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More voters think Reform are on the side of the establishment than the people – politicalbetting.com

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  • JohnLilburneJohnLilburne Posts: 8,413
    Sandpit said:

    Minus one Russian Mi-28 attack helicopter, taken out by a small quadcoptor suicide drone this morning.

    https://x.com/osinttechnical/status/2077295933016965143

    The asymmetric warfare is getting crazy in this conflict, something that costs tens of millions of dollars taken out by something that costs a couple of thousand.

    Nice.

    Magyar is claiming 20 ships in the Black Sea this morning, videos to follow. I notice from the Azov Sea videos they have been double-tapping them - attack the bridge, and then fly another drone into the hole you just made.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 62,508
    edited 8:13AM

    Sandpit said:

    stodge said:

    Taz said:

    Eabhal said:

    FPT I still think it’s mad that the single biggest avoidable risk factor for COVID-19 deaths - obesity - is mentioned so little in the reports. It’s the reason the NHS came under so much pressure, and almost always why relatively young people died.

    E.g. in the 240 page resilience report it’s mentioned once. I do my best to be balanced about the conduct of public servants, but it really is a disgraceful abrogation of duty. Entirely unserious.

    I'm still amazed that the government didn't encourage weight loss and improved personal fitness during covid.
    It’s always little,nudges.

    So we’vehad the so called soda tax, advertising bans, BOGOF bans, bans on placing sweets near checkouts and other drivel that hasn’t worked which was advocated by well organised and well remunerated lobbying groups.

    TFL even had to pull one of its own ads for places to visit in London as food featured in it was HFSS.

    Yet obesity still increases

    We now have an initiative coming where people will get vouchers and rewards if they walk a certain amount of time in the week.

    The answer is probably to get people on the jabs rather than all of this ineffective bullshit.
    Is obesity increasing? Do you have any evidence for that assertion?

    During my week in Manchester, I saw a lot more vaping among young people than I see in London. Is vaping absent of health risk?

    As for the "jabs" (which will likely be pills before long), we'll see. There are those who might argue appetite suppression and reduced size has other economic consequences.

    Indeed, one of those consequences would be to make the manufacturers of Ozempic, Wegovy, Mounjaro and the rest extremely wealthy to an extent the drug cartels can only dream.
    Novo Nordisk already has Wegvy brand oral semaglutide pills approved and available in the US, they’ll be everywhere before long.

    https://abcnews.com/GMA/Wellness/wegovy-daily-pill-now-costs/story?id=128898797

    Better that regulated ‘big’ pharma makes money and pays taxes, than the profits going to the other end of the drug business.
    Those Wegovy pills are already available for sale in the UK.

    At £150 - £200 per month, they are not an option* for many of the poorest but the pay back for the NHS and the DWP must surley be there if they were allowed freely on the NHS.

    I'm sure that will come within the next 5 years.

    (*Not an easy option at any rate.)
    They absolutely should be available on the NHS, subject to reasonable objective criteria which can’t be easily gamed.

    Target those initially with a BMI of over X, people with severe diabetic levels of blood sugar, people with weight-related other conditions, people signed off work sick for a year or more…
  • TazTaz Posts: 29,480
    Sandpit said:

    Sandpit said:

    stodge said:

    Taz said:

    Eabhal said:

    FPT I still think it’s mad that the single biggest avoidable risk factor for COVID-19 deaths - obesity - is mentioned so little in the reports. It’s the reason the NHS came under so much pressure, and almost always why relatively young people died.

    E.g. in the 240 page resilience report it’s mentioned once. I do my best to be balanced about the conduct of public servants, but it really is a disgraceful abrogation of duty. Entirely unserious.

    I'm still amazed that the government didn't encourage weight loss and improved personal fitness during covid.
    It’s always little,nudges.

    So we’vehad the so called soda tax, advertising bans, BOGOF bans, bans on placing sweets near checkouts and other drivel that hasn’t worked which was advocated by well organised and well remunerated lobbying groups.

    TFL even had to pull one of its own ads for places to visit in London as food featured in it was HFSS.

    Yet obesity still increases

    We now have an initiative coming where people will get vouchers and rewards if they walk a certain amount of time in the week.

    The answer is probably to get people on the jabs rather than all of this ineffective bullshit.
    Is obesity increasing? Do you have any evidence for that assertion?

    During my week in Manchester, I saw a lot more vaping among young people than I see in London. Is vaping absent of health risk?

    As for the "jabs" (which will likely be pills before long), we'll see. There are those who might argue appetite suppression and reduced size has other economic consequences.

    Indeed, one of those consequences would be to make the manufacturers of Ozempic, Wegovy, Mounjaro and the rest extremely wealthy to an extent the drug cartels can only dream.
    Novo Nordisk already has Wegvy brand oral semaglutide pills approved and available in the US, they’ll be everywhere before long.

    https://abcnews.com/GMA/Wellness/wegovy-daily-pill-now-costs/story?id=128898797

    Better that regulated ‘big’ pharma makes money and pays taxes, than the profits going to the other end of the drug business.
    Those Wegovy pills are already available for sale in the UK.

    At £150 - £200 per month, they are not an option* for many of the poorest but the pay back for the NHS and the DWP must surley be there if they were allowed freely on the NHS.

    I'm sure that will come within the next 5 years.

    (*Not an easy option at any rate.)
    They absolutely should be available on the NHS, subject to reasonable objective criteria which can’t be easily gamed.

    Target those initially with a BMI of over X, people with severe diabetic levels of blood sugar, people with weight-related other conditions, people signed off work sick for a year or more…
    They are available on the NHS but with very strict criteria.

    I suspect they will become more and more prevalent on the NhS.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 90,820
    Taz said:

    Nigelb said:

    Taz said:



    FPT

    DoctorG said:

    Reports in The Times that the Treasury are looking to bring forward the increase in state pension age to 68 to start from 2037. The current published plan is to phase this increase in from April 2044.

    Millions forced to work longer under state pension age extension plan
    Treasury officials have told the Office for Budget Responsibility that the state retirement threshold will rise to 68 seven years earlier than legislated

    https://www.thetimes.com/uk/politics/article/state-pension-uk-retirement-age-68-nc50dzgcn (£££)

    Dr Suzy Morrissey is due to report imminently with her findings after last years call for evidence for the third state pension age review following the 2014 act. The govt then works on that.

    So there’s a bit of pre emoting of that although the scope also included how future state pension age will be determined.

    https://www.gov.uk/government/calls-for-evidence/third-state-pension-age-review-independent-report-call-for-evidence

    Final govt report/decision was supposedly not due til 2029

    Given the govt is supposedly committed to a 10 year notification of any change in state pension age if that holds this change would need to go through next year. If it is an actual proposed change rather than an assumption.
    The eagerness to bring this change in is in complete contrast to the refusal to do anything about the triple lock.
    What eagerness ?

    We have not announced any change of policy - and certainly not this specific one. There is currently a review of the State Pension age underway - that is simply because legislation (the 2014 Act) requires the Secretary of State to conduct such reviews on a fairly regular basis
    https://x.com/TorstenBell/status/2077158252677071350
    So it’s either been floated to assess reaction or an assumption put into forecasts.

    The Morrissey review into state pension age called for evidence last fall and is due to report imminently

    The govt timescale conveniently,kicks its response to it out to spring 29
    Until Burnham takes office, we're both just guessing.
  • bondegezoubondegezou Posts: 21,648

    Eabhal said:

    FPT I still think it’s mad that the single biggest avoidable risk factor for COVID-19 deaths - obesity - is mentioned so little in the reports. It’s the reason the NHS came under so much pressure, and almost always why relatively young people died.

    E.g. in the 240 page resilience report it’s mentioned once. I do my best to be balanced about the conduct of public servants, but it really is a disgraceful abrogation of duty. Entirely unserious.

    I'm still amazed that the government didn't encourage weight loss and improved personal fitness during covid.
    They did encourage fitness etc., including encouraging people go out to exercise during lockdown. However, it's a bit shutting the stable door after the horse has bolted. People can't (healthily) lose weight quickly. COVID-19 spread fast. You were never going to shift the national average BMI in a significant way in time to have much impact.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 90,820
    Homan: The officers involved in these shootings are well trained, I wouldn’t even call this a bump in the road. This will be a short term review, so ICE feels comfortable….
    https://x.com/Acyn/status/2077134923484602689
  • LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 24,964
    Ukraine's campaign against Russian shipping has moved from the Azov Sea to the Black Sea. They report 20 ships, mostly oil tankers, hit in the Black Sea overnight. Presumably this is because there aren't any undamaged ships left in the Azov Sea.

    The Black Sea is a major route for Russian oil exports. If Ukraine can block it then that's a major loss in revenue for Russia, and they'd be forced to cut oil production, with long-term consequences due to the difficulty of restarting production.

    This is what a strategic turning point in the war looks like, unlike the supposedly "strategic" piles of rubble that Russia have captured at great cost over the last few years.
  • EabhalEabhal Posts: 14,610
    Sandpit said:

    Sandpit said:

    stodge said:

    Taz said:

    Eabhal said:

    FPT I still think it’s mad that the single biggest avoidable risk factor for COVID-19 deaths - obesity - is mentioned so little in the reports. It’s the reason the NHS came under so much pressure, and almost always why relatively young people died.

    E.g. in the 240 page resilience report it’s mentioned once. I do my best to be balanced about the conduct of public servants, but it really is a disgraceful abrogation of duty. Entirely unserious.

    I'm still amazed that the government didn't encourage weight loss and improved personal fitness during covid.
    It’s always little,nudges.

    So we’vehad the so called soda tax, advertising bans, BOGOF bans, bans on placing sweets near checkouts and other drivel that hasn’t worked which was advocated by well organised and well remunerated lobbying groups.

    TFL even had to pull one of its own ads for places to visit in London as food featured in it was HFSS.

    Yet obesity still increases

    We now have an initiative coming where people will get vouchers and rewards if they walk a certain amount of time in the week.

    The answer is probably to get people on the jabs rather than all of this ineffective bullshit.
    Is obesity increasing? Do you have any evidence for that assertion?

    During my week in Manchester, I saw a lot more vaping among young people than I see in London. Is vaping absent of health risk?

    As for the "jabs" (which will likely be pills before long), we'll see. There are those who might argue appetite suppression and reduced size has other economic consequences.

    Indeed, one of those consequences would be to make the manufacturers of Ozempic, Wegovy, Mounjaro and the rest extremely wealthy to an extent the drug cartels can only dream.
    Novo Nordisk already has Wegvy brand oral semaglutide pills approved and available in the US, they’ll be everywhere before long.

    https://abcnews.com/GMA/Wellness/wegovy-daily-pill-now-costs/story?id=128898797

    Better that regulated ‘big’ pharma makes money and pays taxes, than the profits going to the other end of the drug business.
    Those Wegovy pills are already available for sale in the UK.

    At £150 - £200 per month, they are not an option* for many of the poorest but the pay back for the NHS and the DWP must surley be there if they were allowed freely on the NHS.

    I'm sure that will come within the next 5 years.

    (*Not an easy option at any rate.)
    They absolutely should be available on the NHS, subject to reasonable objective criteria which can’t be easily gamed.

    Target those initially with a BMI of over X, people with severe diabetic levels of blood sugar, people with weight-related other conditions, people signed off work sick for a year or more…
    I eat well and exercise - what should my taxes go in those who won’t?

    A sedentary population eating crap food then spending billions on jags to mitigate the effect is my idea of a dystopian nightmare.

    Wall-E isn’t something to aim for, unless you’re one of the corporations making a profit from it.
  • bondegezoubondegezou Posts: 21,648

    stodge said:

    Morning all :)

    One of those nonsensical polls that tells you nothing.

    Who are "the Establishment" ? Who are "the People" ?

    By many metrics, most of us on here would be "the Establishment" and at what point in the glorious revolution (we haven't had one for over 350 years so we're probably due one) do "the People" become "the Establishment" and who will be "the People" once we have all broken wind in the palaces of the mighty?

    I don’t think you count as part of the Establishment until you top 20,000 posts on PB.
    Meet the New Establishment. Very like The Old Establishment.

    A minor example - the Aberfan Disaster showed that former mine union officials became part of The Thing, the moment they assumed office. They became The Mine Owners they hated, almost instantly.
    Which is the problem with privatisation.
  • theProletheProle Posts: 2,025
    Nigelb said:

    Taz said:



    FPT

    DoctorG said:

    Reports in The Times that the Treasury are looking to bring forward the increase in state pension age to 68 to start from 2037. The current published plan is to phase this increase in from April 2044.

    Millions forced to work longer under state pension age extension plan
    Treasury officials have told the Office for Budget Responsibility that the state retirement threshold will rise to 68 seven years earlier than legislated

    https://www.thetimes.com/uk/politics/article/state-pension-uk-retirement-age-68-nc50dzgcn (£££)

    Dr Suzy Morrissey is due to report imminently with her findings after last years call for evidence for the third state pension age review following the 2014 act. The govt then works on that.

    So there’s a bit of pre emoting of that although the scope also included how future state pension age will be determined.

    https://www.gov.uk/government/calls-for-evidence/third-state-pension-age-review-independent-report-call-for-evidence

    Final govt report/decision was supposedly not due til 2029

    Given the govt is supposedly committed to a 10 year notification of any change in state pension age if that holds this change would need to go through next year. If it is an actual proposed change rather than an assumption.
    It's not a proposed change.
    It's written into law (by a prior government) that they have to review it.
    Torsten Bell, who you would expect to know, yesterday explicitly denied any change was planned or proposed. FWIW
    Surely one of the Burnham dividends (if Burnham has any sense) will be that Torsten Bell is posted to a key role such as junior assistant ambassador to El Salvador, so no-one ever has to hear from him again. Half of Reeves's stuff ups have really been his stupid ideas in action.
  • bondegezoubondegezou Posts: 21,648
    Taz said:

    Eabhal said:

    FPT I still think it’s mad that the single biggest avoidable risk factor for COVID-19 deaths - obesity - is mentioned so little in the reports. It’s the reason the NHS came under so much pressure, and almost always why relatively young people died.

    E.g. in the 240 page resilience report it’s mentioned once. I do my best to be balanced about the conduct of public servants, but it really is a disgraceful abrogation of duty. Entirely unserious.

    I'm still amazed that the government didn't encourage weight loss and improved personal fitness during covid.
    It’s always little,nudges.

    So we’vehad the so called soda tax, advertising bans, BOGOF bans, bans on placing sweets near checkouts and other drivel that hasn’t worked which was advocated by well organised and well remunerated lobbying groups.

    TFL even had to pull one of its own ads for places to visit in London as food featured in it was HFSS.

    Yet obesity still increases

    We now have an initiative coming where people will get vouchers and rewards if they walk a certain amount of time in the week.

    The answer is probably to get people on the jabs rather than all of this ineffective bullshit.
    They have worked to a degree. What's your evidence they haven't?1
  • bondegezoubondegezou Posts: 21,648
    Taz said:

    Oops

    At least we’re pushing up,the state pension age to save 6 Billion a year

    The economically inactive dependents need funding somehow !!

    “ Give the Boriswave - 1.6m migrants - the right to settle permanently in the UK after 5 years and the cost is £30bn. It would have been cheaper to pay the unemployed already in the UK £150k plus each a year each to do the care work. Incentives etc.”

    https://x.com/merrynsw/status/2077286495707169233?s=61

    Is that £30 billion accurate or is it based on the same old discredited analysis?
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 62,508
    Eabhal said:

    Sandpit said:

    Sandpit said:

    stodge said:

    Taz said:

    Eabhal said:

    FPT I still think it’s mad that the single biggest avoidable risk factor for COVID-19 deaths - obesity - is mentioned so little in the reports. It’s the reason the NHS came under so much pressure, and almost always why relatively young people died.

    E.g. in the 240 page resilience report it’s mentioned once. I do my best to be balanced about the conduct of public servants, but it really is a disgraceful abrogation of duty. Entirely unserious.

    I'm still amazed that the government didn't encourage weight loss and improved personal fitness during covid.
    It’s always little,nudges.

    So we’vehad the so called soda tax, advertising bans, BOGOF bans, bans on placing sweets near checkouts and other drivel that hasn’t worked which was advocated by well organised and well remunerated lobbying groups.

    TFL even had to pull one of its own ads for places to visit in London as food featured in it was HFSS.

    Yet obesity still increases

    We now have an initiative coming where people will get vouchers and rewards if they walk a certain amount of time in the week.

    The answer is probably to get people on the jabs rather than all of this ineffective bullshit.
    Is obesity increasing? Do you have any evidence for that assertion?

    During my week in Manchester, I saw a lot more vaping among young people than I see in London. Is vaping absent of health risk?

    As for the "jabs" (which will likely be pills before long), we'll see. There are those who might argue appetite suppression and reduced size has other economic consequences.

    Indeed, one of those consequences would be to make the manufacturers of Ozempic, Wegovy, Mounjaro and the rest extremely wealthy to an extent the drug cartels can only dream.
    Novo Nordisk already has Wegvy brand oral semaglutide pills approved and available in the US, they’ll be everywhere before long.

    https://abcnews.com/GMA/Wellness/wegovy-daily-pill-now-costs/story?id=128898797

    Better that regulated ‘big’ pharma makes money and pays taxes, than the profits going to the other end of the drug business.
    Those Wegovy pills are already available for sale in the UK.

    At £150 - £200 per month, they are not an option* for many of the poorest but the pay back for the NHS and the DWP must surley be there if they were allowed freely on the NHS.

    I'm sure that will come within the next 5 years.

    (*Not an easy option at any rate.)
    They absolutely should be available on the NHS, subject to reasonable objective criteria which can’t be easily gamed.

    Target those initially with a BMI of over X, people with severe diabetic levels of blood sugar, people with weight-related other conditions, people signed off work sick for a year or more…
    I eat well and exercise - what should my taxes go in those who won’t?

    A sedentary population eating crap food then spending billions on jags to mitigate the effect is my idea of a dystopian nightmare.

    Wall-E isn’t something to aim for, unless you’re one of the corporations making a profit from it.
    Except that currently you’re paying for these people to sit idle and not work. Thousands of pounds per month per person.

    I’d be all in favour of stopping people buying junk food with benefits, but I suspect you disagree.
  • BartholomewRobertsBartholomewRoberts Posts: 29,281

    Eabhal said:

    FPT I still think it’s mad that the single biggest avoidable risk factor for COVID-19 deaths - obesity - is mentioned so little in the reports. It’s the reason the NHS came under so much pressure, and almost always why relatively young people died.

    E.g. in the 240 page resilience report it’s mentioned once. I do my best to be balanced about the conduct of public servants, but it really is a disgraceful abrogation of duty. Entirely unserious.

    I'm still amazed that the government didn't encourage weight loss and improved personal fitness during covid.
    They did encourage fitness etc., including encouraging people go out to exercise during lockdown. However, it's a bit shutting the stable door after the horse has bolted. People can't (healthily) lose weight quickly. COVID-19 spread fast. You were never going to shift the national average BMI in a significant way in time to have much impact.
    Relatively quickly you can with a consistent diet you can stick to.

    1-2 lbs a week can be done healthily and that quickly adds up. Even at the low end that is basically a stone in three months.

    When I switched my diet I lost the first 50 pounds in 9 months.

    The problem is much diet advice is stuff people can't or won't realistically stick to, like bullshit about 5 fruit and veg a day, and does not address why many people get cravings for food even after they have consumed enough calories.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 64,346

    stodge said:

    Morning all :)

    One of those nonsensical polls that tells you nothing.

    Who are "the Establishment" ? Who are "the People" ?

    By many metrics, most of us on here would be "the Establishment" and at what point in the glorious revolution (we haven't had one for over 350 years so we're probably due one) do "the People" become "the Establishment" and who will be "the People" once we have all broken wind in the palaces of the mighty?

    I don’t think you count as part of the Establishment until you top 20,000 posts on PB.
    Meet the New Establishment. Very like The Old Establishment.

    A minor example - the Aberfan Disaster showed that former mine union officials became part of The Thing, the moment they assumed office. They became The Mine Owners they hated, almost instantly.
    Which is the problem with privatisation.
    The problem isn’t ownership.

    The problem is that people running in an organisation tend to “protect” the organisation. Even when “protecting” it is unethical, illegal and even plain stupid.

    See every NHS scandal, for example.

    As @Cyclefree will tell you, the only effective answer is a combination of a culture of responsibility and ethics at the top of the organisation, combined with active, effective and precisely targeted regulations and regulators.
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 59,522
    Nigelb said:

    Homan: The officers involved in these shootings are well trained, I wouldn’t even call this a bump in the road. This will be a short term review, so ICE feels comfortable….
    https://x.com/Acyn/status/2077134923484602689

    The bumps in the road presumably being protestors they have driven over.
  • carnforthcarnforth Posts: 9,648
    Nigelb said:

    MelonB said:

    Taz said:

    Does anyone do wordle.

    What the hell is that word today ?

    I only got it as I had the last four letters and just went along putting every free letter in until,it was right

    On the fifth go.

    Similar experience here. American word.
    No, not American. It originated in England in the early 17th Century. I've come across it in older books. One of Sherlock Holmes' catchphrases was "Pshaw, my dear boy! It was simplicity itself."
    A lot of the words which we decry as American (sidewalk and apartment, for example) are actually of English origin, which survived over there while they were replaced back home.
    Phooey is the rough american equivalent, I think.
  • BattlebusBattlebus Posts: 3,598

    Eabhal said:

    FPT I still think it’s mad that the single biggest avoidable risk factor for COVID-19 deaths - obesity - is mentioned so little in the reports. It’s the reason the NHS came under so much pressure, and almost always why relatively young people died.

    E.g. in the 240 page resilience report it’s mentioned once. I do my best to be balanced about the conduct of public servants, but it really is a disgraceful abrogation of duty. Entirely unserious.

    I'm still amazed that the government didn't encourage weight loss and improved personal fitness during covid.
    They did encourage fitness etc., including encouraging people go out to exercise during lockdown. However, it's a bit shutting the stable door after the horse has bolted. People can't (healthily) lose weight quickly. COVID-19 spread fast. You were never going to shift the national average BMI in a significant way in time to have much impact.
    Relatively quickly you can with a consistent diet you can stick to.

    1-2 lbs a week can be done healthily and that quickly adds up. Even at the low end that is basically a stone in three months.

    When I switched my diet I lost the first 50 pounds in 9 months.

    The problem is much diet advice is stuff people can't or won't realistically stick to, like bullshit about 5 fruit and veg a day, and does not address why many people get cravings for food even after they have consumed enough calories.
    Talking about shit. Seems the Cyclospora (explosive diarrhea) outbreak is due to the contamination of salads and fresh fruits. Stick to the high fat / high sugar processed stuff to be safe.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 62,508

    Ukraine's campaign against Russian shipping has moved from the Azov Sea to the Black Sea. They report 20 ships, mostly oil tankers, hit in the Black Sea overnight. Presumably this is because there aren't any undamaged ships left in the Azov Sea.

    The Black Sea is a major route for Russian oil exports. If Ukraine can block it then that's a major loss in revenue for Russia, and they'd be forced to cut oil production, with long-term consequences due to the difficulty of restarting production.

    This is what a strategic turning point in the war looks like, unlike the supposedly "strategic" piles of rubble that Russia have captured at great cost over the last few years.

    I’ve been the massive optimist for a while on this war, but the last few weeks look like a significant change in momentum towards the defenders.

    The Russians have effectively no navy to defend against these Fire Point drone strikes, and little left by way of air defences protecting nationally-important infrastructure. Meanwhile Crimea is being starved out, and the front lines in occupied Ukraine are suffering from massive supply shortages.

    It’s starting to happen quickly.
  • LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 24,964

    stodge said:

    Morning all :)

    One of those nonsensical polls that tells you nothing.

    Who are "the Establishment" ? Who are "the People" ?

    By many metrics, most of us on here would be "the Establishment" and at what point in the glorious revolution (we haven't had one for over 350 years so we're probably due one) do "the People" become "the Establishment" and who will be "the People" once we have all broken wind in the palaces of the mighty?

    I don’t think you count as part of the Establishment until you top 20,000 posts on PB.
    Meet the New Establishment. Very like The Old Establishment.

    A minor example - the Aberfan Disaster showed that former mine union officials became part of The Thing, the moment they assumed office. They became The Mine Owners they hated, almost instantly.
    Which is the problem with privatisation.
    The problem isn’t ownership.

    The problem is that people running in an organisation tend to “protect” the organisation. Even when “protecting” it is unethical, illegal and even plain stupid.

    See every NHS scandal, for example.

    As @Cyclefree will tell you, the only effective answer is a combination of a culture of responsibility and ethics at the top of the organisation, combined with active, effective and precisely targeted regulations and regulators.
    You need to reward people for being honest and open about past mistakes and failings. People who are scared about the consequences of owning up to fucking up will be inclined to hide it.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 129,709
    All those posts last week about Labour being in third place and tumbleweed this week.

    The gap narrows slightly as Reform leads Labour and the Tories by 4pts in this weeks voting intention.

    ➡️ REF UK 26% (-1)
🌳 CON 22% (nc)
🌹 LAB 22% (+1)
🔶 LIB DEM 12% (+1)
🌍 GREEN 12% (+2)
❓ OTH 2% (-3)
🟡 SNP 2% (nc)

    N = 2,198 | Fieldwork 10-13/7  | Changes w 8/7


    https://x.com/luketryl/status/2077297501103616225?s=61&t=c6bcp0cjChLfQN5Tc8A_6g
  • bondegezoubondegezou Posts: 21,648
    stodge said:

    Taz said:

    Eabhal said:

    FPT I still think it’s mad that the single biggest avoidable risk factor for COVID-19 deaths - obesity - is mentioned so little in the reports. It’s the reason the NHS came under so much pressure, and almost always why relatively young people died.

    E.g. in the 240 page resilience report it’s mentioned once. I do my best to be balanced about the conduct of public servants, but it really is a disgraceful abrogation of duty. Entirely unserious.

    I'm still amazed that the government didn't encourage weight loss and improved personal fitness during covid.
    It’s always little,nudges.

    So we’vehad the so called soda tax, advertising bans, BOGOF bans, bans on placing sweets near checkouts and other drivel that hasn’t worked which was advocated by well organised and well remunerated lobbying groups.

    TFL even had to pull one of its own ads for places to visit in London as food featured in it was HFSS.

    Yet obesity still increases

    We now have an initiative coming where people will get vouchers and rewards if they walk a certain amount of time in the week.

    The answer is probably to get people on the jabs rather than all of this ineffective bullshit.
    Is obesity increasing? Do you have any evidence for that assertion?

    During my week in Manchester, I saw a lot more vaping among young people than I see in London. Is vaping absent of health risk?

    As for the "jabs" (which will likely be pills before long), we'll see. There are those who might argue appetite suppression and reduced size has other economic consequences.

    Indeed, one of those consequences would be to make the manufacturers of Ozempic, Wegovy, Mounjaro and the rest extremely wealthy to an extent the drug cartels can only dream.
    Vaping health risks but less than smoking.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 62,508

    stodge said:

    Morning all :)

    One of those nonsensical polls that tells you nothing.

    Who are "the Establishment" ? Who are "the People" ?

    By many metrics, most of us on here would be "the Establishment" and at what point in the glorious revolution (we haven't had one for over 350 years so we're probably due one) do "the People" become "the Establishment" and who will be "the People" once we have all broken wind in the palaces of the mighty?

    I don’t think you count as part of the Establishment until you top 20,000 posts on PB.
    Meet the New Establishment. Very like The Old Establishment.

    A minor example - the Aberfan Disaster showed that former mine union officials became part of The Thing, the moment they assumed office. They became The Mine Owners they hated, almost instantly.
    Which is the problem with privatisation.
    The problem isn’t ownership.

    The problem is that people running in an organisation tend to “protect” the organisation. Even when “protecting” it is unethical, illegal and even plain stupid.

    See every NHS scandal, for example.

    As @Cyclefree will tell you, the only effective answer is a combination of a culture of responsibility and ethics at the top of the organisation, combined with active, effective and precisely targeted regulations and regulators.
    You need to reward people for being honest and open about past mistakes and failings. People who are scared about the consequences of owning up to fucking up will be inclined to hide it.
    Yup, look to industries such as commercial aviation, for what effective regulation, impartial investigation, and a no-blame culture, looks like in practice. They have an absolutely astonishing safety record, at least in the West.

    Even the dodgy Asian, African, and Russian operators have better safety records than used to be the case, as the good practice from elsewhere slowly filters through.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 137,553
    edited 8:37AM
    The Conservative Party is still seen as the only party of the establishment, though that is a bit less so since Brexit. No party seen as the party of the people, though the Greens and LDs seen as more so than an establishment party, I would dispute that for the LDs who are arguably now the most establishment party of all.

    Reform seen as less establishment and more for the people still than Starmer Labour even if since the Tory defections even Farage's party is now seen as leaning to the establishment more than the people. We will see if a Burnham led Labour is seen as a peoples' party again
  • BartholomewRobertsBartholomewRoberts Posts: 29,281

    stodge said:

    Taz said:

    Eabhal said:

    FPT I still think it’s mad that the single biggest avoidable risk factor for COVID-19 deaths - obesity - is mentioned so little in the reports. It’s the reason the NHS came under so much pressure, and almost always why relatively young people died.

    E.g. in the 240 page resilience report it’s mentioned once. I do my best to be balanced about the conduct of public servants, but it really is a disgraceful abrogation of duty. Entirely unserious.

    I'm still amazed that the government didn't encourage weight loss and improved personal fitness during covid.
    It’s always little,nudges.

    So we’vehad the so called soda tax, advertising bans, BOGOF bans, bans on placing sweets near checkouts and other drivel that hasn’t worked which was advocated by well organised and well remunerated lobbying groups.

    TFL even had to pull one of its own ads for places to visit in London as food featured in it was HFSS.

    Yet obesity still increases

    We now have an initiative coming where people will get vouchers and rewards if they walk a certain amount of time in the week.

    The answer is probably to get people on the jabs rather than all of this ineffective bullshit.
    Is obesity increasing? Do you have any evidence for that assertion?

    During my week in Manchester, I saw a lot more vaping among young people than I see in London. Is vaping absent of health risk?

    As for the "jabs" (which will likely be pills before long), we'll see. There are those who might argue appetite suppression and reduced size has other economic consequences.

    Indeed, one of those consequences would be to make the manufacturers of Ozempic, Wegovy, Mounjaro and the rest extremely wealthy to an extent the drug cartels can only dream.
    Vaping health risks but less than smoking.
    Gonorrhea vs syphillis springs to mind.

    Plus its way too early to know the full consequences of vaping. Doctors once upon a time recommended smoking, who knows the full impact or vapes?
  • another_richardanother_richard Posts: 29,650

    Eabhal said:

    FPT I still think it’s mad that the single biggest avoidable risk factor for COVID-19 deaths - obesity - is mentioned so little in the reports. It’s the reason the NHS came under so much pressure, and almost always why relatively young people died.

    E.g. in the 240 page resilience report it’s mentioned once. I do my best to be balanced about the conduct of public servants, but it really is a disgraceful abrogation of duty. Entirely unserious.

    I'm still amazed that the government didn't encourage weight loss and improved personal fitness during covid.
    They did encourage fitness etc., including encouraging people go out to exercise during lockdown. However, it's a bit shutting the stable door after the horse has bolted. People can't (healthily) lose weight quickly. COVID-19 spread fast. You were never going to shift the national average BMI in a significant way in time to have much impact.
    Cutting out the alcohol and cakes will reduce weight by a few pounds in a couple of weeks.

    After that steady progress of a pound a week adds up, or rather subtracts diown.

    And covid didn't spread that quickly - most people hadn't been infected in the first six months, many hadn't been infected in the first year.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 64,346
    Sandpit said:

    stodge said:

    Morning all :)

    One of those nonsensical polls that tells you nothing.

    Who are "the Establishment" ? Who are "the People" ?

    By many metrics, most of us on here would be "the Establishment" and at what point in the glorious revolution (we haven't had one for over 350 years so we're probably due one) do "the People" become "the Establishment" and who will be "the People" once we have all broken wind in the palaces of the mighty?

    I don’t think you count as part of the Establishment until you top 20,000 posts on PB.
    Meet the New Establishment. Very like The Old Establishment.

    A minor example - the Aberfan Disaster showed that former mine union officials became part of The Thing, the moment they assumed office. They became The Mine Owners they hated, almost instantly.
    Which is the problem with privatisation.
    The problem isn’t ownership.

    The problem is that people running in an organisation tend to “protect” the organisation. Even when “protecting” it is unethical, illegal and even plain stupid.

    See every NHS scandal, for example.

    As @Cyclefree will tell you, the only effective answer is a combination of a culture of responsibility and ethics at the top of the organisation, combined with active, effective and precisely targeted regulations and regulators.
    You need to reward people for being honest and open about past mistakes and failings. People who are scared about the consequences of owning up to fucking up will be inclined to hide it.
    Yup, look to industries such as commercial aviation, for what effective regulation, impartial investigation, and a no-blame culture, looks like in practice. They have an absolutely astonishing safety record, at least in the West.

    Even the dodgy Asian, African, and Russian operators have better safety records than used to be the case, as the good practice from elsewhere slowly filters through.
    There was an interesting moment, when a U.K. police force tried to interfere in an aviation crash investigation. They tried to grab interviews and evidence.

    A police officer was interviewed for TV and expressed his incredulity and something near anger that the focus wasn’t on finding a guilty party to prosecute. Rather than preventing other air crashes.
  • StuartinromfordStuartinromford Posts: 23,347

    stodge said:

    Morning all :)

    One of those nonsensical polls that tells you nothing.

    Who are "the Establishment" ? Who are "the People" ?

    By many metrics, most of us on here would be "the Establishment" and at what point in the glorious revolution (we haven't had one for over 350 years so we're probably due one) do "the People" become "the Establishment" and who will be "the People" once we have all broken wind in the palaces of the mighty?

    I don’t think you count as part of the Establishment until you top 20,000 posts on PB.
    Meet the New Establishment. Very like The Old Establishment.

    A minor example - the Aberfan Disaster showed that former mine union officials became part of The Thing, the moment they assumed office. They became The Mine Owners they hated, almost instantly.
    Which is the problem with privatisation.
    The problem isn’t ownership.

    The problem is that people running in an organisation tend to “protect” the organisation. Even when “protecting” it is unethical, illegal and even plain stupid.

    See every NHS scandal, for example.

    As @Cyclefree will tell you, the only effective answer is a combination of a culture of responsibility and ethics at the top of the organisation, combined with active, effective and precisely targeted regulations and regulators.
    And then the trouble is that, in the short term, irresponsible and unethical tends to beat responsible and ethical. Right up to the moment when the scandal or crisis hits.

    That's why social and ethical norms are so useful, but we've rather kippered those by hiding everyone and everything behind text-based identities. It's much harder (not impossible, but harder) to be awful to someone face-to-face.
  • TazTaz Posts: 29,480
    Nigelb said:

    Taz said:

    Nigelb said:

    Taz said:



    FPT

    DoctorG said:

    Reports in The Times that the Treasury are looking to bring forward the increase in state pension age to 68 to start from 2037. The current published plan is to phase this increase in from April 2044.

    Millions forced to work longer under state pension age extension plan
    Treasury officials have told the Office for Budget Responsibility that the state retirement threshold will rise to 68 seven years earlier than legislated

    https://www.thetimes.com/uk/politics/article/state-pension-uk-retirement-age-68-nc50dzgcn (£££)

    Dr Suzy Morrissey is due to report imminently with her findings after last years call for evidence for the third state pension age review following the 2014 act. The govt then works on that.

    So there’s a bit of pre emoting of that although the scope also included how future state pension age will be determined.

    https://www.gov.uk/government/calls-for-evidence/third-state-pension-age-review-independent-report-call-for-evidence

    Final govt report/decision was supposedly not due til 2029

    Given the govt is supposedly committed to a 10 year notification of any change in state pension age if that holds this change would need to go through next year. If it is an actual proposed change rather than an assumption.
    The eagerness to bring this change in is in complete contrast to the refusal to do anything about the triple lock.
    What eagerness ?

    We have not announced any change of policy - and certainly not this specific one. There is currently a review of the State Pension age underway - that is simply because legislation (the 2014 Act) requires the Secretary of State to conduct such reviews on a fairly regular basis
    https://x.com/TorstenBell/status/2077158252677071350
    So it’s either been floated to assess reaction or an assumption put into forecasts.

    The Morrissey review into state pension age called for evidence last fall and is due to report imminently

    The govt timescale conveniently,kicks its response to it out to spring 29
    Until Burnham takes office, we're both just guessing.
    I’m not guessing. What I stated is on the govt website.
  • SelebianSelebian Posts: 10,214
    Appropriate that the two disestablishmentarianism parties are seen as least establishmentist :wink:
  • FF43FF43 Posts: 19,974
    I don't mind being on the side of the establishment if the other side is dodgy foreign billionaires with bribes, money launderers and gold bullion dealers to the general public.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 137,553
    'A serious review of MPs' security is needed following the death of Ann Widdecombe, Andy Burnham has said.

    The former Greater Manchester mayor, who is expected to become prime minister next Monday, said politics had "darkened" in the decade he had been away from Westminster.

    He said he was "shocked to see how much security now has to be in place", but added that it may need to be increased further still.'

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c8e2eyg2p40o
  • JohnLilburneJohnLilburne Posts: 8,413
    Battlebus said:

    Eabhal said:

    FPT I still think it’s mad that the single biggest avoidable risk factor for COVID-19 deaths - obesity - is mentioned so little in the reports. It’s the reason the NHS came under so much pressure, and almost always why relatively young people died.

    E.g. in the 240 page resilience report it’s mentioned once. I do my best to be balanced about the conduct of public servants, but it really is a disgraceful abrogation of duty. Entirely unserious.

    I'm still amazed that the government didn't encourage weight loss and improved personal fitness during covid.
    They did encourage fitness etc., including encouraging people go out to exercise during lockdown. However, it's a bit shutting the stable door after the horse has bolted. People can't (healthily) lose weight quickly. COVID-19 spread fast. You were never going to shift the national average BMI in a significant way in time to have much impact.
    Relatively quickly you can with a consistent diet you can stick to.

    1-2 lbs a week can be done healthily and that quickly adds up. Even at the low end that is basically a stone in three months.

    When I switched my diet I lost the first 50 pounds in 9 months.

    The problem is much diet advice is stuff people can't or won't realistically stick to, like bullshit about 5 fruit and veg a day, and does not address why many people get cravings for food even after they have consumed enough calories.
    Talking about shit. Seems the Cyclospora (explosive diarrhea) outbreak is due to the contamination of salads and fresh fruits. Stick to the high fat / high sugar processed stuff to be safe.
    I find a relatively low carb diet is easy to stick to, except when eating out, and seems to manage hunger/cravings well. I often only have two meals a day (but then I'm retired and can have a late breakfast and early dinner)

    It's more expensive than a standard diet, but much cheaper than ozempic
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 59,522

    Eabhal said:

    Taz said:

    Eabhal said:

    FPT I still think it’s mad that the single biggest avoidable risk factor for COVID-19 deaths - obesity - is mentioned so little in the reports. It’s the reason the NHS came under so much pressure, and almost always why relatively young people died.

    E.g. in the 240 page resilience report it’s mentioned once. I do my best to be balanced about the conduct of public servants, but it really is a disgraceful abrogation of duty. Entirely unserious.

    I'm still amazed that the government didn't encourage weight loss and improved personal fitness during covid.
    It’s always little,nudges.

    So we’vehad the so called soda tax, advertising bans, BOGOF bans, bans on placing sweets near checkouts and other drivel that hasn’t worked which was advocated by well organised and well remunerated lobbying groups.

    TFL even had to pull one of its own ads for places to visit in London as food featured in it was HFSS.

    Yet obesity still increases

    We now have an initiative coming where people will get vouchers and rewards if they walk a certain amount of time in the week.

    The answer is probably to get people on the jabs rather than all of this ineffective bullshit.
    It’s not ineffective, nor inevitable . If you eat well and get some exercise there’s no need to spend billions on pharmaceuticals (who have their own lobbying efforts).

    Any student of Economics 1A knows that an insurance system like the NHS collapses if you don’t align the incentives properly. It’s the great fatal flaw of a public health system, and that’s why people are so keen on vouchers for exercise , or tax discounts for being a healthy weight- because that’s precisely what private insurance systems do to correct for moral hazard.

    The evidence is exceptionally strong that they work.
    The Vitality scheme (private health insurance combined with vouchers & discounts) was a roaring success.
    Back in the unhappy days when I did some personal injury work the insurers would offer physiotherapy courses to pursuers who were off work. They were not doing that for the good of their health (the pursuer, quite possibly). It was a good example of the economic cost of waiting times for NHS services.
  • LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 24,964
    Sandpit said:

    Ukraine's campaign against Russian shipping has moved from the Azov Sea to the Black Sea. They report 20 ships, mostly oil tankers, hit in the Black Sea overnight. Presumably this is because there aren't any undamaged ships left in the Azov Sea.

    The Black Sea is a major route for Russian oil exports. If Ukraine can block it then that's a major loss in revenue for Russia, and they'd be forced to cut oil production, with long-term consequences due to the difficulty of restarting production.

    This is what a strategic turning point in the war looks like, unlike the supposedly "strategic" piles of rubble that Russia have captured at great cost over the last few years.

    I’ve been the massive optimist for a while on this war, but the last few weeks look like a significant change in momentum towards the defenders.

    The Russians have effectively no navy to defend against these Fire Point drone strikes, and little left by way of air defences protecting nationally-important infrastructure. Meanwhile Crimea is being starved out, and the front lines in occupied Ukraine are suffering from massive supply shortages.

    It’s starting to happen quickly.
    I wouldn't go that far yet. Russia has also been able to increase drone strikes on Ukrainian logistics supplying the front line. And the Ukrainian campaign against the Russian missile production supply chain has either stopped before success, or is being prevented from continuing by Russian air defences. And among the attacks on civilians the Russians have managed to hit a few high-value targets in Ukraine recently with their missiles - an ammunition store, a drone factory. And Russian attacks on shipping to Ukrainian ports has also increased (two cargo ships hit earlier this week, so not at the scale Ukraine is managing, but not nothing.)

    So there are still two sides in this war.
  • NickPalmerNickPalmer Posts: 22,165
    Battlebus said:

    This is where Kemi could score if she only stopped trying to be one of the establishment and a Reform Ultra

    A Sky article describes here as Burger Flipper - Burger Flipper to PM is a great story.

    She was also brought up on the mean streets of Lagos as part of the Nigerian diaspora (a big voting bloc).

    She had a real job as a "script kiddie" and web designer. I won't use the term "code monkey" as it could be misinterpreted but it was a real modern job in comparison to those that came through the Conservative research department.

    And she is a birthright citizen, one of the last after the UK changed its laws to remove that form of citizenship.

    So she could portray herself as definitely not the establishment and yet fails to use her advantages against the old school Tories in Reform. That's why Kemi is a dud.

    https://news.sky.com/story/who-is-kemi-badenoch-from-flipping-burgers-to-being-in-with-a-chance-to-be-the-next-prime-minister-12654976

    Kemi's not a dud - she polls consistently better than the Tories as a whole. And I think she does quite a nice job of portraying herself as a bit unusual but still sane. The missing bit is any reason to vote Tory, other than habit. Can we think of one important feature of life that would probably get better for ordinary people under the Tories?
  • noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 28,316

    Sandpit said:

    stodge said:

    Taz said:

    Eabhal said:

    FPT I still think it’s mad that the single biggest avoidable risk factor for COVID-19 deaths - obesity - is mentioned so little in the reports. It’s the reason the NHS came under so much pressure, and almost always why relatively young people died.

    E.g. in the 240 page resilience report it’s mentioned once. I do my best to be balanced about the conduct of public servants, but it really is a disgraceful abrogation of duty. Entirely unserious.

    I'm still amazed that the government didn't encourage weight loss and improved personal fitness during covid.
    It’s always little,nudges.

    So we’vehad the so called soda tax, advertising bans, BOGOF bans, bans on placing sweets near checkouts and other drivel that hasn’t worked which was advocated by well organised and well remunerated lobbying groups.

    TFL even had to pull one of its own ads for places to visit in London as food featured in it was HFSS.

    Yet obesity still increases

    We now have an initiative coming where people will get vouchers and rewards if they walk a certain amount of time in the week.

    The answer is probably to get people on the jabs rather than all of this ineffective bullshit.
    Is obesity increasing? Do you have any evidence for that assertion?

    During my week in Manchester, I saw a lot more vaping among young people than I see in London. Is vaping absent of health risk?

    As for the "jabs" (which will likely be pills before long), we'll see. There are those who might argue appetite suppression and reduced size has other economic consequences.

    Indeed, one of those consequences would be to make the manufacturers of Ozempic, Wegovy, Mounjaro and the rest extremely wealthy to an extent the drug cartels can only dream.
    Novo Nordisk already has Wegvy brand oral semaglutide pills approved and available in the US, they’ll be everywhere before long.

    https://abcnews.com/GMA/Wellness/wegovy-daily-pill-now-costs/story?id=128898797

    Better that regulated ‘big’ pharma makes money and pays taxes, than the profits going to the other end of the drug business.
    Those Wegovy pills are already available for sale in the UK.

    At £150 - £200 per month, they are not an option* for many of the poorest but the pay back for the NHS and the DWP must surley be there if they were allowed freely on the NHS.

    I'm sure that will come within the next 5 years.

    (*Not an easy option at any rate.)
    Generic versions should be available in 2031/2. So probably 6 years rather than 5.....
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 64,346
    FF43 said:

    I don't mind being on the side of the establishment if the other side is dodgy foreign billionaires with bribes, money launderers and gold bullion dealers to the general public.

    So you are gong to oppose dodgy foreign billionaires with bribes, money launderers and gold bullion dealers to the general public.

    By being on the side of the other dodgy foreign billionaires with bribes, money launderers and gold bullion dealers to the general public?

    “My price is $130 million dollars. If, when you are ready to pay, I happen to be out of town, you may hand it over to my friend, the Treasurer of the United States”.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 62,508

    Sandpit said:

    stodge said:

    Morning all :)

    One of those nonsensical polls that tells you nothing.

    Who are "the Establishment" ? Who are "the People" ?

    By many metrics, most of us on here would be "the Establishment" and at what point in the glorious revolution (we haven't had one for over 350 years so we're probably due one) do "the People" become "the Establishment" and who will be "the People" once we have all broken wind in the palaces of the mighty?

    I don’t think you count as part of the Establishment until you top 20,000 posts on PB.
    Meet the New Establishment. Very like The Old Establishment.

    A minor example - the Aberfan Disaster showed that former mine union officials became part of The Thing, the moment they assumed office. They became The Mine Owners they hated, almost instantly.
    Which is the problem with privatisation.
    The problem isn’t ownership.

    The problem is that people running in an organisation tend to “protect” the organisation. Even when “protecting” it is unethical, illegal and even plain stupid.

    See every NHS scandal, for example.

    As @Cyclefree will tell you, the only effective answer is a combination of a culture of responsibility and ethics at the top of the organisation, combined with active, effective and precisely targeted regulations and regulators.
    You need to reward people for being honest and open about past mistakes and failings. People who are scared about the consequences of owning up to fucking up will be inclined to hide it.
    Yup, look to industries such as commercial aviation, for what effective regulation, impartial investigation, and a no-blame culture, looks like in practice. They have an absolutely astonishing safety record, at least in the West.

    Even the dodgy Asian, African, and Russian operators have better safety records than used to be the case, as the good practice from elsewhere slowly filters through.
    There was an interesting moment, when a U.K. police force tried to interfere in an aviation crash investigation. They tried to grab interviews and evidence.

    A police officer was interviewed for TV and expressed his incredulity and something near anger that the focus wasn’t on finding a guilty party to prosecute. Rather than preventing other air crashes.
    With very few exceptions, your average detective constable can add precisely nothing to the investigations of the AAIB or NTSB, other than by securing the site and then getting out of the way.

    The investigators know exactly what they’re doing, and unlike the police are trusted by everyone to do the right thing.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 137,553

    Taz said:



    FPT

    DoctorG said:

    Reports in The Times that the Treasury are looking to bring forward the increase in state pension age to 68 to start from 2037. The current published plan is to phase this increase in from April 2044.

    Millions forced to work longer under state pension age extension plan
    Treasury officials have told the Office for Budget Responsibility that the state retirement threshold will rise to 68 seven years earlier than legislated

    https://www.thetimes.com/uk/politics/article/state-pension-uk-retirement-age-68-nc50dzgcn (£££)

    Dr Suzy Morrissey is due to report imminently with her findings after last years call for evidence for the third state pension age review following the 2014 act. The govt then works on that.

    So there’s a bit of pre emoting of that although the scope also included how future state pension age will be determined.

    https://www.gov.uk/government/calls-for-evidence/third-state-pension-age-review-independent-report-call-for-evidence

    Final govt report/decision was supposedly not due til 2029

    Given the govt is supposedly committed to a 10 year notification of any change in state pension age if that holds this change would need to go through next year. If it is an actual proposed change rather than an assumption.
    The eagerness to bring this change in is in complete contrast to the refusal to do anything about the triple lock.
    The two are locked together like Holmes and Moriaty.

    If we creep the triple lock, eventually, the pensionable age will be raised to 27 minutes before the end of average life expectancy.

    This is because there is no political stomach for raising taxes to pay for the Triple Lock.
    Just means test the Triple Lock would be far more sensible, no party would get elected with a retirement age proposed of over 70 anyway let alone over 80
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 59,522
    FF43 said:

    I don't mind being on the side of the establishment if the other side is dodgy foreign billionaires with bribes, money launderers and gold bullion dealers to the general public.

    This is a really interesting piece about the astonishing growth of the super wealthy and how these trends are accelerating with modern technology: https://www.dailykos.com/stories/2026/7/14/800069916/community/happy-bastille-day-regarding-corrupt-kings-arrogant-aristocrats-and-the/

    A lot of it relies on the work of Krugman but it contains some startling statistics.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 64,346
    DavidL said:

    Eabhal said:

    Taz said:

    Eabhal said:

    FPT I still think it’s mad that the single biggest avoidable risk factor for COVID-19 deaths - obesity - is mentioned so little in the reports. It’s the reason the NHS came under so much pressure, and almost always why relatively young people died.

    E.g. in the 240 page resilience report it’s mentioned once. I do my best to be balanced about the conduct of public servants, but it really is a disgraceful abrogation of duty. Entirely unserious.

    I'm still amazed that the government didn't encourage weight loss and improved personal fitness during covid.
    It’s always little,nudges.

    So we’vehad the so called soda tax, advertising bans, BOGOF bans, bans on placing sweets near checkouts and other drivel that hasn’t worked which was advocated by well organised and well remunerated lobbying groups.

    TFL even had to pull one of its own ads for places to visit in London as food featured in it was HFSS.

    Yet obesity still increases

    We now have an initiative coming where people will get vouchers and rewards if they walk a certain amount of time in the week.

    The answer is probably to get people on the jabs rather than all of this ineffective bullshit.
    It’s not ineffective, nor inevitable . If you eat well and get some exercise there’s no need to spend billions on pharmaceuticals (who have their own lobbying efforts).

    Any student of Economics 1A knows that an insurance system like the NHS collapses if you don’t align the incentives properly. It’s the great fatal flaw of a public health system, and that’s why people are so keen on vouchers for exercise , or tax discounts for being a healthy weight- because that’s precisely what private insurance systems do to correct for moral hazard.

    The evidence is exceptionally strong that they work.
    The Vitality scheme (private health insurance combined with vouchers & discounts) was a roaring success.
    Back in the unhappy days when I did some personal injury work the insurers would offer physiotherapy courses to pursuers who were off work. They were not doing that for the good of their health (the pursuer, quite possibly). It was a good example of the economic cost of waiting times for NHS services.
    Many companies offer free private health insurance to white collar workers, because it saves money - the emphasis is on private GPs, physios and access to initial diagnosis.

    Phone up and you are in the MRI machine and then see a consultant before the end of the week.

    This saves noticeable amounts of money, I understand.
  • MelonBMelonB Posts: 17,565

    MelonB said:

    Taz said:

    Does anyone do wordle.

    What the hell is that word today ?

    I only got it as I had the last four letters and just went along putting every free letter in until,it was right

    On the fifth go.

    Similar experience here. American word.
    No, not American. It originated in England in the early 17th Century. I've come across it in older books. One of Sherlock Holmes' catchphrases was "Pshaw, my dear boy! It was simplicity itself."
    Most American words are archaic British words that have fallen out of use over here. Though it seems this one has largely fallen out of use there too.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 137,553

    Loving the first sentence of that header - kudos @TSE.

    It really boils my piss when a Cambridge educated lawyer like The Right Honourable Robert Jenrick tries to say he isn't establishment and is effectively working class.
    Jenrick wasn't born establishment, his father was a gas fitter who then ran a fireplace manufacturing business and his mother was a secretary. He did go to private Wolverhampton Grammar School but it was not a major public school like Eton or Winchester or Harrow
  • TazTaz Posts: 29,480
    Battlebus said:

    Eabhal said:

    FPT I still think it’s mad that the single biggest avoidable risk factor for COVID-19 deaths - obesity - is mentioned so little in the reports. It’s the reason the NHS came under so much pressure, and almost always why relatively young people died.

    E.g. in the 240 page resilience report it’s mentioned once. I do my best to be balanced about the conduct of public servants, but it really is a disgraceful abrogation of duty. Entirely unserious.

    I'm still amazed that the government didn't encourage weight loss and improved personal fitness during covid.
    They did encourage fitness etc., including encouraging people go out to exercise during lockdown. However, it's a bit shutting the stable door after the horse has bolted. People can't (healthily) lose weight quickly. COVID-19 spread fast. You were never going to shift the national average BMI in a significant way in time to have much impact.
    Relatively quickly you can with a consistent diet you can stick to.

    1-2 lbs a week can be done healthily and that quickly adds up. Even at the low end that is basically a stone in three months.

    When I switched my diet I lost the first 50 pounds in 9 months.

    The problem is much diet advice is stuff people can't or won't realistically stick to, like bullshit about 5 fruit and veg a day, and does not address why many people get cravings for food even after they have consumed enough calories.
    Talking about shit. Seems the Cyclospora (explosive diarrhea) outbreak is due to the contamination of salads and fresh fruits. Stick to the high fat / high sugar processed stuff to be safe.
    Time for this


  • noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 28,316
    DavidL said:

    FF43 said:

    I don't mind being on the side of the establishment if the other side is dodgy foreign billionaires with bribes, money launderers and gold bullion dealers to the general public.

    This is a really interesting piece about the astonishing growth of the super wealthy and how these trends are accelerating with modern technology: https://www.dailykos.com/stories/2026/7/14/800069916/community/happy-bastille-day-regarding-corrupt-kings-arrogant-aristocrats-and-the/

    A lot of it relies on the work of Krugman but it contains some startling statistics.
    I wish people used the richest 400 people rather than the top 0.002%.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 137,553

    Battlebus said:

    This is where Kemi could score if she only stopped trying to be one of the establishment and a Reform Ultra

    A Sky article describes here as Burger Flipper - Burger Flipper to PM is a great story.

    She was also brought up on the mean streets of Lagos as part of the Nigerian diaspora (a big voting bloc).

    She had a real job as a "script kiddie" and web designer. I won't use the term "code monkey" as it could be misinterpreted but it was a real modern job in comparison to those that came through the Conservative research department.

    And she is a birthright citizen, one of the last after the UK changed its laws to remove that form of citizenship.

    So she could portray herself as definitely not the establishment and yet fails to use her advantages against the old school Tories in Reform. That's why Kemi is a dud.

    https://news.sky.com/story/who-is-kemi-badenoch-from-flipping-burgers-to-being-in-with-a-chance-to-be-the-next-prime-minister-12654976

    Kemi's not a dud - she polls consistently better than the Tories as a whole. And I think she does quite a nice job of portraying herself as a bit unusual but still sane. The missing bit is any reason to vote Tory, other than habit. Can we think of one important feature of life that would probably get better for ordinary people under the Tories?
    No Stamp Duty
  • eekeek Posts: 34,536
    HYUFD said:

    Taz said:



    FPT

    DoctorG said:

    Reports in The Times that the Treasury are looking to bring forward the increase in state pension age to 68 to start from 2037. The current published plan is to phase this increase in from April 2044.

    Millions forced to work longer under state pension age extension plan
    Treasury officials have told the Office for Budget Responsibility that the state retirement threshold will rise to 68 seven years earlier than legislated

    https://www.thetimes.com/uk/politics/article/state-pension-uk-retirement-age-68-nc50dzgcn (£££)

    Dr Suzy Morrissey is due to report imminently with her findings after last years call for evidence for the third state pension age review following the 2014 act. The govt then works on that.

    So there’s a bit of pre emoting of that although the scope also included how future state pension age will be determined.

    https://www.gov.uk/government/calls-for-evidence/third-state-pension-age-review-independent-report-call-for-evidence

    Final govt report/decision was supposedly not due til 2029

    Given the govt is supposedly committed to a 10 year notification of any change in state pension age if that holds this change would need to go through next year. If it is an actual proposed change rather than an assumption.
    The eagerness to bring this change in is in complete contrast to the refusal to do anything about the triple lock.
    The two are locked together like Holmes and Moriaty.

    If we creep the triple lock, eventually, the pensionable age will be raised to 27 minutes before the end of average life expectancy.

    This is because there is no political stomach for raising taxes to pay for the Triple Lock.
    Just means test the Triple Lock would be far more sensible, no party would get elected with a retirement age proposed of over 70 anyway let alone over 80
    Firstly what are you means testing - secondly means testing is stupidly expensive to do, I would suggest differential tax rates designed to recover the money at an appropriate level instead
  • FF43FF43 Posts: 19,974
    edited 8:55AM

    stodge said:

    Taz said:

    Eabhal said:

    FPT I still think it’s mad that the single biggest avoidable risk factor for COVID-19 deaths - obesity - is mentioned so little in the reports. It’s the reason the NHS came under so much pressure, and almost always why relatively young people died.

    E.g. in the 240 page resilience report it’s mentioned once. I do my best to be balanced about the conduct of public servants, but it really is a disgraceful abrogation of duty. Entirely unserious.

    I'm still amazed that the government didn't encourage weight loss and improved personal fitness during covid.
    It’s always little,nudges.

    So we’vehad the so called soda tax, advertising bans, BOGOF bans, bans on placing sweets near checkouts and other drivel that hasn’t worked which was advocated by well organised and well remunerated lobbying groups.

    TFL even had to pull one of its own ads for places to visit in London as food featured in it was HFSS.

    Yet obesity still increases

    We now have an initiative coming where people will get vouchers and rewards if they walk a certain amount of time in the week.

    The answer is probably to get people on the jabs rather than all of this ineffective bullshit.
    Is obesity increasing? Do you have any evidence for that assertion?

    During my week in Manchester, I saw a lot more vaping among young people than I see in London. Is vaping absent of health risk?

    As for the "jabs" (which will likely be pills before long), we'll see. There are those who might argue appetite suppression and reduced size has other economic consequences.

    Indeed, one of those consequences would be to make the manufacturers of Ozempic, Wegovy, Mounjaro and the rest extremely wealthy to an extent the drug cartels can only dream.
    Vaping health risks but less than smoking.
    Big health issue with vaping IMO is that it appears overall to be a failure as a smoking cessation tool, which was how it was originally sold.

    Smoking prevalence rates were falling until vaping was introduced, at which point it flat lined, and have possibly increased slightly. Vaping should have substituted for smoking as the healthier option and smoking died away completely.

    I think some people have quit smoking via vaping, but if so that means more people are taking up vaping, and smoking, than they previously did.

    If I'm right about this, the way vaping is marketed needs to changed/controlled.
  • EabhalEabhal Posts: 14,610
    eek said:

    HYUFD said:

    Taz said:



    FPT

    DoctorG said:

    Reports in The Times that the Treasury are looking to bring forward the increase in state pension age to 68 to start from 2037. The current published plan is to phase this increase in from April 2044.

    Millions forced to work longer under state pension age extension plan
    Treasury officials have told the Office for Budget Responsibility that the state retirement threshold will rise to 68 seven years earlier than legislated

    https://www.thetimes.com/uk/politics/article/state-pension-uk-retirement-age-68-nc50dzgcn (£££)

    Dr Suzy Morrissey is due to report imminently with her findings after last years call for evidence for the third state pension age review following the 2014 act. The govt then works on that.

    So there’s a bit of pre emoting of that although the scope also included how future state pension age will be determined.

    https://www.gov.uk/government/calls-for-evidence/third-state-pension-age-review-independent-report-call-for-evidence

    Final govt report/decision was supposedly not due til 2029

    Given the govt is supposedly committed to a 10 year notification of any change in state pension age if that holds this change would need to go through next year. If it is an actual proposed change rather than an assumption.
    The eagerness to bring this change in is in complete contrast to the refusal to do anything about the triple lock.
    The two are locked together like Holmes and Moriaty.

    If we creep the triple lock, eventually, the pensionable age will be raised to 27 minutes before the end of average life expectancy.

    This is because there is no political stomach for raising taxes to pay for the Triple Lock.
    Just means test the Triple Lock would be far more sensible, no party would get elected with a retirement age proposed of over 70 anyway let alone over 80
    Firstly what are you means testing - secondly means testing is stupidly expensive to do, I would suggest differential tax rates designed to recover the money at an appropriate level instead
    HYUFD is, rather worryingly, just representing the common understanding of the Triple Lock. People just think of it as a value - there is no appreciation of the ratchet effect from inflation/wage spirals, nor that the biggest negative impact of abolishing would be on young people, not old people.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 81,312
    Nigelb said:

    Homan: The officers involved in these shootings are well trained, I wouldn’t even call this a bump in the road. This will be a short term review, so ICE feels comfortable….
    https://x.com/Acyn/status/2077134923484602689

    I once got stopped because my MOT was overdue. I assume ICE's traffic stops are for similar reasons in the US ?
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 62,508

    DavidL said:

    Eabhal said:

    Taz said:

    Eabhal said:

    FPT I still think it’s mad that the single biggest avoidable risk factor for COVID-19 deaths - obesity - is mentioned so little in the reports. It’s the reason the NHS came under so much pressure, and almost always why relatively young people died.

    E.g. in the 240 page resilience report it’s mentioned once. I do my best to be balanced about the conduct of public servants, but it really is a disgraceful abrogation of duty. Entirely unserious.

    I'm still amazed that the government didn't encourage weight loss and improved personal fitness during covid.
    It’s always little,nudges.

    So we’vehad the so called soda tax, advertising bans, BOGOF bans, bans on placing sweets near checkouts and other drivel that hasn’t worked which was advocated by well organised and well remunerated lobbying groups.

    TFL even had to pull one of its own ads for places to visit in London as food featured in it was HFSS.

    Yet obesity still increases

    We now have an initiative coming where people will get vouchers and rewards if they walk a certain amount of time in the week.

    The answer is probably to get people on the jabs rather than all of this ineffective bullshit.
    It’s not ineffective, nor inevitable . If you eat well and get some exercise there’s no need to spend billions on pharmaceuticals (who have their own lobbying efforts).

    Any student of Economics 1A knows that an insurance system like the NHS collapses if you don’t align the incentives properly. It’s the great fatal flaw of a public health system, and that’s why people are so keen on vouchers for exercise , or tax discounts for being a healthy weight- because that’s precisely what private insurance systems do to correct for moral hazard.

    The evidence is exceptionally strong that they work.
    The Vitality scheme (private health insurance combined with vouchers & discounts) was a roaring success.
    Back in the unhappy days when I did some personal injury work the insurers would offer physiotherapy courses to pursuers who were off work. They were not doing that for the good of their health (the pursuer, quite possibly). It was a good example of the economic cost of waiting times for NHS services.
    Many companies offer free private health insurance to white collar workers, because it saves money - the emphasis is on private GPs, physios and access to initial diagnosis.

    Phone up and you are in the MRI machine and then see a consultant before the end of the week.

    This saves noticeable amounts of money, I understand.
    Mostly it’s not even serious disease (although sadly that does occur), it’s silly sports injuries or various domestic accidents that can keep someone off work for months, especially commuters and travelling staff who need to be able to walk or drive.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 62,508
    Pulpstar said:

    Nigelb said:

    Homan: The officers involved in these shootings are well trained, I wouldn’t even call this a bump in the road. This will be a short term review, so ICE feels comfortable….
    https://x.com/Acyn/status/2077134923484602689

    I once got stopped because my MOT was overdue. I assume ICE's traffic stops are for similar reasons in the US ?
    Except that they have a deportation order logged against them, rather than a speeding ticket or expired tag (tax disc).
  • noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 28,316
    HYUFD said:

    Battlebus said:

    This is where Kemi could score if she only stopped trying to be one of the establishment and a Reform Ultra

    A Sky article describes here as Burger Flipper - Burger Flipper to PM is a great story.

    She was also brought up on the mean streets of Lagos as part of the Nigerian diaspora (a big voting bloc).

    She had a real job as a "script kiddie" and web designer. I won't use the term "code monkey" as it could be misinterpreted but it was a real modern job in comparison to those that came through the Conservative research department.

    And she is a birthright citizen, one of the last after the UK changed its laws to remove that form of citizenship.

    So she could portray herself as definitely not the establishment and yet fails to use her advantages against the old school Tories in Reform. That's why Kemi is a dud.

    https://news.sky.com/story/who-is-kemi-badenoch-from-flipping-burgers-to-being-in-with-a-chance-to-be-the-next-prime-minister-12654976

    Kemi's not a dud - she polls consistently better than the Tories as a whole. And I think she does quite a nice job of portraying herself as a bit unusual but still sane. The missing bit is any reason to vote Tory, other than habit. Can we think of one important feature of life that would probably get better for ordinary people under the Tories?
    No Stamp Duty
    You may as well say no income tax unless you say what you'll replace it with. And why didn't they do this in previous decades of power?
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 137,553
    edited 9:10AM
    DavidL said:

    FF43 said:

    I don't mind being on the side of the establishment if the other side is dodgy foreign billionaires with bribes, money launderers and gold bullion dealers to the general public.

    This is a really interesting piece about the astonishing growth of the super wealthy and how these trends are accelerating with modern technology: https://www.dailykos.com/stories/2026/7/14/800069916/community/happy-bastille-day-regarding-corrupt-kings-arrogant-aristocrats-and-the/

    A lot of it relies on the work of Krugman but it contains some startling statistics.
    Some of the measures it proposes though like higher corporation tax and ending the carried interest loophole were in the Harris platform in 2024.

    Indeed Harris won voters earning over $100,000 a year and had more billionaires backing her than Trump. It was voters earning $30,000-$99,999 who elected Trump again mainly because of issues like reducing immigration and anti woke and they are the voters the Democrats need to win back if they are going to push an agenda of reducing inequality

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2024_United_States_presidential_election#Results

    https://www.forbes.com/sites/dereksaul/2024/10/30/kamala-harris-has-more-billionaires-prominently-backing-her-than-trump-bezos-and-griffin-weigh-in-updated/
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 64,346
    Pulpstar said:

    Nigelb said:

    Homan: The officers involved in these shootings are well trained, I wouldn’t even call this a bump in the road. This will be a short term review, so ICE feels comfortable….
    https://x.com/Acyn/status/2077134923484602689

    I once got stopped because my MOT was overdue. I assume ICE's traffic stops are for similar reasons in the US ?
    The bump in the road Homan is referring to is the bump as ICE agents run someone over. Then reverse to make sure.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 62,508
    Maygar’s video of the first 20 ships in the Black Sea taken out overnight.

    https://x.com/414magyarbirds/status/2077309670331474095
  • CiceroCicero Posts: 4,517
    HYUFD said:

    Loving the first sentence of that header - kudos @TSE.

    It really boils my piss when a Cambridge educated lawyer like The Right Honourable Robert Jenrick tries to say he isn't establishment and is effectively working class.
    Jenrick wasn't born establishment, his father was a gas fitter who then ran a fireplace manufacturing business and his mother was a secretary. He did go to private Wolverhampton Grammar School but it was not a major public school like Eton or Winchester or Harrow
    Oh Come on, whats the point of defending him? He's still part of the 7% who are privately educated, not to mention his Oxbridge degree. So it is just silly to defend his ridiculous pose of Working Class Hero when it's coming from a weakling ex-Tory whose achievements in office were performance cruelty and stupidity.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 90,820
    Taz said:

    Nigelb said:

    Taz said:

    Nigelb said:

    Taz said:



    FPT

    DoctorG said:

    Reports in The Times that the Treasury are looking to bring forward the increase in state pension age to 68 to start from 2037. The current published plan is to phase this increase in from April 2044.

    Millions forced to work longer under state pension age extension plan
    Treasury officials have told the Office for Budget Responsibility that the state retirement threshold will rise to 68 seven years earlier than legislated

    https://www.thetimes.com/uk/politics/article/state-pension-uk-retirement-age-68-nc50dzgcn (£££)

    Dr Suzy Morrissey is due to report imminently with her findings after last years call for evidence for the third state pension age review following the 2014 act. The govt then works on that.

    So there’s a bit of pre emoting of that although the scope also included how future state pension age will be determined.

    https://www.gov.uk/government/calls-for-evidence/third-state-pension-age-review-independent-report-call-for-evidence

    Final govt report/decision was supposedly not due til 2029

    Given the govt is supposedly committed to a 10 year notification of any change in state pension age if that holds this change would need to go through next year. If it is an actual proposed change rather than an assumption.
    The eagerness to bring this change in is in complete contrast to the refusal to do anything about the triple lock.
    What eagerness ?

    We have not announced any change of policy - and certainly not this specific one. There is currently a review of the State Pension age underway - that is simply because legislation (the 2014 Act) requires the Secretary of State to conduct such reviews on a fairly regular basis
    https://x.com/TorstenBell/status/2077158252677071350
    So it’s either been floated to assess reaction or an assumption put into forecasts.

    The Morrissey review into state pension age called for evidence last fall and is due to report imminently

    The govt timescale conveniently,kicks its response to it out to spring 29
    Until Burnham takes office, we're both just guessing.
    I’m not guessing. What I stated is on the govt website.
    About government intentions ?
    The review itself is pretty routine stuff; it's what government now does that matters.
  • FF43FF43 Posts: 19,974
    HYUFD said:

    DavidL said:

    FF43 said:

    I don't mind being on the side of the establishment if the other side is dodgy foreign billionaires with bribes, money launderers and gold bullion dealers to the general public.

    This is a really interesting piece about the astonishing growth of the super wealthy and how these trends are accelerating with modern technology: https://www.dailykos.com/stories/2026/7/14/800069916/community/happy-bastille-day-regarding-corrupt-kings-arrogant-aristocrats-and-the/

    A lot of it relies on the work of Krugman but it contains some startling statistics.
    Some of the measures it proposes though like higher corporation tax and ending the carried interest loophole were in the Harris platform in 2024.

    Indeed Harris won voters earning over $100,000 a year and had more billionaires backing her than Trump. It was voters earning $30,000-$99,999 who elected Trump again mainly because of issues like immigration and anti woke and they are the voters the Democrats need to win back if they are going to push an agenda of reducing inequality

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2024_United_States_presidential_election#Results

    https://www.forbes.com/sites/dereksaul/2024/10/30/kamala-harris-has-more-billionaires-prominently-backing-her-than-trump-bezos-and-griffin-weigh-in-updated/
    The big winners from the French Revolution were the middle classes, who were able acquire property on the cheap that was previously owned by the aristocracy and the Church. I think if someone can offer reliable ways for today's middle classes to get hold of oligarch wealth, that would be irresistible.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 90,820
    Sandpit said:

    Pulpstar said:

    Nigelb said:

    Homan: The officers involved in these shootings are well trained, I wouldn’t even call this a bump in the road. This will be a short term review, so ICE feels comfortable….
    https://x.com/Acyn/status/2077134923484602689

    I once got stopped because my MOT was overdue. I assume ICE's traffic stops are for similar reasons in the US ?
    Except that they have a deportation order logged against them, rather than a speeding ticket or expired tag (tax disc).
    Except they didn't.
    The guy with his three year old daughter in the car was not on the list; there was no probable cause.

    https://immigrantjustice.org/wp-content/uploads/2025/05/Nava_Settlement_ICE_Warrantless_Arrest-Vehicle_Stop_Policy_2021-1.pdf
    ..As federal law enforcement officers, ICE Officers lack federal statutory authority to
    enforce state or local vehicle or traffic laws. See 8 U.S.C. §§ 1357 (a)(4), (a)(5) / INA §§ 287(a)(4),
    (a)(5). Accordingly, when making vehicle stops, ICE Officers shall not state to the driver or
    occupant(s) of a vehicle that the purpose for a stop is related to any vehicle or traffic laws and
    regulations.
    ICE Officers may stop a vehicle to enforce civil immigration laws only if they are aware
    of specific, articulable facts that reasonably warrant suspicion that the vehicle contains an alien(s)
    who may be illegally in the country..


    And there is no legal authority whatsoever for shooting someone for trying to drive away.
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 60,473
    MattW said:

    ydoethur said:

    Eabhal said:

    FPT I still think it’s mad that the single biggest avoidable risk factor for COVID-19 deaths - obesity - is mentioned so little in the reports. It’s the reason the NHS came under so much pressure, and almost always why relatively young people died.

    E.g. in the 240 page resilience report it’s mentioned once. I do my best to be balanced about the conduct of public servants, but it really is a disgraceful abrogation of duty. Entirely unserious.

    I'm still amazed that the government didn't encourage weight loss and improved personal fitness during covid.
    It's something that Boris got right.

    And the solution that he has fairly consistently pushed- gentle active travel builds enough physical activity into people's lives- is on the right lines and is inherently political. It's all about how we divvy up finite shared space, after all.

    Unfortunately, both Sunak and Starmer blinked, panicked and drove away when they saw the opposition to measures that made cars a bit less convenient.
    I am told - I'm not sure how accurate it is - that actually Boris Bikes have not been a success in that regard as they are so unstable they lead to multiple ankle injuries.
    I don't think it is a high injury rate - unless you fall off and 20kg+ lands on your leg. They are clunkers as they are heavy - so people may try to treat them like a normal whippy bike and find it does not work. They are the Morris Oxford or London Taxi of bicycles.
    Hindustan Ambassador 👍
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 37,146
    UK Covid-19 Inquiry: Procurement (Module 5) Report

    The UK Covid-19 Inquiry’s fifth report considers the procurement and distribution of key healthcare-related equipment and supplies across the UK.

    https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/uk-covid-19-inquiry-procurement-module-5-report
  • OnlyLivingBoyOnlyLivingBoy Posts: 18,684
    I'm not sure the term "the establishment" really has any meaning in the modern world. It seems to serve as a proxy for "people I disagree with". See also "the blob".
    Where I think there is a meaningful dividing line is between people whose job it is to set and enforce the rules and the rest of us. Within the latter group there are people who think that the rules are preventing them from being as rich as they think they ought to be. A significant subset of this latter group are absolute scoundrels. While many of us may find the rules irritating from time to time, and the people who set and enforce them tiresome, it doesn't mean we want to surrender our country to a bunch of voracious spivs and crooks.
  • JohnLilburneJohnLilburne Posts: 8,413
    FF43 said:

    stodge said:

    Taz said:

    Eabhal said:

    FPT I still think it’s mad that the single biggest avoidable risk factor for COVID-19 deaths - obesity - is mentioned so little in the reports. It’s the reason the NHS came under so much pressure, and almost always why relatively young people died.

    E.g. in the 240 page resilience report it’s mentioned once. I do my best to be balanced about the conduct of public servants, but it really is a disgraceful abrogation of duty. Entirely unserious.

    I'm still amazed that the government didn't encourage weight loss and improved personal fitness during covid.
    It’s always little,nudges.

    So we’vehad the so called soda tax, advertising bans, BOGOF bans, bans on placing sweets near checkouts and other drivel that hasn’t worked which was advocated by well organised and well remunerated lobbying groups.

    TFL even had to pull one of its own ads for places to visit in London as food featured in it was HFSS.

    Yet obesity still increases

    We now have an initiative coming where people will get vouchers and rewards if they walk a certain amount of time in the week.

    The answer is probably to get people on the jabs rather than all of this ineffective bullshit.
    Is obesity increasing? Do you have any evidence for that assertion?

    During my week in Manchester, I saw a lot more vaping among young people than I see in London. Is vaping absent of health risk?

    As for the "jabs" (which will likely be pills before long), we'll see. There are those who might argue appetite suppression and reduced size has other economic consequences.

    Indeed, one of those consequences would be to make the manufacturers of Ozempic, Wegovy, Mounjaro and the rest extremely wealthy to an extent the drug cartels can only dream.
    Vaping health risks but less than smoking.
    Big health issue with vaping IMO is that it appears overall to be a failure as a smoking cessation tool, which was how it was originally sold.

    Smoking prevalence rates were falling until vaping was introduced, at which point it flat lined, and have possibly increased slightly. Vaping should have substituted for smoking as the healthier option and smoking died away completely.

    I think some people have quit smoking via vaping, but if so that means more people are taking up vaping, and smoking, than they previously did.

    If I'm right about this, the way vaping is marketed needs to changed/controlled.
    Surely it depends on how unhealthy vaping is, and whether it can be effectively controlled by regulation. Nicotine itself needs no more regulation than caffeine, it's the delivery mechanism that is the problem
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 37,146
    HYUFD said:

    Loving the first sentence of that header - kudos @TSE.

    It really boils my piss when a Cambridge educated lawyer like The Right Honourable Robert Jenrick tries to say he isn't establishment and is effectively working class.
    Jenrick wasn't born establishment, his father was a gas fitter who then ran a fireplace manufacturing business and his mother was a secretary. He did go to private Wolverhampton Grammar School but it was not a major public school like Eton or Winchester or Harrow
    Jenrick messes up my theory that major public school means Tory; minor public schools Labour.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 62,508
    LOL at Russian police giving parking tickets to a whole line of people waiting in patrol queues, for blocking the highway 🥳

    https://x.com/natalkakyiv/status/2077087085475811394
  • OnlyLivingBoyOnlyLivingBoy Posts: 18,684
    HYUFD said:

    Loving the first sentence of that header - kudos @TSE.

    It really boils my piss when a Cambridge educated lawyer like The Right Honourable Robert Jenrick tries to say he isn't establishment and is effectively working class.
    Jenrick wasn't born establishment, his father was a gas fitter who then ran a fireplace manufacturing business and his mother was a secretary. He did go to private Wolverhampton Grammar School but it was not a major public school like Eton or Winchester or Harrow
    The minor public school types are the absolute worst.
  • StuartinromfordStuartinromford Posts: 23,347
    Cicero said:

    HYUFD said:

    Loving the first sentence of that header - kudos @TSE.

    It really boils my piss when a Cambridge educated lawyer like The Right Honourable Robert Jenrick tries to say he isn't establishment and is effectively working class.
    Jenrick wasn't born establishment, his father was a gas fitter who then ran a fireplace manufacturing business and his mother was a secretary. He did go to private Wolverhampton Grammar School but it was not a major public school like Eton or Winchester or Harrow
    Oh Come on, whats the point of defending him? He's still part of the 7% who are privately educated, not to mention his Oxbridge degree. So it is just silly to defend his ridiculous pose of Working Class Hero when it's coming from a weakling ex-Tory whose achievements in office were performance cruelty and stupidity.
    Serious question- how much elite do we actually need?

    Oxbridge generates about 7000 BA graduates a year between them.
    Independent schools have abour 40000 upper sixth leavers each year.

    Mutliply both of those figures by about 40 to cover the length of a working life? No wonder so many of them are crossly thwarted.
  • FossFoss Posts: 2,906
    Sandpit said:

    LOL at Russian police giving parking tickets to a whole line of people waiting in patrol queues, for blocking the highway 🥳

    https://x.com/natalkakyiv/status/2077087085475811394

    That's one way to end all those 'long queues' videos that have started to show up. The only question is it a ground up solution or one passed down from on high?
  • MattWMattW Posts: 34,012
    edited 9:28AM

    Taz said:

    Eabhal said:

    FPT I still think it’s mad that the single biggest avoidable risk factor for COVID-19 deaths - obesity - is mentioned so little in the reports. It’s the reason the NHS came under so much pressure, and almost always why relatively young people died.

    E.g. in the 240 page resilience report it’s mentioned once. I do my best to be balanced about the conduct of public servants, but it really is a disgraceful abrogation of duty. Entirely unserious.

    I'm still amazed that the government didn't encourage weight loss and improved personal fitness during covid.
    It’s always little,nudges.

    So we’vehad the so called soda tax, advertising bans, BOGOF bans, bans on placing sweets near checkouts and other drivel that hasn’t worked which was advocated by well organised and well remunerated lobbying groups.

    TFL even had to pull one of its own ads for places to visit in London as food featured in it was HFSS.

    Yet obesity still increases

    We now have an initiative coming where people will get vouchers and rewards if they walk a certain amount of time in the week.

    The answer is probably to get people on the jabs rather than all of this ineffective bullshit.
    They have worked to a degree. What's your evidence they haven't?1
    AIUI obesity has plateaued over recent years.

    The NHS has been good on this with its range of initiatives.

    The sugar tax (OK - not NHS) has been successful - in that the manufacturers all reduced their sugar content to avoid it.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 64,346

    I'm not sure the term "the establishment" really has any meaning in the modern world. It seems to serve as a proxy for "people I disagree with". See also "the blob".
    Where I think there is a meaningful dividing line is between people whose job it is to set and enforce the rules and the rest of us. Within the latter group there are people who think that the rules are preventing them from being as rich as they think they ought to be. A significant subset of this latter group are absolute scoundrels. While many of us may find the rules irritating from time to time, and the people who set and enforce them tiresome, it doesn't mean we want to surrender our country to a bunch of voracious spivs and crooks.

    The Establishment can sensibly used to describe the group currently entrenched in power - especially in the permanent structures of government. This tends to roll over, over time. See the thesis that the U.K. avoided a physical revolution by having such rolling changes.

    “…The Daily Mirror is read by people who think they run the country; The Guardian is read by people who think they *ought* to run the country; The Times is read by the people who actually *do* run the country; The Daily Mail is read by the wives of the people who run the country; The Financial Times is read by people who *own* the country; The Morning Star is read by people who think the country ought to be run by *another* country; and The Daily Telegraph is read by people who think it *is*.
  • state_go_awaystate_go_away Posts: 5,954
    HYUFD said:

    'A serious review of MPs' security is needed following the death of Ann Widdecombe, Andy Burnham has said.

    The former Greater Manchester mayor, who is expected to become prime minister next Monday, said politics had "darkened" in the decade he had been away from Westminster.

    He said he was "shocked to see how much security now has to be in place", but added that it may need to be increased further still.'

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c8e2eyg2p40o

    Another symptom of the low trust society we now live in .
  • JohnLilburneJohnLilburne Posts: 8,413
    Sandpit said:

    Maygar’s video of the first 20 ships in the Black Sea taken out overnight.

    https://x.com/414magyarbirds/status/2077309670331474095

    Interesting that they are mostly going for the deck, rather than the bridge superstructure which we saw in the Azov hits
  • bigjohnowlsbigjohnowls Posts: 23,846
    As a beneficiary of the below it is ridiculous 47 years of Neoliberalism unopposed has delivered it.

    Extraordinary fact: £1 in every £2 paid in income tax in Britain goes directly to the retired.

    Our current pensions set-up and Triple Lock is not only unsustainable, but crippling the economy for those building it.
  • MattWMattW Posts: 34,012
    MelonB said:

    MelonB said:

    Taz said:

    Does anyone do wordle.

    What the hell is that word today ?

    I only got it as I had the last four letters and just went along putting every free letter in until,it was right

    On the fifth go.

    Similar experience here. American word.
    No, not American. It originated in England in the early 17th Century. I've come across it in older books. One of Sherlock Holmes' catchphrases was "Pshaw, my dear boy! It was simplicity itself."
    Most American words are archaic British words that have fallen out of use over here. Though it seems this one has largely fallen out of use there too.
    "Grand Jury"

    Fell out of use here in England and Wales around 1933.
  • noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 28,316

    I'm not sure the term "the establishment" really has any meaning in the modern world. It seems to serve as a proxy for "people I disagree with". See also "the blob".
    Where I think there is a meaningful dividing line is between people whose job it is to set and enforce the rules and the rest of us. Within the latter group there are people who think that the rules are preventing them from being as rich as they think they ought to be. A significant subset of this latter group are absolute scoundrels. While many of us may find the rules irritating from time to time, and the people who set and enforce them tiresome, it doesn't mean we want to surrender our country to a bunch of voracious spivs and crooks.

    Unusual take but I'd say the establishment broadly represent the people already. A confused incapable blob because the instructions from the country are confused and contradictory. It's not a conspiracy, simply a result of our voting preferences.
  • OnlyLivingBoyOnlyLivingBoy Posts: 18,684

    I'm not sure the term "the establishment" really has any meaning in the modern world. It seems to serve as a proxy for "people I disagree with". See also "the blob".
    Where I think there is a meaningful dividing line is between people whose job it is to set and enforce the rules and the rest of us. Within the latter group there are people who think that the rules are preventing them from being as rich as they think they ought to be. A significant subset of this latter group are absolute scoundrels. While many of us may find the rules irritating from time to time, and the people who set and enforce them tiresome, it doesn't mean we want to surrender our country to a bunch of voracious spivs and crooks.

    The Establishment can sensibly used to describe the group currently entrenched in power - especially in the permanent structures of government. This tends to roll over, over time. See the thesis that the U.K. avoided a physical revolution by having such rolling changes.

    “…The Daily Mirror is read by people who think they run the country; The Guardian is read by people who think they *ought* to run the country; The Times is read by the people who actually *do* run the country; The Daily Mail is read by the wives of the people who run the country; The Financial Times is read by people who *own* the country; The Morning Star is read by people who think the country ought to be run by *another* country; and The Daily Telegraph is read by people who think it *is*.
    If "the establishment" simply means "the civil service" I think it has lost its meaning as a phrase. It meant something when there was a small elite, often drawn from a few landowning aristocratic families, who exercised power and influence overtly and covertly through control of the banking sector, the civil service, the military, the press and politics. In today's Britain with a globalized elite, more meritocratic power structures and a weakened civil service I think it's become an empty phrase.
  • noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 28,316

    I'm not sure the term "the establishment" really has any meaning in the modern world. It seems to serve as a proxy for "people I disagree with". See also "the blob".
    Where I think there is a meaningful dividing line is between people whose job it is to set and enforce the rules and the rest of us. Within the latter group there are people who think that the rules are preventing them from being as rich as they think they ought to be. A significant subset of this latter group are absolute scoundrels. While many of us may find the rules irritating from time to time, and the people who set and enforce them tiresome, it doesn't mean we want to surrender our country to a bunch of voracious spivs and crooks.

    The Establishment can sensibly used to describe the group currently entrenched in power - especially in the permanent structures of government. This tends to roll over, over time. See the thesis that the U.K. avoided a physical revolution by having such rolling changes.

    “…The Daily Mirror is read by people who think they run the country; The Guardian is read by people who think they *ought* to run the country; The Times is read by the people who actually *do* run the country; The Daily Mail is read by the wives of the people who run the country; The Financial Times is read by people who *own* the country; The Morning Star is read by people who think the country ought to be run by *another* country; and The Daily Telegraph is read by people who think it *is*.
    What about the people who read the Sun?
  • FF43FF43 Posts: 19,974

    FF43 said:

    stodge said:

    Taz said:

    Eabhal said:

    FPT I still think it’s mad that the single biggest avoidable risk factor for COVID-19 deaths - obesity - is mentioned so little in the reports. It’s the reason the NHS came under so much pressure, and almost always why relatively young people died.

    E.g. in the 240 page resilience report it’s mentioned once. I do my best to be balanced about the conduct of public servants, but it really is a disgraceful abrogation of duty. Entirely unserious.

    I'm still amazed that the government didn't encourage weight loss and improved personal fitness during covid.
    It’s always little,nudges.

    So we’vehad the so called soda tax, advertising bans, BOGOF bans, bans on placing sweets near checkouts and other drivel that hasn’t worked which was advocated by well organised and well remunerated lobbying groups.

    TFL even had to pull one of its own ads for places to visit in London as food featured in it was HFSS.

    Yet obesity still increases

    We now have an initiative coming where people will get vouchers and rewards if they walk a certain amount of time in the week.

    The answer is probably to get people on the jabs rather than all of this ineffective bullshit.
    Is obesity increasing? Do you have any evidence for that assertion?

    During my week in Manchester, I saw a lot more vaping among young people than I see in London. Is vaping absent of health risk?

    As for the "jabs" (which will likely be pills before long), we'll see. There are those who might argue appetite suppression and reduced size has other economic consequences.

    Indeed, one of those consequences would be to make the manufacturers of Ozempic, Wegovy, Mounjaro and the rest extremely wealthy to an extent the drug cartels can only dream.
    Vaping health risks but less than smoking.
    Big health issue with vaping IMO is that it appears overall to be a failure as a smoking cessation tool, which was how it was originally sold.

    Smoking prevalence rates were falling until vaping was introduced, at which point it flat lined, and have possibly increased slightly. Vaping should have substituted for smoking as the healthier option and smoking died away completely.

    I think some people have quit smoking via vaping, but if so that means more people are taking up vaping, and smoking, than they previously did.

    If I'm right about this, the way vaping is marketed needs to changed/controlled.
    Surely it depends on how unhealthy vaping is, and whether it can be effectively controlled by regulation. Nicotine itself needs no more regulation than caffeine, it's the delivery mechanism that is the problem
    The marketing problem with vaping it seems to me is that it's sold as an entry into nicotine addiction however consumed, rather than as a means to move from a more dangerous form to a less dangerous one. This has big public health implications.
  • BartholomewRobertsBartholomewRoberts Posts: 29,281
    Eabhal said:

    eek said:

    HYUFD said:

    Taz said:



    FPT

    DoctorG said:

    Reports in The Times that the Treasury are looking to bring forward the increase in state pension age to 68 to start from 2037. The current published plan is to phase this increase in from April 2044.

    Millions forced to work longer under state pension age extension plan
    Treasury officials have told the Office for Budget Responsibility that the state retirement threshold will rise to 68 seven years earlier than legislated

    https://www.thetimes.com/uk/politics/article/state-pension-uk-retirement-age-68-nc50dzgcn (£££)

    Dr Suzy Morrissey is due to report imminently with her findings after last years call for evidence for the third state pension age review following the 2014 act. The govt then works on that.

    So there’s a bit of pre emoting of that although the scope also included how future state pension age will be determined.

    https://www.gov.uk/government/calls-for-evidence/third-state-pension-age-review-independent-report-call-for-evidence

    Final govt report/decision was supposedly not due til 2029

    Given the govt is supposedly committed to a 10 year notification of any change in state pension age if that holds this change would need to go through next year. If it is an actual proposed change rather than an assumption.
    The eagerness to bring this change in is in complete contrast to the refusal to do anything about the triple lock.
    The two are locked together like Holmes and Moriaty.

    If we creep the triple lock, eventually, the pensionable age will be raised to 27 minutes before the end of average life expectancy.

    This is because there is no political stomach for raising taxes to pay for the Triple Lock.
    Just means test the Triple Lock would be far more sensible, no party would get elected with a retirement age proposed of over 70 anyway let alone over 80
    Firstly what are you means testing - secondly means testing is stupidly expensive to do, I would suggest differential tax rates designed to recover the money at an appropriate level instead
    HYUFD is, rather worryingly, just representing the common understanding of the Triple Lock. People just think of it as a value - there is no appreciation of the ratchet effect from inflation/wage spirals, nor that the biggest negative impact of abolishing would be on young people, not old people.
    The latter is completely false.

    The biggest negative for young people is the ratchet stays in place making pensions utterly unaffordable leading to their being removed entirely which is what many young people expect - that they will get nothing.

    Putting things on a sustainable footing by removing the ratchet will be good for young people.

    Funny how many people do not comprehend the concept of sustainability. Especially those who would use the word in other contexts.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 62,508

    Sandpit said:

    Maygar’s video of the first 20 ships in the Black Sea taken out overnight.

    https://x.com/414magyarbirds/status/2077309670331474095

    Interesting that they are mostly going for the deck, rather than the bridge superstructure which we saw in the Azov hits
    Indeed, there’s a variety of techniques in use.

    The one thing they’re trying to avoid doing to damaging the hull, they don’t want to sink tankers full of oil because the mess will be a nightmare to clean up.
  • OnlyLivingBoyOnlyLivingBoy Posts: 18,684

    HYUFD said:

    'A serious review of MPs' security is needed following the death of Ann Widdecombe, Andy Burnham has said.

    The former Greater Manchester mayor, who is expected to become prime minister next Monday, said politics had "darkened" in the decade he had been away from Westminster.

    He said he was "shocked to see how much security now has to be in place", but added that it may need to be increased further still.'

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c8e2eyg2p40o

    Another symptom of the low trust society we now live in .
    Was the UK a low trust society in 1812 when our PM was assassinated?
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 64,346

    Sandpit said:

    Maygar’s video of the first 20 ships in the Black Sea taken out overnight.

    https://x.com/414magyarbirds/status/2077309670331474095

    Interesting that they are mostly going for the deck, rather than the bridge superstructure which we saw in the Azov hits
    Going for the bridge kills the crew who run the vessel - the engineers would have at least a chance.

    During the submarine campaigns of WWII, the dirty little not-so-secret was that killing the crew was more effective than just sinking ships. Training new crew took longer….
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 60,473

    HYUFD said:

    'A serious review of MPs' security is needed following the death of Ann Widdecombe, Andy Burnham has said.

    The former Greater Manchester mayor, who is expected to become prime minister next Monday, said politics had "darkened" in the decade he had been away from Westminster.

    He said he was "shocked to see how much security now has to be in place", but added that it may need to be increased further still.'

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c8e2eyg2p40o

    Another symptom of the low trust society we now live in .
    Was the UK a low trust society in 1812 when our PM was assassinated?
    There was a war going on at that time.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 57,490
    Eabhal said:

    eek said:

    HYUFD said:

    Taz said:



    FPT

    DoctorG said:

    Reports in The Times that the Treasury are looking to bring forward the increase in state pension age to 68 to start from 2037. The current published plan is to phase this increase in from April 2044.

    Millions forced to work longer under state pension age extension plan
    Treasury officials have told the Office for Budget Responsibility that the state retirement threshold will rise to 68 seven years earlier than legislated

    https://www.thetimes.com/uk/politics/article/state-pension-uk-retirement-age-68-nc50dzgcn (£££)

    Dr Suzy Morrissey is due to report imminently with her findings after last years call for evidence for the third state pension age review following the 2014 act. The govt then works on that.

    So there’s a bit of pre emoting of that although the scope also included how future state pension age will be determined.

    https://www.gov.uk/government/calls-for-evidence/third-state-pension-age-review-independent-report-call-for-evidence

    Final govt report/decision was supposedly not due til 2029

    Given the govt is supposedly committed to a 10 year notification of any change in state pension age if that holds this change would need to go through next year. If it is an actual proposed change rather than an assumption.
    The eagerness to bring this change in is in complete contrast to the refusal to do anything about the triple lock.
    The two are locked together like Holmes and Moriaty.

    If we creep the triple lock, eventually, the pensionable age will be raised to 27 minutes before the end of average life expectancy.

    This is because there is no political stomach for raising taxes to pay for the Triple Lock.
    Just means test the Triple Lock would be far more sensible, no party would get elected with a retirement age proposed of over 70 anyway let alone over 80
    Firstly what are you means testing - secondly means testing is stupidly expensive to do, I would suggest differential tax rates designed to recover the money at an appropriate level instead
    HYUFD is, rather worryingly, just representing the common understanding of the Triple Lock. People just think of it as a value - there is no appreciation of the ratchet effect from inflation/wage spirals, nor that the biggest negative impact of abolishing would be on young people, not old people.
    Ending the Triple Lock is not ending pension increases, it is returning them to the discretion of the Chancellor in light of the overall financial situation. Benefit increases should also be at the discretion of the Chancellor.
  • StuartinromfordStuartinromford Posts: 23,347

    I'm not sure the term "the establishment" really has any meaning in the modern world. It seems to serve as a proxy for "people I disagree with". See also "the blob".
    Where I think there is a meaningful dividing line is between people whose job it is to set and enforce the rules and the rest of us. Within the latter group there are people who think that the rules are preventing them from being as rich as they think they ought to be. A significant subset of this latter group are absolute scoundrels. While many of us may find the rules irritating from time to time, and the people who set and enforce them tiresome, it doesn't mean we want to surrender our country to a bunch of voracious spivs and crooks.

    The Establishment can sensibly used to describe the group currently entrenched in power - especially in the permanent structures of government. This tends to roll over, over time. See the thesis that the U.K. avoided a physical revolution by having such rolling changes.

    “…The Daily Mirror is read by people who think they run the country; The Guardian is read by people who think they *ought* to run the country; The Times is read by the people who actually *do* run the country; The Daily Mail is read by the wives of the people who run the country; The Financial Times is read by people who *own* the country; The Morning Star is read by people who think the country ought to be run by *another* country; and The Daily Telegraph is read by people who think it *is*.
    What about the people who read the Sun?
    There's a link here to David Frost making a complete horlicks of the gag;

    https://www.dirtyfeed.org/2021/04/what-the-papers-say/
  • SelebianSelebian Posts: 10,214
    Appropriate that the two disestablishmentarianism parties are seen as least establishmentist :

    Ann Widdecombe killing: police investigating possible leftwing motivation
    ...
    Investigators are considering whether leftwing, anarchist and single-issue terrorism (LASIT) played a role in the suspect’s alleged motivation, but are keeping an open mind as new material emerges.
    ...
    The ​i​nquiry is also ​l​ooking into the​ suspect’s history of mental health and neurodivergence.
    ...
    While the killing is being investigated by counter-terrorism police, it has not been formally designated as a terrorist attack. That is a decision made by the senior national coordinator for counter-terrorism.

    https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2026/jul/14/ann-widdecombe-killing-police-investigating-possible-leftwing-motivation

    Isn't most terrorism single issue? You don't get a lot of people doing attacks over the decadence of the West and the oppression of Palestine and the division of Ireland.
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 73,213
    James Heale
    @JAHeale

    EXC: Reform is overhauling its party machine again

    - Some 60 staff are being recruited to build a new network of campaign staff at a cost of 'millions'

    - Inspiration comes from the old Tory agents model and the Labour 2024 strategy of ruthlessly targeting seats

    - A 'Burnham bounce' is expected to hit polling... but Farage's aides want to use it to recapture the party’s insurgent message and branding

    https://x.com/JAHeale/status/2077311559278223371
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 57,490

    HYUFD said:

    'A serious review of MPs' security is needed following the death of Ann Widdecombe, Andy Burnham has said.

    The former Greater Manchester mayor, who is expected to become prime minister next Monday, said politics had "darkened" in the decade he had been away from Westminster.

    He said he was "shocked to see how much security now has to be in place", but added that it may need to be increased further still.'

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c8e2eyg2p40o

    Another symptom of the low trust society we now live in .
    Was the UK a low trust society in 1812 when our PM was assassinated?
    There was a war going on at that time.
    Also quite a lot of unrest in the aftermath of the American and French revolutions, with the Peterloo massacre etc.

    It wasn't all Jane Austen drawing room flirtation.
  • bigjohnowlsbigjohnowls Posts: 23,846
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 60,473
    Taz said:

    Battlebus said:

    Eabhal said:

    FPT I still think it’s mad that the single biggest avoidable risk factor for COVID-19 deaths - obesity - is mentioned so little in the reports. It’s the reason the NHS came under so much pressure, and almost always why relatively young people died.

    E.g. in the 240 page resilience report it’s mentioned once. I do my best to be balanced about the conduct of public servants, but it really is a disgraceful abrogation of duty. Entirely unserious.

    I'm still amazed that the government didn't encourage weight loss and improved personal fitness during covid.
    They did encourage fitness etc., including encouraging people go out to exercise during lockdown. However, it's a bit shutting the stable door after the horse has bolted. People can't (healthily) lose weight quickly. COVID-19 spread fast. You were never going to shift the national average BMI in a significant way in time to have much impact.
    Relatively quickly you can with a consistent diet you can stick to.

    1-2 lbs a week can be done healthily and that quickly adds up. Even at the low end that is basically a stone in three months.

    When I switched my diet I lost the first 50 pounds in 9 months.

    The problem is much diet advice is stuff people can't or won't realistically stick to, like bullshit about 5 fruit and veg a day, and does not address why many people get cravings for food even after they have consumed enough calories.
    Talking about shit. Seems the Cyclospora (explosive diarrhea) outbreak is due to the contamination of salads and fresh fruits. Stick to the high fat / high sugar processed stuff to be safe.
    Time for this


    My mum really hates that advert!

    Once I sang along to it AFTER hiding the remote. 😇
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 73,213
    Yvette is now favourite to be CoE on BF
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 73,213
    Yvette is now favourite to be CoE on BF
  • EabhalEabhal Posts: 14,610
    edited 9:44AM

    Eabhal said:

    eek said:

    HYUFD said:

    Taz said:



    FPT

    DoctorG said:

    Reports in The Times that the Treasury are looking to bring forward the increase in state pension age to 68 to start from 2037. The current published plan is to phase this increase in from April 2044.

    Millions forced to work longer under state pension age extension plan
    Treasury officials have told the Office for Budget Responsibility that the state retirement threshold will rise to 68 seven years earlier than legislated

    https://www.thetimes.com/uk/politics/article/state-pension-uk-retirement-age-68-nc50dzgcn (£££)

    Dr Suzy Morrissey is due to report imminently with her findings after last years call for evidence for the third state pension age review following the 2014 act. The govt then works on that.

    So there’s a bit of pre emoting of that although the scope also included how future state pension age will be determined.

    https://www.gov.uk/government/calls-for-evidence/third-state-pension-age-review-independent-report-call-for-evidence

    Final govt report/decision was supposedly not due til 2029

    Given the govt is supposedly committed to a 10 year notification of any change in state pension age if that holds this change would need to go through next year. If it is an actual proposed change rather than an assumption.
    The eagerness to bring this change in is in complete contrast to the refusal to do anything about the triple lock.
    The two are locked together like Holmes and Moriaty.

    If we creep the triple lock, eventually, the pensionable age will be raised to 27 minutes before the end of average life expectancy.

    This is because there is no political stomach for raising taxes to pay for the Triple Lock.
    Just means test the Triple Lock would be far more sensible, no party would get elected with a retirement age proposed of over 70 anyway let alone over 80
    Firstly what are you means testing - secondly means testing is stupidly expensive to do, I would suggest differential tax rates designed to recover the money at an appropriate level instead
    HYUFD is, rather worryingly, just representing the common understanding of the Triple Lock. People just think of it as a value - there is no appreciation of the ratchet effect from inflation/wage spirals, nor that the biggest negative impact of abolishing would be on young people, not old people.
    The latter is completely false.

    The biggest negative for young people is the ratchet stays in place making pensions utterly unaffordable leading to their being removed entirely which is what many young people expect - that they will get nothing.

    Putting things on a sustainable footing by removing the ratchet will be good for young people.

    Funny how many people do not comprehend the concept of sustainability. Especially those who would use the word in other contexts.
    Personally I’m looking forward to my £100k state pension, I’m sure the generations coming after me will be more than happy to pay the tax required :)
  • BartholomewRobertsBartholomewRoberts Posts: 29,281
    What has that got to do with UK children?
  • DopermeanDopermean Posts: 3,389
    Taz said:

    Taz said:



    FPT

    DoctorG said:

    Reports in The Times that the Treasury are looking to bring forward the increase in state pension age to 68 to start from 2037. The current published plan is to phase this increase in from April 2044.

    Millions forced to work longer under state pension age extension plan
    Treasury officials have told the Office for Budget Responsibility that the state retirement threshold will rise to 68 seven years earlier than legislated

    https://www.thetimes.com/uk/politics/article/state-pension-uk-retirement-age-68-nc50dzgcn (£££)

    Dr Suzy Morrissey is due to report imminently with her findings after last years call for evidence for the third state pension age review following the 2014 act. The govt then works on that.

    So there’s a bit of pre emoting of that although the scope also included how future state pension age will be determined.

    https://www.gov.uk/government/calls-for-evidence/third-state-pension-age-review-independent-report-call-for-evidence

    Final govt report/decision was supposedly not due til 2029

    Given the govt is supposedly committed to a 10 year notification of any change in state pension age if that holds this change would need to go through next year. If it is an actual proposed change rather than an assumption.
    The eagerness to bring this change in is in complete contrast to the refusal to do anything about the triple lock.
    The two are locked together like Holmes and Moriaty.

    If we creep the triple lock, eventually, the pensionable age will be raised to 27 minutes before the end of average life expectancy.

    This is because there is no political stomach for raising taxes to pay for the Triple Lock.
    Back to how it was when the modern state pension was introduced post war then. Male average life expectency at birth in 1947 was 64.6 years
    Linking to life expectancy is one of the terms of reference for the Morrissey review.
    That could unfairly discriminate though, there's a 20-30 year time lag, so current pensioners with their triple-lock pensions and decent standard of living, therefore high life expectancy, could cause an increase in pension age for older workers with a poorer standard of living, because they're paying for triple-lock, and hence lower life expectancy. You'd be entrenching the pulling up of the ladder.
  • BartholomewRobertsBartholomewRoberts Posts: 29,281
    Eabhal said:

    Eabhal said:

    eek said:

    HYUFD said:

    Taz said:



    FPT

    DoctorG said:

    Reports in The Times that the Treasury are looking to bring forward the increase in state pension age to 68 to start from 2037. The current published plan is to phase this increase in from April 2044.

    Millions forced to work longer under state pension age extension plan
    Treasury officials have told the Office for Budget Responsibility that the state retirement threshold will rise to 68 seven years earlier than legislated

    https://www.thetimes.com/uk/politics/article/state-pension-uk-retirement-age-68-nc50dzgcn (£££)

    Dr Suzy Morrissey is due to report imminently with her findings after last years call for evidence for the third state pension age review following the 2014 act. The govt then works on that.

    So there’s a bit of pre emoting of that although the scope also included how future state pension age will be determined.

    https://www.gov.uk/government/calls-for-evidence/third-state-pension-age-review-independent-report-call-for-evidence

    Final govt report/decision was supposedly not due til 2029

    Given the govt is supposedly committed to a 10 year notification of any change in state pension age if that holds this change would need to go through next year. If it is an actual proposed change rather than an assumption.
    The eagerness to bring this change in is in complete contrast to the refusal to do anything about the triple lock.
    The two are locked together like Holmes and Moriaty.

    If we creep the triple lock, eventually, the pensionable age will be raised to 27 minutes before the end of average life expectancy.

    This is because there is no political stomach for raising taxes to pay for the Triple Lock.
    Just means test the Triple Lock would be far more sensible, no party would get elected with a retirement age proposed of over 70 anyway let alone over 80
    Firstly what are you means testing - secondly means testing is stupidly expensive to do, I would suggest differential tax rates designed to recover the money at an appropriate level instead
    HYUFD is, rather worryingly, just representing the common understanding of the Triple Lock. People just think of it as a value - there is no appreciation of the ratchet effect from inflation/wage spirals, nor that the biggest negative impact of abolishing would be on young people, not old people.
    The latter is completely false.

    The biggest negative for young people is the ratchet stays in place making pensions utterly unaffordable leading to their being removed entirely which is what many young people expect - that they will get nothing.

    Putting things on a sustainable footing by removing the ratchet will be good for young people.

    Funny how many people do not comprehend the concept of sustainability. Especially those who would use the word in other contexts.
    Personally I’m looking forward to my £100k state pension, I’m sure the generations coming after me will be more than happy to pay the tax required :)
    I would rather get 100% of a sustainable amount than 0% of £100k
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 60,473
    Do you think it's Allah's will that Israel exists?
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