam said:

    Moses_ said:

    Mr. Moses, Hitchens can sometimes make interesting comments, but he's utterly bonkers.

    Indeed and he used to be a fairly down the middle commentator years ago. I have no issue about him going one way or the other but at least be sensible when you do it (though tricky of course the further to the left you move I suppose? )

    He is the Tories Dan hodges but interesting they both write in right of centre media. Good for a laugh if nowt else.
    He has moved to the left? Interesting view as he used to be a trot
    Peter Hitchins is a Tory, are you thinking of the late Christopher Hitchens?
    Nope, Peter. He was a Trotskyist in the 60s and 70s until he saw the light. Hence he is well placed to call out the centrists who increasingly try to inflict commie ideas upon us
    Like letting the ladies vote?
  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 28,821
    TGOHF said:

    Isam - fancy the job with the Kippers that might soon be available ? The donors must be fewmin..


    http://www.breitbart.com/Breitbart-London/2014/11/17/Moves-To-Remove-OFlynn-After-Anti-Business-Newsnight-Interview

    "Senior members of UKIP are campaigning behind the scenes to have Patrick O'Flynn MEP removed as economic spokesman after his appearance on the BBC's Newsnight programme last Monday night."

    "His opponents are now circulating a letter calling for him to go, which they hope to publish this week. One source who is not involved with the letter told Breitbart London: “He really does need to shut up with all talk of aggressive tax avoidance and bashing big business... It's a real mistake to have a pinko in such an important position."

    I haven't seen the interview, but it's very foolish of anyone within UKIP to object to big business bashing. Big business, like big government, is well suited to conditions within the EU, and will fight hard to stay in. Getting out of the EU will benefit small business disproportionately, which is a good thing, as small business is where the possibility of employment growth lies. It is best therefore to do as UKIP have been doing, attacking big business before being attacked. Sucking up to these companies will do no good when they will only turn around and use their clout to try to instil fear about withdrawal. Discredit them first, and their attacks will look self serving and dishonest.
  • IndigoIndigo Posts: 9,966
    edited November 2014
    Ishmael_X said:


    You obviously haven't seen or heard Kelly in action.

    Judge for yourself... I am no fan of Labour, but their candidate eats KT for breakfast.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TBd6yFuiQrk
  • NormNorm Posts: 1,251

    felix said:

    One thing is for sure - Populus either know something the other pollsters are missing or they are massively inflating the big 2 at the expense of the rest.

    Regarding the critcisms on here of Kelly Tollhurst by BenM & Roger -their views can be discounted as both are Labour supporters but to then denigrate the primary voters for choosing her does show a more serious contempt for the electors. Certainly in Roger's rather strange world Tory voters barely deserve the right to vote. Politics really shouldn't be that nasty.

    Iirc Conservative posters were similarly unimpressed by Kelly Tolhurst's performance to date, or as an advert for primaries. After seeing Kelly on the hustings, CCHQ seems to have joined Labour in sitting this one out.
    That would be a good story if it was true. It's amazing how people living a long way from North Kent seem to know a great deal about what is happening in the constituency. George Osborne no less is there today as were a lot of ordinary Joe party workers over the weekend. The Tories are fighting this hard - if we lose it won't be from want of trying.
  • felix said:

    One thing is for sure - Populus either know something the other pollsters are missing or they are massively inflating the big 2 at the expense of the rest.

    Regarding the critcisms on here of Kelly Tollhurst by BenM & Roger -their views can be discounted as both are Labour supporters but to then denigrate the primary voters for choosing her does show a more serious contempt for the electors. Certainly in Roger's rather strange world Tory voters barely deserve the right to vote. Politics really shouldn't be that nasty.

    The amusing thing is that those who lay into Ms Tolhurst are often the same people who complain about 'professional politicians' with Oxford PPE degrees and who keep saying they want MPs to be more like the electorate, have had proper jobs, etc. That's why it's so funny that it's the 'People's Army' candidate who's the Christ Church PPE graduate, who has never done a proper job in his life, just banking and law.
    And ironic that a party led by Old Etonian PPE graduates, and previously represented in this very constituency by this very same PPE man, should criticise him for it.

    What it does show is that perhaps PPCs and byelection candidates in particular should be given more training, although even many frontbench politicians are lousy speakers these days.
  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 28,821
    Norm said:

    felix said:

    One thing is for sure - Populus either know something the other pollsters are missing or they are massively inflating the big 2 at the expense of the rest.

    Regarding the critcisms on here of Kelly Tollhurst by BenM & Roger -their views can be discounted as both are Labour supporters but to then denigrate the primary voters for choosing her does show a more serious contempt for the electors. Certainly in Roger's rather strange world Tory voters barely deserve the right to vote. Politics really shouldn't be that nasty.

    Iirc Conservative posters were similarly unimpressed by Kelly Tolhurst's performance to date, or as an advert for primaries. After seeing Kelly on the hustings, CCHQ seems to have joined Labour in sitting this one out.
    That would be a good story if it was true. It's amazing how people living a long way from North Kent seem to know a great deal about what is happening in the constituency. George Osborne no less is there today
    That's all she needs.
  • isam said:

    Socrates said:

    isam said:

    FalseFlag said:

    rcs1000 said:

    @isam,



    Given that the East End is pretty well correlated with Tower Hamlets, this should be the big demographic groups of the Eastenders cast:

    Bangladeshi: 32%
    White British: 31%
    White Other: 12%
    Black African: 4%
    Chinese: 3%

    One Asian family in it last time I watched, and no Eastern Europeans

    If they renamed it 'Essex Suburbs' it would be realistic
    I've always mentally located it in Stepney, somewhere like Arbour Square just off the Commercial Road.

    Why is anybody worried about the racial composition of the cast? The scripts are so bloody implausible they could have it played exclusively by South Sea Islanders and it wouldn't be any less like the real thing.
  • Norm said:

    felix said:

    One thing is for sure - Populus either know something the other pollsters are missing or they are massively inflating the big 2 at the expense of the rest.

    Regarding the critcisms on here of Kelly Tollhurst by BenM & Roger -their views can be discounted as both are Labour supporters but to then denigrate the primary voters for choosing her does show a more serious contempt for the electors. Certainly in Roger's rather strange world Tory voters barely deserve the right to vote. Politics really shouldn't be that nasty.

    Iirc Conservative posters were similarly unimpressed by Kelly Tolhurst's performance to date, or as an advert for primaries. After seeing Kelly on the hustings, CCHQ seems to have joined Labour in sitting this one out.
    That would be a good story if it was true. It's amazing how people living a long way from North Kent seem to know a great deal about what is happening in the constituency. George Osborne no less is there today
    That's all she needs.
    George Osborne is the country's most popular politician according to the gold standard of UK polling.
  • TGOHF said:

    Isam - fancy the job with the Kippers that might soon be available ? The donors must be fewmin..


    http://www.breitbart.com/Breitbart-London/2014/11/17/Moves-To-Remove-OFlynn-After-Anti-Business-Newsnight-Interview

    "Senior members of UKIP are campaigning behind the scenes to have Patrick O'Flynn MEP removed as economic spokesman after his appearance on the BBC's Newsnight programme last Monday night."

    "His opponents are now circulating a letter calling for him to go, which they hope to publish this week. One source who is not involved with the letter told Breitbart London: “He really does need to shut up with all talk of aggressive tax avoidance and bashing big business... It's a real mistake to have a pinko in such an important position."

    If someone was ever again going to call someone a "pinko", it was surely going to have to be in UKIP. Just wouldn't have expected it to be one of their own they were talking about.

    Ferrets in a sack....
    Pinko is such a poor insult.

    Traitorous Pigdog on the other hand
    As if by magic, I appear when those words appear.... unbelievably I've put some more against the Rochester schweinhund.
    So have I.

    Did you see my suggestion to your question for the collective noun for a group of traitorous pigdogs?

    A Sol of traitorous pigdogs.
    Nope. Nailed it however sir.
  • TGOHF said:

    Isam - fancy the job with the Kippers that might soon be available ? The donors must be fewmin..


    http://www.breitbart.com/Breitbart-London/2014/11/17/Moves-To-Remove-OFlynn-After-Anti-Business-Newsnight-Interview

    "Senior members of UKIP are campaigning behind the scenes to have Patrick O'Flynn MEP removed as economic spokesman after his appearance on the BBC's Newsnight programme last Monday night."

    "His opponents are now circulating a letter calling for him to go, which they hope to publish this week. One source who is not involved with the letter told Breitbart London: “He really does need to shut up with all talk of aggressive tax avoidance and bashing big business... It's a real mistake to have a pinko in such an important position."

    If someone was ever again going to call someone a "pinko", it was surely going to have to be in UKIP. Just wouldn't have expected it to be one of their own they were talking about.

    Ferrets in a sack....
    Pinko is such a poor insult.

    Traitorous Pigdog on the other hand
    Knock Knock Knock can we have a word sir

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1190119/Man-charged-racial-harassment-alleged-pig-dog-insult-German-neighbour.html
    I would never insult the Germans.

    They are one of my favourite peoples/nations

    They make awesome motor vehicles and keep on invading the Frogs, which causes us and The Yanks (and the Cannucks) to liberate them, which upsets the French psyche.
    Q: Why are the roads of Northern France lined with trees?
    A: So the Wehrmacht can march in the shade.
  • NickPalmerNickPalmer Posts: 21,564

    I've just had £2 on the Conservatives for R&S @ 28 and £2 on Labour @ £520.

    Even if you expect UKIP to win these odds are worth a few quid.

    Or are the PB Tories 'all fart and no follow through' ?

    I've taken a little on the Tories. The current odds are barmy - the Tories should be around 5/1, given how much of UKIP's support comes from people who may not actually get round to voting. Also, I heard some moderately encouraging feedback from an experienced canvasser last night.
    28-1 does look extreme. I know nothing about the scene on the ground, but I wonder if punters are going too much on Tory expectations management talk.
  • bigjohnowlsbigjohnowls Posts: 22,736

    TGOHF said:

    Isam - fancy the job with the Kippers that might soon be available ? The donors must be fewmin..


    http://www.breitbart.com/Breitbart-London/2014/11/17/Moves-To-Remove-OFlynn-After-Anti-Business-Newsnight-Interview

    "Senior members of UKIP are campaigning behind the scenes to have Patrick O'Flynn MEP removed as economic spokesman after his appearance on the BBC's Newsnight programme last Monday night."

    "His opponents are now circulating a letter calling for him to go, which they hope to publish this week. One source who is not involved with the letter told Breitbart London: “He really does need to shut up with all talk of aggressive tax avoidance and bashing big business... It's a real mistake to have a pinko in such an important position."

    If someone was ever again going to call someone a "pinko", it was surely going to have to be in UKIP. Just wouldn't have expected it to be one of their own they were talking about.

    Ferrets in a sack....
    Pinko is such a poor insult.

    Traitorous Pigdog on the other hand
    Knock Knock Knock can we have a word sir

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1190119/Man-charged-racial-harassment-alleged-pig-dog-insult-German-neighbour.html
    I would never insult the Germans.

    They are one of my favourite peoples/nations

    They make awesome motor vehicles and keep on invading the Frogs, which causes us and The Yanks (and the Cannucks) to liberate them, which upsets the French psyche.
    Oh dear 1/10

    See me
  • felixfelix Posts: 15,173
    Ishmael_X said:

    felix said:

    One thing is for sure - Populus either know something the other pollsters are missing or they are massively inflating the big 2 at the expense of the rest.

    Regarding the critcisms on here of Kelly Tollhurst by BenM & Roger -their views can be discounted as both are Labour supporters but to then denigrate the primary voters for choosing her does show a more serious contempt for the electors. Certainly in Roger's rather strange world Tory voters barely deserve the right to vote. Politics really shouldn't be that nasty.

    Bizarre argument, can we not criticise any elected politician for fear of showing contempt for the electorate?

    You obviously haven't seen or heard Kelly in action.

    You can do as you wish about candidates my objection was primarily to the contemptuous comments about voters. It's probably the main reason why so many have turned away from mainstream parties. At the end of the day democracy is all about reflecting the views of the voters and they deserve respect whatever you might think of politicians.
  • bigjohnowlsbigjohnowls Posts: 22,736
    felix said:

    One thing is for sure - Populus either know something the other pollsters are missing or they are massively inflating the big 2 at the expense of the rest.

    Regarding the critcisms on here of Kelly Tollhurst by BenM & Roger -their views can be discounted as both are Labour supporters but to then denigrate the primary voters for choosing her does show a more serious contempt for the electors. Certainly in Roger's rather strange world Tory voters barely deserve the right to vote. Politics really shouldn't be that nasty.

    You saying Kelly is a good candidate?


    I mean seriously?

    Are you her mother?
  • felixfelix Posts: 15,173

    felix said:

    One thing is for sure - Populus either know something the other pollsters are missing or they are massively inflating the big 2 at the expense of the rest.

    Regarding the critcisms on here of Kelly Tollhurst by BenM & Roger -their views can be discounted as both are Labour supporters but to then denigrate the primary voters for choosing her does show a more serious contempt for the electors. Certainly in Roger's rather strange world Tory voters barely deserve the right to vote. Politics really shouldn't be that nasty.

    The amusing thing is that those who lay into Ms Tolhurst are often the same people who complain about 'professional politicians' with Oxford PPE degrees and who keep saying they want MPs to be more like the electorate, have had proper jobs, etc. That's why it's so funny that it's the 'People's Army' candidate who's the Christ Church PPE graduate, who has never done a proper job in his life, just banking and law.
    And ironic that a party led by Old Etonian PPE graduates, and previously represented in this very constituency by this very same PPE man, should criticise him for it.

    What it does show is that perhaps PPCs and byelection candidates in particular should be given more training, although even many frontbench politicians are lousy speakers these days.
    Now are you seriously going to criticise Conservativesonly for this - how's the millionnaire tax evader and scion of the dynasticus millipedus doing as the leader of the workers' party these days?
  • CD13CD13 Posts: 6,366
    Indigo,

    The clip may have been a little unfair on the Tory candidate. She had a difficult question. Admittedly, a seven year old might have done better, but look at the background. An audience strongly against unlimited immigration and she had to defend a failure to control the numbers.

    The Labour candidate merely had to tell a couple of porkies. "Yes, we're sorry about 2004 and we'll do better next time."

    The official opposition response may go along the lines of "Well, we thought the other countries would open their borders completely too, but the rotters didn't." when in fact, their honest response is "Tough, we're committed to unlimited immigration so suck it up." Obviously the truth that dare not speak its name in that setting.

    Ukip merely sit back with a smile.
  • felixfelix Posts: 15,173
    Indigo said:

    Ishmael_X said:


    You obviously haven't seen or heard Kelly in action.

    Judge for yourself... I am no fan of Labour, but their candidate eats KT for breakfast.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TBd6yFuiQrk

    felix said:

    One thing is for sure - Populus either know something the other pollsters are missing or they are massively inflating the big 2 at the expense of the rest.

    Regarding the critcisms on here of Kelly Tollhurst by BenM & Roger -their views can be discounted as both are Labour supporters but to then denigrate the primary voters for choosing her does show a more serious contempt for the electors. Certainly in Roger's rather strange world Tory voters barely deserve the right to vote. Politics really shouldn't be that nasty.

    You saying Kelly is a good candidate?


    I mean seriously?

    Are you her mother?

    Oh of course - is that why she is so far behind Labour in the polling. Are you therefore expecting Labour to win on Thursday - or at least come a very strong second leaving Ms Tollhurst in her wake?
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 43,046
    edited November 2014

    Norm said:

    felix said:

    One thing is for sure - Populus either know something the other pollsters are missing or they are massively inflating the big 2 at the expense of the rest.

    Regarding the critcisms on here of Kelly Tollhurst by BenM & Roger -their views can be discounted as both are Labour supporters but to then denigrate the primary voters for choosing her does show a more serious contempt for the electors. Certainly in Roger's rather strange world Tory voters barely deserve the right to vote. Politics really shouldn't be that nasty.

    Iirc Conservative posters were similarly unimpressed by Kelly Tolhurst's performance to date, or as an advert for primaries. After seeing Kelly on the hustings, CCHQ seems to have joined Labour in sitting this one out.
    That would be a good story if it was true. It's amazing how people living a long way from North Kent seem to know a great deal about what is happening in the constituency. George Osborne no less is there today
    That's all she needs.
    George very clever on the newsbites with a soundbite:

    "blah blah...long term economic plan...blah blah."

    ie we're in the middle of something bigger, better, stronger, more successful than all of us (and particularly than those in Europe, Japan), etc, for god's sake don't interrupt by voting in Lab.

    Yo @Alanbrooke‌
  • PlatoPlato Posts: 15,724
    Reminded me of Wait Til Your Father Gets Home. I loved that cartoon series. Especially the daughter who burned her bra.

    https://youtube.com/watch?v=mbsEYoKm9X8

    TGOHF said:

    Isam - fancy the job with the Kippers that might soon be available ? The donors must be fewmin..


    http://www.breitbart.com/Breitbart-London/2014/11/17/Moves-To-Remove-OFlynn-After-Anti-Business-Newsnight-Interview

    "Senior members of UKIP are campaigning behind the scenes to have Patrick O'Flynn MEP removed as economic spokesman after his appearance on the BBC's Newsnight programme last Monday night."

    "His opponents are now circulating a letter calling for him to go, which they hope to publish this week. One source who is not involved with the letter told Breitbart London: “He really does need to shut up with all talk of aggressive tax avoidance and bashing big business... It's a real mistake to have a pinko in such an important position."

    If someone was ever again going to call someone a "pinko", it was surely going to have to be in UKIP. Just wouldn't have expected it to be one of their own they were talking about.

    Ferrets in a sack....
  • felix said:

    felix said:

    One thing is for sure - Populus either know something the other pollsters are missing or they are massively inflating the big 2 at the expense of the rest.

    Regarding the critcisms on here of Kelly Tollhurst by BenM & Roger -their views can be discounted as both are Labour supporters but to then denigrate the primary voters for choosing her does show a more serious contempt for the electors. Certainly in Roger's rather strange world Tory voters barely deserve the right to vote. Politics really shouldn't be that nasty.

    The amusing thing is that those who lay into Ms Tolhurst are often the same people who complain about 'professional politicians' with Oxford PPE degrees and who keep saying they want MPs to be more like the electorate, have had proper jobs, etc. That's why it's so funny that it's the 'People's Army' candidate who's the Christ Church PPE graduate, who has never done a proper job in his life, just banking and law.
    And ironic that a party led by Old Etonian PPE graduates, and previously represented in this very constituency by this very same PPE man, should criticise him for it.

    What it does show is that perhaps PPCs and byelection candidates in particular should be given more training, although even many frontbench politicians are lousy speakers these days.
    Now are you seriously going to criticise Conservativesonly for this - how's the millionnaire tax evader and scion of the dynasticus millipedus doing as the leader of the workers' party these days?
    Eh? The Conservatives put out a leaflet criticising Reckless for not being local and for being an Oxford PPE graduate. That is the point.
  • TOPPING said:

    Norm said:

    felix said:

    One thing is for sure - Populus either know something the other pollsters are missing or they are massively inflating the big 2 at the expense of the rest.

    Regarding the critcisms on here of Kelly Tollhurst by BenM & Roger -their views can be discounted as both are Labour supporters but to then denigrate the primary voters for choosing her does show a more serious contempt for the electors. Certainly in Roger's rather strange world Tory voters barely deserve the right to vote. Politics really shouldn't be that nasty.

    Iirc Conservative posters were similarly unimpressed by Kelly Tolhurst's performance to date, or as an advert for primaries. After seeing Kelly on the hustings, CCHQ seems to have joined Labour in sitting this one out.
    That would be a good story if it was true. It's amazing how people living a long way from North Kent seem to know a great deal about what is happening in the constituency. George Osborne no less is there today
    That's all she needs.
    George very clever on the newsbites with a soundbite:

    "blah blah...long term economic plan...blah blah."

    ie we're in the middle of something bigger, better, stronger, more successful than all of us (and particularly than those in Europe, Japan), etc, for god's sake don't interrupt by voting in Lab.

    Yo @Alanbrooke‌
    Long term economic plan does seem to be the CCHQ-approved soundbite de nos jours. A lot of Conservatives are slipping it in.

  • felixfelix Posts: 15,173

    felix said:

    felix said:

    One thing is for sure - Populus either know something the other pollsters are missing or they are massively inflating the big 2 at the expense of the rest.

    Regarding the critcisms on here of Kelly Tollhurst by BenM & Roger -their views can be discounted as both are Labour supporters but to then denigrate the primary voters for choosing her does show a more serious contempt for the electors. Certainly in Roger's rather strange world Tory voters barely deserve the right to vote. Politics really shouldn't be that nasty.

    The amusing thing is that those who lay into Ms Tolhurst are often the same people who complain about 'professional politicians' with Oxford PPE degrees and who keep saying they want MPs to be more like the electorate, have had proper jobs, etc. That's why it's so funny that it's the 'People's Army' candidate who's the Christ Church PPE graduate, who has never done a proper job in his life, just banking and law.
    And ironic that a party led by Old Etonian PPE graduates, and previously represented in this very constituency by this very same PPE man, should criticise him for it.

    What it does show is that perhaps PPCs and byelection candidates in particular should be given more training, although even many frontbench politicians are lousy speakers these days.
    Now are you seriously going to criticise Conservativesonly for this - how's the millionnaire tax evader and scion of the dynasticus millipedus doing as the leader of the workers' party these days?
    Eh? The Conservatives put out a leaflet criticising Reckless for not being local and for being an Oxford PPE graduate. That is the point.
    Err no - Miliband repeatedly criticises the Conservatives for elitism despite the his own privileged background. The point is that politicians do hypocricy at times...all of them... end of. Have you never heard PMQs - it's his standard line whenever he's doing badly - he has to use it a lot:)
  • chestnutchestnut Posts: 7,341
    Indigo said:

    Judge for yourself... I am no fan of Labour, but their candidate eats KT for breakfast

    Labour "blah blah blah" doesn't really cut much ice any more, does it?
  • ItajaiItajai Posts: 721
    isam said:

    FalseFlag said:

    rcs1000 said:

    @isam,

    Well... Peter Hitchens may be right in his conclusion, but Morris Dancer is right to point out that his facts were simply wrong.

    Really?

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/article-2030849/Libya-Were-cheering-rebels-AK-47s-worse-Gaddafi.html

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/article-1367993/Libyas-War-Why-just-let-fight-make-friends-winners.html

    He has been right on the money regarding US interference in the Ukraine too.
    In the second link he discusses the Midsomer Murders controversy, where the producer defended the lack of non white characters

    If people got uptight about Midsomer Murders, why aren't they up in arms about EastEnders? Midsomer is far more accurate in its portrayal of the demographic... There aren't that many non white people in the kind of areas it is set, and so the show is quite realistic.

    Eastenders cast however, should be mainly Muslim, over 50% non white ,with a large percentage of Eastern Europeans. many of the cahracters should be unable to or prefer not to speak English... The portrayal is more of West Essex than the East End of London

    this is surely racist? I think the reason the bbc cast the show thus is because if it were accurate, non Londoners simply wouldn't believe it

    And wonder what the viewing figures will be. Would give pay the lie about how we all love multiculturalism.
  • NormNorm Posts: 1,251
    edited November 2014

    felix said:

    One thing is for sure - Populus either know something the other pollsters are missing or they are massively inflating the big 2 at the expense of the rest.

    Regarding the critcisms on here of Kelly Tollhurst by BenM & Roger -their views can be discounted as both are Labour supporters but to then denigrate the primary voters for choosing her does show a more serious contempt for the electors. Certainly in Roger's rather strange world Tory voters barely deserve the right to vote. Politics really shouldn't be that nasty.

    You saying Kelly is a good candidate?


    I mean seriously?

    Are you her mother?
    How do you know she won't be a first rate hard working MP for her constituents? You seem to be judging a book by its cover which I thought was a supposed Tory fault.
  • felix said:

    felix said:

    felix said:

    One thing is for sure - Populus either know something the other pollsters are missing or they are massively inflating the big 2 at the expense of the rest.

    Regarding the critcisms on here of Kelly Tollhurst by BenM & Roger -their views can be discounted as both are Labour supporters but to then denigrate the primary voters for choosing her does show a more serious contempt for the electors. Certainly in Roger's rather strange world Tory voters barely deserve the right to vote. Politics really shouldn't be that nasty.

    The amusing thing is that those who lay into Ms Tolhurst are often the same people who complain about 'professional politicians' with Oxford PPE degrees and who keep saying they want MPs to be more like the electorate, have had proper jobs, etc. That's why it's so funny that it's the 'People's Army' candidate who's the Christ Church PPE graduate, who has never done a proper job in his life, just banking and law.
    And ironic that a party led by Old Etonian PPE graduates, and previously represented in this very constituency by this very same PPE man, should criticise him for it.

    What it does show is that perhaps PPCs and byelection candidates in particular should be given more training, although even many frontbench politicians are lousy speakers these days.
    Now are you seriously going to criticise Conservativesonly for this - how's the millionnaire tax evader and scion of the dynasticus millipedus doing as the leader of the workers' party these days?
    Eh? The Conservatives put out a leaflet criticising Reckless for not being local and for being an Oxford PPE graduate. That is the point.
    Err no - Miliband repeatedly criticises the Conservatives for elitism despite the his own privileged background. The point is that politicians do hypocricy at times...all of them... end of. Have you never heard PMQs - it's his standard line whenever he's doing badly - he has to use it a lot:)
    Here is the Tory leaflet:
    http://blogs.spectator.co.uk/isabel-hardman/2014/11/the-recklessness-of-cchq/

    It is doubly silly because Reckless was the Tory MP until a few weeks ago, when presumably the party had no complaints about his background, and because the leaflet is also complaining about the background of half its own party's leadership.

    Again, it is a Conservative Party leaflet.
  • FlightpathFlightpath Posts: 4,012
    felix said:

    felix said:

    One thing is for sure - Populus either know something the other pollsters are missing or they are massively inflating the big 2 at the expense of the rest.

    Regarding the critcisms on here of Kelly Tollhurst by BenM & Roger -their views can be discounted as both are Labour supporters but to then denigrate the primary voters for choosing her does show a more serious contempt for the electors. Certainly in Roger's rather strange world Tory voters barely deserve the right to vote. Politics really shouldn't be that nasty.

    The amusing thing is that those who lay into Ms Tolhurst are often the same people who complain about 'professional politicians' with Oxford PPE degrees and who keep saying they want MPs to be more like the electorate, have had proper jobs, etc. That's why it's so funny that it's the 'People's Army' candidate who's the Christ Church PPE graduate, who has never done a proper job in his life, just banking and law.
    And ironic that a party led by Old Etonian PPE graduates, and previously represented in this very constituency by this very same PPE man, should criticise him for it.

    What it does show is that perhaps PPCs and byelection candidates in particular should be given more training, although even many frontbench politicians are lousy speakers these days.
    Now are you seriously going to criticise Conservativesonly for this - how's the millionnaire tax evader and scion of the dynasticus millipedus doing as the leader of the workers' party these days?
    ''previously represented in this very constituency by this very same PPE man, should criticise him for it.''
    They are criticising him for being a hypocrite. For dropping all the policies he previously supported like a stone out of self interest. For being now supposedly anti politics when he has been part of the system so long.
  • TGOHFTGOHF Posts: 21,633
    Ukip 1.05 on betfair for R+S.

    Surely all over ?
  • NormNorm Posts: 1,251

    felix said:

    felix said:

    felix said:

    One thing is for sure - Populus either know something the other pollsters are missing or they are massively inflating the big 2 at the expense of the rest.

    Regarding the critcisms on here of Kelly Tollhurst by BenM & Roger -their views can be discounted as both are Labour supporters but to then denigrate the primary voters for choosing her does show a more serious contempt for the electors. Certainly in Roger's rather strange world Tory voters barely deserve the right to vote. Politics really shouldn't be that nasty.

    The amusing thing is that those who lay into Ms Tolhurst are often the same people who complain about 'professional politicians' with Oxford PPE degrees and who keep saying they want MPs to be more like the electorate, have had proper jobs, etc. That's why it's so funny that it's the 'People's Army' candidate who's the Christ Church PPE graduate, who has never done a proper job in his life, just banking and law.
    And ironic that a party led by Old Etonian PPE graduates, and previously represented in this very constituency by this very same PPE man, should criticise him for it.

    What it does show is that perhaps PPCs and byelection candidates in particular should be given more training, although even many frontbench politicians are lousy speakers these days.
    Now are you seriously going to criticise Conservativesonly for this - how's the millionnaire tax evader and scion of the dynasticus millipedus doing as the leader of the workers' party these days?
    Eh? The Conservatives put out a leaflet criticising Reckless for not being local and for being an Oxford PPE graduate. That is the point.
    Err no - Miliband repeatedly criticises the Conservatives for elitism despite the his own privileged background. The point is that politicians do hypocricy at times...all of them... end of. Have you never heard PMQs - it's his standard line whenever he's doing badly - he has to use it a lot:)
    Here is the Tory leaflet:
    http://blogs.spectator.co.uk/isabel-hardman/2014/11/the-recklessness-of-cchq/

    It is doubly silly because Reckless was the Tory MP until a few weeks ago, when presumably the party had no complaints about his background, and because the leaflet is also complaining about the background of half its own party's leadership.

    Again, it is a Conservative Party leaflet.
    Which provides information that the electorate may wish to know.

    I am sure if they are impressed by Reckless's credentials they will vote for him regardless.
  • SocratesSocrates Posts: 10,322

    felix said:

    One thing is for sure - Populus either know something the other pollsters are missing or they are massively inflating the big 2 at the expense of the rest.

    Regarding the critcisms on here of Kelly Tollhurst by BenM & Roger -their views can be discounted as both are Labour supporters but to then denigrate the primary voters for choosing her does show a more serious contempt for the electors. Certainly in Roger's rather strange world Tory voters barely deserve the right to vote. Politics really shouldn't be that nasty.

    The amusing thing is that those who lay into Ms Tolhurst are often the same people who complain about 'professional politicians' with Oxford PPE degrees and who keep saying they want MPs to be more like the electorate, have had proper jobs, etc. That's why it's so funny that it's the 'People's Army' candidate who's the Christ Church PPE graduate, who has never done a proper job in his life, just banking and law.
    In what way are banking and law not proper jobs? They're legitimate, profit-making professions. It's hardly being a SPAD.

    And, the issue isn't that an individual has a PPE degree. It's that a disproportionate number of a party does, and that causes group think. It looks like UKIP's parliamentary party will have a good mix.
  • felixfelix Posts: 15,173

    felix said:

    felix said:

    felix said:

    One thing is for sure - Populus either know something the other pollsters are missing or they are massively inflating the big 2 at the expense of the rest.

    Regarding the critcisms on here of Kelly Tollhurst by BenM & Roger -their views can be discounted as both are Labour supporters but to then denigrate the primary voters for choosing her does show a more serious contempt for the electors. Certainly in Roger's rather strange world Tory voters barely deserve the right to vote. Politics really shouldn't be that nasty.

    The amusing thing is that those who lay into Ms Tolhurst are often the same people who complain about 'professional politicians' with Oxford PPE degrees and who keep saying they want MPs to be more like the electorate, have had proper jobs, etc. That's why it's so funny that it's the 'People's Army' candidate who's the Christ Church PPE graduate, who has never done a proper job in his life, just banking and law.
    And ironic that a party led by Old Etonian PPE graduates, and previously represented in this very constituency by this very same PPE man, should criticise him for it.

    What it does show is that perhaps PPCs and byelection candidates in particular should be given more training, although even many frontbench politicians are lousy speakers these days.
    Now are you seriously going to criticise Conservativesonly for this - how's the millionnaire tax evader and scion of the dynasticus millipedus doing as the leader of the workers' party these days?
    Eh? The Conservatives put out a leaflet criticising Reckless for not being local and for being an Oxford PPE graduate. That is the point.
    Err no - Miliband repeatedly criticises the Conservatives for elitism despite the his own privileged background. The point is that politicians do hypocricy at times...all of them... end of. Have you never heard PMQs - it's his standard line whenever he's doing badly - he has to use it a lot:)
    Here is the Tory leaflet:
    http://blogs.spectator.co.uk/isabel-hardman/2014/11/the-recklessness-of-cchq/

    It is doubly silly because Reckless was the Tory MP until a few weeks ago, when presumably the party had no complaints about his background, and because the leaflet is also complaining about the background of half its own party's leadership.

    Again, it is a Conservative Party leaflet.
    So basically I was right - only the Conservatives can be accused of hypocricy because you see no evil in Labour's backyard. Presumably you too are confident of a Labour win or strong second on Thursday?
  • TGOHFTGOHF Posts: 21,633
    Norm said:

    felix said:

    felix said:

    felix said:

    One thing is for sure - Populus either know something the other pollsters are missing or they are massively inflating the big 2 at the expense of the rest.

    Regarding the critcisms on here of Kelly Tollhurst by BenM & Roger -their views can be discounted as both are Labour supporters but to then denigrate the primary voters for choosing her does show a more serious contempt for the electors. Certainly in Roger's rather strange world Tory voters barely deserve the right to vote. Politics really shouldn't be that nasty.


    And ironic that a party led by Old Etonian PPE graduates, and previously represented in this very constituency by this very same PPE man, should criticise him for it.

    What it does show is that perhaps PPCs and byelection candidates in particular should be given more training, although even many frontbench politicians are lousy speakers these days.
    Now are you seriously going to criticise Conservativesonly for this - how's the millionnaire tax evader and scion of the dynasticus millipedus doing as the leader of the workers' party these days?
    Eh? The Conservatives put out a leaflet criticising Reckless for not being local and for being an Oxford PPE graduate. That is the point.
    Err no - Miliband repeatedly criticises the Conservatives for elitism despite the his own privileged background. The point is that politicians do hypocricy at times...all of them... end of. Have you never heard PMQs - it's his standard line whenever he's doing badly - he has to use it a lot:)
    Here is the Tory leaflet:
    http://blogs.spectator.co.uk/isabel-hardman/2014/11/the-recklessness-of-cchq/

    It is doubly silly because Reckless was the Tory MP until a few weeks ago, when presumably the party had no complaints about his background, and because the leaflet is also complaining about the background of half its own party's leadership.

    Again, it is a Conservative Party leaflet.
    Which provides information that the electorate may wish to know.

    I am sure if they are impressed by Reckless's credentials they will vote for him regardless.
    In summary - how dare the Conservatives use normal election tactics ?
  • AlistairAlistair Posts: 23,670
    I'm reading there seems to be a Scottish focused Populus poll out in the field at the moment.
  • Alistair said:

    I'm reading there seems to be a Scottish focused Populus poll out in the field at the moment.

    Might be for Better Together.

    They were the internal pollsters for Better Together.
  • AlistairAlistair Posts: 23,670

    Alistair said:

    I'm reading there seems to be a Scottish focused Populus poll out in the field at the moment.

    Might be for Better Together.

    They were the internal pollsters for Better Together.
    Asked a lot of questions about SLab apparently.
  • Alistair said:

    Alistair said:

    I'm reading there seems to be a Scottish focused Populus poll out in the field at the moment.

    Might be for Better Together.

    They were the internal pollsters for Better Together.
    Asked a lot of questions about SLab apparently.
    Probably an internal poll for SLab then.
  • TGOHFTGOHF Posts: 21,633

    Alistair said:

    I'm reading there seems to be a Scottish focused Populus poll out in the field at the moment.

    Might be for Better Together.

    They were the internal pollsters for Better Together.
    Has BT not disbanded as "job done - foes vanquished" ?

  • And ironic that a party led by Old Etonian PPE graduates, and previously represented in this very constituency by this very same PPE man, should criticise him for it.

    Actually I don't think that's quite right, although I agree the whole setup is pretty funny.

    What the Conservatives are trying to do, I think, is counter UKIP's completely ludicrous claims about being more in touch, not being professional politicians, not being part of the Establishment, being more representative of ordinary voters than other voters, telling the truth without spin, etc. In the case of Mark Reckless, the UKIP positioning is completely absurd, and I'm not surprised the Tories are trying to expose it for the sham which it so obviously is.

    I'm not sure they have gone about this in the most effective way, but the aim is sensible enough.
  • TGOHF said:

    Alistair said:

    I'm reading there seems to be a Scottish focused Populus poll out in the field at the moment.

    Might be for Better Together.

    They were the internal pollsters for Better Together.
    Has BT not disbanded as "job done - foes vanquished" ?

    To misquote someone else, they haven't gone away you know.

    As I understand it, Populus impressed the various component members of Better Together with the accuracy of their polling and providing the right target material on the indy ref.

    So I would not be surprised if one of the Unionist parties commissioned them for their accuracy.
  • SocratesSocrates Posts: 10,322

    And ironic that a party led by Old Etonian PPE graduates, and previously represented in this very constituency by this very same PPE man, should criticise him for it.

    Actually I don't think that's quite right, although I agree the whole setup is pretty funny.

    What the Conservatives are trying to do, I think, is counter UKIP's completely ludicrous claims about being more in touch, not being professional politicians, not being part of the Establishment, being more representative of ordinary voters than other voters, telling the truth without spin, etc. In the case of Mark Reckless, the UKIP positioning is completely absurd, and I'm not surprised the Tories are trying to expose it for the sham which it so obviously is.

    I'm not sure they have gone about this in the most effective way, but the aim is sensible enough.
    They haven't gone about it in the right way because they, like you, do not understand the criticism properly.
  • NinoinozNinoinoz Posts: 1,312
    edited November 2014


    ''previously represented in this very constituency by this very same PPE man, should criticise him for it.''
    They are criticising him for being a hypocrite. For dropping all the policies he previously supported like a stone out of self interest. For being now supposedly anti politics when he has been part of the system so long.

    Well, at least he has the decency to subject himself to his electorate for re-approval.

    What I don't get about PB Tories is the way they attack UKIP for participating in the political process to effect change, as if this is an immoral and unethical act.

    What did you want Ukippers to do? Pick up a gun?
  • Clearly a fine, upstanding and utterly decent person with the best possible taste recovering from a recent 'weakness' fortunately...

    Mark Pritchard @MPritchardMP
    Good to see Cllr Steve Glover, first UKIP Mayor of Market Drayton, Shropshire - leaving UKIP and re-joining the Conservatives. Welcome home!
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 52,937

    Clearly a fine, upstanding and utterly decent person with the best possible taste recovering from a recent 'weakness' fortunately...

    Mark Pritchard @MPritchardMP
    Good to see Cllr Steve Glover, first UKIP Mayor of Market Drayton, Shropshire - leaving UKIP and re-joining the Conservatives. Welcome home!

    It is written - the trickle shall become a flood....

  • Clearly a fine, upstanding and utterly decent person with the best possible taste recovering from a recent 'weakness' fortunately...

    Mark Pritchard @MPritchardMP
    Good to see Cllr Steve Glover, first UKIP Mayor of Market Drayton, Shropshire - leaving UKIP and re-joining the Conservatives. Welcome home!

    What a loyal, patriotic chap Steve Glover is, I'm glad he's seen the error of his ways.
  • Socrates said:

    And ironic that a party led by Old Etonian PPE graduates, and previously represented in this very constituency by this very same PPE man, should criticise him for it.

    Actually I don't think that's quite right, although I agree the whole setup is pretty funny.

    What the Conservatives are trying to do, I think, is counter UKIP's completely ludicrous claims about being more in touch, not being professional politicians, not being part of the Establishment, being more representative of ordinary voters than other voters, telling the truth without spin, etc. In the case of Mark Reckless, the UKIP positioning is completely absurd, and I'm not surprised the Tories are trying to expose it for the sham which it so obviously is.

    I'm not sure they have gone about this in the most effective way, but the aim is sensible enough.
    They haven't gone about it in the right way because they, like you, do not understand the criticism properly.
    Poppycock. I understand the criticism perfectly well, but, unlike you, I can understand the difference between criticising someone for being a PPE graduate, and criticising someone for posing as something they are not.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 119,960
    edited November 2014

    Clearly a fine, upstanding and utterly decent person with the best possible taste recovering from a recent 'weakness' fortunately...

    Mark Pritchard @MPritchardMP
    Good to see Cllr Steve Glover, first UKIP Mayor of Market Drayton, Shropshire - leaving UKIP and re-joining the Conservatives. Welcome home!

    It is written - the trickle shall become a flood....

    Best not mention floods when discussing Kippers....
  • malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 43,498
    TGOHF said:

    The problem was (is) that the scale of the NO victory wasn't big enough to settle the issue for good.

    If NO had won by, say, 63% to 37% we wouldn't even be having this conversation. A result like that should have been perfectly possible, but the Unionist campaign was not an impressive one.

    If No had won by 50.01% the issue would have been settled for good.

    Highly unfair process - and hence the YES camp has blown their chance for 35-40 years.

    A period of reflection and silence would be welcome. Surely the Scottish voters will see through this massive "look squirrel" argument of tossing about the constitution whilst Scottish Education standards plummet further. It's unsustainable.
    Cuckoo even by your standards
  • Is there a market for Carswell's tail-between-legs return too?
  • malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 43,498
    Toms said:

    What was that thunderous phrase that the bully boy kept repeating in the TV indy debates? It was something like "the sovereign will of the Scottish people". The other night on any questions some politician---was it herself indeed?---kept repeating it in a different guise. Well, this unwholesome stirring will continue, but the sovereign will of the Scots has voted NO, thanks be.

    Not for long though, round 2 coming up soon
  • PlatoPlato Posts: 15,724
    OT Calling PB Physicists. I bought one of those tea light ornaments that uses the heat to make it spin. And it doesn't work. Have I squished out the motion too much by flattening the blades? Or done too much the other way? I've tried a few options and it's failed.

    Or of course it could just be a crap purchase! I'm sure someone on here will know the answer - as ever.

    Px
  • Is there a market for Carswell's tail-between-legs return too?

    I've asked Shadsy to put a market on Douglas Carswell no longer being in UKIP by the end of 2016.

    No joy yet.
  • malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 43,498
    Alistair said:

    antifrank said:

    Neil Findlay is determined not to be outflanked from the left:

    http://www.scotsman.com/news/politics/top-stories/findlay-pledges-to-push-for-miners-strike-inquiry-1-3607007

    http://www.scotsman.com/news/politics/top-stories/i-ll-nationalise-rail-and-scrap-trident-findlay-1-3606980

    The second of these raises some very interesting questions for the UK as a whole if Mr Findlay does win the Scottish Labour leadership election.

    Findlay has been absolutely filleted on the trident issue. He's abstained or voted against all motions condemning Trident. Apparently he was all over the place on Good Morning Scotland this AM.

    Basically the classic SLAb problem of hating everything the SNP propose, even when it is an SLab idea.
    Murphy is hiding in London as well after getting pelters, his Tory credentials not going down well at all.
    It is dumb and dumber versus Sarah invisible.
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 33,704
    TGOHF said:

    Alistair said:

    I'm reading there seems to be a Scottish focused Populus poll out in the field at the moment.

    Might be for Better Together.

    They were the internal pollsters for Better Together.
    Has BT not disbanded as "job done - foes vanquished" ?

    What was it George W ludcrously declared?
  • malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 43,498
    Neil said:

    You can't impose New Labour on these places.

    Noone is seeking to impose New Labour on the Scottish Labour Party. They are having an election with a very clear alternative available.

    Yep, it is a Tory , a donkey or an invisible woman
  • TGOHFTGOHF Posts: 21,633
    malcolmg said:

    Toms said:

    What was that thunderous phrase that the bully boy kept repeating in the TV indy debates? It was something like "the sovereign will of the Scottish people". The other night on any questions some politician---was it herself indeed?---kept repeating it in a different guise. Well, this unwholesome stirring will continue, but the sovereign will of the Scots has voted NO, thanks be.

    Not for long though, round 2 coming up soon
    Have one every week - laws of chance and voter boredom suggest you might win one eventually.
  • TGOHFTGOHF Posts: 21,633

    Clearly a fine, upstanding and utterly decent person with the best possible taste recovering from a recent 'weakness' fortunately...

    Mark Pritchard @MPritchardMP
    Good to see Cllr Steve Glover, first UKIP Mayor of Market Drayton, Shropshire - leaving UKIP and re-joining the Conservatives. Welcome home!

    Wheels are coming off.. down in the polls.. infighting, defections...

    http://order-order.com/2014/11/17/patrick-oflynn-denies-leftist-smears/
  • ItajaiItajai Posts: 721
    Indigo said:

    isam said:

    If Farage has said it he should be criticised also, but for the PM to refer to 'Jihadi John' is disgraceful in my opinion

    If he had beheaded a relative of yours would you use that phrase to refer to him?

    http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/middle-east/cameron-wants-jihadi-john-alive-to-face-justice-as-reports-emerge-isis-militant-is-injured-9863555.html

    Face justice in the UK... assuming anyone could find enough evidence that would stand up in a British court... claims of temporary insanity, claims of mitigation because he came from a broken home, was beat by his parents, his dog just died, he got out of the wrong side of bed or whatever, then remission for good behaviour, and out in 7 years ?


    His mates can come round and claim asylum too.
  • Richard_NabaviRichard_Nabavi Posts: 30,821
    edited November 2014

    Is there a market for Carswell's tail-between-legs return too?

    I've asked Shadsy to put a market on Douglas Carswell no longer being in UKIP by the end of 2016.

    No joy yet.
    It must be a fairly high probability, even if you just go on the basis of the half-life of UKIP MEPs. Add to that Carswell's very individualistic take on almost everything, and Farage's apparent tendency to fall out with everyone he works with - maybe evens or so?
  • malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 43,498
    TGOHF said:

    Alistair said:

    I'm reading there seems to be a Scottish focused Populus poll out in the field at the moment.

    Might be for Better Together.

    They were the internal pollsters for Better Together.
    Has BT not disbanded as "job done - foes vanquished" ?

    working for Murphy now
  • BenMBenM Posts: 1,795
    Peter Kellner in the Guardian on the changing nature of UKIP support:

    http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2014/nov/17/ukip-support-british-politics-voters-labour-party

    Actually although Kellner tries to push the "UKIP taking Labour votes" meme the numbers don't really stack up. The data points to a Tory catastrophe the higher UKIP rise.
  • malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 43,498
    TGOHF said:

    malcolmg said:

    Toms said:

    What was that thunderous phrase that the bully boy kept repeating in the TV indy debates? It was something like "the sovereign will of the Scottish people". The other night on any questions some politician---was it herself indeed?---kept repeating it in a different guise. Well, this unwholesome stirring will continue, but the sovereign will of the Scots has voted NO, thanks be.

    Not for long though, round 2 coming up soon
    Have one every week - laws of chance and voter boredom suggest you might win one eventually.
    will not be in a week and will not be many , but another one will be along in near term for sure, unionists are bound to welch on their "VOW" on home rule.
  • FloaterFloater Posts: 14,207
  • Bond_James_BondBond_James_Bond Posts: 1,939
    edited November 2014
    Socrates said:

    isam said:

    FalseFlag said:

    rcs1000 said:

    @isam,

    Well... Peter Hitchens may be right in his conclusion, but Morris Dancer is right to point out that his facts were simply wrong.

    Really?

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/article-2030849/Libya-Were-cheering-rebels-AK-47s-worse-Gaddafi.html

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/article-1367993/Libyas-War-Why-just-let-fight-make-friends-winners.html

    He has been right on the money regarding US interference in the Ukraine too.
    In the second link he discusses the Midsomer Murders controversy, where the producer defended the lack of non white characters

    If people got uptight about Midsomer Murders, why aren't they up in arms about EastEnders? Midsomer is far more accurate in its portrayal of the demographic... There aren't that many non white people in the kind of areas it is set, and so the show is quite realistic.

    Eastenders cast however, should be mainly Muslim, over 50% non white ,with a large percentage of Eastern Europeans. many of the cahracters should be unable to or prefer not to speak English... The portrayal is more of West Essex than the East End of London

    this is surely racist? I think the reason the bbc cast the show thus is because if it were accurate, non Londoners simply wouldn't believe it
    Given that the East End is pretty well correlated with Tower Hamlets, this should be the big demographic groups of the Eastenders cast:

    Bangladeshi: 32%
    White British: 31%
    White Other: 12%
    Black African: 4%
    Chinese: 3%
    I've always thought - well, for about the last 10 years I've thought - that if you wanted to make a really edgy TV programme about life in Britain today, you would make one called EastEnders that depicts EastEnders as they actually now are.

    You would do it without subtitles, so the dialogue would be in various eastern European and subcontinental languages and 80% unintelligible; and you would film it on actual location, sari shops, polski skleps, fried chicken takeaways and all, rather than in the Dick Van Dyke studio mockup they use. The idea that people in the East End live in squares around a pub and all know each other is frankly out of the 1940s but I suppose the BBC does it to make us all feel that nothing has changed.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 119,960
    edited November 2014

    Is there a market for Carswell's tail-between-legs return too?

    I've asked Shadsy to put a market on Douglas Carswell no longer being in UKIP by the end of 2016.

    No joy yet.
    It must be a fairly high probability, even if you just go on the basis of the half-life of UKIP MEPs. Add to that Carswell's very individualistic take on almost everything, and Farage's apparent tendency to fall out with everyone he works with - maybe evens or so?
    The real trigger point for me was Carswell's victory speech, where he said this

    If we speak with passion, let it always be tempered by compassion. We must be a party for all Britain and all Britons: first and second generation as much as every other.

    I don't think that's something that's going to compatible with some of UKIP's more excitable members.
  • Good afternoon, everyone.

    Mr. M, whilst the purples do take, it seems, more blue than red votes, it's worth noting that over the medium term the Conservative polling has been more or less flat, whereas UKIP has risen and Labour has declined.
  • Ishmael_XIshmael_X Posts: 3,664
    Ninoinoz said:


    ''previously represented in this very constituency by this very same PPE man, should criticise him for it.''
    They are criticising him for being a hypocrite. For dropping all the policies he previously supported like a stone out of self interest. For being now supposedly anti politics when he has been part of the system so long.

    Well, at least he has the decency to subject himself to his electorate for re-approval.

    What I don't get about PB Tories is the way they attack UKIP for participating in the political process to effect change, as if this is an immoral and unethical act.

    What did you want Ukippers to do? Pick up a gun?
    It is cultism. Look at TSE's barmy insistence that Reckless is a traitor. He just isn't; we don't vote for parties, we vote for individuals, and their duty of allegiance is to the electorate - to whom, as you point out, he has gone for validation of his move. It only looks like treachery if you fundamentally believe that we must all believe in Dave, because He came down to earth from heaven to reign in coalition over us, praise be. The political process is good only to the extent that it proclaims and magnifies His glory. Otherwise, work of the Devil.

  • NormNorm Posts: 1,251

    Is there a market for Carswell's tail-between-legs return too?

    I've asked Shadsy to put a market on Douglas Carswell no longer being in UKIP by the end of 2016.

    No joy yet.
    It must be a fairly high probability, even if you just go on the basis of the half-life of UKIP MEPs. Add to that Carswell's very individualistic take on almost everything, and Farage's apparent tendency to fall out with everyone he works with - maybe evens or so?
    Added to which apparently the majority of Ukip voters are economically left of centre while being socially conservative. The only thing they have in common with the Gladstonian and libertarian Carswell is in being anti-Europe. Someone like Frank Field or Kate Hooey are more representative of the average Ukip voter.
  • john_zimsjohn_zims Posts: 3,399
    @BenM

    'Actually although Kellner tries to push the "UKIP taking Labour votes" meme the numbers don't really stack up. The data points to a Tory catastrophe the higher UKIP rise.'

    I think Kellner might know slightly more about polling than you.
  • TGOHFTGOHF Posts: 21,633
    malcolmg said:

    TGOHF said:

    malcolmg said:

    Toms said:

    What was that thunderous phrase that the bully boy kept repeating in the TV indy debates? It was something like "the sovereign will of the Scottish people". The other night on any questions some politician---was it herself indeed?---kept repeating it in a different guise. Well, this unwholesome stirring will continue, but the sovereign will of the Scots has voted NO, thanks be.

    Not for long though, round 2 coming up soon
    Have one every week - laws of chance and voter boredom suggest you might win one eventually.
    will not be in a week and will not be many , but another one will be along in near term for sure, unionists are bound to welch on their "VOW" on home rule.
    The vow was reposted down thread - nothing about home rule - you can choose what colour of pinnys nurses wear or something.

    There won't be another official one anytime soon - the media are bored rotten of it for one thing - never mind the voters.
  • Ishmael_X said:

    Ninoinoz said:


    ''previously represented in this very constituency by this very same PPE man, should criticise him for it.''
    They are criticising him for being a hypocrite. For dropping all the policies he previously supported like a stone out of self interest. For being now supposedly anti politics when he has been part of the system so long.

    Well, at least he has the decency to subject himself to his electorate for re-approval.

    What I don't get about PB Tories is the way they attack UKIP for participating in the political process to effect change, as if this is an immoral and unethical act.

    What did you want Ukippers to do? Pick up a gun?
    It is cultism. Look at TSE's barmy insistence that Reckless is a traitor. He just isn't; we don't vote for parties, we vote for individuals, and their duty of allegiance is to the electorate - to whom, as you point out, he has gone for validation of his move. It only looks like treachery if you fundamentally believe that we must all believe in Dave, because He came down to earth from heaven to reign in coalition over us, praise be. The political process is good only to the extent that it proclaims and magnifies His glory. Otherwise, work of the Devil.

    My issue, as it always has been with Reckless, was the timing of the defection.

    It was timed to inflict maximum damage on the Tory party.

    Considering the whining and moaning like whores UKIP were doing when Dave recalled parliament during their conference, I'm sure the hypocrisy of Reckless and UKIP isn't lost on most.
  • Plato said:

    Reminded me of Wait Til Your Father Gets Home. I loved that cartoon series. Especially the daughter who burned her bra.

    https://youtube.com/watch?v=mbsEYoKm9X8

    TGOHF said:

    Isam - fancy the job with the Kippers that might soon be available ? The donors must be fewmin..


    http://www.breitbart.com/Breitbart-London/2014/11/17/Moves-To-Remove-OFlynn-After-Anti-Business-Newsnight-Interview

    "Senior members of UKIP are campaigning behind the scenes to have Patrick O'Flynn MEP removed as economic spokesman after his appearance on the BBC's Newsnight programme last Monday night."

    "His opponents are now circulating a letter calling for him to go, which they hope to publish this week. One source who is not involved with the letter told Breitbart London: “He really does need to shut up with all talk of aggressive tax avoidance and bashing big business... It's a real mistake to have a pinko in such an important position."

    If someone was ever again going to call someone a "pinko", it was surely going to have to be in UKIP. Just wouldn't have expected it to be one of their own they were talking about.

    Ferrets in a sack....
    Gawd, that's a blast from the past.

    Did I dream it or was there a similar cartoon called the Barkleys which was basically the same thing except everyone in it was a dog? Dogs in suits going to the office and stuff? Deeply 70s weird.
  • FlightpathFlightpath Posts: 4,012
    Floater said:
    UKIP are a circus act - an act straddling two horses bareback. Someone has to do the splits in the end. Maybe its 'O'Flynn. Although being blagged against by an obvious thicko like Sean Howlett should not worry him.
    There is only so much that bigotry can do for you. Its hard to see how real tories would like to see UKIP following the policies that please labour bigots. Farage is lying to somebody.

    Meantime Hamilton is losing his flavour of the month status
    http://www.bostonstandard.co.uk/news/local/ukip-due-to-announce-boston-and-skegness-candidate-1-6421269
  • FloaterFloater Posts: 14,207
    isam said:

    Father of british muslim who has been beheading Syrian soldiers says his son should be executed

    Won't Dave just stop him coming back here for two years?

    Only if he will not promise to be good.
  • FlightpathFlightpath Posts: 4,012
    BenM said:

    Peter Kellner in the Guardian on the changing nature of UKIP support:

    http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2014/nov/17/ukip-support-british-politics-voters-labour-party

    Actually although Kellner tries to push the "UKIP taking Labour votes" meme the numbers don't really stack up. The data points to a Tory catastrophe the higher UKIP rise.

    You keep saying that - my only wish is you would say it louder.
  • ItajaiItajai Posts: 721

    Socrates said:

    isam said:

    FalseFlag said:

    rcs1000 said:

    @isam,

    Well... Peter Hitchens may be right in his conclusion, but Morris Dancer is right to point out that his facts were simply wrong.

    Really?

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/article-2030849/Libya-Were-cheering-rebels-AK-47s-worse-Gaddafi.html

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/article-1367993/Libyas-War-Why-just-let-fight-make-friends-winners.html

    He has been right on the money regarding US interference in the Ukraine too.
    In the second link he discusses the Midsomer Murders controversy, where the producer defended the lack of non white characters

    If people got uptight about Midsomer Murders, why aren't they up in arms about EastEnders? Midsomer is far more accurate in its portrayal of the demographic... There aren't that many non white people in the kind of areas it is set, and so the show is quite realistic.

    Eastenders cast however, should be mainly Muslim, over 50% non white ,with a large percentage of Eastern Europeans. many of the cahracters should be unable to or prefer not to speak English... The portrayal is more of West Essex than the East End of London

    this is surely racist? I think the reason the bbc cast the show thus is because if it were accurate, non Londoners simply wouldn't believe it
    Given that the East End is pretty well correlated with Tower Hamlets, this should be the big demographic groups of the Eastenders cast:

    Bangladeshi: 32%
    White British: 31%
    White Other: 12%
    Black African: 4%
    Chinese: 3%
    I've always thought - well, for about the last 10 years I've thought - that if you wanted to make a really edgy TV programme about life in Britain today, you would make one called EastEnders that depicts EastEnders as they actually now are.

    You would do it without subtitles, so the dialogue would be in various eastern European and subcontinental languages and 80% unintelligible; and you would film it on actual location, sari shops, polski skleps, fried chicken takeaways and all, rather than in the Dick Van Dyke studio mockup they use. The idea that people in the East End live in squares around a pub and all know each other is frankly out of the 1940s but I suppose the BBC does it to make us all feel that nothing has changed.
    Some of them could even raise black flags outside their tower blocks and intimidate women not wearing a rubbish bag and men drinking beer (not sure how that would fit in to the Old Vic though). An edgy story line would have one of the stars of the show blowing himself up. Only question being if it'd be in Walworth or Syria.
  • BenMBenM Posts: 1,795
    The Institute for Fiscal Studies has published a short note today saying that the amount the government is saving from changes to benefits and tax credits is much lower than expected. Amongst other reasons, this is partly because of higher spending on pensioners, and partly because anticipated savings from cuts to tax credits, housing benefit and disability living allowance have not materialised.
    http://www.theguardian.com/politics/blog/live/2014/nov/17/rochester-byelection-hustings-politics-live-blog#block-5469efebe4b066908eb73533

    And the final score is:
    Keynes 10 (ten)
    Hayek, Friedman et al Nil
  • Richard_NabaviRichard_Nabavi Posts: 30,821
    edited November 2014
    Sean Howlett's letter isn't quite as billed by Breitbart, but is quite interesting in the way it discusses the inconsistencies in UKIP's economic position:

    twitter.com/GuidoFawkes/status/534349169771937792/photo/1
  • Floater said:

    isam said:

    Father of british muslim who has been beheading Syrian soldiers says his son should be executed

    Won't Dave just stop him coming back here for two years?

    Only if he will not promise to be good.
    When it comes to the criminal justice system the UKIP balloon, always loosely attached to reality, becomes completely untethered and floats high on thermals of outrage without any need for supporting facts.
  • chestnutchestnut Posts: 7,341
    BenM said:

    And the final score is:

    "According to the latest International Monetary Fund fiscal monitor, the cyclically-adjusted deficit has come down from 10.3% of gross domestic product in 2009 to 4.1% this year, a big reduction."

  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 43,337
    TGOHF said:

    malcolmg said:

    TGOHF said:

    malcolmg said:

    Toms said:

    What was that thunderous phrase that the bully boy kept repeating in the TV indy debates? It was something like "the sovereign will of the Scottish people". The other night on any questions some politician---was it herself indeed?---kept repeating it in a different guise. Well, this unwholesome stirring will continue, but the sovereign will of the Scots has voted NO, thanks be.

    Not for long though, round 2 coming up soon
    Have one every week - laws of chance and voter boredom suggest you might win one eventually.
    will not be in a week and will not be many , but another one will be along in near term for sure, unionists are bound to welch on their "VOW" on home rule.
    The vow was reposted down thread - nothing about home rule - you can choose what colour of pinnys nurses wear or something.

    There won't be another official one anytime soon - the media are bored rotten of it for one thing - never mind the voters.
    But there are enough voters who will remember the likes of Messrs Brown and Darling promising and defining Devomax as everything short of actual independence at the time. The status quo, or as near as dammit to it which is what you plainly have in mind, was the least popular option when indyref began as you will recall. And it was not for what many people voted after Mr Cameron's et al intervention right in the middle of postal voting. You're really being hopeful if you can wish away that Vow and the other promises made at the time.

    In any case, it depends what the voters want a few years down the line. And things ca change very fast. You need to look at the figures for staying in/out of Europe - in te same poll and not mentioned in the posting - and what that implies when a Brexit is called by London.

    As for the media - I'm beginning to wonder if any of the Unionist newspapers will still be there.
  • Mr. M, if Labour were actually Keynesian (as they claimed during the bust when Keynes would've advocated massive spending, in line with Labour policy) they'd be attacking the Coalition for insufficient cuts during the boom, the exact opposite of their 'too far, too fast' line regarding the cuts to public expenditure.
  • Sean Howlett's letter isn't quite as billed by Breitbart, but is quite interesting in the way it discusses the inconsistencies in UKIP's economic position:

    twitter.com/GuidoFawkes/status/534349169771937792/photo/1

    Whether the average UKIP voter gives a toss has yet to be determined. Probably most of them realise they'll not win a majority so it doesn't really matter whether UKIP has an economic policy or not, let alone what it is.

    I expect the Green voters of Brighton are similarly relaxed.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 119,960
    edited November 2014
    Betting related post, ahem.

    For those betting on Band Aid 30 being Christmas number 1, take note.

    The girls of Television X have launched a bid to become Christmas number one.

    The adult channel has teamed up with Pornhub Records to create 'Coming for Christmas' by TVXbabes.

    http://www.digitalspy.co.uk/music/news/a610630/adult-channel-television-x-launches-bid-for-christmas-number-one-single.html
  • Socrates said:

    If we look at what's covered by the Eastenders map just before the title comes up, isam is more right than I am: the centre-point is more inside Newham than Tower Hamlets, but pretty close to the border.

    The major groups in the demographics of Newham are:

    17% White British
    11% Other White (mainly Eastern European)
    14% Indian
    12% Bangladeshi
    10% Pakistani
    12% Black African
    5% Black Caribbean

    It does seem like Eastenders is massively pro-white in its casting, completely out of touch with the groups that live there.

    Regardless of the map, I vaguely recall that when it started, the producers said it was based on Hoxton, which is hardly East End in the first place. Hmm. I wonder what I could get for my Queen Vic beermats on ebay.
  • PlatoPlato Posts: 15,724
    Oooh, didn't see that - will look it on YouTube. That site is my personal favourite after Wikipedia - I just love it.

    Plato said:

    Reminded me of Wait Til Your Father Gets Home. I loved that cartoon series. Especially the daughter who burned her bra.

    https://youtube.com/watch?v=mbsEYoKm9X8

    TGOHF said:

    Isam - fancy the job with the Kippers that might soon be available ? The donors must be fewmin..


    http://www.breitbart.com/Breitbart-London/2014/11/17/Moves-To-Remove-OFlynn-After-Anti-Business-Newsnight-Interview

    "Senior members of UKIP are campaigning behind the scenes to have Patrick O'Flynn MEP removed as economic spokesman after his appearance on the BBC's Newsnight programme last Monday night."

    "His opponents are now circulating a letter calling for him to go, which they hope to publish this week. One source who is not involved with the letter told Breitbart London: “He really does need to shut up with all talk of aggressive tax avoidance and bashing big business... It's a real mistake to have a pinko in such an important position."

    If someone was ever again going to call someone a "pinko", it was surely going to have to be in UKIP. Just wouldn't have expected it to be one of their own they were talking about.

    Ferrets in a sack....
    Gawd, that's a blast from the past.

    Did I dream it or was there a similar cartoon called the Barkleys which was basically the same thing except everyone in it was a dog? Dogs in suits going to the office and stuff? Deeply 70s weird.
  • TGOHFTGOHF Posts: 21,633

    Sean Howlett's letter isn't quite as billed by Breitbart, but is quite interesting in the way it discusses the inconsistencies in UKIP's economic position:

    twitter.com/GuidoFawkes/status/534349169771937792/photo/1

    "My big business buddies aint going to fund this pressure group if it aint going to push for big tax breaks for us"

    The mask slips..
  • PlatoPlato Posts: 15,724
    edited November 2014
    Top Belly Laugh Of The Day.

    EPIC, just epic. And I've been watching ridiculous vampire soaps as a benchmark.
    Itajai said:

    Socrates said:

    isam said:

    FalseFlag said:

    rcs1000 said:

    @isam,

    Well... Peter Hitchens may be right in his conclusion, but Morris Dancer is right to point out that his facts were simply wrong.

    Really?

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/article-2030849/Libya-Were-cheering-rebels-AK-47s-worse-Gaddafi.html

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/article-1367993/Libyas-War-Why-just-let-fight-make-friends-winners.html

    He has been right on the money regarding US interference in the Ukraine too.
    In the second link he discusses the Midsomer Murders controversy, where the producer defended the lack of non white characters

    If people got uptight about Midsomer Murders, why aren't they up in arms about EastEnders? Midsomer is far more accurate in its portrayal of the demographic... There aren't that many non white people in the kind of areas it is set, and so the show is quite realistic.

    Eastenders cast however, should be mainly Muslim, over 50% non white ,with a large percentage of Eastern Europeans. many of the cahracters should be unable to or prefer not to speak English... The portrayal is more of West Essex than the East End of London

    this is surely racist? I think the reason the bbc cast the show thus is because if it were accurate, non Londoners simply wouldn't believe it
    Given that the East End is pretty well correlated with Tower Hamlets, this should be the big demographic groups of the Eastenders cast:

    Bangladeshi: 32%
    White British: 31%
    White Other: 12%
    Black African: 4%
    Chinese: 3%
    I've always thought - well, for about the last 10 years I've thought - that if you wanted to make a really edgy TV programme about life in Britain today, you would make one called EastEnders that depicts EastEnders as they actually now are.

    You would do it without subtitles, so the dialogue would be in various eastern European and subcontinental languages and 80% unintelligible; and you would film it on actual location, sari shops, polski skleps, fried chicken takeaways and all, rather than in the Dick Van Dyke studio mockup they use. The idea that people in the East End live in squares around a pub and all know each other is frankly out of the 1940s but I suppose the BBC does it to make us all feel that nothing has changed.
    Some of them could even raise black flags outside their tower blocks and intimidate women not wearing a rubbish bag and men drinking beer (not sure how that would fit in to the Old Vic though). An edgy story line would have one of the stars of the show blowing himself up. Only question being if it'd be in Walworth or Syria.
  • Socrates said:

    If we look at what's covered by the Eastenders map just before the title comes up, isam is more right than I am: the centre-point is more inside Newham than Tower Hamlets, but pretty close to the border.

    The major groups in the demographics of Newham are:

    17% White British
    11% Other White (mainly Eastern European)
    14% Indian
    12% Bangladeshi
    10% Pakistani
    12% Black African
    5% Black Caribbean

    It does seem like Eastenders is massively pro-white in its casting, completely out of touch with the groups that live there.

    Regardless of the map, I vaguely recall that when it started, the producers said it was based on Hoxton, which is hardly East End in the first place. Hmm. I wonder what I could get for my Queen Vic beermats on ebay.
    They used to include the southern edge of Ilford on the zoom-out right at the end of the end-credits, but now they no longer do so :(
  • PlatoPlato Posts: 15,724
    I'm stunned this is even a subject for Kippers - Mr O'Flynn championed their cause in the national press - pissing on him would be immensely rude.
  • Ishmael_X said:

    Ninoinoz said:


    ''previously represented in this very constituency by this very same PPE man, should criticise him for it.''
    They are criticising him for being a hypocrite. For dropping all the policies he previously supported like a stone out of self interest. For being now supposedly anti politics when he has been part of the system so long.

    Well, at least he has the decency to subject himself to his electorate for re-approval.

    What I don't get about PB Tories is the way they attack UKIP for participating in the political process to effect change, as if this is an immoral and unethical act.

    What did you want Ukippers to do? Pick up a gun?
    It is cultism. Look at TSE's barmy insistence that Reckless is a traitor. He just isn't; we don't vote for parties, we vote for individuals, and their duty of allegiance is to the electorate - to whom, as you point out, he has gone for validation of his move. It only looks like treachery if you fundamentally believe that we must all believe in Dave, because He came down to earth from heaven to reign in coalition over us, praise be. The political process is good only to the extent that it proclaims and magnifies His glory. Otherwise, work of the Devil.

    My issue, as it always has been with Reckless, was the timing of the defection.

    It was timed to inflict maximum damage on the Tory party.

    Considering the whining and moaning like whores UKIP were doing when Dave recalled parliament during their conference, I'm sure the hypocrisy of Reckless and UKIP isn't lost on most.
    Reckless responds:
    "I can see you, TSE! Can you see me? Oh, now be honest, TSE, warrior to warrior. You do prefer it this way, don't you, as it was meant to be? No peace in our time. 'Once more unto the breach, dear friends.'"

    :)
  • TGOHFTGOHF Posts: 21,633
    Delingpole wants O'Flynn out now..

    http://www.breitbart.com/Breitbart-London/2014/11/17/UKIP-could-save-Britain-but-first-it-needs-a-coherent-economic-policy

    "why is Patrick O'Flynn, the economics spokesman for Britain's most libertarian mainstream party UKIP, flirting with the kind of wealth taxes and turnover taxes you'd more usually associate with the Greens or the Socialist Workers' Party?"
This discussion has been closed.