I do wonder how long the privatised Royal Mail could or should be allowed to continue calling itself that?
It's only part privatised isn't it?
It's 70% privatised. But come to that, why is the Royal Bank of Scotland (of which I'm a customer) still allowed to use the name, when it's clearly not Royal and arguably hasn't even behaved in the public interest? Once you get the "Royal" tag I think you keep it failing some quite extraordinary circumstances.
A fair point but would present the trademark/IP lawyers with something of a problem. If RBS was forced to drop the Royal title then it would simply become Bank of Scotland but there is already another bank called Bank of Scotland. I am not sure what could be done about it as RBS would not have opted to drop the Royal prefix by choice but had it taken away from them by official diktat.
The Royal Bank of Scotland was founded under Royal Charter, hence its right to use the term "royal" in its name.
The reason for granting the charter was to provide a Hannoverian/Whig alternative to the Bank of Scotland which was widely suspected of raising funds for the Jacobite cause.
From its history we may determine that although Nick Palmer may bank with the RBoS Group, Jack W is most unlikely to have been lured into entrusting them with his funds.
Avery, Is that why I subconsciously went for Bank of Scotland all those years ago , my jacobite tendencies.
This is obviously a "thing" of yours. Whilst I agree that the Council Tax needs more bands (at least in London) I remain to be convinced that it's otherwise so bad as to warrant the upheaval you propose.
As to London property prices (and I write as a tenant) I doubt there is any administrative solution - don't markets correct themselves? I'm always being told they do... by people who have never heard of Ricardo and who think there are only two factors of production...
The London housing market is working fine from a market perspective. It's just that the demand from international investors has driven prices to a level where most UK nationals (including myself) are not able to afford a house in the area they want.
There may be a case to intervene because of the social consequences (and possibly the economic side effects) but there's not really a case to intervene because of market failure (except in the government constraints on the availability of supply)
If the UK were to exit EU, would it affect the London market ? Adversely or beneficially ?
Clearly, some investments would not come in as some investors invest in the UK to sell in the EU. Nissan , Honda have made that plain. I know anti-EU will say that is not the case. Go and tell Nissan that.
Since, most of the capital does flow into London, it would have a small effect on London house prices. Those theives and robbers who are sheltering their money in London bricks and mortars will continue regardless. If anything a non-EU UK government would be so right wing, they would positively invite such money.
Remember, even during the Ukranian sanctions on Russia, the UK government made clear the City would not be involved in such sanctions.
A fair point but would present the trademark/IP lawyers with something of a problem. If RBS was forced to drop the Royal title then it would simply become Bank of Scotland but there is already another bank called Bank of Scotland. I am not sure what could be done about it as RBS would not have opted to drop the Royal prefix by choice but had it taken away from them by official diktat.
Yes, in one of their numerous mergers they said openly that among the choices of name they chose the one that would enable them to keep the Royal tag. I absolutely don't see why Royalty puts up with it, and what else they would choose to call themselves is very much their problem.
On another subject, the Observer reports of UKIP's plans: "Among the seats it is likely to target are a batch in Essex, plus Rotherham, Great Grimsby, Great Yarmouth, Portsmouth South, Eastleigh, Broxtowe, North Thanet and South Thanet."
That might be worth a thread after tonight. I suspect they'll win all of them in the Euros; in 2015, we shall see. I assume that Broxtowe is in there because it has unusually strongly pro-European Tory and Labour candidates, and a vigorous UKIP effort would certainly make it an interesting three-cornered election.
How the hell do UKIP win Broxtowe - isn't it basically university of Nottingham type people. I've backed Great Grimsby, and a couple of others but just can't see Broxtowe going kipper - I think you/Anna is a 99.9% market there.
I have no desire - feigned or otherwise - to equate a vote for Labour, the LDs or the Tories with a vote for the establishment. But UKIP and its supporters frame the choice on those terms - UKIP is the party of the silent majority, the establishment parties are sneering, metropolitan and on the left. And we have seen you have claimed that those who claim UKIP is racist are left-wing.
So let's put it another way: if UKIP does represent the silent majority and the traditional big three are the voice of a leftist, sneering, metropolitan, out of touch elite, why in the privacy of the ballot booth, where no-one knows how you vote, have so many voters failed to heed what UKIP says?
Forgive me, but all I see here is 'Whinge whinge, hate BBC, whinge whinge', which is a shame, because just a little moderation in making the same points could be worthwhile.
Apologies. All I see here is 'whinge, whing, hate UKIP, whinge whing'.
Yorkcity , thanks for that , So very sensible , we have to vote YES to have any chance of his wish for elected head of state and independent bank
No
Watch the interview.
The statement above so spectacularly misses his point it's shameful.
So as I previously stated you took it to be him voicing a unionist position, whereas an unbiased Yorkcity did NOT. Your bias is shameful and colours every post you make.
Is Racist - net (change vs week ago) UKIP: +7 (+6) Farage: -5 (+18)
Comfortable with Romanian (German) family next door (net): Con: +1 (+63) Lab: +25 (+61) LD: +50 (+75) UKIP: -55 (+16)
All the signs are that most people in this country are part of the metropolitan, left-liberal, sneering, anti-WWC establishment.
The question Farage was asked was "Would you be comfortable with a g roup of Romanian men moving in next door" not " a Romanian family".
Big difference
And the question the UKIP voters in that poll were asked is would you be comfortable with a Romanian family next door.
Cant you ever stop trying to twist and turn everything like the worst kind of politican, and sometimes admit you jumped the gun?
You made a sarcastic joke.. it has been pointed out by someone else that it doesnt really fit with reality (the majority of the UK arent part of the metropolitan establishment) and the question was not the same one that Farage was asked, so the premise of the question is dodgy
The results also show that suppporters of every party prefer to live next door to a German family than a Romanian one by quite a margin. So there is something in what Farage said in the first place
I think we may have been talking at cross-purposes. I assumed you meant the grooming cases. The absolute priority with these cases is to (a) make sure we investigate them fully and (b) put people in prison for every case of rape and abuse, with no concurrent sentencing. If you raped a poor kid ten times, then you should get ten sentences, served one after another. If that means these scumbags die in prison, then good. Oh, and the prison sentences should be in the harshest available prisons, not this open prison or holiday camp nonsense.
You have more confidence that the gangs were all locked up than I do. There could be many more out there. Not to mention the many punters that raped these girls, who seem to have been left untouched.
As for Eastern European human trafficking, I don't know enough about it, but wouldn't be surprised if it has been brushed under the carpet similarly. You can understand why the media do it - if the results of Rochdale and Rotherham, where local media covered the issues, were repeated on a broader geographic basis, UKIP would be doing even better.
A fair point but would present the trademark/IP lawyers with something of a problem. If RBS was forced to drop the Royal title then it would simply become Bank of Scotland but there is already another bank called Bank of Scotland. I am not sure what could be done about it as RBS would not have opted to drop the Royal prefix by choice but had it taken away from them by official diktat.
They could use any other name. I imagine they would rename themselves RBS, with the name having no meaning, ala TSB.
More likely to revert to Natwest and just use their real name.
... it was difficult to find a silver lining to the cloud hanging over the Liberal Democrats. Once the local elections were the party’s forte; now they have become an annual embarrassment.
The party argued – not for the first time – that it was often performing better in places where it already has a sitting MP and thus has a strong base of local support. Indeed, there was the occasional bright spot – the party actually did better than in the 2010 general election in Bradford East and Birmingham Yardley. But there were plenty of disappointments too, not least the fact that the party came second to the Conservatives in Vince Cable’s Twickenham constituency and lost control of Ed Davey’s Kingston backyard.
Consequently, on average Liberal Democrat support was down just as much – that is, by no less than 13 points – in Liberal Democrat MPs’ constituencies as elsewhere. In short, there was little consistent sign of the ability of Liberal Democrats’ personal popularity to stem the receding tide. And next year their own seats will be on the line.
That analysis runs counter to the fairy stories we are regularly peddled here at PB about the LD incumbency effect.
I think you'll find punters weren't voting on their LibDem MP's incumbency in the local/euro elections. That comes near year.
Apart from that gaping whole in your thinking that was a searing analysis.
But it was not my analysis Jack, it was John Curtice's analysis today:
- "on average Liberal Democrat support was down just as much – that is, by no less than 13 points – in Liberal Democrat MPs’ constituencies as elsewhere. In short, there was little consistent sign of the ability of Liberal Democrats’ personal popularity to stem the receding tide"
Curtice is usually a respected voice here at PB. Strange that you become so dismissive of him when he says something you do not agree with.
How very unionist, especially of the establishment troughing self seeking elite unionist viewpoint
Is Racist - net (change vs week ago) UKIP: +7 (+6) Farage: -5 (+18)
Comfortable with Romanian (German) family next door (net): Con: +1 (+63) Lab: +25 (+61) LD: +50 (+75) UKIP: -55 (+16)
All the signs are that most people in this country are part of the metropolitan, left-liberal, sneering, anti-WWC establishment.
The question Farage was asked was "Would you be comfortable with a g roup of Romanian men moving in next door" not " a Romanian family".
Big difference
And the question the UKIP voters in that poll were asked is would you be comfortable with a Romanian family next door.
Cant you ever stop trying to twist and turn everything like the worst kind of politican, and sometimes admit you jumped the gun?
You made a sarcastic joke.. it has been pointed out by someone else that it doesnt really fit with reality (the majority of the UK arent part of the metropolitan establishment) and the question was not the same one that Farage was asked, so the premise of the question is dodgy
The results also show that suppporters of every party prefer to live next door to a German family than a Romanian one by quite a margin. So there is something in what Farage said in the first place
Is Racist - net (change vs week ago) UKIP: +7 (+6) Farage: -5 (+18)
Comfortable with Romanian (German) family next door (net): Con: +1 (+63) Lab: +25 (+61) LD: +50 (+75) UKIP: -55 (+16)
All the signs are that most people in this country are part of the metropolitan, left-liberal, sneering, anti-WWC establishment.
The question Farage was asked was "Would you be comfortable with a g roup of Romanian men moving in next door" not " a Romanian family".
Big difference
And the question the UKIP voters in that poll were asked is would you be comfortable with a Romanian family next door.
Cant you ever stop trying to twist and turn everything like the worst kind of politican, and sometimes admit you jumped the gun?
You made a sarcastic joke.. it has been pointed out by someone else that it doesnt really fit with reality (the majority of the UK arent part of the metropolitan establishment) and the question was not the same one that Farage was asked, so the premise of the question is dodgy
The results also show that suppporters of every party prefer to live next door to a German family than a Romanian one by quite a margin. So there is something in what Farage said in the first place
The result shows that a majority of Tory, Labour and LD supporters polled would not mind living next door to a Romanian family, while most UKIP supporters would. If you want to dismiss that, fair enough. But there is absolutely no twisting from me. That's what the poll found.
This is obviously a "thing" of yours. Whilst I agree that the Council Tax needs more bands (at least in London) I remain to be convinced that it's otherwise so bad as to warrant the upheaval you propose.
As to London property prices (and I write as a tenant) I doubt there is any administrative solution - don't markets correct themselves? I'm always being told they do... by people who have never heard of Ricardo and who think there are only two factors of production...
The London housing market is working fine from a market perspective. It's just that the demand from international investors has driven prices to a level where most UK nationals (including myself) are not able to afford a house in the area they want.
There may be a case to intervene because of the social consequences (and possibly the economic side effects) but there's not really a case to intervene because of market failure (except in the government constraints on the availability of supply)
If the UK were to exit EU, would it affect the London market ? Adversely or beneficially ?
Clearly, some investments would not come in as some investors invest in the UK to sell in the EU. Nissan , Honda have made that plain. I know anti-EU will say that is not the case. Go and tell Nissan that.
Since, most of the capital does flow into London, it would have a small effect on London house prices. Those theives and robbers who are sheltering their money in London bricks and mortars will continue regardless. If anything a non-EU UK government would be so right wing, they would positively invite such money.
Remember, even during the Ukranian sanctions on Russia, the UK government made clear the City would not be involved in such sanctions.
Nissan and Honda made it plain they would cut back on investment or leave the UK entirely if we did not join the Euro. So much for their threats.
Is Racist - net (change vs week ago) UKIP: +7 (+6) Farage: -5 (+18)
Comfortable with Romanian (German) family next door (net): Con: +1 (+63) Lab: +25 (+61) LD: +50 (+75) UKIP: -55 (+16)
All the signs are that most people in this country are part of the metropolitan, left-liberal, sneering, anti-WWC establishment.
The question Farage was asked was "Would you be comfortable with a g roup of Romanian men moving in next door" not " a Romanian family".
Big difference
And the question the UKIP voters in that poll were asked is would you be comfortable with a Romanian family next door.
Cant you ever stop trying to twist and turn everything like the worst kind of politican, and sometimes admit you jumped the gun?
You made a sarcastic joke.. it has been pointed out by someone else that it doesnt really fit with reality (the majority of the UK arent part of the metropolitan establishment) and the question was not the same one that Farage was asked, so the premise of the question is dodgy
The results also show that suppporters of every party prefer to live next door to a German family than a Romanian one by quite a margin. So there is something in what Farage said in the first place
The result shows that a majority of Tory, Labour and LD supporters polled would not mind living next door to a Romanian family, while most UKIP supporters would. If you want to dismiss that, fair enough. But there is absolutely no twisting from me. That's what the poll found.
Neither of us are stupid, we shouldnt be suprised that UKIP supporters are least likely to want to live next door to immigrants, and LDs are most receptive to the idea... that is hardly a telling point...
The telling point is that all people surveyed would rather live next door to Germans than Romanians, by a clear margin.
Which debunks almost all the whole idea of portraying Farage as racist for making a distinction between the two, unless you consider the whole country to be racist
A fair point but would present the trademark/IP lawyers with something of a problem. If RBS was forced to drop the Royal title then it would simply become Bank of Scotland but there is already another bank called Bank of Scotland. I am not sure what could be done about it as RBS would not have opted to drop the Royal prefix by choice but had it taken away from them by official diktat.
Yes, in one of their numerous mergers they said openly that among the choices of name they chose the one that would enable them to keep the Royal tag. I absolutely don't see why Royalty puts up with it, and what else they would choose to call themselves is very much their problem.
On another subject, the Observer reports of UKIP's plans: "Among the seats it is likely to target are a batch in Essex, plus Rotherham, Great Grimsby, Great Yarmouth, Portsmouth South, Eastleigh, Broxtowe, North Thanet and South Thanet."
That might be worth a thread after tonight. I suspect they'll win all of them in the Euros; in 2015, we shall see. I assume that Broxtowe is in there because it has unusually strongly pro-European Tory and Labour candidates, and a vigorous UKIP effort would certainly make it an interesting three-cornered election.
I have to admit I was baffled by the presence of Broxtowe on that list- bearing in mind what you have told us about the constituency. I wonder whether it is just sour grapes (warranted sour grapes imho but sour grapes nonetheless) about Soubry's comment on Farage. It could be that they have no serious expectation of winning Broxtowe but just want Soubry out at all costs. Good news for you but a foolish waste of effort and resources for UKIP.
This is obviously a "thing" of yours. Whilst I agree that the Council Tax needs more bands (at least in London) I remain to be convinced that it's otherwise so bad as to warrant the upheaval you propose.
As to London property prices (and I write as a tenant) I doubt there is any administrative solution - don't markets correct themselves? I'm always being told they do... by people who have never heard of Ricardo and who think there are only two factors of production...
The London housing market is working fine from a market perspective. It's just that the demand from international investors has driven prices to a level where most UK nationals (including myself) are not able to afford a house in the area they want.
There may be a case to intervene because of the social consequences (and possibly the economic side effects) but there's not really a case to intervene because of market failure (except in the government constraints on the availability of supply)
If the UK were to exit EU, would it affect the London market ? Adversely or beneficially ?
Clearly, some investments would not come in as some investors invest in the UK to sell in the EU. Nissan , Honda have made that plain. I know anti-EU will say that is not the case. Go and tell Nissan that.
Since, most of the capital does flow into London, it would have a small effect on London house prices. Those theives and robbers who are sheltering their money in London bricks and mortars will continue regardless. If anything a non-EU UK government would be so right wing, they would positively invite such money.
Remember, even during the Ukranian sanctions on Russia, the UK government made clear the City would not be involved in such sanctions.
Nissan and Honda made it plain they would cut back on investment or leave the UK entirely if we did not join the Euro. So much for their threats.
There is a difference. Not being in the Euro, does not mean we have to be out of the single market. Out of EU means out of the single market.
This is obviously a "thing" of yours. Whilst I agree that the Council Tax needs more bands (at least in London) I remain to be convinced that it's otherwise so bad as to warrant the upheaval you propose.
As to London property prices (and I write as a tenant) I doubt there is any administrative solution - don't markets correct themselves? I'm always being told they do... by people who have never heard of Ricardo and who think there are only two factors of production...
The London housing market is working fine from a market perspective. It's just that the demand from international investors has driven prices to a level where most UK nationals (including myself) are not able to afford a house in the area they want.
There may be a case to intervene because of the social consequences (and possibly the economic side effects) but there's not really a case to intervene because of market failure (except in the government constraints on the availability of supply)
If the UK were to exit EU, would it affect the London market ? Adversely or beneficially ?
Near term - some uncertainty, which would probably slow down inward investment temporarily.
Medium term - not much impact
Long term - negative if financial services migrates outside of London (which I don't think would happen), otherwise not much impact
The real challenge long-term is that many of the houses that are being bought as stores of value will never re-enter the housing market (historically, for instance, houses on the Phillimore estate used to trade on a 15 year cycle). Supply is permanently constrained, but also the houses are not occupied so local retail suffers - Ken High Street is packed full of charity shops, pop up stores and empty stores to let: there's one near us that has been empty (admittedly not prime) for about 6 years
Is Racist - net (change vs week ago) UKIP: +7 (+6) Farage: -5 (+18)
Comfortable with Romanian (German) family next door (net): Con: +1 (+63) Lab: +25 (+61) LD: +50 (+75) UKIP: -55 (+16)
All the signs are that most people in this country are part of the metropolitan, left-liberal, sneering, anti-WWC establishment.
The question Farage was asked was "Would you be comfortable with a g roup of Romanian men moving in next door" not " a Romanian family".
Big difference
Which is why the polling is so interesting.
A large majority of Kippers have a problem with a Romanian family.
Not a group of Romanian men.
Draw from that whatever conclusions you want.
What conclusions do you draw from the fact that every other party preferred Germans to Romanians by a massive margin also?
Con 62 Lab 36 Libs 25 UKIP 71
Presumably they feel a closer connection to Germans than Romanians, so in a forced choice they plump for the former over the latter. But it is only a majority of UKIP supporters who reject the idea of living next door to Romanians. What conclusions do you draw from that?
Is Racist - net (change vs week ago) UKIP: +7 (+6) Farage: -5 (+18)
Comfortable with Romanian (German) family next door (net): Con: +1 (+63) Lab: +25 (+61) LD: +50 (+75) UKIP: -55 (+16)
All the signs are that most people in this country are part of the metropolitan, left-liberal, sneering, anti-WWC establishment.
The question Farage was asked was "Would you be comfortable with a g roup of Romanian men moving in next door" not " a Romanian family".
Big difference
Which is why the polling is so interesting.
A large majority of Kippers have a problem with a Romanian family.
Not a group of Romanian men.
Draw from that whatever conclusions you want.
What conclusions do you draw from the fact that every other party preferred Germans to Romanians by a massive margin also?
Con 62 Lab 36 Libs 25 UKIP 71
Presumably they feel a closer connection to Germans than Romanians, so in a forced choice they plump for the former over the latter. But it is only a majority of UKIP supporters who reject the idea of living next door to Romanians. What conclusions do you draw from that?
Correction: Majority of Kippers and Tories. Peas from the same pod ?
This is obviously a "thing" of yours. Whilst I agree that the Council Tax needs more bands (at least in London) I remain to be convinced that it's otherwise so bad as to warrant the upheaval you propose.
As to London property prices (and I write as a tenant) I doubt there is any administrative solution - don't markets correct themselves? I'm always being told they do... by people who have never heard of Ricardo and who think there are only two factors of production...
The London housing market is working fine from a market perspective. It's just that the demand from international investors has driven prices to a level where most UK nationals (including myself) are not able to afford a house in the area they want.
There may be a case to intervene because of the social consequences (and possibly the economic side effects) but there's not really a case to intervene because of market failure (except in the government constraints on the availability of supply)
If the UK were to exit EU, would it affect the London market ? Adversely or beneficially ?
Clearly, some investments would not come in as some investors invest in the UK to sell in the EU. Nissan , Honda have made that plain. I know anti-EU will say that is not the case. Go and tell Nissan that.
Remember, even during the Ukranian sanctions on Russia, the UK government made clear the City would not be involved in such sanctions.
Yes- I was talking to a motor industry ananlyst the other day who made it clear that leaving the EU would devastate the motor industry but I think it is a special case.
This is obviously a "thing" of yours. Whilst I agree that the Council Tax needs more bands (at least in London) I remain to be convinced that it's otherwise so bad as to warrant the upheaval you propose.
As to London property prices (and I write as a tenant) I doubt there is any administrative solution - don't markets correct themselves? I'm always being told they do... by people who have never heard of Ricardo and who think there are only two factors of production...
The London housing market is working fine from a market perspective. It's just that the demand from international investors has driven prices to a level where most UK nationals (including myself) are not able to afford a house in the area they want.
There may be a case to intervene because of the social consequences (and possibly the economic side effects) but there's not really a case to intervene because of market failure (except in the government constraints on the availability of supply)
If the UK were to exit EU, would it affect the London market ? Adversely or beneficially ?
Clearly, some investments would not come in as some investors invest in the UK to sell in the EU. Nissan , Honda have made that plain. I know anti-EU will say that is not the case. Go and tell Nissan that.
Since, most of the capital does flow into London, it would have a small effect on London house prices. Those theives and robbers who are sheltering their money in London bricks and mortars will continue regardless. If anything a non-EU UK government would be so right wing, they would positively invite such money.
Remember, even during the Ukranian sanctions on Russia, the UK government made clear the City would not be involved in such sanctions.
Nissan and Honda made it plain they would cut back on investment or leave the UK entirely if we did not join the Euro. So much for their threats.
There is a difference. Not being in the Euro, does not mean we have to be out of the single market. Out of EU means out of the single market.
80% of Nissan's production is exported to the EU.
No there is no difference. They both said they would leave the UK if we did not join the Single Currency. They had their bluff called and actually increased investment. They used exactly the same arguments then as they are doing now and they are just as false.
Oh and in case you missed it being out of the EU does not mean being out of the single market. It depends on whether or not we stay in the EEA.
These scare stories never have been realistic and no one believes them any more.
Is Racist - net (change vs week ago) UKIP: +7 (+6) Farage: -5 (+18)
Comfortable with Romanian (German) family next door (net): Con: +1 (+63) Lab: +25 (+61) LD: +50 (+75) UKIP: -55 (+16)
All the signs are that most people in this country are part of the metropolitan, left-liberal, sneering, anti-WWC establishment.
The question Farage was asked was "Would you be comfortable with a g roup of Romanian men moving in next door" not " a Romanian family".
Big difference
And the question the UKIP voters in that poll were asked is would you be comfortable with a Romanian family next door.
Cant you ever stop trying to twist and turn everything like the worst kind of politican, and sometimes admit you jumped the gun?
You made a sarcastic joke.. it has been pointed out by someone else that it doesnt really fit with reality (the majority of the UK arent part of the metropolitan establishment) and the question was not the same one that Farage was asked, so the premise of the question is dodgy
The results also show that suppporters of every party prefer to live next door to a German family than a Romanian one by quite a margin. So there is something in what Farage said in the first place
Is Racist - net (change vs week ago) UKIP: +7 (+6) Farage: -5 (+18)
Comfortable with Romanian (German) family next door (net): Con: +1 (+63) Lab: +25 (+61) LD: +50 (+75) UKIP: -55 (+16)
All the signs are that most people in this country are part of the metropolitan, left-liberal, sneering, anti-WWC establishment.
The question Farage was asked was "Would you be comfortable with a g roup of Romanian men moving in next door" not " a Romanian family".
Big difference
And the question the UKIP voters in that poll were asked is would you be comfortable with a Romanian family next door.
Cant you ever stop trying to twist and turn everything like the worst kind of politican, and sometimes admit you jumped the gun?
You made a sarcastic joke.. it has been pointed out by someone else that it doesnt really fit with reality (the majority of the UK arent part of the metropolitan establishment) and the question was not the same one that Farage was asked, so the premise of the question is dodgy
The results also show that suppporters of every party prefer to live next door to a German family than a Romanian one by quite a margin. So there is something in what Farage said in the first place
The result shows that a majority of Tory, Labour and LD supporters polled would not mind living next door to a Romanian family, while most UKIP supporters would. If you want to dismiss that, fair enough. But there is absolutely no twisting from me. That's what the poll found.
Neither of us are stupid, we shouldnt be suprised that UKIP supporters are least likely to want to live next door to immigrants, and LDs are most receptive to the idea... that is hardly a telling point...
The telling point is that all people surveyed would rather live next door to Germans than Romanians, by a clear margin.
Which debunks almost all the whole idea of portraying Farage as racist for making a distinction between the two, unless you consider the whole country to be racist
We'll all have to decide what we see as the telling point of the survey. I agree with you that Farage and the vast majority of UKIP supporters are not racists. But from where I am sitting that poll indicates a much higher level of xenophobia among UKIP supporters and Farage is very good at exploiting that.
So as I previously stated you took it to be him voicing a unionist position, whereas an unbiased Yorkcity did NOT. Your bias is shameful and colours every post you make.
No
He did not voice a Unionist position.
Watch the interview before you look even more foolish.
Is Racist - net (change vs week ago) UKIP: +7 (+6) Farage: -5 (+18)
Comfortable with Romanian (German) family next door (net): Con: +1 (+63) Lab: +25 (+61) LD: +50 (+75) UKIP: -55 (+16)
All the signs are that most people in this country are part of the metropolitan, left-liberal, sneering, anti-WWC establishment.
The question Farage was asked was "Would you be comfortable with a g roup of Romanian men moving in next door" not " a Romanian family".
Big difference
Which is why the polling is so interesting.
A large majority of Kippers have a problem with a Romanian family.
Not a group of Romanian men.
Draw from that whatever conclusions you want.
What conclusions do you draw from the fact that every other party preferred Germans to Romanians by a massive margin also?
Con 62 Lab 36 Libs 25 UKIP 71
Presumably they feel a closer connection to Germans than Romanians, so in a forced choice they plump for the former over the latter. But it is only a majority of UKIP supporters who reject the idea of living next door to Romanians. What conclusions do you draw from that?
Because UKIP supporters are more likely to be answering from experience of suffering the consequences of mass immigration of unskilled labour and the others are answering a hypothetical question which they can answer in a way that makes them feel good about themselves
This is obviously a "thing" of yours. Whilst I agree that the Council Tax needs more bands (at least in London) I remain to be convinced that it's otherwise so bad as to warrant the upheaval you propose.
As to London property prices (and I write as a tenant) I doubt there is any administrative solution - don't markets correct themselves? I'm always being told they do... by people who have never heard of Ricardo and who think there are only two factors of production...
The London housing market is working fine from a market perspective. It's just that the demand from international investors has driven prices to a level where most UK nationals (including myself) are not able to afford a house in the area they want.
There may be a case to intervene because of the social consequences (and possibly the economic side effects) but there's not really a case to intervene because of market failure (except in the government constraints on the availability of supply)
If the UK were to exit EU, would it affect the London market ? Adversely or beneficially ?
Clearly, some investments would not come in as some investors invest in the UK to sell in the EU. Nissan , Honda have made that plain. I know anti-EU will say that is not the case. Go and tell Nissan that.
Since, most of the capital does flow into London, it would have a small effect on London house prices. Those theives and robbers who are sheltering their money in London bricks and mortars will continue regardless. If anything a non-EU UK government would be so right wing, they would positively invite such money.
Remember, even during the Ukranian sanctions on Russia, the UK government made clear the City would not be involved in such sanctions.
Nissan and Honda made it plain they would cut back on investment or leave the UK entirely if we did not join the Euro. So much for their threats.
To be fair, if I remember correctly, in both the Euro and leaving the EU, the second part of the construct was 'if the result is that it is harder to sell cars into Europe'.
It clearly isn't with the UK ex Euro. It may be (although I think unlikely in practice) if the UK was to leave the EU.
A fair point but would present the trademark/IP lawyers with something of a problem. If RBS was forced to drop the Royal title then it would simply become Bank of Scotland but there is already another bank called Bank of Scotland. I am not sure what could be done about it as RBS would not have opted to drop the Royal prefix by choice but had it taken away from them by official diktat.
Yes, in one of their numerous mergers they said openly that among the choices of name they chose the one that would enable them to keep the Royal tag. I absolutely don't see why Royalty puts up with it, and what else they would choose to call themselves is very much their problem.
On another subject, the Observer reports of UKIP's plans: "Among the seats it is likely to target are a batch in Essex, plus Rotherham, Great Grimsby, Great Yarmouth, Portsmouth South, Eastleigh, Broxtowe, North Thanet and South Thanet."
That might be worth a thread after tonight. I suspect they'll win all of them in the Euros; in 2015, we shall see. I assume that Broxtowe is in there because it has unusually strongly pro-European Tory and Labour candidates, and a vigorous UKIP effort would certainly make it an interesting three-cornered election.
I have to admit I was baffled by the presence of Broxtowe on that list- bearing in mind what you have told us about the constituency. I wonder whether it is just sour grapes (warranted sour grapes imho but sour grapes nonetheless) about Soubry's comment on Farage. It could be that they have no serious expectation of winning Broxtowe but just want Soubry out at all costs. Good news for you but a foolish waste of effort and resources for UKIP.
I think Broxtowe is there because Mr Farage said they'd target it, after Ms Soubry said something, I forget what.
Is Racist - net (change vs week ago) UKIP: +7 (+6) Farage: -5 (+18)
Comfortable with Romanian (German) family next door (net): Con: +1 (+63) Lab: +25 (+61) LD: +50 (+75) UKIP: -55 (+16)
All the signs are that most people in this country are part of the metropolitan, left-liberal, sneering, anti-WWC establishment.
The question Farage was asked was "Would you be comfortable with a g roup of Romanian men moving in next door" not " a Romanian family".
Big difference
Which is why the polling is so interesting.
A large majority of Kippers have a problem with a Romanian family.
Not a group of Romanian men.
Draw from that whatever conclusions you want.
What conclusions do you draw from the fact that every other party preferred Germans to Romanians by a massive margin also?
Con 62 Lab 36 Libs 25 UKIP 71
Presumably they feel a closer connection to Germans than Romanians, so in a forced choice they plump for the former over the latter. But it is only a majority of UKIP supporters who reject the idea of living next door to Romanians. What conclusions do you draw from that?
Because UKIP supporters are more likely to be answering from experience of suffering the consequences of mass immigration of unskilled labour and the others are answering a hypothetical question which they can answer in a way that makes them feel good about themselves
So the others are really just part of the metropolitan elite that is not affected by mass immigration? Doesn't that take us back to my original point?
Is Racist - net (change vs week ago) UKIP: +7 (+6) Farage: -5 (+18)
Comfortable with Romanian (German) family next door (net): Con: +1 (+63) Lab: +25 (+61) LD: +50 (+75) UKIP: -55 (+16)
All the signs are that most people in this country are part of the metropolitan, left-liberal, sneering, anti-WWC establishment.
The question Farage was asked was "Would you be comfortable with a g roup of Romanian men moving in next door" not " a Romanian family".
Big difference
Which is why the polling is so interesting.
A large majority of Kippers have a problem with a Romanian family.
Not a group of Romanian men.
Draw from that whatever conclusions you want.
What conclusions do you draw from the fact that every other party preferred Germans to Romanians by a massive margin also?
Con 62 Lab 36 Libs 25 UKIP 71
That people still see Eastern Europe as a 'country far away about which we know little' (to bastardise the last Liberal Unionist PM's bon mot.
So really what we are saying is that everyone would rather live next door to a German than a Romanian. and UKIP supporters are least enthusiastic about living next door to immigrants.
Is Racist - net (change vs week ago) UKIP: +7 (+6) Farage: -5 (+18)
Comfortable with Romanian (German) family next door (net): Con: +1 (+63) Lab: +25 (+61) LD: +50 (+75) UKIP: -55 (+16)
All the signs are that most people in this country are part of the metropolitan, left-liberal, sneering, anti-WWC establishment.
The question Farage was asked was "Would you be comfortable with a g roup of Romanian men moving in next door" not " a Romanian family".
Big difference
Which is why the polling is so interesting.
A large majority of Kippers have a problem with a Romanian family.
Not a group of Romanian men.
Draw from that whatever conclusions you want.
What conclusions do you draw from the fact that every other party preferred Germans to Romanians by a massive margin also?
Con 62 Lab 36 Libs 25 UKIP 71
Presumably they feel a closer connection to Germans than Romanians, so in a forced choice they plump for the former over the latter. But it is only a majority of UKIP supporters who reject the idea of living next door to Romanians. What conclusions do you draw from that?
Because UKIP supporters are more likely to be answering from experience of suffering the consequences of mass immigration of unskilled labour and the others are answering a hypothetical question which they can answer in a way that makes them feel good about themselves
So the others are really just part of the metropolitan elite that is not affected by mass immigration? Doesn't that take us back to my original point?
Of course not. People that dont vote UKIP arent necessarily part of the metropolitan elite. People are allowed to have different views without sticking binary labels on them
You insult peoples intelligence when you draw obviously false sweeping generalisations from questions to score debating points. I dont know what you get out of it.
Is there anyway of sending a Private email to Mike Smithson/TSE the moderators?
I am going to a seminar analyzing the Local/Euro election results on Thursday. The panel will include Vernon Bogdanor, Andrew Dilnot, Simon Hix and others. I just wondered whether they might like me to write a short guest article summarizing the conclusions.
A fair point but would present the trademark/IP lawyers with something of a problem. If RBS was forced to drop the Royal title then it would simply become Bank of Scotland but there is already another bank called Bank of Scotland. I am not sure what could be done about it as RBS would not have opted to drop the Royal prefix by choice but had it taken away from them by official diktat.
Yes, in one of their numerous mergers they said openly that among the choices of name they chose the one that would enable them to keep the Royal tag. I absolutely don't see why Royalty puts up with it, and what else they would choose to call themselves is very much their problem.
On another subject, the Observer reports of UKIP's plans: "Among the seats it is likely to target are a batch in Essex, plus Rotherham, Great Grimsby, Great Yarmouth, Portsmouth South, Eastleigh, Broxtowe, North Thanet and South Thanet."
That might be worth a thread after tonight. I suspect they'll win all of them in the Euros; in 2015, we shall see. I assume that Broxtowe is in there because it has unusually strongly pro-European Tory and Labour candidates, and a vigorous UKIP effort would certainly make it an interesting three-cornered election.
I have to admit I was baffled by the presence of Broxtowe on that list- bearing in mind what you have told us about the constituency. I wonder whether it is just sour grapes (warranted sour grapes imho but sour grapes nonetheless) about Soubry's comment on Farage. It could be that they have no serious expectation of winning Broxtowe but just want Soubry out at all costs. Good news for you but a foolish waste of effort and resources for UKIP.
I think Broxtowe is there because Mr Farage said they'd target it, after Ms Soubry said something, I forget what.
More evidence of a less than complete understanding of how targeting should really work.
Still, would only be good for Nick if they did follow through with it (but I seriously doubt it).
How the hell do UKIP win Broxtowe - isn't it basically university of Nottingham type people. I've backed Great Grimsby, and a couple of others but just can't see Broxtowe going kipper - I think you/Anna is a 99.9% market there.
Well, I expect they'll win it tonight. The constituency is interesting because it's several different types of place; (a) Nottingham university type people (estimated 20% - big Guardian readership) (b) traditional working-class small towns (20% - Sun and Mirror strong) (c) semi-rural commuter villages (Telegraph and Times) (15%) (d) suburban commuter suburbs (20% (Mail and Times)) (e) everything else. Anna does well in c and d and a bit of b, I do well in a and b and a bit of c, and UKIP could do well in b and d and maybe c. Ethnic vote of 6%, rising gently as well-off businesspeople move out of the city. It's a real mixture and fascinating to try to represent. Anna and I differ on economic and environmental matters and have quite different styles but are rather similar in our attitudes to Europe, immigration and social issues (gay marriage etc.).
So as I previously stated you took it to be him voicing a unionist position, whereas an unbiased Yorkcity did NOT. Your bias is shameful and colours every post you make.
No
He did not voice a Unionist position.
Watch the interview before you look even more foolish.
You have yet to explain what he said that was so special. Yorkcity gave a good report of what he said and it is the same as his previous one , where he was neutral but wittered on about elected head and independent bank or not really independence crap , ie better to just stay in the union crap. You appear to be unable to articulate why you , most biased unionist poster on the site along with Carlotta, think he said something special. I believe that you would only like it if it suited unionist position , even if he was mainly even handed and branded politicians and actors as just self seeking. So unless you can come up with something I will go by Yorkcity's excellent description.
So unless you can come up with something I will go by Yorkcity's excellent description.
So rather than watch the interview, make up your own mind, then enter a debate, you would rather stick with your interpretation of someone else's view of what he said.
That's rather sad.
He did not endorse a Unionist position. Watch the interview. You might learn something.
Is Racist - net (change vs week ago) UKIP: +7 (+6) Farage: -5 (+18)
Comfortable with Romanian (German) family next door (net): Con: +1 (+63) Lab: +25 (+61) LD: +50 (+75) UKIP: -55 (+16)
All the signs are that most people in this country are part of the metropolitan, left-liberal, sneering, anti-WWC establishment.
The question Farage was asked was "Would you be comfortable with a g roup of Romanian men moving in next door" not " a Romanian family".
Big difference
Which is why the polling is so interesting.
A large majority of Kippers have a problem with a Romanian family.
Not a group of Romanian men.
Draw from that whatever conclusions you want.
What conclusions do you draw from the fact that every other party preferred Germans to Romanians by a massive margin also?
Con 62 Lab 36 Libs 25 UKIP 71
Presumably they feel a closer connection to Germans than Romanians, so in a forced choice they plump for the former over the latter. But it is only a majority of UKIP supporters who reject the idea of living next door to Romanians. What conclusions do you draw from that?
Because UKIP supporters are more likely to be answering from experience of suffering the consequences of mass immigration of unskilled labour and the others are answering a hypothetical question which they can answer in a way that makes them feel good about themselves
So the others are really just part of the metropolitan elite that is not affected by mass immigration? Doesn't that take us back to my original point?
Of course not. People that dont vote UKIP arent necessarily part of the metropolitan elite. People are allowed to have different views without sticking binary labels on them
You insult peoples intelligence when you draw obviously false sweeping generalisations from questions to score debating points. I dont know what you get out of it.
From where I am sitting this looks like a sweeping generalisation: "the others are answering a hypothetical question which they can answer in a way that makes them feel good about themselves".
So unless you can come up with something I will go by Yorkcity's excellent description.
So rather than watch the interview, make up your own mind, then enter a debate, you would rather stick with your interpretation of someone else's view of what he said.
That's rather sad.
He did not endorse a Unionist position. Watch the interview. You might learn something.
A fair point but would present the trademark/IP lawyers with something of a problem. If RBS was forced to drop the Royal title then it would simply become Bank of Scotland but there is already another bank called Bank of Scotland. I am not sure what could be done about it as RBS would not have opted to drop the Royal prefix by choice but had it taken away from them by official diktat.
Yes, in one of their numerous mergers they said openly that among the choices of name they chose the one that would enable them to keep the Royal tag. I absolutely don't see why Royalty puts up with it, and what else they would choose to call themselves is very much their problem.
On another subject, the Observer reports of UKIP's plans: "Among the seats it is likely to target are a batch in Essex, plus Rotherham, Great Grimsby, Great Yarmouth, Portsmouth South, Eastleigh, Broxtowe, North Thanet and South Thanet."
That might be worth a thread after tonight. I suspect they'll win all of them in the Euros; in 2015, we shall see. I assume that Broxtowe is in there because it has unusually strongly pro-European Tory and Labour candidates, and a vigorous UKIP effort would certainly make it an interesting three-cornered election.
Or maybe someone at the Grauniad is trying to wind Nick up?
Is Racist - net (change vs week ago) UKIP: +7 (+6) Farage: -5 (+18)
Comfortable with Romanian (German) family next door (net): Con: +1 (+63) Lab: +25 (+61) LD: +50 (+75) UKIP: -55 (+16)
All the signs are that most people in this country are part of the metropolitan, left-liberal, sneering, anti-WWC establishment.
The question Farage was asked was "Would you be comfortable with a g roup of Romanian men moving in next door" not " a Romanian family".
Big difference
Which is why the polling is so interesting.
A large majority of Kippers have a problem with a Romanian family.
Not a group of Romanian men.
Draw from that whatever conclusions you want.
What conclusions do you draw from the fact that every other party preferred Germans to Romanians by a massive margin also?
Con 62 Lab 36 Libs 25 UKIP 71
Presumably they feel a closer connection to Germans than Romanians, so in a forced choice they plump for the former over the latter. But it is only a majority of UKIP supporters who reject the idea of living next door to Romanians. What conclusions do you draw from that?
Because UKIP supporters are more likely to be answering from experience of suffering the consequences of mass immigration of unskilled labour and the others are answering a hypothetical question which they can answer in a way that makes them feel good about themselves
So the others are really just part of the metropolitan elite that is not affected by mass immigration? Doesn't that take us back to my original point?
Of course not. People that dont vote UKIP arent necessarily part of the metropolitan elite. People are allowed to have different views without sticking binary labels on them
You insult peoples intelligence when you draw obviously false sweeping generalisations from questions to score debating points. I dont know what you get out of it.
From where I am sitting this looks like a sweeping generalisation: "the others are answering a hypothetical question which they can answer in a way that makes them feel good about themselves".
Yes it was, you are right.
I should have said "the others are more likely to be answering..."
We both knew what I meant, but I am used to this from you now. Well done
To be fair, if I remember correctly, in both the Euro and leaving the EU, the second part of the construct was 'if the result is that it is harder to sell cars into Europe'.
It clearly isn't with the UK ex Euro. It may be (although I think unlikely in practice) if the UK was to leave the EU.
All the quotes I have seen from the period have no such qualification. They all made it clear that they would cut back investment if the UK did not join the Euro.
Vauxhall
"any indication we are not going to get into Emu (European monetary union) sooner rather than later, then that is going to affect future investment decisions."
Toyota
"First you will see the suppliers leave, and then the automakers will begin to cut production, with their factories going to one shift," said Tadaaki Jagawa, executive vice president at Toyota. "It's all too easy to visualize."
NEC
""Future inward investment will soon dry up unless the government commits us to the euro," said Sir Richard Needham, vice chairman of NEC Europe,"
They all played the same scare card as is being played now and they were all wrong - just as they are now.
Is there anyway of sending a Private email to Mike Smithson/TSE the moderators?
I am going to a seminar analyzing the Local/Euro election results on Thursday. The panel will include Vernon Bogdanor, Andrew Dilnot, Simon Hix and others. I just wondered whether they might like me to write a short guest article summarizing the conclusions.
If you click on either Mike's or the PB Moderator's name on one of their postings it will take you to their Vanilla page and from there you can send them a personal mail.
Returning to the original thread, I think the problem the Libdems have is that true liberalism is incompatible with social democracy and power has exposed the fault lines.
Their saving grace is that the party has a democratic structure. However I think the democrat bit (as in Social Democrat) will fade away, the orange bookers have won.
@isam - Yes it was, you are right. I should have said "the others are more likely to be answering..." We both knew what I meant, but I am used to this from you now. Well done
No, I did not know what you meant. I am not in a position to read your mind. I have never met you and do not know anything about you. Thus, I assume that what you write you mean. My mistake.
@isam - Yes it was, you are right. I should have said "the others are more likely to be answering..." We both knew what I meant, but I am used to this from you now. Well done
No, I did not know what you meant. I am not in a position to read your mind. I have never met you and do not know anything about you. Thus, I assume that what you write you mean. My mistake.
Jesus Christ, ok. You win, I cant put up with it anymore
So unless you can come up with something I will go by Yorkcity's excellent description.
So rather than watch the interview, make up your own mind, then enter a debate, you would rather stick with your interpretation of someone else's view of what he said.
That's rather sad.
He did not endorse a Unionist position. Watch the interview. You might learn something.
It is rather hard to watch given it is not available. I also doubt it will differ much from his press interview last week, where he was reasonably fair but has no vote so is really of no importance. Rich actor not living in Scotland with no vote and wishing to remain middle of the road. When it is available I will watch it to see what has enthused you so much it has tied your tongue and made you incapable of explaining it. He has nothing to teach me , I am an independent person with my own mind and wish my country to be the same, no more grovelling to get what is rightfully ours.
To be fair, if I remember correctly, in both the Euro and leaving the EU, the second part of the construct was 'if the result is that it is harder to sell cars into Europe'.
It clearly isn't with the UK ex Euro. It may be (although I think unlikely in practice) if the UK was to leave the EU.
All the quotes I have seen from the period have no such qualification. They all made it clear that they would cut back investment if the UK did not join the Euro.
Vauxhall
"any indication we are not going to get into Emu (European monetary union) sooner rather than later, then that is going to affect future investment decisions."
Toyota
"First you will see the suppliers leave, and then the automakers will begin to cut production, with their factories going to one shift," said Tadaaki Jagawa, executive vice president at Toyota. "It's all too easy to visualize."
NEC
""Future inward investment will soon dry up unless the government commits us to the euro," said Sir Richard Needham, vice chairman of NEC Europe,"
They all played the same scare card as is being played now and they were all wrong - just as they are now.
And the same 'useful idiots' repeat the scare stories each time.
@isam - Yes it was, you are right. I should have said "the others are more likely to be answering..." We both knew what I meant, but I am used to this from you now. Well done
No, I did not know what you meant. I am not in a position to read your mind. I have never met you and do not know anything about you. Thus, I assume that what you write you mean. My mistake.
Jesus Christ, ok. You win, I cant put up with it anymore
Does that mean you will write what you mean from now on? It would be helpful for those of us not able to read your mind.
@isam - Yes it was, you are right. I should have said "the others are more likely to be answering..." We both knew what I meant, but I am used to this from you now. Well done
No, I did not know what you meant. I am not in a position to read your mind. I have never met you and do not know anything about you. Thus, I assume that what you write you mean. My mistake.
Jesus Christ, ok. You win, I cant put up with it anymore
Does that mean you will write what you mean from now on? It would be helpful for those of us not able to read your mind.
I just think you are a bit of an annoying prick if I am honest, and its infuriating to debate with someone who deliberately misunderstands things in order to score childish points
There's no getting round Farage is right on this. If you want to cut net immigration to tens of thousands a year then the only realistic way to do it is to get out of the EU.
There's no getting round Farage is right on this. If you want to cut net immigration to tens of thousands a year then the only realistic way to do it is to get out of the EU.
That's not true.
How many immigrants did Greece get this year?
So immigration numbers are not determined solely by membership of the EU. There are economic factors at play, some of which the government can control.
@isam - Yes it was, you are right. I should have said "the others are more likely to be answering..." We both knew what I meant, but I am used to this from you now. Well done
No, I did not know what you meant. I am not in a position to read your mind. I have never met you and do not know anything about you. Thus, I assume that what you write you mean. My mistake.
Jesus Christ, ok. You win, I cant put up with it anymore
Does that mean you will write what you mean from now on? It would be helpful for those of us not able to read your mind.
I just think you are a bit of an annoying prick if I am honest, and its infuriating to debate with someone who deliverately misunderstands things in order to score childish points
I have absolutely no interest in what you think of me. But there is a very obvious solution to your problem.
Is it racist to have vague national stereotypes - probably. Germans are hard-working and industrious, Italians are excitable, Romanians are ... not too sure about them. Oh and Scousers pinch stuff, Tykes are mean, and Irish like a drink.
Either everyone is racist or the selection depends on your own subjectivity i.e. prejudice.
So it's either a totally subjective term or it's a case of pots calling kettles black. If you self-define racism to pander to your own views .... do you not see the childishness?
@isam - Yes it was, you are right. I should have said "the others are more likely to be answering..." We both knew what I meant, but I am used to this from you now. Well done
No, I did not know what you meant. I am not in a position to read your mind. I have never met you and do not know anything about you. Thus, I assume that what you write you mean. My mistake.
Jesus Christ, ok. You win, I cant put up with it anymore
Does that mean you will write what you mean from now on? It would be helpful for those of us not able to read your mind.
I just think you are a bit of an annoying prick if I am honest, and its infuriating to debate with someone who deliverately misunderstands things in order to score childish points
I have absolutely no interest in what you think of me. But there is a very obvious solution to your problem.
There's no getting round Farage is right on this. If you want to cut net immigration to tens of thousands a year then the only realistic way to do it is to get out of the EU.
That's not true.
How many immigrants did Greece get this year?
So immigration numbers are not determined solely by membership of the EU. There are economic factors at play, some of which the government can control.
You mean they could copy Greece and so wreck the economy that no one wants to come here?
There's no getting round Farage is right on this. If you want to cut net immigration to tens of thousands a year then the only realistic way to do it is to get out of the EU.
That's not true.
How many immigrants did Greece get this year?
So immigration numbers are not determined solely by membership of the EU. There are economic factors at play, some of which the government can control.
That's true - I guess one solution to the immigration issue is to have a totally crap economy! It may not be a popular one though.
There's no getting round Farage is right on this. If you want to cut net immigration to tens of thousands a year then the only realistic way to do it is to get out of the EU.
That's not true.
How many immigrants did Greece get this year?
So immigration numbers are not determined solely by membership of the EU. There are economic factors at play, some of which the government can control.
Great, reduce immigration by creating a massive recession.
A fair point but would present the trademark/IP lawyers with something of a problem. If RBS was forced to drop the Royal title then it would simply become Bank of Scotland but there is already another bank called Bank of Scotland. I am not sure what could be done about it as RBS would not have opted to drop the Royal prefix by choice but had it taken away from them by official diktat.
Yes, in one of their numerous mergers they said openly that among the choices of name they chose the one that would enable them to keep the Royal tag. I absolutely don't see why Royalty puts up with it, and what else they would choose to call themselves is very much their problem.
On another subject, the Observer reports of UKIP's plans: "Among the seats it is likely to target are a batch in Essex, plus Rotherham, Great Grimsby, Great Yarmouth, Portsmouth South, Eastleigh, Broxtowe, North Thanet and South Thanet."
That might be worth a thread after tonight. I suspect they'll win all of them in the Euros; in 2015, we shall see. I assume that Broxtowe is in there because it has unusually strongly pro-European Tory and Labour candidates, and a vigorous UKIP effort would certainly make it an interesting three-cornered election.
I have to admit I was baffled by the presence of Broxtowe on that list- bearing in mind what you have told us about the constituency. I wonder whether it is just sour grapes (warranted sour grapes imho but sour grapes nonetheless) about Soubry's comment on Farage. It could be that they have no serious expectation of winning Broxtowe but just want Soubry out at all costs. Good news for you but a foolish waste of effort and resources for UKIP.
I think Broxtowe is there because Mr Farage said they'd target it, after Ms Soubry said something, I forget what.
More evidence of a less than complete understanding of how targeting should really work.
Still, would only be good for Nick if they did follow through with it (but I seriously doubt it).
To be clear, I think that's why the Guardian included it in their article. I don't consider the Guardian's list to be an official UKIP target list, it's a journalist's opinion.
Is it racist to have vague national stereotypes - probably. Germans are hard-working and industrious, Italians are excitable, Romanians are ... not too sure about them. Oh and Scousers pinch stuff, Tykes are mean, and Irish like a drink.
Either everyone is racist or the selection depends on your own subjectivity i.e. prejudice.
So it's either a totally subjective term or it's a case of pots calling kettles black. If you self-define racism to pander to your own views .... do you not see the childishness?
The poll question regarding Germans and Romanian families proves that voters from all parties have preferences whch are probably based on stereotypes. But everyone was too busy trying to make implications about UKIP voters to notice
If people on here that attacked Farage for his LBC comments were consistent, rather than partisan, they would be debating why the poll showed a nationwide preference for Germans over Romanians from all party supporters, and whether it proved Farage had a point.
[Returning to the original thread, I think the problem the Libdems have is that true liberalism is incompatible with social democracy and power has exposed the fault lines.
Their saving grace is that the party has a democratic structure. However I think the democrat bit (as in Social Democrat) will fade away, the orange bookers have won.]
I think this is a fair point.
My point, which probably isn't very helpful on such a busy Sunday - is that I find the lib dems to be a far more coherent bunch than most of the others. I might be biased.
Is it racist to have vague national stereotypes - probably. Germans are hard-working and industrious, Italians are excitable, Romanians are ... not too sure about them. Oh and Scousers pinch stuff, Tykes are mean, and Irish like a drink.
Either everyone is racist or the selection depends on your own subjectivity i.e. prejudice.
So it's either a totally subjective term or it's a case of pots calling kettles black. If you self-define racism to pander to your own views .... do you not see the childishness?
The poll question regarding Germans and Romanian families proves that voters from all parties have preferences whch are probably based on stereotypes. But everyone was too busy trying to make implications about UKIP voters to notice
If people on here that attacked Farage for his LBC comments were consistent, rather than partisan, they would be debating why the poll showed a nationwide preference for Germans over Romanians from all party supporters, and whether it proved Farage had a point.
Is it 'racist' to conform to Putnam's findings and, whilst making no judgement on others, prefer to live amongst people with a similar cultural background?
Apparently that now is captured in many people's definition of racism, which I find a little worrying.
Of course not, but the PC way of thinking has brainwashed so many people now that they only know one way of debating. Feigning both moral purity, and confusion to anything else, in equal proportions. Anything that doesnt back up a PC dogma is just wrong
The poll proves that Farage was saying what the majority of people were thinking while James O'Brien was pretending not to know the difference between living next door to Romanians and Germans.
When Farage said it, the opportunity for point scoring was irresistable, now the poll backs up his assertion, the distraction technique is applied
Is it racist to have vague national stereotypes - probably. Germans are hard-working and industrious, Italians are excitable, Romanians are ... not too sure about them. Oh and Scousers pinch stuff, Tykes are mean, and Irish like a drink.
Either everyone is racist or the selection depends on your own subjectivity i.e. prejudice.
So it's either a totally subjective term or it's a case of pots calling kettles black. If you self-define racism to pander to your own views .... do you not see the childishness?
The poll question regarding Germans and Romanian families proves that voters from all parties have preferences whch are probably based on stereotypes. But everyone was too busy trying to make implications about UKIP voters to notice
If people on here that attacked Farage for his LBC comments were consistent, rather than partisan, they would be debating why the poll showed a nationwide preference for Germans over Romanians from all party supporters, and whether it proved Farage had a point.
Is it racist to have vague national stereotypes - probably. Germans are hard-working and industrious, Italians are excitable, Romanians are ... not too sure about them. Oh and Scousers pinch stuff, Tykes are mean, and Irish like a drink.
Either everyone is racist or the selection depends on your own subjectivity i.e. prejudice.
So it's either a totally subjective term or it's a case of pots calling kettles black. If you self-define racism to pander to your own views .... do you not see the childishness?
The poll question regarding Germans and Romanian families proves that voters from all parties have preferences whch are probably based on stereotypes. But everyone was too busy trying to make implications about UKIP voters to notice
If people on here that attacked Farage for his LBC comments were consistent, rather than partisan, they would be debating why the poll showed a nationwide preference for Germans over Romanians from all party supporters, and whether it proved Farage had a point.
They were not making implications about UKIP voters...just their official representatives. There is a difference.
Oh and in case you missed it being out of the EU does not mean being out of the single market. It depends on whether or not we stay in the EEA.
My understanding (correct me if wrong) is that UKIP policy is to leave the EEA, although not immediately. Isn't the desired aim similar to Switzerland (i.e. in efta, not in eu nor in eea)?
Didn't (unlike Roger Bootle's incoherent peregrinations on the subject) the IEA Brexit winner grab the nettle on this? - see http://www.iea.org.uk/brexit
He did not advocate an independent bank and an elected head of state, that was what I would eventually want for an independent scotland.
He just stated whatever way you vote , vote for the principle, not whether you will be slightly better off either way, and don`t be swayed by lying here today gone tommorow politicians and actors.
Actually there has been significant immigration to Greece, despite the crashed economy over recent years, and a major factor in the rise of Golden Dawn.
Much is asylum seekers from the Middle East and Africa but also from Albania/Macedonia/Serbia
There are around 800 000 Non EU nationals in a population of 11 Million:
There's no getting round Farage is right on this. If you want to cut net immigration to tens of thousands a year then the only realistic way to do it is to get out of the EU.
That's not true.
How many immigrants did Greece get this year?
So immigration numbers are not determined solely by membership of the EU. There are economic factors at play, some of which the government can control.
That's true - I guess one solution to the immigration issue is to have a totally crap economy! It may not be a popular one though.
There's no getting round Farage is right on this. If you want to cut net immigration to tens of thousands a year then the only realistic way to do it is to get out of the EU.
That's not true.
How many immigrants did Greece get this year?
So immigration numbers are not determined solely by membership of the EU. There are economic factors at play, some of which the government can control.
You mean they could copy Greece and so wreck the economy that no one wants to come here?
There's no getting round Farage is right on this. If you want to cut net immigration to tens of thousands a year then the only realistic way to do it is to get out of the EU.
That's not true.
How many immigrants did Greece get this year?
So immigration numbers are not determined solely by membership of the EU. There are economic factors at play, some of which the government can control.
You mean they could copy Greece and so wreck the economy that no one wants to come here?
There's no getting round Farage is right on this. If you want to cut net immigration to tens of thousands a year then the only realistic way to do it is to get out of the EU.
That's not true.
How many immigrants did Greece get this year?
So immigration numbers are not determined solely by membership of the EU. There are economic factors at play, some of which the government can control.
You feel that Britain should emulate Greek economic policy in order to reduce immigration?
Interesting to hear the commentators commend the way Sri Lanka have built the innings. If England were going at 4.1 an over after 32 the Botham lynch mob would be lying in wait already.
Is it racist to have vague national stereotypes - probably. Germans are hard-working and industrious, Italians are excitable, Romanians are ... not too sure about them. Oh and Scousers pinch stuff, Tykes are mean, and Irish like a drink.
Either everyone is racist or the selection depends on your own subjectivity i.e. prejudice.
So it's either a totally subjective term or it's a case of pots calling kettles black. If you self-define racism to pander to your own views .... do you not see the childishness?
The poll question regarding Germans and Romanian families proves that voters from all parties have preferences whch are probably based on stereotypes. But everyone was too busy trying to make implications about UKIP voters to notice
If people on here that attacked Farage for his LBC comments were consistent, rather than partisan, they would be debating why the poll showed a nationwide preference for Germans over Romanians from all party supporters, and whether it proved Farage had a point.
Is it racist to have vague national stereotypes - probably. Germans are hard-working and industrious, Italians are excitable, Romanians are ... not too sure about them. Oh and Scousers pinch stuff, Tykes are mean, and Irish like a drink.
Either everyone is racist or the selection depends on your own subjectivity i.e. prejudice.
So it's either a totally subjective term or it's a case of pots calling kettles black. If you self-define racism to pander to your own views .... do you not see the childishness?
The poll question regarding Germans and Romanian families proves that voters from all parties have preferences whch are probably based on stereotypes. But everyone was too busy trying to make implications about UKIP voters to notice
If people on here that attacked Farage for his LBC comments were consistent, rather than partisan, they would be debating why the poll showed a nationwide preference for Germans over Romanians from all party supporters, and whether it proved Farage had a point.
They were not making implications about UKIP voters...just their official representatives. There is a difference.
Today's poll findings were used by several people on here to ask us to draw our own conclusions from, and the people polled were ukip supporters not party representaves
Oh and in case you missed it being out of the EU does not mean being out of the single market. It depends on whether or not we stay in the EEA.
My understanding (correct me if wrong) is that UKIP policy is to leave the EEA, although not immediately.
Incidentally, unlike Roger Bootle's incoherent peregrinations on the subject, the IEA Brexit winner grabbed the nettle on this - see http://www.iea.org.uk/brexit
UKIP don't seem to have made a decision on this at the moment. The latest report they did seemed to cast doubt on EEA membership - or at least spent a lot of time highlighting the problems with it - so I assume that would be their position but it is not confirmed.
There's no getting round Farage is right on this. If you want to cut net immigration to tens of thousands a year then the only realistic way to do it is to get out of the EU.
That's not true.
How many immigrants did Greece get this year?
So immigration numbers are not determined solely by membership of the EU. There are economic factors at play, some of which the government can control.
Just when you thought "Tory surge in Edinburgh" couldn't be bettered, Scott comes up with this gem.
There's no getting round Farage is right on this. If you want to cut net immigration to tens of thousands a year then the only realistic way to do it is to get out of the EU.
That's not true.
How many immigrants did Greece get this year?
So immigration numbers are not determined solely by membership of the EU. There are economic factors at play, some of which the government can control.
Just when you thought "Tory surge in Edinburgh" couldn't be bettered, Scott comes up with this gem.
Scott P made a complete arse of himself with his Edinburgh ramping in 2009-10.
Is Racist - net (change vs week ago) UKIP: +7 (+6) Farage: -5 (+18)
Comfortable with Romanian (German) family next door (net): Con: +1 (+63) Lab: +25 (+61) LD: +50 (+75) UKIP: -55 (+16)
All the signs are that most people in this country are part of the metropolitan, left-liberal, sneering, anti-WWC establishment.
The question Farage was asked was "Would you be comfortable with a g roup of Romanian men moving in next door" not " a Romanian family".
Big difference
And the question the UKIP voters in that poll were asked is would you be comfortable with a Romanian family next door.
Cant you ever stop trying to twist and turn everything like the worst kind of politican, and sometimes admit you jumped the gun?
You made a sarcastic joke.. it has been pointed out by someone else that it doesnt really fit with reality (the majority of the UK arent part of the metropolitan establishment) and the question was not the same one that Farage was asked, so the premise of the question is dodgy
The results also show that suppporters of every party prefer to live next door to a German family than a Romanian one by quite a margin. So there is something in what Farage said in the first place
Is it because we secretly like Adolf Hitler ?
Don't be silly. He was Austrian. ;-)
He'd be very upset if he heard you say that ... curious, though, that the Tories and UKIP spend so much time talking about the Great War and the Battle of Britain (complete with Spitfires from a Polish squadron). Not very well targeted if people would still welcome Germans rather than people from a country with which the UK never had any armed combat per se IIRC (at least not since it was part of the Austro-Hungarian empire).
Oh and in case you missed it being out of the EU does not mean being out of the single market. It depends on whether or not we stay in the EEA.
My understanding (correct me if wrong) is that UKIP policy is to leave the EEA, although not immediately. Isn't the desired aim similar to Switzerland (i.e. in efta, not in eu nor in eea)?
Didn't (unlike Roger Bootle's incoherent peregrinations on the subject) the IEA Brexit winner grab the nettle on this? - see http://www.iea.org.uk/brexit
But Switzerland has a bilateral treaty under which they accept free movement of people from the EU. There has been quite a fuss about it, and a referendum, and the EU clearly aren't prepared to budge on the issue.
Theresa May labouring under the illusion that tightening up on benefits will dramatically cut into EU migration, which mainly comes here to do low skill work:
... it was difficult to find a silver lining to the cloud hanging over the Liberal Democrats. Once the local elections were the party’s forte; now they have become an annual embarrassment.
The party argued – not for the first time – that it was often performing better in places where it already has a sitting MP and thus has a strong base of local support. Indeed, there was the occasional bright spot – the party actually did better than in the 2010 general election in Bradford East and Birmingham Yardley. But there were plenty of disappointments too, not least the fact that the party came second to the Conservatives in Vince Cable’s Twickenham constituency and lost control of Ed Davey’s Kingston backyard.
Consequently, on average Liberal Democrat support was down just as much – that is, by no less than 13 points – in Liberal Democrat MPs’ constituencies as elsewhere. In short, there was little consistent sign of the ability of Liberal Democrats’ personal popularity to stem the receding tide. And next year their own seats will be on the line.
That analysis runs counter to the fairy stories we are regularly peddled here at PB about the LD incumbency effect.
I think you'll find punters weren't voting on their LibDem MP's incumbency in the local/euro elections. That comes near year.
Apart from that gaping whole in your thinking that was a searing analysis.
But it was not my analysis Jack, it was John Curtice's analysis today:
- "on average Liberal Democrat support was down just as much – that is, by no less than 13 points – in Liberal Democrat MPs’ constituencies as elsewhere. In short, there was little consistent sign of the ability of Liberal Democrats’ personal popularity to stem the receding tide"
Curtice is usually a respected voice here at PB. Strange that you become so dismissive of him when he says something you do not agree with.
I'll allow you the benefit of the doubt and assume that your original comment wasn't about LibDem MP''s and their "fairy story" incumbency, which of course wasn't what Prof Curtice was referring too.
I have a very high regard for the esteemed Prof and very largely agree with him on most issues.
Oh and in case you missed it being out of the EU does not mean being out of the single market. It depends on whether or not we stay in the EEA.
My understanding (correct me if wrong) is that UKIP policy is to leave the EEA, although not immediately. Isn't the desired aim similar to Switzerland (i.e. in efta, not in eu nor in eea)?
Didn't (unlike Roger Bootle's incoherent peregrinations on the subject) the IEA Brexit winner grab the nettle on this? - see http://www.iea.org.uk/brexit
But Switzerland has a bilateral treaty under which they accept free movement of people from the EU. There has been quite a fuss about it, and a referendum, and the EU clearly aren't prepared to budge on the issue.
The IEA Brexit winner suggested a position between Switzerland and Turkey, I believe.
Anyway, Switzerland is now limiting EU migration, and the EU "not budging" means they've cancelled some joint research programs and continued everything else.
Police arrest man for use of the word "arse" when singing.Free speech clearly not allowed by Hull plod.I think some PBerrs are looking at a very long stretch if previous offences are taken into account,especially those who have used the word "stick" to accompany it.Plod OTT IMHO.
Is Racist - net (change vs week ago) UKIP: +7 (+6) Farage: -5 (+18)
Comfortable with Romanian (German) family next door (net): Con: +1 (+63) Lab: +25 (+61) LD: +50 (+75) UKIP: -55 (+16)
All the signs are that most people in this country are part of the metropolitan, left-liberal, sneering, anti-WWC establishment.
The question Farage was asked was "Would you be comfortable with a g roup of Romanian men moving in next door" not " a Romanian family".
Big difference
And the question the UKIP voters in that poll were asked is would you be comfortable with a Romanian family next door.
Cant you ever stop trying to twist and turn everything like the worst kind of politican, and sometimes admit you jumped the gun?
You made a sarcastic joke.. it has been pointed out by someone else that it doesnt really fit with reality (the majority of the UK arent part of the metropolitan establishment) and the question was not the same one that Farage was asked, so the premise of the question is dodgy
The results also show that suppporters of every party prefer to live next door to a German family than a Romanian one by quite a margin. So there is something in what Farage said in the first place
Is it because we secretly like Adolf Hitler ?
Don't be silly. He was Austrian. ;-)
He'd be very upset if he heard you say that ... curious, though, that the Tories and UKIP spend so much time talking about the Great War and the Battle of Britain (complete with Spitfires from a Polish squadron). Not very well targeted if people would still welcome Germans rather than people from a country with which the UK never had any armed combat per se IIRC (at least not since it was part of the Austro-Hungarian empire).
We're fortunate that the Polish flyers took a more robust response to the Axis in WWII than the SNP Petainistes.
Question is, will the move on Clegg gain momentum?
Off topic: Local elections in NI. Summary.
-Unionists are a bit hacked off, just a bit, not hugely but a bit with the status quo. Unionists vote down the card in an STV system. Smaller parties, particularly on the Unionist side did alright.
-Nationalism is becoming ever more like unionists in its voting levels. Nationalists still don't quite vote down the card like unionists (either way SDLP>SF and SF>SDLP) and possibly never will.
-UKIP actually won more than one seat.
I remember hearing after the 1997 election that a Nationalist majority was just around the corner. 17 years later, it doesn't look like it's any closer.
Newark is my biggest stake so far (£60) on a single constituency - 8-11 on Con was very generous. Might be a small surge in the UKIP price after Euro results though, if I was long UKIP I'd trade out at that point.
Is Racist - net (change vs week ago) UKIP: +7 (+6) Farage: -5 (+18)
Comfortable with Romanian (German) family next door (net): Con: +1 (+63) Lab: +25 (+61) LD: +50 (+75) UKIP: -55 (+16)
All the signs are that most people in this country are part of the metropolitan, left-liberal, sneering, anti-WWC establishment.
The question Farage was asked was "Would you be comfortable with a g roup of Romanian men moving in next door" not " a Romanian family".
Big difference
And the question the UKIP voters in that poll were asked is would you be comfortable with a Romanian family next door.
Cant you ever stop trying to twist and turn everything like the worst kind of politican, and sometimes admit you jumped the gun?
You made a sarcastic joke.. it has been pointed out by someone else that it doesnt really fit with reality (the majority of the UK arent part of the metropolitan establishment) and the question was not the same one that Farage was asked, so the premise of the question is dodgy
The results also show that suppporters of every party prefer to live next door to a German family than a Romanian one by quite a margin. So there is something in what Farage said in the first place
Is it because we secretly like Adolf Hitler ?
Don't be silly. He was Austrian. ;-)
He'd be very upset if he heard you say that ... curious, though, that the Tories and UKIP spend so much time talking about the Great War and the Battle of Britain (complete with Spitfires from a Polish squadron). Not very well targeted if people would still welcome Germans rather than people from a country with which the UK never had any armed combat per se IIRC (at least not since it was part of the Austro-Hungarian empire).
We're fortunate that the Polish flyers took a more robust response to the Axis in WWII than the SNP Petainistes.
Really? I didn't know Scotland was occupied during the war, so you must be referring to the outstanding way in which Petain fought at Verdun. What I do know is that it was the likes of the Conservatives and Unionists who got banged up or deported for the duration. You might like to read up abut the likes of Captain Ramsay and the Master of Sempill.
I suspect that too much is being made of PNS from the local elections. People appear to have forgotten that the Tories were ahead on that in 2011 - same day as AV referendum. Going further back , the Tories only had a modest success at the 1978 locals - well down on 1977 . They still did much better a year later!
I remember hearing after the 1997 election that a Nationalist majority was just around the corner. 17 years later, it doesn't look like it's any closer.
The polling shows that the plurality of Roman Catholic opinion is in favour of remaining within the United Kingdom. The form of political Romanism once championed by the archpriest de Valera is looking increasingly dead in the Republic of Ireland as well.
Is Racist - net (change vs week ago) UKIP: +7 (+6) Farage: -5 (+18)
Comfortable with Romanian (German) family next door (net): Con: +1 (+63) Lab: +25 (+61) LD: +50 (+75) UKIP: -55 (+16)
All the signs are that most people in this country are part of the metropolitan, left-liberal, sneering, anti-WWC establishment.
The question Farage was asked was "Would you be comfortable with a g roup of Romanian men moving in next door" not " a Romanian family".
Big difference
And the question the UKIP voters in that poll were asked is would you be comfortable with a Romanian family next door.
Cant you ever stop trying to twist and turn everything like the worst kind of politican, and sometimes admit you jumped the gun?
You made a sarcastic joke.. it has been pointed out by someone else that it doesnt really fit with reality (the majority of the UK arent part of the metropolitan establishment) and the question was not the same one that Farage was asked, so the premise of the question is dodgy
The results also show that suppporters of every party prefer to live next door to a German family than a Romanian one by quite a margin. So there is something in what Farage said in the first place
Is it because we secretly like Adolf Hitler ?
Don't be silly. He was Austrian. ;-)
He'd be very upset if he heard you say that ... curious, though, that the Tories and UKIP spend so much time talking about the Great War and the Battle of Britain (complete with Spitfires from a Polish squadron). Not very well targeted if people would still welcome Germans rather than people from a country with which the UK never had any armed combat per se IIRC (at least not since it was part of the Austro-Hungarian empire).
We're fortunate that the Polish flyers took a more robust response to the Axis in WWII than the SNP Petainistes.
Really? I didn't know Scotland was occupied during the war, so you must be referring to the outstanding way in which Petain fought at Verdun. What I do know is that it was the likes of the Conservatives and Unionists who got banged up or deported for the duration. You might like to read up abut the likes of Captain Ramsay and the Master of Sempill.
A silly point. You might like to read up about Shimi Lovat.
Comments
Since, most of the capital does flow into London, it would have a small effect on London house prices. Those theives and robbers who are sheltering their money in London bricks and mortars will continue regardless. If anything a non-EU UK government would be so right wing, they would positively invite such money.
Remember, even during the Ukranian sanctions on Russia, the UK government made clear the City would not be involved in such sanctions.
Your bias is shameful and colours every post you make.
You made a sarcastic joke.. it has been pointed out by someone else that it doesnt really fit with reality (the majority of the UK arent part of the metropolitan establishment) and the question was not the same one that Farage was asked, so the premise of the question is dodgy
The results also show that suppporters of every party prefer to live next door to a German family than a Romanian one by quite a margin. So there is something in what Farage said in the first place
As for Eastern European human trafficking, I don't know enough about it, but wouldn't be surprised if it has been brushed under the carpet similarly. You can understand why the media do it - if the results of Rochdale and Rotherham, where local media covered the issues, were repeated on a broader geographic basis, UKIP would be doing even better.
- "on average Liberal Democrat support was down just as much – that is, by no less than 13 points – in Liberal Democrat MPs’ constituencies as elsewhere. In short, there was little consistent sign of the ability of Liberal Democrats’ personal popularity to stem the receding tide"
Curtice is usually a respected voice here at PB. Strange that you become so dismissive of him when he says something you do not agree with.
How very unionist, especially of the establishment troughing self seeking elite unionist viewpoint
Con 62
Lab 36
Libs 25
UKIP 71
The telling point is that all people surveyed would rather live next door to Germans than Romanians, by a clear margin.
Which debunks almost all the whole idea of portraying Farage as racist for making a distinction between the two, unless you consider the whole country to be racist
80% of Nissan's production is exported to the EU.
Medium term - not much impact
Long term - negative if financial services migrates outside of London (which I don't think would happen), otherwise not much impact
The real challenge long-term is that many of the houses that are being bought as stores of value will never re-enter the housing market (historically, for instance, houses on the Phillimore estate used to trade on a 15 year cycle). Supply is permanently constrained, but also the houses are not occupied so local retail suffers - Ken High Street is packed full of charity shops, pop up stores and empty stores to let: there's one near us that has been empty (admittedly not prime) for about 6 years
Easy-peasy ... everybody is racist!
Hang your heads in shame, all of you.
Once they got ticked off enough times for not sorting out their recycling properly they would probably hope for some Romanians to move in!
Oh and in case you missed it being out of the EU does not mean being out of the single market. It depends on whether or not we stay in the EEA.
These scare stories never have been realistic and no one believes them any more.
He did not voice a Unionist position.
Watch the interview before you look even more foolish.
It clearly isn't with the UK ex Euro. It may be (although I think unlikely in practice) if the UK was to leave the EU.
Well I'll be darned
You insult peoples intelligence when you draw obviously false sweeping generalisations from questions to score debating points. I dont know what you get out of it.
I am going to a seminar analyzing the Local/Euro election results on Thursday. The panel will include Vernon Bogdanor, Andrew Dilnot, Simon Hix and others. I just wondered whether they might like me to write a short guest article summarizing the conclusions.
Still, would only be good for Nick if they did follow through with it (but I seriously doubt it).
You appear to be unable to articulate why you , most biased unionist poster on the site along with Carlotta, think he said something special.
I believe that you would only like it if it suited unionist position , even if he was mainly even handed and branded politicians and actors as just self seeking.
So unless you can come up with something I will go by Yorkcity's excellent description.
http://survation.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/05/MOS-Leadership-Contenders-Poll-1.pdf
They make a final adjustment between table 4 and table 5: "Replacing the Undecided/Refused Responses with 2010 Voters responses"
Table 4 Westminster VI
Con 26.2%, Lab 32.6%, LD 7.8%, UKIP 24%
Table 5 Westminster VI
Con 26.5%, Lab 31.9%, LD 9%, UKIP 23.2%
That's rather sad.
He did not endorse a Unionist position. Watch the interview. You might learn something.
That is an incredible thing for you to say
I should have said "the others are more likely to be answering..."
We both knew what I meant, but I am used to this from you now. Well done
Vauxhall
"any indication we are not going to get into Emu (European monetary union) sooner rather than later, then that is going to affect future investment decisions."
Toyota
"First you will see the suppliers leave, and then the automakers will begin to cut production, with their factories going to one shift," said Tadaaki Jagawa, executive vice president at Toyota. "It's all too easy to visualize."
NEC
""Future inward investment will soon dry up unless the government commits us to the euro," said Sir Richard Needham, vice chairman of NEC Europe,"
They all played the same scare card as is being played now and they were all wrong - just as they are now.
Their saving grace is that the party has a democratic structure. However I think the democrat bit (as in Social Democrat) will fade away, the orange bookers have won.
I should have said "the others are more likely to be answering..."
We both knew what I meant, but I am used to this from you now. Well done
No, I did not know what you meant. I am not in a position to read your mind. I have never met you and do not know anything about you. Thus, I assume that what you write you mean. My mistake.
http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2014/may/24/ukip-councillor-investigation-racist-homophobic-facebook-comments
http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2014/may/25/theresa-may-waters-down-tory-migration-target
There's no getting round Farage is right on this. If you want to cut net immigration to tens of thousands a year then the only realistic way to do it is to get out of the EU.
How many immigrants did Greece get this year?
So immigration numbers are not determined solely by membership of the EU. There are economic factors at play, some of which the government can control.
Either everyone is racist or the selection depends on your own subjectivity i.e. prejudice.
So it's either a totally subjective term or it's a case of pots calling kettles black. If you self-define racism to pander to your own views .... do you not see the childishness?
Its a thought I suppose.
Euros - Most votes
UKIP 1.2
Lab 4.7
Con 15.5
Euros - Most seats
UKIP 1.18
Lab 4.5
Con 20
If people on here that attacked Farage for his LBC comments were consistent, rather than partisan, they would be debating why the poll showed a nationwide preference for Germans over Romanians from all party supporters, and whether it proved Farage had a point.
Their saving grace is that the party has a democratic structure. However I think the democrat bit (as in Social Democrat) will fade away, the orange bookers have won.]
I think this is a fair point.
My point, which probably isn't very helpful on such a busy Sunday - is that I find the lib dems to be a far more coherent bunch than most of the others. I might be biased.
Looks likely for the Tories, and out of reach of the kippers to me.
Of course not, but the PC way of thinking has brainwashed so many people now that they only know one way of debating. Feigning both moral purity, and confusion to anything else, in equal proportions. Anything that doesnt back up a PC dogma is just wrong
The poll proves that Farage was saying what the majority of people were thinking while James O'Brien was pretending not to know the difference between living next door to Romanians and Germans.
When Farage said it, the opportunity for point scoring was irresistable, now the poll backs up his assertion, the distraction technique is applied
Didn't (unlike Roger Bootle's incoherent peregrinations on the subject) the IEA Brexit winner grab the nettle on this? - see http://www.iea.org.uk/brexit
He did not advocate an independent bank and an elected head of state, that was what I would eventually want for an independent scotland.
He just stated whatever way you vote , vote for the principle, not whether you will be slightly better off either way, and don`t be swayed by lying here today gone tommorow politicians and actors.
Much is asylum seekers from the Middle East and Africa but also from Albania/Macedonia/Serbia
There are around 800 000 Non EU nationals in a population of 11 Million:
http://www.iom.int/cms/en/sites/iom/home/where-we-work/europa/european-economic-area/greece.html
And this shows that being harsh on these migrants does little to discourage others:
http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/apr/01/migrants-living-hell-greek-detention-medecins-sans-frontieres-scabies-tb
Scott P made a complete arse of himself with his Edinburgh ramping in 2009-10.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-27563904
I can't work out if she's an idiot, or she just thinks we're all idiots.
- "on average Liberal Democrat support was down just as much – that is, by no less than 13 points – in Liberal Democrat MPs’ constituencies as elsewhere. In short, there was little consistent sign of the ability of Liberal Democrats’ personal popularity to stem the receding tide"
Curtice is usually a respected voice here at PB. Strange that you become so dismissive of him when he says something you do not agree with.
I'll allow you the benefit of the doubt and assume that your original comment wasn't about LibDem MP''s and their "fairy story" incumbency, which of course wasn't what Prof Curtice was referring too.
I have a very high regard for the esteemed Prof and very largely agree with him on most issues.
Anyway, Switzerland is now limiting EU migration, and the EU "not budging" means they've cancelled some joint research programs and continued everything else.
http://www.hulldailymail.co.uk/Anti-fracking-campaigner-arrested-Beverley-using/story-21138031-detail/story.html
Could the Lib Dems lose all their seats? Will the BNP be wiped out? Here are six possible results and what they would mean
1) The Lib Dems losing all their seats
2) The Greens getting more seats than the Lib Dems
3) Labour squeaking past Ukip to top the poll
4) Ukip coming a resounding first
5) The Tories slipping into third place
6) A wipeout for the British National party
http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2014/may/25/european-parliament-elections-six-things-to-watch-out-for
Going further back , the Tories only had a modest success at the 1978 locals - well down on 1977 . They still did much better a year later!